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November 3, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 03 November 2023

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General Debate

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2ic

A prediction for today’s special vote results. Not based on any great insights, but I think National are going to lose 2 seats for the following reasons:
1. This is what happened in 2017.
2. Special votes this election are higher than in 2017 and account for around 20% of the vote.
3. National outperformed the polls on election night, so I think the special vote count will bring them back to a result more in line with expectations.
4. I understand National only need to drop 0.2 percentage points to lose 1 seat, so losing 2 seats is quite on the cards.
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November 3, 2023 8:02am
- Drone
  
  All of that 2ic will deliver a parliament that will be unable to deliver the program the country needs..
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:10am
- greybeard
  
  If National “outperformed” the polls on election night, then why should the special votes not follow the same trend?
  I remain optimistic that National & ACT will end up with more seats, not fewer.
  Probably wishful thinking…..
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:21am
  - pdm
    
    I agree with you greybeard.
    
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    November 3, 2023 8:25am
    - Mark Hanley
      
      We will all know at 2.
      
      What we do know is that Jacinda Aderns office were contacted by the mosque shooter notifyng adern of his intended massacre, including the location.
      
      Adern did nothing and told no-one until after many NZers were brutally shot and killed.
      
      Is this another example of Adern killing NZers to further her political/self enrichmant goals.
      
      Was the burka purchased and ready before the atrocity?
      
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      November 3, 2023 8:41am
      - Ghost
        
        Ah what? Ardern office notified the police, how is that doing nothing?
        
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        November 3, 2023 9:29am
      - AitchW
        
        What a vile post. I totally abhorred her politics, but to level accusations like these is a new low.
        
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        November 3, 2023 9:32am
      - All_on_Red
        
        This is not true
        One of her staff called the Police within minutes of learning about it.
        There is plenty of evidence proving this
        
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        November 3, 2023 9:38am
      - Handyman
        
        To be precise…
        1. Ardern’s office passed the email on to Police fairly quickly.
        2. The email contained the exact location of where the attack was going to take place. (Linwood mosque)
        3. The following day Ardern said in her prepared remarks that they had received notification of an attack and she stated there was no mention of where it was to take place.
        
        My inference is that Ardern was covering for her Police and thus herself. She would have looked incompetent if her office had the precise address of the target and her Police failed to pass that on to responding officers.
        
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        November 3, 2023 10:07am
      - slightlyrighty
        
        As much as I dislike how Ardern managed the country, Mark, your post is disgusting.
        
        Ardern was not notified. Her office was. Her office notified the police within minutes.
        
        This manifesto was sent to a number of outlets, including media. Did they notify the police? I don’t know if they did or didn’t, but I’m not going to hang the blame on a reporter.
        
        I mean, what the hell did you want Ardern to do, Immediately hold a press conference to tell the country what she had been sent? She was in New Plymouth at the time.
        
        We are talking about a matter of minutes. The Email was sent to the PM’s office at 1.33pm, and the shooting started at 1.40pm. The PM announced that her office had received the email at a later press conference.
        
        I dislike her politics, and will look back on her term of office with disdain, but I will not lay blame where it is patently not warranted.
        
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        November 3, 2023 10:28am
      - Random T Person
        
        Don’t cloud your judgment just because you don’t like Ardern. She was undoubtedly a massive catastrophe for the country, but judge her on the facts, not Winston’s obvious lies.
        
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        November 3, 2023 10:32am
      - redeye
        
        Wendi Geus on Breaking Views has a pretty good explaination of the Peters tweet about Ardern lying about the CHCH massacre. Essentially Ardern said;
        
        I was one of more than 30 recipients of a manifesto that was mailed out nine minutes before the attack took place…it did not include a location, it did not include specific details.
        
        The inquest report says
        
        The parliamentary staffer scanned the manifesto during the [111] call and picked out information including the terrorist’s name, age, weapon he was intending to use and location of the attack.
        
        I’m not surprise she has avoided the inquest.
        https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2023/11/wendy-geus-ardern-misled-us-after.html
        
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        November 3, 2023 10:41am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        You are correct below about Ardern saying there was no specifityon locations, they played that on the news after Peters stated she kept it too her self, I thought the same when they said at the inquiry that the places were named, not sure I agree she was covering from police, but she certainly did not tell the full truth at that media announcement two days later
        
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        November 3, 2023 12:12pm
      - Mark Hanley
        
        Thanks for all your feedback and clarifications…
        
        To the Adern apologists
        
        If the letter had the time and place, why did adern lie about the location and why weren’t police there waiting for the shooter?
        
        And never forget we’re talking about the same adern who told you the covid jab was safe and effective, then mandated your children receive the.poison, despite medsafe telling her it was neither safe nor effective, a report which was hidden from until thomas cramner got his hands on it.
        
        That act is the nexus for the greatest mass murder in NZ ever.
        
        So who is the real disgusting vile, abhorant person in these scenarios?
        
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        November 3, 2023 1:23pm
  - 2ic
    
    @greybeard
    I think you and all your up-tickers are going to be disappointed.
    
    Special votes have historically always favoured the left, and this election they make up a greater percentage of the total vote than in 2017 (where National lost 2 seats):
    
    https://elections.nz/media-and-news/2017/new-zealand-2017-general-election-official-results/
    “Special votes cast totalled 446,287 or 17% of total votes cast.”
    
    https://elections.nz/media-and-news/2023/election-night-results-for-the-2023-general-election/
    “Special declaration votes still to be counted are estimated at 567,000 (20.2% of total votes).”
    
    So the influence of special votes is going to be even stronger this election than 2017, and National are a whisker away (0.2 percentage points) from losing 1 seat, so I’m going for a 2 seats.
    
    The other wildcard is what is going to happen with the Maori seats and any potential overhang created by Te Pati Maori.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:33am
    - All_on_Red
      
      The reason for the Special Votes being higher this time around is due to thousands of local kiwis being omitted from the Electoral Roll and so had to make a Special Vote.
      
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      November 3, 2023 9:36am
      - backster
        
        Indeed what is the point of having an electoral roll if you can just rark up and vote right up until closing time without having bothered to enroll.
        
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        November 3, 2023 10:22am
      - rouppe
        
        Precisely backster. Voting is something that required thought and consideration.
        
        You have 3 years to enrol. If you can’t be bothered doing it a month before the election, too bad.
        
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        November 3, 2023 11:43am
      - Ghost
        
        backster, many of the specials were people who were enrolled but the digital roll crashed on election day
        
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        November 3, 2023 11:47am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Yes, I have heard of three, and funnily enough all said they have never had a problem, and their papers prior were correct, but all three voted for change
        
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        November 3, 2023 12:16pm
    - Libertarians are right
      
      There is also the potential for the Maori Party to increase their party vote to the point they no longer have an overhang (if they don’t pick up another electorate seat) which would be huge for National and ACT.
      
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      November 3, 2023 9:47am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        And for Peters to drop to 4.9% that would see Nats ACT miles in front
        
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        November 3, 2023 12:17pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      It’s the election with the largest anger at any election in our life time
      
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      November 3, 2023 12:14pm
    - John Loveridge
      
      We’ll know at 2pm, I guess.
      
      Specials may have historically favoured the left, but with the unprecedented swing away from Labour this time I don’t think any predictions can be made with any degree of certainty at all.
      
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      November 3, 2023 12:44pm
    - greybeard
      
      You were right, I was wrong.
      BUGGER.
      
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      November 3, 2023 2:04pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    The over seas vote are grumpy, but there are only 70k
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:06am
    - krazykiwi
      
      Agreed. I have family in London and they report that NZers who couldn’t be bothered voting in previous elections turned out in force to dispatch the putrid remains of Ardern’s government.
      
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      November 3, 2023 11:25am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  National/Act coalition. No NZF, but give Winston something, but something that he can’t use as a tail to wag the dog.
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:31am
  - kowtow
    
    The only thing I’d give Peters is a very well deserved DCM.
    
    But I’m not confident . He might end up holding the scepter , again.
    
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    November 3, 2023 8:37am
    - John Loveridge
      
      Ah yes, the fundamental democratic principle of one man, one vote. In 2017 Winston was the man, and he had the vote. God help us if it has happened again.
      
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      November 3, 2023 12:46pm
  - Cassandra
    
    Exile? Minister-Resident in Washington? Gaza?
    
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    November 3, 2023 8:54am
    - Martonman
      
      Dublin in place of Mallard
      
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      November 3, 2023 9:43am
      - kowtow
        
        Dey already have a ‘uge drink problem , why would ye want to make it worser .
        Begob.
        
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        November 3, 2023 11:46am
    - Don Beckett
      
      Winston will be included in the coalition.
      
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      November 3, 2023 10:08am
      - Drone
        
        But the Left or Right coalition Don B..
        
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        November 3, 2023 10:29am
      - backster
        
        Why not make him Minister of Justice. The usual appointment is a senior National Party lawyer who is too subservient to the legal hierarchy to effect any change and man do the woke collective of judges need to be brought into the real world.
        
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        November 3, 2023 10:34am
      - Flossie
        
        I think Maori Affairs for WP would be perfect!
        
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        November 3, 2023 12:06pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    S.O
    
    Don’t forget the antics of the electoral commission.
    
    1. 300 rural polling booths closed on election day !
    2. Vetting temporary election worker applicants according to their view of a treaty.
    3. Electoral commission data base failed on election day leading to lengthy queues and some not voting.
    4. Failure to deliver some voter registration forms leading to further delays and queues.
    5. Three weeks to count special votes.
    6. No identification required to vote.
    
    Probably more issues.
    
    None of these issues is detrimental to the failing government, but taking them as a whole, could be construed as a coordinated attempt to frustrate the election.
    
    If I’m wrong then at least we will have discovered the only government department in the last six years to be competent.
    
    Yeah right!
    
    We might see a result that we aren’t expecting
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:00am
    - Simon
      
      “Probably more issues.”
      
      Yep, woke leftist electoral commission in effect ballot harvesting gangs & their camp followers 3 months out from election.
      
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      November 3, 2023 9:54am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Give Winston a pillow. He looked uncomfortable sleeping in parliament three years ago, and will be more so next year.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:22am
- cmm
  
  Yup, something like that is the most likely outcome as much as we might hope for something different.
  
  It is funny how people downvote something, it seems not because they disagree with the analysis but because they think they can sway the outcome by downvoting.
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:55am
  - septic skeptic
    
    Don’t shoot the messenger.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:12am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I reckon it’s Mike lurking around. He was definitely here the other day, but not on GD.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:23am
- JJ56
  
  Politik (Richard Harman) this morning quotes multiple informed sources as saying Nats hold their position.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:13am
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    Maggie said the same thing the other day. I personally think this can only be rumours.
    I would be very surprised if the Electoral Commission (their staff) would be leaking anything to any of the political parties.
    Anyway we will soon know.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:16am
    - cmm
      
      The Electoral Commission staff are probably as gossipy as just about anyone else.
      
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      November 3, 2023 10:53am
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        Probably not on election results. This would be very strictly held.
        In my experience, on critical issues people can keep secrets. There are are bunch of things in government that literally hundreds of people know but have never been leaked.
        
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        November 3, 2023 12:04pm
    - Matt Long
      
      Seems to be a lot of reporters quoting rumours for clicks. You have to wonder how many are deliberately made up.
      
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      November 3, 2023 2:50pm
- redeye
  
  The big complication could come from Tamaki Makaurau and Te Tai Tokerau. If Labour loses those 2 it will add an extra couple of overhang seats.
  I can
  t believe this is the second time I have been barraking for Kelvin Davis to win his seat.
  The first was when he knocked off that racist Hadfield bloke.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:23am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Act only need .02 to gain one
  
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  November 3, 2023 11:05am
- David Garrett
  
  2ic: I don’t know why you have been downticked extensively for that careful analysis…wishful thinking on the part of the downtickers perhaps, as greybeard below has alluded to.
  
  I think it is now very clear that whatever happens NZF is going to be necessary to form a stable government…and so far at least, Peters seems not to be acting with his usual bombastic arrogance and silly games.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:06pm
- Terry Dalee
  
  Nicely predicted… National loses 2 seat..
  
  Winnies back…
  
  What is wrong with the losers in this country….. everyone is so keen to go bankrupt in a hurry here…
  
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  November 3, 2023 2:07pm
- Random T Person
  
  Well now, here we are. Well spotted 2ic.
  
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  November 3, 2023 2:08pm
Benedict Yu

A light hearted way to start the day. A bunch of university students are having a discussion. A man makes the mistake of referring to a “trans man” as a “she”. 😂

https://youtube.com/shorts/Hq-KGJoUx8Q?si=FYSdbDCOQbKGk85s
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November 3, 2023 8:10am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Benedict – if you haven’t watched ‘Life of Brian’, that video is almost a perfect copy of the stoning scene in the movie.
  A man is going to be stoned to death for blasphemy. Only men are allowed to attend stonings, but the women love it. They all buy fake beards so they can go to the stoning. They’re all getting a bit hysterical holding their rocks and stones, wanting to get on with it.
  
  John Cleese hears the high pitched voices, looks at the crowd suspiciously and says – “are there any women here?”
  
  The ensuing scene is very, very funny.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNeq2Utm0nU
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:18am
  - alex Masterley
    
    I have always enjoyed the scene where the Judean Peoples Front and the Peoples Front of Judea make their appearance.
    I used to think the Life of Brian was a comedy. I rather think it is prohecy now. We might have a new deity!
    All praise Monty Python for predicting the future….
    
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    November 3, 2023 8:30am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Even “Loretta” is not comedy now. Just look around, they are everywhere.
      
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      November 3, 2023 8:41am
    - Burtland
      
      comedy becoming reality …
      
      NASA looking for martians with ever bigger telescopes
      Life of Brian becoming mainstream politics
      
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      November 3, 2023 10:57am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Clan,
    
    Sounds like the Green party leadership selection process.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:29am
  - David Garrett
    
    Clan: I have never watched “Life of Brian” for my own personal reasons…but that scene is absolutely hilarious…and amazingly predictive of the link Benedict posted to the bunch of freaks of nature arguing over pronouns.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:20pm
    - ClanMcleod
      
      David Garrett – if you reasons are based on your faith then you need to understand that this movie isn’t remotely blasphemous or disrespectful to any religion. It’s made very clear at the beginning that the movie is nothing to do with Jesus, it’s about a little astrological error which sees Brian being mistaken for the Messiah.
      
      Also your life won’t be complete until you watch it!
      
      Two more clips should convince you, they were referenced by Steve Otto and alex Masterly above.
      
      The Loretta scene:
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dgp9MPLEAqA
      
      Nails the whole trans thing.
      
      The People’s Front of Judea scene:
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0BpfwazhUA
      
      That one is reminiscent of the minor parties in NZ pre election!
      
      The whole movie is spectacularly prescient, especially when we realise it was released almost 45 years ago!
      
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      November 3, 2023 1:00pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        My favourite section concerns Latin declensions. Anyone who studied Latin will relate.
        
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        November 3, 2023 7:07pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Watch ‘Life of Brian’ DG. You will enjoy it.
      Brian is the Messier.
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSdXtDjM4lI
      
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      November 3, 2023 6:31pm
artemisia

ZB PLUS is expanding quite quickly. A stable of quality regular columnists, some also published elsewhere, plus guest columnists and news. All in one place. Medium form. And just started to open up for comments in some cases.To me ZB PLUS leans a bit to the conservative and also to the political and legal. Regular columnists so far include – Chris Trotter, Fran O’Sullivan, Philip Crump, Oliver Hartwich, Bruce Cotterill, Jamie Mackay, Muriel Newman, Katharine Rich.

The format will need attention though, too many big pics of writers make it hard to see what’s on the page without lots of scrolling.

Also recommend The Old Reader aggregator for a quick look at headlines (and links) for sites chosen by the reader. Including blogs. Free but premium option available.
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November 3, 2023 8:10am
BeaB

After years of ignoring the glaring deficiencies of the Labour Government, Emmerson has suddenly decided to concentrate on the new government.
I wonder why the Herald persists with such a one-eyed cartoonist?
I hold him and most of the media partly responsible for covering up what has been happening over the past six years – failure in just about every aspect of our country’s governance.
They let us down and failed in their duty to us.
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November 3, 2023 8:10am
- Local Miller
  
  What new government? We have an outgoing Liebour Government and an incoming NACT Government, but at the moment we’re in a hiatus, with no real functioning government. Not that Liebour were ever a functioning one.
  It’s a crazy setup where for weeks we can have no proper government.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:48am
Cassandra

This is just an extract: The Ministry of Business Innovation and Employment staff number is up 85%, while the Corrections department is up only 12.5% over the period, but the prison population is down 15% over the same period.
And you wonder where the money (and the votes) went?
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November 3, 2023 8:12am
- Matt Long
  
  Did the criminals from the prisons go to MBIE?
  
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  November 3, 2023 11:04am
Maggy Wassilieff

Remember when we were told of the far-right conspiracy folk who were rioting and burning tents at the Parliamentary Protest?

Strangely enough this killer gangster doesn’t seem to fit that pattern.

Judge Ian Mill spoke of the hit and run, as well as Clark’s offending during the Parliament occupation in 2022. This included aggravated assaults on police and attempts to sustain the fires that had been lit on the grounds.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/fatal-hit-and-run-driver-chad-clark-jailed-for-hutt-killing/FWXKU5CBVJBKXMVBEP23H7J64E/
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November 3, 2023 8:18am
- cmm
  
  This was far from being “dangerous driving”. It was murder – using a vehicle as a weapon.
  
  He got time off for remorse. Yeah right! Where’s the remorse in driving away, taking off the plates to try to evade responsibility etc?
  
  He ends up with a 5 year sentence, but will be out in 2.
  
  He is disqualified from driving for four years, starting from May 2025. What’s the point? That overlaps with his prison sentence even if he gets out early (which he will).
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:03am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Under National/Act this sort of shit has to stop. A 4 day seminar with the Govt Caucus, Dudges and Corrections hierarchy, Ministry of Corrections top staff.
    More jails, not 5 star hotels!
    Shove them all in a conference center and they stay until there is a positive outcome. No delaying, no filibustering, just some down to earth business.
    They all need to know that NZ Citizens have had enough and want protection from these animals.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:31am
- nathie
  
  So confirmation that the Left’s beloved criminal gangsters were involved in the Parliamentary riots and fires.
  
  But, but, but, the Left and the MSM uncritically blamed the anti-mandate protesters for the riots …
  
  As for gangster Clark’s recklessness and yet more deliberate law breaking which saw an innocent law abiding person killed in Lower Hutt – the scumbag doesn’t deserve to walk amongst society anymore.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:12am
plc

“Stuff also approached Kelvin Davis for comment about the uncle’s complaint. However, the Minister for Children said it would not be appropriate for him to comment on the basis he is in the role in a caretaker capacity, while a new government is formed.”

Nothing can describe the low level of disdain I have for Davis. He has enriched himself where he was in a position to help “his people”.

In the old days he would have been labelled a charlatan, but to me he is just a complete piece of shit.
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November 3, 2023 8:20am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  An ornament that never does anything.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:35am
  - nathie
    
    Except he has been known to tell bad jokes at inappropriate occassions!
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:26am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Dad jokes or kiddie riddles?
      
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      November 3, 2023 6:40pm
- Random T Person
  
  And I got in trouble yesterday for using the name Chris Bishop had described himself with. Get Boosted not on, piece of shit OK. Got it.
  Also, I agree with your assessment.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:12pm
Dudley Quaffquaff

I see Wellington’s vaunted Citizens’ Assembly has laboured and brought forth a bunch of asinine platitudes in response to a stupidly vague question

https://wellington.scoop.co.nz/?p=156319#comments
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November 3, 2023 8:22am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Well, at least they didn’t demand more cycle pathways.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:48am
  - Dudley Quaffquaff
    
    Apparently a lot of people had a lot to say about cycle paths at the first meeting, very little of it good, but evidently they were guided away from that
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:22am
Maggie Pie

Does anyone know if the deal Dame Jacinda struck with ‘Blackrock’ to invest $10B in NZ’s climate-change infrastructure is still going ahead?

Last we heard they were going to establish a full-time corporate office here in Auckland with Cindy as their receptionist.
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November 3, 2023 8:23am
- John Loveridge
  
  I heard she would be working in the kitchen, wrapping the sandwiches.
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:55am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I thought she was making a personal investment.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:39am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Looks like $2B at least is heading for some investment fund
  
  https://www.nbr.co.nz/investment/blackrock-climate-fund-proceeding-irrespective-of-govt/
  
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/government-teams-up-with-us-investment-giant-blackrock-to-deliver-new-climate-fund.html
  
  (Not sure how I can invest my piggy bank’s contents into the scheme tho’)
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:57am
  - Master Mariner
    
    Maybe it will invest in this ?
    
    https://oilprice.com/Alternative-Energy/Wind-Power/Europes-Wind-Energy-Giants-Brace-For-Massive-Losses-And-Writedowns.html
    
    Since it appears to be going so well in the US //,
    https://oilprice.com/Alternative-Energy/Wind-Power/Bidens-Wind-Revolution-Faces-Setback-As-Major-Projects-Halted.html
    
    What did Kerry Packer say about Alan Bond ?? Immediately springs to mind Blackrock and ex-PM making “Captains Calls” ( Jesus I hate that statement) FWIW.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:24am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Why would you get Blackrock to invest in anything for 2Bn, when Grant was printing much much more on cycleways, invisible bridges, invisible light rail, Covid helicopter payments…
    
    $2Bn is chump change. Unless of course it is ensuring Blackrock gets a foot in the door.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:32am
    - Ghost
      
      Blackrock have more than their foot in the door. They’ve been involved with the pension fund since the Key government. They’re invested in spark, one of the main investors in Warner bros who own tv3. They’re the Amp and asb fund managers for kiwisaver and more. Actually they have their hooks in a number of areas.
      
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      November 3, 2023 11:37am
- Mr A Coates
  
  Key Order Koto Car Door, you’re spayking wuth Sunday, heh may Oi duhrekt your call?
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:39am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    😀
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:20am
- kevn
  
  Maggie… Interesting how there always a ‘whiff’ following her.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:12pm
info@cruzpro.com

Stuff article headline “How do you feel about the incoming government’s approach to the economy?”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300995647/how-do-you-feel-about-the-incoming-governments-approach-to-the-economy

But then does not actually enable you to tell them how you feel!
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November 3, 2023 8:26am
- sirknz
  
  Here I was thinking it was some custom blocking I had done on an element on the $1 media site…
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:46am
Scooter

There doesn’t seem to be much commentary on this story but it is extremely sad and maybe a snapshot of how bad it’s got in NZ. An innocent guy stabbed to death in a camp ground for his car by a teen on a rehabilitation course. He was looking forward to travelling around with a new vehicle but ended up dying alone. Guess what the eventual sentence will be.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/crime/tangarakau-campground-murder-trial-camp-staff-give-evidence-in-death-of-adrian-humphreys/JUSXRNEP7VACHBV5DCQHTYTGIU/#:~:text=That%20man%2C%2057%2Dyear%2D,Plymouth%20before%20Justice%20Francis%20Cooke.
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November 3, 2023 8:32am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Stuffs ‘headline’ earlier in the week was worded like he was in the wrong place at the wrong time…..casual victim blaming I thought to myself….
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:37am
  - Scooter
    
    So where in NZ is the right place at the right time, surely anyone should be safe in a civilized country, sadly NZ is no longer safe. How could a camp ground be a “wrong place” except when it is hosted by teenage criminals.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:59am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Rehabilitation works.//
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:57am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The details of the killing had been kept well under wraps until the trial.
  
  Police have not publicly released any information regarding how he died.
  
  It was only when the trial started that we learnt the chap had been stabbed to death and that a group of wayward youths had been at the campground.
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/133203080/remote-taranaki-campground-murder-trial-begins
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:05am
- ClanMcleod
  
  The US has it’s problems, but they know how to deal with scum like this. He was 14.
  
  No leniency for age. No excuses. Minimum 40 years behind bars. Good job.
  
  https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/feb/27/teenager-who-raped-and-killed-maths-teacher-sentenced-to-life-in-prison
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:15am
- nathie
  
  So the thug was receiving so-called “wrap around services” at the time.
  
  Clearly “wrap around services” is a failure and needs to be ditched in favor of harsher punishment in order to protect society and innocent law abiding citizens.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:33am
Jack5

Tova O’Brien sowing dissension in a new coalition government, before it’s even formed.

Does Stuff think Winston Peters might save the subsidies?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/301001519/tova-podcast-relationships-respect-and-resentment–getting-to-know-winston-peters
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November 3, 2023 8:40am
- Random T Person
  
  Just ignore ‘whip smart’ Tova like any other sensible person does.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:14pm
Maggy Wassilieff

I know Wellington is a small place…and you can’t always help who you have over for dinner…..

but there is such a thing as ethics and conflicts of interest still, isn’t there?

It was distressing to hear the Mayor speak on Newstalk ZB on Monday about councillors leaking information, which points to her predetermination of the outcome of the “independent review”. She also discussed her prior association with investigator Linda Clark, showing an obvious conflict. Once again, the Mayor herself discussed the proposed Reading deal.

https://wellington.scoop.co.nz/?p=156279
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November 3, 2023 8:45am
- kowtow
  
  Where’s Fire andFury and $1uffed now,
  Anyone watching the footage of the rioters on that last day could see who the mob consisted of .And they looked like mobsters out for a fight with the Cops and nothing to do with the Freedom Folk.
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:50am
  - kowtow
    
    Arg !
    
    Responding to the wrong Maggy W post .
    
    Shudda been for the parliament gangster one..
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:04am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Absolutely nothing to do with 99.9% of the people there.
    Any protest movement will have a small fringe element who get off on potential violent confrontation with authorities.
    
    That’s why Seymour’s list of demands to permit discussion with the protesters were a complete joke, and he knew it. He was playing politics trying to appear reasonable. Nothing could be further from the truth.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:20am
    - kowtow
      
      Yes that’s why I said they had nothing to do with the Freedom Folk.
      
      Clearly the rioters were just rent a mob turning up when the clearance started for no other reason than causing trouble.
      
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      November 3, 2023 11:58am
  - Matt Long
    
    “but there is such a thing as ethics and conflicts of interest still, isn’t there?”
    Badaboom, you’re on fire today Maggie, ethics and managing conflicts of interest in Councils, best I’ve heard all week.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:23am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Agree Kow,
    
    Odd how the agitators seem to appear at just the right time.
    
    Same deal at the Posy Parker event, I was surprised at how many fit straight young males were willing to attend a speech about womens rights and somehow found themselves on the side of the homosexual agitators.
    They also seemed well rehearsed .
    
    Didn’t see too many of the usual weak beardy weirdy hazy beer drinkers who store their stones in the wifes handbag.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:48am
    - Ghost
      
      Don’t confuse the trans with homosexusls. You’re more likely to find gay people supporting her than protesting her
      
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      November 3, 2023 11:10am
  - sirknz
    
    Where is Fire and Fury now?
    
    No elections for the next little while so nothing to see here…
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:49am
- sirknz
  
  Ethics and conflicts of interest only apply to people who aren’t on the authoritarian left.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:48am
cmm

“There were 21 New Zealanders, family members and permanent residents currently in Gaza”

OK, so mainly Gazans who came to NZ to get citizenship then go back to Gaza. Now the shit hits the proverbial and they expect us to bail them and their families out?

Far too many people do this with dual citizenship (and yes, I’m looking at many South Africans too).

If you want to take on the citizenship of another country then live there. Don’t just use them as a bolt hole.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/middle-east/301001474/israeli-ground-troops-advance-on-gaza-city-airstrike-hits-bureij-refugee-camp-and-nz-supporting-21-people-to-leave-as-soon-as-possible
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November 3, 2023 8:51am
- Cassandra
  
  Interesting speech by Australian PM John Howard in which he extols the virtues of immigrants adopting the values and mores of their new country while retaining aspects of their culture. Excl FGM I imagine.
  
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  November 3, 2023 8:58am
  - Matt Long
    
    FGM is western mainstream now, the mother’s call it Gender Affirming Care.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:25am
- emmess
  
  Roughly 800 people – including hundreds of Palestinians with foreign passports and dozens of wounded
  
  Dozens of wounded? (about 70 I have heard from other sources)
  Okay, so this is how you know the figures provided by the Hamas Health Ministry are bullshit.
  If 8500 are dead, mostly civilians they tell us, then should there not be tens of thousands of wounded, not 70?
  
  And as for refugee camps that would be called towns or suburbs anywhere else in the world.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:17am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    I believe the sentence you quoted is referring to the numbers with foreign passports permitted to leave Gaza. Not the total of injured.
    
    I don’t see anyone in international media disputing the number of dead, and yes, the number of injured will be many thousands. Joe Biden cast some doubt, but he doesn’t know what he had for breakfast let alone what’s happening around the world.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:30am
    - emmess
      
      Wrong!
      Dual passport holders AND injured
      
      hundreds of dual nationals living in Gaza who have foreign passports, as well as people who are injured and need treatment outside Gaza and its collapsing health system.
      
      https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/nov/01/what-is-the-rafah-crossing-and-who-can-now-use-it-israel-palestine
      
      As for Israel, not releasing Palestinian casualty numbers, I guess it is because they do not have enough access to know and don’t want to be accused of lying if found to not be 100% accurate.
      But they and many international media (even on the left) are saying take Hamas’ numbers with a grain of salt.
      
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      November 3, 2023 11:56am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Not wrong. Firstly – the original post and the paragraph you quoted came from ‘Stuff’.
        
        Roughly 800 people – including hundreds of Palestinians with foreign passports and dozens of wounded – have been allowed to leave Gaza over the past two days, under an apparent agreement among the US, Egypt, Israel and Qatar, which mediates with Hamas.
        
        You’ve found a completely different article and used a completely different quote from your original. Talk about discombobulation. Are you a politician by any chance?
        
        Second, I didn’t say anything about Israel’s position on the casualty figures.
        
        Back to the original post.
        
        The implication is that because it stated ‘dozens of injured’, the numbers of dead couldn’t possibly be accurate. That because there are only a maximum of 70 injured, the claim of 8,500 dead couldn’t possibly be true.
        
        Whether the 8.500 figure is accurate or not is irrelevant. The number of dead will undoubtedly be in the thousands, therefore the number of injured will be a multiple of this. Many thousand. The idea that there are only 70 injured is inane.
        
        I’ve read many versions of international media. No, some are casting doubt on the numbers from the health authorities in Gaza, but it isn’t ‘numerous’.
        
        https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/despite-bidens-doubts-humanitarian-agencies-consider-gaza-toll-reliable-2023-10-27/
        
        Nobody knows the exact numbers, but your conclusion that only 70 are wounded, ergo 8,500 can’t be dead is completely flawed logic.
        
        As for refugee camps being “called towns or suburbs anywhere else in the world”, you aren’t being serious I hope.
        
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        November 3, 2023 12:45pm
      - emmess
        
        It is not wrong
        Ok Stuff is not clear, big deal, that is not what I was disputing
        Go to a primary source then
        The point is the Egyptions are letting wounded out not just wounded dual passport holders
        
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        November 3, 2023 3:14pm
  - artemisia
    
    Hard to tell about the ‘camps’ but from photos they still seem to include large multi story apartment buildings. We do know though that hundreds of aid trucks a day went into Gaza, assume for those designated refugees.
    
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    November 3, 2023 5:23pm
- MCōs
  
  Years ago when I wanted to work in the UK I could have applied for a British passport if my father had been English. As it was my mother was English and it didn’t count.
  Instead I got a Right of Abode visa.
  It was all just a matter of convenience
  A Thai friend of ours hung around in NZ just long enough to get citizenship and left to join her husband in Oz before the ink was dry.
  Then there’s Peter Thiel who’s probably forgotten he’s a New Zealand
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:24am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    I got NZ citizenship in 1995. I had the option of EU, UK or Irish passport.
    I went with the EU version for the simple reason it made entry and exit into the UK and other European countries simple.
    
    Leaving and entering NZ I used the NZ passport.
    
    No long delays waiting in the ‘others’ queue.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:37am
- Blog-aholic
  
  You mean people like old uncle Ahmed Zaoui?
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:38am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I hope NZ is not moving to bring him back. He is in a high security prison in Algeria.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:11am
    - Jack5
      
      Zaoui was in trouble in Belgium once, too.
      You can read about this trial there here:
      
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/tracing-ahmed-zaouis-trial-in-belgium/HSZ5FTFVX6X3SRZD42HSZTQKIY/
      
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      November 3, 2023 11:37am
- kowtow
  
  That darling of the left /media Algerian Zouai being a classic example .
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:05am
- alloytoo
  
  My SA citizenship lapsed the moment I became a New Zealander.
  
  I think we should follow the Australians and prohibit MPs from holding dual citizenship.
  
  Don’t care if it wipes out the Green Caucus
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:59am
  - mawm
    
    Your citizenship has apparently been reinstated as what the govt did was illegal.
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:33pm
  - cmm
    
    “My SA citizenship lapsed the moment I became a New Zealander. ”
    
    To be pedantic, I think it was 6 months later.
    IIRC you have 6 months after taking a new citizenship to apply to SA for dual citizenship, otherwise your SA citizenship lapses/is revoked.
    
    Losing SA citizenship didn’t bring a tear to my eye.
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:47pm
Maggie Pie

Check out the BIO! 🙁

Can you believe such an evil sounding creature actually teaches at Auckland Uni?

https://twitter.com/cannibality
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November 3, 2023 9:00am
- cmm
  
  Worse, she/it is a parent!
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:05am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    When you link to the wife, even Kendra describes herself as….
    “a beastly maori communist”
    
    You might want to ask…what chance the kid?
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:12am
  - alphabeatrium
    
    Could be… her “co-parent” is another woman, and [checks notes] women can’t produce sperm, so at least one of them isn’t actually a mother.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:20am
    - Taieri
      
      women can’t produce sperm
      ———
      
      Transwomen can. And as we know Transwomen are women.
      
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      November 3, 2023 10:37am
  - Opie
    
    He. It’s a man, man
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:58am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Robert Rakete’s sister, daughter, relative…?
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:12am
  - Swifty
    
    Yes, child.
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:31am
  - Opie
    
    His son. This is a man.
    
    And an awful one at that
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:59am
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, does the ‘cannibal’ bit mean anything?
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:16am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    faaaaaaark….well spotted I&O 🙁
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:31am
- Random T Person
  
  I know it takes all sorts and what have you, but I prefer my culture to this odious persons by a very long shot, and I am willing to bet the outcomes of children raised in a christian-values setup (I am not religious, but appreciate those values deeply) are likely to be better than most.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:22am
- Blog-aholic
  
  She had to get the blue tattoo as it matches the blue eyes she has…..
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:40am
  - Opie
    
    If you scan the qr code on the chin it will tell you it’s a man
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:00am
- nathie
  
  She appears to be disrespecting pre-colonial Māori culture, customs and history by having tā moko (facial tattoo) at such a young age as it was meant to apply to high-ranking Māori i.e. those of high social status.
  
  Even Nanaia Mahuta, a relation of the Māori monarchy, didn’t receive tā moko until she was aged in her 40’s.
  
  Just saying.
  
  And why is she dabbling in communism which is another form of European inspired “colonialism” used to suppress and oppress people?
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:52am
  - Paulus
    
    Agreed – thought the Moko was an an honour for a mature Maori woman up to Kuia status.
    Now it is almost down to children – Watch for the first schoolgirl to get one.
    The so called tv ones are appalling and they should be ashamed of their views via their Moko chins.
    It does not make them look good as they are not real Maori as there are none..
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:08am
- ClanMcleod
  
  I wouldn’t let my child go to a university that employs something like that.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:39am
- plc
  
  83,600 posts – clearly not “working” at Auckland University
  
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  November 3, 2023 11:42am
Bridgenag

WOKE

woke is not anti-colonization. woke IS colonization
the first rule of woke club is: “you’re pretty much are everything you claim to hate”

it is a matter of no small wonder to me the extent to which the essential ideological swerve of the modern day wokester marxist industrial complex (and make no mistake, this has morphed into a full blown industry) has become projection of the wokelords’ own self-hatred and abject failure upon any who would dare gainsay them.
this is just astonishing. (for those of strong stomach, you can watch the video HERE)

https://boriquagato.substack.com/?utm_campaign=pub&utm_medium=web

What is woke?
An intolerant and moralizing ideology.

‘Woke’: an intolerant and moralizing ideology. It is often used to disparage a liberal progressive orthodoxy. Like its cousin ‘canceled’ the phrase bespeaks ‘political correctness’ gone awry. Though “woke” has its roots in anti-racism, it was mis-used so often that it lost any and all remnants of its original meaning.
Woke’s constant mis-use has ultimately resulted in the word representing all the problematic attempts to redefine society to conform to a very small minority’s understanding of how the world should operate.

https://open.substack.com/pub/rwmalonemd/p/what-is-woke?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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November 3, 2023 9:05am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Bridgenag – another excellent post and analysis by el gato malo.
  
  I’d just like to refer readers to this part of the post.
  
  It shows a video of the final of the US National Speech and Debate Association. A farce, described here in a Twitter post.
  
  This is the *final round* of the *most prestigious high school debate tournament* of the school year, and they made a mockery of it with their selfish, unintelligible performative rant.
  
  The worse part? The judges praised Team A for their bravery and courage and crowned them the national champions. This is sick. It’s anti-merit, anti-debate, and anti-American. No wonder droves of kids are quitting high school debate.
  
  https://x.com/j_fishback/status/1719060564633169921?s=20
  
  No wonder our schools and universities are falling apart. The woke, Marxist movement is destroying everything that has been good about western society.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:53am
  - Bridgenag
    
    What a team we are Clan!
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:07pm
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Not bad eh!!
      
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      November 3, 2023 2:13pm
Maggy Wassilieff

The predictors of child abuse in NZ

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/lindsay-mitchell-infant-deaths-are-not-fait-accompli
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November 3, 2023 9:09am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Every 5 weeks a child dies from abuse.
  How many being abused who have not died yet? The kids do not deserve this. They did not ask to be born from shit parents.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:22am
  - imalwaysright
    
    S.O
    
    You are correct , what about the ones who don’t die.
    
    Imagine the spectrum of violence these children experience every day. Friends, family , and teachers must know what is happening yet say nothing.
    Many of these kids must envy the dead.
    We must start executing the baby killing scum.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:00am
  - Paulus
    
    And what is the % who are defined as Maori ?
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:09am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Your guess could be the same as mine.//
      
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      November 3, 2023 6:43pm
- Kiwiguy
  
  Interesting read. A couple of quotes:
  
  “The victims are also disproportionately Maori. ”
  
  “Of all children having a finding of maltreatment by age 5, 83% are seen on a benefit before age 2.”
  
  So considering that ‘the benefit’ is a white colonialist invention, I suggest it should be removed immediately.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:36am
Chuck Bird

FYI

Why The Middle East Won’t Accept Palestinian Refugees

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7GAg8sWDpI
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November 3, 2023 9:11am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  OH dear, Palestinians have nowhere to go. Best NZ take some in.
  Oh wait. I think there were enough in Queen St last weekend.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:29am
Cassandra

Kiwiblog is an equal opportunity blog: I’ve just opened an advertisement for matatauranga, Maori knowledge. The thrust is that by combining Maori knowledge and modern science NZ can avoid flood damage. Just how the former contributes to the latter is not explained but I get the impression that koha is involved. I’ll stick to modern science thanks.
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November 3, 2023 9:21am
- Dudley Quaffquaff
  
  What do you call alternative medicine that actually works?
  
  Medicine!
  
  What do you call traditional Maori knowledge that is confirmed by science?
  
  Science!
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:40am
Swifty

Not white supremacy, not capitalism, not the patriarchy, not colonisation, not neo-liberalism, not racism and certainly not treaty breaches.

Let all New Zealanders understand that the root cause of this depravity and squalor is the implementation of the welfare state:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/133211711/baby-ru-death-neighbour-alleges-daily-drug-use-in-house-where-child-suffered-fatal-injuries

Through financial payments of taxpayer money, the New Zealand state has for decades subsidised and incentivised couples to separate, women to have children to losers, men to be deadbeats, men and women to opt out of work and responsibility and children to bear the consequences.

It’s one of the main reasons I despise Leftism – even though the evidence is right before their eyes they refuse to recognise the damage their policies cause nor to accept any responsibility for them.
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November 3, 2023 9:28am
- nathie
  
  “Not white supremacy, not capitalism, not the patriarchy, not colonisation, not neo-liberalism, not racism and certainly not treaty breaches.”
  
  Absolutely, that lawyer working for the mobsters appears to be ignorant of how the Mongrel Mob were formed – by disaffected pakeha in Hawkes Bay that were brought up (and abused) in borstals so they rebelled against normal society and law abiding citizens. Exactly what gangs are still doing now (pakeha/maori/etc).
  
  She should be working to dissuade gangster life, not supporting it!
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:41am
  - Taieri
    
    lawyer working for the mobsters appears to be ignorant of how the Mongrel Mob were formed
    ————
    
    The lawyer works for the mobsters because they pay her for it. Being ignorant or aware of how gangs were formed does not come into it. Lawyers work for murderers, rapists, thieves, former politicians, disbarred lawyers and all sorts of other low life. Should they only work for a good people?
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:41am
- MCōs
  
  I know plenty of people who have separated; none of them because they can get more money from WINZ
  Indeed get any money from WINZ (or whatever it’s called now)
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:45am
  - Swifty
    
    Ok, here’s a question to you.
    
    If there was no such thing as welfare payments to single parents do you think there would be more people separating, more, or about the same?
    
    And another question, if men knew that if they fathered children no-one would pay to look after their children if they, themselves, did not – do you think such men would father more children, less, or about the same?
    
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    November 3, 2023 9:54am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    Actually, you probably have no idea. I have known multiple people who “separated” for benefit purposes.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:00am
- Benedict Yu
  
  In the real world, couples do not separate so that they can financially benefit from WINZ. By “deadbeat” do you mean fathers who do not financially support their children? Of course there are some. However most men do support their kids on separation because they have no choice. The Government comes after them and the often considerable child support is deducted by their employers.
  
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  November 3, 2023 9:57am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    In the real world, you are correct. But on paper, as received be WINZ, it definitely happens. Also note that many Dads aren’t on their kid’s birth certificates for the same reason.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:02am
  - Swifty
    
    Please see Maggy’s link above.
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:13am
- RightNow
  
  Add to that the outright enabling of addictive behavior.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:37am
- miltonF
  
  Indeed. And it’s all enabled by the immoral act of theft (redistribution of wealth by force).
  
  People just really don’t get it. You can’t legalise immorality and expect a good outcome for society. This is just common sense.
  
  We have essentially legalised theft and are encouraging a growing underclass of legal thieves. Ask yourselves, how many thieves do you know that are “good” people? Not many. If any. So why are we promoting this?
  
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  November 3, 2023 5:20pm
Taieri

What would happen if someone was to stop a few oil tankers carrying refined petroleum products from reaching NZ ports?

Any National Party members care to comment? What would the incoming government do?
(The Green Party members are unlikely to read this blog of course, so there’s no need to ask them)
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November 3, 2023 9:42am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Contrary to what the Otago Regional Council thinks, if oil tankers stopped coming to New Zealand, it would be the end of New Zealand. Society would collapse. Tens of thousands would die through violence and starvation.
  
  https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/dcc/orc-stop-investing-fossil-fuels-after-review
  
  Perhaps we can do a trial run and just cut off petroleum supplies to Dunedin.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:00am
  - Taieri
    
    Perhaps we can do a trial run and just cut off petroleum supplies to Dunedin.
    ———-
    
    Behave yourself Benedict!;)
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:43am
    - NothingLeft
      
      Best cure for out-of-touch far-left beliefs would be subjecting the proponents to the consequences of their idiocy. A year or two in Venezuela, or in a poor gang-controlled neighborhood, or living un-subsidized lifestyle in a poor country like locals do. Basically any community where life is tough and unforgiving, work is hard and threats are major.
      
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      November 3, 2023 12:05pm
      - artemisia
        
        Like don’t work, don’t eat’- like a large swathe of the world.
        
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        November 3, 2023 12:29pm
- BananaLlama
  
  Also need to look at reacquiring the ability to refine our local energy reserves again even if it is in small quantities. Just common sense to have an insurance policy now that it looks like we are heading towards a global conflict so no surprise that Labour got rid of it.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:03am
- nathie
  
  Taieri: what are the challenges to overcome (and likely costs) for NZ to have its own merchant shipping re-established to continue trading (under the protection of the RNZN) if conflict breaks out in Asia or the Middle East halting vital imports and NZ exports?
  
  https://www.aspistrategist.org.au/lets-get-behind-an-australian-merchant-navy/
  
  The simple point is this: if you stop the sea traffic on which we depend, Australia stops. Not slowly; not gradually. Very quickly. Our seaborne exports are one issue, but not the most critical one. If someone stops bulk ore or liquid natural gas ships from taking our export trade away, things will grind to a halt relatively slowly. But if someone prevents just a couple of ships from carrying our refined petroleum needs into our ports, Australia will shut down very fast indeed. The pain in our economy from expensive petrol would be nothing compared with the pain of having no petrol at all.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:14am
  - Master Mariner
    
    https://www.bairdmaritime.com/ausmarine/ausmarine-shipping-and-offshore/opinion-lets-get-behind-an-australian-merchant-navy/
    
    NZ Is even more Isolated. Worth the read.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:56pm
  - Taieri
    
    Taieri: what are the challenges to overcome (and likely costs) for NZ to have its own merchant shipping re-established
    ————
    
    In my view there’re two main challenges.
    1. It is a very capital intensive industry, with relatively small returns on investment – I’m not sure there’s anyone in NZ capable of raising the required funds to purchase and operate a modern and reliable fleet.
    2. Availability of a qualified manpower. It takes a minimum 10 to 15 years to qualify as a master or chief engineer of a ship. In addition, there’s a need for a qualified shore support and suitable infrastructure, which doesn’t exist in NZ at present.
    
    The only entity that could at present potentially overcome the first challenge is the government. But the government has no money, hence “potentially” and I’m not sure that it appreciates the necessity and/or urgency.
    The second challenge is even more difficult, because of the age of the existing seafarers and their remaining small pool.
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:19pm
    - nathie
      
      Thnx.
      
      “The second challenge is even more difficult, because of the age of the existing seafarers and their remaining small pool.”
      
      Best the Govt get on with it as it will take years to rebuild the skillsets and experience i.e. better late than never … but got it, time is rapidly running out!
      
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      November 3, 2023 9:40pm
- kowtow
  
  We have so much coal it’s just not funny .
  
  We need to build a coal to petrol plant now .In Southland on top of the deposits .Get digging , get building , get independent, get sustainable .
  
  The alternative of being held hostage by anyone of so many evil imperial players such as Iran ,( and its many proxies) China , Russia and N Korea is simply not on.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:16am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    That’s what South Africa did. I worked on Sasol III in the early eighties.
    
    Maybe easier and cleaner to go nuclear?
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:04am
    - NothingLeft
      
      coal-to-liquid is competitive with global oil price, and would do great things for NZ saving us 4-5Billion a year in fuel imports and building more heavy engineering industry in NZ (that would pay off with network effects on other indsutry).
      
      There is a major cost increase for oil coming as exploration and development has all but halted as petroleum companies drunk the coolaid of end of oil mania and figured they would not get needed ~30yr payback on fresh investment.
      
      But back in reality only about 1% of cars are EVs, demand for them is collapsing, (too expensive + various issues) and oil consumption continues to increase.
      
      Interesting factoid; almost all coal is 300-350million years old. From era when plants learned to synthesize lignin, but nothing had evolved to break it down/digest it. (Hence lignite coal)
      
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      November 3, 2023 11:50am
      - kowtow
        
        As a matter of interest , the international business msm reporting the economic miracle that Guyana is about to experience now that huge oil reserves have been found in their waters .
        
        Of course here in Lalaland narey a peep.
        
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        November 3, 2023 1:24pm
    - BananaLlama
      
      Maybe easier and cleaner to go nuclear?
      
      That would be ideal since Australia has large amounts of Uranium deposits that we could use.
      
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      November 3, 2023 12:49pm
- Dudley Quaffquaff
  
  Which other imaginary scenarios do you think the Government should have a specific, detailed and published plan for?
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:20pm
  - Master Mariner
    
    Pandemic Plan.//
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:00pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    True, by getting dragged into debates about stuff like climate change, we’re unwittingly agreeing there’s a problem in the first place.
    It’s looking increasingly likely that the whole thing is a scam of massive proportions.
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:08pm
Ghost

Video for tomorrows Hezbollah speech shows them hitting a launch button

Twitter
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November 3, 2023 9:49am
Maggie Pie

A twitter bestie asks a good question…..

Is New Zealand going to get slowly overrun
by terrorist supporting immigrants & refugees
egged on by refugee and immigrant MP’s?

Hmmm.
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November 3, 2023 9:50am
- kowtow
  
  I thought we had a housing crisis for our poorest .
  
  Charity begins at home.
  
  No refugees ’till all NZers have a decent roof over their head .
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:18am
Benedict Yu

Yesterday I stopped by the viewing platform over the Otira Viaduct, west of Arthurs Pass.

https://www.arthurspass.com/index.php?page=11

It is impressive. There is a plaque saying it was opened by Jenny Shipley in 1999.

Here is the thing that caught my attention. It opened on time and on budget – $25 million. !!!!!

Using the RBNZ inflation adjustor that translates to $46 million today. (Let’s call it $50 million)

https://www.arthurspass.com/index.php?page=11

Could it be built today for $50 million? It is costing $300 million to refurbish a town hall and (still to be finalised) maybe $600 – $700 million to build a recreation centre in Christchurch.

What on earth has happened?
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November 3, 2023 9:51am
- nathie
  
  “What on earth has happened?”
  
  Maybe the coming together of the professional managerial class with the professional consultancy class and the professional health & safety class with the new kids on the block called the professional zero harm class all unrolling truckloads of RMA red tape around and around the engineers, by chance? 😉
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:09am
  - NothingLeft
    
    you omitted the biggest cost center; the professional grievance industry class.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:44am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Health & Safety has a lot to do with spiraling costs.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:49am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Health and Safety are in the business of putting small businesses out of business. I have dealt with them in the factory.
      
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      November 3, 2023 12:07pm
  - thirteenstars
    
    Indeed. Perfect storm. Once the rent-seekers got their legislative ducks all in a row the delays and cost inflation really got rolling.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:07pm
  - artemisia
    
    National Treasure Dr Bryce Wilkinson has written some excellent pieces on scaffolding regulation. This is one.
    
    http://www.nzinitiative.org.nz/reports-and-media/opinion/a-shoddy-tale-of-irresponsible-regulation/
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:09pm
    - thirteenstars
      
      Excellent.
      
      The cost increases are material. A Kapiti Coast builder told us that campaign had needlessly turned a $4,000 roofing job for an elderly lady into a $6,000 cost. A BRANZ study in 2014 put the (discounted) cost to the community at $1 billion over 25 years.
      
      There are unintended consequences. Higher costs make housing less affordable. Poorer owners in particular will defer necessary maintenance, and more homes will be unhealthy. Some owners will become unsafe ‘do-it-yourselfers’.
      
      Such considerations should be assessed before setting out to commander $1 billion of other people’s money. In a January 2015 article, we asked whether officials had done this. We found they had not. To impose such costs regardless is irresponsible.
      
      All done under National. Yet they are supposedly the party of reducing red tape and costs.
      
      I expect to see continued expensive scaffolding around even small jobs regardless of what the Nats maintain. I guess they’ll just “manage” the whole despotic, maniacal health and safety regime better.
      
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      November 3, 2023 1:24pm
- Inandout
  
  BY, contractors now have a minefield of consents to negotiate and they build in these delays in the costings. On a smaller scale, but indicative of how this operates, the new Whirokino bridge at Foxton (when first suggested by National) started at $25 million and by opening time in 2020 had reached $70 million. I learnt later that for the most part of the construction there were two men employed full time as ‘observers’ to watch for bones which may have been unearthed during construction; one from each Iwi. The original bridge stood for 90 years and was apparently built like the proverbial. Rail projects like the stupendous Raurimu Spiral would not be built today because the delays and consents would be horrendous.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:11am
  - artemisia
    
    Family I know wanted to subdivide a beach side piece of land into 6 or 7 sections. One of the many requirements was an observer every day from the local iwi, paid of course because there might be something there of interest. Found? Nothing.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:01pm
    - Bridgenag
      
      Think they are watching out for middens where bones will be discovered after a good feast
      
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      November 3, 2023 1:23pm
- greybeard
  
  Crikey, Benedict !
  Are you still tripping around the South Island ? Get back to work !
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:17am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    The Celica has 299,800 km on the odometer. Just getting run in. 🙂
    
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    November 3, 2023 10:34am
- NothingLeft
  
  I knew people involved in building that viaduct.
  
  During the construction local Maori crawled out of the woodwork and claimed that a particular large boulder that was to be disturbed had great historic cultural significance, taniwhas and whatnot. Much ceremony and koha was duly doled out to staunch their objections.
  
  A while later an old-timer from the region got talking to the construction crew, and was told about this. He informed them that the bolder in question had only come down the hill in a slip a few decades back. Local Maori had been making shit up as usual.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:35am
- Matt Long
  
  Clark, Key, Ardern happened, each one put in place stricter environmental, Labour and, health and safety laws, and got more and more lax on the engineering side.
  Not to mention cultural requirements.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:47am
  - H. Upmann
    
    …and the orange cone monitors.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:00am
- cmm
  
  $50M wouldn’t even make the PowerPoints and feed the taniwha – let alone slosh a single bucket of concrete.
  
  That is an astounding bit of engineering that took many engineers to conferences around the world and really put NZ civil/construction engineers on a pedestal.
  
  Given the challenges and risks, it had a lot of opportunities (and excuses) to have been delivered late and over budget. But no, they did the job extremely well.
  
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  November 3, 2023 10:47am
  - Bridgenag
    
    One of the blokes at bowls has a daughter going to Singapore to find out how to “green” Auckland ffs Paid by us
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:21pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  $50M might get some Council Offices refurnished.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:09pm
- sirknz
  
  What on earth has happened?
  ————–
  
  The religion of Health & Safetyism. It seems to be a predecessor or closely related to what we call ‘Environmentalism’ today.
  
  Adherents seem to believe that deaths, much like carbon emissions, can be reduced to zero so that everyone will live forever.
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:20pm
mandk

Here’s a good piece on why Labour lost the election:
https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/ananish-chaudhiri-labour-stuffed-up-that-s-why-they-lost-deal-with-it
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November 3, 2023 9:58am
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-rugby/133229310/all-blacks-captain-sam-cane-to-miss-super-rugby-pacific-2024-season-to-play-in-japan
It will be interesting to see if the new AB’s coach will take Cane back, not only as captain, which I doubt, but even into his squad .
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November 3, 2023 10:03am
- mandk
  
  I wouldn’t have him in the squad, let alone as captain.
  
  He was always too inconsistent, even when he wasn’t binned or sent off.
  
  Ardie is many times better as a player, and more inspirational as a leader.
  
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  November 3, 2023 11:21am
- Opie
  
  Given he is not the best 7 available and not the best captain, I can’t imagine he will feature highly on robertsons thought process.
  
  Foster continuing to play him there and as captain ultimately caused the downfall of the abs at the world cup.
  
  A lesson in management failure 101. Fascinating to watch
  
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  November 3, 2023 11:23am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Rubbish. Over zealous TMOs cost NZ the game.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:12pm
- thirteenstars
  
  Cane is another Taine Randell. Might be a nice guy but no leader and a fair to middling player.
  
  I suspect as Foster goes so will Cane. Though the NZRFU is now so woke it’s likely NZ rugby will continue its slide into also-ran status just as Australian Rugby has of recent times.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:11pm
- cas
  
  Are there any Japanese playing in the Japan rugby competition?
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:32pm
Yvette

Rob Sarkies starts production on Pike River Mine feature film in Greymouth – Newshub

Wouldn’t the producers be wise to check if Police are going to attempt to prosecute anyone for there not being a Ventilation Supervisor appointed at mine as an administration oversight, the lack of the miners themselves demanding such action – they been the first link in the chain of safety advice – or the union bosses for not properly representing there needs such an appointment?
It could markedly change the storyline
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November 3, 2023 10:28am
- Paulus
  
  Well why not – who was the Union Leader for the Miners ?
  Little Little.
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:29pm
Rusty

Why do the Beatles and the Stones seem to release new songs at the same time?

In 1994 Voodoo lounge and Beatles anthology was released.

Hackney Diamonds by the Stones and the new “Now and then” song by the Beatles.
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November 3, 2023 10:41am
ClanMcleod

This is a very good analysis of UK MP Andrew Bridgen’s speech to the UK covid inquiry held a week ago in their parliament.
The vast majority of MPs didn’t bother to turn up, even though it is their constituents who are dying in alarming numbers.

https://vigilantfox.substack.com/p/the-veil-of-silence-over-excess-deaths

We’ve experienced more excess deaths since July 2021 than in the whole of 2020, unlike the pandemic, however, these deaths are not disproportionately of the old, in other words, the excess deaths are striking down people in the prime of life but no-one seems to care. I fear history will not judge this house kindly.

Exactly the same applies in NZ, a subject that has been studiously avoided by almost every MP in the NZ parliament.

The new government need to instigate a proper inquiry during their term in power, there will problems going forward for many years if this thing is not addressed.

Here’s hoping Peter’s is making that his priority in any negotiations, because it was that position which got him over the threshold.
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November 3, 2023 11:14am
- septic skeptic
  
  A proper inquiry is certainly justified. But I think you have backed the wrong horse if you are counting on Winston. My bet is that if he is in a position to be negotiating anything the priorities will be some shiny baubles and a generous budget with not too much accountability. He ain’t Andrew Bridgen, that’s for sure.
  
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  November 3, 2023 11:27am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    septic skeptic – I had nobody else to count on, Luxon and Seymour refused to even discuss the topic, we’ll find out in due course I’m sure.
    
    If Peters doesn’t follow up on his talk and does take the ‘shiny baubles’ it will be the end of his political career and he won’t be remembered kindly.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:58am
- krazykiwi
  
  “The vast majority of MPs didn’t bother to turn up, even though it is their constituents who are dying in alarming numbers”
  
  The MPs demonstrated their industrial strength cowardice by staying away in droves.
  
  In contrast, the public gallery was completely full and despite being separated from the debating chamber by bullet-proof glass the public supporters could be heard banging on the glass in support.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:05pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

NZCPR. Losing the working class, Chris Trotter.

https://www.nzcpr.com/losing-the-working-class/
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November 3, 2023 11:22am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

‘Seymour says Governmentt deal possible next week.
Confirms he’s reached around to Wintson Peters’

– Jenna Lynch (Newshub)
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November 3, 2023 11:31am
- plc
  
  A turn of phrase almost as hideous as Helen Clark’s “Final Solution”
  
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  November 3, 2023 11:56am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

A referendum on the Treaty will backfire.

https://stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/dont-be-fooled-by-activist-dame-anne-salmond-here-reasoning-is-terribly-flawed/?
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November 3, 2023 11:31am
Burtland

seems the Reserve Bank is filling its pants about the farming sector having to pay for carbon emissions … the current carbon price is around $60/t

At $50/t, the bank summary said the proportion of non-profitable farmers “rises substantially” to 14% percent of dairy and 44% of sheep and beef, compared to that baseline of 6% dairy and 15% sheep and beef. This exposes banks to $4.1 billion of dairy lending and $4.8 billion in sheep and beef.

Theyve also kicked off stress test studies of the banks themselves to the farm sector paying for carbon emissions – surely Tane Mahuta is strong enough to carry the load?

https://www.farmersweekly.co.nz/farm-management/rb-gets-banks-to-model-emissions-costs-for-farms/
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November 3, 2023 11:32am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Simple fix – set the methane multiplier honestly (it’s currently at least 5 times what it should be) and make allowances for carbon sequestration in grass (not currently done because the grass only lasts short term – ignoring the fact that we calculate 100% of the animal emissions).
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:00pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    That is easier said than done. As I have commented previously, the current methodology for calculating methane emissions is set by the UNFCCC. It was developed over several years in the early 2000s by an international working group – led by New Zealand.
    
    I am not disagreeing with your claims about a better methodology – not my area of expertise. Simply pointing out the practical barriers to making change.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:28pm
  - BananaLlama
    
    they should include all the wood and water lots as well not the farmers problem that calculating them is too hard when they are getting hit for every molecule of emissions.
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:11pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  So James Shaw was totally indifferent to 14% percent of dairy and 44% of sheep and beef farmers going under. Good to know.
  
  BTW – Chris Luxon has just kicked the can down the road. He wants to give farmers a free ride for six years until “science” finds a way to reduce agricultural emissions. I have been hearing about this breakthrough being just around the corner for the last 20 years.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:30pm
Jack5

Where are you Alwyn Poole?

Secondary school principals in a survey select issues that apply to their schools.

What they selected as the top issue: support for students with mental health and wellbeing problems.

The country’s education system is sliding into the Third World while our schoolies think “wellbeing” problems are a top issue?

Is there any way out of the education collapse other than privatising the lot?

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/501583/mental-health-support-top-issue-facing-secondary-schools-survey
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November 3, 2023 11:33am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I asked Alwyn Poole about getting into the Education Dept a while back. He declined. He has other stuff on his plate.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:19pm
- Paulus
  
  In Tauranga Otumoetai is the largest new almost finished so called Primary School (actually called a Kura, not a Primary Scholl).
  It is large enough at three floors in two main huge buildings plus another hall for offices and Kapa Kapa.
  It replaces a good older school (sorry now Kura) 300 meters away.
  Local guess probably 18 million including as it is design outside tiled throughout, and air cons are widespread.
  Presumably replace and start next year as huge car parks are currently being concreted.
  Not sure where there are enough children locally to fill unless say an intermediate is included.
  Sure there is a Maori motive behind the whole thing.
  Not far away is a total Maori Secondary School (about 5 years old) but we hear nothing about it or its results’
  We hear that it delivers pupils from far and wide in their own coaches.
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:42pm
Maggie Pie

“Net migration continues to be driven by non-New Zealand citizen arrivals,
with about eight out of ten migrants arriving on a non-New Zealand passport”

– Tehseen Islam (Population Manager, Stats NZ)

Just saying.
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November 3, 2023 11:47am
- krazykiwi
  
  The meta-picture here is that liberal, post enlightenment Westerners are consciously breeding less, while the followers of more authoritarian, and in some instances barbaric religious groups continue to breed like rabbits. Global lifestyles will resemble pre-enlightenment authoritarianism within 100 years unless this trend is reversed.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:11pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    So why does NZ continue to bring them here?
    Is it a bit like the Democrats and the open border? They will vote Democrat as soon as they can?
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:23pm
    - krazykiwi
      
      Why? The same reason other Western nations have been doing likewise: To pay for future superannuation obligations.
      
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      November 3, 2023 12:26pm
      - kowtow
        
        That’s just the excuse govts ( particularly the Germans) use to justify the open borders.
        
        6 0
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        November 3, 2023 1:18pm
      - mawm
        
        The UN Global Migration Compact. It must be faulty as it seems to only work one way.
        
        5 0
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        November 3, 2023 2:03pm
      - Jack5
        
        Krazykiwi’s explanation for Western countries high immigration: “… To pay for future superannuation obligations.”
        
        That ain’t working. New Zealand’s ranking in nations’ GDP per capita, the measure of comparative international wealth, is falling with immigration.
        
        We’re down to 42nd in the world in GDP per capita, and our rate of GDP growth is 127th.
        
        NZ is run by economic zombies.
        
        The more population growth outpaces economic growth – and with that public infrastructure, health and education systems, and facilities like prisons – the more we slide behind others.
        
        Population growing faster than the economy, less money for superannuitants and other State dependants.
        
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        November 3, 2023 5:22pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        So then when all of the ‘old people’ die, then what?
        Oh, I see, it is continuous. Boxes, little boxes, and all made of ticky-tacky – or something.
        
        3 0
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        November 3, 2023 6:59pm
- Dudley Quaffquaff
  
  Sorry, I am confused. Surely all migrants, by definition, should arrive on non-New Zealand passports? If somebody arrives here on a New Zealand passport, they’re not a migrant.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:15pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Not always. My kids were born overseas & arrived here on an NZ passport.
    
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    November 3, 2023 7:33pm
- MCōs
  
  From my observation when I was in hospital recently almost all the nurses in my ward were immigrants
  Furthermore
  The doctor in charge of that particular section told me they had problems with understaffing
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:49pm
  - Fuzzysnuggleduck
    
    These staff don’t want to cut your throat or throw gays off rooftops though. You are probably talking about Phillipinos.
    
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    November 3, 2023 11:47pm
TripeWryter

I’ve just been reading in The New Zealand Herald a review of Ms. Information, a movie about Dr Siouxie Wiles.
The reviewers write: ‘Siouxsie … doesn’t tolerate bullies.’
Didn’t she write a letter to the Royal Society of New Zealand demanding the expulsion of several fellow professors and the like who had challenged a new orthodoxy about Matauranga Maori in science in schools?’
Then like all bullies when they’re stood up to she pleaded victimhood when the backlash got a bit hot for her.
The movie sounds so reverential it might result in her canonisation.
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November 3, 2023 12:04pm
- krazykiwi
  
  ‘Siouxsie … doesn’t tolerate bullies.’
  
  This strategy appears to be in play.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:14pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Bang on!
    You beat me to it.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:24pm
- John Loveridge
  
  The more Matauranga Maori spreads and takes hold in New Zealand, the poorer the country will be.
  
  With a nod to Swifty.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:53pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘canonisation’
  
  Needs two miracles.
  
  Already done !
  
  We had the miracle of the masked multitudes and then the miracle of swimming that wasn’t really swimming .
  
  In fact some enterprising preacher type could buy up property around Freemans Bay , build a basillica and charge the hordes of pilgrims a fortune for vials of sand from the beach she paddled at , sea water that her disciple did swim in , pieces of the true mask , indulgences to save us from future plagues .
  
  Could even have a Via Dolorosa where the pilgrims re enact the route of the lockdown busting 5 km cycle they took from the lock down domicile to the beach .
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:14pm
- Taieri
  
  Siouxsie … doesn’t tolerate bullies
  ————
  
  Bullies never do. They can’t face the competition.
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:22pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  The review is nauseating bullcrap. The women is another narcissistic fraud, just like Ardern, Hipkins, Bloomfield, Verrall and every other pusher of this fake narrative.
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:50pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Hagiography
  
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  November 3, 2023 7:34pm
nathie

It’s the last couple of hours of the Labour caretaker government!

Wonder if the Beehive shredders are still shredding and the bonfires are still burning and if the cupboards are so bare that they look as if they have been freshly installed?

Is there any truth to “reports” that Air NZ’s Koru Club lounges are running out of Chardonnay and all the seats have been taken over by Labour MP’s and their staffers? 😉
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November 3, 2023 12:10pm
- Ghost
  
  Labour will remain government until sometime next week when Luxon goes to the governor general to inform her that he can form a government. That is why Brownlee and Sepuloni are both going to the conference next week, labour will still be the government then.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:15pm
  - Drone
    
    Hopefully Ghost it will only be a part of next week. It’s interesting that the country has survived for three weeks on minimal government maybe we should try for a year..
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:28pm
    - MCōs
      
      The ABs lost, the Blackcaps have lost three times, the Blackferns and the Kiwi league team have both lost since the election
      
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      November 3, 2023 1:39pm
- Swifty
  
  Ring the bells nathie!
  
  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0rPHy8-vUlo&pp=ygUOUmluZyB0aGUgYmVsbHM%3D
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:22pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Donald Trump junior is a fraud for getting accountants to do accounting. How about that?
One other thing he said was if Mar-a-Lago was worth only $18M he would have ten thanks.
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November 3, 2023 12:14pm
Swifty

“The more Islam spreads and takes hold in New Zealand, the poorer the country will be.”

Swifty, November 3, 2023.
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November 3, 2023 12:18pm
- David Garrett
  
  Swifty: It is much worse than that…you might like to find my guest piece on here “An argument for the complete cessation of Muslim immigration”, written a couple of years before the 2019 attacks.
  
  My opinion on what lies before us if we keep taking Muslim immigrants is entirely unchanged; nothing has happened since I wrote it to change my view in any way.
  
  [Mod – adding link to David’s post]
  
  David Garrett on A case for immediate cessation of all Muslim immigration
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:36pm
  - Swifty
    
    Why are you reading my posts?
    
    I am just a gutless, anonymous poster.
    
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    November 3, 2023 12:50pm
  - Taieri
    
    Your protagonist in the linked post makes much out of “diversity”. But “diversity” understood in this way is an antithesis of cohesion and no society can function without the latter as it splits into competing tribes. This is what is happening in many countries right now. Do we really want that in NZ?
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:27pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Thanks for addding that Mod.
    
    As an aside, when the mosque attacks happened in 2019, DPF came under considerable pressure to remove my post of four years before. To his great credit, he refused, doubtless on free speech grounds.
    
    For those who read it then, or feel inclined to read it now, you will see that nowhere in the piece have I advocated violence of any kind – just the exclusion from our society of persons belonging to a faith and code for living that is a total anathema to us, and a very real existential threat to our way of life. As the hapless countries of western Europe – Sweden perhaps being the worst example – which have allowed their Muslim populations to reach and exceed 5% have found to their great cost.
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:38pm
Chris Nisbet

Apparently, “Climate Change!” is going to cause springtimes in Auckland to get drier.

As I look out at _another_ wet day in Auckland, and also see that dam levels have been at 100% for well over a year, all I can think is thank God for that.

Although, as well as getting drier it’s also going to get more flooding – that’s so that ‘Climate Change!’ can be blamed no matter what happens.
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November 3, 2023 12:57pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Bugger – the golf course will be wet tomorrow.
  
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  November 3, 2023 12:59pm
alex Masterley

mmm.
Newsroom suggesting that the anticipated swing left from specials may not happen.
Even Mt Albert is said to be in play!
All rumour I know but interesting.
Still we will know in an hour.
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November 3, 2023 12:59pm
- kevn
  
  alex… Hard to imagine any overseas special voters going with labour, after the border lockdowns and MIQ debacles. Many were caught up in it all.
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:22pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    I am not sure that there are that many overseas specials. But i agree with you that NZ becoming a hermit kingdom created unbeliveable dislike of labour.
    
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    November 3, 2023 1:25pm
    - kevn
      
      Alex… Indeed, but all the NZ based families caught up in the lies will be thinking the same. A ripple effect.
      30 minutes on will tell us something.
      
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      November 3, 2023 1:29pm
    - Paulus
      
      Understood this time only about 80,000 Overseas votes – all others local.
      
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      November 3, 2023 1:45pm
      - Steve Todd
        
        There were 61,037 valid Overseas special votes in 2020.
        
        1 0
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        November 3, 2023 8:26pm
- David Garrett
  
  Alex: Did you notice the piece on Stuff this morning on what effect the specials will have – my vote is one of them – on the overall result? The writer was quite clearly hoping against hope that the “usual” pattern of the left being favoured would be repeated again, and that the Nats would lose one or even two seats.
  
  Their bias is so blatant now that even if they are trying to hide it – which I doubt – they can’t.
  
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  November 3, 2023 1:50pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    David – I saw the piece. I read it. My reaction was along the lines of Darryl Kerrigans line in the Castle – “…he’s dreaming…”
    
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    November 3, 2023 2:15pm
    - David Garrett
      
      Alex: I’m afraid their glee has been proved justified old boy.
      
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      November 3, 2023 5:02pm
Maggie Pie

Just shot down and grabbed my weekly ‘Clik & Collect’ from NW.
It suddenly occurred to me we haven’t ordered Mushrooms for nearly 3 months.
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November 3, 2023 1:12pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Free ones growing down at the parks.
  Dunno what variety, they don’t look normal.
  
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  November 3, 2023 7:06pm
kevn

Maggie… The Aussie mushroom dinner host story put you off?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/australia-mushroom-poisoning-erin-patterson-charged-with-three-counts-of-murder-five-of-attempted-murder/ML24IVPDGNEWHJEYZQ746VRJX4/
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November 3, 2023 1:30pm
ClanMcleod

KB commenter Alwyn Poole is currently on RCR.

https://realitycheck.radio/

Talking about evidence he presented to Ashley Bloomfield’s office in March 2021 re the fact that they knew then that the jabs did NOT prevent transmission of the virus.

He reminds us of Ardern saying that those choosing not to get jabbed would receive no penalties at all.
Then 40% of the workforce were mandated to get jabbed. Lying bastards, particularly Hipkins.

Incredible information, considering the whole narrative was driven that taking this jab would protect granny everyone else.
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November 3, 2023 1:54pm
Maggie Pie

Thort I’d posted this earlier in the week but can’t find it now…..

Anyone thinking National’s ‘15% Foreign-Buyers-Tax’ on Residential Property
won’t be a goer, better think again 😀

https://twitter.com/newscomauHQ/status/1719222673841201376
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November 3, 2023 1:56pm
lifesgood

As I thought NZ first needed. I’m OK with that. Would have preferred not but if Winnie gets some baubles it’ll be alright. His voice won’t be all that powerful anyway.
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November 3, 2023 2:05pm
ClanMcleod

Apparently National have dropped back 2 seats. They’ll need Peters.

Get the popcorn out.
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November 3, 2023 2:06pm
cmm

The electoral commission say they could process the final vote count faster if they had a bigger budget. Why?

It makes no sense to me.

If you have a number of votes to count then you can have either:
* Many people counting them quickly.
* Less people counting them slowly.

But the amount of labour involved, and therefore the cost, is about the same.

But what’s really a bigger problem is having so many special votes in the first place. A bit of thinking and process improvement could massively reduce the need for special votes.
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November 3, 2023 2:06pm
- Nickc2
  
  The longer it takes to count votes, the more susceptible the count is to being corrupted eh?
  IMO, money has nothing to do with the count, it’s the people involved.
  
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  November 3, 2023 3:09pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    You must know Hillary……
    
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    November 3, 2023 7:09pm
cmm

Shaw is crowing about the best Green result ever.

Unfortunately he’s right, though it is a terrible result for the trajectory of NZ.

Ditto Maori.

This is no win for National. National did worse in this election than they did in 2017.

Read the tea leaves people. Things are not going to improve long term.
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November 3, 2023 2:17pm
- Nickc2
  
  I tend to agree with you so far.
  If Nat/Act/Winst don’t kick some arse in their first three years, I don’t hold out much hope for them in the coming years. The last election was a golden opportunity for a Right Leaning Coalition Govt, but they lost out to the rantings of a Left Leaning MSM, University Radicals, and out and out Racists.
  
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  November 3, 2023 3:01pm
- mogg
  
  You are forgetting that this election National were fighting not only Labour’s media mouthpieces, but also an overtly biased MSM who have received vast amounts of tax payer money through advertising and PIJF funding. Every time National made a statement Labour’s opinions and histrionics from their union mates were placed front and fore, given the opportunity to ridicule the message before the voters got to hear it.
  
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  November 3, 2023 3:49pm
cmm

Greens: “We are also proud to be joined by the first Member of Parliament in Aotearoa who is Vietnamese.”

I thought you had to be a New Zealander to become an MP! But no – here’s a person who is Vietnamese!

If this person wants to be thought of as Vietnamese then why are they taking NZ citizenship?

PS: Not even Aotearoa New Zealand. Just Aotearoa.
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November 3, 2023 2:22pm
- David Garrett
  
  cmm: Unless someone does something, and soon – such as a CIR on the name of the country – New Zealand will be erased in less than ten years, probably five.
  
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  November 3, 2023 5:00pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/301002129/police-to-take-to-kpiti-island-in-search-of-missing-kayaker-michaela-leger
Unbelievable !
Nearly 2 weeks since she took the kayak at Raumati Beach and they are only now going over to Kapiti Island to check it out !
Could there be a more incompetent police force in the world !?
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November 3, 2023 6:16pm
Maggie Pie

Given Te-Maori-Pardy ended up with 6 MP’s, who’ll be funding them now?

Just curious.
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November 3, 2023 6:41pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Who? who who like a more- pork.
  We all know who, who, who.
  
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  November 3, 2023 7:14pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Did you see where Bish actually INCREASED his vote in Hutt-South?
    
    No wonder milkey’s gone all dog on us 😀
    
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    November 3, 2023 7:21pm

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