General Debate 16 February 2025

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Cassandra

1938, in Munich, Czechoslovakia was forced by France and the UK to hand over the Sudetenland to Hitler in the hope that Hitler would be appeased and end his further territorial ambitions. The UK PM at that time talked about things going on “in a country far away of which we know nothing.” That was the Wermacht invading, among others, Poland! Sadly, like Zelensky today, the Czech Prime Minister was absent from the negotiation. Hitler went on to gobble up the rest of Czechoslovakia and then Poland. The subsequent war led to 60 million dead. Former Tory leader Ian Duncan Smith is worth listening to. There’s a lesson here. If Trump betrays Ukraine then Taiwan will be next. Then it’ll be back to Europe for the Baltic states, Moldova and so on. NZ – and others – must rearm. Yet not a word from Willis or Luxon.
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February 16, 2025 8:00am
- kowtow
  
  The invasion of Poland came later .
  
  But you’re right .
  
  ‘ Si vis pacem, para bellum.’
  
  That’s the history lesson and it’s much older than Munich .
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:28am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    ‘ Si vis pacem, para bellum.’ = “If you want peace, prepare for war.”
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:41pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Trump wants peace and is preparing for war (IE to win it, if, heavens forbid, that it is required).
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:43pm
- CJames
  
  I do not believe Ukraine can be directly compared to 1938 Czechoslovakia. Even if all the US and European troops went there, it would still be a bloody quagmire with no winners. Better to come up with an agreement that sets hardened borders and is actually defended by the West’s might. Russia will be hurt by any settlement. If Putin has to negotiate a peace, even at the gain of some territory, it will be a regime change there. The country has lost a massive amount of its fighting age men and much of its economy to the war. It won’t be able to rebuild.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:32am
  - AitchW
    
    Don’t underestimate Putin. Even if a deal is struck he’ll be back for more. Unless, of course, he dies whether of old age or defenestration in which case Putin mk 2 will be back.
    
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    February 16, 2025 8:46am
    - Paulus
      
      E Tu Brute, perhaps.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:24am
  - Cassandra
    
    There are some similarities in that the deal has been cooked up by Trump and Putin with Zelensky absent. Informed opinion – Ian Duncan Smith and others – believes that Putin will come back later. With the US absent Europe doesn’t have the wherewithal to stop Russia. And therefore Taiwan becomes more vulnerable.
    
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    February 16, 2025 8:47am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      All well and good Cassandra, but first, the US needs to absent. And that hasn’t happened. Vance’s speech at Munich hit the nail on the head. If they keep moving further and further left toward totalitarianism, then why would the US support them against Putin? They WILL BE Putin. What is it that Europe want the US to defend?
      
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      February 16, 2025 9:28am
      - Matt Long
        
        Zelinksy got a standing ovation for calling for a European Army at the same venue the US VP got the cold shoulder.
        Now that he’s cancelled elections and free speech in Ukraine, he’s the poster child for the global left.
        https://x.com/kaeggen/status/1890746994018177535
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:08pm
    - crikey
      
      What deal? There is no deal yet.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:32am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      No deal has been cooked up at all, how about let’s see how this plays out, Putin is the aggressor, so must start there, they are hardly going to sit down in a room at this stage are they.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:46am
      - AitchW
        
        Surely it’s worthwhile to speculate on what might happen? Or do you suggest that we simply sit back and watch?
        People form opinions or postulate theories then put them out for others to comment on. That’s the point of a general debate is it not?
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:09pm
      - Cassandra
        
        Trump and Putin spoke on the phone for 90 minutes. Both have directed their negotiators to start talking. The deal is underway. Kellogg and co are in Europe, the meeting is, appropriately, in Munich. Quiet week in Dndedin?
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:19pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Presumably the big totalitarian powers will hope and wait for the next lot of grifting airheads to be voted in by a very dumbed-down and demoralised America. If Trump’s cultural revolution succeeds they may be waiting a very very long time.
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:47pm
  - GJM
    
    It starts with the incompetence and timidity of Biden and Europe, especially Germany. The Ukrainians has the Russian forces on the run in the beginning. They were let down by no supply of equipment, and limitations on use. The Himars could not strike with in Russia at staging area. Only a few were provided, etc. Bare in mind, the equipment provided was old and end of life and paid for. There are thousands of M1 tanks sitting in the desert as it is pork barrel politics to keep making them.
    A key part to any military victory is “getting there fastest with the mostest”. It was a squandered opportunity.
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:50pm
- Scott
  
  Thanks for the post Cassandra. I would say three things. First of all isn’t it time to dispense with the “Trump is Hitler” comparisons? That’s done. The American people have heard that and yet they voted for Hitler? The “Trump is Hitler” media personality Joe Scarborough and his wife Mika after the election went to Mara Lago and met with “Hitler” and came back and said he was not such a bad guy after all. So let’s be done with the Trump is Hitler historical comparisons.
  
  Secondly the “Trump will betray Ukraine” idea is completely wrong. Trump wants a peace deal in Ukraine. The rules based international order has condemned Ukraine to endless war. Millions have died. Biden sent enough arms to prop up Ukraine so they could keep fighting right down to the last Ukrainian soldier.
  
  So here’s an idea. Stop endless wars. Trump is rescuing a bad situation. Ukraine cannot win a war with Russia. So a peace deal is the best option.
  
  Finally can we be done with TDS? It’s very old and it’s very wrong. You may not like Trump but his policies are brilliant. Those of us on the centre right watch a guy who’s survived lawfare and two assassination attempts. The man’s been shot. And yet he’s come back and leading the USA like a boss. And the world is going to be a better place because of him.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:43am
  - Cassandra
    
    I was actually comparing Trump to Chamberlain, Scott, but only insofar as Zelenskyy was excluded. I don’t see Trump as Hitler or anyone else. Of course ending this war is desirable but the opinion is that stopping in situ merely rewards aggression and means Russia will come back later. People like Duncan Smith do not believe that Europe will step up if America leaves a vacuum. Talk of moving to 3% is just that, talk. Look at NZ!
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:00am
    - thirteenstars
      
      It’s not America’s job to fill a vacuum. It is certainly in Europe’s interests to support Ukraine by supporting a peace plan that will necessarily be a compromise.
      
      SecDef Hegseth’s comments about the rules around any peacekeeping force are worth noting. No US troops. No UN troops. Only European troops but not as a NATO force, and any attack on those peacekeepers will not trigger the NATO Article 5 mutual aid clause.
      
      That all avoids a lot of entanglements and makes this fully a European problem as it always should have been.
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:37am
      - peterwn
        
        Trump also wants to fill that big vacuum which is north of USA (the contiguous states) and east of Alaska.
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:35pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Europe would have formidable power, if it abandoned wokeness, climate alarmism, and suicidal immigration policies.
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:53pm
  - Paulus
    
    Does not Trumpf’s name derive from his German origin.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:26am
    - pdm
      
      His mother is from the Isle Of Lewis in the Outer Hebrides so that side is more likely Scandinavian.
      
      They (I have a book) say anyone with Isle of Lewis ancestry dates back to Alexander who ruled the Island in the 12th Century AD.
      
      No idea of the Fathers ancestry though – was he American?
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:53pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        German. Name was Drumpf.
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:43pm
- Philview
  
  The American taxpayer is mainly picking up the tab for Ukraine so I understand why the US is saying enough and telling Europe to fund this itself.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:52am
  - Cassandra
    
    Quite right, Phil, but unfortunately few Europeans are stepping up to the plate. Then what? Eventually America will have to bail out Europe again.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:03am
    - Inandout
      
      Cass, no they won’t. I think those days are gone as Europe is dragged back to centre right due to public demand. On a regular basis Germans are being slaughtered by immigrants from Arab countries.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:04am
      - An Old Kiwi
        
        Eg. From https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/czrl51mz7k8o 7 hrs ago:
        “A mother, 37, and her two-year-old daughter have died from injuries they sustained in Thursday’s car attack in the German city of Munich, police say.
        At least 37 people were injured when a car was driven into a crowd of people at a trade union rally.
        The driver was a 24-year-old Afghan asylum seeker, police said, identified in local media as Farhad N.”
        
        An asylum seeker??
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:31pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Another day, another atrocity.
        
        Austria: Villach knife attack leave teenager dead and five wounded. “Suspect” who was arrested at the scene is a 23 year old Syrian male asylum seeker.
        
        http://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cew5v48w54qo
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:46pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Can anyone explain why those people who are alleged “lone wolves” with “mental health issues” who drive a vehicle into a crowd of pedestrians are almost always self professed believers of one certain religion?
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:02pm
- Gussy Fink-Nottle
  
  I must’ve missed the bit where Czechoslovakia was formerly part of the German Empire, Britain involved itself in Czechoslovakian elections and started the process of absorbing it into the British Empire.
  Perhaps it’s not compatible at all.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:50am
  - kowtow
    
    GFN
    
    Oddly enuff Czechoslovakia had recently been part of the Austro Hungarian Empire , so was actually more ‘German ” than many people realise.
    And the Sudetenland was ethnically actually German . Until its Soviet/Russian conquest when there was an actual genocide of the ethnic Germans who lived behind the I on Curtain in what had been very old ands settled communities.
    
    Clearing whole populations out of conquered territories is not exactly a novel idea , nor indeed to many people , strangely , not even repugnant ( depending on who they are of course).
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:49am
    - Gussy Fink-Nottle
      
      Kowtow,
      I know it’s all a bit Teutonic, but the Austro-Hungarian Empire ≠ the German Empire.
      I don’t think Czechoslovakia in 1938 is equivalent to Ukraine in 2022.
      The ‘West’ could have done a lot more to prevent this latest disaster. Arguably, they encouraged it.
      And no-one is telling me how a total defeat of Russia and restoration of all pre-2014 (or even 2022) territories will actually be achieved.
      I’m not a Putin apologist. I do live in the real world though.
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:35pm
    - pdm
      
      Yep Kowtow – The Clearances in the North of Scotland and the Hebrides in the late 1800’s.
      
      Affected both my fathers family on Lewis and more so mrspdm family as her relatives were from the area around Tongue. We have seen the site of a slate factory owned by her relatives that had to be abandoned.
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:59pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Trumpie’s mum was from Tong.
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tong,_Lewis
        
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        February 16, 2025 6:12pm
- backster
  
  Or Hipkins
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:23am
- Handyman
  
  The Munich deal was to buy time for England to rearm.
  
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  February 16, 2025 12:34pm
- Justitia
  
  There are no easy answers. Putin is a thug intent on reconstructing the Soviet empire. At the same time NATO will not fight for Ukraine and Putin knows that. A deal may stop the killing for now, and buy some time. But without regime change in Russia it will remain a threat, just as China, North Korea and Iran will also continue to be. Such threats can only be addressed by deterrence which makes the cost of aggression far more painful than any benefits to be gained. The US has made it clear it expects those who rely on its security guarantee, explicitly or implicitly (as in New Zealand’s case since the break-up of ANZUS), to step up and contribute far more to collective deterrence. Just imagine how far the estimated $24 billion Luxon wants to spend overseas on “carbon credits” to address a non-existent problem, could go towards equipping and training an effective defence force for this country.
  
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  February 16, 2025 12:43pm
- Frank the tank
  
  The latest ‘reckons’ from the global establishment against their bogeyman Trump. Maybe, maybe not. Some significant leaps in logic however.
  
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  February 16, 2025 12:46pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Peter Williams made a submission to the Justice Select committee on the Treaty Principles Bill.

It was via zoom.
The Maori Party MP Takuta Ferris picked his nose and ate food throughout (gross viewing)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lg1mQLYs-dE

Then he asked a question of sorts wondering if Peter Williams knew that the Treaty of Waitangi wasn’t the Democracy of Waitangi.

(if you can’t face the nasal excavation practices of Ferris, here’s a written version of Peter William’s submission)

https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2025/02/15/peter-williams-my-submission-on-the-treaty-principles-bill/#comments
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February 16, 2025 8:16am
- Scooter
  
  Just posted also. I was thinking that maybe he should have used that thing around his neck, might have been more effective. Seriously what what in there that he had to keep picking at?
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:26am
- Scott
  
  I enjoyed a couple of weeks holiday in Christchurch recently. We went for a stroll through the Botanic Gardens. We were greeted with this sign –
  “Haere mai. Welcome to Te Mara Huaoto o Waipapa,
  Christchurch Botanic Gardens”
  The Christchurch Botanic Gardens are totally the creation of western civilisation. But somehow it now has a Maori name that comes before its actual name!?
  
  Christchurch was settled by Anglicans from England who created the city and built the cathedral. There never was a city of any description prior to colonisation. There was maybe a small maori village? Yet when we watch the weather on TV1 or 3 the name of Christchurch is preceded by “Otautahi”. “The Christchurch City Council informally uses Ōtautahi to acknowledge the city’s shared history.”
  
  Then coming back on the ferry the captain announced we were landing not in Wellington but in “Te Whanganui o Tara Wellington.”
  
  The use of Maori names and Maori words is a way of showing that you are an enlightened person. That you are a good person. These decisions to use Maori names have happened throughout society at council level, in the administration of public spaces and even critical infrastructure like ferries.
  
  It’s hard for Luxon and National to go too hard in the direction of reversing these changes without the support of the public. Many many NZers support the Maorification of NZ. I wish they didn’t but they do.
  
  I think Luxon’s done a lot. To do too much is political suicide for National. I disagree with many on this blog. Not because I support cogovernance, I don’t. But because I believe what’s needed is a major cultural shift back towards the idea that we are all NZers with the same rights and responsibilities. That work is going to take more than one term.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:32am
  - Souvlaki
    
    I agree with your last sentence. However, we do not need to ‘progress’ in the glacial fashion that Luxon chooses too!
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:06am
  - Cassandra
    
    Yes, but….., Scott. It’s quite possible that National will only get one term. I take your point about frightening the horses but so far all that has done is shift the polls to the left. There are no signs whatsoever that National is doing anything about the petty Maorification l
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:07am
    - PeeJay
      
      I suspect that National almost took it as banked in that they would have something like three terms to manage Labour’s mess, hence the somewhat glacial pace – don’t spook the horses, slowly catchy monkey etc. As you rightly point out, there is a real risk they could be a one term government.
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:24am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        No wonder with rotten media. Look at the paywalled herald article headline, government has an absolute shocking week, or words to that effect, apart from Seymour’s stunt, can anyone tell me what went wrong? New cancer drugs announced, one of the two mills saved in the north, the later meat poll still has the coalition ahead, what went wrong for them this week?
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:05pm
      - peterwn
        
        National has never had a one term or even two term government. Labour has managed both on four different occasions.
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:37pm
      - AitchW
        
        I’m astounded that the same people who voted National et al in to clean up the mess that Labour created are now considering returning Labour because National isn’t cleaning up the mess fast enough. Talk about turkeys voting for an early Christmas!
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:13pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        The “later meat poll”?
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:49pm
  - Pineapple Lumps
    
    Scott – if you are going to turn this around you need to do it on many levels but you also need to do it bravely and publicly:
    
    1. At a leadership level – have a clear vision of the way it needs to be and communicate these concepts clearly eg equality, a land of opportunities for all who work hard …
    2. At a policy level – remove statements that work against the vision. Benedict has highlighted many of these and how if you want a public service job you must be prepared to agree to the Te Ao Maori religious world view, subscribe to the belief that Maori are in a partnership with the crown etc
    3. At an organisational level, make sure all people appointed to positions of leadership are aligned with the vision
    
    You need to also remember that the activist minority are not the voice of the people and the majority will actually buy into a vision that is built on fair and sound principles. Have the confidence this is one of the reasons, one of the main reasons that NZers voted him into power.
    
    I’m not sure about Luxon’s leadership – is he not sorting this out because he is scared to create upset or is it that he supports much of the Maorification and ethnostate agenda? Clearly as the PM he won’t achieve a new vision for NZ if he doesn’t start to share it more explicitly.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:10am
    - Mark Hanley
      
      Scott and pineapple, thanks for your considered, intelligent comments.
      
      Pineapple, your points are excellent. I would rearrange them slightly.
      
      1. Have a clear vision…. DONE.
      Here is the vision articulated by Luxon on waitangi day.
      Progressing Crown-Māori relations also means removing areas of overreach by the previous Government – like co-governance of public services. Creating complex new bureaucracies and centralisation in Wellington will not fix anything.
      
      I want a New Zealand where those kids – Māori and non-Māori – see opportunity right here at home. And that means driving economic growth, and creating a culture of yes rather than no.
      
      2. make sure all people appointed to positions of leadership are aligned with the vision.
      
      Changing personnel must happen before the vision is realized. This process is quietly underway. Charter schools remove the department of education influence.
      The health unions are bemoaning thousnds of planned layoffs.
      The top cops have been replaced.
      Etc.
      
      3. Change policy and operational procedures.
      Hasn’t Erica Stanford done a remarkable job rolling out the new back to basics curriculum with the maori hocus pocus removed.
      
      Much more of this background work will come to light in the next 2 years.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:13am
      - Paulus
        
        But in respect of Erica Stamford do you expect the Education Departement and their Teachers will take any real notice of it, after all free lunches is more important, and they do not like the new menu either.
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:42pm
      - Taieri
        
        1. Progressing Crown-Māori relations
        —–
        
        Time to dispense with all this “Crown” nonsense. It’s not a “Crown”, it’s the New Zealand Government. Administering this country on behalf of ALL New Zealanders and that includes Maori.
        
        2. make sure all people appointed to positions of leadership are aligned with the vision
        ———
        “planned lay offs”, “top cops replaced”.
        Not enough!!!!
        
        3.Hasn’t Erica Stanford done a remarkable job rolling out the new back to basics curriculum with the maori hocus pocus removed
        ———–
        
        Read the latest from Rodney Hide.
        https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/rodney-hide-schooling-through-a-te-ao-maori-lens
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:51pm
      - Pope Punctilious II
        
        Has the “Maori hocus pocus” been removed from the science curriculum Mark?
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:54pm
      - Mark Hanley
        
        The proof is in the pudding. Kids are largely back in school, the back to basics curriculum has been rolled out with the relevant teaching material
        
        With the rise of the charter schools, public sector teaches will hasten their demise if they don’t lift their game.
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:20pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        And luxons team already fixed education, fixed crime, fixed the fiscal mess, fixed inflation, and maintained majority support.
        
        Luxon is a genius.
        
        [Mod – leave the personal rubbish out of it]
        
        WRT to education Taieri has already pointed you to Rodney Hide’s story of his 13 year daughter’s recent experience at Wakatipu High school, Schooling Through a Te Ao Maori Lens. Here’s the key sections for you to ponder at the halfway mark of your “genius’s” term:
        
        Last week my 13-year-old at Wakatipu High studied in English “An introduction to culture and identity in literature”.
        …
        One of the links to study was the YouTube clip, “How colonisers went from learning te reo Māori to trying to exterminate it”. University of Victoria sociolinguist Dr Vini Olsen-Reeder states: Once the pakeha government was established here, from there the desire grew to exterminate the Maori people.
        
        Rawiri Waititi is in it as well. There’s no debate permitted on this either, for a very simple reason:
        
        The purpose was to see the world through a Te Ao Māori lens. The genocidal claims must be accepted. To do otherwise would be to see the world through the coloniser’s lens.
        …
        The propaganda achievement is extraordinary. History is upended and inverted. Maori are holocaust victims. Pakeha are violent Nazi oppressors. And don’t dare question the narrative.
        
        As Rodney points out (which I didn’t know) about Ms Standford:
        
        Ms Stanford has a BA with honours from Auckland University. She majored in Political Science. And minored in Maori Studies.
        
        She’s hasn’t stopped this Critical Theory crap because she’s steeped in it.
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:51pm
      - Mark Hanley
        
        The obvious solution to some schools continuing the colonizer claptrap, is charter schools.
        
        Give parents choice and they will keep their children away from schools spouting nonsense.
        
        I am constantly forced to explain the bleedingky obviously..
        
        1. The vision is clear and articulated well, the actions are planned and reported every quarter, it doesn’t take much reading to answer/counter most of the unreasonable criticisms.
        
        2. It takes time to change an organisation as large as the nz government.
        
        [Mod – just debate the topics]
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:25pm
  - Dougal10
    
    I live in a place with a maori name , it has always had a maori name , most of this new stuff is virtue signaling crap. When settlers created a new village it got named when they moved into a spot that already had a name they were more than happy to use it.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:31am
    - pdm
      
      Places I have lived in NZ since birth until leaving High School, with no name changes needed.
      Mangaorapa, Porangahau (living with grandparents to start school), Onga Onga, Tikokino, Waipukurau
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:04pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        No place like CHB!
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:50pm
    - Sparrow
      
      Quite right. The discussion over the years has the Māori place name got an H or not. A lot of time and energy wasted over the years about an H. I hope they change Russell back to its original name more challenging pronunciation but a great colourful and rich history. Personally I love living in a place with a Māori name instead of some unknown colonial administrators name, or worse the town you left to seek a better life.
      
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      February 16, 2025 3:48pm
  - Jack5
    
    The Christchurch City Council is Widely Woke!
    Though the Maori population is small it continues to push Maori language on to its citizens.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:35am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      The proportion of Maori in Christchurch is only slightly lower than the average nationally. They just live almost exclusively in parts of the city not visited by tourists. Or wealthy residents for that matter.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:53pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Been a long time since I’ve spent time in ChCh. When I was there the (part) “Maori” I interacted with were moderate and decent people. I didn’t experience any of the “what the F are you looking at c&*t? Want a smack in the head?” feral stuff that I commonly experienced while minding my own business in the Nth Island.
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:42pm
      - Jack5
        
        At the 2018 census, the proportion of Christchurch’s population that identifies as European (82 per cent) was significantly higher than in New Zealand as a whole (70 per cent).
        
        https://www.ecan.govt.nz/your-region/living-here/regional-leadership/population/culture-and-identity/
        
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        February 17, 2025 1:18am
  - Cantabrian
    
    It gets worse. Descendents of those who arrived on the first four ships wanted to hold an event to celebrate the 175th anniversary of their arrival. The CCC and 6 Ngai Tahu groups refused to support it. The council claimed that they had a ‘broader’ perspective these days that acknowledged the ‘harm’ caused by colonization. Yet I’m sure if a Ngai Tahu group wanted support for some event the Council would be right there.
    I agree with you on changing the name of Christchurch. It is completely inappropriate. In 1861 there were only 500 Ngai Tahu in Canterbury. Most of them lived at Kaiapoi and scattered villages on Banks Peninsula.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:37am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Perhaps the colonisers could report crimes from the Chatham Islands
      
      7 0
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      February 16, 2025 12:08pm
    - Paulus
      
      Ngai Tahu want and appear to be getting almost all of the South Island anyway.
      
      6 0
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      February 16, 2025 1:43pm
    - kowtow
      
      The Ngai Tahu were themselves invading , marauding “incomers” from the NI .
      
      6 0
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      February 16, 2025 1:51pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Would Ngai Tahi be experiencing their current wealth without “colonisation”?
      
      Nope, they’d be eking out a crapola existence, neolithic style.
      
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      February 16, 2025 4:54pm
  - pdm
    
    ` Many many NZers support the Maorification of NZ’.
    
    Do they Scott?
    
    I don’t think so.
    
    It is more that they put up with it because they are apathetic and think standing against it is too difficult. A malaise that has afflicted Western Society through out the World for a long time.
    
    We can only hope things will change as the World follows Milei and Trump. Dutton winning in Australia might help us.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:01am
    - Bridgenag
      
      Yes Loved that he was booed in Woolongong
      
      5 3
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      February 16, 2025 11:11am
    - Scott
      
      pdm- that’s the question. How much support does the Maorification of NZ really have?
      I agree that National has lost support because of it but not for the reason you think. I think the uproar around the Treaty Principles bill has upset the soft National voter and led to a loss of support. Act is OK because they only need 10% of voters who are more on the right and won’t go anywhere else. But National needs at least 30% support and that includes the weak and the woke and those who are inspired by Maori wonderfulness.
      
      Lastly I would say that support for Maorification includes every newspaper in NZ, every TV journalist, almost every radio journalist and the majority of internet based news sites. Also every school and university, the entirety of the Greens, Maori Party and the Labour Party. Also from what I can tell every local council and most of the corporates including Air NZ who are happy to give a lecture on Maori mythology on all occasions possible. Even the NZ police have Maori mythology on their front doors and every govt dept appears to be fully woke and loves all things Maori.
      
      So that’s a lot. Maorification is not an 80/ 20 issue. I don’t know the exact number but it’s a lot.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:15pm
      - Justitia
        
        And I think the taste for Maorification, which has been imposed from the top-down along with Critical Race Theory, will evaporate when the ripples of the Trump tsunami eventually wash up on our shores. It’s Woke virtue signaling devoid of substance.
        
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        February 16, 2025 5:46pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Yes I agree. I’ll give you an analogy. Politicians fell for “most folk in Christchurch want the Christchurch cathedral restored”.
      
      No no no. It was perhaps 20 percent. However that 20 percent was maniacal. They never quit. Cajoled and lobbied relentlessly. Of course they got their way. $150 million later they have a cordoned off wreck which will probably stay that way for the rest of my life, at least.
      
      You think a “majority” of public servants want to recite karakia every week? Of course not. They are literally being held hostage on pain of career destroying retaliation for non compliance.
      
      That National has allowed this behavior to flourish is unforgivable. TBH they deserve to be a one term government. It might take that for them to reflect on what went wrong. The first 6 months of their office should have been a blitzkrieg.
      
      Apologies for a meandering comment.
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:02pm
  - Paulus
    
    Everything from 16% of the population will be made to reflect the greatness of the master race.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:28am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Agreed, and the financial sabotage by Labour is also going to take a very long time to fix, I am astounded that people want Hipkins back in polls, although I think that will change as the economy improves, farming receipts alone are far far stronger than predicted, beef and Lamb up $2.50 a KG and Dairy above $10, there will be a huge increase in tax alone, surely that higher tax shows through at the budget
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:55am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Sorry to disappoint. Agriculture represents just over 5 percent of GDP.
      
      https://www.statista.com/statistics/375601/new-zealand-gdp-distribution-across-economic-sectors/#:~:text=This%20statistic%20shows%20the%20distribution,percent%20from%20the%20service%20sector.
      
      While those trends are welcome, they will not rescue the economy or the budget.
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:07pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        5% of direct agriculture maybe, but all the indirect derivative GDP of people serving the farming communities i.e. the industries and services serving agriculture, is a lot lot higher.
        
        Transport, manufacturing, services, processing, software, veterinary, and all the services that supply to the people in those industries.
        
        Supermarkets, butchers, greengrocers, bakers, wool carpet makers, garment manufacturers, machinery manufacturers, timber merchants, kitchens and joinery makers, etc, etc, etc, would all become like “pubs with no beer”.
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:28pm
  - PurplePen
    
    “Many many NZers support the Maorification of NZ. I wish they didn’t but they do.”
    
    While many do, I wonder if that many are a minority. It appears like a majority but maybe that’s just a result of MSM, govt agencies and some corporations use of Manglish. In day-to-day life I don’t really come across it at the dairy, butcher, supermarket, any of the big box shops, my GP, dentist, friends, general interactions with the public.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:44pm
    - Mr T
      
      A very good question, how many support the maorifcation of nz. A good poll question for David Farrar, too much, about right, not enough etc.
      Ne really good to get a current snap shot.
      I’m guessing about 75% in the too much group ,but who knows. Age breakdown stats would show how schools and universities have indoctrinated the young
      
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      February 16, 2025 6:56pm
  - Justitia
    
    This is Luxon speaking to Ngai Tahu at Akaroa on Waitangi Day:
    
    “The Treaty is central to the history of New Zealand, and it is central to our future.
    
    The Government’s role is to honour the Treaty, work in partnership with Māori, and ensure that the country continues in a spirit of Kotahitanga.
    
    When Ngāi Tahu signed the Treaty of Waitangi in 1840, there was hope for partnership and protection.”
    
    The very idea of a “partnership” between Maori and the Crown, a fallacy resulting from Justice Cooke’s unfortunate metaphor in 1987, is that it renders all those without Maori ancestry effectively as second class citizens. Seymour has pointed this out on numerous occasions, the Ministry of Justice has advised the government that the “partnership status” of Maori means discrimination in their favour in healthcare and against other ethnicities trumps the Bill of Rights Act, and Luxon is surely aware of all this.
    
    I do not believe that Luxon is fit to be Prime Minister. National must roll him as soon as possible or all is lost in 2026.
    
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    February 16, 2025 5:28pm
    - Quail
      
      100% correct Justitia.
      NZ is at a cross roads and 2026 will be too late
      
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      February 16, 2025 7:50pm
- CJames
  
  Broadcasting Ferris and his infantile behaviour is some of the best advertising the right can get. Look how Trump destroyed Kamala just by ads showing her speaking.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:34am
  - Philview
    
    Ideally but these sorts of things will not filter through the media.
    
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    February 16, 2025 8:55am
  - AitchW
    
    Remember that his infantile behaviour, his peacocking in the house, his repetitive parroting of the colonialist paradigm, and his blatant lies are all straight out of the Maori Party playbook and will resonate with the activist and dissatisfied Maori and liberal left.
    They will shore up his support among te Tangata Tiriti, those who see through the posturing would never have supported him anyway.
    
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    February 16, 2025 8:56am
    - goNZ1
      
      how do we know he is Maori anyway? I went to school with Ferris kids,they were Greeks.
      Same with that guy Helmut Modlik that has a lot to say on behalf of TPM.Sounds like east German to me.
      Who is Maori these days, I saw the opening of parliament last year and most of the Maori war dance party were as pale as the moon!
      The whole thing is a rort , and all the moko in the world and cowboy hats in parliament don’t wash with quite a few of us now.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:04am
      - pdm
        
        One of his Aunts, Atereta Sciascia has a full pakeha maternal grandmother and is of Italian extraction on the Sciascia side.
        
        There was a TV documentary a few years ago of the Sciascia families from Horowhenua and Porangahau on a pilgrimage (for want of a better word) to Italy to visit family there. Many had gone as individuals previously.
        
        Disclaimer: I am not sure if the relationship between Ferris and Atereta Sciascia is a direct bloodline or through marriage.
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:12pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Ferris is from Porangahau.
        
        His mother is a Sciascia.
        https://whaiacreation.com/aunty-te-raina/
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:36pm
      - PurplePen
        
        You can tell he’s clearly Maori by the big carving hanging round his neck.
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:46pm
  - Cantabrian
    
    With his European surname I wonder how Maori he really is? Another Debbie Packer?
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:41am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Hipkins needs to be asked more about dealing with TPM, about his now support of a treaty commissioner that he originally said was off the table, and the tax theft coming our way if the unthinkable happens
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:10pm
- TripeWryter
  
  I watched the video.
  Peter Williams said pretty much what I would have said. And I think more people who were born here should assert that they are indigenous to this land.
  If we’re born here how can we not be indigenous?
  As for the nose-picker – did he embarrass his mother? Would she have liked to have seen her son acting like an 8 year-old?
  He is becoming as ridiculous as the pompous, puffed-up, thin-skinned under-achieving Ricardo ‘you’re not in Mexico now’.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:36am
  - PurplePen
    
    I think the TPM enjoy and get a kick out of winding up and confusing or shocking the public, much like a teenager does with their parents and authority. They should be given no attention whatever.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:48pm
- Gravelroad
  
  Mr Ferris is not an impressive politician.
  His childish behaviour brings himself, his political party and his workplace (parliament) into disrepute.
  If he has no respect for others, why should I respect him and his demands?
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:41am
  - Cassandra
    
    He’s not after your vote. Unless NZ gets rid of race-based seats he’s there for life.
    
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    February 16, 2025 8:59am
    - Jack5
      
      The Tirikatene clan held the Southern Maori seat (now Tai Tonga) for four-fifths of the last century of so, and may be keen to win it back from Ferris.
      
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      February 16, 2025 9:45am
      - gravedodger
        
        Achieving exactly what Jack? please share.
        
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        February 16, 2025 10:19am
      - AitchW
        
        Gd, power, mana, baubles, cash, koha, lucrative government contracts….
        Look at Mahutacorp for an example.
        
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        February 16, 2025 10:42am
      - Jack5
        
        Achieving what? A nonsensical question. But ….
        
        If Rino Tirikatene, who lost the seat to Ferris, cannot be persuaded to return from retirement, surely other gifted Tirikatene are up for a political fight.
        
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        February 16, 2025 10:46am
      - Jethrod
        
        Perhaps the Sullivan segment of the family could take an interest in Southern Maori seat.
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:43pm
  - Paulus
    
    Do you really think he could care less ?
    – he is getting the Foreman’s Job at last.
    
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    February 16, 2025 9:03am
    - AitchW
      
      Probably the best paying job he’s ever had or will ever have again. The dole on steroids….
      
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      February 16, 2025 9:15am
      - David Garrett
        
        Aitch: Whaddya mean “probably “? Who would employ such an oaf for other than minimum wage or not much more?
        
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        February 16, 2025 10:44am
      - pdm
        
        Aitch – he says he has two degrees from the `Colonial’ University.
        
        How do we confirm that because I do not believe anything he says.
        
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        February 16, 2025 11:07am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Who would employ such an oaf for other than minimum wage or not much more?
        
        Sadly, my old Uni employed him
        https://www.massey.ac.nz/about/news/new-m%C4%81ori-advisor-for-massey/
        
        But Massey is a very changed institution these days from the Agricultural-centred place I encountered in the 1970s.
        
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        February 16, 2025 11:42am
  - Eastlander
    
    The people who want him as their representative do not belong in a civilised country.
    
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    February 16, 2025 9:06am
  - AitchW
    
    Which of the Maori Party MPs is an impressive politician? I can’t think of one.
    And please, please don’t nominate the young lady who tore up the TPB then led the eye rolling,arm waving and finger shooting.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:17pm
- Yvette
  
  Shane Jones has accused Te Pāti Māori MP Tākuta Ferris of showing contempt for Parliament by apologising only in te reo Māori after being found in contempt by the Privileges Committee.
  Ferris stood by his apology, saying it meant more in te reo Māori than in English. He added that his party’s stance would continue to “agitate” and that Māori had long fought to be heard in Parliament.
  https://centrist.nz/shane-jones-criticises-takuta-ferris-for-not-apologising-in-english-after-privileges-committee-report/?
  
  Hansard – Privilege — Consideration of Report of Privileges Committee—Conduct of Tākuta Ferris
  PERSONAL EXPLANATIONS, Privileges Committee Report—Member Conduct
  TĀKUTA FERRIS (Te Pāti Māori—Te Tai Tonga): Tēnā koe e te Pīka. Ēnei kōrero ki te reo Māori. Ki tā ngā kōrero nāku i roto i te tautohetohe whānui i te 18 o Hepetema i te tau kua taha ake nei. Nāku ētahi kōrero whakapōrearea i te Whare. Nā ka tangohia aua kōrero. Ka whakapāha atu ki te Whare, tēnā tātou.
  
  [Thank you, Mr Speaker. I’d like to speak in te reo Māori. In regards to what I had said in the general debate on 18 September last year, I had expressed words that had upset the House. I withdraw what was said and apologise to the House. Thank you.]
  https://www.parliament.nz/mi/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20250213_20250213_28/.
  
  I am wondering if, in saying “it meant more in te reo Māori than in English”, Takuta Ferris may have uttered another mistruth in responding to accusations he had wrongfully claimed other politicians were responsible for mistruths.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:54am
  - pdm
    
    `Māori had long fought to be heard in Parliament.’
    
    Difficult to be heard if you are suspended from Parliament which will probably happen if he offends again.
    
    Then again the MSM will lap it up and give him extended coverage.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:10am
    - G152
      
      The numbers of Maori in all political parties in Parliament proves the ‘no voice’ claim to be a blatant lie
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:32am
      - AitchW
        
        Obviously either not Maori enough or the wrong sort of Maori…..
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:18pm
- kowtow
  
  Debbie packer’s St Valentines take.
  
  From facebook.
  
  ‘Today we celebrate an indigenous love story that is taking down a coloniser who brought nothing but disease and death across the pacific’
  
  Accompanied by picture of the murder of Capt Cook.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:20am
  - Eastlander
    
    Something the Maoris conspicuously failed to do!
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:59am
  - jacthecat
    
    Guess who said this ‘It makes some people squirm, but I think it’s okay to be colonised. Because when we bring about what could have been, it was perhaps a marriage and a balance between Māori and settlers.’.
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:26pm
    - jacthecat
      
      The answer? … why, it was Debbie Packer herself. Fancy that.
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:40pm
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  Eating and nose picking during a hui must surely be a breach of tikanga!
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:29am
  - kowtow
    
    Thank goodness he wasn’t eating his nose pickings .
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:51am
    - pdm
      
      As far as could be seen – the camera was not always on him.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:11am
- Pineapple Lumps
  
  Ferris and TPM demonstrating what the country will become if the advancement of the maori ethnostate continues. They are providing a more powerful display of why we need the TPB than the actual submissions.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:39am
  - pdm
    
    Then there is this in Urewera Country;
    https://nominister.wordpress.com/2025/02/16/this-is-what-co-governance-will-look-like-throughout-new-zealand/
    
    No surprise really.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:12am
    - AndyW
      
      Look at the state South Africa’s in….I’m afraid we’re heading down that path too.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:35am
- thirteenstars
  
  Ferris was perhaps acting out his disrespect, though (and I don’t normally make observations like this) I’ve known a few Maori who having been brought up in a particular kind of environment have a habit of nose picking as well as a incessant eye rubbing.
  
  It’s bogan behaviour regardless of your ethnicity and is right up there with belching, farting and eating with one’s mouth open, which Ferris also practises.
  
  About all he didn’t do was drop his pants and slap his arse at the camera.
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:51am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    For Melbournians on public transport, shameless public nose picking seems to be a common enough past time. Even had one guy sitting next to me rub his boogers off on a bus curtain. I guess it’s a certain class of people known as “grubs” that spans many ethnicities. Another reason I avoid public transport unless I’m desperate.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:50pm
- Ghost
  
  Itchy nose needs a good scratching….
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:55am
  - Inandout
    
    Ghost, I remember as a kid being told I must have stomach worms if I was twitchy or had an itchy bottom.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:13am
Notsofast

The storming of the drag show in Te Atatu depriving an audience of their event reminded me of the storming of the band rotunda in Albert Park depriving an audience of their event.
Of course, the Green party laments one of these but supported and was active in the other.
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February 16, 2025 8:17am
- Pineapple Lumps
  
  Also, when the Green Party coleader, advocate for violence against Israel, and the legacy media are saying punches were thrown, children were terrorised, do you actually believe them?
  
  Show me the evidence!
  
  They have never condemned the extremely violent assault of an elderly lady at the Posie Parker protest.
  
  They are despicable hypocrites that cannot be trusted.
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:15am
  - David Garrett
    
    WHO cannot be trusted old boy…”that” is for animals and inanimate objects.
    
    9 3
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    February 16, 2025 10:46am
    - Pineapple Lumps
      
      DG sorry my English skills are so bad I don’t get the correction. I’m a product of the failed theory of ‘process writing’. This theory was prevalent in primary schools in the 70’s and 80’s.
      
      Hopefully, the point I was trying to make it is clear: neither Chloe Schwarbrick nor the Herald can be trusted with telling us the truth of what went on.
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:56am
      - David Garrett
        
        Pineapple: Of course your intent was clear mate…I am just an old pedant who learned the Queen’s English in the 1960’s. I can’t help myself! No offence intended.x
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:14pm
      - AitchW
        
        DG, surely you mean the King’s English?
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:19pm
    - thirteenstars
      
      Oh, cut it out, David. You made at least three grammatical errors in your reply.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:06am
    - Inandout
      
      DG, your explanation would suffer if reference were made to that school teacher who dressed as a cat and made pussy sounds.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:18am
    - alwyn.a
      
      “”that” is for animals “.
      I accept your statement. However, can you please tell why you object to the statement PL wrote? It seems quite appropriate to me.
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:30pm
      - kowtow
        
        I understand these days that pets are to be considered members of the family . Logicallythen in these irrational times they too deserve a who , not a that .
        
        Can’t hurt their feelings or those of their fellow human being family members.
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:06pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      English always struck me as being a highly illogical dog’s breakfast. Perhaps that’s why I never really took enough interest in all it’s intricacies during my school daze.
      
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      February 16, 2025 3:54pm
    - GJM
      
      Animals? Yup that checks out as being correct.
      
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      February 16, 2025 6:44pm
Bridgenag

Psychological Bioterrorism
Play it again, Sam. Play “Bird Flu”.

“We need to learn to protect ourselves from the economic, social, and psychological damage that is caused by permitting psychological bioterrorism. This is truly a crime against humanity, and one which can only be stopped when politicians with integrity and the general public become aware that they are being manipulated, refuse to play along, and socially, economically, and politically shun those who promote and deploy psychological bioterrorism.”

https://open.substack.com/pub/rwmalonemd/p/psychological-bioterrorism-ebb?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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February 16, 2025 8:17am
- Chuck Bird
  
  Climate change hysteria works in a similar way.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:27am
- imalwaysright
  
  According to the Terrorism Suppression Act, Adern, Bloomfield and their regime seem to qualify as terrorists.
  
  https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2002/0034/latest/DLM152702.html
  
  Calling it bioterrorism is a bit weak. Its terrorism.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:34am
- NK
  
  It’s remarkable to think that USAID funding made the Corona virus in the Wuhan lab. Then USAID funded media told us all the V was safe and effective while those who contributed to making the virus (politicians in the USA) locked us down, forced everyone to wear masks, and mandated the V on us all.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:44am
  - Yvette
    
    In Wuhan, doctors “noticed that most cases were linked to the wet market.” The market is about as far from the lab as JFK airport is from Times Square. If a bomb goes off in Times Square, how do you explain most victims being at JFK?
    
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    February 16, 2025 9:12am
    - NK
      
      It doesn’t need explaining, Yvette. Indeed, explanations and critical thinking were punished and censored. You were told what happened and were ordered and forced to comply with the “cures”.
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:01am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      I landed at JFK and as you say it’s a bit of a distance, it was a one hour drive to New Jersey, which is about 5 mins from the Hudson River
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:15pm
  - Paulus
    
    It pays the Chinese to allude to the fact that USAID funded the Virus, so its the fault of the USA after all.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:49pm
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  Before reading, I think everyone should wash their hands, put on two masks, get another toxic booster, and put on a tin foil hat.
  Psychological Bioterrorism must be where “Safe and Effective, JA.” came from.
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:31am
Bridgenag

GOLDEN AGE
THE AMERICAN RENAISSANCE

Interesting essay

https://open.substack.com/pub/eko/p/golden-age?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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February 16, 2025 8:21am
- hookerphil
  
  “California unleashes advanced technology unburdened by corruption.”
  That’s a big ask.
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:52am
- Northshoredoc
  
  Well that was a waste of 5 minutes. It reminded me of a trite piece of nonsense you might read from a third form writing competition.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:15am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Northshoredoc can you name the three news sources you respect the most?
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:59pm
    - Northshoredoc
      
      The reads I enjoy the most are The Economist and The Spectator.
      
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      February 16, 2025 7:09pm
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  “Governor of Canada”
  It’s a blueprint. I think it is.
  Republics. Not sure about Texas and Florida but California are free to float away and take all of their Democrats with them.
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:40am
- sungsamning
  
  That was a good read. Thanks for the link.
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:31pm
Scooter

The main thing I have taken from watching the TPB select committee videos is not so much the arguments, although obviously important but the reactions from both sides. When the group for the bill give their speech they are interrupted, shouted at and in Ferris’s case shows his lack of class, a monkey/pig would have better manners. Whereas I haven’t seen any bad behaviour from the other side.

Video of Ferris during Peter Williams speech, and we pay him to represent some in parliament. Advise descretion.

https://youtu.be/lg1mQLYs-dE?si=RYNjPk60oHFzE-jt
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February 16, 2025 8:23am
- PurplePen
  
  I’ve just twigged TPB is Treaty Principles Bill and not a typo resulting from TPM! I’m slow to the game.
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:01pm
TripeWryter

I have just been reading the story in The New Zealand Herald about alleged violent activity against LGB etc etc people in Auckland by members of Destiny Church.
I have questions about the reporting and the reporter, Raphael Franks.
Was he at the Te Atatu library when Destiny men and boys ’stormed’ and punched and barged their way in and disrupted an event hosted by a drag queen.
Going by his story it seems he wasn’t.
If Franks wasn’t there to witness it then he must have been quoting people. Presumably those people would have been connected to the Auckland Pride event.
Who did he quote? He doesn’t say.
The New Zealand Herald has form here in how it covers stories connected to LGB etc etc matters.
It was one of those media outlets that misled the public about Posie Parker’s attempted address in Auckland, which included having the belief that men assaulting women was almost acceptable.
A trans bully, Shaneel Lal, was one of its columnists.
So it’s about the reporting.
To be clear I am not necessarily against LGB etc etc people as individuals.
I have a gay cousin, who I’ll be seeing tomorrow. He’s a Republican in the US.
I have a trans nephew who is happy with his life and is getting on with it; he refuses to be some kind of poster boy for the cause and he refuses to be a ‘victim’ because so far he is not.
No-one in his circle or where he works gives a shit.
Nor am I any kind of supporter of Brian Tamaki and his church. His church doesn’t fit my picture of what a church should be but then not many churches do.
And I wonder if Jesus is as obsessed with LGB etc etc as Bishop Tamaki and Family First appear to be. Have they even asked Jesus what he thinks?
But that’s all another story.
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February 16, 2025 8:24am
- Morgan H
  
  Destiny Church is a joke. The irony is that their actions usually lead to more people having “progressive views”.
  
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  February 16, 2025 12:12pm
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    Unfortunately I suspect you’re right about the net effect of Destiny’s behaviour on the electorate.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:02pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    I think you’ll find many Christians quietly respect their resolve. That has been my observation with the Christian “fundies” (pentecostals and the like) I know. As for woke “Christians” well yes, that’s a different story.
    
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    February 16, 2025 4:04pm
- AitchW
  
  Shaneel Lal is a thoroughly unlikeable fellow.
  He’s prone to go on vile, foul mouthed rants at those with whom he disagrees, propped up by the smug, superior attitude of those in the rainbow community who believe that their gender bending confers some sort of invisible shield of invincibility and an unassailable moral superiority.
  He’s a perfect fit for the Labour or Green Party.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:48pm
  - PurplePen
    
    A worse version of that NZ comedian that ranted that was at David Seymour’s stand up at Waitangi.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:03pm
- PurplePen
  
  I’m a gay boy as I’ve said a few times on here and I have trouble with the rationale behind having drag kings and queens entertaining children. Why? Especially when in my world or community drag kings and queens have always only ever been adult comedy.
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:06pm
  - Morgan H
    
    I think growing up seeing drag in film and TV I’ve always associated it with funny entertainment rather than something not for kids. Personally, I’d rather kids being taught science by drag queens than being indoctrinated in a church, mosque, or whatever religious organization.
    
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    February 16, 2025 5:18pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Never been to pantomime? From memory, the Widow Twankey was not all she seemed.
    
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    February 16, 2025 6:32pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

These people have no shame. They are exploiting the death of a crocodile bike rider in Martinborough to push their barrow on Waiheke, despite the reason for the accident not yet being established.

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/541997/bikes-speed-and-tourists-an-accident-waiting-to-happen-waiheke-cycle-group
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February 16, 2025 8:36am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Yep NMTB, they have no shame. “It is a scary road to cycle down for a local, let alone a tourist.” Onetangi Rd. I’d suggest that Xan () is talking horseshit, since my wife and I, and friends often bike around Waiheke on ebikes, and have never felt unsafe or that the roads are scary. I’d suggest that Xan () finds an awful lot of things are scary.
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:02am
- JackRabbit
  
  “Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.”
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:12am
sungsamning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I16Cul7BKtA
RFK Jr Plans Complete Healthcare System Reset.
Robert F. Kennedy Jr. takes the helm at HHS, promising a seismic shift in America’s approach to health. From battling the “poisonous” food industry to challenging Big Pharma’s influence, RFK Jr.’s “Make America Healthy Again” initiative is set to redefine public health policy. [Its great to see a Kennedy at the cabinet table for the first time since 1964.]
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February 16, 2025 8:48am
- David Garrett
  
  Sung: RFK is a dangerous nut. His father must be turning in his grave.
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:05am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Why is he a dangerous nut?
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:19am
  - Pineapple Lumps
    
    David it is easy to dismiss someone with a derogatory slur “RFK is a dangerous nut”. Many of your opponents use the same tactic.
    
    If you look at RFK jnrs position more closely he shows with evidence that the public health of Americans is in decline. The average life expectancy of Americans has been declining as the population becomes more obese and impacted by chronic illness such as diabetes and heart disease. He shows that Niaid, the body responsible for public health has been focused on the wrong things to improve public health. They receive most of their funding from the military and CIA and pharmaceutical patents. The latter are often setup to create wealth for the very senior members of Niaid. So it is a broken system, with those entrusted with its leadership corrupted too badly to change.
    
    There is no doubt that American public health has had woeful results over the past 50years. It requires a transformational change and on that basis RFKjnr, who is clearly not part of the establishment, may well be the man to make that change happen.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:39am
    - AitchW
      
      RFK is a lot like the Parson’s egg.
      Yes, some of his policies are, shall we say, controversial, however parts are excellent.
      His efforts to get Americans to improve their their diets and increase physical movement are commendable.
      His views on chemtrails and vaccinations perhaps not quite so good.
      However he’s a huge improvement on the last shower, so slowly slowly catchee monkey.
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:54am
      - David Garrett
        
        Aitch: It was the Curate’s egg old boy…but of course i get ur point…and largely agree with it.
        
        Who can argue that most Americans are eating themselves to deat with super size portions of fast food shit?
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:17pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Let’s have a debate on vaccines again.
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:36pm
      - AitchW
        
        Thank you for the correction DG, accuracy is important.
        I would point out that it’s not only the Americans feasting on enormous portions of fast food. Our very own citizens are, in many cases doing exactly the same thing. All over the Western world cheap, calorie laden convenience foods are often much cheaper and more readily available than nutritious balanced foods. Add to that a reduction in physical activity especially among the young and you get an obesity epidemic.
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:27pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        I’m always amazed at how healthy some Americans look after shoveling so much of that fast food shite into their mouths every day.
        
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        February 16, 2025 4:06pm
    - David Garrett
      
      Oh he may well “make change happen”… Fortunately he wont be there long enough for once dreaded diseases like TB and polio to make a serious comeback.
      
      As for “my opponents” calling me a dangerous nutter, the comparison is ludicrous; i am a has-been politician who once, briefly, attracted a bit of attention in a tiny country at the bottom of the world.
      
      Mr Kennedy literally has the health and well being of hundreds of thousands of American children in his hands.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:03am
      - JackRabbit
        
        Sorry David, I disagree. I’ve been following research from some of the smartest health minds on the planet, for over 35 years, and read thousands of articles, and research. And I have seen the outcomes and results of all sorts of treatments and vaccines.
        
        [1] Polio is a disease, and interestingly enough, not unlike malaria, is caused by insect bites, insects that carry microscopic parasites. And for the record, I have a friend that had polio as a child, and is permanently disabled. And had children in my school that polio.
        
        [2] Polio has been largely eradicated. Even the corrupt Tedros of WHO, has admitted on record, that the new Polio outbreak in Africa, was caused by the Polio vaccine, and that the vaccine has paralysed thousands of children.
        
        [3] It was discovered/theorised in the USA in the early 1920s after extensive research that Polio was most likely a seasonal disease with a bell curve not unlike the flu, but in summer. And not unlike Malaria.
        
        Is Poliomyelitis an Insect-borne Disease?
        https://www.jstor.org/stable/6871
        
        Current thinking is that helminths (parasites) are the cause of 85% of diseases. Parasites also spread by insects are at the root of Ebola, and many other tropical diseases. This is of note, as Modena claimed “success” with mRNA a few years, wiping out the Ebola epidemic in the Congo.
        
        ‘Unqualified failure’ in polio vaccine policy left thousands of kids paralyzed
        https://www.science.org/content/article/unqualified-failure-polio-vaccine-policy-left-thousands-kids-paralyzed
        
        Oral polio vaccine causing paralysis in kids: Study
        https://www.newindianexpress.com/nation/2019/Oct/23/oral-polio-vaccine-causing-paralysis-in-kids-study-2051670.html
        
        Doctors question India’s polio strategy after surge in number of cases
        https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1570019/
        
        An unusual case of vaccine-associated paralytic poliomyelitis
        https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4173946/
        
        You cannot vaccinate against parasites, hydatids, or many other tropical diseases. You can only treat them.
        
        It is common knowledge by doctors in India and Africa, and indeed NZ doctors that spent time volunteering in such countries, that parasites are the major cause of diseases in those countries.
        
        Helminth infections: the great neglected tropical diseases:
        https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2276811/
        
        Global burden of soil-transmitted helminth infections, 1990-2021
        https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/39444032/
        
        The role of helminths in the development of non-communicable diseases
        https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/immunology/articles/10.3389/fimmu.2022.941977/full
        
        Research Agenda for Helminth Diseases of Humans: The Problem of Helminthiases
        https://journals.plos.org/plosntds/article?id=10.1371/journal.pntd.0001582
        
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        February 16, 2025 11:45am
      - Pope Punctilious II
        
        Responding to JackRabbit’s comment below.
        
        Who exactly are these “smartest health minds on the planet” that you claim to have followed for 35 years?They may have led you astray, because your medical knowledge is every bit as muddled as your grasp of history and geography. NO, polio is not spread by insect bites. You’ve cited a speculative paper from 1923 to support your bizarre claim – here’s some more updated info about polio: https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/polio/symptoms-causes/syc-20376512
        
        So “Current thinking is that helminths (parasites) are the cause of 85% of diseases.”? Please clarify: do you mean current thinking in 2025, 1923, or 400BC?
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:28pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        I had to read that three times.
        
        “Polio is a disease, and interestingly enough, not unlike malaria, is caused by insect bites, insects that carry microscopic parasites.”
        
        No polio is caused by the Poliovirus. A vaccine was developed that wiped out polio from most of the world. Polio could have gone the way of Smallpox. However misinformation caused folk in places like Pakistan and Nigeria to refuse the vaccine.
        
        That is the beginning and the end of the story of polio.
        
        Anything else, especially the nonsense that it is spread by insects, is delusion.
        
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        February 16, 2025 6:07pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        especially the nonsense that it is spread by insects, is delusion.
        
        House flies are one of the vectors that can carry the polio virus from human faeces (out-houses, pooey nappies) to the mouth (flies landing on food).
        
        That’s one of the reasons polio outbreaks were so prevalent in summer months when flies were common.
        
        There’s a famous experiment in the 1940s whereby Scientist caught flies:
        
        Last July and August, during polio outbreaks in rural Connecticut and Alabama, and in Cleveland and Atlanta, the doctors trapped thousands of flies in those parts. They mashed up the flies in sterile water or ether, gave it to monkeys in feedings, injections or nosedrops. Down came the monkeys with polio.
        
        https://time.com/archive/6786591/medicine-flies-polio/
        
        THE DETECTION OF POLIOMYELITIS VIRUS IN FLIES COLLECTED DURING EPIDEMICS OF POLIOMYELITIS
        https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2135360/
        
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        February 16, 2025 7:21pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Heard him talking on Friday. He is aiming at chemicals shoved into the food in America, the same foods in Canada do not have these same chemicals, I suggest that may happen here as well
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:19pm
      - AitchW
        
        If you ignore fast and processed foods I think our food here is pretty unadulterated. Of course imported foods may not be so clean, but most of us choose locally produced foods where possibly can do we not?
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:30pm
  - sungsamning
    
    He has won a lot of cases against the health cabal in open court over the last few years. He either has the best ever lawyer; or his cases were strong.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:34pm
sungsamning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gE1QGtLwsLg
JD Vance Eviscerates EU Leaders.
JD Vance did not hold back while talking at the Munich Security Conference. We will Watch and Discuss. [He won’t be getting Christmas cards from the WEF, and European Commission.]
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February 16, 2025 8:49am
- Waipuk
  
  Somewhere in the speak Vance mentions politics/governments who ignore their voters do so at their own peril. I think Luxon should take note.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:54am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Can you tell me what Luxon has ignored of his voters? And don’t say the TPB because you all knew before the election both Nats and NZFs policy on that bill
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:20pm
    - pdm
      
      Co Governance happening as we read and write today, tomorrow and the next day in Wanganui, Rotorua and with Ngai Tahus Court Case re Water.
      
      While Luxon waffles Co Governance prospers.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:20pm
    - RichardF
      
      Your comments prove the point that he is ignoring voters. He had a position, fair enough, but it’s obvious a large number of New Zealanders, including many National supporters, do support the bill. He should be able to explain to his supporters with more detail than “you can’t change things with a stroke of a pen”.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:31pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      He is not a leader. He cannot explain his opposition to the Treaty Principles Bill.
      
      Can you explain it?
      
      If has failed the nation. They deserve to be a one government. That might lead them to change.
      
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      February 16, 2025 6:11pm
      - Quail
        
        There is absolutely nothing stopping Luxon allowing, no encouraging ,a referendum on Acts Treaty Principles Bill
        That at least would show concern for the voters and New Zealand’s welfare itself!
        That would satisfy most of this Country!
        
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        February 16, 2025 8:12pm
  - sungsamning
    
    Yes, it’d be nice to see some of the ripples from Trumps victory lap these shores. Dumping TVNZ, and RNZ would lose few votes. National’s poll result would probably go up. Ditto for dumping the Department of Women’s Affairs, and all the racist departments.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:37pm
- pb
  
  Wasnt it Chamberlain whom sought peace at Munich, and came home to an adoring press. Funny place for a security conference. May as well hold a nuclear weapon conference at Hiroshima. Or war crimes conference at Dresden. Vance laid out a dozen cases of totalitarian hate speech arrests, akin to the worst tyrannies of our imaginations. In Europe and the UK. The enemy is within. Australia and New Zealand have similar laws minted ready to implement, and our corrupted politicals similarly cant wait to bow down to their foreign masters.
  
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  February 16, 2025 4:44pm
David Garrett

There is an excellent piece on Stuff this am on the disaster which has occurred since the Urewera National Park was given to Tuhoe in 2014. In short, fomer DOC huts have been burned down – which even the Tuhoe management admits was illegal – and “possums are everywhere” which will inevitably lead to the extinction of a bird called the kokako, brought back from the brink by DOC.

Lake Waikaremona is a magic place – which also happens to be the site of one of the tiny number of good memories i have of my father. I have taken my son there twice and established similarly good memories with him.

I have visited three times in total since 2014; each time the ongoing disastrous management by Tuhoe is worse.

Handing over former DOC land to Maori is a disaster which will only get worse.
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February 16, 2025 8:50am
- AitchW
  
  It’s ok, Tahoe will appeal to the next Labour led government who will pour millions into controlling the colonialist possums.
  It’s all Captain Cook’s fault doncha know?
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:59am
- Philview
  
  I recall there is also a management contract which sounds like the Crown are paying the money but not getting a lot back in return. Is that still correct?
  
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  February 16, 2025 8:59am
  - wsk12345
    
    Yes they get millions each year to maintain tracks and so pest control. Instead they tore fences down and let their hunting dogs in with the kiwi.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:24pm
- Clyde
  
  At the basis of this policy of “handing back” National Parks is a mistaken belief that Eastern Polynesians valued the land and rivers etc. BS. They were always rapers and pillagers of the land and remain so.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:10am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Since humans arrived here, 53 species of bird have become extinct. Of those, 38 became extinct before 1840.
    
    https://blog.tepapa.govt.nz/2015/07/28/extinct-birds-of-new-zealand-part-1-a-diverse-menagerie-sadly-departed/
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:03am
  - Taieri
    
    They were always rapers and pillagers of the land and remain so
    ———–
    
    I would not go that far.
    They were simply a primitive people who had to survive on what was available to them.
    Paraphrasing one Karl Marx, it’s the struggle for physical existence that determines consciousness.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:05pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      “It’s the struggle for physical existence that determines consciousness.”
      
      Is a virus conscious?
      
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      February 16, 2025 4:13pm
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    No they weren’t. When a people arrive in a new land, they have an abundance mentality and don’t appreciate the limits to resources. This was true of the Polynesian settlers of NZ in the 13th century (slaughtering moa & seals, and sometimes eating only the choicest parts of the prey), and also of European settlers in the 19th century, who saw what they imagined to be an inexhaustible supply of fine timbers, leading to wasteful use of forest resources. Once resources start to dry up, people become more conservation-minded, irrespective of ethnicity.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:41pm
- NK
  
  You’re just a racist coloniser, David.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:21am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I went to Kakadu National Park in the early 1990s when Joint management of the Park by Federal Government and local tribes (clans) was underway and seemed to be working very well.
  
  I returned about 10 years later, and the places I visited seemed neglected.
  
  It looks like the co-management relationship has been deteriorating for years and visitors are staying away from this park.
  
  https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-02-22/traditional-owners-threaten-to-close-kakadu-national-park/13125884
  
  https://www.integratesustainability.com.au/2021/09/17/kakadu-and-joint-management-in-a-nutshell/
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:28am
  - David Garrett
    
    Maggy: Mark my words – within 10 years European New Zelanders will not be allowed to visit Te Urewera. There is already hostility and downright rudeness to European visitors now.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:03am
    - Pineapple Lumps
      
      It is already putting people off going there. It was on my list to do with my children but I’m not interested now that it has been overtaken by the ethnostate.
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:41am
      - David Garrett
        
        Pineapple: yes, what a shame your children will be unable to enjoy the magnificence that is Lake Waikaremoana.
        
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        February 16, 2025 11:08am
      - JackRabbit
        
        Te Urewera is one of the homes of the earlier Patupaiarehe, and the earlier Tūhoe people that have red hair and fair skin, and that were living here BEFORE the arrival of the Maori.
        
        It is in Ngapuhi and Waitaha oral history of the presence of people here long before the 1200 AD Maoris.
        
        It does not suit the current elite activist Maori for the NZ public to have access to any land that contains evidence of older civilisations living here before the current Maori.
        
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        February 16, 2025 11:59am
      - PurplePen
        
        Just wear a big tiki round your neck and carry out frequent nostril clearing with your right index finger and thumb. You’ll be fine.
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:10pm
    - Dougal10
      
      I would suspect that only certified people from the local tribe and chinese paying tourist visitors will be allowed in.
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:44am
    - AitchW
      
      Perhaps Tuhoe are unconsciously ashamed of the dreadful state they’ve allowed the place to become….
      
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      February 16, 2025 10:55am
      - Inandout
        
        Aitch, very much doubt they feel shame, much like the feral occupiers of state houses feel no remorse for the derelict car dumped on the front lawn. Even their early structures had a certain neglect about them.
        https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2f/76/57/2f76577570c984bbf00398fd75c3ab6b.jpg
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:32pm
      - Paulus
        
        You must be joking !
        Tuhoe ashamed of what they have done ?
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:54pm
      - AitchW
        
        Inandout, Paulus you may have missed that I said unconsciously ashamed.
        They’d never admit their shame to anyone else or to themselves but surely, on some level they must be aware of the decline of the park and their part in that decline, even through inaction?
        
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        February 16, 2025 2:55pm
    - pdm
      
      We are planning to drive through, maybe September, and I must admit to being a bit nervous about it.
      
      The road and or the weather do not worry me but, other things make me hesitant to go.
      
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      February 16, 2025 11:20am
      - David Garrett
        
        Pdm: You need to be very careful of the road in mate, especially from the north.
        
        It has deteriorated massively since the Maoris took over.
        
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        February 16, 2025 12:20pm
      - pdm
        
        DG e would go in from Wairoa but thanks for the warning as we head out.
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:22pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      DG: “There is already hostility and downright rudeness to European visitors now.”
      
      Yep many reports of that. And yet was not the agreement simply that Tuhoe would manage the park instead of DOC (F knows why). They were not “given” the park, right?
      Weird how this insane racism has taken hold.
      
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      February 16, 2025 4:17pm
  - peterwn
    
    And to think that the Park was concerned that they might lose visitors (you have to pay an entrance fee) when a visitor got devoured by a crocodile 20+ years ago. Instead visitor numbers increased!
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:45pm
- In Vino Veritas
  
  And this is the Tuhoe, who managed a “Treaty Settlement” even though they were not a party to the Treaty. Go figure that.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:30am
  - David Garrett
    
    In vino: Yes indeed…a remarkable feat!
    
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    February 16, 2025 9:51am
  - AitchW
    
    To be fair, we can’t wish for equality then criticise Tuhoe for wanting to be equal to the other tribes.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:57am
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  Decolonization in action. Instead of declaring Te Urewera a “legal person” and handing it over to Tuhoe, maybe the Key government could have given Tuhoe a contract to control pests and maintain huts and tracks, with auditing to ensure targets were being met. Of course the problem would be the optics of Tuhoe working for “whitey”. Under the current arrangement, the taxpayers is still funding the park (admittedly it’s only $2M per annum), but there is no requirement for Tuhoe to look after the place properly.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:41am
  - David Garrett
    
    Pope: In short, Tuhoe’s idea of “looking after the place properly” is very different from DOC’s or ours. The honest members of the current management openly admit that they have no interest in “manuhiri”.
    It now belongs to them, and they will do what they want with it regardless of what whitey might think
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:32am
    - Pope Punctilious II
      
      Then it’s time to stop paying them $2M annually.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:06pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      manuhiri = visitor or guest.
      
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      February 16, 2025 4:19pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      DG correct if I’m wrong but it does not “belong” to Tuhoe. The (extremely f’ing foolish) deal was they manage the area as would DOC. No?
      
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      February 16, 2025 4:21pm
  - AitchW
    
    When I went there in the late 70s there was a number of rangers drawn from the local iwi who did a lot of them day to day running of the park.
    They were clearly passionate about maintaining the park. Perhaps the problem is that the management has fallen on urban Tuhoe with no real regard for the park, rather with an activist view concerned only with possession and no sense of conservation.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:01am
  - AitchW
    
    If the park is a legal person then surely legally nobody can own it? Or has slavery been reintroduced?
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:33pm
- Gravelroad
  
  The current management of these places and the impact of uncontrolled predators such as possums, may well be disastrous.
  But you can bet it will be not the fault of those in charge at the moment –
  Colonisation
  Customary payments insufficient
  Not enough “first people” willing to go out and work
  If native birds go extinct – that will be the down to the white man.
  No personal responsibility expected and none offered by the current “owners”.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:45am
- Benedict Yu
  
  And here is Chris Finlayson in 2022 praising giving away the National Park to the local iwi, and co governance in general. He compares opponents to the “KKK” in the USA.
  
  “The people I call “the KKK brigade” are out there. They dream of a world that never was, and never could be. They are the people — and these words aren’t mine but are taken from a former British foreign secretary — that you can call the “sour right”. They don’t really understand tangata whenua. They don’t like change.”
  
  https://e-tangata.co.nz/nzoa-pijf/chris-finlayson-co-governance-should-be-embraced-not-feared/
  
  Yeah well now the huts have been destroyed, and the possums and stoats are turning one of the most beautiful areas of back country into a lifeless disaster.
  
  IMO Chris Finlayson was one of the most damaging politicians to hold power in my time in New Zealand.
  
  I would support taking that national park back for all of us. If we need to buy out the iwi, so be it. Declare that it will never happen again.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:48am
  - NK
    
    Another glaring example of why National is as much a part of the problem as Labour.
    
    But National will manage the decline better.
    
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    February 16, 2025 9:58am
  - David Garrett
    
    Bene: I am using my phone so cant easily quote and highlight ur last para.
    
    Finlayson is a thoroughly odious little man. Before my career imploded I remember telling our caucus that Finlayson was a liar and not to trust him after he lied to me over part of the replacement for Clarks foreshore and seabed act.
    
    Some time later i recall dear old John Boscawen – a lovely but quite unworldly man – calling me and saying, in an injured tone “Today Chris Finlayson told me a bare faced lie” All I could do was chuckle and metaphorically shake my head.
    
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    February 16, 2025 9:59am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    No to buying out. QV Danegeld. Just pass a law resuming state ownership on behalf of all. Back it up with force, because the only thing the locals up there respect is force.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:09am
    - AitchW
      
      Are you honestly suggesting that the state should legislate to confiscate private property because it doesn’t like the way that property is being managed?
      Not a precedent anyone would like to see being set, surely?
      
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      February 16, 2025 4:02pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        The Ureweras belong to all of us. It is, or was, a National Park.
        
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        February 16, 2025 6:49pm
  - Quail
    
    BY,
    Agreed , In addition Finlayson reference to KKK is totally disgusting.
    “they dream of a world that was never was and never could be”
    KKK is on a par with a Nazi or Hitler or even Pol pot.
    He refers to the New Zealanders who believe ,as most do ,that every individual NZ citizen should have the same rights under NZ law!
    Were he still in Parliament he would no doubt have to answer for it.
    Instead he is presently in court being paid to take South Island water rights from those who have earned them.
    Yes the park belongs to all New Zealand. Take it back!
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:53pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    Chris Finlayson was one of the most damaging politicians to hold power in my time in New Zealand.
    
    And was praised to the skies by every Nat I know, including those on this forum and DPF. I got the impression that National thought they’d got one up on Labour by getting Finlayson, which is exactly what you’d expect from people who’ve been beaten into cringing submission as “racists”; “See, we’re not racist” they cry – as they implement the opposition’s plans. The pre-Trump GOP is another example, as are the Tories in Britain.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:20pm
- PaulP
  
  They’ve got the land back and it’s literally gone feral. Quelle surprise!
  
  It is a good indication of where conservation would be here without the colonisers though.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360576549/fossilised-animals-left-traps-claims-pest-control-neglect-former-national-park
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:49am
  - Paulus
    
    Is it only the land that has gone feral, or has that never changed ?
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:57pm
- trout
  
  The article in Stuff is loaded with PR speak coming from the Tuhoe Brown table at Taneatua.
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360576549/fossilised-animals-left-traps-claims-pest-control-neglect-former-national-park
  DOC has bent over, given the tribe $2mill. which probably bought 4×4 Rangers; it certainly has not been spent on track maintenance and pest control as promised. DOC speak of Tuhoe being the ‘lead’ in the management of Te Urewera (does ‘co-management’ have a ‘lead’?) and then stands aside while huts are burnt down (unlawfully) and facilities are neglected. And this is likely to be the future of other Parks DOC want to hand over. Thankyou Chris Finlayson.,
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:53am
  - pdm
    
    Not only that but, it is happening in Cities you may live in:
    
    Wanganui and Rotorua sneaking Co Governance through as we write about it.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:25am
- Mod88
  
  Wait and watch what happens in 2026 under Potaka’s review of DOC. The Urewera National Park was a just a Test Run.
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:10am
NeverMindTheBollocks

Commentators here occasionally pose the question of what NZ would look like if Maori co-governance is established.

Well, you don’t have to look far. Try the Ureweras. Tuhoe have burned down the pakeha infrastructure, stopped conservation efforts, continue to take the taxpayers coin and claim that there are no problems.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360576549/fossilised-animals-left-traps-claims-pest-control-neglect-former-national-park
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February 16, 2025 8:52am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I can’t help but think of once productive farms in Zimbabwe, overgrown with weeds, and the homesteads burned down.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:54am
  - pdm
    
    Read the Novels by Tony Park.
    
    He has written a number based around Zimbabwe, Botswana and Kruger Park. Good stories which highlight the decline in a lot of areas – including civil way, land confiscations, poaching etc.
    
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    February 16, 2025 11:28am
    - Bridgenag
      
      Lots of leaping over the fence here too……
      
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      February 16, 2025 12:31pm
goNZ1

I see Macron has called an emergency meeting of European leaders for Monday. Panic is setting in as they realise the past decades of modest EU defence spending due to over reliance on USA is coming to an end. In 1917 only after the sinking of the Lusitania by the German navy did the US enter WW1 and tipped the balance of force in favor of the Allies. In 1941 as Europe was teetering on a Nazi victory, only after Pearl Harbour did the US enter WW2 and again secure victory by force over the Axis Powers, with the Red Army making a large contribution while suffering millions of horrific military and civilian deaths.
Pres. Trump is doing exactly what he campaigned on and won the presidency,that is America First . Growing up in NZ, many of us are familiar with a strong anti-American mantra embedded in our psych,largely because of our European socialist worker heritage. US navy ships were not welcomed,then banned, Helen Clark turned down an offer of cheap F-16 ex USAF fighters,Lange misled Secretary Schultz over nuclear ship visits etc etc you get the idea.
While we may think all this change in global world order is comfortably not going to worry NZ, then consider just last week the Cook Is. PM signed up to a Chinese Aid deal,big time. It won’t be long before the Cooks,3 hours flying time north of Auckland, will get a nice big Port upgrade and extended airport runway courtesy of the CCP (merely to help tourism of course!!)
Just like the EU, our nation has for decades relied on assuming Australia and USA have our backs, free loading on their military while spendinga paltry 1% of GDP on defence.
Those days are over and with Trump and likely Dutton soon to deal with (who dosent give a rats about NZ eg 501s) some big decisions are coming for us and our Pols. Do Nothing until it’s Too Late, or take our Defence spending seriously and redirect funds by stopping the lunacy woke spending on climate rorts , welfarism and having Big Govt 32% of the economy
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February 16, 2025 9:01am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  The Port will be built either on Aitutaki or Penryhn which has an abandoned WW 2 airstrip.
  
  The PRC will blow a channel through the reef then deepen the lagoon. Look how big the lagoon is at Penrhyn!!!
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:02am
- Jack5
  
  Cook Islands Premier Brown has signed co-operation agreements with China, the South China Morning Post reported yesterday (link below).
  
  This despite NZ’s Cook Islands Constitution Act 1964 containing this clause:
  
  5 External affairs and defence
  
  Nothing in this Act or in the Constitution shall affect the responsibilities of Her Majesty the Queen in right of New Zealand for the external affairs and defence of the Cook Islands, those responsibilities to be discharged after consultation by the Prime Minister of New Zealand with the Premier of the Cook Islands.
  
  When reports emerged of a Cook Islands-flagged Russian “dark fleet” tanker being held on allegations of sabotage in the Baltic, an early media report suggested NZ’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade said this had nothing to do with NZ.
  
  In October 2022, NZ’s then Foreign Minister, Nanaia Mahuta, signed a “statement of partnership” with the Cook Islands.
  
  Last Tuesday, Mahuta was reported in the Cook Islands News as saying Cooks Premier Brown “should be taken at his word” that the comprehensive agreement he’s signing with China will not affect the constitutional arrangements with New Zealand.”
  
  What’s going on? Did Mahuta and MFAT somehow overturn some NZ legislation?
  
  Time for Foreign Minister Peters to straighten things out. Before he gets a phone call from Trump or Vance.
  
  China-Cooks agreement:
  
  https://www.scmp.com/news/china/diplomacy/article/3298820/china-seeks-deeper-trust-cook-islands-premier-li-tells-prime-minister-mark-brown
  
  Mahuta and the Cooks Islands’ Brown:
  
  https://www.cookislandsnews.com/uncategorised/internal/national/politics/two-countries-but-one-people-cook-islands-new-zealand-strengthen-ties/
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:07am
- Allan
  
  A bit of history; The USA almost didn’t go to war in Europe.
  
  Germany and Japan had a treaty that Germany would help Japan if the latter was attcked, not if they attacked first.
  
  After Pearl Harbor Hitler foolishly declared war on the USA.
  
  If he hadn’t done that it would have been a very hard sell to justify US involvement in another Eurpean war.
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:36pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    True, but they’d have got there in the end. US Navy ships had already attacked, and been attacked, by German U-Boats in the North Atlantic and the Germans would have had no choice but to deal with the Arsenal of Democracy sooner or later. My bet would be sometime in 1942/43 at the latest.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:54pm
- sungsamning
  
  Good points. Does the political elite here even know Camala Harris isn’t president?
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:44pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

A KO tenant who’s obviously a nutter is in prison on remand (but has not been convicted) for various forms of assault on neighbours has been given notice by KO.

Someone should ask Carmel Sepoloni to justify why this man would have kept his KO tenancy under their watch.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360580934/kainga-ora-tenant-prison-facing-charges-setting-neighbour-fire
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February 16, 2025 9:12am
AitchW

Bradbury laying on the hyperbole extra thick in his latest outpouring of bile.
https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2025/02/16/why-are-police-allowing-zionist-christofascist-leather-thugs-to-attack-nzs-rainbow-community/
He really hates the church! And the Jewish community too it would seem.
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February 16, 2025 9:27am
- spanish_tudor
  
  Bomber, as usual, can’t see the wood for the trees.
  
  There is no such thing as a “rainbow community”, there are same-sex attracted people (LGBs) and the gender nutters (TQ+); our goals and attributes are not the same. The TQ+ wants to indoctrinate kids with gender tosh, which is what Destiny Church is against; the sane LGB just want to get on with our lives – we already have equal rights.
  
  Unfortunately, the LGB have been tarred by association with the gender identity TQ+ shower, who have destroyed decades of goodwill that gays and lesbians fought to foster with the wider community in order to achieve equal rights.
  
  And we never targeted kids.
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:58am
  - David Garrett
    
    Spanish: Well said Sir…your views are identical to those of my closest gay friend, and the Godfather to my children.
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:28am
  - PurplePen
    
    Excellently expressed and absolutely correct. Thanks.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:15pm
  - NoFax
    
    The QT nutters as you call them are no different to the LGB people – it’s the same logic. You can’t get the trans genie back into the bottle without also acknowledging that sexual activity has a correct and ordered end and the LGBs are disordered.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:54pm
    - spanish_tudor
      
      Re-read the final sentence of my post again. Whatever else you want to quibble over, that is the difference.
      
      Also, LGBs asked to be accepted for what they are; the TQ+ demand to be accepted for what they are not. Sexual acts have nothing to do with it, whether you think they are correct or otherwise.
      
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      February 16, 2025 7:29pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

This is Chris Luxon’s opportunity to show that he has learned from Donald Trump. He should simply say that we will cut the financial gifts, make an orderly plan for the removal of the NZD as the Cook’s currency and state that all Cook Islanders born in the Cooks but living in NZ will be transitioned off NZ citizenship to a residency visa. And wish them luck as a newly independent country.

Once the hoo-ha peaks, Luxon can suspend these proposals pending the result of the next Cook Islands election.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360582497/cook-islands-signs-china-deal-centre-diplomatic-row-new-zealand
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February 16, 2025 9:28am
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  Realistically, what are the odds of Chris Luxon “learning from Donald Trump”?
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:32am
  - sungsamning
    
    Zip, zilch, and nada. His learning comes from the WEF.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:49pm
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  Luxon will as usual do nothing but sit on the fence.
  IMO Luxon hates Trump’s guts, most socialists do.
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:18am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Trump is fighting the global deep state. Luxon is part of the global deep state.
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:04pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Luxon appeared to have a warm respect for Trump before the election, geez he must have changed quick especially as it is your opinion
    
    4 3
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    February 16, 2025 12:25pm
    - Steve Otto N Shore
      
      He won’t stop Maorification of the English language (signs) and he won’t stop the co-governance rubbish.
      He is a Maori activist and woke, like it or not
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:46pm
  - Quail
    
    Is there any point at all in trying to bully the Cooks and their citizens living in this Country?
    Don’t think so .
    On the other hand matters of NZ and Cooks security must be discussed.
    
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    February 16, 2025 8:38pm
- sungsamning
  
  No way its going to happen. TV1 would call him a ‘racist’, and it’d be time to back down.
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:49pm
Souvlaki

New Zealand needs a Trumpesque leader to come in and clean out the steaming piles of dung in many of our organisations, but particularly schools( see Rodney Hide on his site) and our tertiary institutions likewise.
Late yesterday, commmenter Graham Sharpe brought our attention to the fact that to achieve a position as an Oro – Facial Surgeon in Otago, the applicamt must be well advanced in their “Te Ao Maori journey”. Pythonesque in the extreme imo!
Read this link:
https://www.linkedin.com/jobs/view/4096062451
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February 16, 2025 9:36am
- NK
  
  Late yesterday?
  
  What about this post from four days ago: https://nominister.wordpress.com/2025/02/13/nothing-to-worry-about-luxon-will-fix-this/
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:49am
  - Souvlaki
    
    Missed that….but worth reinforcing…’banging the drum’ imo!
    
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    February 16, 2025 10:13am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  I believe the training time for an Oro Facial surgeon is one of the longest in the medical world.
  
  I am sure that the applicant has also had time to study Tikanga etc.
  
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  February 16, 2025 10:05am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Seymour has his chance with his ministry of regulations, but no, silent
  
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  February 16, 2025 12:26pm
  - pdm
    
    G look it up.
    
    As I advised you late last week it starts on the 1 March – 12 more sleeps as they say in Parliament.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:25pm
    - Ghost
      
      No, it’s been running since march last year. There first review was on early childhood education
      
      https://www.regulation.govt.nz/news/big-response-to-first-regulatory-review/
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:17pm
  - Pineapple Lumps
    
    Seymour has areas for improvement as a minister – I have been critical of his handling of the school lunches. I think his stance on the ethnostate is brave and just what is needed.
    
    The question I have for you and Mark H who are very supportive of Luxon and National thus far. Will Luxon and National , as the leader and major party in the coalition, make significant gains rolling back the ethnostate in this term? Will they be able to replace maorification philosophies embedded in people’s minds, schools, the public service, the legacy media through the PIJF, during Arden’s reign or not? Personally I’m not seeing them achieving this yet. If they can’t do this, then Ardern has been successful at swinging NZ left and dividing the country. This coalition may do a good job in slowing things down after Ardern but the question for all of us is how do they actually unite kiwis behind a cohesive vision and take us forward to a better place.
    
    Pot shots between ACT, NZF and National aren’t really what we need. A cohesive vision that they jointly communicate to us that we can collectively buy into is what is required. The person responsible for bringing this together is Luxon. So that is why we ask the questions most staunchly of his leadership. Not for cheap shots because we are trying to highlight our sub-tribes superiority. All our sub-tribes fail if they don’t push back the advancement of the ethnostate.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:40pm
    - Mark Hanley
      
      Luxon has been outlining his vision repeatedly since the campaign trail. The coalition agreements contain the details and actions for the vision luxon agreed with his coalition partners..
      
      Luxon also publishes quarterly plans to achieve that vision, and is reporting progress againat the plans/vision every month.
      
      Luxon has said repeatedly every citizen will have equal rights. That public services will be allocated on need not race. He reiterated this message on waitangi day (see my post above).
      
      The luxon lead government has dismantled the maori king and gangs money making schemes established by Adern and hipkins. None of aderns and hipkins Maori initiatives helped anyone but the gangs. the maori kings family, and adern.
      
      The distracted and outraged voters merely provided cover for adern etc to steal our money from under our noses.
      
      Luxon has been very clear with his vision, it is communicated constantly to us, to his managemen team and to the operation staff.
      
      The issue really lies with those who haven’t been bothered to read the aforementioned documents.
      
      And utilize false, unreferenced, repetitive pot shots instead.
      
      Sean plunket is an ufortunate example of the pot shot tribe.
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:17pm
      - Quail
        
        MH
        Luxon is also clear he intends for Maori to have special rights in the natural environment ,in particular water (.See Nga Tahu court case in Christchurch).
        Todays comment on this blog about Urewera national park are relevant , just as is the fact of differential taxation based on race.
        And Governments increased expenditure plus deficit budgeting leading to inflation
        Please be objective and accurate as to Nationals performance!
        But ,yes you are right ,the alternative Government on offer would be much worse!
        But somehow the people of NZ need to be heard. MMP has choking the value of voting out.
        This blog is an avenue for people to be heard.
        
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        February 16, 2025 9:09pm
      - Ghost
        
        The court case in Christchurch is against the crown. If Luxon was supporting it there would be no court case.
        
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        February 16, 2025 9:18pm
    - AitchW
      
      I like Seymour’s calm demeanour and reasoned arguments when he’s under fire from the radicals and I support unconditionally the TPB.
      I do think, however, that driving a Land Rover up the steps of the parliament was a dopey stunt. His campaign to extend the parliamentary term to 4 years is Quixotic. I’d vote yes in a referendum, however there have been 2 referenda on this very matter that I can remember and both were soundly defeated.
      Only just over 4 years ago NZ elected Ardern and her party of incompetents and bludgers with a simple majority on the strength of her self proclaimed kindness. Does anyone really believe that the electorate is mature enough to extend the parliamentary term to 4 years?
      
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      February 16, 2025 3:04pm
      - GJM
        
        I might consider a 4 year term if there were controls like a democratically elected upper house. A democratic lower house would bea fine thing as well, without the racist Maori seats.
        
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        February 16, 2025 7:26pm
  - Paulus
    
    Ministry does not start until 1st March I believe.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:01pm
    - Ghost
      
      No, as told to you before it has been running since last march. You can go read up on what they have been doing since then
      
      https://www.regulation.govt.nz/
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:13pm
  - Ghost
    
    Silent? They’ve actually been working on a number of projects since opening
    
    Maybe go learn about them G.
    
    https://www.regulation.govt.nz/regulatory-reviews/
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:19pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

A lecturer in the School of Critical Studies in Education at Akld Uni says that not enough is known about the effect of charter schools last time around. She omits to observe that the schools were closed down in 2018, and that the 4,000+ bureaucrats at the Ministry of Education had five years under Labour to conduct the required research. She also neglects to speculate whether the research was undertaken but suppressed due to inconvenient findings (speculation on my part, to be sure). Perhaps, gasp, she could have done the research herself.

http://www.1news.co.nz/2025/02/16/as-new-charter-schools-open-we-know-little-about-how-they-worked-last-time/
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February 16, 2025 9:43am
- mandk
  
  The Charter Schools were closed solely for doctrinaire reasons.
  
  The unions hated them.
  
  Consequently, Labour shut them, and the Maori Labour MPs, who previously supported the schools, caved.
  
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  February 16, 2025 1:14pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Reading the Cricinfo report of the Pakistan-NZ match overnight, you’d be forgiven for thinking that our easy win bodes well for the Champions Trophy fixture against them on the same ground in six days time. We restricted their batting, Tom Latham made runs and so on.

But this is Pakistan. I note that Latham should have been out several times, while their openers let 48 balls go scoreless in the first power play. Good bowling or strategic planning?

Should be an interesting tournament.
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February 16, 2025 10:02am
- AitchW
  
  Good bowling, strategic planning or was the opposition rewarded for the result by a generous bookie?
  I really hate that because of corruption driven by bookies every unexpected result is suspicious!
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:20am
- pdm
  
  I hope the Champions Trophy is on Sky.
  
  The cricket season has another 6 weeks to go.
  
  No rugby watching for me other than selected 6 Nations games.
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:32am
  - Steve Todd
    
    pdm: It’s on Sky Open (Freeview 15; Sky 004), starting at 9:30PM on Wednesday.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:08pm
    - pdm
      
      Thanks.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:26pm
      - Steve Todd
        
        You’re welcome.
        
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        February 16, 2025 1:35pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  NZ has a very good record against Pakistan over there in the last few years, beating them in all formats
  
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  February 16, 2025 12:27pm
  - pdm
    
    No Ajaz Patel this time though.
    
    Still NZ’s best spin bowler.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:27pm
- Gravelroad
  
  Watched recently a TV discussion where four or so commentators (including two top former international players) debated who would be in the running to win the upcoming ODI competition.
  They actually reckoned that Pakistan could/would make the final – especially if held at a home venue – and that they were capable of winning it.
  Their top four picks were Australia, India, South Africa and Pakistan.
  NZ not worthy of a mention.
  
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  February 16, 2025 1:24pm
  - Steve Todd
    
    Hmm. It sounds to me like you were watching Sky Australia.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:09pm
David Garrett

Sung: RFK is a dangerous nut. His father must be turning in his grave.
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February 16, 2025 10:25am
- Bridgenag
  
  Exactly. We wouldn’t want adulterated food full of chemicals sorted would we. ffs
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:06am
  - JackRabbit
    
    And the “dangerous nut” label belongs to Fauci.
    
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    February 16, 2025 12:05pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Seems to possibly be off the rails with the measles vaccine/autism thing. Otherwise a defender of the people over corporate psychopathy.
  
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  February 16, 2025 4:25pm
vand

And I wonder if Jesus is as obsessed with LGB etc etc as Bishop Tamaki and Family First appear to be. Have they even asked Jesus what he thinks?”
Well you could read the gospels ans find out- je seemed to have the now unpopular idea marriage was for a male and female so that gives you a clue- and yes for his compassion read Matt 11 : come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”
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February 16, 2025 10:35am
- AitchW
  
  The Jesus in the bible wouldn’t care about LGB. He might be concerned about the mental health of TQI+ mob though.
  I suspect that like most Christian fundamentalists Tamaki is more of an old testament kinda guy and only pays lips service to the New Fangled Testament, ignoring the message of tolerance and respect within.
  And before anyone suggests that I’m a bible basher, I haven’t set foot inside a church for decades.
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:17am
  - mandk
    
    I doubt you have read the NT properly. It includes no tolerance for sin.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:09pm
    - AitchW
      
      Is homosexuality a sin?
      
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      February 16, 2025 3:06pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Jesus was reportedly a Jewish Rabbi so I imagine would probably regard all forms of homosexuality as sinful and to be repented from (IE just stop and don’t keep doing) I’m thinking. Correct me If I’m wrong.
    
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    February 16, 2025 4:28pm
- JackRabbit
  
  I think we know how Jesus would view LGBTQIDFA…
  
  Sodom and Gomorrah are two ancient cities mentioned in the Book of Genesis. Both cities were destroyed by fire from God because of their sexual wickednesses including rape, child sexual abuse,and indecent assault.
  
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  February 16, 2025 12:07pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Including sodomy.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:28pm
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    Your biblical knowledge is no better than your history or your medical knowledge. The destruction of Sodom & Gomorrah is a story from the Old Testament, written centuries before Jesus.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:37pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      According to the bible, Jesus was a mortal incarnation of the God source, so it is very likely he had knowledge of the Old Testament.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:58pm
    - Matt Long
      
      Yes, but according to the New Testament Jesus was God in human form, given that God rained sulphur and fire down on Sodom, it’s difficult to see how Jesus would take different view.
      Genesis 18 and 19 contain the story and I think most people would accept that what is written about is more than sodomy.
      20 Then the Lord said, “The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous 21 that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know.”
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:51pm
  - AitchW
    
    Old Testament, JR.
    The New Testament is far more liberal. I believe that a lot of the happy clappy churches largely ignore the blood lust of the old one….
    It’s the fundamentalists who lean on the Old Testament.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:38pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      It may be old testament, but he would be aware of what ‘Dear Old Dad’ did.
      
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      February 16, 2025 1:59pm
      - AitchW
        
        Did he not suggest that we should hate the sin but love the sinner? Nowhere, to my knowledge, does he promote killing anyone!
        Judge not lest ye also be judged and all that…
        
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        February 16, 2025 3:09pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @AitchW
        
        No-one here is suggesting killing anyone.
        
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        February 16, 2025 5:50pm
  - Pineapple Lumps
    
    Jesus loves all sinners, offering us all the opportunity to be made perfect and enjoy relationship with God. At the same time Jesus abhors all sin, all hubris, all defiance of the creator. There would be much about the world today that Jesus would stand against – the love of money & greed, laziness and entitlement, the arrogance of men who believe their intellect is superior to Gods, sexual deviancy, the pursuit of hedonism etc etc etc. However, in his first appearance he singled out the religious hypocrites for his most brutal assessments.
    
    I don’t think Jesus would be supporting LGB Pride, but he would also be most disgusted by those who do evil while proclaiming they act in his name. Since the start of the Christian church we have been warned of false prophets. A threat that still plagues many churches today.
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:53pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      If created planet earth and populated it with species to roam and populated the earth, learn ethics and principles, he had a plan. I seriously doubt that plan included genital mutilation and buggery.
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:03pm
    - PurplePen
      
      Didn’t he put out his hand and give a gesture of kindness to Mary Magdalene the town bike-for-profit? Much to the horror of those with him at the time.
      
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      February 16, 2025 3:25pm
- lifesgood
  
  I’m pretty sure Jesus would not want children’s minds adulterated by sexually explicit drag queens, though. He said “Suffer the little children to come to me for such are the kingdom of heaven” But yes, I’m certain LBG people would be just as special to him as anyone else.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:15pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Anyone who harms one of these little ones, better that he be cast into the water with a millstone around his neck.
    
    IIRC
    
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    February 16, 2025 6:57pm
- kowtow
  
  He did say “Go and sin no more ”
  
  Not a license to continue but an invitation to change.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:18pm
- PurplePen
  
  From The West Wing TV series. The president responds to someone saying how the bible says homosexuality is an abomination.
  
  The upshot is the bible says many things that are contradictory and downright nonsense for today. You have to remember that like any religion’s texts, they were created and written by a human.
  
  https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3pqGoBOj9Y/
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:23pm
  - JackRabbit
    
    You have to remember that like any religion’s texts, they were created and written by a human.
    
    Indeed. Written by humans, years and indeed generations after the events, and often events that were not understood.
    
    The Bible(s) are not historical documents, all compiled with a printing date and editorial review.
    
    They are a collection of stories, parables and ideas, that have been thrown together, edited, mutilated, parts cut out, translated and rewritten many times, by people who had vested interests or egotistical obsessions, or who believed centuries after the event that certain disciples and writers couldn’t have possibly meant what they meant.
    
    The passage of time is not kind to truth. Witness the Treaty of Waitangi: In a short 185 years, the truth of the Treaty and of Maori history has been inverted 180°, and anything pre 1200 AD Maori has all but been deleted and censored.
    
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    February 16, 2025 6:03pm
Pineapple Lumps

Yesterday there was a question about whether a study had been done on the impact of colonisation.

The problem with the activist maori view of colonisation is they want to blame it for all the negative outcomes they have and don’t acknowledge any of the benefits or their own responsibility for their outcomes. They have a worldview that if left to their own devices they would have gained all the advantages of western civilisation – technology, systems, economy – but with brown people holding all the power.

Here is a link to an article put out by the productivity commission that highlights this sort of thinking.

https://thehub.sia.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/NZPC_Colonisation_Racism_Wellbeing_Final.pdf
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February 16, 2025 10:50am
- goNZ1
  
  how unbelievably thick are some tourists to try their luck with the Mad Mullahs!?
  Two Britons arrested in Iran on unspecified “security charges” have been identified as Craig and Lindsay Foreman, who were midway through a round the world motorbike trip.
  
  Lindsay Foreman, a life coach, and Craig Foreman, a carpenter, were planning to reach Australia. They were detained last month after crossing from Armenia into Iran.
  
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  February 16, 2025 1:36pm
- Paulus
  
  But there are no Maori, only many many very part Maori, but they want it all.
  Even if they are only 16 % so we are told, but that is doubtful as we are now learning.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:10pm
- PurplePen
  
  If you have time, watch this speech from Rafe Heydel-Mankoo, an historian. He gives a lecture on colonisation at Cambridge University. He provides a lot of facts and stats that the woke students aren’t too keen on. Just over 10 minutes long.
  
  https://youtu.be/O02RrKCZ64Y
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:29pm
imalwaysright

On tv1 this morning was an old man who likes furry plants and butterflies that live on and around a rocky wasteland that gold miners would like to mine.
He doesn’t want the gold mine in case it upsets the furry plants and butterflies.
Here we go again.
If its not maori activists, its bugs and weeds botherers.
No wonder NZ is poor.
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February 16, 2025 10:51am
- AitchW
  
  Bring on the promised RMA reforms to stop botherers of furry plants causing interminable delays in the consent process.
  To paraphrase the PM, we have to stop saying no!
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:10am
  - Allan
    
    Is that why he doesn’t say ‘no’ to the co-coverence nonsense?
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:42pm
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  Just do it and ignore these people.
  They don’t mind that gold wedding band on their finger, or that gold watch do they?
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:25am
  - mandk
    
    They are also the people who drive EVs and prefer the rare minerals they need to be mined by child slaves in dangerous workplaces in Africa, than by well-paid adults here in NZ who have the prptections of H&S laws
    
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    February 16, 2025 1:07pm
    - Steve Otto N Shore
      
      Bloody hypocrites!
      
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      February 16, 2025 2:47pm
    - PurplePen
      
      Yes. Its OK because it’s not done here.
      
      To pull its weight environmentally and morally and to avoid the hypocrisy NZ must find a way to mine all its current mineral needs including fuel or at least covering minerals imported in products with export of a similar amount.
      
      Its so easy to shout and appear on the right side of environmentalism and morality when all the immoral and unenvironmental practice is not done here. Are you going to relinquish your laptop, phone, EV, and just about any other transport and electrical device.
      
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      February 16, 2025 3:33pm
  - PurplePen
    
    Or the gold required in any electronic device they might have.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:32pm
- pdm
  
  Jonesy should tell him to transplant the furry plants.
  
  The Butterflies will follow.
  
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  February 16, 2025 11:34am
  - Ehlana
    
    And if we start now, and plant new plants a little further away each year, then by the time anyone is ready to start mining, the butterflies will be happily settled in their new home.
    Further south of course, because of global warming.
    
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    February 16, 2025 2:23pm
- Paulus
  
  Why is Australia richer than we are
  – because they dig the soil and sell it overseas.
  QED
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:12pm
- JackRabbit
  
  He doesn’t want the gold mine in case it upsets the furry plants and butterflies.
  
  Simple solution for him: Buy the land so that he can protect the furry plants and butterflies.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:12pm
Bridgenag

Surely California and their Greenie DEI nonsense should be a lesson………
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February 16, 2025 11:08am
- Ehlana
  
  That they didn’t do it properly and if we just did it properly then all would be well?
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:21pm
infused

JD Vance speech is magical https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCOsgfINdKg
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February 16, 2025 11:37am
- JackRabbit
  
  Very good.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:22pm
Swifty

According to this fellow you can rape or kill a child daily but as long as you pray daily to the (non-existent) Islamic god you will looked on more favourably by that (non-existent) god than if you lived a blameless life but never prayed daily:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14391795/amp/Islamic-preacher-paedophile-murderer-prayers-speak-Britain.html

If that’s what passes for religion these days then leave me out.

And if I object to these teachings, if I label them immoral or say that their god doesn’t exist does that make me a damnable Islamophobe worthy of scorn and correction?
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February 16, 2025 11:44am
- Tom Hunter
  
  It’s been a lesson to me about the perfidiousness of the Left as I’ve watched countless Left Atheists – including some I’ve personally known and laughed with as they stuck it to the Falwells’ and Tamakis’ of the world – snuggle up to Islam via way of the bullshit term, “Islamophobia”. Europe especially is sickening in that respect.
  
  The reason is that they see Muslims in the West as yet another oppressed group that can be used to wreck capitalist democracies and implement socialism to one degree or another, and of course both teams are very big on social welfare.
  
  It may be that the Left may think they can just beat/absorb the Islamists after they’ve used them. But that’s a combination of atheists dismissal of religion and Social Democrats who think the State can buy them off with money.
  
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  February 16, 2025 4:42pm
  - kowtow
    
    When they do take over the lefty athiests are in the most danger of losing their heads, literally.
    
    The rest will just have to put up with the extra taxes , abuse of their children and living in their own quarter .
    
    And no this is not a joke . That’s how that particular coloniser operates . At the moment our cities are the vector for this ,but eventually whole countries will follow.
    
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    February 16, 2025 6:15pm
  - GJM
    
    They should learn after Iran. The mad Muslims and the communists were allies before the revolution. Afterwards, they were all purged in 18 months.
    Being communists, I assume that was their plan after the revolution, but the Muslims got in first.
    
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    February 16, 2025 7:37pm
  - Pope Punctilious II
    
    “It may be that the Left may think they can just beat/absorb the Islamists after they’ve used them”
    
    I don’t believe that for a moment. The woke left considers everyone other than straight white males to be victims (to varying degrees) of the white heteronormative patriarchy. That includes Muslims. However, this view reveals a remarkable level of cognitive dissonance, as Islam is one of the most conservative institutions on the planet. Like the Molotof-Ribbentrop pact, the alliance between Islamists and the woke left will not last long. There have already been cases of Muslims in the west rejecting gender ideology in schools https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2023/6/19/muslims-opposed-to-lgbtq-curricula-for-their-kids-arent-bigots
    
    It’s the wokesters who are the Islamists’ useful idiots, not vice versa. I recommend you read “Submission” by Michel Houellebecq, if you haven’t already.
    
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    February 16, 2025 7:45pm
Morgan H

Quite a few people on here say National is just Blue Labour or Labour Lite. If this current government was a Labour-Act-NZ 1st Government, what would change?
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February 16, 2025 12:29pm
- JackRabbit
  
  Hipkins would be PM. Perish the thought.
  
  DEI and Rainbows all around. But you are fantasising. ACT and NZF would not be in coalition govt with Labour, after what Ardern pulled off in 2017.
  
  Winston only went with Ardern because she whispered sweet bullshit in his ear.
  
  24 hours after taking office, she took off her sweet innocence mask and unveiled her witches hat and garb. Winston and Ardern became mortal enemies.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:19pm
  - AitchW
    
    Did not Peters go with Ardern as big middle finger to Bill English? My recollection is that Peters hated English (the man, not the language) with a passion so chose to go with Ardern simply as an act of petty vindictiveness.
    Perhaps someone with a better memory than mine will remember why Peters was so bitter and twisted.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:14pm
    - fightingtemeraire
      
      Because English was one of the ones that got him removed as a Nat MP.
      
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      February 16, 2025 4:01pm
    - Taieri
      
      chose to go with Ardern simply as an act of petty vindictiveness.
      ————-
      
      My suspicion is that Peters was into the art of puppetry and that Ardern seemed like a good one to practice on. Didn’t quite work out though…
      
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      February 16, 2025 5:21pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        More likely she plied him with her womanly ‘charms’, telling him that Andrew Little was a communist, and that she was not, and that she would get rid of the commies out of the Labour govt.
        
        Ardern was an accomplished liar: she could keep a straight face and say on televised election debates that child poverty was decreasing, when 10 seconds on google would prove it was going up. She said she would not penalise anyone that did not get the vaccine.
        
        Nothing she ever told the NZ was truthful. It was all a big fat.
        
        Do you really think Winston joined her because she said she was going to screw the country, and roll out Marxism?
        
        She, all cute and coy, agreed to make him Deputy PM, and as soon as she waddled down the hallway to the podium as PM, she put a political harness on him.
        
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        February 16, 2025 6:16pm
  - PurplePen
    
    Don’t forget Winston got his nose out of joint with national and so picked Labour. He got his nose out of joint with them and now he’s with national.
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:36pm
  - Morgan H
    
    It looks like Hipkins being PM would be the main difference.
    
    “DEI and Rainbows all around.” What exactly do you mean by this? Are you saying the difference between National and Labour is the support of “DEI and Rainbows”?
    
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    February 16, 2025 3:37pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      I’m sure you can figure it out.
      
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      February 16, 2025 6:17pm
Chuck Bird

This should be viewed by Watts and Luxon.

How can eager Governments get off the Net Zero hook? – Dr Benny Peiser

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdLEN1ExW7g
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February 16, 2025 1:26pm
Ehlana

From Stuff today: https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360581345/end-free-public-transport-blues-games-raises-concerns-local-mp

Local MP Helen White says the ending of free public transport for Blues games at Eden Park is “out of touch” with what people want.

Apparently the ratepayers of Auckland co-fund this “free” public transport along with the promoters.

Can the rest of us nominate events we’d like cheap travel to?
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February 16, 2025 2:01pm
- mandk
  
  I think it would be better if we could nominate which MPs and Councillors should pay from their own pockets to take comfortably off people on free transport to rugby matches.
  
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  February 16, 2025 2:59pm
- Jules99
  
  I was at a family event and was told how appreciative they were to the council for funding the kids to go to a bagpipe event. In my day we just got in a car and drove there at our own cost.
  
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  February 16, 2025 3:31pm
- JackRabbit
  
  Can the rest of us nominate events we’d like cheap travel to?
  
  The criminal trials for the thugs from the last govt, including the trials that should (but won’t) come out of the 2nd phase of the Covid response inquiry.
  
  The biggest challenge would be finding a covered venue big enough.
  
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  February 16, 2025 6:20pm
AitchW

I’ve been to the last 2 Sail GPs, both of which had free public transport to and from the event included in the ticket price.
A few years back we attended a Queen concert at Mt Smart, it also included free train travel to and from the event.
As long as the ratepayer doesn’t fund said travel I can see no reason why it shouldn’t continue.
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February 16, 2025 3:18pm
Steve Otto N Shore

Elon Musk’s DOGE recovers $1.8b misplaced from Biden administration.
Unions and lefties are starting to get upset. The Trump admin is taking away their binky. Doge found this money, but you can guarantee it was going to be fed out to the corrupt. DOGE clock says this is only 2.5%

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/other/elon-musk-s-doge-recovers-1-8b-misplaced-from-biden-administration/ar-AA1z71xy?

The DOGE clock:

https://dogegov.com/dogeclock
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February 16, 2025 3:55pm
SmokerGuy

Very impressive performance by Erica Stanford this morning on Q and A. She must surely be a future leader of National.
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February 16, 2025 4:15pm
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  No thank you. Stanford is a pride-flag waving progressive who has failed to remove maatauranga from the school science curriculum.
  
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  February 16, 2025 7:18pm
Steve Otto N Shore

Democrats still on their last hopes – Lawfare.

https://patriotpulse.net/donald-trump-just-got-some-bad-news-about-getting-sent-to-jail/?
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February 16, 2025 4:30pm
Steve Otto N Shore

Three men donning shirts and hats referencing Donald Trump’s famous campaign slogan and Elon Musk’s task force showed up at San Francisco’s City Hall on Friday demanding employees surrender files, authorities said Friday..

I believe this.//

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/other/men-in-doge-shirts-and-maga-hats-show-up-at-sf-city-hall-demanding-files-officials/ar-AA1z5UbT?
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February 16, 2025 4:35pm
kevn

g.newsome prepping… for what?
https://x.com/WallStreetApes/status/1890954215549264248
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February 16, 2025 5:00pm
gorse

[Perhaps repost indicating whether you think he is lgbtq or pathetic (or both). mod.]
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February 16, 2025 9:00pm
- gorse
  
  Forget it
  
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  February 16, 2025 9:23pm

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