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November 7, 2024 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 07 November 2024

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General Debate

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Conservatarian

“We just didn’t call Trump a Nazi enough”
“We just didn’t harangue men enough”
“We just didn’t hide Harris enough”
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November 7, 2024 8:01am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Some random observations.
  
  1. The Black woman commentator on CNN saying it was non-college educated black and white guys that defeated Kamala.
  2. CNN refusing to call a State until 100% of the vote had been counted denying defeat.
  3. Trumps victory speech giving credit to his supporters and laying out a bright future for the country.
  
  This was a victory of the workers over the Elites. It was a defeat of the Woke the Racists and those who would control thought and speech and tell the dumb arses who to vote for.
  I hope Luxon and the Nats take note and can the Woke and Racist nonsense in NZ.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:52am
  - RoboRob
    
    Luxon would do well to look at how standing up for your principals and not being afraid to offend can, and will work for you in the political environment.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:16am
    - Groggy
      
      That would work but Luxon doesn’t have any principles. As his children are adult he probably doesn’t interact with principals any longer either.
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:14am
  - Cassandra
    
    Alan Dershowitz: What we need now is a Lincolnesque approach to bringing a divided nation together, with malice toward none and charity toward all. It’s a tall order, especially for Trump. But if he succeeds, his legacy will be secure and the world will be better off. This is his greatest challenge. It’s up to him to meet it with strength and magnanimity.
    
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    November 7, 2024 11:10am
- Frank the tank
  
  “We just didn’t have a decent candidate”
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:02am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  And the people are anti women or she would have bolted in, hahaha
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:07am
- alphabeatrium
  
  I heard on RNZ this morning a despondent Democrat saying “we tried so hard to educate them” during the campaign… That seems to be the attitude of many on the left, namely that their opponents are simply less intelligent. Such a sanctimonious attitude can only strengthen the resolve of people on the fence to support the Republicans, because they don’t treat you like you’re stupid.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:17am
NeverMindTheBollocks

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
So, in a two horse race, Americans have just elected as President a convicted, erratic, pussy grabbing liar.

Makes you reflect on how bad the other candidate was.
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November 7, 2024 8:01am
- Kiwiguy
  
  To me it shows that people put the candidates aside and considered the policies instead.
  If only that happened in NZ when Jacinda was elected…
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:34am
  - RoboRob
    
    YES. Trump won despite his obvious personal failings. In the end his policy agenda and lack of being a professional politician won it for him.
    
    Kamala lost, in part, because she was such a professional politician that nobody could get a straight answer out of her as to where she stood. They then projected their own worst fears onto her.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:18am
  - Flossie
    
    But she had such wonderful policies…and she saved tens of thousands of lives…..
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:21am
  - slightlyrighty
    
    The thing about that is, NZ did that in 2017, and National got the largest share of the vote.
    
    and Winston anointed Jacinda, and screwed the country.
    
    and we voted him back in one term later, and we should not have done so.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:30am
- kowtow
  
  Call him all the names you like , but look at the various past candidates that the Elites consider so much better and look at their legacy of how many failed states ( with all the attendant human misery and suffering) across N Africa and the ME they created , and they get off Scot free ( along with Blair).
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:25am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Yep,
    Kill one man and you get 20 years in jail.
    Kill a million men and you get a knighthood.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:49am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Downticked to oblivion – I thought KBloggers were more sophisticated than that.
  
  All of the adjectives used to describe Donald Trump are accurate – if anyone thinks otherwise, then lay it out.
  
  In fact, my comment was more of an oblique reference to just how bad a candidate was Kamala Harris.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:39am
  - Don Beckett
    
    No, you deserved to be downticked to oblivion. You simply repeated all the Democrat/MSM talking points that attempted to denigrate Trump out of the race, most of which were lies. And you should know that the conviction was just a political attack on Trump, which had been totally disproven at a previous court case.
    So on that point, you were Full of Bollocks.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:35am
- Im Right
  
  @ NMTB – Kamala was a walking train wreck…EVERY interview was a disaster (with ‘friendly’ interviewers on friendly networks).
  She could not even answer simple questions “I was brought up middle class….blah blah” when asked how she will fix the economy
  “Trump….Trump…Trump” was her answer to how she is going to fix the border.
  Interviewer:
  “What would you do different when president to what Biden has been doing”
  Kamala “Nothing different”
  See why they kept her hidden, see why Trump has a clean sweep now??
  Probably not, and this is why Trump is now president.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:48am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Convicted of what ffs, what he did was a simple valuation arrangement which is done by businesses daily, never before has a person been charged let alone found guilty of a simple well established business arrangement
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:10am
- Ghost
  
  You should see the guy they elected last time.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:13am
rouppe

Now that the election is over in the USA, a couple of thoughts.

1. It’s good that it’s an unequivocal result. Well over the Electoral college threshold, and the popular vote as well.

2. Some of the things that were said were utterly disgraceful. I saw Oprah Winfrey say that “if you don’t vote for Harris, it is entirely possible we will never get to vote ever again”. What an outrageous thing to promulgate. She ought to be excoriated for that.
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November 7, 2024 8:01am
- sirknz
  
  There is a small but growing contingent of women in the US asking to repeal the 19th Amendment.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:39am
  - rouppe
    
    A small but growing contingent of women in the US asking to lose the right to vote?
    
    Where are you seeing that?
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:27am
- imalwaysright
  
  Regardless of the win, I hope voting fraud is fully investigated and the perpetrators jailed.
  The next election depends on it.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:41am
- RoboRob
  
  Joy read and the team at CNBC were saying they feared being sent to the gulags if Trump won. Disgusting.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:21am
  - rouppe
    
    Last time he was president they said he’d – probably accidentally because he’s so stupid – press the nuclear button and cause a nuclear war. They said he’d institute gulags. That he’d suspend elections. That women, or blacks, or Latino, or all of them, would lose rights, be locked up, rounded up.
    
    None of that happened. It’s incredible they’ve trotted out much the same lines.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:31am
    - RoboRob
      
      Americans aren’t stupid. Eventually you realise that every Rep candidate (Bush, Romney, McCain, Trump) cant all be hitler.
      
      The bonus Trump had this time was he had already been president and not dont most of waht they claimed.
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:13am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        What I always laugh at is when the Old Hitler is brought out of retirement and the public informed that he wasn’t so bad after all – not like the New Hitler.
        
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        November 7, 2024 10:28am
  - rockape
    
    They are not that significant.
    
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    November 7, 2024 11:05am
- freemark
  
  Elephant in the room. This result almost overwhelmingly proves the Election cheat by Dems, MSM & electoral bureaucracy in 2020.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:22am
- Rich Prick
  
  And it is looking like a trifecta with 54 Senate and 223 House seats. I think that is a very clear mandate.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:51am
peterwn

Two inter-related things happening in politics. There is a big row about Ministers and Government rejecting Departmental advice especially respect to tobacco products. There are health ‘experts’ in the Ministry of Health who are pretty miffed that Casey Costello has thrown their advice in the bin and is going about things her sweet way (with support from many quarters apart from some Labour and Green MP’s). I incidentally side with Casey’s approach, she is considering the wider picture rather than the narrow basis of the advice provided). It needs to be remembered it is the Ministers who are in charge, not officials in Ministries. Norm Kirk bluntly pointed this out when he became PM in 1972 and told his new Ministers not to take any nonsense from Departments (he was extremely suspicious of officials since they had served 12 years under Kiwi Keith’s government). So Chris Hipkins and his people conveniently forget this when they are not in power and instead question all the way about Casey ignoring official advice. I have never seen the tobacco business thrashed so thorougly in Question Time over the last weeks with the questions ceasing yesterday (the Treaty business no doubt now taking priority). The PSA has now stepped in effectively expressing concern that public servants are no longer ruling the roost (no such concern would be expressed if a left wing government is in power – go figure).
Allied to this, Labour seem to perceive that Casey is the most vulnerable link in the Coalition and would line nothing better than to see the Coalition disintegrate so either Labour/Green/TPM can form a coalition with Winston (which would be as unstable as a radioactive isotope) or an election (which would be inevitable whether a left wing coalition manages to get together or not). The Left would no doubt like to see Casey crack under the strain and relinquish her portfolios or apply so much pressure that the PM removes her from her portfolios. However she receives strong support from the PM and her leader Winston and this gives her the fortitude to carry on.
Chris Luxon was a master at putting together the current Coalition and will be just as masterful keeping it together and thriving.
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November 7, 2024 8:01am
- Anthony Melchett
  
  The reason labour don’t like people not following departmental advice is none of its ministers were equipped to think of things themselves so can’t fathom a minister might be competent.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:06am
- ChristopherW2
  
  There are good independent studies that show that known carcinogens are much lower with HTPs; the Minister is right and is doing the right thing for the health of NZers; the experts are wrong and are the ones who are bowing to outside influence.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:12am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I think the issue at hand here is an official describing in writing the minister’s ideas as “crap”. Totally unacceptable.
  
  Ministers reject the advice of their officials every day. I daresay that Grant Robertson rejected the Treasury advice on important issues for 6 years.
  
  In the case of the tobacco thing, there is nothing wrong with the Ministry constructively advising the Minister to change course. If the Minister decides to proceeed, the officials should work to their full abilities to implement the policy. I doubt that an official who emailed colleagues describing the ministers ideas as crap can do that.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:33am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I doubt that an official who emailed colleagues describing the ministers ideas as crap can do that.
    
    And that’s the point that the Greens and Chris Hipkins don’t get.
    
    A competent public servant would have alerted their boss that the information provided to the Minister was out-of-date by showing them the most recent and relevant information; if he/she can’t do this…and can only express a personal opinion that what the Minister has seen is “crap”, then our taxpayer$ $$$$ are being wasted.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:25am
  - peterwn
    
    Oops! I forgot to include that originally. I doubt that Labour/Green Ministers would have taken too kindly to their ideas being called ‘crap’ by an official. I strongly suspect it would be a ‘gone by lunchtime’ case or at least the official shuffled sideways.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:54am
  - pdm
    
    `I daresay that Grant Robertson rejected the Treasury advice on important issues for 6 years.’
    
    I think this may be more accurate BY.
    
    I daresay that Grant Robertson rejected the Treasury advice on virtually every important issue for 6 years.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:01am
Scott

I’m just so enjoying CNN right now! This morning they interviewed a Democrat Congress woman who had to admit, “we have to do some soul searching”.

The interviewer, Erin Burnett, noted that Harris did worse with women voters than Biden! Who saw that coming? Women were supposed to vote for Kamala because she’s a woman and because abortion!
Joy Reid over at MSNBC was also very disappointed with women not voting for a woman candidate –

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2024/11/msnbc-host-joy-reid-whines-black-voters-came/

Apparently the actual women voters didn’t see it that way and instead were concerned about the economy and how to pay for the groceries! Who would have thunk it? 😆
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November 7, 2024 8:02am
- sherp
  
  If the dems hadn’t shut down Gabbard in 2020 there would have already been a woman president…. but nope they had to install a dementia patient.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:26am
- G152
  
  aljazeer actually broke with its anti Jewish propaganda and reported the US election even though their pundits were wrong from the first interview….
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:32am
- RoboRob
  
  Joy Reid the stupidest person on TV, and there is tough competition. She still believes, despite all evidence, that Trump is a Russian agent.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:25am
kiwikidsnz

In other news in case it was missed in all the excitement yesterday:

Roy Morgan’s New Zealand Poll for October 2024 shows a significant swing in support with the Labour-Greens-Maori Party Parliamentary Opposition up 7% points to 48% now with a narrow lead over the National-led Government (National, ACT & NZ First) on 47% (down 8% points).
https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/national-support-down-significantly-in-october-after-the-sinking-of-hmnzs-manawanui-in-samoa?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=MRU%206th%20November%202024&utm_content=MRU%206th%20November%202024+CID_80e618fd7590cb070f6451722b1bd4f3&utm_source=Market%20Research%20Update&utm_term=Read%20Full%20Article
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November 7, 2024 8:03am
- peterwn
  
  So? There is not an election until 2026 so polls mean pretty well nothing at this point in the election cycle.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:31am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    It is still astounding.
    
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    November 7, 2024 8:35am
    - Scott
      
      Was it an outlier? You can get rogue polls where the sampling occasionally doesn’t go right.
      
      That would seem astonishing to me especially when the opposition is so poor?
      
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      November 7, 2024 8:42am
      - kiwikidsnz
        
        RM has consistently shown the Coalition ahead by a good margin since the election – until just now. Its a massive swing.
        
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        November 7, 2024 8:58am
      - mandk
        
        An outlier?
        
        Quite possibly. Just think about the Iowa poll that Dems and the lefty media were crowing about.
        
        trump was supposed to lose Iowa by 3%, but he won by 13%.
        
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        November 7, 2024 9:32am
    - peterwn
      
      I would put it down to a very astute setting of priorities by Chris Luxon. As my father would like to say ‘there is method in the madness’. Chris would want to get things done now then start working on his popularity in late 2025. His aim is to win the war, not waste time on meaningless battles.
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:00am
      - Groggy
        
        I think you are crediting him with more political nous and control than he actually has. Winston and David are running the show and he’s flapping around in their wake.
        
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        November 7, 2024 10:21am
- Burtland
  
  the US election has shown polls are a waste of time – they have become a form of gaslighting
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:33am
  - Im Right
    
    Not so Burtland…..I strongly believe the polls were consistantly showing strong support for Trump, and binned until they got one that
    was neck n neck and put
    that one out.
    How can you spur on your supporters when polls show you will lose.
    No, much better to show a fictitious close race and spout the ‘every vote counts and we need you to vote’
    The pollsters have once again ‘lost’ in the eyes of the public.
    Trump won easily, and increased his votes amongst black/Hispanic voters and THAT has scared the beejeezus out of the Dems big time.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:58am
- backster
  
  A few days before the US election an American Po;;ster who had called every election right changed his mind from Trump to Harris on the basis there had been a swing of 18% in Iowa from Trump to Harris. Our Mainstream Media trumpeted it. Harris claimed she had momentum. The election result had Trump ahead by 12%…..Corrupt repporting!!!
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:56am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  I find that very hard to believe in one month when the parliament has not sat for 3 weeks
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:49am
Conservatarian

Trump becomes the first man since Franklin D. Roosevelt to win three consecutive United States presidential elections.

Also the first since the 22nd amendment was ratified in 1951.
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November 7, 2024 8:05am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I don’t follow.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:35am
  - John Loveridge
    
    Like Trump, Conservatarian disputes the 2020 result, Benedict.
    
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    November 7, 2024 8:45am
    - Mrs_Right
      
      It’s just ignorant to say that the 2020 election was 100% legitimate.
      
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      November 7, 2024 9:39am
    - Conservatarian
      
      You are correct John, I do dispute the “official” result of the 2020 election. I see Trump’s comprehensive win last night as an obvious indicator that his popularity has increased from 2016 to 2020 to 2024. Well, other than those that download the messages of the corporate press into their brain, advocates of “Our democracy” and lovers of killing babies. Trump has clearly won all seven swing states and thus will win the electoral college by a thumping 312-226.
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:31am
  - sirknz
    
    ~15 million less votes were cast in the 2024 US election compared to 2020.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:30am
    - Im Right
      
      Because the voting procedures were under more scrutiny this election, no 2am votes ‘found’ and counted.
      This election had little to no room for any Democrat party sleight of hand malarkey.
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:02am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Those of us who were around in 2020 understand that.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:44am
- kowtow
  
  The CNN commentators let it slip , when discussing the Harris collapse from Biden’s alleged showing .
  
  ‘The mail in ballots’ they said and therein explains an awful lot of how and why Biden “won” in 2020.
  
  I still contend that with the hundreds of millions of dollars from the tech billionaires support ( see Time Magazine special report) and the army of activists that hired , together with the covid mail in harvesting ……..they cheated.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:30am
- David Garrett
  
  Conservatarian: What?? This is Trump’s second term…FDR was the last president to have served more than two. That led to a Constitutional amendment allowing for only two terms.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:50am
  - Romney
    
    He said ‘to win three elections’ not serve three terms.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:24am
WaynelSexton

Three theories on the missing 15 million left votes?

Trump (74 million) 2020
Trump (73 million) 2024

Harris (66 million) 2024
Hillary (65 million) 2016

Biden (81 million) 2020
(EXTRA 15 million votes, for you slow ones)

-First theory, the left absolutely hates the idea of a female leader.

Second theory, Trumps “Operation Warp Speed” killed 15 million liberals with the vax.

Third theory, Biden cheated…
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November 7, 2024 8:05am
- Colville
  
  The obvious one tho is that Kamala didnt energise her voter base..they just stayed home.
  
  The Dems knew it was about turnout and they failed.
  
  Pretty tough trying to sell Kamala as a legitimate President! 🙂
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:28am
  - WaynelSexton
    
    Yeah I agree the left just can’t energize around women, that’s why I put that as my first theory.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:03am
- sherp
  
  The lefts claim kow is there was ballot harvesting in 2020… but they had used emergency powers to change the law just before the election so their cheating was legal…. now upon being challenged in courts most of those law changed to fortify the election for their candidate were illegal but never mind that.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:29am
- RightNow
  
  I encourage all lefties to keep up with their boosters!
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:35am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I must be slow. Was the participation rate higher in 2020?
  
  I don’t follow theory 1. Theories 2 and 3 are insane.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:40am
  - Anthony Melchett
    
    We know you aren’t slow, its just that you can’t get your head around how much cheating there was in 2020.
    
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    November 7, 2024 8:45am
    - David Garrett
      
      Anthony: FFS man! Every single one of Trump’s challenges in 2020 – IIRC there were more than 30 of them – failed. Or does this mythical creature the “Deep State” also include judges at different levels across 30 states, all of whom are acting cohesion? Let it go man! Your guy lost last time, but won this time. Thems the breaks.
      
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      November 7, 2024 9:55am
      - RightNow
        
        I assume you don’t use X David, or at least you haven’t seen the live reports of what’s been happening during this election. In a nutshell there have been multiple attempts at election interference documented on video by citizen reporters, and a team of 250,000 election watchers engaged by Trump’s team, as well as an army of lawyers that have been able to fight for election integrity.
        One example was a poll location that tried to shut down voting early (in a Republican leaning area) but the Trump team lawyers challenged it immediately and a judge sided with them and ordered the poll site to open an extra 3 days to balance it out.
        Basically they were ready to stop the steal this time, and were successful.
        
        The evidence of election fraud in 2020 is huge if you take off the MSM blinkers.
        
        Get on X and follow Elon, for a start.
        
        Note also, I have much respect for you (and Rodney), I’m not dissing you and I hope it doesn’t come across that way.
        
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        November 7, 2024 10:11am
      - Handyman
        
        60% of the cases were dismissed without a hearing on the basis any decision will not affect the outcome and not be in the public interest. There is a legal latin term for this which escapes me at the moment.
        
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        November 7, 2024 10:36am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    Basically, Theory 1 is that the voters that mobilised for Biden couldn’t be bothered mobilising for Harris – was it because she’s a woman?
    Theory 3 is that with mail in ballots in 2020 there was potentially a huge number of usually non-voters that voted due to the ease of mail in voting. Due to the nature of mail in voting, we have no idea what pressure was on them or if it was actually them that voted. This explains the difference but doesn’t mean it was cheating.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:08am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Voter turnout is always a good number to look at…..
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:54am
  - cmm
    
    Biden appealed to the dead demographic. High numbers turned out to vote.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:51am
- cmm
  
  Regardless of whether there was shenanigans in ballot counting in 2020, if the Hunter Biden laptop issue had not been lied about then it is almost certain that Biden would have had a far lower votes.
  
  I saw somewhere that polling after the truth came out shows that around 15% fewer people would have voted for Biden. That would have put Biden at around 65M votes.
  
  That was clear, undisputed, election interference.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:49am
Matt Long

America may be entering a new golden age.
Trump wins;
Their share market make record highs.
Free speech on X is preserved for at least 4 more years.
The Houthis are reported as wanting a ceasefire.
Musk and Ron Paul are figuring out how to slash the cost of the public service by 2 trillion dollars.
Pet squirrels are hopeful.
…
…
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November 7, 2024 8:05am
- Mark Hanley
  
  If only I could predict the stock market as well as i predict politics….. “Perhaps it’s a result of watching the corruption of the NZ media, but I can’t help but think Trump will romp into the White house.
  You know the democrats are in deep trouble when they have to ask Jacinda Adern for an endorsement.”
  
  And all evidence to date points to my other prediction coming true… “Christopher Luxon will be the best Prime Minister NZ ever had”
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:09am
  - pdm
    
    Not so sure about your last sentence MH.
    
    He is too Labour lite for me and he is going to have some big calls to make when submissions on the Treaty Principles Legislation come in. I suspect they will greatly out number the 90 odd thousand 3/5/All Waters submissions that Nanaia Mahuta allegedly threw in the bin or shredded or at best totally ignored.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:08am
- ChristopherW2
  
  Hurrah! 😀
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:12am
- Cassandra
  
  For all his faults (but who is perfect? JFK? LBJ?) Trump has scored a resounding victory. Popular vote, Senate, House. He’ll remake America and affect the world. A biggie is Ukraine. Why should the US be the main funder? Europe has all the resources needed to support Ukraine to victory, but does it have the will?
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:13am
  - rouppe
    
    The thing about the Ukraine conflict is that everyone seems to see any action by nato countries as a nato action.
    
    There doesn’t have to be a formal nato action. It could just be European countries looking after their interests making a move.
    
    Now that Russia has introduced North Korean soldiers, surely that’s the precedent for pan European involvement?
    
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    November 7, 2024 8:21am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Trump has said he will fix Ukraine/Russia while he is President Elect.
    
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    November 7, 2024 8:50am
    - imalwaysright
      
      S.O
      Correct, he will get more done before Jan 20 than many would get done during their entire term.
      Can you imagine Putin or Xi taking a call from Sleepy?
      
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      November 7, 2024 9:09am
  - rangitoto
    
    US has funded SFA to Ukraine. They have actually saved money by finding a cheap way to get rid of old military hardware.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:00am
    - Burtland
      
      and the russians have used it to empty their jails and clear their warehouses of rusting tanks
      
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      November 7, 2024 9:47am
  - David Garrett
    
    Cass: An excellent point.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:56am
- cmm
  
  … and Americans continue to be over-entitled and plunge themselves deeper into debt…
  
  The overall trajectory is still in one direction. They might have just bought themselves a couple of years.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:28am
- Matt Long
  
  Trump has achieved regime change in Germany already.
  Interesting that 99% of Germans polled expected a Harris victory.
  https://x.com/visegrad24/status/1854251792814473688
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:39am
In Vino Veritas

I see Die Zeit (German paper) has led with the headline “F–k” after the American election. To be fair, Zeit is center, probably more center left, so it’s to be expected, and spoiler, it’s generally a pretty good read. But you have to draw the line at this crap “half past five is also a perfectly appropriate time for feeling helpless, for feeling sorry for yourself, for panicking and for sheer horror”. The woke virus is literally everywhere.
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November 7, 2024 8:06am
- John Loveridge
  
  None of these people seem to understand democracy.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:47am
Anthony Melchett

Welfare check DPF?
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November 7, 2024 8:06am
I remember when

John Key, Australian Bookies, New York Times 3,
Pollsters 0.
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November 7, 2024 8:09am
- Prince
  
  Key was interviewed by Ryan Bridges this morning.
  So good to hear a relaxed, intelligent viewpoint. I miiss him.
  https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/early-edition-with-ryan-bridge/audio/sir-john-key-former-prime-minister-talks-donald-trumps-victory-and-impact-on-nz/
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:39am
  - greybeard
    
    I heard that as well. So articulate and sensible.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:37am
  - cmm
    
    Don’t miss him too much. He helped get us on the path we’re no now by dodging many challenging issues that should have been addressed years ago.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:54am
Matt Long

Elon Musk by providing a free speech platform to counter the media parties hoaxes, and Lara Trump’s Election Integrity Team can count themselves as being integral to America’s win.
https://apnews.com/article/rnc-election-monitoring-trump-republicans-voter-fraud-997947656e0b5d5d16cc4353bd726452?origin=serp_auto
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November 7, 2024 8:10am
- Matt Long
  
  I wouldn’t possibly suggest any election fraud in 2020, but there’s not one county in America where Harris out polled Biden according to CNN.
  Biden was so successful as a campaigner, that despite suffering dementia and only campaigning from his basement, he got 15 million popular votes more than Obama, Clinton or Harris. 2012, 2016, 2024.
  https://x.com/zerohedge/status/1854144250562429081
  https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1854193548717126030
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:16am
- ChristopherW2
  
  Without much fanfare, it seems that Ms Trump has done a marvellous job (thinking about that very telling graph tweeted by Zero Hedge).
  
  Mr Trump is a great man blessed by loyal and able children.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:16am
Tom Hunter

Oh dear. Also note that this woman edited this and still put it out on TikTok.
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November 7, 2024 8:11am
- Matt Long
  
  They do it for clicks, the more outrageous a video is the better it is to monetise.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:18am
  - cmm
    
    Yup, they get the same clicks and money no matter whether it is a supporter or someone who has gleefully clicked on it to watch a meltdown.
    
    A million blue clicks or red clicks are worth the same.
    
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    November 7, 2024 8:34am
- rouppe
  
  Good grief.
  
  She should make a run for Canada before Trump signs an executive order to turn the USA into Gilead.
  
  /sarc
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:31am
- Local Miller
  
  Now that is what I call a sham. For all her “weeping and wailing” I didn’t see a single tear actually run down her face. What a farce.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:33am
  - cmm
    
    But you still watched it. That’s all that matters.
    
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    November 7, 2024 8:46am
Yvette

Treaty
Ngāti Hine leader Pita Tipene told RNZ he could barely put into words how angry the news made him.”I don’t even know what word can be used to describe this particular action that’s been taken by the government… other than it lacks honour. [It is] dishonourable to our ancestors who signed Te Tiriti o Waitangi and had honour.”
Tipene said shifting the date forward was a deliberate attempt to avoid the national hīkoi set to begin next week.
“The government has been purposeful in pre-empting the hīkoi and rushing the introduction of the bill into parliament, knowing that the hīkoi will arrive on a certain date. It’s really a stunt.”
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/533057/treaty-principles-bill-early-introduction-before-parliament-dishonorable-says-furious-maori-leaders

Somewhere, awaiting the re-election of Labour, whenever that may happen, there is a document which is the response of 72 hui Labour held with Maori before presenting their aspirations to a Labour Cabinet, for obviously a Labour Government position for non-Maori for discussion on He Puapua – another Ardern promised “national conversation” which ended in non-delivery like almost everything else Labour touched.

This document never reached Cabinet because Willie Jackson – one man – had not watered-down (a Mana o te Wai process) or filtered sufficiently the roughly twenty percent of the document that he believed to be acceptable to his Cabinet colleagues – so missing the deadline it is shelved somewhere because of the 2023 Election.

National Govt to support UN rights declaration
• reaffirms the legal and constitutional frameworks that underpin New Zealand’s legal system, noting that those existing frameworks define the bounds of New Zealand’s engagement with the Declaration.
https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/national-govt-support-un-rights-declaration

“… the legal and constitutional frameworks that underpin New Zealand’s legal system” are the Treaty, as declared elsewhere, so it defined “the bounds of New Zealand’s engagement with the Declaration”

But I can not remember any protests from Ngāti Hine leader Pita Tipene to one man, Willie Jackson, hijacking the Treaty and ignoring the covenant on UNDRIP – one man actually filtering the Maori response, so of his own people, to the secretly written He Paupau

It would be helpful – balancing the present Maori shock / horror – for the Government to reveal the currently hidden and obviously devisive documentation of Maori response to He Puapua.

_______________

bumf –
• Māori Development Minister Willie Jackson says he is glad NZ First never saw the contentious He Puapua report, but denies it was “deliberately withheld”.
Peters said He Puapua was never shown to his party, despite having four ministers and being in a coalition government at the time.
“This [He Puapua] report is a recipe for Māori separatism,” he told Newstalk ZB.
“They knew it and that’s why they suppressed it till after the election … it was a gesture of ingratitude and bad faith.”
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/he-puapua-willie-jackson-pleased-nz-first-and-winston-peters-didnt-see-report/B4LOHMCMJJFJAKZHRGSP7ZEXEQ/

• In June a first draft was delivered to Jackson, but the minister never took it to Cabinet for consideration because he knew his colleagues wouldn’t support it.
At the time he told Newsroom he wasn’t comfortable with about 20 percent of what had been proposed and had asked the governance group set up to consult and draw up the plan to go back and try again.
He had hoped they’d return with a more palatable version by late July, but he is yet to receive anything.
“We’re a little bit off schedule and a little bit out of date. I’m meeting with them on Friday and there will be some decisions made about where we’re going,” Jackson told Newsroom.
https://newsroom.co.nz/2022/10/18/cabinet-still-waiting-on-co-governance-draft-plan/.
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November 7, 2024 8:11am
- Tricati
  
  We are still waiting for Ardern (Labour) to honor this promise, but not holding my breath.
  Doubt anyone in Labour has the fortitude to take this to the public as an election commitment.
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/03/prime-minister-jacinda-ardern-confirms-public-consultation-on-m-ori-co-governance-will-happen-in-2022.html
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:42am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Now that is something worthy of being leaked.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:00am
  - Yvette
    
    Blog-aholic, I don’t know that it even needs leaking.
    
    Cabinet or ACT should be able to simply look it up among Cabinet or Ministry documents, or request all contributing information, as of right.
    
    Then they should be able to legitimately release it as evidence of how Labour intended to step beyond the bounds of the Treaty, and contrary to the 2010 covenant statements of engagement with UNDRIP, especially the 20 percent portion Willie Jackson wanted rewritten.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:24am
    - pdm
      
      Yvette – no way will PM Luxon do that.
      
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      November 7, 2024 11:24am
Bridgenag

And Here We are…
Envisioning a future we have all been praying for

https://open.substack.com/pub/rwmalonemd/p/and-here-we-are?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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November 7, 2024 8:12am
In Vino Veritas

And on the US election, had a chat with an old mate this a.m. He said that searches in the US for “move to NZ” had spiked (I think he read it on some NZ site?).
I pointed out that there’s a decent possibility that a good few NZ’rs wouldn’t want wet sooks from America moving here as we have enough batshit crazy nutters doing that shit already.
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November 7, 2024 8:12am
- cmm
  
  The vast majority of those wet sooks are incapable of doing a 9 to 5 job – let alone organising themselves to move to NZ.
  
  The mere fact they’ve done a search is often enough for them to feel that they have taken some action and done something. Actually following through in the real world is a lot more effort.
  
  ie. all talk no action.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:37am
- John Loveridge
  
  Meh, it’s like all those celebrities who were going to bail in 2016. It’s all just noise and hot air.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:54am
- sirknz
  
  Definitely don’t want the ones who attended any Diddy parties…
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:44am
Surely Knott

The people’s vote in the USA was interesting. It tells us not just who they want for President but who they are turning to for influence and opinion. The public no longer believe Hollywood, pop stars, the mainstream media, or the globalist NGO think tanks.

Elon, Trump, RFKjr, Rogan and the voice of Joe ordinary on Twitter > B&M Gates, Dems, Beyonce, Oprah, Bruce Springsteen, Arnie Schwarzenager, Julia Robers, Jenifer Lopez, Taylor Swift, Ariana Grande, Lady Gaga, Katy Perry, Rihana, Eminem, Cardi B, Comedian John Oliver, Bill Maher, the NY Times, The La Times, CNN, all the major universities pushing culture wars, critical race and gender theory and socialism and globalism.

It’s a sea change. Not just for government but for society. People have seen what they do and how they operate and they can’t unsee it. They don’t trust them.
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November 7, 2024 8:14am
Souvlaki

I am delighted to see ACT has been able to bring forward the Treaty Bill to this afternoon!
IMO, like the Democrats, National are way out of step with public sentiment on this issue, and their pigheaded stubbornness will translate into a considerable reduction of their power post 2026 election with ACT & NZ First being the beneficiaries.
Even former cabinet Minister Maurice Williamson is flabbergasted with their foolishness ( HDPA drivetime yesterday, circa 1740hrs.)
And then this Roy Morgan poll: https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/national-support-down-significantly-in-october-after-the-sinking-of-hmnzs-manawanui-in-samoa
Surely not everyone in National agrees with Luxon on this ??
Their foolishness will be further highlighted when the citizens referendum on the issue comes to pass 🙂
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November 7, 2024 8:14am
- imalwaysright
  
  Souv,
  
  We may see the Treaty Principles Bill become known as the What are Luxon’s Principles? Bill
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:34am
- kiwikidsnz
  
  RM attributed the significant change to the Navy boat sinking & the Dunedin hospital rethink. Both not really directly attributable to the Coalition, more their response to unexpected & undisclosed events so not sure I agree with RM
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:39am
- Scott
  
  Once again, National and NZ First have a different approach. They want to take references to the Treaty of Waitangi out of the legislation. Unless directly relevant the references to the Treaty will go. They argue that are no principles in the Treaty and it was simply an agreement between two peoples.
  That’s not wrong. It’s just a different approach.
  I hope people understand this. 😊
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:55am
Agricola

The big win by Trump should draw a focus on the credibility and, indeed, relevance of polling companies, their methods and their strategic importance, not so much in manipulating public opinion, evidently, but in seriously deluding their beneficiaries.
I would like DPF in defence of political polling to do some serious analysis of the polls that so misrepresented the American electorate.
Is it professional incompetence that renders the polls useless? Were the polls corrupted by venal political activists? Was it all a cunning GOP conspiracy to stir republicans to vote?
Or is it that after years of relentless demonisation and hectoring by preening celebrity solipsists, conservatives are just pissed off with pollsters and see them as part of the problem.
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November 7, 2024 8:21am
- cmm
  
  I wonder how easy it is to actually do reliable polling any more.
  
  Land line calling is getting less and less relevant as people have switched over to cell phones. So how do you actually get a representative population any more?
  
  Secondly, how many people are willing to give honest opinions in this crazy world we live in?
  
  Thirdly, most polling questions seem to be loaded. They don’t ask meaningful questions to find data but rather pose questions more intended to steer the respondent.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:45am
- Conservatarian
  
  Per NBC News, the swing state leads (in percentage points) for Trump are currently:
  
  PA 1.9% – 98% expected votes in
  MI 1.5% – 99% expected votes in
  WI 0.8% – 99% expected votes in
  GA 2.3% – 99% expected votes in
  NC 3.3% – 99% expected votes in
  NV 5.1% – 93% expected votes in
  AZ 4.7% – 63% expected votes in
  
  https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-presidential-election
  
  The margin of error for a 1,000 respondent poll is around 3% (maybe 3.7%?) so the pollsters will pat themselves on the back and say “but margin of error” (well apart from NV and AZ).
  
  The problem is that the margin of error is all in Trump’s favour, as always. Three straight cycle of misses.
  
  The pollsters will breathe as sigh of relief until the next populist they can’t understand (J D Vance?)
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:38am
  - cmm
    
    “The margin of error for a 1,000 respondent poll is around 3%”
    
    The rough rule of thumb is to take the sample size, square root that, then divide 100 by that number:
    
    1000 -> square root is 31 -> 100/31 % = 3.1%
    
    But that only applies if you got:
    a) a proper random sample of the voters
    b) an honest response.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:01am
Paulus

Kamala Harris should not be blamed, as some in the USA are already doing.
Blame must fall heavily upon the Democratic Party and such as Obama, Pelosi, Clintons and of course the Bidens for putting her in this position.
My wife of over 60 years says that if you tell a women what she has to do them she won’t, as can be seen by recent polls urging the women to vote for Kamala, because she is a women (and coloured).
Haven’t we seen this yet in New Zealand where the so called media try and tell us what to do, as it is their opinion, and not their jobs, as reporters with some balance.
They would not know what balance is anyway
Sad really, for our Country
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November 7, 2024 8:23am
Maggy Wassilieff

“Razor edge, too close to call, neck ‘n neck” … bullshit

Time for our journalists to stop repeating leftie mantras and actually take a look at what is happening in the real world.
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November 7, 2024 8:25am
- John Loveridge
  
  I took a couple of extremely rare looks at Stuff’s front page last night and couldn’t figure out how their supposedly live updates were completely different to everybody else’s, and appeared to show Harris much closer to Trump in the electoral votes. Were they wishful thinking or something?
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:57am
  - sirknz
    
    Comparing and contrasting with the NZ Herald, they were showing completely different results off what was presumably the same data source.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:49am
- imalwaysright
  
  I’m worried that there are 66 million people in America who think she should be President. (Allegedly)
  
  Equally worrying is that 48% of kiwis surveyed support Labour , Maori party and Greens.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:25am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Is just me, but does TV1 US reporter Logan Church bear an uncanny resemblance to a young Grant Robertson?
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:42am
  - geoff3012
    
    Maybe Grant’s sister…….
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:08am
  - pdm
    
    Bollocks – Collins might need to up his Pie and Cream Bun eating to get his physique right if that is his ambition.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:16am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  All of the pollsters repeating that “bullshit” need to be called out and named publicly.
  Liars are a waste of space.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:44am
- mogg
  
  Better still is the hysterical reaction from lefty MSM drama queens all around the world. I think that we can all agree that this is very funny stuff.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:14am
NeverMindTheBollocks

Shell Lane (The Terrace) bike rack report:

At 8.26am, zero bikes.

A calm, coolish, still morning in the Capital, ideal for cycling.
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November 7, 2024 8:26am
- AitchW
  
  Lefties at home hiding under the blankets and sobbing uncontrollably.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:12am
- greybeard
  
  I love these updates: you should be sending them to Nick Mills on NewstalkZB Wellington, 9am – 12 noon weekdays.
  He would be very much on your side !
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:45am
  - pdm
    
    grey – that doesn’t sound like the Nick Mills I have heard on radio from time to time.
    
    He comes across as a very loyal lefty.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:18am
    - greybeard
      
      He knows what a cock-up the WCC has made of the city.
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:56am
Tom Hunter

I wonder if American Horror will be making a successor episode to this one.
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November 7, 2024 8:27am
Matt Long

The Taxpayers union is being very busy at present,
IRD apparently sent raw data with a large number of taxpayer’s details by email to social media companies
https://www.taxpayers.org.nz/ird_have_lied_to_new_zealanders_heads_must_roll
And Luxon may have plans to turn over many more billions of taxpayer funds to the climate scammers than even Adern. Hospitals anyone? Roads? Clean beaches?
https://x.com/TaxpayersUnion/status/1853221201411490193
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-advocate/news/coopers-beach-a-no-go-for-swimmers-or-seafood-gathering-following-sewage-leak/VA2AU7XBAJHBNBI7ZMFRU7NHKQ/
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November 7, 2024 8:28am
- cmm
  
  Yesterday I posted my request to the Privacy Commissioner on the IRD leak. I have not heard anything back yet (government department so I expect it takes months).
  
  While clearly any sharing of data with outside bodies is unacceptable. I also find it rather alarming that:
  1) It took 9 months to inform the victims.
  2) It took 9 months for the Privacy Commissioner to make a statement.
  
  Yes, heads need to roll top to bottom. I suggest at both the IRD and the Privacy Commission.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:50am
  - kowtow
    
    And at the legacy media who don’t give this the prominence it deserves.
    
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    November 7, 2024 9:36am
    - cmm
      
      Well to be fair, they’ve only had this info for a day or two now.
      
      The IRD and Privacy Commissioner have sat on it for 9 months without informing the victims.
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:03am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

I estimated 312/226. It’s looking pretty good.
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November 7, 2024 8:29am
- Grunter
  
  Yes you did Steve, well done!
  
  I got a bit carried away with my “330+” prediction. But a few ‘Blue States’ came close which would have got Trump to 330. Even New Jersey swung towards Red (but stays Blue).
  
  The Dem’s lost the day they picked The Kackling One .
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:37am
- Local Miller
  
  Yesterday someone down ticked my estimate of trump at 280+ I wonder now if they did this because they felt I was too low 🙂
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:02am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I did think it was too low, but I didn’t downtick. I rarely do.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:15am
Rusty

TVNZ Donald Trump is an enigma.

The only enigma is TVNZ and the rest of the putrid media in this country.
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November 7, 2024 8:41am
- John Loveridge
  
  TVNZ is more an enema than an enigma.
  
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  November 7, 2024 8:58am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I think some folks in TVNZ will be polishing up/embellishing their CVs today….
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/533010/tvnz-plans-to-axe-50-jobs
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:57am
Yvette

The latest unbiased Report from the Waitangi Tribunal …

Ngā Mātāpono/The Principles: Part II of the Interim Report
Wai 3300 – Tomokia ngā tatau o Matangireia – the Constitutional Kaupapa Inquiry
https://forms.justice.govt.nz/search/Documents/WT/wt_DOC_221817323/Nga%20Matapono%20Ch6%20W.pdf.

– but rather than ruin the taste of your breakfast maple chocolate sugar puffs with that, achieve the same effect by considering this –

Waitangi tribunal Wai 19
of the treaty of Waitangi act 1975
of a claim by D McMaster relating to ‘Special Privileges for Maori People’

Minister of Maori Affairs
Parliament Buildings, Wellington

Dear Mr Wetere

In February 1985 D McMaster of Auckland filed a claim with the Waitangi tribunal alleging, amongst other things, that a number of special privileges were accorded to Maori people by virtue of their race, but these privileges were at variance with the Treaty of Waitangi. He called on the tribunal to take such steps as are necessary to put an end to this situation.

Section 6 of the treaty of Waitangi act 1975 defines who can bring a claim to the Waitangi tribunal. It appears that only Maoris can bring a claim. Mr McMaster was told of that preliminary view and was asked whether he was a Maori, or, in the alternative, whether he disputed that interpretation of section 6. 
Mr McMaster has replied that he is not a Maori and he has withdrawn the claim.
Dated at Wellington this 21st day of May 1985

[E T J Durie] Chairman
https://forms.justice.govt.nz/search/Documents/WT/wt_DOC_68479315/Wai0019%20W.pdf
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November 7, 2024 8:43am
Benedict Yu

America’s climate change actions up in smoke.

If there is a chance of government in Australia and Canada there will be a walking back from net zero.

Meanwhile Chris Luxon is walking New Zealand towards a ruinous commitment with almost zero media attention.
27 1
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November 7, 2024 8:44am
- Souvlaki
  
  Virtue signaling tuber ! 🙁
  
  11 2
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  November 7, 2024 8:49am
- kowtow
  
  I suspect there were an awful lot of votes from the media reviled working classes who made that possible . Auto workers , oil and gas , coal miners and steel ( if there are any left) etc
  
  The media went on about the Michigan Arab vote , well duh they work in factories too.
  
  Interestingly trade union leaders wanted the Elitist out of touch Democrat to win while their membership favoured Trump.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:41am
- Damocles11
  
  Woke corporate potato. This country lacks strong centre-right leadership. Luxon thinks his voters are a pack of wokesters like him. How weak can you be. Further to the fiscally ruinous climate scam being foisted on us all, RNZ should be defunded TODAY, why are taxpayers funding a far left propaganda broadcast? This is a sick joke being perpetrated against all Coalition voters and the blame sits squarely with Luxon and Goldsmith.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:53am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Maybe the Trump win will wake Luxon up on the climate change hoax, but I doubt it.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:19am
kevn

googles ‘help’ didn’t help…
https://notthebee.com/article/oh-look-google-will-show-you-where-to-vote-for-harris-but-not-where-to-vote-for-trump
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November 7, 2024 8:47am
- ChristopherW2
  
  That gag snuck up on me, lol
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:12am
kevn

and… a senior TDS offer.
https://x.com/MelaniaTrumpo/status/1853832035032252654
and:
https://x.com/TrumpVVon/status/1854156178655183129
7 1
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November 7, 2024 8:48am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  They are welcome to leave the US, just don’t come to NZ. We have enough wets here.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:23am
Matt Long

The former editor of Recount, who debunked the pizzagate child abuse stories, has been found with hundreds of images and videos showing child sex abuse, including at least one video he produced himself.
How weird is that? As weird as the Podesta art collection? As weird as all the Diddy party people endorsing Harris?
https://www.nbcboston.com/news/local/ex-news-site-editor-had-hundreds-of-child-sex-abuse-images-mass-da-says/3194061/
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November 7, 2024 8:49am
- cmm
  
  That article is a year old.
  
  The real news is how the authorities have slow-walked the process. A year later the discovery process continues…
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:35am
Grunter

Democrats deserve to lose for lying about the war in Ukraine and dragging innocent men to their deaths. And for driving neo-Marxism even further than ever before in the USA.

Will Trump be the answer? IMO – NO!!

Too late to stop WW3 – 3 Reasons Why:
1. Trump’s massive Tarriffs will start a global trade war that will hurt almost all economies and drive inflation up. In effect ‘Financial WW3’ in a global economy that has never before been this interdependent economically. China will react big time, and then it will turn ugly….

2. Russia has recently signed up to a comprehensive defence alliance with North Korea. In 2 weeks they sign a similar deal with Iran. These are NATO-type deals – “attack one and we all respond.” With Netanyahu’s Israel (just sacked his Defence Minister – obviously, things need to ramp up….) intending on dealing to Iran (and they will) – how does that not bring Russia and the USA into direct conflict?

3. Trump is too late to save Ukraine. He will likely stop the funding, but the war-mad Zelensky needs a war to survive so there will never be a peace deal that is sustainable. Trump will not just roll over, but he has no cards to play and Putin will negotiate hard.
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November 7, 2024 8:53am
- cmm
  
  Once there is a war raging there are never any easy solutions.
  
  Biden tried the “oops, let’s just run off home” method in Afghanistan and see what a shit show that turned into.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:27am
- rouppe
  
  On your point 2, Russia is the first to bring a member of their alliance into a conflict that they started, and had nothing to do with North Korea.
  
  That’s potentially going to allow a European response to threats at their border
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:36am
  - Grunter
    
    I think you’ll find that NATO have been involved in Ukraine for quite a while now……
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:07am
    - slightlyrighty
      
      Logistically? yes.
      
      Providing Intel? Yes.
      
      Training Troops? Yes.
      
      However, Ukraine has weakened the Russian Military to a point where a conventional War between Nato and Russia would only end one way.
      
      Russia’s only defence is the possibility that the war would not stay conventional
      
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      November 7, 2024 10:18am
- David Garrett
  
  Grunter: the war-mad Zelensky needs a war to survive…
  
  Really? So Putin didn’t start the conflict by invading Ukraine then? Forget all the “proxy war” theories – one nation started this conflict, and it wasn’t Ukraine.
  
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  November 7, 2024 10:05am
  - Grunter
    
    You forgot to add – IMO
    
    There is plenty of realistic analysis laying out how this conflict has been going on well before Russian troops entered Ukraine in 2022. You may well refute that is the case, but fighting in this region was going on in 2014
    
    3 3
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    November 7, 2024 10:10am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I think Trump has many cards up his sleeve to play against Zelenski and Putin.
  We will see. Most of his promises come true.
  
  1 1
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  November 7, 2024 10:26am
Frank the tank

Poor old Jack Tame – managed to convince a broke TVNZ to send him across and have a seat at the table of the coronation of Kamala Harris only to have a re-run of 2016. Reverse Midas.
21 0
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November 7, 2024 9:00am
- imalwaysright
  
  YouTube had all of the worlds major and minor news channels providing coverage.
  
  I’m not sure what Jack and the other geezer could add to that apart from Jack showing off his dads coat and his mums sunnies.
  
  6 0
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  November 7, 2024 10:06am
- geoff3012
  
  Bloody hilarious…..thought he was going to cry….
  
  6 0
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  November 7, 2024 10:13am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I thought he was crying.
    
    4 0
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    November 7, 2024 10:27am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

The United Spot.

She lost.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWcpmAHlMLg
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November 7, 2024 9:00am
Blog-aholic

With the USA voting away from the looney left we have waiting in the wings Canada to the north to do the same………
9 0
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November 7, 2024 9:06am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  They have to do something – socialism doesn’t work.
  
  2 0
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  November 7, 2024 10:30am
Mod88

Given there is only one big talking point today don’t drown in the tears of the Leftys, enjoy the moment.

Gloat For The Goat

https://x.com/DustieDahl/status/1854164363021541499
7 0
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November 7, 2024 9:09am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  That is well done.
  
  2 0
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  November 7, 2024 10:34am
Steve Todd

One of the reasons why I like The Young Turks is that they criticise the Republicans and the Democrats equally. While they are left leaning, they are not biased towards the Left.

Yesterday, as it was becoming clear that Kamala Harris and the Democrats were having a bad day, Cenk Uygur, John Iadarola & Michael Shure discussed the results with Congressman Steve Cohen (D–Tenn): see here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPhbQrBPS2c [17:48].

From 8:00, Uygur makes the point that the Democrats deliver for their donors and not for their voters. (This has always been a bone of contention for Uygur.) From 13:15, he asks Cohen if there is any chance that Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries will be removed. Cohen replied, probably not.

Cohen agreed with Cenk that the Democrats won’t change a thing, and that, while he will go back if they lose the House, it will be “hard to stay”.

An interesting interview. The Democrats have got a lot of soul-searching to do, but probably won’t do it. Hint: it really is the economy.
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November 7, 2024 9:10am
- All_on_Red
  
  You and the pundits like Cohen, Scaramucci, the Sexist Pig at TYT, the Bulwark and the Lincoln Project have been so wrong I doubt anybody will take anything any of you say seriously again.
  The nonsense about the Gender Gap was hilarious since none of you know what a woman is. Not a surprise given the Beta Males in the Democrat Party
  Hint- it’s really more than the economy
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:28am
- Tom Hunter
  
  🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
  
  Are the walls closing in yet, Steve?
  
  5 0
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  November 7, 2024 9:42am
  - Steve Todd
    
    Don’t be silly, Tom. As I said at General Debate last Thursday, “if Trump wins, sure, I will be disappointed, but I also know that I will simply suck it up and carry on with my life.”
    
    No doubt just as you did in 2008, 2012, and 2020.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:07am
- kowtow
  
  Why would any organisation use the name of a political movement that engaged in genocides .
  
  3 0
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  November 7, 2024 9:43am
- RoboRob
  
  Only seen clips of the Young Turks but would never watch. Cenk Uygur is a deranged man who frequently breaks down into yelling at his opponents. Whilst he clearly is intelligent and sometimes makes sound arguements he acts like a little baby. Which, given your dislike for Trump, surprises me that you would like him!
  
  He is a regular on Pearce Morgans Unplugged podcast, which is often like Jerry Springer, and you can see why. He is chosen not for his words of wisdom but for his ability to loose his shit at the drop of a hat.
  
  I would suggest one of the many other left wing with a little right wing podcasts like perhaps breaking points. At least Crystal Ball can control her emotions.
  
  p.s. I said left win with a little right wing as it seems most of these ‘both sides’ podcasts tend to end up with hard leftists with centrists or moderates on the other side.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:47am
- Tom Hunter
  
  Jonathan Pie has a better set of explanations
  
  3 0
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  November 7, 2024 9:48am
  - slightlyrighty
    
    A great summation of why the centrists went right.
    
    Identity Politics will kill you.
    
    3 0
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    November 7, 2024 10:15am
Swifty

I wonder what the future holds for Harris and Walz?

Will the Democrats next four years be centered around them or will they slink off into obscurity?

I did see some commentary overnight that picking Walz was a mistake from Harris and that he added absolutely nothing to her chances – unlike Vance who appears to have been a great pick and a great communicator.
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November 7, 2024 9:33am
- Tom Hunter
  
  Saturday Night Live did a skit the other day of “Guess That Name” and brought out one Tim Kaine, who was actually Hillary’s running mate in 2016 and is currently a senator; the whole joke being that the “Liberal” contestant couldn’t name him.
  
  I reckon Harris and Walz will be forgotten even faster.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:44am
  - RoboRob
    
    That was hillarious and funny that Kaine and Walz even look the same.
    
    4 0
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    November 7, 2024 9:49am
  - John Loveridge
    
    Very true. In fact, if you’d asked me this morning to name Hillary’s running mate, I would have looked at you blankly and gaped.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:46am
- RoboRob
  
  I imagine Harris will end up at some not for profit law firm, earning a huge wage.
  
  Tim will probably just truck on. He was never president material and should not have been picked. The Dems were just to0 scared to pick a jew as Kamalas running mate.
  
  Vance could go on to be a two term president. He might even be an excellent one. Vance is actually much more an old school Dem then a Rep generally and was an excellent pick. Clearly Trump was looking to the future with Vance rather then just picking up electorate votes, although Vance certainly may have done that with his appearances, especially against Walz.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:54am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Vance future 2 terms – that is the plan I think.
    Trump will then be in the background, like Obama.
    
    3 0
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    November 7, 2024 10:43am
  - John Loveridge
    
    Harris will end up with a lucrative speaking circuit gig and a book deal. The book will sell millions of copies, and in about five years you will see stacks of boxes filled with barely read copies at charity book sales. But she’ll have milked the cow dry by then.
    
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    November 7, 2024 10:49am
Maggy Wassilieff

Why the hell should rural school principals be expected to be drinking water experts?

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/country/533074/paperwork-cost-of-safe-water-plans-tipping-some-principals-over-the-edge

Why don’t the folks at the water Quality regulator Taumata Arowai get off their bums and do the work themselves?
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November 7, 2024 9:47am
- pdm
  
  Better still Maggy.
  
  Get rid of Taumata Arowai.
  
  I still cannot understand how it survived the 3/5/10/All/Mahuta Waters clean out.
  
  4 0
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  November 7, 2024 10:24am
Swifty

I’ve got a meeting with Wellington City Council staff at 11am.

I guess they’ll all be in mourning.

I’ll wear black.
10 0
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November 7, 2024 9:50am
- Ghost
  
  Slap a little whiskey on for aftershave, see if the mayor comes running.
  
  11 0
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  November 7, 2024 9:54am
mogg

“Drill baby drill”
Mass sackings of public servants, reinstate the travel ban from Muslim countries, expel illegals, tariffs on Chinese and European countries which don’t compete fairly.
From my first day in office”
7 0
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November 7, 2024 9:52am
Maggy Wassilieff

The USA Constitution limits the term of President to 2.

If the good folks of USA had voted Trumpy for President in 2000, then they’d be looking at a new President-elect today.
4 0
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November 7, 2024 9:53am
- RoboRob
  
  If Biden (or his handlers) hadn’t picked a DEI VP, the dems wouldn’t have been stuck with Kamala is a candidate after it became clear Biden had lost his marbles.
  
  Next election I look forward to two decent, non aged, strong candidates.
  
  Sure one will be hitler and the other will be destroying american families, as usual, but it would be nice to see some less polarising candidates.
  
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  November 7, 2024 9:57am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Hitler reacts to Trump winning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpCdX2g31ww
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November 7, 2024 9:56am
Tom Hunter

I don’t understand why my simple offer…

“Would you like me to explain why you lost?”

… has not appeared on the following blogs”
– No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
– The Pyschic Scream (TDB, “Bomber”)
– The Standard.

I’ll keep trying. Surely they want to know, so that they can win next time?
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November 7, 2024 10:05am
Sparrow

Whatever you think about Trump there are two other winners. The little people and democracy. The deplorables won in 2016 and the garbage won in 2024. The elite, celebs, woke just don’t get it. Its how much you can afford to put into that supermarket trolley. One vote per person proved itself again and it needs to be defended.
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November 7, 2024 10:16am
Surely Knott

What happens to Ardern from here? Now that the election is over and the Dems lost. Is that job over for her? What is happening with her $30 million Gates fund that she’s been given to distribute? Does she continue on living in the USA under a Trump presidency? Will she come back here? Move to Canada? France? Where is left for them to hide?
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November 7, 2024 10:22am
- Cassandra
  
  Madagascar has a quite pleasant climate.
  
  0 0
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  November 7, 2024 11:12am
rouppe

Caught a little bit of Kamala Harris’ speech.

Basically saying they will continue the fight for equality, blah blah blah.

The clear implication that this election doesn’t represent those things.

She just doesn’t get it.
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November 7, 2024 10:36am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

I wonder how the US Public Sector is feeling?
Sphincters clenching with Elon Musk coming for the big cost saving cleanout?
2 1
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November 7, 2024 10:49am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Yep, they are melting down.

https://rumble.com/v5mgtmq-liberals-are-melting-down-over-trumps-victory.html?
2 1
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November 7, 2024 10:55am
- David Garrett
  
  Steve O: Please tell me that is spoof site…Are there really that many totally mad Yanks??
  
  0 0
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  November 7, 2024 11:14am
Lee C

I hope this doesn’t mean we’ll have to endure another five seasons of:

‘The Handmaid’s Tale’.
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November 7, 2024 11:06am
kevn

SteveO… The meltdown winner is. This.
https://x.com/dvorahfr/status/1854274565418922203
Second is..
https://x.com/ClownWorld_/status/1854274254852047128
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November 7, 2024 11:13am

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