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August 6, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 06 August 2023

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General Debate

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G152

Any-one keeping count of the shootings and deaths during Libors term in power???
And how many since the monumental change to the firearms legislation??????
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August 6, 2023 8:08am
- Loddenthinks
  
  You won’t hear about the out-of-control gang warfare raging in the central city from the Police, and you certainly won’t hear about it from the MSM.
  
  Seems like the directive has gone out – never mind “Don’t say gay” we have “Don’t say gangs” in New Zealand.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:33am
  - Matt Long
    
    No gang warfare to see here.
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/08/armed-police-guard-middlemore-hospital-overnight-person-reportedly-shot-and-injured.html
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:38am
  - stewmar
    
    Isn’t it time that we stopped calling them gangs and gangsters and referring to them as criminals and criminal groups. I reckon the gangs love reading about themselves in the media being referred to as gangs and gangsters.
    
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    August 7, 2023 9:21am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Best thing Labour did was buy back those shotgun barrels.
  So fucking dumb. 87 extra sawn off shotguns out there.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:34am
- imalwaysright
  
  G152,
  
  Isolated incidents !
  Everything is fine.
  Isolated incidents !
  
  Unfortunately , there are a lot of isolated incidents !
  
  That’s the problem
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:41am
  - NothingLeft
    
    There have been lots of isolated incidents of lions eating zebras this year in Africa too.
    
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    August 6, 2023 4:31pm
  - Scooter
    
    I think the police need to look up the meaning and find a new buzz word.
    
    ISOLATED
    adjective
    UK /ˈaɪ.sə.leɪ.tɪd/ US /ˈaɪ.sə.leɪ.t̬ɪd/
    
    C1
    not near to other places:
    an isolated farm/village
    
    C2
    happening or existing only once, separate:
    There were only a few isolated cases of violent behaviour.
    
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    August 6, 2023 5:03pm
    - Ghost
      
      Isolated incident means it is not connected to any other crimes. It does not mean that there aren’t other crimes like it taking place.
      
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      August 6, 2023 5:14pm
      - Scooter
        
        Phew, that’s ok then. We can have 5, 10, 20 shootings but they’re all “isolated” as they’re not connected to each other.
        
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        August 6, 2023 5:17pm
      - PhilBest
        
        Or maybe our Plods haven’t made the connections or have been discouraged from doing so?
        
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        August 6, 2023 7:43pm
      - kowtow
        
        Unlawful possession of a firearm is not “isolated” from actually shooting people.Or being a gangster .
        
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        August 6, 2023 7:47pm
    - kowtow
      
      scooter
      
      Yer all those gang members so “isolated” from their criminal acts .
      
      or how about that guy who’s so “isolated” from criminality he just randomly pooters around central Auckland on a scooter all day with a gun in his pocket,
      
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      August 6, 2023 7:45pm
      - Ghost
        
        As I said if you know better than the police call 111 and give them your information that proves that the shooting was not an isolated incident, but I would think since they knew who did that shooting, they are more qualified than you in them calling it that. You obviously have more information than the police
        
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        August 6, 2023 8:31pm
- kowtow
  
  Last night on 1 Lies they featured that ……Swarbrick saying the register can’t come soon enough .
  No talk of getting serious about gang crime which is out of control.
  
  And speaking of messaging I see the latest shooting, yes another one , has been described as a “disorder incident”
  
  Plod and the regime using “1984” as a training manual.
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:17am
- pdm
  
  Pointless at this stage G152.
  
  With two months roughly until the election shootings over the last 3 years could double by election day.
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:19am
Chuck Bird

Very interesting read.

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/barry-brill-a-climate-crisis-really?postId=18aeb5b0-9e7c-4b54-be9c-693a0031e118&utm_campaign=ba49403a-7fcb-451f-9bd3-0353f3c0d888&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&utm_content=8063efe1-e2c3-4ef2-95b1-15c4f8b70706&cid=5ad2ad14-ab55-4e15-92b1-7b9538cabd9b
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August 6, 2023 8:08am
- Grumpy Silver Haired Female
  
  It’s a long read and very interesting and thought provoking. I marvel at the hubris of mankind that believes that it is our actions that caused it and that we are powerful enough to fix it. Climate change, that is. Again, the hoi polloi are at the mercy of political narratives.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:45am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    My road to Damascus moment was when I read Bill Bryson’s The Short History of Nearly Everything and I realised just how insignificant and trivial we humans are.
    
    And how vain, and arrogant to believe we could affect something as incredibly complex and inter-related as the climate, subject as it is to so many overwhelming natural factors. Earthquakes, volcanoes, meteors and solar changes all have an impact on the climate far greater than anything man could ever do, as well as the earth’s natural rhythms of cooling and heating over millennia.
    
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    August 6, 2023 2:13pm
    - backster
      
      There is climate change on all the planets in our solar system but only anthropogenic on earth
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=marXhyDw3i8&list=RDCMUCTiL1q9YbrVam5nP2xzFTWQ&index=3
      
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      August 6, 2023 2:44pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  I agree with most, but by no means all of the points made. I dispute this:
  
  “The real key questions are: how much AGW is happening? Is it trivial or is it dangerous?”
  
  Those are interesting questions, almost completely insoluble; which is to say we have no way of knowing how much AGW is happening (my hypothesis is an infinitesimally and statistically insignificant amount) and whether it’s trivial or dangerous.
  
  For me, the REAL key question is: what if anything is within the power of humankind to do anything about it? And again, my hypothesis is: practically nothing. The vanity and arrogance, let alone stupidity, of these communists who believe there’s a magical thermostat somewhere in the climate, and if we pay enough taxes, send civilisation back 300 years and cripple every economy except the ones who ignore this nonsense (such as China, Russia, India, Brazil and others), we’ll be able to dial the temperature back a bit, and all will be well. Laughable and tragic all at once.
  
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  August 6, 2023 2:22pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Foster out!
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August 6, 2023 8:08am
- Colville
  
  If we are lucky Foster willing get two weeks longer than Hipkins.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:04am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Correct Bollocks, the guy is a bad coach. The first half gave you an idea what his coaching is about. Another few things, McKenzie was ordinary in the Super final, and reprised that ordinariness in this test. The number of times you saw Whitelock gathering the forwards around and talking to them was interesting (or disturbing) given Cane is the captain and was still on the field. Coles is quite a bit past his use by date.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:10am
  - Observant Octagenarian
    
    Not a ‘bad’ coach – simply out of his depth. McKenzie always looks good against ordinary teams. As does Cane.
    Christie played his way out. As did Stevenson.
    
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    August 6, 2023 11:19am
  - pdm
    
    Exactly what I said in my comment to Gravedodgers test post over at No Minister. Have a read>
    
    https://nominister.wordpress.com/2023/08/05/a-lesson-learned/
    
    I say again it was Whitelock’s tackle on McDermott that allowed Savea to get there to hold him up. This was completely overlooked by the Sky Commentators and the press reports that I have seen.
    
    In all probability a match winning tackle.
    
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    August 6, 2023 11:26am
- rangitoto
  
  Who’s Foster?
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:02am
Tricati

So, David Seymour is accused of Dog-whistling to anti co-governance supporters yet the government had no mandate to introduce their anti-democratic policy as they didn’t run on it at the last election, and its certainly wasn’t part of their election manifesto.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/political-commentators-accuse-act-s-david-seymour-of-dog-whistling-to-anti-co-governance-supporters.html
How about someone ask the government where is their ‘public’ mandate for this agenda, and when did they present it to the public for consultation as promised.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/03/prime-minister-jacinda-ardern-confirms-public-consultation-on-m-ori-co-governance-will-happen-in-2022.html
The rabble accusing Seymour of dog-whistling, seem to be of the impression that co-governance has been accepted by the majority of New Zealanders. I can tell them it isn’t and until the country gets to vote on co-governance and its impact of both, suffrage and principles of democracy, no amount of activist rhetoric makes its acceptable.
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August 6, 2023 8:09am
- Che Guava
  
  “When you look into the detail [of his policies] on wealth and policing and everything else, it’s all about slamming into Māori, slamming into low-income and no-income people, slamming into beneficiaries,” Bradford said.”It’s dog-whistling.”
  
  Sorry? As a European, I can tell Sue Bradford for a fact that the very notion of co-governance is fundamentally grounded in “slamming into” Europeans and colonialism. The difference is that no “dog-whistling” is necessary when attacking Whites – it is seen as axiomatic and a moral imperative.
  
  My suggestion to Seymour and others would be to stop “dog-whistling” about Maori and start doing what is necessary, which is exposing that Maori have no clothes, as it were. Leave no doubt that the number 1 problem with Maori is themselves, not the so-called evils of colonialism.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:39am
  - Prince
    
    I disagree.
    There is nothing inherently ‘wrong’ with Maori.
    Most maori are just typical New Zealanders, working for their families.
    Unfortunately there are elements in our society, eg Gangs, who have no respect for others. It is true that (a minority of) maori are over-represented there. But that doesn’t meant there is an inherent problem with Maori as such.
    
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    August 6, 2023 9:53am
  - In Vino Veritas
    
    Che, don’t give the woman the time of the day. She is just another hard left activist that thinks slicing the pie into ever smaller pieces is how everything will be better. She is a waste of fresh air.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:12am
    - softail 1450
      
      In Vino Veritas , ,No Sue Bradford we haven’t forgotten how your anti smacking bill was going to fix all the countries problems yet has made them far worse, F- -k off and have another fagg you old communist dinosaur.
      
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      August 6, 2023 11:14am
  - mogg
    
    This is more about Neo Liberal Marxism. Their identity politics which divide society into groups is a way of attacking the status quo. Whether it is about co-governance, racism, gender, ethnicity, religion, just stop oil, climate change etc, their aim is to turn people against each other and hope to take control from the resulting national disunity. They want revolution not inclusion or social harmony.
    
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    August 6, 2023 1:42pm
- Swifty
  
  One can hardly accuse Seymour of ‘dog-whistling’ about co-governance – he has repeatedly and openly stated his opposition to race-based laws and co-governance, whereas ‘dog-whistles’ are ‘inaudible’ political appeals and statements. That’s why they’re called ‘dog-whistles’ FFS.
  
  The silly Bradford and Di Boni should look up the meaning of phrases before throwing them around.
  
  Worse though, is Bradford’s complete misrepresentation of Seymour’s policy intentions – that ‘he wants to slam low and no-income people and Maori’ or ‘that he wants to grow the wealth gap’.
  
  An utter lie from Bradford and typical from many lefty people these days. If you can’t beat your opponent’s arguments then just lie about them.
  
  It’s just like equating opposition to certain trans phenomenon to ‘wishing genocide on the trans community’.
  
  Just complete and provable lies.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:27am
Matt Long

Labour loves their poll results, Willie Jackson cannot believe Labour being so useless is not 15% behind.
https://twitter.com/NewshubNationNZ/status/1687581605974466560
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August 6, 2023 8:09am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I don’t believe Willie. He is lying. He is just trying to give Labour their last useless boost.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:08am
  - rouppe
    
    There is not one thing that comes out of Willie Jackson’s mouth that I would believe
    
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    August 6, 2023 9:29am
NeverMindTheBollocks

Eddie Jones should be done for walkie-talkie abuse.
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August 6, 2023 8:10am
- Loddenthinks
  
  I had the same thought – I envisioned a great advertisement by the makers of those devices, to prove their durability under the toughest of conditions. Cue multiple shots of Fast Eddie bashing them all game long, all season long.
  
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  August 6, 2023 2:42pm
  - Loddenthinks
    
    For example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSv6Z5BA6e8
    
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    August 6, 2023 2:44pm
Chuck Bird

Interesting read and also listen on the podcast

Election 2023: Seymour, Act will ‘stop work’ on wasteful projects, cut public service jobs

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/election-2023-seymour-act-will-stop-work-on-wasteful-projects-cut-public-service-jobs/RER2ISDBEZDPBBUWTBZNLSKBZI/
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August 6, 2023 8:10am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Threats of cutting public service jobs – however warranted – is one of the main reasons the polls have remained so ‘stubborn’ in this nation.
  
  I do know some public servants who have a ‘centre right’ perspective, but still require employment…
  
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  August 6, 2023 8:15am
  - rouppe
    
    Sure. But let’s get them employed on getting the roads fixed and improved. Let’s get them employed on finding ways to get more operations done. Let’s get them employed on making sure we have a first world, first rate education system.
    
    Let’s not keep then employed on Auckland light rail. On a racist Maori Health Authority. On developing legislation that diminishes democracy.
    
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    August 6, 2023 9:34am
    - crikey
      
      The Maori Health Authority will be rolled into Te Whatu Ora – stated by senior National MPs at a meeting on Friday.
      
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      August 6, 2023 10:17am
      - Tony Stuart
        
        Dr Shane Reti has been saying that for weeks. Responsibility for Maori health outcomes will be placed back in the control of the Ministry of Health. And Reti has again emphasised that health decisions will be made on the basis of need.
        
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        August 6, 2023 1:13pm
      - rouppe
        
        So the wrong approach.
        
        “Rolled into” means the same teams, units, funding and separation, just under a different name. It’s weak, snivelling, obfuscation.
        
        The correct approach is: disbanded, and the staff redeployed within the existing Health system. Not to say that units targeting health in poorly served areas should not exist, but I’ve not seen any of that delivered by MHA.
        
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        August 6, 2023 1:21pm
      - pdm
        
        Inv – Ministry of Health sounds like a better organized outfit than Te Whatu Ora will ever be.
        
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        August 6, 2023 1:22pm
      - artemisia
        
        If there is a change of government, we will see ‘adjustments’ of outcomes and their associated funding. In non bureaucratic language, cuts are coming. Yes, some will cost bigly where contracts unable to be repurposed have been signed for people, premises, gear. But if there is a change in government, it certainly indicates people are raging against the waste.
        
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        August 6, 2023 2:52pm
    - Burtland
      
      the public service has only been successful at shoveling money to minority groups
      – a BA in marxism doesnt allow constructing a working economy
      
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      August 6, 2023 1:57pm
- Michael Sommerville
  
  I listened to the whole podcast. It was excellent and a highly recommended listen.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:07am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  If I was in the Public Sector I would have been looking for a job 3 years ago.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:37am
Frank the tank

When is the next Curia poll and does this confirm trends in the last few polls? I trust DPF more then any Jenna lynch-manipulated poll.

I’m hoping the more polls that come out the more the Government backbench goes into a tailspin – they won’t really want to go back to primary school teaching, trade union secretary and lower paid public service jobs without the expenses they can claim.
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August 6, 2023 8:12am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Soon. DPF mentioned the other night that they were in the field currently, so we can probably expect a poll within the next week or so.
  
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  August 6, 2023 1:15pm
Yvette

Julian Batchelor under investigation over anti-co-governance pamphlets
The law also prohibits unregistered third-party promoters from spending more than $15,700 on promotion material in the three months leading up to the election
https://www.1news.co.nz/2023/08/05/julian-batchelor-under-investigation-over-anti-co-governance-pamphlets/

If “spending” actually means paying for the booklets and Julian Bachelor has done that already outside of three month period, is it illegal to actually distribute the booklets within the three month run up to the election?

“All of it, exclusively, is extremely worrying. It is what you would call dangerous speech. It incites hate, and it instigates harm offline,” said Sanjana Hattotuwa, a researcher from the Disinformation Project.
“This is racist rhetoric. This is colonialism’s long shadow.”

What actual authority does the Disinformation Project have?
Should Sanjana Hattotuwa as the researcher not deal in facts rather than opinions.
And should his opinions in countering those of Julian Bachelor, have had the same official electoral reference as is being required of Julian Bachelor?

And as an aside, is Julian Bachelor just exercising free speech in endeavouring to correct what he seess Labour as doing, just as research Sanjana Hattotuwa appears to be using free speech and his rhetoric, like claiming Bachelor’s booklet “is colonialism’s long shadow”
Or can Julian Bachelor be seen as inciting particular action from a group of people – and Sanjana Hattotuwa as doing the same

“Disinformation Project”. my arse
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August 6, 2023 8:17am
- rjay
  
  The law is designed to stop parties from doing workarounds with 3rd parties. Consider what would happen if Greens had Twig and Tweet, Greenpeace etc spruiking for them. Be careful what you wish for.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:30am
  - Matt Long
    
    Or if the unions were giving Labour free resources.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:31am
    - backster
      
      Ohh the Unions wouldn’t do that would they?
      
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      August 6, 2023 2:51pm
  - kowtow
    
    How does that apply to te pahti media and signing up to and being paid by the the regime ton contract to “actively protect/ promote the principles of ToW”.
    
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    August 6, 2023 11:22am
- Taieri
  
  Sanjana Hattotuwa
  ————
  
  An immigrant? Or a colonialist?
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:37am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    A propagandist and an ideological clown.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:05am
  - oldpark
    
    @Taiera 9-37 AM
    Or just Labour/Green /Maori Party Selected mouthpiece puppet on a string .
    Seems the Labour Partys’ TVNZ mouthpiece is also culpable of misinformation on a one sided so called news report
    Wish they would do something useful just for a first time . Stop trying to hide the truth.
    Of course so called co -goverance with 16% of NZs Population Threat allegedly
    pulling the strings is why
    Ardern/Hipkins cabal are taking a beating in the polls .
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:20am
- rouppe
  
  The pamphlets would have to be exhorting you to vote for, or not vote for a party.
  
  I haven’t read them, so I don’t know. If they are simply opposing a law, he should be fine. Opposing a political party, probably not.
  
  I suspect it’s largely an exercise in Labour attempting to envelop him in litigation.
  
  There’s a million ways to say any given thing, just avoid saying “vote for me”, or “don’t vote for them”
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:39am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The money for the booklets comes from donations. One couple gave $20,000.
  The Elite Maori are instigating a Coup. If not stopped we lose democracy and will be ruled by Tyranny, Tribal Govt.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:48am
- Matt Long
  
  I hope the first thing ACT gets rid of is Ardern’s pet disinformation project.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:58am
- Che Guava
  
  If New Zealand really had a problem with racism, would someone named Sanjana Hattotuwa be in such a privileged position to lecture and browbeat anyone who holds a different opinion to himself? While he probably holds his anti-White views independently, don’t forget that he is also paid to spew anti-White hatred. As usual, the real haters are the ones calling everyone else a hater.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:58am
  - Swifty
    
    We are stink racists in NZ – if we were any good at it that bloke would never have got a look in.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:40am
- Clyde
  
  It takes but a minute to find out about this Disinformation Project – https://thedisinfoproject.org/about-us/our-people/
  
  Led by a woman called Kate Hannah who, on their website has this bio.
  
  Kate Hannah is a cultural historian of science and technology who works within and across cultural history, critical science and technology studies, and public understanding of science and technology. Hannah has extensive experience in research translation, strategic communications, policy development, and community engagement.
  
  Her research interests include gender, ‘race’, eugenics, colonization and white supremacism in historic and contemporary science and technology cultures and subcultures. Hannah is one of two New Zealand representatives on GPAI’s Responsible AI Working Group and is leading a research project developing principles for community consultation on classification and mitigation of online harm for GPAI. Hannah is the Director of The Disinformation Project, and was previously a Principal Investigator with Te Pūnaha Matatini. She is currently a PhD candidate at the Centre for Science and Society at Te Herenga Waka – Victoria University of Wellington.
  
  Hannah has led the Disinformation Project since its inception in early 2020. She provides rich and critical insight to the Disinformation Project, ensuring our work is reflective of the communities we serve. Hannah’s interrogation of information disorders embrace how Aotearoa New Zealand’s communities have differential experiences of past pandemics, different measures of health and wellbeing, and different experiences of state services and state intervention.
  
  She recognises that the pandemic and infodemic are also taking place within different nation-states, with different political systems, worldviews, and approaches to healthcare and the role of government. Inspiring the work at and creation of The Disinformation Project, she identified how COVID-19 disinformation is linked to online or physical harm, dissenting or fringe views related to a number of conspiratorial narratives, and hateful or violent expression.
  
  Guiding her work are questions around how disinformation narratives targeting and radicalising people in Aotearoa and internationally, how information disorders relate to narratives and tropes of white supremacy, racism, and extreme misogyny, the role of media, and the impact of the infodemic on social cohesion, tolerance and democracy.
  
  Seems to me that this mob has absolutely no relevance – ideal for the MSM to be asking for comment on.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:08am
  - rouppe
    
    Sounds like a modern era Heinrich Himmler. He was quite interested in “race, eugenics, colonization and white supremacism” too…
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:33am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Yvette, you are one of the more knowlegeable here.
  Have a look at this:
  
  Sign up at our web site for news and updates http://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:14am
Matt Long

Interesting long form interview on Obama, he’s similar to Arden,
“It’s like your question “Why is he at an event with Jay(z) and Bey(once)? Why does he want a private plane?” And the answer is, well, because those are the things that winners get.

‘But you remain hollow.’

They’re all hollow. That’s what the system produces.”
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/arts-letters/articles/david-garrow-interview-obama
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August 6, 2023 8:18am
- Albert_Ross
  
  The point you are trying to make with this extract might come across more clearly if it were clear who is being quoted, and who is the “you” that is being referred to.
  
  Who asked the question, and to whom, “why does he need a private plane”?
  Whose comment is it that “that’s what winners get”? When somebody says “but you remain hollow”, is that Obama saying that he himself remains hollow, or is that something the interviewer is saying about/to Obama? Is the comment about the system Obama’s, or is it the interviewer, or somebody else, editorialising?
  
  If the rest of the article is as incomprehensible and poorly composed as this extract – then thanks, but no thanks
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:53am
Yvette

Lies, lies and damn! … more lies .
..
<b<Broadcasting Minister Willie Jackson has no qualms about the $230,000 spent on a review panel to investigate editorial processes at RNZ.
… The review was launched after it emerged in June an RNZ digital reporter was altering stories about the Russia-Ukraine war to include a pro-Kremlin sentiment. The reporter subsequently resigned.
Jackson told Newshub Nation on Saturday the Government did not regret the amount spent on the review because “we had no choice”.
…”You’re almost talking about national security here,” Jackson added.
“Sometimes, you can’t spare the expense when you’re talking about national democracy – you’re talking about our national radio station.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/08/broadcasting-minister-willie-jackson-defends-230-000-spend-on-rnz-review.html

Alternative –
Minister for Māori Development Willie Jackson has no qualms about altering the response of Maori Elite at 72 hui on He Paupau. Jackson was in the process of watering it down to be acceptable to his Cabinet colleagues but having missed the deadline it has been tucked away until after the Election, Jackson for his betrayal of Maori input and the failure to deliver (which is only normalised by other Labour non-delivery) has not subsequently resigned.
Jackson will probably tell Newshub Nation on some Saturday, the Government did not regret the amount spent because “we had no choice”.
…”You’re almost talking about national security here,” Jackson added.
“Sometimes, you can’t spare the expense when you’re talking about national democracy” and laughed hysterically.

based on –
Such is the essence of Jackson’s problem: he can neither withdraw, nor water-down, the Draft Plan without exposing the Labour Government to the most withering political fire from Māori. His Pakeha colleagues face the same problem – in reverse. If the Labour Cabinet signs up to UNDRIP/He Puapua, then the party can kiss the 2023 election good-bye.
,,, Not that National and Act can afford to just sit back with a bucket of popcorn and enjoy the fun. If the Right/Left poll numbers remain relatively even, then the parliamentary support of an enlarged Te Pāti Māori – pumped-up by the protest votes of all those Māori outraged by a Labour betrayal even bigger than the Seabed and Foreshore, may prove critical to National and Act being able to form a government.
https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2022/07/05/maoridom-went-first-in-shaping-a-response-to-the-undrip-he-puapua-challenge-and-now-willie-jackson-has-a-problem/
– and other sources

_______________

And in looking for other reference, there is this –
Jackson handed in his resignation after being shoulder-tapped by then-Labour leader Andrew Little to stand for the party in the coming election.
It was somewhat of a coup for Labour given Jackson’s previous ties to the Māori Party and removed the risk of him standing against Peeni Henare in Tāmaki Makaurau.

When Jackson announced his decision to stand for Labour, he also decided to campaign full-bore on wiping the Māori Party from Parliament.
Having got his wish after co-leader Te Ururoa Flavell was beaten by Tamati Coffey in Waiariki, Jackson is unapologetic.
“I came into the game to destroy the Māori Party, just like their game was to destroy us. Labour wants to destroy National and National wants to destroy Labour, go ask the Pākehā politicians the same question.”
“It’s the game we play, the game we play is take each other out. Not their families or anything, their families are all good people but I was clear from the start as campaign manager we had to take them out.”
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/99990475/willie-jackson-i-wanted-to-destroy-the-mori-party
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August 6, 2023 8:30am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Willie’s last lurch before Labour dies for 15 years.
  Wiping Maori Party form Parliament? Bullshit, he will join them.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:42am
  - Burtland
    
    Willie is part of the maori party Trojan Horse in Labour – only the maori unionists will stay post election – theyve done their hit job.
    
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    August 6, 2023 2:14pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Yes!
      
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      August 6, 2023 4:48pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Jack Smith doesn’t know jack.

https://thepatriotchronicles.com/news-for-you/trumps-lawyer-says-smith-doesnt-know-jack-about-the-law-lays-out-simple-strategy-plan/
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August 6, 2023 9:10am
Captain Mainwaring

Stuff ‘cartoonist’ Emma Cook plumbs new depths of Luxon hatred this morning.
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August 6, 2023 9:12am
- Philview
  
  Stuff also running an article about the ‘possible’ threat to NZ abortion laws. They don’t name names but the implication is that a vote for the right is a threat, even though they aren’t campaigning on it. There is a sniff of misinformation in that article.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:19am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Insane. A new Government would not touch abortion law.
    
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    August 6, 2023 9:44am
  - kowtow
    
    ‘There is a sniff of misinformation in that article.’
    
    The left wing legacy media did the same over English’s Catholicism.
    
    What it really is is a campaign of fear mongering designed to sway the stupid swing voter , in this case targetting particularly women . Ironically this from the media who’re so activist in promoting anti woman , ‘trans’ sexual divisive identity politics.
    
    They are hypoctritical ,neo marxist extremists .
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:18am
  - crikey
    
    Philview: Not a sniff of misinformation in that article, a stench.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:22am
  - Scott
    
    I hope a new government does modify our abortion laws. At present under Jacinda’s regime we have abortion on demand up until birth. The unborn child has no legal protection or rights as abortion is now out of the crimes act.
    
    We have the most radical abortion regime, short of infanticide, possible. Something should change.
    
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    August 6, 2023 2:24pm
- Jade Warrior
  
  Emma Cook – in fact, Stuff’s entire stable of cartoonists – are going to need several months of counselling if we have a National/Act government by mid October.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:01am
- Prince
  
  Stuff has an inbuilt hatred of National/Act.
  It shines through their selection of Political ‘journalists’ (eg Vernon Small), their cartoonists, and their ‘Opinion’ writers.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:04am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Musk controlling Ukraine war?

https://redbloodedconservative.com/2023/08/05/musk-orders-starlink-to-block-ukrainian-drone-attacks/
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August 6, 2023 9:13am
- info@cruzpro.com
  
  Kind of a neutral stance. Musk not allowing his Starlink satellite system to be used by one country to attack the other is reasonable in my opinion. Pretty sure that Musk won’t allow the Russians to use Starlink to attack the Ukraine either.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:28am
  - rangitoto
    
    Since Starlink is a contractor to the US military then the claim is dubious.
    
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    August 6, 2023 1:18pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Maybe. But I doubt that the Ruskies need Musklink to attack Ukraine.
    
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    August 6, 2023 4:05pm
Bridgenag

Saturday Morning Conspiracy Theory
The COVID-19 pandemic plot predicted in Sept 2019 – prescient warning or lucky guess?

https://open.substack.com/pub/metatron/p/saturday-morning-conspiracy-theory?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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August 6, 2023 9:20am
lastmanstanding

An Anti Racist Government would do away with Race Based Government Departments and Agencies.
An Anti Racist Government would govern for all regardless of race religion colour or creed.
The polls show the overwhelming majority believe the country is racially divided. Until the citizens elect an Anti Racist Government NZ will continue to be the South Africa of the South Pacific.
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August 6, 2023 9:21am
Bridgenag

Are the spooks trying to shut down Kiwiblog? Took until now to get on this morning
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August 6, 2023 9:23am
- info@cruzpro.com
  
  Would not be surprised. Same here. Kept getting strange error messages having to do with not being able to connect with database.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:44am
- Benedict Yu
  
  The last few days I have found the sure site slow to respond. Occasionally times out.
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:45am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The server must be clogged up with leftist rubbish?
    
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    August 6, 2023 9:50am
- crikey
  
  Could it be that logons to the site are being monitored, thus slowing it down?
  
  Just because you’re paranoid it doesn’t mean they’re not out to get you.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:25am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Could be any number of reasons. Given the extremist weirdos in charge of New Zimbabwe though and their obvious desire to police dissent, highly possible.
    
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    August 6, 2023 1:32pm
- Chris Nisbet
  
  FYI – we learned last night from One News that The Disinformation Project are monitoring traffic to Julian Batchelor’s anti-co-governance website.
  If they monitor that website, why not this one?
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:24am
  - kiwi_chileno
    
    The Disinformation Project is an organ of the the surveillance State, monitoring on-line expression of free and lawful opinions. I wonder if they are recording the IP addresses of visitors to https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi? The Disinformation Project could fingerprint and profile users from their IP addresses (and other data they might be collecting) by correlating hits on Stop Co-Governance and other ‘right-wing’ sites they are (probably) monitoring.
    
    Increasingly, I am using either a VPN or Tor to obfuscate my real location, IP address, etc https://www.torproject.org/
    
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    August 6, 2023 6:19pm
- kevn
  
  A form of hacking is taking place.
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:53am
imalwaysright

Watching Robertson on gst on fresh fruit and veg with Tame Jack on q@a
Asked how it would work, he said it works overseas .

Tame asked him how and where ?

He said he hasn’t looked into it !

That’s resignation material.

Total incompetent fool proposing a tax change that is an excercise in smoke and mirrors by retailers and futility by government .
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August 6, 2023 9:29am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Minister of Finance “has not looked into it”
  I think he just doesn’t know what he is doing. Limited economic sense.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:18am
  - kowtow
    
    ‘I think he just doesn’t know what he is doing’
    
    The regime accounts prove that.
    
    Sadly te pahti media have turned what is a critically important issue into literally a laughing matter over that question from Willis .
    
    There’s nothing funny about the depths that labour , NZF and the media pardy have driven this country to.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:26am
- mogg
  
  Yes Labour are the government who made food unaffordable.
  
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  August 6, 2023 1:22pm
- Pavel
  
  Australia does not charge gst on primary produce. It’s a very simple thing to do and if you do find it overwhelming you can spend $100 on accounting software (quick books, zero etc) and it will work it out for you. I cannot understand the opposition to it here.
  
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  August 6, 2023 1:49pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Nope, it ain’t that simple.
    
    Among the principles of tax are that they should be broad based, easy to account for and have few or no exemptions or carve outs.
    
    Another way of looking at it is that by removing GST on food, the Govt is either reducing the overall tax take or it will create a new tax to make up the shortfall.
    
    Which option gets your vote, Pavel, and why?
    
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    August 6, 2023 4:10pm
  - Swifty
    
    As but one example, the IMF says that it’s most likely that two thirds of the tax decrease will be retained by food retailers and only one third passed on to consumers in the form of lower food prices.
    
    Taking GST off food is just a great big wealth transfer to food retailers.
    
    There are many and better ways of helping out low income folk.
    
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    August 6, 2023 4:41pm
  - Hard Cheese
    
    Go have a look on the ATO website at the food classification flowcharts that tell you whether a food item attracts GST. Simple it definitely is not.
    
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    August 6, 2023 7:19pm
- Scooter
  
  There’s 2 very good, informative interviews with Don Brash on Reality Check Radio , Grant should listen to them pronto.
  
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  August 6, 2023 5:08pm
Albie

Had the displeasure of watching One News last night as I had deleted Prime by mistake.
Never again. A hit job on Batchelor by the creepy Disinformation Project ( who’s funding these A Holes by the way?) followed up by another scaremongering End of Days climate change story.
Of course no counter narrative on either story for a bit of balance.
No wonder the msm are so despised by many.
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August 6, 2023 9:35am
- Jade Warrior
  
  I also saw that news item and found it distasteful. What was particularly frustrating is that at no point in that item did the journalists attempt to engage with the arguments Batchelor made in his pamphlet. The viewer was just invited to assume that co-governance is a great thing and that only alt-right extremists would think otherwise.
  
  Another dangerous aspect of the “disinformation project” is that it gives the left an easy way out. Instead of engaging with right leaning views and taking the time to explain why they are wrong, it’s much easier for them to simply slap the “disinformation” tag and then dismiss them.
  
  I think that news item will also backfire on the disinformation project. I didn’t even know Batchelor had released such a pamphlet until I saw it on the news last night. Now that I know about it, I would say there are a lot of people who are keen to read it. I will be keeping an eye on my mailbox.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:07am
  - Swifty
    
    “Instead of engaging with right leaning views and taking the time to explain why they are wrong, it’s much easier for them to simply slap the “disinformation” tag and then dismiss them.”
    
    Yep, that’s exactly why they do it.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:31am
  - WaveyDavey
    
    We were never going to get an impartial piece when this reporter was tasked with doing the job
    
    Te Aniwa Hurihanganui, Māori Affairs Correspondent
    
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    August 6, 2023 1:14pm
  - wsk12345
    
    I think you can download the pamphlet off the stop co governance website.
    
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    August 6, 2023 7:30pm
    - Piniwi
      
      No not for download. Tried to register or sign up but then got blocked?? Not very supporter friendly.
      
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      August 6, 2023 11:38pm
  - Piniwi
    
    Hobson Pledge must be next as they suggest to vote for those who reject Co Governance and 3 Waters.
    
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    August 6, 2023 11:42pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  How can you delete Prime? Go to the function menu and re-tune all channels.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:20am
  - Albie
    
    I deleted the 5:30 news episode last night silly! Not the channel!
    
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    August 6, 2023 5:12pm
  - wsk12345
    
    Can’t you download the pamphlet off the stop co governance website Steve?
    
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    August 6, 2023 7:29pm
- kowtow
  
  As I said on GD last night , tv1 will be promoting him via the Streisand effect .
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:29am
- Chris Nisbet
  
  Who is funding them?
  My money is on us. They’re such a transparent bunch that they won’t tell us though.
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:19am
Ipanema69

People who can just foxtrot oscar today.

1) Helen Elizabeth Clark

We ditched you in 2008. The only difference between you and Jacinda was that you were prime minister during an economic boom. This hid all of the crap spending you and Cullen masterminded. Even then we were in recession prior to the GFC. I dont care about your views on new defence policy, nor does anyone else.

2) Ganesh Nana

You may have a PhD but you dont know squat all. Your opinion piece in stuff about considering the future in planning is interesting. As I recall you emphatically stated that robbo had done the sums correctly in 2017. Not sure anyone should take your advice on future planning.

3) Vernon Small

Labour goverments always end in recession. Your column in stuff is pathetic. Stephen Joyce called it in 2017. There is always a hole in labour goverment budgets.

4) Any moron considering voting for WRP.

Yup he will keep them honest right up until his ass sinks into the leather of the crown limo! This guy turns 80 in the next parliamentry term! He isnt going to give a damn how many promises he breaks.
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August 6, 2023 9:46am
All_on_Red

A lesson for Mr Luxon to observe perhaps.
‘Rishi Sunak’s popularity among Tory members has surged after he took a tougher stance on net zero issues.
The Prime Minister’s support among the Conservative grassroots has grown after his party’s surprise victory in the Uxbridge and South Ruislip by-election, which was widely viewed as a de facto referendum on the London ultra-low emission zone expansion (Ulez).
In the aftermath of the vote, Mr Sunak declared that he was on motorists’ side as he asked the Department for Transport to carry out a review of low-traffic neighbourhoods across the country.

On Monday, he announced the Government was granting hundreds of new licences for North Sea oil and gas exploration.’

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/08/04/rishi-sunak-popularity-rise-net-zero-ulez-north-sea-oil-gas/
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August 6, 2023 9:47am
- Colville
  
  Electricity price in UK has gone up 300%?
  That is a lot of political motivation.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:09am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  ALL of Ardern’s Captains calls should be revoked.
  If she could act like the Tyrant she is, and do them without select committees and Parliament votes, the Luxon can undo using the same method.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:23am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    I would like to see the government publish a discussion document on the costs of the governments climate change policies. Simply starting with the 2030 commitments.
    
    A factual, well written document in English without all the woke language. Just the facts. The economic, private and fiscal costs.
    
    It would be an eye opener. There is currently little information. The Treasury did some limited analysis that showed the fiscal costs would exceed the education budget.
    
    Imagine a question today.
    
    “Mr Luxon, are you aware of the Treasury analysis that suggests that the costs to the government of overseas carbon credits to 2030 could be as high as 23.7 billion dollars? Are you prepared for the government to meet these costs?”
    
    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/climate-economic-fiscal-assessment/nga-korero-ahuarangi-me-te-ohanga-2023&ved=2ahUKEwjX4YbaycaAAxXQnFYBHfuADgIQFnoECAwQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3gx3gf7rL_QWOB-STROJef
    
    Note that these are ONLY the financial transfers to other countries. It excludes all other government and private costs within New Zealand.
    
    I’ll say it again. Folk in New Zealand have no idea what is going to hit them. Remember these massive economic and financial costs in the next seven years will be in addition to the costs of fixing everything that has been broken in New Zealand over the last 6 years.
    
    I guess ignorance is bliss. If you are a young ambitious person in New Zealand today, the only rational decision would be to leave for Australia. That nice new Australian PM will now roll out the red carpet on citizenship.
    
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    August 6, 2023 10:46am
    - gravedodger
      
      Have a read here https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/barry-brill-a-climate-crisis-really?postId=18aeb5b0-9e7c-4b54-be9c-693a0031e118&utm_campaign=ba49403a-7fcb-451f-9bd3-0353f3c0d888&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&utm_content=f42bd7d3-94f2-4cee-afb0-1ed7c26dce92&cid=414ab8b8-d1f5-4c80-bd32-ceace170aaab
      
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      August 6, 2023 2:22pm
- Master Mariner
  
  The new inconvenient Truth.
  Ideology meets Reality.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:33am
  - Observant Octagenarian
    
    I prefer Utopia meets Reality.
    
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    August 6, 2023 1:46pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

Want to know what propaganda and misinformation looks like?
Look no further. This TV item has it all.
No more than $15700 to be spent on election material? Take note, Julian Batchelor and Stop Co-Governance received a $20,000 DONATION specifically to finance the printing of the booklets.
https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/tv-one-determined-to-shut-down-julian-batchelor-and-stop-co-governance/

What are TV1 afraid of? This movement is now gaining a shitload of traction. Those who oppose it are now getting very scared.
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August 6, 2023 10:03am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Online booklet is here:
  
  https://bit.ly/stopcogov
  
  Sign up at our web site for news and updates http://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:08am
  - Piniwi
    
    What’s the point. “The publisher chose not to allow downloads for this publication”. Some of us oldies need a PDF that can be read at leisure or in spoken word for some to us if required. Spread it far and wide or the whole issue will be back in the cupboard for later promotion.
    
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    August 6, 2023 11:28pm
- Shaun the Sheep
  
  Clearly there needs to be a plethora of Stop Co-governance entities that pop up every $15k or so.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:15am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Good to see that many more on Kiwiblog are now taking notice of Julian Batchelor and Stop Co-Governance. This is serious stuff. If the Coup is not stopped in it’s tracks, it will be all over and we will be too late.
  Julian Batchelor is a good man. He is committed to this. Evangelist, Minister – so bloody what? I am not a man of faith, and I can talk with him freely.
  
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  August 6, 2023 3:28pm
ClanMcleod

REVELATIONS reported last weekend by the Australian, a leading broadsheet owned by the Murdoch group, have huge implications for pandemic policy in New Zealand. They should completely change public perceptions and understanding of the Covid landscape. These implications include legal liability, safety of public health measures, future pandemic responses and personal health choices.

Whatever the motivation for this MSM public admission, the implications for New Zealand of these Covid revelations are profound.

For three years we have been divided as a nation along the lines of vaccinated versus unvaccinated. It is now abundantly clear that both Covid and Covid vaccines originated from risky biotechnology research on mutated deadly pathogens. Rather than a divided nation we could have been a united nation, standing shoulder to shoulder against novel biotechnology experimentation.

https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/how-jacinda-ardern-was-played-by-the-covid-puppetmasters/

A very good read.
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August 6, 2023 10:16am
- Master Mariner
  
  Thanks Clan.
  In a nutshell.
  The DG of Health should never of been politicised into a Healt Commissar.
  This is where subjective evidence has over ruled objective evidence.
  Ie Feelz over substance.
  Same with the Current Police Commissar.
  Being objective you can follow the Science as it devolves and change strategy accordingly.
  Being Subjective YOU CANT.
  Will we ever get the DG of Health Back or stumble through with Commissars?
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:22am
- Grunter
  
  Clan – here’s another interesting read. A rundown and a number of clips from the Aust Senate session with Pfizer and Moderna Execs.
  
  These evil clowns admitted that they gave their own employees a different jab to everyone else.
  
  If anyone reads all this and still thinks the jab was safe and effective then you must be brain dead.
  
  https://www.zerohedge.com/medical/your-injections-are-killing-our-young-people-pfizer-moderna-reps-slammed-during-heated
  
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  August 6, 2023 1:48pm
  - info@cruzpro.com
    
    I watched that video in its entirety. The Australian Phizer execs never answered the main question about whether they knew how the spike protein caused miacarditis. They were repeatedly asked the same question and repeatedly obfuscated. At one point they were asked to simply say yes or no ans still waffled on without answering the question,
    
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    August 6, 2023 8:31pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Hubby arrived home last Sunday afternoon on Day 6 after a Triple by-pass operation at Waikato Hospital.

I’d been expecting to get back a very tired and frail man in constant need of pain relief and reassurance.

What I’ve got back is a skinny wee thing with a very healthy appetite and his usual fondness for late nights.

The daughters and I had to order him to bed at 11pm on his first night back home.

Since then, I’ve told him to get himself to bed as I’m whacked by about 9-10pm.

His only discomfort seems to be that he has to sleep on his back for the next few weeks until his sternum heals.

We had equipped the upstairs living room with some new tech stuff, to save him traipsing downstairs to his man cave… but that only lasted for a day or two, as he expressed his disdain for the crappy lap-top we’d bought him and the lousy programmes on the chrome-cast channels.

So he’s back down into subterranean territory and life is pretty much back to normal here.

I’m in awe at the skills and care he has received from the Staff at the cardiology unit, Waikato Hospital and from the nurses and Doctors here In Gisborne.
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August 6, 2023 10:17am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Sternum is important. My Dad had two open heart surgeries at Waikato. Second one his sternum was wired up but it never joined. Plagued him until the day he died, some 20 years later. Your hubby needs to take the first 6 weeks very easy.
  Best wishes.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:29am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Add to that. For the sternum to join, it needs to stop moving. As you walk – left right left right, the ribcage moves up and down.
    Lay down and stay there.
    
    6 1
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    August 6, 2023 4:53pm
- tavita
  
  Tie him down Maggy. My father had a heart attack and surgery but was back outdoors within weeks. He got a chill and never recovered.
  
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  August 6, 2023 2:40pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Cheers,
    I’m watching this carefully…
    
    3 0
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    August 6, 2023 7:36pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Well, I am going to take advantage of a beautiful winter day. Something I have been waiting for. Sun and low SW breeze.
Today’s job – timing belt and pulleys on a V6 Land Cruiser. Big job. Good that I know what I am doing.
16 1
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August 6, 2023 10:35am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING 😎

No sooner had I walked in the door after Mass than this popped up on my Twitter feed….I’ve just retweeted to well over 6k followers. Please share!

https://twitter.com/Charleton_Hone/status/1687952160607338496
10 2
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August 6, 2023 10:37am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Here we go again. Another plug for the Catholics.
  
  1 6
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  August 6, 2023 11:33am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    All I see is something about a petition. For something. Maybe you need a twitter account to read it.
    
    8 0
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    August 6, 2023 11:55am
    - Maggie Pie
      
      Hiyaa Bene
      It’s the petition to strip Cindy of her Damehood….for all the harm she’s done to people, bankrupted, and financially crippled.
      
      There’s nothing stopping anybody from logging in….unless of course you’ve already signed the petition and were hoping to vote twice?
      
      13 1
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      August 6, 2023 2:29pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        What needs to happen is someone giving her a right out dressing down. Give her her pedigree. Make her understand what she has done. No running away or diverting.
        She is an adult now, so away with her childishness.
        
        9 1
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        August 6, 2023 3:32pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “It’s the petition to strip Cindy of her Damehood..”
        
        Stupid waste of energy.
        
        If Luxon becomes PM there is no scenario where he would do that. Get back to the real world.
        
        6 0
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        August 6, 2023 6:38pm
      - Piniwi
        
        Fair go Steve (no reply button) do you honestly think the SLG would listen to any such verbal “dressing down”. She is totally convinced she is special and so far above reproach to be heavenly. Oh well on cloud coocoo land maybe but always right. Lol
        
        1 1
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        August 6, 2023 11:14pm
    - Matt Long
      
      https://www.change.org/p/strip-jacinta-ardern-of-her-damehood?recruited_by_id=54ae4f10-33de-11ee-bad3-edd0e7603c97&share_bandit_exp=initial-36456205-en-AU
      Is the link, do you think either Hipkins or Luxon would strip Ardern of her Damehood?
      
      7 1
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      August 6, 2023 3:18pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Signed. This is where Maggie Pie was heading through Twitter.
        
        5 1
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        August 6, 2023 3:34pm
- xasperated
  
  Would it kill them to spell her name correctly?
  
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  August 6, 2023 3:44pm
slightlyrighty

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/132689857/green-party-promises-free-dental-care-for-all-funded-by-multimillionaires

Free Dental? Piss off. Dental self care is easy and cheap. Brush and Floss. Target funding where it is needed.

and I’m speaking as a parent who has just received an 11K bill for my child’s braces.

Basic Dental care is free up until 18. That’s good enough.
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August 6, 2023 11:27am
- wreck1080
  
  If you care for your teeth, dental costs are super low compared to other life essentials. I pay 130-250 annually… depending on whether I need to visit the hygienist.
  
  In the old days, the dentist and hygienist were the same person…
  
  6 0
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  August 6, 2023 1:37pm
  - wsk12345
    
    Not true. My teeth were destroyed by the Dental Nurses of the 70s and 80s. “If you drill it wrong you just fill it up and try again”.
    
    As a result all my molars are cracking after biting on them over the subsequent 40 yrs. All of them need crowns at $1500 each. So far I’ve done 6. By the one I finish I will be starting to replace them. And yes, I brush and floss.
    
    Still don’t agree with free dental.
    
    2 0
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    August 6, 2023 7:47pm
bjools

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300944071/live-pm-reveals-plans-for-twin-tunnels-for-second-auckland-harbour-crossing
So Mr Hipkins, remind us…how much is your current tunnel in Auckland,
1. Behind time
2. over budget
3. and still not finished
Q: Will babies born today, be able to use it, in their life time?
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August 6, 2023 11:27am
- RightNow
  
  6 years of press releases about Labour revealing plans.
  
  12 0
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  August 6, 2023 2:04pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The babies born today will not even see it.
  The light rail idiots are interfering.
  You will still have to travel from home to a train station. Park and ride is a joke. Oteha Valley road parking is full up by 6am weekdays, to catch a bus, what makes the rail idiots think this will not be the same? Their thinking stops at the end of the line.
  
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  August 6, 2023 3:22pm
softail 1450

Hell the moderator must have gone back to bed ???

[Mod: lots of issues going on behind the scene. We are as frustrated as you are!]
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August 6, 2023 1:07pm
Chuck Bird

FYI

DAVID SEYMOUR interviewed by Simon Shepherd

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/david-seymour-interviewed-by-simon-shepherd?postId=9285dfd2-de7e-41f4-9a97-ad34ef3b3000&utm_campaign=e7bd4984-c1ae-44c6-b83d-ad223f693003&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&utm_content=8aa94464-bff9-42d7-a479-efc1011d0678&cid=5ad2ad14-ab55-4e15-92b1-7b9538cabd9b
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August 6, 2023 1:16pm
- info@cruzpro.com
  
  Watched the entire video. The interviewer continuously interrupted David Seaymour but David did an incredible job of maintaining his cool. Especially liked the part where David said “if you would like me to say more than two sentences in a row “. That only stopped the A- hole a minute.
  
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  August 6, 2023 8:17pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Grrrrrr. The interviewer was insufferable! Interrupted every answer from Seymour within seconds.
  
  The psychedelic “worms in the sky” background was pretty odd and distracting too!
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:16pm
BeaB

Thought I should listen to Suzy Ferguson’s RNZ podcast about dis/misinformation. So glad I did as I could easily have fallen into a rabbit hole of sourdough starters and kombucha scobies, not to mention feeling arrogant about growing my own tomatoes. And that terrible dark community that brought meals to help out the woman with sick kids. It’s a terrible world, the dark web. I shall have to be extra vigilant after the troubling stuff I learned.
9 0
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August 6, 2023 1:26pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  I got 3 minutes into it, then threw my slippers at the radio.
  
  7 0
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  August 6, 2023 4:15pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The radio did not say anything. Don’t kill the messenger.//
    
    6 1
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    August 6, 2023 4:59pm
Chuck Bird

Did anyone see the Outsiders this morning and if so can you remember the name of the climate skeptic Dr John Cleu***?
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August 6, 2023 1:26pm
- Steve Todd
  
  What are you talking about, Chuck? What is ‘the Outsiders’ and where would we have seen it?
  
  6 0
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  August 6, 2023 1:42pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Outsiders is on Sky News Australia and is on from 11 am and 1 pm NZ time.
    
    6 0
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    August 6, 2023 1:45pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      Thanks, Chuck.
      
      I finally found it by googling Sky News NZ Outsiders. I played around with various spellings of Dr John Cleu…, but could not come up with anything.
      
      Fortunately, Chris Nisbet has come to the party.
      
      5 0
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      August 6, 2023 2:06pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  I recently read a discussion on the July 2023 marked spike in global temps (as measured by entire-globe-scanning UAH satellite). One interesting hypothesis was that it correlates with marked slump in atmospheric sulphur particulates over the same period (as shown by satellite measurements). It was hypothesised that this could have been due to the increased rain fallout caused by the Tonga Volcano big water vapour belch into the stratosphere. As in this alleged extra rainfall washed out a significant amount of sulphur particulates from the atmosphere in areas that spew lot of sulphur (East Europe and Asia). Sulphur particulates come from industry and *some* volcanic eruptions and generally have a cooling effect on global temps (EG as happened markedly after the Pinatubo and Krakatoa eruptions).
  
  May not pan out, but other explanations (IE from career Co2 alarmists) don’t add up.
  
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  August 6, 2023 1:47pm
  - Chris Nisbet
    
    Somebody explained the recent spikes in sea/air temperature this way… because they’re so unusual it tends to indicate that they are not due to “Climate Change!”. This is because “Climate Change!” is a slow moving beast. The ‘climate’ changes slowly, so if we get some strange spike it means that some else is probably going on.
    Of course, it could be that we’ve (finally) reached one of the dreaded “Tipping Points!”, and we’re all going to have to move to higher ground.
    /s
    I know where I’d put my money.
    
    7 0
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    August 6, 2023 4:15pm
- Chris Nisbet
  
  I didn’t see it, but maybe they interviewed John Clauser
  
  10 0
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  August 6, 2023 1:49pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Brilliant. Thank you very much, Chris.
    
    10 0
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    August 6, 2023 1:53pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    I hope others check out the link you sent.
    
    9 0
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    August 6, 2023 2:05pm
    - JohnRidd
      
      A Nobel prize winner in Physics who does not believe there is a climate crisis.
      
      https://co2coalition.org/news/nobel-laureate-dr-john-clauser-i-dont-believe-there-is-a-climate-crisis/
      
      10 0
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      August 6, 2023 3:46pm
- kowtow
  
  Nobel laureate in physics mentioned in Barry Brill’s excellent recent piece over on Basset Brash and Hide.
  
  6 0
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  August 6, 2023 2:44pm
- Master Mariner
  
  Nobel prise winner.
  I think his name is Cleusser?
  
  4 0
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  August 6, 2023 3:02pm
- JohnRidd
  
  John Clauser.
  
  6 0
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  August 6, 2023 3:44pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  Do you mean John Clarke, the renowned climate skeptic? I don’t know if he’s a Doctor, though this is from nearly 10 years ago – https://theconversation.com/profiles/john-m-clarke-113123
  
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  August 6, 2023 11:24pm
oldpark

THE IMPACT OF CO-GOVERNANCE ON THE NATION? A real sad wakeup call for all democratic Loving NZs.
Up until recently New Zealand has had one of the world’s oldest, most enduring and stable democracies – a democracy the envy of many peoples. However, democracy and political stability are seriously undermined by the growing prevalence of the co-governance model and other undemocratic arrangements, and exclusive racialised provisions in legislation and government policy. These changes are having a significant impact on our constitution – changes for which the peoples’ agreement has never been sought by the government.

Briefly, negative effects of the 50/50 co-governance model in the New Zealand context include:

the trashing of one of the world’s longest standing and most successful democracies.
The disproportionate amount of power placed in the hands of one sector of the community. This disregards the principle of equality of citizenship – one person, one vote, each of equal value.
Giving veto power to those unelected by and therefore unaccountable to the community, thereby undermining democratic accountability.
It is racially divisive, fostering a them and us mentality, which can easily morph into a ‘them versus us’ attitude.
The detrimental impact on social cohesion and race relations.
CO-GOVERNANCE NOT NECESSARILY THE END GOAL
Te Parti Māori, iwi leaders, and other individual Māori have indicated that co-governance is only a step on their journey to full authority and control. Such an intention is realised in the new Water Services Entities Act, which not only establishes 50/50 co-governance boards at the apex of the Entities, but also goes much further in a different type of constitutional arrangement from anything we have seen before. The Act gives local iwi and hapu extensive and exclusive rights which effectively amount to full authority over the management of water in each catchment area. It does so by allowing any number of iwi and hapu to provide Te Mana o Te Wai Statements, which the Water Services Entities must give effect to. There is no equivalent directive power provided for local government, nor the opportunity for other communities who have an interest in freshwater to have the same input.

WHAT THE FUTURE MIGHT HOLD FOR NEW ZEALAND
New Zealand is at a crossroads. Our choice for the future is either as a democratic state based on equal rights for all, or an ethno-nationalist state with separate, race-based governance.

The probable future if New Zealand continues down the current path will be an end of a united sovereignty, to be replaced by co-governance complete with two parliaments organised under two totally different systems and cultures – one democratic and the other based on tribal tikanga. We will become two peoples with vastly different rights.

The Labour Government is already considering such a future for New Zealand. In 2019 it commissioned a report to outline what it needed to do to realise its commitments to a United Nations Declaration on Indigenous Rights. Māori Development Minister Willie Jackson has labelled the resultant report – He Puapua – merely a discussion document and not government policy. However, the reality is that several of the proposals contained in the report have already been implemented, and others are progressively being imposed by the government.

A rift between the races in an ethno-nationalist state paints a very bleak future for New Zealand. Based on humanity’s historical experience and an understanding of what works, the only way to a harmonious future is to work together as a nation of equal citizens irrespective of ethnicity – equal before the law, with equal rights and duties, each with an equal vote in a democracy.

As Dr John Robinson, former university lecturer and research scientist writes of this in his latest book, Our Choice for the Future Equality or Tribal Rule

“New Zealand is in big trouble, a divided country. Many arguments have been put forward to divide us, based on documents from the past, with the meaning of each hotly debated.

We need not be directed by any of that. Rather we should be guided by basic principles that we can all agree on when we meet to debate our choice for our society, no longer held hostage to the shackles of the past. The question for today, as always, is what sort of society and what sort of country do we want? In answering that question, we must be free to think for ourselves, and consider what is best for us, now, in today’s world.

What guides us in a search for a decent and prosperous nation? This core principle is for equality. We must be one, with government by us all, working together as equal citizens – equal before the law, with equal rights, each with an equal vote in a true democracy. That basic condition is not met today. Co-governance, shared rule by two separate peoples, is only possible when we are divided into two race-based groups, Māori and the other, where one’s position in society is defined by ancestry, determined by accident of birth.

When the choice is for equality, co-governance and all the considerable apparatus of separation must be decisively rejected.”

FURTHER READING
Gary Judd KC: Lawyers must reject co-governance and coercion

Professor Elizabeth Rata: The Road to He Puapua – Is there really a Treaty partnership?

The Democracy Project: Dr Philip Temple: Nothing to fear? A response to Willie Jackson on fairness and co-governance.
The Legacy of the Ardern/Hipkins last six years as Government .Should we be afraid?Asking for so many many voters not being deliberately informed on the ramifications of such a huge Political Call by Labour/Green/Maori Party .
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August 6, 2023 1:28pm
greybeard

Spot the odd man out:

Greens will make dental care “free” for all, paid by a new wealth tax.

Labour will build two more harbour crossing tunnels and a light rail line, paid for (somehow).

ACT wants to reduce the public service staff levels and stop wasteful and unnecessary projects
31 2
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August 6, 2023 1:29pm
slightlyrighty

So National Announce Nation Wide roading plans costing 24 Billion

Labour Bitch and moan about the costs, saying they’re between 2.8 and 4 Billion out.

Then Labour announce a 45 Billion Dollar project for Auckland only?
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August 6, 2023 1:54pm
- Piniwi
  
  But with a lot of pictures along with blank pages and crayons for the children to draw Chippie and the woman with the pompom hair. All we can take from this “staged” performance is that Labour do make the biggest announcements to be followed by…an announcement. But that is not all as elsewhere the Fat Controller is weaving his own word web ” Labour’s finance spokesperson (oohoo) Grant Robertson says “it’s not going to be possible to make big promises” this election and suggested the global economy is “starting to deteriorate further”. Yep that global economy has done it again. Baa baa Baloney again.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:50pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Fake News or not?

https://libertyonenews.com/china-was-likely-planning-to-launch-pathogen-from-illegal-california-lab/
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August 6, 2023 3:53pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

WHAT’S GOING ON?!: Jim Jordan Won’t Commit on Impeachment of Joe Biden or Merrick Garland!

https://spreely.video/v/2344501800/WHAT-S-GOING-ON—-Jim-Jordan-Won-t-Commit-on-Impeachment-of-Joe-Biden-or-Merrick-Garland-?
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August 6, 2023 3:56pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump gatecrashed a wedding at his own golf club. How rude!
That will be a wedding to remember.

https://libertyonenews.com/trump-attends-wedding-for-guests-at-his-nj-hotel-after-indictment/
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August 6, 2023 4:08pm
Maggie Pie

Despite what Moodys said, I see Winnie is still calling Robbo’s hole north of $20B!!

Who’s right I wonder?
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August 6, 2023 5:01pm
- CAKE FACE1
  
  I suspect the fiscal hole will be many over years’ forecast figures…
  
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  August 6, 2023 9:48pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  I try and avoid commenting on, let alone thinking about, Robbo’s hole as much as humanly possible.
  
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  August 6, 2023 10:09pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

You know what? I think the 5D chess has been exposed a bit. Trump wants to go to jail!!!

https://billingsreport.com/trump-could-win-from-jail-take-the-oath-pardon-himself-and-leave/
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August 6, 2023 5:05pm
Scooter

Anyone reckon there’s more gun crime after Cindy’s buy back than before.

https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/national/police-hunt-for-shooter-after-man-dies-in-palmerston-north-firearms-incident/
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August 6, 2023 5:35pm
- kowtow
  
  And Point England “disorder incident” which must be regime newspeak for yet another shooting.
  
  I wonder if there’ll be any apologists along trying to claim it’s yet another “isolated” incident.
  
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  August 6, 2023 7:52pm

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