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February 10, 2023 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 10 February 2023

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General Debate

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NeverMindTheBollocks

I can’t believe they want to rename Russell after a man who ate an endangered species!

http://www.stuff.co.nz/pou-tiaki/131172636/russell-locals-already-calling-the-town-kororreka-as-name-restoration-proposed
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February 10, 2023 8:01am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  People like Aitkin are the ones who are allowing this Maori walkover. They are too dumb and stupid to know there is a Coup happening right under our noses.
  Aitkin has been programed now.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:24am
  - Jack5
    
    ~~Scotch woman~~ Scotswoman gives a lecture on NZ place names.
    
    Bet she wouldn’t push Scots to change the name of Glasgow to the Gaelic – Glaschu. Or Dundee to Dùn Dèagh or Dùn Dè, or Glasgow to Glaschu.
    
    Many of the old Scottish pioneers of Southland and Otago 150 years and more ago used “Scotch” rather than “Scots” or “Scottish” and they weren’t talking about Hokonui whisky.
    
    Remember Samuel Johnson’s famous quip:
    
    ““The noblest prospect which a Scotchman ever sees, is the high road that leads him to England!”
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:06am
- graham
  
  I’m not going to click on the link, because I dislike visiting the agenda-driven, crusading activist website that Stuff has become. But I quite honestly doubt that any more than a handful of locals would be calling Russell “Kororareka”.
  
  I’ve commented on this before – I quite simply no longer believe that I can trust Stuff to report on the issues facing New Zealand and the world with neutrality, to examine all sides of an issue fairly and without bias or prejudice, and to present reports that might contain facts that they didn’t like but which are credible and important nonetheless.
  
  I don’t think Stuff are capable of reporting just the facts any longer – their agendas have taken over any objectivity they might have once had.
  
  And that’s why I pay headlines like this from Stuff very little attention. I simply do not feel they have any credibility nowadays.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:35am
  - Jack5
    
    Who pays the piper calls the tune is an old proverb.
    
    Ardern forged for Labour a media monopoly of State TV, State radio, Stuff and other subsidised newspaper groups, subsidised radio, and subsidised internet sites.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:10am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Jaspinda has a degree in Communications you know.
      So what she did is bought off the media communications so they would only broadcast Labour things in a kind light, and spread misinformation about National and Act.
      Now she has gone, the media will continue to do the same.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:51am
      - Paulus
        
        Isn’t it interesting that it appears that the so called media have now quietly been told to not have anything to do with Ardern publically, and concentrate only on Hipkins.
        It is as if Ardern did not exist or destroy New Zealand.
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:57am
      - Ghost
        
        There will be a few woman’s mag articles to come, including excuslive wedding crap. She’s too toxic to roll out at the election
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:00am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        @Paulus,
        Jaspinda is far from finished fucking NZ over. Now she is quiet and camouflaged.
        The messages coming to her from H1 will be relayed to Chippie. This is what you are going to do boy.
        One to keep an eye on. Hell has no fury like a woman scorned, and we know she can turn septic just like that when no cameras or mics. I have not seen it but a friend has dealt with those who have. In some ways Jaspinda can be even more dangerous.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:08pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        “Jaspinda is far from finished fucking NZ over. Now she is quiet and camouflaged.”
        
        Like with an iceberg (in this case, a giant turd-berg) most of the thing is unseen and below the surface. It’s Labour’s back room operators that do the real damage methinks.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:51pm
  - Alan Wilkinson
    
    Especially when the link is misspelt. As I said earlier, both names have been in use for a long time each with their own history. That will continue.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:46pm
  - David Lenny
    
    Ignore that down tick. Clumsy fingers strike again.
    
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    February 10, 2023 3:30pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  In over 55 years of following politics I have come to the conclusion that the biggest problem is that politicians and civil servants only see the big picture. But within that big picture are many many smaller pictures. These are the actual human beings impacted by the big picture.
  Hence the law of unintended consequences. Civil servants draft laws and politicians pass them without any consideration of the many many small pictures.
  Politicians and civil servants need to get out more. Rather than sitting in Wellington or only consulting with the usual suspects they should be getting out and listening to real citizens in the real world. My impression is that most interaction is stage managed not real.
  Ask yourself. When did a politician ever call you up and ask to have a chat about what was on your mind. Sure you can go to their clinics but these are largely for show.
  IMHO I and those of my generation have been poorly served over many decades. I give them 3 out of 10 for effort and 1 out of 10 for performance.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:49am
  - Keith White
    
    I have long advocated the following principles
    
    Every central politician and bureaucrat involved in healthcare should have to go on the same waiting list as the rest of us for urgent and so-called elective procedures
    
    Every judge and parole board member should have people they let go on bail or parole early housed in the closest available property near them
    
    Anytime someone wants to change the status quo in terms of public domain names, they have to pay a bond of $10,000 personally and if a two thirds majority of the people in that area are not in favour they forfeit the bond
    
    A few other modest proposals (I know, none of them will ever see the light of day, I am not entirely an idiot – some parts of me are still missing 🙂 )
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:02am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The MP for Upper Harbour, I have never seen her in Glenfield, never read any media reports concerning her. Invisible.
    I am wondering what the fuck does she actually do besides eating her lunch and getting paid handsomely.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:04am
  - herb1
    
    Last man standing … politicians and civil servants only see the big picture.
    The problem with this is normal people see a picture but upon looking at different angles can see a different picture.
    Politicians on the other hand see their big picture , and like the Mona Lisa , whatever able they view their picture from , they still see their picture staring intently at them
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:55am
- Loddenthinks
  
  “I’m very happy with the return of it [Kororāreka], it makes the town that bit more unique.”
  
  There are no degrees of uniqueness; something is either unique (the only example of that thing in the world) or it is not unique. I’d be very happy with her return, to Scotland.
  
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  February 10, 2023 2:18pm
  - David Lenny
    
    To make the name even ‘more unique’, respect its history and reflect the bicultural principles of the ToW, it should be called ‘Kororaka: hell hole of the South Pacific.”
    
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    February 10, 2023 3:59pm
    - David Lenny
      
      Damn it. First, WordPress eats my comment, then I don’t proof read the second attempt… Kororareka.
      
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      February 10, 2023 4:21pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Lodden, I applaud your grammar pedantry.
    
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    February 10, 2023 7:38pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

[Interim director of outbreak response at Te Whatu Ora Matt] Hannant said Te Whatu Ora is “well positioned” to respond if an infectious disease enters Aotearoa, adding the response would be guided by the country’s influenza pandemic plan. ”Te Whatu Ora has significant experience in managing diseases transmitted by the respiratory route through responding to COVID-19.”

Bwahahahahahahahaha!

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/02/new-zealand-well-positioned-to-respond-as-bird-flu-causing-concern-for-experts-as-it-spreads-among-mammalian-species-overseas.html
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February 10, 2023 8:01am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  In that newsclip, Aotearoa now has a Ministry of Health. How about that?
  New Zealand does not have a Ministry of Health, or if we do, it is not working.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:29am
  - Keith White
    
    I’m pretty sure that all the policymakers have healthy, even obese, bank balances…
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:03am
  - Paulus
    
    Every thing now publically has dropped New Zealand in favour of just Aotearoa.
    Try the RNZ Midday session led by Marnie Dunlop, the wife of our cabinet Minister Kirimata Allen.
    It is now a Maori programme.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:59am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  I love the laugh 😂
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:47am
Southern Raider

So according to the media Chippy is now the messiah of working poor.

Yet the fundamentals across every social metric are still broken eg retail crime through the roof, cost of living through the roof.

But all he had to do was cancel or pause some stupid projects and everything is wonderful.
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February 10, 2023 8:03am
- kowtow
  
  And their future is to be poor due to the collapse in education.
  
  That is the real and current “emergency” facing this nation.
  
  Meanwhile schools fix the “ethnic” problem by having a Maori translation or two…….
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:54am
- Keith White
  
  Gotta admit, the media are much more honest than politicians, the media stay bought…
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:03am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Half the snots not going to school, polices still forcing up inflation that punishes the working man.
  
  Look yesterday, the increasing in Min wage has now pushed people n the Min wage to be paying not the 30 cent bracket, now tell me that Nats tax bracket policy is not fair
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:49am
Southern Raider

I heard Luxon on Hoskins show yesterday. Best I’ve ever heard him. He spoke about the tripartite relationship in society between Govt, Business and Community Providers and what each should be doing and what each shouldn’t be doing. I thought it was brilliant and needs to be the core of Nationals policy framework.
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February 10, 2023 8:05am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Now all you have to do is get the voters that should be listening instead of talking shit about the Nats being useless on board, start with some of the fools around here, I have gone some homework about the at fFS Rangiora town hall, people there said he was awesome, I heard that some people that day have decided Nats will get their vote, and have said only a couple of questions from anti vaxers, there was no shame on you like the rotten vulgar media have stated
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:54am
  - Pineapple Lumps
    
    G – Call us “anti-vaxxers” all you like, but I’m not defining us that way – we are “pro-freedoms, anti-totalitarianism, anti-big pharma” people.
    
    The MSM coverage of the “pro-freedoms” people at Luxons meeting is disgusting, dehumanising, attack the person not their message type bs.
    
    The fact that Luxon can’t reframe those messages around anti-vax and the pro-democracy anti-ethnonationalism message is a problem. This is why he will bleed party vote. Seymour is doing better with this stuff.
    
    He and Seymour both lost the room on the Wellington protest. They both need to do better to win the room. Convince me with a proper argument why he should get my party vote and not ACT.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:47pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      For a start i never said you are anti vaxer, clearly you have made it quite clear that was the mob that was there , go back and read what i said, i said people who were at thew meeting said a few questions were asked, the people said there was no such “you should be ashamed” quip. People have put some of the questions up, he was asked by one person what about mandates, and he said what he has always said as leader, he doesnt see the point in it, he was then questioned by someone else who said have you read some article about the vax and health issues with it, he said no, he was then asked by someone answer his question , he said the question was have you read it, he was correct, and then said if you give it to me i will read it, but as usual, no one came up with this proof that we need , no article , he can’t read what he can’t see.
      
      If anti vaxer is the wrong word, i can’t help that, i can’t think of another word for it.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:23pm
  - Ghost
    
    Is a nurse an antivaxer for asking luxon, “Are you aware of this FDA document that lists 1200 adverse events of these injections?” And if she is update on all vaccines except the covid is she still an antivaxer?
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:52pm
    - rockape
      
      Non of those events in that report blamed the vax. She is a liar !
      
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      February 10, 2023 1:32pm
      - rockape
        
        AP’S ASSESSMENT: False. The researchers cited a number from a blog that lists news stories about recent deaths and medical emergencies among people of all ages, from all over the world — some of which were attributed to other causes, such as cancer. The previous figure, meanwhile, is from a 2006 study that specifically reviewed literature for reports of sudden cardiac deaths among athletes under age 35. Comparing the two sources, with different methodologies, is not scientifically sound, experts told The Associated Press.
        
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        February 10, 2023 1:40pm
      - rockape
        
        ofessor Nigel McMillan, the director of the Infectious Diseases and Immunology Program at Griffith University Queensland, said the claim of 1223 deaths related to the vaccine’s first three month rollout was a common misuse of information.
        
        “In any group of people we see deaths from all sorts of things like heart attacks and cancer (450 a day in Australia actually) and some of these people might have been vaccinated in the last month or so. It doesn’t mean those people died because of the vaccine. In Australia, regulator investigation have resulted in 12 vaccine-attributed deaths from 50 million doses given,” Prof McMillan said.
        
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        February 10, 2023 1:52pm
      - GJM
        
        It suited the Powers That Be to ahve every death within a month of a positive test or even post mortem as a Covid death, not, for example, being shot.
        All you can accuse them of is applying the same definition and methodology. Either every death within 28 days of a postive test or as a reasult of a post mortem high cycle PCR test is a covid death, or it is not.
        Amazing how they have memory holed that.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:49pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      She asked have you read it, he said no, he asked if you let me see it i will read it, but no document was presented to him, i dont care what they are called , she wont take the vax (thats her choice) by definition it makes her anti vax, my sister is a top nurse in Auckland , she is the organisational nurse in the liver and Kidney transplant uynit, she has never once forced her opinion on us, but once again thats her choice.
      
      I say again, since Luxon became leader, he has always answered the question about mandates that he can’t see the point in them, but of course its his fault, these people have to get in that swine Hipkins face if they want the mandates dropped, Luxon cannot do anything about it from the opposition which you guys seem to want him to stay there.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:29pm
      - Ghost
        
        No, researching and coming to a personal decision to not take one vaccine doesn’t make you an antivaxer.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:49pm
      - Pineapple Lumps
        
        G – You are right, the Government is responsible for creating the laws and stripping NZers of their freedoms. Luxon and Seymour are guilty of letting Labour create a narrative of the river of filth and not having the ability or spine to reframe this to ordinary kiwi people opposed to government overreach, aggrieved at the loss of personal medical privacy, being required to carry papers to participate in society, being made redundant for choosing not to partake in an experimental medical treatment etc etc
        
        When NZ needed an opposition they were missing in action. Even now they are shirking getting involved with these issues and continue to allow this group of people to be defamed as anti-vaxers.
        
        I was pleased to see he had the spine to stand at Ratana against co-governance. I hope he keeps growing a spine.
        
        Similarly, Key had no spine to oppose anti-smacking bill despite referendum of 80% kiwis opposing. So kiwis keep getting dictates that they don’t want. A true opposition would roll these things back. Democracy is broken when the wishes of the majority are ignored by the elite.
        
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        February 10, 2023 8:11pm
surfing

“Slated to be one of the “most serious storms of the century” by forecasting agency WeatherWatch”

This century? Or, do they mean in the last 100 years?

I’m leaning towards the biggest storm this century, ie, last 22 years. Not so bad.
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February 10, 2023 8:07am
- Cinematic
  
  Increasingly looking like that call was made way too soon.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:26am
  - slightlyrighty
    
    I have found that the more they warn us about an impending weather bomb, the more of a damp squib it turns out to be.
    
    I’m hoping that this is the case!
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:34am
    - Don Beckett
      
      Yesterday the bloody thing was way up by New Caledonia. Anything could happen to it, but its most likely course is to pass to the East of the North Island. Depends on the influence of the highs will determine if & how hard it hits us.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:46am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        I stated yesterday the weather man on the TV said two scenarios, one had a wind pushing south forcing the storm east and missing us altogether, he stated that looks like the most possible scenario at this stage, some fool on here told me yo keep denying! But I only stated what the weather man said
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:57am
  - coge
    
    Been downgraded to cyclone Fizzer.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:43am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Cyclone pFizer?
      
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      February 10, 2023 2:19pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  Because they ( central and local Government)FUp big time last time they are trying to scare the bejesus out of the citizens. Betcha it will be a nothing.
  Just trying to cover their sad sorry incompetent arses as usual.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:28am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    It is a worse case scenario. If we had no warning there would be questions and blame. That is what the forecasters want – to be blame free, no responsibility.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:38am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      We weee warned not to travel Auckland anniversary day because of weather, rotten media said there was no warnings
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:04am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    It will be Browns fault for being too ready this time
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:03am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  If only the children understood what they were saying.
  This is our future, the result of dumbed down teaching.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:35am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  That’s what it means, so bigger than Gitta? Oh that’s right, it only counts if it’s Auckland
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:54am
Yvette

• The only difference to Three Waters is rather than mandate 50/50 in legislation, they have said at least two members of each Regional Planning Committee must be appointed by Iwi. The Waitangi Tribunal has already stated that anything less than 50/50 will be a Treaty breach, and a failure to do so will inevitably see lawsuits from Iwi. And the law requires those deciding on the numbers to abide by the principles of the Treaty [1]

Where in the Treaty does it mention 50/50 governance – or if it comes from a principle of management of taonga – “treasures”, Article 1 – is that not constrained by “subjects” in Article 3, or is there actually a conflict between Article 1 and 3 – that is: a flaw in a supposedly ideal founding document?

That “50/50” is not in the Treaty, nor “co-governance”, should the Treaty be regarded in the same way as “abortion” is not in the American Constitution, desirable as that may be.
The world concentrated on the abortion issue, yet again, and not on the principle of clearly defining the Constitution again.
Here, that redefinition or “cleansing” principle should be applied to the so-called “Principles” of the Treaty of Waitangi with a reevaluation of the Treaty version invented in the about 1980s.
Least the Treaty just become an abortion.

___________
[1] from host David Farrar’s 7am post “Why the RMA replacements bills should also be added to the bonfire”
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February 10, 2023 8:07am
Southern Raider

Will there be a debate about Waitangi Day and need for a New Zealand day?

Was interesting watching the news on Waitangi Day evening and every Māori they interviewed stated the day was “for Māori”, “so we can discuss our grievances”, “lots more settlements needed to cover the historical issues”, “we still live in a racist country” etc

Not one person said this day is about reflecting on the past but more importantly focusing on the future as one nation of people from different backgrounds.
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February 10, 2023 8:08am
Bridgenag

‘Mo jabs, mo deaths’
It’s like the more jabbing we come across, the more problems we see…

https://open.substack.com/pub/metatron/p/mo-jabs-mo-deaths?r=1aj1bv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
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February 10, 2023 8:08am
- Keith White
  
  Gotta be fake news, all the Ministry of Health, Medical Council and – when it still existed – Medical Association apparatchiks have consistently reassured us that without the jab we anti-vaxxers will sicken and die and kill everybody else while we’re meeting our deserved fates. Also, the >2000% excess deaths we have had since the jab was mandated are entirely coincidental and it can never be proved that they wouldn’t have happened anyway.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:06am
  - Keith White
    
    Is that you, Sir Ashley, with your MiniMeMouse…
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:56am
Tony Stuart

Well blow me down with a feather; the Chinese balloon floating over North Carolina wasn’t a weather balloon after all; who would have thunk it?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/us-china-tensions-spy-balloon-was-for-collecting-intelligence-part-of-huge-aerial-spying-programme-us-says/TJ7VEEFCDJCT3OTZ3P4BI4HLVU/
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February 10, 2023 8:09am
- surfing
  
  The americans would say this even if it was a weather balloon.
  
  But, of course it was a spy balloon. Why are the chinese flying their balloons in US airspace. Imagine if the US were doing this in chinese territory.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:16am
  - NoCash
    
    So the balloon had communications equipment, which I would imagine is expected for a weather balloon, as you would want to upload measurements and data back to base.
    
    Not saying it’s or not a spy balloon, but if the only evidence the US has is comms equipment onboard, that’s a bit thin isn’t it?
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:24am
  - Stellaboxer
    
    “ Imagine if the US were doing this in chinese territory” What do think U2 spy planes and military satellites are doing?
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:47am
- Ruahine
  
  Huawei tried it on with 5G.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:33am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Bidens people will have know this fact with the close up shots excuse the pun, pretty sure those panels underneath will be for comms
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:50am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  These balloon fleets apparently happened during Trump’s time as POTUS, but the Pentagon withheld any information from Trump because he was seen as too ‘aggressive’ Really?
  “You don’t have to like someone to respect them, and with that respect you gain respect back” DJT.
  Now, Mad Dog Mattis is in the shit for doing this.
  Anyway, the balloon. Why did Biden wait so long before acting? Word is he should have ordered the downing when the balloon was over land – to recover surveillance equipment. Now is seems the equipment can not be recovered.
  Hang on. After the remains hit the water the Americans put a 7 mile diameter geofence around the site, in 47 feet of water. 47 feet! Something stinks to high heaven here.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:55am
  - Random T Person
    
    Surely they could have captured the thing without shooting it down. Then they really could KNOW what it was, rather than speculating over some salty ruins.
    
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    February 10, 2023 8:59am
    - Widogast Corwin
      
      How would they “capture” it?
      
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      February 10, 2023 9:08am
      - Local Miller
        
        They could have captured it with a slow fly past with a helicopter and a tether with a hook. If the hook’s on an electronic release they could then bring it to ground with little risk of damage. If it was too high for a helicopter then a plane, but a plan could have been made.
        
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        February 10, 2023 9:28am
      - NoCash
        
        @LM
        No helicopter in the world has a service ceiling at that altitude, over 60,000 ft.
        
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        February 10, 2023 9:30am
      - Local Miller
        
        Hence my comment that if it was too high for a helicopter a plane (jet). The point being there was value in making a plan.
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:05am
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        LM – I think you are under estimating the task.
        
        The balloon was at 60,000 feet. That is close to the ceiling of fighter jets. There is no such thing as a ‘slow’ pass with a hook. These planes cannot fly slowly. They are not like a helicopter.
        
        Also bringing the balloon down over land could have posed a risk to people on the ground. Nobody knew what harmful substances may have been on board. Hence it was brought down over the ocean.
        
        If the balloon could have been recovered intact without posing risks, it would have been done.
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:31am
      - NoCash
        
        At that altitude, any fixed wing plane needs to fly at a very high speed to stay aloft due to the thin atmosphere. With such a high speed difference, it’s not possible to get hook to capture the balloon.
        
        The only potential option would be using another balloon, but it would likely need propellant based flight control at that altitude, again due to the thin air and high speed jet stream, and it would be extremely difficult to get a hook to capture the balloon considering the gap between two giant balloons.
        
        So it’s mostly likely not feasible to capture it with existing hardware and tech.
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:34am
      - Ghost
        
        Superman?
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:35am
      - Random T Person
        
        I’m not an aeronautical engineer, so I don’t know. But I did find it amusing they shot a balloon (in use since the Montgolfier brothers papier mache efforts 300 years ago) with a F-22 Raptor. Talk about bringing a gun to a knife fight!
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:48am
  - RoboRob
    
    My understanding that previous balloons only passed over briefly and had left US airspace before even being identified. Even if they had told Trump / Obama the balloon had already gone.
    
    Biden not shooting it down straight away is clearly a case of indecision. I think he didn’t want to shoot it down but was forced to do so politically. The whole, wait for it to travel over the country for a week to shoot it down over the ocean to protect people is total BS. Like it didn’t fly over plenty of unpopulated areas.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:04am
    - Nickc2
      
      Well, there goes any further CCP payments to the Hunter/Joe Biden Slush Fund eh?
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:19am
    - Don Beckett
      
      It was first noticed over Montana – a huge state with less than 1 mil. population. It could have been downed then – they could calculate the drop zone & clear the area if necessary.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:54am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        No, it was first noticed over Alaska, should have been brought down there , Biden lied and said it was Canada
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:10am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Joe loves China, and Chinese money handouts.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:14pm
  - Local Miller
    
    No, this didn’t happen during the Trump Presidency. This has been categorically denied by the various defense officials from the time. Additionally it’s been shown to be false by the fact that unlike this balloon, there were no public photos or footage of the supposed 3 balloons that the Biden WH has said they have “discovered” in the archives. This is a very fortuitous find I would say. But also a BS fine.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:17am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Yes, snd the telling fact was when they had the dem member of the security committee on CNN they stated also it was not true, the look of hatred on those crazy woman’s faces
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:12am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      It did happen, but the Pentagon killed all information. Mattis is heading to Treason.
      
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      February 11, 2023 10:51am
  - Local Miller
    
    47 ft is nothing in diving terms, only 14.3m. In my diving days I could free dive to that depth and have breath to look around.
    
    Their justification for not shooting it down over land was “risk to the population”, but this is BS. They could have shot it down over Alaska, with close to zero risk of hitting anyone at a population density of about 0.5 people per square km.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:24am
    - Alan Wilkinson
      
      Dropping it in the water made it more likely to survive better for investigation.
      
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      February 10, 2023 12:54pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Exactly. The balloon was only over the Aleutian archipelago. Fuck all people out there. Alaska pop say 730,000. Nearly half live in Anchorage.
      Alaska has shitloads od Air bases and Defence stuff. Plenty of water between the Aleutians and Canada/US. Fuckin bang! just destroy it before it starts gathering info.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:20pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    They have had the intelligence personnel under Trump, the security committee including Dems, the foreign minister or what ever they call it, some never Trumpers in the Republicans all on the news channels, all have stated they have never once been told of this, CNN got thd drm committee member on with the squawking woman and we’re spur as fuck when he stated this was not true
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:09am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Joe baulked because he was being kind to China. He wants China to see him as the good guy. Americans? Stuff them.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:09am
  - sirknz
    
    Isn’t withholding timely and pertinent military information from the head of your military treason?
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:23am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I think that is the direction Mattis is going.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:23pm
- NoCash
  
  Interesting info, if true then bad optics for China. The game of spying is to not get caught, even though everybody knows everybody does spying.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:56am
- kowtow
  
  I can’t help but feel that there’s a moral panic around this balloon.
  
  President’s of the USA have encouraged / allowed Red China scientists , academics etc to work in the US with all that implies.
  
  Trump was the only one to call it out . He was called a raycis , by the same media who wanted Creepy Joe to shoot down the balloon, doing the same thing that tens of thousands of CCP apparatchits have been doing on the ground at the invitation of the administration for decades.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:00am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    One of the Democrats was shagging a Chinese spy.
    How much damage did he cause?
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:13am
    - sirknz
      
      You missed out the fact that the Democrat was also on the intelligence committee and is also unable to get a security clearance in the private sector.
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:24am
    - Keith White
      
      Wasn’t “Fang it!” an expression of encouragement in ‘Mad Max: Fury Road’?
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:53pm
    - kowtow
      
      Depends on their relative sizes .
      
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      February 10, 2023 7:39pm
- MCōs
  
  China floats this bloody great balloon across America and says it was off course weather balloon.
  American doesn’t know what to believe and shoots the bugger down, which China knows it will do sooner or later.
  My theory is it’s a nothingburger and China has made the US look silly.
  Predictably the US claims it’s a fiendish spy balloon.
  
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  February 10, 2023 1:09pm
  - Ghost
    
    I’d agree, they can get far better information with their satellites.
    
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    February 10, 2023 1:14pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    US is silly under Biden. Remember Biden is not running the show, Obama is.
    
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    February 10, 2023 3:25pm
    - NoCash
      
      Which Obama, Barack or Michelle?
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:38pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Meanwhile, big (and not so big) merchants still stock their warehouses full with stuff manufactured in China, as if nothing has changed in the world.
  
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  February 10, 2023 4:04pm
- Ra Henare
  
  To respond to all the KB keyboard experts.
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEJpP_tI9rs
  
  1. The Balloon was at 64,000 ft
  
  2. F22 Ceiling 58,000ft? is the level at which the fighter can maneuver. ie fly level.
  
  3. They can zoom climb to 70,000ft+ then engage a target on the way down.
  A strategy devised by the Brits during the cold war when they had Lightnings intercept Russian high altitude aircraft back in the 80s(they also intercepted an American U2)
  
  4. The F22 is equipped with a 20 mm cannon with a rang up to 6,000ft – level flight or slow descent(after a zoom climb)
  
  5. The idea that using a Cannon would have destroyed the “”equipment”” is bollocks if they have competent pilots. The Balloon envelope is reported as being the size of 3 London busses with equipment slung way underneath(from photos)
  
  6. The use of a missile was IMHO more about optics than best effectiveness to recover equipment.
  
  7. A hydrogen balloon at extreme altitudes can not be steered.
  
  8. This whole thing has been about political theatre which the Americans are experts at. Think back to Weapons of Mass destruction(Iraq war) and all subsequent warmongering by the USA, from Afghanistan to Libya to Syria to Ukraine.
  
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  February 10, 2023 4:23pm
Mike

RIP Burt Bacharach.
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February 10, 2023 8:10am
Souvlaki

Hooton’s paywalled opinion piece in Herald this am is spot on. I know Ill be downticked for this…but Nats are sleepwalking to defeat.
Outsmarted by the cunning as shithouse rats in Labour who are desperate to retain power…and appear to have seized the ‘ initiative’!
Compared to ACT….Nats seem dead in the water!
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February 10, 2023 8:20am
- peterwn
  
  Except Matthew Hooton is a political commentator, not a political strategist. The hare may appear to be sleeping as the tortoise plods by but the hare is fully awake and alert.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:32am
  - Keith White
    
    And Matthew Hooton is not at all unbiased.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:06am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      He is very biased against Nats when he is paid by the rotten Hearald
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:13am
      - Keith White
        
        Yep I shoulda added a sarc tag 🙂
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:57am
- Jimbob
  
  🤡🤡🤡, Oh the Hooten who said to replace Bridges with Muller, that Hooten. Yeah that guy is so smart, probably having his morning chat with Redbaiter.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:38am
  - RoboRob
    
    Hooton is smart but what he says depends on his current pay master. Who is he working for at the moment, Act?
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:06am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Isn’t it funny that people rush to Bridges now and seem to love him, Grrrrr , that’s why we have to stop this anti Luxon bullshittery
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:14am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Mods, i am not attacking people, i am asking for policies that are woke the Nat’s want from this governments list of policies, i am also asking for proof of crap like WEF representation, if that’s a crime then what’s the point debating
      
      [Mod – just calm it down, before you post something re-read it and ask yourself if it will get approved or not]
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:58pm
- Simon
  
  National are utter garbage. Luxon is a dripping wet buffoon. National will not have any policy that benefits the productive. All they attempt to do is feed off Labo mistakes. The size and scope of govt will remain with National in charge. National will take no measures to protect society from future harm from the left.
  
  National are better off merging with Labo and the let the genuine opposition ACT get on with it.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:46am
  - Random T Person
    
    Agree. National is awful, Labour-lite, woke fools, led by wishy washy Luxon. Ryan Bridge nailed it when he asked ‘who are you, Chris’, and Luxon blabbed some shit about customer experience. He’s a CEO not a prime minister, and he is a woke, green CEO at that.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:00am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Utter bullshit, tell me just one idiotic Labour policy they want to continue with?
      
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      February 10, 2023 9:11am
      - Keith White
        
        We have been fooled before. We have had National promise is they will reverse a Labour policy and then when they get elected they didn’t. Past performance or lack of, is often a guide to future performance, or lack of. That does not of course equate to “let’s keep Labour in case National are as bad or worse”, but there’s no good reason to trust any current or aspiring politician.
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:08am
      - Stellaboxer
        
        Agreed giant the pile on to Luxon to distract from shambolic Labour policy flip flopping u turns and shelving began as soon as Hipkins , a man who had been defending said policies for months, began as soon as he announced them. The usual suspects in the media pushing this but sad to see so many on this blog falling for it and prepared to start squabbling amongst themselves. The truth is Act will never govern alone and need a strong National party to govern with. Or we could of course join in the pile on and see a Labour Green and racist party government. I wonder what the racist party would demand if they held the balance of power.
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:32am
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        “Utter bullshit, tell me just one idiotic Labour policy they want to continue with?”
        
        Climate Change Response (Zero Carbon) Act
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:37am
      - krazykiwi
        
        Ok, I’ll bite:
        
        – Working for Families
        – Continued bloat of state sector
        – Continued racial separatism
        – Allegiance to the WEF, WHO, UN
        – Carbon Zero
        – Cycle lanes
        
        Now, you can nit-pick and wail that “These aren’t policies wah wah”, but the truth is that over successive election cycles National had predominantly chosen to ‘optimise’ Labour’s continuous lurching to the left. And they’ve done this safe in the knowledge that voters like you, G, will continue to give them your vote because they’re not Labour.
        
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        February 10, 2023 10:53am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Widogast coran 10.37 Luxon has stated science eill be behind any zero carbon, there is no such bloody thing as zero carbon as humans would not exist, it’s carbon neutral, sheep and beef farmers are becoming carbon neutral already, it’s not the poison you think ffs
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:19am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        @Keith,
        We need to see those promises on paper and signed.
        How many will commit themselves? We will certainly find out who the NINOs are!
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:20am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        Policy is not needed when, as Chris Trotter points out, starting with this quote from Dame Claudia Orange:
        
        I think the general public is not aware that we are going through huge revolutionary changes in the country and, in fact, we have taken that such a long way, there is no going back.” – Dame Claudia Orange
        
        But it was one of his commentators who really nailed it:
        
        Chris, you need to take a long term break with some old mates in Wellington. Use the time to reconnect with another bunch of mates who retain links to the “bureaucracy and you will find that the “coup” is pretty much done and dusted.
        
        What is now occurring is that private organisations are getting the “get on board or bugger off” message so are also succumbing to the new order.
        
        Is it too late? Well if the leader of the conservative National party is on board along with the bulk of his caucus then I think we already know the answer.
        
        And before “G the Giant” chips in, I’ll point out that I’ll be party voting ACT and electorate vote National.
        
        But when they turn out to be the get-along-to-go-along crowd I’m expecting I’ll be here to point that to you Mr Enthusiasm, just as during the Key government.
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:26am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Krazikiwi 10.53
        Working for families has been embedded for more than 20 years, nothing to do with Nats,
        Luxon has stated clearly that bureaucracy bloat will be dealt to, Luxon has stated clearly there will be no separatist services, snd has vowed to end racist policy, WEF UN Who, give just one little bit of evidence on these things, I have had a guts full of skills saying Luxon is signed up to all these outfits, don’t tell me he went there with Uniliver, he has stated he has never been to Davos, give clear evidence or it’s bullshit, there is no such thing as zero carbon that’s bullshit, and I have never once heard him mention cycle ways, cycle ways are fine if they are in the right place, the own cycle was that block up roads and arterial routes are council stuff ups ffs, you are not stupid are you, and doubt tell me not yo wail ffs, you have given five or six points that Luxon has said he does not agree with, he has also stated he will be far more bolder than the Key government.
        
        I am going to give response to all this utter bullshit from you shills from ACT, good luck with ya third term of Ute worst government in history
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:30am
      - Random T Person
        
        Yeah G, I’ll take any foul mouthed criticism from you with a pinch of salt. You’re barely literate, so I can’t expect much. And as Widowgast and Krazy have pointed out, there’s ample evidence for National’s wokeness. And even more ample evidence for the former Air NZ CEO’s ‘greenie’ and ESG credentials.
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:53am
      - Jack5
        
        Tom Hunter, in his excellent 11.25, post, writes about Chris Trotter’s latest blog – put up at Bowalley Road blog today.
        
        Trotter’s piece is well worth a read. I strongly disagree with Trotter about Rogernomics, but not with him about the severity of the present revolution Labour is imposing on us:
        
        “It is difficult to believe that Labour could be contemplating a bureaucratic coup-d’état even more destructive than Rogernomics. If they are, then – this time – they will provoke a real revolution.”
        
        Trotter’ s revolution warning:
        
        https://bowalleyroad.blogspot.com/2023/02/a-real-revolution.html
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:03pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        G says “Working for families has been embedded for more than 20 years, nothing to do with Nats”
        
        Riiiight, nothing to do with the Nats, other than the fact that the Nats introduced it, and the Nats have helped entrench it. “It” being, of course, a socialist construct.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:25pm
      - Ghost
        
        Labour introduced it, 2004 budget, national continued it
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:28pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Ghost, my bad. Thanks for the correction.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:36pm
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        “there is no such bloody thing as zero carbon…”
        
        So why did National support the Zero Carbon Act?
        
        I don’t know what you mean by the emissions reductions will be guided by “science”. To achieve the requirements of the Act – which National voted for – there will need to be major reductions in agriculture and transport. Simple as that.
        
        And what do you mean by “farmers are becoming carbon neutral”? New Zealand does not get to decide how to measure emissions. Last time I looked agriculture accounted for about half of emissions.
        
        Wayne Mapp is on record here as saying that National will only make changes at the margin to current climate change policies. Unless a national Government repeals the Act, I agree with him.
        
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        February 10, 2023 1:32pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        [Mod – tone your posts down, your language and stop attacking people]
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:41pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Random T Person 11.53, i have not given you a foul mouth burst at all, i asked them to tell me which policies they want, Kiwi starts off saying i was wrong that WFF’s was introduced 20 years ago, he tried to say the Nat’s introduced it , so excuse me, he has not credibility if he doesn’t even know the facts about the socialist policies, nothing to do with Nat’s, but yes they should have got rid of them when Key got in, they did not , and it would be suicide to say now you will get rid of it.
        
        I will say whatever i like when i see incorrect statements , you can smear me do what you like, i will question some of the arrogant replies here that are plain wrong , i will ask you, which policy of this rotten 2023 government do the Nat’s want to keep if Luxon is so bloody wet?, not 20 year old polices , what polices of this rotten regime , we should be thanking his pressure for what has been cropped or delayed, and don’t bother returning saying that was all Act becaue that is rubbish also
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:54pm
      - GJM
        
        Gun laws. After all, they supported them and rushing through the confiscations and despite being told, also supported, and continue to support the stupidity of the changes.
        Did you know it is easier to own a machine gun than an 11 shot .22 rifle. The machine gun also has less restrictive storage requirements.
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:10pm
    - pussycat
      
      Luxon showing his woke credentials on the Auckland floods.
      https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2023/02/barry-brill-great-flood-religion-vs.html
      
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      February 10, 2023 1:26pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Random T Person: “Ryan Bridge nailed it when he asked ‘who are you, Chris’”
      
      At that point Chris scratched his head?
      
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      February 10, 2023 4:06pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    They have a large tranche of policy that will be delivered straight after the budget shambles, getting rid of three waters, getting rid of the health authority, getting rid of all Labours new taxes, tax indexation, no separatist services, emissions only yo be dropped through science. Nothing there says wet yo me, yes he may come across as a bit soft when speaking, but we have two choices, Luxon with as pm with ACT and maybe NZF, or Hipkins the greens ( with cabinet positions) and the MP as activists. Act are never going to win enough support to be the strong centre right party, you have two choices, make ya mind up
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:10am
    - Widogast Corwin
      
      “getting rid of the health authority..”
      
      Do you mean Te Aka Whai Ora – Māori Health Authority? Are they really going to get rid of it or subsume it within the other health authority?
      
      “emissions only yo [sic] be dropped through science..”
      
      I am not sure what that means. However given that National supports the ‘zero carbon’ law, I can only see climate change policy being changed at the margin.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:41am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Luxon has stated it will be gone, what part of that don’t you get? Don’t give me this shit that successive Nat governments have blah blah blahed, enjoy your third term of ruin
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:31am
      - Random T Person
        
        Luxon said it will be gone…and he’ll hand the money to Iwi. So…??
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:56am
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        Stated what will be gone?
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:57am
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        “Luxon has stated it will be gone, what part of that don’t you get?”
        
        What is “it”?
        
        You seem to have anger management issues.
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:04pm
    - Paulus
      
      Imagine the Redundencies needed in closing down these stupid items which are actually underway.
      You can bet that all these very highly paid people will have huge redundency payments in their contracts.
      However still worth half a billion to get rid of them.
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:08am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        They are Bureaucrats, Luxon has stated he will trim them down even though posters above said he will keep them all
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:32am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        In my post, There shall be minor changes, based on a post that DPF did about bureaucrat numbers under successive Labour and National governments (graph from Taxpayers Union), I said the following:
        
        In 2000 we had 28,000 ‘crats for a population of about 3.8 million, one ‘crat for every 136 subjects. In 2020 the ratio is one ‘crat for every 83 subjects of the government.
        
        So this basically means that National could drop the numbers back to about 36,000. I can imagine the screams and the pain, and that blue section of the graph indicates that it won’t happen.
        
        I was immediately informed by a National Party insider that:
        
        there are better battles to fight … 3 Waters; the Health Reforms (in the middle of a pandemic); declining education standards; inflation; He Puapua; taxation … those are issues voters can relate to. Cutting the core public service back to 36,000 is dog whistle politics stuff which ain’t gonna happen except around the edges and, as I noted, not even ACT is proposing such a move.
        
        More recently former Cabinet Minister Wayne Mapp took time to scoff here at Kiwiblog about big reductions in the numbers of bureaucrats, laying out in detail what it takes to reduce these numbers and how unlikely this was going to be. From his commentary it seems the only sure way to do it is to abolish or “re-structure” the places they work for.
        
        I’m struggling to recall when National last did this? Hence the sinking lid approach – which just leaves the beast awaiting the next Labour government to feed it, as they’ve done since 2017.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:03pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Performance management them out, Paulus. Or change their JDs & invite them to reapply for their jobs. Or transfer them to Special Projects.
        
        All the usual ways that surplus-to-requirements public servants are moved on.
        
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        February 10, 2023 7:56pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Everything National say they will get rid of needs to be on paper and signed.
      National need to be held responsible, and not just throw bait around.
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:23am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Oh ffs, enjoy the damage of another Marxist term then
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:33am
    - Random T Person
      
      LOL you do know the ’emissions science’ is closely controlled by an approved cadre of ‘scientists’ who refuse any alternative evidence or viewpoints? And that Luxon applied all that ‘science’ at Air NZ?
      Or should we ignore all that past performance, because he said ‘science’.
      All politicians lie. Science is his weasel word for ‘we’ll do the same thing’. Don’t believe me? Just watch (thanks Mark Ronson).
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:56am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        I don’t give a shit about any of that crap, reducing farm emissions will be done by scientific measures, its already started and is helping.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:44pm
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        “I don’t give a shit about any of that crap, reducing farm emissions will be done by scientific measures..”
        
        What on earth is a “scientific measure”?
        
        Luxon has stated that he will maintain the Carbon Zero policy.
        
        New Zealand Ag emissions have been flat for 20 years (as at 2020). They make up 50 percent of emissions. What are these “scientific measures” that will drastically reduce these emissions so that the next National Government can reach “net zero” by 2050?
        
        https://environment.govt.nz/publications/new-zealands-greenhouse-gas-inventory-1990-2020-snapshot/#emissions-trends-by-sector
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:45pm
  - Jack5
    
    Rootin’, tootin’ Hooton.
    
    He’s been gnawing holes in National’s hull since Bill English retired to pasture.
    
    Suits Labour’s State subsidised media conglomerate.
    
    And Simon, splitting ACT from National on the Right, sounds a bit like a Labour saboteur.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:16am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Exactly, it’s reverse psychology, just look at the baiterfor red, he can only be working for Labour, he spouts the same shit as their in paid foot soldiers
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:35am
      - Tom Hunter
        
        I may not agree with everything Redbaiter says but he’s been pushing right wing ideas on Kiwiblog since almost its earliest days in the mid/late 2000’s – back when you were still voting Labour I believe?
        
        As a result a lot of commentators here know of him and how laughable an idea it is that he’s a Labour plant. The fact that you don’t know of him and can say something so bloody silly is a mark of what a newbie you are to KB where right-wing voters, including National voters, have regularly got stuck into National, whether they were in Opposition or Government.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:11pm
      - The Redbaiter
        
        Thanks to Mr Hunter for trying to put you right below G, even though both he and I know you will not hear what he is saying. Still, I will try once more-
        
        I would actually prefer National to return to its founding principles and become a party I want to vote for. That is my objective. Think about the following simple facts-
        
        ACT is only sitting on 10% because of two things. 1) is that Luxon/Nats are too left wing, and the other is that Seymour is a goofy incompetent too. If the Nats were not so bad ACT would be lucky to be above 4%.
        
        The other important fact is that (at the moment) 8% of the center right vote is going to a myriad of small parties.
        
        So if National stopped being so left wing, there is another 18% they could pick up and they could even look at governing on their own.
        
        But no, we’ve got boot licking socialist quitters on here saying the Nats should go further left, and Holland’s brilliant founding principles are just anachronistic rubbish. By saying this they’re just making things worse and driving voters to ACT or smaller parties or even worse to NZ First.
        
        [Mod – no need for that]
        
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        February 10, 2023 2:08pm
      - Local Miller
        
        I’ve got to agree with Red on his 2:08 comments. I’ve voted National at most elections until 2020, at which point National lost my vote, Act didn’t win it and NZ First (Winston) were too much of a lose cannon to vote for.
        If National were reliably right of center or Act were less fringe I may consider voting for one of them this year.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:54pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Redbaiter 2.08, yoppu can spout about founding principles if you like that were from the 30’s
        
        from day one once we were forced to except MMP those founding principles were way too far right to ever have a centre right vote again, as i say , you may as well be baiting for the reds, you want to vote Act , that’s fine , but except[t others have different opinions to yourself , we don’t attack Act , infact i have given them my party vote more than once to try and keep them in the game
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:03pm
      - Widogast Corwin
        
        “Exactly, it’s reverse psychology, just look at the baiterfor red, he can only be working for Labour…”
        
        I am amazed that he replied to you so politely 🙂
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:46pm
  - NothingLeft
    
    Elections are won in the middle. National have to appeal to ignorant, thick, wet, swing voters who read women’s mags, watch reality TV and spend most of their waking hours on social media.
    
    Right wing political tragics like ourselves are irrelevant to their chances of winning the election – they know they have our votes regardless (except for eejits who vote Winston).
    
    So stop moaning about National puting electoral pragmatism before ideology
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:57am
    - kowtow
      
      In essence then democracy is then lost in the so called centre .
      As we move ever leftward , the state grows and grows and along with it the loss of individual freedom .
      
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      February 10, 2023 1:01pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        Yep, the only hope is to educate the (predominantly female) left out of their endlessly disproven delusion that socialism (ever expanding welfare and exploiting the labour of the productive to support the consciously unproductive) improves the living conditions in a country over the long term.
        
        On current trends, all democracy is doomed to fall into inevitably repressive left wing totalitarianism by electorally dominant female voting preferences driven by their, and some mens, strong (evolutionarily embedded instinct) preference for generous charity and altruism. They want unquestioned and unreserved support to maintain their comfortable lifestyles no matter what happens. It’s a quite natural but sadly functionally destructive preference.
        
        The problem is charity and altruism don’t scale.
        
        They don’t work over long term unless there are powerful demands for reciprocal good/industrious behaviour placed on the recipients – which is why the anonymity of welfare, carelessly enabling laziness and individually destructive behaviour without the balancing demands or reciprocity of family or close personal relationships, breeds grasping failing miserable underclasses that vote for a living and bankrupt countries by voting themselves rich (so many examples of this, Venezuela being the big one, but many more scattered through 3rd world).
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:15pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        We are straddling the centre, not moving further left, the Nats are where they were when Act came into existence
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:10pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        On current trends, all democracy is doomed to fall into inevitably repressive left wing totalitarianism by electorally dominant female voting preferences….
        
        Heh. In that case you will enjoy this commentary from Chicago regarding the increasing flight of its business class in the face of increasing violence, taxes and general malaise in the city, Packers and Victims:
        
        “I used to think that if blood spilled within a family or friend circle, it would get people to question the narrative,” says a business leader in the finance sector. “Instead, it’s made a number in my city peer group, especially women, who have opted to stay, even more steadfast in their commitment to progressive causes, including supporting no-bail for violent offenders, drug decriminalization, anti-racist re-education and extreme affirmative action in the workplace and, of course, gender ideology in schools.”
        …
        “Interestingly, many of the men that remain want out and are planning their exodus, though they are not speaking up, except to their friends in private. It’s their highly educated spouses – both working and stay at home – who have the progressive leash on, one that is often reinforced by their children, often daughters, who have bought hook, line and sinker into the progressive narrative and critical theory being taught in private Chicago schools like Latin and Parker, as well as Select Enrollment high schools.”
        ‍
        “A father told me that his daughter said that wanting to leave Chicago is racist,” he adds. “I can’t wait to see how that one plays out when she learns about the deposit her dad is planning on putting down on a new place in Florida. But who knows. Maybe she won’t even be his daughter by then.”
        
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        February 10, 2023 6:21pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        Woke is of course religion. Faith in the dogma in spite of all evidence for the contrary is par for the course. two generations of (mostly female) humanities grads have spent their young adult lives in modern Convents, being steeped in the liturgy and gospel of the new secular gods, from whence they emerge arm in arm with their co-religionists armed with a rock solid and unchangeable faith, not open to questioning or falsification.
        
        These missionaries from la-la-land have moved out into the world and taken over all the non-STEM institutions of our world. And are going to have a good hard try at destroying democracy in the world forever.
        
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        February 10, 2023 7:55pm
    - cmm
      
      “Elections are won in the middle”. Possibly, but are they really? We hear that a lot, but this assumes that what matters is swinging fence sitting voters.
      
      There are other factors too:elections are maybe won by motivating “your” voters to turn out and vote.
      
      Appealing to the middle voters does not necessarily achieve that. In fact it can turn off “your” voters.
      
      For example, there might be quite a few people who see little point in chosing between Labour and Labour Lite (if that is how they perceive National), so can’t be bothered to vote.
      
      Same for females voting for Cindy because she’s “just like me”. Now she’s gone many of those people will just not vote.
      
      2011 had a voter turn out of 74%, 2020 had 82%. Those sorts of differences are enough to sway a tight election.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:02pm
      - NothingLeft
        
        When times are tough election turnouts are high.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:18pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Right so if Nats when much further to the right, what do you think would happen? i will give you a clue , ACT would have gone years ago.
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:12pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Exactly, that’s what i am trying to suggest when debating these people’s stupidity to rubbish the Nat’s, what is the point, they want a Nat Act government but rubbish the Nat’s with glee, all it does is lead people back to the rotten Labour party,
      Act were formed to take the right and for Nat’s to straddle the centre, i have been told that’s not true by some of the people ion here, but i wouldn’t mind betting they are younger and don’t realise, as i remember that is exactly why Act were set up looking forward to MMP.
      
      I even had Kiwi telling me that i am wrong about WFF’s and that the Nat’s introduced it even though we all know it was the Clarke governments dirt.
      
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      February 10, 2023 4:09pm
      - cmm
        
        All very well to “straddle the centre”, but the overton window has shifted so far left that there’s an awful lot of space to straddle.
        
        Trying to appeal to everyone makes a One-Size-Fits-All that doesn’t fit anyone.
        
        A party that tries to stand for everything, stands for nothing.
        
        Once a policy has survived both sides (eg. WFF) it is no longer anybody’s policy. WFF is now as much National’s policy as it is Labour’s because both gave it the nod.
        
        Assuming National get into power, if National don’t address crim hugging in their first term then crim hugging is as much National’s policy as it is Labour’s.
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:32pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        For “G the Giant”, the Overton Window:
        
        According to Overton, the window frames the range of policies that a politician can recommend without appearing too extreme to gain or keep public office given the climate of public opinion at that time.
        
        The National Party, for whom I have voted many times, is very good at detecting where the Overton Window has moved to in order to get elected.
        
        But they never move it. Only the left does, ever leftward.
        
        And the real joke is that while one could appreciate National’s strategy between 1945 and 1990, the fact is that since 1990 Labour have done just as well as National in holding government power, and actually better since 2000, all while embedding things like WFF.
        
        As I said in The Precious Midpoint:
        
        That approach just won’t cut it anymore with Centre-Right parties. Real, practical solutions based around giving incentives to individuals – in education, healthcare and other areas – are what is required. Certainly not something that “‘we’, the clever ones, are going to impose upon ‘them’, the Lower Orders“, from the hearts of wealthy suburbs sporting myriad electric cars.
        
        The midpoint is there to be moved, not just accommodated while others move it.
        
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        February 10, 2023 6:33pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Until we get policy we can’t say, policy is not going to be released until after the budget end of. I heard Luxon putting the boot in on the news last night, he was pretty forceful I thought, the vulgarity of this rotten media is part of the problem, look yesterday, a large article how canto vaxers attacked him viscously, while people that were at the event say there was a few strange questions about vax, and about mandates, no where did the people say they heard shame on you.
  
  Nothing these bastards have done is cunning, if they think we will forget the nasty divisive policies that will remain then they are deluded . PS I did not down vote you, but I would like to know why as soon as people like Hooten and that other bloater go to the Hearald for the filthy dollar, why fo they automatically attack the Nats
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:56am
  - leoj
    
    National had their chance to be a real opposition during the jabfest and protest.
    Instead, they chose to hide behind Jacinda’s skirt and agreed with everything Labour suggested.
    They were in lock step National blew it.
    I don’t excuse Seymour either. He could (should) have differentiated ACT from the entire parliament but didn’t.
    Our entire government are traitors.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:58am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      F….the jab fest, Labour forced it on us when we were in unknown waters, Luxon from day one as leader has said the border needs to be reopened, he has always stated that the mandates are un needed, look what happened to Nats polling when Bridges tried to rubbish Labour over the wufli, wake up
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:38am
  - Keith White
    
    I assume that the people who write in this case anti-National screeds do so because they want to keep sucking at the media’s publicly-tax-funded teat. I don’t even think they have flexible principles, I don’t think they have any principles at all other than GibMeDat and don’t make me work for it.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:10am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Nats have been told this is no walkover, but for some reason they are not taking it on board.
  Maybe Luxon and National want Labour to win and fuck us over even more?
  That is all I can think of.
  Uptick from me. Don’t worry about downticks, those are from the resident downtickers with no debating skills.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:00am
  - nathie
    
    Hmmm, who to put one’s money on ….
    
    *Sir Robert Jones, who still states in his columns that Labour will be trounced at the election?
    
    *Or Matthew Hooten, who tends to get it wrong (he supported the Muller coup after all) and will write something controversial to be noticed (i.e. clickbait)?
    
    Hmmm … one of the above isn’t paid and gives his thoughts freely (and calls a spade a spade).
    
    Whereas the other one is a paid “influencer” (and will try and convince you a $25 spade is an outdated manually operated implement whereas the latest shinny new $100k Caterpillar Excavator is what every “real bloke” should have tucked away in their Garden Shed)!
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:22am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Bob Jones likes inflation. It is good for his businesses.
      Remember The New Zealand Party? Solely designed to get National votes for a Labour win.
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:34am
- artemisia
  
  Some smart and experienced folk in and around National. Of course there is a set of strategies. Just as well they waited to adjust as the policies bonfire grows and grows.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:03am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Exactly, Labour are canning the divisive policies, they should be charged with treason over that alone, if policy had been handed out before Christmas, then Labour would grab them, I am reliably informed that Nats will be delivering wide spread policy after the budget and leading up to the election, why the centrist voter can’t see it is beyond me
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:23am
- nathie
  
  Why do people here (and including the likes of Hooten) buy into Labour’s on-going propaganda campaign against Chris Luxon?
  
  That same Labour campaign that was supported by the MSM last year (eg “Luxon changes his mind” or “Luxon holidaying in Hawaii”) etc.
  
  Why are Labour doing this? Because under Luxon National’s polling moved from the 20’s into the 30’s, where they remain. And with ACT both National and ACT can form a Govt and boot Labour out!
  
  If the likes of Hooten want National to poll higher, I’d prefer that wasn’t at the expense of ACT (like when they used to be at 1% for the last few years).
  
  If the likes of Hooten want Luxon to poll higher – why? As no one votes for Party Leaders at the election (vote for your Party and vote for your electorate MP).
  
  Preferred PM polls are TV entertainment for the TV political reporters to strut about the place with self-importance.
  
  The only poll that matters is voting in the October election (not what TV political reporter personalities tell us)!
  
  Do we want a National and ACT combo or do we want more Labour/Greens/Maori Party divisiveness for another 3 years?
  
  If so, vote National or ACT (it doesn’t matter)! But stop listening to Labour Party attack lines being fed to the MSM, that are being amplified by some (that are also bought and paid for) on the Right!
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:04am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Yes, just like vote NZF to teach Nats a lesson, how did that ho, then vote Labour to keep Greens out, pfft, now fools are saying Labour are cunning for dropping policies that have been hated for years
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:26am
  - Paulus
    
    On the Radio this morning it is said that on the latest opinion poll that Labour, Greens and Maori can reign over Parliament after the election.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:11am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      They might sneak in if Mp get 5 seats MP have stated they will sit on the cross benches so that’s a no
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:39am
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    “Why do people here (and including the likes of Hooten) buy into Labour’s on-going propaganda campaign against Chris Luxon?
    … that are being amplified by some (that are also bought and paid for) on the Right! ”
    
    “One day in early summer Squealer ordered the sheep to follow him
    …
    He was, he said, teaching them to to sing a new song, for which privacy was needed.
    …
    – they might have uttered some word of protest. But just at that moment, as though at a signal, all the sheep burst into a tremendous bleating of –
    ‘Four legs good, two legs better ….’ ”
    
    Suspect Orwell knew why back in the ’40s.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:17am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Yes there are NINOs on the right. They need exposing.
    
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    February 10, 2023 3:32pm
- Widogast Corwin
  
  Maybe this is my inner conspiracy theorist talking 🙂 but it looks to me like Jacinda did not come to a revelation over the Christmas break that she had ‘run out of gas’. It is more likely that the power brokers took her out the back for a talk. The manufactured headlines about ditching “Ardern-era” policies is a stark message.
  
  Also since she resigned it is like she fell off the face of the earth. No Wmans Weekly articles about her packing up at Premier House. No photo ops of the now relaxed couple enjoying life.
  
  Politics is a brutal game 🙂
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:13am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    It was completely orchestrated, media, thd pardy, Hipkins and Robertson have all been well rehearsed
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:27am
    - kowtow
      
      No te media pardy were blindsided .
      But they are most definitely on side with the Hipkins regime.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:02am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        No the media were not blind sided, more than one media personnel state that Ardern was quoting well before Christmas
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:40am
      - kowtow
        
        G
        Name one media org that said she said she was resigning.
        
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        February 10, 2023 1:03pm
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Audrey Young has stated many times leading up to Christmas , HDA asked ministers if what she hears about Ardern resigning true
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:14pm
  - nathie
    
    Well I agree 100% with your “conspiracy theory” but just to add to that, the reason why there are no more Woman’s Weekly (and MSM) articles about Ardern … is because the MSM has now been told to focus on her successor the so-called everyday, regular Cossie Club attendee (oh wait!) “Chippie”, so that Labour are re-elected (and bonus points for MSM mocking Luxon or Seymour – like they did at Waitangi when Seymour spoke in Maori)!
    
    Isn’t it also interesting that previously, according to the MSM, calling Jacinda “Cindy” is sexist misogyny hate speech!
    
    But now, according to the MSM, calling Chris Hipkins “Chippie” is not only “ok”, it is to be amplified and used everywhere and everyday so that Kiwi’s know that “Chippie” is “just like you, an everyday good sort of bloke” who apparently hangs out at Cossie Clubs (oh wait, whoops bring that reporter in for re-programming)!
    
    Unlike those “nasty” Nats and “fake Maori” ACT MP’s!
    
    With Robbo and Labour now openly using the unspent Covid fund for anything-they-want-in-order-to-win-the-election expect more paid for puff pieces on “Chippie from the Hutt” (with photoshopped pics of Chippie with a mullet downing a bottle of JD’s and driving a beat up Holden back in the day)??? 😉
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:41am
    - cmm
      
      The “Ardern-era” phrase is deliberate.
      
      “era” is a period of history. It has a distinct start and a distinct end. It is old. It is finished. It is in the past.
      
      ie. Dusty old Cindy is gone, together with her old, dated policies. Nope, focus on the new face of Labour as they “refresh, refocus, re-organise, re-xxx”.
      
      But most of Cindy’s quirky charm is that the young wimminz (and previously young wimminz) could relate to her and thus supported her.
      
      Lots of people who wouldn’t normally vote lined up because “Cindy needs us”.
      
      Will they line up for a pale male ginger wingnut?
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:11pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        ‘ I saw it in a farmer’s paddock, “End of an error’
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:37pm
  - Tom Hunter
    
    Uber Lefty Chris Trotter agrees with you.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:19am
  - plc
    
    No,no…..Boxer went to the farm
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:47pm
- Its only I
  
  Apparently the dry powder the Nats are saving is a very small amount, one shot in fact.
  Maybe not even a shot but just enough to make a pigment and write “down with this sort of thing” on a piece of card nailed to little piece of wood so they can wave it around whilst standing behind Labours current politically dominant frontman.
  
  I’m waiting for National to look like they can step in today and fix the children’s mess rather than letting the children keep running riot and winning the bedtime negotiations.
  
  National….?…Lazy 1980’s campaign based on letting Labour hang itself while relying on the swing voter becoming hopeful the Nats are less shyt.
  Except the media are all in on Labour winning this time around and the Nats don’t do social media well.
  
  The way the Nats are behaving its like they don’t have the stamina for more than a month or two of looking like a viable alternative to the worst Gov in living memory before the election. How the hell are they going to cope for the three years after?
  
  They don’t have to do a policy dump either, just walk tall, be straight up and farking accurate with numbers.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:16am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Again, no policy till after the shambles that is the budget, Luxon has stated there has been a lot of work on policy, there is no way he is just spouting and going to the election with no policy like Labour, he is delivering his state of the nation speech next week before parliament opens, let’s see how he goes, one thing is for sure, it will be anti this vulgar Labour Marxist regime
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:10am
    - Widogast Corwin
      
      How about you try some punctuation.
      
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      February 10, 2023 8:29pm
- slightlyrighty
  
  National has called for an end to the RNZ/TVNZ Merger, the Compulsory Unemployment Insurance, The Biofuels Mandate and the Hate Speech Legislation.
  
  Labour has paused or cancelled all of these and got a bump in the polls.
  
  If National put out too many policies too soon, Labour will just copy their Homework and take the credit again.
  
  Labour may claim the initiative, but they are doing so by implementing the recommendations of the Opposition, and the Media is not choosing to note this.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:39am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    What annoys me it’s supposed level headed voters on here that can’t see it, they have been calling for policy for a year fFS, the 5?policies they have delivered have been forgotten, so what the hell is the point releasing policy too soon?
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:12am
    - Its only I
      
      Like I said already, the Nats dont have to do a policy dump.
      Everybody knows Labour will screen their real policy with stolen Nats stuff, everybody knows the media will let Labour reset itself.
      
      The act of policy theft in itself is a barn door target for satire let alone the architect of doom pretending the last five years was bundled into an old waka with Ardern and set adrift never to be spoken about again.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:42am
  - Its only I
    
    Your right slightly.
    
    This stage of the election cycle is bad at the best of times, sadly this isn’t the best of times.
    
    Something is not right with the political part of NZ this time around, something has changed. I used to think the kiwi “she’ll be right” idiom was optimistic, now I think is apathetic in regards to our democracy.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:26am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    A bump in the polls. This is why National should not talk policies anymore. The mongrel left just steal them.
    I am quite happy to wait until after the Budget and the lies are sorted out.
    
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    February 10, 2023 3:47pm
- Nickc2
  
  With PIJF bonuses handed out, our MSM has switched to INFLUENCE mode. Expect more such garbage from the likes of that Poison Pen Hooton.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:28am
Maggie Pie

Just how effective are Chippy’s FOG-CANONS?

Watch as violent gang of yoofs in Glendene rob Indian dairy…..

https://twitter.com/JeremyMcilvride/status/1623606436076081158
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February 10, 2023 8:25am
- Southern Raider
  
  Megan Woods said on Hosking that the retail crime stats were actually improving and that Labour’s policies are starting to work.
  
  Mitchell proposed allowing security guards to make arrests, but Megan made it clear Labour would not do that and it’s more about understanding the underlying issues
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:33am
  - igm
    
    Labour allowed maori gang members to run road blocks. They are crim huggers and must be removed.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:00am
  - Widogast Corwin
    
    “…it’s more about understanding the underlying issues…”
    
    The underlying issues include the collapse of family structures, unquestioned welfare dependency, methamphetamine and related drug addiction, and modelling of violence by gangs and drug crazed men, with Maori men vastly over represented in all these groups.
    
    Megan Woods, the “underlying issues” are not difficult to understand. What are you going to do about them?
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:04am
  - backster
    
    Meanwhile if you live in Hamilton don’t go to town today, and keep your kids at home. The town centre is to be given over to gangsters and hoodlums to have a rumble to decide whose territory it is. Chicago comes to town.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:27am
  - leoj
    
    If National promised to build more prisons, keep crims in jail longer and appoint judges who stop ruling with wet bus tickets, then I might take them more seriously.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:14am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      That was their policy before Peters treachery, it will be their policy this year too, don’t forget prisons are now half empty, so may not need them for some time
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:43am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      And put the existing crims now on the loose back in the hinaki.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:48pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    The whole Labour Party is spouting this shit that ram raids have slowed, fact is it’s been Christmas time, snd the floods met very well have slowed the crime for a while, now these scum are filling trolleys and walking out telling security to take a hike, this is becoming like the states with Dem governors who are equally soft on crime like these fools are when they just walk in a shop and take what they want and walk out
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:17am
  - krazykiwi
    
    “more about about understanding the underlying issues”
    
    Woods has about as much capability of “understanding the underlying issues” as she has of designing a cold fusion pie warmer.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:57am
- TS Child
  
  Unconvinced about the fog cannons, but the covid masks are being worn correctly and seem quite effective in this situation.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:39am
- Rich Prick
  
  Fog cannon? The smarter solution would be a Claymore.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:46am
  - Keith White
    
    I always liked Ripley’s approach.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:00pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    I was thinking more along the lines of a Gatling gun.
    
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    February 10, 2023 3:57pm
- Simon
  
  If the dairy owner shot one of the attackers would anyone from the National party defend the dairy owner?
  
  No. Didnt think so. Violent gang are National’s as well.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:49am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Oh ffs, do you want your government in waiting to say shooting dead people is okay? Even though it’s against the law
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:20am
    - Jack5
      
      What is the criminal charge for shooting a dead person? 🙃
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:26am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Aiding and abetting?//
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:51pm
    - Keith White
      
      Many of us would prefer castle doctrine to apply in NZ – home invaders should get the Texas treatment, not the Coster cuddles.
      
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      February 10, 2023 12:01pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Everyone should arm themselves with a taiaha.
        My taiaha is above my front door. 20mm stainless steel.
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:52pm
  - Bobba Fret
    
    I am waiting for this to happen. And when the dairy owner is charged, I hope the public back lash is so loud that he gets off as was simply defending himself. Like the farmer that removed a couple of fingers.
    
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    February 10, 2023 1:28pm
  - cmm
    
    Ok, we don’t need to go as far as shooting.
    
    Just a pepper spray would change the equation.
    
    As one of very few people on here who has shot someone, I can say it is not a pleasant thing to have to do. I would not wish having to do so on any dairy owner.
    
    But a pepper spray in the eyes is enough to change most people’s mind and does not leave as much of a scar on the person doing the spraying.
    
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    February 10, 2023 3:16pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Still I go back to the skimping. One fog cannon protecting a cigarette cabinet?
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:56pm
- Ehlana
  
  I think its probably doing exactly what is meant to do Maggie – it’s letting the worker escape without injury.
  
  Surely you’re not suggesting this Government would recommend something that would deter, interfere with or prevent the business of robbery? Have you thought about the damage that would cause these young people, who have obviously already suffered greatly from colonialisation?
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:53am
- MCōs
  
  Fog canons have been around since at least 2016 going by this article.
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/fog-the-new-weapon-to-fight-crime/6RMRH6B4ZRXXRJBUGUJUBLAWGI/
  In that clip it obvious from the moment those guys came in the door the cannon should have been activated, but he didn’t push the button for about 10-12 seconds.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:05am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Pretty sure they have been around longer than that, they have been used twice by my shop owner successfully, the secret is using them at the right time when they are directly at the counter
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:22am
  - Keith White
    
    Can fog cannons get grapeshot mods? Asking for a friend who runs a dairy north of the Bombay Wall.
    
    (quickly adding – mods in this context means modifications, not moderators 🙂 )
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:03pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  So dangerous//
  First, not enough of them. Second the activation was delayed too long – needs remote control. Third, the front door should be closed and locked automatically, as long as the owner is behind a locked grill at the back.
  These no-hopers need to be stopped – Labour will never do it, they will lose votes.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:10am
- Keith White
  
  Every home should be protected with a high-capacity trebuchet.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:11am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    All I have is a curtain rod above the front door.
    It is 900mm long and 20mm diameter. Stainless steel.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:38am
    - Keith White
      
      Wut? that’s a high-capacity curtain magazine!!! I only have a modest small-gauge ‘polite assault broom’.
      
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      February 10, 2023 12:04pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Yer, no curtain on it. The one the will maybe gets it will meet his maker. Look after number one and family first.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:25pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  My shop that is run by a Tiwanese family have used to fog cannons they paid for themselves twice, they don’t like it up Em when they are fired directly at their face, I think the Indian shop keeper’s maybe too timid to smoke them up too quickly
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:14am
  - Keith White
    
    Considering what the shopkeeper would get charged with if a Dindu Nuffin sustained even a superficial abrasion during a ram-raid, one can sympathize with them.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:06pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  I’m amazed that Worksafe aren’t prosecuting the owner for providing an unsafe workplace.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:08pm
kevn

@Maggie… Pathetic fog. Just like a big vape session while they steal.
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February 10, 2023 8:39am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Seems the fog was protecting the cigarette cabinet.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:11am
- Keith White
  
  Can the fog cannon be fitted with a tear-gas canister?
  
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  February 10, 2023 12:06pm
  - Ghost
    
    Shame it can’t be fitted with bright pink dye
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:09pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      What? A whole lot of pink terrors running around. No thanks, one is enough.//
      
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      February 10, 2023 12:26pm
      - Keith White
        
        Steve, just think of it as a target rich environment for your curtain rod…
        
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        February 10, 2023 3:59pm
    - Keith White
      
      Ghost, that would be a very good development. apart from everything else, it would be difficult for those people not to be found rather promptly.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:58pm
Grunter

For those that want to read/hear a different perspective on what is really happening in the NATO/Russia war (hint it is NOT what you read in the Herald and Stuffed). Some links below. Make up your own mind what you think, but don’t rely on the crappy MSM for anything.

1. Seymour Hersh – Pulitzer Prize-winning investigative journalist has just released a very in-depth piece on the Nord Stream.
https://seymourhersh.substack.com/p/how-america-took-out-the-nord-stream

2. Col. Douglas Macgregor – ex US military guy. Look him up on YouTube.

3. The Duran (YouTube). These guys rabbit on for about an hour every other day with all the latest developments from the front line, NATO, Russia, etc. Much more balanced view.

In summary (my view based on the above);
– Ukraine are getting their arsed kicked
– US/UK pushing the rest of the NATO alliance into a full-on war they don’t really want.
– Russia realise that US/UK wants to destroy Russia as a country, so they will defend it until the end.
– NATO has refused to enter into any peace negotiations.
– This is all heading toward a very bad scenario of all-out war.
– Russia already threatening nukes.
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February 10, 2023 8:41am
- RoboRob
  
  Hear Macgregor speak before. Seems very smart guy and gives an interesting perspective.
  
  Re ‘Pulitzer Prize’ winning meaning you should trust this journalist… Remember that the NY times won a Pulitzer for their coverage for Trumps ties to Russia. That said, I think Hersh is likely right, the US is the most likely culprit as they have the ability and the motive. Russia certainly didn’t have the motive, neither did Germany. Ukraine had the motive but not the means.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:11am
- Ehlana
  
  “NATO has refused to enter into any peace negotiations.”
  
  Presumably because Ukraine is not a member of NATO and it was Ukraine that was invaded.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:16am
  - I remember when
    
    The Ukraine conflict highlights the problems that always arise in conflicts involving major world powers.
    If you desert the defenders, what message are you sending to other countries.
    Or, are you prepared to accept the level of casualties that escalation will mean.
    Meanwhile, both sides try to chip away so that some largely acceptable resolution can eventually be reached.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:45am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Biden gave the order to destroy it. US under the disguise of NATO exercises planted explosives time to be activated days after NATO left the area.
  Joe’s famous words “I promise you we could do it”
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8BygV2kZBU
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:19am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Biden is full of shot, he also tried to say it flew over Canada as well even though it flew over Alaska
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:24am
    - Ghost
      
      It flew over Canada
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:31am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Flew over the Aleutian Islands, Alaska.
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:41am
      - Ghost
        
        the alleged surveillance balloon initially approached North America near Alaska’s Aleutian Islands on Jan 28. According to officials, it crossed into Canadian airspace on Jan. 30, travelling above the Northwest Territories, Alberta and Saskatchewan before re-entering the U.S. on Jan 31.
        
        https://www.google.com/amp/s/beta.ctvnews.ca/national/sci-tech/2023/2/6/1_6262580.amp.html
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:44am
      - G the giant from Dunedin
        
        Just, but it was shown going right around the whole border of Alaska, don’t listen to too much of what Biden says, he has been shown several times recently telling straight out lies, in fact his state of the nation shows just how much of a liar he is
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:12pm
      - Ghost
        
        That’s from Canadian officials, not biden
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:17pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        @ Ghost,
        Our host family friends in Anchorage told me over the Aleutians. It was on their local TV News. They did not see it of course.
        Maybe their media is same as ours?? and Alaska is a Red State.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:30pm
    - cmm
      
      FFS kids stop fighting… Go to your rooms until you can be civilised.
      
      It flew over both Canada and Alaska.
      
      Between Alaska and the Lower 48 states there is a gap. That gap has a name: Canada.
      
      It flew over the Alaska, then the state of BC (Canada) then over the the contiguous USA.
      
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      February 10, 2023 3:24pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Hear hear, what that man said.
        
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        February 10, 2023 4:01pm
- OverseasKiwi
  
  At the moment I cannot see a way out of this conflict which does not end in thermonuclear war. I am unconcerned with the Russians re nuclear weapons, as they are rational and follow doctrine (no childish Putin comments please), but I think that the Americans are increasingly unhinged and desperate to retrieve what seems to be an impending major strategic defeat.
  
  Quite frankly, I find the gullibility of many on this website amusing, who swallow the MSM’s narrative completely and suddenly become true believers in that narrative, if were not for the prospect of a third World War (arguably it has already begun).
  
  The incompetence of the Biden administration is astonishing. Whereas previous presidents would have sought peace as quickly as possible, Biden sought to prolong the war he himself has done so much to provoke (since 2014, the evidence is clear on this matter). It is now an existential matter – either Russia is dismembered as a nation state, or the US loses much of its global power and heads into rapid economic decline. It is 1956 all over again, a major global power shift. Europe will just fade into irrelevance, with no secure access to Russia’s huge mineral resources.
  
  As for the fighting, the Ukrainians are on their last legs, and should collapse in the next month or so. Their casualties are extreme (upwards of 250,000 dead at this point – the Russians probably around 30,000 at the most). Interestingly, the Ukrainians, by trying to defend everywhere, are being ground down (cf. Germany in 1943-45), whereas the Russian concern is to minimise casualties (the rumour of human wave attacks is asinine – this is not even true for WWII).
  
  No one knows how far West the Russians will advance, but at the moment there is no possibility of meaningful negotiations. My view is that they will absorb Odessa and everything east of the Dnieper River (95% of Ukraine’s GDP). What is left will become a puppet state.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:57am
  - cmm
    
    The Ukraininas have been used as common fodder to try to consume Russian resources. This is almost an exact copy of what they did in Angola: pour in resources to fuel up the conflict, using non-US soldiers as cannon fodder.
    
    Once the toy breaks, USA will just walk away and leave a mess for others to sort out (refer Angola again, Iraq, elsewhere).
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:35am
  - Grunter
    
    OverseasKiwi – I agree with what you are saying, especially “…Quite frankly, I find the gullibility of many on this website amusing, who swallow the MSM’s narrative completely and suddenly become true believers”
    Even Hosking this morning gave Zelensky a 9 out of 10 rating for his performance in front of the UK elite this week (unbelievably naive). Zelenskyy is the puppet driving the West toward WW3. If you are trying to avert WW3 why on earth would you provide a former actor with jets and missiles to fire at the world’s largest nuclear power? What do they think they will achieve?
    Like most wars, there is no “good” & “bad”. The entire thing is a mess and the only issue is how to quickly de-escalate. Continuing to ‘poke the bear’ (Russia) can only end one way – nuclear WW3. If you can’t at least see that (ignore for a minute who started what) then there is no hope – go back to your MSM people…….. It sucked you in during Covid and it’s doing it again, only this one is much much worse.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:07am
    - MCōs
      
      Who’s ‘poking the bear’?
      Nobody, on this occasion, has invaded Russia/USSR as has happened in the past.
      
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      February 10, 2023 4:36pm
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    Deluded Putin propagandists (basically fellow travellers) who keep thinking the Russians will invade Odessa. The same prediction as for the last 12 months. The Russians couldn’t even keep Kherson much less invade Odessa.
    
    The Russians started the war with 2,500 operational tanks and 1500 or so in short term reserve. So far 1,500 of those tanks have been destroyed. So now Russia is having to restore 40 to 50 year old tanks (early T72’s and T64’s) that have been stored out in the open for the last 30 years. They won’t last long.
    
    Any major Russian offensive will fail. Ukraine is getting too many advance western weapons for such an offensive to succeed, especially when coupled with the level of Western intelligence they are getting. Yes, Russia might get small gains, but not enough to change the basic military balance.
    
    In my view the current front line is reasonably close to what the final outcome will be. So for all of Russia’s efforts they will have gained a land bridge for Crimea.
    
    But at the cost of about 200,000 Russian dead. Sweden and Finland joining NATO. The likelihood that Ukraine will also join NATO and will ultimately have an armed forces entirely equipped with modern western weapons. Russia being on the outer for the next 20 years, unless they change political direction.
    
    Overall a strategic Russian loss.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:10am
    - Grunter
      
      Yep – and Putin did attempt to have a negotiated land-grab cease-fire (Donbas, etc) way back in about March. The Zelenskyy puppet was heading to the negotiation table when suddenly Boris J yanked his chain and said “No negotiated cease-fire”. Why would Boris do that? And then the US & Norway blow up Nord Stream after Biden lost his teleprompter and declared that was exactly what they were going to do.
      Again – there are no “good guys” in any of this. And don’t be deluded that Zelenskyy is a good guy and that the ‘West’ will win. No one can win this mess.
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:42am
    - OverseasKiwi
      
      Re Wayne Mapp:
      
      With respect you are completely wrong and you seem to know nothing about modern warfare. To label myself and others as Putin propagandists is pathetic. I could equally accuse you of being a mindless stooge for the USA.
      
      If the Ukrainians are faring so well, why are they begging for arms, or why are they conscripting every available citizen between 16 and 55, or why the only part of the army with hitting power left consists of foreign nationals (i.e. mercenaries and volunteers, especially
      Poles)?
      
      The Russians have not suffered 200,000 dead. Have you not read the abstracts of the Mossad report on Ukrainian/Russian material and human losses, which accords generally with the figures estimated by British think-tanks?
      
      FYI, it appears through the fog of war that the effectiveness of Russian and Nato weapons is about equal. Please remember that no single weapon is a game changer (an amusing term) on the battlefield. All weapons operate in an environment with other weapons’ systems which enhance their strengths and compensate for their weaknesses.
      
      When the Russians launch their offensive, that will be end of Ukraine. Nothing can change that short of a nuclear exchange.
      
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      February 10, 2023 12:12pm
  - rangitoto
    
    It’s the other way around. Russian dead is at least 130,000. A lot less Ukraine soldier. Russians are losing 700 to 1,000 KIA per day.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:56pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Many her will know I am a Trump fan. This War would never have started under Trump as POTUS. I would say get Putin and Zelenski together with Trump as a moderator to negotiate.
    Does not have to be face to face, but a video debate. We know Trump is a good negotiator. Love him or hate him, he negotiates well. Trump has offered in the past.
    I really think this can be settled, before the big time bragging comes and we see a Russian Nuclear attack.
    Dumb idea from me? Go and have a think. I will give you the same quote as I have said before. “You don’t have to like someone to respect them, and with that respect you gain respect back” DJT
    I think this will work, and the muscle flexing would stop. The boys can stop playing games. Sure there will be concessions, but I think this is the way out for Russia, Ukraine, and the World.
    
    ps, there are many in Ukraine that want to be real Russians again.
    
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    February 10, 2023 4:27pm
- Individual Responsibility
  
  Grunter – if you haven’t already seen/heard this interview,
  
  John Mearsheimer: The West is playing Russian roulette
  https://youtu.be/HBiV1h7Dm5E
  
  The interview, by U.K. based UNHERD, is approx 1:15:00 in length, but very informative for anyone that believes, as I do, that the west is being fed a line by U.S. hawks and legacy media.
  
  Background from Britannica on John Mearsheimer –
  
  https://www.britannica.com/biography/John-Mearsheimer
  
  born December 14, 1947, New York, New York, prominent American scholar of international relations best known for his theory of offensive realism.
  
  After graduating from the United States Military Academy (West Point) in 1970, Mearsheimer served for five years as an officer in the air force, rising to the rank of captain.
  
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  February 10, 2023 12:35pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  “– Russia already threatening nukes.”
  
  Then they are threatening the complete suicide of their own civilisation also.
  
  Everyone needs to pause, walk back to pre-invasion stations, then negotiate a further pullback on both sides. I believe this is what Kissenger is urging. He might know a thing or two about these kinds of situations.
  
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  February 10, 2023 2:03pm
Frank the tank

So Swim”safe” decided to do an actual test at a beach yesterday. Funnily enough beach was fine for swimming whereas their algorithm said it wasn’t.

Who did their modelling – Gavin Hendy?
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February 10, 2023 8:44am
- RalphT
  
  Gavin? Don’t you mean Shaun?
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:02am
  - I remember when
    
    ‘Shorn.’
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:36am
  - Frank the tank
    
    Yep you are correct – my mistake.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:08am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Hendy with a mad microbiologist pink terror.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:20am
- cmm
  
  Modelling is a dumb idea. It should only be used when reality cannot be measured.
  
  Unfortunately those who get steeped in modelling consider the models to be “their” reality. When the models and the real world disagree then in their brains the real world is broken.
  
  Nope, the real world is always right.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:38am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Dumb idea, but it pays real well.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:43am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3W5fXic9To

John Fetterman Hospitalized ft. Spin and Hype!

All right everyone now we need to talk
about John Fetterman he is I believe
still currently in the hospital he felt
lightheaded the other day and he was
transported to the hospital to get
checked. The original presser
that his people put out is
that the doctors don’t believe that it’s
related to his prior stroke it could be
related to stroke meds though now maybe
he took one too many blood thinners.
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February 10, 2023 8:50am
- Inandout
  
  curry, I wonder who will go first, Fetterman or Biden?
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:13am
  - Keith White
    
    From a purely physiological perspective, I would say Biden. But I’m not a gerontologist.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:11am
    - Inandout
      
      KW, Joe was obviously pumped with stay awake vitamins for the SOTU. The next day he was speaking to a group of unionists and just lost his train of thought.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:59am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnut-E_eEM0

Curtains for Ukraine?

Colonel Douglas Macgregor sits down with Stephen Gardner to update us on the Ukraine Russia war. Did NATO want this war? Will the US trigger world war 3 in order to prop up Biden and his white house? Was the Chinese spy balloon to embarrass Biden or is it to distract Americans? Can Ukraine beat Putin? Can Nato beat Putin? [Did Zelensky use Tide instead of Persil to launder the ‘aid’? Did that ruin things? 30:35]
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February 10, 2023 8:51am
- MCōs
  
  You expect us to watch half an half hour clip on the strength of some of those stupid theories?
  
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  February 10, 2023 1:21pm
The Redbaiter

Listened to Nicola Willis discussing the minimum wage hike with the communists on Morning Report. She was perfunctory and unimaginative and just came across as robotic. Not persuasive and therefore not any kind of winner.

She agreed with almost every proposition put forward by the far left host, the main one being that the minimum wage improved the cost of living for the poor. This is a lie, or worse, a confidence trick designed only to deliver power to the charlatans who advocate for it.

Its a simple and stark truth that wages can only be improved if production is improved. Otherwise the producer must pass on the raised costs, or eventually go broke. Passing on the costs only makes everything more expensive so the gain for the poor or anyone is exactly nil.

Willis apparently couldn’t express this simple truth though. Instead she said the Nats believed fully in the minimum wage, that they had put it up frequently in the past, and that the only problem she had with Labour’s rise was that it was too much.

National seem too intellectually weak to fight these silly left wing ideas, and therefore wrong notions over time get implanted in the voters’ thinking without any opposition.

Willis should speak the truth, and not go along with a lie just for the sake of National’s own desire for power.
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February 10, 2023 8:53am
- Random T Person
  
  These people would do well to read an economics textbook.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:03am
  - Don Beckett
    
    “Its a simple and stark truth that wages can only be improved if production is improved.”
    I think you mean Productivity – not production. Production can be increased and productivity reduced by using wrong means.
    Need to get your terms right.
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:26am
- RoboRob
  
  From what I saw I thought she did well. Of course they have to support the minimum wage, 90% of the voters support it and dont understand the issues around it. Why piss against a wall arguing against it, the issue at hand was the massive increase.
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:15am
  - The Redbaiter
    
    “90% of the voters support it and dont understand the issues around it. Why piss against a wall arguing against it, ”
    
    Exactly why NZ is in the trouble it is in. Nat supporters are admitting right here that they are so intellectually bereft and gutless they would rather allow Labour to lie than confront them with the truth.
    
    The Nats have been caving this way for decades. One could very easily say therefore that NZ deserves everything that is coming its way, including the potential re-election of the Labour govt.
    
    Roll on NZ’s Ron DeSantis. A brave man and unlike the Nats, unafraid to confront and expose the lies that underpin the left’s ideology.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:45am
    - RoboRob
      
      National can totally argue against the minimum wage but that interview wasn’t the right place for it. The discussion was around the impact of Labours changes on the minimum wage on inflation.
      
      Willis succeeded in showing that the 7% change in the minimum wage would have roll on effects in teachers pay and firefighters etc. That this would cause further inflation. Discussions on the validity of the minimum wage muddies her argument when she has a clear point to make.
      
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      February 10, 2023 10:59am
      - The Redbaiter
        
        IOW, the discussion was directed by the left/Labour and Willis went right along with it. When do the Nats start setting the terms?
        
        National is poorly served not only by its leaders and MPs, but more importantly by its campaign directors. Luxon is bad enough, but Chris Bishop has (IMHO) already shown he does not have the intellect or experience to conduct a hard hitting political campaign, It was a big mistake putting him in charge.
        
        Hamish Rutherford is another weakness. (again IMHO) You can of course argue that I am quite wrong, however that the Nats are polling so low at a time when the govt is so unbelievably incompetents points to a serious failure somewhere.
        
        With competent leaders and a performing campaign team, they would have at the least a 10-15% margin.
        
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        February 10, 2023 11:57am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Go and join the red team baiter for red, if you want a change of government you won’t get it by rubbishing the Nats, we get it, you want ACT, but they will never get a huge support, it may go up a little, but the whinging is seeing people going back to Labour, we’ll done baiter for red
      
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      February 10, 2023 12:19pm
- Sacha
  
  I don’t think that Willis has the depth of knowledge to be a Minister of Finance. I’m not even sure about her making a good job of Deputy Leader.
  I saw her doing the rounds as she campaigned for the last election – lots of photo ops, and she seemed nice enough, but not convincing somehow.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:22am
  - Inandout
    
    Sacha, if Robbo can be in that role then Willis is a shoo-in.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:54am
  - RoboRob
    
    Personally I think she comes over well on TV and is articulate. Seems intelligent. As Inandout says, if Robertson can do it it should be easy for her to do a better job!
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:01am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  She has stated clearly that Min wage would not go up In massive increments like we are getting, she has also stated that under he Nats the Min wage would no need to go up as quickly, compare her to that idiot Robertson saying if money squandered in the cancelled ( Flip flopped) policies is not wasted if it is spent, ffs we have no chance at all with this attitude
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:29am
  - Keith White
    
    Will National bring the minimum wage back down to sensible levels where people will be motivated to improve their skill set and work ethic? Because if National just leave where it is now, they are Labour-Lite on this type of metric.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:09pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      That would be suicide, they would have to say so before the election, think about it, only Labour foist policy on us un announced after elections
      
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      February 10, 2023 12:23pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  National appear to be a slightly less batty version of Labour.
  
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  February 10, 2023 2:05pm
Swifty

Rawiri Waititi shows what he’s got:

https://twitter.com/dbseymour/status/1623566227544371201

And it aint much.
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February 10, 2023 9:10am
- slightlyrighty
  
  They just can’t help themselves….
  
  From the Maori Party Website…
  
  “Māori invented many sports prior to European arrival. Running, Swimming, Fishing, Waka, Hunting,”
  
  https://www.maoriparty.org.nz/maori_sports
  
  It must have been really interesting walking everywhere for us non Maori prior to 1840!
  
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  February 10, 2023 9:44am
  - Ehlana
    
    In other words, Maori did what every other tribal society did – they practiced and competed in arts that aided their survival.
    
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    February 10, 2023 9:54am
  - Keith White
    
    I guess anybody who went into deep water and didn’t instantly invent swimming, drowned and didn’t improve the gene pool.
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:13am
  - Jack5
    
    From the link given by poster Slightlyrighty …
    
    Maori Party sports policy deserves to be spelled out. It includes:
    
    – A national Maori sporting body.
    
    – Establishing a $100 million fund for three years to invest into Maori sporting codes (not clear whether this is $100m a year or $100m in total);
    
    – Funding Maori sporting academies and scholarships.
    
    – Funding “iwi & hapu Pa Wars” events.
    
    – Funds going directly to regional Maori sporting codes for Maori, by Maori, and not via regional sporting bodies.
    
    – Ensuring sporting codes with high Maori participation have Maori governing boards, and allowing them to compete at world events as “Aotearoa Maori”
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:44am
    - RoboRob
      
      Is there any part of society Maori dont want to segregate?
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:03am
      - Keith White
        
        Bank accounts. They want your bank accounts to be treated like their bank accounts with full and free movement of funds (one-way of course, only from yours to theirs), and the Govt being the enforcer for the transfers.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:11pm
  - graham
    
    Interestingly, the Maori Party website seems to have quietly dropped one of their, err, more contentious claims. As recently as September last year, their “Maori Sports” page proudly stated that:
    
    There is much to be taught and learnt from the navigators of our past and how we can use that mātauranga to sail and paddle our way into a future frame by Whānau Pakari. It is a known fact that Māori genetic makeup is stronger than others. When there is commitment, dedication, and great support around Māori to achieve a high standard in sport, it is guaranteed that Māori will thrive.
    
    I remember this being discussed on Kiwiblog last year, when David Seymour drew attention to it.
    
    https://www.act.org.nz/press-releases/racial-discrimination-by-te-pati-maori-must-stop
    
    https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2022/09/general_debate_29_september_2022.html#comment-3250100
    
    But now, when I check their website, that sentence in bold has disappeared. How strange …
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:36pm
    - Keith White
      
      Probably because the concept of makeup is a Colonial construct. Real natives do not apply makeup superficially; they change their appearance via “broad toothed combs of varying widths called uhi, dipped in dark pigment, and struck into the skin with small mallets known as tā. The teeth of the comb pierce the skin and deposit the pigment.” So saith Te Papa.
      
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      February 10, 2023 4:03pm
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Yeah Graham, I miss that lunacy too
      
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      February 10, 2023 8:18pm
  - rangitoto
    
    All humans were doing those things more than 100,000 years ago.
    
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    February 10, 2023 1:06pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  RW seems to be relying on very thick people to support him. Hasn’t got a leg to stand on.
  
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  February 10, 2023 7:00pm
Ohm my

Vote Labour = Get Apartheid! Let’s do this.
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February 10, 2023 9:13am
Maggie Pie

WATCH

ACT leader David Seymour casts doubt on claims by Rawiri Waititi…. ‘that Maori had already established Specsavers stores well before colonisation’.

https://twitter.com/dbseymour/status/1623566227544371201
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February 10, 2023 9:19am
I remember when

Dublin Live News: Record numbers of asylum seekers in 2022, alongside 70,000 Ukrainian refugees:
13,319 people from around the world applied for asylum in Ireland last year, according to data released by the Dept of Justice.
Separately, almost 70,000 Ukrainian refugees were granted protection in Ireland last year.
The numbers have put a huge amount of pressure on accommodation services, according to Roderic O’Gorman the Minister for Integration.
A blogger (on The Conservative Woman site) states, “Currently all across the Republic of Ireland there have been mass protests over mass immigration.”
They call it a most salient news story which the Main stream media in the UK isn’t touching.
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February 10, 2023 9:24am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Ireland is actually free of the UK yoke, you know.
  
  But, mass influx of immigrants swamps resources that are no longer available for indigent locals is not exactly a man-bites-dog story.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:21pm
Swifty

Treat yourself today.

Herb Alpert – This guys in love

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppYnbbu1OmA

Anyone who had a heart – Dionne Warwick

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtREAqXZEjE

Anyone who had a heart – Cilla Black

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUxn6JLwdDY

The look of love – Dusty Springfield

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tf1d65OHYXo

I say a little prayer – Dionne

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kafVkPxjLYg

Walk on by – Dionne

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9M744rDd40

Do you know the way to San Jose – Dionne

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnzTgUc5ycc

Thanks for everything Burt.
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February 10, 2023 9:31am
- mogg
  
  Add some jazz and blues classics and you have got the playlist for UK Boom radio, accessible on internet no ads.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:28am
I remember when

Desley the deputy steps into the breach: Newsroom:
No ‘ulterior motive’ behind this story???
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February 10, 2023 9:31am
- Don Beckett
  
  What story ???
  
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  February 10, 2023 11:33am
DimChappie

14 months jail for stealing woman’s underwear off the clothes line!
I recall many violent offenders getting much lower sentences. Maybe Mr Woods did not have a cultural report.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/man-who-stole-womens-undies-off-ngongotaha-clothes-line-sent-to-jail/O3XY3FNYG5ARFKLMQ33GHMTJJA/
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February 10, 2023 9:41am
- Swifty
  
  The phantom panty nicker.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:37am
  - kowtow
    
    Knicker nicker nicked .
    
    Snigger.
    
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    February 10, 2023 1:09pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Had to larf when the judge asked him why he stole the panties…Woods replied “because I wanted to wear them”
  
  Reminded me of the guy who approached me in a Parnell pub and said “he’d like to get into my knickers”
  When I asked him why, he replied… “Because I’ve just sh*t mine”
  
  LOL!!
  
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  February 10, 2023 11:53am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Woods, eh.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:22pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Poor old Joe. Do as I say, not as I do.
“The whole narrative of Joe Biden calling it irresponsible to have classified documents in one’s possession had gone completely out the window.”
https://gopnewsfeed.com/new-evidence-found-biden-camp-scrambling-2/

No wonder Trump is 6 points ahead of him.
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February 10, 2023 9:43am
nathie

Whoops when former PM Ardern resigned I should have looked at Nathan King’s social media (Mike King’s son), which I did last night and oh boy look at the smile on his face!

https://www.facebook.com/derty.sesh/videos/jacinda-ardern-resigns/1197303070884229/

Nathan aka Sesh even penned a farewell song!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9V8Sdcd9MGQ

Expect to hear it on The Rock, Hauraki, Edge, ZM etc anyday now ….. oh wait!//
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February 10, 2023 9:48am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Good stuff by Nathan. Mrs Pfizer LOL!!
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLWpB7r-nNg
  
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  February 10, 2023 12:07pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

From Stop Co-Governance comments yesterday:
Carl Kent on February 9, 2023 at 11:01 am
I had the ” Thoughts of Chairman Spoonley”, and other racially biased academics, rammed down my throat at Teacher Training College and Otago Uni over 30 years ago. We students were constantly bombarded with divisive propaganda on a daily basis.

I was not viewed kindly by some of the lecturers as I often challenged dishonest/ inaccurate information. I was a mature student with wide experience and a keen interest in history. Therefore, I was well aware of some of the fairy stories which were being presented as fact.

Unfortunately, many of the students were impressionable and naive. All too often they swallowed all this crap and then went on to relay this crap to the next generation. I argued with a Professor that we were being softened up for a form of Apartheid. He strongly disagreed saying it was all about ” Equity” ?????

It’s been a long time brewing but here it is looming large.
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February 10, 2023 10:17am
Maggie Pie

THE EYES ARE THE WINDOWS TO THE SOUL

Meet Steph Copus Campbell….

Australia’s new ‘Ambassador-for-Gender-Equality’

https://twitter.com/AusAmbGender/status/1623126565558321158

(full screen/sound up)
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February 10, 2023 10:20am
- Ghost
  
  Why does that video remind me of a zombie
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:23am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The eyes, the eyes man.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:14pm
- Keith White
  
  Dayum. Looks like HR from ‘The Shining’ hotel.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:38am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Actually reminded me of Regan in the Exorcist 🙁
    
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    February 10, 2023 11:16am
ecco

Does anyone else think these warnings about a catastrophic cyclone about to hit Auckland are a bit of an overkill, and it’s more likely to be a bit of heavy rain and winds like on a normal windy day in Wellington.

All this talk of going out and buying up large may be a little overdone, don’t you think. Maybe it’s just Hipkins and Robertson trying to move the dial a bit on retail spending in a desperate effort to try and avert the inevitable recession that is about to hit NZ harder than any cyclone.

Either that or it’s just an arse covering exercise to make up for the metservice screwing up on not predicting those Auckland floods a couple of weeks ago.
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February 10, 2023 10:31am
- Ghost
  
  Better to have the worst case scenario and be prepared.
  
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  February 10, 2023 10:33am
  - Keith White
    
    …The NZ Police will not allow firearms to be used by civilians for self-defence…
    
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    February 10, 2023 10:39am
    - Sparrow
      
      Do you think they would allow AK47?
      Trival Pursuits question for KB’s
      What country has AK47 on its flag ?
      Beware correct answer shows left wing tendencies and/or likes Bob Dylan.
      
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      February 10, 2023 11:17am
      - Keith White
        
        I thought it was Angola from memory, but Fuhrer Googul tells me it’s Mozambique.
        
        I forget who originally said it, but I remember years ago being told that the AK-47 was so popular with communists across the globe because “it’s the most efficient way to kill unarmed people without training, skill, expense, effort or maintenance.”
        
        Probably why Bushmaster once produced a Bushmaster AK-47.
        
        One of New Zealand’s patched gangs has long been armed with Bushmasters.
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:17pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        I won’t say then 🙂
        
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        February 10, 2023 12:19pm
      - kowtow
        
        KW
        
        Yes Mozambique.
        Robert Fisk in his book The Great War for Civilisation talks of his meeting Mr K who was very happy that the minister of defence for Mozambique having presented him a banner of the country featuring said firearm also told him that ‘when all the liberation soldiers went home to their villages they named their sons ‘Kalish’. ”
        
        Old Mikhail was very proud and honoured by this.
        
        btw Hizballah also feature said firearm on their banner.
        
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        February 10, 2023 1:20pm
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    Agree but compare
    https://www.metservice.com/warnings/tropical-cyclone-activity
    to
    http://www.bom.gov.au/australia/meteye/
    
    Suspect that after the premature “Cyclone Hale” track? Met published they are being a little more careful/circumspect this time and waiting until TCWC Wellington takes over from Queensland 🙂
    
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    February 10, 2023 1:00pm
- NothingLeft
  
  It will weaken as it gets closer to NZ, but still be a decent storm, and likely to be >200mm rain for Auckland and Northland.
  
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  February 10, 2023 12:07pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    100 t0 150, 100 to 200, 50 to 250.
    What the hell is this? A sweepstake?
    All bullshitters. It is going to rain and blow, deal with it!
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:22pm
- Paulus
  
  No, the Auckland floods and the storm were Mayor Brown’s fault.
  
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  February 10, 2023 1:50pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.

https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/maori-at-ground-level-are-the-real-victims-of-media-propaganda/

The truth is, these Maori writers, these radicals, are the ones CAUSING division, hate, separatism, and apartheid.
https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/Maori-propaganda.pdf

Just read it carefully and slowly, and look what the writer is doing.
We on the other hand, in reality, we are fighting to preserve unity, harmony, democracy, and a future for our children and grandchildren.
We are fighting FOR Maori.
For if tribal rule sets in in New Zealand, the entire country, all 160 cultures who live here, including the vast majority of Maori, are going to be far far worse off that we are now. This is the truth of the matter. The only people to prosper from all this are the tribal leaders of the dominant tribe.
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February 10, 2023 10:42am
Maggie Pie

Listening to callers into ZB’s Kerry Woodham giving their views on Chis Luxon.
It was about 50/50 I recon ??

Prue (my doubles-partner) probably summed him up best when she said….”Luxo comes across as a really intelligent guy, but not the sort I’d want to sleep with”

Just saying.
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February 10, 2023 11:08am
- Jack5
  
  Is Woodham, like the rest on subsidised radio, subtly, or unsubtly, undermining National-ACT?
  
  With Labour conning people it’s moved to the centre, the emergency call’s gone out to its media conglomerate of State TV, State radio, and subsidised newspapers, radio, and web sites: “Nail Luxon!”
  
  It’s the sort of sabotage they fostered against Bridges and against those between him and Luxon.
  
  However, no way can Chipkins Media Corp hypnotise enough voters by October.
  
  It’s Stuff, Hooton, Wilson, and the like v. Abraham Lincoln, who famously said:
  
  ““You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”
  
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  February 10, 2023 11:32am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    No, she has actually turned on Labour, she used to praise Ardern, but completely turned on her, and has not picked up the Chipky mantel.
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:28pm
    - Paulus
      
      Who is Ardern – ?
      Where is she – ?
      
      4 0
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      February 10, 2023 1:51pm
      - Nickc2
        
        Who cares?
        
        9 0
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        February 10, 2023 2:07pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Did you say you don’t have to sleep with him, just use his intelligence? He loves his wife dhe is safe 😃👍🏻
  
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  February 10, 2023 12:25pm
- Surely Knott
  
  Does Prue want to sleep with Chris Hipkins though?
  
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  February 10, 2023 12:53pm
  - Ghost
    
    I thought Prue was Chris Hipkins
    
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    February 10, 2023 12:56pm
Yvette

How much more could Labour be wrong in what they say about Luxon, than Labour is wrong in their judgement of the appeal of their own policies to voters before the upcoming Election, that they are trying to say they won’t implement them now and are pushing them out of sight and mind until after the Election?

“Schrödinger’s Cat” theory states that if you place a cat and something that can kill the cat in a box and sealed it, you would not know if the cat was dead or alive until you opened the box, so that until the box was opened, the cat was (in a sense) both “dead and alive” at the same time.

But be assured, that with “Labour’s Schrödinger’s Cat”, while Hipkins says “co-governance” and other policies are dead cats in a carton, they will all be alive and well and ready to go, when you open the box after the Election, if you are silly enough to vote for Labour.
(And Labour will just remain wrong in what they say about Luxon)
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February 10, 2023 11:16am
- greybeard
  
  Schrödinger’s cat must be getting really pissed-off with being put into stupid boxes just so his loony owner gets a bit of PR.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:07pm
Opie

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/02/covid-19-pfizer-vaccine-should-be-considered-for-all-children-aged-under-5-epidemiologist-says.html

So a group that is affected the least by covid 19 should take something that doesn’t prevent infect or transmission to prevent transmission just incase.

Just fuck off.
17 1
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February 10, 2023 11:44am
- Keith White
  
  Yes. Not just a lack of ethics, but a total lack of morals displayed by “trust us, we know what we’re doing”.
  
  7 1
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  February 10, 2023 12:18pm
Maggie Pie

Hamilton Ambos have been told to wear stab-proof vests today ahead of the scheduled 3pm ‘gang scrap’ at the bus station.

God spare me!
12 1
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February 10, 2023 12:00pm
- Keith White
  
  Hope somebody has a stack of donor cards ready.
  
  6 0
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  February 10, 2023 12:18pm
- NothingLeft
  
  I’m tired of paying for these parasites, they contribute nothing, are a never ending drain on NZ, destroying lives of individuals and communities who get in their way. Gang members are recidivist criminals to the core – they have taken up arms against the rest of society and should be permanently removed from NZ.
  
  Give all gang members and associates with criminal records an ultimatum: stop now or next time you break the law you will be permanently banished from NZ. Banished will need to find another country willing to take them or be dumped on Raoul Island to fend for themselves.
  
  Lets see how well the wolves do without any sheep to feed on.
  
  8 0
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  February 10, 2023 2:38pm
- MCōs
  
  What ‘gang scrap’ was that?
  I haven’t heard of anything untoward.
  
  2 0
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  February 10, 2023 4:39pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    SHEESH Cossie… you wont hear anything about it in the ‘Pattaya Mail’ !!
    
    https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1623825566297096194
    
    3 1
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    February 10, 2023 5:27pm
    - MCōs
      
      So, what happened?
      Was there a gang scrap, or was it all just a beat up, so to speak?
      
      2 0
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      February 10, 2023 7:27pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Syria. One thing I notice about buildings in the Middle East and surroundings, either it is earthquakes or bombs.
Look at the rubble. What little steel reinforcing (Rebar) they have is just wires.
8 0
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February 10, 2023 12:12pm
- fightingtemeraire
  
  No Building Codes or Inspectors. Go to Greece and see the buildings there!!!
  
  6 0
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  February 10, 2023 2:39pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Buildings were built quick and dirty with payoffs to govt to get them certified even though they avoided meeting structural standards. This was well known in Turkey – and even okayed by govt. Turkish people could have demanded and voted for better, they didn’t, so to a large degree the population there are the authors of this nightmare. Perhaps a side-effect of Islamic fatalism? (“Allahs will” determines all outcomes so why bother avoiding danger)
  
  And Turkey has a long history of terrible deadly earthquakes, at least 3 in last 100 years that have killed 10’s of thousands. Not like they didn’t have warning.
  
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  February 10, 2023 8:08pm
Surely Knott

Why don’t NZ have MP’s like Rep Luna that bring fire for free speech.

Meanwhile in NZ this is still silenced by Media and no mp’s mention it. Was the NZ govt or it’s departments or NGO’s doing the same? Did we have links direct with Twitter or other media suggesting who to remove or what was disinformation.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1623424584501305352
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February 10, 2023 12:17pm
Maggie Pie

Thort I’d share this with the group B4 the wet weekend.
Hot-X-Buns from NW are this years winners!
Full of fruit & spice with a luvly soft dark texture. At $5.99 for a 6pack they’re a steal.

I don’t even bother toasting them anymore.
Just pull them apart between thumb & forefinger, put in microwave for 20sec.
Allow to cool a wee bit then spread heaps of soft butter inside, along with Anathoth Raspberry Jam and a big spoonful of whipped cream.

Eat for breakfast or dessert O.M.G.
7 1
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February 10, 2023 12:55pm
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Hot X Buns from Bella Pane in Putaruru are the BEST. Out of Hot X Bun season they don’t do the X’s and sell them as Spiced Buns.
  
  4 0
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  February 10, 2023 2:38pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    WOW thx for the heads up on that!
    Will try and get down there over the weekend…weather permitting.
    
    (not that ‘gluten-free’ shite are they?)
    
    3 1
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    February 10, 2023 2:45pm
    - Mike
      
      Will you be giving up hot cross buns for Lent?
      
      3 5
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      February 10, 2023 3:08pm
- mogg
  
  ‘I can resist anything except for temptation’
  
  3 0
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  February 10, 2023 3:51pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

From my FB.
Approximately 40 years ago Tom Jones wrote a song called “She’s a Lady” despite the fact that he is not a biologist.
10 1
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February 10, 2023 1:18pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  But as he became a daddy at the age of 16, he probably didn’t suffer from sexual/gender confusion.
  
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  February 10, 2023 7:26pm
Jack5

Labour’s abandoned merger of TVNZ and Radio NZ would have received $200 million a year in State subsidies.

That’s stated in an article at the RNZ web site by Peter Thompson, a lecturer in media studies at Victoria University and a board member of the activist group Better Public Media Trust.

Advocates for the State media merger don’t seem to have given up.

Thompson suggests using RNZ/NZ On Air funding to establish a “public service publisher”.

Thompson says the TVNZ-RNZ merger was intended to provide a framework for development of “multi-platform public media services capable of addressing the needs of a wide range of audiences”.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/on-the-inside/483974/let-them-watch-netflix-what-can-be-salvaged-from-the-wreckage-of-the-failed-tvnz-rnz-merger
4 0
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February 10, 2023 2:42pm
DimChappie

Police 10-7 cancelled with weak excuse. (Real reason: portraying the real profile of NZ crime):

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/484029/tvnz-to-cancel-controversial-crime-show-ten-7
6 0
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February 10, 2023 2:54pm
- Bobba Fret
  
  So if Police Ten 7 is cancelled, Labour MP’s will probably think there is less crime now.
  
  5 0
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  February 10, 2023 3:57pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

She’s headed our way guys!!

Baton down the hatches…..

https://twitter.com/abcnews/status/1623861314505543681
4 1
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February 10, 2023 2:57pm
krazykiwi

RNZ Headline: “Epidemiologist Michael Baker to head new public health communication project”

His preferred style of communication seems to involve claims unsupported by evidence, lies, obfuscations, and waving his hands about.

Public health will not be advanced by his involvement. Quite the opposite.

Also, Baker is not and epidemiologist. He has a Bachelor of Medicine, a diploma in Public Health, and a diploma in Obstetrics.
8 1
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February 10, 2023 3:13pm
- mandk
  
  Don’t they know he passed his sell-by date about the same time as Ardern?
  
  3 0
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  February 10, 2023 4:29pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  I’ll bet the traditional servo pie that Mr Baker will not be investing a single dime of his own in his new enterprise.
  
  3 0
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  February 10, 2023 8:30pm
Maggie Pie

And here’s something else….Netflix can go and get fcuked!
Prue just txt to say I can no longer use her password.

A-HOLES.
6 2
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February 10, 2023 3:25pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  What was that password? Asking for a friend.
  
  4 0
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  February 10, 2023 4:53pm
  - Ghost
    
    *getyourownaccountyoucheapbugger123*
    
    5 0
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    February 10, 2023 5:06pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      That is yours Ghost. I wanted Maggie’s friends password. LOL
      
      3 2
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      February 10, 2023 6:03pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, with Spark I pay $6 a month for Premium Netflix and was before paying $25. I have nominated family who share the downloads.
  
  3 0
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  February 10, 2023 5:05pm
cmm

Cops: ““Public safety is our top priority.”

Absolute bullshit.

If it was their top priority they’d do many things differently including being a bit more keen on nailing criminals.

They’d also take a few more steps securing prisoners.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/300804485/prisoners-on-the-run-after-escaping-from-van-on-aucklands-southern-motorway
7 1
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February 10, 2023 5:33pm
- Ghost
  
  It’s not the police’s job to transfer prisoners. So better steps for securing them should be taken by corrections and the security company transporting them.
  
  3 0
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  February 10, 2023 5:36pm
- greybeard
  
  When I read this my first reaction was: “I bet that one or more of the corrections staff in charge of this vehicle was related to one or more of the prisoners”.
  And the whole thing was a scam.
  
  3 0
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  February 10, 2023 8:04pm
  - Ghost
    
    It was First Security doing the transfer.
    
    1 0
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    February 10, 2023 8:08pm
info@cruzpro.com

“Urgent investigation: 1000 faulty Wellington lamps that can fall and kill”.

I’m going to guess that the issue is electrolysis. The metal used to support the lamps is different from the metal in the lamps or the screws/bolts that hold them in place.

The electric current generated by this electrolysis slowly dissolves the less noble metal and failure results.

If true, then the person responsible for ordering the lamps was not trained in this phenomenon and is responsible as is whoever hired them to do this job.
10 0
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February 10, 2023 6:22pm

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