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December 8, 2022 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 08 December 2022

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General Debate

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Yvette

But Willie won’t need anyone’s consultation, Will he

Government falling behind on timeframe for co-governance plans – Willie Jackson
Māori Development Minister Willie Jackson has confirmed he’s “leaning towards” putting the government’s work on co-governance on hold.
That work would continue over the next 12 months, he said.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/480211/government-falling-behind-on-timeframe-for-co-governance-plans-willie-jackson

■ So ”We still haven’t consulted with New Zealand” and Willie Jackson still hasn’t knocked the Elite Maori response into his version that he thinks Cabinet will even accept.

But –
Minister Nanaia Mahuta offers three waters co-governance defence
The Water Services Entities Bill passed its first reading in Parliament last night, with ■ co-governance one of the main points of contention in the proposal to shift drinking, waste and stormwater management from councils to purpose-built independent entities.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/468837/minister-nanaia-mahuta-offers-three-waters-co-governance-defence

So “co-governance” is definitely in this “3 Waters” Bill going through Parliament right now, without the promised “public consultation”, nor even the Elite {“Targeted”) Maori response which is awaiting Willie’s rewrite for Cabinet acceptance – still a year away.

■ Therefore the Impertinent Question is What consultation, or who’s response, is it that informed the “co-covernance” legislation being passed into the nation’s law, in the Water Services Entities Bill, right now?
Or, “Who exactly told the legislators what to put in the Bill, without Maori Elite input or the New Zealand public consultation – when both are yet to come?
See what you think of when your morning shower is too long …
Why is Thomas Cranmer, David Seymour, Don Brash, or even Wendy Geus [1] not onto this?

Why is Willie getting his undies in a knot over work that will “continue over the next 12 months” to then “consult with New Zealand”, timed after the Election – and after ”The Prime Minister likely allows Mahuta to finish getting the Three Waters reforms through the House when she will feel her job is done,” [2] before the bloody Election.
Obviously, if the legislation is being passed right now, Willie won’t need anyone’s consultation or input, Will he.
______________
[1] “Water bill trojan horse for ‘privatisation’ of water by Maori” – Wendy Geus
https://theplatform.kiwi/opinions/water-bill-trojan-horse-for-privatisation-of-water-by-maori
especially her comments on Luxon regarding the “entrenchment debacle” –
[2] https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/12/jenna-lynch-christopher-luxon-too-trigger-happy-with-call-to-sack-nanaia-mahuta-but-her-clock-is-ticking.html
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December 8, 2022 8:00am
- pdm
  
  Yvette – Mahuta is not only pushing Co-Governance.
  
  She is also PRIVATISING Water and it’s infrastructure as per DPF’s Post on Tuesday.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:10am
  - Ehlana
    
    Reported on the AM show this morning: the Greens claiming entrenchment is necessary because Act and National have form when it comes to selling assets.
    
    National and Act don’t stand party candidates in local elections and the water assets are owned by local government, not central government. So before a National-Act central government could sell these assets, they would have to buy them.
    
    If Labour and the Greens were serious about protecting water assets, the best way would be for them to keep their sticky central government paws off them.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:51am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      “the Greens claiming entrenchment is necessary because Act and National have form when it comes to selling assets.”
      
      So what? What is their mania about privatisation? Why does the Government own a farming company? It is absurd.
      
      https://pamunewzealand.com/company
      
      The Government owns 25 percent of Christchurch airport. Why?
      
      The Greens are mad.
      
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      December 8, 2022 10:01am
      - Ehlana
        
        I think it’s some sort of desperate need to see themselves as the hero fighting the supervillain. Just like little children, when a supervillain doesn’t exist, they invent one.
        
        If you remember from childhood, imaginary supervillains are much easier to defeat. And you can change them at will to suit yourself.
        
        Self-reflection, acknowledging one’s own failings and weaknesses and working to overcome them are much, much harder. As is the business of understanding other people’s point of view, working to persuade them towards yours, or compromising to achieve a better outcome for both of you.
        
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        December 8, 2022 10:36am
      - I remember when
        
        Government ownership of farms was used as a useful way of opening up farming land before allowing it to be passed into private ownership.
        
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        December 8, 2022 1:36pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      If 3-5 waters goes through, then they will be owned
      
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      December 8, 2022 10:59am
    - Ra Henare
      
      Form selling assets.
      Who sold BNZ,Telecom, NZ Steel etc etc etc.
      Tell the Greens to open their eyes.
      Yea I know they are richard craniums.
      A waste of breath as they were not given the usual handout of common sense when common sense was distributed.
      
      Have a green Brother in law……and a green sports related friend.
      Observations based on them
      
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      December 8, 2022 1:39pm
- Justitia
  
  Willie’s consultation has been a diversion all along, intended to distract while “co-governance” is being rammed through in Health and 3 Waters. As we have pointed out previously, there’s precious little “co” in the governance of 3 Waters. The bill effectively gives one ethnic group absolute control of all New Zealand’s water, with no accountability to either the public or to Parliament as the Auditor-General has pointed out. It is a monstrosity on every level. Hopefully it will seal Labour’s fate.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:14am
  - herb1
    
    The Government are hiding the real end game of 5 Waters, which is control by Iwi , by claiming that councils will still own the water.
    Yet in the same breath they claim entrenchment was to prevent National privatising the water.
    If the Labour are being honest and Councils still own the water then by law councils can’t privatise the water.
    Also claiming Iwi don’t own the water , councils do , ignore the effective ownership through legal control.
    High country farmers mostly don’t own their land , it is leased from the Crown , the legal owners. Yet you wander onto those properties without permission , you can be arrested for trespassing. The farmers can also charge for you to come on their property to stay or go hunting or fishing.
    That’s their legal right.
    Iwi will do exactly the same only the fees will be eye watering and we’ll have to pay all of the fuzzies Aunties , probably mob members , who are going to get fees for monitoring compliance with Te Mana O Te Wai statements.
    It’s a pity Willie and the CEO OF Mahutacorp haven’t had military training.
    In the first week they would have learned never go into battle unless you have 3 times the number of a similarly equipped enemy.
    Listening to either speak , they’re not at all well equipped and 17% vs 83% doesn’t compute
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:03am
- crikey
  
  The short answer for the delay: Jackson doesn’t know how to sell it to non-Maori New Zealand.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:39am
  - Yvette
    
    Crikey, Jackson doesn’t yet know (and may take another 12 months to decide) how to sell just the Elite Maori response to his own Cabinet colleagues, before he and they rehash any “co-governance” proposals for the 83 percent non-Maori New Zealanders to accept.
    And Jacinda will have to condense it into a bumper-sticker size slogan too.
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:52am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Fighting supposed ancient racism with new actual racism IS a hard sell.
    
    Then again when the top internet searches in NZ are Guacamole and some other brain-dead crap he may have a chance.
    
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    December 8, 2022 2:53pm
mikenmildagain

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
I trust everyone will enjoy the immaculate conception today.
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December 8, 2022 8:01am
- hmmokrightitis
  
  Didnt spill a drop.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:13am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  What a clown!
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:26am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  First experiment of artificial insemination?
  Same as cows.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:42am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Unecessary, Steve. You obviously do not know what you are talking about.
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:40am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I do. I grew up on a farm. Cows don’t get pregnant on their own. We had no bull. The vet came.
      
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      December 8, 2022 11:01am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Ad.
        I am not a man of faith, but I totally respect your faith Don.
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:04am
      - bco90
        
        The immaculate conception isn’t about the conception of Jesus by the virgin Mary.
        
        It’s about the conception of Mary without sin. It has nothing to do with getting pregnant “on their own”.
        
        A common misconception.
        
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        December 8, 2022 10:57pm
  - Ghost
    
    ET abduction? 😜
    
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    December 8, 2022 4:04pm
- rangitoto
  
  Another haploid?
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:00am
- kowtow
  
  Fuck , don’t encourage the troll .
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:24am
- Don Beckett
  
  Actually yes, milky. I went to Holy Mass this morning to honour Mary the mother of Jesus Christ, and her Immaculate Conception. 🙂
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:38am
- Kiwiguy
  
  What immaculate contraption are you referring to?
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:02am
  - Ehlana
    
    Kiwiguy, it is a Catholic belief that Mary, the mother of Jesus, was free of sin from the moment of her conception. It is a public holiday in Catholic countries, and there are special Catholic church services for it.
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:33am
    - Kiwiguy
      
      I know….
      
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      December 8, 2022 11:56am
- NZer In Exile
  
  Everyone?
  
  Why this?
  
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  December 8, 2022 3:45pm
  - Don Beckett
    
    I’ll try an answer.
    Milky is a leftist politically, and atheist – so he enjoys poking fun at Christian beliefs – particularly Catholic. I am a deacon (retired) in the Catholic church, and occasionally respond. Everyone is entitled to their view and rightly so – but I do tend to react when some of the dogmas of the Christian Catholic faith are ridiculed.
    Christanity built Western civilisation, and over the post Reformation centuries, with the rise of atheistic philosophies conceived in the so called Enlightenment,- eg Marxism & Freemasonry -we have seen in recent decades a huge growth in anti-Christian sentiment.
    Be sure that this will continue to develop into overt persecution, as is developing now in a passive way, but as has developed as we speak openly in Ukraine, where Zelensky has “Banned” the Ukrainian Orthodox church.
    History repeats – Rome 2000 years ago is re-emerging – as it has done at several times over the centuries..
    
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    December 8, 2022 5:35pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Are you forecasting a return to the times when the unified Italian polity expanded to control the Mediterranean basin and much of its surrounds, or to a times when the pope was relevant internationally?
      
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      December 8, 2022 6:36pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        You make my point. 😆
        
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        December 8, 2022 7:20pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        I’ll take that as a ‘both’, so that you want to establish a dictatorial empire with a state religion run by Italians until they change sides to a new religion that has emerged from one of their more obscure colonies.
        Is your prophecy derived from pastafarianism?
        
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        December 9, 2022 7:00am
    - Ian Boag
      
      The Inquisition
      Catholic/Prod problems in Ireland
      Anti-Jew pogroms in Eastern Europe
      Kiddy-fiddling Catholic clergy
      
      Probably a few more if I could be bothered digging
      
      Christians are generally OK folk,but there are a few blips …
      
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      December 8, 2022 8:55pm
Benedict Yu

Lindsay Mitchell blogs:

“An ODT opinion piece recently parodied the rapid adoption of Māori names for government departments. It drew attention to the renaming of the Earthquake Commission as Toka Tū Ake EQC which apparently “reflects the whakapapa of our nation.” The name-change decision was made by the Minister and cabinet.”

“The Commission site contains a section about their new Māori name.

‘In the beginning, Ranginui (sky father) and Papatūānuku (earth mother) were joined in such a strong embrace it created darkness. When their sons separated them to create light, Ranginui grieved so much for Papatūānuku that his tears flooded the land. Their sons turned Papatūānuku over so their parents would not face each other and see each other’s sorrow.’

“Are these characters any different to Adam and Eve? Creation myths sit at the basis of religious belief. Imagine then Christian biblical stories and imagery appearing on Ministry websites to explain their reason for being and values. It would not happen.”

https://lindsaymitchell.blogspot.com/2022/12/new-zealand-no-longer-secular-state.html

I agree with Lindsay. The term “Earthquake Commission” has been expunged from the EQC website.

There is no “sky father” or “earth mother”. It is not appropriate for Government agencies to be named by references to deities from religion. Any religion.
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December 8, 2022 8:01am
- Nickc2
  
  That’s interesting! What will the story be when Morrinsville is changed by Govt decree to Mahutaville?
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:15am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    When you see some of the voluptuous women in that town it might be called Ma Hooter Ville.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:48am
    - Nickc2
      
      Spare me the agony FFS!
      
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      December 8, 2022 11:21am
  - fightingtemeraire
    
    No Jacindaville and Huntly will be Mahutaville
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:25am
- slightlyrighty
  
  I see the musical, “Hamilton” is touring NZ soon.
  
  I await the outcry to have it renamed “Kirikiriroa” for local markets..
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:19am
- Blog-aholic
  
  The addition of any spirituality into law or goverment or public service is insanity. It creates divisions and alienates all sectors of society.
  
  Look at how Iran is run where church and state are one. In the end they cannot be reconciled.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:20am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Exactly. Indonesia is another example. Banning sex outside marriage for everyone including tourists. Goodbye Bali economy. The law is unlikely to be widely enforced. However, the corrupt police will perform shakedowns on unsuspecting tourists.
    
    Make no mistake. There will be many long standing and competent public servants (these do exist – I have worked with several) who will be aghast at this Maori mythology. Career advancement will increasingly depend on your ability to speak te reo and to recite the origins of the sky father.
    
    Sadly, “Maori science” will have nothing to offer if New Zealand faces a crisis that requires a response grounded in science, e.g. a foot and mouth outbreak. What do we do if all the competent scientists at MPI have fled from the earth mother?
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:39am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      MPI? Hasn’t been changed to a Maori name yet?
      Congratulations, but I am probably wrong.
      
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      December 8, 2022 8:48am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Manatū Ahu Matua
        
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        December 8, 2022 9:58am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Yup, I was wrong.
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:05am
    - cmm
      
      … and yet, for some reason, we give foreign aid to Indonesia.
      
      Cindy and her current boyfriend can’t share a room, but have a few million from the NZ taxpayer anyway.
      
      https://www.mfat.govt.nz/en/aid-and-development/our-aid-partnerships-in-south-east-asia/aid-partnership-with-indonesia/
      
      IMHO, we should not be providing foreign aid to any country that:
      * has incompatible values
      * has a larger military than us.
      
      Sure, I understand that Indonesia have a GDP per capita that is less than a tenth of what ours is, but the foreign aid we supply is only a few cents per Indonesian. It doesn’t move the needle. It probably keeps one or two of their F16s in the air.
      
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      December 8, 2022 10:19am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        I guess my Partner and I won’t go to Bali then?
        Their loss, not mine. I prefer Waikiki Beach anyway.
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:07am
- pdm
  
  BY are you and Lindsay saying that we now have a `Minister For Earthquakes’?
  
  The whole cabinet would be contenders for that role because they are all very unstable and shaky!!!!
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:21am
- 70andstilllearning
  
  “The name-change decision was made by the Minister and cabinet.”
  Children acting out their imaginary world!
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:22am
  - Flossie
    
    The Government has time to consider this very unnecessary stuff but “because of the Queens funeral” have to rush 3(5?) Waters through under urgency!
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:33am
    - Flossie
      
      *Queen’s funeral!!
      
      [Mod – fixed it for you]
      
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      December 8, 2022 8:45am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Yes I was scratching my head over the “Queensland funeral”.
        
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        December 8, 2022 10:02am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Children. Sums up these clowns with one word. Children.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:50am
- Swifty
  
  I totally agree Benedict.
  
  And what’s worse, I bet there is a growing cohort of our young who believe these fables to be the literal truth and who will go through life distrusting science and reason as a result – and which will make us all worse off.
  
  (They are the people I see on social media applauding the announcements of the Maori Health Agency that witch doctors and astrological health services will now be funded but without therapeutic evidence in support.)
  
  Sort of like the vast dumbing down of huge swathes of the world’s Islamic population.
  
  I despair.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:23am
  - artemisia
    
    It is a top priority for parents to instill critical thinking into their children’s minds.
    
    It’s an uphill job these days.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:36am
  - rockape
    
    I can’t wait till a Maori self trained medical Practitioner gets sued for missing a major illness.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:15am
    - Nickc2
      
      Won’t happen, it’ll be blamed on insufficient funding.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:18am
      - Don Beckett
        
        ……or colonisation.
        
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        December 8, 2022 10:46am
  - Prince
    
    Serious question – can someone please detail how many Health ‘Ministries’ we now have, and what their names are ?
    Is ‘Te Aka Whai Ora’ just the Maori Health section, or is it the overall NZ Health Ministry ? If the former, what is the name for the Health Ministry that looks after all of NZ (including Maori, presumably) ?
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:23am
    - Paulus
      
      It doesn’t matter what it is called, Mahuta’s sister is the Big Boss and I suspect other senior appointments are whanau related.
      
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      December 8, 2022 1:33pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Yes, Te Aka Whai Ora is the Maori Health Authority.
      
      https://www.teakawhaiora.nz/about-us/our-board/
      
      The Chair Person is Tipa Mahuta (Nanaia Mahuta’s younger sister)
      
      The District Health Boards have been subsumed into the mega-entity- Te Whatu Ora (Health NZ)
      https://www.tewhatuora.govt.nz/
      
      and above them all is Manatū Hauora (Ministry of Health).
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:10pm
  - Random T Person
    
    To be fair chiropractic and osteo and other hocus is also funded so why not.
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:41am
    - Swifty
      
      Scrap that too – in the absence of therapeutic evidence.
      
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      December 8, 2022 10:56am
- Yvette
  
  Benedict, conflate that with Race Relations Commissioner Meng Foon’s reaction below, and his mention of “provide a space to express their culture and language” but omits “religion”.
  Also consider that, in the 2018 Census .the number of people to respond that they adhered to a Maori religious view was 3,599 persons.
  
  Kaipara mayor Craig Jepson unrepentant over karakia ban
  Race Relations Commissioner Meng Foon has said he was shocked and disappointed about what had happened at the council meeting.
  “It’s very important for councils and all organisations to create the right space to encourage Māori to honour the Treaty of Waitangi, to provide a space to express their culture and language,” Foon said.
  “I would encourage the leaders of Kaipara District Council to acknowledge that and create a safe environment for all people.”
  https://www.1news.co.nz/2022/12/03/kaipara-mayor-craig-jepson-unrepentant-over-karakia-ban/
  
  Also I considered it journalistic bias when Kaipara Mayor Craig Jepson is said to have “shouted down” the councillor proposing a karajan, when the video shows the Mayor spoke in the same even reasonable tone of voice as he used earlier.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:24am
  - Blog-aholic
    
    I saw the video and he was quite polite.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:35am
    - Paulus
      
      Heard that he has relented to squaking and squealing now.
      
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      December 8, 2022 1:35pm
  - Thought Criminal
    
    Is the mayor allowed to create a safe space to disagree with maoriification of everything.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:42am
  - Nickc2
    
    Meng Foon’s a clown. I don’t recall anyone asking for his consultation on the matter. IMO, his role as conciliator is to conciliate when asked to.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:44am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Meng Goon owes the Mayor an apology.
    Out with it today – then resign. You are racist.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:54am
  - rouppe
    
    There is time and space.
    
    In your own time and in your own space.
    
    Council meetings are for council business.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:09am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  This continuous shit being rammed down out throats is getting rather boring.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:29am
- ClanMcleod
  
  We are being moved back to pre The Enlightenment. These people are moving us into the dark ages, possibly literally with their assault on our power generation systems.
  I thought I had witnessed a lot of madness in my life, but the last ten years or so have surpassed everything in the previous fifty years. I feel very sorry for the young people of today and can only hope this insanity can be somehow stopped and reversed.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:33am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    For madness, the last 2 years in New Zealand have surpassed everything I have seen in my life.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:41am
    - Thought Criminal
      
      Will National undo it?
      
      Will the remove the Labour shills who have been planted at the top of qll these agencies. I think not.
      
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      December 8, 2022 8:44am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        In the New Zealand system, Ministers have no direct say in the appointment of Chief Executives of government agencies.
        
        In Australia, department CEs are appointed by the Prime Minister.
        
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        December 8, 2022 8:51am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      The last 2 years have been the “icing on the cake” as far as madness goes. Once a week or so I go to Carl Vernon on Youtube. He mainly does short (less than 2 minutes) videos that graphically show the “Clown World” we currently inhabit.
      Here’s a short example. It injects a bit of humour that is sadly lacking in many places these days.
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj7VDNwe0ko
      
      This one is slightly more serious. Trudeau speaking publicly is interrupted by what sounds like indigenous people protesting. He stops mid speech for what seems an eternity, then has the temerity to applaud them stating that Canada is a bastion of “free speech”.
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-_0RNziR1E
      
      It really is “clown world”.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:15am
- My
  
  Yep, here is the Cabinet agenda
  law and order – nah, too hard
  inflation – nah, not sure what that is
  housing – nah, just nah
  Kia Ora name change for Earthquake Commission – Yep we can do that, I read this report to Neve last night she loves the story.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:38am
- Harry Knuts
  
  Just waiting for the Ministry of Taniwha’s to appear.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:45am
  - pdm
    
    HK – Nanaia is expected to make an appointment any day now.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:15am
- lastmanstanding
  
  There is always a tipping point and I suspect it is getting very close. Citizens will rise up and reject Maorification in all its forms and demand a return to the previous settings. A Nat/ACT Government where ACT has a significant say will ensure this happens. For this reason ACT needs to get at least 40% of the Nats vote ( at present they have around 33%) so they can demand key Ministerial slots.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:37am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  hey hold on….. this admittedly minor deity is fully supportive of a return to faith-based policy!
  
  It is critical that we respect the small but dedicated set of acolytes that make up our selfless public service and sacrifice appropriately to propitiate the Gods.
  
  Monetary sacrifices from the grateful populace will suffice.
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:14pm
Warren

Fast intervention for 10 to 13 year olds, Ram raiders and robbers – new Government package.
Ha ha this Jacinda Ardern and Labours master plan to curb young peoples crime, after the damage has been done when this Government sat on their arse and did nothing , the horse has bolted these kids have become addicted to the the crime they commit.
But I have to ask this question where are all these Qualified workers coming from to help rehabilitate these young people that commit crimes or will it be the practice followed by the Mongrel Mob where you invested thousands in their drug rehabilitation and what happened there.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/fast-intervention-for-10-to-13-year-old-ram-raiders-and-robbers-new-govt-package/TTFTXZWJ3VAMTA7WCJ32HGKSEU/
Jacinda Ardern our Prime Minister and Labour only have one plan throw millions of dollars at the problem and if that doesn’t work pour in more after all its taxpayers money and they think we are soft on crime.
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December 8, 2022 8:03am
- Harry Knuts
  
  So, the wrap around was a slow-moving system but Labour declaring a fast-track system. Still sounds like the ambulance at the bottom of the cliff attitude.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:46am
- Random T Person
  
  The little scrotes don’t need ‘support’ they need punishment. The more severe, the better. Deterrents work; you don’t like harsh sentences? Don’t do crime. Simples.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:52am
  - Ian Boag
    
    Borstals were closed 40 years ago. Possibly because they were deemed to not be working?
    
    Go figure.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:14am
    - rockape
      
      Is youth crime more prevalent now than during Borstal days that would be an indication of it working or not.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:18am
      - Ian Boag
        
        Google “borstal effectiveness NZ” and see what you make of it all ….
        
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        December 8, 2022 8:51pm
    - kowtow
      
      So were mental asylums , now they just wander everywhere , free range like the crims.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:36am
    - Warren
      
      And Gangs like the Mongrel Mob were around to ,terrorizing the Towns and Cities they lived in and look what happen there with successive Government’s allowing them to get stronger every year , running drugs , committing assaults, robberies and firearm offences .
      So if you don’t like Borstals Ian you obviously don’t like prisons either, so I guess your happy with what young people perpetrating crimes are doing on dailly basis at the moment.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:43am
      - Ian Boag
        
        If I don’t like borstals I don’t like prisons and I am totally happy with all the youth crime. Nice bit of mind reading Warren.
        
        you don’t like Borstals Ian you obviously
        
        I observed that they were closed 40 years ago. I don’t remember enough about them to have a useful opinion based on my own recollections. I did google it and got a few hits with opinions that they were a training ground for further offending …
        
        FWIW I have no problem with prisons although some of the internal carry-ons are a bit rough. Not at all happy with all the ram raid shit …
        
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        December 8, 2022 4:32pm
    - Ghost
      
      Here is one man’s story
      
      https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/southland/abuse-led-life-prison-inquiry-told
      
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      December 8, 2022 10:01am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Around 40 or 50 years ago neo-marxist infiltration of the institutions began.
      
      It capitalised on post-war soft headed thinking based on knee jerk feelz.
      
      It was too icky to bear watching people suffer the consequences of their own destructive actions. So close down the icky institutions and hope for better solutions to magically evolve out of the ether.
      
      Yes some of those mental/youth institutions were run very poorly. The solution was to run them better.
      
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      December 8, 2022 12:53pm
  - Bob
    
    The only ‘wrap around’ support these juveniles require, is a length of supplejack wrapped around their chubby bottoms several times; boys and girls.
    Apparently it works very successfully in ‘attitude modification of young minds’; ask the Singaporeans.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:35am
    - NZer In Exile
      
      Very quick and very cheap too.
      
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      December 8, 2022 12:56pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  ‘Wrap around’ Another childish slogan from the children.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:01am
  - Prince
    
    Where is the ‘wrap around’ support for the victim ?
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:28am
  - Alan Wilkinson
    
    Empty slogans that beat no relation to reality. I heard very recently that Kaikohe OT has six social worker vacancies and one working – part time. This in a gang town.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:52pm
- oldfella
  
  Warren, stuffed has a cartoon today on how to address this problem. It mocks Cindy for … oh, wait.
  It knocks Luxon’s plan for boot camps.
  Must be a day with a ‘y’ in it if they’re attacking the Nats, instead of holding the govt to account. //
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:20am
- Bridgenag
  
  Still like to know where these millions are thrown………..
  
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  December 8, 2022 1:38pm
DeepBlue

The obituaries for the 6th Labour government are coming thick and fast now.

Beware. The fight isn’t over.
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December 8, 2022 8:07am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  In the footsteps of the 5th. Same old, same old.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:02am
Kiwiguy

From now on I’m referring to the whole 3 waters entrenchment debacle as “Code Brown in Aisle 3 Waters”
Some will get the double entendre, some may not….!
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December 8, 2022 8:09am
- Random T Person
  
  Only one as thick as a Labour minister wouldn’t get it.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:53am
  - Kiwiguy
    
    Agreed.
    Also FYI: Stuff wouldn’t publish what I wrote above. Funny that.
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:58am
artemisia

What happens next when unions flex their muscles. While they can.

Uber drivers flocking to join up and become employees – Fares up? Business falls off and drivers not replaced when they leave? Fewer drivers, so people have to take the bus? Hey, there you go, it’s the government doing that nudging thing!

PSA resolutely telling taxpayers how critical some of the sector workers are as they see union dues slip sliding away. All those ‘backroom bureaucrats’ are essential. Good luck with that. Mind you that $1.24 billion spent last financial year on contractors and consultants would pay for a lot of ‘backroom bureaucrats’ If they are so critical.

Some care support workers not happy and Te Whatu Ora said they should talk to their union or employer. But actually they should first look at themselves as they set their own availability. Their bosses are paid the big bucks to manage shortfalls. The care workers on the ground are not responsible for management incompetence.
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December 8, 2022 8:17am
- Ghost
  
  Uber are appealing, if they lose that I’d guess they will drop New Zealand.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:32am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Exactly. What a clown show. These drivers think they can shake down Uber. Uber will just quit New Zealand.
    
    Folk using Uber (including me) are price sensitive. Increasingly people using taxis (e.g. from airports) are not paying out of their pockets. They don’t care how much the fares are.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:45am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Back to the clown show analogies. I thought this was satire but I’ve checked the veracity in a number of places and it turns out to be a true story.
      
      EU President Ursula von der Leyen Announces Review of Protected Status for All European Wolves After a Wolf Kills Her Pony
      
      As Eugyppius notes:
      
      The European Union is a stupid organisation governed by stupid people.
      
      The same can be said for many of our governments and organisations who were once relatively effective and respected. Certainly NZ is giving the EU a run for their money in the moron stakes. Clown world is here.
      
      What is astonishing is, they did DNA testing to identify the wolf involved.
      So she’s going to kill wolves because they killed her pony. What is she going to do to the unvaxxed who refused to follow her orders?
      
      https://www.eugyppius.com/p/eu-president-ursula-von-der-leyen
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:28am
    - Si334
      
      Nah, I dont think they will drop NZ completely. Wages will go up, fares will rise, and people will just stop using Uber as much. Uber has always been about demand and supply, and 30% of the business in NZ (which doesnt really cost them anything) is better than nothing. But the consumers and eventually the drivers will lose out.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:36am
      - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
        
        Not sure. It is likely more important to send a message to markets that actually do contribute to the Uber bottom line.
        
        If the US can show Uber can operate in a system with compulsory unionism in NZ, then it can do it anywhere.
        
        If I was advising Uber I would suggest creating the biggest mess possible and then walking out as a point of principle. “pour encourager les autres”
        
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        December 8, 2022 12:21pm
    - Opie
      
      Especially when you work for the government.
      
      Who cares if a taxi is over $100 and an Uber is $60, its not my money. The attitude seems to be – I only say I like immigrants, I don’t want to get in a prius with one.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:42am
hmmokrightitis

All hail Wellington and craft beer.

Wandering back from a client (bottom of the Terrace) yesterday to apartment, bumped into a long lost friend. Decided we would try the new Malthouse as it was their opening night, red carpet and all. Tick.

And then:

LBQ
Goldings
Fortune Favours
Whistling Sisters and for a final
Mean Doses

2k walk, 6 great craft beer joints (the food at WS is great) and a fun night.

Thank you Wellington, one thing this government hasn’t managed to screw up is the craft beer scene.
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December 8, 2022 8:19am
- DeepBlue
  
  You forgot the CO2 crisis.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:54am
  - hmmokrightitis
    
    I thought #globalclimatechangecrisiswarming fixed that?
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:04am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Govt employees grab a craft beer shandy on the way to the rail station.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:06am
  - kowtow
    
    The only people in the country who can afford a craft beer.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:38am
    - hmmokrightitis
      
      Actually they were all humming – might be the season of course.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:55am
  - grumpy
    
    Soon to be the Yellowstone “Train station”…..
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:20am
- Jinky
  
  Did a craft beer tasting pub crawl in Wellington recently and would encourage others to try it out. As hmmmok has said great beer, good food and good atmosphere with no aggro.
  
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  December 8, 2022 3:38pm
Gravelroad

Re – cafe attack in Hamilton:
“He [the abuser] said ‘you don’t belong here… this is my land, and you should go back to your country’,” said Singh.
And there we have it. Soft, spoilt, entitled people, who don’t want to do any work themselves, shout at others to go away.”Gimme, gimme, gimme your stuff cause I am special and you are not.”
This government’s divisive, race based policies have a lot to answer for.
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December 8, 2022 8:22am
- Benedict Yu
  
  Regular readers will recall that my close associate is a tenancy manager at KO. She recently approached a state house to do an inspection and discuss some issues with the tenant, a young Maori guy. He had been given notice of the visit.
  
  Tenant: “What are you doing here?”
  
  Tenancy manager: “To do an inspection – we told you I was coming.”
  
  Tenant: “Get off my land.”
  
  Tenancy manager: “It is not your land. It belongs to the Government.”
  
  Tenant: “It is my land. This is all my land *pointing to the horizon in every direction* 🙂
  
  Large savage dog then appears.
  
  Tenancy manager: “I will see you at the same time tomorrow. I will have the police with me, and an animal control guy from the council.”
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:31am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Ardern will be responsible for race related crime and fractured social cohesion that is to come for many years. A whole generation have been brought up to believe this nonsense.
    I’ve said it often and it is true, she is the worst, most dangerous PM in New Zealand’s history by a very long way.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:49am
    - NK
      
      I agree, Comrade.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:00am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      If she is still Commandant after the Election, we are in deep deep shit.
      North Korea comes to mind.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:11am
      - Opie
        
        Container booked for December next year.
        
        If she’s out I can cancel it.
        
        If they are back in, the waiting list for overseas house moving will be months or years as the workers jump ship.
        
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        December 8, 2022 9:48am
      - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
        
        New Zimbabwe comrade! Know your place. Be grateful, and don’t forget to be kind!
        
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        December 8, 2022 12:23pm
    - Flossie
      
      And we are increasingly a mixed race, me included. When are the loud voices going to acknowledge that those “colonialists” actually did good things?
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:33am
      - cmm
        
        I too am mixed race, but a mix of European races – mainly based in what is now UK. Probably most of the people on KB loosely belong in that boat.
        
        About 2000 years ago My People were pretty primitive: rubbing woad all over their bodies and in violent conflict with each other. Really no different to the Africans and Polynesians of, say, 400 years ago.
        
        Then along came the Roman colonists. What they brought was game changing and set Britain up to becoming Great Britain rather than that mud pile somewhere off the Western coast of Europe.
        
        And, luckily for others, Britain went around the world, sharing that gift far and wide.
        
        Without British colonisation most places outside of Europe and Eastern Asia (China, Japan etc) would be miserable shitholes with zero infrastructure. Slavery would still be common.
        
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        December 8, 2022 10:37am
      - Phronesis
        
        My people are indigenous to both Antarctica and the Arctic. How much more ethnically diverse can you possibly get?
        
        (Indigenous – first off the boat at a previously unoccupied land. Second off the boat is a dirty colonialist.)
        
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        December 8, 2022 10:48am
      - Groggy
        
        @CMM you realise you are regurgitating Roman propoganda? history is rewritten by the winners, and the archaeology shows that the Celts were not the primitive barbarians the Romans portrayed them as.
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:11am
      - herb1
        
        They’ll announce colonialists did good things at the same time they give the colonial alphabet which gives them a written language and the jobs in local and central Government, which give their leaders employment cheques well above their abilities
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:23am
    - kowtow
      
      Ardern is just the latest iteration.( and yes by far) but this goes back to at least the ’70’s . The Nats are donkey deep too. The courts , the churches , ngo’s , public service ,media etc
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:41am
  - cmm
    
    Producing a dog to convey a threat is no different to threatening with a weapon.
    
    Your good friend should have this person charged with threatening violence.
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:28am
  - crikey
    
    BY: How did the follow-up visit with the tenant go?
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:13am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Fine – she just turned up with a police officer. It is not uncommon.
      
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      December 8, 2022 1:51pm
- Swifty
  
  There is a complete broken-arse out my way who sits, in various states of drunkenness, outside our dairy with his hat out – at times ranting and raving that “this is a Maori footpath” and that he decides who gets to walk it.
  
  (A cop-killer the cops have told the dairy owners, but having looked through all the NZ cop homicides, looking at dates and the bloke’s likely vintage etc I can’t work out who he is.)
  
  This is what you get when you feed people’s heads with this sort of bullshit.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:31am
  - Fuzzysnuggleduck
    
    A Maori footpath would be a bare dirt track.
    You might point out that concrete was a Roman invention.
    And there is nothing Maori about any textile which form the garments he covers his unwashed arse with.
    Come to think of it…hats (even begging hats) too.
    What a sad creature.
    
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    December 8, 2022 6:44pm
- My
  
  The Kosy Kitchen in Garden Place Hamilton. If you are up for a late night Lamb Burger this is the place. Get the works, egg, beetroot, cheese.
  These guys are open all night. Work hard. They deserve their place in our country far ahead of the young punks that did the holdup.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:53am
  - NothingLeft
    
    beetroot *Blech*, why would you want to ruin a good burger with that shit.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:14am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Beetroot is the uniquely Kiwi contribution to the world of burgers
      
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      December 8, 2022 8:32pm
- Fuzzysnuggleduck
  
  IWI.
  I Want It.
  When you keep repeating a blood & soil, special relationship to the land, mana whenua, exalting of a special genetic lineage-message along with all other arrivals being greedy rapists and thieves of the special group, with nothing to offer, no value and no redeeming features.
  What does that do the the impressionable, the angry, disaffected, lazy, stupid or violent who are told that they are the true owners of it all and victims at the same time?
  
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  December 8, 2022 6:38pm
piglady

I’m confused.
On the one hand this government and its maori caucus are adopting and forcing all things maori on us , while with the other advertising the second booster for Māori and Pacifica.
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December 8, 2022 8:22am
- Phronesis
  
  It’s all about intentions, not outcomes…
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:49am
Biscuit

There
.
Are
.
NO
.
World
.
Cup
.
Games
.
For
.
Me
.
To
.
Watch
.
Live
.
Today
.
.
.
.
.
.
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December 8, 2022 8:22am
- Yvette
  
  Biscuit
  Sorry –tough bikkies
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:29am
  - Biscuit
    
    Yvette, your concern is … touching!
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:41am
- pdm
  
  Biscuit go back to bed or off to Golf – anything for peace and quiet for the rest of us here.
  
  There is more to life than trying to `kick a round ball wiff yer head’. Got it!!!
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:43am
  - Biscuit
    
    :: Cries::
    :: Hollers ::
    :: Peers out from behind hands over tearing-up eyes to see if any sympathy is forthcoming ::
    :: Sniffs ::
    :: ‘Throws a Ronaldo’ and sashays off into the World Cup-less day ::
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:17am
    - Gravelroad
      
      You have my sympathy. I’ve been watching. It’s an interesting world event on several levels.
      Just hope five year old grandson not seeing it though. He is already keen and competent at pushing things over, grabbing stuff, falling to ground in absolute agony and complaining to the officials……….
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:41am
- alloytoo
  
  That’s how the cookie crumbles.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:32am
- Jinky
  
  Then do some practice for when they come back on.
  
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  December 8, 2022 3:42pm
Right of way is Way of Right

Imagine, if you will, in a National Government, there was a cabinet minister that had relatives who are continuously awarded consultancy contracts under circumstances that could best be described as ‘unusual’. A minister who, whilst overseas representing us, had staff members who threatened accompanying media with loss of access if they dares to portray the minister in a less than favourable light. A minister who has framed legislation to favour a narrow interest group to which they are intimately related. A minister who has acted in direct contravention of the Cabinet Manual, and in doing so has engineered a vote by which THE ENTIRE CABINET has contravened that same manual. A minister that has made a sham of the democratic consultancy process.

The cries for their resignation and/or sacking would be ringing from the rooftops, but this cannot happen, because Labour cannot govern without the Maori caucus.

This self same Maori Caucus whose members wax rhapsodical about the so called ‘tyranny of democracy’ while manipulating that self same democracy in a manner that would make Machiavelli blush!
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December 8, 2022 8:23am
- Flossie
  
  It is apparently only because she’s a Maori Luxon called for her sacking//
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:37am
- Harry Knuts
  
  Also, Cindy doesn’t sack her own. She gives them the wrap around support and declares they are a team. Mahuta and Jackson are pulling the strings, not Cindy.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:56am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    We made a mistake as a team.
    We will fix it as a team.
    We will blame 9 long years of National, as a team.
    Or, we will just fuck it up as a team.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:21am
- kowtow
  
  The absence is from the fourth estate who’s duty it is to do the shouting .
  
  And we know they’d do that had it been any right of centre party.
  
  Lying , conniving , hypocrites. ( and bought and paid for to boot)
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:48am
- zulumonster
  
  The outrage when the brother of an old schoolmate of John Key was appointed as director of GCSB was deafening.
  The difference in the reaction to the Mahuta family appointments tells a clear story of media bias and Labour Party hypocrisy.
  By now no-one should be surprised – we are living in a strange old world, yet incredibly there is still a chance that we will still be burdened with this unholy mess for 3 more years.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:57am
- NZer In Exile
  
  It’s the union way. Traitors to the mob are viciously dealt to. Nobody snitches. They “stick fat” to defeat the enemy.
  
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  December 8, 2022 1:01pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

December 7th. Pearl Harbour.
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December 8, 2022 8:23am
Maggy Wassilieff

I wonder if Christopher Luxon will be safe from the wrath of Tainui

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2212/S00062/prime-minister-should-sack-nanaia-mahuta.htm
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December 8, 2022 8:26am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Look over your shoulder Chris, it’s Tuku coming for you.//
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:33am
  - Inandout
    
    SO, does Tuku walk with confidence in his $90 underpants?
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:54am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      I would think so..
      
      I haven’t seen any tribal criticism of him being appointed as head of the Auckland-Northland 3-Waters Iwi.
      
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/300731108/tuku-morgan-to-head-three-waters-iwi-body-for-auckland-and-northland
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:23am
    - rockape
      
      I am assured he wears a nappy these days.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:24am
Tony Stuart

If Helen Clark, John Key or even Bill English was the Prime Minister, Nanaia Mahuta would be sacked from Cabinet in the blink of an eye.

But yesterday, Jacinda Ardern was defending Mahuta for breaching the Cabinet Manual, proceeding with support for an SOP entrenching anti-privatisation measures on water assets, and misleading the Prime Minister. It makes you wonder what hold Mahuta has over Ardern, and just how much support Labour’s Maori caucus has over non-Maori Labour MP’s.

Ardern will probably reshuffle Mahuta out of the Local Government portfolio once Three Waters has passed its Third Reading, but if she thinks that the electorate’s anger over Three Waters will simply die away she is sadly mistaken.
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December 8, 2022 8:26am
- mogg
  
  It has become very obvious that Ardern is in office but not in power. After her persistent lying over this matter will anybody believe a word she says in future.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:35am
  - Tricati
    
    What I don’t get is why those list MP’s that are under significant threat of loosing their cushy number aren’t pushing back on this crap from Mahuta.
    Would seem to me that if collectively they threatened to cross the floor on the 3rd Reading of the 3 waters Bill, then Mahuta, Jackson and Davis would be exposed. You get the sense Dr Sharma was onto them all along – They are just bullies.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:58am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Labour’s survival is dependent upon support from long-time voters… and working-class Maori have been long-time supporters of Labour…via the Maori seats.
      
      But as Maori have moved from blue-collar to white collar jobs their allegiances have started to change.
      
      It is easy to walk from Labour to the Maori Party
      (John Tamihere and Rawiri Waititi) or from Maori Party to Labour (Adrian Ruawhere) or have links to both parties (Willie Jackson).
      
      Labour knows that if they lose the support of some of their key props, their edifice may crumble.
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:25pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Jaspinda worried about scaring the horses.
  Or just plain chicken. Who knows?
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:39am
  - Harry Knuts
    
    Chicken through and through.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:57am
  - kevn
    
    @SteveO… Doesn’t want the trojan horse emptying out.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:20am
- Blog-aholic
  
  She wont.
  Mahuta is the reshuffler in charge here.
  That is evident.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:40am
- RoboRob
  
  At a guess getting rid of Mahuta means a leadership challenge with the entire Maori caucus voting against JA. I image GR would be in for a go in that scenario. Regardless of the outcome that’s a bad look for Labour and maybe even lower polling.
  
  I guess she would rather take the hit on looking weak than the above alternative.
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:52am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Lower polling would be great.
    They are neck and neck you know.//
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:25am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    In this scenario I’d back Jaxxie over Grant. But, it looks like Jaxxie doesn’t back herself. Not surprising, really. She was more or less anointed into the leadership, she never had to scrap for it. She hasn’t got the cojones needed to face down Mahuta & co.
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:39pm
- DeepBlue
  
  When an Act is passed it normally has a period to come into force. How much is planned to be implemented in the next 10 working months before the election that entrenches 5 Waters?
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:58am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    3 Waters does not come into effect until 2024.
    
    (So none of us will receive stinking high water bills before the 2023 election)
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:26am
    - Bridgenag
      
      But hey have hired and leased already……..
      
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      December 8, 2022 1:46pm
    - DeepBlue
      
      So everything is still able to be unwound up to then, barring costly leases and employment terminations. I guess most of that can be reversed by secondments back to Councils and repurposing of leases.
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:23pm
    - Ghost
      
      I’m now identifying as Maori, I expect to get my water for free now bro.
      
      – Te Ghost
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:30pm
- NothingLeft
  
  Hard times (70’s-80’s) create strong people/MP’s, strong people/MP’s create good times (90’s-2000’s), good times create weak people/MP’s (2000’s -2010’s), and weak people/MP’s create hard times (you are here).
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:19am
- lastmanstanding
  
  The First Fifteen have Labour by the balls. If they walk to the Maori Party Labour will never govern again without the MP support. That means Labour will have to do what the MP says to get their support. So Labour are adopting “better to keep them in the tent”.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:46am
- Bill Felt
  
  The reshuffle has the added interest of being likely to define the rankings going forward for the List. The Maori caucus will want their members to be put up the list if Mahuta is relieved of her Local Government role. That will be at the cost of others that may end up losing their representation in the Nov election.
  
  Fun times ahead.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:18am
surfing

Government announced a new package of wrap around services for ram raiders . Ram raiders can’t believe their luck. . .

“Local iwi and community organisations would be engaged at the earliest opportunity, with the aim to develop a plan for the child and their whānau.”

Labour have mush for brains for thinking more of the same will work.
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December 8, 2022 8:33am
- Ian Boag
  
  And your solution for 10 yr old crims is …. ?
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:06am
  - Ghost
    
    Couple of the best phone calls into talkback I have heard is, and it isn’t a solution because most won’t be able to do it. They’ve sent their kid overseas to live with family to get them away from the nz gangs. Be interesting to hear a follow up on how they are doing.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:10am
    - kevn
      
      @Ghost… aka Mossies and yes, it seems to work most of the time.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:19am
      - Nickc2
        
        501s in the making eh?
        
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        December 8, 2022 9:22am
    - NothingLeft
      
      Send them to live in a foster home in a village in India or Kenya for 6 months, places where they value education and hard work and where misbehaving gets met with real punishment. They’d develop get sorted out pretty quick, and a lot cheaper than state care in NZ.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:33am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Ghost – we are seriously considering options for our daughter, she’s starting High school next year, but as for uni, when I look at the state of education I think it would be worth her going overseas. Maybe Singapore, we’ll do some investigating, but we don’t want her anywhere near this woke circus with the climate scam. The travel and experience will be as educational as the actual education.
      
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      December 8, 2022 10:46am
      - Groggy
        
        Does she get any choice in the matter? Or are you planning her courses for her as well.
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:19am
      - Alan Wilkinson
        
        Teenage daughter reality check coming up I suspect. They come right but it takes a while.
        
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        December 8, 2022 12:19pm
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Groggy – the sarcasm is noted but you miss the point.
        
        We’re her parents, we’ll parent, she’ll be treated with the maturity she deserves which I have no doubt will be ample. Unlike many of the kids we are talking about on this blog on what seems to be a daily basis who don’t seem to have anyone who gives a shit about what they are doing with their lives. Or do you believe a 12 year old has all the maturity to make all the decisions regarding the direction they are going? I still hadn’t by the time I was 16.
        
        Thanks for your comment, but she has been involved in all aspects of this stage of her education and is totally on board so far. She will be involved in all others until the time she is old enough and in a position to make all the big decisions for herself. She sees what is happening in the university sector, the rainbow crap, the trans garbage, the critical race shit – even at this tender age she knows it may not be the best environment to get an education. She knows what indoctrination is. She knows a lot of big words.
        
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        December 8, 2022 1:31pm
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Cheers Alan, we’ve had the “tweenager” for a couple of months now. It’s been entertaining! Luckily my wife and I are both oldest sibling and are “older” so we’ve seen it first hand a number of times and watched friends and rellies go through the process.
        
        I don’t for one minute think it will be easy or that it will all go smoothly, but she’s a great kid, very smart and is used to being involved in conversations about pretty much all aspects of what she does. It might change when the hormones etc start doing their thing, but I have faith! I’ll let you know if that changes!!
        
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        December 8, 2022 1:36pm
      - Ghost
        
        Friends daughter wants to be a nurse, she’s been looking around and decided it’s better for her daughter to leave NZ and move to ireland than here.
        
        Yeah, day in, day out we are talking about shit parents, kids committing crimes. Refreshing to hear of you and your daughter actively seeking a better option than what nz now offers.
        
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        December 8, 2022 1:41pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        Export daughter to Singapore for study. Tuition around NZD20k per year plus it’s not a cheap place to live.
        
        Nice that you can afford it.
        
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        December 8, 2022 4:39pm
      - Alan Wilkinson
        
        Keep a sense of humour and a loose rein and you’ll probably survive it ok. Good values and insight will get her through it too.
        
        Too soon to be planning uni I think. A lot of mental world to explore first and discover what skills and paths excite. Good luck.
        
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        December 8, 2022 5:02pm
  - lastmanstanding
    
    Dealing to them so they eat their meals off the mantel piece for a week with a promise of more to come if they reoffend. Face it. the soft cock stuff has failed. Time to get back to basics.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:48am
    - NothingLeft
      
      The last 30 years experimenting with the academic left’s theories on how best to raise children hasn’t exactly proven itself successful given the huge expense, intensive parenting with worse outcomes (by most objective metrics).
      
      In that period educational levels have declined dramatically, and youth suicide rate have climbed inexorably.
      
      Maybe turning our back on more rigid and disciplined child rearing and teaching with a lot less cotton wool in favour of the Current Thing isn’t a good idea?
      
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      December 8, 2022 5:07pm
- Gravelroad
  
  @surfing-
  Horse has bolted.
  There is now a growing generation of Maori youth who firmly believe the government’s stated view that Maori are more special than anyone else.
  White colonisation and more recent immigrants (not necessarily just white) are to blame for any negative happenings in their lives – so they have no personal responsibility to be civilised members of a modern society.
  The Labour government has chosen the path of sympathy, cosseting and a “no fault” criminal response.
  Really, the government should be promoting self discipline and some worthwhile ambition.
  In the past, the left wing politicians used to scoff at the “born to rule” class.
  Now we have different lot of born to rulers.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:29am
Yvette

Germany Arrests Dozens Suspected of Planning to Overthrow Government
Many the police detained had military training and were believed to belong to a recently formed group that operated on the conviction that the country was ruled by a so-called deep state.

… The group, which included people who had taken part in demonstrations against the lockdowns aimed at preventing the spread of the coronavirus, was fueled by conspiracy theories, the authorities said.

Its aim was “to overcome the existing state order in Germany and to establish its own by its own form of state, the outlines of which have already been worked out,” using military means and violence against state representatives, the prosecutors said in the statement.

The group’s plans included an armed attack on the German Parliament building, the Reichstag, the prosecutors said. – New York Times, subscription access

ECHO … ECHO … … echo
Wait for Jacinda to link the plots, and use this for deflection and diversion
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December 8, 2022 8:39am
- NothingLeft
  
  Comical that they media/politicians are promoting their “planning to overthrow the govt” as if it were anything other than a ridiculous fantasy. Of course we know that this is just to justify more repressive laws (that strangely weren’t needed when leftie terrorist groups were pulling same shit 50 years back), but really it’s People’s Front of Judea planning to overthrow the Roman Empire. https://youtu.be/rwkfDFynLBQ
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:41am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    It’s the same as the US circus called the “insurrection”.
    
    Clown World™.
    
    Remember when the German police had a demonstration of over 100,000 people opposing covid restrictions and they gave a far right group permission to climb the steps of the Reichstag and wave a few flags. Then videoed it and tried to claim it was part of the main protest? No? Read this excellent summary of it from CJ Hopkins.
    
    New Normal Gleichschaltung, or: The Storming of the Reichstag Building on 29 August, 2020
    
    Mr Hopkins defers the description of the Pythonesque scenes that followed to blogger Mathias Bröckers :.
    
    How do you manage to delegitimize a peaceful mass protest against the corona measures in such a way that the media report not about a protest by hundreds of thousands, but about the “storming” of the Reichstag?
    
    Quite simply: you approve an application by a group of Reichsbürger to assemble directly in front of the Reichstag (N.B. the official applicant for this assembly was Ex-NPD-member Rüdiger Hoffmann) and station only three policemen in front of the west entrance despite the large police presence everywhere in the area. Then you let a crazy Q-Anon-chick scream into the microphone that “Donald Trump has declared freedom,” that “the police have laid down their weapons,” and that “everyone should now occupy the steps of the Reichstag,” and, presto, you have the images you need to dominate the coverage … a mob of a few dozen people with Reichsbürger flags “storming the Reichstag.”
    
    A carbon copy of January the 6th and the “insurrection”.
    
    Another “coup” by “far right, misogynistic, anti semitic domestic terrorists. The “Rivers of Filth” are everywhere, be afraid, be very afraid…..
    
    The narrative is ludicrous, but it is incredibly dangerous for all of us.
    
    https://consentfactory.org/2020/09/02/new-normal-gleichschaltung-or-the-storming-of-the-reichstag-building-on-29-august-2020/
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:06am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    NothingLeft – and so history repeats. As with the Roman Empire, there will be no uprising of “domestic terrorists” coming down a “river of filth” to overthrow “legitimate” western governments. They will manage to collapse the system all on their own due to their vast incompetence and hubris.
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:10am
wilderbeast

Amazing what passes for journalism these days. Jenna Lynch from Newshub manager to turn the entrenchment fiasco into a story about Luxon being hasty calling for Mahuta to be sacked. I mean 1) it appears she willfully deceived the PM and 2) f*cked around with constitutional convention….
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December 8, 2022 8:44am
- Blog-aholic
  
  Yes, that didn’t go un-noticed.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:04am
Maggie Pie

“NZ’s-Most-Googled-Searches-For-2022”

– HOT CROSS BUNS
– CLARKE GAYFORD
– GUACAMOLE

https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1600574635329863696
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December 8, 2022 8:44am
- plc
  
  People be googling “Clarke Gayford”…. can’t think why?
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:56am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Yes Maggie, but I’m sure you didn’t need to google Guacamole – ‘cos you already knew that. 😆
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:16am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Yes that’s an interesting one. Maybe the die-hard worshippers of the fairy princess secretly wish they were partnered up with her “dream guy”???
    
    Or they are searching the various rumours swirling around.
    
    Google will keep them safe from any “disinformation” (anything not supporting far left regimes) appearing.
    
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    December 8, 2022 3:56pm
- Biscuit
  
  Really, Maggie?
  
  I never lie, as 8, 001,888,888 other Earthlings would agree, but I didn’t Google any of the Herald’s threesome even the once … either this year or, indeed, in any year…
  
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  December 8, 2022 8:59am
- Harry Knuts
  
  Ferald making shit up again. I suppose if they think they say it enough times we will believe them. LOL
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:02am
  - Ghost
    
    No, they aren’t making anything up
    
    https://trends.google.co.nz/trends/yis/2022/NZ/
    
    The related queries are interesting
    
    https://trends.google.co.nz/trends/explore?date=2022-01-01%202022-12-31&q=Clarke%20Gayford&geo=NZ
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:07am
    - kevn
      
      @Ghost… So the fix worked.
      
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      December 8, 2022 9:17am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Does that include the shit that Google shadow bans or are they helping reinforce a narrative? It’s beyond dispute now that big tech companies collude with governments in this manner. I’m not saying it isn’t true, but I would not be surprised in the slightest if it isn’t.
      Your faith in Google’s reporting is interesting. I can almost understand the PM’s fisherman being in numerous searches, but guacamole? Surely “Wellington protest”, “anti vaxxers” or any one of a thousand other searches are more likely to be in the top 3 considering the sort of year it was?
      
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      December 8, 2022 11:22am
      - kevn
        
        @Clan… Yes, narrative as directed.
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:29am
      - Ghost
        
        Looking at google trends banana trends far higher than guacamole
        
        Parliament protest trends for only while it is on. https://trends.google.co.nz/trends/explore?geo=NZ&q=Parliament%20protest
        
        Antivax spikes a few times https://trends.google.co.nz/trends/explore?geo=NZ&q=Antivax
        Anti vax spikes in December then is flat https://trends.google.co.nz/trends/explore?geo=NZ&q=Anti%20vax
        
        3 waters is like a bad ecg https://trends.google.co.nz/trends/explore?geo=NZ&q=3%20waters
        
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        December 8, 2022 11:43am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        They are (far left) political activists. Most “anonymised” alternate search engines (EG DDG etc etc) use google, so their search results are also “washed” through google’s political filter bubble.
        
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        December 8, 2022 4:12pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  All 3 are a little fruity
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:22pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S43rBAS8Ss

SNP Mandate Collapses.

Labour will be the main party in Scotland soon. Reform might also get some seats. Things don’t look good for the Fish lady. [4:24]
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December 8, 2022 9:09am
- oldfella
  
  Does Labour want independence? Or will that finally die with the ‘fish lady? (Curry, for a second or two I though you were talking about the Morrinsville chippie.)
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:33am
  - curry4me
    
    No, I was talking about Nicola Sturgeon. A sturgeon is a species of fish. Just my way of ridiculing her, and ‘Scottish independence’.
    
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    December 8, 2022 9:56pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGp6dQEWLdg

How Jiang Zemin’s Death Could Hurt Xi Jinping.

Former Chinese leader Jiang Zemin may be dead, but that doesn’t mean he’s totally out of the way of current Chinese leader Xi Jinping. The two were locked in a bitter power struggle for close to a decade, the basis for the people’s favorite soap opera “General Hostility”. In this episode of China Uncensored, we look at how Jiang is being remembered in Chinese state-run media, important aspects of his life that were left out, and how Jiang’s family cashed in on his position. [16:56]
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December 8, 2022 9:09am
Yvette

Hon Nanaia Mahuta
As the first indigenous woman to lead this portfolio, I believe we have a prime opportunity to call on the bi-cultural values that have characterised who we are.
Values such as:
• manaaki – kindness or the reciprocity of goodwill;
• whanaunga – our connectedness or shared sense of humanity;
• mahi tahi and kotahitanga – collective benefits and shared aspiration; and,
• kaitiaki – protectors and stewards of our intergenerational wellbeing.

– Inaugural Foreign Policy Speech to Diplomatic Corps, 4 February 2021
https://www.beehive.govt.nz/speech/inaugural-foreign-policy-speech-diplomatic-corps

reconcile the above with the present perhaps seeming treachery
and betrayal of these Maori values, or cultural self-appropriation
but they are for Foreign Affairs and dealing surely with Putin
rather than the people of this nation

take my medication now
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December 8, 2022 9:10am
- Handyman
  
  There is no indigenous population in New Zealand. The first settlers arrived about a hundred years after the signing of the Magna Carta.
  Ipso facto, there can be nothing “ancient” in Maori culture.
  For perspective, the elapsed time between the first settlers arriving and European visitors is less than the elapsed time between first European visitors and today.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:29am
- greybeard
  
  “• manaaki – kindness or the reciprocity of goodwill;
  • whanaunga – our connectedness or shared sense of humanity;”
  Oh, I was wondering what the reasons were for the murders of so many little maori children, and the subsequent avoidance of justice.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:18am
- Swifty
  
  We are being openly lied to.
  
  Talk about cherry-picking.
  
  Pre-contact Maori life featured, and in abundance, war, conquest, butchery, rape and enslavement. Just as was the eating out of food resources until they were gone.
  
  No guardianship there whatsoever.
  
  Why are they never mentioned these days – and as key elements of Te Ao Maori or tikanga?
  
  Who gets to choose what is tikanga and what is not?
  
  New Zealanders are being taken for an absolute ride – and with a narrative which is incoherent.
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:10am
  - Nickc2
    
    Hopefully, this ride won’t last long, and we can all get off.
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:16am
  - OTGO
    
    I have a book that my Father left me which is a captain’s log in James Cook’s words (old English) of his three visits to NZ.
    This book should be compulsory reading for all schoolkids because it is a great snapshot of what life was like when Cook visited.
    And it wasn’t pretty.
    
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    December 8, 2022 2:26pm
Maggie Pie

SOCIALISM….

“The problem with socialism is, you can vote your way in to it, but you have to shoot your way out of it”

– ZB Talkback caller
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December 8, 2022 9:34am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  First they came for your guns.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:39am
I remember when

Lisa Burns – Cystic Fibrosis NZ:
Trikafta to be funded by April 2023 –
WE DID IT!
Together, WE DID IT.

Wot? Surely Paddy did it?
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December 8, 2022 9:41am
- cmm
  
  Lube up taxpayer!
  
  All this self-congratulation, but no acknowledgement for those being impacted.
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:06am
Chris Nisbet

New coal mine approved in the UK…
Are countries finally waking up to the climate crisis nonsense? Is reality starting to win out over the non-problem that is ‘climate change’?
Let’s hope so.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-63892381
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December 8, 2022 9:48am
- kowtow
  
  I believe we are in the midst of a moral panic surrounding “carbon”.
  
  Once power bills create unrest or a challenge at the ballot box then the pollies who’re going along with this nonsense will come to their senses .
  
  Or third parties will come to the fore with common sense policies .
  
  Might take a while .
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:54am
- fightingtemeraire
  
  It is for coal used in the steel making not power stations
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:11am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    What difference does it make what it is being used for? Surely electricity to keep people warm is at least as important as heat to create steel? If it’s “bad for the planet” then it doesn’t matter the use it is burned for surely?
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:46am
    - Nickc2
      
      There is a vast difference between Coal used for domestic heating and Coking Coal which is used for the production of steel.
      The difference between these two fuels is that Coal is mostly carbon but Coking Coal contains mostly water and less than half the carbon content of Coal.
      
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      December 8, 2022 11:54am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        And aren’t we importing “dirty” coal from Indonesia for Huntly when we have “clean” coal in NZ but for ideological reasons, the lefties won’t mine it?
        
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        December 8, 2022 1:44pm
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Cheers Nick – I was talking about the coal used for Huntly Power Station to generate electricity for heat pumps etc. rather than in a fire in the home.
        
        As a side note, I lived in the UK when they brought in the low emission coal, made a massive difference. That was in the early 70s. Through the 60s I can remember the city being blanketed in smog when there was no wind. The coal was raw and often wet too. Not sure what the process was that cleaned it up, but the coal itself was in a regular “nugget” form, burned really hot, and there was barely any smoke emission at all.
        
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        December 8, 2022 1:49pm
  - Ehlana
    
    So, does coal used in steel making have a different carbon impact from coal used in power stations?
    
    What about coal used in steam trains? Can we still have them too?
    
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    December 8, 2022 12:30pm
Alan Wilkinson

The best thing you can say about this Government is that their incompetence trumps their stupidity.

But it’s a close run thing.
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December 8, 2022 10:16am
Maggie Pie

Looks like Wellington got the Mayor they deserved 🙁

Calls for the Capital to be re-named:

Te Upoko o te Ika a Maui

https://twitter.com/aniobrien/status/1600575788461408256

There’s never a day goes by when we don’t Thank the Lord for Wayne Brown
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December 8, 2022 10:18am
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  A dead fishhead seems about right. And they rot from the top too.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:32am
- Harry Knuts
  
  Lots of voters regret now in Wellington i would conclude.
  Cracks me up reading the replies.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:41am
  - Groggy
    
    Sadly, There wasn’t really a credible alternative in the Wgtn election – I mean Andy again, meh, smart, diligent but not a leader. Hence Ray Chung did so well despite being ignored by the debates and media coverage
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:26am
    - Jack5
      
      Wellington’s mayor seems to be paranoid very early in her term in office. From the Herald:
      
      Wellington mayor Tory Whanau’s office is working on a security plan for her that includes having a minder at events, an unmarked car so people don’t know where she is, and a clean-up of her social media.
      
      But is her Woke resentment of association with the great Wellington something to do with her parents naming her “Tory”.
      
      Bet they never expected that little “Tory” might become an enthusiastic indigenous, Leftist Green.
      
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/wellington-mayor-tory-whanau-fears-for-personal-security-from-future-rates-rise/MEOBLE65CJA7PPAIWKMWY7IJAE/
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:07pm
    - Steve Todd
      
      Ray Chung for Mayor 2025?
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:32pm
- cmm
  
  If Wayne Brown has a twin can we get him for Chch?
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:52am
  - Ghost
    
    Len Brown?
    
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    December 8, 2022 10:53am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Baaaaah Christchurch deserve Len Brown LOL!
      
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      December 8, 2022 5:31pm
Alan Wilkinson

Re the blood transfusion court case, public healthcare asks if the request might inconvenience it. Private healthcare asks if it can be served profitably.

The difference in being regarded as a problem or as a customer.
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December 8, 2022 10:24am
- ClanMcleod
  
  If the parents had the ability to go private I will guarantee the money would be raised via a go fund me type platform within 12 hours.
  This judge’s decision is NOTHING to do with health. As with all aspects of the government response to covid it is political. Like Ardern’s thuggery in removing peaceful protesters, she will never concede anything, she has to always “win”. The supreme narcissist.
  Nauseating that this child is being used as a political tool by her.
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:53am
- Phronesis
  
  It’s an unfortunate precedent. If we continue down this road we are going to see more children denied proper healthcare due to legitimate parental concerns that their strongly held beliefs and wishes will not be respected and their children may be removed from them. Just another example of how divisive this government is.
  
  Will be interesting if the next such case demands that their child only receives blood from a maori relative. A different result then I would expect.
  
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  December 8, 2022 2:12pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Vegans insist on vegan blood? Soy blood?
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:49pm
Blog-aholic

Bryce Edwards sums up why Mahuta will never be sacked…..
https://democracyproject.nz/2022/12/08/bryce-edwards-labour-needs-mahutu-to-go-but-shes-too-powerful/

This is governance by corrupted manipulation.
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December 8, 2022 10:29am
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  The Government is a dog and the shitty end is wagging the stupid end. All good so long as it falls off the cliff.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:40am
  - Ehlana
    
    I think you insult dogs.
    
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    December 8, 2022 12:32pm
    - Alan Wilkinson
      
      Only those that fall off cliffs they built themselves.
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:13pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    A mixed metaphor there, Alan
    
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    December 8, 2022 8:50pm
I remember when

We used to have have reporters that were a political commentator.
Now we have apolitical commentators.
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December 8, 2022 10:39am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Stop Co-Governance. Julian Batchelor.
https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/blog/why-we-must-avoid-the-language-of-capitulation-part-2/
https://www.stopcogovernance.kiwi/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/The-language-of-capitulation-part-2.pdf
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December 8, 2022 10:45am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  This is a coup. Nothing less. And if the majority of New
  Zealanders knew about what we going on, they would be horrified and would join in the fight against it. The reason they don’t know about this coup? As I have said, the media has been bought by the government. As such, the MSM are being forced to promote / support / encourage the coup. It’s an absolute disgrace.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:58am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Steve O – It is exactly the same with the covid bollocks, though the numbers seeing through this clown show are rising. Same with 3 Waters.
    
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    December 8, 2022 11:56am
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Not just the media. Big Tech are in on it.
    
    You also have deeply entrenched far left stupidity in the education system.
    
    Most kids coming out of high-school vote green by default because “the planet needs saving”.
    
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    December 8, 2022 4:17pm
Ghost

James, the council infrastructure is council owned, ratepayers owned. You and your labour’s thiefs are stealing that infrastructure off of the ratepayers and giving iwi a controlling say over it. You’ve privatized it. Thiefs

We proposed, and have proposed for some time that water, essentially, is a constitutional-level matter and, therefore, entrenchment would be appropriate,” he told host Nicky Styris.

He added the National and ACT parties had, in the past, “got a bit of a penchant for selling off the family silver”.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/12/james-shaw-expresses-unhappiness-at-three-waters-entrenchment-reversal.html
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December 8, 2022 10:48am
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  You can forgive the Greens for being misguided but not for being stupid.
  
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  December 8, 2022 10:53am
cmm

Herald ponders: How did Kiwis get through two world wars, the Great Depression and the 1980s without smashing up the corner dairies?

Well some stuff has changed:
* The youth (and adults) of today are not those that faced the world wars, great depression or event the 1980s. I doubt the Kiwi of today could cope with any of those.
* There were huge pressures to be good citizens. More punishment/conbsequences for disobeying the law. Kids would have got a caning etc. Parents would have felt ashamed to have their kids run around causing damage.
* There were no Tiktok challenges to steal a Mazda Demio and commit crime.
* Societal fabric was organic: churches etc. Now that has been broken down and replaced by the state.
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December 8, 2022 10:51am
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  Consequences of the anti-smacking law:
  1. Maori are still killing their kids
  2. Their kids are now killing other people
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:04am
- Jack5
  
  It’s also a prevailing ultra-Determinist philosophy that diminishes, or even rules out, the role of individual choice.
  
  Blame is laid on upbringing, family, education or lack of it, on poverty, everything but choice.
  
  What about the thousands of successful kids from broken homes and who have always been poor? The thousands of them who don’t join gangs? The thousands who made the right choices?
  
  An example of NZ’s Woke Determinism is the TV advertisement for prison warders. It’s a job of helping people is the theme of the ad.
  
  Prison should be about punishment, about keeping the community safe from violent scum, and then about helping those who choose to change.
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:25am
- MCōs
  
  NZ didn’t get through the depression without far worse domestic unrest than that which is occurring now.
  There were riots up and down the country, most notably in Auckland on 14 April 1932.
  https://www.police.govt.nz/about-us/history-and-museum/museum/exhibitions/curators-casefile/1932-auckland-riot-baton
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:52pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    Have you heard the track by Frank Zappa and the Mothers called “It Could’t Happen Here”?
    
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    December 8, 2022 4:24pm
Ghost

3 waters has passed its 3rd reading
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December 8, 2022 11:00am
- cmm
  
  As I said yesterday, the entrenchment clause is an excellent smokescreen.
  
  They make it appear that all the controversy is about the entrenchment clause. Remove the entrenchment clause, then everyone should be happy.
  
  We have been royally deceived, manipulated and screwed.
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:30am
- kevn
  
  @Ghost… Death knell for labour.
  
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  December 8, 2022 2:06pm
cmm

A scumbag goes to jail for demanding “respect” and killing someone.

5 years 6 months, so less than 3 in reality.

Yup, I know he only killed some other scum gang member and really did a service to humanity, but still an 3 year effective sentence for murder is pretty light.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/130703383/senior-mongols-member-fatally-cowardpunched-stomped-man-who-disrespected-gang-at-new-year-party
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December 8, 2022 11:25am
- Ghost
  
  Just to look at another case
  
  Man who shot lady Gaga’s dog walker just got 21 years in jail
  
  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-63871286
  
  Yeah, labour, nz isn’t soft on crime.
  
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  December 8, 2022 11:33am
cmm

Stuff: “… Luxon is right to point out that poor attendance is a chronic and worsening issue in New Zealand – but most children are still going to school most of the time.”

What a bullshit way of looking at it. It’s like pointing out that the worst criminals are not committing crime most of the time. Nope. most burglars only spend 5% of their time actually committing burglaries. The rest of the time they are sleeping or watching rugby on telly or talking to their business associates – just like anyone else.

The problem is that those kids end up becoming the criminals of today and tomorrow. They end up become the beneficiaries, prisoners and shit heads that take up the vast majority of government services (dole, government housing problems, police call outs, incarceration, teen pregnancy,…).

I’ll bet that well over 90% of the ram raider kids wag school too. People that make poor decisions in one are of their lives tend to make poor decisions in many areas.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/the-whole-truth/130516397/the-whole-truth-whats-going-on-with-school-attendance
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December 8, 2022 11:40am
mogg

Ardern has been “taken hostage by Māori Caucus “

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/author/bryce-edwards/
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December 8, 2022 11:42am
I remember when

Is it true that Harry and Meghan’s new documentary is to advise that –
it is based on real events.
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December 8, 2022 11:54am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Harry and the racist Yank are getting paid millions for a Netflix show so they can tell everyone how they have no “private life.” Seriously. You can’t make this shit up.
  Clown World strikes again.
  
  Watch this and make sure you don’t strain your neck too badly as you shake your head in complete disbelief.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fj3fROxnu8A
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:28pm
  - Ghost
    
    I had a little laugh at an article the other day. Harry had been ringing the queen a lot asking for money. Queen asks Charles about it and gets the responses, I’m not a bloody bank.
    
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    December 8, 2022 12:33pm
    - ClanMcleod
      
      “But granny’s head is on all the notes and important coins, don’t we own it all???” lol
      
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      December 8, 2022 2:40pm
- Ehlana
  
  Apparently the promo features a touching scene of her in tears, sitting on a chair decorated with a very expensive blanket featuring the letter H. I thought it was H for Harry, but apparently, it’s H for Hermes.
  
  You can have one too – for AUD 2340.
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:50pm
- Harry Knuts
  
  As the heckler asked Harry from the crowd “putting money before family Harry?”
  https://www.express.co.uk/news/royal/1706640/prince-harry-meghan-markle-Netflix-documentary-money-before-family
  He’s shameless. His Mrs is trying to be an A grade celeb but a D-grade at best.
  
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  December 8, 2022 1:10pm
- MCōs
  
  I’ve read hundreds of autobiographies/biographies. Seen movies ‘based on true events’, read shock horror articles etc and so on.
  I’ve seen with my own eyes stuff that is reported differently by reporters.
  One thing stands out.
  When it comes to controversial stories everyone has an agenda and why should we think we know the true story.
  One thing is true when it comes to the Harry/Meagan extravaganza.
  They plus all the ‘Royal correspondents’ are making a shit load of money out of all this and the more they ramp it up the more they make.
  
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  December 8, 2022 1:53pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    If you look at the video I posted above, apparently they are getting paid 100 million by Netflix to tell the story of how much they are harassed. A bit of wishful thinking I reckon.
    There’s one touching scene which looks very much like poor Harry has regretted the decision to team up with the soap opera lady. He takes his hand away and she quite forcefully pulls it back, he don’t look best pleased.
    
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    December 8, 2022 2:44pm
thetiedarch

Very interesting comment from Peter Dunne in Bryce Edwards’ column today:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/bryce-edwards-labour-needs-nanaia-mahuta-to-go-but-shes-too-powerful/4TNTR3T2VJBJPENKCWPS6XC55A/

“both are senior members of Labour’s highly influential Māori Caucus – the so-called First Fifteen – which makes it almost impossible for the Prime Minister to act against them.”

Note that it is the Maori caucus in Labour, not cabinet that is referred to as “the first fifteen”.

I know it’s a petty hill to die on, but can you imagine the outrage if National or Act had a select group of straight, white men in their caucus that pulled the strings behind the scenes and referred to themselves in that way.
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December 8, 2022 12:07pm
- Ghost
  
  Could you imagine the nationwide protests if 3 waters was a national government plan. Labour would be screaming their tits off. If a national mp had done what Nanaia had done labour would be calling for their head, kick them out of parliament.
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:12pm
- Nickc2
  
  Will this be another Labour Govt Capital Gains Tax Moment? “I have listened to the public and I ………..”
  Ca-mon Cindy, do it!!!
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:21pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I have listened to my people – so I will do the exact opposite. The people don’t know shit.
    
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    December 8, 2022 3:53pm
Nickc2

An article by John Porter on the subject of He Puapua. It’s worth the read.
Maori want sovereignty over NZ by 2040 and Cindy’s acting as their Aide Provocateur.
https://thebfd.co.nz/2022/12/08/john-porter-template-do-not-use/
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December 8, 2022 12:08pm
Ghost

I saw an article today

Football World Cup: Cheeky Kiwi ‘bikini girl’ makes unscheduled appearance on Italian TV from Doha

I wondered what would happen if it was a male smacking a female reporting on the bum

Viral video of runner slapping reporter on butt leads to criminal charge
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December 8, 2022 12:09pm
- MCōs
  
  I used to have that problem on a regular basis in my youth.
  It never occurred to me to lay a complaint with the authorities.
  
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  December 8, 2022 1:08pm
  - Ghost
    
    I used to have long hair in my youth, almost daily I’d get the regular female customer yanking it. Made me laugh at woman insulted when John key did it.
    
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    December 8, 2022 1:14pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I bet you wore a hippy headband like I did. Long hair halfway down my back.
      Bellbottom pants, platform shoes, paisley ties.
      Fuck! How embarrassing now, but there are photos – shit.
      
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      December 8, 2022 3:51pm
Jack5

What’s coming with the Therapeutics Products Bill, which appears to lift Maori remedies towards equivalence with prevailing Western medicines …

Red Radio yells “How racism still shadows cancer diagnosis …”

This headlines a report about a Maori woman’s report of being advised by telephone she had breast cancer.

The report says a diagnosis should be an open “korero” between “doctor and patient”. No problem with that.

But then it reveals the Maori lady is in fact a practitioner of traditional Maori health (rongoa) practices.

“… she treats people using traditional Māori healing practices taught to her by her tīpuna. These practices include mirimiri, which can be broadly described as Maori massage therapy. She wanted to be able to use rongoa Maori alongside traditional healthcare.”

So a Western medical practitioner fails to offer or include traditional Maori treatment, and that is the basis of Red Radio’s accusation of racism?

Does this mean, that with the Therapeutics Products Bill, Ardern is on course to making doctors practising in NZ qualify in traditional Maori medicine as well as in Western medicine?

Ardern is leading us on a race down to the Third World.

The RNZ piece:

https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/in-depth-special-projects/story/2018869604/a-cancer-diagnosis-via-a-two-minute-phone-call-the-shadow-of-racism-over-cancer
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December 8, 2022 12:16pm
- Ghost
  
  Just as a side note, my massage therapist is also trained in oncology massage, the hospital send people to her.
  
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  December 8, 2022 12:25pm
- herb1
  
  So Radio Nz thinks the Dr should have booked the patient in for a consultation, in what a week, fortnight , to be told face to face. Well I for one want to know effing well ASAP , so treatment can start. I’m saying this having been through it personally and for my wife.
  
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  December 8, 2022 2:32pm
  - Ghost
    
    A good gp gets you in as soon as the results are back.
    
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    December 8, 2022 2:42pm
Nickc2

A sad day for New Zealand as theft by Maori and the Labour Government is given legal status with the passing of the 3Waters bill.
I despair!
A Pox on all your Thiefdoms.
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December 8, 2022 12:56pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  “Who owns the water? It’s a very simple question with a very simple answer.
  Maori own the water”
  
  – John Tamihere (Jul 11, 2020)
  
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  December 8, 2022 1:18pm
  - Nickc2
    
    There’re lots of skeletons in his closet eh?
    Did he ever face a Judge for allegedly sneaking money from a Trust he was managing to fund his campaign for Mayor?
    
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    December 8, 2022 1:23pm
CAKE FACE1

The local government elections were the canary in the coal mine. Labour’s support was far softer than the polls were saying. Things have got dramatically worse for Labour since.

The Roy Morgan poll shows Labour at 25%. This result is before the likely economic collapse in 2023. Ouch.

The Hamilton East by-election this weekend could be interesting. The Greens aren’t standing, so this should pump Labour results up by about 10%. Nonetheless, a recent Curia poll shows Labour will still be annihilated. Labour will be spinning.

I suspect that Labour will be lucky to get 25% in the next general election, if it is held at the end of next year. It is conceivable that they could score in the low twenties.

The disintegration of Cindy’s support has been quite staggering in speed and scope.

If Cindy were competent, she would have cancelled five waters and the TVNZ – RNZ merger. The fact that she goes ahead with these crazy schemes shows that she has simply given up. The die is now cast.

Perhaps she is concerned that sacking Mahuta would lead to the fifteen Maori ministers resigning and defecting en masse, leading to a collapse in the government? She should have cancelled these policies anyway. They will be reversed by National / ACT one year later, in any case.

It seems to me that Cindy has lost control of her caucus. Unfortunately, she never had real world experience to fall back on with decision-making, so she constantly makes schoolgirl mistakes. We saw this during the Covid hoax, where Cindy was trying to eliminate an airborne virus, but only succeeded in eliminating the productive economy. She then proceeded to do a little dance to celebrate her callous vandalism!

The good news is that Cindy is gone in a years time. The bad news is Cindy isn’t gone for another year! The ongoing damage to the economy and society could be serious.

I fear for the state that our country will be in, by the time that Cindy is unceremoniously heaved out. It is scary how people were so taken in by a vacuous grinning clown.

Cindy’s legacy will be that she will be remembered as the worst Prime Minister in our history. Every reform she implements will be reversed. The only thing enduring from her tenure will be a sour taste in the mouth, as people ponder how and why the darkest time in our history unfolded with such little resistance.

At least Cindy will finally be gone in one years time, I suppose…
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December 8, 2022 12:56pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Jaspinda is not in control. She is not running NZ anymore.
  I have always said she would stay until Election eve.
  I have been wrong before.
  
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  December 8, 2022 3:43pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  I hope Jaxxie will be cited as a cautionary tale to young voters assessing the promises and philosophies of would-be politicians.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:00pm
Maggie Pie

RANDOM IMPERTINENT QUESTION

A bestie asks….

Is it true that Chinese people living in our country do not feel safe due to ‘CCP interference’ in their communities?

https://twitter.com/tzemingdynasty/status/1598487642890379264
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December 8, 2022 1:02pm
- MCōs
  
  Some Thais in NZ, my wife for example, won’t express a negative opinion of the King at the temple because you don’t know who’s taking notes.
  It’s extremely unlikely to happen, but back home people disappear into the prison system for very lengthy sentences for something they may have written on Facebook.
  
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  December 8, 2022 1:36pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Yes, we were told never to complain at a Thai restaurant because they’ll spit in the dessert.
    
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    December 8, 2022 2:02pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Our Thai friend never comments about the King, but she married an American.
    Live is Alaska – big change, but she is happy.
    
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    December 8, 2022 3:36pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  It appears to be true in Australia at least.
  
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  December 8, 2022 2:49pm
- Sir Henry Morgan
  
  The CCP basically runs Chinese communities in New Zealand via its United Front Work Department.
  
  The largest ever demonstration by Chinese in New Zealand would surely have been back in 2008 when the CCP got everyone down to Aotea Square to ‘support the Beijing Olympics’. Supporting the Olympics turned out to involve bashing anyone asking questions or offering criticism. This eventually progressed to attacking non-Chinese who were photographing events (Chinese photographers were left unmolested). The police were nowhere to be seen, and later responded to reports of assault by blaming the victims.
  
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  December 8, 2022 4:54pm
I remember when

Cristiano Ronaldo:
Is the hardest thing for a sport’s star to handle the effects of growing older.
Does the way they handle this show whether they have real ‘star power.’
3 0
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December 8, 2022 1:28pm
Maggie Pie

This is an interesting pic….

How come there weren’t any ‘front-benchers’ wanting to get in on the act?

https://twitter.com/MarjaLubeck/status/1600614732586954752

(I was going to say what a motley-crew …..but people reckon my partner looks like the drummer)
9 0
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December 8, 2022 2:10pm
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  Looking forward to their financial support for Musk’s Twitter.
  
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  December 8, 2022 2:22pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  As with much of what Labour do on social media these days, Marja restricts comments to her buddies. Cowards.
  
  8 0
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  December 8, 2022 3:03pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Most of them, if the Polls come true, will be looking for jobs next year.
  
  9 0
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  December 8, 2022 3:06pm
- mandk
  
  Lubek hasn’t got a hope in hell of being in Parliament after the next election, except perhaps as a visitor guide. She’s ranked 34th on the Labour list.
  
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  December 8, 2022 4:51pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  They live in their own private bubble
  
  2 0
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  December 8, 2022 9:02pm
ClanMcleod

Steve Kirsch comments on the baby Will case. His comments are measured, he sides with the legal ruling based on current NZ law, but points out one critical issue regarding the decision.
In another case of a baby receiving a blood transfusion, the baby died from blood clots after the operation.

Another baby, Baby Alex, received a transfusion of vaccinated blood and got blood clots and died. Providence Sacred Heart Medical Center in Spokane, Washington has removed all records of this case. This is how the officials in New Zealand can testify that there is no evidence of harm… because that evidence is expunged.

That they claimed there is no evidence of harm, just because it isn’t on the “record”, is a travesty and an embarrassment to those in the medical and legal professions who are responsible for going down this path. They may believe they are protecting the integrity of their institutions. To any right thinking person it will have the opposite effect.
This was another terrible day for trust in NZ authorities.

The mother of the baby who died posted a comment when he got sick and before he died. It is tragic.

https://stevekirsch.substack.com/p/new-zealand-court-takes-custody-of?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=548354&post_id=89274186&isFreemail=true&utm_medium=email
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December 8, 2022 3:15pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Seems like someone senior has been enforcing the rules in the Manual, and now does not want to make a cock out of themselves.
  I mentioned yesterday about Public Servant going pan faced and saying nothing.
  You will lose. But this time common sense (not that common) has won.
  
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  December 8, 2022 3:30pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Free speech. Misinformation, disinformation.
Is this shit happening in NZ? Is it going to happen?
Tucker Carlson on exposing the Censored Twitter Files. Lots to unpack but about 12 minutes it gets real interesting. This is what is going on, the media will not tell you – yes NZ media.
Further on Carlson hands out more info on Arizona Secretary of State Katie Hobbs. She is part of the game.
https://thepatriotchronicles.com/news-for-you/tucker-carlson-gives-a-damning-breakdown-of-the-twitter-files-exposed-new-crooks/

NZ has partly beaten one crook today. 3 waters has passed the third reading, but without the ‘entrenchment’ amendment.
Rotten snaky bastards. Tell me Jaspinda did not know this. She tells lies you know.
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December 8, 2022 3:20pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Luckily your pal Tucker can be counted upon to keep playing Butt Hunter. Did he have anything to say about the Herschel Walker debacle or the latest criminal convictions for the Trump crime organisation?
  
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  December 8, 2022 6:47pm
Master Mariner

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU2202/S00416/maritime-industry-says-fuel-quality-issues-threaten-new-zealand-fuel-security.htm
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December 8, 2022 3:36pm
Ghost

Kaipara mayor backs down on karakia ban after ‘frank’ discussion

https://www.1news.co.nz/2022/12/08/kaipara-mayor-backs-down-on-karakia-ban-after-frank-discussion/
4 5
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December 8, 2022 4:05pm
- Swifty
  
  Interesting to see on social media many comments along the lines of “you forced on to us your Christmas and Easter etc religious observations, so it’s only fair that we can force our karakia and matariki etc on to you…”
  
  Yep, that’s the argument.
  
  Two wrongs DO make a right, it seems.
  
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  December 8, 2022 4:38pm
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  The compromise is that each councillor will get a turn to start the meeting with a brief whatever. That’s going to be entertaining. Maybe they can sell tickets?
  
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  December 8, 2022 5:20pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Sounds ok. If it’s really important to a councillor, say whatever. If not, it’s only a brief interruption in the agenda.
    Unless you think the mayor can unilaterally tell the councillors what they can say, how and when.
    
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    December 8, 2022 6:44pm
- greybeard
  
  I am sick of this maori language CRAP.
  They had no written language.
  Their language as transcribed by Europeans only used 14 letters of the alphabet.
  They had no soft sounds: c,d, l, q, s, v, y
  After apparently living in NZ for 800 years they never discovered the wheel, ceramics, metallurgy, written language, paper, use of coal, any form of written information such as maps or any history.
  They had no knowledge of Australia and I very much doubt that they ever made return journeys to other Pacific Islands: how would we know? – they never wrote anything down !
  The re-invention of the great maori culture should stop.
  
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  December 8, 2022 6:33pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    How many societies do you think invented all those things independently?
    Why should Maori have had knowledge of Australia? Have you tried getting from your armchair to Botany Bay by sailing a double-hulled canoe with a woven sail?
    
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    December 8, 2022 6:52pm
Ghost

Don’t get our hopes up newshub

Former Health Minister David Clark has refused to commit to standing at next year’s election and expects to speak to media about the topic at a later time.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/12/david-clark-refuses-to-commit-to-standing-at-next-year-s-election-expects-to-speak-on-topic-in-due-course.html
6 1
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December 8, 2022 4:08pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  He’s announced he’s not standing.
  The rats are lining up and the ship is sinking.
  
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  December 8, 2022 4:28pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Well, he will be a loss as a figure for Kiwiblog commenters to scorn.
    
    2 12
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    December 8, 2022 6:42pm
- rockape
  
  Stuff seems more certain he is going.
  
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  December 8, 2022 4:34pm
Swifty

Indonesia releases the Bali bombing mastermind and bomb maker after just 10 years.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11514037/Bali-bomber-Umar-Patek-released-parole-serving-10years-making-explosives-2002-attack.html

Some 200-odd people died and many, many more were severely injured.

Interesting.
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December 8, 2022 4:34pm
- info@cruzpro.com
  
  Getting ten years imprisonment for murdering 200 people and injuring scores more seems like a pretty light sentence.
  
  Owning small quantities of marijuana in Indonesia gets you a 5-15 year prison term. Having one Kg or more results in life imprisonment.
  
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  December 8, 2022 5:36pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    [Mod – do not make such accusations of members, thank you]
    
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    December 8, 2022 6:40pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Killing people seems to be less punished than making life to them (if you’re not married)
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:04pm
Ghost

Should a council run ECE? Personally I’d love to see councils returning to delivering their core basics, not owning cafes or gyms, etc

About 350 children and their parents are calling for “time out” on a “rushed” budget proposal from Auckland mayor Wayne Brown that would see their council-run early education centres cut.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300760303/call-for-time-out-as-auckland-mayor-proposes-scrapping-childcare-centres
9 1
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December 8, 2022 5:28pm
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  If there’s demand at the price point charged by the Council ECE, then the private sector should take over.
  
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  December 8, 2022 9:07pm
info@cruzpro.com

Just got an email from NZ Police saying that the government is looking at increasing the gun license fees. You have ten weeks to voice your opinion.
5 0
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December 8, 2022 5:31pm
- Ghost
  
  Hasn’t been raised since 1999
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/480361/consultation-begins-over-proposed-firearms-licensing-fees-hike
  
  3 1
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  December 8, 2022 5:38pm
- GJM
  
  They are talking thousands of dollars. It will price endorsement holders (collectors, pistol shooters) and dealers out of the sport. This the intent.
  Having recetntly renewed my license, the cost recovery reason is rubbish. ThePolice are cost plus, and many costs are of their own making, due to their incompetence and red tape. the 35 page form to apply, plus the 10 pages for endorsements, and much of the info is repeated. THey can’t blame the change in regulations and Arms Act – the Police wrote them along with the confiscation.
  
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  December 8, 2022 6:29pm
Ghost

Looks more like a human muzzle

Dyson has revealed fresh details on its most controversial product to date, a pair of noise-cancelling headphones that cleans the air while you’re breathing.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/dyson-zone-everything-you-need-to-know-about-air-purifying-headphones/GINAX4PNDVCAFG6YFVJAKSXZWI/
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December 8, 2022 5:31pm
Chris Nisbet

After pretty much ignoring 182 Waters for the last year, it’s nice to see One News has figured out it’s controversial.
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December 8, 2022 6:03pm
Maggie Pie

Thort this worth sharing with the group….

My partner walked in a few moments ago with his mobile stuck to his ear.
As he went upstairs to change I heard him say….. “Chynahs’ fcuked!!”
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December 8, 2022 6:24pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Who is Chyna and how was he/she/it fucked?
  
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  December 8, 2022 6:38pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    MILKEY…..you’re back!! 😀
    
    You and Ross patched up your differences?
    
    8 1
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    December 8, 2022 6:46pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      I was just wondering whether you had joined Deacon Don in an immaculate conception today.
      
      3 7
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      December 8, 2022 6:54pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        And I was just wondering if you’ve still got that neck beard?
        
        5 1
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        December 8, 2022 7:09pm
kevn

@mma… Repeating yourself.
Careful of the fixation, remember your recent efforts.
6 0
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December 8, 2022 6:59pm
Prince

I need a translation of this evening’s weather forecast.
‘Heavy rain at the top and bottom of the Motu’.

Google tells me ‘motu’ is maori for ‘island’.
So are we talking about the South Island or North Island ? Or have they decided that Motu now means The Country’.Will there be heavy rain in Wellington ? Blenheim ? Otago ?
If TVNZ have to use a language that 90% of their audience does not understand, and not translate it for us, perhaps they could apply some accuracy to convey the message.
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December 8, 2022 7:04pm
- graham
  
  What is even more farcical, is when they use Maori words and immediately follow it with the translation.
  
  “Live from Kirikiriroa Hamilton …”
  “And in Tamaki Makaurau Auckland …”
  “In Paremata Parliament …”
  
  I have yet to work out whether this is a tacit admission that the attempts to “normalise” the use of the language is an utter failure – surely, if a language has been “normalised” then it doesn’t need translating to another language so that people can understand it – or just a stubborn insistence to continue virtue-signalling irrespective of whether people can actually understand what is being said.
  
  When even the Minister for Māori Development – and former broadcaster – wants to see more content in English, saying “In the past it has all been about the language … but we need our own news in English and we need our own programmes in English“, doesn’t that tell you something?
  
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  December 8, 2022 7:29pm
- Don Beckett
  
  If they’re talking about the whole of New Zealand, they should say “nga motu roa”.
  The long islands of Aot….(gag) New Zealand. 🙂
  
  6 1
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  December 8, 2022 7:37pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Please don’t watch it if it upsets you so much.
  
  2 11
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  December 8, 2022 8:18pm
  - Prince
    
    Just confuses me. I watch the weather forecast to see what the weather is forecast to be tomorrow.
    Weird, I know.
    
    7 1
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    December 8, 2022 9:47pm
    - graham
      
      Huh … same here! Weird, right? Imagine – watching the weather to try and find out about, well, the weather.
      
      4 1
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      December 8, 2022 10:40pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Do you find the pictures too difficult to interpret? Perhaps just listen to the RNZ forecasts on the wireless.
      
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      December 9, 2022 6:55am
      - Yabster
        
        troll on troll
        
        1 0
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        December 9, 2022 7:17am
      - graham
        
        For me, mikenmildagain, the solution is even simpler – I simply go to one of my preferred weather sites on the Internet. I can find as much information as I require, updated regularly, and I can understand it.
        
        Honestly, it really doesn’t bother me if TVNZ continue presenting the news and weather in such a manner, where they randomly throw in words that the the majority of their audience doesn’t understand. Like the vast majority of people, my primary news source is no longer the TV.
        
        I can’t help but reflect that, surely, the purpose of a news program is to communicate the news, weather, and current affairs to the audience clearly and in a manner where they can understand it. And if your audience is struggling to understand segments at times, then hasn’t that news program failed in its prime purpose?
        
        But in an online world, where the choice of where to source your news from is virtually limitless, it really is unimportant. TVNZ News is becoming increasingly irrelevant, and has nobody to blame but themselves.
        
        1 0
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        December 9, 2022 8:11am
Ghost

One who will retire next year will be Jacinda. It’s just a question of if she does it before the election to save face or after her election night loss.

The Prime Minister has revealed to Newshub some MPs are set to call it quits and she’s looking to scrap some of the Government’s reforms next year admitting Labour’s tried to do too much and needs to focus.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/12/prime-minister-jacinda-ardern-confirms-labour-mps-to-retire-government-to-pare-back-some-reforms.html
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December 8, 2022 7:40pm
Alan Wilkinson

This is paywalled but worth reading if you can:
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-truth-about-matt-hancock/
The Pandemic Diaries of the UK Minister of Health was co-written by a journalist sceptical of the government’s actions and this is her take on what happened and why.
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December 8, 2022 10:55pm
- Ghost
  
  Wasn’t paywalled for me, was able to read the whole article.
  
  I at he’d Hancock in I’m a celebrity, he was a very interesting person.
  
  2 1
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  December 8, 2022 11:10pm

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