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December 22, 2022 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 22 December 2022

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General Debate

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Yvette

Democracy down the road?

• In the 2017 Election 186,707 people gave Winston Peters their votes so that, knowing the official result of the Election and after negotiations and secret deals, he – one man, and reportedly a few others – could decide what to do with all those 186,707 votes, regardless of the voters aspirations –
and we all saw what happened

• Now Willie Jackson has had 72 hui with ‘targeted’ Maori Elite and Willie – one man, and reportedly a few others – will take at least three times as long as the 72 hui consultation [1], to knock their response into shape to be acceptable for the Labour Cabinet to rehash, if a Labour Cabinet exists by then. regardless of the Maori Elite aspirations –
and we may all see what happens … eventually … perhaps

Both processes re apparently quite legal, if not moral
bur neither really seems to be democracy … any more

___________________
[1] Co-governance plan kicked down the road to 2024
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/pro/co-governance-plan-kicked-down-the-road-to-2024?
subscription access (not that I can afford one)
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December 22, 2022 8:01am
- oldfella
  
  Yvette: I’ve like to know how many millions of taxpayer dollars Willie and co spent on these 72 hui.
  If we had any real journos left one of them might dig around and find out.
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:03am
Opie

The quality of the New Zealand education system on full display in an article on newshub… saw this howler today.

“A mild butter chicken is our most popular dish, and we make it with Kiwi pallets in mind…”

Do you mean palate? Or are you supposed to put your curry on a small wooden platform now, instead of eating it?

You are a so called journalist. At least write properly!

I guess if you are happy enough to butcher the English language by jamming Maori words into it mid sentence you probably don’t care about the standard of your writing.

People just don’t care anymore. Pride in your work appears to be a thing of the past.
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December 22, 2022 8:03am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Yes and apart from the spelling, the sentiment makes me cringe. The inference that every “Kiwi” has similar food preferences.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:09am
  - Deane Jessep
    
    Totally agree Benedict, not a fan of Butter Chicken. At least my favourite takeaway dish is actually a real kiwi dish! The venerable sweet and sour pork from the old Edmonds Cook Book (or any local Chinese takeaway). Many people will say it’s not kiwi either but it passes my basic test. 1st generation Cantonese immigrants used to make it and sell it to gold miners in Otago around the time Parliament was first moved to Wellington. To me, this makes Sweet and Sour Pork as kiwi as the lamb roast. And if one was to actually survey takeaway stores around the country, I bet it’s alot more eaten than Butter Chicken!
    
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    December 22, 2022 12:45pm
- Cassandra
  
  To be fair to the journalist (why ffs?) it was probably autocorrect and no proof reading. But you’re right, education as we knew it has changed. Illiteracy is the new UE.
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:08am
  - RalphT
    
    True, autocorrect is responsible for a lot of howlers, but in the good old days people used to proof their work to stop things like this getting through. Of course if they don’t know how to spell then no amount of proofreading will help.
    
    And in the very old days there were things called subeditors but sadly they became extinct.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:35am
    - Lexicon
      
      Not extinct, just sidelined.
      
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      December 22, 2022 2:19pm
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Butter Chicken from most curry shops is ghastly sweet slop. Even my daughters, who initially loved it, have taken to making it themselves for our dinner, and now won’t eat the curry shop version.
  I have to say, the typical Indian curry shop curry in NZ is nothing like those that you get in India.
  
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  December 22, 2022 2:07pm
- TS Child
  
  Maybe they meant pullets 😀
  
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  December 22, 2022 3:46pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Is it Over and out for our Mainstream Media journalists?

The inescapable fact, however, is that if you want to be well informed on many matters of importance to politics and policy in New Zealand you won’t get the full picture from the mainstream media. You’ll need to read, watch and listen to alternative media sites as well.

https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/graham-adams
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December 22, 2022 8:04am
- Blog-aholic
  
  The sad part of this is that the so called journalists have not clue that they and their editors are the creators of their own extinction.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:11am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Not sad. Great!
    
    May they journey through the S bend gracefully.
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:16pm
- RockyJ
  
  I reckon that a couple of months out from the election, as the prospect of Labour losing becomes more certain, that the media will finally come out strongly against cogovernance.
  
  The Public Interest Journalism Fund (PIJF) bribes have been contingent on the msm supporting the treaty as a partnership and are refundable to the government if this position is recanted. As the Labour loss looms it will look increasingly unlikely that any government would enforce this.
  
  I would love to see this happen. Even better if a court case was to take place over breach of the terms of the PIJF.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:15am
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    There’s a certain irony in the fact that while a breach of PIJF terms would be of current government’s terms the payment would be to a likely right leaning coalition government – damages/compensation or karma? Why wouldn’t such a government enforce it given it would likely make supporters very happy..
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:37am
    - alloytoo
      
      I think they should, at least give them something to moan about.
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:40am
    - leoj
      
      What makes you think that National is right-leaning?
      Luxon’s most admired politician is Barack Obama!
      Luxon virtue signalled that he was learning te reo.
      Luxon and National went back on their promise to make the tax brackets fairer. They want the rich to pay more. Some National party! Hypocrites.
      
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      December 22, 2022 1:39pm
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        Vote Act.
        
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        December 22, 2022 2:57pm
      - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
        
        Yes leoj. This will be the first time I will be voting ACT. Once Mr Luxon ditched the 39% envy tax removal policy, he and National lost my vote and my sphere of influence, at least another 10 votes. They don’t deserve my vote for sure. National is keeping the 39% tax policy purely because they are scared of Right Honourable Grant Robertson’s attack during election campaign. Gutless.
        
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        December 22, 2022 3:46pm
  - cmm
    
    Nope. People like this never admit to being wrong.
    
    Either:
    * They will blame disinformation.
    * They will blame the audience for failing to understand properly.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:29am
    - crikey
      
      You mean, cmm, like they have for the last 5 years?
      
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      December 22, 2022 11:32am
  - Paulus
    
    Do you mean the paid for Public Propaganda Interest Journalism Fund ?
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:42am
  - rouppe
    
    MSM only need to criticize government policy to trigger refund.
    
    If national were smart, they’d say nothing about the pijf, wait for the inevitable piling on from Vance, and other lefty publications, trigger the clause, and then close the pijf.
    
    That way the govt would get the money back
    
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    December 22, 2022 12:51pm
- Stellaboxer
  
  I think that when people need to get their domestic news from foreign news outlets the local media needs to take a serious look at itself. The censorship by omission that our media is indulging in is untenable now. We desperately need an overhaul. What I find fascinating is that the highest ratings go to Hoskin and Heather du Plessis-Allen both fair critics of the regime but that doesn’t seem to register with the news editors of the dwindling outlets of basically all the rest.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:23am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Not only will you not get the “full picture”, in most cases you will get a picture distorted beyond anything resembling the reality of the situation. It will be a manufactured picture that is solely designed to support the narrative of whoever is paying them. Over the last few years this has been Ardern and her ~~communications~~propaganda team.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:27am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    [Mod – no need for that ]
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:38am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Read whatever you want Brian, I don’t really care.
      The MacCleod’s were Highlanders, not that it has any relevance to the real world today, why you keep referencing it is bizarre. Did your ancient rellies win a battle or something and you can’t let it go? Tragic.
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:10am
      - cmm
        
        Brian is one of those “stolen valour” people. He’s forever swelling his chest with Kiwi Pride for accomplishments made on the battlefield etc.
        
        But why should he be entitled to any of this pride? He has not contributed to it. He has not earned it.
        
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        December 22, 2022 10:33am
      - Jack5
        
        Are you guys having some sort of row over the massacre of the McDonalds at Glencoe?
        
        The massacre was led by a Campbell, and the McLeods were mainly from the Isle of Skye, weren’t they?
        
        If this is the topic of the exchange, you guys may or may not know of a Glencoe massacre memorial in Southland. It’s at Glencoe, which is on the Hedgehope-Mataura road.
        
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        December 22, 2022 10:37am
      - john1234
        
        It’s the Battle of Coire Na Creiche all over again!
        
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        December 22, 2022 10:52am
      - rangitoto
        
        Almost sassenachs to us Shetlanders.
        
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        December 22, 2022 11:01am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        https://www.reverbnation.com/couthyfernenst/song/18985151-the-war-of-the-one-eyed-woman
        
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        December 22, 2022 11:24am
      - Jack5
        
        Hell, Coire Na Creiche was worse than Glencoe.
        
        No wonder the English ruled: too much internal fighting in Scotland.
        
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        December 22, 2022 1:35pm
- hullkiwi
  
  A perfect example of this is DPF’s post yesterday of the ANZ Confidence Survey? How widely was the ANZ survey reported and discussed in the MSM?
  
  Exactly, point made!
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:30am
  - kowtow
    
    It was in interest.co.nz and the comments were very illuminating.
    
    I suppose that’s the point , you have to find the “news” in places other than in what passes for the news.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:06am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      There seem to be a hell of a lot of jet-setting socialists infesting the interest.co.nz comments!
      
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      December 22, 2022 8:19pm
  - pdm
    
    Circulated among ANZ Business customers I think.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:23am
    - hullkiwi
      
      ANZ customers are not the MSM!
      
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      December 22, 2022 10:25am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  “You’ll need to read, watch and listen to alternative media sites as well.” Nothing like a bit of patronising Maggie. I prefer to read what I want and make of it what I want. The reason I didn’t readily “gulp” the fish of the day as others did here in believing that “Harry’s lot” had interviewed the PM for a show. Classic.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:36am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    I bet you believe her lies she didn’t know as usual? No way a producer in the US puts their livelihood at risk and millions of dollars in costs to deceive the worst pm in history
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:43am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Brian believes everything Brenda says. She told him, she’s the single source of truth, so it must be true!
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:14am
    - rouppe
      
      You know she’s lying when the answer starts with an incredibly high pitched “Oh that was…” followed by a diversionary statement about something else
      
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      December 22, 2022 12:56pm
  - Simon
    
    Yeah but many of the cattle thought the jaxx actually worked and Cindy had saved the economy. Because they didnt think and were assigned their opinions by MSM. Many sad cases.
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:56am
    - LB
      
      Just a case of not thinking? Didn’t have anything to do with losing their bloody jobs if they didn’t get the vax??
      
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      December 22, 2022 10:26am
      - Don Beckett
        
        The other day my son & daughter-in-law got Covid from a birthday they went to in Auckland on the weekend. My son is showing no symptoms, but my D-i-L was fairly ill – so I took them around some Ivermectin on Tuesday. Just checked with my D-i-L and she tells me she is now fine – still a slight cough, but otherwise well – son is taking the ivermectin and is still assymptomatic.
        Oh – and they were both jabbed – they had to to go to Melbourne a while back, and the D-i-L has had one booster because she works at Mt.Maunagnui College.
        Ivermectin 1 – Jabs & booster nil. 😆
        
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        December 22, 2022 10:44am
      - NothingLeft
        
        Anecdata. After 2.5 years and 100+ trials ivermectin, as an antiviral against covid, only works if taken very early or even before infection to slow replication and reduce the peak of the viral load. By the time you are sick the viral load has already maxed out and it has little benefit (as confirmed in numerous trials)
        
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        December 22, 2022 4:46pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        Not according to the work of Dr. Peter McCullough in Texas back in 2020 before the “vax” happened.
        
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        December 22, 2022 5:12pm
  - Mike H S
    
    Brian, if you only read what you want to, you will continue to reinforce your own beliefs, which may or may not be right but you will never know.
    
    I don’t agree with Carbon zero and all the hype around Climate Change but I do read the opposite view so that I am fully informed.
    
    I suggest you open your mind and broaden your beliefs. (But I doubt you will even read this response which proves my point.)
    
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    December 22, 2022 1:36pm
- Thought Criminal
  
  The New Zealand media have failed the people of New Zealand.
  
  It’s sad, but a low paid profession has only attracted average minds with clear political bias who seek to force their far left views on everyone else.
  
  I’d say if you want the full picture, you should avoid MSM.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:42am
  - Paulus
    
    Look where most of the so called media – young women now, were educated to what low common level – now the norm and intergenerational.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:46am
  - kowtow
    
    They have failed the people of NZ , but have done their paymaster , the Ardern regime , proud ( with our money).
    
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    December 22, 2022 12:28pm
  - Jack5
    
    Poster “Thought Criminal’s” …. a low paid profession …
    
    Some might say the drive to change journalism from a trade to a profession has caused decline.
    
    A drive for status, like the move of accountant training to universities.
    
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    December 22, 2022 2:45pm
  - bco90
    
    Is Michael Morrah still exposing things?
    
    I’m overseas, so I can’t see Newshub, but he was doing great investigative work during Covid.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:13pm
- Scott
  
  Thanks Maggy, for linking to that excellent article by Graham Adams. The only thing I would disagree with Graham a little bit on is the mainstream media’s stance on race. It is true they are afraid of being called racist. But they also ideologically agree with the basic premises of this labour government i.e. the Treaty of Waitangi is a partnership, Maori people are oppressed by racism and if Maori people lag behind in any category, such as health, that is prima facie evidence of racism.
  
  The other aspect that Graham Adams doesn’t touch on is the $55 million paid to media organisations to report on certain issues such as the Treaty of Waitangi. We now know that if they report against the government line on issues such as race then the government can demand the money back. So the government has both an ideological and a fiscal hold on the media on issues such as race relations.
  
  It has amazed me that Jacinda has been able to gain such a hold on the media. So much so that she can do pretty much whatever she wants and will hardly ever be called out for it. Even though her government is headed for defeat at the next election, she is putting in hugely ideological legislation that will be very hard to unravel.
  
  I actually think she is winning. The People’s Socialist Republic of Aotearoa is becoming more and more a reality every day.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:47am
  - Swifty
    
    “The other aspect that Graham Adams doesn’t touch on is the $55 million paid to media organisations to report on certain issues such as the Treaty of Waitangi. We now know that if they report against the government line on issues such as race then the government can demand the money back. So the government has both an ideological and a fiscal hold on the media on issues such as race relations.”
    
    That alone should see this Labour government thrown out on to the street and their ringleaders jailed for corrupt practices.
    
    The stench of corruption just positively reeks from the NZ Labour Party.
    
    I must add too that I think a little less of some of my fellow citizens over this issue – those that think that using taxpayer money for paying/punishing news media companies for promoting/not promoting Labour policies is a perfectly valid and above board government approach.
    
    How utterly shameful.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:16am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Scott – “It has amazed me that Jacinda has been able to gain such a hold on the media.”
    
    It’s amazing what a couple of hundred million dollars will buy you. The 55 million was only part of the bribe, the amount of money spent advertising the covid stupidity will be substantial, and it is the unstated bribe that is rarely talked about.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:17am
    - kevn
      
      @Clan… Unstated bribe or is it really a threat?
      The PIJF monies can actually be claimed back from recipients, if the narrative isn’t followed. It’s in the contract.
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:59am
  - Nickc2
    
    The People’s Socialist Republic of Aotearoa is becoming more and more a reality every day.
    If you had said that say six or seven months ago, I would have very much agreed with you. Today, however, watching the polls, I’m far from convinced.
    The bi-election in Hamilton West was a good indicator as to how far and how fast the public’s opinion of this Govt has changed.
    Let’s face it, Labour’s lies, failure to deliver, and pandering to Maori demands have become their downfall.
    FWIW, long may it continue to be so eh?
    
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    December 22, 2022 11:00am
artemisia

Eugenie Sage retiring next election, Stuff yesterday.

Sage … made her decision some time ago, well before the furore over the entrenchment clause in the Three Waters reform bill.

Well she would say that, wouldn’t she.
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December 22, 2022 8:06am
- Paulus
  
  She has said before that she would probably be more active as she was with say Forest and Bird than she would be in Parliament.
  Assume that is where she will turn up again as an unencumbered Activist.,
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:49am
  - Drone
    
    Rebuilding huts in the Ureweras. Yeah right..
    
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    December 22, 2022 3:12pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Eugenie Sage retiring – a nation mourns
  
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  December 22, 2022 4:27pm
Red Rooster

Eugenia Sage is retiring at the next election. A great Xmas present. What started as bird activism became an all out attack on agriculture and the economy without respect fo due process through Ecan then parliament. An awful legacy topped off with the duplicitous charade with Mahuta on entrenchment a couple of weeks ago. Will not be sorely missed!
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December 22, 2022 8:09am
- JerJer
  
  Yep, now I am waiting for the disabled, 1/3 Maori, 1/3 Pacific Islander and 1/3 something else, who is not educated, not qualified, is transgender, but occasionally identifies as giraffe, who is offended about everything and everything, except is not qualified for anything, to put their name forward amoung many similar candidates in the Green Party and fight for this list seat. Sage, as useless as she was, understands what will happen next year, and obviously does not want to sit in opposition. At least she gets it. Whoever wants to move in the list just wants a meal ticket, which fortunately they will most probably not receive.
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:07am
  - rouppe
    
    Green party polling is holding up. So that person may well have their meal ticket
    
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    December 22, 2022 12:58pm
  - Overworked
    
    Please. Disabled, Maori and giraffe are so 2010’s. It will have to be a trans woman to even get a foot in the door.
    
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    December 22, 2022 4:47pm
Thought Criminal

Belgian cops seize £1.3m in cash in EU corruption scandal https://mol.im/a/11533805 via https://dailym.ai/android

When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.

P. J. O’Rourke
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December 22, 2022 8:09am
- Stellaboxer
  
  I lived in Brussels for most of the eighties and the EU gravy train was astonishing then but just about legal. Goodness knows what it’s like now
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:27am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The EU are not corrupt and never have been.//
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:34am
  - hullkiwi
    
    ….and how many EU Audit Reports remain unsigned because each report points to corruption within the EU and the programmes that EU taxpayers pay for.
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:40am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Just as bad as the UN.
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:33am
- rouppe
  
  Eva is a member of the Greek PASOK party – The Panhellenic Socialist Movement.
  
  But I’m sure she must be far-right because all the Left wing academics tell us that when used in a political party name, “socialist” doesn’t mean Socialist //
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:08am
  - Thought Criminal
    
    Just like the National Socialists?
    
    The left love their mental gymnastics when trying to control the narative.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:01am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Quite cute though. So that’s alright.
    
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    December 22, 2022 4:28pm
hullkiwi

Evidence that there is something very wrong with the NZ economy and retail sector.

NZ lamb for sale at $9.90 per kilo, Pork for sale $8.99 per kilo,

But red onions between $11.99 per kilo up to $14.99 per kilo.

There is only one statement WTF!

There is something very wrong when meat prices are at very low kilo prices, while fresh vegetable prices seem to be immune to gravity.
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December 22, 2022 8:12am
- Ghost
  
  Onion and other veggie shortages going on due to weather and labour shortages, export market for lamb and beef has shrunk as people can’t afford nz meat
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:04am
  - hullkiwi
    
    Really, that is the line trucked out by producer boards/agencies on a regular basis, but a visit to the weekly Avondale Market proves that such spin, is usually PR spun lies!
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:21am
  - Dougal10
    
    Surely not , the minister against agriculture said just last month the very high overseas prices for our meat and dairy products will allow NZ farmers to have plenty of money to pay the new fart taxes.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:54am
    - Ghost
      
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/lamb-tastic-price-of-a-kiwi-favourite-plunges-before-christmas/3MA2VZ4N2BEA7JH6E7BEEZ2RJ4/
      
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      December 22, 2022 11:11am
- Loddenthinks
  
  The peeled red onions are imported from the US, as the New Zealand crop is delayed or spoiled due to the incredibly high rainfall in the north this “summer”.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:21am
  - hullkiwi
    
    Funny how it is only red onions, and not other crops coming out of the Pukekohe market gardens currently. We’ve been here before 2 years ago it was potatoes.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:34am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      It’s the same with brown onions as red, unfortunately – more yellow-grey than brown, and mostly with mottled skins and a bit of mould you have to wipe off. Not good.
      
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      December 22, 2022 4:44pm
- Bridgenag
  
  Told not enough workers to slaughter so the beef prices are kept down.
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:20am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Most pork comes from overseas
  
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  December 22, 2022 4:29pm
- CJames
  
  According to the label in my supermarket, red onions are coming in from the USA. Maybe the crop here failed because of the very wet conditions – or they just can’t harvest them.
  
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  December 22, 2022 6:09pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  “NZ lamb for sale at $9.90 per kilo, Pork for sale $8.99 per kilo”
  
  That’s very cheap. Is it radioactive?
  
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  December 22, 2022 7:47pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  My crystal ball says brown onions are $4.49 per kilo at Pack N Save at time of writing this.
  
  Eat brown onions from PNS instead!
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:00pm
Yvette

The Treaty, abortion, and DNA –

The United States Supreme Court Ends the Constitutional Right to Abortion
… The majority concluded that the right to abortion was nothing more than a manufactured constitutional right — an abuse of the Fourteenth Amendment’s “liberty” protection …
https://www.commonwealthfund.org/blog/2022/united-states-supreme-court-ends-constitutional-right-abortion

World media concentrated on the issue of abortion and women’s rights regarding that – and not that those supposed rights were … an abuse of the Fourteenth Amendment’s “liberty” protection — and that the parameters of the Fourteenth Amendment’s protection are set by the scope of rights that existed in 1868 when the amendment was adopted.

Here in New Zealand the US Supreme Court decision saw the abortion issue again dusted off and Christopher Luxon’s religious views were obviously questioned (hit on) again, but no one questioned the validity of laws that “lacked any basis in historical fact” or was not “set by the scope of rights that existed in [1840] when the [Treaty] was adopted”.

So, consider this slight chronological anomaly (remember: 1840) –
Immigration biometrics – finger prints, facial recognition and DNA samples (of all New Zealanders, not just 501s)
DNA represents whakapapa (genealogy) information, which is taonga and engages tino rangatiratanga and the principle of active protection, under the Treaty of Waitangi. It also gives rise to rights and responsibilities according to tikanga Māori

Surely “whakapapa DNA”, “Mana o te Wai” statements (3 Waters), the Maori name for this country, and for another example “The new Māori Health Authority has a budget of half a billion dollars and CEO Riana Manuel has allocated $100 million of that to support centuries-old treatments” should all be examined in the context of the actual 1840’s Treaty, just as the right to abortion over-stepped the United States of America’s Constitution

So the point here
perhaps ‘Honour the Treaty’ – but for its 1840 reality
rather than turn it into an abortion
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December 22, 2022 8:15am
Captain Mainwaring

So the useless Eugenie Sage has pulled the pin.
I wonder if they can find anyone more incompetent to replace her.
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December 22, 2022 8:24am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  Wait with bated breath for the 20 year old Green Acolytes to stream in. Bloke by the name of Wijohn in Mt Albert is one.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:34am
  - alex Masterley
    
    He is a poor little rich boy.
    enough said.
    
    18 0
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    December 22, 2022 9:19am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Most of the climate limpets and their ilk are silly little spoiled brats!
      
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      December 22, 2022 7:49pm
- Jimbo666
  
  You betcha!
  There’s a lot more floating on top of the pond.
  
  18 0
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  December 22, 2022 8:35am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    With a bit of luck they’ll superglue themselves to Transmission Gully in the middle of rush hour.
    
    22 0
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    December 22, 2022 9:20am
    - Master Mariner
      
      Super glue ? That’s for overseas.
      Here , All they need is too put there hands in Tar on newly sealed roads that has not set as per specification.
      That’s the NZ way. //
      
      21 0
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      December 22, 2022 10:19am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The frightening part is where is she going and to do what?
  3 waters and entrenchment haunting her?
  
  24 0
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  December 22, 2022 8:38am
  - CJames
    
    Maybe she will go back to Canterbury Regional Council to finish the interrupted job of stuffing that organisation up.
    
    25 0
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    December 22, 2022 8:52am
- Matt Long
  
  Useless people are lining up to be worse and worser.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:40am
- Benedict Yu
  
  “I wonder if they can find anyone more incompetent to replace her.”
  
  Sadly the answer is “Yes” 🙂
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:44am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Thanks to 50 or so years of neo-marxist brainwashing in edumication there is an unlimited supply!
    
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    December 22, 2022 7:51pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  Given that one of the co-Leaders of the Greens couldn’t even remember if they had voted against ~~Three~~ Five Waters or abstained, I doubt they can find anyone less competent – but don’t tempt fate!
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:23am
Benedict Yu

This is a little bizarre.

Why should an employer allow its employees to charge their EVs at work, at no charge? The journalist thinks it is outrageous.

EV owners are subsidised in buying the car, and pay no road user charges. Yet they think they are entitled to “free” charging.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/130786625/petulant-fire-and-emergency-nz-is-desperately-clinging-to-power
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December 22, 2022 8:25am
- peterwn
  
  If an employee brought a very large battery pack to work and charged it up with the employer’s power to save home power bills, that would be theft of electricity under the Crimes Act and the employee could get the boot (or at least a warning and request to refund the employer for the power taken.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:32am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    If people think that is necessary then the economy is fckd.
    
    Fix the economy then people won’t be bothered with petty shit like this (on both sides).
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:06pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  It really is bizarre isn’t it? Why should the employer pay you for your electricity? Should I demand free petrol when I go to work?
  The part that made me chuckle most was the bit at the bottom that said “support Stuff’s journalism today” – that was funny.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:33am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Funny how the journalist said it is only $6 to charge an EV. Nasty nasty employer. 🙂
    
    Let’s say you have 6 employees with EVs. x 5 days per week = $180 per week in electricity costs. Say 45 weeks per year = $8,100 per year.
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:41am
    - EssenX
      
      Would Fringe Benefit Tax kick in too?
      
      26 0
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      December 22, 2022 8:53am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        yes
        
        21 0
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        December 22, 2022 9:12am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        The laws of unintended consequences, something the Greens apparently have no understanding of.
        
        18 0
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        December 22, 2022 9:22am
    - Ehlana
      
      If it’s only $6 to charge an EV, why would any one need to use their employers electricity? Surely if you can afford to buy one of these expensive vehicles, you can afford to fuel it up yourself?
      
      23 0
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      December 22, 2022 10:05am
      - Raphael
        
        because you want to be able to get back home
        
        (yes yes, I know the new EVs have fairly decent range, but some of the older ones, i.e. the one’s most people could realistically think of affording, have terrible battery life)
        
        14 0
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        December 22, 2022 10:11am
      - Paulus
        
        Was it not recently reported that an EV owner with an older vehicle was quoted $33,000 for new batteries and the car was valued at about the same price.
        When an EV is built, I understand, the whole car is lowered onto the chassis which holds the batteries.
        Presumably to replace same the reverse is necessary.
        
        6 0
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        December 22, 2022 10:55am
      - Jack5
        
        Here’s a video of an expert replacing a Prius battery in less than 15 minutes.
        
        It looks complicated.
        
        https://youtu.be/FPXY0AqHHzI
        
        2 0
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        December 22, 2022 7:46pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    ‘The part that made me chuckle most was the bit at the bottom that said “support Stuff’s journalism today” – that was funny’
    
    At Stuff, every day is 1 April, Clan
    
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    December 22, 2022 4:32pm
- hullkiwi
  
  This runs alongside the TVNZ story tell how Canterbury police have faced record levels of fraud and scams. In this article there is reference to the rising number of instances of employees stealing and defrauding their employers.
  
  What do you think charging your car with electricity paid for by your employer?
  
  Typical hypocrisy of $1stuffed, happy to spin the line about white collar fraud & theft, but when a government agency says no to employees availing themselves to what has been paid for by the employer $1Stuffed becomes a “campaigner” for those stealing.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:38am
  - cmm
    
    Of course this normalises theft.
    
    When people feel entitled to taking $6 of electricity, then what else are they helping themselves to?
    
    Then of course there will be those without EVs that feel they should be entitled to some hand out too.
    
    Need coffee at home? Take some home from work. A stapler? A laptop?…
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:41am
- Spam
  
  Fringe Benefit Tax.
  
  It would require the employer to meter how much electricity each employee is using (or at a minimum, collectively across employees).
  
  Do freight companies and couriers allow employees to put company petrol / diesel into their personal cars?
  
  No? Wow – outrageous.
  
  Do supermarkets allow staff to help themselves to food off the shelves?
  
  No – disgusting petulant behavior by those rich-prick food companies who are making $1 Million per day.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:40am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Full of their own self importance just like cyclists.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:45am
- alex Masterley
  
  Whats the difference between taking your employers petrol or your employers power? Fallon doesnt seem to get the picture.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:20am
- Loddenthinks
  
  That’s no journalist, that’s a union lick-spittle – no matter what their by-line says.
  
  Always on the grift, wanting something for nothing, and seemingly unaware of the dangers of ev batteries overheating and bursting into flames. Not really a good look for the Fire Service to be promoting and paying for things that tend to combust and prove very difficult to extinguish when they do.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:25am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Good for practice, though, and think of the saving on travel to the fire!
    
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    December 22, 2022 4:34pm
    - Loddenthinks
      
      An EV battery fire uses 4 to 5 times as much water to extinguish as a standard fire.
      
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      December 22, 2022 4:46pm
- john1234
  
  Can the staff with diesel vehicles use the FENZ diesel? If not, why the difference?
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:58am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    Two very good questions. Answers: No, and JUST BECAUSE.
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:49pm
Benedict Yu

This is a good example of how disconnected the Greens are from reality. They think that 2022 has gone ‘phenomenally well’. 🙁

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/12/james-shaw-and-marama-davidson-say-2022-went-phenomenally-well.html

This was the highlight for Marama Davidson. Please read this carefully. If you have any clue what it means, let me know. 🙂

“Marama Davidson’s highlight was Te Aorerekura, the strategy to end violence.

“This year was putting the roots down across the agencies across the sector and getting the workforce tools out.

“The workforce tools are one of the biggest opportunities we have to reduce the harm of government agencies, to reduce the harm of people seeking help being re traumatised across the system.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/130733468/end-of-year-interviews-the-green-party-on-pulling-three-waters-support-and-the-highs-and-lows-of-2022
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December 22, 2022 8:31am
- alloytoo
  
  “The workforce tools are one of the biggest opportunities we have to reduce the harm of government agencies, to reduce the harm of people seeking help being re traumatised across the system.”
  
  It would be really helpful if citizens knew which government agency to approach and what services they offered.
  
  A clear English name would make a big difference to 90% of the population.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:33am
- ClanMcleod
  
  That is a language incomprehensible to me. I have no idea what message it is attempting to get across. The woman is an idiot.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:35am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Yes. She is speaking English but it is riddles within riddles.
    
    “Putting the roots down”
    
    “Getting the tools out”.
    
    It is too funny 🙂
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:38am
    - kevn
      
      @BY… Indeed, just trying to kid us something is happening. Bullsh*t words.
      
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      December 22, 2022 8:42am
    - alloytoo
      
      Things the Greens in reality know nothing about.
      
      16 0
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      December 22, 2022 8:43am
      - artemisia
        
        Marama Davidson has 6 children. I rest my case.
        
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        December 22, 2022 12:08pm
    - Thought Criminal
      
      So they haven’t done anything yet? Five years in power and they’re just getting the tools out? That’s everything you need to know.
      
      30 0
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      December 22, 2022 8:46am
    - Brian McDonald
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      As funny as trying to believe a street person quakes at the sight of a redhead. I was just trying to remember your other ridiculous one for the year something along the lines of the prospect of 2 years imprisonment was going to stop people fleeing from crimes that had a maximum of 14 years imprisonment.
      Do you wear stylish Mr. Magoo glasses, Benedict?
      
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      December 22, 2022 8:50am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Yes that’s right – I say “ridiculous” things all day 🙂 🙂
        
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        December 22, 2022 8:51am
    - Simon
      
      Te Aorerekura what garbage. Its “ambition”. Dont have to understand anything else. There are no benchmarks or accountability.
      
      When its quietly shelved 12 months later having achieved nothing, with family violence worse, if ever asked they will say it was only aspirational
      
      Its purely for wankers and grifters.
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:15am
      - artemisia
        
        Follow the money ….
        
        7 0
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        December 22, 2022 12:09pm
    - rouppe
      
      Not funny. It’s deliberate. Because language that skews the purpose towards “her people” is littered throughout.
      
      There’s a reason for that.
      
      It’s the reason why I heard two callers yesterday say they had been denied access to Paxlovid after being asked their ethnicity. Despite both having had heart operations and being over 65.
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:25am
  - RockyJ
    
    Yes. I must do a dictionary of incomprehensible and vague statements typically used by the left to disguise their incompetence and deceit. “The system” is a favourite. Means you and me and is usually prefaced by an accusation, eg “racist”.
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:42am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    “I have no idea what message it is attempting to get across. The woman is an idiot.”
    
    You’ve answered your own question, Clan.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:27am
  - oldfella
    
    Clan: is she speaking te reo? I don’t understand that, either.
    
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    December 22, 2022 11:17am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Is that the same Marama that thought the Greens had abstained from voting on the 5 Waters Bill, not in fact voted against it?
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:36am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Lol, getting the workforce tools out. Williams, Sio, Clark, Strange, Lubeck, Eagle and Sage all going. So yep, Marama, there are tools out. And if you and James and the rest of your Greenie nut job friends all walked, there’d be a general clean out of the Government workforce tools.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:56am
- Ruawai
  
  It might have been easier to understand if she said it in maori.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:58am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Jaspinda has taught her well.
  Word soup waffle.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:01am
- PeeJay
  
  To be fair, I’ve always thought that Davidson and Shaw were complete tools anyway.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:13am
- Taieri
  
  This was the highlight for Marama Davidson
  ————
  
  Who’s Marama Davidson?
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:34am
  - alloytoo
    
    I believe, based on her own comments, that she is the token Anti-Semite.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:47am
- NZer In Exile
  
  “They think that 2022 has gone ‘phenomenally well’”
  
  Economy derailed. Tick.
  
  Population divided and demoralised. Tick
  
  Extremely dumb and wasteful policies launched galore. Tick
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:09pm
alloytoo

Should we, as NZ citizens, be having a national conversation as to the make up of refugees we allow into our country.

Given the investment we make in these refugees shouldn’t the public have knowledge and a say as to their make up?
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December 22, 2022 8:31am
- Paulus
  
  Is it not as now reported that 501’s get priority housing when they arrive ?
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:58am
Benedict Yu

This strikes me as a panicked backdown.

“The Government has promised to price agricultural emissions at the lowest point possible to ensure its emission targets are met, prompting cautious optimism from the farming sector over its part in New Zealand meeting its climate change goals.”

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/govt-promises-lowest-possible-farming-emissions-levy-price-in-latest-plan/YAUNW2KXHRAHPBXOUFE7FS6YAE/

So why was there ever a scenario where the Government would choose to price emissions at a HIGHER level than that required to meet New Zealand’s obligations?

The reality is that this policy will never see the light of day.

And hey you have to love this gaslighting of farmers by James Shaw 🙂

““It is up to our farmers to seize the opportunities [this] will make.”

He [Shaw] said farmers were let down by past Governments which hadn’t given them the tools to reduce emissions and change farming practices.”
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December 22, 2022 8:36am
- alloytoo
  
  Shaw has all the integrity of a fundamentalist mega church pastor and none of the charisma
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:40am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  There is no depth to the announcement, no cost to farmers, but still leaves the door ajar to lift the price, no figure to farmers who have planted, this lot can’t be trusted, win election and they will carry on the way they were
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:47am
  - Matt Long
    
    It’s weasel words, lowest cost to change practice, they just get people to create computer models and chose whichever one suits them. GIGO.
    
    12 0
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    December 22, 2022 9:03am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      And then when the government stays the same? Just drop everything
      
      6 0
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      December 22, 2022 9:51am
- Thought Criminal
  
  More giving out of tools.
  
  Such an interesting metaphor from a party that clearly doesn’t do any real work.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:47am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “….let down by past Governments which hadn’t given them the tools to reduce emissions and change farming practices.”
    
    It is revealing of how James Shaw thinks about the role of the Government. You won’t find many farmers celebrating Government officials visiting the farm to give them “tools” to better run the farm. 🙂
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:54am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      “We are from the Government and we are here to help”
      
      18 0
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      December 22, 2022 9:06am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Run for the hills!!
        
        1 0
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        December 22, 2022 8:10pm
    - rouppe
      
      Quote from a farmer:
      
      We can’t buy an electric sheep
      
      The only tool provided to farmers to reduce emission is to reduce the herd. Which is economically destructive
      
      16 0
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      December 22, 2022 9:29am
      - Taieri
        
        We can’t buy an electric sheep
        —————–
        
        Don’t they make them in the People’s Republic of China?
        
        10 0
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        December 22, 2022 9:35am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Reducing herds of a primary industry is a no brainer, but the current clowns could do anything. No forward thinking – they can’t. That is why they are socialists.
        
        11 0
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        December 22, 2022 9:37am
    - Jimbob
      
      I used to work with scientists that were researching ways to reduce emission and fertilizer leaching.
      This was back in the 1980’s, progress so far has been minimal.
      Shaw is talking crap, as usual.
      
      14 0
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      December 22, 2022 9:59am
      - Bob
        
        progress so far has been minimal…..
        a half truth Jimbob.
        Way back in the 1960/70 era NZ agriculture scientists developed a genetically modified RYE grass. The greenies element of the government at the time introduced legislation banning the use of genetically modified organisms/seeds in NZ.
        The seed was sent to America for field trials; GUESS WHO is benefitting from the improved lower methane producing Ryegrass now. NOT NZ FARMERS.
        
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        December 22, 2022 11:16am
      - artemisia
        
        Low run off, low cadmium phosphate at Chatham Rise. Lots of it. Not allowed to extract it.
        
        6 0
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        December 22, 2022 1:15pm
- Matt Long
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/130784599/tescos-warning-to-new-zealand-farmers
  Tesco’s head of climate scare white washing wants to make it look like their carbon footprint is net zero. “UK farmers were able to offset farm emissions by, for example, claiming carbon credits for having hedgerows. This in turn brought down Tesco’s emission profile, she said.”
  So because the government in New Zealand won’t allow on farm sequestration to be properly recognized our produce is causing a “problem” for Tesco.
  The bullshit response around climate politics is so farcical it’s no wonder our government is net zero with farmers.
  If they really believe the Climate “Emergency ” maybe they could look at policies that actually encourage solutions instead of playing accounting games that decimate farming communities.
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:49am
  - Matt Long
    
    Was speaking to the guy taking logging gear away from here yesterday, he said the dangerous overtaking and drugged drivers in the last 3 years is worse than anything he’s seen in 50 years of driving. The drugged drivers are turning up to make life hard for his wife at the ED too.
    Labour, net zero for road safety and health as well as climate policy.
    
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    December 22, 2022 8:54am
    - Ruawai
      
      Net zero doesn’t seem to be working, think I read a few days ago the recent road toll is the highest in 4 years. I guess words, policies and advertising doesn’t save lives after all.
      
      21 0
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      December 22, 2022 9:00am
    - Master Mariner
      
      The thing with Net Zero this , Net Zero that, Is it all stems from the illustrious WEF and Partners.
      So on a grander scale NZ has to tag along for the ESG messaging and scoring.
      I have previously commented that in my previous company we had to change our company Policies for Zero Harm, Much to great outrage at the shear impossibility of doing so.
      CEO explained that company vessels can not get Charters/Contracts until Policy was changed.
      The ” Partners” were and not limited too where all the Oil Majors ( WEF approved special Partners).
      So, With this in mind , People need to understand where the Zero this and That actually stems from.
      NZ fully embraces WEF and ESG mesagging / And “scoring”.
      
      So hence, Net ZERO for roading.
      
      11 0
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      December 22, 2022 10:35am
      - Nickc2
        
        Agree. NZ’s future is not in the hands of NZers and their elected/anointed representatives. We’re being manipulated and controlled by offshore interests and their sycophants that have infested our Political System.
        
        11 1
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        December 22, 2022 11:58am
  - Simon
    
    If they really believe the Climate “Emergency ”
    
    They dont. Years later when global temperatures havent moved they will say climate emergency was only worse case.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:20am
  - oldfella
    
    Matt, I heard a reporter on TV last night talking about Global Warming? And here I thought we’d moved beyond that to Climate Change.
    Hard to keep up these days. //
    
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    December 22, 2022 11:23am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Not much global warming going on in North America atm.
      
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      December 22, 2022 4:39pm
- Wayne Mapp
  
  Actually something like this will see the light of day. Labour will pass it into law next year. National will have a hard job working out whether they support or oppose. Todd Muller’s press release kept that open.
  
  National is not in the same place as Groundswell. More like FedFarmers. I noted that their President was also hedging his bets on the latest announcement.
  
  Let’s say Labour does pass it this coming year, Labour will do so because of the many younger urban population who are ardent environmentalists many who are part of their support base.]. Let’s assume National opposes. But will National repeal? Not likely. Much more likely would be amendment.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:05am
  - PeeJay
    
    But don’t you see the problem with this approach by National? They do it on pretty much every policy difference with Labour. They tweak the legislation through amendments and regulations, but the fundamental issue, the legislation, is never repealed.
    
    This is the reason a lot on here hold their nose and vote National. They have a well earned reputation for ‘managing it better’.
    
    The ultimate problem with this, rather timid approach, is that the policy direction increasingly tilts leftwards with brief interludes of National managing things a bit better. The overall direction though is still left.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:22am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Yes exactly. Which is why National should never have signed up to this “net zero” nonsense. James Shaw can’t even decide whether it means “zero net domestic emissions” or whether it allows buying international offsets.
      
      The 30 percent reduction promised in the Paris Accord could have easily been achieved using the ETS. Then wait and see what happens in a few years – the whole edifice might collapse if the lights go out in Europe and Australia.
      
      Back to farming – there are no ways to achieve major reductions in ag emissions without cutting the herds. One thing I agree with Shaw about – what the farmers came up with under ‘he waka eke noa” would have done next to nothing to cut emissions – it was all window dressing – it did not involve herd cuts which is why Shaw hated it. Yet National supports it. Why? It will achieve nothing and just employ a hundred public servants to run it.
      
      Climate change policies – especially ANY policies to reduce agricultural emissions – will always be controversial because they are economically damaging. All of them. That is why nothing much has happened in New Zealand for the last 25 years to reduce emissions. Shaw and Ardern talk about these policies being “opportunities” for farmers. It is all BS. Farmers are well able to spot opportunities on their own.
      
      New Zealand emissions will fall when markets and technology make that happen. No doubt in 20 years most of us will be driving EVs without being bribed into doing so. In the mean time leave farmers alone and do the bare minimum so to not be regarded as an international pariah.
      
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      December 22, 2022 10:21am
      - Master Mariner
        
        I agree with what you are saying totally, However on a Global scale ( Who we trade with), NZ has to meet some sort of Balance in “Proving” we are meeting some “Mythical” target, Or at least have the perception of doing so.
        It really is a “dammed if you do and dammed if you dont” approach with the very real outcome of not meeting ESG targets and hence NZ can not sell its produce.
        The real question in my mind is James Shaw / Damien O’connor able to walk a Tight rope to the betterment of NZ ( ie Farmers, Fisherman and most Primary producers) with our “Traditional” trading partners or destroy our Export earners in trying to comply ?
        
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        December 22, 2022 10:45am
      - Drone
        
        Hi @BY in the UK there is the beginning of a push to move people away from drinking milk and from eating meat because of the emissions caused by dairy farming and animals generally. If this gathers steam around the world our farmers won’t have to worry about reducing their herds because there won’t be a need for them. What our government need to think about is what will replace dairy farming in 50 years time. How will NZ generate enough wealth to maintain the current living standards..
        
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        December 22, 2022 3:50pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    “ardent environmentalists” = brainwashed useful idiots. BTW Wayne, I live fully off grid, my “carbon footprint” is miniscule compared to the vast majority (if not all) of those “ardent environmentalists”, so don’t bother lecturing me about how we need to “save” the planet.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:30am
  - alloytoo
    
    That’s probably why I’m not voting for National.
    
    10 2
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    December 22, 2022 9:49am
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      So you want a Labour/Green/Maori Government, or are you going to vote for Act?
      
      5 2
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      December 22, 2022 11:01am
      - Matt Long
        
        We’re pretty shitty but Labour is worse is not a great election slogan.
        
        5 0
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        December 22, 2022 12:30pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Nats have already given their policy on this, it will come at no cost to farmers, science will be at the forefront, and all plantings will bring down their emissions
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:54am
    - Matt Long
      
      No, their policy is He Waka Eke Boa as presented originally and that was a very poor proposal.
      
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      December 22, 2022 12:32pm
  - Jimbob
    
    Yes, they will dump it.
    Have you jumped the fence Wayne?
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:01am
  - Jack5
    
    The new Government after the election in 11 months will have a huge job unwinding Labour-Woke lunacy.
    
    Wayne Mapp is right in pointing out the Green obsession of many young voters. This is largely the result of decades of brainwashing by the Woke Lefties who control primary school education.
    
    Maybe ACT and National can learn how to live with this by the way Japan lived for decades with its primary education dominated by Communist teachers – active unionist Communists.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:44am
    - All_on_Red
      
      They are not all brain washed.
      Most of the boys aren’t believers.
      You might be surprised how honest some of the Science teachers are about this.
      Certainly at Takapuna Grammar.
      Its anecdata of course but I’d observe it’s mainly the girls, their mothers and the soy boys who hang around with them who are the alarmists.
      The rest know there’s only modest changes.
      They are also cynical about the gravy train and the self serving Politicians as well.
      
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      December 22, 2022 11:57am
- Paulus
  
  But the “Cabinet” will decide the price !
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:59am
Rusty

So what is President Zelensky going to talk to Joe Biden about and is he going to wear a suit and tie at the White House instead of his military tank top?
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December 22, 2022 8:47am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Zelenski has the begging bowl out. He will also thank Joe for blowing up the Nordstream pipe and blaming it on the Russians!
  He is still in the khaki green, it is his trademark.
  He is also speaking perfect English, something that the media don’t let on much. He is speaking better English than Putin.
  Maybe Joe could give him back some of the millions he and Hunter extorted from Ukraine?
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:22am
  - Jimbob
    
    Already a done deal.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:02am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Just watched them again. Biden has prepared notes, Zelenski speaks off the cuff. How embarrassing.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:04am
  - Master Mariner
    
    Maybe just maybe, He has served his purpose and now not of any more use ( Zelensky).
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:49am
cas

I was just thinking about the practicalities and implications of the te mana o Wai statements.

If we take Lyall bay in Wellington as an example, Te Ati Awa claim mana whenua status even though they didn’t come down from Taranaki in the 1820s and 30s. But the sewage outfall goes out from Lyall bay into Cook strait so we can presume this is part of 3 waters. Which means they could do a Te mana o Wai statement to cover Lyall bay and say it is sacred and you can’t discharge sewage into it. Or that Wellington airport couldn’t expand as they want to. ( Thought they could negotiate with the airport for a equitable financial conclusion to that). Or even heaven forbid that people can’t fish off the rocks or surf or whatever.

Bloody frightening.
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December 22, 2022 8:47am
- Blog-aholic
  
  That, is exactly, as was planned.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:29am
ClanMcleod

Further evidence that the more jabs you get your risk of getting covid increases. It isn’t even a topic for debate, it is a stone cold fact.

Cleveland study conducted to demonstrate the clinical effectiveness of the bivalent vaccines accidentally finds that the risk of Covid-19 infection increases with each prior vaccination

The associated graph clearly shows the correlation with number of vaccines taken and cases of covid.
The authors of the study are surprisingly (in the present covid narrative era) honest in their comments.

The association of increased risk of COVID-19 with higher numbers of prior vaccine doses in our study, was unexpected. A simplistic explanation might be that those who received more doses were more likely to be individuals at higher risk of COVID-19. A small proportion of individuals may have fit this description. However, the majority of subjects in this study were generally young individuals and all were eligible to have received at least 3 doses of vaccine by the study start date, and which they had every opportunity to do. … This is not the only study to find a possible association with more prior vaccine doses and higher risk of COVID-19. … We still have a lot to learn about protection from COVID-19 vaccination, and in addition to a vaccine’s effectiveness it is important to examine whether multiple vaccine doses given over time may not be having the beneficial effect that is generally assumed.

https://www.eugyppius.com/p/cleveland-study-conducted-to-demonstrate

As Eugyppius notes:

“You know what is effective against infection, though? Prior infection. The more recent that infection, and the more related the variant, the better.”

Further down, this example of insanity, doing “the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.”

This adage now provably applies to the covid vaccination.

Eighty-five employees of Cleveland Clinic submitted to five vaccine doses prior to the release of the bivalent vaccine, only to be outdone by the 16 heroic vaccinators at the bottom of the chart, who somehow managed to secure no less than 6 doses for themselves by September of this year. There are a small but very real number of people out there, who are compulsively vaccinating every three months or so. Think about that.
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December 22, 2022 8:55am
- mandk
  
  I like this bit:
  “We still have a lot to learn about protection from COVID-19 vaccination”
  
  Clearly, the authors do. The lesson from their study is obvious: THE VAXX DOESN”T WORK.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:04am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    mandk – what is also clear from the study and the results is that this “vaccine” is NOT “safe and effective.” That we were lied to when we were told it was “tested and approved.” We were gaslit when we were told it wasn’t rushed and corners hadn’t been cut in getting it out to market.
    It is clearly and provably obvious that this is an experimental product and always was, from the very beginning.
    Ardern and her government lied to us. That is criminal activity.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:35am
    - kevn
      
      @Clan… and it still is, experimental but ‘they’ are still pushing the jab.
      
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      December 22, 2022 9:50am
  - mandk
    
    I would be genuinely interested to hear from the down tickers what else could be concluded from the graph about the protection that the vaxx affords, relative to not being vaxxed.
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:56am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      mandk – you won’t get a response from the down tickers. Their frustration is in the fact they were wrong and while in the beginning, some of this stuff was debatable, it is rapidly becoming apparent that is no longer the case. The empirical evidence is proving all the “conspiracy theories” were actually truth.
      
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      December 22, 2022 10:29am
      - mandk
        
        Yeah, you are probably correct.
        
        Despite the title of this post, the downtickers don’t want to debate.
        
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        December 22, 2022 10:43am
      - Master Mariner
        
        Re: Medsafe,
        Does any one know what actual “Trials” they did before approving it here in NZ. ?
        Any reports etc ?
        I mean thats what they are for, right ?
        
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        December 22, 2022 11:18am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Herd immunity was always the way to go, but no, the experts knew better and made some money on the way. Extortion.
  Nuremberg 2.0 must come one day. They just can’t be allowed to get away with this shit, otherwise they will do it again
  I have read about ‘gain of function’ viruses that are 20 to 60 times more powerful than Covid 19. A huge money trap waiting to happen.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:30am
  - Ian Boag
    
    Herd immunity was always the way to go
    
    It looked like that might have been a useful approach when we thought you could only get covid once ….
    
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    December 22, 2022 9:56am
    - kevn
      
      @iboag… Had the flu a few times in your life then?
      
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      December 22, 2022 10:03am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Still a useful approach. People died, but most were going to die from underlying and unknown causes anyway. The Govt fudged the numbers to use fear porn against us.
      My ex wife’s Sister had throat cancer for the last 20 years. Many surgeries. Parts of the tongu gone and a breathing hole in her neck. She was going downhill fast so was put in a resthome. Breakfast time at 8 am and she was not alive. Taken immediately and cremated. The family were not allowed in, they had to wait across the road. Ashes could not be picked up for four weeks.
      Others in the resthome contracted Covid so she was listed as a COVID death, when all the time she died of cancer.
      Rotten bastards. She was 52.
      
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      December 22, 2022 10:16am
      - Taieri
        
        The family were not allowed in, they had to wait across the road. Ashes could not be picked up for four weeks.
        ————-
        
        Applied “Be kind” …
        
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        December 22, 2022 10:22am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Ian – you might not have noticed, but it’s the vaccination that is causing the repeat covid infections. I posted a study further up the thread proving this to be the case. Natural immunity is the very best protection from covid. The more you vaccinate, the more likely you are to get covid. End of story.
      
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      December 22, 2022 10:33am
    - alloytoo
      
      That renders the “vaccine” even more useless.
      
      From the out set we should have focused co-morbidites that could mediated and nutrition.
      
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      December 22, 2022 11:01am
- Ghost
  
  A video for you
  
  Press Release 21.12.22 – Doctors For Patients UK
  
  https://vimeo.com/783103991
  
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  December 22, 2022 5:37pm
  - Ghost
    
    This will likely interest you as well
    
    https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/COVID-19/safety-report-46.asp
    
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    December 22, 2022 5:54pm
Brian McDonald

There’s probably been a comment on here at some point but in an otherwise rather bland year, it was great to see Ukraine bombs and rockets cross the previously sanctified border of Russia in an “I can bomb you but you can’t bomb me” war. The expectation that they had to fight figuratively one-handed must have burned into both the Ukraine people and soldiers as they were attacked across their borders through the air.
That will even out further with the new rockets from the Americans. While that reciprocating aerial pressure may have seemed a bridge too far earlier and held diplomatic restraints, bit by bit the gloves are off and it makes me consider the difference between “bend over” Trump and a much more formidable, strategic, and practical Biden. Putin’s effort to weaken and threaten Nato has had the opposite effect, effectively strengthening it with a new determination and boldness.
In the fullness of time, Biden’s presidency will be well appreciated for its deft sure-footedness and for reversing Trump’s damage by appearing weak and compliant when dealing with the Russians and North Korea – that story isn’t finished yet. On the other hand, either is Biden’s relationship with Russia but at least there is the comfort that he is showing unflinching strength with Putin well aware of the American “levers” being utilised against him.
Others here may say “what about Afghanistan” and the answer to that is “it’s done.”
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December 22, 2022 9:37am
- ClanMcleod
  
  What about Syria……give us more of your outstanding geopolitical analysis…..//
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:44am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Yes Brian, Biden’s idiocy is ushering in WW 3.
    I don’t have your optimism – this is a proxy US war in an attempt to permanently neutralise Russia. I hope Vlad doesn’t lose it, and hit the nuke button. But I’m not optimistic.
    
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    December 22, 2022 11:17am
    - Ehlana
      
      If it was a US proxy war, wouldn’t it have started with Ukraine invading Russia, instead of the other way round?
      
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      December 22, 2022 11:28am
      - KH
        
        In a way Ukraine did invade Ehlana. Ethnic Russians broke away and formed the Donesk and Luhansk Republics some time ago.
        Ukraine has been shelling those places and trying to occupy since 1914. Yes 1914. 14,000 people died before this latest war.
        So yes. Ukraine went first.
        
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        December 22, 2022 12:21pm
- Jack5
  
  The problem is the West, despite idealism and good intent, tends to get bored with supporting democrats in the Third World.
  
  The wars and uprisings drop of the news bulletins and headlines, and help fades away.
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:47am
Benedict Yu

This article on birth control is mildly interesting. However I cannot get over the absence of any references to “men” and “women”. Instead we have:

“People with a uterus” and

“People who produce sperm”

🙂

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/300747981/why-is-there-no-male-birth-control-pill-and-will-one-ever-exist
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December 22, 2022 9:38am
- Taieri
  
  “People with a uterus” and
  
  “People who produce sperm”
  ————
  
  Which we should replace with:
  
  “People who have no functioning brain”
  
  aka
  
  Stuff “journalists”
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:11am
- PeeJay
  
  That is such an ironically funny read! You have to laugh or else you’d cry!!!
  
  Particularly love the way they switch between male, as in “male pill”, then revert to the appropriate current non-offensive term of “sperm producing people”, then back again to “male”.
  
  Trouble with self-censorship and being ‘woke’ is even the truly woke can’t keep up with the bullshit and sometimes the old offensive terms like “man” and “woman” slip through! Off to the re-education camp for this “journalist” I would think!!! Almost inferred that only women can have babies for goodness sake!
  
  All jokes aside, not sure which one is the more ridiculous phrase though – originally thought “people with uteruses” was the clear winner, but I think “people who produce sperm” is a strong contender for most ridiculous phrase of the year!!!
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:24am
  - Jack5
    
    The reporter’s unwritten words: how would you know the bastard really is on a man pill?
    
    The existing surgical snip is mostly done to men in settled relationships, and wives or partners know it’s been done.
    
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    December 22, 2022 10:50am
    - oldfella
      
      Should trans-men also get the snip? And what would you snip? //
      
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      December 22, 2022 11:35am
- graham
  
  I strongly expect people in 20 years time will read articles such as these, shake their heads in disbelief – and perhaps pity – when they reach those particular phrases, and muse, “What on earth were these poor deluded people drinking?”
  
  (I say “in 20 years”; I’d like to hope it was less, but unfortunately this current insanity still seems to have some legs on it).
  
  This sort of writing does serve a purpose in reminding us that there are still valuable lessons to be learned from the great playwrights of many years ago. “The Emperor’s New Clothes” was first published in 1837 …
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:00am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Graham, we can only hope
    
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    December 22, 2022 4:45pm
- Ghost
  
  GP was showing me that the medical records have be altered to now show if you are a he, she or whatever.
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:19am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Title 42 stays. For once the SCOTUS made a great Judgment. Saved Biden from himself. Slows up the drug trafficking as well as illegal aliens.
https://patriotunitednews.com/judge-deals-biden-crushing-defeat-conservatives-celebrate/
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December 22, 2022 9:51am
- Inandout
  
  SO, having Gavin Newsom now questioning Biden’s border policies is such sweetness for Republicans. The old coot also thinks the illegals will all vote Dems.
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:36am
  - NothingLeft
    
    People will vote to advantage themselves so of course poor immigrants with little english or education will vote to keep competition for their jobs out with stronger borders, they are also mostly religious conservatives deeply uncomfortable with woke agenda. They are natural republican voters, not democrat.
    
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    December 22, 2022 12:28pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    All vote Dens – yep, Pelosi is the same. Deluded.
    
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    December 22, 2022 4:03pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Elon Musk is draining the Twitter swamp. Good Man. Trump will be pleased.
https://leadpatriot.com/twitter-files-chronicles-fbi-has-zero-evidence-to-launch-censorship-attack/20358/
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December 22, 2022 10:02am
fernglas

Isn’t the simplest way around all this gender debate just to stop having genders? Don’t put M/F on birth certificates. Abandon masculine and feminine in grammar. Problem solved.
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December 22, 2022 10:13am
- alloytoo
  
  The simplest way around this gender debate is to call any one with gender pronouns in their bio as “Hey you” in direct address and “That idiot” in the 3rd person.
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:07am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    French, Spanish & Portuguese to be neutered, linguistically speaking.
    
    Can see that going down like a bucket of cold sick.
    
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    December 22, 2022 4:47pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  How about “trans female”? Or “trans male”?
  
  Or is that too truthful to bear?
  
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  December 22, 2022 8:44pm
Taieri

Don’t put M/F on birth certificates.
———-

Abandon birth certificates.
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December 22, 2022 10:20am
- Rusty
  
  @Taieri
  
  I wonder what language these gender bender nutters would use if they were required to give a description of a criminal to the cops?
  
  The criminal had two legs, two arms, a head, and a torso – but I refuse to say what gender or race they were because..
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:31am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.
https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/woodville-newspaper-editor-forced-to-conform-or-else/?utm_source=mailpoet&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=the-latest-posts-from-our-blog
Maori are now DEMANDING, nor asking.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/kahu/editor-apologises-over-racist-remarks-against-maori-and-promises-to-change/DGH2S4AXDNFVBPAEGTOCV4II2Q/
https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/Woodville-Editor.pdf
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December 22, 2022 10:25am
- Blog-aholic
  
  The entire Woodville thing was plain bullying.
  Sadly the editor handled the reply with little diplomacy. She should have either ignored the demand (as it was a demand) or just replied with a simple thanks but no thanks.
  
  She created an opportunity for the tecup to have a storm in it.
  
  By enaging in the debate she got handled.
  
  Lesson is, state the thruth, stay true and speak only the truth but never engage with bullies because they thrive on that.
  
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  December 22, 2022 10:32am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Bullies, a bit like trolls. Bullies like to trigger you.
    
    This Maori bullying has to stop. Everyone is a racist to them.
    Apartheid.
    
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    December 22, 2022 12:38pm
nathie

NZ Herald this morning:
“Seventy thousand people, roughly equivalent to the population of Rotorua, are forecast to lose their jobs as the Reserve Bank plunges the economy into recession in a bid to control inflation.”

It won’t be long before the Left start marching in the streets, but this time instead of marching against National, they will be marching against Labour and if it is anything like “the good old days” of the 70’s-90’s they will be carrying (and burning) effigies of Adrian Orr and Labour MP’s!

Perhaps the PM, if she had any sense, should stand down in the new year (and let the grand mastermind of NZ’s economic collapse – Grant Robertson – step up and take the heat, deservedly so) before she gets caught up in this and has her international reputation tarnished!
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December 22, 2022 10:34am
- Inandout
  
  nathie, a wise suggestion as Robbo is embedded in Wellington’s cafe culture and the fawning public servants will still back him. Jacinda is a mere stand in.
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:30am
- Paulus
  
  With Robertson in charge of Labour and PM in the New Year she can blame him for ever and anything – as usual not her fault.
  
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  December 22, 2022 1:50pm
- Jack5
  
  Nathie’s … as the Reserve Bank plunges the economy into recession…
  
  That is the Ardern-Labour spin, enthusiastically taken up by the subsidised media.
  
  The Reserve Bank’s Orr was a partner with Labour, specifically Finance Minister Robertson.
  
  They together launched the billion dollar money printing exercise through bond issues and purchase.
  
  This blow-out in the money supply would inevitably cause galloping inflation without the recession being engineered to stop it.
  
  The coming tough times are down to Labour.
  
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  December 22, 2022 2:03pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Wellywood has say 213 thousand. Reduce that by 70 thousand and what will they do?
  Walk the streets like Zombies?
  Whatever they do, just don’t come to Auckland. We will know you by your standard grey suit issue and a red tie.
  Hope you have a passport to enter Auckland.
  
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  December 22, 2022 4:12pm
Jack5

The Ardern Labour Government is forcing a de facto official name change for New Zeland

On the Government web site beehive.govt.nz, Ministers are issuing statements, like the one linked to here, under the name “Aotearoa New Zealand”.

In this release by two Cabinet Ministers, the country is named as “Aotearoa New Zealand” in the headlilne on the release, then twice in the text.

As with Three Waters and as with beach-heads for racial separation, the doomed Government is trying to bulldoze through planned radical changes.

https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/aotearoa-new-zealand-supports-tokelau-response-covid-19
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December 22, 2022 10:52am
- Swifty
  
  The other day Kim Hill was dropping the ‘New Zealand’ entirely and continually referring to, solely, Aotearoa.
  
  I don’t get particularly worked up over this issue but it does irk me that, yet again, we haven’t even had anything resembling even the slightest debate over THE NAMING OF OUR OWN BLOODY COUNTRY and Labour have just rammed it through our public institutions.
  
  They didn’t campaign on it, we haven’t debated it and calls for a referendum ignored.
  
  And, as a great fat cherry on top, we are lied to straight to our faces by the elites saying “it is the Maori word for New Zealand, in use for centuries”.
  
  It was not! It was, at best, a word used by some Maori for the North Island only.
  
  It is at best the very misinformation they accuse us of and at worst active disinformation – ie the elites say it knowing it’s not true.
  
  We are reduced to mere pawns.
  
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  December 22, 2022 11:20am
  - Inandout
    
    Swifty, last time I heard Hill was on TV years back. The internet is a wonderful invention.
    
    7 1
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    December 22, 2022 11:26am
  - Nickc2
    
    IMO, this is a clear indication that they have realised that come the next election, they are out on their lying arses.
    I sincerely hope an incoming Govt will issue a mandate stating that as of date x, the country will revert to its internationally recognised name of ‘New Zealand’, and likewise, all Govt Depts and Agencies will also revert to their given names pre-1917 and in doing so, there will be no consultation or referendum because none were conducted prior to undergoing their name changes during the term of the Ardern Govt.
    
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    December 22, 2022 11:32am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Pre 1917 is good. I think we only had about 10 ministries then.
      
      Bring back the Department of Native Affairs!
      
      5 1
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      December 22, 2022 4:52pm
  - Paulus
    
    Thought Kim Hill was more sensible than that – but assume she needs the job with those who pay the piper.
    
    5 2
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    December 22, 2022 1:51pm
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Radio NZ policy. Even Gyles Beckford, in his broad Scouse accent, was referring to the motu this morning.
      
      4 1
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      December 22, 2022 4:53pm
  - Jack5
    
    Swifty, Radio NZ — Red Radio, is a leader in the move to change the country’s name by stealth, without a referendum, without debate in Parliament.
    
    Radio NZ was first scalp taken by Wily Willie Jackson in his move to take control of the media. He pretty much merged it with the 20 tribal radio stations financed by the State.
    
    The bigger step of merging Radio NZ and TVNZ and then expanding the new entity is phase two of Jackson’s plan.
    
    Maorification is a big part of his goal.
    
    Maori have their own separate TV service and the tribal radio, but for Wily Willie the strategy of a partnership is: what’s mine is mine, and what’s yours if half-mine.
    
    Maorification continues despite problems for Wily Willie to get a vast amount of dollars to expand a merged State radio and State TV. The present weather forecast in the TV1 broadcast from 6pm is an example.
    
    Perhaps John Key influenced Willy Willy with his comment that he regretted not changing the country’s flag without putting it to the referendum that rejected a change.
    
    Just do it, then worry about the democracy.
    
    10 1
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    December 22, 2022 1:52pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Would you prefer the name ‘Maoriland’?
      https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/maoriland
      
      0 9
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      December 22, 2022 7:16pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    “Aotearoa” is basically just a pretentious way to piss on NZers who don’t buy the loony left narrative on all this guff.
    
    2 1
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    December 22, 2022 8:47pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I have asked our Alaskan friends to send me a letter with a photo inside – any photo.
  Addressed to yours truly:
  Mr Otto.
  Bayview.
  North Shore. Auckland.
  Aotearoa.
  You all know that it will never get delivered. There is no such place Worldwise.
  I will just leave it at that.
  
  6 2
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  December 22, 2022 4:51pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump’s Tax Returns.
My opinion is Trump is playing his 3D Chess. I reckon there is nothing wrong in the Tax Returns. This is a game where Trump will release his Returns, and then, demand the same of Joe Biden and possibly Hunter.
https://redrightdaily.com/house-ways-and-means-committee-votes-to-release-trumps-tax-returns-watch/
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December 22, 2022 10:59am
- Frank Hematuria
  
  Joe Biden’s tax returns have already been released, voluntarily. Hunter Biden is a private citizen, if Trump wants his tax returns released why not those of other private citizens, say Ivanka or Jared Trump? Or any one of millions of other private citizens?
  
  7 2
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  December 22, 2022 11:21am
  - Nickc2
    
    I think you’ll find that all the ‘kick-back’s for the ‘Big Fella’ weren’t mentioned in Joe’s tax returns eh?
    
    8 3
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    December 22, 2022 11:37am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      10% for the Big Guy.
      
      6 2
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      December 22, 2022 12:41pm
  - Paulus
    
    Isn’t Trump a private citizen now like Hunter Biden ?
    
    5 3
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    December 22, 2022 1:52pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Yep. So Hunter Biden’s Tax returns will be the same as investigating Trump’s Tax Returns.
      What have I missed here, serious, where is the difference?
      
      3 3
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      December 22, 2022 4:54pm
    - Mike
      
      His is a candidate, again. His spurious reasons for not releasing the returns, unlike all other candidates in the modern era, prompted a congressional committee to investigate. This does not mean congress can override any person’s privacy. You can use the Google to find out why – it’s a bit more complicated than can summarized in a blog comment.
      
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      December 22, 2022 5:44pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Biden and Zelenski live on Al Jazeera. Zelenski is getting a voiceover, why?
He speaks perfect English. I can only think the this interpreter is messing with the words.
Fuck, it is Joe that needs an interpreter!
9 3
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December 22, 2022 11:02am
- kevn
  
  @SteveO… Zelensky has scored 45 billion from biden apparently. Worth the trip, clip 10% for a success fee.
  
  4 2
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  December 22, 2022 5:46pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    More than that when Hunter was involved
    
    3 3
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    December 22, 2022 6:08pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

World History – As it Really Happened:
Humans existed as members of small bands of nomadic
hunter/gatherers.
They lived on deer in the bush ranges during the summer & would
go to the coast to fish & gather shellfish in winter.
The two most important events in all of history were the invention
of beer and the invention of the wheel. The wheel was invented
to get man to the beer.
These were the foundation of modern civilization & together
were the catalyst for the splitting of humanity into two distinct
subgroups: the Left & the Right.
Once beer was discovered it required grain & that was the
beginning of agriculture.
Neither the glass bottle nor aluminum can were invented yet,
so while our early human ancestors were sitting around waiting
for them to be invented, they just stayed close to the brewery.
That’s how villages were formed.
Some men spent their days hunting animals to B-B-Q
at night while they were drinking beer. This was the beginning
of what is known as “the Right.”
Other men who were weaker & less skilled at hunting learned
to live off the National voters by showing up for the nightly
B-B-Q’s & doing the sewing, fetching & hair dressing.
This was the beginning of the Labour Party.
Some of these socialist men eventually evolved into women.
The rest became known as ‘girliemen.’
Some noteworthy socialist achievements include the domestication
of cats, the invention of group therapy, group hugs & the
concept of Labour/Green voting to decide how to divide the meat
& beer that the Right provided.
Modern socialists like imported beer (with lime added) but
most prefer white wine or imported bottled water. They eat
raw fish but like their beef well done.
Sushi, tofu,& French food are standard leftie fare.
(Another interesting evolutionary side note: most of the left voting
women have higher testosterone levels than their men. Most
social workers, teachers, journalists,race relations experts, group therapists and prositutes are socialists.)
National voters drink domestic beer. They eat red meat and still
provide for their women. The Right are deer stalkers,
farmers, forestry workers, builders, firemen,
medical doctors, police officers, corporate executives,
athletes, strippers, SAS soldiers & generally anyone who
works productively. National voters who own companies hire other right-wingers who want to work for a living.
Socialists produce little or zilch. They like to “govern”
the producers and decide what to do with the production. They creep in after the hard yakka’s done & create a business of trying
to get MORE for nothing.
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December 22, 2022 11:26am
- cmm
  
  This underlines the difference between a do-ocracy and democracy.
  
  In a democracy people get to vote in their own interests no matter how little they have done. Those that get to control the committees etc force the doers to do their bidding.
  
  In a do-ocracy the doers decide what is done through their own actions.
  
  7 3
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  December 22, 2022 12:26pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Do you have any examples of a do-ocracy that you would prefer to live in rather than a modern liberal democracy?
    
    1 10
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    December 22, 2022 7:19pm
    - Keith White
      
      Florida
      
      2 2
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      December 22, 2022 8:55pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        When are you moving?
        
        1 6
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        December 22, 2022 9:35pm
Tony Stuart

Dave Letele, aka the Brown Buttabean does amazing work in South Auckland, feeding the hungry and trying to change lives. Yesterday, he got some help:

Brown Buttabean
orSnedstpo9a1t62la98mm2905001fm1u0ig0mm3la
h
cm76
6
3ma
1
8ll0g10i
·
Today had to be up there as one of the busiest days BBM has ever had. Isolation food parcel deliveries, a food parcel drive through, stock deliveries, Christmas present wrapping, as well as getting ready for our huge Christmas event with the Middlemore Foundation tomorrow.
So we were very lucky to have some reinforcements. Christopher Luxon, his wife Amanda, their daughter Olivia, Mark Mitchell MP, his partner Sarah, and Jake came to lend us a hand.
They stayed for hours, and got stuck in helping prep food parcels for over 300 families.
To be honest I didn’t expect them to stay as long as they did. I actually said it’s ok. You can go when you need to. Their reply was ‘we are here til the end.’ 🙂
It was genuine and my team really appreciated the help!
#buttabeanmotivation #merrychristmas #community #christmasjoy

https://fb.watch/hzj_545oOu/

Kudos to Luxon and Mitchell and their respective families for helping out yesterday. But more help is likely to be on the way. A couple of weeks ago in a radio interview, Luxon said he was open to more money going to people like Letele, like Mike King, who have a track record of success in their endeavours. He said that’s preferable to the money getting “tied up in Wellington”, like Labour’s “missing” $1.9b in Mental Health funding.

Get the money to the coalface, with as few people as possible finding reasons not to spend it. The people there doing amazing things on generosity and the smell of an oily rag will appreciate it far better than a legion of mandarins in Wellington.

I have nothing but admiration for people like Dave Letele who are making a tangible difference in their communities. It’s time they were supported.
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December 22, 2022 12:32pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  With all due respect Tony, did those National MPs and families complete their mahi with an opening and closing karakia?
  
  Don’t you think it should really be up to six-figure salary postgraduate bureaucrats adept in te Ao Maori and all hui, no doey to decide where the moni goes…?
  
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  December 22, 2022 1:52pm
Jack5

Did Mahuta jump the gun with her Fiji congratulations?

Even if so, has Bainimarama since conceded his party lost?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/south-pacific/300771487/fijis-ruling-party-refuses-to-concede-election-says-nanaia-mahuta-jumped-the-gun
3 2
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December 22, 2022 3:54pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  You spelled Bananadrama wrong 🙂
  
  7 4
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  December 22, 2022 4:49pm
  - Mike
    
    Why do all these foreigners have such ridiculous names?
    
    6 6
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    December 22, 2022 5:35pm
    - Jack5
      
      Says Milky who posts under two pseudonyms, sometimes using both in the same discussion.
      
      On the Milky wagon are Mikenmild AND Mike. Milky is his long-standing nickname on Kiwiblog.
      
      4 2
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      December 22, 2022 7:53pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        [Mod – no need for that]
        
        0 4
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        December 22, 2022 8:10pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Sorry Mod, but I try to stick to the comments policy and simply suggest other do the same.
        
        1 5
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        December 22, 2022 8:51pm
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Very good. Over the heads of some.
      
      3 0
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      December 22, 2022 8:50pm
Don Beckett

Has this been posted here beofre?

https://rumble.com/v21ahhm-new-zealand-documentary-memorial-day-silent-no-more-nz.html

I have not seen or heard it, but it is shocking – it leaves me rather speechless that this has been suppressed. People need to be held to account. Jacinda, Bloomfield, Woods and the complicit politicians, health Dept., Police & those who agreed to a divided society.
Shame. Over 58,000 life changing adverse reactions & deaths.
What have we become as a society & country? Shame.
7 3
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December 22, 2022 4:20pm
- kevn
  
  @Don… Isn’t it odd that one Mike Williams (ex labour party pres) was very critical of the jab beware folk. Calling them anti-vaxxers etc.
  Must have extra large blinkers glued in place plus narrow thinking.
  
  7 2
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  December 22, 2022 5:44pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The blinker suit him
    
    4 3
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    December 22, 2022 6:10pm
Ra Henare

So who jails more “”activists””, Russia, bad bad Russia
Or UK, western Democracy Icon (They gave us the Westminster style Government)

Ie the effects of Hate Speech laws.

You may be amazed.
Russia – 400
UK – 3,300

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0r7GRx8Sl-s
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December 22, 2022 4:36pm
- cmm
  
  Remember too that Russia has approx 2.1x the population of the UK, so scaled for population the UK is jailing people at about 18x the rate of Russia!
  
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  December 22, 2022 5:05pm
cmm

Herald out-woking themselves.

People, you need a summer hat to keep off the nasty UV.

So who do they show a picture of? An extremely dark skinned African!

I have absolutely nothing against African people wearing hats for fashion or for shade and keeping cool, but c’mon Herald – it isn’t for the UV protection!

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/viva/fashion/12-summer-hats-that-youll-actually-want-to-wear/BRM7UK3SBJGLXJC5WQRPXLABCY/
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December 22, 2022 5:01pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/130839141/jacinda-arderns-arrogant-prick-comment-snapped-up-by-reefton-vet-at-auction

1. The Vet wins: he has his memento. ( More money than sense ): hey, pet owners, stay away from this obviously over-priced bloke !
2. Jacinda wins: she ( and her handlers ) turned a crap event into a winning situation for her.
3. Seymour loses: He should NEVER have had any further involvement with this issue after hearing her comment in the house. Very bad judgement on his part ( or his PR team’s part ).
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December 22, 2022 5:22pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  The Vet is at retirement age and has managed over the course of his lifetime to accumulate enough assets where he believes he can afford to make a $100k donation to Prostate Cancer Foundation. His wife didn’t want him to buy a boat so he bought this instead. He admires the work of the PCF and feels he should’ve contributed earlier, and sees this as catching up in one big go. Nothing to do with “obviously overpriced” or “more money than sense” – too nasty slurs against a man you don’t know.
  
  My view is that Jacinda has a net loss – sure she gets points for “being a good sport” but in reality every day it was in the news cycle, which was 9 or 10 days, reinforced to everyone that she’s nasty, and not kind at all. She had no choice but to go along with it, but she wasn’t in control of the auction or the narrative, and she desperately wanted it to go away.
  
  Seymour has, in my view, played a master-stroke here. He’s shown he can laugh off a petty insult, and shame Ardern into going along with a stunt to raise money for a worthy cause.
  
  Their body language in the photos with the signed Hansard showed who was bouncing around like a schoolboy in cool sockless shoes, and who looked like she’d swallowed a dead rat. Impossible to call that a win for Ardern.
  
  He was in charge of the Q & A on the auction, and milked it – some very witty retorts, no nastiness, nothing overtly political. Clear win to ACT and Seymour.
  
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  December 22, 2022 9:04pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Vote for the schoolboy and the schoolboy stunts?
    
    2 5
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    December 22, 2022 9:33pm
Ghost

No conclusive evidence Russia is behind Nord Stream attack

But now, after months of investigation, numerous officials privately say that Russia may not be to blame after all for the attack on the Nord Stream pipelines.

“There is no evidence at this point that Russia was behind the sabotage,” said one European official, echoing the assessment of 23 diplomatic and intelligence officials in nine countries interviewed in recent weeks.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/12/21/russia-nord-stream-explosions/
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December 22, 2022 6:09pm
- kevn
  
  @Ghost… It seemed clear that Liz Truss (remember her?) was connected to the pipeline attack by UK Special Forces whilst PM.
  Never saved the info but it all added up at the time.
  Sweden apparently knows but are staying mum.
  
  5 1
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  December 22, 2022 7:04pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    I thought it was Hunter Biden in the conservatory with the lead piping.
    
    2 9
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    December 22, 2022 7:09pm
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Actually not bad. Lead pipe, though.
      
      3 0
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      December 22, 2022 9:06pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        I slump, lifeless, corrected.
        
        0 5
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        December 22, 2022 9:34pm
      - Loddenthinks
        
        Hunter Biden in the hotel room with the P pipe?
        
        1 0
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        December 22, 2022 10:24pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/south-pacific/300772186/army-called-in-after-contentious-fiji-election
Typical fucking Fijian response: if the Fijian Indians look like they are getting political power then the Bainimarama-backed Fijian nationalists start hitting out.
This will get ugly.
6 1
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December 22, 2022 6:48pm
- Jack5
  
  So Mahuta did jump the gun:
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/130824704/new-zealand-congratulates-fijis-new-prime-minister
  
  1 0
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  December 22, 2022 7:57pm

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