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June 2, 2024 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 02 June 2024

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General Debate

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Benedict Yu

Surely it is time to accept that Australia will continue to deport New Zealand criminals from Australia.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-05-31/new-zealand-pm-calls-albanese-over-criminal-deportation-change/103917638

The brief “peace in our time” moment was a political concession from the Australian PM to Jacinda Ardern.

Meanwhile back in New Zealand. Remember the Chistchurch serial rapists who drugged and raped customers at their bar?

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/518205/mama-hooch-rapists-will-not-be-deported-after-release

Well it turns out that they are NOT New Zealand citizens. They are Australian citizens only. However when they are eventually released from prison they will be allowed to remain in New Zealand because of the length of time that they were in New Zealand at the time of the offending.

So to summarise the situation…

Australia now gives citizenship to the New Zealanders it wants to attract

Australia deports the criminals and undesirables back to New Zealand, even if they have been living in Australia for decades.

New Zealand allows Australian serial rapists to remain in New Zealand.
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June 2, 2024 8:12am
- wsk12345
  
  I wonder if there is anything we can do to get that decision changed? Lobbying etc. anyone know?
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:20am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    It is not a “decision” yet. They will be in prison for a long time. Probably out on parole mid 2030s.
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:52am
- Mike
  
  Australia wants to change to an approach which leads to worse results overall. NZ’s policy is kinder to Australia than their policy is to NZ.
  To a simple mind, our policy should match theirs. But if their policy is objectively worse, why should we change just because Dutton wants to act tough?
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:29am
  - wsk12345
    
    Objectively worse overall perhaps. Not objectively worse for us.
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:42am
  - MikeMan
    
    Treat others as you want to be treated.
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:08am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      You mean, like when NZ dropped virtually all its tariffs back in the ‘80s, in the expectation that other countries would follow our virtuous lead?
      
      Remind me, how did that work out again?
      
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      June 2, 2024 3:16pm
- Swifty
  
  We deport criminals who have been here since childhood – and long should we continue to do so. We’re hypocrites criticising Aussie when we do exactly the same things ourselves.
  
  Your point about the Aussie rapists is well made, but I’m pretty confident they’ll return of their own accord, their old man has already decamped back.
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:30am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “We deport criminals who have been here since childhood.”
    
    We would deport a 20 year old murderer who has been in New Zealand since he was 11 years old.
    
    At least that is my understanding from the article.
    
    A 22 year old murderer who has been in New Zealand since he was 11 could stay.
    
    Your statement is only true in a minority of cases.
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:55am
    - cmm
      
      “We deport criminals who have been here since childhood.”
      
      Possibly if they are not Permanent Residents.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:51am
- JimBobJoe
  
  “New Zealand deportation laws can be used to remove migrants who have committed crimes, but only if the offences happen within two, five or 10 years of residence being granted – the period varies, depending on how serious the offence is.
  
  In the case of the Jaz brothers – whose crimes fall into the most serious 10-year category – their offending occurred more than a decade after they got residence.”
  
  So the stupidity of this law is unbelievable. They are Australians, not NZ citizens, but because of the way our law is written they can be deported….
  
  Well lets hope they meet misfortune inside jail, because dollars to donuts the crimes they were convicted for weren’t their first rodeo and its highly probably they will be arseholes again when released…
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:45am
- Anthony Melchett
  
  To anyone contemplating moving to Australia, it’s now a case of looking for reasons not to go and you would need something serious.
  
  There is not a thing there that is worse than nz.
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:55am
  - Mike
    
    Snakes, buushfires, Australian beer, Australians…
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:39am
    - OlderChas
      
      I concur, Mike. Having been forced by my employer to go to Australia many times for various periods – every time I went I found the place full of bloody Australians!
      
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      June 2, 2024 9:57am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        You can’t have been in Melbourne
        
        Can’t move but bump into Kiwis… (and Yanks, Greeks, Cambos, Viets, Lebos, Eyeties, etc).
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:22am
      - Jethrod
        
        HEAT… who can take 30°C plus!!!!! It’s diabolical
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:52am
      - Don Beckett
        
        30 deg. + is great. When I lived there in the 1980’s I really enjoyed the warm climate – used to work often (roofing contractor) in temps over 40 deg. 🙂
        
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        June 2, 2024 12:25pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      FFS.
      
      There are good and bad Australians like everywhere.
      
      Have you ever been attacked by a snake in Australia?
      
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      June 2, 2024 9:57am
      - Ghost
        
        Can’t you take a joke
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:02am
      - westernScientist
        
        I have had their beer there though….
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:19am
      - jkt
        
        Gost: 🤭
        
        Bene snakebite:
        You live in NZ, right?
        
        Western:
        Good reason to stay, but then, you can get most of our beers there, at a very steep price. But worth the trouble and the money.
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:52am
    - Mike
      
      Gosh! I think we might need a shorter list: good things about Australia.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:09am
      - Ghost
        
        Ummmm…..
        
        I will get back to you when I think of any
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:12am
      - Terry Dalee
        
        Hmm, I dunno, having a CHOICE as to whether I or my children would want to learn how to speak Maori, is pretty high on the list there.
        
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        June 2, 2024 1:40pm
      - Anthony Melchett
        
        For starters, they have enough staff to operate the businesses. And by staff I don’t mean Indians running subway while staring at you in disdain.
        
        People are just happier there, it’s a wealthy positive country whereas nz is an angry poor country.
        
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        June 2, 2024 6:59pm
    - cmm
      
      Snakes don’t worry me as I kept them as a child.
      
      But, objectively, all the snakes, sharks, kangaroos and other things that can kill people in Australia don’t come anywhere near to the differential in murder rates.
      
      NZ is far more dangerous that the Aussie outback.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:54am
      - artemisia
        
        Be fine in Victoria though, as they now have the MP for Men’s Behaviour Change.
        
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        June 2, 2024 12:13pm
      - softail 1450
        
        CMM ,snakes do worry me especially the 123 of them in parliament .
        
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        June 2, 2024 3:52pm
  - goNZ1
    
    Since Albo changed the rules last year, 20,000 NZers have taken up Australian citizenship already. So much for the theory that ” they will come home eventually “
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:39am
  - David Garrett
    
    Anthony: To the list below I would add flies too small to swat; box jellyfish; crocodiles; language misuse as bad as in the US…and of course women whose voices would immediately kill any desire. At least in me.
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:50am
    - pdm
      
      Snakes.
      
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      June 2, 2024 10:55am
    - jkt
      
      No-one said Aussie is perfect.
      
      And they claim Pharlap!
      
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      June 2, 2024 10:56am
    - Matt Long
      
      Mosquitos, flies that try to walk across your eyeball, green ants, bull ants, cane toads.
      Stingers, sharks, muddy beaches in North Queensland. Stone fish.
      
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      June 2, 2024 10:59am
  - Colville
    
    The main reason I would never live full time in Oz is the lack of decent bush to hunt in. Other than the beaches the outdoors in Oz sucks.
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:43am
    - Don Beckett
      
      In NSW & Victoria in the alps there are vast areas that one can hunt – 3 or 4 breeds of deer, wild pigs, kangaroos etc.
      
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      June 2, 2024 12:29pm
  - Ghost
    
    Good news, your kids will have to apologise to the aboriginals
    
    https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/flaoke-games-aussie-dad-unleashes-at-school-after-daughter-forced-to-apologise-to-aboriginal-indigenous-people/ar-BB1nafVh?ocid=BingNewsSerp
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:57am
    - Terry Dalee
      
      At least some Aboriginal Australians know and call out racism for what it is aren’t afraid to be seen saying it.
      
      https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/calls-grow-for-mount-warning-to-be-open-to-the-public/video/5653029fe8fa2a5969c3b175c166c93e
      
      That elder in that piece clearly says, I want the Mt Warning track open to everyone, it’s racist to disseminate who can go up Mt Warning.
      
      I’d rather deal with a snake, box jelly or bad beer any day off the week than have TPM anywhere in power or a position where they could remotely be or have to continually deal the forced Maorification of NZ society.
      
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      June 2, 2024 1:38pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Be kind, Benedict!
  
  Nope, wait, I think the Government has changed.
  
  Over to you, Coalition Minister. Send those scum back to where they came from.
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:02am
  - jkt
    
    Why?
    It will cost us the plane ticket. They can pay their own airfare.
    
    I do not want to slander those criminals, but they more than likely pushed drugs. Or …. is that an endorsement. … shit, this world is upside down..
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:59am
    - Don Beckett
      
      A plane ticket is cheap – way less than the $120,000 per annum per prisoner to keep them here.
      
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      June 2, 2024 12:31pm
      - jkt
        
        Then we should have sent them the day after sentencing not after serving out their sentence.
        
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        June 2, 2024 4:51pm
- ISeeRed
  
  We are not a serious country.
  
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  June 3, 2024 5:19pm
Chuck Bird

I wonder if Joyce is correct. If they do fix their lie who will believe them in 2026? I an disappointed that Seymour supports this callous lie,

Pharmac blunder, tax cuts and debt: the hits and misses of Budget 2024 – Steven Joyce

The one significant blemish that may dog the Government is its inexplicable failure to make good on its cancer drugs promise. It seems weird that you can trumpet a massive $17b increase in health spending across three Budgets and yet not dedicate any of it to meeting the most public health pledge of your recent election campaign. Worryingly, it suggests a lack of political savvy in a crucial area of Government policy.

I’d bet this will be fixed in short order, as ministers have clearly missed the significance of this omission.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/steven-joyce-column-pharmac-blunder-tax-cuts-and-debt-the-hits-and-misses-of-budget-2024/AFOO5WJBBNF4NLDC6OGMKABFUY/
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June 2, 2024 8:14am
- G152
  
  If every drug for every ill was financed there would be nothing left to finance anything else.
  Many of these drugs are valid for only a few ailments and with the time they are active not able to be stored..
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:20am
  - wsk12345
    
    I doubt we would be keeping stocks of them if that’s the case.
    
    The difference between these and all drugs is an electioneering promise. I didn’t hear a promise to give $50m to kapa haka and yet they got it.
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:44am
    - westernScientist
      
      I really fail to see how they thought that 50m to kapa haka was a better idea than 50m to pharmac, what every way you look at it.
      
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      June 2, 2024 10:00am
      - Ghost
        
        I actually wonder if it was more of not wanting to be seen to be taking everything away from Māori all at once. It’s a small amount, $16 million a year from next year.
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:06am
      - westernScientist
        
        Ghost, didnt really work then did it? Which was completely foreseeable
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:20am
      - Ghost
        
        Didn’t it?
        
        This snap poll on the budget seems to be positive
        
        https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/other/budget-2024-snap-poll-reveals-voters-views-on-budget-as-parliament-rushes-through-tax-cuts-bill/ar-BB1npaT4?ocid=BingNewsSerp
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:25am
      - westernScientist
        
        My point was that they now have bad press about both not filling the pharmac promise, and ‘taking everything away from maori all at once – come on they have tmp calling for an ‘dependent parliament’ because they are ‘trying to exterminate us’ and they could have increased funding to their troughs directly and still would have got that result.
        
        Not that people dont like tax cuts, of coarse they do, especially the ones that like big government.
        
        On a side note – they really should talk about this stuff in annual terms for x number of years rather than the total over a random number of years.
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:35am
      - Ghost
        
        If your point is bad press, sorry to burst your bubble but they are going to have bad press for the entire time they are in government,
        
        So they have a mp calling for a Māori parliament, big deal. There doesn’t seem to be much support at all for that, mp’s often say stupid things, especially those from the minor parties.
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:06am
      - Flossie
        
        TPM was calling for a Maori Parliament before they even saw the budget. Had the budget promised everyone on the Maori roll $1000 they’d have been complaining it wasn’t enough.
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:20am
      - ISeeRed
        
        That’s what blows my mind. How. Could. They. Not. Have. Seen. This. Coming?
        
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        June 3, 2024 5:23pm
    - goNZ1
      
      Whats a kapa haka?
      Give me Milo any day!
      
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      June 2, 2024 10:37am
      - Paulus
        
        KH is an good clear out I understand !
        
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        June 2, 2024 2:57pm
- kowtow
  
  Te legacy media are also ,strangely, holding the govt to account , very vigorously on this subject .
  
  Strange because Ardern’s regime made any number of extraordinary promises but weren’t held to account at all by the same media and it took the thicko swing voter a long time to wake up too.
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:30am
  - pdm
    
    One does need to have the IQ of Einstein to agree with you kowtow.
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:38am
- SmokerGuy
  
  I completely agree Chuck, they probably shouldn’t have done this in the first because Pharmac is there to make these decisions but it’s not cool to dangle this carrot in front of people who are dying and then say sorry not now. It is a big own goal, I think they did ok with the budget but this is hugely disappointing. Did they seriously not see how this would look?
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:30am
- Mike
  
  No, it’s a deliberately cynical move to ignore support the national party considers as baked in.
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:31am
- artemisia
  
  Hard not to feel a lot of empathy. However, there are numerous groups telling the government they just must have more money. Or else, something or other. Even some no doubt worthy causes that did get a bump in funding, but hey it’s not enough.
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:39am
  - MCōs
    
    The issue was that Mr Luxon stood in front of the cameras and promised funding for a bunch of cancer drugs and when he looked into the abyss he chickened out
    
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    June 2, 2024 8:55am
    - JackRabbit
      
      No, The cupboard is bare. $100 Billion is small if you say it quickly, but that is how much the former govt put us into debt for. And there is nothing they created with it. And not to mention other hidden liabilities.
      
      Putting mildly, the former govt in a prick of a position. Another 3 years of Labour we would be like Venezuela.
      
      $100 Billion would pay for about 100 new 500MW power stations or enough to give every man, woman, and child, a 2nd division lotto win.
      
      The interest costs alone are mind blowing. 20% of GDP. And GDP is other peoples money, before taxation. So GDP is not net income for the Govt.
      
      If your spouse and you owned a business that had an annual turnover of $10 million, and annual profit of profit of $200k, could you manage your budget if she/he went out and borrowed $2 million on the business, spent it on nothing tangible, and then buggered off leaving you to face the music. Not to mention all the other debts you find when you take the lid off the can of worms.
      
      In these circumstances, tolerance is called for. If you had promised your oldest child to stump up a $180k deposit on their first house and then your spouse leaves and you are facing that $2M debt, only an idiot would say you chickened out on the house deposit.
      
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      June 2, 2024 9:24am
      - wsk12345
        
        All very well until you start to list the crap they do fund. Kapa haka $50 m. The Maori health initiative thing. NZSO. Arts and culture. So much waste.
        
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        June 2, 2024 9:49am
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        The hugely increased pay rates for the nurses and other medics, teachers, flowing through the whole of government, would alone be $20 billion per annum. It mans government salaries are quite close to those of Australia, not withstanding NZ has a 25% lower per capita GDP.
        
        It is the main reason why Nicola Willis’s budget actually has higher spending than grant Robertson’s last budget.
        
        Just about all the money to do this is borrowed.
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:50am
      - jkt
        
        Who needs better health care, right!
        Labour promised this and now this lot delivers this, improved public services and tax cuts.
        
        Let’s vote labour!
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:11am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Who needs better health care, right
        
        Exactly…
        
        We’ve had 6 years of “Well-being” budgets.
        
        It must have worked.
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:26am
      - cmm
        
        Billions and millions are both large numbers outside of people’s everyday comprehension. They have little emotional content.
        
        People will get outraged about a few thousand dollars – something of which they have first hand experience.
        
        But they don’t get a thousand times more outraged about a million dollars or a million times more outraged about a billion dollars.
        
        $100 billion is a lot. That is enough to buy everyone in NZ a brand new car.
        
        Essentially that is what Cindy and Robbo did. They took away a new car from everyone in NZ.
        
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        June 2, 2024 12:02pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        Our future will increasingly consist of being forced to at least match Australian salaries while our economy falls further behind theirs. The gap is about 25% now and will likely be 30% by 2030.
        
        Naturally the private sector will lose people and be unable to do much about it, but the public sector won’t have any choice.
        
        Actually the real trigger point will be when the Philippines begins to approach our levels – and then surpass them.
        
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        June 2, 2024 1:50pm
      - softail 1450
        
        Jackrabbit, the debt is approaching $100,000 per household ,remove the unproductive households among those and it’s probably around $120,000 per household ,another name for our situation is 3rd world so we’ve just gotta accept the inevitable consequence of Dame Arderns caring kind 6 years.
        Meanwhile Chippie Hipkins is blaming the coalition for all the problems we are only NOW starting to face up to.
        
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        June 2, 2024 4:08pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @wsk12345
        
        You mean the crap that Labour funded, some of which the Coalition have not yet canned.
        
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        June 2, 2024 6:26pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @softail 1450 @4.08pm
        
        Agreed. Ardern, Robertson, Chippie et all, lit the fire, ran away and then blamed the Coalition.
        
        The size of the debt is enormous. We could have had dozens of new hydro dams for the money they pissed up against the wall.
        
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        June 2, 2024 6:28pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @Wayne Mapp
        
        The hugely increased pay rates for the nurses and other medics.
        
        For some medics who are simply toxic vaccine pushers, I agree, but not all. But not the nurses. I used to view many as militant union types, but I’ve seen first hand the bullshit and bullying and sheer disorganisation they work under.
        
        If increased pay is one way of making them stay, it was worth it, but so many good doctors and nurses left to go overseas or work elsewhere to get away from the toxic workplace, mandates, lying and bullshit.
        
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        June 2, 2024 6:37pm
    - pdm
      
      Mcos – a lot like 3Strikes.
      
      Good legislation watered down by Luxon.
      
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      June 2, 2024 9:40am
      - Ghost
        
        And can you show it was watered down by Luxon. I read the article by Nicole McKee explaining why they doing what they were with 3 strikes. The article felt like this was what act wanted to pass.
        
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        June 2, 2024 9:54am
      - imalwaysright
        
        3 waters was like charging everyone in the street $50k because the worst house needs $50k in maintenance.
        It doesn’t make sense.
        
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        June 2, 2024 10:10am
      - jkt
        
        AlwaysRight:
        You are so right on 3Waters.
        Once again Labour promised reform and relied on National and others to implement the reform that we need.
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:15am
      - JackRabbit
        
        Agreed.
        
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        June 2, 2024 6:26pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    The government should have left it to Pharmac to decide what drugs to fund. They choose to promise specific drugs to desperate people if they vote for them.
    
    They are better than the left. This is getting like the US. People vote not for someone but against the other lot.
    
    They all lie.
    
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    June 2, 2024 8:57am
    - Mike
      
      Exactly right. One of the reasons to have Pharmac was to stop politicians from making promises in response to emotional marketing campaigns funded by the drug companies.
      
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      June 2, 2024 9:43am
      - jkt
        
        I am desperate to buy a car!!
        
        That announcement is beyond stupid.
        
        We will get a better deal as was promised by Luxon. He has the Mana (humility is plain English- the Maori translation of Mana is Utu) to wear the egg on his face.
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:20am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        You mean like “Safe and Effective” chanting for Pfizer?
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:31am
- MCōs
  
  Pharmac decides which medicines it will fund, not the government
  All the government can due is ensure funding is not an issue
  I’m not sure what would happen if the government came up with x million dollars, but Pharmac decided something else was a higher priority?
  https://pharmac.govt.nz/about/what-we-do/how-pharmac-works
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:45am
  - JimBobJoe
    
    The NZ Government can, if it wants, ear mark funding for a specific programme outside Pharmac.
    
    Its simple really – but it breaks the model, so wouldnt be a clever idea and would just amplify Pharmaceutical companies advertising campaigns.
    
    The problem is we are not healthy enough as a country and we end up needing all sorts of treatments – which consume large dollar flows to fund.
    
    If we were healthy – we would have more opportunity to fund the more expensive drugs ….
    
    Walking the streets of Wellington region the number of morbidly obese people seems to have jumped in the last 25 years – that cant be good for our health system…
    
    Short run stats seem to support my eyeball observation, though I am too lazy to dig for a long run stats set:
    
    Obesity statistics
    
    [Mod – fixed link]
    
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    June 2, 2024 8:55am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Not just Wellington, JBJ.
      
      It’s funny, really. You have one end of the spectrum, which are the gym-bunnies. My-body-is-a-temple types, now come here and worship. Cyclists too, to give them credit, albeit at a cost to the rest of us (the Council don’t fund too many gyms).
      
      And then there are the slobs, with no self-control & for whom labour-saving devices just exacerbate the problem. You’ll see them in doctor’s waiting rooms.
      
      It’s just nuts. Whatever happened to moderation and personal responsibility?
      
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      June 2, 2024 9:54am
      - MCōs
        
        People don’t necessarily die as a direct result of being overweight
        In Mangere Bridge there is a Maori cemetery dating back maybe eighty years and I’ve been amazed at how young most of the deceased were when they died
        Inappropriate diet, smoking, accidents, epidemics, poor housing, isolation all contributed to shortened lifespans and still do for a decreasing number of people, particularly the financially deprived
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:04am
      - ISeeRed
        
        @MCōs There are always exceptions. A few smokers live to a ripe old age. Generally, being overweight isn’t healthy. What’s your point?
        
        As for “financially deprived”, note the passivity of the phrase.
        
        deprived = being kept from possessing, enjoying, or using something
        
        The implication is they have no agency. They are victims, actively “deprived” by a bad actor (no, not Mark Wahlberg). Someone else made them poor! There is nothing they can do to become financially better off.
        
        Logically, someone who is “financially deprived” shouldn’t be overweight in the first place. Genuinely poor people can’t afford expensive meals like junk food or takeaways. Yet the poorest among us are often the fattest.
        
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        June 3, 2024 6:12pm
    - Handyman
      
      Quite right.
      Fat people are the greatest weight (figuratively and literally) on the health system.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:44am
    - Paulus
      
      Interested to know how many people are affected by not receiving these specific drugs at present ?
      
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      June 2, 2024 3:00pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Not in this case. The election promise was to effectively direct pharmac to fund more cancer drugs. We can debate whether that is a good thing, but that was the promise.
    
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    June 2, 2024 8:57am
    - lifesgood
      
      There are two more budgets during this term of government. They have not said they won’t fund
      cancer drugs. It’s just not this time. Surely no-one expects everything be done immediately, there are 2 and a half more years… hopefully longer.
      
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      June 2, 2024 9:15am
      - artemisia
        
        Thought that funding for the cancer drugs was to come from removal of many free prescriptions. That starts next month.
        
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        June 2, 2024 9:56am
      - greybeard
        
        Some common sense here at last.
        
        4 3
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        June 2, 2024 10:43am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        The people who will not live another year would not agree with you.
        
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        June 2, 2024 2:37pm
  - peterwn
    
    But the Government can allocate specific sums to Pharmac for specific purposes. It would become awkward if there was too much ‘ring fencing’. I do not know if there is a mechanism to figure out whether the Pharmac budget versus rest of Health budget provides an optimum outcome. For example if a $1M increase in Pharmac’s budget results in $2M decrease of other healthcare costs then it would be worthwhile increasing Pharmac’s budget by $1M. The Health Minister should ensure that comparisons are made on a continuing basis.
    
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    June 2, 2024 8:58am
  - Damocles11
    
    Why is the government saying they haven’t funded the 18 new cancer drugs, saying they “had to make hard choices?” Please just be honest.
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:30am
    - peterwn
      
      I suspect the election plank came into being before Robbo’s skulduggery with the long term financial where if you carefully read a footnote on page 999 (or so) it would be apparent that funding for various programmes disappeared in 2025 and beyond. Now any reasonable person (ie the sort you see on the Karori omnibus) would think when reading the paper normally that the programmes were being funded into the future.
      No doubt Otago University will try similar smoke and mirrors when making funding applications to the Government then blame Nicola for not reading the reports properly.
      
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      June 2, 2024 2:00pm
- Damocles11
  
  Unfortunately you’re getting downticked for stating facts. I was appalled to see someone commenting yesterday ‘politicians lie, get over it’ and others twisting themselves in knots trying to say the books were bad so the cancer drugs had to go. Money was found to give to Auckland for their rail issues, when it should the rail operators in the city sorting it out from existing resources. Money was found for ‘Kapa haka’. Over the next 12 months we’ll be getting the articles on the individuals dying of cancer who didn’t get these drugs, a PR disaster.
  Why believe any promises National makes at the next election?
  The slogans write themselves: ‘National: they put landlords over cancer patients’.
  Downtick all you like, that’s the scenario the government now faces.
  
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  June 2, 2024 8:50am
  - ISeeRed
    
    The Republicans have often been called the Stupid Party, partly because of their complete lack of awareness of something called “optics”. National is the NZ branch.
    
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    June 3, 2024 6:22pm
- peterwn
  
  I seem to remember a certain Labour MP (who was a man of the cloth) promising he would resign his seat if his Government closed the Wanganui railway workshops. The Government did close the workshops but he did not resign.
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:02am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    The Reverend, Honourable Russell Marshall.
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:38am
- Cassandra
  
  I’m paying for my keytruda. I accept that. A government can’t fund everything unfortunately and there have got to be priorities.
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:40am
  - Mike
    
    Bad luck for you that Mr Luxon changed his priorities once safely in office.
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:46am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Got to agree with you Mike, not on the drug funding, but other things he campaigned on he is not following through with.
      You will know what they are.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:34am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Good luck, Cassandra
    
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    June 2, 2024 9:56am
    - artemisia
      
      Agree, but sounds more like very good management.
      
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      June 2, 2024 10:16am
  - westernScientist
    
    I think the issue is what those priorities appear to have become.
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:05am
- Ghost
  
  I would expect that within a few months they will find extra funding.
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:56am
- nathie
  
  Health Minister Shane Reti said this morning:
  
  “We will fund those cancer drugs, and we’ll be making more announcements soon on that.
  
  Which suggests something sooner rather than later (despite the headline on the link below)?
  
  https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/the-sunday-session/audio/shane-reti-health-minister-assures-kiwis-hell-deliver-on-promised-cancer-drugs-this-term/
  
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  June 2, 2024 10:59am
  - Ghost
    
    Followed up by Willis and luxon
    
    PM Christopher Luxon said getting core funding in place for Pharmac was critical, and the government is committed to getting more cancer drugs funded.
    
    Nicola Willis said the Government wasn’t in a position to make a detailed announcement on drug funding during the Budget, but will be making one shortly.
    
    Willis said the government has always been committed to funding cancer drugs, and will deliver on that commitment: “We are absolutely going to deliver on it.”
    
    Article
    
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    June 2, 2024 12:14pm
- Paulus
  
  It will be revised shortly -watch this space when Luxon gets back from the Pacific.
  
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  June 2, 2024 1:22pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Pimping the sick is back.

The story is all about unfunded drugs. I have no problem with that, particularly given National’s pre election promise. But, where were these stories when Labour were shovelling cash out the door? Where’s the story weighing the relative merits of unfunded drugs vs, say, $2.75m to the late Sonny Smith of the Bitzer Brigade?

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2024/06/auckland-mum-with-advanced-breast-cancer-fights-for-new-wonder-drug.html

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/518409/hawke-s-bay-braces-for-gang-leader-s-tangi
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June 2, 2024 8:44am
Yvette

Taonga?
Forty years of Waitangi Tribunal decisions have been built on a “very wobbly” house of cards, according to Piers Seed in his new book Taonga and Contra Proferentem – thoughts on the Waitangi Tribunal Process …

Seed’s new book shows that the Waitangi Tribunal has built its empire on a word and a concept to create its wobbly house of cards.

The word is “taonga”, which originally meant “property procured by the spear”

[An]old legal doctrine called “contra proferentem” [is]used by the tribunal to claim that the Maori language “Te Tiriti” has precedence over the English “treaty” text.

This effectively denies the Crown any say in its interpretation which is “surely a very strange thing in an agreement between two parties”, Seed wrote.

The word “taonga” was used 6182 times in newspapers from 1842 to 1989, Seed found by searching digitised records “with a few keystrokes”.

“Property procured by the spear”, the first documented English definition of “taonga”, was recorded by New Zealand missionary, recorder of the Maori language, schoolmaster, arms dealer, and Pakeha-Maori Thomas Kendall in 1820.
https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2024/03/mike-butler-tribunals-wobbly-house-of.html

In the comments, one person says –
“The Waitangi Tribunal has used the word “taonga“ to include water, fishing rights, environmental management, forestry, geothermal resources, Maori language, radio frequencies, data related to the Maori world, flora, fauna, intellectual property, mountains, minerals, the right to vote, Maori seats, Maori children, and so on”

An observation to make is that : the Treaty appears to have already be vastly mis-interpreted on just this one word, but Maori don’t even want to debate the matter.
But they of course may precipitate the circumstances in which it will have to be discussed or clarified.
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June 2, 2024 8:44am
- Mike
  
  Piers Seed’s website provides no indication of his legal, linguistic or historical expertise. Why would one read his books instead of others?
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:52am
  - Yvette
    
    Why would one read his books instead of others?
    
    I don’t think I advocated reading his book.
    I had hoped to just point out how ambiguous the Treaty can be – from one word, that someone can write a whole book about – not to mention the rest of the words in contention.
    And “contra proferentem” is as indefensible too – as take the “indigenous” version as ‘gospel’. Why?
    It’s like an NYPD-SVU rape drama scenario that they call “She said, he said”
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:42am
    - Mike
      
      I sincerely doubt his definitions of either taonga or contra proferentum would be supported by any actual linguistic or legal scholarship.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:17am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        I think you will find the following definition of Taonga in the 1820 Lee & Kendall “NZ Grammar & Vocabulary”
        
        Property procured by the spear, &c
        
        and in 1843, Dieffenbach “Travels in NZ II ”
        
        Taonga – treasure, property, goods
        
        So basically, physical goods.
        
        The intangible meaning of Taonga (language, intellectual property) seems to be a recent use of the word.
        
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        June 2, 2024 11:36am
      - kiwikidsnz
        
        If you did any level basic research to support your own biased & predetermined opinions you would know that contra preferentum has historically been used for commercial contracts, not inter country treatys.
        
        It is only in recent years that the usual suspects (Waitangi Tribunal, UN etc) have seized on it in attempts to justify their own prejudiced agendas.
        
        https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contra_proferentem#:~:text=Contra%20proferentem%20(Latin%3A%20%22against,the%20party%20who%20provided%20the
        
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        June 2, 2024 12:27pm
      - Yvette
        
        http://piersseed.co.nz/about-the-author
        
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        June 2, 2024 4:19pm
    - jkt
      
      Yvette:
      
      Taonga – that makes sense.
      
      I can imagine a linguistic truth in that definition when one marries the meaning of the word to the tradition of Mana, Haka and Utu.
      
      Kindness forces one to consider sharing your treasures with others who are less powerful, if one treasures Mana over Utu!
      
      Not to speak of need! Mine, mine, mine…..
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:28am
- pdm
  
  The word “taonga” was used 6182 times in newspapers from 1842 to 1989, `
  
  Misused many thousand more times since.
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:53am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I don’t see the word “Taonga” mentioned in the Preamble or any of the Three Articles of the Treaty.
  Must be something made up and bent and twisted over the last 49 years.
  
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  June 2, 2024 11:40am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    It is there in the 1st sentence, 2nd Article.
    
    Ko te Kuini o Ingarani ka wakarite ka wakaae ki nga Rangatira ki nga hapu-ki nga tangata katoa o Nu Tirani te tino rangatiratanga o o ratou wenua o ratou kainga me o ratou taonga katoa.
    
    And here’s Hugh Kawherau’s translation of that sentence:
    The Queen of England agrees to protect the chiefs, the subtribes and all the people of New Zealand in the unqualified exercise of their chieftainship over their lands, villages and all their treasures.
    
    and here’s the footnote attached to the word “treasures”
    
    ‘Treasures’: ‘taonga’. As submissions to the Waitangi Tribunal concerning the Māori language have made clear, ‘taonga’ refers to all dimensions of a tribal group’s estate, material and non-material — heirlooms and wahi tapu (sacred places), ancestral lore and whakapapa (genealogies), etc.
    
    https://www.waitangitribunal.govt.nz/treaty-of-waitangi/translation-of-te-reo-maori-text/
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:48am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      A “footnote”?
      Why the Hugh Kawharu ‘translation’ of the Treaty was so wrong.
      In 1989 Hugh Kawharu was invited by the government of the day to “attempt to reconstruct the literal translation of the Treaty.” He was a Maori, a Tribunal member, and a claimant.
      This was like inviting the Mongrel Mob to take control of the ports of Auckland.
      Pages 17and 18:
      https://issuu.com/esisite/docs/3481_jb_-_go-governance_-_a5_booklet_-_online
      
      The Littlewood Draft. Pages 7 and 8:
      Same book,
      https://issuu.com/esisite/docs/3481_jb_-_go-governance_-_a5_booklet_-_online
      
      I have no reason to not believe this over and above any propaganda from the Waitangi Tribunal.
      
      This is not a one-upmanship thing Maggy, it is separating the truth from the lies of the 49 years since the Waitangi Tribunal Act was passed.
      
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      June 2, 2024 4:10pm
Bridgenag

German press denounce activist Michael Stürzenberger for “extremism,” “Islamophobia” and “right-wing populism” after an Afghan terrorist violently stabs him and five others with a 30cm combat knife

https://open.substack.com/pub/eugyppius/p/german-press-denounce-activist-michael?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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June 2, 2024 8:52am
- PeeJay
  
  Can’t believe the cop restrained the guy who intervened to save Stürzenberger from being stabbed. So many cops doing absolutely nothing and only seemed to react when one of the cops was stabbed.
  
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  June 2, 2024 11:12am
Yvette

Te Pāti Māori Declaration of Political Independence

The latest comments from the Kiingitanga come after Te Pāti Māori issued a Declaration of Political Independence, or Te Ngākau o Te Iwi Māori, on Thursday. The party said it wants to establish an independent Māori Parliament.
At Friday’s hui, Kiingi Tuheitia himself said of the idea: “actually it frightens me“.
Others at the hui also expressed uncertainty.
“That’s something that could be ongoing,” said climate activist Mike Smith.
“But I think in the short term, what we can do is just stem the bleeding. You know, we need to cauterise the wounds that have been created,” he added.
…
The Kiingitanga will host the annual Koroneihana celebrations at Tūrangawaewae Marae in August.
That’ll be followed by the third Hui ā-Motu in Ngāi Tahu territory, in the South Island/Te Waipounamu later in the year.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2024/06/kiingi-tuheitia-calls-for-more-k-rero-about-unity-after-national-hui-at-hastings.html

Has Te Pāti Māori – Waititi and Tamihere – “stolen thunder” or “jumped the shark”?

And Willie Jackson has often said there is nothing for the rest of New Zealand to fear.
If Kiingi Tuheitia says “actually it frightens me”, how should 81 population percent of New Zealanders (non-Maori) feel?
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June 2, 2024 8:53am
- pdm
  
  Tvette I think that remains about 84/85% of New Zealanders.
  
  There is no doubt in my mind that many Pakeha with not a skerriick of Maori blood identified as Maori, for the many benefits that accrue from doing so, in the last Census
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:57am
  - julesnzuk
    
    and I bet it’s exactly the soy boy types who self identify as “pakeha” (but wish they were Maori) who do exactly that!
    
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    June 3, 2024 12:16am
    - ISeeRed
      
      Curious how many of those who like to rabbit on about The ScienceTM when it’s Covid “vaccines” or “climate change” don’t want anyone to provide a DNA test to prove their ancestry.
      
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      June 3, 2024 6:34pm
- artemisia
  
  Did he say what frightened him? And why?
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:59am
  - Yvette
    
    Apparently not.
    And it appears no journalist has the intestinal fortitude or basic intelligence as to what their job is, to have asked.
    I would be pleased to be corrected on that.
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:47am
    - jkt
      
      I want to thank you for your posts.
      I find your posts thought provoking.
      
      7 1
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      June 2, 2024 11:36am
  - DimChappie
    
    No journalist thought to ask that obvious question. I would like to think he saw it as incendiary and treasonous, but here is a link to ask him yourself:
    
    https://waikatotainui.com/contact-us/
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:48am
  - goNZ1
    
    I thinks he is worried about having to actually do something more than endless hui
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:49am
    - jkt
      
      That is not very generous.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:35am
- Pineapple Lumps
  
  Listened to Muriel Newman (NZCPR) on the Leighton Smith podcast this morning. There are bigger issues than the Tamihere mob promoting an independent parliament, which is the ongoing work to enact He Pua Pua and have Māori rule over all. Apparently the two things required to enable all others are 1. Embedding Tikanga into law, and 2. Creation of a NZ constitution which embeds the Treaty of Waitangi.
  
  And guess what? Our activist judiciary have already got Tikanga into law, with the first claim of customary ownership of seashore and seabed. Meanwhile, Margaret Motu and one of the authors of He Pua Pua continue to work on advancing their concept of the constitution.
  
  Hopefully now the budget has been done the government can turn their focus to stopping the political, economic and geographic takeover of NZ by radical Māori activists.
  
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  June 2, 2024 11:16am
  - Yvette
    
    Perhaps the sooner David Seymour can get his bill in law the better.
    
    To assert that the Government actually has the right to government, protection of all property rights and equal voting rights and equal responsibilities for all New Zealanders.
    
    And I would urge a re-statement that government is secular
    Means little difference for down-graded Christianity, and others, but should shaft pan-spirituality such as that of te Ao Maori, and some tikanga, from taking over law and Government services – like Te Mana o Wai; have water purity but not spirituality. Let those who want to worship any religion, function as New Zealand law allows – within the law but not of the law (– Declaration of Human Rights)
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:36am
    - Taieri
      
      To assert that the Government actually has the right to government,
      ———–
      
      The legitimacy (i.e. the right to govern) of a government comes from the popular vote. In the majority of countries this is embedded in their constitutions. There’s no need for any further legislation to confirm it.
      Unfortunately, there’s no written constitution in NZ. But there’s the Constitution Act of 1986, which recognizes that the Parliament has the full and exclusive power to make laws. And this power is an essence and a basis of a government, the formation of which is also exclusive to the Parliament.
      
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      June 2, 2024 12:49pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Margaret Mutu*
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:44am
Benedict Yu

I cannot read the linked article because it is behind a pay wall. However I am assuming that Steven Joyce is saying that they should have financed the cancer drugs?

They could have been financed by cutting any number of low, or zero, value programmes. However that is simply my opinion. It is obviously not shared by the majority of Cabinet.

In all governments, the willingness to cut spending diminishes as the next election approaches. Anything not cut in this budget is most likely safe. Including the Ministry of Education, ☹️, New Zealand on Air, and the Ministry of Women delegation to Peru to discuss….

…. “the Policy Partnership on Women and the Economy (PPWE) and Manatū Wāhine [Ministry of Women] is New Zealand’s lead agency on the group.

PPWE’s overarching goal is to advance the economic integration of women in the APEC region and to coordinate gender activities across other APEC working groups.”

https://www.women.govt.nz/international/asia-pacific-economic-cooperation

I’m not picking on the Ministry of Women. Yes sending a delegation of officials to Peru to discuss such things with other delegations of officials seems nuts. However there are hundreds of equally worthy targets across the state sector 😅

Back to the cancer drugs. Yes of course, IMO, they could have been funded. However Cabinet thought otherwise.
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June 2, 2024 8:54am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Apologies that comment was a reply to Chuck Bird @ 0814
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:05am
  - jkt
    
    Black and white.
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:37am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  It’s lucky that the Ministry of Women’s Affairs don’t have to worry about greenhouse gas emissions. Because if their travel to Peru did pollute the atmosphere then of course they’d just Zoom in. Right? Right?
  
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  June 2, 2024 9:06am
  - goNZ1
    
    I didn’t realise it was only women that have affairs
    
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    June 2, 2024 10:51am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Been going on for years. Men don’t have affairs – we are always innocent.
      
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      June 2, 2024 11:48am
- rouppe
  
  I agree.
  
  Like the universities complaining that they have financing problems when they pay their vc’s $600k a year.
  
  https://newsroom.co.nz/2024/05/31/budget-shifts-universities-financial-burden-onto-students/
  
  What about me most was the statement:
  “the people making these decisions about fee increases didn’t even have to pay fees”
  
  I’m sick of hearing that. I went to Waikato in the 80’s. I definitely paid fees. Yes I got a universal student allowance but I still need a job to get through the year.
  
  The student loan scheme was brought in because the same set of people (student unionists) said the allowance wasn’t equitable because of the additional funding parents or working required.
  
  Well if the old system want equitable, and this system isn’t equitable, what do you want? Everything for free?
  
  Wake up. Nothing is free.
  
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  June 2, 2024 10:47am
  - Paulus
    
    Am pleased to see that Student first year free is cancelled and replace by free final year – makes more sense, as so many first year free never get to second year – too hard
    
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    June 2, 2024 1:29pm
- Ghost
  
  The relevant part of the article
  
  The one significant blemish that may dog the Government is its inexplicable failure to make good on its cancer drugs promise. It seems weird that you can trumpet a massive $17b increase in health spending across three Budgets and yet not dedicate any of it to meeting the most public health pledge of your recent election campaign. Worryingly, it suggests a lack of political savvy in a crucial area of Government policy.I’d bet this will be fixed in short order, as ministers have clearly missed the significance of this omission.More generally, they’d be wise to have a close look at both the size and effectiveness of the dual (and duelling) bureaucracies created by Shane Reti’s predecessor Andrew Little.
  
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  June 2, 2024 10:52am
  - jkt
    
    You think that this government may have realised that running a two tier public health system is not compatible with their fundamental principles.
    
    Luxon and National haste to wear the egg on their faces. It will help them strengthen their spines.
    
    Or does the age old WOKE principle “What does not kill you makes you Weaker!” rule ……
    
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    June 2, 2024 11:45am
Bridgenag

The Battle of Evermore
Observations from Globalism Central

“And that the weaponization of fear of infectious disease to control human behavior is ethically evil, and that those who deploy these unethical practices to advance their objectives of political power, profit and control should be shamed and condemned. The use of psychological bioterrorism is wrong, and it must stop.
”

https://open.substack.com/pub/rwmalonemd/p/the-battle-of-evermore?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
8 2
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June 2, 2024 8:56am
- peterwn
  
  Same could be said about climate change.
  
  6 2
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  June 2, 2024 9:04am
kiwikidsnz

Stats NZ investigating potential misuse of Māori census data

Tamihere behind this. No surprises there.

https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350293431/stats-nz-investigating-potential-misuse-maori-census-data/?utm_source=stuff_article&utm_medium=referral
19 1
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June 2, 2024 9:14am
- rouppe
  
  That is disgraceful behaviour.
  
  How many times is John Tamihere in particular allowed to get away with this sort of behaviour?
  
  15 0
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  June 2, 2024 10:38am
  - Colville
    
    Hopefully the whistle blower has some hard data to back up the claims.
    I have no doubt the claims are factual but can they be proven?
    
    6 0
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    June 2, 2024 11:12am
  - MikeMan
    
    No one has the balls to call him on it, he will keep doing it for as long as he gets away with it.
    
    5 0
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    June 2, 2024 11:48am
  - Keith White
    
    rouppe – Always – he has the the Race Ace card.
    
    4 1
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    June 2, 2024 11:49am
- Paulus
  
  Believe Stats Depar5tment should look closely at itself, as well as independently, as many stats on ethnicity are spurious for some years.
  Of course will not happen.
  
  4 0
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  June 2, 2024 1:32pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Up my suburban way, on-street parking is being removed for cycle lanes. With fewer parks available, the Council has instituted resident’s parking permits in neighbouring streets. These cost money, and incidentally are limited by number per house, regardless of the number of adults per house. That’s a separate post.

Cyclists pay rates, of course. That entitles them to use the public roads, same as any other ratepayer. But, what they’re getting is the exclusive use of a section of the road, for no additional payment. Car parkers, on the other hand, are having to pay for the right to occupy a section of the road (not that there’s a guarantee of actually finding a park). And, not to mention the reduction in lanes available to car drivers – it’s not just on-street car parks being removed

Neither do cyclists have to pay extra for the cost of installing the cycle lanes, which is horrendous.

All in all, it’s a massive transfer of cash and outcomes from car drivers to cyclists. Where is the equity, eh?
28 1
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June 2, 2024 9:28am
- kiwikidsnz
  
  Then there’s the mass devaluation of private property with the removal of adjacent street parking for owners & visitors.
  
  15 1
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  June 2, 2024 10:04am
- All_on_Red
  
  The lack of utilisation of that road space due to a low of cyclists skews the problem even more.
  
  4 0
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  June 2, 2024 1:33pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

If you’re thinking of replacing your bathroom, now is a good time to ask for a few quotes

http://www.1news.co.nz/2024/06/01/new-builds-canned-put-on-hold-amid-cost-of-living-crisis/
8 0
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June 2, 2024 9:34am
- rouppe
  
  That’s what I thought. Except…
  
  Had a kitchen crowd come do a design. Did some thinking, testing of ideas, and had one minor question. Emailed the question, not heard a thing.
  
  Had an electrician come to look at that that side of things. Took some measurements, went away, not heard a thing.
  
  Got other things happening now, preparing to retire. So I guess they miss out
  
  8 0
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  June 2, 2024 10:30am
  - Colville
    
    Tradies have gone thru boom times and forgotten how to price and how to look after a client. We had a guy price a fence, came in at three times the price of the other guy. He said he didn’t think the price mattered because the insurance company was paying. I asked him if he thought the insurance company was that stupid?
    
    9 0
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    June 2, 2024 11:36am
    - Paulus
      
      Some years back acquaintance had a recorder stolen so went to local well know shop to replace.
      Asked was it insured said yes with such and such insurance company.
      Was told that’s good because they are easy so you can get a better one.
      Gave him his card address and IT said
      >>>>Insurance, General Manager.
      OOOPS!
      
      2 0
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      June 2, 2024 1:42pm
kglm

Be careful what you wish for. The Democrats have lost their majority in the Senate – the day after the Trump verdict Sen. Jon Manchin left the Democratic party to become independent. Republican Senators have withdrawn their cooperation on the Biden administrations programme- no more appointment confirmations and appropriations except those concerned with national security. Trump is raising record amounts of campaign money. Post verdict polls show Trump’s popularity has increased.
12 3
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June 2, 2024 9:39am
- Mike
  
  Did you think the senate was operating in a cooperative manner before now?
  
  4 15
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  June 2, 2024 9:55am
  - jkt
    
    The fear of a nuclear war is escalating!
    
    Biden bided his time and waited until the Speaker of the House spoke before granting Ukraine the right to strike limited Russian territory with US provided munitions.
    
    Expect to see the Speaker on his bike soon as MAGA turns this into an attack opportunity.
    
    6 1
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    June 2, 2024 11:51am
- All_on_Red
  
  Manchin still caucuses with the Democrats though and Trump is standing up for Johnson.
  He told Taylor-Green to pull her cray cray head in…
  
  2 2
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  June 2, 2024 1:32pm
blue collar

Crusaders missed the playoffs .
Zero sympathy and feeling good they have fallen so dramatically .
Their era reminds me of Fitzpatricks Auckland one
Super fucking boring coz the same team always wins . One giant yawn fest .
Go the drua. Best fans and brand of rugby . Hope they win . Fiji would go nuts .
But yep , the politically correct sellouts the crusaders can suffer , you are the laughing stock of New Zealand rugby and about bloody time ……. Slow clap ….👏
4 8
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June 2, 2024 9:42am
- pdm
  
  Shame the Crusaders dipped out – was that really a Penalty Try at the end of the Brumbies game? I thought the ball equally came off a Brumby hand when it went dead..
  
  With Scott Barrett and David Havilly back plus the difference Taylor, Burke and Blackadder have made they may well have taken another title,
  
  2 6
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  June 2, 2024 10:03am
  - Mike
    
    Crusaders were the worst NZ team this year by a good margin. Quarterfinals from a 12-team competition is a joke. Straight semis much better.
    
    5 0
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    June 2, 2024 11:23am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  I wouldn’t go that far, Blue. But, it’s good that there’ll be a new champion this year. Whether it’s European football, Formula One or many other league sports, there’s been an alarming decline in the number of likely winners. A big chunk of the interest in sport is in the uncertainty of the outcome, which is why betting corruption is treated so seriously. It’s also why Bayer Leverkusen’s success in winning this year’s German league, thereby depriving Bayern Munich of their tenth title in succession, has been so widely celebrated.
  
  Here’s to the 115 financial doping charges against Manchester City being finally heard this year & if found proven lead to them being stripped of titles. With the unlimited funds of a country behind them, it’s only the loss of titles that would be felt.
  
  7 0
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  June 2, 2024 10:09am
  - Countrygirl
    
    Better watch motogp, there are at least half a dozen who could win at any point. Great racing and photography and you are on the edge of your seat throughout the race.
    
    7 0
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    June 2, 2024 11:15am
    - All_on_Red
      
      Am impressed the way Marc Marquez is doing so well on last years Ducati (although I think he has this years Front suspension)
      Its great racing.
      
      3 2
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      June 2, 2024 1:30pm
- MCōs
  
  Even down in Chch there was a better crowd yesterday when the Crusaders were struggling to stay relevant than they used to get for post season games in recent years when they were practically invincible
  
  4 1
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  June 2, 2024 10:13am
- julesnzuk
  
  I was a Crusaders fan but the re-branding and cancellation of their British heritage put me off. I agree – neo Marxist sellouts.
  
  0 0
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  June 3, 2024 12:18am
wsk12345

A friend had bowel cancer surgery this week. 70 and fit and healthy with no symptoms then one day some bleeding. Public list colonoscopy would have had her waiting months so had it done privately and bingo, cancer, stage 3. Surgery done (private) two days later. She was advised to pay and have that done too as the public system would have a long wait again.

Makes you wonder how many people die unnecessarily as most people, without insurance, can’t afford to pay for private.
21 2
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June 2, 2024 9:54am
- artemisia
  
  Most people? Sure there will be some. But many older folk do have options if they own their home or have family happy not to swap their loved one for a bigger inheritance.
  
  9 1
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  June 2, 2024 10:04am
  - wsk12345
    
    Yeah “most”. Most people do not have a few thousand in an emergency fund for if the car breaks down. Most people are not mortgage free.
    
    My husband had a cancer op last year too. We paid to go private, about $50 k all up in order to get it done quicker AND to get a minimally- invasive approach not available in public. We don’t have a mortgage so it was doable. Not so for most.
    
    12 1
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    June 2, 2024 10:10am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Not so sure about that, Artemisia. The older I get, the better I understand the Victorian novel & the recurring theme of impecunious relatives clustering around the wealthy widow’s deathbed.
    
    8 1
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    June 2, 2024 10:14am
- Ian Boag
  
  Or – mate of mine needs a hip – is bored with waiting – has opted to pay for it. He is in reasonable health but has a heart pacemaker. Because of that no surgeon will do the job except in a hospital that has an ICU. Private hospitals don’t have ICUs …..
  
  7 2
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  June 2, 2024 10:30am
  - Cassandra
    
    I’ve had several operations with a pacemaker in a private hospital, one was nearly 5 hours on the table. I’m not doubting your friend’s experience but it does seem to be an exception – bye and large our private hospital system works well at subsidising the public system. But it does cut both ways, probably 70:30.
    
    11 0
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    June 2, 2024 10:37am
    - Ian Boag
      
      Just out of curiosity – when was the last one?
      
      5 0
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      June 2, 2024 10:53am
  - greybeard
    
    Interesting ! I have had a pacemaker since 2019, and apart from my annual checkup at Wellington Hospital Cardio Unit not one of my subsequent health professionals has been interested in that fact.
    
    1 0
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    June 2, 2024 8:13pm
- Taieri
  
  Surgery done (private) two days later.
  ————
  
  So, it seems that the capacity is there if done privately. A question arises then, why similar capacity doesn’t exist in the public sector, despite gigantic amounts of money spent every year in that sector?
  
  6 2
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  June 2, 2024 10:34am
  - rjay
    
    Public hospitals deal with complications that private won’t so need to keep capacity underutilized.
    
    6 1
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    June 2, 2024 10:55am
  - wsk12345
    
    I don’t know. Apparently the private hospital was near empty. I queried that as I thought they did some public work in private hospitals as a win win – private hosp gets contribution to holding costs of otherwise empty beds and gov gets to push through a waiting list faster.
    
    9 0
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    June 2, 2024 10:58am
  - Ghost
    
    It would depend on cancelations I would guess. I know here the private hospital book their cases typically a month in advanced. People can get in sooner if there is a cancellation.
    
    Public have to keep theatres free for emergencies and deal with the elective surgeries. The key government pushed hip and knee replacements through the private hospital to get the list down. Same surgeons doing it privately as public. The public patients spend a night in private, then transferred to public for the remainder of their stay and therapy.
    
    4 0
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    June 2, 2024 1:17pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      The day after my Hip surgery (last year) I was tested by the Physio in the afternoon for my ability to use Crutches to go up and down stairs and 2 hours later I went home.
      Sure, I was sore but no need for me to stay any longer
      Amazing really.
      Knees are a bit more tricky.
      
      3 0
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      June 2, 2024 1:25pm
      - MCōs
        
        I had a hip replacement in Bangkok in 2002 when I was 54yo as a result of a congenital problem
        There was no way I could go anywhere for several day and it was six months before I got a good night’s sleep. I was at home feeling sorry for myself so after about three weeks I thought bugger it I might as well go back to work and earn some money while I was feeling sorry for myself
        More than twenty years later and the prosthetic is still doing the business!
        
        5 0
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        June 2, 2024 2:35pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Sorry for your bad experience.
        Perhaps you needed a better Surgeon
        
        0 0
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        June 2, 2024 10:44pm
      - Ghost
        
        Depends red. I have a relative who was on the waiting list for a hip replacement under labour. Didn’t meet the increased points. His surgeon and doctor were trying to get it approved. Hip completely collapsed, put him in a wheelchair. He was in for five days after the replacement. His first hip replacement he was out after 3 days
        
        0 0
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        June 2, 2024 11:16pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        I waited 18 months for mine- under Labour
        National, 3 months for the first time
        I only got it as they had just hired a new guy.
        An NZer returning from England
        My previous Surgeon transferred me to him and I had the op within a week- a lucky break
        Have to say he was better than the first guy
        Although I was out within two days then too.
        But have to say, having a hip collapse sounds pretty serious and painful
        Shocking they couldnt see him sooner
        Hope he is all good now
        
        1 0
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        June 2, 2024 11:45pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Under Labour they were just waiting for you to die. No more medical provision and het, no more super!
  I have mentioned this to my Doctor many times. If the Govt is waiting for me to die, they can tai-hoa for 20 years!
  
  5 1
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  June 2, 2024 11:59am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

From Facebook ‘Boaters for Trump’
Notice how we didn’t burn down any Cities last night because we didn’t like the outcome?
Instead we raised the man $52.9 million in 24 hours!
We are not the same.

If he had been found not guilty there would have been riots and looting!
13 5
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June 2, 2024 10:46am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  From the same Facebook poster.
  “I am 34 times more MAGA now than ever!”
  
  10 4
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  June 2, 2024 11:02am
- Inandout
  
  SO, Trump needs to be ultra carefull.
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ilQqyHkQp8
  
  3 3
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  June 2, 2024 12:23pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    He knows this. Tucker Carlson – “short of killing, Trump will win” or something.
    That is very true.
    In the motorcade which vehicle is The Don in?
    
    3 1
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    June 2, 2024 5:08pm
rjay

Te Maori Pati at it again
https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350293431/stats-nz-investigating-potential-misuse-maori-census-data
16 1
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June 2, 2024 10:54am
- nathie
  
  If this was National or ACT or NZF, the TV MSM would be leading with this on the news bulletins for days/weeks on end and demanding heads need to roll (ditto left wing blogs and left wing news sites).
  
  But no. It’s TPM so apart from The Post giving it critical coverage (alas with its limited readership in the wider scheme of things I mean) they will not suffer or lose support.
  
  17 0
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  June 2, 2024 11:11am
- softail 1450
  
  rjay, This country isn’t slowly declining into 3rd world status we’re already there ,there will be an investigation and no wrongs will be identified , everybody that reads that article already knows the outcome will be whitewashed, who can forget the $380,000 dollars that Tamihere stole and has never paid back as far as I know, our system is f- —d and is the reason so many good people are leaving including our family members.
  
  12 2
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  June 2, 2024 11:30am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Anyone with half a brain knows this photo was staged.
Confirmed by Judge Cannon.
Arrest Jack Smith!

https://x.com/SteveLovesAmmo/status/1788174926660186457?
8 3
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June 2, 2024 11:12am
- MCōs
  
  A selection of files have been taken out of the box and placed on the floor to be photographed
  Pretty obvious really
  
  Don’t you ever watch those border security programmes on TV?
  
  2 2
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  June 2, 2024 7:01pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    The legal question is; are those documents really ‘classified’, or did Trump’s decision as president to transfer them into his personal possession automatically declassify them? As president he had absolute discretion over what is and what isn’t classified.
    
    Only real question is whether putting them in his personal stash implicitly declassifies them, which seems the sensible interpretation (however inconvenient to TDS sufferers), as whether or not they were declassified was entirely at his discretion anyway.
    
    3 0
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    June 2, 2024 9:35pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    The classified documents were sent back to Trump, ie they didnt take them out before they sent them when they could have and should have
    The Special Counsel has admitted that THEY put the folders on marked Classified and that the documents within werent actually classified
    It was a set up
    
    1 0
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    June 2, 2024 10:31pm
softail 1450

Unbelievable, Judicial Watch have forced FOIA information that proves the transcripts released by the Biden Administration a few weeks ago about the Hurr interviews were doctored and inaccurate removing his babble , forgetfulness ,double speak and stuttering , this is an indication of how corruption ridden the Biden Administration has become , this lawbreaking is 10x worse than what Trump has been convicted of but nothing will happen to the offenders you can bet your house on it.
11 2
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June 2, 2024 11:12am
Its only I

So what’s Trump going to get as a punishment for defrauding the republican voter when sentenced in July?…stealing a nomination and ultimately the the presidency.

I know, how about driving a post into the ground in front of every building the rapist ever built, chaining the painted old coot to the post for twelve hours every site and letting every single contractor the wanker ripped off give him a kick in the nuts.

Should also allow the surviving families of those contractors who went bust and lost everything and committed suicide, shoot cannonballs made from Trump’s own frozen shit at the fraudster, rapist convict, traitor.
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June 2, 2024 11:49am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Trump’s punishment will be four more years as POTUS.
  Oh, btw, your severe TDS is showing out at the bottom of your petticoat.
  
  13 6
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  June 2, 2024 12:03pm
  - Its only I
    
    TDS- I wear the badge with pride!
    
    I cant live my life vicariously through trump like you or the other maga cultists do.
    
    2 12
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    June 2, 2024 2:50pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Gotta uptick that! Who counts badges? I do, but not by numbers.
      The Kiwiblog badge is nice for me and you buddy.
      
      2 2
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      June 2, 2024 5:11pm
- softail 1450
  
  It’s only I, FFS seek immediate help from a psychiatrist before you do something we’ll all regret ,my guess is your gonna be NZ’s first full postal assassin when 45 wins on 5th of November 🤡🤡🤡
  
  5 2
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  June 2, 2024 4:21pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yeah, but leave him alone while he has some fun, we all like fun
    
    3 1
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    June 2, 2024 5:13pm
Ghost

An interesting story. Have china found a cure for diabetes
2 1
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June 2, 2024 1:12pm
- Jack5
  
  I wonder if this is related to research in America, as reported by CNBC two years ago:
  
  https://youtu.be/E5bacxqobwY?si=788cG9vQaB4ooYWL
  
  2 0
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  June 2, 2024 4:38pm
  - Ghost
    
    It does sound connected to what the Chinese have done
    
    2 0
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    June 2, 2024 4:47pm
- NothingLeft
  
  also trials starting on regrowing teeth:
  https://newatlas.com/medical/tooth-regrowing-human-trial/
  
  1 0
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  June 2, 2024 5:59pm
kevn

For Maggie at their beach place…
https://www.stuff.co.nz/home-property/350292797/auckland-suburb-snapshot-diverse-affordable-and-convenient-mount-roskill
0 2
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June 2, 2024 4:11pm
Ghost

Sigh. Do people not understand what “while stock lasts” actually means.

A customer who had been saving up stickers in the hope of trading them for premium cookware as part of a supermarket giveaway was left empty-handed when the stores ran out of stock.

Article

No con job, no baiting, you just missed out
7 0
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June 2, 2024 4:48pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Getting ready for July 7th
  
  1 1
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  June 2, 2024 5:20pm
  - MCōs
    
    Ringo Starr’s birthday?
    84yo this year
    
    0 0
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    June 2, 2024 6:52pm
Ghost

Tucker Carlson: “I Feel Like We’re Being Pushed Into Civil War”

Hmmm, I used to think the same. But watching what is happening with illegals, the illegals being caught on or around military bases, I think something other than a civil war is being set up
1 1
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June 2, 2024 9:00pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Illegals who are planted for sure.
  
  0 0
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  June 3, 2024 8:22am

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