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August 13, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 13 August 2023

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General Debate

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CJames

I see from other email newsletters I receive that Tuku Morgan (he of expensive underpants infamy) is threatening to take the NZ government to court if they change the 5 waters legislation. He boasts they have never lost a case – spoiler alert – they have. This would be an interesting case. If a democratically elected government changed a law that had previously been introduced without it being an election policy or meaningful consultation occurring, would the Courts support the Maori elites? That would really test the NZ political system. Is it Parliament or the Courts that make the rules? Remember the attempted entrenching ? Why the Israeli system is in turmoil as the courts there say they are above the parliament. Their parliament introduced a law to change that so the left protested. And I do hope the Maori leaders have to fund their own court action.
Or is Tuku just bloviating as he is terrified of losing his boondoggle and he will have to pay for expensive clothes himself?. Though I doubt that he puts his hand in his own pocket. No doubt it is a Kingitanga expense claim ripped off from Tainui beneficiaries. IIRC, their audits were being tagged about impropriety around expenses.
The Taxpayers Union are drafting legislation that can replace 5 waters but without Maori elites being supreme rulers. This is done by real experts, not the sycophantic ones the Labour government use. Remember all the corrections they had to do on the ones already passed but not enacted? I do hope a new centre right government picks the Taxpayer Union one up and runs with it.
It is worth noting that Labour has to pass three new laws before the end of the month to bring 5 Waters in. Can they do that without stuffing it up? Or will Chippie go against the Maori caucus?
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August 13, 2023 8:01am
- Inandout
  
  The next government can then request all material that led up to the 3 waters legislation. This whole business has a stench of family looking out for the bros.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:06am
  - imalwaysright
    
    Mahuta and CuzzieCorp are trying to assemble publically owned infrastructure under the umbrella of a single entity which they control.
    
    They will then use the assets borrow tens of billions from overseas.
    
    They will keep the money and we, as those who technically are still the owners of the assets, will have to pay back the tens of billions plus interest.
    
    This is why mahuta tried to entrench 3 waters, it made the assets a better, more secure bet for financers.
    
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    August 13, 2023 11:59am
- Tricati
  
  I’m hoping that when Labour push the additional 3/5 waters legislation through before parliament closes for the election, that National/ACT have their acts together and start asking some searching questions as to the real impact of Mana o te Wai Statements, the change in Labour’s interpretation of what democracy is and what is their policy on co-governance as they have never explained or run on it as an election policy.
  Great opportunity for National & ACT to put some heat on, but alas, I fell they will roll over like the apology to Tova O’Brian for calling out her crap – Gutless.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:19am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Tuku is high up on the Elite Maori list as part of the Coup.
  Dangerous man.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:42am
- pdm
  
  ` would the Courts support the Maori elites’
  
  At present almost certainly.
  
  In fact this is the sort of case where the loss of the Privy Council (thanks for that Margaret Wilson) will be most sorely felt by almost all New Zealanders.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:44am
  - peterwn
    
    Mood of the UK Government was to terminate Privy Council appeals (except for the remaining colonies) anyway. NZ had no choice but to set up a Supreme Court to replace Privy Council appeals. As it was its Judicial group rule that it was not competent to rule an aspects of the law that were peculiar to NZ. A lawyer I know went to London, turned up at 11 Downing St and was told the group would not hear the case as it was not conversant with relevant NZ law. Money down the gurgler.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:30am
    - fernglas
      
      Really? The Privy Council dragged NZ lawyers halfway round the world only to tell them when they got there that they weren’t competent to hear the case? Sounds unlikely.
      
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      August 13, 2023 5:07pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘Meaningful consultation” or some such is still in there , whatever that means and the way our courts are going it could still mean the Maori Elites get to wag the dog.
  
  The democratic principle of the rule of law means accountability to all voters ,equally .
  
  We are still on the road of race inequality and division.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:34am
- surfing
  
  “And I do hope the Maori leaders have to fund their own court action.”
  
  Are you joking? Maori fund nothing, but take all.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:36am
  - Spring Bank Westie
    
    You’re quite right surfing, and this fact will be conveniently be hidden whenever possible.
    
    I’m still annoyed after all these years that Tuku Morgan is still recognised for buying and wearing $80 undies.
    
    The real issue wasn’t how much the undies cost, it was that someone in a governance position of a (I believe) public funded entity that was going broke saw this happening and his first reaction was “I’d better spend my clothing allowance fast while there’s still some money left”.
    
    Despicable behaviour from someone who should never have been given any position of authority again. But then, that’s not how it works, is it?
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:11pm
    - Stellaboxer
      
      People like Morgan ( wow what an amazing Māori surname) are in my opinion just professional Māori grifters. Their eternal dilemma is of course that they’re known and recognised as grifters but desperately want to be taken seriously for whatever they happen to be identifying as and peddling at present. Whatever heights they achieve during daylight will always disappear at night when they lay awake at night wrestling with their imposter syndrome.
      
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      August 13, 2023 9:20pm
- GJM
  
  It will be an interesting one. COLFO went to court for the defacto banning and confiscation of certain types of ammunition without compensation. They lost, with the court judgement being that yes it was wrong and probably against the bill of rights, but Parliament is sovereign and if that is what the law says, then so be it. Also shows how useless the so called Bill of rights is.
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:27am
- AC
  
  I say bring it on! What expertise does he have in infrastructure management . Zero . But he got appointed Chair of one of the water entities. I wonder if taxpayers would end up funding his litigation.
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:55am
Benedict Yu

This is a good example of the episodic weakness and timidity of Chris Luxon.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/insensitive-and-innappropriate-christopher-luxon-adresses-national-mps-tweet-about-today-fm-going-off-air/ONOKONUAIBGPLEKFPWHHB5BLQE/

Tova Obrien writes stupid article saying there is a split betwen Chris Luxon and the National Party.

Chris Penk MP tells her that “her poor ratings crashed a radio station”. Brilliant.

Chris Luxon chased down for comment. Tells journalists that Penk’s comments were “insensitive and inappropriate”.

Chris Luxon should have replied that his MP was correct and that Tova Obrien should stop writing stupid stories.

It is easy to forget (I did until I checked today) that National received 44 percent of the votes in 2017. Now they are stuck in the mid 30s. It is looking more likely than not that an ACT National Government will need the support of New Zealand First to govern with all the poor consequences of such an outcome.

If National and ACT do make it over the line, it will be down to the horror show of the current government rather than a resurgent popular National Party led by Chris Luxon.
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August 13, 2023 8:03am
- Luke Piewalker
  
  Message to Chris Luxon : Go Woke. Go Broke.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:08am
- CJames
  
  I agree. Luxon was a wimp giving in to Twitter pressure. Just sets him up as a target for more backdowns. How about politicians that actually grow a pair?
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:13am
  - Gravelroad
    
    Same as what they did when they went hysterical over the Twitter con and got rid of Simon Bridges – a leader who actually “had a pair”.
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:57am
    - kowtow
      
      That was a coup d’etat managed by the so called fourth estate that our Wayne seems so enamoured with.
      
      Talking of which there were two significanr stories about this BlackRock/Fink/Ardern business yesterday .
      
      One in NZME , O’Sullivan saying it was an Ardern initiative and giving She Who Saved Us all the credit ( if there’s any due , which I doubt) while the other was in interest.co.nz saying it’s all come from Blackrock ( which means Ardern was their pawn) ……..who to believe ?
      
      Who to “trust”?
      
      Is someone engaging in disinformation ?
      
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      August 13, 2023 9:41am
    - Jack5
      
      Luxon was wrong.
      
      Woke 1, National 0, after this own goal.
      
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      August 13, 2023 10:39am
  - yossarian
    
    Luxon had this delusion that if he’s nice to the media, they’ll be nice to him. Reality check buddy; the media are part of what I think Karl Du Fresne labelled the left wing cabal. This includes the media, academia and the bureaucratic elites.
    
    They will never like you, and appeasing them only encourages them to go even harder. No you don’t have to be hostile to them, but they’re never going to be your friends.
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:02am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Show where Luxon gave into twitter? Penk retweeted his apology, never heard Luxon say he expected him to apologise
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:43am
- Souvlaki
  
  Luxons timidity and generally flaccid state has certainly facilitated Peters resurgence…big time imo!
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:20am
  - Matt Long
    
    “2023 Election Commitments
    New Zealand First
    1.New Zealand First will not form a government with the Labour Party, whether in Coalition or as a Confidence and Supply partner.”
    Unfortunately not signed in blood.
    https://www.nzfirst.nz/2023_commitments
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:31am
    - Gravelroad
      
      Will mean absolutely nothing on the day.
      We could have 2017 situation again where Peters holds the power.
      His old man vanity will get the better of him.
      Look out for Ginny Andersen as your new Prime Minister – breath of fresh air, nice smile, youth adjacent etc.
      You don’t think this could happen?
      It did.
      
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      August 13, 2023 9:54am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Don’t laugh, Seymour has given Peters his out for not working with Labour ever again
        
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        August 13, 2023 10:44am
    - yossarian
      
      He will not go with the “Labour party” but he could go with with the “Labour and Green Party?” See it’s not the same.
      
      I don’t know why people want to run that risk
      
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      August 13, 2023 10:04am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        That won’t be enough, they would also need the TPM nutters, and that right there is scared enough, we need rid of any remnants of the 2017 debacle
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:15pm
  - Cassandra
    
    Typical Luxon response. I despair – he can’t seem to make his mind up about anything or stick up for anybody. No wonder National is in the doldrums when it should leading a charge. “National has principles but if you don’t like them I have others”.
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:34am
- emmess
  
  Pathetic Luxon
  Just pathetic
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:26am
- Wayne Mapp
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Benedict,
  You know perfectly well that MP’s from major political parties do not attack journalists.
  When I saw Chris Penk’s comments, I was pretty sure he would be in trouble from the leadership of the party.
  Major parties don’t indulge themselves in the way smaller parties do. The reason being is that the idea of the fourth estate has some real relevance in a democracy, especially for the major parties that form the core of governments. They don’t, and should not be, going to war against the media.
  Even today the MSM has a breadth of news gathering, comment and analysis that alternative media simply can’t match, and in my view, are unlikely to ever do.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:34am
  - Cassandra
    
    This wasn’t attacking the media, it was Penk having a witty whack at a toxic journo who is a failure. Occasionally National has to get off the fence.
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:36am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      And what he said is not sn attack? I give up
      
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      August 13, 2023 12:16pm
  - Souvlaki
    
    Wayne,…how about some ‘ loyalty’ from the leader huh? Particularly since Penk was correct , and it was a MOST inoffensive tweet!
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:43am
    - Colville
      
      And it was funny! 😁
      
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      August 13, 2023 9:01am
  - Andrew Worth
    
    I find the MSM shallow, once they actually did “in depth” analysis, that is no longer true.
    Some alternative media have them utterly beaten on that score (though obviously many are even more propagandistic than the MSM).
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:44am
    - James Stephenson
      
      Alternative media wear their biases openly, MSM pretend to neutrality but as can be seen by the response to Penk’s tweet from Dallas Gurney they are Team Labour to the core.
      
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      August 13, 2023 8:49am
  - artemisia
    
    I agree, Mr Mapp. And Mr Luxon is not stupid, has experienced advisers and will not have shot from the hip on this.
    
    Mr Penk has done the apology thing, probably enough to close the issue down.
    
    For the record, IMO opinion a good post from Mr Penk, but this time in the cycle politics rule. OK??
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:47am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Wayne Mapp – there is no worthwhile fourth estate in NZ. Hasn’t been for quite some time and the current lot lost any relevance when they sold their souls for the PIJF.
    
    There are a bunch of stenographers and shills writing and publishing whatever pays them the most.
    
    That is why alternative media is rapidly replacing them as a source of trustworthy information.
    After 3 years of mainstream media bleating on and on about “mis/dis information” without once giving a clear example of what the hell they were talking about, they are done.
    
    It will take some very hard work and many years to get any integrity back.
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:53am
  - Michael Sommerville
    
    Wayne, if the NZ MSM was unbiased and disinterested I would understand the principle but when the MSM is so blatantly biased against any party that is seen to be right of centre, I cannot agree with you and I believe that all right of centre politicians should be calling them out.
    
    If you see something you do not agree with or wish to comment on, you should be free to do so.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:00am
    - rockape
      
      How many fronts do you want to fight on. MSM, Labour, Greens , anti Vaxers etc. Hitler learnt that lesson.
      
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      August 13, 2023 11:23am
  - Joely Doe
    
    Not sure about that
    
    Thomas Cranmer at Cranmer’s Substack is showing up established journo’s on a regular basis
    
    Insightful commentary and breaking stories well ahead of MSM
    
    Never gets the credit or attribution from MSM either
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:00am
  - CJames
    
    Wayne,
    Why do politicians not attack journalists when the latter continually deviate from reporting facts and do just opinion, almost all of it hostile to one side? Can the public ever forget Jessica then Tova? That alone showed she is not impartial.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:03am
    - Stephen Russell
      
      Wayne’s analysis is essentially correct: Like it or not (and I don’t) the media have the main parties by the delicate parts. It is perilous to criticise them even when they thoroughly deserve it.
      
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      August 13, 2023 10:03am
      - artemisia
        
        Ways and means! There’s the taxpayer chequebook….
        
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        August 13, 2023 10:30am
      - GJM
        
        2hile truee, given the media are bought and paid for lefties, why not call them and their fake news out on it? Reminding people regularly that they are the state funded media who signed up to toe the party line for money. It worked for Trump at least once if kt twice, even though he was not supposed to win.
        
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        August 13, 2023 10:31am
      - Jack5
        
        Stephen, the Internet changed the rules.
        
        Politicians of the past may have had to kowtow to the old “Main Stream Media.”
        
        Today’s “MSM” is shrivelled economically and dependent on taxpayer subsidies from today’s politicians.
        
        The internet allows speedier, far more diverse, mainly free information sources.
        
        Meanwhile changes in retailing patterns and alternate advertising such as the World Wide Web throttle MSM income.
        
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        August 13, 2023 10:52am
    - rockape
      
      Penk should have got the young Nats to post that for him.
      
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      August 13, 2023 11:24am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        It doesn’t matter, he got the burn in, she will shut her mouth for a while
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:17pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “You know perfectly well that MP’s from major political parties do not attack journalists.”
    
    No I was unaware.
    
    You are totally wrong about the mainstream media. What kind of “analysis” does Stuff and the NZ Herald do? I haven’t seen any. Not for years anyway.
    
    Some examples of outlets that do better “analysis” than MSM:
    
    https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/
    
    http://offsettingbehaviour.blogspot.com/
    
    https://croakingcassandra.com/
    
    https://www.dailywire.com/
    
    I could provide you with another 50 examples, but I think my point is clear.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:12am
    - Observant Octagenarian
      
      I’m currently on my winter sojourn in Mooloolaba, reading the Australian papers daily.
      The “Australian” is slightly right wing but not ashamed about it, sometimes referring to “those pinko rags ‘The Age and The SMH””.
      If you read two of these, the truth is somewhere in the middle.
      It’s similar to the UK, where you have to read The Guardian and either the Times or Telegraph to discover the truth.
      Unfortunately there are no equivalents in NZ.
      
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      August 13, 2023 12:14pm
    - Tom Hunter
      
      Wayne’s fulfilling one role here that’s increasingly familiar to Right-wingers aware of it, which is that of gatekeeper. He constantly criticises the Right for the things he does not criticise Left for.
      
      Aside from that, you might all want to consider the possibility that he hasn’t strayed far from his Labour roots, and that the reason he defends the MSM is that they support most of the same stuff that he does, especially the big issues on climate change and Maori issues – and every Covid policy back in the day.
      
      Nothing better than having the MSM and Lefty activists pave the way towards turning public opinion while your “moderate Centre Rightist” polly sails in it’s wake: “Oh Dear, there’s nothing we can do against the majority”
      
      The only real question is how many more are there like Wayne Mapp in National? I think it’s more than a few: he and Finlayson sailed in friendly seas.
      
      You are right. There were (and are) a substantial number of National MP’s who would have similar views to myself… For instance probably two thirds of the Key cabinet (and Nats generally) preferred Obama to the Republican contenders. So successful National leaders are very much like Romney.
      
      Romney. Now there’s an endorsement.
      
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      August 13, 2023 1:18pm
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    Wayne Mapp, go back to 1973 and your comments were correct. But fast forward to 2023 and your comments are severely out of date.
    I had this brought to my attention when absent from NZ for six weeks in 2018. Kiwiblog’s news was so far superior to anything on the MSM’s web sites. I saw the same thing when in Europe for four weeks in June this year.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:22am
  - In Vino Veritas
    
    “Even today the MSM has a breadth of news gathering, comment and analysis that alternative media simply can’t match”. Quite correct Wayne. The funny thing is, that blogs like this and others, all get much of their talking points from MSM. So everyone here can fire comments at it. Much as I have issues with MSM as it currently stands, it is better to have it than not.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:37am
  - Che Guava
    
    Wayne, for an intelligent man who was once a politician, you don’t know shit about politics.
    
    This “you don’t do this, you don’t do that” attitude is precisely why we don’t have a right wing in New Zealand. To say these things is to presuppose that there is a single agreed upon way of conducting politics and political discourse.
    
    There are two games being played – the left are out to destroy any challengers, while the “centre-right” (you can’t be actually “right” anymore allegedly because the left have been allowed to set the rules on what you can and can’t be, you see) exist only to avoid the ire of the left who would crush them in a heart beat if they could. It’s like the “centre-right” feel they have to seek the approval of the left 99% of the time.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:55am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      “for an intelligent man who was once a politician, you don’t know shit about politics”. Entirely laughable Che. The man spent 15 years in Parliament, he was elected FIVE times, 1996, 1999, 2002, 2005 and 2008 by the voters of North Shore electorate. He has been Minister of Defence, and Minister of Science. I’d suggest he’s forgotten more about politics than you have ever known. You should be congratulating him on his service to the country and to the National Party and engaging him with at the very least, a little respect. From what I have seen, all Wayne wants is for politics to be civil and support for parties not to be insanely polarised. Is that a bad thing?
      
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      August 13, 2023 11:43am
      - imalwaysright
        
        Too much vino and not enough veritas.
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:14pm
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        Hmm, humour me then right, and let me know which parts of my comment aren’t true. Or was your comment just an inept way of trying the be cutting?
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:35pm
      - Ra Henare
        
        How the world has changed since Wayne was part of the entrenched conservatives.
        
        Identity politics has taken over from consensus(ie Trump, Johnson, Ardern etc)
        
        Click bait is more and more important to MSM than traditional reporting.
        
        So while Wayne may be experienced in the politics of yesteryear. I think he is out of his depth a bit in the modern version of politics.
        
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        August 13, 2023 3:04pm
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        Again Ra Henare, I disagree. Don’t you think that the development of politics over centuries has weeded out the really dopey things that we did, and that some still want to do? Why would “yesteryear” not be as relevant today, as it was “yesteryear”? Do you think things are better now? If not, why not? Or do you believe that, for example, identity politics are the way to do things? If you don’t, why are you suggesting that Wayne’s way is bad? Or at minimum, not good? Surely we should aspire to something better if the other ways are causing significant division?
        
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        August 13, 2023 7:53pm
  - emmess
    
    Why?
    I not only find what you say wrong but bizarre and incomprehensible.
    Why should the right play by an unwritten set of rules that the left don’t themselves.
    Labour, Greens, Maori Party won’t even talk to frankly very moderate The Platform. The TOP leader had an interview and wouldn’t say a word.
    The Platform always had a much farther reach that Today FM ever did, let alone the Spin Off which I am guess would be one of your uncriticisables.
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:02am
  - Ghost
    
    I do agree Wayne, the last thing national and act need now is to be creating bad press or getting the press even more off side. This is a close election, the right do not need to be creating anything that gives the media another avenue to attack.
    
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    August 13, 2023 12:05pm
    - imalwaysright
      
      Not too many successful leaders considered the feelings of their enemy.
      
      Would it be better if Luxon had the media vet his policies and press releases lest they be offended?
      
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      August 13, 2023 12:20pm
      - Ghost
        
        It would be better that national and act focus on winning the election, not getting side tracked with stupid comments that achieve nothing but get them bad press.
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:23pm
    - Ra Henare
      
      Forget the written MSM, severe reduction in readership.
      
      Concentrate on the voters who watch TV news at 6pm.
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:06pm
      - Ghost
        
        Looking at https://www.similarweb.com
        
        Stuff get around 37 million visits a month
        Nz herald just slightly behind that
        
        More people get their news online rather than sit and listen to the 6pm news
        
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        August 13, 2023 3:17pm
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        And Ghost, no one wants to pay for Stuff’s news. That’s the acid test. And why stuff is financially on a knife edge. But for the Ardern Government, they’d be gone by now.
        
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        August 13, 2023 7:55pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Better yet Ghost, National should simply not engage with known sacks of sh$% in the MSM!
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:19pm
      - Ghost
        
        Exactly, Penk has given her oxygen, given her friends oxygen. To the point her former boss has likened it to Aaron Gilmore. Shut up and win the election, then you can make stupid comments about the media
        
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        August 13, 2023 3:37pm
  - NoFax
    
    I knew Dr. Mapp would be along to explain that National needs to kowtow to the so-called MSM. The so-called MSM do not represent the mainstream but the extreme Left. They will never ever give National a fair go unless it’s the usual capitulation of National to the Left’s causes. After all that’s been done by the media during the last 6 years the idea that they are neutral is actually sad to see. This is why I despair for NZ and only hope that Dr. Mapp does not represent any sizeable group inside the National party.
    
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    August 13, 2023 12:10pm
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      NoFax. Here’s a tip. Go spend some time in say, France, and check out the “extreme left” or the “extreme right”. There are NO comparative parties in NZ. Whilst I have no truck with the current Labour Party at all, they are a bunch of numpties and have drifted more left than they have ever been, the divide between our “extreme left” and “extreme right” is miniscule compared to some other countries.
      
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      August 13, 2023 7:58pm
  - imalwaysright
    
    Wayne
    
    There is no fourth estate .
    
    The media consider themselves to be the First Estate .
    
    They are now the preachers.
    Their message is divine .
    They cannot be wrong.
    
    Good luck with you ethical dilemmas.
    
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    August 13, 2023 12:11pm
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Bullshit. Alinsky Rules 5 and 6 apply here.
    
    Penk nailed it, and Luxon achieved an unforced own goal.
    
    Wayne of course plays the good little sweeper explaining that the own goal was in fact sensible policy to avoid upsetting powerful forces ™
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:48pm
    - I remember when
      
      The thing is that apologies used to mean that you were sorry and will not do it again.
      Now they mean I’m saying sorry , which I am not, and the comment hasn’t disappeared.
      
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      August 13, 2023 2:48pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Yes Wayne. The centre right musn’t call out far left gotcha propagandists claiming to be journalists. They might get upset. And that could cause other people to get upset.
    
    Hint: Most NZ News outlets wandered off the journalistic integrity reservation years ago. They punch below the belt all the time. When they get a richly deserved serve back, the public take note. When they are left unchallenged they get to control the narrative!
    
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    August 13, 2023 2:15pm
  - Liberty
    
    fourth estate has some real relevance in a democracy,
    What a load of crap.
    The so called fourth estate have been labours lickspitkes for year’s.
    How do you explain democracy and media slash fund? They are incompatible. If labour wins the election. It’s still possible unless Luxon finds his balls. There will be a media fund bonus next year for loyal comrades
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:04pm
- rockape
  
  It pays to remember in 2017 ACT got just 0.5%. Any dramatic rise say to mid 40s again for National will be at ACTs expense and could see them back there Your not going to get Nats on 45% and ACT. On 15%. I am happy to see National closer to the center and ACT to the right of them it’s a combination that could work well for future dominance of elections.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:41am
  - Matt Long
    
    The unfortunate fact is that when the main parties are failing to show leadership people vote for the minors, ACT, NF First and Green.
    Once in government the small parties tend to be subsumed by the larger coalition partner and their vote is cannibalised. ( Labour is so hopeless the greens are rising this term. )
    This election is likely to be ACT’s best result for at least a decade.
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:51am
    - rockape
      
      I think it’s more that many want harder right, anti co governance policies. That’s what they are getting from ACT and NZ First . Greens too are getting the hard left vote on things like a wealth tax because Labour don’t want to frighten the horses.
      
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      August 13, 2023 9:21am
      - jon
        
        The anti co governance strongly advocated by Act and NZF should unite them at least on this matter. Should they both end up in a governing arrangement with the Nats, their presence will ensure that the latter cant go all nandy pandy on this very important issue.
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:50pm
    - RightFirstTime
      
      Correction Matt. This election will be ACT’s best result EVER. And I have to ask the question with mis-steps like this Tova issue “who the hell is advising Luxon?” Whoever it is should be shown the door. Tova’s a big girl. She can take the hits as well as dishing them out.
      
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      August 13, 2023 9:58am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Are you sure about that? Did ACT not have 20 seats once? Not sure, but a poster here was one of them
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:19pm
      - sparkhole
        
        Replying to G the Giant,
        
        I think you’re referring to the 2008 election where Act, lead by Rodney Hide, had 5 seats;
        Rodney Hide, Heather Roy, Roger Douglas, John Boscawen, and David Garrett.
        
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        August 13, 2023 1:11pm
      - rockape
        
        They had nine or so seats for some time but blew it and ended up back needing a cup of tea on 0.5%. Arrogance kills political parties and I fear ACT may be heading that way again.
        
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        August 13, 2023 1:27pm
      - rockape
        
        It will,maybe but his attacks on likely alliance partners may cost him. ACT have been up here before. 96 and to 02 elections saw the with between 6% and 7% giving them 8 to 9 seats .2005 saw them at 2 seats and just 1.5%, 08 back to 3.65% and the a slide away polling 1.07%,0.69% and 0.5% over the next three elections. It wasn’t until 2020 and Nationals internal problems did they get to their best ever poll of 7.58% and ten seats. But that could vanish overnight as it did after 2002 under very similar circumstances of National going from disarray to getting their shi5 together. Minor parties are very =ulnerable to the ups and downs of the main party they all gone with. That’s why Winston has done well by playing for both sides!
        
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        August 13, 2023 1:46pm
      - alwyn.a
        
        The best results ACT have had since we have had an MMP environment were 8 in 1996 and 9 in each of 1999 and 2002.
        There current 10 members is the highest they have ever had.
        
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        August 13, 2023 1:51pm
- Dairy Flat
  
  Give me Penk over Luxon any day. Penk is very impressive in person and prepared to speak his mind, a mind that is very astute and agile.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:43am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    You have two choices. Luxon or Hipkins
    
    7 4
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    August 13, 2023 12:20pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Both appealing to the woke.
      
      Woke leads to everything turning to excrement.
      
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      August 13, 2023 2:48pm
- pdm
  
  BY – I support Chris Penk and what he said re Tova.
  
  I say to Chris Luxon – stay woke and National will lose on 14 October.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:47am
  - Colville
    
    I believe the Nats are sleep walking to power. They are not going to do anything slightly ambitious or scary as they perceive rightly or wrongly that the electorate is too timid for that ambition.
    While I don’t like that particularly I can understand a safety first planfrom the people who are advising them.
    This is the most important election I can remember.. They know they MUST win.. And I believe they are willing to sacrifice principle to achieve the win.
    Win first.. Change New Zealand after winning. Can’t change anything without the win.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:08am
  - Che Guava
    
    Luxon is trying to appeal to a hypothetical voter who doesn’t exist. Making some enemies in order to win some good friends would be my advice to him.
    
    Plenty of people loath types like Tova O’Brien and would love to see her shat on and humiliated.
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:00am
    - Colville
      
      There are hundreds of thousands of those voters…the mushy center of New Zealand who only cares about politics 4 weeks every 3 years or when there is a massacre at a mosque of a huge earthquake etc that requires the PM to step up.
      
      You wont find those people on a political blog.
      
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      August 13, 2023 11:08am
      - Che Guava
        
        Put them in camps for the politically indifferent, I say. If someone doesn’t care about politics, then they shouldn’t be participating in the political process. Democracy, if we assume for a moment that that is what we have, requires active participation. If, notionally, the people decide and govern, then they can’t be indifferent. If you can’t or won’t actively inform yourself in order to better participate, then excuse yourself.
        
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        August 13, 2023 11:32am
      - Colville
        
        Che.
        There are a LOT more of them than there are of you and your type.
        How about they imprison you for being overly excitable??
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:38pm
      - Ghost
        
        Sad when people talk of democracy as taking the right to vote away from people.
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:40pm
    - Flossie
      
      Aren’t there enough people already suggesting what’s wrong with Luxon without adding “he is rude to women” to the list?
      In reality he probably should have just said nothing at all.
      
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      August 13, 2023 11:57am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      We have just had a break down of a poll showing much larger young voter support for Nats by double of Labour, the young will not like nasty, show nasty you lose some of that new found support
      
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      August 13, 2023 12:22pm
    - JJ56
      
      Che, put your brain gear. How would this play if left unattended to? Penk was accusing Tova of being responsible for the redundancies of all kinds of staff. How long before hurt ex-employees still unemployed are produced to say how mean and hurtful it was.
      
      The Nats needs a clear hit on the tax package and having this floating around would get in the way.
      
      As some else has said a great response, but should have come from someone further from the action.
      
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      August 13, 2023 12:54pm
      - Ghost
        
        They already have one likened the behavior to Aaron Gilmore
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:56pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    No where did he tell Penk to apologise
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:48am
    - Che Guava
      
      Yeah, he effectively apologised for him.
      
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      August 13, 2023 11:33am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        No he did not, Pent Tweeted the next morning on his own bat when he received bad tweets
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:23pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        And what precisely prompted Penk to apologise?
        
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        August 13, 2023 2:17pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Seriously, 9 weeks out from the Election, media are best ignored.
  Media opinions do not form a Government, voters do. Our media are very supportive of one Party, and attack the other. Sad thing? We are paying for it.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:53am
  - Albert_Ross
    
    Yeah, and what forms voter opinions?
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:07am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      The media, if you let them. The gullible suck it up, they have no mind of their own.
      
      OK, I’m off to watch CNN now.//
      
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      August 13, 2023 12:45pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Correct, but people’s have found a pathetic silly little way to rubbish Luxon, Penk apologised, he was not whipped
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:50am
  - Paulus
    
    Our so called media are supporting the return of NZ First aka Winston Peters becuse it is a way of attacking Luxon.
    
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    August 13, 2023 11:17am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Winston First will not make 5% no matter what the media say. NZF is a goneburger.
      
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      August 13, 2023 12:47pm
      - Ghost
        
        He’ll get in likely around 8 or 9%
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:54pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        National will not need him Ghost. NZF 8 or 9%?
        Well those voters have to come from somewhere, that will be Labour.
        There is a lot of hate with Labour after the last 6 years. Those voters will never vote National, so they will hold their nose and vote NZF.
        That means Labour will crash and burn – delicious! In the last 6 years they have cost me a lot of money, never mind on what. 2017 I voted from Alaska.
        Every time Labour come into power, they do the same thing. Kill the economy, inflation is rampant, fuel, and then they just wreck our lovely New Zealand.
        This time has been the worst. It started with that speech in 2009. I was thinking ‘please no’ Well I knew back then trouble was headed our way.
        
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        August 13, 2023 3:20pm
      - Ghost
        
        Nataional and act have lost voters to Winston, they’re the protest votes he is getting.
        
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        August 13, 2023 3:29pm
      - rockape
        
        Your right NZ Firsts vote will come from Labour Nationals wet dream will be that they could govern with either and make their choice, leaving the other on the cross benches National 42%, ACT 8% NZ first 8% would be fun ! It could happen too.
        
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        August 13, 2023 3:51pm
- leoj
  
  How long before G from Dunedin replies indignantly that Luxon recently stated that he actually had balls of steel.
  So believable!
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:06am
- coge
  
  Chris Luxon isn’t a leader. He’s a follower.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:15am
- DeepBlue
  
  Great satire by Penk.
  I have a different viewpoint though.
  
  This has got SM /MSM legs because of what Chris Luxon said… otherwise it would be a dead tweet. Everytime there is a headline for Luxon (good or bad) it helps for name recognition and takes the focus away from Labour. No-one, outside political tragicals here, actually reads or remembers the actuale detail of the articles.
  
  A further example is the school cellphone ban. It shunted Labour’s Blackrock deal off the airwaves.
  Overall a win for Luxon.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:34am
- Frank the tank
  
  Add his response to Sam U’s groceries comment and that sums up why the majority of white, heterosexual males under the age of 50 will be voting Act this time up.
  
  Compare it to Seymour’s response to the media’s attempted hitjob on Court. Shut it down, support his MP and doesn’t look like a wet drip.
  
  Chris – you better get enough of the female <40 vote to justify this approach.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:56am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Penk came out the next day and said he apologised if he had up set the hoi polio, he tweeted, are you saying he forced him to say it? No one has stated that, but Penk got his point across, and no one tase will care a shit about anything else, but they will love the burn on Tova
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:39am
- AC
  
  Bad mistake by Luxon. Tova banging on about the MP from Tauranga – doesn’t really pretend to be balanced and objective.
  
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  August 13, 2023 11:00am
- Ra Henare
  
  Of course the devious mind might say this was a brilliant play.
  Penk generating a headline that paints Tova as biased
  Luxon stopping the resultant pileon.
  
  Most MSM followers will have read the tweet!!!
  
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  August 13, 2023 2:20pm
- Philview
  
  Stuff have been very quiet on this story so far. They will be working on their next attack strategy today I am sure.
  
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  August 13, 2023 2:39pm
- Scooter
  
  Luxon should have used Cindy’s old line of “it’s not somethink I would necessarily say”.
  
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  August 13, 2023 5:01pm
- Jim
  
  BY, to be effective I believe Luxon needs to more closely observe the politically cunning and communication savvy Seymour.
  
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  August 13, 2023 6:14pm
- Beach Haven expat
  
  More damaging for Luxon than the public’s view of this is the internal optics. The message to his troops is: If you try to stand up for the boss, not only will it not be appreciated, he’ll throw you under the bus to placate voters who hate him anyway.
  Just a rank amateur move.
  
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  August 13, 2023 7:31pm
Warren

Labour dangles a election carrot : Promise to remove GST from fresh and frozen fruit and vegetables.
So another promise or bribe which what ever way you want to look at it that will save between $4 to $5 per week on your Grocery bill which by the way won’t start until April next year another six months away. Apparently the move has proved quite popular with supporters across the political spectrum if you care to believe the internal Talbot,Mills Labour poll finding 66% of 1296 of respondents polled strongly supported the policy.
Eighty per cent of Labour supporters and 75 % of Green supporters were in favour, whilst 59% of National supporters and 45% of Acts also believed it was a good move.
Crucially the Herald understands the policy went down well with Swing voters according to the poll- conducted between July 28th and August 2nd .
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August 13, 2023 8:04am
- greybeard
  
  Warren, you forget the most important thing: the scheme won’t work !
  It CAN’T work: retailers will simply keep their market prices the same and make bigger GPs.
  And wait until the cost of the scheme is revealed: the software changes required will be costly.
  
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  August 13, 2023 11:11am
  - sparkhole
    
    It will be a nightmare. Will McDonalds charge less for a bag of apple slices? Why aren’t plain frozen chips exempt? What about dried fruit? Raisins, Sultanas? Why not? What about a lettuce and tomato sandwich? What about a bowl of lettuce and tomato and a plate of bread? Are they then separate line items? What about a bag of mixed frozen vegetables? What about a bad of mixed salad? What if it has salad dressing? What if the salad dressing is in a separate little bag in the big bag? What about anything grown in some way and then put in a jar? What about an apple tree? Or carrot seeds?
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:57pm
    - Ghost
      
      What about if we do it we just copy what the aussies have
      
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      August 13, 2023 2:02pm
      - Ra Henare
        
        Dont forget the Aussies generated 10,000 pages of GST rules and interpretations.
        Yep thats Ten Thousand.
        
        If anyone things its a simple change to exclude fruit & veggie from GST then I need to inform you it IS NOT.
        
        Its a bloody minefield and who will bear the cost immediately and ongoing????
        (Think setting up a committee to decide what is 0% rated or not and then companies having to enter line by line the 0% rate for said items.
        
        Just an observation from someone who has been involved with business systems in NZ, Australia & Canada over 3 decades.
        
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        August 13, 2023 2:26pm
      - artemisia
        
        What is proposed is not the same as over the ditch. For example fresh, frozen, dried, canned or packaged fruit and veg is zero rated. At least canned, maybe others, are to be excluded here.
        
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        August 13, 2023 3:44pm
    - artemisia
      
      So walnuts and peanuts in the shell will be zero rated? Shelled not?
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:38pm
- leoj
  
  A moronic lefty will look at this bribe and say:
  “That’s great. I can afford another latte.”
  
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  August 13, 2023 11:19am
  - Colville
    
    Will the GST get taken off the organic kale that goes in the smoothie at the cafe??
    
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    August 13, 2023 12:40pm
    - Don Beckett
      
      A much better thing would be to take the GST of the excise charged on fuel – easier to institute and a bigger saving.
      Alternatively, National could show the amount of GST on fresh veges,food etc. and give a tax reduction instead that would be greater then the GST figure.
      Pretty simple to defeat really.
      
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      August 13, 2023 1:24pm
- alloytoo
  
  It’s disturbing how Labour are willing to sabotage the integrity of a tax which is much envied around the world.
  
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  August 13, 2023 11:27am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  When have Labour ever removed a Tax other than on fuel?
  Face it, Govt gets shitloads of Tax on fuel so 25 cents is nothing really.
  There might be a Tax they have reduced but I can’t think of one atm.
  
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  August 13, 2023 12:52pm
  - Warren
    
    Labours tax policies is to talk up taking GST off fruit and vegetables to keep the voter happy , and then dupe them with policy that won’t be available until 2026. https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/election-2023/495698/labour-promises-to-remove-gst-from-fruit-and-vegetables-boost-working-for-families
    Here is the framework for Prime Minister Chris Hipkins working for families policies that won’t be available until 2026.
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:35pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      2026, an announcement about an announcement about an announcement.
      take it with a container load of salt.
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:23pm
- DeepBlue
  
  Poor people don’t but fruit and veg from the supermarket, but the Saturday markets. So there is no GST on F&V for them. Chippy is supporting the millionaires, despite his comment otherwise.
  
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  August 13, 2023 3:33pm
- rockape
  
  I would recommend we all look at an old supermarket bill and calculate the savings on fresh fruit and veg . Nice to see a few posts on the amount saved. Doesn’t work for me as I grow nearly all my own and have a 4 freezers full of meat veg and fruit plus a fridge with about 20kg of home made cheese.
  
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  August 13, 2023 4:00pm
igm

No wonder our Police Force only attracts Labour-type weirdos and wimps.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/300942366/anatomy-of-an-arrest-how-an-officer-who-served-with-distinction-was-convicted-of-assault
Even good members of the force are bailing out.
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August 13, 2023 8:04am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  NZ needs real Cops, and Laws thrown out. Marshall should have just knocked him out, but not allowed.
  A person on meth becomes really strong.
  The Law protects the bad bastards.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:04pm
Mobile Michael

Remember how Phil Goff couldn’t explain what fresh fruit and vegetables were? Why does Chippy and Grant want to do this again.

E.g. Is a bag of mixed salad fresh or prepared? Answers on the back of a ballot paper please.
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August 13, 2023 8:06am
Nukuleka

Am I delusional or not? Yesterday I spotted two puff pieces in the Herald online: one on Tamati Coffey and another on Willow- Jean Prime. Today there appears to be a third on Ginny Anderson. Am I correct? Surely the Herald wouldn’t be quite to blatantly politicking… would they?
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August 13, 2023 8:06am
- kevn
  
  Nuku… MSM is very busy on a daily basis denigrating anything/anybody that is not affiliated or locked stepped to labour.
  Not reading the room (NZ) at all.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:14am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Herald doing a case study between Ginny and short planks?
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:54am
  - imalwaysright
    
    I’d go for the plank.
    Very handy to apply to the cranium of a ramraider.
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:06am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Fucking bang !
      
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      August 13, 2023 1:06pm
- rockape
  
  It pays to remember in 2017 ACT got just 0.5%. Any dramatic rise say to mid 40s again for National will be at ACTs expense and could see them back there Your not going to get Nats on 45% and ACT. On 15%. I am happy to see National closer to the center and ACT to the right of them it’s a combination that could work well for future dominance of elections.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:58am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Prime? I watched a clip of her answering questions from Brooke Van Velden, she was bloody awful. For a lawyer, her speech was stunted and uncertain. The whole thing was agonising to watch as she was smacked by Van Velden.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:41am
  - Spring Bank Westie
    
    And not a whisper about here statement on The AM Show on Friday that compared sexual assault as different to “serious crime”.
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:22pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Looking at someone’s bum for slightly too long is somewhat different to punching someone’s lights out (as an example).
      
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      August 13, 2023 2:53pm
Matt Long

Where oh where would an incoming government be able to make cost savings and get government book back into black? It just looks impossible with all the essential spending Labour is doing.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/parliament-s-new-te-k-hui-m-uri-marker-cost-500-000.html
Twitter is full of people with trans flag icons saying how great this looks and value for money.
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August 13, 2023 8:07am
- rouppe
  
  Interesting that the pare over the entrance features a Maori with a gun.
  
  And Kelvin Davis says
  
  Kelvin Davis, the Minister for Te Arawhiti Māori Crown Relations, said the recognition of Māori culture outside Parliament has been “a long time coming” and will play “an important role in ensuring that visually, Parliament represents our shared identity”.
  
  Maori culture is the gun, huh?
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:45am
Benedict Yu

This is very bad policy from the Australian government.

Qatar Airways seeks permission to significantly increase flights into Australia. You would think there would only be one feasible response. “Hell yes”. Nope. Application declined using a whole lot of weasel words and word soup. Real reason… To protect Qantas.

Economic cost to Australia.. between $500 and $700 million annually.

https://www.afr.com/companies/transport/labor-s-airlines-policy-is-risible-20230808-p5duxk
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August 13, 2023 8:07am
- Matt Long
  
  I guess that’s why Quantas can be such a poor airline and still survive.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:10am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    No “u“ in Qantas
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:14am
    - Matt Long
      
      Yes, qite.
      
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      August 13, 2023 8:21am
      - Jack5
        
        Are you really Matt Luong?
        
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        August 13, 2023 12:35pm
  - Colville
    
    I flew Q(no U)antas business class a while back. It rates as possibly the worst spending desicion of my life.
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:12am
- kiwikidsnz
  
  Remember Ansett Airlines.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:20am
Prince

Today Hipkins will try to trash NZ’s one tax policy that is the envy of the world.
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August 13, 2023 8:11am
Matt Long

Cook Strait Ferries aren’t fit for purpose under Labour. You would have to be cautious about using the ferry for time sensitive travel or freight.
https://i.stuff.co.nz/travel/travel-troubles/132714976/truckers-say-ships-are-too-old-after-kaitaki-steering-issue
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August 13, 2023 8:12am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Aren’t there 2 brand new ferries arriving shortly?
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:15am
  - Matt Long
    
    Apparently yes,
    https://www.irex.co.nz/new-ferries
    Also new tunnels under Waitemata harbour starting soon.
    
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    August 13, 2023 8:19am
    - pdm
      
      matt – not sure they willhelp in crossing Cook Strait either way – lol.
      
      ps – if Labour are organising them my 4year old and nearly 2year old great grand children probably won’t ever see or hear of them operating either.
      
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      August 13, 2023 8:54am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Construction of at least the first one is due to get underway in March 2024. Contracts all signed.
        
        https://www.hmd.co.kr/english/main/main.jsp
        
        I’d have more faith in Korean ship builders.
        
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        August 13, 2023 9:22am
      - rouppe
        
        @Ben
        
        If I remember correctly it was Korean train builders that delivered train engines lined with asbestos.
        Long time ago now, but it was after the dangers of asbestos were known.
        
        4 2
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        August 13, 2023 9:49am
      - rouppe
        
        Nope, my bad, it was Chinese builders
        
        https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/308206/more-chinese-trains-to-be-bought-despite-asbestos-headache
        
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        August 13, 2023 10:06am
  - alwyn.a
    
    The ferries are due in 2025 and 2026.
    There may be nowhere to berth them though. As of June this year the apparently hadn’t even got a design for the terminals finalised.
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/dire-strait-concern-terminals-wont-be-ready-in-time-for-interislander-mega-ferries/FDYEVPTDXVAY5NTLNUHSW74CWY/
    
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    August 13, 2023 9:30am
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      what!!! who said we needed port facilities for massively larger ferries, loaded with obsolete rail capacity!
      
      What do you mean the port side facilities were extra???
      
      Michael Wood, super-genius that was who. Smartest Minister of Transport since, oh Phil Twyford.
      
      Bwuhahahaahaa!
      
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      August 13, 2023 1:55pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Where these ferries not promised in 2018?
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:52am
  - wsk12345
    
    2025. Though I hear from someone working on the new port that the chances the larger jetties will be completed in time for the arrival of the 40m longer ships in 2025 is close to zero.
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:17pm
- fightingtemeraire
  
  The ferries should have been replaced 20 years ago. They have 3 differing ferries so the spares system must be a nightmare,
  
  I wonder where they get their Deck and Engine room Officers from now as there are no NZ Flag ships that can train them.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:23am
  - Jack5
    
    It’s more than surprising that New Zealand, a remote, ocean archipelago, has no ships on which deck and engineering officers can be trained.
    
    NZ could set up scholarships for New Zealanders to train at the Australian Marine Academy in Tasmania, but what ships would the Kiwis then go to?
    
    My understanding is that the big container shipping lines just tack on their NZ services to their more important (to them) eastern Australia calls.
    
    Did this come about because of opening cabotage to foreign shipping lines? That is allowing visiting foreign vessels to carry internal freight up and down our coast?
    
    Couldn’t there be sensible use of both? A flourishing NZ coastal fleet supplemented by foreign ships carrying some cargo between NZ ports?
    
    If we didn’t have so many trucks on the road, would there be enough work for both types of shipping?
    
    In the meantime, in an international shipping emergency we will be stuffed.
    
    Who would pay for an emergency airlift on the scale of Berlin’s in 1948? Would there be enough planes?
    
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    August 13, 2023 12:20pm
- Taieri
  
  Cook Strait Ferries aren’t fit for purpose under Labour.
  —————-
  
  I don’t think it’s got much to do with the Labour Government. Mostly it appears to be due to the poor operational practices and poor management. Running an old tonnage doesn’t help, but the age of the tonnage should not preclude reliability if the overall technical and operational management is on par. The company is top heavy, with the management lacking maritime background. Also, the regulatory oversight by the Maritime NZ seems to be deficient – an anecdotal evidence suggests that exemptions are often issued on the fly.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:57am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Media have been a bit slack on details of this but your link provides a bit of detail.
  Steering problem and I am thinking burst hoses o blocked valve bodies. Turns out the actual steering is fine. The problem is steering control, so electronic I guess.
  
  There seems to be a lot of problems with ferries in the last few years. What is really going on? Too old? Nope, there are many bits of machinery running after more then 100 years. Lack of maintenance? Yep, with staff cuts? Sabotage? Nah.
  Whatever is happening it is interfering with transport. This can only result in increased prices. Ferry Staff – get your shit together. Going to strike just before Christmas? You bet they will. Do it quite often.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:14am
  - Jethrod
    
    You heard it here first!
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:21am
  - Taieri
    
    Going to strike just before Christmas? You bet they will.
    ————
    
    The last industrial action involving interisland ferries was in 1993.
    
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    August 13, 2023 11:48am
  - wsk12345
    
    Why would they? $31 per hour on the checkin counter, double time on Sunday’s and public hols (plus a lieu day for the latter). Etc etc
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:20pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Unions, just because…
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:26pm
- RightFirstTime
  
  Hot on the heels of announcing the removal of G.S.T. from fruit and vegetables I believe that next week Chippy will be announcing the construction of not one, but two, tunnels under Cook Strait.
  On the subject of the G.S.T. removal, Robbo had previously characterised this as a “boondoggle” of an idea. The definition of which is “an unnecessary, wasteful or fraudulent project”. It will be a joy to see how Robbo tries to squirm his way out of this one if indeed the sycophantic MSM bother to press him on this issue.
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:11am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Not the rotten Hearald saying Talbot mills poll showing 1000s of votes flicking to Labour just because of gst off fruit, how pathetic, work out how much families spend on f&v and do the math, it’s a saving a couple of bucks a week
    
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    August 13, 2023 10:55am
  - PeeJay
    
    Robertson could just say that he was being too definitive. After all, he used it before and no ridicule from the MSM – doubt he’ll have any trouble doing a 180. Amazing what $55m+ can buy you.
    
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    August 13, 2023 11:28am
  - Hollyfield
    
    Grant Robertson is interviewed by Heather du Plessis Allen on Mondays straight after the 6pm news. Could be quite entertaining this week.
    
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    August 13, 2023 11:43am
    - rockape
      
      I have it on good authority that his piles will be playing up at that time and he will have to cancell. Sarc.
      
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      August 13, 2023 2:05pm
Suze Wainwright

Stuff looks to be on a mission to ridicule conspiracy theorists and anti-vaxxers.

I’m confident that in the interests of balance and fairness, they will also look at those who believe in the mystic powers of crystals, the Great Green eco she God and the influence of Taniwha on waterways.
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August 13, 2023 8:15am
Matt Long

The pent up demand from the lockdowns and expanding the money supply is falling away.
Next step is letting the sub contractors go then redundancies.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northland-age/news/relief-for-far-north-following-acute-fibre-broadband-delays/PHH7PAACNJC6LEBRR5CFUBNVL4/
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August 13, 2023 8:15am
I remember when

Maui Island Plan, which is part of the Maui County Code, calls for the number of visitors to be no more than one-third of the resident population.
The population (Google) of Maui is 154,000 (although 167,730 is also quoted): one-third of that is 51,300.
The first four months of 2023 saw a daily average of 66,517.
Although they have been having a drought, it is the middle of summer and with its mountainous slopes even in July parts received considerable rainfall.
Forecasters warned that “the risk of fires during this year’s dry season is elevated.”
Hawaii is no stranger to wild fires and about half of Maui is forested.
The last major fire in Hawaii occured in 2018, when winds from Hurricane Lane whipped up flames around Lahaina.
Five years ago, the fire destroyed 2000 acres of bush, 31 cars and 21 structures – most of which were homes.
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August 13, 2023 8:21am
Matt Long

Westpac joins the group expecting house prices to rise next year and interest rates to stay high.
https://www.oneroof.co.nz/news/westpac-predicts-house-prices-will-rise-8-next-year-44075
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August 13, 2023 8:26am
- Colville
  
  Based on the assumption that National will get the banks to open up lending again I would agree.
  My Son is gagging to buy but can’t borrow enough to get the kind of house he wants currently.
  
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  August 13, 2023 8:39am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  With a freehold property in a Trust increasing house prices don’t affect me unless I sell. Why sell? I like my house. Too old to downsize.
  Reverse mortgage? Nope, even though I will not be paying it back. My daughter will.
  By the time my partner and I die, my daughter will be at retirement age. She wont be able to repay the loan, so the house will be sold.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:24am
I remember when

Give Nicola Willis a chance to lead: Shaneel Lal. NZHerald.

Aw, well. That’s it from the experts.
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August 13, 2023 8:28am
- Jack5
  
  Here’s what poster I remember when is talking about (note that the Herald describes Lal thus – “They are a law and psychology student, model and influencer”):
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/shaneel-lal-replace-christopher-luxon-with-nicola-willis-to-take-advantage-of-labours-losses/ZLMLGAEQ7RHP7LXSXZTCF5ZTRY/
  
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  August 13, 2023 12:31pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  All girls together, eh
  
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  August 13, 2023 3:12pm
Sparrow

If National does not become the government in October it will be for one simple reason its leader. Luxon worked for only two companies in his working life. Unilever a huge international corporation and Air New Zealand government owned with a virtual monopoly on domestic routes. Rose through the ranks in Unilever climbing the greasy pole by working in many overseas posting and I would guess by never rocking the boat or being the maverick at management meetings. A safe and competent pair of hands never questioning those above him. Big organisations love those sorts. Suitable to be a leader of a political party being able to get down in the dirt and play rough and connect with the public. NO
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August 13, 2023 8:29am
- Flossie
  
  And how many Labour members have worked for even one company?
  
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  August 13, 2023 2:31pm
  - Ghost
    
    Luxton owns an early childhood centre, that is the only one I know of.
    
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    August 13, 2023 2:35pm
Bridgenag

censorship 2.0: “free speech not free reach”
X marks the spot where twitter began once more to die

“and after much sturm and drang about freedom and being a real and open public square, twitter is once again losing its nerve and going darkside. the EU and US have cowed them into acquiescence and while i have been trying to give elon and co the benefit of the doubt (and then some), the new evolutions here are becoming clear:
it’s just going to be more thought police.”
https://open.substack.com/pub/boriquagato/p/censorship-20-free-speech-not-free?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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August 13, 2023 8:29am
Bridgenag

David Weiss’ appointment as Special Counsel to investigate Hunter Biden’s criminal career is the latest action in a continuous pattern of corruption
All of this is happening while President Trump is facing criminal charge after criminal charge in a political persecution like we’ve never seen before in America. Another DOJ Special Counsel, Jack Smith, has launched an unprecedented attack on the First Amendment, on President Trump and on his supporters. This two-tiered system of injustice being rolled out in our country is designed to scare the hell out of Biden’s political opposition and force us into the shadows.

https://open.substack.com/pub/rwmalonemd/p/rep-marjorie-taylor-green-on-david?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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August 13, 2023 8:30am
- virtualmark
  
  David Weiss was appointed a US Attorney by … Donald Trump.
  
  He’s been investigating Hunter Biden for five (!) years. So far.
  
  In April 2022 over 90 GOP congress reps wrote to Merrick Garland asking that a Special Counsel be appointed to the case. https://miller.house.gov/sites/evo-subsites/miller.house.gov/files/evo-media-document/Letter%20to%20AG%20Garland%20RE%20Hunter%20Biden%5B1%5D.pdf
  
  In September 2022 over 30 GOP senators wrote to Merrick Garland demanding David Weiss be given Special Counsel powers. https://www.cornyn.senate.gov/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Hunter-Biden-Special-Counsel-Letter-FINAL-2.pdf
  
  And now that Weiss has been appointed a Special Counsel … they all complain about it and you idiots swallow their shit wholesale and then ask for a bigger spoon.
  
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  August 13, 2023 11:38am
  - virtualmark
    
    What’s really happening here is that:
    – After 5 years of investigation Weiss hadn’t found evidence of serious criminal activity/corruption, or at least none that would stand up in court
    – So he negotiated a plea bargain with Biden on tax and gun charges
    – The judge who had to approve the plea bargain pointed out that it was poorly worded
    – So now it looks like Hunter Biden will go to court, on the same charges, instead of pleading.
    – The case is expected to be over and done by the end of the year.
    – But the GOP politicians want the Hunter Biden story to keep running through to the 2024 elections – the last thing they want is for Hunter to be slapped with a wet bus ticket before the end of 2023.
    – So now they’re complaining in some unclear attempt to get things changed so that Butt Hunter stays a new story for at least another 12-18 months.
    
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    August 13, 2023 12:12pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    David Weiss appears to be largely responsible for taking 4 years to investigate Hunter for pretty clear bribery and money laundering and other crimes with lots of evidence in hand and a studious effort to limit investigation, avoid questioning implicated people or chase down evidence that has now made its way into the public domain. At minimum displaying massive incompetence, but more realistically partisan corruption.
    
    He offered an unbelievable sweetheart deal to Hunter, pay a fraction of unpaid taxes, no jail, other charges dropped and with immunity from future prosecution at the conclusion of his investigation – that was knocked back by judge they were hoping would rubber stamp it because it was so egregiously out of step with the prima facie case. He is at least partly responsible for allowing statute of limitations to run out on various clear offenses (tax evasion).
    
    So why after he had dallied about for 4 years and tried to sweep everything under the carpet is he now asking to have another bite at the apple as a ‘special prosecutor’? Republicans have, (quite reasonably), no belief in his impartiality – this is clearly just a DNC maneuver designed to stall and prevent actual investigation, limiting House’s ability to chase a case that will be sub-judice and run out the clock on Biden’s presidency.
    
    A special prosecutor is, by convention, supposed to be a terrier and strictly non-partisan, something that Weiss has demonstrated he is not.
    
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    August 13, 2023 12:46pm
    - virtualmark
      
      That is the narrative in the Fox Cinematic Universe that so many of you inhabit.
      
      But here’s the thing … after 5 years of Weiss’ (Trump DoJ) investigation, and a (GOP led) Senate investigation, and a (GOP led) Congressional investigation … there’s no evidence that Hunter Biden did anything seriously criminal, or that Joe Biden is in any way corrupt.
      
      I’m all there on indictments if you have proof. But so far there’s crickets.
      
      Meanwhile the GOP politicians and the Fox News bobbleheads are telling you all that proof and indictments are just around the corner. Well, just around the next corner. Maybe, another corner.
      
      It’s like nuclear fusion … always another year away.
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:45pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        You have to be kidding. There’s evidence for miles. To pretend otherwise is to label yourself as so disconnected from observable reality as to be deranged – and disqualifying yourself from having any opinion worth listening to.
        
        -Multiple first hand witnesses – going back years, whistle blowers, transaction records for large unexplained payments from dodgy sources to 10+ Bidens, photos, videos, phone records, the huge trove of incriminating corroboration from hunter’s laptop, clear quid quo pro decisions from Biden just after said transactions (Burisma prosecutor fired, Moscow mayor being left off sanctions list). It goes on and on and on.
        
        Its almost beyond belief that Bidens are still not in jail and anyone still trying to pretend that it’s all kosher is patently corrupt or delusional.
        
        I’m not a fan of Trump (except in contrast to what Democrats have been selecting and doing), but Biden is just about the most cut and dried provable case of political corruption I can ever remember.
        
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        August 13, 2023 4:25pm
      - virtualmark
        
        So either (a) have Weiss, a Trump appointee who the Trump DoJ tasked with investigating Hunter Biden, bring serious charges or (b) have the Senate or House write a damning report exposing the evidence.
        
        Neither. Has. Happened.
        
        In. Five. Years.
        
        Maybe, just maybe, bear with me here … maybe the line you’ve been fed by Fox News, Comer, Jordan etc is all a crock of shit?
        
        Maybe, just maybe, Hunter Biden is a colossal grifter … but that’s not a crime, just sleazy.
        
        Don’t you ever wonder why, if Hunter and Joe are “the most cut and dried provable case of political corruption I can ever remember” that they’ve never been indicted? Maybe it’s because what you think isn’t actually true, it’s just a lie that you desperately want to believe.
        
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        August 13, 2023 4:53pm
      - miltonF
        
        Christ, Mark. You’d have to be born yesterday to not realise Biden is utterly corrupt and compromised. Either that or you live in a main stream media/left wing echo chamber. From my experience, more than likely you are suffering from severe Trump derangement syndrome, where Trump is literally Hitler (no evidence required) and so literally anything Biden does is acceptable in your eyes. Biden is so far gone mentally, that he even brags about his corruption out in the open and on camera. “I told him that if he didn’t fire the prosecutor (investigating his SON) that they would not get the billions$”. His corruption is undeniable.
        
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        August 13, 2023 6:27pm
- mawm
  
  There are 2 aims – Prevent Trump from running because they know they can’t cheat enough this time to beat him, and imprison Trump for life (they hate him that much).
  
  The USA is no longer a democracy and yet they want to interfere in other countries to impose “their democracy”, which in actuality is subservience to them.
  
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  August 13, 2023 12:16pm
  - artemisia
    
    Think I saw mentioned that someone can run for President from a prison cell. Did I recall correctly? If so, how would that work if the person is elected? Apart from being a whole lot of fun.
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:35pm
    - virtualmark
      
      You can run for President from a prison cell. It’s even been done before.
      
      If you were to win it would pose a huge Constitutional question as to whether a President could pardon themselves (general view = they can’t, but Trump would surely do it and then fight in the Courts).
      
      But if Trump is found guilty in Georgia (indictments expected this week) then he has a problem, because a President can’t pardon state crimes, and Georgia has a very restricted pardon process.
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:47pm
      - artemisia
        
        Could a fed prison double as the White House for an incarcerated President?
        
        A large chunk of the world would find that hilariously ridiculous, and some big players will definitely make the most of it.
        
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        August 13, 2023 4:46pm
      - virtualmark
        
        No. I think if Trump were found guilty of Federal crimes and then was elected President then he’d have to be freed and allowed to take up the role.
        
        But it would be a Constitutional nightmare that would make the USA a laughing stock.
        
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        August 13, 2023 4:55pm
      - virtualmark
        
        But if you do like Constitutional details … yesterday two highly regarded members of the Federalist Society (very right leaning group that vets & promoted right-wing judges for GOP Presidents) published a fascinating piece laying out why Trump is ineligible to stand for President, under the Fourteenth Amendment.
        
        These aren’t Democrats writing this. And the legal reaction I’ve seen so far says that they probably have this argument correct.
        
        https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4532751
        
        “we will argue, taking Section Three seriously means that its constitutional disqualifications from future state and federal officeholding extend to participants in the attempted overturning of the presidential election of 2020, including former President Donald Trump and others.”
        
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        August 13, 2023 4:58pm
Iamright

So Labour is about to announce taking GST off fresh fruit and veges. Oh and frozen. So why not tinned? And where does that leave Robertson who is on record as saying it’s too difficult. Answer from him will be along the lines he didn’t oppose it just that it was too difficult. EXcept too will disappear from his response so not a problem!! Yesterday we bought 2 avocados for $2 and a pumpkin for $3 from a roadside stall. Do you honestly belive that next time we will pay $1.74 and $2.61 respectively??
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August 13, 2023 8:39am
- Matt Long
  
  There are probably issues with accounting for GST with roadside stalls.
  
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  August 13, 2023 11:42am
  - rockape
    
    Only if they are registered for GST now. Many don’t need to because they are below the threshold.
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:10pm
    - rockape
      
      $60k the limit below which you don’t need to register.
      
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      August 13, 2023 3:54pm
- Pineapple Lumps
  
  There are three questions that need to be asked:
  
  1. How much is the total tax reduction from removing GST on fresh fruit and vegetables?
  2. How much is the total additional cost of creating and administering this system?
  3. What is the net change to NZers in their pocket?
  
  Who in Legacy Media will be asking these questions? Given Willis raised this several weeks ago they have had plenty of time to get their questions ready!
  
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  August 13, 2023 2:45pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    4. Which taxes will be raised to recoup the lost tax revenue; or which projects will be cut to offset the lost tax revenue?
    
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    August 13, 2023 5:11pm
slightlyrighty

I see the NZ First election campaign slogan is “Let’s Take Our Country Back”

This raises the question “From whom?”

The answer is “The government Winston appointed in 2017”

Winston relies on at least 5% of the voters having short term memory issues, or being a bit deluded. Thay come through for him nearly every time.
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August 13, 2023 8:41am
- I remember when
  
  slightlyrightly:
  The question is “to where.”
  
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  August 13, 2023 12:31pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  You can fool some of the people, all of the time.
  
  Looks like 5% minimum in NZ
  
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  August 13, 2023 5:12pm
Nickc2

READ S-L-O-W-L-Y and Understand!!
I have never heard this said as simply or as well.
The folks who are getting the free stuff don’t like the folks who are paying for the free stuff, because the folks who are paying for the free stuff can no longer afford to pay for both the free stuff and their own stuff.
And the folks who are paying for the free stuff
want the free stuff to stop.
And the folks who are getting the free stuff want even more free stuff on top of the free stuff they are already getting!
Now.. The people who are forcing the people who pay
for the free stuff have told the people who are RECEIVING
the free stuff that the people who are PAYING for the free stuff are being mean, prejudiced, and racist.
So.. The people who are GETTING the free stuff have been convinced they need to hate the people who are paying for the free stuff by the people who are forcing some people to pay for their free stuff and giving them the free stuff in the first place.
We have let the free stuff giving go on for so long that there are now more people getting free stuff than paying for the free stuff.
Now understand this…..All great democracies have committed financial suicide somewhere between 200 and 250 years after being founded. The reason?
The voters figured out they could vote themselves money from the treasury by electing people who promised to give them money from the treasury in exchange for electing them.
NZ is such a place.
The number of people now getting free stuff soon will outnumber the people paying for the free stuff.
Failure to change that spells the end of New Zealand as we know it.
A Country of Sheep a Government of Wolves!
I’M 100% for PASSING THIS ON !!!
For all our sake PLEASE Take a Stand!!!
Anon
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August 13, 2023 8:47am
kevn

Knock of the booze, smokes and pies. Just pay the mortgage.
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August 13, 2023 9:04am
- alwyn.a
  
  I can’t do that.
  I’m expecting to be hosting the negotiations between the Green Party, New Zealand First and Labour on how they might form a Government.
  How could I possibly entertain their leaders if I couldn’t supply booze, smokes and pies?
  Oh well. With any luck at all none of them will get enough votes.
  
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  August 13, 2023 9:35am
Bridgenag

Nurse Nikki Hanna reveals that nearly 20% of residents of her nursing facility died from COVID vaccine
But nobody noticed because it happened over a 3 month period of excess deaths and nobody was keeping track of the death rates.
Today, 0% of the nursing staff will take the COVID vaccine. If it is forced, they will quit.

https://open.substack.com/pub/stevekirsch/p/nurse-reveals-that-the-covid-vaccine?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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August 13, 2023 9:05am
ClanMcleod

The fearmongering narrative pivot from covid to climate is gathering pace. Have you noticed how according to msm we are supposed to be in a constant state of terror regarding the latest ‘thing’?

Excellent article in a genuinely open and balances alternative media site. OffGuardian.

Apparently, July 4 was the hottest day on Earth in as many as 125,000 years, breaking a record that was set the day before. Wow.

We are being told that extreme heat is far deadlier than other natural disasters, killing on average more than twice as many people each year as hurricanes and tornadoes combined, according to data tracked by the National Weather Service.

How many people are we talking about?

A whopping six hundred people are killed by extreme heat each year. That’s the terrible emergency we are facing—the “worst existential threat to humanity”.

As with Covid, how many of those people who died were unhealthy already and/or on medications that exacerbated heat-related medical issues? Medications pushed on the American people like those for heart disease, high blood pressure, depression, ADHD and other conditions, are making people at higher risk for heat exhaustion and heat stroke.

Some medicines, like Benadryl, can reduce your body’s ability to sweat and cool down. Others — like antidepressants such as Prozac and ADHD stimulants like Adderall and Ritalin — can create excessive sweating, which can lead to dehydration. Drugs like levothyroxine, which is used to treat an under-active thyroid, can raise your body temperature.

They have solutions for everything, and it isn’t getting healthier, so people don’t worry that they’ll actually have to take responsibility for their own health by changing unhealthy habits into healthy ones.

https://off-guardian.org/2023/08/12/climate-change-is-turning-our-planet-into-hell-on-earth/

We are meant to be in a constant state of fear. We are being deliberately divided in every possible way. These things are being done deliberately because it makes people easier to control. The mainstream media is the primary outlet being used to facilitate this war.
Starve them of oxygen, don’t subscribe, don’t buy, don’t click their links.

There are plenty of very good alternatives for news and analysis. My 2 favourites are https://off-guardian.org/ and https://www.ukcolumn.org/

There many others. Some are propaganda outlets, but it’s pretty easy to work that out for anybody with a bit of common sense.
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August 13, 2023 9:15am
Hugh Jarse

So why won’t PM C.Hipkins take the GST off meat and dairy ?, aren’t they equally important in a balanced diet or can we expect to see that next weekend ?
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August 13, 2023 9:23am
Warren

Just a question for those who seem to drool over every Policy our Prime Minister Chris Hipkins makes , who is running the books , Grant Robertson the Finance Minister or Labour Party chief Economist Craig Rennie.
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August 13, 2023 9:39am
rockape

Another blog seems to have been totally infiltrated by lefties attacking everything to the right. Plus more than a sprinkling of conspiracy theorists. I hoe it’s not a coordinated attack but it sure looks like one. Lots of new posters and all anti right.
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August 13, 2023 9:42am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

I think cold kills more than heat.
Climate change fear porn. They saw how fear porn worked with Covid. Control of the weak. Now if people grew a pair, and hardened up mentally, they would not be quivering in their boots. The mentally strong can challenge this ongoing shit.
The fearmongers know who and where to target. Schools. The teachers spread their rubbish and the kid take it home. Parents research and get the google machine propaganda.
Think of all of it is a joke – because it is!
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August 13, 2023 9:43am
- Bridgenag
  
  Remember the two houses in the UK made to look as though they had spontaneously combusted when it was just kids playing with matches in the long grass… powerful image though
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:35am
- imalwaysright
  
  Well said SO.
  
  Its hard to believe that people are gullible and intellectually ignorant enough to believe that we can heat an entire planets atmosphere just with the help of a minute amount of gas.
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:49am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    They are not right in the head.
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:28pm
- miltonF
  
  For me, the scary part is how people are so utterly deluded and disconnected from their environment (reality). People are more likely to believe some white coat on the TV over what they can discern with their own two eyes. I think people need to get off their devices and social media and touch some grass. It has become extremely obvious on so many topics: climate change “the sky is falling! It’s a catastrophic doomsday!” But if you look outside, everything is fine and normal. Covid “everyone is dying, existential threat” but take a look outside and everyone was healthy and fine. The “vaccine” didn’t stop Covid or prevent any deaths. Deaths have actually increased, but people can’t comprehend this fact, because the TV hasn’t told them. Trump “he’s a bigoted, racist, warmonger etc” but if you actually listened to the man, you would not get that impression at all.
  
  Is it merely intellectual laziness? Or something more? I think it is something more…some kind of social contagion. A religious or cult-like adherence to group-think that is so powerful, that people are willing to deny reality in-order to “fit in” and claim they are one of the virtuous ones.
  
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  August 13, 2023 4:05pm
Chuck Bird

Great win by Scott Dickson this morning. He got bumped hard from behind and ended up near the last and he clawed his way to a win.
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August 13, 2023 10:09am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  His name is DIXON.
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:30am
Maggie Pie

Is the Judge being racist?

In sentencing repeat violent offender Rewi Hawera Karetai, 45, JUDGE JIM LARGE noted from the Cultural Report…. “that the defendant had witnessed his mother being treated this way for an extended period of time”

“Monkey see, Monkey do”

https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1690196609911373824

LOL!!
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August 13, 2023 10:35am
Captain Mainwaring

Stupid decision by the Chipster to remove GST from fresh and frozen fruit & vegies. The complexity will cost more than the saving. He would have attracted more votes from the dopey Labour enthusiasts if he removed GST from KFC.
Robbo is being very diplomatic but this is a major split in the ranks.
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August 13, 2023 10:36am
- Colville
  
  Utterly desperate scrabbling by Hipkins that he will rightfully blasted for from all sides.
  
  Cost of food to every family will rise because of this.
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:45am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Never mind, Media say TM poll said 40% said they will now vote Labour giving them 60 plus %
  
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  August 13, 2023 10:58am
- Paulus
  
  Think of the new GST Exemption Department run from many Marae by many expensive staff,
  Will not happen.
  
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  August 13, 2023 11:24am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Let’s waste some money on climate change.
Biden Admin Wants To Suck Carbon Out Of The Air With $1.2 Billion Dollar Vacuums.
Biden needs a lesson about elements. No matter what you do with carbon forms, it is still there unless it is jettisoned into space. Not a good idea. These idiots want to kill all life on the planet.

https://finishtherace.com/ella-ford/biden-admin-wants-to-suck-carbon-out-of-the-air-with-1-2-billion-dollar-vacuums/
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August 13, 2023 11:22am
- miltonF
  
  Ah…good ol “carbon capture”. Let’s burn coal and gas to power machines to remove CO2 from the atmosphere. Makes perfect sense (if you’re in the business of selling fossil fuels). If you think carbon capture is a good idea then you probably need to go back to school and brush up on some physics. It’s such a poor use of energy that it makes hydrogen production via electrolysis seem like a comparatively good idea.
  
  We already have a form of solar powered carbon capture, perfected over millions of years of evolution. It is called a tree.
  
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  August 13, 2023 4:23pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump has a secret weapon.
Melania is a Patriot !

https://patriotsnewsstand.com/redrebelnews/melania-has-become-trumps-secret-weapon/
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August 13, 2023 11:25am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  How does she do it? Well her love of Donald and America are paramount above Politics.
  Trump keeps saying “It is not me they want, it is you. I am just in the way”
  
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  August 13, 2023 3:33pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Oh dear.
Disgraced Former FBI Agent Involved In Trump Probe To Plead Guilty In Russian Oligarch Case.

https://rantsofizzo.com/dominick/disgraced-former-fbi-agent-involved-in-trump-probe-to-plead-guilty-in-russian-oligarch-case/
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August 13, 2023 11:36am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Spending so much money.
US$1 = NZ$1.67. Maybe I won’t go to Hawaii/Alaska atm.

https://spreely.video/v/1164672757/Hyperinflation-and-the-Devaluation-of-the-Dollar.
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August 13, 2023 11:44am
- Burtland
  
  russia is probably the place to go – the ruble is pretty low
  ru$1=nz$0.017
  crimea is good this time of year //
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:40pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I have no intention of going to that Continent, except maybe Thailand.
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:35pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Now who might be behind this? I know of someone.

https://rantsofizzo.com/dominick/new-covid-variant-eris-set-to-plague-the-nation/
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August 13, 2023 11:46am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Democrat candidates a bit of a mess.
Michael Obama? Barry has not finished driving America into the ground, even with the help of Biden.

https://rantsofizzo.com/dominick/could-it-happen-obama-newsom-2024/
Trump 2024.
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August 13, 2023 11:50am
Maggie Pie

I heard JK on the news saying his holiday home on Maui escaped the fires.
Wonder if he has any theories on the cause of the devastation?

This possibility is certainly very very interesting 🙁

Nearly a million views in the last few hours…..

https://twitter.com/samtripoli/status/1690174529706823681
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August 13, 2023 11:53am
- peterwn
  
  His holiday home is in a gated condo area a block away from the beach surrounded by golf courses. You can rent units in the complex for $1000 or so a night. Odds are that JK’s unit is rented out when he is not there. Took a bus ride down there several years out of curiosity (was staying with others in a less upmarket condo further north).
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:11pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

How to launder money Biden style. Get about 20 shell companies.

https://spreely.video/v/2275933208/JUST-IN–Biden-Family-bank-records-reveal-massive-criminal-corruption-scheme–
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August 13, 2023 12:00pm
- Mrs_Right
  
  You won’t hear anything about on our news outlets…
  
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  August 13, 2023 12:57pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    We have news outlets? Who knew?
    All I can find are a lot of Maori channels, stupid cartoons, and cooking programs.
    Where is this news you speak of Kemosabe?
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:14pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Dianne Feinstein is not well. She is 90.
I guess when she dies, Dems will lose their shit again, like Ruth Bader Ginsburg

https://libertyonenews.com/feinstein-heads-to-the-hospital-after-the-90-year-old-senator-takes-a-tumble/

Meltdown:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TF1E0DNvhM0
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August 13, 2023 12:23pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

“If you go after me, I’m coming after you!”
I think he means it.

https://craigbushon.com/2023/08/trump-to-the-doj-if-you-go-after-me-im-coming-after-you/
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August 13, 2023 12:40pm
Swifty

A question for KBers please.

I’ve set up automatic payments with my bank for all my regular payments. I’ve worked this way for years and years without a hitch – always pay on time and in full etc.

Nevertheless, I am constantly badgered by some companies to set up direct debits with them for reasons that are never made clear to me.

Then I see situations like this:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/business/132694093/the-dangers-of-direct-debit-and-water-charges

Where firms, because direct debits are in place, just grab money from customer accounts on a whim. Or, more usually, double or triple bill because of some stuff up at their end, and which takes days or weeks to be reimbursed.

Well fuck that. That can never happen with me and my automatic payments , because I control them – whom is to be paid, how much and how often etc.

So, my question is, why the badgering and why would it be in the customer’s interest to set up direct debits, over automatic payments, or does the advantage only accrue to the firm?

Grateful for any responses.
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August 13, 2023 12:41pm
- peterwn
  
  The advantage of direct debits is convenience. The disadvantage of direct debits is particular privileged outfits can raid your account when you have specifically canceled. And Kiwibank is too chicken to reverse such DD’s when asked. Even the Banking Ombudsman wont get off its chuff and call them out over it. This is why I will not set up any further Direct Debits.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:05pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Ah, Kiwibank. I paid my credit card and closed that account. Next month I get a demand by email that I am overdue. So I rang. “Oh it’s interest on your account sir”
    “I am not paying. I got a full and final amount that I paid. It this like a Maori Tribe Settlement where you just come back for more?” “It is interest sir” “Sue me, I am not paying” Supervisor came on the phone. “Leave it with me sir”
    How come so many thick people get into banking?
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:31pm
    - Manu-Rau
      
      Because Big Hole Robertson and Haw Haw Orr got the plumbing jobs, lea ing the other dumb-asses to fight over the scraps.
      
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      August 14, 2023 3:56am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Some are spammers? I was having trouble with Spark at one stage. I got emails that were sent by me. Some included another name looking into properties. I did learn something, careful when blacklisting or you blacklist yourself !
  Seems to have settled since I changed to a real fucked up password.
  
  I have a few automatic payments and direct debits. Insurance, always increasing. Direct debit saves me the hassle. Lantern Ins have my house, contents, cars, boats, everything is with them. They have been good when my Prado got pranged.
  So yeah, it is down to trust.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:24pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Avoid DD’s like the plague!
  We set one up once with a well known weekly Bin-collection outfit. Within 3 months the service was sooo sh!t we cancelled.
  Took me nearly two years till I realised they were still making the monthy deductions from my bank.
  Apparently it’s up to the recipient to cancel it!
  And turned out to be an absolute joke trying to get it refunded.
  Wasn’t till I actually tracked down the home address of one of the Directors and went to his house personally and made a scene. Money was back in my account the next day.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:32pm
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    Maggie, good on you for visiting the director. The good news is that I am not the only bastard who has tried that trick. It worked for me very well.
    
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    August 13, 2023 2:42pm
    - Maggie Pie
      
      I remember how my dad used to arrange for everything from Firewood to Skips being delivered to other peoples driveways if they crossed him over money.
      And they got the bill!
      
      LOL
      
      5 1
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      August 13, 2023 3:16pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    As I said, it is down to trust. An Insurance Company would not do this. They have goodwill to protect.
    Refund, sometimes making enough noise that the neighbourhood can hear works.
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:43pm
- Hollyfield
  
  No actual knowledge, just as a consumer, these are my thoughts of when direct debits are useful, and yes these are both for the benefit of the company.
  1. Loan repayments eg hire purchase etc. If you have an automatic payment you can cancel it on a whim, but a direct debit takes a little more effort to cancel. Having a direct debit reduces the risk for the company of the consumer buying an expensive item and then cancelling the payment immediately.
  2. Regular payments such as insurance which change (increase!) annually. Having a direct debit gives the company control of the amount and removes the risk of consumers not adjusting the amount.
  
  A side issue which is annoying me at the moment. My insurance provider has started texting me to remind me my payment will be deducted that day and to ensure I have the funds in my bank account. I find this reminder (that I didn’t need) insulting, and worse annoying as the few texts I receive are usually because someone I know wants something, and this spam text makes me waste time looking at my phone for no reason. There is no instruction in the text on how to opt out of them, and searching the company’s website has not helped. My phone company did the same about 2 years ago but did include instructions on how to opt out, which I immediately did. By law electronic messages have to be consented to by the recipient and have an unsubscribe feature. I replied “stop” last week so am waiting to see what happens on the next payment due date.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:44pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I have one account that is for all direct debits and automatic payments.
    Funds are transferred into this account automatically from the main account.
    in the event that a payment goes out 2 hours before funds in, I get a text.
    BNZ there’s a plug for you!
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:52pm
- rouppe
  
  Yes it is impossible to control the cancellation of direct debits.
  
  I was a member of a gym. I gave notice, but they kept on charging. I told them again and again to stop. Went on for months.
  
  I went to the bank and said “I want to specifically cancel my Authority for this debit. They said they can’t”.
  
  Insane
  
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  August 13, 2023 3:04pm
  - Swifty
    
    Madness.
    
    Why on earth would people agree to direct debits?
    
    I presume it is just naivety or ignorance of the potential consequences for them.
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:15pm
    - rouppe
      
      They do work well for variable amounts like power bills.
      
      I think it comes down to horses for courses. From big players for energy, insurance, you’re probably OK, and if they over charge you’ll get it back.
      
      It’s the smaller players like gyms, club fees and the like where it has more chance to go pear shaped.
      
      I still don’t understand how the bank can’t stop it. A direct debit is a written Authority from you the account holder to allow a certain party to debit your account.
      I should be able to, in writing, withdraw that Authority just as easily.
      
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      August 13, 2023 4:48pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Leave the bank, they will soon wake up. Just zero out all accounts.
    
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    August 13, 2023 3:54pm
  - Manu-Rau
    
    Close your bank account.
    
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    August 14, 2023 4:05am
Fisiani2

Labour’s GST bribe of $4 is less than the price of a tea or coffee. Pathetic
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August 13, 2023 12:43pm
- Prince
  
  Less the cost of software changes, implementation and bureaucracy to decree what is in and what is out. Make that $1.33 a week saving, if anything.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:15pm
  - greybeard
    
    It won’t save a cent: the retailers will just make more profit from their same selling prices.
    
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    August 13, 2023 5:07pm
    - rouppe
      
      Exactly. The GST component of a $3 head of broccoli is 39¢. Price variability alone makes it impossible to know if it’s actually been removed.
      
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      August 13, 2023 5:29pm
      - Swifty
        
        Correct.
        
        Even the IMF says their estimates are that a mere 30% is likely to passed on to consumers – with 70% retained by firms.
        
        It’s a goldrush for the grocers.
        
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        August 13, 2023 5:57pm
      - miltonF
        
        Every receipt I’ve ever received has the GST component clearly listed. You will 100% be able to tell if it has not been removed. A lot of these arguments sound good on the surface but actually don’t make a lot of sense…
        
        Or are you trying to say supermarkets will just raise prices and claim the 15% as extra profit? Well what’s stopping them from doing that right now? Why wait? Oh that’s right….competition. Why do people believe that removing GST will somehow also eliminate competition? Again, it just doesn’t make sense. Consider the temporary reduction in fuel tax. If we’re being consistent in our reasoning, this tax reduction should not have reduced fuel prices at all, because the fuel companies will just “maximise profit” and “prices are set at the maximum consumers can pay”.
        
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        August 13, 2023 7:50pm
      - rouppe
        
        Every receipt has one line that says “includes GST of $d.cc”. After listing all the grocery items which are all GST inclusive.
        
        Let’s say GST is removed from April 1. You go in on March 31 and the broccoli is $3.00, GST inclusive.
        
        You go in the next day, and the broccoli is $3.00, free of GST.
        
        What happened to the 39¢? How will you tell that it hasn’t just been taken in margin?
        
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        August 13, 2023 10:07pm
lifesgood

Feeling depressed after reading General Debate this morning. All the bitching and whining and moaning about Luxon leads me to believe that many on here actually want a Labour led government. If that’s not the case, just quit the moaning and get in behind National…it will be the only way, ACT will not win alone.
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August 13, 2023 12:58pm
- Prince
  
  Agree. If you want a change in Govt and prefer Seymour to Luxon, vote Act.
  If you hate the thought of Luxon as PM above all else, vote Labour.
  Otherwise, forget the cult-personality as PM shtick, and vote National.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:13pm
- rockape
  
  I agree. After the 2017 election National we’re struggling internally under several leaders and that cost them and the country dearly in 2020. It wasn’t until under Luxon’s leadership that the party settled. He is the leader of the National Party and as such done a good job. Only voters will decide if he becomes Leader of the country. People need to make up their minds if the want three more years of Hipkins and Labour or not.
  
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  August 13, 2023 1:18pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    National will come up with the goods soon.
    If it is too soon, the lying Labour [Mod – tone your language down] will steal it, they are desperate.
    
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    August 13, 2023 1:34pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      I guess they could be keeping their powder dry. However D Day is virtually upon us.
      
      5 1
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      August 13, 2023 3:04pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Did not think that was a bad word – in context.
      
      2 1
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      August 13, 2023 4:36pm
- Chris Nisbet
  
  Personally speaking, I just want the election over and done with. We’ll either vote for even worse devastation (because the Greens will be included), or, God help us, make it even worserer by involving Maori racists, or, give at least some of the people (the ones who pay the tax) some small sliver of hope and vote in the only people who have any sort of chance of turning the shit-show around.
  
  18 1
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  August 13, 2023 1:37pm
- Sparrow
  
  Whether you like it or not Luxton does not resonate with many people this includes many National supporters. Yes he has seemingly done a good job of reorganising the political wing of the party. That’s because undoubtedly he is a good manager that does not make him a good political leader. Dare I say he is passionless. If Nicola Willis was leader the Nats would bolt in. Her rebuke of the Labour Party for not supporting her Bill was remarkable full of passion and guts. Couple that with the sincerity of Shane Reti would make a formidable team. Yes Luxon is very business like but he appears too many to be cold and remote and not street smart, love or hate him like Winny.
  
  13 3
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  August 13, 2023 2:31pm
  - kevn
    
    Sparrow… So when attending one of Luxons meetings you found him to be so?
    
    7 2
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    August 13, 2023 2:49pm
  - rockape
    
    Well he needed the backing of his caucus and the board to get where he is. They must have seen his leadership qualities or do you think all National MPs are dumb ?
    
    6 2
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    August 13, 2023 4:58pm
Fisiani2

Labour are trying to bribe people with $4 of their own money. Do they think we don’t have brains?
17 0
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August 13, 2023 1:30pm
- lifesgood
  
  Unfortunately there are a lot of people who don’t have brains. Sad reality.
  
  11 0
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  August 13, 2023 3:46pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  YES!!!
  
  8 0
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  August 13, 2023 3:56pm
- Hollyfield
  
  I wonder if they’ve missed the mark with the WFF changes. The PM sent out a letter a little while ago, telling us how wonderful Labour is with all the goodies for us in the budget. Three out of the four points in that letter were aimed at people with children. Now again WFF – they’ve ignored the many households with no children. The Herald article specifically says “Chris Hipkins revealed the party’s tax policy and has confirmed no changes to income tax levels”- that would have benefited everybody.
  
  An earlier article also said “It would apply to fresh and frozen fruit and vegetables, but not processed or canned items including juices and frozen chips.” I happen to have a bag of frozen chips in my freezer – ingredients are potatoes (96%) sunflower oil (4%). So GST will be removed from fresh potatoes (presumably) but not frozen potatoes. I wonder about the bags of frozen stir fry vegetables that have sauce in them.
  
  “An expert group with Inland Revenue would be established ahead of the introduction in April to decide whether certain products were exempt.” So they haven’t even worked through the details of it yet! Typical of Labour, make an announcement but no work behind it.
  
  10 0
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  August 13, 2023 5:06pm
Prince

Breathless reporting from Stuff on Hipkins’ extravaganza.
200 people attended. Wow !
“About 200 of the party faithful turned out for the announcement. Spirits were high, and a person in the crowd had even pinned a Labour Party ribbon onto their beanie.”
Astonishing scenes ! Imagine ! A ribbon on a beanie !
21 0
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August 13, 2023 1:44pm
Hugh Jarse

I am starting to get the impression that this is the best Labour can do, big populist, never to be achieved announcements covered at a national level by the media because they are not organised or funded to fight an electorate battle. They are invisible in our electorate and have selected a candidate not long out of kindy. Having said that we have a very strong national electorate MP but Labour don’t even seem to be chasing the party vote here.
14 0
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August 13, 2023 2:07pm
- Gravelroad
  
  We have a young woman Labour Party candidate here.
  Doesn’t know much , but is quoted as saying she decided to be the candidate because she so much admired Jacinda Ardern.
  Works in the pre-school sector.
  She looks like a lovely, idealistic, warm and fuzzy socialist clone of Jacinda. One that very few people have ever heard of and with no political experience.
  Should fit in well at Parliament.
  The media will love her.
  
  11 1
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  August 13, 2023 3:48pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    Until you have experience leading a team, managing a large budget and delivering results on a demanding schedule or in a competitive environment you have absolutely no business going anywhere near parliament. And that is why Labour have been such a colossally shit Government.
    
    1 0
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    August 13, 2023 7:45pm
Flossie

Well woop-de-do. GST off fruit & veg. And even more help for families. As a pensioner living in an area with absolutely no public transport I may (but not necessarily) have been impressed with an across the board tax bracket shift, or a few cents off petrol. As it is my vote remains firmly for ousting the current useless government.
22 0
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August 13, 2023 2:45pm
- Nickc2
  
  They have to be elected first! Let’s hope that doesn’t happen.
  If they are elected and they do implement this, be aware, they will have to get the tax from somewhere else. IMO, it’ll probably be the implementation of wealth tax.
  The Greens have the Labour Party in the palm of their hand and Labour knows full well they can’t form a Govt without their Communist mates, the Greens.
  
  8 1
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  August 13, 2023 3:00pm
- rockape
  
  Just think. Truffles are $3000 a kilo so 15% of that is around $450 ! I will be buying heaps more of them not !
  
  5 0
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  August 13, 2023 3:40pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Bluff oysters $31 per doz. No GST = $27. Wow!
    But oysters are not fruit or veg.
    Truffles are a veg?
    
    5 1
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    August 13, 2023 4:02pm
    - rockape
      
      If mushrooms are so are truffles. Not the chocolate kind of course.
      
      6 0
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      August 13, 2023 4:55pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Yup.
        
        2 0
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        August 13, 2023 5:46pm
NZer In Exile

IMHO there are certain “journalists” that National should simply not engage with. Namely proven woke gotcha-jockeys. Going to them is a hiding to nowhere.

Go to people who actually let you answer questions and do generally act with journalistic integrity.
15 1
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August 13, 2023 3:11pm
kisekiman

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/labour-mp-ingrid-leary-apologises-for-queue-jumping-traffic-allegedly-speeding-away.html

“Don’t you know who I am?”
Yes we do, it’s written on the side of your van. Probably in a rush to another hui with her Mongrel Mob mates.
12 0
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August 13, 2023 3:44pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Can’t resist. “Do you know who I am?”
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv5iEK-IEzw
  
  5 1
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  August 13, 2023 4:10pm
Maggie Pie

Anyone else just hear Robbo on with ZB’s Tim Beverage?

LOL!!

https://twitter.com/Coltheman1/status/1690569842859143168
9 0
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August 13, 2023 4:51pm
- rockape
  
  Talk about weasel words.
  
  8 0
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  August 13, 2023 4:53pm
- Hollyfield
  
  Particularly funny when the GST is removed from frozen vegetables but not frozen fries.
  
  11 0
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  August 13, 2023 5:09pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    “Would you like fries with that?”
    There is already confusion.
    Anyway, where are National on this fruit and vege GST?
    
    4 1
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    August 13, 2023 5:50pm
    - rockape
      
      A definite no to any change. If you want to give taxpayers money to the poor do it directly not through the supermarket duopoly.
      
      5 0
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      August 13, 2023 8:12pm
  - rockape
    
    Truffles but not bread. I know I go on about them but a good camamber laced with truffles and a couple of glasses of port is one of my indulgences.
    
    3 0
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    August 13, 2023 5:53pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Bidens. When will the greed and corruption stop?

https://finishtherace.com/ella-ford/the-bidens-may-be-served-with-subpoenas-soon/
6 1
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August 13, 2023 4:53pm
- RichardX
  
  Steve, Is it stupidity or dishonesty that you took it as an insult when I asked for evidence for your repeated claim of Trump requesting troops prior to Jan 6 that does not rely on “Its true because Trump says its true” and later you post, as evidence, an article about what Trump says?
  
  RichardX
  Several times you have been given sworn testimony that contradicts your claim.
  
  Please provide evidence of your claim that does not rely on “Its true because Trump says its true”
  MARCH 13, 2023 2:10PM
  .
  .
  Steve Otto(North Shore)
  ….“Its true because Trump says its true” Oh boy. That is something my Grandson would say. Come on sonny, you can do better than insults.
  MARCH 13, 2023 4:47PM
  
  .
  
  Steve Otto(North Shore)
  https://www.billoreilly.com/b/Trump-Says-Pelosi-Turned-Down-His-Request-For-10000-National-Guard-Troops-For-Jan.-6-Rally/237165124525255203.html
  
  Verbal suggestion, therefore no written order. God you guys are thick.
  AUGUST 13, 2023 8:23AM
  
  3 6
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  August 13, 2023 5:43pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Go away, you are very annoying.
    You are now on the ‘do not engage’ list, same as Mike.
    
    6 2
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    August 13, 2023 5:52pm
    - RichardX
      
      Your choice to engage or run away but it won’t stop me highlighting your flawed reasoning.
      
      4 6
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      August 13, 2023 6:06pm
greybeard

1. There is no Price Control in NZ.
Businesses can ask what they like, what they think their market will stand.

2. Some newly-created “Price Commissioner” will be toothless, the position will cost a lot to administer and be just more taxpayer money down the drain.

3. Obviously there are many New Zealanders who haven’t a clue how GST works, and who haven’t a clue about retailing / market prices / gross profits etc.

If basic economics was taught to every school kid from age 5 then maybe as paying customers they would make better-informed choices.
14 0
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August 13, 2023 4:54pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  1. There are a group that think ‘Market value’ is in the carpark every Sunday.
  2. Just another wombles created job to expand the Public Sector.
  3. They have no clue of what GST is. The end price is how they buy.
  
  5 1
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  August 13, 2023 6:02pm
  - greybeard
    
    It is noticeable that nobody seems to have obtained the views and opinions of the people who actually SELL fresh fruit & veges: where are the interviews with the supermarket owners ?
    The fruit & vege shop owners ?
    The dairy owners ?
    
    Mind you, if I was a supermarket owner anticipating bigger gross profits thanks to a dumb Labour government then I wouldn’t bother talking to anyone !
    
    5 0
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    August 13, 2023 6:11pm
rouppe

Labour’s tax numbers don’t make sense.

The In-Work Tax Credit will be raised by $25 a week

And

Labour will remove the GST from fruit and vegetables

And the savings are allegedly $30 a week, so means $25 from the WFF and $5 from the GST change. But then…

The cost of taking GST off fresh and frozen fruit and vegetables was estimated at $2 billion over four years, while increasing the in-work tax credit and lifting the Working for Families abatement threshold was expected to cost $1.4b over four years.

How can the GST change that brings only 1/6ths of the benefit cost more than WFF that brings 5/6ths of the benefit?
7 0
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August 13, 2023 5:10pm
- rockape
  
  Add to your astute comment. It’s going to be paid for by not allowing interest deductibility on depreciation of commercial buildings. What, buildings like supermarkets ? So they will have to put up their prices to pay that ! What a joke of a policy !
  
  6 0
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  August 13, 2023 5:39pm
  - rockape
    
    Note , They will put up all their prices.
    
    3 0
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    August 13, 2023 7:26pm
Warren

Labours dropping of GST has not gone down very well with those that support them with saying ” Labours Tax Policy as a miserly offering “.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/election-2023-labour-s-tax-policy-under-fire-as-miserly-offering.html
With other comments saying “worth less than a kumera”.
8 0
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August 13, 2023 5:24pm
- Swifty
  
  We want our bribes bigger!
  
  8 1
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  August 13, 2023 5:52pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    They will. Just wait for the final lurch of desperation!
    
    7 1
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    August 13, 2023 6:06pm
- Gravelroad
  
  From the article:
  “It (Labour) has acknowledged there will be some “line-calls” and will therefore establish an expert group “to work through the finer details of the policy and help develop the empowering legislation”.
  Great – another round of working groups to show them how to delete GST. Followed by a platoon of consultants to actually do it.
  Has there ever been a more incompetent outfit than this Labour government?
  What are we paying them for?
  
  3 0
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  August 13, 2023 7:20pm
kevn

The clown circus is at play.
Rooting NZ.
8 0
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August 13, 2023 5:44pm
Warren

Labour Party Prime Minister Chris Hipkins out of ideas and rushed Policy to bribe the voter with no money to pay for it and make a fool of himself by saying this will help those that are suffering through inflation.
Twenty-five dollars for some from working for families and maybe $4 a week savings from GST has many upset at Labours much talked about gift to those that are struggling through inflation.
On top of that $40.00 lift for others in working for Families that won’t be payable until late in 2026.
This is why the Government needs to be replaced they are out of touch and a embarrassment to those that support them and hopefully won’t be back for years after the October 2023 General Election.
9 0
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August 13, 2023 5:50pm
jon

Two days down when parties can erect electoral billboards. Nats and Act have an abundance of them, north,south and in Pahiatua. Perhaps Labour has manpower/volunteer issues for the Wairarapa seat!
6 0
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August 13, 2023 5:54pm
- rockape
  
  A friend of mine has a viral printer. I think he is going into production printing the letterRu together to change In it for you to Ruin it for you. Balaclava and hidden number plate time coming.
  
  4 1
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  August 13, 2023 6:37pm
  - rockape
    
    Vinyl above not viral ! Lol
    
    3 0
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    August 13, 2023 6:51pm
Philip Hart

So the big question is…… will fresh fruit and veges be an exempt supply or zero rated because if it is exempt then the supermarket cant claim the input tax, neither can the wholesalers, neither can the growers. I ask because as an example Hipkins just said on the news that residential rents (an exempt supply) didnt have GST but motels do. But the landlord cant claim GST on the cost of the house, the rates, the insurance, the repairs, the agents fees, the body corp levies. So there is a GST component indirectly in the rent paid.
6 0
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August 13, 2023 6:15pm
- rockape
  
  Zero rated was the announcement I think.
  
  4 0
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  August 13, 2023 6:22pm
  - Philip Hart
    
    Thats what i thought, but then he compared it to rents. He probably doesnt even know the difference
    
    5 0
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    August 13, 2023 6:29pm
Maggie Pie

Chippy says…. “with the policies announced today, it means 106,000 families will be better off by $25 per week”

Just how much longer does this commie arsehat think he can keep going to the Taxpayers Well before it runs dry?

Asking for a number of friends.
12 1
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August 13, 2023 6:16pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

This came in just a while ago.

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/we-want-to-thank-the-activists/

What is co-governance? Depends who you ask.
https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/Co-governance-is-a-conspiracy-of-silence-NZ-News-Essentials.pdf

Hmmmm. It is happening.

https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/Democracy-Action-Newsletter.pdf
3 1
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August 13, 2023 6:25pm
Biscuit

Maggie, news just in:

Tova has just interviewed her typewriter again and reckons that Labour’s internal polling has Chippie’s mob at 51%,
13 0
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August 13, 2023 6:25pm
- rockape
  
  I will await the one news poll. I think it comes out tomorrow.
  
  3 0
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  August 13, 2023 6:34pm
Maggie Pie

“No one with a penis should be allowed into a Women’s Toilet”

– Hon Winston Peters (Invercargill Rally today)
8 0
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August 13, 2023 6:44pm
- rockape
  
  That might upset a certain All Black!
  
  5 0
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  August 13, 2023 6:52pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    😀
    
    1 0
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    August 13, 2023 6:55pm
Ghost

Police, family and hundreds of members of the public are searching for 2-year-old girl Willow, who was last seen playing in the garden of her home in Henderson with her sibling.

Police search and rescue, LandSAR and the police eagle helicopter were all searching the area for the child on Sunday afternoon. Police teams were searching a nearby creek.

Article
2 0
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August 13, 2023 7:02pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  What sort of parent would allow a 2yo out of their site for even a minit?
  
  4 2
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  August 13, 2023 7:09pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    Any normal parent not afflicted with extreme anxiety disorders?
    
    2 2
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    August 13, 2023 7:41pm
- Ghost
  
  Good news, she’s be found and home again
  
  3 0
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  August 13, 2023 8:27pm
rockape

My wife and I are reasonably well off for my age in particulat (77). She still works and earns a good salary. But we are a good example of why the GST policy kelps the rich. We grow our own veg as I said previously so what we buy fresh food wise is the items at the top end of the scale. Grapes, strawberries and tomatoes out of season . Some of the more exotic fruit and veg as well. We can do that. Sadly those on low incomes can’t. They buy tinned fruit and veg cheaper proteins, sausages ,mince, chicken and not so cheap cheese, None of that will be GST so who wins the better off or those on minimum wage?
8 0
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August 13, 2023 7:06pm
- Ghost
  
  There was a project down here, not sure how it went, to help put in vegetable gardens into low income homes for free and teach them how to grow their own food.
  
  We’re the same, several fruit trees, three grape vines, blueberry’s, raspberry’s, passion fruit, a few hundred strawberry plants, large vegetable garden. Nothing like eating it fresh.
  
  5 0
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  August 13, 2023 7:14pm
  - rockape
    
    Yes we try and grow some of the expensive stuff. Asparagus, beef, and eggs to name a few. We sell some and it makes what we keep free. It’s all part of the plan I had for retirement. When you can’t earn find ways of cutting costs.
    
    3 0
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    August 13, 2023 8:08pm

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