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January 5, 2025 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 05 January 2025

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artemisia

Elon Musk, undeterred by days of German political hyperventilation, continues to promote fascism and undermine democracy by tweeting things and scheduling interviews with people

So eugyppius takes a major swing at …. ? Or maybe not. But in the process might provide teeny tiny insight into a sea change in many western democracies.

https://www.eugyppius.com/p/elon-musk-undeterred-by-days-of-german
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January 5, 2025 8:04am
- lastmanstanding
  
  I suggest the Elites think very carefully. History has shown that if they push the peasants too far it wont end well for them. Think French Revolution.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:03am
  - kowtow
    
    The French Revolution was also an “Elite” reaction .
    
    The Estates weren’t the peasants , alot , as per the English Revolution were lawyers .
    
    The leading Bolshies and indeed Mao himself were middle class .
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:16am
  - Rusty
    
    @lastmanstanding, Unfortunately history can work the other way. The Russian revolution of 1917 demonstrated how the Communist elites got the peasants on their side.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:38am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Robespierre was one of the elite kids, until, oops he wasn’t anymore. They always think that the crocodile won’t eat them. Spoiler, it always does. The Woke DEI kids are just the next iterations of young Red Guards. They will be tremendously surprised when they end up in the gulag.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:54am
  - NothingLeft
    
    Fantasies of revolution are just that; fantasies. 99% of westerners are not going to risk what comfort they have on political actions that might cost them their possessions or get them imprisoned.
    
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    January 5, 2025 4:25pm
- PurplePen
  
  Roth, a Green MP in Germany, according to the article has said the solution is “Because democracy, it is okay for journalists to express opinions, but not for people or “platforms” to express them.” Only very few acts of expression, it turns out, are compatible with democracy.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:26am
  - oldpark
    
    @PurplePen 9.26 am
    
    Speaking of Greens and Reporting on their comments, if there are many left in some countries .
    Case in point which was kept quiet literally in the massacre the Green Party got in recent Irish Election in late 2024.
    Out of 13 seats the Irish Green Party lost 12 Seats.
    We can only hope that History will repeat in next NZ elections same result would be mirrored.
    The Irish voters realised that mad dog Green Party Policies have been and gone in that Country .
    
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    January 5, 2025 11:27am
    - sungsamning
      
      The ‘Greens’ were also wiped out in one of the state [Lander?] elections late last year; from memory.
      
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      January 5, 2025 4:26pm
    - kowtow
      
      OP
      
      I wouldn’t over credit the Irish electorate just yet.
      
      It appears to me that they have a penchant for very left ,even extremist representaives and lots of independents .
      
      It’s actually got the look of chaos rather than stability.
      
      I suspect the Greens were punished by the traditional eco nut voter for going into support the govt in the previous regime. As I say that left voter is spoiled for choice there.
      
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      January 5, 2025 4:43pm
    - AitchW
      
      The more fruit loops the Greens put on their list, the more truly green voters they will lose. Genter, Menendez March, Paul and Doyle are all extremely ideaogically driven and quite unlikeable.
      The Greens will have lost a lot of support with their pro-Hamas stand and their trans madness will lose a lot of support from both cis and gay voters who are not happy with men in women’s toilets and sport.
      Their love of taxes, especially CGT, wealth and inheritance taxes will see the ladies who lunch leave them in droves.
      The government needs to make sure that it highlights the madness in all 3 opposition parties at every opportunity.
      
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      January 5, 2025 5:04pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  The left now hate Musk when he was their hero. I remember the simple diagram he drew and posted it on x the pic had him slightly to the left, then the next diagram had him in the same place, but the left had moved on the diagram right to the left. They only have their selves to blame
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:42am
- rouppe
  
  Generally speaking, the general population would welcome open discussions and interviews.
  
  Alice Weidel is having one with Elon Musk, and this is viewed as a terrible afront to democracy.
  
  Have the opponents considered having an open discussion with, well, anyone outside the inner political sanctums?
  
  Perhaps Habeck could go on a Joe Rogan podcast. Or some European equivalent (is there one?). Imagine one between Habeck and, say, Boris Johnson. That’d be a spectacle.
  
  But no. The go to response is to shut down conversations they don’t like.
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:15am
  - AitchW
    
    Of course. Any opposing viewpoint is challenging and makes them feel unsafe. It must be suppressed.
    
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    January 5, 2025 7:50pm
Cassandra

Jordan Peterson in the Spectator (interviewed by Michael Gove): “Part of the story on the economic side is that you’re not a victim of circumstances. If you conduct yourself honourably, if you’re reliable, if you tell the truth and you have a sharp eye and are in a relatively functional state, you will be rewarded and you will gain economically. All the societies of the world that people are inclined to migrate to are characterised by a society that still rewards competence. The basis of competence is honesty and reliability.” He’s making the argument that poverty is avoidable. Get an education, at least to read and write level, turn up for work sober and on time etc. He also emphasises that the greatest impediment to a successful society is fatherlessness and the breakdown of the nuclear family. Pretty simple really. What’s wokeism, colonialism and all the other isms got to do with that?
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January 5, 2025 8:05am
- cmm
  
  I think that Jordan Peterson paints far too simple a picture.
  
  Yes, certainly, if you just show up sober and on time and then make use of the enormous opportunities available in a modern society you will be able to thrive.
  
  The breakdown of the nuclear families certainly makes that harder as people do not see their fathers going off to work etc.
  
  However, on the flip side, both complexity and automation make it harder for many people to get onto the career ladders.
  
  What I think makes it hardest of all is social media. Younger people associate more with the highly curated images they see on social media than with the real world around them. They expect more. They expect higher pay and expect to get there sooner. The gulf between their aspirations and reality is enormous.
  
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  January 5, 2025 8:32am
  - Cassandra
    
    Note that he says “Part of the story”. It’s a lengthy interview. Peterson never paints anything simple or simply!
    
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    January 5, 2025 8:37am
  - artemisia
    
    Young people from stable middle income families can also have unrealistic expectations. Like expect to live at the level their parents do now. Not how the parents started out.
    
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    January 5, 2025 8:51am
    - rouppe
      
      Saw it with tenants and first home buyers. They expect their first house to be better than their parents last house.
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:19am
  - Paulus
    
    On of the reasons we stayed here from a 3 year contract, 50 years ago was when my young son in the UK said “Night Night Daddy – see you in the morning”
    And thas was when I was not elswehere usually in an airplane, or somewhere else..
    May have missed a lot, but gained a lot more ever since.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:00am
  - PurplePen
    
    “if you just show up sober and on time and then make use of the enormous opportunities available in a modern society you will be able to thrive”.
    
    I would argue you can’t thrive as well as workers did some decades ago. My dad was a builder working for himself. He brought up 6 kids on what he earned, sent them all to a private school as well. You just couldn’t do that today on a single income. I was a dishwasher for a time earning $12 an hour in the 80s. The Reserve Bank calculator puts that at around $90k a year. No way do dishwashers today earn that amount. Somehow we’ve been ripped off by the economy in wages not keeping up with inflation.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:34am
    - Graeme Hall
      
      $12/hour as a dishwasher in the 1980s. Back then Crown Research Institutes hired young scientists on that rate if they were lucky.
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:13am
      - westernScientist
        
        I have no idea what the starting rate was in the 80s, but if it was inflation adjusted 90k, its about 15% higher than a starting wage in a CRI with a PhD and 3-9 years experience as a post doc would start on now (I have the FY 2024 pay scales for some of them). CRI’s were established in 1992, in the 80s it was DSIR and various research branches of other departments like MAF.
        
        Now to get that entry level position, you have to have a PhD and have spent 3 and 9 years as a postdoc, where as in the 80s you would start with honours from your undergrad degree and work on your PhD as part of employment – entry level CRI scientist now is 30+, there isnt enough time to get the required education and prior experience to get a entry position until that age (degree + honours or masters + phd + at least 3 years as a post doc). There is a reason why our CRI scientists are almost entirely people over the age of 55 – they started in DSIR or MAF. Most now have to go overseas to get the experience to be considered for an entry level position, and they never come back – why would they?
        
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        January 5, 2025 12:32pm
    - rouppe
      
      My first job was a programmer for IBM, started in 1985. I started on a salary of $18,000pa and I thought that was the pigs back.
      
      18000÷52÷40 is $8.65 per hour.
      
      $12 an hour, 40 hours a week, 52 weeks a year is $24,960
      
      Where was that job? Railways?
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:26am
      - lastmanstanding
        
        Luxury ( said with a Yorkshire accent). I started at the ASB in 1969 on $1250pa/$24pw/60cents perhr.
        
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        January 5, 2025 12:53pm
      - rouppe
        
        They woooont believe ya!
        
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        January 5, 2025 1:08pm
      - PurplePen
        
        Sharella Motor Inn in Glenmore St Wellington.
        
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        January 5, 2025 1:57pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        I made $18k working for ECNZ in Wellington doing data analysis university holiday summer of ’92, though doing a lot of overtime.
        
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        January 5, 2025 4:33pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Are you sure that your memory is correct? I was in Australia for two years in the mid 80s traveling and doing odd jobs. I got a job doing data entry. I still remember the annualised salary. $12,450. That is 6 dollars per hour.
      
      If you were getting 12 dollars an hour 40 years ago for washing dishes you were on a good thing.
      
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      January 5, 2025 12:18pm
      - PurplePen
        
        I cleaned houses for $15 an hour cash in the hand. I guess cleaning paid well.
        
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        January 5, 2025 1:57pm
      - sealegs
        
        In 1985 I was working in a supermarket as a first job, I remmember my hourly rate was $2:52 I think his memory of getting 12 bucks an hour is not a reality.
        
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        January 6, 2025 3:18am
    - wsk12345
      
      Are you sure? I worked in a cafe for $3.15 per hour in the late 80s. Youth rates though. Didn’t get to $12 until I got my degree!
      
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      January 5, 2025 12:19pm
    - cmm
      
      There are certainly things that were easier back then.
      
      But there are now many things that are far easier now, especially education and access to information.
      
      Back then you were basically forced to attend university etc to be able to do a degree, courses etc. Now there are thousands of opportunities online that people can do after hours.
      
      People’s expectations have gone up massively too. Even beneficiaries turn their noses up at houses people were proud to call home for themselves and their 4 kids in the 1960s.
      
      Just saying “it was easier then” and giving up is pathetic victim culture.
      
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      January 5, 2025 1:54pm
  - Local Miller
    
    While things like social media may be impacting young people, I don’t think this is significantly different to the peer pressure of our days More pervasive yes, but not much different. In the same way that we (generally) overcame peer pressure and made a success of our lives and families, so could young people today.
    It’s a nonsense to say “complexity and automation make it harder for many to get onto the career ladder”. For every job that’s been “lost to automation”, another 10 have been created, and increased complexity similarly has resulted in more jobs. While the “brighter” have taken on the more complex jobs, this has left a vacuum at the so called “bottom of the ladder” that is open for anyone with the will to do some work, to pick up the slack. I have 4 children who have all basically started at or near the bottom of the career ladder, and I changed careers at age 33, starting at the bottom as a “trainee computer programmer”. Now, 30 years later I’m one of the top in my field, and all my children have done very well because they “conducted themselves honourably and were reliable”.
    
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    January 5, 2025 10:07am
  - Michael Sommerville
    
    I watched “Gifted Hands” over the break. It is the story of Ben Carson. The world’s top neuro surgeon. He was raised by a single mother who couldn’t read or write but who knew the importance of education.
    
    This is a story / video that should be shown to all those in poverty. It clearly shows the importance of education and hard work. You may not end up a brain surgeon but you will do well being able to read and write. With a positive mental attitude to life of endeavour and integrity, you will end up as the best that you can be.
    
    As an aside, Ben Carson is an African American, a Republican and served in Donald Trumps Government as Secretary for Housing and Urban development. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Carson is a good read.
    
    I agree with Jordan Peterson.
    
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    January 5, 2025 10:14am
    - cmm
      
      I have written before of a 12 year old coloured (mixed race) boy I once met in Cape Town.
      
      He came from a drug family where he had been helping run drugs from age 9 or so. He moved out and was living under a bridge, but he was also working as a newspaper seller and going to school and going home on occasion to take his younger siblings food.
      
      By the age of 12 he had already saved almost the equivalent of half a year of university fees.
      
      He had this attitude that he was surrounded by opportunities and used those opportunities when he encountered them.
      
      I met him early in the morning sitting in the back of a rusted out HiAce sitting on piles of newspapers going over his homework with a mate. As soon as he heard I was a science student he roped me in to discussing his maths homework.
      
      As chance would have it, I met him again a few years later when he was an electronics technician.
      
      Everyone in NZ in 2025 has many times more resources available to them than that guy. The biggest factor is whether you get off your arse and use them.
      
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      January 5, 2025 2:03pm
  - Anthony Melchett
    
    “…as people do not see their fathers going off to work etc.”
    
    And their two mums refuse to motivate them and convince there adopted/surrogate whatever sons are actually daughters.
    
    Modern kids get told they don’t even have to accept their gender, let alone go to work on time.
    
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    January 5, 2025 1:31pm
- CJames
  
  Here is a link to the interview.
  https://youtu.be/k0fCgeaU-lI
  
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  January 5, 2025 8:51am
- kowtow
  
  A problem with today’s migration is many are targetting countries with the ‘best’ welfare options ,so they have a free ride .
  Britain , Germany , Sweden.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:27am
kiwikidsnz

“What’s wokeism, colonialism and all the other isms got to do with that?”

Excuses.
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January 5, 2025 8:31am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Yes, it is always someone or something else’s fault why they didn’t succeed.
  
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  January 5, 2025 10:19am
igm

Mormons never seem to be a problem anywhere, yet “Stuff” are taking them apart.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360528100/what-massive-fortress-structure-south-auckland
Never seem to see them touch Islam dens of who knows.
Is this not part of an agreed narrative for under the carpet funding?
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January 5, 2025 8:36am
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  I grew up in Hamilton (don’t tell anyone.
  I do remember the Temple at Temple View., out the back of Frankton and Melville. I was about 10 when we went to an open day. Fantastic place. It is not exactly rural anymore.
  I had friends from there that I went to school with. Never ever a problem.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:10am
  - rjay
    
    Church College from Temple view had demon teams to play rugby against. Their wingers were all Jonah Lomu sized which left us poor Frankton kids for dead. The forwards were up a notch from that. Always hospitable hosts though.
    
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    January 5, 2025 11:41am
- Local Miller
  
  On a personal level I think it’s an ugly building.
  
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  January 5, 2025 10:40am
  - 7kiwi11
    
    Personally I like it. Looks great lit up at night. I appreciate the craftsmanship in it which is lacking or nonexistent in most modern buildings
    
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    January 5, 2025 11:37am
- goNZ1
  
  stuff take turns between demonising JWs, Gloriavale,Brethrens, & Catholics.
  But far too scared of challenging the Religion of Peace!
  Their ex-brethren gay reporter Craig Hoyle is a nasty piece of work too.
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:54pm
  - SometimesRight
    
    My understanding is several of those are not religions per se but clever tax scams that we pay for. The trick is: run businesses at break-even and pay no tax by donating all profits to the church; claim the 1/3 government reimbursement on charitable donations; disburse church takings back to the membership as charitable disbursements. This is one key reason that in my view, religions should not have charity status.
    
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    January 5, 2025 8:19pm
Maggy Wassilieff

How folks from other countries view the divisive notion of biculturalism:

I told them ‘I think this biculturalism would be a very bad idea. That is what we have in Sri Lanka, and so we always have prejudice and discrimination, and sometimes riots, and even a civil war killing many people. Government should not create differences between people. It would be much better to emphasise what all the citizens have in common as New Zealand citizens, to strengthen unity and to help treat everyone fairly.’”

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/john-mendzela-submission-on-the-treaty-principles-bill
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January 5, 2025 8:39am
- Terry Dalee
  
  When people I know from Malaysia and South Africa have been saying to me, “oh, what’s happening in New Zealand is exactly what happened at home”, sealed the deal to move to Australia for us…..
  
  New Zealanders have no idea of the shit storm heading their way in this naive pursuit of “bi-culturalism”…
  
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  January 5, 2025 8:50am
  - crikey
    
    Terry: “ New Zealanders have no idea of the shit storm heading their way…”
    Oh yes we do, more and more of us day be day.
    
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    January 5, 2025 12:52pm
  - cmm
    
    Is Australia really on a better course? It seems to me that every public talk starts with some acknowledgement of first people etc.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:06pm
    - Terry Dalee
      
      You have a point. But I have more faith in Australian society than New Zealand to actually understand the concept of “one people”.
      And Australia has a Constitution, not sorry bits of a half burnt, rat eaten parchment pretending to be.
      
      Voting no to “the Voice” was a start. Even some of the First Peoples were against “the Voice” for the reason that it divided rather than united.
      
      As much as I disagree with Pauline Hanson, I’m glad she is in the Senate. Why?
      Because she is able to say what she does without being cancelled or de-platformed like would happen in NZ.
      Australia appears capable of having a reasoned debate in Parliament without it devolving to a singing and dancing circus…
      She brings the other perspective to the debate, as much as you might not agree with her viewpoint.
      
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      January 5, 2025 5:46pm
- pdm
  
  I just finished reading it before coming over here Maggy.
  
  It is an excellent piece.
  
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  January 5, 2025 8:50am
- Tauhei Notts
  
  The Mendzela submission is possibly the best submission that I have read about the Treaty Principles bill.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:03am
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  Unfortunately it will probably be binned. Can’t have submissions from people smarter than committee members.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:17am
  - Cantabrian
    
    I often wonder how much ‘selection’ will be made by committee staff – I fear that the good, rational, conservative submissions such as this will be sidelined by officials and not be seen by members. There is a very real danger committee outcomes will be impacted by censorship by staffers who disagree with the Bill.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:32am
    - peterwn
      
      David Seymour would be wide awake to that possibility. Committee members (and hence their staffers) are entitled to view ALL submissions. Committee staff may well review submissions and report to Committee members summarising them into a report and grouping like submissions.
      
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      January 5, 2025 10:46am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      I hope they run the Submissions through an AI model. I’d prefer to rely upon a machine’s summary than that of a human.
      
      Or to put it another way, I’d like both approaches to be taken & the results compared & contrasted.
      
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      January 5, 2025 2:37pm
      - Steve Otto N Shore
        
        A “racist” human you mean right? Because that is what is going to happen. Thousands of Seymour support submissions in the bin.
        Tell me I am wrong. We are talking the corrupt Public Sector here.
        
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        January 5, 2025 3:28pm
      - Graeme Hall
        
        Not me. Have you ever read the AI summaries of computer product reviews? AI only seems to offer the modal view not the best or most thoughtful. At best it is only a very general guide & rarely points out true strengths or weaknesses.
        
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        January 5, 2025 3:32pm
- rouppe
  
  Yesterday I was looking for a registered dietician. As it happened, one popped up that provided services to the medical centre at which I an enrolled.
  
  I looked at the prices.
  Initial consultation: $150 or $35 if subsidised.
  Follow up $85 or $19.50 if subsidised.
  
  You qualify for a subsidy if you are enrolled at the Medical Centre (and other Wellington Medical Group practices) who have a community services card or are of Māori or Pacific descent.
  
  So a not quite poor enough white person can’t get subsidised help, but a rich Maori or Pacific Island person can.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:18am
  - igm
    
    Come on Coalition, this crap must stop, and maybe Chris Luxon himself, puts an end to it. Currently he is no better than hapless Ardern in many spheres of leadership.
    
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    January 5, 2025 11:26am
- Local Miller
  
  As a South African who chose to come live in New Zealand with my wife and family, the current trend is very worrying and upsetting. We personally saw and experienced the impact apartheid had, not only on the country, but on all race groups. We saw this both under the old apartheid and under the new apartheid. One of the biggest motivating factors for our leaving SA was the new apartheid there, and we chose NZ (among other reasons) because we believed the risk of it becoming like SA was minimal. At the time (20 years ago) this was the case, but over the years the Left and Mäori have changed all that.
  A race based system negatively impacts all races, even those it purports to benefit. If things go the way they are currently going and NZ becomes a bi-cultural (AKA apartheid) country then the need to apologise to the Springboks for refusing to play rugby against them, and to SA for opposing their apartheid system.
  I think a lot of South Africans will rethink their decision to come here and look to emigrating again. I just don’t know where they would go. Australia doesn’t look that flash politically at the moment.
  
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  January 5, 2025 10:54am
  - cmm
    
    Local: I went through pretty much what you did, but 33 years ago. I really had hopes we were coming to a country with no racial bullshit.
    
    As you say, apartheid was a lose-lose situation for everyone. Many people thought it was for the benefit of whites to the detriment of blacks, but I don’t think that is true at all.
    
    My (white) family was kicked off their property on the East of Pietermatitzburg in the 1950s because it was made an Indian group area and whites were no longer permitted to live there. Somewhat ironic as the main road in that area is named after my family.
    
    That was a situation forced onto the local people by the Pretoria government.
    
    The destruction of District Six that was forced on Cape Town was terrible in all ways. Cape Town never recovered from that. Again – a situation forced on them by Pretoria – over 1000 miles away.
    
    Even still, I do not recall animosity between whites and coloureds in Cape Town. In many suburbs the “group areas” were interleaved such that they were sometimes different sides of the same street – with the kids all playing together, families going to church together etc etc.
    
    I grew up in Pietermaritzburg with a lot of Indians in the area. I also don’t remember any animosity between whites and Indians either.
    
    All through that, I think the relationship between whites, coloureds and Indians was far less strained that what we are seeing in NZ.
    
    I have not mentioned black people here because they are many very different tribes in very different areas and that made for a much more complex picture.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:25pm
  - Paulus
    
    Neither does the UK from what we hear.
    We met a New Zealand couple again yesterday, as finally buying our house, as we have to go into care close facilities, coming home from the UK – they have excellent jobs and will do well here.
    Mum going back to pick up children now they know here where they are going.
    Some of what the Starmer and Lady Finance Minister are proposing will frighten many more people away from there.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:36pm
    - cmm
      
      The missus and I were talking about this a couple of days back….
      If you’re white and English speaking then is there anywhere you can feel like you really belong – long term?
      
      We are now in out 60s, so slowly heading towards retirement. I an certainly thankful I’m not trying to build a career.
      
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      January 5, 2025 3:08pm
Burtland

“This year’s La Nina and El Nino weather patterns had not behaved as expected”

modelling again wrong from NIWA – the weather is not following the narrative
– about time they sacked some people

if they cant predict the weather a month out, how can they claim to predict it 25yrs out

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/538174/weather-horrendous-sunday-ahead-but-hope-is-in-sight
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January 5, 2025 8:40am
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  In other words they have no idea and are just guessing, not forecasting.
  What gets me is boaties rely on good forecasting. You can get into a lot of trouble in the Hauraki Gulf with a bad forecast. How they hold down a job is beyond me.
  These days I take it with a grain of salt and rely on my own 50+ years of experience out there and I am still alive. I have helped many who get out of their depth, like jetskiers and paddleboarders out the back of Waiheke. It can change fairly quick with the wind and the tide turning.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:26am
  - AitchW
    
    I imagine that within a few years weather forecasts will be produced by AI. I have heard that it’s already being trialled and that it’s far more reliable than human forecasting.
    Has John Conner been born yet?
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:31am
  - notreadyet
    
    there is a very good weather forecast app developed by Team NZ called Predict Wind, berry accurate. it derives it’s information from the 5 main Global forecast models, it can show all 5 and my experience is if 3 of then say it’s going to start raining at 5am and the other 2 are +/- an hr or 2 it will rain at 5am. It shows all other weather info like wind speed. gust speed., direction, cloud cover, temp, wave height etc etc for any location you chose. Rain is less accurate as tends to be governed by topography, I’m seaside surrounded by hills and they get the rain but not us.
    a very good app, when the house manager looks at a forecast that tells her 50’/, chance of rain, I ask when will it happen and get a blank look, now I can tell her rain at 900-1200
    
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    January 5, 2025 11:04am
    - Steve Otto N Shore
      
      I had a look and subscribed. Thanks.
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:33am
- imalwaysright
  
  Marxists wear many uniforms. NIWA are the department who wear weathermen uniforms.
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:34am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Are NIWA models less reliable than those of similar institutions globally?
  
  What is remarkable about climate modelling is how accurate it has been over the last 50 years.
  
  https://www.science.org/content/article/even-50-year-old-climate-models-correctly-predicted-global-warming
  
  I appreciate that does not fit the narrative of commenters here who try to wish away climate change.
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:04pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    The new models are tested against existing models to “verify their accuracy”.
    If you can’t see the problem with that, just say so.
    Happy to explain.
    
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    January 5, 2025 1:17pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    ‘What is remarkable about climate modelling is how accurate it has been over the last 50 years’
    This is a remarkably disingenuous statement- and I have seen others say this before.
    
    The IPCC and others publish a range of models.
    From very low estimates of temperature increase to quite high (I’m looking at you RCP 8.5)
    The accurate models are the ones which estimated THE LOWEST RISE!
    
    Yet we still see institutions like City Councils use RCP 8.5 , the highest and most extreme Model, in their planning.
    Its just deceitful.
    No one disputes the Temp is rising but for years people like myself have said it will be modest.
    And it is.
    .9C per Century.
    NOT the 2-5 C so many alarmists predicted.
    
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    January 5, 2025 3:06pm
- westernScientist
  
  dont worry, NIWA are way ahead of you: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/516201/niwa-job-cuts-could-gut-team-of-nz-s-top-climate-modellers
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:37pm
- cmm
  
  I don’t care that NIWA gets things wrong.
  
  I care that they deliberately destroy data and are anti-science (well have been in the past and, I therefore assume, still are).
  
  I have had two interactions with NIWA staff that really showed how anti-science they are:
  
  Interaction 1: I have written about that before. I requested some data on sea level rise. They refused to release “uncorrected” data or their correction methodology. They also said they had deleted the original data “to save disk space”.
  
  Destroying measured data is about as close as you can get to a crime against science.
  
  Interaction 2: Somewhere around 2008 I was fishing at the Whitecliffs Domain (I lived about 1km from there at the time) and came across a field team of two or three NIWA people gathering sediment samples from the river.
  
  When I asked what they were doing they said they were gathering data to prove that grazing was wrecking the river. Red flag: You don’t gather data to “prove” something – you gather data to see if it supports a hypothesis.
  
  I told them that the places they were gathering the samples were unstable and they wouldn’t find anything useful because the river had changed significantly a few weeks prior (as it did each time the river came down in spate). The rocks they were standing on had moved about 200 metres down river in the previous 6 months. The silt they were gathering hadn’t been there 3 months prior.
  
  They were not bothered by that – no doubt they found the “proof” they were looking for.
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:37pm
hookerphil

I see at least one writer in the world knows what is going on in Gods own.

https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/03/07/new-zealand-the-wokest-country-in-the-world/
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January 5, 2025 8:43am
- CJames
  
  It is a near three year old article. Jacinda was still PM them. I think everyone agrees it is different now – the discussion is just how different
  
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  January 5, 2025 8:54am
  - imalwaysright
    
    C
    It may be different from when adern was dictator, but her marxist regime still exists and seems to be actively working against Kiwis.
    It may be more enlightening to judge today’s NZ against NZ pre adern.
    We are now a very different country in all of the wrong ways.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:48am
    - AitchW
      
      Ardern and Robertson gave activist public servants pretty much free rein to act on their previously unactivated liberal agendas.
      The new (ish) government will struggle to put all of those woke genies back in their bottles.
      The damage Ardern did will take generations to undo.
      
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      January 5, 2025 10:36am
    - Steve Otto N Shore
      
      Incredible that someone can damage out Country so much then walk away without even saying sorry.
      She belongs in jail.
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:36am
      - AitchW
        
        The way she quit with no warning then pretty much fled the country was astounding. Obviously didn’t want to lose the election as badly as she knew would happen.
        A rat leaving a sinking ship springs to mind.
        What’s even more astounding is the unfettered adulation from the woke of the world she’s enjoying.
        The money is pretty good too.
        When will they realise that the empress has no clothes?
        
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        January 5, 2025 12:15pm
      - crikey
        
        Steve: If Ardern said Sorry I would know it’s a lie.
        
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        January 5, 2025 1:00pm
      - imalwaysright
        
        Aitch, the adulation of her is an illusion. Even the most devout marxist wouldn’t part with $500 to hear that drivel.
        The speaking circuit for these types is a form of disguised payment for services rendered.
        The companies she served give away the tickets to drones who are happy to get free food and piss for the night and pretend to listen to the unintelligible tripe from the chippy worker.
        She’s collecting her 30 pieces of silver.
        
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        January 5, 2025 3:12pm
- Scott
  
  Thanks for posting this hookerphil. It shows just how bad things were under the Adern regime.
  The wokest country in the world!!
  
  It shows to me the head winds this govt is battling. Transforming the wokest country in the world is not easy. We have lots of woke people in senior positions. Wokeness is endemic in the public service, the media and the education system.
  
  That’s why I’m very positive with this govt. They’re transforming the country but it takes a lot of time and effort and patience. The coalition is doing a good job in my opinion. 😊
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:27pm
Hugh Jarse

Global warming is obviously hitting other parts of the world and not Canterbury.
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January 5, 2025 8:45am
- pdm
  
  Anyone know what it is like in Wellington for the ODI?
  
  Wet and murky (dreich) in Hastings.
  
  Means watching bowls or two cricket options.
  
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  January 5, 2025 8:55am
  - rouppe
    
    Overcast, windy, cool from the southerly.
    
    I’m north of Newlands so sometimes the weather can be quite different to south of Newlands but since it’s a southerly, the only thing I can’t comment on is rain.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:07am
  - MCōs
    
    Relentless sunshine in Mangere Bridge once again
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:29am
    - kevn
      
      mcos…. The result of your sunny disposition? Reflected locally.
      
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      January 5, 2025 10:57am
    - AitchW
      
      Steady rain here at Karapiro. Good for the vege garden and our tanks have been full for months. Not so hot for those driving home from the bach.
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:05am
  - Hugh Jarse
    
    Forecast for today in Wellington was pretty average.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:31am
  - hookerphil
    
    To my mind – the Australia India test. Not only edge of seat type cricket but commentators that are proven International players who so often correctly predict what type of ball or shot will be played.
    On the other hand we have non stop verbal garbage from Scotty Robinson who is certainly a channel changer
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:33am
    - pdm
      
      Agreed re commentators hooker.
      
      The Aussie ones are better than the Chappell, Lawrie, Grieg days while as you say Scottie Robinson is a real turn off.
      
      Good to see McMillan back today but shame no one will bow down and let Smith commentate in NZ.
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:05am
      - GazzaW
        
        Scottie’s commentary is a shocker but the female commentator is so blindingly boring and she has zero sense of humour. Bring back Smithy!!
        
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        January 5, 2025 1:40pm
      - MCōs
        
        It’s like a lot of other things to do with cricket in NZ.
        There isn’t the money to employ the top people.
        A number of our better players and coaches are working for offshore franchises.
        BTW
        I think Ian Smith is involved with a radio station.
        
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        January 5, 2025 4:24pm
      - MCōs
        
        Chappell, Lawrie, Grieg etc all worked for Kerry Packer on Channel 9 and he liked a certain style of presentation
        Currently I believe some other channel has the contract hence the difference.
        
        The Packer guys never gave credit to visiting teams who only won because the locals played below their normal standard
        
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        January 5, 2025 4:35pm
      - AitchW
        
        Mcos, those guys were dreadful. Richie Benaud used to wet himself when Ponting went anywhere near the ball.
        I remember one ODI played in Aus where we had the upper hand and the Aussies were batting. The commentators couldn’t bring themselves to say anything positive about our guys and spent a couple of overs talking about the batsman’s haircut!
        
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        January 5, 2025 5:37pm
    - pdm
      
      Scottie Stevenson Hooker.
      
      I knew there was something wrong but had to google to get the correct name.
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:23am
  - GazzaW
    
    Regardless of the Wellington weather I will be watching some real cricket from a packed Sydney Cricket Ground between India and Australia in the deciding fifth test. As a bonus it is also Pink Day which is a massive fundraiser for Jane McGrath’s cancer foundation.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:47am
  - Biscuit
    
    Forecast here, pdm, is:
    
    Partly cloudy with a few showers. Southerlies, rising to gale this morning, gusting 90 km/h in exposed places.
    
    No sign of those showers or wind here as yet, mind…
    
    Coolish, mind – 14 o C.
    
    Just about to head to Brewtown for some supplies – garlic roti, mmmm, one of Dough Bakeries’ filled rolls and, okay, one of Dough Bakeries patisseries…
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:48am
    - imalwaysright
      
      Don’t go near the chip van. $29 for large fish and chips!
      
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      January 5, 2025 9:52am
      - Steve Otto N Shore
        
        I guess salt and sauce is extra?
        
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        January 5, 2025 11:46am
    - pdm
      
      Biscuit what about those marshmallow biscuit thingees you like?
      
      Or do you only eat `other peoples’ of those?
      
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      January 5, 2025 11:07am
      - Biscuit
        
        $29 for large fish and chips?
        
        Y-i-k-e-s!
        
        We are biscuit-less in this house at present, pdm. This is a (predictable) consequence of having the wee fella next door spending most of yesterday here, ha…
        
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        January 5, 2025 11:33am
      - alwyn.a
        
        Seems a pretty reasonable price.
        The “large fish” is a 70kg tuna.
        
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        January 5, 2025 3:05pm
- Scott
  
  Global warming is also missing Masterton. After a warm Dec for about 3 weeks, the weather has gone very cool for this time of year. Today it’s 13C rising to 15C, tomorrow a maximum of 16C. Normally at this time of year it’s around 25C to 29C.
  
  But I look forward to some “climate scientist” informing us that 2025 was the hottest year on record and remember to charge your electric car! 😁
  
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  January 5, 2025 9:07am
sungsamning

https://thehill.com/policy/technology/5063700-fcc-loses-net-neutrality-appeal/
Federal Appeals Court Strikes Down Biden Net Neutrality Rules.
A federal appeals court ruled this week the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) lacked the authority to restore certain net neutrality rules last year, handing a blow to FCC Democrats and Biden administration officials who pushed for revived open internet measures.

The Thursday ruling by the 6th Circuit Court of Appeals overturns last year’s FCC vote, which reinstated the net neutrality rules barring broadband providers from blocking or throttling internet traffic to some websites and speeding up access to others that pay extra fees.
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January 5, 2025 8:56am
sungsamning

https://nypost.com/2025/01/02/business/morgan-stanley-joins-goldman-sachs-citi-in-exodus-from-climate-alliance/
Morgan Stanley joins Goldman Sachs, Citi in Exodus From UN-Backed Climate Alliance.
Morgan Stanley said on Thursday it had decided to leave a UN-backed climate alliance — joining rivals Goldman Sachs and Citi in ditching the group amid conservative backlash toward environmental and diversity initiatives.
The Wall Street investment bank gave no reason for its decision to exit the Net-Zero Banking Alliance, a pledge to achieve net-zero greenhouse gas emissions by 2050.
Citigroup and Bank of America said they were leaving the group earlier this week, and Goldman Sachs and Wells Fargo made the same announcement in early December. [It looks like their reality check isn’t made of rubber.]
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January 5, 2025 8:56am
Pineapple Lumps

Has anyone here read the latest Ann Kelly / Naomi Wolf book “The Pfizer Papers”?

They have a team reading through the Pfizer mRNA vaccine trial reports and documentation that was only made public after initially being requested to be sealed for 70years. This book is some of their findings from the trial information.

I’m interested to hear feedback from anyone here who has read it.

Here is a description of the book:

“The Pfizer Papers features new reports written by WarRoom/DailyClout research volunteers, which are based on the primary source Pfizer clinical trial documents released under court order and on related medical literature. The book shows in high relief that Pfizer’s mRNA COVID-19 vaccine clinical trial was deeply flawed and that the pharmaceutical company knew by November 2020 that its vaccine was neither safe nor effective. The reports detail vaccine-induced harms throughout the human body, including to the reproductive system; show that women suffer vaccine-related adverse events at a 3:1 ratio; expose that vaccine-induced myocarditis is not rare, mild, or transient; and, shockingly, demonstrate that the mRNA vaccines have created a new category of multi-system, multi-organ disease, which is being called “CoVax Disease.”
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January 5, 2025 9:03am
- Keith White
  
  I have read it, now twice.
  
  Short summary; the people who most need to read and internalize the facts presented and the atrocious unethical mandates based on lying-for-power-and-profit – those politicians, doctors and scientists – are the least likely to ever read it and learn anything from it. Ardern, Bloomfield, Hopkins, Verrall, and Co.
  
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  January 5, 2025 10:08am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I have not read the book.
  
  I am aware of some of the crazy claims by Naomi Woolf over the last several years.
  
  Put simply, the claims are not supported by large scale data relating to what happens to people after they have received the vaccine. The vaccinated had much lower age adjusted mortality rates than the unvaccinated. Month on month, every month since the vaccines were rolled out.
  
  https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsinvolvingcovid19byvaccinationstatusengland/deathsoccurringbetween1april2021and31may2023#:~:text=Monthly%20age%2Dstandardised%20mortality%20rates,with%20just%20a%20first%20or
  
  Folk who have kept up to date with boosters have the lowest mortality of any of the cohorts, which is exactly what you would expect to see.
  
  Sadly, people like Naomi Woolf have led to the deaths of millions of people.
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:00am
  - imalwaysright
    
    It isn’t a vaccine.
    
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    January 5, 2025 12:16pm
  - Keith White
    
    You haven’t read the book, but people like Naomi Wolf are responsible for the deaths of millions.
    
    WOW. Quite a take.
    
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    January 5, 2025 12:38pm
  - freemark
    
    Benedict. Are you aware that (still?) a death within 2 weeks of the jab is in most cases coded not as a vaccine death – “not fully vaccinated?”
    Of course you have been informed (many times) that a Covid death (for most of the “pandemic”) referred to any death within 2 weeks of a totally unsuitable & non-diagnostic PCR positive (generally above 35 cycles) result.
    How can you cite all (or any) of these statistics by those (often with a financial incentive) researching or publishing them?
    Is it a self-protection mechanism for your brain?
    
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    January 5, 2025 1:35pm
CJames

Interesting testimony here. Trump from 20 years ago before US Senate going on about how the UN building refit was a financial disaster waiting to happen. He was a Democrat then so what he said was perfectly acceptable.
On the evidence of this, he appears to have had them a very good grasp of facts and figures. If he has kept those mental faculties, then it is a major contrast to his opponents. https://youtu.be/6SgSno0JtiI
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January 5, 2025 9:08am
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  He knows money. What a great tutorial, Democrat or not. He had everyone in the room listening. The Chairman was mesmerised.
  The question at the end, “In two words what would you say if a project cost twice the price?” “You’re fired!”
  This is why the swamp didn’t want him as President. He is going to take away their “binky.” Stop their corruption!
  Those watching, I hope you watch all of it.
  
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  January 5, 2025 10:31am
- ChristopherW2
  
  Excellent video – “they’re gonna take you to school, and they’re gonna eat your lunch.” 😀
  
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  January 5, 2025 4:26pm
AitchW

Tamahere throwing his toys out of the cot about Herald and ZB reporting on his party illegally using funds from Waiparera Trust. No MP will write for or be interviewed by either outlet.
Also doxing senior NZME editors and a political reporter.
Pre-emptive strike prior to the marae report being released?
The natives are restless methinks.
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January 5, 2025 9:17am
- kowtow
  
  You’d wonder why then NZME is so craven in the name of all things Maoriwonderfulness .
  
  Time for the media to come in from the cold and re join the democracy club.
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:35am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Heard a good description of the media: “Presstitutes”
    
    -Jimmy Dore show.
    
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    January 5, 2025 12:14pm
  - AitchW
    
    Neither Hosking nor HDPA buy into the Maori wonderfulness bullshit.
    Her interview of Chappie wotsisname from OT was a breath of fresh air.
    They don’t allow the prevarication, grandstanding and general bullshit that so many journos do. Not unlike the Fuzzy Wuzzies the Maori Party MPs don’t like it up them!
    
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    January 5, 2025 12:22pm
Inandout

This is the 1959 visit to the US by Nikita Khrushchev and is qute an eye opener. There was a banquet held in California and Marilyn Monroe was interviewed on her thoughts. She couldn’t expand on her finding it ‘quite interesting’ and perhaps explained her grasp of the English language.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBL4z8wVfjQ&t=14s
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January 5, 2025 9:24am
- sungsamning
  
  Yes, I’ve seen that. He got a cold reception at first. The banquet in California changed things. His reception was better after that. Then he visited an experimental corn farm in Kansas. That was a media circus. The temperature of the Cold War had dropped considerably after that.
  
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  January 5, 2025 4:44pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

There’s only two days to go until submissions close on the Treaty of Waitangi Principles Bill.

The weather being what it is, making a submission strikes me as a good indoor activity.

Encourage your spouse and children to do likewise!
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January 5, 2025 9:29am
TripeWryter

I hear on the radio news that a former US President, Jimmy Carter, is being buried today after a state funeral.
He was a great pretender of American politics just like another Democrat, Barack Obama.
Both pretended to be ‘outsiders’ to Washington.
Neither was. They were as ‘insider’ as you could get.
I was working on a provincial newspaper in early 1976. Carter’s name never even featured in the news and commentary about who would be elected President in 1976.
Until suddenly the American media were talking about the former peanut man and Governor of Georgia as a Democrat possibility.
From then on the coverage was relentless. He was an outsider to Washington. He was a God-fearing Baptist. A Christian who preached and lived ‘family values’.
What the insider-run American media never reported was that James Earl Carter was a creature of David Rockefeller and his Polish-born hireling, Zbigniew Kazimierz Brzeziński.
They scouted around for a candidate who would have those values. Jimmy Carter was meant to embody those values in front of the American people.
But he was an ‘insider’ who continued the Washington tradition (since 1923) of Establishment figures being chosen and sold to the American people.
By that I mean that you couldn’t even hope to be President of the United States – or even hold Cabinet office – unless you belonged to the Council on Foreign Relations or David Rockefeller’s Trilateral Commission.
That’s where the real decisions were – and probably still are – made.
Barack Obama and his wife are long-time members of the commission.
The thing about these bodies is that they’re not open and honest about why they really exist. Look at their web sites. They’re bland and waffle about being nothing more than talk shops.
In 1977-78 Penthouse magazine began running a series on Jimmy Carter. What they wrote was quite at odds with what I was seeing in front of me as I was doing my day job as a sub-editor.
It was confronting and confusing because you didn’t see this in The New York Times or The Washington Post or the feeds from Reuters or The Associated Press.
My bride confronted me one day after she’d found a box under our bed with copies of Penthouse.
Among the tits, bums, clitorises, and penises were articles about Jimmy Carter that were not being printed elsewhere – nor defended or denied in the American media.
The American people were conned into voting for a fraud.
He was soon found wanting. The Establishment abandoned him.
The debacle in the desert to rescue the hostages in Tehran finished him off.
Americans voted for Ronald Reagan in 1980.
To prove to my bride that my possession of Penthouse was ‘for these articles’, and to satisfy her wish that I get rid of them, I did.
If you want to see a real ‘outsider’ in American politics you only have to look at Donald Trump.
The Establishment hate him. Their media revile him and portray him in the worst possible light.
He is not St Donald, no.
Anyway, I hope Jimmy Carter had a more authentic life in his latter years.
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January 5, 2025 9:52am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  That’s a bit naive, TW. All Presidents have powerful people behind them. Mr Smith Goes to Washington is fictional.
  
  And, it’s surely also true here in NZ, and elsewhere.
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:04am
- MCōs
  
  A Penthouse interview with Jimmy Carte from 1983
  https://penthouse.com/legacy/jimmy-carter/
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:23pm
- AitchW
  
  I’m surprised that we don’t have saturation media coverage of his funeral. Are most of our journos too young to know who he is?
  
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  January 5, 2025 5:40pm
  - MCōs
    
    Contrary to the news report Tripe above heard, he’s not being buried today.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:31pm
Swifty

Got the evil eye from Rawiri Waititi in Wanganui last night.

We had followed a black car some small distance to the Cooks Gardens Motel when we noticed it was Debbie Ngarewa-Packer-branded vehicle and as we pull in out hops Debbie and Rawiri, who gave me the evils.

I presume he thought we were following him deliberately or something – but no, like Joseph and Mary, we were just looking for a room for the night.

Long story short, we couldn’t find a room for love nor money so we shot through to Palmy.
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January 5, 2025 10:03am
- AitchW
  
  Maybe you were just the wrong race…..
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:13am
- MCōs
  
  Maybe the TPM leadership are a bit nervous after this incident a couple of weeks ago
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/politics/360524159/te-pati-maori-call-extra-security-following-staged-attack-debbie-ngarewa-packer
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:32pm
  - Swifty
    
    Heh, yep, and no doubt my fearful countenance, MCos.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:39pm
mogg

Thi is an excerpt from the official transcript of a court trial where Pakistani Muslim rape gang were found guilty of repeatedly sodomising an 11 year old white girl in Rotherham.

be to taken to the Nanford twice or three times a week. 53) You, Mohammed Karrar, prepared her for gang anal rape by using a pump to expand her anal passage. You subjected her to a gang rape by five or six men (count 30). At one
point she had four men inside her. A red ball was placed in her mouth to keep her quiet. Not only were you both involved in the commercial sexual exploitation of GH, you also
used her for your own self-gratification. You both raped her when she was under 13. When she was very young, although it is not clear whether she was under 13, you both raped her at the same time (oral and vaginal/anal). It happened on more than one occasion
(Count 28). 54) Mohammed Karrar, on one occasion when GH was 12, after raping her, she threatened you with your lock knife. Your reaction was to pick up a baseball bat with a silver metal handle, strike her on the head with it, and then insert the baseball bat inside her vagina. You treated her as if she was your commodity. You branded her (with your initial near her anal passage) using a hot hair pin. If GH did not comply with your wishes,
if you were not with other people, you would lose your temper with her. As part of the
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January 5, 2025 10:10am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Dear God in heaven!
  
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  January 5, 2025 10:31am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    “I don’t think the great British public really knows the truth about the scale of it – at least 50 different towns in which this happened.
    
    The Reform leader said the decision by Labour not to hold a national public inquiry into the grooming, sexual assault and rape of young girls was a political disgrace.
    
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/01/04/starmers-role-grooming-scandal-probe-farage/
    
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    January 5, 2025 11:17am
    - mogg
      
      This type of depravity, has been covered up by Labour run councils for the past 30 yrs, Starmer as director of public prosecutions has been right at the centre of it. A current Labour MP has said in Parliament that “ White Girls in Rotherham and Rochdale should keep their mouths shut in the best interests of diversity”, he has still got his job.
      
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      January 5, 2025 12:06pm
      - imalwaysright
        
        If I’m not mistaken a certain fish and chip wrapper later got a job as one of Tony Blair’s press team that actively suppressed these accusations.
        
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        January 5, 2025 12:21pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Keir Starmer was the Director of Public Prosecutions through this period (like Una Janos, but much worse). You would think that he cannot possibly survive this. Yet, he remains in office, unlike the Archbishop of Canterbury.
        
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        January 5, 2025 2:46pm
      - DimChappie
        
        No she (Naz Shah) retweeted the quote from a parody account.
        https://fullfact.org/online/naz-shah-diversity-quote-tweet/
        
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        January 5, 2025 3:15pm
  - AitchW
    
    Sickening. The cold premeditation is just chilling.
    
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    January 5, 2025 5:41pm
- Local Miller
  
  Makes me sick to the stomach. The death penalty would be too easy for people like this. Bring back life with hard labour.
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:01am
- GazzaW
  
  British judges hand down some fairly savage sentences and it is to be hoped that these animals received their just rewards. I’m picking forty years or life without parole for this outrage. Sufficient time for them to be the recipients of doses of their own medicine on multiple occasions in one of His Majesty’s prisons.
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:10am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Some received stiff sentences..
    
    Many have never come to trial
    
    Some involved remain in the UK even though they have lost their citizenship.
    
    . Despite being stripped of British citizenship, the leader of a Rochdale grooming gang still lives among his victims despite being ordered to be deported.
    
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/04/grooming-gangs-scandal-cover-up-oldham-telford-rotherham/
    
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    January 5, 2025 4:31pm
  - Sir Henry Morgan
    
    UK prisons are now mostly run my muslim gangs. I expect that means, even if jailed, the rapists will be well protected in prison.
    
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    January 5, 2025 5:12pm
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  Disturbing.
  Nothing being done to stop them.
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:00pm
  - crikey
    
    Deeply, deeply disturbing. These people do not deserve to live, let alone be housed for life at taxpayer expense in prison. There is no solution to that other than vigilante action (and we don’t want that do we).
    
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    January 5, 2025 1:31pm
- cmm
  
  Mohammed Karrar, will you be requiring any new games for your XBox?
  
  It would actually be a delight to have these people face their own “tribal law”. Some Pakistani law, without the protection of a woke dudge would likely be swift and brutal.
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:45pm
  - Sir Henry Morgan
    
    They didn’t rape Muslim girls, only infidels. Pakistani law would likely not see it as the type of rape that needs to be taken too seriously.
    
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    January 5, 2025 5:15pm
- Waipuk
  
  Yes go after the Asian men ie Pakistani men that did these crimes. But the real scum are the police, social workers, councils, schools, judicatory, media, and politicians that let this go on because they did not want to be seen as racist.
  
  Hopefully Tommy Robinson will start to be seen as the hero he is.
  
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  January 5, 2025 3:37pm
  - Sir Henry Morgan
    
    100%
    
    In so many cases, even those now talking about the issue treat Tommy Robinson as somehow beyond the pale, though that seems to be slowly changing – even Jordan Peterson interviewed Tommy Robinson a couple of months back.
    
    Tommy Robinson essentially just makes the same points as Douglas Murray. One difference is that rather than merely denouncing what is happening, Tommy Robinson mobilizes ordinary people without their own platforms to get on the streets. Beyond that though, the differences relate to class. Douglas Murray is well educated and speaks with an acerbic wit. Tommy Robinson is working class and has a different manner of expressing himself. So Douglas Murray gets constant media appearances, a column in The Spectator, etc. Meanwhile, Tommy Robinson gets vilified, socially ostracized and repeatedly jailed.
    
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    January 5, 2025 5:22pm
Benedict Yu

Something to reflect on..

Does New Zealand, with a population of just over 5 million, need 162 government agencies?

https://www.publicservice.govt.nz/system/central-government-organisations

There are also 78 local government and territorial authorities.

If you were designing the government administration of a small country from a clean slate, would you ever consider such a structure? 😳 Of course not.

These agencies administer 3,865 active, in force, Acts of Parliament.

Then there are countless, but certainly tens of thousands of regulations.

This is why David Seymour’s approach to systematically reviewing regulations piece by piece is doomed. It will take centuries. Coming up to half way through this term of government, what has he achieved on this front?
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January 5, 2025 10:45am
- Local Miller
  
  If we don’t start now, it will never be done. If we take this attitude things will never get better.
  I am disappointed about the rate of change, but, as my grandfather always said: “Slowly, slowly catchy monkey”
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:07am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Well in this case your grandfather would wrong. New Zealand has no time lose. Or I guess we could go “slowly” until we are truly in the league Argentina. You think that will not happen?
    
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    January 5, 2025 11:47am
  - cmm
    
    Find the common ground – make a start.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:48pm
- rjay
  
  Local authorities should be local. Economies of scale can be achieved with shared services e.g. of water services. I bet the good people of Kawerau have a better connection with their representatives than in Auckland.
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:03pm
- Steve Otto N Shore
  
  NZ desperately needs Elon Musk and Vivek Ramaswamy types to exterminate all of the shit.
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:05pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    I like Vivek’s proposal to halve the American civil service.
    Tell those whose Social Security number ends in an odd number that they are no longer employed.
    
    It sounds brutal, but it is logical and it will focus the minds of the half that remains.
    
    As BY said, we don’t have time.
    
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    January 5, 2025 1:04pm
    - Jack5
      
      So many public service units that the Labour-Green added one to co-ordinate them in 2020.
      
      It’s first name on its web site: Te Ohu Tumu Whakarae i te Ratonga Tūmatanui. Second name: Public Service Leadership team.
      
      These are the bureaucrats who run the country.
      
      https://www.publicservice.govt.nz/system/leaders/public-service-leadership-team
      
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      January 5, 2025 2:39pm
    - Steve Otto N Shore
      
      To me, it is not a matter of negotiating their employment. Look at what they have done in the last year. If it is abysmal or just nothing, DCM. You’re Fired, FIRED!!
      Sure there may be payouts, some large, but only a Public Sector employee gets paid for doing fuck all.
      
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      January 5, 2025 3:43pm
- cmm
  
  BY: You forgot the roughly 115,000 NGOs in NZ (not all taxpayer funded).
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:48pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Apropos of my comment in the Akld Law School thread: if you have too many law graduates then you will end up with an over regulated public sector. Because when your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:48pm
- sungsamning
  
  Time for a repeat of the Great QANGO Hunt of 1986 to be repeated.
  
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  January 5, 2025 4:50pm
Jethrod

A story out on that must read X that John Tamihere has forbidden all TPM mps from doing interviews with that racist newspaper NZ HERALD and Newstalk ZB.
Must be preparing for the end of month bad news coming for TPM and all.
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January 5, 2025 10:46am
- CJames
  
  With the quality of answers they usually make in interviews, it is of benefit to readers not having to put up with them. The Herald putting Maori Party refused to comment at the end of each article will say it all.
  
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  January 5, 2025 1:26pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  Seems incredible that a functionary can instruct MPs who they can talk to.
  
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  January 5, 2025 1:26pm
  - kevn
    
    BY… Like how mallard banned any MP contact with the mandate protesters. So they all just cowered.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:29pm
    - Jack5
      
      Winston Peters came to talk with those protesters. NZ First didn’t have any Parliamentary seats at the time. It was voted out in 2020.
      
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      January 5, 2025 2:45pm
      - sungsamning
        
        Yes, I was extremely anti NZF at the time. Had been since 1991. Now, I like them. No egregious botch ups. A miracle really. Long may it continue.
        
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        January 5, 2025 4:52pm
  - cmm
    
    Why is that incredible?
    
    Labour and National have both instructed MPs on what they should say (and likely to whom they should say it).
    I expect Act and Greens have too.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:50pm
    - AitchW
      
      I think the difference is that those instructions would have been issued by the leader of the political wing of the party, not the party president.
      
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      January 5, 2025 3:11pm
    - Steve Otto N Shore
      
      Looks like Luxon has instructed all National MPs to vote David Seymour’s Principles Bill down.
      Not very democratic, more like tyranny – or else!
      
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      January 5, 2025 3:47pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        All MPs need to vote the Party line on all legislation. Conscious votes are very rare. So there is nothing unusual about the Treaty Principles Bill.
        
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        January 5, 2025 4:08pm
      - Dave
        
        BY @ 4.08. “Conscious votes are very rare.”
        
        So that’s why some NZ legislation is so bad!
        
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        January 5, 2025 5:21pm
      - Steve Otto N Shore
        
        BY @ 4.08.
        So my MP does not vote for the way I gave my vote to him? And that is democratic?
        My MP (Upper Harbour) does as Luxon says? Fuck Luxon!
        Nobody is allowed to speak for those who voted them in????
        New Zimbabwe, we are here…..
        
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        January 5, 2025 6:21pm
      - AitchW
        
        Parliamentary votes are cast on party lines.
        Always have been. The only exception is conscience voted which are relatively rare.
        When you vote for your local mp you should be aware that he or she will be required to vote on party lines, and that should be what the party campaigned on.
        Pragmatic democracy.
        
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        January 5, 2025 8:13pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Who did the instructing? Not a Party official.
      
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      January 5, 2025 4:05pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    That would be the functionary that (allegedly) funds the Maori Party.
    
    If TPM MPs obey John Tamihere then on the face of it you’d have to think that the funding rumours have some degree of truth.
    
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    January 5, 2025 2:51pm
- DimChappie
  
  Post a Link please.
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:55pm
Taieri

Does New Zealand, with a population of just over 5 million, need 162 government agencies?
———-

It does. In order to feed parasites…
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January 5, 2025 10:55am
goNZ1

a good summary in the NY Post about the end of the Obama era. Some learnings in there for New Zealand in 2025 I would love to hope..

https://nypost.com/2025/01/04/opinion/the-end-of-the-obama-era-has-officially-arrived/
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January 5, 2025 11:10am
- Notsofast
  
  Yes a great read.
  The dark hazard that accompanies charisma.
  Obama launched full on transgenderism with his dear colleagues letter that changed title 9 and required federal funded schools to treat males as females if they so elected.
  
  No one knew what was going on, it is a dawning realization.
  Mentioned in the article.
  It is unlikely he was fully aware of the evil he was unleashing.
  
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  January 5, 2025 11:54am
- David Garrett
  
  There are no such things as learnings FFS! Learning(s) is a verb not a noun.
  
  The word you seek is LESSONS….something one derives from the practice of the verb LEARNING
  
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  January 5, 2025 12:23pm
  - AitchW
    
    While I agree with you, David, you may be fighting an uphill battle on this point. I suspect that ‘learnings’ is just another in a long line of buzzwords coined by a consultant and adopted by those who enjoy using the latest fad.
    Not unlike the overuse of ‘pivot’ to mean ‘adapt’ during Covid it’s likely here to stay until someone invents a trendier buzzword.
    
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    January 5, 2025 12:47pm
    - crikey
      
      I too agree, but it’s worth fighting for accuracy. We probably won’t see much change until the education system learns to educate.
      
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      January 5, 2025 1:39pm
      - AitchW
        
        Remember our language is constantly evolving. The English we speak now is quite different to that spoken when I was born a little over 60 years ago.
        Can you believe that the OED stated about 20 years back that split infinitives were acceptable? Heresy!
        
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        January 5, 2025 3:06pm
      - Steve Otto N Shore
        
        Teachers can’t teach.
        Indoctrinate yes, but not teach.
        
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        January 5, 2025 3:52pm
      - David Garrett
        
        crikey: Yes, it will be struggle to resist this nonsense – but I have never been one to avoid a scrap….and language is important – VERY important.
        
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        January 5, 2025 4:15pm
  - sungsamning
    
    You have a point David. Two of my pet hates are ‘The British Navy’ and The British Airforce. They’d only be British if there was a republic; like under Cromwell. Its Royal Navy, and Royal Airforce.
    
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    January 5, 2025 4:55pm
  - Dave
    
    Being an old fogey inclined to pedantry, I mostly agree, but then we have the teachings of Jesus Christ and Buddha, meaning ‘doctrines’. Hmmm.
    
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    January 5, 2025 5:38pm
- Inandout
  
  go, I would imagine given Obama’s supposed sexuality he may like this camouflage. Tucker’s interview with that close friend of Barack seems to have been swept under the carpet.
  
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  January 5, 2025 1:33pm
  - MCōs
    
    You talking about this ‘close friend’?
    https://wjla.com/news/nation-world/elon-musk-questions-tucker-carlsons-interview-with-larry-sinclair-not-super-convincing-barack-obama-whistleblower-fox-news-president-twitter-x-social-media
    
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    January 5, 2025 3:54pm
Chuck Bird

Something for my grandchildren to look forward to.

Why Islam Won’t Survive the 21st Century: A Quiet Collapse

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YN2Ae0iroRI
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January 5, 2025 1:37pm
- Inandout
  
  CB, dogma in the tech age simply can’t survive discussion around the town square. Muslims of average intelligence must inevitably question the more outlandish aspects of the Koran. Much like Christianity evolved with the times so must Islam, or the alternative will be mass disregarding of that religious way of life.
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:49pm
- cmm
  
  I’ll believe that if, and only if, it happens.
  
  Meanwhile Islam is growing in Africa and Africa is the main growth area for population in the world.
  
  By 2100 we can expect:
  * Africa to have over 2.5 billion people (with the highest growth rates in Muslim areas).
  * Outside of Africa only Pakistan and the Middle East are expected to have substantially larger populations than they have now (China is expected to shrink massively).
  * Over 50% of many European countries (maybe even 50% of the whole of Europe) to be African descent (mainly Muslim).
  
  I won’t be here to cash in that bet.
  
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  January 5, 2025 2:57pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Recent survey in Iran – majority are secretly atheists or muslim apostates:
  https://youtu.be/cHzzOAo-R3U?t=1
  
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  January 5, 2025 4:38pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Interesting video.
    
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    January 5, 2025 9:32pm
Jack5

America stands by Israel

The latest US weapons package for Israel is $US8 billion worth of weapons, which the Wall Street Journal says includes thousands of bombs, missiles, and artillery shells.

The BBC says that four months ago, the US approved the sale of $US20 billion worth of fighter jets and other military equipment to Israel.

The Irish Times in September reported that Israel, since establishment in 1948, has received $US310 billion in US assistance.

News channels variously report the latest weapons deal as a “package”, “aid”, and “sale.

The New York Times says Israel would use money provided by the United States to buy weapons in the latest help package. It adds annual aid had been about $US3 billion, but Biden increased that amount after the Hamas terrorist attacks.

How economically strong is Israel?

Israel’s real (i.e. inflation adjusted) gross domestic product in 2023 was $US471.03 billion, and was 2 per cent higher than the previous year, which was up 6.83% (NZ’s GDP for 2023 was $US254.77 billion, and grew at 0.63 per cent, compared with 2.77% in 2022 and 4.55% in 2021). Those figures are from the CIA World Factbook.

Israelis rank 45th in GDP per capital, immediately behind NZ (we are 44th)

The “Irish Times” on US aid for Israel:

https://www.irishtimes.com/world/middle-east/2024/09/27/extent-of-us-military-and-economic-aid-reveals-israels-reliance-on-washington/
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January 5, 2025 2:03pm
- cmm
  
  The problem with how these numbers are counted is that they use the massively inflated military supply “costs”. These are seldom an accurate indicator of the real costs or quality of the weapons.
  
  For example, a Patriot missile system has the price tag of $US2.5billion and up to $US10 million per missile. I would expect the mark up there is around 50 to 100x
  
  The “money for arms” packages are massively inflated.
  
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  January 5, 2025 3:04pm
MCōs

An interesting article about the cost of a trip to a hospital emergency department in Texas re kidney stones
https://www.alternet.org/medical-bills-2670741334/
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January 5, 2025 2:19pm
Steve Otto N Shore

More on Trump’s sentencing on Jan 10th.
A convicted felon cannot possess a firearm. Trump has a concealed carry permit which I guess becomes invalid.
Then there is voting. A grey area but a convicted felon cannot vote unless the sentence has been completed? I don’t know!
Then there is the gag order. It stays in place. Trump can not talk about the trial ffs!
He can’t talk about the Jurors, the dudges political connections, the prosecutors.

What is the bet that this dudge Merchan is riding for a fall, a big fall? I think Trump is going to be angry and nail Merchan to the wall.
Get a cleansack full of popcorn!

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/politics/elections/legal-consequences-loom-for-trump-over-felony-convictions-despite-no-jail-time-expert/ar-AA1wXMBd?
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January 5, 2025 2:43pm
- Jethrod
  
  He could always get Joe to pardon him.
  
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  January 5, 2025 3:48pm
- Ipanema69
  
  The judge has already indicated that the sentence will be an unconditional discharge i.e. no consequence other than the entry of a conviction.
  
  However once sentencing is completed Trump may appeal the conviction by the usual NY state processes.
  
  There are numerous legal commentators from both the left and the right indicating that there are multiple reversible errors in the trial.
  
  The conviction will almost certainly be overturned by the New York Appellate Courts. Although these courts have a liberal bias they tend to follow the law. As an example they reversed a Harvey Weinstein’s convictions on procedural grounds.
  
  In the long term this case will have no impact on Trump.
  
  In fact the scheduling of sentencing by the judge is an admission of weakness. Bragg (the prosecutor) wanted the sentencing to be held in abeyance until Trump completed his term as president.
  
  If this had occurred it would have been exceedingly likely that Trump’s legal team would have applied to the NY appellate courts for a writ of Mandamus seeking the dismissal of the case on constitutional grounds. Specifically State judges may not constrain the actions of the US president. The argument would be that Trump would be concerned about possible incarceration following the completion of his presidency rather than remaining solely focused on the job in hand. It’s quite likely that such a writ application would be handled on an extremely urgent basis and most likely granted by the appellate courts given the constitutional issues. Check out the “Dershow” for further information on this!
  
  By sentencing Trump to an unconditional discharge the judge knows that there are no constitutional issues generated. The judge also knows that it will take 12 to 18 months for the convictions to be overturned.
  
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  January 5, 2025 3:59pm
- MCōs
  
  Your man must be cheered by what happened in South Korea
  
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  January 5, 2025 4:00pm
- sungsamning
  
  Between the Trump Justice Department, and SCOTUS; he will be in a world of hurt. His daughter might also be.
  
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  January 5, 2025 5:00pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/360539916/ferry-passenger-stranded-picton-frustrated-he-doesnt-know-when-hell-sail
This is surely a hit job on Bluebridge by the opposition: why is this guy the only one complaining ? Was he the only passenger to be rescheduled who never received any communications ?
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January 5, 2025 5:16pm
- AitchW
  
  Did he pick up the phone? He may have been overlooked for a call.
  Lazy gotcha journalism.
  
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  January 5, 2025 5:46pm
Cantabrian

Just been watching some of the cricket. I see TVNZ is being so woke that it doesn’t know where the game is being played. On one screen it says the game is at the Basin Reserve, Whanganui a Tara, yet on another it refers to Poneke. Neither of these is a legal name for the city. The Geographic Names Board does not show the ‘Maori name’ as an alternative. Yet like the so-called native names for other cities these are being forced upon us, not by genuine popular consent and government approval, but by activists who are determined to delete New Zealand as an entity.
As an illustration of how far this stupidity has gone, I find my peanut butter is made in ‘Aotearoa New Zealand’. The country and its identity is being renamed by stealth. I wouldn’t mind if the removal of engagement.ish names was a nationally agreed step – like replacing the flag – that had been fully consulted and agreed by the people through a properly managed process.
And I detest the dual naming of locations which is being used as a not so subtle tool to influence the population. I see a move in less than 10 years to do what was done to Mt Egmont – just stop using the English name.
I know longer know where I’m living. At times I feel like a visitor in a foreign land, yet my family have been here since the 1830s and have helped to make New Zealand what it was until 10-15 years ago.
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January 5, 2025 5:47pm

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