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August 23, 2020 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 23 August 2020

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General Debate

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Sigmund Freud

Here is a more balanced account of the Anti-lockdown protest in Auckland yesterday. The reports in the MSM are bullshit.

https://ysb.co.nz/white-supremacy-march/
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August 23, 2020 8:02am
- SB2
  
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  Ysb ??
  
  LMAO!
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:13am
  - chuk
    
    SB2 ??
    
    LMAO!
    
    44 2
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    August 23, 2020 9:47am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    SB2??
    
    ROFLMAO!
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:02am
  - gorse
    
    The Standard?
    
    LMAO!
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:18am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  These look like reasonable, ordinary, justifiably concerned citizens to me. In contrast, the dumbed-down fervent Twitter zealots, believers and enthusiasts who dutifully swallow what they are being fed daily, and happily ask for seconds, are the true danger.
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:22am
- IC5000
  
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  The police should have dealt with this rabble by giving them a short sharp shock to wake them up. That’s the problem when the police senior ranks need to seen as politically correct and give this unwashed mob leeway to act out. Let’s hope the police deploy truncheons and teargas to deal with these miscreants should they decide to repeat the exercise. Give this scum an inch and they’ll take a mile.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:10am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    But BLM, right?
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:41am
    - IC5000
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Correct. This rabble could easily get out of control like BLM so force should have used to disperse this illegal gathering.
      
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      August 23, 2020 10:48am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        The obvious difference is that BLM are and have always been out of control looters and rioters. They don’t even invoke George Floyd any longer, instead gratuitously committing criminal acts solely for the purpose of obtaining free stuff. These folks, however, are actually peacefully protesting and seem very restrained in comparison.
        
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        August 23, 2020 11:29am
      - IC5000
        
        Obviously there is a need for pre-emptive dispersal to ensure the mob doesn’t gain the critical mass to challenge police control of the street. There needed to be a show of force by the police to dominate this space and show this rabble there will be a physical cost to be paid if they tried anything. Force is the only language they understand.
        
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        August 23, 2020 12:16pm
  - Don Beckett
    
    Spoken like a true communist KGB enforcer.
    Idiot
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:58am
    - IC5000
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Stop trying to defend criminal behaviour. Either adhere to the law or face the consequences.
      
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      August 23, 2020 11:23am
      - chukar
        
        IQ 5
        Like this Goverment obeys the law?
        Lol
        
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        August 23, 2020 12:04pm
      - wimpston peeeders
        
        you defended our govt criminal behaviour when they broke the law 9 consecutive days.
        
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        August 23, 2020 2:16pm
  - mark15
    
    You are excercising your right to be sarcastic,aren’t you?
    
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    August 23, 2020 1:57pm
- tf78
  
  While you’re at ysb – check out today’s long opinion piece entitled “Our biggest concern is not the virus” –
  a sobering truth I think.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:30am
- Kiwi_in_Paris
  
  Exactly the same thing happened in Berlin. The lamestream media said 17 thousand Neo-Nazis, including the New Zealand media. In fact it was 1.3 million German citizens. Journalists need to take a good look at themselves, and think about what will happen to them when they are held accountable.
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:13pm
  - Vory v zakone
    
    When the Marxist revolution arrives, those media useful idiots will be first up against the wall.
    
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    August 24, 2020 1:40am
- Alex13
  
  Who said “deplorables”!? – You can say that again!
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:54pm
krazykiwi

“It’s quite simple, New Zealand: confirm you’ll return me to power, and I’ll give back a few of your civil liberties”
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August 23, 2020 8:04am
- Ronin
  
  Yeah, but she’s a liar, so….
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:23am
- Notsofast
  
  From a Scottish citizen:
  
  “Oh, and Scotland is currently heading into a very bad place. Would that we were comparable to New Zealand. We have a large cluster in Perthshire, another cluster in NE Glasgow, and infection rates are significantly up in almost all the mainland counties, and we’re not clamping down at all. On the contrary we’re continuing to open up. It’s madness.”
  
  She is 66, retired, and a specialist in herd immunity by vaccination.
  
  Unfortunately Ashley Bloomfield was a handbrake on mask wearing, and New Zealand never needed to open churches, hence our lockdown.
  
  This is a debate not a pissing contest.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:22am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Yes the Sheeple are so numbed that they cheer when the lockdown returns to L1 and thank the Princess.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:37am
Happychappy

When is the Electoral Commission going put a stop to the Labour Party using Government funds to pay for ads for the upcoming Elections. This is second Election in a row that Labour have the boundary of what is right and what is wrong and David Seymour has already had the changing what they done already.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=12358720
If National or act had played the same game all hell would have broken and Labour would have been crying corruption. Remember slave gate and the donation tha Andrew Little and Labour new nothing about.
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August 23, 2020 8:08am
krazykiwi

“In a world where decision-makers, their advisers and the media were able to admit their mistake and the initial panic that gripped them, we would have long since returned to routine. The ongoing destruction due to the inability to admit this mistake, despite the epidemic’s small mortality numbers, is outrageous. History will judge the hysteria.”
— Prof Udi Qimron, the incoming head of clinical microbiology and immunology at Tel Aviv University
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August 23, 2020 8:11am
- Cinematic
  
  No doubt a Prof with the intellect and experience to make NZ’s group of experts look like silly little people.
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:14am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Didn’t need to be a professor to make the ‘experts’ look ‘flawed’
    
    Shaun Hendy anyone?
    
    80,000 dead, my arse – Jim Royale
    
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    August 23, 2020 8:50am
- Simon
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Yep in NZ National just as fucking useless as Labour.
  
  No political party admits to making mistakes. The lot in Wellington are just straight out garbage.
  
  There are a lot of National party tribe members here but if you are honest with yourselves you will know that National, over the Wuhan flu have been utter rubbish.
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:34am
  - Happychappy
    
    This from a guy that idolizes Winston and his corrupt policy then condems National and has the gaul to blame them for own stupidity.
    
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    August 23, 2020 8:45am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Unfortunately I have to agree. National still make more sense on other policies but on the virus they are too scared and know voters have been made too scared to go for a less restrictive policy.
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:03am
    - Cassandra
      
      Yes, this would be a very loseable argument. It’s a bit like nuclear ships and ANZUS, totally wrong but sometimes you need to accept the irrational and move on. We all know the earth isn’t really flat but it’s a belief system, so make the right noises and do what’s right another way. Even Helen Clark cosied up to the US!! And Michael Cullen took his knighthood.
      
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      August 23, 2020 9:40am
  - fernglas
    
    If by that you mean that they have failed to question the elimination strategy and its evidential underpinning, then you are right. But they know that to do their job properly would cost them seats and the limited opportunity for power that they still have. All the more reason for this aspect of our lives to be taken from the hands of politicians and given to people with the courage to question and, if necessary, disagree.
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:18am
    - Albert_Ross
      
      All the more reason for this aspect of our lives to be taken from the hands of politicians and given to people with the courage to question and, if necessary, disagree
      
      You could say the same about almost any aspect of public policy, and you would always run up against the same problems.
      
      What people? Who would appoint them, and on what basis? Who would they report to? What would be their terms of reference? How would their performance be assessed? Can they be removed from post, and under what circumstances?
      
      There’s no shortage, never has been, of people who think they know better than elected governments. Some of them are sometimes right, no doubt about that. Strange though, how few successful examples there are of this approach to governance.
      
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      August 23, 2020 10:01am
      - fernglas
        
        I thought this Government was in love with the idea of outsourcing difficult policy issues to inquiries and reviews. Why should this be any different?
        
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        August 23, 2020 10:32am
      - Albert_Ross
        
        Asking independent experts to undertake an inquiry/review and report back with recommendations ain’t the same thing as giving up to them the reins of power. In the former case Ministers can, and do, decide which recommendations to implement and which not, whereas you seem to be suggesting removing decision-making from Ministers altogether
        
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        August 23, 2020 11:23am
    - Debsta
      
      Bang on fernglas. The fear propaganda has been eaten up by a gullible and risk averse electorate. So National and others need to tread very carefully until the election, and they know it, regarding any different approach.
      
      A sad indictment on democracy really, which requires informed and thinking voters, not the sycophancy of celebrity politics currently endured.
      
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      August 23, 2020 10:21am
    - Classic Liberal
      
      The pink haired expert would love to tell us what to do: lock ourselves up and never get any bug. Experts usually have one field and know little about others.
      
      But politicians are meant to balance considerations and decide: is this extreme reaction to the virus good for our country’s long term wellbeing?
      
      Instead our politicians have panicked, considered only the virus and not even other health issues, let alone economic outcomes.
      
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      August 23, 2020 10:57am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        Navigating one’s path through life is largely about balancing competing interests. Zero sum games are rare. This idea often goes out the window when blinkered and self-appointed “experts” and technocrats are concerned.
        
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        August 23, 2020 11:22am
  - Nickc2
    
    Simon Bridges highlighted many errant practices, procedures and statements made/implemented when he was appointed to chair the so called bipartisan Zoom conferences, What happened as a result? SQUAT! The CoL had no intention whatsoever of giving any credence to an independent body they themselves set up.
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:18am
- SB2
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Krazykiwi, I would say he would not have much faith in Netanyahu’s handling of the pandemic,
  
  https://www.dw.com/en/israel-protests-anger-mounts-over-netanyahu-government-pandemic-response/a-54499798
  
  But while you out there how do you think we could achieve herd immunity which would require at least 60% of our poulace being infected by Covid?
  
  https://www.dw.com/en/israel-protests-anger-mounts-over-netanyahu-government-pandemic-response/a-54499798
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:18am
  - Don Beckett
    
    So who chose the correct path to dealing with the shamdemic?
    
    https://realclimatescience.com/2020/08/two-different-paths-to-herd-immunity/
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:52am
    - SB2
      
      Don Becket, answer the question. How do we acheive herd immunity other than with vaccines?
      
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      August 23, 2020 11:44am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        A population will acquire herd immunity by infecting the populace through widespread exposure to the virus within the environment.
        
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        August 23, 2020 12:49pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Herd immunity is reached using the same mechanism that has ensured the thriving of our species over millions of years: the human body is the world’s finest antigen factory.
        
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        August 23, 2020 12:56pm
      - SB2
        
        Krazykiwi, it hasnt worked in Sweden thus far with 12- 15% at best !
        
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        August 23, 2020 2:18pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Steffie, it’s worked for humankind since the dawn of time. Use some of that evolved prefrontal cortex to understand that.
        
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        August 23, 2020 7:58pm
G152

Covid… Just another chance to screw the population.
You must believe us because we KNOW…
yeah right
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August 23, 2020 8:13am
stewmar

Our hapless ptpm is like a possum in the delights, terrified of failing in the eyes of the adoring international media that put her on a pedestal.
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August 23, 2020 8:18am
- stewmar
  
  That is headlights not delights
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:27am
  - igm
    
    If you ever rode an older British motorcycle they were referred to as “Delights”, because they rarely worked when required, if at all.
    “Lucas the Prince of Darkness”, was a regular reference.
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:33am
    - All_on_Red
      
      Funny how the acronyms stick
      FIAT- Fix it again Tony
      Lotus- Lots of trouble usually serious
      
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      August 23, 2020 12:09pm
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        CITROEN
        Curiously innovative technology reflects owners’ eccentricity nicely.
        
        ALFA ROMEO
        Always literally falling apart. Rust or mechanical expiry obligatory.
        
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        August 23, 2020 12:43pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        FORD – Fix Or Repair Daily
        
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        August 23, 2020 12:57pm
kowtow

‘A police recruit was fired, days before graduation, after she was found to be living with a member of the Mongrel Mob.

The relationship was not picked up by police vetting procedures and only discovered days before the woman was due to graduate from the Royal New Zealand Police College, earlier this year.’

I wonder if she was bringing him to the passing out and what he was planning to wear , a three piece suit or a patch ?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/122517687/investigation-after-police-recruit-was-found-to-be-living-with-mongrel-mob-gangster
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August 23, 2020 8:20am
- igm
  
  Coster the Imposter would surely sanction this behaviour, as after all, he is a closet supporter of gangs . . . look at his handling of illegal road blocks!
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:14am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Bloody hell!
  
  The article says that the gangs are deliberately trying to infiltrate and corrupt police.
  
  No shit Sherlock!
  
  Two biggest jaw droppers in the piece though:
  
  1. 10% of recruits are being investigated for criminal activity!!!!
  
  2. Apparently according to Greg Cahill (Weasel-in-Chief for the Police Union) vetting is a bit lax at the moment, perfectly understandable because of the pressure to get recruits in the door.
  
  Fuck!
  
  So, we have relaxed admission standards so far that the fat, the thick and the bent can get in.
  
  Even then 10% of them can’t even lie straight during training
  
  And, we don’t bother vetting them, because, reasons.
  
  These are the people who want to take gun rights off law abiding NZers and to manage a gun register.
  
  These are the people who illegally told us to lock down and stay off the beaches or we would take a trip to their place (and what happened to Bush? Oh yes, promoted to another cushy sinecure)
  
  These are the people playing guitar for protesters at illegal occupations.
  
  These are the people allowing gangs to run checkpoints in Northland.
  
  These are the people preventing farmers and apiarists from tending stock around Auckland.
  
  NZ, I hoped that when we became a police state, it would at least be a competent one.
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:20am
  - Nickc2
    
    Don’t expect any changes.
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:08am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Anything to meet the target of 1800 new police. Unfortunately, they failed by 600, even with ‘relaxed’ entry standards. A recently retired copper who attends our church says he can’t believe the low quality of recruits now, and is now glad he got out of the job he loved.
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:21am
- YesMinister
  
  The real concern, if you read the article, is the open admission by police that a) they are underpaid and financially strained, and b) gangs are happy to splash some of their ill-gotten gains buy officers.
  
  I suspect they have been infiltrating the cops for some time, however, the cops themselves have made it clear that the gangs don’t really need to. I wonder how many owned officers we have.
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:28am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    ” b) gangs are happy to splash some of their ill-gotten gains buy officers.”
    
    That’s what happens in 3rd-world countries.
    
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    August 23, 2020 12:37pm
- cmm
  
  If nothing else, this really does not help the Police Check brand.
  
  This is, after all, Tarrant’s sentencing week when people will be reminded that the cops did a piss-poor job of firearms license vetting.
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:33am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    That bit will be suppressed- sorry can’t talk about that, got to wait for the Commission of Inquiry to whitewash that out.
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:03am
  - Nickc2
    
    Don’t forget Cindy chaired the parliamentary committee that rewrote the laws around fire arms licencing that enabled Tarrant to obtain his weapons.
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:13am
    - cmm
      
      As much as I like putting in the boot, I believe those licensing changes took effect AFTER he got his license.
      
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      August 23, 2020 12:59pm
      - Nickc2
        
        To worries. I havn’t got time to chase it up today. I don’t work on Sundays.
        
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        August 23, 2020 1:05pm
- Maxx
  
  I thought Nash said that hangs aren’t a problem. If they’re not a problem, what was the need to fire this recruit?
  
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  August 23, 2020 2:26pm
All_on_Red

Mail in Fraud…
https://pjmedia.com/election/matt-margolis/2020/08/21/we-told-you-so-new-jersey-election-invalidated-because-of-mail-in-voter-fraud-n823582
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August 23, 2020 8:20am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  But, but, but … Trump something, something!
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:23am
  - IC5000
    
    What a disgrace of a president.
    
    https://www.scmp.com/news/world/united-states-canada/article/3098466/trump-ordered-pay-us44100-porn-star-stormy-daniels
    
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    August 23, 2020 1:26pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      But, but All_on_Red assured me that Stormy was having to pay Trumpy…
      
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      August 23, 2020 4:07pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Oh dear. This might be a lesson for you, AoR, about the dangers inherent in using such loopy sources.
  The PJ Media ‘report’ includes a link to a New York Times report, subheaded:
  
  A judge ruled that the election in Paterson had been irreversibly tainted. The president has used the case to assail mail-in voting as dangerous, though election experts disagree.
  
  The NYT report went on to note:
  
  election fraud is extremely rare and, as the case in New Jersey shows, is usually easy to detect.
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:32am
  - amospicton
    
    I really struggle with this. Yes, more people voting is, on balance, a good thing. There’s an argument that if you can’t be bothered to go out and vote then you don’t deserve to vote but let’s ignore that for now. With postal voting how can we know whether the vote is fair? Imagine a household where one person is either more politically active or is dominant. He/she could easily complete all the household’s votes and who would know? Plus an election has to be seen to be fair. I don’t know whether postal voting favours the Dems or Republicans but it’s clear that it will provide an ‘excuse’ for Trump, if he loses, to question the result.
    
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    August 23, 2020 8:51am
    - DeepBlue
      
      A politically strong household or church member probably controls the voting anyway.
      
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      August 23, 2020 9:43am
    - Cassandra
      
      Mail voting is a very bad idea, open to fraud (and there is evidence from NZ local body elections. In-person much better. Let’s not ignore your argument re bothering!
      
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      August 23, 2020 9:44am
    - Nickc2
      
      You are right. In Miami at the last election, ballot boxes weren’t delivered for counting from certain Republican districts. They were subsequently located in the office of the person in charge of managing Miami’s election processes. Yes, she was a Democrat.
      
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      August 23, 2020 10:24am
    - Fletch
      
      One of the problems with mail voting is that voter roles haven’t been cleaned up in years. People have died, moved away to other cities, left the country, etc etc. Some cities have attempted to do clean the roles but the Democrats are always against it (surprise, surprise) and sued to stop it happening.
      
      So you’ll have ballots being posted out to dead people, double ups with people getting a ballot for a city they no longer live in at an old address, etc. And these will be filled out by unscrupulous people and sent back. Millions of these ballots. It’s a recipe for fraud on a grand scale.
      
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      August 23, 2020 11:58am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    I find I hadn’t missed you at all.
    
    Please piss everyone off faster than you usually do and get banned again.
    
    For someone who obviously has an intellect, you really behave like a dick.
    
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    August 23, 2020 8:53am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    And why do you automatically assume that the NYT is reliable? Any reason?
    
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    August 23, 2020 8:54am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Tough question really. NYT vs PJ Media…
      
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      August 23, 2020 9:47am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        That doesn’t answer the question: on what basis?
        
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        August 23, 2020 10:19am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Lol
    “Loopy sources” which details a prosecution for Mail voter fraud and then you give weight to an OPINION from the NYT saying it doesn’t happen.
    Bwhahahahahahahah
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:06am
    - SB2
      
      Why not opinion from the NYT’s precisely compared to loopy PJ Media or Breitbart , WND etc, etc
      
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      August 23, 2020 9:11am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        stephieboy
        Exactly what do you base your distinction on? Prejudice? I would have thought the content is more relevant than the source.
        
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        August 23, 2020 9:52am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Which part of the NYT story said it didn’t happen?
      
      You can’t have it both ways, AoR. You can’t accept the PJ Media blog post while rejecting the actual report which PJ Media misrepresents.
      
      This is the point where you resort to name-calling, BTW.
      
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      August 23, 2020 9:14am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Ah yes, extremely rare! Except when we get caught.
    
    The NYT is the house paper of the machine democrats, of course they are going to whitewash this.
    
    There is an election to win. By any means necessary, Comrade ™
    
    Remember the slogan of the Democrat Party, “Vote early and Vote often”
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:22am
  - cmm
    
    When the postal service workers have come out in support of Biden, the postal service can no longer be considered an unbiased government service.
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:35am
    - MCos
      
      Does the same apply throughout the public service over there?
      
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      August 23, 2020 10:50am
    - SB2
      
      cmm, so our health workers support the government covi intitives .
      
      Does that make them bosed workers?
      
      LOL
      
      1 21
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      August 23, 2020 11:46am
      - SB2
        
        Does that make them biased workers?
        
        1 16
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        August 23, 2020 12:32pm
      - Komata
        
        SB@1146
        
        So you STILL can’t spell!!
        
        To reiterate: A good ‘English’ dictionary might be useful…
        
        10 2
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        August 23, 2020 1:05pm
      - Greg Ettridge
        
        “So you STILL can’t spell!!’
        Just seems to have bouts of this, no consistency.
        
        3 3
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        August 23, 2020 1:48pm
  - bruceavon
    
    Yes. No evidence of widespread fraud ever in the US. Trumps own commission after his election gave up because they could find no evidence. The other thing that is just plainly silly is, Trumps Assumption that if any fraud occurs it will be all by his opponents. Will be 100% democrat. When the evidence suggests when it has happened it has been even on both sides or slightly more republican.
    
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    August 23, 2020 9:46am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    Saying election fraud is rare just after it’s happened is a bit like saying we don’t often get earthquakes just as the shaking stopped.
    
    It happened milky, that’s the point. And it can (and will likely) happen again.
    
    16 4
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    August 23, 2020 11:20am
  - Fletch
    
    It’s a disaster waiting to happen –
    
    https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/08/05/michigan-absentee-ballots-november-election/3298698001/
    
    Inside Wisconsin’s election disaster: Thousands of missing or nullified ballots
    https://www.chicagotribune.com/politics/elections/ct-nw-nyt-wisconsin-election-problems-20200410-rdea6424ynecjemkwwfyjqcyqq-story.html
    
    In New York –
    The first large-scale test of mail-in voting in the pandemic has left one in five New Yorkers with their votes tossed out.
    
    https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/07/new-york-election-failure-mail-in-voting/614446/
    
    New Jersey, as reported above –
    1 in 5 Ballots Rejected as Fraud Is Charged in N.J. Mail-In Election
    
    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/06/26/1_in_5_ballots_rejected_as_fraud_is_charged_in_nj_mail-in_election_143551.html
    
    California –
    California rejected 100,000 mail-in ballots because of mistakes
    
    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/california-rejected-100000-mail-in-ballots-because-of-mistakes
    
    Virginia –
    More than 500,000 Virginia voters were mailed absentee applications with incorrect info
    
    https://wjla.com/news/local/more-than-500000-virginia-voters-were-mailed-absentee-applications-with-incorrect-info
    
    Nevada –
    Nevada Sent More Than 200K Mail-In Primary Ballots to Wrong Addresses
    
    https://freebeacon.com/2020-election/nevada-sent-more-than-200k-mail-in-primary-ballots-to-wrong-addresses/
    
    Disaster waiting to happen in Pennsylvania.
    Pa. legislature’s delays could result in chaos for election officials and voters in November
    
    https://papost.org/2020/08/09/pa-legislatures-delays-could-result-in-chaos-for-election-officials-and-voters-in-november/
    
    28 Million Mail-In Ballots Went Missing in Last Four Elections
    
    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/04/24/28_million_mail-in_ballots_went_missing_in_last_four_elections_143033.html
    
    The whole thing is a disaster…
    
    11 4
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    August 23, 2020 12:20pm
gorse

I note a number of Stuff articles that are not too supportive of the Government this morning. Good to see.
60 3
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August 23, 2020 8:21am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  This is always the case, actually.
  
  4 54
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  August 23, 2020 8:41am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    Genuine question – do you spend time each morning considering which windmills you’re going to tilt at, or do you just have a poke at everything, on general principle?
    
    22 4
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    August 23, 2020 11:18am
    - SB2
      
      Loddenthinks,
      
      Reaching out for the rich irony alert button?
      
      1 17
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      August 23, 2020 12:34pm
- mark15
  
  10% of wing 318 investigated.
  That’s before they’ve graduated.
  Nash says recruiting standards won’t slip.
  Are they all this bad then?
  
  32 2
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  August 23, 2020 9:08am
- igm
  
  Andrew Little will have his minions bin these articles, possibly also with a threat of less taxpayers’ $50m.
  
  26 5
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  August 23, 2020 9:20am
  - RichardX
    
    Any evidence to support this assertion?
    
    3 21
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    August 23, 2020 10:19am
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Learn the difference between assertions and cynical jokes.
      
      18 3
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      August 23, 2020 11:13am
I remember when

So the deluge of coronavirus stories have started to fade. After five months the media are starting to question the daily briefing details.
The Nation panelists and today the Sunday Star Times, have media being critical of the political emphasis of the Government performance.
Not perhaps the ‘who is to blame?’ but the fudging of the true facts.
Where did the latest outbreak come from?
Is it ‘we haven’t found the source yet’ or ‘we haven’t found the source yet, but it must have been through a contact within the isolation systems’?
43 2
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August 23, 2020 8:23am
- Gravelroad
  
  I don’t watch the Nation, Q&A or similar shows.
  Am currently viewing a re-run of Star Trek on the Jones channel.
  It’s just as, or more believeable than the fantasies our tv “journalists and influencers” serve up on TV 1 and 3 and much more entertaining and “logical”.
  
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  August 23, 2020 8:57am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    Why on Earth anyone would waste a moment watching those shows in unclear. The format is essentially some jumped-up presenter interrupting an interviewee as they spew vacuous talking points. They’re just filler to place between the ads. I don’t think that they have any value at all, in fact they probably cause more harm than good.
    
    26 5
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    August 23, 2020 9:42am
    - Nickc2
      
      I’m so glad we have ads otherwise we would have to put up with this crap all the time on free to air TV. Luckily, I’m able to go to Sky TV and watch what the grown ups watch.
      
      7 1
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      August 23, 2020 12:05pm
Scooter

Is the Coronavirus the main reason Jacinda spoke to Angela Merkel or was she getting tips on the Universal Basic Income they are now trialing?
41 3
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August 23, 2020 8:25am
- KevO'Brien
  
  We already have a modified form of UBI.
  
  28 4
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  August 23, 2020 8:47am
  - Scooter
    
    If you mean the Income Relief Payment then that’s for 12 weeks. I wonder if she is planning an extension/UBI just before the election.
    
    19 2
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    August 23, 2020 9:11am
    - Cassandra
      
      It would not surprise me. Labour has a track record of pre-election bribery eg student loan interest. And what’s another 50 billion? Other people’s money easy to spend. And when you run out of that, rob Peter to pay Paul – Paul always votes for that.
      
      18 2
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      August 23, 2020 9:48am
      - Jimmy White
        
        The problem with this Socialist policy is they soon find out there are more Pauls than Peters
        
        19 1
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        August 23, 2020 10:32am
- pdm
  
  Ardern would have called Merkel – there is no way Merkel would want to ring her.
  
  24 4
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  August 23, 2020 8:54am
  - Ruahine
    
    Ardern may have been asking Merkel if (she) has some soldiers from the Werhmacht that can be spared so that they can come and safegaurd our borders. The German Army is likely to have a lot of residual knowledge about border crossings and people fleeing prison camps which could be very useful..
    
    11 4
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    August 23, 2020 11:21am
    - Jack5
      
      We don’t need the Germans to teach us about controlling prison camps, Ruahine.
      
      https://www.nzgeo.com/stories/massacre-at-featherston/
      
      2 2
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      August 23, 2020 2:58pm
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  Wage Subsidy = UBI
  
  20 4
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  August 23, 2020 9:02am
  - Albert_Ross
    
    You have absolutely no understanding of the UBI concept.
    
    3 19
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    August 23, 2020 10:03am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Thank you very little.
      
      9 2
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      August 23, 2020 10:25am
  - alloytoo
    
    I had very much the same thought, and in typical socialist fashion we are running out of money very quickly.
    
    16 3
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    August 23, 2020 10:08am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      There is nothing more permanent than a temporary government program (Tom Sowell, I believe)
      
      16 3
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      August 23, 2020 10:25am
- oob
  
  I happen to think the UBI concept has value, and may in the future become a necessity.
  
  Though it’s subplot, the potential social ramifications of UBI are really well explored in the TV series The Expanse and the novels.
  
  In synopsis, the vast majority of people on Earth are unemployable due to technology. They subsist on “basic” (as UBI is called in ‘The Expanse’ milieu) and as a consequence are prohibited from voting, obtaining training or government positions with the exception of those who stand out enough to earn scholarships and exemptions.
  
  This aligns closely with the changes I’d like to see introduced into NZ. I believe in the repeal of universal suffrage, and that only those who contribute to society should be afforded a say in how society is governed. Specifically I would like to see the following changes introduced to NZ’s voting eligibility:
  
  • Voting age raised to 25.
  • The right to vote removed from anyone receiving social assistance, except for the pension or disability allowance.
  • The right to vote denied to anyone with a criminal conviction.
  • The right to vote earned through an IQ test with a pass set at 100 and;
  • The right to vote earned through a civics test where knowledge of NZ’s political and economic landscapes must be demonstrated.
  
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  August 23, 2020 2:17pm
mikenmildagain

One hundred years ago today, Violet Walrond became NZ’s first female competitor at an Olympic Games, swimming in the heats for the 100m freestyle in a chilly outdoor pool in Amsterdam.
she qualified for the final,in which she finished fourth, and also qualified for the 300m final, from which she withdrew due to sickness.
New Zealand had only five athletes at the game, but picked up one medal, a bronze for Darcy Hadfield in the men’s single sculls.
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August 23, 2020 8:41am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Correction: the 1920 Olympics were in Antwerp, not Amsterdam.
  
  13 10
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  August 23, 2020 9:29am
- Cassandra
  
  Are you changing the subject, Milky?
  
  15 4
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  August 23, 2020 9:49am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    Boring us all into submission with useless trivia is his speciality.
    
    18 5
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    August 23, 2020 10:27am
  - MCos
    
    There is no subject. It’s a General Debate.
    
    6 11
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    August 23, 2020 10:54am
SB2

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Now why do people believe in this stuff apart from maybe the last gasp Tump die-hards,

Covid-19 response for a third time

US President Donald Trump has again disparaged New Zealand’s response to the new Covid-19 outbreak, telling a crowd “it’s over for New Zealand” and labelling it a “massive outbreak”.

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/its-over-new-zealand-trump-attacks-nzs-covid-19-response-third-time
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August 23, 2020 9:04am
- David George
  
  From a handful of cases to 120 in a few days certainly qualifies as a massive outbreak in terms of rate of increase. Our government seem to agree, in that least; they’re certainly behaving as if they do.
  
  33 3
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  August 23, 2020 9:43am
  - Dougal10
    
    Level 2 in the south island is proof of a massive outbreak
    
    16 4
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    August 23, 2020 10:56am
  - RJ
    
    From COVID not being in our country, which it always was, especially at the hotels, it telling the world we were COVID free when we weren’t to possibly our biggest cluster and outbreak. Only a moron wouldn’t understand this and it just so happens that is who is running the country, a moron.
    
    12 2
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    August 23, 2020 12:06pm
    - Tall Man
      
      But but but she did a little dance!!!!!
      
      https://youtu.be/fniZzaViEZc
      
      or
      
      https://youtu.be/_-zENAU4AFY
      
      3 1
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      August 23, 2020 1:41pm
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  TVNZ?
  
  Lmao
  
  21 2
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  August 23, 2020 9:44am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  You can’t be that stupid. Trump is trolling Jaspinda, giving her some borax for calling him a ‘professional arsehole’ on the World Stage.
  Then again, maybe you are
  
  38 4
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  August 23, 2020 9:44am
- Sigmund Freud
  
  If there is no concern about the outbreak of coronavirus-19, why then is Auckland under Fascist Level 3???
  
  31 3
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  August 23, 2020 9:44am
  - SB2
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Sigmund Freud , why don;t ypu apply you grossly exaggerated hypebole to Trump’s ” fascist” America
    
    3 35
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    August 23, 2020 10:22am
    - rangitoto
      
      Trump is a defender of freedom.
      
      17 5
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      August 23, 2020 11:55am
      - IC5000
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12358834
        
        Even his own sister thinks he is a lying cheating scumbag. Given that she knows him better than anyone here and has had the opportunity is observe his behaviour over 80 years we can trust her judgement.
        
        1 7
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        August 23, 2020 4:51pm
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      How exactly is Trump’s America fascist? There should be plenty of support for your assertion if it is true. But it isn’t.
      
      11 4
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      August 23, 2020 12:51pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        Fascist to fire “non lethal” projectiles and tear gas against peaceful protestors (yes they were, I watched it in real time on CNN, MSNBC and Fox) in clear violation of the 1st Amendment. Not t mention the Priests, Pastors & Rectors from same church.
        
        For a photo op (notable: bible upside down).
        
        4 10
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        August 23, 2020 2:16pm
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        Gee. If that is all you have to support spurious allegations of Trump being a “fascist” then I was right: there is no evidence.
        
        3 2
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        August 23, 2020 2:46pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  You seem very naive SB2 ?
  
  25 3
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  August 23, 2020 9:49am
  - Dougal10
    
    And short tempered .
    
    17 1
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    August 23, 2020 10:58am
  - SB2
    
    Benedict Yu , simply view Trump’s TV speech.In his own words
    
    Go to it!
    
    0 23
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    August 23, 2020 11:48am
- alloytoo
  
  small itty question.
  
  …..if it’s not a massive outbreak then why is our largest city and economic zone in lock down?
  
  35 3
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  August 23, 2020 10:12am
  - tf78
    
    I imagine Trump is more informed about what’s going on in NZ that we are and probably Covinda for that matter.
    
    23 5
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    August 23, 2020 11:05am
    - Batman
      
      The only thing Trump is informed about is the White House kitchen extension number.
      
      But more seriously, he heard we had a small outbreak and because he’s been exaggerating since he was a child, he called it massive without knowing any of the numbers involved.
      
      5 30
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      August 23, 2020 11:13am
      - alloytoo
        
        Trump has been Trump since long before he was president.
        
        It’s more disturbing that Jacinda hasn’t figured this out.
        
        14 2
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        August 23, 2020 12:27pm
      - Tall Man
        
        And you know this how?
        
        Are one who deleted my comments for labeling ardern a liar? Yet you feel entitled to denigrate the President of the USA on an almost daily basis.
        
        Which one of us is obsessed do you think?
        
        6 2
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        August 23, 2020 1:36pm
  - Pharmachick
    
    Really don’t know… at out peak in April we had 25-30 cases and 4-5 deaths/day. In the last week we’ve had 70 – 90 cases an 1-2 deaths a day. Were are in the equivalent on NZ level 2 (and have been since June)… so signals we’re moving to NZ-type ‘phase 3’.
    Ohhhh Caaaanadaaaaaa
    
    5 1
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    August 23, 2020 2:18pm
    - Pharmachick
      
      Correction:
      
      *NO signals we’re moving up a level…
      
      At our worst in March/April we were in equivalent of NZ level 3. Never hit 4.
      
      5 1
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      August 23, 2020 2:21pm
oldpark

Cant help but think . Other than Coronavirus -19 being Commie Arderns running mate she is also ably aided and abetted by NZs defacto “List” MP wee Ashley Bloomfield. Labour/ Green Parties must be salivating over him . Just a few days ago Bloomfield put the boot into National Party Leader Judith Collins Plan saying it would not work to swab anyone heading for NZ by Plane to check for the Coronavirus disease when the real genuine NZ Government wins at the General Election. I think Judith should have told the wee Ardern sycophant Public Servant Bloomfield to keep his taxpayer funded $500k tongue in his cheek . WTF.
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August 23, 2020 9:10am
- MCos
  
  Did he say that?
  
  4 18
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  August 23, 2020 11:04am
Ipanema69

As an essential worker I have had to travel in and out of Auckland twice last week over the border.

Firstly I’m not in anyway having a go at the Police &/or Military staff on the check points. They are good people trying to do a job in fairly extraordinary circumstances.

However the level of incompetence clearly coming from the “top” is astounding.

There was a belief by staff at the checkpoints last week that in order to cross the border an exemption from MBIE was required.

This is not correct. There was and still is a general exemption issued on 14-August-20 to the public health order by the director general of health. This order provides a general exemption to a number of specified agencies AND most importantly any entity listed under Schedule 1 of the Civil Defence Emergency Management Act.

If you are employed or are performing work for such an entity then the only requirements to cross the border is to provide credentials to demonstrate that you are subject to the general exemption.

In my first crossing last week I presented my company photo ID and an documentation signed by the CEO of the organization to whom we were contracted (this was a schedule 1 entity).

I was initially denied permission to cross. However not being one to take no for any answer. I parked up on the side of the road and then went to find whoever was in charge.

This individual turned out to be a police sergeant. After talking him through the situation and showing him a copy of the exemption order (published in the NZ gazette) I was allowed to pass.

This is only a small example however it is indicative of a lack of leadership and direction from the top. The left hand clearly doesn’t know what the right hand is doing.
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August 23, 2020 9:17am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Is this happening every time you go through thew checkpoint?
  
  7 20
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  August 23, 2020 10:00am
  - Ipanema69
    
    Yes on both occasions going out. To be fair on the 2nd occasion I didnt have to leave the vehicle. In addition following the SNAFU on the first occasion the schedule 1 entity to whom my company was contracted provided yet another document from their lawyers confirming that a specific exemption was not required.
    
    Coming into Auckland is generally easier. The generally just ask if you live in Auckland after youve presented credentials.
    
    12 2
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    August 23, 2020 12:30pm
- Ruawai
  
  We live on the edge southern border In Waikato but the checkpoint is a few kms into Waikato so we can legally move back and forth through the checkpoint. Last night coming home from dinner close to midnight we had a chat with the lovely police officer. He said they are doing rolling 12 hour shifts and there are at least 4 officers on at a time so at least 8 officers at 13 checkpoints, so at least 104 police officers a day and actually a lot more officers Bombay. He said they have had their rosters changed to continue doing checkpoints until mid sept!!!
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:26am
  - sooty
    
    Yet they found a heap of people to go to the protest yesterday and still ma the quarantine hotels. Where did they rob them from?
    
    12 1
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    August 23, 2020 10:55am
SB2

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Yet another Trump lie,

“The deep state, or whoever, over at the FDA is making it very difficult for drug companies to get people in order to test the vaccines and therapeutics. Obviously, they are hoping to delay the answer until after November 3rd. Must focus on speed, and saving lives!
@SteveFDA

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1297138862108663808?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1297138862108663808%7Ctwgr%5E&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tvnz.co.nz%2F
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August 23, 2020 9:26am
- virtualmark
  
  Trump is desperate for a Covid-19 vaccine to be approved before 3 November.
  
  Whether it’s safe or not …
  
  3 11
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  August 23, 2020 12:55pm
  - Tall Man
    
    So’s cindy.
    
    What’s your point?
    
    Are both smart or both idiots?
    
    4 2
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    August 23, 2020 1:31pm
Swifty

Bike racing in the Hutt, 1976:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eozooUOhco
11 1
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August 23, 2020 9:27am
- Colville
  
  I watched it looking for a 9 year old lil blond me standing on the side lines with a very exasperated Father beside me… no luck tho…
  
  15 1
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  August 23, 2020 10:17am
  - Swifty
    
    Heh – we’re the same age, but I didn’t attend until the mid-80s.
    
    8 1
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    August 23, 2020 11:00am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  I love these sorts of vernacular historical snippets. They have value in-and-of themselves.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:33am
  - sooty
    
    Did you see a youthful duck riding!
    
    5 1
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    August 23, 2020 10:56am
  - Swifty
    
    Agreed.
    
    7 1
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    August 23, 2020 11:01am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Live over the hill in Wainuiomata at the time.
  But don’t remember this.
  Notes to take
  Ciggie sponsor made it happen….great.
  The enjoyment everyone had
  H&S hadn’t got in to spoil it. Policeman “The spilt oil is more important than the spilt blood”…or some such.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:46am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Gee do I remember all that!
  
  The cars, the bikes, the smell and the spills.
  
  Hay bales! safety before OSH!
  
  Great times!
  
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  August 23, 2020 11:08am
Dave Mann

I know how this might sound all too much doom-and-gloom for a Sunday morning – but I have to say that we are witnessing the death of a civilisation now.

The unthinking mob who mindlessly go along with continuing lockdowns simply don’t understand that almost EVERYTHING they see around them is the result of people coming together to build a world in which to live.

Our society simply cannot function productively when it is driven by fear, atomised and confined to existing in ‘bubbles’. It can survive for a while living in the shell. It might take 5 years for all the roads to decay, for the buildings to crumble and for the last playststation to stop working; but from here on, my friends, it’s all going to turn to shit unless we come to our senses pretty quick.

Think about it. Imagine you are a manufacturer or supplier of a useful product – anything at all from curtains, cars, tools, clothing, lawnmowers etc – and you knew that at ANY TIME the government is going to crack down and confine everyone in your market to their homes in house arrest with very little warning. How would you view the future of your business under these circumstances?

On top of this, imagine that the country has been divided into Maori tribal control areas and that all vestiges of democratic freedom of movement and association has been destroyed. Additionally, our country has been sealed off and nobody is allowed to enter or leave. What kind of society is this to live in?

What do we think our future will look like unless our country WAKES THE FUCK UP and takes action NOW to stop these stupid crazy lockdowns which are destroying our society, our freedom and our ability to be productive and to thrive?
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August 23, 2020 9:27am
- Dave Mann
  
  On this note, I have a started an
  SMS text campaign which goes like this:
  
  —————————-
  
  FREEDOM NOW. End the destructive NZ lockdowns and work instead to protect those genuinely at risk. SAVE OUR COUNTRY before it’s TOO LATE!
  *You can help by forwarding this message today*
  
  —————————-
  
  Please consider copying the text and sending it to as many people as possible.
  
  Give me an uptick if you will do this (and of course a downtick if you think it’s a bad idea) – Cheers
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:46am
  - Dave Mann
    
    Thanks to the fifteen people who have joined in this (albeit embryonic) campaign. Often, big things can start from small beginnings….!
    
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    August 23, 2020 8:02pm
- Tall Man
  
  “Divide and conquer”.
  
  No politician has divided NZ more than this woman and her supporters.
  
  Hatred seems to flow between the parties more than I can ever recall and that includes the Moyle/Muldoon years.
  
  Landlords, white men, baby boomers, higher earning people regardless of race, farmers, Asian Immigrants are all to be vilified while “others” are accorded benefits way beyond their entitlement.
  
  Is that now the labour way or just cindy’s?
  
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  August 23, 2020 1:28pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Helen Clark interviewing herself

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/300087854/helen-clark-new-zealands-smokefree-gains-among-my-proudest-achievements-but-theres-more-work-to-do
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August 23, 2020 9:27am
- sooty
  
  Her daughter is about to stuff that thought up by introducing smoking of cannabis!
  So that gets blown out the window.
  Another failure, to keep you warm at night!
  
  30 1
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  August 23, 2020 9:42am
  - Tall Man
    
    Daughter?
    
    Requires breeding, not happening.
    
    Puppet I think.
    
    4 1
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    August 23, 2020 1:22pm
- Durden
  
  Haha ! While supporting normalisation of cannabis which is mostly smoked .
  
  And the Smokefree agency just keeps moving the goal posts.
  
  If they show us one example of a country, even a most authoritarian one, successfully eliminating smoking or any other such vice for that matter ,that might start to sway my thinking a bit.
  
  Failing that they are all sanctimonious con-artists grabbing taxpayers money.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:00am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRyPxRGvYgs
  
  6 2
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  August 23, 2020 10:35am
- Nickc2
  
  I think its pretty well known universally that Helen Clark is a F’n idiot. On one hand, she wants to eliminate smoking in NZ and on the other, she wants to legalise smoking cannabis. I wish there was a law against past-their-use-by-date politicians (specially ex-PMs) interfering in current politics. I guess her reasoning is ah, think about the taxes.
  
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  August 23, 2020 12:21pm
DeepBlue

God help the country, if Labour are returned without support parties (or only one)…. and Hipkins and Woods return to a ‘normal’ portfolio allocation.

Who will replace Ministers Peters, Mark, Martin, Jones, Shaw, Center, Sage, Tabuteau, Logie?

Whatever we think of their performance, losing that experience and replacing with Labour MPs will be a nightmare for getting the country up and running.
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August 23, 2020 9:33am
- DeepBlue
  
  To clarify, the above comment was not about Labour or Greens or NZFirst, but to show how shallow Labour talent pool is.
  
  26 2
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  August 23, 2020 10:29am
  - sooty
    
    Will they have to drain the carpark puddle?
    
    16 1
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    August 23, 2020 11:00am
Maggy Wassilieff

This 3rd world disease is entrenched in NZ because we are a 3rd World Country
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/122260447/we-have-totally-failed-rheumatic-fever-the-third-world-disease-entrenched-in-new-zealand
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August 23, 2020 9:35am
- SB2
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Third World Country?
  
  Untrue!
  
  2 33
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  August 23, 2020 10:17am
  - tf78
    
    SB2 did you not hear watercare’s announcement that Aucklander’s could end up collecting water from hydrants if we don’t stop wasting it. These b…..ts should be washed out.
    
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    August 23, 2020 11:13am
    - Nickc2
      
      Yea, I’m collecting buckets and things to collect water from Fire Hydrants in. How pathetic, definitely 3rd world?
      Pipe the water in from the Waikato River. F the niceties, just do it. Are we one country or what?
      
      11 1
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      August 23, 2020 1:15pm
  - Benedict Yu
    
    No but the current policy settings are wealth destroying. In another decade we will look more like Argentina than Australia. In 20 years we could be like Mexico. In 40 years like Bolivia.
    
    15 4
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    August 23, 2020 11:18am
    - fernglas
      
      Mexico is a nice place with nice people, so I don’t think we will ever be like them.
      
      3 2
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      August 23, 2020 2:09pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Where else would Cindy R. get to reign?
    
    10 3
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    August 23, 2020 1:11pm
- SB2
  
  US has many diseasea and infections of a third world variety,
  
  https://www.huffpost.com/entry/america-diseases-of-poverty_n_5a69f610e4b0dc592a0fe66a
  
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  August 23, 2020 12:07pm
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    “US has many diseases and infections of a third world variety”
    
    That’s because of mass third world immigration. Good to see you coming around finally.
    
    3 1
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    August 23, 2020 6:59pm
Brian McDonald

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Besides the people that think it’s fine to cough over others during a pandemic there were also anti 5g protests along with “herders” at yesterday’s protest in the city – no doubt a few of KB’s illuminary herders were present but Pauline Hansen couldn’t make it.

Meanwhile a for and against argument re Sweden:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300084767/covid19-should-nz-go-swedens-way
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August 23, 2020 9:36am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  It looks like one of the resident crazies has filed a report on this at YSB.
  Highlights:
  
  Signed a wacko petition about poisons or something (she was pretty so I was distracted).
  Lots of females, most of them pretty through to drop-dead gorgeous (I am an expert here).
  
  Apparently there were about 100 people, if one includes the anti-vaxxers and anti-1080 folks.
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/08/anti-lockdown-vaccination-and-1080-protesters-take-over-auckland-s-aotea-square.html
  
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  August 23, 2020 9:55am
  - Dougal10
    
    So you do have a YSB account .
    
    14 3
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    August 23, 2020 11:05am
  - bruceavon
    
    I was there yesterday by accident. I must say I didn’t notice all these attractive women. There was a woman who looked like an angry librarian going up to groups and trying up talk to them, as they moved away. Quite a few normal people, I am not sure if they just happened to be there like me. But also some who were anti everything. 1080, vaxx, 5g – some odd Maori flags there I didn’t recognise. I know a lot of people who are always complaining about the lockdown, who should get up and do something about it. The organisers need a advertise better. Get more along.
    
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    August 23, 2020 11:19am
- Don Beckett
  
  The difference is Brian, that they are free, without their civil rights being removed.
  We are presently living in a police state, with a PM having dictatorial powers and our civil & human rights being ignored.
  I’m happy to run the risk of a normal life – with all its other attendant risks – and be free.
  To lockdown the vulnerable people is quarantine.
  To lockdown a healthy citizenry is TYRANNY
  
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  August 23, 2020 11:35am
krazykiwi

From The Telegraph:

New Zealand’s lust for lockdown is the latest example of vapid political virtue-signalling

Progressive mythology always demands a socialist valhalla; a nation to be idealised and held as up an inspiration. For years, Scandinavia, and particularly Sweden, played this role. The stereotype was never entirely accurate; Scandinavian social democracy is a far cry from full-throated socialism, yet it remained influential.

In the face of the pandemic, however, the tables have turned; now it is the libertarian Right who are lining up to applaud Swedish exceptionalism, while progressives liken their controversial strategy to a form of eugenics. With Sweden consigned to the naughty step, the Left needs a new country to fetishise, and they have alighted on New Zealand.
:::
We should be under no illusion – this is no model for New Zealand to follow, let alone a sophisticated global economy like ours. NZ may have contained the virus, for now at least, registering the lowest mortality rates in the OECD, but it has taken genuinely draconian policies and great economic pain to get there. The Ardern administration is eliminating rights on a scale more reminiscent of authoritarian China than a Western liberal democracy.
:::
Last week, the whole of Auckland was sent into lockdown after the government announced a grand total of four new cases in the capital. GDP has taken its biggest slide in three decades. A total ban on foreign arrivals has endured for months, with catastrophic results for tourism, directly employing 8.4 per cent of the workforce. New Zealanders returning from abroad must pay for the privilege of isolating in military-guarded facilities, to the tune of more than £1,500 per head. One man recently received a six-week jail sentence for hugging a friend quarantining in a detention centre.

The NZ experience should serve as a cautionary tale about the normalisation of overreach.
:::
Before the recent spike, commentators lauded Ardern as being “on course to eradicate the virus completely.” The ambition was childish and hubristic in the extreme. Until the planet reaches a state of elimination, New Zealand will have to stay in indefinite isolation, with domestic lock-downs a likely fixture of life, perhaps for years to come. The economy cannot bear this for long. Nor can the people.
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August 23, 2020 9:37am
- Frank Hematuria
  
  For the sake of all of us, somebody send this article to Judith Collins and tell her to start banging the drum. And for the downticker (one at the time I write this) ……really?
  
  30 2
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  August 23, 2020 9:41am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Is Auckland now the capital?
  Sorry, hadn’t caught up with that one.
  
  23 1
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  August 23, 2020 9:57am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    It’s the Daily Telegraph. The writer probably thinks NZ only has one city, which must be the capital. To be fair, many Aucklanders would agree.
    
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    August 23, 2020 10:01am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    It should be
    
    7 15
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    August 23, 2020 10:17am
    - septic skeptic
      
      Nah, we have enough troughers here already with the council.
      
      13 1
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      August 23, 2020 11:20am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    Auckland should be the capital.
    
    1 5
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    August 23, 2020 5:41pm
- Jimmy White
  
  Nasty J. new that the four were just the tip of an almighty F*K up and that the MSM would be full of lockdown stories, which they were, rather than who’s fault it all was. Now they are saying you can catch it from lift buttons. Reminds we of being told when I was young that you can get pregnant from toilet seats.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:49am
- KevO'Brien
  
  GDP is irrelevant as the Min of Finance cna get all the money he wants out of thin air.
  
  6 3
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  August 23, 2020 1:13pm
- Durden
  
  The author sounds like a fun woman.
  
  https://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/9243617/Oxford-student-who-boasted-about-her-great-rack-fined-120-for-bringing-Union-in-to-disrepute.html
  
  6 1
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  August 23, 2020 2:19pm
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    Maddy Grant is well fit. Plus she’s a poetry buff, which places her almost off the charts.
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHj6OkV3b4k&lc=UgylCss6vU_SLMGQCuZ4AaABAg.9CImUuZmcje9CNVNUs9S10
    
    2 1
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    August 23, 2020 5:12pm
DeepBlue

Jacinda’s puff piece and cry for sympathy on Stuff today had two bad things for her. South Aucklander’s pissed off:
1. That the mandatory quarantining wasn’t announced prior to the outbreak nor discussed.
2. Heather Simpson’s appointment is unwelcome as she ignored Maori wishes re Health Review.

Both could well backfire hugely re votes in South Auckland.
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August 23, 2020 9:42am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Jack Tame now doing a TDS piece. God NZ lefties are pathetic
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August 23, 2020 9:56am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  My place is a Jack Tame free zone and I feel much better for it.
  
  36 3
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  August 23, 2020 9:59am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Same, life becomes a lot more peaceful without him TVNZ or TV3 news, or the muppets on Red Radio.
    
    32 2
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    August 23, 2020 10:09am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I only watch because the speaker of the house insists.
    Keep the queen bee happy and the hive is happy
    
    19 3
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    August 23, 2020 10:19am
    - Tall Man
      
      Just head to the can.
      
      3 2
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      August 23, 2020 1:16pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Mine too! My TVs automatically change channel as soon as his melon appears (I wish).
    
    6 1
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    August 23, 2020 12:44pm
- cmm
  
  Your hearing must be better than mine.
  
  All I heard was “click”.
  
  18 1
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  August 23, 2020 10:07am
- Flossie
  
  Why is Laila Harre a panelist? Are there no others who can pass opinions without such unnecessary (and untrue) commentary that JC is “hysterical”. Every time I’ve seen JC lately she has been very calm and measured in her comments.
  LH is a Jacinda fangirl quite obviously and I doubt she has the ability to look at things in any sort of unbiased way. The other panelist this morning was acknowledged ad a Nat supporter but he seemed reasonable.
  
  13 1
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  August 23, 2020 12:43pm
- Inandout
  
  Steve, gosh Jack’s flatmate must get tired of this TDS.
  
  4 1
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  August 23, 2020 2:00pm
fernglas

Apparently tonight Sunday on TVNZ will have an article about Covid-19 in Melbourne. The trailer being played on TVNZ contains a breathless female voice saying “every day we are seeing young people die”. If the suggestion is that this is from Covid-19 then it is demonstrable bullshit. To date in Australia no man under 42 or woman under 50 has died from the virus. https://www.health.gov.au/news/health-alerts/novel-coronavirus-2019-ncov-health-alert/coronavirus-covid-19-current-situation-and-case-numbers#cases-and-deaths-by-age-and-sex
42 2
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August 23, 2020 9:56am
- cmm
  
  Keep people frightened. Frightened people do not plug in their brains.
  
  This is well understood in a wide range of disciplines.
  
  42 3
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  August 23, 2020 10:24am
  - fernglas
    
    I may be a bit naive, but for a primetime documentary on something of such genuine public interest not just to allow a blatant lie to be broadcast, but to highlight it is a betrayal of public trust.
    
    7 1
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    August 23, 2020 12:25pm
  - SB2
    
    cmm , simply put “keep people informed”
    
    0 10
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    August 23, 2020 2:31pm
Tauhei Notts

The betting market has shown Trump firming from a rough 34.7% to 42.7% chance; over the past 33 days.
Biden’s chances have slipped from 61.7% to 55.6% in the past 18 days.
The figures do not add to 100% because there is still the rough chance of something weird happening; like Harris, Pence or Clinton getting up.
That steady trend for Trump is proving to be strange, particularly when read alongside all the anti Trump media releases.
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August 23, 2020 10:01am
- RW Capitalist
  
  This happened last time.
  But later
  Trump came charging home in last 2 weeks
  Played the electoral game very well in the US took the key states by working Very hard there, when Clinton NEVER went to many of them.
  Trumps charge is happening very early, he is going to romp past (and is already in a statistical tie in many of tie important states) in all but the most leftie of states.
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:57am
Brian McDonald

After 2 days of political bidding on border control it eventuates that the public are offered new versions, proving once again how useless politicians can be in organising things.
There is no check list made to the public about what security is in place and why, how it is monitored and what further improvements are to be made.
I’ve gained the impression that the Health Authorities ring a security company to seek their services not considering first of all their suitability to do so and having a clear plan of what must be done set out, recorded in writing and within its own built in safety plan for variations. Like if you’re not sure don’t let it happen.
Unfortunately in NZ security services are that you get what you pay for. The next mistake is to rely on the security services in a way that considers the security company beyond its capacity to perform without tight and specific instructions and monitoring for potential breaches.
This week we appear to have had service men going to fix TV in hotel rooms for those in isolation not wearing appropriate safety clothing indicating another gap “I’m here to fix the TV” with no precautions taken. People touching potential Covid services without gloves.
Just real dumb stuff while the politicians ramp up bids on what they are going to do at the border.
Will the public seriously think National are capable of doing any better or that Labour throwing out one plan and replacing it with another that is not strictly observed in all its moving parts is the answer?
Never underestimate that something functioning to a reasonable level can be improved or tweaked, and that simply off loading a job is no guarantee of it’s success because you’ve told them what to do and have put it in writing. But this is the political environment induced right now.
The security services need monitoring and auditing at the border otherwise first of all they may not perform in the manner required, which includes thinking on their feet, or they will eventually become complacent if there is no one to kick their butt. Too many Indians and not enough Chiefs.
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August 23, 2020 10:10am
- cmm
  
  Putting aside whether the plan is required or not, how well a plan is carried out comes down to:
  1) Designing a plan that understands people are imperfect, make mistakes and take shortcuts. This is engineering 101: when you design a system then you need to account for, and have mitigation, when components fail.
  2) Need oversight and accountability. Sack rent-a-cops sleeping on the job. Sack people all up the chain.
  3) Need the auditing function of the elected government. Sack them when they fail to carry out their function correctly.
  
  None of these is happening because it is just being treated as theatre to be seen to be caring and to be seen to be doing something.
  
  Until heads roll at the top, and all the way through, when things break down there will be no change.
  
  We got told the airforce guy was going to sort it all out, no matter that he was already in charge for 2 months or so and was in charge during the worst cockups. He’s still in charge.
  
  Where’s the minister? Any ministerial heads rolled?
  
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  August 23, 2020 10:22am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    “Where’s the minister? Any ministerial heads rolled?”
    Don’t be silly, these public servants are the ministers scapegoats.
    There to take the blame and punishment on behalf of the minister…Labour’s playbook from …forever.
    
    whipping boy
    noun
    noun: whipping boy; plural noun: whipping boys
    
    a person who is blamed or punished for the faults or incompetence of others.
    
    18 1
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    August 23, 2020 11:02am
    - cmm
      
      Yup, the ministers can’t have it both ways.
      
      They claim plausible deniability that they are taking reports etc on good faith and can’t help it if they are being lied to.
      
      Now here’s the thing. The minister’s primary job is to be questioning and auditing. ie. not taking things in good faith.
      
      ie. you can claim plausible deniability only by admitting you’re not doing your job properly.
      
      15 1
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      August 23, 2020 1:03pm
- Jimmy White
  
  “Hay Bob, who are that security company that monitors our ablution block?. Find out and give them a ring would you. They must be up with the play on Medical issues”
  
  13 1
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  August 23, 2020 10:53am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  “Too many Indians and not enough Chiefs.”
  
  Cancelled.
  
  13 2
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  August 23, 2020 10:54am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Kamala tricked into slamming Trump by Russians posing as Greta. Hilarious.
https://www.the-sun.com/news/1327431/kamala-harris-donald-trump-russians-greta-thunberg/
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August 23, 2020 10:11am
cmm

St Cindy, halo and everything:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/resizer/42bgfdeLyia3glVHJBCpFqBPX9o=/150×183/smart/filters:quality(70)/cloudfront-ap-southeast-2.images.arcpublishing.com/nzme/EXHU3FZYZJGEZFOVBR4M6ATDDQ.jpg

and the arrow, pointing to the top.

Is this a sign that she’s been selected for a Higher Purpose?

#CinD4UN!
17 4
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August 23, 2020 10:13am
- Inandout
  
  cmm, it could be an arrow, or…
  
  12 3
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  August 23, 2020 10:25am
  - cmm
    
    Well it’s not a kiwibuild house.
    
    11 1
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    August 23, 2020 1:05pm
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      About as saleable . . .
      
      2 1
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      August 23, 2020 1:27pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I say it is a kiwibuild house. Jaspinda has just not finished it yet – same as the rest of those promised
      
      8 2
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      August 23, 2020 3:37pm
Interested Party

This is a good watch, about 5:45 in they state Jacinda is a nutcase for locking down the country after 4 cases
https://youtu.be/TC02NKjz46E
22 2
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August 23, 2020 10:20am
- Inandout
  
  IP, Jacinda and Ash have a bag of new cases to bring out in the next week or so. Notice how Ash goes into excruciating detail of where the ‘new’ cases were found, and grateful for the ‘co-operation’ of this group or that. As has been mentioned on here, keeping the plebs shit scared is a plus for the incumbent government.
  
  24 1
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  August 23, 2020 11:29am
  - alloytoo
    
    If I was Americold I would have sent him a cease and desist letter two weeks ago.
    
    11 2
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    August 23, 2020 12:35pm
- lifesgood
  
  That’s hilarious. They can see right through her bs but are amazed she is never criticised. We ll we all know why that is, don’t we?
  
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  August 23, 2020 5:55pm
Lee C

Listen to this:
https://www.iheart.com/podcast/1049-kerre-mcivor-mornings-pod-46787367/episode/gerhard-sundborn-covid-is-not-as-70204639/?fbclid=IwAR0IUrIb4j2UGwEAzr2aw4sHscKxq32Fh0Qar2pme1zRmM5gZWIvuDksSFo
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August 23, 2020 10:26am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Arizona. Any death within 60 days of a positive Covid test is a Covid death. This is why the numbers are high. Covid is a leftist political tool.
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/08/fraud-arizona-counts-death-within-60-days-positive-covid-test-covid-death/?fbclid=IwAR1cWw-y2CT1Y0FggI22TmogtcOq7JsfB9PC9dbegi96tk3St4DGDKxsTwo
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August 23, 2020 10:29am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Read a piece
  A guy who died in a motorbike accident, had Covid19, was put on the list.
  
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  August 23, 2020 11:05am
- SB2
  
  Shall we say then 156,152 ( not 156153
  
  https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
  
  Spurious way to argue by proTrump media!
  
  2 25
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  August 23, 2020 12:23pm
- RJ
  
  28 days in the uk, they reduced it. Don’t believe a single number released
  
  6 4
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  August 23, 2020 12:24pm
Tony Stuart

Polly Gillespie says what tens of thousands of New Zealanders are thinking:

I may be vilified, tarred and feathered, stoned to death, or bombarded with messages of righteous indignation, but I’m going to go out on a fragile dying elm limb and say: I’ve had enough of ‘we’ve got this’.

Shut up, Jacinda. I need to mention right now as you’re spitting at me, deriding me, deleting me or aghast with horror, that it’s fairly well known I hang to the left, so I’m not anti-Labour at all.

In fact, I find myself in the unenviable electoral voting position of having orange marker in hand in October, with no-one to vote for. Sacrilege!

It’s been a wee while coming, but I’ve finally had enough of the platitudes, and sentimental psycho-babble. It came to a head last week when we were dished up the rehearsed response to a journalist’s question: re the ‘team of five million’.

It went something like this: “We may be all on the same team, but not everyone is on the field at the same time.” It struck me too, that Jacinda wears black like a widowed Queen Victoria when she has bad news, and white like the good fairy when she has worse news, or news that’s half bad and half good.

Yes, she’s a great person, an incredible communicator, and could spin any spin doctor. I like Jacinda and have a particular affection for Grant Robertson and Andrew Little, but I’m just finding it irritating being spoken to like I’m a slightly IQ-deprived child. It’s starting to wear very thin. If anyone says ‘we’ve got this’ one more time I will squeal!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/300085193/jacinda-i-like-you-but-please-shut-up-about-the-team-of-five-million

When a bleeding-heart leftie like Ms Gillespie is fed up to the back teeth with the PM’s $16 million worth of platitudes, or “psycho-babble” as she calls it, surely the PM’s office will take notice.

I’ve certainly had a gutsful of being constantly talked down to by the PM, with her carefully manufactured (not to mention bloody expensive!) word salad, and I voluntarily opted out of her “team of five million” some time ago. All the platitudes in the world couldn’t stop Covid-19 re-establishing itself in the community, but more attention on border and MIQ management rather than PR sessions from the Beehive pulpit might have had more effect.
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August 23, 2020 10:35am
- SB2
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Polly Gillespie and the culture of compaint!
  
  2 34
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  August 23, 2020 12:09pm
  - Tony Stuart
    
    How about you address the substance or otherwise of what she says SB? Or is that asking too much of you?
    
    27 2
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    August 23, 2020 1:26pm
    - RJ
      
      Come on tony you know he never addresses anything, just trolls each post.
      
      As for the post I’m finding that people who use to talk to me a lot about labour and Cindy no longer are. I brought it up to a couple of them and they seem to be shifting away from labour because of the damage she has done to their businesses and her inability to comprehend that
      
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      August 23, 2020 2:06pm
    - SB2
      
      “I’ve certainly had a gutsful of being constantly talked down to by the PM, with her carefully manufactured (not to mention bloody expensive!) word salad, and I voluntarily opted out of her “team of five million” some time ago. All the platitudes in the world couldn’t stop ”
      
      I would call that a good old fashioned nat fan whinge!
      
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      August 23, 2020 2:34pm
      - Tony Stuart
        
        You must have missed this bit SB:
        
        it’s fairly well known I hang to the left, so I’m not anti-Labour at all.
        
        15 2
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        August 23, 2020 5:56pm
Maggie Pie

Trending on twitter this morning…..

“Jizz Zin DAH”

😛
26 4
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August 23, 2020 10:38am
- sooty
  
  The last word is correct
  
  19 1
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  August 23, 2020 11:06am
JibberJabber

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/122522331/judith-collins-tough-times-calls-for-tough-border-measures

Covid is not the immaculate Infection, it is just a very naughty Virus…
23 2
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August 23, 2020 10:50am
- sooty
  
  A naughty naughty chinese one!
  
  19 2
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  August 23, 2020 11:07am
- Classic Liberal
  
  “ This is why my Government will establish a new Border Protection Agency – Te Korowai Whakamaru, which can be translated as the ‘cloak of protection’.”
  
  What?? Judith, it’s bad enough that you are going along with making NZ a bubble for who knows how long, now you’re also playing the PC ‘name everything in Māori’ game??
  
  I’m disappointed and worried.
  
  24 6
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  August 23, 2020 11:44am
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    Get with the program. You live in New Zealand in the 21st century. All government departments have names in te reo as well as English. That ain’t changing in your lifetime.
    
    11 30
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    August 23, 2020 12:45pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      More that she made such a big deal out of the name. Paragraphs instead of just a few words. Whom does she expect to suck in with that?
      
      11 5
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      August 23, 2020 12:53pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Ps I’ve wondered for a while who you really are. Your language makes me really wonder.
      
      8 6
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      August 23, 2020 12:56pm
      - RJ
        
        Just a sheep farmer who is looking for the next place to put sheep
        
        0 1
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        August 23, 2020 5:55pm
    - Nickc2
      
      That’s one of the first things I’m gunna change when I’m King. It’s in my notebook.
      Ko tetahi o nga mea matewai ka hurihia e ahau, kei roto i taku pukapuka pukete.
      
      3 4
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      August 23, 2020 12:56pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Pandering you mean?
      
      10 3
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      August 23, 2020 1:04pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        It’s just so pretentious. Using Maori, adding of incomprehensible transliterations for modern concepts and functions it can’t really cover. And trying to use all sorts of ancient Maori words in modern roles they had nothing to do with. All not out of a real respect for the language but to virtue signal.
        
        Is this really what part-Maori people on average want or would they rather it was used for traditional speeches, songs etc, but not shoved into all sorts of modern roles? As someone who likes ancient languages for what they are, it seems disrespectful of the language. I’d as soon hear a Mozart symphony played on electric guitars!
        
        Lol, I remember trying to read a novel in Maori (I like learning languages by reading). I couldn’t get past the first page – a word kept coming up that I couldn’t find in my very large dictionary. Later I found out the word had been some very messy transliteration of an English word.
        
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        August 23, 2020 1:41pm
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Spoken like true sit-on-my-hands former National politician. Anything will change if it is actually changed.
      
      11 5
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      August 23, 2020 1:09pm
    - DeepBlue
      
      In our lifetime the English version may will be dropped. Eg Taranaki/Mt Egmont. If you said the latter to someone under 30 years old they wouldn’t know what you were talking about.
      
      7 2
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      August 23, 2020 1:23pm
  - kowtow
    
    CL
    
    Consider yourself chastised, literally told ,scolded “get with the program”
    
    What program ? Even the Maoris don’t speak Maori , but the program is instructed by your betters you will pretend , we’re all in this waka together.
    
    But I suppose calling it something silly and feathery is better than the English , Border Farce .
    
    13 3
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    August 23, 2020 1:10pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Haha, it was interesting seeing the true face of WM. He must know which side his bread is buttered on.
      
      5 2
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      August 23, 2020 1:44pm
      - wimpston peeeders
        
        yup but either way its butter to the floor
        
        3 0
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        August 23, 2020 7:31pm
JibberJabber

You couldn’t really call NZ Labour and the Greens Champagne socialists because you can only be Champagne socialist if one is from the Champagne region of France. A more accurate term would should be an NZ Lindauer Sparkling White wine socialist.
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August 23, 2020 11:03am
- oldfella
  
  More an NZ Cheap ‘Plonk’ Socialist.
  
  17 2
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  August 23, 2020 11:34am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Chateau a la cardboard socialist
  
  18 2
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  August 23, 2020 11:56am
- Tall Man
  
  Marque Vue more like.
  
  9 2
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  August 23, 2020 1:03pm
- Dougal10
  
  Spew-mante
  
  6 1
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  August 23, 2020 3:55pm
- tf78
  
  Jibber – That’s my only tipple – what does that make me.
  
  5 1
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  August 23, 2020 4:44pm
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Methode socialiste?
  
  4 0
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  August 23, 2020 8:02pm
oldfella

The week in US politics as seen through the eyes of the leading conservative Powerline blog. Always good for a laugh or two…
https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2020/08/the-week-in-pictures-all-male-voting-edition.php
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August 23, 2020 11:04am
Swifty

Mr Hindmarsh is quick to blame racism, several times, but puts up not one shred of evidence:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/nelson-mail/news/122491901/takakas-forgotten-maori-doctor-fought-an-uphill-battle
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August 23, 2020 11:17am
- wimpston peeeders
  
  if that mr hindmarsh is from takaka I can tell you that all folk with the same surname their are total woke weirdos (and that was 12+yr ago)
  
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  August 23, 2020 7:34pm
MCos

Judith Collins seems to be painting herself into a corner over the Covid-19 testing prior to hopping on a plane to come to NZ.
It seems there will be no exceptions.
Apparently if you are leaving from some country with no acceptable testing facilities you would then need to fly to anther country that has, but there might not be one that will let you in.
All to catch about one infected person in several hundred.
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August 23, 2020 11:30am
- marcw
  
  Perhaps you could list the countries that currently fly to NZ “with no acceptable testing facilities”. Then we could assess if your concern is at all warranted. I understand ‘Emirates’ have this policy in force, and are still flying here.
  
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  August 23, 2020 11:40am
  - MCos
    
    There’s 200+ countries listed on Worldometer.
    One imagines NZ would struggle to find reputable testing clinics in any number of them, let alone a trustworthy translation service, if required.
    
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    August 23, 2020 12:14pm
    - marcw
      
      The question was “how many of these countries fly to NZ?”, not how many listed on Worldometer.
      
      21 1
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      August 23, 2020 1:04pm
    - MCos
      
      That’s not the question at all.
      Very few countries have direct flights to NZ. Most of the time you check in somewhere or another and arrive here after at least one connecting flight along the way.
      
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      August 23, 2020 2:04pm
  - Flossie
    
    I did wonder where flights were arriving from that were so bad there is no chance of a covid test. You would have to assume that in such countries we cannot trust their pre boarding Visa checks, their security or MPI standards. Never mind their actual aviation standards!
    
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    August 23, 2020 12:51pm
    - MCos
      
      Use your imagination.
      
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      August 23, 2020 2:05pm
- RJ
  
  Common sense is to test people before they board planes and spread a virus globally. It is ok if you can not comprehend that.
  
  Btw, this virus started out with one person, so do tell us why it isn’t important to catch one person with a virus before they get on a plane and travel internationally.
  
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  August 23, 2020 12:22pm
- Stu2
  
  The policy document does not detail what an acceptable test would be.
  
  But Shane Reti when interviewed was talking testing laboratories that were suitably accredited. And it sounded as though they would be limited as all his examples were first world.
  
  Might be issues trying to return to NZ from Pakistan, India, Peru …
  
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  August 23, 2020 12:24pm
  - MCos
    
    A few bob under the counter works wonders.
    
    0 6
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    August 23, 2020 2:11pm
  - Nickc2
    
    I think all certified International Airports should be required to test all passengers passing in and out of their facilities before they go through customs. Lets face it, there are reputable testing techniques in vogue as we speak that take approximately 30 seconds to produce a result. Having passed through a testing facility, customs should stamp passenger’s passports manually or electronically stating they passed a COVID-19 test at said time on said day in said country at said airport.
    IMHO this is achievable as we speak. All it takes is a law to be passed that makes it an international requirement and affected countries held responsible for any indiscretions.
    A similar process could be established for passengers embarking/disembarking Maritime Shipping.
    
    7 2
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    August 23, 2020 5:22pm
- Tall Man
  
  Several hundred? Several thousand I think.
  
  8 2
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  August 23, 2020 1:00pm
- septic skeptic
  
  Macos, Samoa currently run a “no test within 3 days, no entry to Samoa” policy. I guess they can do that because anyone who can’t get a test wherever they are in the world can always fly here. Get put up in a hotel for two weeks at our expense, get tested at our expense, get treated/hospitalized at our expense, then move on to Samoa.
  
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  August 23, 2020 2:13pm
oldfella

NY lefty governor Cuomo bans dancing.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/megan-fox/2020/08/21/footloose-comes-to-life-in-new-york-governor-cuomo-bans-dancing-n824432
How about a little victory dance with your young daughter when you have eradicated Covid-19?
A heartwarming moment you can then share with the media and win international plaudits.
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August 23, 2020 11:44am
- Inandout
  
  oldfella, if Frank Sinatra could only see what a dump NY has become, and these ironical lyrics:
  
  ‘Start spreadin’ the news, I’m leavin’ today
  I want to be a part of it
  New York, New York’
  
  NY residents are now leavin’ in their thousands.
  
  7 3
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  August 23, 2020 2:09pm
- SB2
  
  Another term for it is social distancing often ignored in states like Texas.
  
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  August 23, 2020 2:28pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

The real reason they want you to hate Donald Trump. The Great Reset.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ski2FYUZtGY
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August 23, 2020 11:57am
- SB2
  
  Shouldn’t that be laugh at Trump?
  
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  August 23, 2020 12:19pm
I remember when

How do you count the number of covid deaths.
Has the dead person ever had covid-19?
If the answer is yes, then they are included in the covid stats.
Reason: Died after they tested positive for civid-19.
No need to tell a lie – they died AFTER they got the virus.
Add to the list.
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August 23, 2020 11:59am
Ruawai

This is an interesting interview with Michael Morrah, some in the media trying to shut down other journalists.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/mediawatch/audio/2018760556/a-backlash-over-tough-questions-for-dr-ashley-bloomfield
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August 23, 2020 12:14pm
- kowtow
  
  The scary thing about the article is they can only cite one other journo whose asked “tough questions” and that was a RNZ journo to the Minister .(other than Morrah)
  
  Morrah is doing a great job , the rest of them , not so much.
  
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  August 23, 2020 2:07pm
- Inandout
  
  Ruawai, that Ash doesn’t look well.
  
  4 2
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  August 23, 2020 2:11pm
- Lance
  
  He was a good panelist good on ‘The Nation’.
  First time I have ever watched it. I couldn’t take the smarmy far left git Jack Tame anymore and their joke of a ‘panel’.
  Alas the Tame equivalent on The Nation was actually worse, what an arrogant arse. After a joke of a patsy interview with Grant Robertson, he proceeded to scoff at everything Shane Reti had to say, the turd was laughing at his replies.. literally and openly mocked the proposition of NZers having to have a Covid test before they can get on the aircraft returning to NZ, stating that it was beyond India’s ability to test for such things.
  That a mindless cretin, and a huge insult to a growing tech power like India.
  
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  August 23, 2020 5:14pm
  - Hard Cheese
    
    Tame is an ignorant fool. India is one of the largest manufacturers of vaccines and generic drugs in the world. It’s likely that the vaccine that Ardern is counting on and thicko Jack will be queuing up for will be manufactured in India.
    
    12 1
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    August 23, 2020 6:23pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    India is managing to Covid-19 test 1 million people per day.
    
    https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/govt-reaches-target-of-testing-a-million-people-in-a-day/story-6G33zy5k3VTi5ZF2u7r4bP.html
    
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    August 23, 2020 6:34pm
SB2

What a bunch of deluded plonkers ,

One placard

Mask to protect Mask to Suppress

https://ysb.co.nz/white-supremacy-march/
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August 23, 2020 12:29pm
- wimpston peeeders
  
  the masks arent there to protect the peasants theyre to protect politicians arses.
  
  same principal as H&S, the policy and inductions has nothing to do with stopping you getting hurt and everything to do with stopping them getting sued.
  
  of course being a lefty troll and confronted with fact and logic youll go off on a tangent and deny
  
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  August 23, 2020 7:39pm
Happychappy

You have ask has Jacinda got control over the media as why would a lot the media eat their own to silence good Journalism.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/mediawatch/audio/2018760556/a-backlash-over-tough-questions-for-dr-ashley-bloomfield
What chance have the opposition parties got for fair Journalism when Michael Morrah gets attacked from his own because he asks with good reason the tough Questions of Ashley Bloomfield. I believe that certain people in politics and the media are trying to silence anyone that needs questions to be answered by the Prime Minister.
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August 23, 2020 1:08pm
Chuck Bird

Has anyone seen this outrage? I am not a doctor and neither is Hipkins. However, Shane Reti is and he says it is completely unacceptable.

Covid 19 coronavirus: Nurses continue to jump between ED and managed isolation, patient lives at risk

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12358584
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August 23, 2020 1:22pm
- DeepBlue
  
  I thought that was meant to stop about 6 weeks ago.
  
  5 1
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  August 23, 2020 1:29pm
- RJ
  
  The idiot in charge has no idea what she is doing, and neither do those under her. If it wasn’t for the fact we were an isolated country in the middle of nowhere we would of been hit hard with this idiot running the country and boarders.
  
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  August 23, 2020 1:56pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Boarders are people who rent your spare room.
    Borders are what you cross to get from one country to another.
    
    2 0
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    August 23, 2020 8:55pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I am not a doctor and neither is Hipkins.
  
  It’s not rocket science, Chuck.
  
  I think anyone who has managed a household or even a chook shed with a sick inhabitant understands cross-infection.
  
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  August 23, 2020 2:07pm
  - SB2
    
    In other words basic hygiene like regularly cleaning hands and similar!
    
    0 12
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    August 23, 2020 2:37pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Covid-19 is a respiratory disease, stephieboy.
      
      A high percentage of folks who have come down with this virus are medical professionals.
      
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      August 23, 2020 7:03pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Hipkins say PPE means the nurses will not get infected.
    
    10 3
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    August 23, 2020 3:34pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      He’s an optimist, alright.
      
      16 1
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      August 23, 2020 3:41pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        Arrogant and not very bright.
        
        12 2
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        August 23, 2020 4:23pm
      - cmm
        
        Funny way to spell idiot.
        
        He’s just winging it and hopes he can get away with it.
        
        If it goes pear shaped he’ll find an expert to go under the bus for him.
        
        10 2
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        August 23, 2020 4:25pm
- Isobar
  
  Maybe its time to pay them more, so they don’t have to.
  
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  August 23, 2020 3:37pm
DeepBlue

Prof Gorman in Stuff :

Gorman felt New Zealanders were taking the virus more seriously the second time, as he felt their trust and confidence had been “seriously eroded”.

“One coping strategy is called monitoring and monitors want to know absolutely everything. Blunters on the other hand look for faith in establishment and authority figures. We were all blunters at the beginning of this.”

The stardust is falling in the professional ranks too. We must be Monitors here at KB.
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August 23, 2020 1:31pm
septic skeptic

I absoludely reassure you that we take this very seriously. I have asked that this doesn’t happen going forward. Now it is time to move on. I take full responsibilidy for the huge success that our team of five million has had by going hard and early.
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August 23, 2020 2:01pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Damian Grant calls out the sycophantic journalists who inhabit our media morass.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/300087950/coronavirus-pms-abuse-of-power-during-lockdown-a-warning-to-us-all

our media most of all, to check to see if those in power have a legal basis to wield the authority that they claim.
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August 23, 2020 2:05pm
Jack5

Bang goes a colourful idea …

Browsing on the RNZ site I came across mention of a documentary, Wahine Warrior, which promotes hunting to help solo mums put food on the table.

Wahine Warrior is made with taxpayer support, from: NZ on Air; the Film Commission; and Te Mangai Paho of the Ministry of Maori Development (Te Puni Kokiri).

On the surface the idea seems not bad. However, think of the cost of each of the .308 rifles demonstrated as a tool for the Mums. The price starts at more than $1000 and ranges to more than $4ooo. Ammunition costs around $2.50 a shot.

You need good footwear for the bush and suitable clothes, and a good knife to skin carcasses. Not forgetting a decent vehicle to get through the back-country roads, and petrol for the trips.

Before all this, the Mum will need a firearms permit, which means going to training course sessions, and a police-vetted safety cabinet for storing the rifle.

Presumably, there’s a fee to for the learn-to-hunt course.

Perhaps the Government will create subsidies to get solo Mums into the bush.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/loading-docs-2020/story/2018758470/loading-docs-2020-wahine-warrior
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August 23, 2020 2:46pm
- Hollyfield
  
  She also needs good and reliable childcare.
  
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  August 23, 2020 7:17pm
- wimpston peeeders
  
  then she can go hunting and realise its all poisoned to hell with 1080, pindone and broadifacoam 🙁
  
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  August 23, 2020 7:43pm
Nickc2

A rather humorous perspective on the US’s DNC. Well, it would be humorous if it wasn’t so true and tragic. It’s rather long, but view with an open mind and whilst at it, consider if any or all of it could be applicable to lil olde NZ at the bottom of the world. Yes, you can put names of NZer’s to the participants in this monologue and the words uttered would be the same.
It’s all coming to a place near you soon (after our election to be precise). Enjoy.
https://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2020/08/the-dnc-that-democrats-dont-want-you-to-see.html
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August 23, 2020 2:55pm
Fletch

Seen on Facebook –

A kiwi finished their public submission on the End of Life Bill (Assisted Suicide) with…
“I’ll leave you with a quiz question:
There are three people in a room.
The first is sick and dying; she has palliative care and is surrounded by loved ones who treasure every last minute they can have with her.
The second is sick and dying; she has no palliative care; is alone and in agony, and wishes she were dead.
The third isn’t dying or in pain, but thinks there is nothing wrong with killing the second, and maybe even the first.
Who is the sickest person in the room?”
Author, Anon.
* David Seymour was on the panel receiving it. He didn’t like it very much…
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August 23, 2020 2:56pm
cmm

Media really are filthy scum.

Latest bit of alarmism from the Herald:

Nasa predicts asteroid is headed for Earth on eve of US election
The asteroid’s impact is due on November 2, the day before the US election.

Ok, I doubt it, but click:

“An asteroid is projected to zoom close to Earth on November 2 – the day before the US Presidential election.”

So they’ve started taking their tent down.

“Nasa says there is a small chance an asteroid could collide with the Earth on the eve of the US election in November.

According to the scientists, the asteroid is currently on a direct collision course for Earth and is projected to hit our home planet on November 2, a day before the US presidential election.”

So what is it “small chance” or “direct collision course”?

“t’s worth being aware of but not worth worrying, as the asteroid is very unlikely to directly impact Earth, however many problems that would solve at this stage.”

What problems would an asteroid impact solve?

So there’s a o.5% chance of an impact and we now laugh it off (rightfully). But there’s a less than 0.1% chance of dying of CV19, but we better take that seriously.
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August 23, 2020 4:15pm
- RJ
  
  Interesting, saw an asteroid hit predicted a few weeks ago, guess this is it.
  
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  August 23, 2020 5:53pm
cmm

Scummy Herald:

Have a good laugh at the people saying NZ has massive problems: “Kiwis’ hilarious response to overseas critic calling locked-down NZ ‘hellhole'”, idyllic photos of carefree people on beaches etc.

Two stories up: 89% of Auckland businesses on wage subsidies (and quite likely most of the rest are on the taxpayer’s tit one way or another).

Yes, no matter if you can have a nice play in the surf or watch the sun go down with a glass of white wine, the economy is being turned into a hell hole.

No doubt you can also watch the sun go down with a glass of bubbly in Peru too!
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August 23, 2020 4:22pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  It is drizzel rain on the Shore. Just getting drinkie preps done, dinner is done (scallops in safron/chili sauce) them some meatballs out of the slow cooker.
  So no sunset, but spapool it is, with umbrella hats on
  
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  August 23, 2020 4:55pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Jaspinda can promise all she wants, but the left will never get this until the stupid stop voting for Labour and the blatant left
    
    10 2
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    August 23, 2020 4:58pm
- Inandout
  
  cmm, Pearl Harbor before the attack was calm and peaceful, NY before the Twin Towers attack was sunny and crisp. Until the earth shakes people will seek the easy road, we like our creature comforts and don’t want to think of the nasty things.
  
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  August 23, 2020 5:31pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Fun, it’s Sunday eve. Mods get upset if I don’t hint subject. Guess they don’t like fun. Democrats Isle, that is all.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0-2GXplx3E&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR0Mq9E1LoQOQSyOYJ2zg_nsKMPt-YMAmB9NvmN548NeRK0ep90dsvZkyRQ
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August 23, 2020 4:23pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/300088468/we-can-all-do-our-part-to-halt-the-onslaught-of-covid19-misinformation
Hey Tracey: what about all the misinformation given to us at 1pm each weekday by Jacinda Ardern and Mr. Bloomfield ? Not to mention the appalling reports by the so-called MSM, the TV stations and the red radio.
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August 23, 2020 5:50pm
- Doc Holliday
  
  No cure for paranoia.
  
  Make Ardern Great Again
  
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  August 23, 2020 7:02pm
  - RJ
    
    You could always get medication for your Psychosis
    
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    August 23, 2020 7:36pm
  - cmm
    
    So you’re saying she is not great? I thought she was supposed to be Awesome!
    
    10 3
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    August 23, 2020 8:01pm
    - RJ
      
      Well she is a great liar
      Greatly corrupt
      A great manipulator
      And a great waste of space
      
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      August 23, 2020 8:07pm
Kiwi_in_Paris

Winston Churchill accurately predicted the situation today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TY7oUNobsY
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August 24, 2020 3:13am
SpencerArnold

Apparently there are loads of victims and relatives coming in from overseas for the sentencing of the chch shooter brenton tarrant. My 3 questions are….
1. how did so many foreigners get ahead of the queue of NZ’ers wishing to come home,
2. why turn up to a sentencing where the court is closed and there is no face-to-face interaction, and
3. why are no politicians or journalists asking these questions?
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August 24, 2020 6:44am
- Jack5
  
  More important, will they all go home after the sentencing?
  
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  August 24, 2020 11:26am

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