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February 10, 2022 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 10 February 2022

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General Debate

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krazykiwi

The other day Fight4NZ made a bunch of evidence free assertions, as is his/her drive-by trolling style. Fight4NZ then cut-n-pasted the same nonsense, completely out of context yesterday.

At first I couldn’t be bothered responding – pearls before swine – but on reflection have decided that I’ll wade in. I know, I know. Don’t feed the trolls. But I can’t help myself. I’ll split this into two parts, and post the second tomorrow.

The Covid19 vaccines have worked surprisingly effectively along side non-medical measures. Compare Delta outbreak in NZ to other countries where it got into the community.

The only thing surprising about the effectivity of the ‘vaccines’ is how utterly ineffective they are. After a billion or so doses we learned that these jabs were non-sterilising, and protection from infection and disease rapidly attenuate locking in both a lifetime of anticipated boosters, and the continuance of ‘non-medical measures’ (I assume you mean NPIs – non-pharmaceutical interventions) like lockdowns. It is true that turning New Zealand into a hermit kingdom to rival North Korea delayed the arrive of Alpha and Delta, but at what cost to the economic future of millions of NZers? Feel free to critique 42 Studies on Vaccine Efficacy that Raise Doubts on Vaccine Mandates. All tidily referenced. You’re welcome.

The vaccines are definitively not gene therapies

Wrong. They most certainly are definitely are gene therapies. Moderna noted as much in their SEC filing dated 30th June, 2020. Skip to paragraph 2 page 70 which reads “Currently, mRNA is considered a gene therapy product by the FDA. […] In addition, because no product in which mRNA is the primary active ingredient has been approved, the regulatory pathway for approval is uncertain.”. See, they were uncertain how to apply for FDA approval given the novelty of the delivery system. Sometime after this the FDA changed their definition of gene therapy, and information released un FOI showed that CDC changed their definition of Gene Therapy in August 2021. You can spend time arranging those angels on the pinhead all you like, but mRNA that instructs your cells to manufacture a cytotoxic protein represent gene therapy. End of story.

Few in the population are terrified by the virus, the vast majority have just taken the sensible precautions on offer. Most fear-stricken are antivaxxers of the vaccine which has proven to have a very high safety record internationally.

A very high safety record internationally? You’re having a laugh – surely? Even based on what we know today, ie in the absence of formal longitudinal studies, these are the most harmful therapies in the history of vaccinology. I dare you to read this post, crammed with evidence of the harm cause by this generation of therapies, or to peruse this torrent of research and commentary further detailing the harm. To contend they “have a very high safety record internationally” it weapons-grade stupidity. And you, Fight4NZ, and parading that stupidity with much aplomb.

the minimal inconveniences of the non-medical measures will be quickly forgotten in the return to normality.

Oh the arrogance whereupon you decide what is minimally inconvenient. Did you ask the owners or employees of the soaring number of companies that have failed?. Was it a minimally inconvenient for the people left without healthcare when 30,000 surgeries were cancelled?. Every single one of these NPIs has a medical/health implication for New Zealanders. Some are short term, like undiagnosed cancer resulting in mortality spikes. Other are longer term, like increased unemployment leading to shorter life expectancy, or the impact of mRNA therapies on the immune system as shown in the paper The BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine against SARS-CoV-2 reprograms both adaptive and innate immune responses. Been vaccinated, Fight4NZ? Then your immune system has been reprogrammed.

In summary, Fight4NZ, firing off evidence-free assertions as you do is like bringing a wet noodle to a knife fight.

Upgrade your noodle by doing some research.

Part 2 tomorrow.
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February 10, 2022 8:00am
- Rodion Raskolnikov
  
  Fight4NZ comes across as having never investigated any of the relevant issues for his or herself, beyond switching on the TV news at 6pm every night, supplemented by a few 1pm press conferences.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:13am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Agreed. There are two types of Corona idiot:
    1. Those who believe Bill Gates in implanting mind control chips; and,
    2. Those who get their knowledge from the 6pm news and from the podium of odium.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:22am
    - Fight4NZ
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      No, he real idiots are those sucked in by insidious Q derived crazy town lies.
      
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      February 10, 2022 8:49am
      - krazykiwi
        
        Your mind is so closed I doubt Houdini himself could find a way out. It’s pretty sad.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:10am
    - Clownworld
      
      1. Mind control was achieved well before the microchip. Population surveillance and population control by transhuman aka data integration via bioengineering is possible, trialled and ready to go. As for Mr Gates he is simply one cog.
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:13am
    - Overworked
      
      Uptick for “podium of odium”
      
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      February 10, 2022 12:04pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Had to look it up, good job.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:30pm
    - dannz
      
      Make that three:
      3. Those who, with irrelevant data and grammatical technicalities, dance on the head of a pin to somehow shed a bad light on the vaccines.
      
      The evidence is overwhelming that the risks of the vaccine are far outweighed by the risks of catching covid unvaccinated. Everything else is incidental.
      
      And yes I’ve read the studies and in many cases posted them here.
      
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      February 10, 2022 3:26pm
  - Bridgenag
    
    Don’t you think several of these down ticking trolls are probably paid gummint spin agents? Nothing to do without the podium of truth/odium to prepare for.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:26am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Bridgenag almost certainly correct. We know they exist.
      
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      February 10, 2022 8:32am
      - RichardX
        
        How do you know they exist?
        
        What evidence can you provide that demonstrates anyone is paid by the Labour Party and/or the NZ Government to comment on Kiwiblog?
        
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        February 10, 2022 9:04am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Who is this ‘we’ of whom you speak?
        
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        February 10, 2022 9:09am
      - kevn
        
        @Clan… Nudge unit contractors. Great stay at home ‘job’.
        
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        February 10, 2022 9:15am
      - Libertarians are right
        
        Wait, you mean that all those “former National voters” in Australia that created the pressure that lost Bridges the leadership weren’t real? I would never have guessed.
        
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        February 10, 2022 9:37am
    - artemisia
      
      Maybe not paid but committed to an ideology and with spare time. Not unlike some other KB posters.
      
      And it’s a good thing to have opposing views aired. And readers of this blog pretty much all have an interest in politics and the nation, probably well above average intelligence too, so can choose who to believe and when to roll eyes.
      
      There are way more different covid views here than in the MSM.
      
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      February 10, 2022 8:48am
      - bronny1
        
        It’s a good thing to have informed discussions – that is the basis of learning and science after all. What we are getting here though is a highly informed person attempting to engage with someone so ignorant of the issues that they are unable to participate in an informed manner so just use ad hominem attacks instead. I find it very sad that our population has been this dumbed down.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:13am
      - Fight4NZ
        
        Bronny, no problem, I don’t mind his mud slinging attacks.
        Very difficult to not succumb to the temptation to volley return at the net though when leaving themselves so wide open.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:58am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      I think you ‘probably’ have an overactive imagination.
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:10am
      - Trev
        
        That is exactly the thing Labour had their interns doing some years back! Perhaps they were not paid; so does that make it ok? [Actually it came to light because of the poor treatment of the interns and how they were not receiving the conditions promised. Letter writing, social media influencing attempts etc. was exactly what they were expected to do for Labour] These days with the huge expansion of government paid spin merchants and the blurred lines between Labour Party and Government it would not surprise me if such things were now being conducted by paid operatives.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:22am
      - pdm
        
        Yep Trev – history repeating itself.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:31am
    - Clownworld
      
      Yep that’s what it is. Sustained propaganda.
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:14am
    - Nickc2
      
      There’s a number of them at it already today. Five downticks already (@ 8:26AM) for that post – ridiculous!
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:26am
    - coge
      
      The selfsame clowns who believe arresting mothers and the elderly will make it all go away.
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:50am
    - Overworked
      
      It’s probably just the idle following an outraged link from the Spinoff.
      
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      February 10, 2022 12:05pm
    - curry4me
      
      Bridgenag: I always scroll past them as a matter of principle. My scroll wheel isn’t worn out yet.
      
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      February 10, 2022 1:15pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      This blog is infested with them!
      
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      February 10, 2022 1:34pm
      - artemisia
        
        Unfortunately the recent spate of bans has removed some excellent and well informed posters. Even with temporary bans, some may not return.
        
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        February 10, 2022 2:59pm
  - ClanMcleod
    
    RR that is exactly right, either that or they are a 9th floor insider parroting the “single source of truth” in a dreary monotone.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:31am
    - coge
      
      If you look carefully, you might catch one peeking out from behind a filing cabinet.
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:52am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        That would be – oh wait, mind blog, I forgot the name.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:35pm
  - pdm
    
    You make Fight4NZ sound like a Cabinet Minister.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:36am
    - Nickc2
      
      Stuart Nash incognito?
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:29am
  - Fight4NZ
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Or perhaps I have opened a textbook on the subject and at no time have based anything on the “ podium” be it Jacindas or Trumps. Perhaps I have sufficient scientific understanding to not make myself look like a moron day in and day out.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:52am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Well, in that case, perhaps you could refer me to a similar programme of mass vaccination with a very very leaky vaccine that has successfully turned around a very transmissible virus.
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:58am
      - Fight4NZ
        
        Pretty much every vaccine on first release. But several of them were much worse.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:03pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Pretty much every vaccine on first release.
        
        That is nonsense.
        
        1. pretty much every vaccine was not administered as billions of doses within the first year of release.
        
        2. Most vaccines provide a degree of sterilizing immunity: i.e. the recipient does not become ill, the virus does not replicate willy-nilly in the recipient, and the infected person does not go on to become a super-spreader.
        
        3.The pfizer vaccine seems to elicit a very incomplete immune response in folks and has rapidly waning effectiveness against some variants.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:50pm
      - Fight4NZ
        
        Point 1. – which has given us the advantage over earlier vaccines of a massive wealth of data which clearly shows effectiveness and high safety.
        Point 2 and 3 are essentially repeats for some reason? In any case the above wealth of data does not support your speculations though the durability is not what would be hoped for. Contracting a disease despite having had a vaccine is not unique to this one.
        
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        February 10, 2022 2:36pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        So my first point remains..
        
        You have failed to provide me with details of mass vaccinations that have been anything like this one.
        
        I imagine if the measles, TB, Polio, mumps, rubella, and pertussis campaigns had used such leaky vaccines, I’d be dead by now.
        
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        February 10, 2022 7:30pm
    - mawm
      
      Maybe then you will have an explanation for the reason why so many vaccinated Israelis, who started early and are now one of the most vaccinated countries in the world and who are on to vac no 4/2nd booster, are dying?
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:48am
      - Fight4NZ
        
        https://ourworldindata.org/vaccination-israel-impact
        The statistics from Israel would disagree.
        So looking at the Delta peak, approx 11,000 cases in a day, deaths around 33.
        Omicron peak approx 102k cases, 73 deaths.
        Far lower death rate now than earlier. No they are not zero, but based on the kind of analysis I see here we can probably attribute those to being people who have been killed by gunshot.
        Seems likely the drop in cases is some combination of vaccine and reduced virulence of Omicron. Not sure why they thought a 4th shot was warranted and perhaps in light of the short lived wave they might not have gone to that.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:03pm
    - bronny1
      
      If you have then why do you come across as so uninformed. Is there a gap between your understanding of the issues and your ability to elucidate your understanding?
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:14am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Perhaps not.
      
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      February 11, 2022 2:14am
  - bronny1
    
    Yes his brain is unfortunately programmed to believe the msm diatribe of safe and effective. It doesn’t have the capability to realise that repeating “safe and effective” a million times does not make it true.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:10am
- wreck1080
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  “The only thing surprising about the effectivity of the ‘vaccines’ is how utterly ineffective they are.”
  
  You are a spreader of misinformation. Thankfully, yours is a fringe view, or many more would have lost their lives.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:15am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    wreck1080 – many more have lost their lives. Due to the jabs and due to the inability to get genuinely serious health conditions dealt with in a timely manner. All because of the single focus on a seasonal respiratory illness at the expense of everything else. Physical and mental health are being damaged as is social cohesion and the economy.
    The response has been ridiculously over the top. It will eventually be recognised for what it is – the biggest cock up by a NZ government ever.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:37am
    - wreck1080
      
      Show me the proof that the vaccine has killed more people than covid. This is crazy territory!
      
      I’m not arguing with your other points, I agree with them.
      
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      February 10, 2022 8:45am
      - yobi
        
        We have not had one reported covid death that has been solely attributed to covid. The best example of this is the man who died of a gunshot wound! August last year there was a reported vaccine death. The Covid-19 Vaccine Independent Safety Monitoring Board released this information, so you will have to accept it as fact. I’m sure you will have a misguided argument for this, however there is the proof that you asked for.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:11am
      - wreck1080
        
        in response to yobi…you are factually incorrect.
        
        2 people have died directly from vaccination in New Zealand…. I believe it is likely around 5 people have died from the covid vaccine (by applying the mortality percentage of investigated cases to unresolved cases).
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:24am
      - bronny1
        
        Try the excess all cause deaths data. 1000 or 2000 excess deaths in 2021. We have had no respiratory illnesses in NZ in the past year yet the data looks like a bad flu season. What has killed all these extra people? We dont know for sure but likely a combination of lockdowns, missed medical treatments and vaccine adverse effects. And yes, based on VAERS the latter is likely to be a contributor.
        What other reasons can you see – I’m interested.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:18am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        What evidence out there is currently dismissed with the inane comment “correlation is not causation”.
        The evidence WILL come out. It is coming out, it is like pulling teeth because it is being suppressed with every tool available. But it will emerge and it will be damning.
        The covid numbers worldwide are now proven to be massively overexaggerated. Massively. I’m not digging it up again, I’ve posted it multiple times.
        UK just one example. 60% of hospital “covid” cases were actually there for something completely different but tested positive for covid when they got there. NZ is the same in the deaths and hospitalisations. Provable facts.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:28pm
      - Jim
        
        People should have seen the groundbreaking public disclosure last week showing UK Gov data for the entire period records less than 18k people who died ‘solely attributable’ to C19. Also the average age of the other 130k soles who were attributed to the ridiculous ‘WHO defined C19 death’ was 82.5 years old and with 2+ accompanying comorditities. Relate that figure in a NZ population of 1/16 the size of the UK.
        
        KK is right, it’s unlikely NZ has experienced anymore than a handful of true C19 deaths. The others are likely to have been in poor health, oh and the gunshot should have been quite conclusive. Economic and social destruction for the equivalent to saving an annual road toll?
        
        I will never understand why people who’s ‘metabolic health is poor’ have believed the government spin that suggests the vaccine (all 3 so far) will prevent death. It’s been shameless false advertising (safe and effective) at best or misinformation at worst.
        
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        February 10, 2022 4:54pm
    - riffer
      
      ClanMcLeod. That is misinformation.
      There is a thing called excess mortality that is used to determine deaths that are in excess of normal expectations, and in NZ in 2021 that rate went down.
      That is the exact opposite of what you have suggested.
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:59am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        riffer – If you can’t understand even the most basic concepts around what is going on then I am not wasting any energy educating you. Like with all of Ardern’s acolytes and Branch Covidians, it is a pointless exercise.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:31pm
      - riffer
        
        Understand it quite fine thanks. You are welcome to your misguided opinion. It’s a free world.
        
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        February 10, 2022 2:26pm
      - artemisia
        
        How many deaths from flu? Compared to a usual flu season. Not a season when the populace were not allowed out.
        
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        February 10, 2022 3:02pm
  - krazykiwi
    
    You call protection from infection and disease that attenuates into negative territory .. effective?
    
    You call the unexpected reprogramming of billions of immune systems .. effective?
    
    You call more vaccine-related deaths in 2021 than the sum total of the previous 30 years … effective?
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:38am
    - Fight4NZ
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      No I call it the misinformation that it is.
      
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      February 10, 2022 8:42am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        No F4NZ, you simply (very simply) say you disagree and think that’s that. Your word is final.
        You have no ability to debate and aren’t worth spending time on. Good luck going forward. You are on the wrong side of this, you might even be starting to realise it, hence the bile. But it’s all going to eat you from the inside out. It’s wasted on those who understand what is going on.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:33pm
    - Fight4NZ
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Correction:
      No I just call yours the misinformation it is.
      
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      February 10, 2022 8:57am
    - riffer
      
      krazykiwi. Compare rates of death directly attributable to the Covid vaccines to rates of death attributable to the Covid-19 itself.
      There is no comparison. Sure, an infinitesimally small amount of people have died from complications of the vaccine. It happens. It’s really sad. But far, far more lives have been lost due to non-vaccination and Covid-19 worldwide.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:01am
      - krazykiwi
        
        You’re right, riffer. There is no comparison. Because your argument relies on an unfalsifiable assertion that anyone who got the shot and didn’t die was saved by the shot. If your life depended on this argument then a judge would be donning his Judgement Cap before sending you down.
        
        There is no doubt in my mind that the shot has initially saved the lives of some already very vulnerable. My contention is that ‘vaccine’ stimulated OAS is putting billions of humans lives at risk for an unknown period of time, and that continuously having bodies generate billions of cytotoxic spike proteins is net harmful.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:34am
      - mawm
        
        Riffer – the problem is the deaths “attributed to” Covid has been greatly and deliberately exaggerated and those that have been “attributed to” the vaccine have been deliberately minimised through a number of means plus there are long term consequences including death some of which are only now becoming apparent.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:29am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        riffer – you’re out of your depth. You have no understanding of even the rudimentary statistical manipulations used that are now exposed. This is only the start of the revelations that are to come.
        Give it up. Like Brenda, you’re only digging a deeper and deeper hole.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:36pm
      - riffer
        
        Thanks for keeping it seemly folks. I appreciate it. I am not actually claiming that every person who is alive is due to a covid vaccine. That would be silly. It’s impossible to prove it either way because you’d need to test on an alternate universe. Thanks for engaging though.
        
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        February 10, 2022 2:28pm
      - Jim
        
        The vast majority would be aged and in poor metabolic health.
        I’m not lacking compassion, but point out the fact of evolutionary life cycles that the weakest are typically the first to succumb to disease(s). Vaccinations may buy time for the old and weak, but the risk/reward profile for younger healthy age groups is very questionable.
        
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        February 10, 2022 5:02pm
      - Fight4NZ
        
        “your argument relies on an unfalsifiable assertion that anyone who got the shot and didn’t die was saved by the shot”
        No it doesn’t. A great example of logic fail.
        The moot point is do more people die of the vaccine or the virus? Riffer correctly identifies the virus as being many times more lethal. The numbers of people who live is irrelevant.
        Who is out of their depth?
        
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        February 10, 2022 5:27pm
  - mandk
    
    How can a vaccine be described as effective when it clearly doesn’t stop vaccinated people from being infected and passing it on?
    
    This is why Ardern/Bloomfield are not reporting – like they used to – on the vaccination status of people who have been infected or hospitalised.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:39am
    - riffer
      
      Here is how.
      Say it’s 95% effective. That means 5 in every hundred it won’t work on.
      Those 5 people will get Covid.
      Say every single unvaccinated person will get Covid.
      If 95% of the population are vaccinated, for every thousand people you will have 46 vaccinated people get Covid. And 50 unvaccinated people will get covid.
      
      Oh noes! Just as many vaccinated are getting it as unvaccinated!!! The vaccine must be useless!!!
      
      You see where the “vaccines don’t work” misinformation comes from? Nobody considers the 904 people that were given immunity from the Covid.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:05am
      - krazykiwi
        
        Your knowledge on this topic is really very low, and as a result you make factually incorrect statements.
        
        I suggest you research and understand Absolute Risk Reducation vs Relative Risk Reduction. In the absence of factoring in actual mortality risk within well defined cohorts an RRR of 95% is an utterly useless metric. It is designed to fool the ignorant. And in the regard as least it appears it works.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:18am
      - mandk
        
        Jeepers.
        
        You start by assuming (not showing) it’s effective and then assume that anyone unvaxxed will get COVID.
        
        Ridiculous attempt at analysis.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:33am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Please riffer. Give it up. You are seriously making yourself look very, very stupid. At least we know you’re not a govt troll. They usually have a bit of a clue how to argue from an unwinnable position. You have no clue. Give it up.
        Here’s something to fill in the afternoon. Look up the difference between Absolute Risk Reduction and Relative Risk Reduction. Then research those numbers and their relevance to the Pfizer jab. The evidence is available from Pfizer, so you’ll know it’s accurate.
        No, I’m not giving you the link. Find it for yourself, it’ll be on the Pfizer website.
        Hint. The ARR is 0.8%.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:40pm
      - riffer
        
        I understand the difference quite well thanks. I wasn’t expecting this level of understanding here, based on the last few days discussion. Bravo. Looking back, my claim of 904 saved was lazy and a bit of a gish gallop. My apologies for being so glib. Of course it’s unprovable. But if we look at relevance versus overseas populations, it is a bit of an indicator of similar progress here – not the same – there are differences here, and some are significant, not the least our vaccination rate = my point remains that the vaccines are far more effective than they are ineffective. Unless we truly are God’s Own Country and they (whichever bloody god it might be) truly looking out for us.
        
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        February 10, 2022 2:32pm
      - Jim
        
        OMG if only that were the truth. Mate you need to look up ‘relative’ vs ‘absolute’ statistics and you may be in for a shock about vaccine efficacy statistics.
        
        Relative to my dogs guitar skills I’m as good as Brian May ?
        
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        February 10, 2022 5:05pm
      - Zoomfatigued
        
        You are proof that the world needs an extinction level event.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:39pm
    - SGA
      
      @mandk
      
      How can a vaccine be described as effective when it clearly doesn’t stop vaccinated people from being infected and passing it on?
      
      From the Johns Hopkins website
      https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/vaccines/vaccines-faq
      
      In general, most vaccines do not completely prevent infection but do prevent the infection from spreading within the body and from causing disease. Many vaccines can also prevent transmission, potentially leading to herd protection whereby unvaccinated people are protected from infection by the vaccinated people around them because they have less chance of exposure to the virus. We are still learning whether or not the current Covid-19 vaccines prevent transmission of SARS-CoV-2. It is likely they reduce the risk of virus transmission but probably not completely in everyone. This is one of the reasons why it will still be important for people to continue wearing masks and practicing physical distancing, even after being vaccinated.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:56am
      - bronny1
        
        Can you supply a date for this?
        As it’s demonstrable now that the vax does not reduce transmission. In fact you are more likely to catch covid if double vaxxed (see UK and Scotland public health data that has been shared here many times).
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:22am
      - mawm
        
        Everything in that statement has since been refuted. Firstly the vaccines do not prevent disease. There are a number of studies that have shown that the vaccinated carry the same viral load in their nasopharynx as the unvaccinated so spread it as readily as the unvaccinated. There are studies that have shown that spread within families (the major spreader events) is as frequent from vaccinated as unvaccinated. And from a “recent” John’s Hopkins there is no protection offered by masks or physical distancing – unless of course you never get anywhere near anybody.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:39am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        “we are still learning” – It is likely they reduce”. Have you got any more empirical data? You’ve just confirmed that this is an experimental product.
        
        The information you have quoted is totally irrelevant. The definition of what a “vaccine” is has been changed twice in the last 2 years to fit the current narrative.
        You’ve had way to much of the koolaid. The stuff you’re saying was debunked months ago.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:47pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        “We’re still learning”
        
        Quite. A voting member of a Food and Drug Administration (FDA) advisory committee admitted that whether or not Pfizer’s Covid-19 vaccine is safe for 5 to 11-year-old children won’t be known fully until it begins being administered.
        
        “We’re never gonna learn about how safe the vaccine is until we start giving it,” said panel member Dr. Eric Rubin during the hearing. “That’s just the way it goes.”
        
        This is called experimentation.
        
        At one time learning was done in a lab, in vivo with animals for years before moving to human trials, and then for years more before being made available to the public.
        
        But now?
        
        The global population has become a lab rat for a rapacious industry that is inflicting untold harm on humans, and doing so with impunity.
        
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        February 10, 2022 2:55pm
  - Viva Christo Rey
    
    yet you do not provide any refutation of even a single point
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:50am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Come on be serious. KK and I do not agree on everything vaccine. My view is that the world is better with them than without them. I just had my booster.
    
    I guess it depends what you mean by “effective”. I would call them “profoundly disappointing” in relation to what was promised and the hype that Jacinda generated about them. She promised us a “summer of freedom” if we were vaccinated. Now we are locking up fully vaccinated people for 10 days if they happen to be in the same eating establishment as a positive case.
    
    So no they are not ‘highly effective’. Far from it. Otherwise we would not be in this crazy position.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:58am
    - riffer
      
      Yep. The overabundance of caution is the killer. That is the one thing that royally pisses off everybody, on the left and the right.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:06am
    - leoj
      
      The vaccine is so good, you had to have it three times.
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:48am
      - Fight4NZ
        
        You know that doesn’t set it apart from several other vaccines right?
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:11pm
    - Fight4NZ
      
      Agree it very much depends on what you mean by effective.
      By effective I mean that without exception for the pre-Omicron strains (which I noted specifically) vaccination campaigns in numerous countries crushed case numbers.
      Durability of effect is a different matter and I guess what you refer to as profoundly disappointing. I wouldn’t go that far but would have been good if at least a year.
      As you have said everyone will get Omicron, and the immunity gain from that will allow the return to normal, though at this stage durability and ability to combat new strains is unknown.
      So I don’t think there is much we disagree on out of that?
      
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      February 10, 2022 1:29pm
  - Billy
    
    Remember when the aim was herd immunity if we reach 60%, then 70%, then 90%? Now, there are places with over 100% and there is no herd immunity.
    
    Remember when the Pfizer CEO came out and said getting a 3rd dose definitely stops omicron in its tracks, then he said the very next day that a 4th dose will definitely do it. Israel is over 60% on their 4th dose and guess what? It aint stopping anything.
    
    What counts as effective exactly? That it reduces hospitalizations? That wasn’t what we were sold and that is like the bare minimum to be considered minimally effective. The vaccines were sold as our ticket to end covid. Now the experts are all saying we will just have to live with covid from now on.
    
    Lets face it, we were either lied to from the beginning or the experts, while they may know a lot, don’t know as much as they would like us to believe and what they say today could be completely false and flip 180 tomorrow.
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:04am
    - riffer
      
      I get that, but how would the public react if every expert said “well, buggered if I know. I guess you’ll have to wait and see what really happens.” Everybody demands a perfect opinion from experts who are working with imperfect data. And then we bitch and moan when it doesn’t gel with reality.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:07am
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        Maybe a bit of honesty in the self-promoters, and the media who pick the most hysterical numbers for gaining attention.
        
        Maybe not just a ‘buggered if I know’, but ‘to be clear: one possibility amongst any is this…..’.
        
        The modelers have done arguably more harm than good.
        They have scared a lot of people beyond what is justified at an individual level, and yet not spurred the government into a war footing expansion of our health system’s capacity.
        
        I see them more a part of the tools of coercion, rather than presenting a range possibilities and saying ‘here are the facts, judge for yourself the risks’.
        The way Hendry was rolled out on screen after 1pm between the PriNZcess and Saint Ash was pure theatre.
        I think that extrapolating the modelled numbers across the whole of the population is meaningless, aside from highlighting the failed opportunity around scaling up the government preparedness, RATs, supply lines, ICU.
        We need to look at what it means for us and those around us. Fatty? Lose weight. Smoker? Stop. Old/vulnerable or anxious, get a vaccine {in the sense that mRNA is called a vaccine}.
        Or don’t do any of these things.
        It’s all on you.
        
        Aside from that, all we need to know is that vaccines help reduce symptoms for the more serious Covid19 cases effectively, for a short time.
        The mRNA prophlatics we are getting are not as effective on Omicron – but then again, no matter how we dress it up, the health impacts are less than the self-isolation impacts.
        The recent modelling that has said that had >1 million infected, 100,000 cases, which means >400 deaths. This is really into the FLU-season spectrum of worry.
        So if that modelling is still trying to tell us how serious this all is, well, Omicron does not rate in my spheres of concern.
        
        Get a vaccine if you want, and as many as you want….but judge for yourself.
        The real interesting facts around comorbidities, the average ages of death, and the demographic and other differences between the places hit hardest’ were never as thrust in our faces as the old lie ‘tens of thousands will die’.
        
        We actually have facts enough now (despite the media preferring to scare us) to make individual judgements on risk. Modelling should not be part of the headlines.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:35am
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        spelling correction: -Hendy- of the “80,000” dead – along with his team, whom we might call “The 6 Million Dollar Man”.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:43am
      - Phronesis
        
        I think the opposite is true. We would all prefer it if the experts would sod off with their entirely useless predictions. Politicians can then be left to make political decisions without the benefit of their bought and paid for “science” as cover.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:55am
      - kowtow
        
        Of course you’re right . Honesty and transparency are no longer a currency in the post modern , state knows best world we live in.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:59am
      - pdm
        
        Fuzzy – you forgot to add $50,000 with Omicron by Waitang Day to Hendy/s misleading calculations.
        
        That man has not been within a bulls roar on any calculations yet the Government continues to fund him – $6million of taxpayers money ast time.
        
        Hard to believe Ardern, Robertson and Hipkins are that stupid – then they go and prove it every day.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:41am
    - kowtow
      
      There was another mantra “One shot keeps you out of ICU , two keeps you out hospital , do it to save the health system”
      
      4/5 of “cases” didn’t even know they had the lurg ,so how do shots ( 1, 2 or 3 ) keep fit healthy people out of hospital , let alone ICU.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:58am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      It is now confirmed that natural immunity gives stronger and longer lasting protection.
      
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      February 10, 2022 12:51pm
      - virtualmark
        
        No it isn’t.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:48pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        So why are the antibody tests still banned? If you have had Covid (symptomatic and asymptomatic) then you will not need to be vaccinated.
        Ahhh! I know. If you test for antibodies and it is positive – it fucks with the fear porn numbers
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:57pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        “When somebody is naturally immune— like they got COVID— they probably have…more antibodies against the virus because what the vaccine is…that protein is just on the outside.”
        …
        “It’s just one antibody against one specific part of the virus. When you actually get the virus you’ll start producing antibodies against multiple pieces of virus, not only the outside portion but the inside portion, the actual virus so your antibodies are probably better at that point than the vaccination.”
        
        That’s Nick Karl, a biochemist at Pfizer.
        
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        February 10, 2022 3:28pm
  - krazykiwi
    
    @wreck1080, I’m interested in your commentary on this chart. It is US data only, and shows, for example:-
    
    1. For Flu jabs (2006-2019)
    — 1,600,000,000 doses
    — 0.35 deaths per million doses
    
    2. For Covid jabs (2020-present)
    — 550,000,000 doses
    — 19.5 deaths per million doses
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:06am
    - Fight4NZ
      
      The inexplicable habit of presenting Covid deaths as vaccine deaths. As if that’s not baffling enough simultaneously presenting the same data to show there are no excess deaths so Covid is a sham. Shrug?
      
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      February 10, 2022 9:18am
    - wreck1080
      
      Click ‘about me’…
      “I am just a concerned citizen reporting on often overlooked public data regarding adverse events related to the new Covid-19 vaccines. ”
      
      This guy is an anti-vaxxer who codes for a job. Yet you are prepared to accept his credentials over that of trained scientists and doctors.
      
      Regardless, go directly to the horses mouth, Vaers…
      
      https://vaers.hhs.gov/data/dataguide.html
      When evaluating data from VAERS, it is important to note that for any reported event, no cause-and-effect relationship has been established.
      
      So there is no distinction as to whether they were hit by a bus, died from cancer, had a heart attack, or even died from covid itself.
      
      Lets check the NZ equivalent, where we use the ‘carm’ system of reporting post vaccination deaths…
      https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/COVID-19/safety-report-39.asp#death
      
      Up to and including 31 December 2021, a total of 133 deaths were reported to CARM after the administration of the Comirnaty vaccine.
      
      Using your method, you’d claim the mrna vaccine has caused 133 deaths in New Zealand… sounds scary, if I were an anti-vaxxer I’d be using this data to scare people
      too (as with vaers).
      
      But medical experts have reviewed each one of those 133 deaths in detail, and found…
      
      54 of these deaths are unlikely related to the COVID-19 vaccine
      58 deaths could not be assessed due to insufficient information
      19 cases are still under investigation.
      2 deaths were likely due to vaccine induced myocarditis (awaiting Coroner’s determination
      
      Of conclusive cases, 3.5% are likely related to the vaccine. Taking all of the people who died following vaccination, 3.75% of 133 deaths is approx 5 people. So I’d accept that around 5 people have died directly because of the covid vaccine.
      
      5 people, out of 4 million vaccinated, slightly over 1 person per million has died from vaccination in New Zealand.
      
      My view on our covid vaccine deaths is that we improve post-vaccine complication detection and treatment.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:05am
      - mawm
        
        Wreck – there is no discussion on how they determined which of those deaths were related or not to the vaccine. The dishonesty here is that the WHO/CDC/NIH have discouraged doing post mortem examinations on these cases. There are specific histological changes which are recognised as being caused by covid vaccines and are necessary to look for to exclude the diagnosis. Looking into the time line and the symptoms experienced is very subjective. There are markers out there that suggest not all is as it seems, such as an increase in deaths in the younger cohorts of those vaccinated as noticed by life insurance claims and above normal number of acute coronary events picked up in the usual governmental health and disease monitoring, and with time a full and proper analysis will be done. But the signals are there that once the deaths due to covid are removed there is an increase in deaths in almost all age cohorts.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:02pm
    - riffer
      
      A far greater percentage of the population are getting Covid vaccines. Therefore it is more likely that, according to statistical variation, more unexpected events will happen. Because… humans.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:08am
      - ClanMcleod
        
        Give it up riffer. It isn’t getting any better for you. Seriously. I’m getting embarrassed for you ffs.
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:54pm
    - Raphael
      
      19.5 deaths per million doses however is still in the very safe margins for medicines, if not as safe as the flu jabs.
      And is still a lower deaths per million rate than C19 (which also still very low when you look at the total figures)
      
      (which is why I suggest getting vaccinated. I also think the mandates are a violation of human rights that should have Ardern on trial.)
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:20am
  - Clownworld
    
    Use of the word misinformation is a slogan not a solution. Critique the research, don’t attack the person.
    
    If views were different what proof do you have more lives would be lost? Lost lives how? A virus? Or you mean more indirect lives lost through what exactly? Lockdowns? Masks?
    
    Use of the word “spreader” is simply a loaded word, again without proof.
    
    What happened to critical thinking?
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:20am
    - riffer
      
      Good point. Nobody has time for critical thinking any more. Its all about the instant reckons.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:09am
    - wreck1080
      
      Quoting raw vaers data without analysis of that data, is that critical thinking?
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:19am
    - Phronesis
      
      “Critical theory” is what happened to critical thinking. They are entirely incompatible. Hence the push to stop critical theory being taught in schools.
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:00am
- ClanMcleod
  
  kk – thank you so much. I read Fight4NZ’s complete and utter twaddle, sat down reluctantly to rip it apart line by line, did one paragraph and thought stuff it. Grabbed a couple of beers and went for a game of golf instead.
  It wasn’t because it was a difficult job, but because it is tedious, has been done many times before and as you say, pearls before swine.
  F4NZ threw a handful of dismissive points together without a shred of evidence to support the dismissals. Just their own opinions. They haver repeatedly failed to respond to numerous challenges about specific aspects of the covid response when clear evidence was presented. Obviously that is why there was no response.
  
  Good on you for taking one for the team and doing the painful job of addressing that inane post.
  Thanks again.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:27am
  - krazykiwi
    
    You’re welcome. BTW my golf is atrocious at the best of times, but after a couple of beers I’d be in failblog/failarmy video territory.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:30am
    - pdm
      
      KK – perhaps you should take up Lawn Bowls.
      
      You never lose your Bowls (balls) and seldom are further than 100 yards from the bar.
      
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      February 10, 2022 8:38am
      - Biscuit
        
        pdm, back in the day (beginning in the mid 1970s, I mean) I regularly tripped over the Tasman at Easter time for the Saturday Monday Wednesday Saturday Easter Carnival run by the then Australian Jockey Club.
        
        And, every trip, I made a point of stopping over for a couple of hours at a nifty little artificial-greened Lawn Bowling Club alongside Hyde Park.
        
        Their blurb back then was not dissimilar to your line, heh.
        
        V pleasant company, mostly all old enough to be my Grandfather, but all delighted that a few youngsters (as I was then, sniff) were interested enough in them to drop in.
        
        I liked, too, that their club was holding out against the probably-inescapable infestation of bloody pokie machines…
        
        Been three years now, arrrrgh, since I’ve been across the ditch…
        
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        February 10, 2022 9:00am
      - lastmanstanding
        
        One of the major problems in Auckland and other cities is that with the increase in cars ( NZ now has the largest number per population ahead of the US) the narrow streets and the intensification of building often with only one car garages or no garages we have a traffic safety issue. With cars parked on either side of a street there is no room for two cars to travel safely.
        Plod bangs on about safety but is silent on this issue. The Gweens and other morons efforts to reduce the number of cars has failed spectaculary but instead of admiting defeat and widening roads and streets where possible by taking out the berms that arent needed they do nothing.
        
        This is typical of Government refusing to serve the people by taking practical steps. Instead they bang on about Climate Change and ignore the reality.
        Maybe citizens should make this an issue in the upcoming local body elections. Petition candidates and ask if they will enact a road and street widening programme if they are re-elected.
        
        Oh and by the way no increase in rates for this. They must do it out of existing rates by cutting back on their vanity and feel good programmes. Afterall there is plenty of fat in these to be put to a practical issue.
        
        Your thoughts?
        
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        February 10, 2022 9:07am
      - graham
        
        lastmanstanding, a subdivision in my neck of the woods, Millwater (near the Silverdale area) which was built quite recently, has done something that makes no sense to me. On one road they have included parking bays for cars, so no problem there. But, this road is also used by buses, and the bus-stops are located on the actual road. There is no bay for the bus to pull into; instead the bus will stop on the road.
        
        So what happens is that cars get stuck behind the bus, because the road is just busy enough that they often can not overtake. Even if there is a break in the traffic and the cars CAN overtake, it has broken the flow of the traffic. It’s not due to a lack of room to inset the bus stop – remember, there are plenty of parking bays. And this is a relatively new subdivision, which started being developed 15 years ago, so they had every opportunity to get it right.
        
        Why do they do this? I can only assume it is a “traffic calming” mechanism; something that transport planners use to try and encourage drivers to drive calmly, smoothly and safely. NZTA also states that the aims of traffic calming include:
        • Crash and casualty reduction
        • Traffic speed and volume reductions
        • The promotion of alternative modes of travel, especially walking and cycling
        • Reduce the dominance and reliance on the motor vehicle
        
        https://www.nzta.govt.nz/assets/planning/process/trial-ip-toolkit/docs/calming.pdf
        
        The theory is that car drivers will (a) drive more calmly, and (b) switch out of their cars onto public transport, or walking and cycling. But as people who live in the real world know, the reality is that very, very few people will ditch their cars because for the vast majority of us it simply isn’t a viable option. The inconvenient truth for Government and AT is that the car is simply THE most efficient and practical mode of transport. But of course, these people know better than us, so they will continue to make every effort to get us out of our cars and just merrily ignore reality.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:12am
      - bronny1
        
        He won’t be allowed. You need a vax pass to play lawn bowls. It’s very dangerous super spreader territory doing ge the exercise outside – how do you not know that? //
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:29am
      - pdm
        
        Biscuit – I started Bowls at the Suva Bowling Club in 1976 – that mantra was part of the beginners day I went to.
        
        The beauty of Suva BC was you cloud [could] drink on the green – Tano was the man that kept them coming. – a 60 year old Sikh who got very good tips to bolster his probably meagre wage.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:46am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      kk trust me, my golf is as bad. It’s my zen Buddhism. Seeking enlightenment that I know I’ll never find. Hence the beers. 🙂
      
      On that note, I see a couple of bunnies have unsuspectingly entered the fray. Cue another 6 pack and a trip to golf.
      Have a great afternoon. Don’t savage them too much.
      
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      February 10, 2022 12:57pm
  - Fight4NZ
    
    To deal with just 1 of your lies there, I have responded multiple times to expose your scientific illiteracy. You have utterly failed to revaluate a single element of the harmful misdirection you slavishly repeat to this day.
    Who’s on a payroll is my question?
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:47am
    - Don Beckett
      
      What ?? You are so delusional, my friend. Go back to school – the bell has rung.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:47am
      - RichardX
        
        Don, I don’t believe you are the correct person to judge others given some of the nonsense to which you have provided links.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:38pm
    - ClanMcleod
      
      F4NZ. You’ve never refuted a single thing with anything resembling evidence. You’ve refuted based on your opinion, which has repeatedly been shown to be inane.
      
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      February 10, 2022 12:59pm
      - Fight4NZ
        
        I have refuted with facts which have never been shown to be incorrect, in particular by yourself.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:18pm
      - Fight4NZ
        
        In fact I have refuted this claim by you that I have never responded with evidence on several occasions. It has become abundantly apparent that when your as deep in the cult as you are there is no such thing as discussion because you just blow a fuse as soon as you are disagreed with.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:36pm
- Simon
  
  Good work KK. Look forward to part two.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:28am
- Fight4NZ
  
  Disclaimer:
  – Data worldwide has demonstrated the efficacy of the vaccines beyond doubt up to the arrival of Omicron. With Omicron evidence shows a lower inhibition of transmission but remains high for serious disease and fatality.
  –The Covid19 vaccines have worked surprisingly effectively along side non-medical measures. Compare Delta outbreak in NZ to other countries where it got into the community.
  – vaccine’s by definition cause changes to the immune system. This might be referred to as “reprogramming “ again to pursue fear porn agenda. In reality it simply generates the ability for the immune system to recognise and produce counter agents to pathogenic material that has entered the body. This is the very definition of a vaccine.
  – vaccines are 1-off treatments the components and products of which are completely metabolised out of the body within days. Obviously any effect from these is not possible in their absence outside of the “memory “ invoked in the immunity system and therefore to talk about “lack” of long term studies is self evidently meaningless in terms of adverse events.
  – currently it is impossible to know if further boosters will be beneficial. Given the continued mutations in the virus this seems unlikely. On going use of this vaccine is far from locked in.
  – The vaccines are definitively not gene therapies. As confirmed by kk post 10/2/22 “ CDC changed their definition of Gene Therapy in August 2021.”. This action was forced by the distorted interpretation used by antivaxxers to bolster their fear porn.
  – Few in the population are terrified by the virus, the vast majority have just taken the sensible precautions on offer. Most fear-stricken are antivaxxers of the vaccine which has proven to have a very high safety record internationally.
  – the minimal inconveniences of the non-medical measures will be quickly forgotten in the return to normality.
  – the process to return to normality is underway with the arrival of omicron, with NZ moving along its own schedule which will be argued to be slow or fast but ultimately of minor consequence.
  – There is no evidence vaccination can lead to more virulent strains. Unsubstantiated antivaxxer scare story.
  – the rare phenomenon of Original Sin has not been observed with Covid-19
  – The Jews and other “untermensch” of the Nazi Germany regime were defined by inherent and unalterable attributes. You can get a vaccination and move from unvaxxed to vaxxed in NZ. Any attempt to draw a parallel is not only wildly inaccurate, but disrespectful of those who suffered and those who fought to liberate them.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:39am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Again, a list of unsubstantiated, unverified statements with zero evidence to support them.
    Because you said so doesn’t make it true, which it isn’t.
    
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    February 11, 2022 7:11am
- Andrew Worth
  
  The vaccines are just vaccines, it’s a pitty so many attach ideological agenda’s to them.
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:32pm
  - Fight4NZ
    
    Exactly.
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:18pm
  - Fight4NZ
    
    Actually I would go further and say that is one of the best comments I have seen on the topic in some time.
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:37pm
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Get ya hand off it Darryl.
      
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      February 11, 2022 12:59am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Which definition of “vaccine” are you using Andrew? 2020, 2021 or 2022? What will you do if they change the definition again? Oh I know, comply. Good chap! That’s the unthinking type of citizen we need. Brenda loves you.
    
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    February 11, 2022 7:08am
Warren

Jacinda’s petty politics from yesterday,
I hear nothing from that side is the Prime Minister on defence over ‘eye watering ,’rent increases and ‘ sky rocketing prices’ in the cost of living.
Well maybe she needs to get off that high horse and change her attitude as her lies don’t hold water anymore and her defence to use this in Question Time yesterday to Chris Luxon yesterday with its all Nationals fault and its currently the same problem all over the world is just a bit rich.
Jacinda Ardern should not be the Prime Minister if she can’t understand that spending money like drunken sailors on your pet projects and I’ll thought idea’s at every whim is a recipe for disaster and a large contributor to inflation.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2022/02/prime-minister-jacinda-ardern-challenged-on-eye-watering-rent-increases-skyrocketing-price-of-living.html
So just a point in honesty Jacinda Ardern how can you answer that the only thing the Leader of National Chris Luxon come up with on inflation is camera’s on fishing boats and school lunches, well let me remind you the money you used to fund them projects was used from a fund set up to fund and fight the pandemic Covid-19 and save lives at the expense of nursing and ICU Beds which most would call misappropriation of funds by your Finance Minister and used as Political bribes, so for you to bring your childish comments to the table is really a bit rich.
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February 10, 2022 8:00am
- info@cruzpro.com
  
  Oops. Fat finger. I meant to uptick but down ticked accidentally. Here’s two upticks to compensate _/ _/
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:32am
  - Biscuit
    
    info, your upticks look more to me like Ice Hockey sticks!
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:11am
    - NeverMindTheBollocks
      
      Cockney rhyming slang
      
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      February 10, 2022 7:40pm
- Paulus
  
  Treasury it is reported cannot get an audit on the Pandemic spending money because it appears that it has not all been used for purpose and they are unable to find where it has been spent.
  The Auditor General has been asked to report on this anomaly.
  Would like to think we will see the report but will be heavily redacted.
  I would still like to see the Peters/Ardern agreement papers.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:21am
- oldfella
  
  Just an aside, is the first man in trouble again?
  
  MrBlobby: so many rumours, so little… MSM curiousity. Hmm.
  
  [Mod: We all know the rumours. If you must share them, share them away from Kiwiblog please]
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:47am
  - oldfella
    
    FWIW, no one on KB is actually sharing rumours. Just saying that there are a lot of them swirling around at the moment about the same individual. Should that attract at least some MSM scrutiny, even if only to discount them?
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:29am
    - Sean OConnor
      
      No. Ardern’s massive failings as a leader are sufficient fodder for criticism, leave her family out of it unless said family wrongly uses their position (as Gayford did with his RAT call, and was rightly targeted).
      
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      February 10, 2022 1:55pm
- Hard Cheese
  
  its currently the same problem all over the world
  
  Ardern’s QT spin that inflation is a global problem caused by supply chain issues and high oil prices, whilst avoiding any admittance of her Government’s money printing program as a major contributor, is disingenuous nonsense. She says inflation is an international problem and NZ is no different than the US, Canada, UK and Germany. The US (7.0%) is the only one of those four that has a higher inflation rate than New Zealand. You could dubiously argue that they’re all “in the ball park” (Canada being at 4.8%) but what about Australia (3.5%), Italy (3.9%), South Korea (3.7%), Denmark (3.1%), France (2.8%) and Japan (0.8%)? Sweden, whose COVID response was much maligned by Labour, are at 3.9%, and even perpetual economic basket case Greece has a lower inflation rate than New Zealand, at 5.1%.
  
  The reality Arden wants you to avoid is that NZ has the 12th highest inflation rate in the OECD, headed only by countries like Turkey, Poland, Hungary, Mexico, the US, and Spain.
  
  If supply chain issues were a major factor, then you would expect all countries to be affected. How does Denmark not have supply chain problems and the United States does?
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:11pm
RockyJ

As if we needed any proof journalists are getting dumb and dumber here are a couple of basic mistakes from Newshub writers.
Yesterday in an article on the Wellington protests the police were written by the journo as “cops”. This morning on the same topic Rachel Sadler wrote for MC (Master of Ceremonies I guess) the word “emcee”.
Small points I know but these are supposed to be the exemplar of writing skills.
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February 10, 2022 8:06am
- kowtow
  
  Instead of learning on the job through the school of hard knocks , they go to university .
  
  Therein the problem.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:30am
- graham
  
  Small points, yes … but on the other hand, not so small because they are indicative of the decline in journalistic skills.
  
  I wince every time I hear a story on the news or read a story referring to “cops” – and it’s depressingly common these days. So much for the high and lofty ideals of journalism; it seems that our journalists are abandoning the Queen’s English in favour of street talk. Why, I don’t know. Maybe they think they can relate more to the younger generation?
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:59am
  - Flossie
    
    I believe there are other terms used by the younger generation for police than “cops”.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:59am
  - greybeard
    
    I am heartily sick of the word “kiwis”. And “kiwi”.
    Has it been forbidden to use “New Zealanders” ? And “New Zealand” ?
    Too colonial ? Too white?
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:49am
Simon

Corona Dividend. More people understand how utterly useless the National Party tribe are. Being slightly less garbage than the Labo tribe isnt going to cut it.
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February 10, 2022 8:06am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Go watch Luxon in the house from Tuesday, he was fantastic, if that is a little bit less useless than the worst government in history then you are a Labour plant
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:40pm
Rodion Raskolnikov

Canadian Opposition Leader Candice Bergen calls on Trudeau to end Covid-19 restrictions:

“When it comes to lockdowns and mandates, we’re seeing things change very quickly, and rightly so. Doctor Tam has said that vaccine mandates should be re-evaluated, and today the chair of the Quebec Liberal caucus clearly and strongly stated it’s time to end the divisiveness, the politicisation and end the mandates. We Conservatives could not agree more. This cannot be a slow and dragged-out process simply because of the Prime Minister’s ego, pride or denial. Canadians are too tired; Canadians need hope. So will the Prime Minister follow the science, follow the evidence, and end the restrictions and the mandates?”

Trudeau goes on to meekly explain that Canadians are indeed sick of the restrictions, notably neglecting to acknowledge that he was responsible for introducing them, while also talking inanely of the unity that, again, he has shattered through his divisive mandates. While he failed to answer any questions, in his defence, he’s certainly got the script well memorised, the script that he, Ardern and all the other puppets have been handed and told to recite whenever challenged.

Bergen steamrolls Trudeau throughout this clip, and she hits it out of the park when she says that “people don’t know where public health ends, and politics begins.” Brilliant. It’s really a contrast between someone talking sense and being reasonable, and someone else waffling platitudes and clinging on to a set of policies that lack any rational justification.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_TZvyQKzsQ&t=2s

This is the approach. This is precisely what our nominal opposition should be saying loudly and clearly both in the House and in public if they don’t want to go down in history as continuing to be complicit in what is now, beyond any remaining doubt, a pathological politically motivated and unjustifiable program to maximise state control of our lives while minimising our rights as free agents who possess an intrinsic right to make our own choices based on the relevant information.
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February 10, 2022 8:06am
- lifesgood
  
  She is impressive. Canada’s next PM if they’ve got any sense. Why they ever elected that sissy soy boy is beyond belief.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:18am
  - Warren
    
    When do Government identities like the Police have the right to discourage Kainga Ora from evicting misbehaving Tennant’s especially if they have threatened violence to other householders. They are paid to uphold the law not make the rules to any agency and if this Government says that how it will be done they don’t deserve to be in power.
    What a absolute joke this Government is and no wonder gangs are creating problems as we have a Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern that is out of touch with reality and obviously prefers violent criminals over hard working New Zealander’s.
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/461209/other-agencies-discourage-kainga-ora-from-evicting-misbehaving-tenants-select-committee-told
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:04am
  - Warren
    
    Boris Johnstone, Justin Trudeau and Jacinda Ardern won’t be Leaders of the political parties come their next Elections. All wannabe dictator s in their own right.
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:10am
- Random T Person
  
  The UK is dropping restrictions too, because Boris is under pressure over flouting the lockdowns he imposed on the proles. Proving the whole thing was political all along. Covid destroyed nothing. The reaction destroyed everything.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:24am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    And Germany.
    
    “The manic drive for perpetual vaccination has all but stalled. Courts in Bavaria and most recently in Hessen have overturned rules banning the unvaccinated from shops. All discussion of new restrictions, of new metrics, of new rules, is increasingly tabu.”
    
    https://www.eugyppius.com/p/paralysis
    
    But there is much more to be done. Stopping the train is one thing, then it has to be driven back up the tracks. The draconian legislation brought in must be abolished.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:47am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    And Sweden is over Covid
    
    Swedish health minister says coronavirus is no longer classified as a danger to society
    
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/sweden-lifts-covid-restrictions-testing-b2011574.html
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:25am
- kowtow
  
  Climate catastophe back to the top of the agenda.
  
  Same actors , same tactics .
  
  Media Pardy fear porn , political intervention, taxes up , prouctivity down, more rules and regulation.
  
  plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:28am
  - Master Mariner
    
    An interesting new development.
    
    “If we can maintain fusion for five seconds, we can do it for five minutes and then five hours as we scale up our operations in future machines,” said Tony Donné, EUROfusion Program Manager.”
    
    https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/New-Breakthrough-Could-Speed-Up-Nuclear-Fusion-Development.html
    
    Looking promising, If successful the real question is ” How would this effect Climate activists respond , Political or otherwise ?
    A lot of People making large amounts out of this Green New Deal with the potential to be decimated ?
    With all the unintended consequences of going Green, As expected it has the reverse effect.
    Look no further than the NZ carbon Market being “Shanghied” by overseas investors and huge increases in prices.
    The prices of all commodities through the roof associated with the Green revolution, Copper, Lithium, Cobolt etc.
    And this is what the Oil Majors already new, That the energy required to “transform” into Green economies require a load more energy input to manufacture.
    Check out Coal, Oil and Gas.
    The next thing is will people chose to freeze literally to death over the uncertainties of Green technology? The answer should be obvious and a political ” Hot potato” with Germany declaring Nuclear and Gas as Green.
    
    Here’s a good article if interested,
    https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/global-energy-crunch-1.6216531
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:43am
- All_on_Red
  
  Looks like the Canadian Truckers have won.
  
  ‘Authorities in Canadian provinces Quebec, Alberta and Saskatchewan have signaled they are ready to ease Covid-19 restrictions as the truckers so-called ‘Freedom Convoy’ protest enters day 12.’
  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10491549/Canada-provinces-ease-Covid-rules-trucker-protest-hardens.html
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:31am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Excellent. That is exactly what Luxon and the Nats should be doing. Instead, they are copying Starmer in the UK, effectively zero opposition. It will see Starmer consigned in the history books as one of the worst leaders of the opposition in history. Luxon should look hard at the UK and pay attention to how that has unfolded. He still has time to change course, but he needs to do so soon.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:42am
  - leoj
    
    Luxon and Seymour have disappointed re the Convoy.
    Big chunk of votes they could have courted.
    Both failed.
    Winston will see an opportunity.
    2017 all over again.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:52am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Another one, Luxon can not bloody do anything , these measures were put in place bt the totalitarian regime , and they will use it to their own use, if Luxon rubbishes the government when the protesters are full of mob members and maori activists and very uncouth scum, then he would lose a lot of support, taking away a vote for him will see Cindy the dictator squeak back in , and her and cabinet put these measures in place
    
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    February 10, 2022 2:45pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I saw that clip on FB, Dan Bongino.
  Trudeau was very nervous
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:13pm
bartybart

Any bloggers at the protest?
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February 10, 2022 8:07am
- westernScientest
  
  stuff has a feed, so do counterspin
  https://rumble.com/vuimj0-live-convoy-2022-nz-day-5-wednesday-10th-february-2022.html
  
  Cops have surrounded them and are dragging people out of the crowed and arresting them, so it will probably be over soon
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:40am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Wonderful crime stopping NZ police. Absolutely wonderful, saving us all from the thugs and criminals yet again. Bravo. Bravo. //
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:28am
    - kowtow
      
      No doubt this is under orders from the Speaker .
      
      To be fair ,once trespassed they should bugger off and anyone giving the Cops shit is an idiot.
      
      But I’m all in favour of lawful , peaceful protests and happily look forward now to the police consistently applying the law to similar events …….
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:08am
      - bronny1
        
        They have not been trespassed. This required each individual to be issued a named trespass notice which has not happened.
        From watching the feed it seems that the police are using bully boy tactics. So ashamed of what NZ has become.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:45am
      - kowtow
        
        I’ll defer to your knowledge of the on the ground legal niceties.
        
        Will await the charges and see what the courts make of the arrests in that case .
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:57pm
      - curry4me
        
        kowtow: Their next step shoul be to decline any work delivering stuff to Wellington.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:34pm
- Zero Kindness
  
  I have attended the protest each day for a few hours, but more involved in the provision of food and water for those whom have traveled and set up camp. We have plenty of provisions to last weeks and looking forward to new arrivals. The rain is coming and that will not help but these people are very motivated and are on the right side of history.
  If you are in Wellington, get down to parliament grounds and support these brave lions who are fighting for our children’s future.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:16am
  - RichardF
    
    Oh yes, like the brave lion who egged the defenceless 17 year old girl for wearing a mask? What a tough brave Lion! Wants freedom to “choose” but not happy when someone chooses something different, like her right to wear a mask without being assaulted. I’m pretty anti mandate and anti mask but you lost me when innocent people get attacked.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:09am
    - Zero Kindness
      
      There will always be exceptions to the rule. A few bad eggs sure, but 99%+ of these protesters have a heart and kindness, unlike out PM and her useless aides. Cuddles Coster will regret todays actions. This will not be over until the mandates are dropped.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:23am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      RichardF, wow, your self righteous indignation is about as sincere as Brenda’s “kind and caring”.
      There will always be examples of extreme or obnoxious behaviour, but don’t highlight this as if it is the worst thing that has happened in two years.
      I could respond with a book full of truly tragic incidents that have cost lives, all due to Brenda’s actions. Even the one you are referring to can be laid at her feet. She is the narcissist who has shredded the fabric of NZ. Completely and utterly down to Ardern.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:39am
    - Joely Doe
      
      Wants freedom to “choose” but not happy when someone chooses something different
      
      Lefties are never happy when others don’t do what they want…
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:46am
    - leoj
      
      Fake. You were never with us.
      One egg vs live-saving operations cancelled, businesses closing and suicides.
      You’re a fake.
      
      18 1
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      February 10, 2022 11:56am
    - Viva Christo Rey
      
      I doubt that is even true. Just the media slandering people I bet. Nothing the media says can be trusted, they work for the enemy.
      
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      February 10, 2022 1:18pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Exactly, business owners hassled, mongrel mob patched member in attendance, and a growing lot of maori in the scum that are illegally protesting , it is illegal to protest if you are being unruly
      
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      February 10, 2022 2:48pm
      - Clownworld
        
        Last I heard MM encouraged votes for Labour in exchange for lucrative P rehab contracts.
        
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        February 11, 2022 5:14am
  - curry4me
    
    Zero Kindness: Well done dude. I see one, or both lf the New Conservatives leaders have appeared there. Of course, they’re not MPs yet. They’re showing up the rest of the MPs though.
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:35pm
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      They have nothing to lose FFS , waiting for the rotten Peters to step foot in Wellington and get arrested
      
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      February 10, 2022 2:49pm
    - Zero Kindness
      
      Thanks Curry, just got back from another 5 hours at the protest, four stints on the front line. Lost a couple of lions to the police in one of the pushes, but managed to evade arrest so far. The crowd is growing and this could get very ugly.
      
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      February 10, 2022 4:50pm
      - curry4me
        
        Zero Kindness: Good for you. I think this crowd are smart enough to behave like Ghandi, and MLK.
        
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        February 10, 2022 6:23pm
- Raphael
  
  the Daily Examiner has been streaming on location
  https://www.facebook.com/watch/dailyexaminernz/
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:56am
- curry4me
  
  bartybart: Yes, see the story below that I posted from YT.
  
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  February 10, 2022 1:32pm
krazykiwi

“One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors.” — Plato
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February 10, 2022 8:09am
Viva Christo Rey

By refusing to meet with the protesters at parliament yesterday, who I am convinced represent the majority of this country – our politicians have shown themselves to be representatives not of our people but of big pharma and unelected globalist interests.
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February 10, 2022 8:12am
- krazykiwi
  
  Agreed. That Luxon and Willis both declined to meet the protestors is further confirmation, as if it were needed, that our opposition is another side of the same, filthy coin
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:19am
  - mandk
    
    Yes, they demonstrated that they are intolerant of dissent and not willing even to listen.
    
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    February 10, 2022 8:42am
  - I remember when
    
    Labour have decided that covid madates could still be their way to success.
    The dangers for National and Act is that, if the occupation of Parliament overstays our tolerance, they will be the parties blamed.
    This despite the fact that it is very hard to identify any National voters in those camping there.
    Plenty of probably Green (anti vax), Labour (Maori and disadvantaged) and Maori Party (the protest party).
    However, because the protest is anti-Jacinda and National/Act are calling for the end to mandates, the protesters are their supporters according to Labour and the media.
    Has there been any indepth articles on the benefits and gains we get from vaccine passports.
    What does having a vaccine passport actually do to reduce your chances of getting Omicron?
    Regardless of the extra risks of being unvaccinated/boostered what danger is that to those who are.
    If we have 200+ local cases what is the danger from imported cases?
    If you are proven to have been infected by Omicron is that the same as having a booster dose.
    Jacinda is determined to continue stressing the dangers of the unvaccinated, need for mandates and things like the danger of new strains.
    The polls suggest something like a 50/50 consensus on matters covid.
    At the moment Labour would think that was acceptable.
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:00am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      I haven’t seen ACT/National calling for an end to mandates? If they have that is excellent news. More important would be to call for the end of vax passes. Immediately.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:41am
      - Raphael
        
        Chris Bishop was saying yesterday that there needs to be an end date to the mandates (but at the same time he looks to be supportive of them)
        https://www.facebook.com/ChrisBishopMP/posts/498182895001329
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:13am
      - Observer of Life
        
        I’ve decided Bishop is a complete wind bag – aka a tosser.
        
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        February 10, 2022 10:13pm
  - curry4me
    
    krazykiwi: That includes the party I used to support too, ACT. They’re still in Branch Covidians.
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:38pm
  - Sean OConnor
    
    Don’t let fake freedom merchant Seymour off the hook.
    He’s decided that there isn’t a single government excess worth protesting.
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:58pm
    - curry4me
      
      Sean OConnor: Not about to. I’m sending him a letter saying what I think of ACT.
      
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      February 10, 2022 6:25pm
- yossarian
  
  Come on. The media have already written the headline and the entire content if any MP dares goes out to meet them. They just need a name.
  
  “ANTI VAX MP (insert name here) MEETS WITH LOW LIFE PROTESTORS”
  
  MSM had a pocket full of the Curren/Ardern media fund and the govt expects payback.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:33am
  - Sean OConnor
    
    At which point, the MP says, “I want to hear with my own ears if any of their grievances are justified, maybe you should try it instead of pushing the government line”.
    
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    February 10, 2022 2:00pm
  - yossarian
    
    And on queue…https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300514726/convoy-protest-national-mp-maureen-pugh-deletes-post-thanking-protesters-says-she-didnt-know-they-were-antivax
    
    So predictable
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:21pm
  - Observer of Life
    
    Yoss: No, time for the opposition to grow a pair. They are sadly pathetic, spineless blow hards. This has really shown their true colours. Sadly disappointed.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:15pm
- artemisia
  
  Opposition politicians need to be watchful of the middle voters and the timing of taking sides against that middle. Because the medias (MSM and social) would go ballistic if they fronted, whatever they said, even if a huge number of voters agree. Media still rules OK.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:33am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    I am sick to death of politics by media, no wonder Brenda throws so much money at it. It’s all about optics and zero to do with integrity, yet the political “pragmatists” support this. It make me truly despair for society and in particular, the people who manage our society. We are in a dark place.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:44am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Even play school TV1 reporters were inside the bee’s nest. This is for their own safety of course.
  Horseshit – they were hiding from reality
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:26pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Bullshit, i had some support for their plight, but when i see the bullying, the Mob in attendance and maori radicals involved, i say stick that shit where the sun dont shine
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:51pm
kevn

@kk… The only thing that should be mandatory is compulsory full reporting of (Pfizer) jab side effects.
As per http://www.dailytelegraph article and vid, the MOH have been very cavalier about this. Ask anyone who has had a vax problem and tried to get an exemption.
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February 10, 2022 8:12am
- SJ Actual
  
  95+% who are vaccninated are not the majority?
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:20am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    SJ Actual – Majority of what? How many got the jab because of implicit and explicit coercion?
    And are you referring to boosted, double or single jabbed? Or are you doing the same as the other useful idiots parroting the “single source of truth” and trotting out meaningless sound bites?
    Trust me, they’ve been tried here many times and received the same deserved derisive treatment.
    
    No matter how many have been double jabbed (no it isn’t 95%) it is still not representative of the opinions of those people. I know for a fact that ALL of my friends who got jabbed are utterly opposed to mandates and vax passes. They will not be voting for Ardern ever again. Maybe that’s an anomaly but I doubt it.
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:01am
  - Joely Doe
    
    Compulsion is not ‘Choice’.
    I am in a mandated professional position.
    I am not allowed to wait out the coming wave of Omicron on my 2 vacc shots. I am happy to forego a third shot (it’s not a booster), to gain perhaps a 30 day / 20% chance of reduction of symptoms.
    I do not have that choice.
    Many people, including Senior (Prof / Surgeons) medicos are not scanning in anywhere due to the crazy isolation requirements.
    This only ends in disaster.
    Perhaps that is what Labour wants, so Cindy can save us again?
    Labour has lost the nurses, lost the hospital staff, lost the police.
    Who’s left? 25-59 yr old women? Wait until hubby can’t work and the money stops.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:54am
  - leoj
    
    [We read it the first time. mod.]
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:58am
  - Viva Christo Rey
    
    Means nothing. I was jabbed against my will. I did it under duress because the mafia told me they would destroy my life if I did not comply.
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:20pm
    - virtualmark
      
      You had a choice. If you are a rational person then you chose the best option available to you. Now stop whining about the choice you made.
      
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      February 10, 2022 1:50pm
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        It’s called Hobson’s Choice
        
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        February 10, 2022 7:47pm
- 70andstilllearning
  
  news on TV1 this morning (banner scroll I think) – NZ data ~ 45k non serious adverse effects, 2k serious adverse. That will only be the tip of the iceberg. GP could add +1 to the 2k but hasn’t. Not much point really
  
  “If you or a patient experience an adverse event after vaccination that is very severe or unexpected you can report this to the Centre for Adverse Response Monitoring (CARM).”
  
  No compulsion, and (my view anyway) CARM were (are) going out of their way to dissociate effects as being “directly” attributable to the jab.
  (3 out of 3 identical reactions of varying severity is good enough for me! – but it Could be hereditary or a viral infection effect which are historically known triggers)
  My guess is CARM would go for the “hereditary”, that’s the hardest disprove //
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:49am
  - Weetbix3ways
    
    So 1 in 4,000 chance of a serious reaction, assuming every serious reaction is recorded in the database (historically unlikely). Per jab.
    So if you’ve had just one booster, you’re at 1 in 1350 chance of a serious reaction.
    If you were double-jabbed in 2021, and get your 3-monthly boosters in 2022, your odds are getting worse than 1 in 700.
    
    Would you get on a plane if you knew there was a 1 in 700 chance it would crash?
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:24am
    - 70andstilllearning
      
      @Weet.. – as I commented to kk sometime back, with self inflicted co-morbs that could create issues you make pragmatic choices. Meds that I’m on clearly reduced the adverse impact as predicted for the booster – but could well have “shut” the “juices” activity down as well making it pointless – so the the pragmatic “risk” choice could well change if a 4th jab becomes “necessary”.
      
      But your analogy – itching to go back to Hawaii or WA or any where I don’t have to put up with daily exposure to our beloved leader – but in Dreamliners that have been mothballed in dry(dusty) conditions for a couple of years – ummmm. Pragamatic choice I suppose. :):)
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:58am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    I personally know 5 people who have had adverse reactions. They have all been told it was nothing to do with the jab. It’s a deliberate lie by the medical people involved.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:46am
    - 70andstilllearning
      
      Yep – I’ve completely lost any faith I might of had in the likes of “independent” bodies such as Medsafe, MCNZ, CARM etc ……. Their ” independence” and credibility have disappeared into the sewers somewhere. I do have a lot of sympathy for the front line health practitioners (GP’s and others), their registration bodies have pretty well put them over a barrel with a ” there’s one opinion permitted – challenge that publicly and your rego’s gone” atitude/message.
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:22am
    - Observer of Life
      
      Clan: Ditto. Know if 5 and none of them have reported to CARM.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:22pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Your communist regime is hiding the facts, Nats have tried to get coverups of all sorts under covid into the air , but are shutdown
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:52pm
Yvette

Testing times
The average number of tests for the past seven days is 15,000. A week ago, that number was closer to 20,000. And just under 28,000 a fortnight ago.
The Prime Minister however isn’t worried by the decrease.
“The positivity rate remains low so there is the view currently that there aren’t a large number of cases being missed,” said Jacinda Ardern.
https://www.1news.co.nz/2022/02/09/experts-urge-people-to-get-tested-for-covid-amid-low-numbers/

“The positivity rate remains low”, surely because the test numbers are low
Occam’s law – that simple.
And if this is the level of Ardern’s thinking or understanding, some of us won’t vote for her or Labour next Election – because some of us likely won’t be here

Under the Newshub headline “COVID-19 expert Michael Baker’s message to Kiwis as QR code scanning numbers plummet” it is observed QR Code scans have gone the same way as Testing –

The number of COVID Tracer QR Code scans has dropped dramatically since last week, from 2.5 million to 1.6 million on Monday and only 1.5 million on Tuesday.
But we’re not all diligent – and it’s turning into a big problem.

But it is not a matter of “diligence”.
When the anti-smacking laws were passed there was an increase in younger children beinging assaulted by older sisters or brothers, and when questioned (by teachers in playgrounds) admitted a parent had told them to do it.
A parent caught punishing a child could be arrested by not a daughter or son.
These people may be ‘criminal’ but they are not fucking ’stupid’.
However not ‘smart’ or ‘clever’ – just also as simple as Occam’s thing

And for families that can not afford to be shutdown totally for several weeks, Baker says –
So if you’re one of those who looks the other way or won’t get tested even if you have symptoms, here’s something to think about.
“You will infect other people, you will intensify the outbreak, and you may actually infect people who get seriously ill and die from it,” says Prof Baker.

A very serious appeal – life or death for some – but it ignores the fundamental factor Ardern is ignorant of – wilfully or Maleficentally – that in fact THEY ARE NOT US and WE ARE NOT A TEAM OF FIVE MILLION
Yet again, as simple as Occam’s thing
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February 10, 2022 8:14am
- Julie
  
  A simple answer to this is anyone isolating receives full pay. If it is that vital to the health of the nation the government will do so.
  The young and low paid have more than paid the price to protect others- house prices through the roof, wages not keeping up with inflation.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:37am
  - westernScientest
    
    all very well, but who is going to pay? businesses cant afford it, tax payers cant afford it….
    
    currency can only be added to a system if goods and services are produced, if they are not then we get inflation…. hmm I wonder what was done recently that could have caused that.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:48am
    - artemisia
      
      The rich can afford to pay more, much more. The rich can also afford to remove themselves and / or their assets from New Zealand. As France discovered.
      
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      February 10, 2022 6:14pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  Factor in the inaccuracy of the tests. Never forget that the both the RATs and the PCR tests are very unreliable. VERY.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:04am
- Yvette
  
  While several ‘experts’ now bemoan a lack of tests to tell them what is happening with cases, to reflect their ‘wild’ and dire predictions, actual hospital cases may reflect where things are in fact going – like, omicron is indeed spreading.
  
  While hospital numbers seem minor, how many cases result in one hospital admission –
  have they worked that out yet? –
  
  04 February 2022 – 9 in hospital
  05 February 2022 – 10 in hospital; 1 in ICU
  06 February 2022 – 12 in hospital; 1 in ICU
  07 February 2022 – 14 in hospital; 1 in ICU
  08 February 2022 – 14 in hospital; 1 in ICU
  09 February 2022 – 16 in hospital
  
  Data – https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-news-and-media-updates
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:16am
  - westernScientest
    
    hmm I wonder if that is an indication that there is a lot of people out there not getting tested.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:50am
- Ehlana
  
  “So if you’re one of those who looks the other way or won’t get tested even if you have symptoms, here’s something to think about. “You will infect other people, you will intensify the outbreak, and you may actually infect people who get seriously ill and die from it,” says Prof Baker.”
  
  So, just like every other viral or contagious illness that circulates through our communities then?
  
  Maybe instead of an “unemployment insurance” scheme our government should have put its effort into addressing the question of improving the health and wellbeing of New Zealanders, especially the workers we have now discovered are essential. Besides spending money on doctors, nurses and ICU beds, we could have ensured access to basic exercise for everyone by making our streets pedestrian friendly. And requiring Councils to improve and maintain basic infrastructure rather than build white elephants and sponsor endless “events” that the people don’t want enough to organise themselves.
  
  Since the government likes advertising, how about some campaigns on basic health – sleep, nutrition, movement? If we’re going to have another fund paid for by workers and employers, it should cover employee sick leave rather than unemployment (for which we already have benefits). Sick people going to work can spread a virus; unemployed people, by definition, do not go to work. And will get their benefit while isolating and recuperating at home, presumably. It is the employed who need support.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:19am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Baker is without doubt the most obnoxious irritant of the last 2 years. Brenda has been the most obnoxious overall, but Baker is like the bad itch that you can’t scratch. Just when you think it’s gone away, nope, back it comes, worse than ever.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:50am
- Mr_Blobby
  
  What is this QR code you speak of?
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:29pm
lazza

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Hey KK

I reject the premise of your statements.

I will not participate in arcane, presumptuous pseudoscientific amateur “research” … thank you

The arrogant arrogance of it.

Back in your box/kennel?
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February 10, 2022 8:15am
- krazykiwi
  
  Hey lazza, that’s a shame. Knowledge is advanced by dialog, and not by sulking in the corner which is what you appear to be doing.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:41am
  - RichardX
    
    Yes…because dialog with flat earthers and young earth creationists works so well.//
    
    4 17
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    February 10, 2022 9:09am
    - All_on_Red
      
      You forgot the Climate Extremist nutters.
      
      14 2
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      February 10, 2022 10:00am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        You are, of course, free to choose which group of nutcases you agree with.
        LOL
        
        2 7
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        February 10, 2022 11:18am
    - Clownworld
      
      You forgot the woke , the marxists and the cult of Jacindamaniacs.
      
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      February 11, 2022 5:30am
- ClanMcleod
  
  lazza if you can’t engage in rational, evidence based debate then best you get back under your bridge and stay there. You add nothing to society or the discussion around this issue.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:06am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Oh yes, because Kiwiblog is renowned for its rational and evidence-based debate.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:19am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      It would be a rational place, but there are to many fruit loop lefties in the chamber
      
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      February 10, 2022 2:55pm
    - Zoomfatigued
      
      Doesn’t seem to stop you from tuning in every day.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:42pm
kowtow

Only two odd months ago Batlfu was so dangerous and threatening to society that HM’s UK govt was actively considering cancelling Christmas .

Today , after Party Gate and a crash in the polls the same govt announces the end to all restrictions .

Where are the modellers with their apocalyptic death scenarios , the Media Pardy who through fear porn enabled the hysteria and what of the “science” that is so subject to political whim?

And we saw elements of the same here . From reduce the curve to save the health service to all out eliminayshun , total lockdowns so popular with so many , to covid fatigue and falling polls that resulted in ‘learn to live with the lurg’ , we’ve had more flip flops than a Coromandel summer.
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February 10, 2022 8:16am
- Zero Kindness
  
  When you mix science with politics you get only politics.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:25am
Truman lodge

The protesters at Parliament would appear to be Labour /Green and Maaarri party supporters if the flags waved are anything to go by. Tino Fags, United tribes, LGBTQI, and a Palestinian flag.

I did see several NZ flags on tv though.
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February 10, 2022 8:18am
- RockyJ
  
  It makes you wonder if we had a demo against Three Waters et al whether the Maori independence flag wavers would turn up.
  They probably would, they are so thick.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:03am
  - chukar
    
    RJ
    The convoy did list three waters and he Puapua as challenges to Freedom in NZ.
    Not all about mandate and vaccination but about freedoms for all NZ .
    
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    February 10, 2022 4:57pm
- Fight4NZ
  
  Yes, the usual rent-a-mob
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:06am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Has arrived. That would be you F4NZ. Nice to have you back to inject some humour into the debate.
    
    8 4
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    February 10, 2022 10:52am
- Simon
  
  Pro freedom/ NZ people are mostly European. (complete lack of Asians & Indians for e.g) MSM shows what you what they want you to see.
  
  Had to laugh at the police all wearing masks outside. Draws a line so to speak.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:10am
- mikenmildagain
  
  It’s the usual grab-bag of miscellaneous grievances.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:13am
- Weetbix3ways
  
  Not even close, mate. But since you’re getting your information from your TV, your position is to be expected.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:33am
- curry4me
  
  Truman Lodge: They’ll be a similar cross section to the ones I’ve met at thr F&R protests. Mostly Joe and Jane six pack. Vaxxed, and unvaxxed alike. The common motivation seems to be my body my choice.
  
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  February 10, 2022 1:46pm
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  Yes, many maori activists, Mongrel mob, and young activist fools , all showing us a toxic shambles
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:56pm
NeverMindTheBollocks

Re the protest at Parliament:

The problem is political but the solution is operational? Jacinda’s ‘aving a larf!
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February 10, 2022 8:18am
- pdm
  
  `Jacinda’s ‘aving a larf!’
  
  While Poto as Police Minister wonders what is going on.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:58am
NeverMindTheBollocks

Breathless reporting from cub reporters. Protesting at parliament brings it home to the media, parliamentary staffers etc – this is their place to stuff the nation, nobody else’s!

They don’t like it up ‘em.
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February 10, 2022 8:20am
I remember when

Just reading about the businesses affected by the Mandate convoy disruption.
A business was forced to close for the day because of the inability to operate under the conditions.
Sounds very similar to what happens when there is a ‘lockdown.’
No real consultation.
A sort of the ‘will of the majority’ at that moment.
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February 10, 2022 8:27am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Indeed, the convoy was one day. How many days did Brenda disrupt their business? I’ll give her a win on this one.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:10am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    The businesses effectively blockaded by the protestors, for the third day now, might see it differently from you.
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:15am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      Those with businesses and lives destroyed after almost two years of inane policies, mandates and rules from Brenda might disagree with you milkey.
      
      Considering their businesses were apparently shut down by this “minority” of “radicals” I’m surprised I didn’t see them out protesting against them. I did see many thousands out supporting the convoy. But that must be the MSM being biased against Brenda. //
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:00am
    - Mr_Blobby
      
      They are taking one for the team of 1 Million, that are prochoice.
      
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      February 10, 2022 2:38pm
cmm

The government is getting snookered by its own fear mongering..

We’re all told how terrible Omicron is and how the old masks are useless against this new sneaky foe.

So surprise, surprise, nursing staff now feel fearful because they are only being supplied with the almost completely useless surgical masks and not N95s.

Surgical masks (those pleated blue and white masks) are useful for:
* Stopping splashing liquids. eg. blood spurting out of a cut artery in surgical situation and maybe from droplets if someone coughs straight in your face. They are useless against aerosols.
* Theatrical props.

Only N95s help with what is important: aerosols.

They’ve had 2 years now. Couldn’t even get nurses their PPE!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/127718372/most-dangerous-place-to-be-nurses-buying-own-n95-masks-as-ministry-fails-to-provide-them
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February 10, 2022 8:30am
- cmm
  
  It is also a bit hysterical of the nurses to claim their workplace is “the most dangerous place to be”. Nowhere near that. Life is far more dangerous for people working in forestry and many other workplaces.
  
  This irrational thinking is the result of the fear mongering that is used to suppress rational thought.
  
  Still, nurses deserve better and the only reason they are not getting better is pure incompetence.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:55am
  - oldfella
    
    cmm:
    
    It is also a bit hysterical of the nurses to claim their workplace is “the most dangerous place to be”.
    
    Just look at the TV news at night and you’ll see that the entrepid reporters hiding inside parliament, after being called unkind names by the protesters, are doing the most dangerous job in the country. Those nasty words can really sting. /s
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:01am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Any mask is like using a wire mesh fence to keep out mosquitos – even the big Alaskan mossies
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:48pm
fisho

Where’s First-Man Clarke hiding? We haven’t seen or heard from him for quite some time.
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February 10, 2022 8:32am
- barnacle bill
  
  The same place Mrs Luxon is hiding.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:26am
  - pdm
    
    BB she seems a more respectable and responsible person than the first man will ever be.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:51am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    What bullshit FFS, he is the only speaking , not counting the possum in the headlights Ardern , and Seymour is as bad as her, he stuffed up , and is trying to change tact
    
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    February 10, 2022 2:58pm
- Biscuit
  
  fisho, maybe it’s the First Man who is co-ordinating all the mysterious downticking of Kiwiblog posts today.
  
  If even 0.0000000000001% of the rumours are true – and I have NO info there – he’s not able to do much else of late…
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:36pm
- Observer of Life
  
  Mt Eden.. oh no sorry, Mt Roskill?
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:32pm
Lee C

Thank you for that KK.

How can we get this message to a wider, more effective range of people?

Kiwiblog is wonderful in its way. But let’s not deny it, it has been front and centre of the mythologised narrative about ‘covid’ all down the line.

Then you have the likes of the Main Opposition Parties, on-board with the narrative perhaps similarly intoxicated by the prospect of unlimited political power, courtesy of ‘Public Health Concerns’.

Otherwise intelligent people eagerly exposing their childrens’ arms to the needle.

Largely because no one out there in the political forum has the stones to show any real leadership.

But how might I define this? Am I merely seeking someone who agrees with me, and pinning my hopes on them?

One hundred times no.

What I mean by ‘leadership’ is fulfilling ones’ duty to interrogate, challenge and apply a blow-torch to the current administration. Regardless of the issue.

The so-called ‘Oppostion’ on the subject of ‘covid’ has, in my opinion, been a shameful, empty, self-seeking shell of an organisation.

They stood by mute as Ardern publically tore up their pandemic plan. Not a whimper. What a bunch of spineless sell-outs.

They have been akin to under-fit boxers, caught on the ropes and mercilessly pummelled by the fitter, hungrier and frankly more psychopathic contender – Jacinda Adern and her terror-porn.

Yes, she has essentially tore the Oppostion a new one.

So punch-drunk (still) are the Opposition that they are now unwilling to get up and into the ring even as the bell for the final round is sounding..

Still, even now, Ardern is in such total control of the official narrative that teh ‘Oppostion’ and their water carriers are stuill parroting it.. I mean Really?!?

The Opposition still act and think as if they are fighting a conventional rules-bound bout of gentlemens’ boxing.

They have not reaalised they are facing a brawling, dirty street-fighter who doesn’t give a shit about ‘the rules’, and who has slipped the referees and the judges a few grand to throw the match.

Excuse the sexist innuendo but they are effectively ‘pussy-whipped’.

So KK, this is wonderful, and I salute your integrity on this and other issues (that I tend to agree with) – but how do we get these home truths out in front of enough people so they realise they’ve been ripped off.

How do we get around the glib lies of some?
Because let’s face it preaching to many of the nice people in Kiwiblog who think they are here for ‘the boxing’ isn’t going to be enough.

Love your work.
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February 10, 2022 8:34am
- Rusty
  
  @Lee C. Your comment is the “comment of year” so far on this blog in my view!
  
  The majority of Kiwis have simply been stunned into silence and compliance by this Govt and sadly so have the opposition.
  
  Talking to family, friends, and people I meet in public on the matter of our personal freedoms being restricted — the response I get is something like— well yeah it is an inconvenience but its for our own good and its only temporary!
  
  Perhaps that is the attitude of many Nzers –“she’ll be right”
  
  Not too sure if I will be censored for suggesting this idea to you.
  
  Remember the Exclusive Brethren distributing hundreds of thousands of flyers to peoples letter boxes during the 05 elections questioning Labours hidden agendas?
  
  It nearly toppled the Labour govt. A similar idea in 2022?
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:28am
  - Rodion Raskolnikov
    
    “…its for our own good and its only temporary!”
    
    They are wrong on both counts. Without sustained and determined resistance and rejection, this is just the beginning of enslavement for everyone on earth (unless, of course, they are an “elite”).
    
    While we are encouraged to think otherwise by people who would prefer to consolidate all of the control and decision-making capacity, far and away the most potent political force is actually being the change you want to see, not voting for some empty suit every three years hoping they’ll make the change for you.
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:22pm
  - Lee C
    
    I agree Rusty Grassroots is the ony way forward.
    
    I see Winston is sniffing the wind, but I’d rather crawl over broken glass than give him any oxygen.
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:10pm
- krazykiwi
  
  Thanks Lee. I don’t know the answer to the question of getting the message out more effectively. In the early days of the ‘pandemic’ the UK nudge engineers advised their government that people wouldn’t change their behaviours because they didn’t feel sufficiently threatened. As much as I despise the engineering of such threats, this does speak to the frailty of our human psyche. Perhaps a majority of NZers will only wake up once the damage perpetuated by their own apathy starts to manifest on their personal circumstances. Which is tragic because the human cost of the apathy is already building like a tsunami.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:07am
Tony Stuart

Protestors are about to be evicted from the grounds of Parliament; check out Stuff’s live feed, with the voice of Trevor Mallard audible on occasions

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300514229/live-police-operation-to-end-antimandate-protest-at-parliament-appears-under-way

Mallard will be loving this chance to flex his muscles!
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February 10, 2022 8:34am
- MCōs
  
  So are the protesters.
  
  I note the leader has abandoned the ship and headed back to Invercargill. Chap must have a vaccine pass to get on a plane.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:46am
  - All_on_Red
    
    I have a Vaccine Pass, and I too would like the Mandates to cease.
    And masking too.
    So what’s your point?
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:58am
    - MCōs
      
      His anti mandate stance is clearly flexible when it’s an inconvenience.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:10am
  - Weetbix3ways
    
    Vaccine pass is not required to fly.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:42am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Lots of people at the protest are jabbed MCōs. Or are you still suffering from the delusional comment of the other Branch Covidians that “94% of us are jabbed so ergo we all support Brenda”??? lol
    You’re funny sometimes.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:04am
  - Joely Doe
    
    Don’t spread misinformation.
    He doesn’t need a Vaccine Pass to get on a plane.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:13am
- Hometruth
  
  How come the protesters wernt ecicted from Ihumatao
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:48am
- KH
  
  Complete lack of respect from the protesters. Not wearing masks. Dorks indeed.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:48am
  - Ehlana
    
    Aren’t they outside? In Windy Wellington?
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:18am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    KH – masks don’t do squat. They’re for optics and to show compliance. Nothing else. You’re welcome to present evidence to the contrary.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:06am
- kowtow
  
  Last night B Soper told HDPA on the wireless that the Duck made it clear thru’ the head of the gallery that he did not want reporters talking to the protesters .
  
  Very interesting.
  
  I’m sure the audio is available if anyone wants to check .
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:52am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Right here – it’s in the last couple of minutes – https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/heather-du-plessis-allan-drive/audio/barry-soper-the-protesters-have-been-out-in-force-for-24-hours-now/
    
    My estimation for Soper has increased significantly in recent mon ths.
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:52am
  - curry4me
    
    kowtow: Who’d want to talk to a bunch of breathless fake news Jacinda worshippers anyway?
    
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    February 10, 2022 1:53pm
- Lee C
  
  This will be Ardern’s enduring epitaph, not Mallard’s.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:55am
  - Nickc2
    
    I don’t give a shit whose epitaph it is! It’s a massive slight on all political parties and those within them.
    Yes, there were some less than savory characters within the protest but what can’t be denied, is that the protest represented a cross-section of our society.
    IMO, all Political Leaders (Mallard included) should hang their heads in shame.
    Luxon, I’m afraid you’re on that slippery slide into oblivion mate. You should never have let a chance like that offered yesterday pass you by.
    An audience is an audience FFS and National/ACT should avail themselves of any audience to show up the current Govt’s ineptitude and failings and get their own messages imparted for free.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:09am
    - G the giant from Dunedin
      
      Go and look at the lunatics protesting , Maori activists, Mongrel Mob, green nutters , anyone siding with that is a fool, i did have sympathy with their plight, but not now
      
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      February 10, 2022 3:01pm
      - chukar
        
        GG from D
        Read your last 4 or 5 posts.
        Just asking are you a National troll.?
        
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        February 10, 2022 5:06pm
- westernScientest
  
  watching one from on the ground. It appears the police fully surrounded the protest, a number of the protesters have sat down between the police line and the rest of the protesters, then the cops are dragging the mainly sitting front line out while they are sitting down.
  Might take a while but I guess it will just continue until they get them all or they leave.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:02am
- westernScientest
  
  given what the police have been tasked with, they are handling it pretty well so far, pretty minimal use of force.
  
  Whether true or not I dont know, but there are claims they have locked the gates so they cant get away
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:10am
- mikenmildagain
  
  How long do you think protestors should be allowed to remain on the parliamentary grounds and disrupting surrounding traffic and businesses?
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:17am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    You’re talking two separate issues mikenmild. There should be little tolerance for any disruption outside the fences of Parliament. However Parliament has allowed “long-stay” protests in the past. I would have given them until the weekend, when the weather is expected to turn foul!
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:57am
    - MCōs
      
      I would suggest it’s all connected.
      
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      February 10, 2022 10:12am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      So you think the protestors and their vehicles blocking traffic should be swept from the streets surrounding parliament? I doubt that will be a popular sentiment on Kiwiblog, but there you go.
      The speaker’s rules about protests have been in place for many years.
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:25am
  - graham
    
    mikenmildagain: “How long do you think protestors should be allowed to remain on the parliamentary grounds and disrupting surrounding traffic and businesses?”
    
    How many years did the Ihumātao protesters disrupt Fletcher Building from their business? And they got what they wanted in the end, so I guess the answer to your question is, they should be allowed to remain there for years if necessary until they get what they want.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:24am
    - Yabster
      
      he won’t reply- the left never explain…… or if he does he won’t mention his thoughts re Ihumatao- after all its one rule for iwi and another for all other nzers
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:04am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Your response to the question is obviously going to depend on the degree to which you sympathize with the object of the specific protest.
      Perhaps you sincerely believe that any protestors should be able to camp in the parliamentary precinct for as long as they wish.
      I heard a comment this morning: if unlimited stays were ok, parliament’s forecourt would make an ideal overnight stop before catching the ferry to Picton. Just scrawl your grievance on a piece of cardboard and put it in the camper van’s window.
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:31am
      - graham
        
        Why should your approval, or otherwise, of the specific protest make any difference?
        
        Either we as a nation accept that protests are valid and appropriate, and the inconvenience that some people have to endure is an unfortunate but necessary consequence of accepting the validity of the action for the greater good (which, incidentally, is probably what Ms Ardern would argue about the need for vaccine mandates) …
        
        … or we as a nation say that protests should have their limits, and as soon as they interfere with the rights or privileges of others that’s it – they need to be ended.
        
        Which ever position you take, surely it should apply to ALL protests.
        
        Or do you consider that some people have more right to protest than others?
        
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        February 10, 2022 12:38pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        I think you might be excluding a vast middle ground of varying circumstances. You surely cannot believe that every protest must be allowed to continue for so long as the protestors wish. For example, should a group campaigning for South Island independence be able to block the Cook strait ferries from sailing indefinitely?
        The right to assembly and protest, guaranteed under the law, are, and never have been, unlimited rights.
        So there is a vast difference between one person maintaining a daily vigilance at the parliamentary gates for years to protests against abortion laws and a large group of somewhat unruly demonstrators intent on obstructing public and private business for days.
        This is why I say that one’s views on a particular protests are most likely to be coloured by one’s approval or otherwise of the object of a protest. It’s only natural that if I sympathize with these convoy folk that i will see the inconvenience they cause as a very small price other should bear. As a simple contrary example, if I don’t agree with the aims of Extinction rebellion, I am much more likely to consider their protestors a nuisance who should be speedily removed from intersections.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:04pm
  - westernScientest
    
    They could have towed illegally parked vehicles on the first day. And obviously any abusive behaviour toward businesses etc. should be dealt with the way it is any other time.
    
    Parliament grounds however are arguably the most appropriate place in the country to have a political protest. Why should there be any limits at all? None of the MPs have even addressed to the group.
    
    Same goes for XR, if they want to glue themselves to a bench on parliament lawn, let them be there as long as they want.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:27am
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Because it inconveniences and embarrasses politicians.
      
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      February 10, 2022 12:21pm
  - Lee C
    
    Spoken like a true radical Mike.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:44am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    It is hilarious and a tragic reflection of society that people like milkey accept the premise that protesters are “allowed” to remain somewhere.
    You are either very young or have no concept of what protests actually entail. It’s the whole point of a protest. You don’t ask for permission. You don’t comply your way out of tyranny.
    Check the 60s and 70s protests re Vietnam or those in N Ireland. I don’t think anyone needed permission to do anything.
    Laughable.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:11am
  - WellingtonBFF
    
    At least for as long as the soap-dodging hippies that disrupted the Defence Industry Forum in Wellington in 2018, stopping others going about their lawful business.
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/108238916/peace-protesters-gather-outside-the-barricades
    
    Funny thing is Defence people understand, support and defend their right to peaceful protest, but not unlawfully stopping others going about their lawful business.
    
    Chloe Swarbrick attended some of it with them. Weird, because in the words of Ardern: ,they do not represent the majority’.
    
    What a crazy mixed up country we’ve become under this Government of ne’er-do-wells….
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:22pm
- Rich Prick
  
  I’ve been watching some of the live video and am disgusted. Labour and the Police will regret this. I wandered through the crowd yesterday and can confirm that the media sought out anything negative and reported as though that was the whole story. What I saw was a pretty good cross section of NZ making their point is an orderly way, but I guess that doesn’t get the media too many clicks, or another $110m.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:19am
  - MCōs
    
    I used to work in that vicinity.
    Protests are commonplace on the grounds of parliament and they’re all pretty much the same.
    A bunch of people parade down Lambton Quay, make their point, hand a petition to a sympathetic MP, or whatever, and after a period of time wander off.
    They don’t block off surrounding streets and threaten to camp on the grounds for days; both of which are illegal.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:24am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      You do know that everything Hitler did during his time in power was legal? It doesn’t make it right. Same with Brenda’s power grab in the last 2 years.
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:13am
      - MCōs
        
        Didn’t take long to bring up Hitler.
        
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        February 10, 2022 11:39am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        We can always find plenty of things in the current day that are ‘just like Hitler’, MCos. where another generation might have referred to the ‘work of the Devil’, for instance, we will always have Hitler to invoke for a lazy and insulting comparison.
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:12pm
    - bronny1
      
      Well perhaps if they could find a single MP with the guts to actually speak with them we might start getting somewhere.
      I’ll go with your suggestion though that they should stay at least until that happens.
      
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      February 10, 2022 3:04pm
      - MCōs
        
        The problem is there’s nobody sympathetic to their origin cause, except maybe Maureen Pugh and she is the ultimate lightweight.
        When the police wanted to talk to the leader they couldn’t find one.
        There’s the 1080 faction, the antivaxxers, another lot who want to execute the PM, Little, & others, I saw a Mongrel Mob bloke in the crowd, Counterspin Media, the Freedom and Rights Coalition and of course Convoy 2022.
        
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        February 10, 2022 8:04pm
  - Rodion Raskolnikov
    
    They are fools and have made a blunder, but it is actually a good development. This only helps the resistance movement. Arresting citizens at the nation’s parliament simply for protesting the actions of the government cannot be easily spun as being “liberal” or “progressive.” Hearts and minds will be gained by this.
    
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    February 10, 2022 12:19pm
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Did they plant the mongrel mob there? did that put the maori activists there?
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:03pm
- westernScientest
  
  back to holding the line, its calming down again. It really does seem like a massive waste or police resources.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:35am
- oldfella
  
  Tony, the police confronting the protesters will carry tasers.
  Unlike Ihumatao when they carried guitars.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:05am
  - James Stephenson
    
    I’ll also point out that the public highway past the site is *still* blocked with concrete slabs, although nobody tried to stop me when I rode around them on my motorbike last weekend.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:44am
  - bronny1
    
    They are. I spoke with one in Picton at the weekend. He was wearing a taser; when I asked about it he said they always do. And that was just a low key party, effectively.
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:05pm
- Fuzzysnuggleduck
  
  The footage of the policeman being dragging into the crowd, by the ‘protesters’ has lost me a large piece of sympathy for them.
  This is the embedded clip part way down the page.
  If police cracked some skulls for that, good job.
  Tempers are going to get hot.
  Police are tasked with removing them, and any physical resistance should be made without laying hands on law enforcement.
  Where is the pepper spray or tear gas?
  Point has been made, end result will be the same sooner or later.
  
  Only wish they did this clearance at Ihumatao though.
  Law should be the law, not selectively applied.
  Still respect the police as an important institution, but they have dropped in my estimation for a number of reasons under the CoL and then Labour govt.
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:15am
  - Clownworld
    
    Pepper spray was used.
    The reality is it didn’t have to be this way.
    
    An Mp or three could have the gumption to listen and show face to the subset of NNZers. Something about representation and serving voters?
    Better still the Prime Minister could have showed her empathy like that time she was wearing her hijab and go hug those that lost jobs etc.
    
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    February 11, 2022 5:47am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Mallard has no muscles, just pipis.
  Little man with a big invisible stick
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:54pm
Maggie Pie

‘A MINISTRY OF GREEN WORKS FOR AOTEAROA’

I’m sure we can all take comfort in the knowledge that we have the ‘MP-for-Tijuana’ sitting on the Select Committee 🙁

Extracts from Report….

“The dominant public delivery model for infrastructure and housing is contracting out to a third-party (OFTEN FOR PROFIT) provider”.

“This report suggests the setting up of ‘A Ministry of Green Works’ – alongside significant resourcing for Maori infrastructure and housing – would be an important step in the right direction”

https://twitter.com/RMarchNZ/status/1491189006146863104
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February 10, 2022 8:36am
- pdm
  
  MP – Aotearoa an have:
  ‘A MINISTRY OF GREEN WORKS FOR AOTEAROA’
  
  Just keep it out of New Zealand – the current Labour lot are bad enough.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:43am
- Frank the tank
  
  If this was established and then disestablished would anyone outside of Wellington realize?
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:53am
- curry4me
  
  Maggie Pie: I guess each ’employee’ would need a new shovel to lean on.
  
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  February 10, 2022 1:58pm
KH

Best fun news of the week.
The convoy to Wellington had a song playlist. Then somebody added. “Get a job”
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February 10, 2022 8:40am
- Weetbix3ways
  
  Many of them did, but Cindy forced them out. Thus the protest.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:44am
- kowtow
  
  Easy to mock but I’m guessing that at least some of them lost their jobs due to the fascist health mandates .
  
  I hope when eventually all restrictions are gone that those people will be offered their jobs back .
  
  In fairness , and kindness they should be.
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:39am
Hometruth

I read the police are moving in to clear the anti mandate protesters from parliment grounds. How come the police didnt exercise the same force at Ihumatao
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February 10, 2022 8:40am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Different when the left do it – brownie points
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:56pm
Andrew Worth

It’s strange that the media claims that the anti-mandate protesters are so frequently abusive towards them by, despite being loaded with cameras they appear unable to get footage of the alleged frequent abuse.
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February 10, 2022 8:40am
- Blog-aholic
  
  IMO they are now realising they have created the monster as much as the Govt has and now they are afraid it will turn on them. Complicity breeds contempt.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:52am
- kevn
  
  @Andrew… Media are just following the prescribed narrative.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:27am
- westernScientest
  
  if you watch the stuff live stream, occasionally the stuff bloggers are dumb enough to call out shit to the protesters to try and get a reaction.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:40am
- Local Miller
  
  The only abuse is verbal jabs.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:47am
  - oldfella
    
    But local, words can hurt. A lot. That’s why we need hate speech laws.
    To protect bloggers from uncouth protesters. /s
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:08am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      oldfella, I watched the latest UK Column episode.
      
      https://www.ukcolumn.org/ukcolumn-news/uk-column-news-9th-february-2022
      
      Very little about covid, they were focused on the new “anti hate” laws being pushed through in the UK. Similar happening in NZ. More draconian legislation to shut down opposition.
      What sparked my reply is that they are picking up on the latest popular “sound bite” coming out of politicans etc. Very formulated, similar to “build back better” and “great reset”.
      The comment word for word is:
      
      “words have consequences”
      
      Keep an ear out. See if it starts gaining traction here. If it does, it’s another part of the psyop directed from elsewhere.
      
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      February 10, 2022 11:35am
Rusty

More dribble from our PM dismissing the protests in Wellington as not being on a large scale and so according to her they are not worth listening to.

Can she give us a crowd figure that would make her sit up and take notice of?

Disappointing that Chris Luxon takes a similar attitude to the PM on these protesters.

I can only assume Luxon and National are not against vaccine mandates.
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February 10, 2022 8:42am
- G the giant from Dunedin
  
  The protesters are unruly, its illegal, gang members and activist , wake up, all you do is usher in Ardern again
  
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  February 10, 2022 3:06pm
- EssenX
  
  I did hear the PM dismissing the protests yesterday and that she had seen bigger in her time. If that’s the case why are the police bringing in more resources and the Superintendent stating that:
  
  “This is unprecedented for New Zealand, we haven’t had an occupation of this scale.”
  
  I don’t necessarily agree with the protestors or their means, but there’s clearly a coordinated job to make the protests look smaller and wackier than it is. I think support for the protestors is much bigger than the Government or the beltway elite want to admit.
  
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  February 10, 2022 6:03pm
Frank the tank

https://spectatorworld.com/topic/shame-self-preservation-ends-mask-mandates/

Oh to have an independent media where alternative thought can be expressed……..
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February 10, 2022 8:51am
Frank the tank

Honest question – when international travel is lifted are all those people that brought over priced holiday homes going to travel again and if so who buys their houses?
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February 10, 2022 9:00am
- westernScientest
  
  1 downtick from someone who just relied [realised] they brought and overpriced holiday home they are going to have to sell in a market downturn….
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:33am
- DeepBlue
  
  They will keep the holiday homes, living there between overseas trips, and sell their inner city pads to developers or new migrants, returning NZers. They will never have to go back to work at their corporate jobs.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:57am
- tui47
  
  I am in the market for one, so hopefully, I can be a buyer but at a vastly reduced price when they become hard to sell!
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:49pm
Warren

When do Government identities like the Police have the right to discourage Kainga Ora from evicting misbehaving Tennant’s especially if they have threatened violence to other householders. They are paid to uphold the law not make the rules to any agency and if this Government says that how it will be done they don’t deserve to be in power.
What a absolute joke this Government is and no wonder gangs are creating problems as we have a Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern that is out of touch with reality and obviously prefers violent criminals over hard working New Zealander’s.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/461209/other-agencies-discourage-kainga-ora-from-evicting-misbehaving-tenants-select-committee-told
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February 10, 2022 9:02am
Lee C

My prediciton
On Feb 22nd Ardern will do a ‘steps of Parliament annaoncent ‘It’s time to end the Mandates’ and the Opposion will fade into insignificance as she ‘Rebuilds Our Nation’.
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February 10, 2022 9:09am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Lee C it is her best chance to salvage whatever reputation she has left. It would be a master stroke. I don’t know if she has the brains to understand that though. Unless she can swing it as her having “followed the science” and “changing course” as a result. She could then get away with claiming how she “protected” NZ for 2 years and “saved 80,000 lives”. Apart from the covid victim who was shot, even the messiah couldn’t fix that one.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:18am
- westernScientest
  
  na she is a true believer in her self, they must stay so she can save us
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:19am
- I remember when
  
  Ain’t going to be making any announcements about mandates until Omicron starts fading.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:33am
- cmm
  
  You’re completely missing the point of her actions.
  
  She’s looking at it from the perspective of adding bullet points to her UN CV.
  
  Accomplishments showing manipulative abilities that make me a good candidate for a senior UN role:
  * Christchurch Call.
  * Gun control
  * Coerced people into a vaccine mandate.
  * Was able to keep CV19 mandates and other measures in place long after other countries folded.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:35am
- Nickc2
  
  I’m fearful of what it’s going to look like when it’s built! She’s on shaky ground to begin with (in the Polls that is).
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:41am
alex Masterley

So the police are arresting protesters at Parliament. Compare and contrast their actions at Parliament with those at Ihumatao.
And in the Herald this am a report on the impending closure of Suits on Broadway, a Newmarket retail icon. Leaving aside the mall there are many retail vacancies along Broadway which is a microcosm of retail in NZ. Winter is comming for small business.
It will not be fun.
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February 10, 2022 9:15am
- kowtow
  
  Good to see the police will no longer tolerate illegal protests , trespass , unruly gatherings etc
  
  Looking forward to the consistent application of the law in similar future events ( as per the Peel Principles that Cuddles is so publicly committed to) //
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:36am
  - oldfella
    
    kowtow, I reckon the protestors should have billed it as a BLM event. Watching Cindy spin that would have been worth the price of admission.
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:12am
  - Lee C
    
    https://www.facebook.com/messenger_media/?thread_id=4237231039737448&attachment_id=1056103255247171&message_id=mid.%24gAA8NvTr0bmiFEbS3LV-4G9vg74kk
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:45am
  - Nickc2
    
    Won’t happen! How many Gang Members have appeared in court for breaches of the peace wrt unlawful funeral escorts during lockdowns?
    Cuddles maxim “look away, look away!”
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:47am
mikenmildagain

People are buying fewer suits. Long-term trend? Hope you can stock up for a few years from their closing-down sale.
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February 10, 2022 9:20am
- MCōs
  
  I have a photo of a bunch of bloke fishing at the Rangitata Mouth from the late forties, maybe earlier. A couple a wearing suits, several ties.
  Maybe that was the warmest stuff they had.
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:35am
  - marleybob
    
    Must have had a treaty payout
    
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    February 10, 2022 5:08pm
I remember when

So are the Newshub/Reid Research and Roy Morgan polls both right.
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February 10, 2022 9:23am
bythesea

How is it that modellers are predicting very high number of cases for NZ, which implicitly requires
– vax getting infected
– vax to vax spread

and at the same time still pretends that vax mandate is important enough to deny livelihood / access etc

I mean either you think everyone is going to get it or not. At what point does the illusion shatter?
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February 10, 2022 9:26am
I remember when

Aryan: A member of an (alleged) master race comprised of non-Jewish Caucasians, especially those of Nordic or Germanic descent.
Are we haven’t even got to the financial aspects or the fact their officers were held responsible for Germany losing the Great War.
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February 10, 2022 9:29am
- Jack5
  
  “Aryan” is a fairly flaky description.
  
  The name “Iran” means land of the Aryans, but I’m not sure White extremists regard Iranians as Aryan.
  
  One use of “Aryan” is for people whose native language is part of the Indo-European group, covering European languages (but not Basque, Hungarian, or Finnish), Iranian and Kurdish, Sanskrit and its Indian language descendants, including Hindi.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:05pm
cmm

No, they are not cultural organisations worthy of taxpayer funding.

They are criminal scum! The only taxpayer funding they should be getting is prison food.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/rebels-gang-vp-who-used-teens-in-drug-deals-was-a-youth-worker-for-oranga-tamariki-linked-agency/6WUBZPNURUF3WEBYGHRNGBLAIY/
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February 10, 2022 9:31am
Lee C

Live now: https://www.facebook.com/watch/live?ref=watch_permalink&v=643319020252464
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February 10, 2022 9:34am
Maggie Pie

Anybody have any idea what the relevance of ‘Feb 22nd’ is?

Speculation rife on Twitter that Jacinda intends to resign on that day.

Asking for a friend.
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February 10, 2022 9:36am
- alex Masterley
  
  11 years ago 22 February 2011 – Christchurch earthquake?
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:50am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Well that’s one that hasn’t been mentioned.
    I daren’t post those that have 😀
    
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    February 10, 2022 10:43am
- graham
  
  “Speculation rife on Twitter …”
  
  Well, that seems pretty authoritative.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:26am
ClanMcleod

Brenda’s finest moment. Disagree with me and you will be arrested.
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February 10, 2022 9:45am
Nickc2

Marxism couldn’t happen here, could it? Too effin late, it’s here and we let it happen.
Well worth listening to Leighton Smith’s Podcast 142 if you haven’t already done so.
https://www.iheart.com/podcast/1049-the-leighton-smith-podcas-30246213/
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February 10, 2022 9:49am
Tauhei Notts

On a couple of occasions in the past I have been accused of barking up the wrong tree, so to speak. I have been lucky in that on those occasions a friend has quietly told me that I was wrong and I should fix my ways. I was grateful for that sage advice.
David Seymour’s old friend, Rodney, has been kind enough to point out to David just how wrong he is. I hope David appreciates that good advice.
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February 10, 2022 9:53am
- bythesea
  
  The link to Rodney’s article
  https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/i-support-the-protest-100-percent
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:11am
  - alex Masterley
    
    I agree with the sentiments in Rodneys article. Mandates have created a divided society which, in these interesting times, is something that we dont need.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:36am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    Rodney is 100% correct. Seymour would do well to pay heed.
    
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    February 10, 2022 12:13pm
- ClanMcleod
  
  This is Seymour’s big opportunity, if he misses it he will become a political nonentity in a very short space of time.
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:02pm
Yvette

Asked about the protest at her post-Cabinet press conference on Tuesday, Ardern used the opportunity to instead talk about the number of people who had been vaccinated so far.
“I know today at 1pm, 31,000 people had gone out and been vaccinated, and so I think it would be wrong to, in any way, characterise what we’ve seen outside as a representation of the majority,” she said.

So, as pointed out elsewhere, the underlying but obvious message is THEY ARE NOT US,

And for further reference bear in mind ‘MAJORITY RULES’ when Maori Health Authorities are given authority, “3 Waters” is enacted, and other matters occur, perhaps like – as has happened – the Maori vaccination tail wagged Ardern’s entire covid response dog – and some do say it is a dog (sorry, dogs :o)
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February 10, 2022 9:58am
- ClanMcleod
  
  Distortion of the facts yet again by Brenda. “Correlation is not causation” – or in this case, no matter how many get boosted, it is not remotely connected to the number of people who support her policies. To claim so is complete Machiavellian bullshit.
  She is a sick and twisted individual.
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:16pm
cmm

Stuff:An egalitarian country tied to an undemocratic hierarchy

Ummm, really?

How egalitarian is NZ? Perhaps not quite as egalitarian as it was when I moved here 29.5 years ago. In those last three decades we’ve certainly seen the emergence of:
* “Special people” based on race.
* Special rules for those with good political connections.

While the queen serves no real day-to-day function in society, she’s still a symbol of what the British colonial system brought to NZ. Without the Brits colonising NZ there would be no democracy in NZ, nor egalitarianism of any sort. It would be a shit hole run by warlords and tribalism – basically what the gangs are trying to recreate.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/127724814/an-egalitarian-country-tied-to-an-undemocratic-hierarchy
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February 10, 2022 10:02am
Surely Knott

David’s views on protest are not liberal or consistent with his opinions on free speech.

Re Protesting: “It’s possible to have a peaceful protest but I think what they’re doing is far too intense.” (Ok so no intense protests for David? Define intense? This sounds like vague hate speech laws that is defined however the government likes it )

“I think what they need to do is respect the law, respect people’s basic property rights and not believe that because they disagree they have the right to trample over a whole lot of other people.” (The protestors are not violating “peoples public property rights” they are on parliamentary grounds. How are they “trampling over other people?” A right to public protest is worthless if you can’t use public space. The protestors could go onto the road and block traffic if you prefer but that would inconvenience people. Doing a sit in in front of parliament inconveniences no one but makes a visible peaceful point and is all about the message)

“I mean, they’re trespassed, they’re breaking the law … but look, I just think it’s rude to set up your tents on someone’s lawn – not everyone in New Zealand can do it, what makes them different?”
(You’ve trespassed them to make it illegal. Which is just like the hate speech laws you oppose. You are making normal peaceful protest in a public space illegal. I have contacted David Seymour and other MP’s via email re mandates and safety and he won’t respond. So public protest it is. They need tents because they intend to sleep there until they are heard. )
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February 10, 2022 10:11am
- westernScientest
  
  Yep its disappointing. All I can really surmise is that it got put in the ‘to hard basket’ to work out how to not get attacked too much in the MSM.
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:56am
- Cinematic
  
  Act and National are beyond disappointing.
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:42am
  - G the giant from Dunedin
    
    Enjoy another term of Cindy then
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:11pm
Clownworld

Watching a live stream of the police action of peaceful advocates at parliament grounds. NZ is becoming a police state.

The police are wearing masks outside in hot conditions. Lunacy!

Where are the spineless politicians advocating for free speech? Busy?

What is next a false flag and blame these peaceful protestors for violence?

God defend NZ because the so called leaders of this country are not.
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February 10, 2022 10:12am
- kevn
  
  @Clown… ‘Protected’ but breathing in plenty of stale/own air.
  “I was just lining up to follow orders Mum”…
  
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  February 10, 2022 10:46am
  - ClanMcleod
    
    “befehl ist befehl” to quote a Nazi who didn’t understand how they became one.
    
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    February 10, 2022 12:18pm
Surely Knott

“Hate speech laws are divisive and dangerous. Hear how ACT will defend our fundamental right to freedom of expression at this free public event.” ………..Free Speech tour 2021.

Banning freedom of expression is divisive and dangerous . He was right.
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February 10, 2022 10:14am
Surely Knott

From fubar on Twitter: “As the police are coming forward, we’re sitting. They’re kneeing people in the face, stamping on legs, smiling about it, telling us we should just go. Parliament grounds have been shut to the public. Two elderly have been taken in ambulances due to heart issues.”
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February 10, 2022 10:15am
- MCōs
  
  Fubar’s problem is even his own videos on Twitter don’t show what he claims is happening.
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:53pm
Clownworld

It is great when people can make free choices and be promised no penalties for those choices.
Not so flash when you then have been lied to and promises broken and then told you must conform or else.
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February 10, 2022 10:24am
bythesea

Very interesting multi tweet thread by Ezra Levant about how Canadian media works, who funds it, and how it is changing.

https://twitter.com/ezralevant/status/1491022674839339008

The parallels with NZ media are there to see.

The key bit about changing is how the Canadian MSM media have been locked out of internal reporting on the trucker protest. Therefore foreign media comes to Rebel News instead
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February 10, 2022 10:34am
- bythesea
  
  Another super thread about the bind that Trudeau finds himself in with diminishing support on all sides. From Ezra Levant of Rebel News again.
  
  https://twitter.com/ezralevant/status/1491582230216548357
  
  Predicting that US turnaround on trucker mandates will skewer Trudeau and force him to concede.
  
  The behaviour that is described for Trudeau seems very relevant for Ardern. If only she can get her come-uppance too.
  
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  February 10, 2022 4:27pm
Lee C

I too enjoyed Rodney Hide’s article.

Fight.

How Rodney?

Show us the way.
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February 10, 2022 10:40am
- mikenmildagain
  
  I suspect Rodney Hide has more enjoyable and lucrative things (writing columns) to do than putting in the hard yards creating and leading any organization.
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:36am
  - marcw
    
    A bit like yourself mike – just continually snipe and criticise without ever contributing anything constructive.
    
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    February 10, 2022 12:31pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Oh, I make plenty of constructive contributions. Don’t you like my guest posts? It’s mostly true, though, that Kiwiblog is not a forum for constructive debate – I regard it more as an entertainment space.
      
      3 19
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      February 10, 2022 12:50pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Ah yes, Mikey’s thing is called ‘pissing in the well’.
      He’s all about creating disruption.
      You have to wonder at the personality which can stick to doing that for over a decade.
      Its sooo pathetic.
      He tells some bad lies too
      
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      February 10, 2022 1:18pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        LOL
        
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        February 10, 2022 1:27pm
Maggie Pie

Why does mine keep buffering when I clik on Tony’s live Stuff link to the protest outside Parliament?
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February 10, 2022 10:55am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Appears to have settled down now thank goodness.
  
  Just showed Trev standing on a balcony of the Beehive. He gave a ‘thumbs-down’ signal and the Police immediately moved in and pulled someone from the crowd then handcuffed him.
  
  Just like a modern-day Commodus 😀
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:26am
  - kowtow
    
    Biggus Dickus.
    
    17 1
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    February 10, 2022 11:47am
    - ClanMcleod
      
      I see what you did there kowtow. lol
      
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      February 10, 2022 12:20pm
bjools

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president-biden-job-approval-7320.html
OH dear
Check out the “leader’s” comparison….Trump 3.6% ahead of Biden.
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February 10, 2022 11:00am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  538’s comparison with past presidents show Biden is on the edge of being less popular than Trump was (and every other post war president) at same point in presidency:
  https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating/
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:07pm
westernScientest

Police are starting to get a bit more heavy handed now, punches being thrown (by cops), generally being much more forceful.

No batons or tasers yet though.
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February 10, 2022 11:10am
- Maggie Pie
  
  I see the ‘Mighty Mongrel Mob’ have turned up as well…..
  
  Maybe the 2.5mill has run out?
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:32am
  - Nickc2
    
    Notice how the Police aren’t touching the Mongrel Mob members in the protest? I wonder why?
    
    22 2
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    February 10, 2022 11:35am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Some people are naturally attracted to chaos and the opportunities that accompany it.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:38am
  - westernScientest
    
    Yeah just saw that, not a good look. Maybe their ‘drug rehab program’ was subject to the mandates.
    
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    February 10, 2022 11:40am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    Either that, or 2.5mill just ain’t worth what it used to be worth…
    
    9 1
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    February 10, 2022 11:43am
- Nickc2
  
  Come on Cindy, go and address these people FFS. They’re all members of your team of 5 Million aren’t they?
  
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  February 10, 2022 11:45am
thetiedarch

Pisses me off that the police and media are taking a harder approach to the covid mandate protestors – who are on public land.

Yet, pussyfooted around when that Fletcher’s land occupation went on for months in Auckland.
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February 10, 2022 11:36am
- kowtow
  
  BLM broke all the rules of lockdown . nadda response , in fact quite the opposite Cuddles went to a kumbaya with them.
  
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  February 10, 2022 3:35pm
PeeJay

As a few other have commented, I’ve been watching the protests at parliament grounds over the last couple of days and I’m astonished by the police response.

Don’t get me wrong, there are obviously some bloody idiots in that crowd, as there are in every demonstration or protest, and the disruption being caused is a bit OTT and deliberately provocative, but the sheer numbers of police is crazy. It’s really looking like they want to spark trouble.

Where were the Police when that mob illegally occupied Ihumatao which was private land? There were a handful and the did sweet FA. Where was the police response for any of the numerous gang funerals causing massive disruption to law abidings citizens? A couple of officers sitting at a safe distance in their car with no further action was about it.

I can’t help but wonder if the same crowd was protesting but the issue was an “approved” issue like Maori issues, climate change activists, or a gang procession, would we have seen the same police response? I think we all know that they would have been waived through and Labour & Green politicians would have met them on the steps of parliament, probably fighting over each other to get there first.

As the old saying goes, if you believe that the police would have acted the same aggressive way to any of those protests then I have a bridge for sale!
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February 10, 2022 11:42am
- krazykiwi
  
  The vastly different response by the New Zealand Police to this protest vs Ihumatao is glaring evidence of their actions being directed by the Labour government. This is exactly what happened in Melbourne when dictator Dan called in the anti-terrorist squad on predominantly peaceful protestors. We are in dangerous territory for a liberal democracy.
  
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  February 10, 2022 12:54pm
  - Yabster
    
    Cuddles will be getting told what to do by JaXinda behind the scenes- but she can just say “trespass is a police matter” – Love one (just one) of the MSM to ask the commisioner re the contrasting treatment of protestors occupying private land for months vs protestors on public land for a few days…
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:44pm
Its only I

Just got home from the protests and are a bit knackered. Message is getting diluted unfortunately, perhaps it always was but that is the nature of big collections of people frustrated with one entity for many different reasons.

If you bored and in the vicinity head on down and hand out some water.
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February 10, 2022 12:17pm
Biscuit

A friend in England sent me this overnight.

With the comment that it’s really aimed at Boris Johnson but that he was sure I could think of someone in Jacindastan to whom it might be applicable, ha:

Remember, it’s only ‘Champagne’ if it’s from the Champagne region in France. A ‘Sham PM’ can come from anywhere in England.
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February 10, 2022 12:21pm
Sparrow

Please excuse my naivety and ignorance. I thought Parliament was the people’s Parliament. So how are people trespassing on their own land. Parliamentarians are only there at our behest not the other way round. Am I missing something?
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February 10, 2022 12:49pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Some see it as their land and only theirs.
  Hence the flags that have nothing to do with Covid vax mandates.
  ie. the rent a mob
  
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  February 10, 2022 3:20pm
Colville

on Air NZ one way return flight home from a funeral.
I booked the flight on Saturday, $450 Inc bag.
approx 30 empty seats.
price gouging wankers.
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February 10, 2022 12:54pm
Russ the Muss

We are in trouble.
I am anti mandate and support the protesters. But I support law and order more. The police have recently opened this can of worms with their sof approach. They should have cleared parliament in 30 minutes with batons and tear gas. Make no bones about it, every profesionaly run protest movement is watching this. Think rebellion extinction. The cops must be prepared to do the dirty stuff. This is a very bad precedent. I wish all the protesters well. But there comes a time the police have to act swifty and ruthlessly to uphold our law.
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February 10, 2022 12:55pm
- Its only I
  
  There is a vast range of kiwis down there so cops bashing granny and grandpa is not a good look for NZ.
  
  At least you will never have to ask how a gov can get away with what it does ever again will you Russ the Muss. It’s so easy for you now that every single protester looks the same to you…bash em all!!
  
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  February 10, 2022 1:29pm
  - Russ the Muss
    
    Don’t agree mate. If I was there I’d give as good as I got, bit I wouldn’t complain when the cops dusted me up. It’s part of the game. U are either for law and order or not. It’s like freedom of speech. Just because it’s our side dosnt mean we don’t get the hammer as well. The bikes over the bridge was the same thing. Little old ladies…well no one is above the law. Our cops r deranged and soft. That’s not good for all of us.
    
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    February 10, 2022 2:50pm
    - Don Beckett
      
      It is not unlawful to protest on public land.
      
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      February 10, 2022 5:12pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    It’s a weird take – all protests must be ruthlessly crushed.
    
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    February 10, 2022 3:04pm
    - Russ the Muss
      
      Don’t blame me mate, blame your mate Mallard. He trespassed them. Game over. That’s the law the house always wins.
      
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      February 10, 2022 5:39pm
- BananaLlama
  
  We don’t live in a totalitarian state with hard lines mate, extinction tards have their right to protest the same as you and the lines are often fuzzy not hard where you can go to jail for calling your leader Winnie the Pooh.
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:55pm
- kowtow
  
  RtM
  
  The police created this . They have not “policed” protests , gang funerals , bikey show of force , climate trespass ,illegal road blocks and blockades ,illegal land trespass , BLM etc for 4 years .
  
  Softly , softly let these folk think anything goes ( and it does , as long as the regime approves) but then these guys didn’t reckon on Trev the Mus or Robbo the Biff telling the Cops to finally ,finally do their duty .
  
  I think a lot of thinking NZers will wonder why the double standards .
  
  Cuddles Coster needs to be held to account by the Media for his lies re “policing with consent” . Looks like the consent of the Elites ,not the common man.
  
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  February 10, 2022 3:34pm
Maggie Pie

Q: Since when is it OK for the police to pull a protester out by the hair?

A: When she’s not wearing any clothes, Silly! 😛

https://twitter.com/LivnUndaATyrant/status/1491546284905299969
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February 10, 2022 1:10pm
- rockape
  
  A new meaning to be picked up by the fuzz.
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:09pm
- chukar
  
  MP
  No —-never
  
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  February 10, 2022 5:23pm
curry4me

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/feb/8/alberta-caves-canada-trucker-protests-ends-vaccine/

Alberta caves to Canada trucker protests, ends vaccine passports.

A Canadian province has conceded to nationwide demonstrations by the nation’s truckers and will abolish vaccine passports immediately and end most COVID-related restrictions by month’s end.
Jason Kenney, the premier of Alberta, announced Tuesday evening that the passport requirement to enter businesses in the province will end at 11:59 p.m. local time and most other restrictions will be gone in three steps over the next three weeks.

[If the truck convoy hadn’t appeared in Ottowa, I guess this policy would still be in force.
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February 10, 2022 1:12pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSzg4ZwKP44

Convoy 2022 NZ – Day 2 Wrap up.

An eventful couple of days as NZs Convoy 2022 descended on Parliament to protest against vaccine Mandates, passports, and government control.
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February 10, 2022 1:12pm
curry4me

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/02/08/white-house-defends-rights-of-canadian-trucker-protesters-as-justin-trudeau-smears-freedom-convoy/

WH Defends Rights of Canadian Truckers as Justin Trudeau Smears Them.

The White House on Tuesday backed the right of Canadian truckers to protest Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and the overbearing coronavirus restrictions and vaccine mandates.
“We of course support as you know the right to freedom of speech and protest,” White House press secretary Jen Psaki said during the daily briefing on Tuesday.
“Everyone can peacefully protest, we fully support that,” she added. [I wonder if a trucker convoy appearing in DC would change their minds. I’m sure they’d be quickly smeared in the usual way.]
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February 10, 2022 1:13pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Science.
“OK, you have two options for you Covid 19 policies. Option (a) is more restrictive, Option (b) is less restrictive, But both with give you the same results”

Your Leaders.
“We pick option (a)”
12 2
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February 10, 2022 1:27pm
- Blog-aholic
  
  Exactly like when JFK said “We choose to go to the moon, not because it is easy, but because it is hard”.
  
  This government thought for three nanoseconds and chose the hardest route possible and then they couldn’t even leave the ground let alone build a rocket….(ICU, investment in hospitals etc etc etc….jeez it is long list).
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:18pm
  - kowtow
    
    He could have as easily said ” Oh bugger the Ruskies have got ahead of us with their Nazi rocket scientists so I ain’t goin’ to be accused of letting down my team so I’m getting our team of Nazi rocket scientists to up their game”
    
    But it doesn’t have the same ring to it .
    
    4 1
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    February 10, 2022 4:11pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  They are our elected representatives, not our leaders.
  I wish they’d understand that.
  
  14 0
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  February 10, 2022 2:19pm
  - MCōs
    
    That’s commie talk.
    
    4 1
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    February 10, 2022 5:05pm
lazza

Heads Up Todays employment data

“NOTE … ALL ADVERSE*
* (Down)

The number of paid jobs (compared with the previous week) were:
2,251,330 total paid jobs (down 40,990 or 1.79 percent)
107,780 paid jobs in primary industries (down 4,820 or 4.28 percent)
426,170 paid jobs in goods-producing industries (down 16,140 or 3.65 percent)
1,660,160 paid jobs in services industries (down 19,510 or 1.16 percent)
57,230 paid jobs in unclassified industries (down 510 or 0.88 percent)
11 0
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February 10, 2022 1:36pm
- rockape
  
  But that’s ok Jacinda says unemployed at a record low.
  
  14 0
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  February 10, 2022 2:04pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Unemployed are only those seeking work! Others who have chosen not to look for work and are in receipt of the dole, aren’t counted as unemployed.
    Statistics, Statistics, and more effin lies!
    
    10 1
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    February 10, 2022 2:15pm
- RdM
  
  2648 jobs available in the Public Service, according to https://jobs.govt.nz
  But if you click on Find Jobs it says 2671.
  
  8 0
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  February 10, 2022 3:41pm
  - MCōs
    
    Noted
    
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    February 10, 2022 5:03pm
westernScientest

Police just started pepper spraying people out of the blue. Looks like they are trying to rap it up – but the crowed are not really reacting
19 2
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February 10, 2022 1:47pm
- kowtow
  
  Live feed gone .
  
  But from wot I’ve seen they have set themselves on a very difficult course .
  
  Not enuf cops to arrest those passively ( largely) resisting , so they have to up the stakes .
  
  Not a good look for the police , or Speaker .
  
  23 1
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  February 10, 2022 2:04pm
  - westernScientest
    
    Yeah your right, it is looking like it will last a long time. When they got the pepper spray out I was expecting to cops to just go in full force with pepper spray and batons and arrest who they could and get the others to flee, but they didn’t, seem to have dropped back now and are ready for another night.
    
    Also, there must be twice as many people there this evening as there was this morning, it looks like a lot of people have seen it is happening and have gone down.
    
    15 0
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    February 10, 2022 4:50pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Excellent. If the numbers went up by 10x for a week or two (Ottawa style) the embarrassed govt would likely end all their covid bullshit and we could get on with our lives. Here’s hoping for a lot of honking
      
      4 0
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      February 10, 2022 5:19pm
    - Cinematic
      
      The protest may have reached a critical mass where it just continues to grow. Pretty easy to summon support these days.
      
      3 0
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      February 10, 2022 5:24pm
  - RdM
    
    The live feed has continued seamlessly, apart from the odd bit of buffering and is still on.
    
    Stuff has changed the headline link to it from
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300514229/live-police-operation-to-end-antimandate-protest-at-parliament-appears-under-way
    to
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300514229/live-120-protesters-have-been-arrested-and-two-police-officers-injured-as-standoff-continues-outside-parliament
    but both links still seem to work.
    
    3 0
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    February 10, 2022 5:55pm
  - RdM
    
    And now (my earlier 5:55pm comment about it still working is still in moderation) it has stopped.
    
    From a comment to overseas friends, UK & US:
    
    “And the live feed has stopped, reduced to a 19 sec clip from toward the end.
    Some might have recorded it all, I didn’t. Enough to have as background throughout the day as I did other things.
    So now 10+ hours of live stream footage has been removed, as well as some still photos as I noted earlier.
    
    This is typical. Stuff is widely held in contempt by some here, but at least the live feed was good while it lasted.
    The replacement links, commentary and photos seem to now show the protestors in a negative light.
    The narrative (on both above / below links) has been skewed … “
    
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    February 10, 2022 7:59pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  trying to rap it up
  
  Sounds like things will be humming along.
  
  5 5
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  February 10, 2022 3:01pm
- MCōs
  
  Police have used pepper spray!
  
  The worst thing I’ve seen was a woman pulled out of the crowd by her hair. Usually they’ve grabbed aggressive people by their clothes, but she didn’t have any!
  
  7 3
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  February 10, 2022 5:02pm
  - kowtow
    
    She probably had them pulled off her by Plod .
    
    I ‘d like to see the Media Pardy siding with the arrestees , in the way they did over Fentanyl Floyd.
    
    There’s a report that she’s 14 btw .
    
    4 3
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    February 10, 2022 5:22pm
    - Tom Barker
      
      Kids these days eg? Can’t keep their clothes on
      I blame the parents myself
      
      3 1
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      February 10, 2022 9:20pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        How is the Green Energy revolution working out for Germany these days Tom?
        #RussiasBitch
        LOL
        
        1 1
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        February 10, 2022 11:37pm
mandk

306 new COVID cases in the community – presumably Omicron.

12 people in hospital, none in HDU or ICU.

COVID restrictions no longer justified.

They are only about fear and control, and deflecting attention from Labour’s generally abysmal record.

Get rid of them now.
22 1
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February 10, 2022 2:07pm
Maggie Pie

Has his cover been blown….

Trevor reportedly spotted mingling with Protestors. wearing TRUMP2024 Tee-Shirt, blonde wig and Nick Smith paper-mask…..believed to be filming episode of ‘UNDERCOVER BOSS’
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February 10, 2022 2:13pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Wow – what are they drinking at the Otahuhu Tennis Club today?
  
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  February 10, 2022 2:59pm
- kevn
  
  @Maggie… Same guy with the (new local meaning) M.A.G.A cap?
  
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  February 10, 2022 4:18pm
wilderbeast

Why such a hard line against these protestors? Ihumatao weeks and months, Shelly Bay etc. I have virtually no sympathy for those saying “let Wellingtonians go about their lawgiver business”. For a start it’s in the government precinct, and we know bureaucrats have deserted their workplaces anyway “working from home”, destroying the local service sector along the way. And they’re doing the governments bidding (along with the MSM) so I’d say the protest is accurately directed at exactly those it’s supposed to be. They don’t look like my types but let them protest, I mean it’s the biggest political issue in at least 40 years in NZ, and I thought protest was part of the democratic fabric? And so what if there’s a few rascals in there – there always is….doesn’t undermine the whole thing…an even hand and all that
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February 10, 2022 2:40pm
- MCōs
  
  What hard line is that?
  
  1 14
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  February 10, 2022 4:56pm
  - wilderbeast
    
    120 arrests for starters. At Ihumatao the police played guitar and sang songs with the protestors….
    
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    February 10, 2022 5:16pm
- Ra Henare
  
  I would have thought local business would love the crowd. Where do they eat drink and buy toilet paper etc? Yep locally.
  
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  February 10, 2022 7:10pm
Its only I

Record cases of covid today, not one person in ICU or a high dependency unit. Not saying there won’t be over this next wave.

As they said in Africa, Omicron BA2 is the vaccine we failed to make.
19 1
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February 10, 2022 2:59pm
- kowtow
  
  There will be deaths .
  
  Sadly .
  
  People in palliative care , people with multiple co morbidities , the very old and frail.
  
  Strange that , those people die all the time in the normal course of events .
  
  But it won’t stop the regime , the media or the branch covidians from hyping the deaths as “covid’
  
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  February 10, 2022 4:07pm
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Australian data shows omicron raises your chance of death this year by an utterly irrelevant (and statistically unnoticeable) 1-2%. Ie average kiwi is 50-100x more likely to die of something else this year. There is clearly no reason to pay Omicron spread any mind, or have any special rules with regard to it. End all covid specific bullshit now.
    
    2 0
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    February 10, 2022 5:16pm
Prince

Watching the demo at Parliament at the moment, 4:40pm.

Clear message to the Police and Mallard…
“They’re gonna need a bigger boat”.
19 1
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February 10, 2022 4:42pm
- kowtow
  
  Personally I’m delighted to see that the police will take a robust approach to all public “disorder” from now on .
  
  The Wellington Top Cop said he has a thousand “resources” at his disposal , with more from other parts of the country coming.
  
  Great , now smash gang funeral gatherings , initiations, roadblocks etc instead of telling the public to let the gangs have their head , etc
  
  No excuses , the precedent has been set . In the very heart of our democracy and in the most public of ways .
  
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  February 10, 2022 5:20pm
  - Prince
    
    Looking forward to the Shelley Bay clean out next week…
    
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    February 10, 2022 9:54pm
Maggie Pie

It is sooo hot here today….been in the pool for the last hour.

Just made myself a Vodka Gimlet and took a quick squiz at the live-feed of the protesters outside parliament.

You can bet most of the women hanging over that barrier-fence would be from Lower Hutt.

Just saying….
6 8
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February 10, 2022 4:58pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  And I’ll tell you something else….
  that Knob holding up the ‘NATURAL IMMUNITY’ placard is really starting to piss me off.
  
  7 7
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  February 10, 2022 5:03pm
  - Jimmy Brown
    
    Really? I take my cap off to the guy. He’s been there all day. What have you done for the cause??
    
    4 0
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    February 10, 2022 6:47pm
    - Bea Rossini
      
      What cause? – these poor protesters are Steve Bannon’s cannon fodder. They just don’t know it. I actually feel sorry for them. They know not what they do. You/we should be very frightened.
      
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      February 11, 2022 12:55am
lifesgood

I am feeling utterly ashamed of NZ and particularly the NZ Police today. What disgraceful, bully boy behaviour. We saw this sort of thing in Melbourne and I thought it would never happen here. How wrong could I be? That nasty thug Mallard sitting on the balcony of parliament loving every minute of it too. If only some politicians had come out and spoken to the crowd and noted their concerns it could have all ended peacefully. The govt have brought this on themselves and you can guarantee lost a lot of votes. National and Act are not covered in glory either. Oh, man, I feel sick in my heart about all this.
25 1
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February 10, 2022 5:07pm
- Its only I
  
  Like our braided rivers in the south Island, most of the water seen at the surface is just the small visible part of the total water volume underneath.
  The original convoy was only a small portion of those in support.
  
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  February 10, 2022 5:21pm
- NK
  
  Oh, man, I feel sick in my heart about all this.
  
  So do I.
  
  8 1
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  February 10, 2022 6:09pm
- All_on_Red
  
  If there are screen shots of Mallard watching then please post them tomorrow in GD
  Thanks
  
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  February 10, 2022 7:55pm
- wilderbeast
  
  Touché
  
  2 0
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  February 10, 2022 8:23pm
- MCōs
  
  Oh! Get a grip of yourself man.
  
  Police in riot gear and shields used rubber bullets and pepper spray against protesters in Melbourne.
  The police today were very restrained & in the end of the day left them alone except for those who were aggressive.
  
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  February 10, 2022 9:51pm
UrbanNeocolonialist

Lab origins of Covid – a(nother) smoking gun: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/02/09/early-lab-grown-covid-virus-found-sample-lends-weight-wuhan/
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February 10, 2022 5:11pm
Ian Boag

Just wondering what the desired outcome of all this is.

All the pollies appear to be more or less on-side with the current rules. Is there an expectation that the PM will unilaterally do away with vaccine mandates sometime in the next 24 hours?

Are we going to ban 1080 and do some Tiriti things while we (?) are at it? Invade Parliament a la Trump stuff?

Just wondering …..
5 17
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February 10, 2022 5:19pm
- Ian Boag
  
  Sorry that I get downticked for asking. I’m not expressing an opinion on how things should be, just wondering how it will pan out.
  
  Historically this sort of thing would have seen the marchers turn up with a petition signed by umpty gazillion people. A pollie or two would have shown up, undertaken to take it into consideration …
  
  And there probably would not have been the hangers-on …
  
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  December 10, 2021 6:43pm
- Ra Henare
  
  No invasion Trump stuff as no CIA agitators in teh crowd.
  
  However London to a brick there will be members of SAS in plainclothes amongst the crowd in case things start to get pear shaped and they will deal to the perpetrators with a significant nudge which will be reported as fighting amongst the factions….
  
  Yes, boys and girls have been in crowds/protests where I have bumped in to serving SAS individuals. When asked why are you here, get a nod and a smile then they fade back in to the crowd.
  
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  February 10, 2022 7:07pm
chukar

IB,
FYI
Am not concerned whether all the pollys are on side with this.
The point is the protesters ( and much of NZ )are not!
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February 10, 2022 5:44pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

When does the influenza season start? Be interesting how many diagnosed, and how many in hospital, and how many did not make it through.
8 1
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February 10, 2022 5:50pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Looks like UK has escaped a nasty flu season this winter…
  
  Flu season hits here around late June- July usually, but could be anytime between April-October.
  https://surv.esr.cri.nz/PDF_surveillance/Virology/FluAnnRpt/InfluenzaAnn2021.pdf
  
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  February 10, 2022 6:13pm
- kevn
  
  @SteveO… Grant Dixon on youtube 3rd Feb 2022 has a good vid with flu stats and season. Super high for 2019, but low for 2020 and 2021. All 2020/21 loaded onto c19 stats I guess
  
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  February 10, 2022 6:43pm
Maggie Pie

When I was a tot at boarding school, I had visions of being a Police Woman and arresting low-life scum.

Can you imagine what it must be like wearing a Stab-Proof Vest & John Bull Boots on a day like this?

🙁
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February 10, 2022 6:34pm
- Paul Marsden
  
  If you are in love with Ardern, they are probably getting their rocks off.
  
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  February 10, 2022 8:54pm
kevn

@Maggie… Not forgetting, masked up as well. But looking forward the big rark up/crowing back at base at the end of the shift. Nothing better than a good bit of ‘legal’ nudging eh boys? and girls.
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February 10, 2022 6:46pm
Scooter

Did HDPA call Chris Hipkins Prime Minister at the end of her interview? Opsy Freudian slip.

https://www.iheart.com/podcast/24837940/?keyid%5B0%5D=Heather%20du%20Plessis-Allan%20Drive&keyid%5B1%5D=Chris%20Hipkins%3A%20Kiwis%20will%20take%20more%20responsibility&sc=podcast_widget
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February 10, 2022 6:58pm
Ra Henare

Once again Jacinda is contradiced by one of her servants.

Jacinda says. Nothing to see here re Protest at Parliament.

Police Superintendent says.
Protest unprecedented.

RNZ reports
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/461228/police-say-anti-mandate-protest-at-parliament-unprecedented

“We’ve continued to try and really encourage those persons present here to peacefully desist and effectively now have been trespassed from the grounds of Parliament. Despite our hope that they would do that willingly and peacefully, that hasn’t come to fruition.”

Two officers have been assaulted during the operation, Parnell added.

Officers have spotted weapons like placards, sticks and a knuckle duster which signalled the sentiment of some of the occupiers, he said.
/ends
I wonder how many protests at Parliament have allowed 120+ of their “team”” to be arrested and others still arriving.

Do I see another Trudeau like massive fail
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February 10, 2022 7:02pm
Biscuit

Just back from a great Thai dinner – but aren’t ALL Thai dinners great? I can eat Thai until it comes out of my…

(Oh, you KNOW where it comes out?)

Skimmed through One News on NZ On Demand and was astonished to note that their coverage of the Parliament protests was a LOT more even-handed tonight as compared to last night.

Not a SINGLE whine about the poor wee journo being abused!
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February 10, 2022 8:46pm

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