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April 10, 2022 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 10 April 2022

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General Debate

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CJames

When will the Leader of the Opposition wake up and realise the media are doing all they can to take him down. They believe lying is acceptable if the end result helps Labour stays in power and their government cash keeps rolling in.
There is an article on Newshub by Mike Kilpatrick (I won’t link to it to keep the eyeball traffic down) criticising Luxon for saying there is no electric alternative to utes so they are taxed unfairly. The article then turns into the advertorial for a LDV plaything. You can’t actually buy one. Just put a deposit down (they don’t state the full price) – similar to the Tesla ute which seems to be delayed yet again. Ad claimed it will be available Summer 22 ( Mike didn’t notice that has actually been and gone) Then the article mentions its specs. It is only 2WD and towing rated for just 1000kg -when the range drops to only 150km – be less than 100km in winter conditions. Most 4X4s are rated as 3500kg and will do 300km towing that heavier load between fillups. Those fills take 5 minutes as opposed to the hours batteries do. The shorter charge time promotors use is invariably only an 80% charge so the range will just be <70% of the quoted figure.
So what Luxon said was absolutely correct. You cannot buy an electic twincab 4WD ute with 3500kg towing capacity. Battery powered ones ARE NOT available. Can't even get a 2WD toy one. I can't go to the showroom, pay the money and drive away in one The reporter just spun a big story, lying by omission, using some advertising blurb for a tacky toy to imply the Opposition Leader wasn't telling the truth. And we don't even know if the vehicle will turn out to be a dog – what is its track record for reliability? Australian reviews of the LDV ICE ones describe them as rusty shitboxes. https://autoexpert.com.au/posts/dont-buy-warning-why-owning-an-ldv-in-australia-can-go-wrong Even if the Chinese manufacturer makes a vehicle that isn't as bad as all the others in their range, will the electric one do 1,000,000km like many Hiluxes do? (for the benefit of those that don't understand sarcastic rhetorical questions, no it won't)
No doubt Mr Kilpatrick will wonder why their readership is tanking and reporters now rate lower than used car salespeople. Look in the mirror.
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April 10, 2022 8:01am
- Albert_Ross
  
  I am sure he knows perfectly well that there are some in the media who are doing everything in their power to take him down.
  
  What’s he supposed to do about it?
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:03am
  - artemisia
    
    What is he supposed to do? Mr Luxon could quietly mention the next PM might not be too well disposed to them. Nods and winks, no need to suggest save the house deposit while they still have a job.
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:34am
    - Albert_Ross
      
      And that’s not at all likely to make them even more determined to make sure that he doesn’t get to be the next PM, is it.
      
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      April 10, 2022 11:31am
  - altiora
    
    Agreed. Since Ardern’s election, the media has taken the view that their job is to bring the Opposition to account, not the Government. Opposition alternative budget proposals are to be scrutinised and “costed”, yet the Government is permitted without question to borrow billions, and spend billions without anything to show for it without the media so much as asking questions. But while this is inherently unfair, Luxon can use it to his advantage by showing that (unlike Ardern) he can answer questions in a straightforward manner without incessant waffle and spin. How refreshing that will be to the public who are simply over the Ardern personality cult.
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:47am
    - Bob
      
      their job is to bring the Opposition to account,….
      NO altiora….
      the media have been paid and told, that their job is to BRING DOWN the National Party.
      Under Communism there is no place for an opposition.
      
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      April 10, 2022 12:17pm
    - Harriet
      
      “…..Since Ardern’s election, the media has taken the view that their job is to bring the Opposition to account, not the Government……….How refreshing that will be to the public who are simply over the Ardern personality cult….”
      
      Absolutely agree!!!
      
      “…….iMP
      To quote a Govt Minister of this current Administration …”Old white males should get out of the way for younger women”. I took that to the HRC. They replied “ Nothing to see here, move along citizen.”…….’
      
      In just one generation the [white]name Ardern at the senior level of NZ government has gone from fully responsible — to totally irresponsible. 😎
      
      Meanwhile [white]’male toxicity’ defends women and children in the Ukraine —- while women sit on the sidelines. 😎
      
      And where does the minister think the Westminster system of government that she serves in came from — several hundred years of male maori[non white] protocol? 😎
      
      It should be sent back to the HRC — ACT — and the media.
      As this government is absolutely disgusting at several levels. 😎
      
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      April 10, 2022 12:44pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    What’s he supposed to do about it?
    
    Raise hell, like Trump did. But he’s not Trump. He’s just slightly better than the loony left clown show and his only benefit is buying time to somewhat slow the slide into economic and social destruction. Buying time so someone with the guts may emerge.
    
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    April 10, 2022 12:41pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Heh, if the journo is like some others I know, he will be proud of his research abilities on the more technical matters of the new economy…
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:09am
- Benedict Yu
  
  The whole idea is absurd. Petrol is in the emissions trading scheme. The only way to reduce New Zealand emissions is to withdraw units from the ETS.
  
  When I buy petrol at my BP station, BP buys Units on my behalf. If I buy an EV, the Units I used to buy will be purchased by another emitter. New Zealand’s emissions will remain the same. The market for Units will always clear.
  
  Apparantly Luxon does not understand this. Otherwise he would not be drawn down a rabbit hole of debates about electric utility vehicles. Whether you can buy one is neither here nor there. The whole fee / rebate is an absurdity. It is simply a wealth transfer from farmers to elite urban elite.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:14am
  - Albert_Ross
    
    That’s quite right of course Benedict, it’s an important point that needs to be more widely understood as James Shaw moves ever closer to a set of proposals that will do nothing but divert resources away from cost-effective, manageable ways of reducing GHG emissions and towards ruinously expensive ways of reducing GHG emissions.
    
    However. I do wish advocates for the market-based approach, ie the ETS, would point to some actual, real-world examples of real people taking real action to actually reduce GHG emissions in response to not being able to buy ETS units. There may not be many in NZ as yet, but there must be some from the EU or the US, both of which have achieved substantial reductions over the last couple of decades. If the point and efficacy of emissions trading, rather than Government regulating to enforce its chosen technologies, is to be got across
    – we need to do better than explanations based in economic theory.
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:25am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      There are probably few examples because units have been free or cheap. Because the government is scared of high carbon prices.
      
      If the numbers of units were reduced over the next 30 years to whatever target we commit to, that target WILL be met. By millions of decisions. We don’t really need to know how. But as the price of carbon rises, examples would become evident.
      
      But it won’t happen. We will just have clown shows like EV subsidies. I mean the idea came from Julie Ann Genter. How could it not be mad?
      
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      April 10, 2022 10:49am
      - Albert_Ross
        
        Again – you don’t need to convince me. I know how it’s supposed to work. But if more people, who are not economists or policy wonks by training or by nature, are to be convinced – then actual examples of it really working in practice need to be found and publicised.
        
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        April 10, 2022 11:34am
      - Warren
        
        Ask yourself Benedict if Chris Luxon lied like this he would get hammered by the Media while the wannabe Princess and Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern gets a free ride.
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/my-account/profile/details/
        She drove this MP Louisa Wall out of Parliament and then tried to praise her to the media.
        
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        April 10, 2022 11:51am
    - Phronesis
      
      The problem is that the examples will be things like shutting down older more inefficient coal fired power stations that were requiring heavy maintenance and replacing them with wind or solar. The so called economic analysis will then say the coal produce X amount of carbon a year subject to tariff and the solar produces zero carbon a year. Ignoring the fact that the numbers only work because the solar was produced in China at great carbon cost but outside of the relevant scheme. They keep telling us it’s a global problem but don’t even try to account for emissions on a global scale.
      
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      April 10, 2022 11:45am
  - Matt Long
    
    I’ve looked into EVs at various times, particularly PHEVs, like the Outlander.
    They are urban vehicles basically. The towing capacity is either zero or inadequate, the new PHEV Prius is only a 4 seater.
    They are rich people’s toys and unsuitable for work vehicles or practical family life.
    
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    April 10, 2022 10:05am
    - David Garrett
      
      Matt L: Talking of towing capacity, has anyone heard of an electric bulldozer, or digger?
      
      Back in my youth I worked in some remote areas on a pipeline job – my first proper job after dropping out of uni in fact. Even if there was such a thing, I dunno how you would have recharged an electric D9 bulldozer in the back blocks of Taranaki.
      
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      April 10, 2022 10:26am
      - All_on_Red
        
        David, here is a discussion with Lord Bamford of the English company JCB and what they are looking at
        for their large industrial equipment.
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19Q7nAYjAJY
        
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        April 10, 2022 10:32am
      - Dougal10
        
        Big bulldozers can be electric like trains they have a big diesel engine driving a generator. They are ripe for hydrogen fuel cell conversion.
        
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        April 10, 2022 10:56am
      - Jack5
        
        Turbo-electric propulsion, a bit like our hybrid cars, has been used in ships for at least a century, including in some battleships, aircraft-carriers, and liners.
        
        Britain’s two big new aircraft carriers, the Queen Elizabeth and the Prince of Wales, have turbo-electric drive.
        
        Nuclear-powered ships and submarines seem to use nuclear to make steam that either drives the propellers through a gear-box, or generates electricity to power them.
        
        Electrical power’s not the problem then, but as D.G. suggests, getting feasible batteries.
        
        The push is to get ships off diesel and on to cleaner-burning LPG, but Rolls-Royce, with Norwegian research funds helping, is working on battery systems for ships:
        
        https://www.rolls-royce.com/media/press-releases/2018/15-08-2018-rr-launches-new-battery-system-for-ships.aspx
        
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        April 10, 2022 11:34am
      - David Garrett
        
        All on: Many thanks for that Red…another great example of what a great blog this is – although I vaguely knew about fuel cells and hydrogen – used 50 years ago in the Apollo spacecraft – I had no idea that heavy duty hydrogen powered engines existed.
        
        Well worth watching this link.
        
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        April 10, 2022 11:36am
      - Matt Long
        
        DG I have heard of an electric excavator, used indoors, powered by a generator outside once the battery ran down.
        
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        April 10, 2022 12:08pm
      - chukar
        
        See Caterpillar.
        Their have just released their first high track electric machine.
        They have had electric dozers for some years D7E for example.
        The benefits of electric motors high torque means less costly and more efficient transmissions
        Having said that all the electric construction machines I know of are charged by an on board diesel motor and generator, so certainly still need fossil fuel to work. No Batteries.
        Not sure about the new hi track model but assume it is similar.
        
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        April 10, 2022 12:15pm
      - CJames
        
        Jack. All those ships to my knowledge have a diesel or gas turbine engine driving a generator. The output from this powers the electric motors on the shafts. There are a lot of advantages with this system – no gearboxes – you can have a different number of engines to propellers – you can have bow or stern thrusters running off the same power.
        There will be big differences in the power systems between those and battery motors. The current setup are invariably AC, maybe with a variable speed drive. Battery ones seem to be brushless DC = lot of power lost going from DC to AC
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:08pm
      - cmm
        
        All diesel electric trains are essentially hybrids, like most ships etc. They can get huge torque.
        
        But hybrids, as constructed for motoring, are not quite the same beast. Just because one configuration can achieve massive torque does not mean another can.
        
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        April 10, 2022 7:02pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Tesla Cybertruck might be almost useful – claiming up to 800km range for most expensive $120k version, so perhaps it will be enough to tow a heavy trailer a few hundred km.
      
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      April 10, 2022 11:09am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        Will push up the cost of freight massively. As will many other loony left initiatives.
        
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        April 10, 2022 12:47pm
      - cmm
        
        The give-away that it is hype is in the name: Cyber.
        
        Why Cyber anything? Cyber means something related to computation, control or communication.
        WTF has that got to do with a truck?
        
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        April 10, 2022 7:05pm
    - Bob
      
      Most EV vehicles are for the virtue signalling ladies of the Bridge Club.
      Meanwhile their husbands drive around in their image professing top end of the range petrol vehicles, and they buy their children small petrol engine’d cars for uni.
      
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      April 10, 2022 12:21pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      A PHEV is basically a hybrid but with a bit bigger battery as far as I understand it.
      
      The 2022 Outlander appears to do about 80km on the charged battery under “ideal conditions” (one anorexic jockey driving and no other added weight, no heating, towing or aircon) or similar scenario I would imagine.
      
      Cost? Always ask the cost.
      
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      April 10, 2022 1:33pm
      - cmm
        
        Pros: Can be used as an EV on short trips, but run as a hybrid when the battery goes flat.
        
        Cons: heavier battery, higher cost than a hybrid.
        
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        April 10, 2022 7:08pm
  - Phronesis
    
    It does have another effect. I’m seriously considering buying a 4th car for around town. As the operating costs go up the capital costs of owning more vehicles becomes less of a factor and it makes sense to run another vehicle that takes advantage of the subsidies. From a carbon point of view this greatly increases emissions as half the carbon cost of a car is in its construction and not its operation.
    
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    April 10, 2022 10:15am
    - septic skeptic
      
      Same with me. If I buy an EV it will be as an extra not a replacement.
      
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      April 10, 2022 11:30am
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      Not everyone has the space to park 4 cars.
      
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      April 10, 2022 12:09pm
      - BeaB
        
        So? I do. You don’t. So what.
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:57pm
      - AitchW
        
        What relevance does that have? Some apartment dwellers have no room for parking. I’m afraid your comment sounds like left whataboutism!
        
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        April 10, 2022 5:34pm
- peterwn
  
  Chris Luxon would fully appreciate this. However he is in opposition and therefore cannot bribe or bully the media into submission. All he can do is work around this the best he can. This would be just about the most important factor surrounding his decision making.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:44am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Sorry I don’t follow. Why can’t he state that this scheme will not reduce emissions?
    
    I know why the government won’t withdraw units from the ETS. because it will increase petrol prices. They recently panicked and reduced petrol prices. 🙄 Whereas those high petrol prices would have caused emissions to fall.
    
    The government just ties itself in knots of contradictions. In 4 weeks the government will release the first 3 years emissions budget. Expect billions trying to persuade people to catch buses and a giant baseball bat to reduce dairy herds.
    
    The first will fail. You could make public transport free and patronage will not go up much. The second will succeed. The government has the power to regulate and tax farmers into oblivion. Result will be a decline in dairy exports. That lost market share will immediately be captured other international competitors such as Brazil.
    
    What a 🤡 clown show.
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:15am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      BTW I recall talking to a Wellington public servant who was an advocate for cutting dairy cows to reduce emissions. I pointed out that other dairy exporters would just fill the gap, negating New Zealand’s emissions reductions.
      
      He said to me “No they would not do that because they are committed to reducing emissions too” 🤡
      
      This is what we are dealing with.
      
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      April 10, 2022 11:20am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        There are some that don’t understand numbers, economics, marketing, supply and demand.
        Unfortunately the Labour Party is infested with them
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:10pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        There are some that don’t understand human nature.
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:50pm
      - AitchW
        
        The world loves dairy products. If we reduce our output it is likely to be replaced by high input high carbon producers. The irony is that the Luddite Greens blocked the import of GE grass seed that dramatically reduced the methane emissions of grass fed cattle.
        
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        April 10, 2022 5:38pm
  - curry4me
    
    Chris Luxon could put all the releases on YT Bit
    
    Chute, Rumble, and The Platform. Maybe even eclusivelt to The Platform. Once in government; drop the “team of 55 million” fund and redirect all ads to media that didn’t join the above team. National are already using email, and social media.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:32am
  - Paulus
    
    Even when Luxon becomes PM the media will not make any changes to its current denigration practice of anything but left wing/communist like their Unions declare.
    
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    April 10, 2022 2:31pm
- redeye
  
  Further, it looks like a ute full of tools and timber would be unlikely to make the length of transmission gully.
  
  Electric vehicle owners are being warned to top up if heading over Transmission Gully, because the steep road will drain their batteries faster than the old coastal route.
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/464887/ev-owners-warned-to-plan-charge-ahead-of-using-transmission-gully
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:46am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Sounds like hype.
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:16am
  - potato
    
    If left home with nearly empty petrol tank I would run out of fuel on Transmission Gully, Electric batteries are still crap and so run out quick
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:41am
    - peterwn
      
      When the Auckland Harbour Bridge opened in 1959, more cars than expected ran out of petrol on the bridge – so much so that it was made an offence under the then Bridge bylaws. The problem seemed to be that as the car was not level the tank outlet could be left high and dry even though some petrol remained in the tank.
      If electric cars using Transmission Gully had a reasonable regenerative braking system then some energy would be returned to the battery on the downhill run.
      
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      April 10, 2022 8:20pm
  - Phronesis
    
    What Laura, the car owner, and Emma, the “journalist”, don’t understand is that driving faster uses more energy. Basically all the energy required to move something from A to B is required to overcome drag which is proportional to the square of the speed. It has nothing at all to do with the steepness of the road. In fact an EV is more efficient than an ICE vehicle up and down hills because of its ability to regeneratively brake.
    The Media, making people stupider since forever.
    
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    April 10, 2022 10:23am
    - cmm
      
      Partially correct.
      
      When you go uphill you need to burn more petrol/electricity to push the vehicle up hill.
      
      If an electric motor is under load, then it will most likely be way less efficient uphill because the electronics, battery and motor will be less efficient at higher currents – turning more power into heat.
      
      You get some of that back “free wheeling” down the other side, but not all.
      
      In ICE vehicles, every time you touch the brakes it converts some of that energy into heat.
      
      With EVs and regenerative braking, some of that is recaptured, but by no means all of it. There are inefficiencies in the motor (now acting as a generator), the electronics and, finally in the charging of a battery (electricity going into charging a battery is less than what comes out again).
      
      The big difference is that if you have an ICE and see the fuel is low you can pull into a petrol station and fill up in 2 minutes. No such luck with leccy.
      
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      April 10, 2022 7:18pm
- BullyHayes
  
  try getting any of the current LDV repaired in NZ – there is only a limited pool of spares/replacements and as a result the vehicles are often off the road for months waiting for parts to be brought in
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:21am
  - Paulus
    
    And the Insurance Companies will ultimately charge for getting parts from Overseas as they do now with any parts not available.
    
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    April 10, 2022 2:32pm
Yvette

“Co-covernance”
from Hansard, Ministerial Statements
UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples—Government Support
… It was with regret that in 2007 the Labour Government was unable to sign the declaration. We believed that it deserved to receive more than a lip-service approach. In particular, there were inconsistencies between the text and New Zealand’s constitutional and legal framework that would be difficult to overturn while retaining the fabric of what our society is working towards.

… This document is not a time for window dressing, empty promises, or hollow gains. If the National Government is serious about this declaration and about realising its aspirations, then why has it been signed under a veil of secrecy?

More important, why have New Zealanders been prevented from participating in a debate on an issue that has a profound impact on the future that we see for this country? Why is the Prime Minister not making this announcement in the House? The Government has taken care to recognise that this document is aspirational and non-binding, an approach that should weigh heavily on the efforts of those people who wanted the declaration to be a strong platform for the continued assertion of indigenous rights. – Hon Nanaia Mahuta, Hansard, Sitting date: 20 Apr 2010
https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/document/49HansD_20100420_00000071/ministerial-statements-un-declaration-on-the-rights-of

I take it from this that Nanaia Mahuta alerts that a national Government signing the indigenous People’s Declaration was “a lip-service approach, window dressing, empty promises, or hollow gains” and that the document was “aspirational and non-binding”.

And Mahuta believed “New Zealanders [had] been prevented from participating in a debate on an issue that has a profound impact on the future”

I wonder how that now compares to Maori being exclusively consulted for six months to result in Willie Jackson reporting on that to Cabinet, who will then have a “conversation” with the rest of the Nation, including I assume Maori again?
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April 10, 2022 8:01am
- RockyJ
  
  The consultation to date has been with iwi and Maori organisations. In other words with Maori grandees, not ordinary Maori who are as likely to get shafted as the rest of us.
  Now that the first round of consultation has ended and consultation with the general public has begun, will there be a report for the public on the outcomes of the first round? Hmm?
  
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  April 10, 2022 2:00pm
CJames

Interesting analysis over at Daily Sceptic. Using the official NZ government data, their statistician shows that relative to the unvaccinated, the vaccinated have a higher case and hospitalisation rate. Even being boosted has not been the silver bullet it was promoted as. The death rate is higher for the unvaccinated but not by a big margin when one looks at the actual numbers, not rates. As well as that lack of vaccine effectiveness, there is the excess mortality averaging 50 deaths a week from about December 2020 onwards.
https://dailysceptic.org/2022/04/09/vaccinated-have-up-to-six-times-the-infection-rate-of-unvaccinated-new-zealand-government-data-show/
Of course there may be a totally logical explanation for it. The type of analysis that epidemiologists do. But there has only been silence. I wonder why? Maybe they are all too busy being wannabe TV celebrities to do real work with no pre-conceived answers.
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April 10, 2022 8:01am
- krazykiwi
  
  You beat me to this. The DS article is a must-read for anyone that interested in solid analysis. Our MoH only publishes daily counts, so they used the wayback machine to build data series.
  
  Additionally, el gato malo has more good analysis here: Boosters associated this higher death rate.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:27am
  - surfing
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Beaten to the misinformation, must be upsetting.
    
    Covid anti-vaxxers almost always refer to anti-science sources and rarely reference respected sources within the scientific community. So, you go you, keep getting your info from substack, Daily Sceptic, dodgynews.com etc…
    
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    April 10, 2022 10:25am
    - JimBobJoe
      
      Lets imagine a Mediveal Surfing, he/she/it/they are good friends with the Papacy. (Obviously if and it/they Medieval Surfing will be hiding true nature from the papacy!)
      
      Along comes Copernicus and Galileo Galilei – they say the earth centric view of the cosmos is wrong and in reality the Earth orbits the Sun….
      
      But of course all the ‘scientists’ who are in good or want to be in good with the Papacy say that Galileo Galilei is wrong headed and possibily a satanist as everyone KNOWS the Sun orbits the Earth which is of course the centre of all creation, as the Papacy teaches!
      
      But I have data says Galileo Galilei … and the ‘scientists’ boo, jeer, hiss and call for Galileo Galilei to be silent. Excommunication and imprisonment beckon …..
      
      Believe the papacy says Medieval Surfing, after all the ‘scientists’ say the cosmos is earth centred…..
      
      Things haven’t changed a lot in human nature and power structures over the centuries really.
      
      (I love the stoush between Surfing and KrazyK by the way)
      
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      April 10, 2022 11:08am
      - Mike
        
        This is officially known as the ‘Galileo Gambit’, closely related to ‘science was wrong before’, and loved by cranks.
        
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        April 10, 2022 12:35pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        I aim to inform, but gotta say I love dishing up and chowing down on a bit of entertainment too 🙂
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:05pm
      - surfing
        
        You refer to a time when scientists were in conflict with the church. Evidence was irrelevant, but ultimately science still won as you can’t argue against facts in the long term.
        
        If, a paper(s) were published tomorrow in respected publications that showed new evidence that the vaccines are dangerous, ivermectin is effective, etc, I’ll go with that .
        
        It is also important to have people argue against the status quo, sometimes they are right. An issue is that the minority don’t necessary have the resources to prove their theories.
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:58pm
      - NZer In Exile
        
        “loved by cranks”
        
        You mean like “climate emergency” cranks?
        
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        April 10, 2022 2:04pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Surfing: “I’ll go with that”
        
        No. No you won’t. Unless it is delivered to you via the MSM. You seem to have developed a cast iron closed mind in respect of the source of information. Anything I post you dismiss without evidence-based critique but instead based on your disdain for the delivery channel, no matter that it might be a blog citing published papers, or official data.
        
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        April 10, 2022 10:00pm
    - Inandout
      
      surf. with regard to ‘respected sources’ can we mention both Bloomfield and Fauci once considered face masks next to useless? As an after thought I don’t consider Fauci respected.
      
      14 2
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      April 10, 2022 12:00pm
      - surfing
        
        Yes, in the early days of covid. The science evolves over time. Maybe it will evolve one day to show the vaccines cause more harm than good. Hasn’t yet though.
        
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        April 10, 2022 2:00pm
    - krazykiwi
      
      surfing, the data is from MoH. How in your mind does this represent ‘misinformation’?
      
      26 3
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      April 10, 2022 12:18pm
      - CJames
        
        It doesn’t meet surfing’s preconceived answers so must be mis-information. He wrote his email without even looking at the article. That is why there is no comments saying how the analysis is wrong. Surfing only gets his info from the pulpit of truth, and it shows.
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:13pm
    - NZer In Exile
      
      “Beaten to the misinformation”
      
      Translation: This stuff doesn’t sit well with the generalised vibe I’ve picked up on this from my ideological tribe. 😝
      
      12 2
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      April 10, 2022 12:56pm
    - krazykiwi
      
      Just for you, Surfing. From the Safe and Effective™ department
      
      The National Health Security Office in Thailand has provided more than 1.7 billion baht ($NZ74 million) in financial compensation to more than 14,000 people who developed adverse effects from COVID-19 vaccinations, according to the Bangkok Post.
      
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      April 10, 2022 6:01pm
- westernScientist
  
  The totally logical explanation for it is that the two groups are not similar enough to make direct comparisons. This isnt an easy analysis to work out, it is very difficult, near on impossible.
  
  There are way more vaccinated/boosted old and/or unhealthy people as a proportion than unvaxed people. For example the 70 group is up near on 100% jabed, and they are the most likely group to die anyway. Within the age bins is the effect of commodities, which we have no data on the jabed vs unjabed prevalence, or the presence of them at hospital admission/death. The statistics more imply that we do not have enough information to state that being vaccinated has a strong effect on the likelihood of hospitalisation/death. This is at least partially because most of the hospitalisation/death data is likely to be incidental, meaning more old/unhealthy people are picked up in it because they would be in those categorises anyway. This isnt surprising as it is a very skewed set of distributions everywhere, because the chances of hospitalisation/death are not far removed from the baseline anyway. This makes it hard to separate out the effects in a meaningful way on a relatively small population. Larger populations such as the UK have shown some effects, but it is much messier because they have a mixture of delta induced immunity etc as well.
  Weekly mortality jumps around way to much to make year on year comparisons. It could easily have gone the other way just by chance, like it did in 2020. Although we dont have the information to deduce if the 2020 chance was due to any underlying shift in environment, or if it was just a statistical perturbation, the same as we dont have the information to make a claim regarding 2021.
  
  The reason there has been silence, I dont know, maybe cindy didnt want to come out and say, granny was old and was going to die anyway, but I still saved her, even though she died. Spinning that is probably harder than ignoring what is a very complex set of statistical interactions.
  
  On the bigger question, do the jabs work, or are they detrimental. The answer is we dont know, and probably never will. There has been so much muddying of the data and poor analysis on both sides to be able to work much out. I think it is reasonable to say that for a significant proportion of the population in a delta or earlier outbreaks jabs appear to have had at least some effect on hospitalisation/death (what that proportion was I dont know, in the over 70s I would be pretty confident claiming it, for a healthy 20 year old, I wouldn’t be, and there is a gray area somewhere in the middle). But whether that positive effect was greater than the negative effects of adverse reactions to the jab, I dont think we will ever know, especially since this is heavily determined by individual risk status for both covid and jab, at the group level, young people appear to be at the greatest risk for jab side effects, but also the lowest risk of serious issues from covid. For omicron the water is much muddier simply because the proportions are much smaller in every which direction, reducing the signal to noise ratio within the data, so separating out meaningful underling trends is even harder.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:51am
  - CJames
    
    The British data was in age group bins and had the three vaccines listed. It showed same results as the NZ data. Go back on the DS site and look at their analyses in the old posts.
    The British government’s answer was to stop publishing the data.
    
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    April 10, 2022 1:17pm
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    Gee wS – wish I had a few more “commodities” to replace some comorbidities 🙂 – but I agree with your premise re of sample/population differences. I believe the information is there in NHI data but it would be a very complex analysis to normalise into meaningful groups and in the MOH’s mind certainly not in the public’s ‘need/interest to know’.
    
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    April 10, 2022 2:18pm
  - Phronesis
    
    I mostly agree but I think you are overly pessimistic about the possibility of doing a proper cost benefit analysis for the vaccine. The data exists it is just not currently available. Frankly if its impossible to determine whether there is a benefit then that would suggest a lot of public health interventions are on shaky ground as well.
    
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    April 10, 2022 4:43pm
Warren

Has the tide started to turn for National and forcing our Labour Party paid media to do a backflip on publishing there blatant obscurity and lies our Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern tells.
Clare Trevett pens of late one of National’s most valuable assets in its attempt to turn Law andOrder into a Election issue has been Police Minister Poto Williams.
Damian Grant the Ardern Government has achieved close to nothing outside of Covid-19.
Janet Wilson Climate Change: New Zealand’s talking big and acting small.
Benedict Collins new data shows Police response time around the Country has become remarkable slower under this Labour led Government.
Kyle MacDonald the real reason for Louisa Wall to Quit Politics .
One News mixed response to latest pay offer for Nurses but Government backtrack on promised back pay.
So it looks like the sunshine from the Prime Minister’s arse is turning into storm clouds for.Labour and will they be able to weather the storm.
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April 10, 2022 8:01am
- PeeJay
  
  Two options I think.
  
  First option, the media always like to be associated with the winner. If they genuinely see a change in government coming or even possible, they will be playing to very carefully so as to not piss off National, or Labour, so will do a bit of a mix of some critical articles mixed with softer ‘Ardern visits a kindergarten’ and ‘co-governance awesome’ articles.
  
  Second option, the bribes and advert money is running dry so this recent spate of mildly critical articles are a warning of what’s to come if the tap isn’t turned back on. Similar to a unions opening ‘negotiation’ with a veiled threat of industrial action to follow when they don’t get exactly what they want.
  
  Suspect a bit of both options, but the cynic in me suspects more of the second option and this is funding negotiation!
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:41am
- David Garrett
  
  Kyle MacDonald the real reason for Louisa Wall to Quit Politics
  
  Do please elaborate. I don’t read the free stuff on the Horrid, let alone anything behind a paywall.
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:30am
  - oldfella
    
    DG: you might not want it, but I suspect there are some on KB who would appreciate getpocket.com. Spotted the recommendation on BFD yesterday, and am now using it. Their ‘Save to Pocket’ app is a simple way to read paywalled stories from NZ and around the world. PC, tablet, phone – any or all devices.
    I suspect there may be other such options out there, but this is the first one I’ve tried. Love it.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:34am
    - Mike
      
      Does it help you steal content from othet providers too?
      
      2 14
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      April 10, 2022 12:37pm
  - Philview
    
    Strangely the attack line was that she wasn’t offered a cabinet position. I can’t stand this Government but it seems reasonable that they would promote their inner circle, which is actually a good thing for those of us who want them out of power.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:52am
  - Matt Long
    
    Apparently on Q&A this morning Wall said Ardern told her she would never be in her cabinet, and Wall “knew” Ardern wanted her out of caucus. Due to her support for silent T.
    As I recall Wall herself isn’t particularly inclusive, something about no Fn TERFs, doesn’t sound like a team player.
    
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    April 10, 2022 12:44pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      doesn’t sound like a team player.
      
      You don’t get to be a top netball and rugby player if you can’t work in a team.
      
      I wonder what sports teams our Dear PM participated in.
      
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      April 10, 2022 7:06pm
- Paulus
  
  She is off overseas shortly on the first of her Overseas trips in her VIP B757 c/- RNZAF
  
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  April 10, 2022 2:36pm
G152

Scare tactics from a bought media.
And an attempt at a nation wide language change.
Time to shut them down and run news from alternate sources
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April 10, 2022 8:07am
Maggy Wassilieff

Has the Queen of Covid entered a state of stupor?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/128287501/the-ardern-govt-has-achieved-close-to-nothing-outside-of-covid
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April 10, 2022 8:09am
- Gravelroad
  
  MW:
  Not to worry, the media driven “Save our Cindy” campaign is subtly ramping up.
  Have you noticed how often journalists are inserting phrases into their stories about “hate speech and misogyny directed against our Prime Minister”- as though it is an absolute truth?
  Senior $tuff writer, Kirsty Johnston uses it in her take down piece on lawyer Sue Grey today, whom she describes as “the hero of the conspiracy underbelly” in the opening paragraph.
  So very kind, these left wing journos – but only applying to people and causes they agree with.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:28am
  - Stellaboxer
    
    The thing is Gravel is that these ideological “ journalists “ are preaching to the choir now. A recent poll showed the majority of NZs don’t believe them anymore. It’s what tends to happen when you keep telling people that what they can see with their own eyes they can’t that all that black they can see is in fact white and if they don’t agree it’s because they’re a stupid conspiracy theorist.
    
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    April 10, 2022 8:45am
  - peterwn
    
    But then no one cared less when John Key and his daughter were on the receiving end of similar abuse. No one then suggested that state security was threatened. Instead the Left seemed to take great delight in this.
    
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    April 10, 2022 8:55am
    - Gravelroad
      
      @peterwn:
      Almost certainly no one in the cool socialist/celebrity/entertainment circles cared about it – the current Prime Minister thought it was a great song.
      But out here in the provinces many of us thought it was reprehensible.
      
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      April 10, 2022 9:26am
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        It was a throwaway line in a forgettable song by a young stoner rapsinger. Get over it!
        
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        April 10, 2022 10:12am
      - NZer In Exile
        
        BWAV, but the wonder girlpower PM endorsed it. Hello?
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:41pm
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        BWAV, but the wonder girlpower PM endorsed it. Hello?
        ____________
        
        Maybe she just has crap taste in tunes?
        
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        April 10, 2022 7:17pm
- Ra Henare
  
  When I emailed the PM to ask why the sign language(25,000 users in NZ) and not text subtitles generated automatically, like other 1st world countries. (700,000+ hearing impaired in NZ)
  The reply was, its an official language of NZ and some communities appreciated it.
  
  So I agree with the stuff article. Its about theatre not providing info to Kiwis.
  
  Maybe I should complain that Maori translations were also NOT provided as its an official language.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:39am
- mogg
  
  Damien Grant is right about Ardern being tainted
  by a perception of incompetence. Surely the level of blatant dishonesty is Ardern’s greatest achievement.
  All politicians are dishonest when they need to be, but her claim about not having told political lies, means that she has even lied about lying .
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:51am
  - septic skeptic
    
    You still don’t know Cindy? She did NOT lie about lying. She said “I believe it is possible to exist in politics without lying”. Never said she hadn’t lied. Never said she didn’t intend to continue telling lies. She invited you to draw the conclusion that she was an “honest” politician, and most of the electorate bought that.
    But the main point is that you don’t need to lie. Obfuscation, misdirection and half-truths prevent her getting caught in an outright lie 99% of the time.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:44am
    - mogg
      
      Gower then asked her for a second time if she had told lies and she said “no”, and then emphatically repeated “no I own my own mistakes”. Where is the obfuscation in that??
      Bill English when asked the same question fudged/avoided the answer.
      
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      April 10, 2022 1:46pm
    - cmm
      
      “She invited you to draw the conclusion that she was an “honest” politician”
      
      ie. A statement intended to deceive.
      
      ie a LIE.
      
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      April 10, 2022 7:27pm
- pdm
  
  `Has the Queen of Covid entered a state of stupor?’
  
  Not really MW – they have been stupid from day one in 2017.
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:04am
Maggy Wassilieff

Gerrymandering our Local body elections

https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2022/04/09/you-thought-voting-rights-and-representation-was-a-governance-matter-get-to-grips-with-the-treaty-and-sophistication/
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April 10, 2022 8:12am
mikenmildagain

Interesting profile of activist Sue Grey:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/128296235/just-asking-questions-how-lawyer-sue-grey-became-the-hero-of-new-zealands-conspiracy-underbelly
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April 10, 2022 8:22am
- Surely Knott
  
  A political hit job on a Tauranga candidate. Let’s give it the fact check. Valid fact (VF) or Baseless smear (BS)
  
  “How lawyer Sue Grey became the hero of New Zealand’s conspiracy underbelly” Thinking of voting or listening to this NZ. Don’t bother or you are a conspiracy theorist from the underbelly of NZ society (Verdict: BS)
  
  “The same day, Grey was name-checked by friends of far-right extremist Richard Sivell as he was being arrested for threatening to kill the Prime Minister. ” So a friend of a bad person said her name? Wow tenuous link. (Verdict: BS)
  
  ” Later that week she gave a talk to farmers about AGENDA 2030, a set of United Nations development goals that some believe will be used to “enslave humanity”.” So an anonymous person somewhere said it could enslave humanity not Sue herself. (Verdict: BS)
  
  “And, she (Sue Grey) said the vaccine was causing deaths.” Sue posted ““Confirmed: First NZ schoolgirl Vax death. The tragic early end to an innocent life.” “And, in the case of the schoolgirl, both Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Chief Coroner Judge Deborah Marshall spoke out publicly against Grey’s claim. The truth didn’t deter Grey.” “She said the coroner was wrong to make a call on the girl’s death so quickly,”
  
  The coroner did speak about that school girls deaths saying she did not believe it was linked. But it was before she had done her investigation.
  From teh Herald in November:
  “I am aware of ongoing speculation about the cause of death in a case involving an Auckland teenager that was recently referred to the Coroners’ Court,” she said.
  “Based on the information available to date, it does not appear that the death in question is linked to the Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine.”
  Marshall said the “issue” would still be “investigated carefully” by the coroner and “pertinent information will be requested from various agencies, including the Covid-19 Vaccination Independent Safety Monitoring Board”.””It could be a number of months before the final post-mortem report is received and all information relating to this death is obtained from relevant agencies.
  “The coroner’s findings will be made available once the inquiry has been completed.””
  
  So Sue’s point that the coroner spoke early is a valid point to raise. But Stuff said “The truth didn’t deter her” when actually the truth hadn’t been established and NZers are still waiting for coroners findings and post mortem report that was promised to us in a matter of months.
  (Verdict: BS)
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-coroner-says-death-of-teen-not-linked-to-vaccine/OEEJATMBMBPX2BGBA2XWEET37Y/
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:23am
  - curry4me
    
    It looks like Sue Gray is making the establishment nervous. She shouls be in the Parliamentary Press Gallery.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:44am
- Sacha
  
  Sounds as if she’s keeping the ‘defenders’ on their toes, lol.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:39am
- ClanMcleod
  
  That wasn’t a profile, it was a media smear and hit job on a thorn in the side of Ardern. No doubt she’ll be noticed and looked after.
  As with almost all of the mainstream media these days, it is full of lies and distorted facts, far too many to list here.
  The writer is nothing more than a media shill, like most of them.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:43am
Philview

I have read the reports of Boris Johnson in Kiev. I have to admire the dedication to getting a boost in the polls.
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April 10, 2022 8:24am
- PeeJay
  
  Bit pathetic that he turns up after the retreat and miles away from the danger zones.
  
  Does look a bit like shameless opportunism when you compare his arrival with this of the Slovenian, Polish and Czech leaders who travelled to Kyiv earlier in the war when it was actually being bombed.
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:50am
  - Paulus
    
    Nevertheless he actually went to Kiev.
    That’s his job too !
    
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    April 10, 2022 2:40pm
Nickc2

FWIW, I prefer KB in its old format whereby posters were informed of new postings, new topics, and responses to postings by e-mail.
Does anyone know the reason for the change?
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April 10, 2022 8:29am
- Nickc2
  
  Hey you downtickers, at least tell me why this format is better. You never know, I may be persuaded to agree with you.
  BTW, if our host is being charged by this site’s ISP for e-mail traffic, I would agree with this format.
  
  6 6
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  April 10, 2022 9:38am
- artemisia
  
  If you sign into WordPress there are email options for sites subscribed to. Including an option for posts to be emailed. I don’t know why the old buttons have been removed.
  
  8 1
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  April 10, 2022 9:40am
- curry4me
  
  That emial thing has never worked for me. I just check 2-3 times a day for replies.
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:46am
Warren

Is this how the most honest, caring and transparent Government is supposed to act and behave over pay negotiations.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2022/04/nurses-feel-lied-to-after-promised-back-pay-left-out-of-equity-offer.htm
Jacinda Ardern’s credibility is becoming a liability for Labour as the Country’s Nurses lose patience and trust.
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April 10, 2022 8:30am
- Gravelroad
  
  @Warren-
  Just so long as the nurses don’t start losing patients.
  If that happens the PM will turn on them in a lightening flash and blame, not extra pay, will be apportioned.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:30am
- Matt Long
  
  Nurses will have to be asking why they’re enduring long hours and abuse by low lives while their pay is not keeping up with the cost of living.
  Meanwhile Labour was able to run up upteen billions of debt to finance their lockdowns and pet projects, their own inflated salaries, but have no resources to provide health care workers with an abuse free environment or competitive wages.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:49am
  - Philview
    
    A friend told me the headlined life changing payrise was about a $1.80 an hour to her. Nice to get a rise but the extra money will be gobbled up in taxes and left over will not cover cost of living rises so still poorer than last year.
    
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    April 10, 2022 12:01pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    Let the nurses leave then! The most important thing is the establishment of the new Maori health authority to ensure equal outcomes. No matter if heathcare is shit, so long as it is not racist.
    
    17 2
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    April 10, 2022 12:02pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      The new Maori Health Authority will still be dependent upon a non-maori workforce to deliver the health services.
      
      Currently only 7% of NZ’s qualified nurses are Maori and only 4% of our GPs
      
      15 2
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      April 10, 2022 12:58pm
      - septic skeptic
        
        Exactly. So if half of these honkies leave for greener pastures it will improve the health workforce by making it more representative.
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:49pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        How embarrassing!
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:59pm
- surfing
  
  Nurse’s pay rise is still not great. I don’t think it is going to stop nurses from leaving.
  
  A nurse friend of ours is looking to quit, over conditions rather than pay. What do you do when there are so many patients assigned to you that it is unsafe for the patients?
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:31am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  The other part of the story is that the pay increase applies to DHB nurses only, and not nurses in rest homes or providing in-home care – even though these are largely funded by the taxpayer too.
  
  The predictable outcome is that some of these nurses will move to the DHBs, thereby reducing the quantity & quality of care to residents.
  
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  April 10, 2022 2:03pm
Monique Watson

Is it just Twitter or is New Zealand still intent on embracing socialism? The only content I can really see is how awful it is that people call the Prime Minister names and why we should embrace co-governance which is a Trojan horse for socialism. It’s just the Iwis, the Greenies and Labour slicing up the pie. My God. I think I’ll go back into hibernation and concentrate on getting further educated. So depressing. More almost depressing than the limpwristed Democrat response to Putin and Lukashenko .
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April 10, 2022 8:31am
- westernScientist
  
  twitter is a leftist cesspit all over the world, not just in NZ. I wouldnt read to much into any prevailing opinion on there.
  
  18 1
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  April 10, 2022 9:03am
  - curry4me
    
    It has been a leftist cesspit for ages. I don’t think Elon Musk oining the board will change that. There are three other outfits with 6-8% shares. So, he can be out voted. He could say: “Do this, or I’ll sell in dribs and drabs, causing the share price to drop”. we’ll have to wait and see.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:50am
    - artemisia
      
      Mr Musk is allowed to buy more, up to 15% I think. Other existing or new shareholders might also agree with him, and with free speech.
      
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      April 10, 2022 2:09pm
- Black with a Vengeance
  
  Under ol mate Drumpf there wouldn’t have even been any response.
  
  Supplying weapons and Intel to Ukraine is hardly limpwristed.
  
  NATO is doing everything possible but send their own troops in and assassinating Lukashenko.
  
  What would you rather they be doing ?
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:16am
  - mawm
    
    You are allowing your prejudices get in the way of truth. Obama sent the Ukrainians blankets while Trump sent them offensive weapons. Trump was able to keep Putins expansionism at bay while under Biden he feels he can do what he wants.
    
    Somehow that translates into a non response to Trump.
    
    OTOH NATO is trying to start WWIII by baiting the bear.
    
    11 2
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    April 10, 2022 11:24am
    - Black with a Vengeance
      
      It wasn’t Trump that kept Putin in check, it was Merkel.
      
      Biden has in no uncertain terms shown Putin he can’t do what he wants.
      
      Im not interested in what Obama DID. The question remains, what would you rather Biden and NATO be DOING ?
      
      2 17
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      April 10, 2022 12:15pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Merkel enabled Putin by closing down Nuclear and Coal Powered stations. She has made Germany reliant on Russian Gas.
        
        12 2
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        April 10, 2022 2:01pm
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        She kept her enemies close and used German funds to leverage Russia into friendly compliance towards peaceful and diplomatic solutions.
        
        If anything Putin believed Trumps bullshit that Biden was weak and NATO in disarray.
        
        Trump enabled Putin into thinking he could do as he pleased with impunity.
        
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        April 10, 2022 10:27pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Jeremy Clarkson: “Twitter now is just an opportunity for very left-wing people to express increasingly left-wing views to other left-wing people”
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:11am
Lee C

Chantelle Baker describes how Newshub Senior Editor Rebecca Watson seeks to [objectively] report an a major scandel involving the Prime Minister and Ashley Bloomfield lying to the public:

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=955409078501205&aggr_v_ids%5B0%5D=955409078501205&notif_id=1649533372325069&notif_t=watch_follower_video&ref=notif
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April 10, 2022 8:37am
- Ruahine
  
  Chantelle Baker. A genuine New Zealand Freedom Fighter.
  Thank you for your all your efforts in in the struggle to safeguard our Freedoms.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:57am
  - curry4me
    
    Chantelle should be in the Parliamentary Press Gallery. I guess if she was; there would be Keystone Cops scenes of our “representatives” running away from her, rather than answer any hard questions. It’s a safe bet the PM wouldn’t say: “First Chantelle then Jessica”.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:52am
- kevn
  
  @Lee C… Can’t argue with that doco timeline. Notice blomfield looking uncomfortable?
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:28am
  - Rodion Raskolnikov
    
    Chantelle Baker’s work is devastating to Ardern:
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hioylytN7Ng&lc=Ugzaq60bmrccktwPWbl4AaABAg
    
    It seems to be fairly well known by now. If they wanted to, National could probably bring Labour down with just the documents cited in that clip as well as Ardern blatantly lying. Yet they don’t. I find that very suspicious indeed.
    
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    April 10, 2022 12:57pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Jacinda and Bloomfield (provably) lying clearly isn’t the right sort of news for the media in Nu Tirani
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:57am
- Rodion Raskolnikov
  
  Happily, someone in the FB comments has posted a link to the “forged” document the Newshub propagandist refers to:
  
  https://dpmc.govt.nz/sites/default/files/2022-03/dpmc-roia-oia-2020-21-0688-material-re-clemengerbbod-omd.pdf
  
  Pages 14-20 give an neat overview of the strategy.
  
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  April 10, 2022 1:31pm
  - maintiens le droit
    
    Page 14 of the document under Game Plan has Border spelled as Boarder. Is this written by a real consultant?
    
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    April 10, 2022 8:13pm
NK

For those into English football, Man City v Liverpool tomorrow morning, to probably decide the Premiership. Even though it’s at Etihad, I’m picking Liverpool to win this.
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April 10, 2022 8:43am
- Philview
  
  Interesting what it must take to make a club successful. Man Utd have the money, have employed top managers and players but can’t get back to the top.
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:55am
  - NK
    
    Juergen Klopp and Liverpool have bought smarter. Their squad is deep with talent. Man U still plays Harry Maguire. If he were a horse, he’d have been put to pasture years ago. A useless sack of shit.
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:06am
  - Warren
    
    That what happens when you have had a Manager that most people respected in the game, when you lose that experience and what he installed into players minds. Liverpool have had Great managers like Bill Shankly, Kenny Dalglish and many more over the years but it has taken a Manager like Jurgen Klopp to bring them back to the top also.Top managers are a dime a dozen and you only get world beaters once in while, you don’t get Alex Ferguson’s, Pep Gaardiola’s, Bill Shankly , Kenny Dalglish and Jurgen Klopp every year.
    
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    April 10, 2022 9:24am
- pdm
  
  I bet Biscuit, presently lurking in Sydney, is supporting Liverpool too – one eyed even.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:05am
- 70andstilllearning
  
  Lol – learn something every day – ‘soccer’ doesn’t do much for me but wondered where in the hell “Etihad” was in the UK. Turns out it’s only about 10 km from where my old man was born……..
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:09am
- JimBobJoe
  
  Liverpool need to win this one NK and then win the remaining games to be certain of the title, barring City dropping points elsewhere.
  
  I will be dragging myself out of bed to watch Mo, Sadio, Luis, Diogo et al take it to that dodgy City mob. I am hoping to see a Pep-xplosion on the side lines : )
  
  YNWA, JFT97
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:18am
  - Warren
    
    Haha dreams are for free.
    
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    April 10, 2022 12:37pm
    - JimBobJoe
      
      : )
      
      Liverpool havent won at the Emptyhad in the League since Klopps first season – so we are due.
      
      3-1 Warren – 3-1 ….
      
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      April 10, 2022 3:44pm
Yvette

A Damien Grant opinion piece says “The Ardern govt has achieved close to nothing outside of Covid”

But even in the context of covid, what has been achieved that did not involve sheer luck?

1 – The elimination of the Auckland outbreak that involved the KFC worker – to whom Ardern has yet to apologise for nation-wide humiliation, after authorities failed to communicate properly with her – but the whole incident was sheer luck.

2 – the Sydney tourist who while infected visited Te Papa and wandered around Wellington for a weekend and apparently contaminated no-one – more sheer luck

3 – the similar pending catastrophe that didn’t happen with the British DJ – again similar sheer luck

4 – and now, two years into the pandemic, when the virus has swept the country, it has evolved from Alpha, to Delta, to now Omicron – apparently the most infectious, but least serious variation of covid – so, it seems, absolute sheer luck of momentous proportions, meaning although deaths so sadly have occurred, the toll is not on the scale of Italy, the UK or those nations that engendered such fear here.

So “The Ardern govt has achieved close to nothing outside of Covid” and now with covid appearing to fizzle out, what is left?
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April 10, 2022 8:53am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  5 – allowing the Ruby Princess passengers to walk around Wellington when the pandemic was kicking off. That boat led to a lot of deaths in Sydney. Again sheer luck Ardern.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:14am
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Luck? I think you’ll find the zephyrs of Wellington simply blew that tricky old covid virus out to sea!
    
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    April 10, 2022 2:07pm
- Stellaboxer
  
  What is left ? A government/ media holding an evermore angry wolf by the ears.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:25am
- kevn
  
  @Yvette… What is left?
  Massive debt, multiple health issues. Two of many.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:48am
  - pdm
    
    Kev – New Zealand divided on racial grounds through He Puapua.
    
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    April 10, 2022 10:07am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    50% more beneficiaries manufactured (3-4 electorates worth of votes for labour), tens of thousands of people living in motels. Kid’s with enormous educational set-backs and a deteriorating education system that is not up to the task of repairing that.
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:01am
- ClanMcleod
  
  If you take the time to research the stats around the world you’ll find they are nonsensical and manipulated to sell a narrative. Take them with a pinch of salt. Ardern had done nothing beneficial, luck or not, the only thing she has done “successfully” is wreck the economy and tear the social fabric to shreds.
  
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  April 10, 2022 9:50am
  - Black with a Vengeance
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    The economy was wrecked long before JA came to government and the social fabric from a Pasifika, inclusive of Maori perspective has been in tatters for centuries…
    
    Cool story though, but if you want some constructive criticism I’d say it’s slightly stale, reeks of eurocentric ignorance with a hint of misogyny and projects a certain fragility by the author.
    
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    April 10, 2022 10:25am
    - JimBobJoe
      
      BAV – give up all the benefits Maori and Pasifika have gained in NZ courtesy of our British colonial past. Then maybe we will listen to your constant whining with a sympathetic ear.
      
      Walk or canoe everywhere do you BAV? Grow your own food do you BAV and don’t consume any Beef or Lamb, or Pork for that matter, as none occur naturally in NZ? Don’t avail yourself of modern Western based medicine?
      
      Maori lost control of some land – and gained access to modern technology, a better food base, access to all of Eurasia’s accumulated knowledge and crucially freedom from endemic inter tribal warfare. The benefits far out weigh the costs..
      
      Your Polycentric view is nothing more that a posturing for free stuff and ignores all the benefits delivered due to NZ being founded as a British colonial possession…
      
      Oh and by the way if you are Pasifika in origin you can always hop on a Western Jet and fly back to which ever those Island paradises scattered across the South Pacific your bloodline is derived from.
      
      But I guess you wont ay, you’ll just sit in 1st World, Western inspired comparative luxury here in NZ and carp from the sidelines…
      
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      April 10, 2022 11:27am
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        I’m planning to move back to Samoa to write a novel/ screenplay, grow Chinese medicinal herbs on one of the plots of family land, develop another plot of beach front land as an eco tourist venture and sail once again with our Voyaging society.
        
        Just waiting til my kids are all grown up.
        
        Haha…Thanks for the enlightening story though. Must raise a few laughs and rark the lads up down at the country club eh what ?
        
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        April 10, 2022 5:26pm
    - Alan Wilkinson
      
      BWAV still hasn’t explained why he came to this dreadful racist country and why he doesn’t go home. The Samoan “chief” just jailed for 13 years for keeping his compatriots slaves in Hastings suggests racism is not Pacifica’s biggest problem.
      
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      April 10, 2022 1:57pm
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        He’s certainly no ‘chief’ if he was living in NZ and treating his countrymen like that.
        
        Evil bastard deserves every minute he spends behind bars!
        
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        April 10, 2022 5:29pm
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      “Social fabric from a Pasifika, inclusive of Maori perspective has been in tatters for centuries”?
      
      ‘Pasifika’ have only been in NZ in serious numbers since the 1950s.
      
      Sounds like you’re a bit desperate to hold on to Maori coattails there, BAV.
      
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      April 10, 2022 2:11pm
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        I think you’ll find the 1350s is closer to when we started arriving in Aotearoa in serious numbers.
        
        Perhaps you need to go back to school and learn the correct history from a less eurocentric bias.
        
        We’ve always been here to help guide and support Maori. It’s what we as Pasifikan elders do with our younger whanau.
        
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        April 10, 2022 10:33pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Without Covid she is nothing. I suspect she is desperate for XE to arrive in NZ, so she can repeat the whole lockdown process.
  I’ve got you again you peasant bastards.
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:30am
  - emmess
    
    XE LOL what a joke
    
    11 4
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    April 10, 2022 10:34am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      No joke to Jaspinda. If she can use it to get a bit of control, she will. Cunning as a shithouse rat
      
      19 3
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      April 10, 2022 11:20am
      - Mike
        
        Tell me more about these shithouse rats you seem so familiar with.
        
        2 19
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        April 10, 2022 11:44am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Best you just look at the Labour Party Mike – with both eyes and no blinkers
        
        14 2
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        April 10, 2022 1:12pm
- surfing
  
  “the toll is not on the scale of Italy”
  
  Many here would argue that covid caused no extra deaths haha.
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:33am
  - Don Beckett
    
    And that would be correct in large part.
    
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    April 10, 2022 5:22pm
westernScientist

So when Adern does it it is “world leading”, “kind” and amazeballs. But when China does exactly the same thing it is horrible and bad and inhumain:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/300562559/shanghai-hospital-pays-the-price-for-chinas-covid19-response

I mean dont get me wrong, I think it is horrible and both china and NZ should not have done it, but it is incredibly hypocritical to be acting like there is moral high ground now that NZ has given up on elimination and china hasnt.
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April 10, 2022 9:00am
TripeWryter

I see it’s already been mentioned and I’m slow off the mark this morning.
But you have to wonder what possessed Nelson lawyer Sue Grey to consent to an interview with Stuff journalist Kirsty Johnston.
It was a hatchet-job, and a not subtle one at that. Lots of links to disprove what Ms Grey says. I don’t read links. They’re tiresome distractions from the story.
I did think it ironic, though, that Ms Johnston went to such earnest efforts to discredit Ms Grey when Ms Johnston works for the biggest disinformer and misinformer in the country – I’m talking about the climate change hoax that Stuff bangs on about.
I’m not in Ms Grey’s camp, either. I vaxxed, I masked, and did all that was required of me so that I could go overseas to see my grandchildren.
I’ve just come back from Australia in an Airbus packed with Kiwis of the same mind.
A lot of grandparents were crying with joy at the airport the other day as little ones ran to them arms outstretched.
But I did note in Ms Johnston’s story the ‘misogyny directed at the prime minister’ as if this is fact.
I see that Hayden Munro in The New Zealand Herald this morning takes a similar vein, but adds that other stand-by, racism.
It seems that Labour and its shills have decided that any criticism of our woman prime minister is to be painted as ‘misogynist’.
This is a stretching and deforming of the original meaning of misogyny – which is the fear and loathing of women.
It’s dishonest and needs to be resisted.
Any criticism of Maoris is deemed to be racist. In passing I’d just say that nobody would be more scathing of Maoris and the attempts to portray them as helpless victims than some of my Maori cousins including those who have made good lives for themselves across The Ditch.
And wasn’t Kirsty Johnston the author of a scrofulous story – seemingly in collusion with some judicial ‘sources’ – a few months ago about Judge Peter Callinecos, who had the temerity to stand up for a Maori girl in the care of loving pakeha foster parents?
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April 10, 2022 9:09am
- Mike
  
  Sue Grey is a crank. End of story.
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:43am
  - Warren
    
    That’s the pot calling the kettle.
    
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    April 10, 2022 12:41pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Yep Johnston is a well known Govt propagandist. Perhaps looking for a job in ‘comms’ with them.
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:03am
- MCōs
  
  “But you have to wonder what possessed Nelson lawyer Sue Grey to consent to an interview with Stuff journalist Kirsty Johnston.”
  
  No doubt she’s so sure of her own righteousness she believes she can bat away any detractors with ease.
  It’s obvious she believes she’s always right, which is why she’s so unapologetic even when she wasn’t and the Nelson ratepayers were left $100,000 out of pocket.
  The very definition of hubris.
  Well, she’s standing in Tauranga.
  If the voters have any sense they’ll vote for
  Bill or George or Frank, anything but Sue
  
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  April 10, 2022 1:48pm
  - Mike
    
    I’m guessing the profile was too short to list all her other nutcase beliefs beyond cellphones, 5G, and 1080.
    Crank magnetism.
    
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    April 10, 2022 3:42pm
Yvette

“Co-governance”
Taxpayers forked out $30 million for the land at Ihumātao and gifted it to mana whenua on the basis that housing would be built.
Sixteen months later, mana whenua haven’t even set up the group that’s meant to govern the land. A decision on the number of homes built could be years away, and actual construction looks like a pipe dream.– New Zealand Taxpayers’ Union, 8 April 2022

At what speed will Maori Health Authority or “3 Waters” decision be made – unless driven by Government, but that will then be Government for Maori, rather than Maori for Maori, so …

Just thinking
– for a friend … :o)
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April 10, 2022 9:37am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Maori kaua means that everyone relevant gets a say & it takes as long as it takes.
  
  Which is fine; but no reason for taxpayers to fund alternative housing in the meantime. But we are.
  
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  April 10, 2022 2:14pm
kevn

@Clan… The other thing is newly created multiple divisions amongst NZer’s.
That was never there before her reign.
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April 10, 2022 10:08am
- Black with a Vengeance
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Oh pull your head outta the sand mate…
  
  Just because you couldn’t see the divisions before now doesn’t mean they weren’t there!
  
  [Deleted – Mod]
  
  [Mod – how about you try and make your point without gratuitous abuse]
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:30am
  - kevn
    
    @black… c19 has been with us for how long ?
    Jab enthusiasts v/s not keen on the experiment have been with us for how long… mate?
    
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    April 10, 2022 10:49am
  - Black with a Vengeance
    
    [Deleted – Mod]
    
    [Mod – how about you try and make your point without gratuitous abuse]
    __________
    
    Fair point. To be honest, I can’t even remember what I wrote. It’s more a case of when in Rome…
    
    I get that this site is a team blue echo chamber so its always open season on “The Queen of Covid”, but surely we can be a bit more thick skinned about the odd knock on Luxon and Seymour.
    
    Is that really too much to ask ?
    
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    April 10, 2022 11:33am
    - patreon_36178434
      
      A walking talking example of where racism actually exists in New Zealand
      
      15 1
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      April 10, 2022 12:45pm
    - Cassandra
      
      There are other blogs more suited to your views, Black. And they’ll accept them without a fact check.
      
      16 2
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      April 10, 2022 1:03pm
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        Don’t see the point of preaching to the choir. Besides, I’ve been banned from most team red blogs.
        
        They seem to like their natives as timid and pliable as team blue.
        
        The stale pale fragile male perspective permeates the entire political spectrum.
        
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        April 10, 2022 5:34pm
Maggie Pie

OMG! Only woke up half-an-hour ago. Totally missed Mass 🙁
Last thing I remember was walking across Parnell Rd in bare feet and getting into te Uber.

Really was a fab nite out with the girls…..but honestly, next time I’m going to take a leaf out of Prue’s book and stick with sparking mineral water.

And the other thing I was just thinking about, does anyone still appreciate natural boobs and bodies anymore?
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April 10, 2022 10:32am
- Mike
  
  No confession today tben, Maggie. Is it hard carrying the burden of your sins for another week?
  
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  April 10, 2022 10:45am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Getting on the piss is a sin? Bugger me, never knew
    
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    April 10, 2022 1:19pm
    - MCōs
      
      Missing Mass
      
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      April 10, 2022 1:50pm
      - Mike
        
        And I’m charitably believing that Maggie’s ‘partner’ must be her husband, as she couldn’t be repearedly confessing adultery, could she?
        
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        April 10, 2022 4:11pm
      - Don Beckett
        
        And on Palm Sunday. Naughty naughty girl. 🙂
        
        3 2
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        April 10, 2022 5:28pm
  - NeverMindTheBollocks
    
    Confession is typically celebrated separate from Mass.
    
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    April 10, 2022 2:16pm
- Black with a Vengeance
  
  I’m all about the natural boobs and bodies!
  
  I find it kinda scary that you can’t remember anything more than getting in the Uber though.
  
  My daughter had an experience like that with a particularly nasty experience happening between the time the Uber dropped her off and waking up.
  
  It doesn’t take much to turn a fab night into a nightmare! Please be safe and take extra care out there.
  
  Especially if your boobs and body are worthy of excessive appreciation!
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:39am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Thanks Blackie! Always have Oven Spray in the handbag in case of emergency.
    
    TBH, a girl feels safe in Parnell these days….the number of undercover-cops in the bars is amazing.
    
    (PS: Sorry to hear about you daughter. Was he Indian? )
    
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    April 10, 2022 12:22pm
    - Black with a Vengeance
      
      She can’t remember as it happened after the driver dropped her off, drove away and as she drunkenly staggered to her front door…
      
      Nowhere is particularly safe from predatory males and I wouldn’t trust undercover cops most of all!!!
      
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      April 10, 2022 12:45pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        Only mentioned it cos one of the girls at tennis is a bestie of JJ Feeny.
        
        Those undercover cops don’t seem to make a secret of it either.
        Saw 3 guys in one of the bars with handcuffs hanging out the back of their jeans pockets.
        
        It does make a woman feel a lot safer.
        
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        April 10, 2022 1:55pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        Maggie – in Parnell – are you sure the presence of handcuffs confirms that he’s an undercover cop?
        
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        April 10, 2022 2:18pm
      - Black with a Vengeance
        
        Haha…handcuffs out the back pocket screams sexual deviant more than undercover cop, but most probably both.
        
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        April 10, 2022 5:38pm
    - MCōs
      
      My wife carried a can of pepper spray.
      I asked her where she got it from and she said she brought it out from Bangkok in her handbag.
      Went right through security at Bangkok and Sydney.
      Maybe they’re too busy looking for some harmless apple core to notice the really dangerous stuff.
      
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      April 10, 2022 1:59pm
kevn

@Maggie… Bubble wrapped doesn’t do it for me.
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April 10, 2022 10:50am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Stay out of Parnell on a Saturday nite then Kev….
  half of K’Rd are there 😀
  
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  April 10, 2022 11:12am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5vxJ2rqzYA
Panic!

Well well. Bodycams are revealing the truth about “raycist” cops. “Hate Crime” hoaxes got exposed. Liberals were asking for this. Now, they’re having second thoughts. [8:01]
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April 10, 2022 11:24am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Lots of Karens out there, even transistors are Karens
  
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  April 10, 2022 1:26pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7lv8BxHK8s

Enshrine our Bill of Rights March – TFRC 9th April 2022.

What a beautiful day to be out marching with freedom minded people. Around 500 kiwis took the time to March through the streets of Christchurch again today, to protest against continued government overreach, and their failure to serve the people. [23:43]
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April 10, 2022 11:24am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8wA93-MPlI
US officials expose Joe Biden

Chemical attacks? What chemical attacks? Just fake news from Brandon. [5:37]
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April 10, 2022 11:25am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  The Warmongering Generals in the Pentagon want to get into the War (indirectly) Remember, the Bidens have unfinished business in Ukraine and want a few people silenced. Joe Biden will not stop things escalating, as long as he is seen to be part of it.
  Propaganda comes from both sides always
  
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  April 10, 2022 1:36pm
oldfella

A weekly dose of US political humour. Enjoy.
https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2022/04/the-week-in-pictures-scent-of-musk-edition.php
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April 10, 2022 11:27am
I remember when

As China demonstrates how ‘elimination’ has become impossible.
Vaccines are increasingly bypassed by ‘new’ variants.
Major countries like Germany are refusing to legislate to make vaccination mandatory.
Lockdown is at best a very short term answer.
The length of the effectiveness of vaccines shortens with repetition.

Why wasn’t there more appreciation of alternative views during the last two plus years.
How did we benefit from the ‘cancelling’ of anything that might contradict the official version.
Why was any view not MOH and/or Government labelled ‘conspiracy theory.’
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April 10, 2022 11:36am
I remember when

While it seems to be here to stay, is now the time to suggest appropriate use of the Maori language in the media.
Could the Maori language best be promoted by making a ruling that all ‘Climate Change’ stories are to be reported in Maori.
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April 10, 2022 11:44am
Jack5

Ardern’s media is dancing to Labour’s inflation tune as the country moves into a period of high inflation.

Dann in the Herald (behind paywall) today is talking up China’s Covid problems as fuelling inflation in NZ.

Next to get the blame will be rising world food prices because of the Ukraine war.

These factors will make inflation worse, but the key driver of NZ’s emerging high inflation is the vast State spend-up. Far from all it went on subsidising businesses during the pandemic.

The Government has “printed” tens of billions of dollars unchecked by a sleeping Reserve Bank which has the incompatible goals of both controlling inflation and maintaining full employment.

As Milton Friedman famously said:

Inflation is blamed on many things, but it has only one cause. It is a monetary phenomenon. Inflation occurs when the quantity of money increases faster than the quantity of goods.

Why does the money supply increase? Very often it does so to enable the government to pay its bills without raising taxes.

There’s only one real cure for inflation. It is a cure that’s easy to describe but difficult to apply. The government must reduce spending and print less money. The alternatives are both recession and double-digit inflation.
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April 10, 2022 11:47am
- than
  
  Some economists don’t believe that inflation is a monetary phenomenon and rather just an increase in consumer prices.
  Their idea is wrong as normally price increases in one area would be offset by a decrease in prices in other areas if it were not an increase in the money supply, thus everything balances out within the system all other things equal.
  Inflation is definitely a monetary phenomenon but it’s not something that can be examined exactly using mathmatical formulas which is why it was thrown to the wayside for something which examines the inevitable consequences of inflation (consumer price index).
  
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  April 10, 2022 5:10pm
Jack5

I wonder if our poster, Clan McLeod, knows there is a maritime attraction in Sydney with a link to his clan.

It’s the rescued and restored sailing ship, the James Craig. The great old square rigger was named Clan Macleod when she was built in the UK in 1874.

In 1905 an Auckland businessman, J.J. Craig, bought the ship, renamed her, presumably after himself, and the ship was on Tasman Sea routes until steam made sail power uncompetitive.

The ship finished up a coal hulk in Tasmania, and then was abandoned.

The restoration has been magnificent.

https://www.sea.museum/whats-on/our-fleet/tall-ship-james-craig
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April 10, 2022 12:01pm
Maggie Pie

OK, accept this may be Shanghai……but it could have been filmed from the balcony of any leaky high-rise apartment building in Auckland 🙁

https://twitter.com/serpentza/status/1511936214323982341
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April 10, 2022 12:09pm
- NZer In Exile
  
  Yes, I feel for that guy, having lived through the longest lockdown in the world, courtesy of the supreme far left dickhead running the state I live/d in. I was lucky, but many in the same boat as this guy weren’t.
  
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  April 10, 2022 1:10pm
- Rodion Raskolnikov
  
  The Chinese have the best “go off” moments, don’t they.
  
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  April 10, 2022 1:11pm
  - NZer In Exile
    
    When you live in a nightmarish surveillance police-state where you need to be a conforming robot to survive “going off” like this probably means things are very dire for this guy.
    
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    April 10, 2022 1:53pm
    - Rodion Raskolnikov
      
      Like this man, I too will “not go gentle into that good night.” Going off is a necessary survival strategy at this point.
      
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      April 10, 2022 2:02pm
    - Alan Wilkinson
      
      The bottom line is when the government doesn’t fear the people then the people fear the government. Ultimately that is the justification for the right to bear arms.
      
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      April 10, 2022 2:04pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Socialism stage two coming up. Oh wait, we might have an Election first
        
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        April 10, 2022 2:56pm
jon

10th April 1968. WAHINE. Today marks the 54th anniversary of the sinking of the interisland ferry in Wellington Harbour with heavy loss of life. To those of us who lost dear family and friends, this day is remembered every year, and with such clear memories as if it was yesterday.
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April 10, 2022 1:35pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Definitely one of the worst storms I’ve lived through…
  (Tho’ I was in Wanganui at the time..and managed to get to school by bus that morning.)
  
  https://my.christchurchcitylibraries.com/cyclone-giselle/
  
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  April 10, 2022 2:52pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  A taxi driver told me that the wind was so strong that day that when a passenger exited from his cab the wind caught the door and flung it against the side of the taxi’s bonnet. That happened in one of those north south streets near Athletic Park.
  
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  April 10, 2022 3:32pm
- David Garrett
  
  Jon: I was a lad in Gisborne when the Wahine storm hit…I remember the wind howling all night and the house shaking…and in the morning several large trees had been uprooted in our back garden…and Gisborne is 300 miles from Welly; God knows what it was like for Wellingtonians that day.
  
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  April 10, 2022 5:06pm
  - chukar
    
    In Marlborough there were hundreds of hectares of indigenous vegetation ( Beech Totata etc) flattened .
    Not a farmer in sight either.
    As a weather event right up there!
    
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    April 10, 2022 6:10pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Our family home overlooked Seatoun and the harbour entrance. Both my patents were medical professionals and they helped triage survivors as they beached. I was a bit young to remember this well, but I do remember growing up seeing the Holmpark salvage ship stationed over the sunken wreck for many years.
  
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  April 10, 2022 5:53pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Clean-out in the Wellington Greens?

https://wellington.scoop.co.nz/?p=143731

https://wellington.scoop.co.nz/?p=143733
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April 10, 2022 3:06pm
Maggie Pie

Just back inside from the pool. The sun has gone behind the Magnolia.

The other thing I ment to tell you about last night, I totally screwed up telling Lee C’s ‘Penguin & Mechanic’ joke!
Came to the punch-line, and instead of saying “Looks like you’ve blown a seal” I said, “…..gasket”
Needless to say nobody got it 🙁

Best of the night and the magnum of Moet went to Amanda with –

Reading where Pfizer has developed a new drug for Lesbians with depression.

It’s called Tricoxagain.

LOL!!!!
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April 10, 2022 4:16pm
AitchW

Really impressed with the UK and Boris Johnson. He’s shown real balls by visiting Kiev and committing a shit load of real military hardware. Meanwhile we’re sending old helmets and flak jackets. Time for out government to grow a spine and send some ageing Javelins and excess LAVs.
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April 10, 2022 6:06pm
- Opie
  
  Johnson has also come out and said that trans women should not be able to play sport against actual women.
  
  Maybe he is alright after all!
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:13pm
- Alan Wilkinson
  
  They are doing their best. Wellington has sent a load of b.s
  
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  April 10, 2022 8:22pm
Maggie Pie

Just watching Aljaz. If you think Mt Roskill is the pits….imagine being caught out on the streets of Karachi tonight 🙁
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April 10, 2022 8:34pm

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