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November 20, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 20 November 2023

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General Debate

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goNZ1

O well,we head into a new week with Mr 6% stringing things out again. I reckon one of the sticking points will be NZF wanting an even bigger Provincial Pork Fund,which Seymour will not have a bar of. If Luxon dosent want to lose his authority he needs to tell the other two they have 24 hours to sort their shit out or he tells the GG we need another election.
Voters will then realise a vote for NZF means Labours back so hopefully turf out Peter’s.
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November 20, 2023 8:01am
- Taieri
  
  he tells the GG we need another election
  ————–
  
  Be careful what you wish for…
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:18am
- slightlyrighty
  
  I’m astounded at the sheer number of people, including the media types who are expressing impatience at the length of time it is taking to form a government, and who are pinning the blame on Luxon’s inexperience.
  
  As I see it, we have a senior co-alition partner that is simply not going to roll over and let the tail wag the dog, as has happened in previous negotiations.
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:04am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    That will be all forgotten before long, sounds like Peters wants to be attorney general, but they don’t want him dictate to judges and hiring his mates
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:28pm
    - peterwn
      
      As well as avoiding paying the $300k costs he owes the Solicitor General for those lawsuits.
      
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      November 20, 2023 1:19pm
  - Philview
    
    The credibility of the NZ media is severely damaged but the bias still grates me.
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:44pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  goNZ1: “O well,we head into a new week with Mr 6% stringing things out again. ”
  
  Any evidence that Peters is solely to blame for things not magically going National’s way instantly? 😝
  
  I do hope Seymour and Peters * * * ARE * * * sticking to their guns!!! Better than just going with National’s trust the (woke-infested) institutions approach!!
  
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  November 20, 2023 7:40pm
Captain Mainwaring

It seems that Mr.6% wants to have 100% of the say in what goes into the coalition agreement.
A pox on Winston and all the idiots how voted for the old prick.
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November 20, 2023 8:02am
- pdm
  
  Agree Capt.
  
  Has anyone told Peters he and his party are 3rd in the pecking order.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:09am
  - Vinicius
    
    This is why I never voted for MMP in the referendum in the 1990’s. Too much power to the minor parties.
    
    Also it probably comes down to how do they all agree to a coalition arrangement whereby no one appears to lose face on a key policy issue?
    
    Re Peters, he’s just being his old self, a political scrapper from way back.
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:19am
    - pdm
      
      Scrapper?
      
      More like opportunist – Winston first.
      
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      November 20, 2023 9:19am
  - cmm
    
    What does ne care? He has always known the power of king making.
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:32am
    - lifesgood
      
      I wish his partner would just tell him “For God’s sake, Winston, pull your head in” or maybe she has. 🙂
      
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      November 20, 2023 11:55am
      - cmm
        
        When he’s bringing in $300k + toys she doesn’t care what he does.
        
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        November 20, 2023 3:27pm
- Colville
  
  The people who voted for him see that as a feature rather than a bug.
  
  I voted for ACT for exactly that reason, Luxon is just to woke and wet to be steering the ship alone.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:09am
  - NothingLeft
    
    When it comes to good govt Peter’s is the disease not the cure.
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:39am
- Chuck Bird
  
  I might consider voting NZF with a new leader.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:20am
  - Simon
    
    Yep woke, dripping wet National need to be kept in check.
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:28am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      A pity Luxon and the drippy wet Nats haven’t grasped the reality that the IPCC have stated that none of the extreme scenarios pushed by the climate “emergency” grifters have any scientific certainty behind them. I guess when the climate “emergency” narrative turd-polishers realise the public are onto this they’ll throw the (alleged gold standard) IPCC under the bus as “deniers” or “corrupted” and simply move the goal posts again (as they do)!!!
      
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      November 20, 2023 7:47pm
  - cmm
    
    I doubt NZF would exist without WP.
    None of the others have the nose for opportunity that WP has. Nor do they have his drive.
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:31am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      I am impressed with Cassy Costello. She is doing well now as a new MP.
      
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      November 20, 2023 8:41am
      - OlderChas
        
        Is she related to Casey Costello? //
        
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        November 20, 2023 9:16am
      - Michael Sommerville
        
        I am surprised at your down tickers. Having read some of the articles about Casey Costello and read her articles when she was with Hobson’s Choice, I found her very balanced and sensible.
        
        I could easily support her and I think a lot on this page might change their minds if they knew more about her.
        
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        November 20, 2023 11:42am
      - Colville
        
        Older..?? are you related to the resident spelling Nazi …one David Garret??
        
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        November 20, 2023 11:49am
      - NK
        
        She’s not a MP yet. Even if she were, what has she done? There’s no parliament nor government yet!
        
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        November 20, 2023 12:05pm
      - Jack5
        
        A bit about Casey Castello, for anyone who, like me, hadn’t heard the name until today:
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northland-age/news/casey-costello-first-i-am-a-new-zealander/SLZ7KBXLV7TLPQPKRAJE4UK7PA/
        
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        November 20, 2023 1:15pm
      - cmm
        
        Costello might be very good, but she lack’s Winston’s ability to find a tiny coal and fan it to success.
        
        Winston Peters would not have got over 5% if he hadn’t found an issue: disaffected voters pissed off with the treatment of the unvaxxed.
        
        All Luxon or Seymour need to have done is just stand up in a small way for the unvaxxed, they would have got an extra 4% between them and with Winston under 5% they’d have got another 2 or 3% boost from that. Enough that they could have made a Nact coaltition.
        
        For example, they could have said that River of Filth comment was unacceptable as was Mallard’s use of sprinklers etc.
        
        Seymour says he contacted and spoke with some of the people, but that was not enough. He needed to have been vocal and visible.
        
        By keeping silent, Luxon and Seymour came across as tacitly approving of what their fellow Labour MPs said and did, leaving a gap for Winston.
        
        Sure, it is their right to not support people when they need it most. But then don’t expect those people’s support at the voting booth.
        
        Perhaps they will learn. I don’t expect they will.
        
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        November 20, 2023 3:42pm
  - Pavel
    
    If NZ first ever changed leaders I’d imagine Winston would form a new party and probably call it “Winston Peter’s progressive coalition”.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:07am
    - cmm
      
      The only way Winston is going to leave NZF is toes first in box.
      
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      November 20, 2023 3:43pm
- peterwn
  
  I anticipated that this is what would happen. Chris would have anticipated it too and will have weighed up the relative strengths and weaknesses. Some media person indicated that Winston could start looking at a Labour led coalition (which would have to include Greens and TPM). This would be despite Chris Hipkin’s claim that Labour would not do a deal with Winston (which can be taken with a pinch of salt) and the situation where Labour and TPM appear to be incapable of reaching any sort of agreement and the negative feelings between Winston and TPM. So the issue for Chris Luxon is how likely a left wing coalition is and what his negotiating stance would be in the light of this. Then if Winston is in a position to conduct an auction (as in 2017), at what point should Chris Luxon close the wallet?
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:28am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Hipkins tells lies and is not to be trusted.
    Look at his crap right through Covid!
    No doubt the Greens will be pushing for NZ1st to come on board.
    TMP will take anything they can get to push the TOW.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:16am
- Benedict Yu
  
  I have given up thinking we were rid of Winston. I confess that I had never imagined that he would return in 2023. I think he will keep going until he is infirm or dead. That could be a further decade.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:05am
  - Taieri
    
    I confess that I had never imagined that he would return in 2023
    ————–
    
    So, why he did return?
    Perhaps, because the people who voted for NZF had nowhere else to go?
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:20am
  - virtualmark
    
    After the nuclear apocalypse Winston will still be there, negotiating coalition deals with the cockroaches.
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:13pm
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      A wooden stake or a silver bullet should do it
      
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      November 20, 2023 6:18pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      He’s doing deals with (woke) cockroaches now! 🤣
      
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      November 20, 2023 7:51pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        PS. I was probably going a wee bit too far re cockroaches, even in jest.
        
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        November 20, 2023 11:05pm
- Raphael
  
  I personally can’t stand Winston (he is a lying liar who lies), and am continually astounded that people actually vote for the blighter.
  
  Still, at the same time, there is a fair number of National MPs who are sitting on the Left of Centre (and would have beenn at home in the Labour Party from about 7-8 years back) so if Winston has a moderating effect on them, I say more power to him.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:34am
mister nui

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
So, the shampoo salesman, despite all his bluster about being an expert at M&A, has shown his incompetence to be on par with Cindy’s.

We’re fucked.
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November 20, 2023 8:03am
- MCōs
  
  Mr Luxon, as I recall, said if needs be he’d pick the phone up and call Mr Peters, a guy he claimed he didn’t know
  Prior to that point NZF wasn’t on the radar according to the polls; suddenly their support surged at the expense of the cocky Mr Seymour & ACT.
  So here we are.
  Never mind Mr Luxon told us he was a skilled negotiator previously involved in a plethora of mergers & acquisitions or whatever and he’d sort things out by lunchtime
  Anyone who ‘knows’ Mr Peters would accept that the time taken to get an agreement signed is not unreasonable. Particularly when, by all accounts, two of the signatories detest each other.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:59am
  - H. Upmann
    
    Correct. Both National and ACT lost votes to Peters the moment Luxon made his “I’ll make the phone call” announcement. NZ1 went from 4+% to 8+% and much of that was the result of Luxon not having the courage to rule Peters out.
    The question that needs to be raised is, why, after 6 years of the most incompetent and corrupt government in NZ history, did National at a bare minimum, not get at least 40% in the election.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:34am
    - cmm
      
      “The question that needs to be raised is, why, after 6 years of the most incompetent and corrupt government in NZ history, did National at a bare minimum, not get at least 40% in the election.”
      
      Yup, that is the biggest question that people often skirt around.
      
      National’s results were extremely poor even without the “push” facto for Cindy being so terrible.
      
      If we ignore the 2020 elections which were completely screwed by Covid, then the last time National did this badly was 2002.
      
      The worst result in 21 years is nothing to crow about.
      
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      November 20, 2023 9:59am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Cmm
        Good point. It is the elephant in the room.
        National was presented with a loaded shotgun and a barrel full of fish and failed to pull the trigger.
        In fact there were times when they fed the fish and topped up the water.
        
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        November 20, 2023 11:00am
    - mawm
      
      H. Upmann – the majority of the commenters on this blog blame it all on Winston whereas they need to take a deep hard look at their party instead.
      
      As a life-long Tory voter I just could not bring myself to vote for a party that has positioned itself as a centre-left party and which has failed to address the horrific attack on our freedoms, those injured by an untested medication they were forced to take, and one that is rushing headlong into economic ruination on the road to net zero.
      
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      November 20, 2023 10:35am
      - Sparrow
        
        Coming from the opposite political belief as a life long labour supporter from yourself I however agree entirely with your blog. Long time old time Labour supporters had a dilemma at election time. There was no way we could bring ourselves to vote for the incompetents so where to go ? The Nats just the same as the incompetents. Maybe hold the nose and tick ACT f.. that Seymour turned out to be a little Hitler. Dont vote ? What a waste. Then wow out of the mist of time on a horse rides the Lone Ranger supported by Tonto Shayne how could you resist !!!!!
        Why not
        
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        November 20, 2023 11:31am
      - H. Upmann
        
        I fully understand your reasoning and agree with you on National’s collaboration over Covid. The last time I voted National, Muldoon was PM.
        ACT voter since their inception.
        However, Peters has a history of deception and if I was in the position of being a National voter but against their stance on Covid, I would have held my nose and still voted for them as I did with ACT. Obviously many didn’t do that.
        
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        November 20, 2023 11:41am
      - mawm
        
        H. Upmann – I held my nose and voted for the few good ACT policies. Pity Seymour behaved like an entitled prick. OTOH I really think that Winston could be the saving of this country if he can be held on a short leash. (That’s worth a dozen down ticks).
        
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        November 20, 2023 6:02pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Rubbish, Nats got more support by the election than leading up to it, o ly bloody act lost support to let Peters in, they went from 14% to about 8% game set and match
      
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      November 20, 2023 12:35pm
      - ISeeRed
        
        You just can’t admit National ever does anything wrong. It’s pathetic.
        
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        November 20, 2023 5:27pm
      - mawm
        
        ISR – he also cannot see that alone he has turned many away from National. I quietly suspect he’s a closet Labour voter.
        
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        November 20, 2023 6:03pm
    - hullkiwi
      
      National didn’t lose votes to NZF.
      
      Act did.
      
      However, people are forgetting NZF’s core vote has always been between 4%to 5%. Even in 2020 NZF’s vote did not fall between 5%. If WP didn’t exist, it would be a case of where that core vote goes.
      
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      November 20, 2023 7:43pm
- zulumonster
  
  Not sure how many M&A’s you’ve been involved in mister nui, but if they all happened quicker than this current negotiation I would be surprised.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:09am
- Grumpy Silver Haired Female
  
  A little premature methinks. Do you want an agreement full of holes or something workable and stable? And.. have you ever worked as a corporate CEO? Do you think they sit on their hands?
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:13am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Oh ffs, it appears he is saying no to Peters, what would you like him to do?
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:33pm
Ra Henare

Its interesting to try and take a balanced approach to controversial subjects on KB.

I am amused that many take to abuse and allegations of me being a ? Putin apologist, Māori lover, anti semite or whatever.

What it tells me is that the commenter has run out of arguments(if they had any)

Come on KBers, you are better than acting like juiced up teenagers.
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November 20, 2023 8:04am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Come on KBers, you are better than acting like juiced up teenagers
  
  Evidence for that proposition is lacking..
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:41am
  - Lee C
    
    Pot.Kettle.Black. Milky.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:22am
  - pdm
    
    Your presence does lower the tone Mikey.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:22am
    - Ian Boag
      
      Absolutely. This is a right wing blog seriously in favour of free speech and we don’t have to put up with shit from people who don’t agree with us …. 🙂
      
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      November 21, 2023 9:51am
- Benedict Yu
  
  What is a “balanced approach”? Your claim yesterday that the IDF was killing Israeli citizens was not rational.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:50am
  - Master Mariner
    
    What is a balanced approach ?
    My take is one without emotion.
    Emotion , fear and love have a detrimental effect on natural thought proccess.
    At work and on phone, However there is strong circumstantial evidence that a commander called in a strike on his position during the terrror attack whilst over run.
    There is also an Israeli General denying 40 babies with heads cut off etc.
    One thing for sure is that attrocities happened. To what extent is the question.
    I24 who broke the news has retracted her original statement. She had been in Israel for 8 months.
    I suggest watch her interviews after the initial announcement on youtube.
    Regardless, I take anyone how i find them regardless of race or religion. This is after working in the middle east numerous times etc.
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:31pm
  - Ra Henare
    
    BY.
    What was not rational??????
    It was reported in Israelis news that Israeli Civilian’s had been killed by Israeli forces.
    
    A balanced approach was what you used to apply in the days of Covid.
    
    Ie not to have emotional outbursts but to look at the available facts.
    
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    November 20, 2023 1:39pm
    - cmm
      
      ” It was reported in Israelis news that Israeli Civilian’s had been killed by Israeli forces.”
      
      This likely has occurred, though the numbers would be few.
      
      But killing people in error is not “targeting” them.
      
      There is a good reason people speak of the fog of war. It is extremely difficult to know what is going on much of the time and mistakes happen.
      
      Unlike in the world of video games there is no undo/respawn button.
      
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      November 20, 2023 3:52pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      I think you mean “rational” approach.
      
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      November 20, 2023 5:37pm
- Tom Hunter
  
  You’d probably be happier over to The Standard and The Daily Blog since they also have commentators claiming that Oct 7 was a false flag and/or IDF fakery.
  
  Admittedly as a Rightie you’d have to get in bed with Commies and other Far Lefters over there, but I’m sure the hot passion of Jew hatred will make it work for you.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:17am
  - Ra Henare
    
    Oh dear Tom, another lack of facts leads you to personal abuse and wild assumption.
    
    You seem to live in a fantasy world. I have NEVER claimed or suggested that Oct 7 was a false flag or IDF fakery.
    
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    November 20, 2023 1:41pm
- imalwaysright
  
  Ra
  There is a number on the site who see key words and are instantly triggered .
  The tick system is anonymous and those who do engage in personal criticism are usually emboldened by more than two down ticks.
  There are plenty of good contributors who can read nuance and context, they make it worthwhile
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:13am
Matt Long

In a terrible tragedy, two green activist who set out to prove loggers had evicted a poor helpless bear from its den found that a, the bear was still in residence, and b, the bear didn’t know how virtuous tree huggers are and attacked them.
https://www.insider.com/eco-activist-mauled-bear-poland-2023-11
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November 20, 2023 8:05am
- Colville
  
  When he gets out of hospital he should be arrested for annoying the poor animal! 🙂
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:12am
- Blog-aholic
  
  You get to do that once in your life…….
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:36am
- Pope Punctilious II
  
  That bear is obviously deeply reactionary. Or maybe it was this bear: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwghDRDzxfQ
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:38am
- Dave
  
  Perhaps they thought it was this bear:
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXvyyWBQjck
  
  An altogether superior bear, providing you don’t know how bears were trained to dance.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:58am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Two trips to Alaska and I was made very aware of the dangers, and what to do.
  Walking in the bush park at Seward with our host family and little one (then 5 months) and my partner spies a sign about black bears in the area.
  So I said “Jayson, what is the plan in the event of an incident?” He lifted up the cover underneath the stroller and there is a 9mm and a 45, locked and loaded.
  “Don’t worry” he said “I have everyone covered”
  A bit uneasy when we have never been in a place if danger. NZ only has sharks!
  Add, previously we had been for a meal at “Rays.” The guns would have been in the stroller there.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:34am
  - imalwaysright
    
    S.O
    Apparently a very tasty meat. Described on Rogan as a cross between beef and pork.
    Native Americans have great respect for bear and would give a full ceremony on the harvest of a bear. The first thing they would do is remove the bears eyes to spare its soul from seeing its own dismemberment.
    Every part of the bear was utilised.
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:20am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      The meal we had was beef T bone. So big it came on a separate plate.
      Bear I have not tasted, but moose backstraps eye fillet yes. Venison.
      The story about the Native Americans was the same as Native Alaskans. Guide on a river tour at Talkeetna told us. Water was rough – 3 rivers merge into one.
      
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      November 20, 2023 12:29pm
      - imalwaysright
        
        S.O
        Sounds like a great place.
        Moose sounds great, I think the NZ equivalent is wapiti.
        It must have been a great experience to get close to a place where food, risk, and survival are so interlinked.
        Check out the Hunza area of north Pakistan . They have a similar relationship with food and the human spirit. Living to over a hundred years is not unusual. In those environments humans are all valuable and so is everything else.
        People, in the so called civilised society, assume that they are safe. Wait ’til the power goes out.
        
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        November 20, 2023 1:21pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        @ I’m always.
        The Wapiti in NZ is actually Elk, not moose. We have adopted the American Indian name for elk.
        Moose is moose – they were liberated in NZ back in the early 20th. century – they appeared to thrive for a few years, but eventually disappeared. I think a few were shot by hunters, but they didn’t reproduce enough – not like deer & elk/wapiti – the largest in the deer family.
        
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        November 20, 2023 5:06pm
      - imalwaysright
        
        D.B
        Thanks
        
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        November 21, 2023 6:11am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        imalwaysright,
        We are very lucky to have two host families there. They tend to argue about whose place we are staying at.
        Started with food and diet. I kept on looking online for Asian food and this one name kept on coming up. Pattip, a Thai girl. Worked at a cooking school catering for tourists. Translation, photos emailed to clients. After about six years she met an Alaskan man and ended up moving to Alaska and marrying him. One day she said ‘Papa (yeah, she adopted me as a senior figure in her life, an orphan) you and partner better come and visit us. And so it all started. Friendship for 22 years now.
        Looking at going again soon.
        
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        November 21, 2023 8:02am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Darwin Award candidate
  
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  November 20, 2023 6:22pm
Kiwiguy

Someone posted last week that the Public Interest Journalism Fund has been extended by the outgoing government and payments are scheduled to continue through to 2026, I think they said.
Can someone please verify this for me, and point to a source?
Thanks in advance.
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November 20, 2023 8:07am
- Yabster
  
  Fairly sure the fund is closed but the “outputs” (whatever woke crap they are) continue to 2026.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:40am
  - Kiwiguy
    
    Yes, I heard this too, but I’m interested in having it verified, preferably with a link or something else that can verify this.
    If it’s true, then it will continue to help the media to work against National and could be quite destabilising – as we see them doing already.
    It’s a threat to basic democracy. If it’s true, it needs to be called out.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:02am
    - Ehlana
      
      https://mch.govt.nz/media-sector-support/journalism-fund
      
      5 2
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      November 20, 2023 12:09pm
      - sungsamning
        
        I hope National do a mini-budget, and remove all the funding.
        
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        November 20, 2023 2:19pm
      - Jake Dee
        
        Than you very much for that Ehlana.
        We now have to watch closely for the Journalism Fund coming back under another guise. Remember we are talking about a mutually reinforcing deal between journalists, politicians, lawyers, bureaucrats and public image consultants. All of the are very slippery fish indeed. Personally I suspect funding to be re-routed through various “philanthropic” foundations. It’s already happening with “The Misinformation Project”.
        Philanthropy;
        definition, verb, mechanism for converting money into political power.
        
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        November 20, 2023 4:20pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    Yab
    “Outputs ” is their term.
    You said it yourself ,
    we would probably call it “excreta”
    
    8 2
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    November 20, 2023 11:24am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Until early 2026.
  
  https://www.nzonair.govt.nz/funding/journalism-funding/#
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:50am
- cmm
  
  Surely this can be cancelled, just like any other spending.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:01am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    If not cancelled, why not?
    And don’t call me Shirley.
    
    9 2
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    November 20, 2023 12:30pm
    - imalwaysright
      
      “Shirley, you can’t be Sirius”
      Musk.
      
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      November 20, 2023 1:31pm
- NothingLeft
  
  That might currently be the case. But there is no limit on what laws a govt can pass in NZ except that it may not pass a law that can not be repealed later. The journalism propaganda fund can be cancelled by incoming govt if they want to.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:05am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

https://stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/why-english-must-officially-be-recognised-as-the-official-language-of-new-zealand/
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November 20, 2023 8:09am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  “Why no Government has acted on this is beyond me , it is so obvious a so self-evident.”
  Simple answer, votes.
  At the end of the day, NZ Tourism will suffer. A Dutch, German, Asian with little English will see NZ once and never come back because of the confusion.
  The idea of University Courses recognising the TOW is downright ridiculous.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:20am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Making English formally an official language would be empty virtue signaling.
    
    5 30
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    November 20, 2023 8:43am
    - Nigel Kearney
      
      Agree. We should be like the US and not have an official language. Just use whatever language is most effective for communication depending on the circumstances.
      
      14 6
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      November 20, 2023 8:50am
      - cmm
        
        Have a look at California for that in action.
        Supporting Spanish speakers that have no intention of learning English is a massive problem.
        
        17 2
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        November 20, 2023 9:00am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        So why are Maori pushing their language for all it’s worth?
        A Coup, that’s why.
        
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        November 21, 2023 8:04am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Not at all…
      
      I’ve even heard that some of our diplomatic missives contain entire sentences in Te Reo, a language that has fewer than 50,000 proficient readers worldwide.
      
      32 2
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      November 20, 2023 8:53am
    - cmm
      
      No, it would stem the tide.
      
      17 3
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      November 20, 2023 8:58am
- ISeeRed
  
  After that, no more translating anything official or government-related into any other language. You come here, you must understand English or be committed to learning it. I’ve worked with foreigners whose English is as broken and accents just as thick as five years ago. No attempt to improve as they already live in “communities” or colonies where they can function in their native languages.
  
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  November 20, 2023 5:38pm
artemisia

The incoming government has one advantage. The cupboard is bare. No money for nice to haves.
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November 20, 2023 8:11am
- MCōs
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Plenty of money for flash hotels to conduct negotiations in Auckland when there are government departments with conferences rooms they can use for free.
  Better still they could bugger off down to Wellington where the soon to be fired public servants could run around after them making coffee and correcting spelling mistakes
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:43am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Hacking and wire tapping would be the reason for the movements.
    The media we have are a nasty bunch of bastards.
    
    21 3
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    November 20, 2023 9:55am
    - kowtow
      
      Not to mention “public servants” in Wellington doing everything they could to stick a peasant’s clog in the machinery .
      
      Gone by lunchtime and all that ……
      
      20 3
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      November 20, 2023 10:10am
    - MCōs
      
      If that were the case they’re in for a rough three/six/nine years
      
      5 13
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      November 20, 2023 10:13am
  - Local Miller
    
    The negotiations are taking place at the expense of the political parties, not at the expense of the government. At the moment National don’t have access to any government funds beyond their salaries.
    
    14 2
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    November 20, 2023 11:01am
    - imalwaysright
      
      Local
      
      Seymour was asked who was paying and he said that since they are elected and are conducting activities related to government that parliamentary services are paying the bills.
      
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      November 20, 2023 11:30am
- rouppe
  
  Since when has a bare cupboard mattered?
  
  Just ask Tory Whanau in Wellington or Anne Tolley in Tauranga.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:46am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Rou
    
    Yes, sell the airport and build a bike lane.
    
    I can imagine Genter pedalling her arse off to get the Raleigh A380 off the ground.
    
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    November 20, 2023 1:39pm
Paulus

How we cheered when we saw the election results whereby the taste of Ardern still lingered but she has gone.
Now we have another carbuncle playing silly buggers, and doing well to destroy the Country again through his meanness and arrogance.
Sadly he thinks he is clever as nobody else is and jokes about his place in our society playing games with the media as well as National whom he still totally dislikes.
His epitaph will not make pleasant reading.
On his grave I will pour whisky but will pass it through my kidney’s first.
What an unmitigated arsehole Winston Peters is who only thinks of himself, and not what he can do for his Country – so hasn’t changed over the years.
I am sad for the mainly old people who voted for him – they are just as bad as he is.
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November 20, 2023 8:11am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Since Luxon came onto the scene I have not had a lot of time for him. Good manager, but not a leader.
  What is happening now I basically support. Let’s get is right – on paper, and signed by all.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:58am
- I remember when
  
  Does a longer length of time taken to by the parties mean:
  * Winston is not controlling the outcome.
  * The longer it takes the less influence he is able to exert.
  * The longer it takes the greater the disatisfaction with Winston.
  * Three-way negotiations mean all parties have to accept adjustments in their demands.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:46am
- wsk12345
  
  I actually didn’t vote for him but I am absolutely rooting for him to get much of what he campaigned on. If he gets 60% of it I would say most of those that voted for him will be overjoyed. I will also be very pleased.
  
  National has campaigned on doing sweet FA to stop the demise of our country- why would anyone want it to get what it campaigned on?
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:01pm
G152

Evidently an ex prime minister has hidden depths bought to light.
Didnt hear a dicky bird from him when the terrorists invaded Israel and murdered innocents.
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November 20, 2023 8:14am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Why would you post such an obvious lie?
  
  “New Zealand condemns unequivocally the terror attacks led by Hamas on Israel. We are appalled by the targeting of civilians, and the taking of hostages which violate fundamental international humanitarian law principles,” Chris Hipkins said.
  
  https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/statement-escalation-violence-israel-and-gaza
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:46am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Traffic jams in Newmarket. Westfield – no comment. Business Association – take public transport. So two kids and you want to buy two bikes. Take the bikes on the bus? The man is stupid. Westfield? Well the carpark would not have been the problem, getting out was.
I know! Build better, wider, and more roads! How come nobody has thought of this?
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November 20, 2023 8:14am
- alex Masterley
  
  Westfields car parking system is a shambles at the best of times.
  Getting in and out at peak is very difficult. Traffic planning in the area is very poor.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:21am
- Simon
  
  Called this years ago. 1970s motorway / roading next to Newmarket shopping mall. The motorway system needed to be rebuild.
  
  Auckland Transport basically hate people who use cars. This is NZ. Govt departments who run along DEI / ESG lines dont serve the people.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:26am
- Ehlana
  
  Auckland Transport should be aware of snarl-ups like this and take responsibility for getting the message out (via radio and text) to tell people to avoid the area until further notice.
  
  The mall solutions were fairly simple – tell people still in the mall about it and that they need to make alternate arrangements to get home. Start at the back of the carpark queues, tell people what was happening, and re-park them. Get contact details so you can let people know when they can get their cars out. Since you know when every car entered, allow 24 hours from entry time to remove the car without any further parking charges.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:33am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    You work for Auckland Transport, and are trying to create more jobs right?//
    
    7 1
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    November 20, 2023 10:02am
    - Ehlana
      
      No. I’ve been caught in traffic jams so bad I was travelling at less than 1km/hr. These things usually only affect a small part of the city; given that they happen, and that I think AT do know (or should) when it is happening, I’d just like them to do the sensible thing and get a message out to people saying “really bad problem here, please avoid it if you can”.
      
      My suggestions for the mall response are just common sense – get people out of the queue, let them go home by other means and then collect their cars later.
      
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      November 20, 2023 12:36pm
- cmm
  
  Why would anyone want to go to Newmarket unless you lived within walking distance?
  
  Just like CBDs, large inner-city malls etc are dying.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:36am
  - MCōs
    
    I went to the Westfield Mall in Newmarket a couple of weeks ago and the one in Manukau on Saturday
    Neither looked to me like they were dying
    BTW
    I had no trouble getting out of either car park and they were both full.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:12am
    - plc
      
      Cool story bro!
      
      12 0
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      November 20, 2023 9:38am
      - MCōs
        
        Thank you
        
        6 1
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        November 20, 2023 10:17am
  - Local Miller
    
    cmm: Why would anyone want to go to Newmarket unless you lived within walking distance?
    
    It’s the only mall in Auckland with a Lego outlet. 🙂
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:09am
Pope Punctilious II

Glad tidings! University of Waikato library is now an “anti-racist” space. Like most other NZ uni’s, Waikato has recently implemented a range of austerity measures, apparently because of reduced student enrolments. But surprisingly, Waikato does have sufficient resources for the university library to hire not one, not two, but six new staff whose job it is to ensure the library is an “anti-racist environment”.
https://www.pressreader.com/new-zealand/library-life/20231001/281891597927384
This is one of the fruits of a recent report that deemed the university “systemically racist”, simply because it’s a western institution created by white people. Oh, and the a article also reports that ALL university library staff must include at least one “anti-racist” goal in their annual development plan.
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November 20, 2023 8:16am
- cmm
  
  I couldn’t find “anti-racism” in the Dewey catalogue.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:14am
  - Colinxy
    
    Look under “racism” as “anti-racism” is the same thing under Critical Theory.
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:16am
    - Jack5
      
      Universities are a concept of Western civilisation, and were created in Medieval Europe by Roman Catholic monks.
      
      If you look at the Wikipedia article on “university” you will see that, beginning in the 12th century, the notion of academic freedom was part of the concept.
      
      The University of Otago requires all research to be vetted by a Maori committee, which does not meet this principle.
      
      In NZ, the State set up and funds wananga, which are Maori tertiary institutions meant to be parallel to our universities. Yet Maori have taken over much of our traditional universities.
      
      As with State broadcasting, it’s been a case of “what’s mine is mine, and what’s yours is half-mine”.
      
      Meanwhile, the Woke have pretty much “stuffed” NZ universities, and Hipkins has done the same to our polytechnics.
      
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      November 20, 2023 1:38pm
      - Colinxy
        
        Critical Theory’s origins have nothing to do with universities as they were invented by the Frankfurt school, especially by Max Horkheimer. In other words, it is Neo Marxist is origin.
        
        Critical Theory was built from Italian Cultural Marxist Antonio Gramsci whose works were translated into English by Joseph Buttigieg (that’s Pete Buttigieg’s father BTW). Gramsci also wrote that Marxism is the religion to replace Christianity…just as in interesting side note in case there are still people unaware that Marxism is a religion.
        
        However, Critical Theory and all of its sub-disciplines have long since infiltrated universities. Some blatantly like Derrick Bell and others through administration and hiring practices.
        
        In my mind, the only real way to get rid of Marxism in our education system (be it tertiary or otherwise) is to correctly classify Marxism as a religion. That way it can be dumped into religious studies where it belongs.
        
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        November 20, 2023 5:48pm
    - Jake Dee
      
      Good point, how do you classify “anti-racism’ in the Dewey decimal system? Is it “racism” + 0.0001 or is it “Marxism” +0.ooo1?
      
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      November 20, 2023 4:32pm
- NothingLeft
  
  “anti-racist environment”
  
  In modern academic practice that actually means an explicitly hostile racist environment as batshit-crazy-land-woke means that everything is looked at through lens of race and lower ranked races (in victimology olympic standings) like whitey will be denigrated and attacked, while higher ranked races are celebrated.
  
  Dismantle this bullshit.
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:03pm
Simon

All these “right wing commentators” who dont say anything right wing. Worked for National in Wellington doesnt make you right wing.
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November 20, 2023 8:17am
kowtow

In today’s Whoreald there’s a comment piece by one Sasha Borissenko on humanitarian law and the Hamas terror outrages .
In it she uses a sentence including ‘ to tow the international party line’ .

This from a journalist ?
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November 20, 2023 8:18am
- cmm
  
  There seems to be some confusion over toe/tow a line. Some people think it means not putting your toes over a line on the ground. Some people think it means towing another ship with a line (aka rope).
  
  In this modern age where 2+2=5 is an opinion and all opinions are equally valid, toe/tow is about the teeniest thing to be picky about.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:46am
  - suzieq
    
    Tow is simply wrong. Look at the saying’s provenance.
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:11am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Perhaps she’s homophonic.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:58am
  - greybeard
    
    Sounds like it.
    
    5 0
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    November 20, 2023 7:47pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Well dun.
      
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      November 20, 2023 7:52pm
Matt Long

This Islamophobia is getting so terribly bad in America that Moslems are having to make up attacks, á la Jussie Smollett.
It must be really frightening taking part in anti Israel demonstrations with millions of leftists.
https://www.foxnews.com/us/ohio-man-allegedly-fakes-hate-crime-claims-he-was-hit-by-car-by-person-who-yelled-kill-all-palestinians
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November 20, 2023 8:20am
- Tarquin North
  
  Round here they call that ” doing a Marama Davidson “.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:24am
- Local Miller
  
  Taking lessons from Jussie Smollett?
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:15am
nathie

Hosking moans that Luxon didn’t appear on his show this morning.

Well from what I’ve seen on the news Luxon looks quite tired – he seems to have been mostly working non-stop for the last 2-3 weeks including weekends.

(Couldn’t imagine the likes of Labour or Ardern or Chippie doing the same)!
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November 20, 2023 8:24am
- MCōs
  
  Luxon would probably be worried he’d start negotiating with Hosking to form a government
  
  (Ardern refused to appear on his show)
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:18am
- igm
  
  Labour leeches have never worked. All living lives of Riley off taxpayers, ratepayers or misled unionists.
  Show one who has been a success in commerce or any related field?
  Like the Green leader, many have made claims, these having been shown to be lies.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:19am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  He is tired. Crow’s feet at the edges of his eyes that I had not seen before.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:11am
  - goNZ1
    
    He is probably longing for his old job at AirNZ where he could bark orders and push buttons and stuff would happen in no time. Whereas now he is dealing with a whole raft of poncey clusters off on their own hobby horses plus rude journalists asking inconvenient questions!
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:39pm
- Local Miller
  
  Since Luxon isn’t PM, I can’t see that he has any reason to be on Hosking’s show.
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:17am
  - MCōs
    
    #1 Leader of the National Party
    
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    November 20, 2023 3:15pm
Vinicius

The Controller and Auditor-General (CAG) has released a report on performance measures and reporting in the public sector entitled “Do your performance measures measure up?”.

The CAG found three weaknesses that need urgent attention:

1. Measures that are not meaningful or comprehensive.
2. Gaps in measuring what difference is being made.
3. Poor measures for assessing the stewardship, oversight, and monitoring functions of departments.

The report gives numerous examples from government departments where there are issues.

– The Ministry of Education doesn’t provide a meaningful assessment of how well the Ministry is providing effective oversight of the education system.

– MSD do not provide a meaningful assessment of how well the Ministry is providing effective oversight of the system. The Ministry provides a substantial amount of useful information on its website and in publications. We think there are opportunities to incorporate these activities more formally into the performance framework.

– The Ministry of Transport does not provide an assessment of how well the Ministry is addressing major funding and financing risks faced by the sector now and into the future, such as with the National Land Transport Programme.

Hopefully based on what National and ACT said during the election campaign they will take this seriously. The report is here:

https://oag.parliament.nz/2023/performance-measures
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November 20, 2023 8:35am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Is the auditor-general still banging on about this?
  Earlier this year he had this to say to the finance and expenditure committee:
  
  I worry that any changes to performance reporting will be potentially marginal or temporary without legislative support for change…We’ve been at it for thirty years and I think it is time for a step change.
  
  at it for thirty years
  One might be excused for thinking that if the present model for public sector performance couldn’t be made effective in 30 years, then it might be time to reconsider the model.
  I expect the latest guidance on performance measures will have about the same impact as the guidance issued in 2011, 2015, or 2018.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:00am
  - Vinicius
    
    So you’re quite happy to continue to accept mediocrity from the public sector? Of course Labour for 6 years set a new low for poor performance. Thanks to Ardern, Hipkins and friends.
    
    It is only tax payers money that is being wasted here.
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:01am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      I merely note that if the public sector has spent 30 years trying, and failing, to improve performance reporting then it might be time to revisit the assumptions on which that reporting is based.
      
      6 5
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      November 20, 2023 12:12pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        This is a complex area and I can’t do it justice without writing an essay. There is something in what Mike is saying – this has been 30 years of effort with not much to show. However, the last Government just stopped pretending that they cared about performance.
        
        If you implement policies that are stupid, there is not much point investing in performance measures because, well you will get stupid results. For example, the EV subsidy was idiotic, as The Treasury pointed out. If you measure its performance it will just show that it is idiotic.
        
        So what do do?
        
        Three things
        
        1. Introduce performance metrics for critical areas – hospitals, health care, crime etc. There might be 12 of those.
        
        2. Abolish programs, policies and regulations that are stupid and failing – the Treasury will have a list.
        
        3. Introduce new programs based on evidence that they will work, and establish the right performance measures for those.
        
        … I am sceptical of a “performance unit” in the Public Service Commission designing performance measurement systems for every programme. It just collapses under its own weight and becomes a box ticking exercise for officials responsible for programmes.
        
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        November 20, 2023 12:40pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  So late in the day to report on these issues.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:00am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Yes, thirty years is a long time.
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:06am
- Tom Hunter
  
  Meh. Could be worse. Back in 1990 the US Congress passed a law inside the National Defense Authorization Act demanding that the Pentagon, for the first time in its history, conduct annual audits of iteself.
  
  They finally started doing that in 2018!
  
  They’ve failed it six times now and when the Pentagon Comptroller was asked in 2021 about his predecessor’s claim that it would be working by 2027, said that he wasn’t sure if that was possible. 🙂 🙂
  
  Still, even the failures have produced some good effects. The US Navy found a billion dollars worth of stuff it didn’t know it had and $28 million worth of F-18 spare parts.
  
  The final scene of Raiders of The Lost Ark springs to mind. 🙂
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:26am
- Master Mariner
  
  Thanks, In my mind it is interesting that a lot of reports are now coming out, Where was the reporting prior ?
  Regardless,
  “We have found through our work that it has long been unclear to the public and Parliament what outcomes are being achieved with public spending – about $160 billion in 2022/23. To maintain trust and confidence in government, we all need to understand what value we are getting from our taxes, and what difference it is making to our lives.”
  
  Yep, Bloody amazing how $160 Billion can miraculously dissapear ?
  
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  November 20, 2023 1:28pm
Maggie Pie

We went up to Tindalls yesterday with the new Outdoor-Kitchen. Looks fab out on the deck. Eventhough our last barbie was sposed to be stainless-steel it rusted out over 2 years. Chinese I think. This new one is made in OZ and comes with a 5 year guarantee.
My partner went into his office really this morning for a meeting. He just txt to say rumor down the Viaduct is we’ll have a government later today.
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November 20, 2023 8:40am
- Flossie
  
  Sure hope the rumour is true!
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:15am
- MCōs
  
  “Chinese I think.”
  What you really mean is you bought something dirt cheap at the Warehouse left over from the USSR
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:30am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Troo dat Cossie 😀
    Although we made up for it this time…. $16k !!
    
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    November 20, 2023 9:38am
    - MCōs
      
      Last barbecue we had never got used so we left it out on the footpath about 2yrs ago and it was gone in half an hour
      Some lady in a tennis frock squashed it into a Porche
      
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      November 20, 2023 10:25am
      - Maggie Pie
        
        😎
        
        I have actually been known to cruise the streets on the Council Organic-Collection days. But only in the local hood.
        Scored a fab Nutrablast Blender once…still goes like a charm.
        
        12 2
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        November 20, 2023 11:41am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Certain suburbs in Melbourne, Asian Uni students throw out pretty much brand new items to the kerbside when their time has come to go back home. Often worth 100s of dollars.
        
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        November 20, 2023 8:01pm
      - Manu-Rau
        
        One of your finest, Cossie. Well done!
        
        0 0
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        November 21, 2023 6:21am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  American “Buffalo” is the brand we have. 304 grade with 316 (marine) plate and grills. No rust after 8 years. A few stains but nothing rusting out. Hauland, Albany. $2900 BBQ only. Rotisery extra. Then I also have a ‘Smokai” smoker fitted to the side. Hot or cold smoke.
  Covers get ruined by the UV so I had one hade the same as the spa. Vinyl ripstop, used for trailer covers.9
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:23am
- mogg
  
  The best fish is straight out of the ocean and onto the barbecue, who does the gutting and de-scaling while you are filing your nails?
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:41am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Don’t bother gutting or de-scaling. That is old school. Slice the fillet off, turn over and slice the skin off. Bit of salt and cook it.
    Too many people spoil fish with herbs, spices and whatever. The idea is to taste the fish.
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:39pm
- virtualmark
  
  Maggie,
  
  If you’re near the sea you need 316 grade stainless steel. It has molybdenum added into it, to protect against chloride pitting.
  
  The most common grade of stainless steel is named 304, and while it’s impervious to most liquids it doesn’t like salt. 316 is 304 with the addition of molybdenum.
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:19pm
  - virtualmark
    
    To be more accurate … common grades of stainless steel don’t like chlorine. So they don’t like salt. But they also have a hard time with things like bleach.
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:38pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    For me Hellyer’s creek is about 600 meters away.
    BBQ is out on a large deck with SE wind protection. Maybe it is not 304 but that’s what the manual says.
    304 we used for boat trailer roller pins. Free machining whereas 316 does not like 3.5mm drills!
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:50pm
    - virtualmark
      
      Yes, the molybdenum makes 316 a little harder to work with.
      
      Steve, in a previous life, many years ago, I was a registered/chartered engineer specialising in exotic metals … stainless steels, nickel alloys, titanium etc etc.
      
      For those who’ve been here a while, for some of that time I worked with Penny Bright (RIP). She was fantastic at her job. A bit looney, but great to work with, and not afraid of anything. I know her political beliefs jarred with many here, but I had/have massive respect for Penny.
      
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      November 20, 2023 1:06pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Penny was a fun person.
        I have been on KB for about 12 years? 15? Dunno.
        
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        November 21, 2023 8:10am
  - MCōs
    
    Years ago a steel fabricator I knew made some barbecues when real work was a bit hard to come by.
    They consisted of a plate and grill over a semi circular fire box with a chimney to take away the smoke. Everything made of steel; none of your namby pamby stainless steel.
    A fire would be lit up and once it died down the cooking began. The trick was never to clean it and the next fire sterilized the contraption. The fat protected the steel from rusting
    I also had an old caste iron bath which we filled with water and heated up by way of a fire. That was the spa bath!
    
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    November 20, 2023 3:48pm
Kiwiguy

Can NZ just get over the whole “The incoming govt negotiations are taking too long” thing?
It’s not too long. It’s fine.
Far better to have a quality coalition agreement that they’ve taken time to negotiate, than a hastily-put-together one that turns out to be rubbish.
This also is a positive reflection on Luxon’s negotiation skills & experience – he’s not lying down and letting the minor parties just walk all over him. He’s taking time to work through the issues with them instead. This is good.
Marry in haste – repent at leisure.
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November 20, 2023 8:41am
- Ehlana
  
  We want MMP you understand, but with FPP speed of government formation.
  
  Actually, what we really want is some alternative activities for our political commentators. Perhaps now would be a good time for classes in media ethics and a refresher course in English?
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:47am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  For the three of them to get around a table for the first time a whole month after the election is not good enough. And I think if it was the other side doing that, this blog and its comments would be much more critical.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:57am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “And I think if it was the other side doing that, this blog and its comments would be much more critical.”
    
    Not me. I think you are overstating the extent of partisan allegiances by regular commenters here. I expect that I will be frequently critical of the actions of the incoming government.
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:13am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Critical until Luxon realises that he is in charge and he can harden up.
      
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      November 20, 2023 10:30am
  - gravedodger
    
    Three weeks of that “Month” Nigel was waiting for the shiny arsed Crats to come up with definitive numbers for the Leaders to work with.
    Cut them some slack huh.
    Cripes it has taken six months for Spain to reach a coalition and a few years ago Belgium had no decision for almost a year. These three have so far had just over two weeks and impatience is substituting for analysis for the children who sincerely believe they are “Journalists”??
    
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    November 20, 2023 5:53pm
- Taieri
  
  This also is a positive reflection on Luxon’s negotiation skills & experience – he’s not lying down and letting the minor parties just walk all over him
  ———-
  
  Nothing positive about it.
  The deal between National and ACT should have been tentatively concluded before the election as they are natural partners. If that was done the negotiations with NZF would have been conducted from much stronger position.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:28am
- NZer In Exile
  
  Pretty sure Luxon is acutely aware of the “disunity is death” reality and he seems pretty good at managing teams, so yeah, good things take time!
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:06pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

“In a bold move for transparency and accountability, Speaker Mike Johnson has made good on his commitment to the American people by releasing all video footage from the events of January 6th.” Video.

The kangaroo court committee will not be happy, especially RINO Cheney.

https://www.thepoliticalglobe.com/speaker-mike-johnson-fulfills-transparency-promise-unveils-january-6th-footage/?
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November 20, 2023 8:43am
oldpark

So funny if it was not so serious .Yes some Mothers’do have them .The joke that keeps giving.
Here we have a wee guy who was allocated by his then running mate PM Ardern to take her job as she could not handle the heat in the kitchen .
After a failed attempt to be all things to all people in NZ, Hipkins running a Country it was discovered he could not literally run a bath .
On the 14th October 2023 NZs voted his lot out .
Yet he has the gall and the cheek to say Negotiations for his replacement Government is taking too long.
His lot fresh from Six years acting as control freaks of NZs took Six years accomplishing sweet ****all in that time except divide the Nation and virtually bankrupt it as well . Go figure.
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November 20, 2023 8:47am
kowtow

What a surprise , not.

‘Fortified terror tunnel exposed underneath Gaza’s Al Shifa hospital complex
IDF says tunnel, outfitted with blast-proof door and firing hole, found alongside booby-trapped vehicle loaded with weapons’

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/hywtiapep#autoplay
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November 20, 2023 8:49am
- Burtland
  
  the western media may need to swallow some dead rats
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:36am
  - kowtow
    
    Not to mention the array of doctors , ngo types they’ve trotted out for us telling us “it just ain’t true”.
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:16am
Chuck Bird

Djokovic beat Sinner in straight sets.
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November 20, 2023 8:52am
- Maggie Pie
  
  We’re all capable of doing that Chuck.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:59am
Maggie Pie

You’ll recall last week I asked… “what’s happening with Karel Sroubek?”
The violent Czech drug smuggler awaiting deportation following his prison sentence.

Looks like I’m not the only one concerned….
although the MSM aren’t.
Hmmm…

https://twitter.com/SimonRAnderson1/status/1725391093364359210

(I found a few of the comments interesting)
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November 20, 2023 9:10am
- imalwaysright
  
  Maybe he also got a job at Harvard.
  They’ll employ anyone there.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:41am
- RoboRob
  
  I would love to know what is going on with Kim DotCom too. Regardless of whether one thinks these guys should or should not be deported, they have been flagged for deportation so why isn’t this happening?
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:04am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    There is a big difference between them Robbie.
    KDC has never ever harmed anyone and he’s invested millions in our economy.
    
    We really miss the soirees out at his Coatesville mansion.
    And one thing you can say about Kimmie…he really knows how to party 😎
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:54am
    - RoboRob
      
      Actually ‘magz’, you will note I said ‘Regardless of whether one thinks these guys should or should not be deported’
      
      The courts decided both should be deported. Why have they not?
      
      p.s. Kim hurt John banks big time. He tried to destroy John Key and the National party. He has NOT invested millions into our economy. At best he ‘wasted’ millions trying to rig an election. Remember to ‘big announcement’ that would destroy the National party?
      
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      November 20, 2023 1:48pm
Burtland

Seems like barn farming of kids has been rejected at the coal face
– another MoE fxxkup
Most schools rebuilt after the quakes in Christchurch are to these designs

https://www.thepress.co.nz/nz-news/350112302/15m-school-reverse-open-learning
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November 20, 2023 9:26am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Open plan learning is and always has been an oxymoron promoted by the morons at the MOE and NZCER.
  It is like the concept of learning through play….no one seems to be able to answer the question though, how does a child learn to tread and write through playing?
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:49am
  - RoboRob
    
    There are plenty of games you can play with young people (toddlers) that involve character and word recognition. Lots of activties / games help develop the fine motor skills required for writing. All these things can and are done at (decent) ECE centers. Decent parents also do this with their kids. So yes you can learn the basics of reading and writing through play.
    
    Open plan learning (modern learning environment) however is a different and crazy concept. The idea that throwing 90 odd 5,6,7 yr olds in a barn sized room with bean bags, 10 desks and three roaming teachers would improve learning outcomes is just bat shit crazy. The MOE and Unions should be ashamed.
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:48am
- RoboRob
  
  Anyone with a brain knew these ‘moden learning environments’ were moronic but somehow the fools at the MOE thought it was a good idea and the unions liked it becuase you had multiple teachers per student (i.e. impossible to gauge teacher competence).
  
  Hekia Parata fell for it too. Bunch of idiots.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:07am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    ” impossible to gauge teacher competence”
    Maybe that is the reason?
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:50am
  - Local Miller
    
    “you had multiple teachers per student”
    
    Well actually you don’t, you have multiple teachers in the space, but the Teacher/Pupil ratio would be the same, if not worse than current ratios. Part of the idea of open learning spaces like this was to promote “self directed learning”, but this only works in small groups with high teacher/pupil ratios, like 1:10 or better. We were able to do this as home schoolers, but I’ve only heard of a few top, small class schools manage it (even internationally), and typically (again) only once kids get their core education under the belt.
    The other thing kids need to have to get self directed learning to work is the self discipline and motivation to learn. Again, this takes a level of maturity not seen in a lot of kids sitting in classrooms.
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:39am
    - RoboRob
      
      Yes I totally understand that, you are right. What I meant was, since your kid didn’t have one specific teacher it was hard to say a particular teacher was ‘poor’ (or good for that matter). This seems to be a union requirement for any educational change. Whatever the change is it must not allow parents or schools to judge the quality of a teacher. The MOE and principals association are right behind this policy too.
      
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      November 20, 2023 1:52pm
- nova
  
  In unrelated news, despite the cost of living crisis, private schools in Christchurch are seeing unprecedented demand…
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:20am
- Observer of Life
  
  The two Deputy Principals in the video clip reminded me of one J Ardern with their word soup waffle. “It’s a great space… but not that great as we’re spending a shed load to fix it up and take it back to sensible smaller spaces”…
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:29pm
goNZ1

Some more Green madness in Wellington –
Fireman Assistant Commander Michael Dombroski says there are significant delays and congestion issues because of the cycleway from Newtown to the city. New pedestrian crossings and cycleways are slowing down fire trucks on the way to urgent jobs, Fire and Emergency say.
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November 20, 2023 9:39am
- I remember when
  
  Next the constant crossing of raised pedestrian crossing/speed controls will be increasing mechanical problems.
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:57am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Whoever is responsible for the madness has no idea of the damage that can happen. Upper and lower ball joints, tie rod ends, steering rack mounts, A frame bushes, roll bar bushes. There is so much going on that the idiot with the pen just can’t understand.
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:57am
    - MCōs
      
      There are a number of raised pedestrian crossings outside the school at the end our street.
      The purpose is to slow the traffic down.
      From there it’s a km or so of straight road to the other end.
      Unfortunately the occasional hoon then put their foot down and passes our house at dangerous speeds. I couldn’t care less if they broke stuff on the underside of their cars
      
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      November 20, 2023 1:30pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        You don’t get it either. I’ll give you a lesson on servicing fucked suspensions one day.
        
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        November 21, 2023 8:13am
- cmm
  
  We see the same here in Chch.
  
  In some areas, part of the road has been cut off with a low concrete ridge/wall for cycles – reducing the roadway to a single lane.
  
  As a result there is nowhere for vehicles to move to to make room for emergency vehicles. I have seen an ambulance stuck for over 5 minutes on Hansons Lane.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:10am
- Taieri
  
  New pedestrian crossings and cycleways are slowing down fire trucks on the way to urgent jobs,
  ———
  
  Firefigthers can use bicycles just like everybody else.
  After all a bicycle was good enough for the former minister Genter and a minister is far more important than a firefighter.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:31am
- david
  
  Since when have we referred to the Americanism “fire trucks”?
  Historically we have termed them “fire appliances” but I also heard the truck term used on ZB News this morning.
  Is it the Paw Patrol generation?
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:43am
  - jgw739
    
    Fire Engine?
    
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    November 21, 2023 7:03am
Maggie Pie

“As I say Jack, I’m not bitter”
– Nanaia Mahoota (Q&A repeated 5 times)

Explaining is losing 😀 😀 😀
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November 20, 2023 9:44am
- Biscuit
  
  But did Jack have the nous to point that out to Nan?
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:11am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    He didn’t even have the gonads to mention Baby Ru 🙁
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:18am
- Wayne Mapp
  
  Well, maybe she is not that bitter about it. She has had 27 years in parliament and would be going into Opposition if she had won. Probably she didn’t see that as a particularly appealing prospect. For much newer Labour MP’s going into Opposition is just a normal part of the process, but for Nanaia it would signal the end of her career, whether she won the seat or not.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:46am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    TBH Wayne, a lot of the girls at tennis thort she was ‘dangerous’ for the country.
    Would that be a fair description do you think?
    
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    November 20, 2023 10:59am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Wayne doesn’t seem to want to respond to plebian replies MP (not even tennis wives who drive Euro SUVs). 😝
      
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      November 20, 2023 8:12pm
  - RoboRob
    
    I would have thought that after 27yrs she has spent a lot of time in opposition. I would have thought she would look forward to it, a drop in pay but still good money and zero pressure in opposition. Now she needs to find a job.
    
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    November 20, 2023 1:59pm
cmm

One of the huge concerns that always comes up with AI is that AI does not tend to work as well with dark skinned people.

For many people this is seen as racial bias in some way. The “theories” include:
* most AI programmers are light skinned so they have a deliberate or unconscious bias to exclude black people.
* not enough data is used from dark skinned people, so they AI is not trained properly on dark skins.

I don’t think this is really true. Rather it is due to technical issues tied to the laws of physics.

Cameras (both digital and film cameras) do not work as well on dark skinned people. Again, the allegations are made that these technologies were invented/designed by light skinned people who forgot to make the technology work for black people. Those people immediately grab at the “racist” option again.

In fact the real issue is far deeper than that. It comes down to the laws of physics.

Anything dark (skins or not) reflects less light. The range of light levels reflected off dark surfaces is less than off light surfaces. For example if you have a sensor (eg a camera pixel) that generates a value from 0 (completely dark) to 1000 (bright white), then the pixels from a white skin might go from, say, 200 to 800 (ie. a range of 600), while off a darker skin they might be limited to a lower range – say 100 to 300 – a range of only 200.

Lower dynamic range means less information. Less information means it is more difficult to detect features. Less features mean it is harder to make decisions.

This is not racism. It is physics.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/technology/301007979/can-you-spot-the-ai-impostors-we-found-ai-faces-can-look-more-real-than-actual-humans
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November 20, 2023 9:44am
- BananaLlama
  
  Stuff repeating fake news like a pack of Bozos again A.I has no problem identifying and generating images with darker skin colours.
  
  https://imgur.com/a/BTWcRjx
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:11am
- Taieri
  
  It comes down to the laws of physics.
  ———–
  
  These laws will change once physics’ decolonisation is concluded.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:33am
- Local Miller
  
  Science is racist, we all know this, and you’ve just proved this now. //sarc
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:44am
- rangitoto
  
  Physics is racist then. Maxwell’s equations must be repealed! What should I do with my copy of Jackson’s Classical Electrodynamics?
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:58am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Joel Maxwell’s equations? Shirley Knott!
    
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    November 20, 2023 6:48pm
- imalwaysright
  
  Cmm
  
  Ridiculous .
  
  Ask chat gtb “why is it good to be black?” and you will get a full essay on surviving slavery and being oppressed and being the next coming of Jesus Christ etc.
  Ask chat gtp ” why is it good to be white ?” and you will get a curt reponse that chat gtp doesn’t facilitate hate speech.
  
  Its not technology , its not photography or f stops or irises or whatever, its ideological programming .
  Simple
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:00pm
  - kevn
    
    cmm… Programmed by ‘people’ of the woke type. It will suit some agendas of course.
    
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    November 20, 2023 1:33pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Yes as I thought. A tool of the quasi-marxist idiocracy!
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:14pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Same with tattoos. Just don’t work as well on black skin. Lack of contrast.
  
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  November 20, 2023 6:46pm
I remember when

Germany Backs Siemens Energy in $16 Billion Rescue Package for Green Projects: NY Times.
The German government has agreed to extend financial guarantees for Siemens Energy, a major manufacturer of wind farms based in Munich, as part of a package worth 15 billion euros, or $16.2 billion, aimed at helping the ailing company continue to participate in large renewable energy projects,
Germany’s economy ministry said that it would provide E7.5 billion in guarantees, with private banks and other stakeholders also participating in the deal.
Under the agreement, Siemens Energy will not be allowed to pay out any dividends or higher-level bonuses, the ministry said.
The company said that E110 billion worth of orders were on the books and that it required help to sustain them.
The company’s difficulties have served as a warning that financial problems weighing on makers of renewable energy equipment could be growing more severe.
This month, Denmark’s Orsted scrapped plans to build two wind farms off the coast of New Jersey, forcing it to write off as much as $5.6 billion.
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November 20, 2023 9:51am
- All_on_Red
  
  Update
  German Courts block the initiative. The money was meant for Covid and cant be redirected.
  BIG problem for the Greens
  ‘German court deals 60 billion euro budget blow to Scholz government
  The German government froze major spending pledges focused on green initiatives and industry support on Wednesday after a constitutional court ruling on unused pandemic emergency funds blew a 60 billion euro ($65 billion) hole in its finances.
  
  The decision threw into disarray budget negotiations taking place this week within Chancellor Olaf Scholz’s three-way ruling coalition, whose popularity has slumped as Europe’s biggest economy teeters close to another recession.’
  https://hotair.com/tree-hugging-sister/2023/11/17/when-green-budget-bailouts-go-big-time-bust-n593155
  
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  November 20, 2023 5:15pm
kevn

cmm… Apparently black cats/kittens are rarely chosen by the instagram crowd because they are too hard to photograph.
Same theory applies.
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November 20, 2023 9:56am
- cmm
  
  It is also a part of the reason soldiers typically use darker colours for camouflage face paint. Apart from blending in, it also reduces the dynamic range and makes it harder to determine facial features.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:18am
  - Jake Dee
    
    Oooh yeah, that bit is actually a sight gag in “hot shots part deux.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYQgq3Avypg
    
    The AI chatbot actually helped me find it, narrowing down the possibilities for my vague memories of the scene
    
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    November 20, 2023 4:55pm
Maggie Pie

“From-the-river-to-the-sea” 🙁

This should see Chloe and the rest of her Rainbow mates banned from ‘X’

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1725656810449772662
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November 20, 2023 10:04am
- Ra Henare
  
  haha.
  That of course would apply to those wanting to “”remove”” all the Palestinians.
  
  Lets hope some of the more Rabid KB commenters dont use X.
  
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  November 20, 2023 1:57pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Remove being distinct from murder. Quite a distinction when you think about it.
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:15pm
Biscuit

Just a heads up, people.

You’d know that the much-beloved, chortle, Eddie Jones has walked as Rugby Australia’s national clash…
Well, overnight, the head honcho of Rugby Australia, Hamish McLennan, equally-treasured, ha, has been ousted.

Searches are on to find replacements.

Run Kiwibloggers r—u—n!
I’m safe – my partner won’t move across the ditch (especially now the Labourites here are in deserved Opposition again!) but one of more of you good people might get seconded…

Update your excuses list – sore big toe, next door’s cat is poorly etc – pronto!
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November 20, 2023 10:08am
- MCōs
  
  Hamish McLennon was instrumental in firing Dave Rennie and replacing him with the woeful braggart Eddie Jones.
  All this would be wonderful if it happened to their cricket team, but the players have enough talent to beat the likes of us whatever is going on in the background
  Unfortunately for the ABs when there is such a pitiful Wallabies team there is little to test our dudes outside the local teams.
  
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  November 20, 2023 1:16pm
Chuck Bird

I wonder how many of our climate change alarmist MPs would know the answer.

‘What Percent Of Our Atmosphere Is CO2?’: Doug LaMalfa Stumps Entire Panel With Climate Questions

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJfrKNR3K2k&t=25s
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November 20, 2023 10:21am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Word of the day….
  
  CLIMITARD/ klimit’tard/ [n] a person that believes the climate can be controlled
  by paying a fart tax to the government.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:32am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Listened to a couple of podcasts from the excellent Tom Nelson climate related podcast today. One was a very old earth scientist who was though hard to understand sometimes because of his age (really needs to be remastered with a narrator) extremely knowledgeable about what causes weather and climate on earth. He says that winter temps are getting colder. Once summer temps get colder as well it is likely based on patterns leading up to previous glaciations (ice ages) the earth will likely start heading into an ice age.
    
    https://www.podbean.com/ew/dir-nhmha-1be9c5ab
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:22pm
- cmm
  
  Astounding.
  
  The air that you breath out after holding your breath as long as you can is around 3% CO2, but these “experts” driving the decision making think there is 8% CO2 in the atmosphere!
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:00pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Most of them and most alarmist plebs don’t have an effing clue about any of it at all! They believe what the paid zombies on the news tell them and/or believe the institutions are totally credible so no thinking or personal investigation required!
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:26pm
Maggie Pie

Matty Maclean gives a tearfull farewell to ‘TV1 Breakfast’.

– The Horrid.

YAY!! I still wont watch it tho.
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November 20, 2023 10:36am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, where is the Matty going to…. oh wait is there a baby in the offing?
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:45am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Men can’t have babies. A friend told me.
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:05am
    - imalwaysright
      
      Maddy can have babies. Maddy can have many babies. Maddys can do anything !
      And if Maddy can’t , it’s because everyone is homophobic .
      Homophobic means we are scared of Maddy !
      I wonder if Maddys babies will be scared of Maddy .
      I don’t think Maddy would give a flying fuck.
      
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      November 20, 2023 12:09pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    🙁
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:06am
- graham
  
  I have to say Maggie, your sentiments echo mine.
  
  I just hope he isn’t going to start popping up elsewhere on our screens.
  
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  November 20, 2023 10:57am
  - plc
    
    “Matty McLean’s Got Issues”?
    
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    November 20, 2023 11:55am
  - lifesgood
    
    He’s off to radio. He said himself he has the face for it.
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:18pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Radio.
    I know, I know, I know. The idiot box is on TV1 then because the speaker of the house insists.
    Keep the queen bee happy and the whole hive is happy – or something.
    
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    November 20, 2023 12:57pm
ClanMcleod

Eugyppius asking the question. Why were politicians and ‘experts’ so hysterical in their drive to get the experimental covid jabs into children?

The bizarre campaign to vaccinate German children against the recommendations of regulators and in the absence of all evidence

https://www.eugyppius.com/p/the-bizarre-campaign-to-vaccinate

The contents of his post are specific to Germany, but completely align with events in NZ which totally mirrored the German madness.

Why were German politicians so eager, in summer 2021, to vaccinate school children? This was the question at the centre of yesterday’s post. I mean it in a very specific way. I understand this was a time of general vaccine mania, when everybody from local paediatricians to Chancellor Angela Merkel nourished wild dreams of ending the pandemic via mass vaccination. I want to know, however, what specifically drove German politicians to contradict the advice of their own advisory body, the Standing Committee on Vaccination (STIKO).

Exactly the same happened in NZ. For Angela Merkel, substitute Jacinda Ardern. For STIKO substitute CV TAG.

The government were clearly and specifically warned by CV TAG (NZ vaccine advisory group) about danger from the jabs, particularly young people 12 – 30. They deliberately removed this information from publication. There was no informed consent. That was covered well by Thomas Cranmer earlier in the year. Kindly republished here by VFF.

https://www.voicesforfreedom.co.nz/blog/covid-and-our-kiwi-kids-part-1/

The evidence is still available on the Medsafe website that there were serious concerns about the lack of safety data.

Medsafe considers that the safety specification for this product is currently inadequate and does not accurately reflect the important known risks, important potential risks or missing information.

This was from January 2021!!

https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/profs/adverse/MinutesOoS-20-jan-2021.htm

It goes on:

The RMP should be updated to include the additional risks and state how the missing information will be addressed. The additional studies appear to generally address the information gaps, but the company should state specifically how they will provide information on the NZ concerns raised above. In addition the provision of the results of these studies and provision of safety updates should be made a condition of approval.

So the government were advised about the problems and ignored them. Remember hearing about this on One News, RNZ and The Herald? Me neither.

How many of you who got the jab knew about this information? If you didn’t, you didn’t have ‘informed consent’. In fact, the evidence shows this was important information was deliberately withheld from you.

The risk of myocarditis and pericarditis was added to the Medsafe Risk Management Plan in June 2021.

On 9 June 2021 we published a Monitoring Communication on a safety signal of myocarditis with Comirnaty vaccine. It has now been concluded by Medsafe, other national regulators (such as the FDA) and the company, Pfizer, that myocarditis (inflammation of the heart muscle) is a rare side effect of vaccination with Comirnaty.

https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/safety/Alerts/comirnaty-myocarditis-alert.htm

‘Rare’ is subjective, the only thing ‘rare’ about any of this is the number of times vaccine damage is looked for. Almost never.
Either way, when did you get your jab? If it was after June 2021, were you told about this ‘rare’ risk of heart damage? Were any of your relatives?

You did not have informed consent. In fact, the information was deliberately kept from you.

Eugyppius continues:

I’ve assembled a general timeline of events between the crucial months of May and August 2021. This exercise has been enormously revealing, for showing how our science-following regime 1) subjected their own scientists to enormous political pressure when they issued an unwelcome recommendation on the vaccination of children, then 2) sought to undermine the force of this advice by urging teenagers to get vaccinated anyway, before it all became too much and 3) their own scientists folded and changed their advice.

To this day, The Science has never been able to produce anything that speaks in favour of vaccinating healthy children against Covid-19. The vaccines are riskier for them than the virus, and even the vaccinators’ own data shows that this is so. Despite this, we jabbed millions and millions of teenagers, maiming and killing a non-trivial number of them, for purely political reasons. To say that this is a great scandal, is an understatement.

It is beyond scandal, it is criminal activity and certain people need to go to jail.

Instead – NZ health authorities continue with the insanity of “Get your booster!!”

And some people think we should just move on…..
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November 20, 2023 10:37am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  “Safe and Effective”
  Nek minut she ran.
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:11am
- kevn
  
  Gave them a gong…
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:11pm
- imalwaysright
  
  Clan
  The certain people who should be in prison should start with the dirty dozen you listed the other day.
  
  Fear not though , this scandal will be imminently exposed, for we have currently, a Royal commission investigating these crimes.
  The commission is so determined to expose the truth that they have employed a pro mandate , pro jab Australian who will hear all evidence, as long as it is related to the questions he may ask, in private , lest it bother the public.
  This paragon of intellect and virtue will in due course tell us it was all a bit confused and next time they will probably do it better. Snigger.
  All is well Clan.
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:31pm
- goNZ1
  
  Regardless of how many boosters you have had, you can get an additional booster now if you are:
  
  aged 30 and over
  pregnant, and aged 16 or over
  aged 12 to 29 and at higher risk of severe illness from COVID-19.
  
  MoH
  
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  November 20, 2023 1:09pm
ClanMcleod

The evil of the ideologically driven trans movement is being entrenched.

Schoolchildren are being ‘indoctrinated’ into thinking miserable boys who may be questioning their gender may be happier if they transition to become girls, a promotional video of a primary school inclusion lesson reveals.

Teachers at hundreds of primary schools across the U.K. are sharing ‘nonsense’ from lesson plans created by controversial inclusion group No Outsiders.

The group, run by teacher Andrew Moffat, sells £20 teaching guides for babies and children aged “from birth to 11 years old” that “present gender ideology as fact”. …

Now, a recording has emerged of a teacher at Prae Wood Primary School, St Albans, taking a No Outsider lesson where she reads aloud a book to her class of ten year-olds, explaining how an unhappy boy teddy called Thomas becomes happy when he transforms into a girl teddy called Tilly.

https://dailysceptic.org/2023/11/19/video-exposes-trans-indoctrination-in-primary-school/

This is extremely dangerous behaviour. It has no place in schools. Their job is to educate, not indoctrinate.
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November 20, 2023 10:43am
- Jake Dee
  
  I don’t want to get too deep into the weeds on this one, so I will just say that slogans such as “follow the science” will disappear when sexual identity politics is the subject under examination.
  A plan to put a new widget into a car will get more extensive testing and experimentation than a radical plan to psycho-sexually re-engineer our society through children.
  
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  November 20, 2023 5:09pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

RIP Rosalynn Carter

She seems to have been a good woman, and Jimmy is one of my favourite Presidents, albeit perhaps not one of the more successful.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2023/11/former-us-first-lady-rosalynn-carter-dies-at-96.html
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November 20, 2023 11:30am
Maggie Pie

Just been drying my hair and listening to Kerry Woodham.
She’s obviuosly invited all the lardos out there to phone up if they’ve been taking the new weight-loss wonder drug Ozempic and to share their experiences.

Honestly, why on earth would ‘Ehlana’ call in…. and believe anyone listening would be the slightest bit interested in hearing about the color of her diarrhea?

God. give. me. strength.
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November 20, 2023 11:34am
- kowtow
  
  I caught a bit ,sounds like some subliminal advertising for My Nose Bag…….. sorry my food bag .
  
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  November 20, 2023 11:59am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Nose Bag. We use that term often, 🙂
    
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    November 20, 2023 1:00pm
sungsamning

https://pjmedia.com/rick-moran/2023/11/18/a-flood-of-retirements-in-congress-threatens-to-upend-the-2024-election-n4924046
A Flood of Retirements in Congress Threatens to Upend the 2024 Election.
Less than a year before election day 2024, the number of retirements in the House and the Senate may break a record for this cycle.

Thirty-four members of Congress have already announced they were not seeking re-election, including Senator Joe Manchin whose West Virginia Senate seat has moved from “Leans Republican” to “Safe Republican” in the Sabato Crystal Ball ratings.
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November 20, 2023 11:41am
- MCōs
  
  Fascinating
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:57pm
sungsamning

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tkb8lUzhjpo
Politicians, Military Officers Involved in Busted ‘High-End’ Brothel Network.
A high-end prostitution ring was uncovered, and the case is now turning heads because of the clients and odd requirements they were required to follow. The Justice Department announced Wednesday that it arrested three individuals for allegedly running a network of brothels aimed at high-end clients. The prostitutes were mainly Asian, as were the people running the operation. Details on the clients are still slim, but they’re broadly described by the Justice Department as including elected officials, military officers, government contractors with security clearances, and others along those lines. And interestingly, if these high-end clients wanted to purchase prostitutes, they had to give the network their full names, an email address, a phone number, their employer, and a reference if they had one. In this episode of Crossroads, we’ll discuss this story and others.
Views expressed in this video are opinions of the host and guests, and do not necessarily reflect the views of The Epoch Times.
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November 20, 2023 11:42am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  A reference? What did they have in mind?
  
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  November 20, 2023 2:39pm
- Jake Dee
  
  Interesting, BUT, Epoch Times funding and backers deserves a closer look, you can come to your own conclusions, I’ve come to mine.
  Also, Asian prostitutes for high end brothels is a supply and demand deal like all economics.
  And also, in a criminal enterprise such as a brothel or underground gambling prospective players or “johns” are often required to have a known player vouch for them or “duke them in.”
  In a digital world this would be done online.
  
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  November 20, 2023 5:29pm
kowtow

This is very, very disturbing .

IDF releasing video footage and photos from the so called hospital( so called as it is cover for terror) of at least some Israelis abducted ( to the repeated declarations of how great their god is) to there as well as a photo of the jeep that was possibly involved in the abduction of that poor young woman Naama Levy , at Shifa .( Naama was a peace activist)

Now that IDF got in there and able to seize evidence , is it any wonder the terror apologists didn’t want them anywhere near the place.

How much of this will our media cover .
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November 20, 2023 12:08pm
- Inandout
  
  kow, how many people take notice of our MSM anyway as I am sure a great percentage of NZers get their news online? There some excellent sites which give footage of what is really happening in Gaza and the IDF are superbly equipped to deal with Hamas in tunnels. Little wonder that the US military are constantly looking to purchase the latest Israeli weapons and technology.
  
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  November 20, 2023 12:59pm
  - kowtow
    
    I suspect a huge number do . TV1 “news” still has a big following . I guess 3 too. Not to mention the papers .
    
    Online ? The legacy media is there too .
    
    It takes an effort to keep ontop of issues and again Isuspect an awful lot of people tell themselves they don’t have the time to do tht and so just take what’s presented to them .
    
    Look at how so many people fell for covid , for example.Or climate catastrophe.
    
    An awful lot of this is down to the media , which is radical/activist .
    
    And there’s so many many more examples , too many to list.
    
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    November 20, 2023 3:08pm
- Ra Henare
  
  KOWTOW, didnt your interest pique when IDF would not let worldwide media in to take pictures.
  Only publishing their IDF photos??
  
  Does it pass the reality sniff test.
  
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  November 20, 2023 2:03pm
  - Fuzzysnuggleduck
    
    New York Times journalists have already been given limited access to the site, but only seen entrances to systems which are claimed to be to lead to bunkers and blast doors, etc.
    
    It would make sense to let the media in immediately, assuming they don’t mind booby traps or potential stay-behind jihadis.
    I expect tours will be available soon enough if there are genuinely HQ centres there.
    But some people would probably then claim the Isrealis built the tunnels in the days before the media was allowed unrestricted access…..
    
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    November 20, 2023 3:17pm
    - MCōs
      
      The mere existence of tunnels under hospitals doesn’t mean much
      Middlemore
      https://www.constructors.co.nz/hospital-services-tunnel-infrastructure/
      Auckland Hospital
      https://www.adhb.health.nz/about-us/latest-stories/construction-work-underway/#:~:text=If%20you%20are%20coming%20to,one%20of%20our%20main%20buildings.
      Christchurch
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mystery-hole-revealed-sinister-plot/ETWFCSRZVI2PBDPEL5G3W7GNAQ/
      
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      November 20, 2023 5:52pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Nice try. The tunnels in question aren’t mere hospital service tunnels.
        
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        November 20, 2023 8:36pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Bit of an oppsie there leaving the CCTV working…
  
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  November 20, 2023 2:03pm
  - kowtow
    
    The problem Israel has is that the media are almost totally against them.
    Everybody knows/ knew what was going on but the media and ngo’s, UN etc demand Israel provides “proof” and when they do , it gets basically no cut through or wall to wall coverage .
    
    ‘A British doctor who used to work at Shifa Hospital, Gaza’s largest medical center, under which the IDF says Hamas operates a major command and control base, has confirmed that there were areas of the hospital where he could not go, or else he would be shot.’
    
    and
    
    ‘The physician also reported to the journalist that if hospital staff were 10% frightened of possible Israeli airstrikes, they were 90% frightened of being persecuted by Hamas.’
    
    This is how terror organisations operate .
    
    Where are the Greens ,the media now ?
    
    https://www.timesofisrael.com/uk-doctor-who-worked-at-shifa-confirms-gaza-hospital-used-for-non-medical-purposes/
    
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    November 20, 2023 2:14pm
lifesgood

Everybody seems to be blaming Winston for holding up a coalition agreement. To be honest I don’t trust him one inch but let’s not forget that Seymour blew the election towards the end of the campaign by coming out with some stupid comments and by getting way too cocky. If he hadn’t done that Winston wouldn’t have been needed. Luxon could see Seymour’s support dropping so had no choice but to include Winston.
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November 20, 2023 1:04pm
The Redbaiter

A candidate the mainstream media refers to as a far-right outsider (Javier Milei) has just won the election in Argentina, with 55% of the vote. Mr Milei called climate change a “socialist scam”.

Food for thought for the dinosaur leftist progressives (Luxon and Willis) who have taken over the National party.

If it turns out NZ needs a new election, they have to go. A 38% result against the worst Labour govt in history is down to them, and they need to take responsibility.

(Willis was a big player in the Muller fiasco too, and should have been shown the door then,)
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November 20, 2023 1:04pm
- kiwi_chileno
  
  Milei – ‘El Loco’ – the chainsaw-wielding economist and self-described anarcho-capitalist (“The state was invented by the devil, God’s system is the free market”) – beat Sergio Massa, the Establishment, Peronist candidate and current Economy Minister. Luxon is like Massa – an unprincipled managerial technocrat, not a leader.
  
  Milei wants to dollarise the economy, abolish the central bank, slash public spending, and root out the financial and moral corruption of the parasitic political elite. He also opposes the UN Agenda 2030 for Sustainable Development (as does Chile’s José Antonio Kast).
  
  The problem for Milei is that his party doesn’t have majorities in the bi-cameral legislature. But Argentinians want real change. The status quo has delivered 140% inflation, a poverty rate of 40%……..
  
  Meanwhile, Chile votes on a new Constitution in mid-December to replace the current 1981, Pinochet-era one (in 2022, an extremely progressive text was rejected by ⅔’s of voters) . The new text was written by an elected council dominated by the right: Kast’s Republican Party was the single largest bloc. The text has been described as even more neo-liberal and socially conservative than the 1981 Constitution. Even if the text is rejected, the right wins because it leaves the 1981 Constitution in place. If the text is approved, it strengthens the ‘right’ right at the expense of the traditional conservatives and centrists, the equivalent of National, who have dithered about supporting the text.
  
  And President Gabriel Boric – Chile’s Trudeau / Ardern – and his leftist coalition, lose whatever the result. Boric has said that he will not try again to replace the Constitution in the remainder of his term.
  
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  November 20, 2023 4:48pm
  - Manolo
    
    I have visited Argentina many times and can say I am delighted Peluca Milei has been elected President after defeating Sergio Massa, current minister of Finance (!) and member of the country’s political mafia.
    Tough times ahead, but there is at least hope for a nation destroyed by successive Peronist governments, all of them corrupt to the core.
    
    Also, as a frequent visitor to Chile, I’m dismayed by the turn for the worse taken under President Gabriel Boric, a militant communist and professional agitator, whose government appears mired in corruption perpetrated by his friends and associates.
    Santiago, the country’s lovely capital city, looks very run down these days.
    
    There is hope Jose Antonio Kast wins the presidency next time (he came second less than two years ago.)
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:57pm
Jack5

An interesting obituary piece at the RNZ site on the admirable Roslynn Carter, wife of President Jimmy Carter.

Though without any mental illness, Rosslyn Carter became a chamption of those who suffered mental problems.

The article lets itself down, though, with its description of her husband as “a peanut farmer-turned-governor”.

Carter was also a US Navy submarine officer and a nuclear engineer who was a hero of a meltdown.

He did later farm peanuts. Many Woke Americans tend to look down on farmers socially and on farming as a business, a career, and a life. Lets hope New Zealand keeps its regard for farming and agriculture.

The report on Roslynn Carter:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/world/502812/former-us-first-lady-rosalynn-carter-dies-at-96

Her husband’s salvage role after a nuclear station melt-down:

https://www.military.com/history/how-jimmy-carter-saved-canadian-nuclear-reactor-after-meltdown.html
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November 20, 2023 1:11pm
goNZ1

https://edition.cnn.com/middleeast/live-news/israel-hamas-war-gaza-news-11-19-23/index.html
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November 20, 2023 1:27pm
emmess

Some good news from Argentina
https://www.breitbart.com/latin-america/2023/11/19/populist-libertarian-javier-milei-wins-presidency-of-argentina-in-landslide/
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November 20, 2023 1:28pm
- MCōs
  
  This chap.
  Benny Hill without the laughs
  https://x.com/jules31415/status/1726455205028561237?s=61&t=yFkzCNMWRCaVt1p5eRxUog
  
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  November 20, 2023 5:35pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    The people have spoken. Eat it.
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:39pm
- kiwi_chileno
  
  Milei planning budget cuts – “Ministry of Women, Genders and Diversity …..OUT!” https://nitter.net/WallStreetSilv/status/1726394041745444923#m
  
  Part of his victory speech https://nitter.net/silverland_yank/status/1726427076717162680#m
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:04pm
Maggie Pie

R.E. UPDATE…

‘The Post’ is running an advertorial for the sale of Nashie’s house.
Not all that big but a real nice home by the looks of it.
Actually a good size piece of dirt tho – over 1700sm.
The CV sits above $1.5m…. but agents talking it up to over 2.
A steal at that sort of money I’d say.
Only problem of course its in Napier.

Transfer the same listing to the Northern Slopes of Remmers
and you’d staring north of 12mill eazi.

https://nzsothebysrealty.com/property/listing/HBNP1239/60-milton-road-bluff-hill
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November 20, 2023 1:40pm
Swifty

There’s something about ‘windfall taxes’ that just come across to me as economically and morally wrong.

https://www.thepost.co.nz/a/nz-news/350112631/forget-foreign-buyers-tax-could-be-answer-nationals-revenue-gap?utm_source=stuff_website&utm_medium=stuff_referral&utm_campaign=mh_stuff&utm_id=mh_stuff

(paywall)

That a government can just decide unilaterally to forcibly confiscate private wealth and for what is always a very temporary phenomenon. – supposed ‘excess’ profits.

That this extra taxation would under the NZ Labour Party very likely just be squandered subsequently just doubles the wrongness.

It is also unbalanced, in that if government action causes profits to fall do companies get a taxpayer top up to compensate? Of course not. But when government actions cause ‘windfall’ profits, then the government has a case to confiscate them?

How is that fair and reasonable?

The best thing this government should be doing to resolve the revenue versus spending gap is to cut wasteful spending – to ensure much, much greater focus on generating value from government spending – and to eliminate that spending that does not measure up.

That the lead economist from the CTU is advancing arguments to legislate even more state confiscation of private wealth (and seemingly blind to the consequences) to pay for massive state spending increases which all sorts of evidence has shown to have been of low to no value, demonstrates to me just how irresponsible, incoherent and fanatical NZ’s left has become.

They will be the ruin of us.
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November 20, 2023 3:17pm
Gussy Fink-Nottle

What are the strengths and weaknesses of Te Reo Māori as a language to convey contemporary ideas?

I ask this genuinely, with non-partisan enquiry.

Many of the words I look up (I do try) appear to have multiple, diverse meanings.
Are we required to rely more heavily on context than with other languages?

I also understand the generation of new words and names is prolific.
Is there any available record of the date/timing of when a new word came into existence (thus providing some reference as to the development of the language)?

Keen to receive any objective advice/opinion on these matters.
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November 20, 2023 3:28pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Frankly, if I was you Gussy I wouldn’t worry about it anymore.
  Both our new PM (and Winnie) have said they want an “English First” approach…. and a promise to erase all Maori names from government departments.
  
  Finally – sanity prevails.
  
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  November 20, 2023 4:11pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  Most modern Te Reo Maori is manufactured to try and give it credence or accommodate contemporary utility.
  
  A speaker from 80 years ago would not be able to communicate effectively because it is now been reformed.
  
  The utility however still cannot be fully integrated in communications because the base words still used have, as you say far too many contextual different meanings and macrons don’t fix that problem.
  
  The issue we confront is that the langugage is now so reformed due to the desire to make it useful it is less a toanga (as it was probably once) and now it has been ‘pidgendised’ to grant it some semblence of (and for) modern usage.
  
  An example is the word for helicopter which clearly never existed in the original word stream but instead of adopting that word helicopter in the language (like English adopts words like kindergarten and anorak) the Maori Language Commission have made one up and it is ‘waka topatopa’………
  
  Sadly the language is not an evolution of itself through natural growth it is made to order by the Maori Language Commission bought and paid for with taxpayer funding.
  
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  November 20, 2023 4:18pm
- Steve Todd
  
  I ask this genuinely, with non-partisan enquiry.
  
  I’m struggling to believe you, Gussy.
  
  Why do you ask your primary question, and then your secondary questions?
  
  Why would you think that the commenters on a centre-right/right blogsite, who, generally speaking, are at the very least, unhappy with the ever-increasing encroachment of the Māori language into everyday life in this country, be able, or would be willing, to help you here?
  
  What research of your own have you done, to this point? What enquiries have you made, so far, of relevant institutions/government departments?
  
  Sorry, Gussy, but I say to you, go away (and get yourself better informed before asking if others have done the “hard yards” – the results of which you now hope they will kindly share with you – that you would appear not to have done yourself).
  
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  November 20, 2023 4:41pm
  - Gussy Fink-Nottle
    
    That’s a little uncharitable Steve.
    If it’s too much of an imposition to ask others’ their wisdom, I clearly am in the wrong place.
    If I raised this elsewhere, I risk being shamed for my ignorance. Looks like I can get that well enough here.
    PS – I’m not a native of these parts, I struggle to find people who wish to speak freely on these matters (in person), and I’m not convinced Government departments will provide me an objective view.
    
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    November 20, 2023 5:04pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      Gussy: Your 3:28PM post came across, at least to me, as dripping with insincerity. Even now, you have not informed us as to where you’re coming from – you did not take this opportunity to answer my questions.
      
      What are you trying to achieve here? You say you are “not a native of these parts”. (I suspected that.) Are you a recent immigrant from South Africa? Does the use of Māori in everyday life “get right up your nose”?
      
      What are you about?
      
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      November 20, 2023 5:31pm
  - Jake Dee
    
    You’re being too harsh Steve, there’s nothing wrong with asking for directions and I’m interested in helping Gussy.
    The question is at least as much philosophical and linguistic as it is social and political. Are we looking at an indigenous language or a modern creole or patois of an indigenous language? Will promotion of modern NZ Te Reo Māori benefit natural Māori communities or the artificial communities of the NZ Professional Managerial Class?
    I don’t think the bureaucracy will answer those questions, Gussy and I will have to look farther afield.
    
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    November 20, 2023 5:52pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      Gussy did not ask, or even imply, those questions, Jake.
      
      Also, we all know that when a Kiwiblog commenter says “genuine question”, it is usually anything but: there is an agenda.
      
      Gussy may well be “genuine”, but he erred in not saying where he is coming from.
      
      He has withdrawn, and so do I.
      
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      November 20, 2023 6:38pm
- Ghost
  
  I also understand the generation of new words and names is prolific
  
  Oxford dictionary added 700 new terms last year, I trust you’ll be asking the same of them
  
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  November 20, 2023 4:54pm
  - Gussy Fink-Nottle
    
    Language is indeed dynamic, Ghost.
    However, the words added to the Oxford dictionary last year are but a tiny proportion of those already in existence.
    
    I really would like to understand the rate of increase. Oxford lets us know. I’ll leave ya’ll alone and see if I can find out elsewhere.
    
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    November 20, 2023 5:20pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      Okay. So, you would appear to be from “the South”. That’s fine, but I’d still like to know what your agenda is.
      
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      November 20, 2023 5:48pm
  - Jake Dee
    
    It’s a relevant point. Now divide words created by population for both English and Māori users. then we might get some interesting metrics
    
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    November 20, 2023 5:55pm
- cmm
  
  “What are the strengths and weaknesses of Te Reo Māori as a language to convey contemporary ideas?”
  
  Just like Zulu and Xhosa which I grew up with, Maori language is unwritten. The written form is a very modern invention by white linguists.
  
  Unwritten languages lack precision. They tend to be extremely fluid and their meanings can vary significantly from area to area.
  
  Once a language is written down, and its meaning has been debated/argued over/discussed for many generations, the meanings of words and phrases become well defined. We end up with dictionaries etc which clearly define what words do and do not mean.
  
  This history of using a language precisely refines the language and makes it suitable for tasks where precision matters – especially when constructing legal documents etc.
  
  Unwritten languages on the hand tend to have extremely imprecise ideas associated with them (rather than definitions). This history of imprecise use dilutes what the words mean and the ability to convey complex thoughts, legal documents etc.
  
  As an example of a squishy “feels” word, look at mana. We all know that it sort of means something like pride, honour etc but ask a hundred people and you’ll get a hundred answers. Worse yet, ask people in North Island and you’ll get a different distribution of meaning compared to people in South Island.
  
  We have an education crisis in this country. Until that is addressed, any thoughts of adding further challenges/confusion by changing languages should be shelved.
  
  But by far the most important factor is that nobody speaks the Maori language. We live, increasingly, in an international environment where we make international deals involving people from all over the world.
  
  NZ in particular is extremely dependent on foreign trade.
  
  English is the language of international dealings, of technical dealing and such. Any deviation from English as our primary language makes everything else harder.
  
  To think that 5 million people (or 8+ billion if you think internationally) should pander to the handful of people who speak Maori as a primary language is rather self-centred.
  
  Now I am not at all opposed to people learning Maori. I think that is fine. But don’t force it on people who don’t want to learn it and see no value in doing so. Maori don’t value the language or they would all learn it.
  
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  November 20, 2023 5:09pm
  - Gussy Fink-Nottle
    
    Thank you cmm
    Apologies to others. I get it, it’s emotive. I’m fishing for reasoned arguments for that very reason.
    
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    November 20, 2023 5:39pm
  - mandk
    
    Perhaps Māori should use Te Reo only in the spoken form.
    
    After all, the written version is a colonialist construct.
    
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    November 20, 2023 6:34pm
- Jake Dee
  
  It’s an area I’m interested in too. Clearly the language must shift as the society changes and post-British contact NZ Māori has moved maybe 10,000 years down the social development timeline from pre-contact NZ Māori.
  But in what direction is the language moving and who’s pushing it?
  How much of Te Reo is being written by technocrats and academics ? Will the language be some symbolic ritual of the Professional Managerial Elites to brown-face in?
  
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  November 20, 2023 5:38pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Nice to see that Jeeves & Wooster live on
  
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  November 20, 2023 7:09pm
Ghost

Now just the ministers to decide

The Incoming Prime Minister says he has reached agreements over policy with his coalition partners NZ First and the ACT Party, but has yet to work out ministerial allocations and who will be in Cabinet.

Christopher Luxon gave the update outside the Cordis Hotel in Auckland, where he has been hashing out coalition deals with Winston Peters and David Seymour.

Article
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November 20, 2023 3:32pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Sounds like the rumor from the Viaduct this morn was correct 😀
  
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  November 20, 2023 4:13pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    What’s at the viaduct? Drinkies?
    
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    November 20, 2023 8:42pm
- cmm
  
  Winnie looks as happy as a dog with two dicks.
  
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  November 20, 2023 4:45pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Sounds like decent progress!
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:43pm
Sparrow

Just watched Luxon on 6pm news and frankly am gobsmacked at his naivety. Surely as someone who is apparently skilled at negotiating in the business field he would not publicly state a policy agreement had been reached until the signatures were on the piece of paper.
Both Winston and Seymour undermined his statement by basically saying there was not an agreement yet on policy. This makes him look a fool.
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November 20, 2023 6:21pm
- Ghost
  
  It doesn’t matter what he says, people will always have a moan. The policy is settled, now it moves on to negotiating portfolios.
  
  Act and NZ First will now be looking at the respective deals National has signed with them. Luxon doesn’t believe there will be major issues through that process.
  
  Luxon told reporters: “We’ve achieved, I think, a significant milestone overnight and that is that we have actually closed down and agreed policy programmes with both Act and also with New Zealand First.
  
  “That’s a major achievement.”
  
  Luxon said he will continue conversations to make sure Act and NZ First can also both sign on to each party’s policy programmes and agendas “that we’ve agreed with them individually”.
  
  Luxon said the negotiations will “kick on” and move to ministerial responsibilities and Cabinet.
  
  Article
  
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  November 20, 2023 6:53pm
Ghost

Newshub understands a final policy sticking point was that ACT and New Zealand First want to narrow the scope of the Treaty’s interpretation in legislation and the courts. They had faced a brick wall from National on the matter but it’s understood last night it was sorted.

Article
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November 20, 2023 6:48pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Let’s hope the Nats aren’t just fckuing ACT and NZF over with fake assurances. That could go pear shaped on the Nats later if they are.
  
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  November 20, 2023 8:52pm
Sparrow

Has not David Seymour stated that an agreement on coalition policy is 2 or 3 days away. I acknowledge I might not be the brightest as having reached 80 but surely that contradicts Luxton’s claim. I am very happy to be corrected.
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November 20, 2023 7:44pm
- Ghost
  
  Here is Seymour talking, suggest you listen to.
  
  He says that it is now before act and nz first to agree with each other and then for it to go back the party. That it is a day or two away.
  
  Guess Luxon isn’t as bad as you want to claim
  
  https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/heather-du-plessis-allan-drive/audio/david-seymour-act-leader-says-coalition-negotiations-are-still-ongoing-despite-luxons-claims/
  
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  November 20, 2023 9:30pm
Sparrow

Apologies I added a T to Luxon’s name.
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November 20, 2023 8:11pm

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