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May 29, 2020 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 29 May 2020

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PhilBest

The biggest failure of COVID-19 expert analysis and policy relates to the ignoring of the findings, by mid-March, that a significant proportion of persons infected (and testing positive for the virus) remained asymptomatic. The majority of the rest become only mildly ill. Of those who become severely ill, even among the elderly, the majority recover. The oldest victims to recover have been over 100.

https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2020/03/coronavirus_stats.html#comment-2668972

https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2020/03/coronavirus_stats.html#comment-2668984

The obvious implications of this for modelling COVID-19 deaths, and the serious illnesses that might overwhelm ICU’s, are that it is completely wrong to use the entire population as the denominator for serious illnesses and deaths in the process of attaining “herd immunity”.

Sure enough, the alarmists are not being supported by the evidence of unfolding statistics. Everywhere, the curve is turning down “too soon”. It is only “too soon” if you ignored the early findings, and failed to apply them to the calculations. The curve of illnesses and death starts to fall long before you get the magical >60% of the population having been infected. Circa 60% of the population are already not at risk of even developing symptoms.
So when the virus has got into the social circles where the relatively few truly vulnerable people are, it very quickly kills some, and others get very sick, and recover, and have the antibodies. It is the progress of the virus through this subset of society that determines when the curve of deaths and serious illnesses will peak, and to what extent “second waves” might occur. But the numbers are an order of magnitude lower than those assuming “the entire population” as the denominator.

Here’s the full-wonk analysis for those who need it:

https://judithcurry.com/2020/05/10/why-herd-immunity-to-covid-19-is-reached-much-earlier-than-thought/#_edn7

But it was simply a matter of reason and logic, by the end of March. How long will it take for even the correct hindsight to be reached?
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May 29, 2020 8:01am
- PhilBest
  
  The above is quite apart from the separate issue of environmental factors that render different regions of the world and even of some countries, more or less vulnerable to infections, illnesses and deaths.
  
  For example, Florida has the highest proportion of elderly people of any US State, and yet one of the lowest rates of COVID-19 mortality.
  
  If we aren’t going to learn the lesson about the dangers of politicians listening to up-their-arse computer modellers, on this issue, we aren’t ever going to learn. Computer modellers are perhaps unrecognized as the worst of the west’s swamp creatures, for their combination of unaccountability and treacherousness. Comey, Brennan, Clapper, etc said in 2016 “look what we can do to the elected President of the USA, with total impunity”. Pandemic modellers responded in 2020; “hold my drink”.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:10am
  - cmm
    
    PB: The biggest problem with overreliance on models like this is that they have no solid foundations built on physics or reality.
    
    There are thousands of very good models that you use every day.
    
    Your cell phone uses signal models to be able to track and decode cellphone signals. Same too the fibre modem signals etc. Same too the tracking and positioning algorithms in GPS receivers. All models. All those are based on physics. They are all accurate.
    
    GPS receivers can pinpoint a position to a centimetre or two. Astounding accuracy, especially when you consider it is done by tracking satellites flying at approx 8km/sec something like 25000 km away. All done with models.
    
    Other computer models provide us tide tables and predictions for the movement of planets. Those have a solid basis in the physics of gravity, how the moon moves etc. We can accurately predict the tide for 17th July 2407 in we want to. We know when Haley’s Comet is going to be back again – accurate to hours over a 70 year period.
    
    There are computer models work because they are based on physics and are highly predictable.
    
    But climate, disease propagation etc are inherently chaotic systems and unpredictable. They cannot be modeled with the same precision and there is no solid physics behind them.
    
    This means they get “tweaked” until they give the expected result. Surprise, surprise, the expected result is the desired result.
    
    The real failing, IMHO, is all the confidence that is placed on these models. The people that make these models understand that these models are flawed – at best – and misleading. Yet these same people will use very confident language when reporting on, and presenting, these models.
    
    Unfortunately our decision makers (politicians and bureaucrats) get baffled by the bullshit. Anyway, they have a vested interest in the alarm that is cause.
    
    These “experts” have done us all a terrible disservice.
    
    We cannot undo the last few months so let us please LEARN and not fall in the same hole again.
    
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    May 29, 2020 8:46am
    - MT_Tinman
      
      We cannot undo the last few months so let us please LEARN and not fall in the same hole again
      
      In making that plea you are addressing the same people who, having watched socialism fail 100% of the times it has been tried, are attempting to try it again, this time on our fair shores.
      
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      May 29, 2020 8:58am
      - cmm
        
        Yeah, I suppose I’m over-wishing here but sometime it has got to get through…
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:45am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        You don’t understand MT – all those other times socialism failed, every single one of them, in each country where it’s been tried, multiple times over decades, they just weren’t doing it right!
        
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        May 29, 2020 2:35pm
    - KevO'Brien
      
      A computer model is not reality. When feelingz and beliefs are substituted for applied knowledge, mathematics, discernment and judgement decision making can be farcical. That quality at some levels can be criminal if it does not respect the duty of care required.
      
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      May 29, 2020 9:55am
      - oldfella
        
        A climate change computer model is not reality either. Stuff it full of lefty beliefs and it will spit out… lefty sh*t.
        
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        May 29, 2020 10:26am
      - JackRabbit
        
        It’s been an ongoing problem for at least 100 years.
        
        “Today’s scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality.”
        -Nikola Tesla
        
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        May 29, 2020 10:56am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        The understanding is in the language.
        Virtual reality…is only VIRTUALLY real, not actually real.
        You have not seen a giraffe, if you saw it on the TV.
        That is just an image of a giraffe…..This particular image of this giraffe could be 50 years old and said giraffe would be dead.
        Ticking a thumbs up, does not make you a real friend.
        
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        May 29, 2020 12:00pm
    - JackRabbit
      
      “Unfortunately our decision makers (politicians and bureaucrats) get baffled by the bullshit.”
      
      “Confirmed” Deaths in the USA=103,254
      https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
      
      “Provisional” Deaths = 81,372
      Confirmed deaths will be lower.
      And this figure is overstated.
      
      https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm
      
      Yes, World Meters is being used by everyone as a source for Covid-19 deaths, but no-one knows who is behind the website or where the data comes from.
      
      I am not intimidated by how many govt organisations use the site, or whether it is endorsed by the pope, the queen, or Bernie Madoff.
      
      -There is no address, phone number, contact email address, no company info, no listed personnel.
      
      That is a red flag. In my consulting, and performing due diligence for clients, where the client is either looking to pay money for a service or as a source of raw, and the website has no data as above, it’s a no go and tagged as a scam.
      
      To get accurate data you need connections and relationships with all the data sources. Especially with Covid where the data is changing and you need “confirmed” data. So we are talking dozens if not hundreds of staff on computers and phones. We are talking an entire floor or entire building of staff.
      
      So tt is a concern for a “professional” organisation that would have to employ dozens if not hundreds of staff that:
      
      -As stated, there is no address, phone number, contact email address, no company info, no listed personnel.
      
      -The IP Address used to host the website is shared by 87 other websites, many of which are porn sites, as was their previous website.
      
      For a “successful” data company, implied from their site, they should have their own IP Address and VPS virtual server all for very little per month, as many of my client’s do.
      
      -Their tag line is “Mesmerize your audience”. Yeah right.
      
      -Another linked site owned by the “owner” is: https://www.internetlivestats.com/, which is essentially a “guesstimate counter” site, and not linked to real data.
      
      There is no way they can know with any certainty how many computers or iPhones were sold today, unless you had live feeds to every retailer or distributor in the world. Its all a big guess based probably on the last 12 months annual sales volumes divided by 365 /24 / 60 / 60.
      
      The Covid stats are just another false authority dealing in fear mongering by over estimating Covid-19 deaths by between 33 and 50%.
      
      Also check out:
      https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2020/05/world/worldometer-coronavirus-mystery/
      
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      May 29, 2020 10:29am
      - JackRabbit
        
        Correction: There are several IP addresses involved, and the latest one is hosted along with 1,858 other websites in the USA.
        
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        May 29, 2020 11:27am
      - rangitoto
        
        The IP addresses belong to Cloudfare which is one of the companies that provide website protection services. You are not connecting directly to the real worldmeters.info website(s), instead the DNS is pointing at Cloudfare distributed reverse proxies acting as a middle man.. These mitigate threats such as DDOS attacks, SQL injection and other attacks. The real addresses of the web servers are hidden. There is no way to know them unless you are an insider. This is standard anti hacker practice these days.
        
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        May 29, 2020 12:24pm
    - rangitoto
      
      Actually comets are tricky as they are subject to unpredictable forces due to sublimation of gasses from their surface. Still the magnitude of such forces are generally small but definitely have a measurable effect.
      
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      May 29, 2020 12:13pm
    - theoldbloke
      
      I think you may be confusing a couple of things when you say models eg Cellphone signals….
      They perhaps should better be discribed as algorithms. Taking known data and calculating a result.
      
      Models as used in the Covid19/Climate change fiascos are about taking a bunch of variables and attempting to calculate an outcome from unknown data.
      
      Just saying.
      
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      May 29, 2020 1:18pm
Captain Mainwaring

So the two idiot trampers who broke all the rules by going into the bush in Covid level 3 withour a locator beacon and finally got rescued by a helicopter which costs 25K per hour (on top of all the other costs of the search) are being praised for surviving for 19 days.
Then the only journalist who questions their stupidity and suggests that they be sent a bill (Mark Richardson) gets ripped to pieces for being unkind.
We are surely a leftist bludger’s paradise where nobody has to take responsibility for their idiocy and somebody else can pay.
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May 29, 2020 8:01am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Other have been arrested and prosecuted by our stasi for breaking such rules.
  The rule of law has been abandoned for tribal say so.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:10am
  - Tricati
    
    I did hear Ms O’Conner is related to our current Minister of Agriculture, so that may explain it.
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:54am
- Tomtoddy
  
  I suspect they were in search of a certain type of mushroom known to grow in the Anatori river valley. It can cause disorientation among other things.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:13am
  - cmm
    
    Yup, there is certainly more to this story.
    
    I still fail to understand how someone can really irrecoverably lost in that terrain. Follow any river and you come out at the sea.
    
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    May 29, 2020 8:49am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      How far can you go into the bush? Half, because after half you are coming out.
      Anyone who gets lost in NZ is a fuckwit – streams are the secret
      
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      May 29, 2020 8:56am
      - MT_Tinman
        
        I don’t know the particular area but having wandered around some of the South Island high country, fishing rod in hand (listening to hysterically laughing trout) I can assure you that many streams stream through very harsh gorges and over some rather steep and forbidding cliffs.
        
        Streams may be the secret but to what?
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:04am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        The secret to staying alive
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:15am
      - Mike
        
        Tinman is correct. It is very easy to get lost, and to get trapped, in rough country, especially when conditions are bad.
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:19am
      - cmm
        
        Tinman: Certainly that is true, but following a stream/river does not necessarily mean walking in the riverbed. The general flow of rivers and ridges will take you to the sea.
        
        If you do not cross watersheds then whatever valley you go up is the same one as you come down. Pretty simple really.
        
        High country is a bit different. I’ve been way lost in high country too – I even managed to cross a border and be 5km into the wrong country. Embarrassing map reading error.
        
        I am still astounded that the media keeps saying they were well equipped, but no PLB and no navigation gear is completely ridiculous.
        
        I would not have gone in there for a single day, let alone a multi-day, tramp without at least two PLBs (one can break), maps (on paper), GPS (plus spare batteries) and two compasses as well as whatever navigation apps are on a cell phone.
        
        Those trout seem to like the jokes I tell too.
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:25am
      - Michael NZ
        
        Thinking on the media coverage, I have a Power Monkey for Battery recharging.
        We also have a lifestraw for clean water.
        I have them to take into the bush and for disasters.
        If I were to go into the bush I would take a PLB if no one else had one.
        That is called being an adult.
        Why aren’t the media being adults and holding Dion and his girlfriend to account.
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:37am
      - MT_Tinman
        
        cmm, I joined a search party one time in South Westland, looking for a group of overdue (daytripping) hunters.
        
        The hunters were located in the middle of a swamp, feeding mossies and sandflies, less than a Km from the main road, about a Km from the nearest stream (Ship Creek) and probably no more than 2Km from the sea.
        
        They weren’t going anywhere.
        
        The idea you can just follow a stream to the sea is a little naive.
        
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        May 29, 2020 10:12am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Mike, I’ll take you out the back of Broadlands/Galatea some day. Have not been there for 45+ years, but if you get lost I will find you
        
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        May 29, 2020 2:11pm
    - Durden
      
      And as food ran out, they lived for two weeks on just spring water and no food ? !! No one bounds out of the chopper like they did and give energetic hugs after two weeks of zero food– even if you had shelter and water.
      
      NZ Media are excellent at NOT asking the most relevant question. You need an Aussie or Saffa or Richardson to do that.
      
      Suggests a well stocked bolt hole or a second trip back in to keep up appearances.
      
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      May 29, 2020 9:08am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        We will never know because the media are useless.
        
        I am thinking it might be time to make locator beacons compulsory for trampers. Just like we make life jackets and seat belts compulsory. I know it would require defining a “tramper”. You obviously don’t want to capture people just going for a walk. Maybe a start would be to make it mandatory for anyone using DOC huts. Sure there would be mass avoidance but if you could lift the use of beacons to 70 percent of trampers, that would be a big change. Based on my experience, I think about 20 percent of trampers use beacons all the time. If you are alone you can fall down and break an ankle late in the day within 2 km from the track carpark. And you will be stuck there all night, or longer.
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:45am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Some idiots can get lost walking to the local dairy
      
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      May 29, 2020 10:54am
- Benedict Yu
  
  They were on a very challenging tramp over several days in remote country. A beacon should have been a must. They are now affordable so no excuses. I mainly do day or sometimes overnight tramps. I always take my beacon.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:22am
  - MH
    
    And they didn’t have an analog watch with hands on. is that tautology
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:00am
- Benedict Yu
  
  The cost is not as much as you make out. RNZAF crews need to have a specified hours to stay current. In cases like this the rescue hours just substitute for training hours.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:26am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  But that’s the New Zealand way.
  Be kind. No-one ever takes responsibility for their actions.
  
  //
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:40am
  - Paulus
    
    This will be apparent when the COL gets re elected and people wonder what happened !
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:59am
- NZDirect
  
  Would they have not been prosecuted if they were hunters rather than trampers?
  
  Yeah, thought so…while we rejoice in their survival, they should also be prosecuted. Its no different to your Nana causing a car accident – we are all relieved no one was hurt but she is still prosecuted for dangerous use of a motor vehicle.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:08am
  - Jack5
    
    That is spot on, NZ Direct.
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:09am
- alex Masterley
  
  I asked myself this morning why they didnt take a simple handbearing compass with them. Or even a map.
  Having the compass would have stopped them walking around in circles.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:35am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    A local map and a compass is good enough. As a youngster I got lost in the bush but the compass got me out.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:00am
    - Brian Marshall
      
      I used to head to bush on my own as a teenager. I made plans, took map and compass and didn’t diviate from the planned journey. Parents were told where I was going, and it was written down.
      PLB weren’t a thing at the time and I don’t want to make them compulsory, but as many have noted, they’re cheap to buy and even cheaper to hire. Something is very fishy about this story and it doesn’t fully add up. Also, if they would have been prosecuted if they were hunting, they should be prosecuted for tramping. One is not that more dangerous than the other.
      
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      May 29, 2020 10:16am
- Loddenthinks
  
  Some bloke down here at the Mount decided to go for a rock-scramble on Leisure Island, which was closed off with signs saying keep out etc, this was during Lockdown Level 4.
  
  Managed to fall several metres, badly breaking an ankle and various other injuries, mostly moderate, requiring to be winched off by paramedics and being taken in an ambulance to hospital. A fireman who was called out also managed to fall over and injure himself – less badly, but still requiring rescue.
  
  Local Police said “he has some serious explaining to do” but since then there’s been the sound of crickets. Nothing in the press to say he’s been prosecuted, no update on the position, looks like you can breach lockdown, endanger yourself and others, use expensive rescue resources and bowl up to the hospital which has turned away people with cancer and in agony, get free treatment and no consequences.
  
  In Queensland if you go outside your hotel room when in quarantine you’re fined $5,000 – as a warning!
  
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  May 29, 2020 2:46pm
  - chukar
    
    Fog is an issue on is own.
    It is unbelievable how easy it is to become disoriented in those conditions.
    Lost a friend years ago in the Canterbury high country who fell over a bluff and know of a born and bred landowner who went down a wrong spur on his own property.
    Fog is very dangerous in the mountains.
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:23pm
Left Right and Centre

The MAGA hat, the massacre and this awesome opinion column.

Enjoy. You’re welcome.
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May 29, 2020 8:07am
- Andrei
  
  I don’t know why you got downticked for sharing that rambling diatribe writte by one Donna Miles-Mojab.
  
  It is truly an awesome example of word salad worthy of mockery and demonstrates why stuff is worth only one dollar.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:35am
  - Sacha
    
    To associate the Mosque tragedy with a frivolous bit of election memorabilia is, well, inane.
    Like the author of that article. Jeez!
    
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    May 29, 2020 8:52am
  - adamsmith1922
    
    Agree see some comments from me about this rubbish article https://adamsmith.wordpress.com/2020/05/28/sloppy-journalism-28-bilge-from-nz-journalist-on-hijabs-and-maga-hats/
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:03am
    - marcw
      
      Why don’t you post your comments here adamsmith, instead of using someone else’s blog to generate traffic to your own blog?
      
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      May 29, 2020 2:08pm
- Scott
  
  Left Right and Centre – thanks for posting this column. It shows everything that is wrong with our New Zealand media. Donald Trump is the duly elected President of the United States with whom Todd Muller will need to build a relationship with if he becomes Prime Minister.
  
  But this opinion writer has decided that the Make America Great hat is a symbol of everything that is wrong in the world. This is the zero-sum game that our media play. Our opinions are right and everyone else is an evil person. It’s just not good enough I’m sorry.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:45am
  - oldfella
    
    I commented on this column yesterday. I described the writer as ‘loopy’. I was trying to be kind.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:30am
- emmess
  
  What a disgusting article.
  To blame Trump for the Chch attack is less valid than blaming Ardern for the release of the coronavirus because of her IUSY speech in 2009, as the CCP and her both share an ideology. Trump is not an eco-fascist.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:47am
  - Crisplion
    
    Although to be fair, despite their many egregious faults, one can’t really accuse the CCP of being socialist. Unlike Ardern they do actually recognise the importance of economic growth.
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:38am
    - Brian Marshall
      
      I give you an uptick but I would be amiss to not point out that the CCP are actually National Socialist (Fascist) not Communist Socialist. The difference is that the CCP now encourage private enterprise, but that must serve the state (China) when called upon, rather than the Mao communist CCP that had the state own the means of production. The kids get heavily indoctrinated during their school years and a bit of Ethno-National Socialist policy creeps in with their Han Supremacy in places like Tibet and Xinjiang.
      
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      May 29, 2020 10:23am
      - Crisplion
        
        Fair point Brian. You’re perfectly correct of course. The CCP are the very definition of fascist (national socialist). I was taking a little license for the sake of my quip about Ardern.
        
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        May 29, 2020 11:51am
      - freethinker
        
        Brian – up ticked for a valid opinion/comment but not sure were the line is drawn – between the freedom of private enterprise and state control. We may find that out as the CCP reneges on their agreement with UK on Hong Kong.
        
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        May 29, 2020 12:29pm
  - BananaLlama
    
    The social justice left have these weird ideological positions because they can’t except the fact that Islamic terrorists were running people over with trucks, gunning down concerts, Knifing people on streets and shooting up cafes.
    Now we have Right wing extremists who have started doing the same. Not good at all.
    For christ sake we even had New Zealanders join ISIS it’s just that they didn’t end up killing anyone here, they killed people in the middle east instead.
    And now suddenly because terrorism and extremism have arrived on our shores it becomes convenient to blame Donald Trump and MAGA hats instead of being honest and looking at the broader issues around the Globe.
    
    I am very thankful that Trump eradicated ISIS had they continued to kanker and fester i think we would have seen a real bloodbath erupting around the globe.
    
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    May 29, 2020 4:13pm
- krazykiwi
  
  It is astounding, the fresh realisations one can receive from the enlightened. I, for one, had no idea the possession of Trump campaign merch made one a supporter of mass murder in NZ. Yet there it is. Clearly set out for the uninformed
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:52am
  - freethinker
    
    If Todd had been sharper he would have told the questioner his hat was not a Trump Hat it was kiwi Hat and MAGA stood for Make ardern Go Away and given us a belly laugh as the questioner had an apopletic fit.
    
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    May 29, 2020 12:32pm
- PhilBest
  
  It would be fairer to assume that everyone wearing a Che T-shirt is cool with 100 million dead victims of Communism. After all, Che was one of the actual murderers who routinely shot victims through the head. Does the execrable Ms Miles-Mojab have any Che memorabilia in her possession, one wonders?
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:55am
  - Crisplion
    
    Or maybe she has a little Mao cap. Mass murder is only chic when the left do it.
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:40am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Another import from Iran who thinks she is important
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:58am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The stupid person suffers from pure TDS. Can’t help but bend and twist things
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:57am
- BobbyS
  
  What a very long bow to draw in that “opinion” piece
  How a person can mentally traverse from a Massacre by a crazy gunman to a MAGA hat is beyond belief
  NO a hat did not kill 51 people
  NO a hat did not divide a Nation
  NO a hat does not represent hate
  People kill people
  People divide Nations
  People Hate People
  Stuff & Opinion pieces is why $1 was a fair price to pay for the purchase of that stupid company
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:10am
- artemisia
  
  Ms Miles-Mojab is certainly entitled to her opinion. And equally entitled to eyerolls from we thickos who can’t figure out her leap over a chasm of irrelevancy.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:22am
- Ruawai
  
  OMG the writer says we shouldn’t get caught up in outrage then goes on to say she is outraged and that the hat is somehow tied up with the mosque shootings.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:29am
  - oldfella
    
    As SJWs love to say, she was ‘triggered’ by the MAGA hat, but in the context of a mass shooting… maybe not.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:34am
  - Surely Knott
    
    Yes. But she also wrote an article talking about the multiple meanings of wearing a hijab and the context.
    
    She says, “…. you should not minimise the element of free choice in the decision of those New Zealand women, including me, who opted to don a hijab as a visible display of support for the Muslim community affected by the terrorist attack.
    
    And what better way to politically deweaponise the hijab than using it in the way my grandmother did whenever she felt the need – as a way of bringing solace and spiritual comfort. ”
    I would suggest that the Maga hat has also turned into a political weapon. And I agree with her that we should not minimise peoples free right to wear it. That like a hijab the MAGA hat also has multiple meanings. Sure the media use it as a symbol of hate by finding some idiot wearing one. But many Americans will take the hat’s message literally as a message of love and hope and aspirations for their country, that it could indeed be great again. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12219037
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:16am
- graham
  
  Donna Miles-Mojab does seem to have form for insinuating some quite incredible conspiracy theories from what people say or do.
  
  When Golriz Ghahraman called for tougher laws around hate speech last year, David Seymour apparently said that “Golriz Ghahraman is a real menace to freedom in this country”. Several people called him out for this possibly unwise turn of phrase, but Ms Miles-Mojab took it to a whole new level and claimed it was Islamophobic.
  
  Ms Miles-Mojab then went on to essentially say “ordinary Kiwis” are thick, and only culturally sensitive people such as herself can see this:
  
  The Islamophobic trope coded in Seymour’s comment about Green MP Golriz Ghahraman may not be obvious to ordinary Kiwis, but for some it is a strong reinforcement of a familiar narrative that says Muslims “hate our freedom”.
  
  There’s an interesting discussion on that here:
  
  https://pointofordernz.wordpress.com/2019/05/23/seymour-should-consult-some-american-judges-to-avoid-being-denounced-as-a-bully-who-speaks-in-inflammatory-code/
  
  Funny … apparently Trevor Mallard, of all people, said Seymour’s choice of phrase was “bullying”.
  
  Well, he should know …
  
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  May 29, 2020 10:12am
  - hilaryt
    
    Donna is another added to my ever-lengthening list of ‘don’t bother’ reads in the Press. Email exchange with the editor the other day over the smear piece on the local Mayor who, 20years ago, yes, 20 years ago, impersonated his idol Louis Armstrong at an event. Muck-raking clickbait.
    
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    May 29, 2020 12:13pm
- Jack5
  
  Stuff’s doomed to a short survival under its $1 regime if it continues to publish crap from Leftist activists like the ethnic Iranian Miles-Mojab.
  
  There seems to be a photograph of Miles-Mojab at the Spinoff, in a close encounter with the Australian-border crasher and NZ overstayer Behrouz Boochani. Miles-Mojab is advocating NZ asylum for him and says:
  
  “I know there are many of us who are asking him to stay in New Zealand.
  
  Miles-Mojab, who bills herself as a columnist for the Christchurch Press, is typical of the steep slide to the Left of Stuff newspapers during new ($1) owner Sinead Boucher’s term as chief executive. Leftists and general anti-Western hacks’ columns have proliferated on Stuff newspapers’ opinion pages.
  
  Let’s hope the Muller-led National fights any Labour Government move to pump cash into Stuff.
  
  Miles-Mojab and Boochani (and Golriz!):
  
  https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/26-11-2019/why-behrouz-boochani-should-indeed-seek-asylum-in-new-zealand/
  
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  May 29, 2020 11:26am
TWEEDSE

In my earlier days, going hard and early was an embarrassing fact of youth.

Now, it transforms you into a saint.
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May 29, 2020 8:09am
- PhilBest
  
  That’s a good simile, in both cases it is more like claiming to go early and hard even if the facts are somewhat different….
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:55am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Thanks for that…very amusing (and unfortunately often true), thats made my day.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:06am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Only if it was true….
  But it isn’t.
  
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  May 29, 2020 12:06pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Hipango is a surname that means a lot if you know anything of NZ’s history.
https://teara.govt.nz/en/biographies/1h24/hipango-hoani-wiremu

But to the folks who run our TV, it is a name to be mocked, especially as it now carried by a National MP.

https://www.facebook.com/HareteHipangoMP/videos/vb.1772213219772184/248263209764722/?type=2&theater

Perhaps it is time for media folk to take a damn hard look at themselves and reflect on their ignorance of basic manners as well as NZ History before they scream diversity/racism…and try and hide their failings behind pay-walls.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12335421
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May 29, 2020 8:09am
- Swifty
  
  Appalling.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:29am
  - Mike
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Oh, get real. Kiwibloggers’ reactions would be very different if the unfunny comedians were mocking the name of Meka Whaitari (Mega Fightery anyone?), for example.
    
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    May 29, 2020 8:54am
    - Prince
      
      No one would dare mock the whakapapa of a sainted Labour Party MP. It would never get to the screen in the first place.
      
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      May 29, 2020 9:16am
    - Libertarians are right
      
      She got attacked purely for her political allegiance whereas Meka Whaitari got attacked for attacking her employees. Meka disrespected her own name to be fair while Harete’s only crime seems to be being an “Uncle Tom”.
      
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      May 29, 2020 9:20am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      But they haven’t mocked Meka Whaitiri’s name on National TV or compared her to a pottle of soy-yoghurt, have they?
      
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      May 29, 2020 9:24am
      - Mike
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        More people would read Kiwiblog than watch that lame-as show. I’m astounded that anyone noticed. But now that they have read the Herald’s excellent piece of journalism, I’m not surprised the Kiwiblog snowflakes are up in arms.
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:35am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        I’m not surprised the Kiwiblog snowflakes are up in arms.
        
        I think what surprises you is that this snowflake (and believe me, there’s few folks as snow white as me) knows and cares about this matter.
        
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        May 29, 2020 10:28am
      - Libertarians are right
        
        Mike – It’s also worth noting that there is a monumental hypocrisy here from the left. My issue lies more with them effectively claiming it’s ok to attack someone for their Maori name if they don’t follow the rules (i.e. vote for Labour like good little serfs) but everyone else is racist scum if they do to anyone else.
        
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        May 29, 2020 10:39am
    - JibberJabber
      
      But of course, the alleged comedians don`t mock any thing to do with the Lefty politics with which they are aligned with do they?
      Surprising, given the Labour led Coalition is such a deep vein of comedy gold….
      
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      May 29, 2020 9:32am
      - Mike
        
        Really. Have you never watched any comedy shows?
        
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        May 29, 2020 10:05am
      - Jack5
        
        Mike is half-right in his 9.35 post: it’s a crap piece of entertainment.
        
        The pandemic has given television, in its decline from media dominance, a short lift by providing millions of pandemic trapped home viewers. That’s over.
        
        What needs more scrutiny is Creative New Zealand, which pumps out taxpayer money like one of those big irrigation sprayers on a dairy farm. Some of it is effectivelly a back, second channel for the Government to feed money to TVNZ.
        
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        May 29, 2020 11:43am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Paul Henry and Ms Dickshit?
      
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      May 29, 2020 12:07pm
- Mike
  
  Tut tut. Lame comedy show displays poor taste.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:29am
- Tony Stuart
  
  We live on a hill overlooking Putiki. Hoani Wiremu Hipango is buried about 500m from our home, as is Lt Col Waata Hipango, Harete’s brother, who was killed in a hit-and-run accident in Singapore, while serving New Zealand overseas.
  
  The Hipango name has significant mana in Whanganui. What passes these days as “comedy” was greatly disrepectful of both the Hipango name, and the whanau in general.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:36am
  - niggly
    
    So using the left-wing play book the left-wing luuvie comedians are actually … Racist!
    
    Come to think about it, most (99%?) of our left-wing luvvie comedians … are pale! Which surely, according to our left-wing luvvie journalists this week, means they are indeed racist!
    
    Oh the ironing! Left-wing luvvies found out to be closet racists!
    
    And to make matters worse it looks like left-wing luvvie comedians are not respecting the “principles of the treaty” by disrespecting Maori – Shame!
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:46am
    - oldfella
      
      TVNZ has pulled the show. Apparently it was a South African-born, now local, comedian making the bad taste joke. Does that make it doubly racist? /sarc
      
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      May 29, 2020 12:46pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  So the Leftys attack National for not having any Maori on their front bench.
  
  They also attack any National Maori MPs for not being Maori enough or just attack them for no good reason (for being in the wrong party most likely).
  
  They really are morally corrupt.
  
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  May 29, 2020 12:00pm
- freethinker
  
  Maggy – The Heralds & others paywall are excellent as it stops me reading most of the leftish bullshit, just a quick skim through the headlines. Had a marketing call yesterday from ChCh Press offering cheap subscription and the lady seemed unsurprised when I told her not interested due to biased inaccurate reporting of news that I read the previous day on blogs with comments that allowed a better overview of how factual/accurate the news story was. She politely thanked me for my valuable feedback!!!!
  
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  May 29, 2020 12:40pm
KevO'Brien

They can hide behind pay walls as they wish–I won’t go there, so they can talk to themselves.
Media have lost credibility and customers–>death.
Without integrity, they will be replaced.
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May 29, 2020 8:15am
- G152
  
  Behind paywalls are the place for these articles.
  Where we dont have to even know they exist and the subscribers can dwell in ignorance of the real world…
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:19am
- Scott
  
  Kev – totally agree. I’ve actually started subscribing to Kiwi blog and BFD because I am hungry for local news that is not Jacinda adoring, soft socialist, left-wing boilerplate.
  
  I would like to see the news media actually return to the principle of free speech. That we can actually talk about things and we can actually have a discussion. This is a principle known as liberalism. It used to be quite common in the news media but then they became left-wing activists and so they don’t want free speech. In fact they define free speech that they don’t like as hate speech.
  
  But we need to have discussions. Take the principle of abortion for example. A hot button issue. Our media basically ignored the very quick passage of the abortion bill. It was basically not discussed. Having won the fight there is now no discussion allowed, outside of forums like this, on the rights or wrongs of abortion and the abortion legislation.
  
  This is what you get when you replace liberal journalism with left-wing activism. You lose free speech, you don’t have interesting conversations and you only really appeal to those who think like you. On social issues the media’s stance appears to be shut up and toe the line. No wonder they are losing support from the general public.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:23am
  - Durden
    
    Something to consider re the BFD. Slater is getting artisan and tiresome. At least various readers used to make the site interesting because of their different viewpoints. But now they are banned of they comment against the flow.
    
    He is pathetic now in his adulation of Winston Peters as much he used to be scathing of the Pensioner from St Mary’s Bay.
    
    https://www.whaleoil.net.nz/2011/11/winston-tells-another-one/
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:48am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Is it adulation or shilling for the shilling? Hard to reconcile such a 180-degree shift but the filthy lucre would explain it, and let’s face it he’s been through a number of fairly severe perspective-altering experiences. Many of them in court, I understand.
      
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      May 29, 2020 3:57pm
- Lummox
  
  But surely if you lose customers you just go back to the Ministry of Truth and ask for a top up to your $50,000,000 bailout?
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:54am
  - Paulus
    
    Is the $50,000,000 a loan or a gift ?
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:22am
    - marcw
      
      It’s just a start Paulus, more where that came from (us taxpayers) if they just keep up with the election campaign they are on. Victory for the chosen ones will ensure there is more. Chilling.
      
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      May 29, 2020 2:16pm
Blackface Twin Reverb

Please.
Can we not use or endorse the term “level 0”?
Doesn’t this concede that the “emergency” is perpetual?
Can we call it normal?
Can we just be done with “Covid Alert”?
Can we have our lives and freedoms back, or do we have to take them?
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May 29, 2020 8:15am
- amospicton
  
  Yes, and we should all make an effort to describe the consequences of this nonsense as being caused by the lockdown rather than the media/govts insistence on covid-19. The lockdown was imposed by the government.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:28am
  - oldfella
    
    Yep, the Wuhan virus didn’t cause the huge job losses, the CoL government did. And to even consider extending the pain for another month, when it’s obvious we could all go straight to Level 1, hell let’s just go straight to normal. Continued restrictions are simply cruel. And our ‘kind’ PM doesn’t seem to grasp that.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:41am
- artemisia
  
  As a normally law abiding citizen with serious respect for the Rule of Law, I have to admit now consciously practicing civil disobedience. So far only in small ways, but planning on extending. Some mates doing similar.
  
  Chances of being invited to ‘visit our place’ remote but as it spreads it will become out of control.
  
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  May 29, 2020 11:04am
oldpark

Heard the flap jaw Peters on Radio last night being given a solution and how Peters could end Level 2 .
Yes Peters in full electioneering mode looking for a Headline will travel to suit his self preservation anywhere .
Well on Truth Radio “Talk Magic ” being interviewed by the John Banks Peters was given the chance to walk the talk on ending Level 2 .
John Banks said to the now sweating Peters who knew what was coming .
All you have to do Mr Peters is on June 2 2020 when Parliament starts up again and you will have the floor in front of the sicko reef fish Arderns sycophant Mainstream Media supporters .Introduce a bill to end Level 2 with the votes of National and ACT hey Presto Level 2 will be no more .That Mr Peters will give you a real headline a lot better than you have been getting up to now as “Auntie Cindy” control freak has batted away your demands for Level 2 to end .
Interview was quickly ended as you have probably guessed Peters didnt think that that type of solution was not such a good idea after all as it would also put his job on the line. Yes a chance for Peters to walk the talk regarding Level2 he has been bleating on about for days,sadly he blew it .
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May 29, 2020 8:19am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Peters had already talked out of both sides of his mouth earlier in the day at Question Time when he was standing in for the PM and had to answer a question about his view to end Level 2.
  
  Hon Amy Adams: Does she agree with the Deputy Prime Minister that the country should be in level 1 right now?
  
  Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS: On behalf of the Prime Minister, I think I made it very clear to Jane Patterson of RNZ on Tuesday, and other journalists who cared to have regard to what I’ve said, she said, when she set the parameters out there, “at the latest,” and gave that date, which means it could be before that date. And then she said also, there’s going to be a review two weeks after the announcement. That means that the Prime Minister and others envisage the possibility of it being—
  
  Hon Member: Nonsense.
  
  Q1: https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20200527_20200528_38
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:54am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Amy Adams?
    Wasn’t it Nikki Kaye?
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:35am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Not according to Hansard. Nikki Kaye asked the first question but it appears Amy Adams asked the supplementary mentioned above. Haven’t seen the video to confirm.
      
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      May 29, 2020 4:06pm
- jv
  
  Showing himself up to be as impotent as the Greens
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:05am
- niggly
  
  Talk is cheap when it comes to WinstonFirst!
  
  He occasionally says these things for news headlines but does nothing about it. Zero. Zilch. Nada.
  
  What’s the bet he’ll roll over for Jacinda and NZ will only come out of level 2 when the health professionals say to Jacinda it is safe to do so!
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:53am
  - alwyn
    
    “NZ will only come out of level 2 when the health professionals say to Jacinda”
    What are the health professionals going to have to do with it?
    The only people who are going to matter are the folks at UMR who do the Labour Party polling. We will come out of this mad panic when the pollsters tell the CoL that the support has dropped to the point that staying in a shut-down mode is being counter-productive to their support.
    Then we will get some action. Health has nothing at all to do with it.
    
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    May 29, 2020 12:01pm
Mike

Happy International Day of United Nations Peacekeepers!
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May 29, 2020 8:19am
- emmess
  
  African kids should be extra careful today, then
  
  16 1
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  May 29, 2020 8:53am
- Mike
  
  For those of apparently finding that hard to stomach, it is also World Digestive Health Day.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:55am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Another: Anti cow pat use for global warming day.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:06am
- krazykiwi
  
  The UN is a club of despots and dictators. Their so-called peacekeepers indulge in rape and sexual assault. Yet NZers are taxed to support the UN. We should defund the UN. It is not fit for purpose.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:01am
  - Mike
    
    Bu that logic, we would disband the NZ police because some of its members have committed murder.
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:11am
    - krazykiwi
      
      Does floating around in the ignorance of moral relativism help you get through the day?
      
      15 3
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      May 29, 2020 10:11am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Yep, another bunch of “do-gooders” who abuse the vulnerable under the cover of defeating evil.
    
    The U.N.’s internal oversight body says in a report on U.N. peace operations that the number of fraud cases it decided to investigate last year increased nearly 80% from 2018, while the number of sexual exploitation and abuse cases rose 40%.
    https://www.dailysabah.com/world/investigations-into-fraud-and-sexual-abuse-in-un-peace-operations-increase/news
    
    https://www.hrw.org/news/2020/01/12/un-peacekeeping-has-sexual-abuse-problem
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:43am
- hookerphil
  
  My son went to East Timor on this so an upvote from me.
  
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  May 29, 2020 1:43pm
Prince

I was feeling quite positive after Muller’s initial press statements.
Not now. ‘Most New Zealanders are unemployed.’ ?
FFS.
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May 29, 2020 8:23am
- MCos
  
  “Most New Zealanders are unemployed but they don’t know it yet.”
  
  Now that’s going to take a bit of explaining, unless he’s adding in school kids, retirees, clergy, etc
  BTW
  A lot of people have lost their jobs, but no one I know.
  However I know one guy whose salary dropped 20% & another 40%. Forty bloody percent!
  They don’t show up on any stats, but that’s serious shit; not the least for the ripple effect it causes in the economy.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:00am
  - marcw
    
    Wait until Superannuation is dropped by 40% to reflect the new 60% of average weekly wages.
    
    22 1
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    May 29, 2020 9:08am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Labour can do that if they wish, but they won’t get back in Govt for 6 Election cycles
      
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      May 29, 2020 10:44am
      - marcw
        
        If they are voted back in, you can guarantee a “mini-budget” before Christmas to manage the economic disaster they have unleashed. The haircuts will commence, as well as the new taxes. Three more years.
        
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        May 29, 2020 12:02pm
  - Michael NZ
    
    I know a dozen people who have lost their jobs.
    I know 4 people who don’t think their businesses can keep all their staff.
    I know one businessperson who has lost their business and their House (mortgage attached) is up for sale.
    I have spoken to dozens of people who won’t be going away within NZ, no matter how cheap, because they are fearful of what the next 6 months will bring and they have families.
    I’m just a little guy in the capitol, there must be thousands of people in the same boat.
    It is a tragedy.
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:54am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      I have a business, deemed “essential” supplying services and parts to other “essential” businesses.
      Called in, under contract, to another “essential” business 2 weeks into L4.
      He told me, he has 8 friends who had already handed in the keys to their landlord, taking about 8 staff each, with them.
      Have had reason to pass Pomare Train station over the past 6 weeks.
      Under Level 4….car park was empty 0-2 cars
      Under level 3….5-8cars
      Now, under level 2….maybe….40 cars.
      In a car park that was filled to bursting with over 200 cars (approx.) before all this lock down nonsense.
      These people, used to catch the train to Wellington (mostly)….to WORK.
      
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      May 29, 2020 12:15pm
- MT_Tinman
  
  Are you suggesting most New Zealanders are employed?
  
  If by “employed” you use the usual meaning ( working in some way to earn their living) I can assure you that is very, very wrong.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:13am
  - fernglas
    
    60% of the workforce is getting the wage subsidy. 20% of the workforce are public servants. Doesn’t leave many to pay the taxes.
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:18am
fisho

Isn’t Go Hard, Go Early just a fancy name for premature ejaculation?
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May 29, 2020 8:25am
- MCos
  
  You’re probably the last person to figure that out.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:03am
Simon

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Hong Kong eh?

The National Party’s biggest donors are tearing the place apart.

Pay the money back National. You are a disgrace.
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May 29, 2020 8:34am
- KevO'Brien
  
  How many tongues do you have?
  
  11 1
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  May 29, 2020 10:08am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Just one, but it has multiple forks…
    
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    May 29, 2020 12:25pm
I remember when

How is Winston’s health? The tremor in his hand is much more obvious now? Noticeable in both his Level 1 interview and in latest QT. Added to his breathing problems it questions his value for money.
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May 29, 2020 8:37am
- burt
  
  The tremor in his hand is much more obvious now?
  
  I’ve only noticed it prior to his long lunch break, after that it’s gone but his speech deteriorates in the afternoon. I wonder what is causing that….
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:55am
  - Mike
    
    What – you witnessed him awake before noon?
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:12am
  - Ruawai
    
    He holds his left hand in his right hand at all times when talking to the media.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:21am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Has he got Parkinson’s? Or has drink caught up with him. That old fella should get out now before being boxed up.
  
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  May 29, 2020 10:10am
Frank the tank

Slowly but surely economists and so called ‘financial experts’ are realizing the true nature of this depression. The hammer is about to fall on the middle management, white collar worker.

While tourism, hospitality and to a degree retail have solid fundamentals, corporate entities have mirrored government institutions over the past 20 years complete with the same structural inefficiencies. Nominal growth and scale has masked these inefficiencies and indeed provided falsity on regards to their true impact to large business.

Faced for the first time in decades with dollar and cents decisions senior management are rapidly realizing there is no need for over inflated HR or marketing departments; customers will still purchase goods and services without liquid lunches; the need for corporate conferences in Queenstown or Bali has gone; and if you are non-performing and/or remote offices of a large multinational there is little point in you because you can be run from Sydney or Singapore (HSBC anyone?).

The delicious irony is that some of the very people that decided the Cindy’s Kindy was a good idea are the same people that are going to be hit the hardest and with no short-to-medium prospects.
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May 29, 2020 8:43am
- DeepBlue
  
  Tower Insurance for example laying off 100+ people today. They will be the middle management and soft roles.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:41am
  - Frank the tank
    
    Think of it as an ecosystem set up for a certain type of corporate spend – accountancy and legal partnerships; banking and finance; catering firms; external consultants; office furniture and it goes on….
    
    Look on the bright side if you are an office worker and survive the great cull there probably won’t be any of those idiot culture consultants brought in to the next corporate conference. The downside will be that it won’t be in Queenstown or the Gold Coast this year, they will just section off part of the basement car park.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:38am
  - freethinker
    
    Deep Blue-Given Towers appalling treatment of customers in the Ch Ch quakes it may hopefully be the loss of customers.
    
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    May 29, 2020 1:12pm
- Michael NZ
  
  Shame.
  
  4 1
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  May 29, 2020 9:56am
  - Frank the tank
    
    Yes and no. For 30 years large corporate businesses have been adding non essential bureaucracy. The people employed in these roles had very little idea that their job was a nice to have but not essential to the business.
    
    A fair analogy is a healthy person that changes to an unhealthy diet and then develops high blood pressure and diabetes and then has to go back to a healthier lifestyle.
    
    Point is i’d argue that its likely 75% of those jobs gone should never have been there in the first place. You go woke you go broke…….
    
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    May 29, 2020 12:04pm
brett68

Muller will fail because he doesn’t know how to deal with the media.
Like so many who have spent their careers in upper management all they know how to do is give orders which the underlings then follow.

They also operate in a bit of a vacuum because they get surrounded by yes men and brown nosers, no one would ever tell Todd his thoughts and ideas are complete bollocks, you’d have to be insane because you’d get fired, so it’s very easy to end up getting a completely over inflated opinion of ones abilities.

What they never experience or haven’t for a very very long time is getting challenged or told they’re a bit shit.
People like Todd don’t know how to deal with that it’s such a foreign concept for him.

Which is why I have always said, Judith Collins should have been leader,
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May 29, 2020 8:44am
- YesMinister
  
  I think it’s bizarre how Muller has been embraced by people here after he popped up more or less without warning and proceeded to embody every archaic stereotype which paved the pathway for Jacinda to be elected in the first place.
  
  A less charismatic John Key clone is not what National needs.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:35am
- Gravelroad
  
  Brett68 – so far, Mr Muller has come across to me as an arrogant twat (similar to his mentor, Bolger). As you say, have seen plenty of these in upper management.
  Not so sure about Ms Collins. She poses a risk that the left wing msm, celebrities, twitter experts and so on would immediately compare her to Trump and bring her down with her “sinister links to China.”
  End of story then.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:45am
  - brett68
    
    How she handles the media is her greatest strength, she’s the female version of Winston peters in that regard.
    
    Blown away that no one in National sees that, it’s like no one actually has any idea
    how politics works,
    what they’re up against,
    what it takes to be elected
    and what’s required to stay in power.
    
    I see real structural weaknesses within the National party that could keep them out of power for a very long time.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:06am
    - Batman
      
      Of course they realise that. She piles on the fake commsy smile, like you do in a call centre to make people feel like you’re being nice.
      
      The problem is countering her very good communications skills.
      
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      May 29, 2020 10:11am
    - Ruawai
      
      What compared to the great structure of the Labour party?? One leader and no one of any ability underneath.
      
      7 1
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      May 29, 2020 10:24am
      - brett68
        
        Its the team behind the scenes, the MP’s are dead weight.
        
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        May 29, 2020 11:03am
    - Blackface Twin Reverb
      
      Judith Collins eh?
      
      1/ pissed all over law abiding firearms owners.
      2/ has the albatross of Oravida non-issue hanging around her neck that the
      media and the left would never let go.
      
      Are you sure this is a good idea?
      Would she not be more use to the team by bagging the s**t out of Cindy and the other diversity hires?
      
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      May 29, 2020 11:04am
      - gorse
        
        Certainly pissed off firearms owners when she said they could “bugger off”. I was a long standing National party member until she said that. I immediately joined ACT, emailed my resignation from National. I did get a reply querying it, it started with the word “really?”. I replied that I was one of those people that Collins had said to bugger off, so I am buggering off. Never regretted it. Two ticks yellow.
        
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        May 29, 2020 11:37am
  - Mike
    
    Dunno. Muller has a long, long way to go to reach Bolger’s level of political nous. Bolger was a very underrated politician, and one of the most capable PMs we have had.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:08am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Yep,
  If he and Nikki Kaye haven’t figured out by now that they are in a cage by themselves with a bunch of attack dogs, then they’re going to be well chewed over before they’re spat out.
  
  It’s time for them to get the dogs under control.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:50am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    Good point Maggy, but change the word dogs to “mongrels”.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:24am
- KevO'Brien
  
  From a Fraser House basement dweller with beady eyes and a short tail that a bit dirty even for the Standard.
  
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  May 29, 2020 10:13am
  - brett68
    
    Not a flattering description of yourself chap.
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:00am
- Paulus
  
  Agreed with your Judith comment but she dos not have the numbers in the parry caucus and I doubt sadly she ever will get the numbers.
  
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  May 29, 2020 11:28am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Did you not hear Judith Collins say she didn’t have enough support in caucus to stand for leader Brett?
  
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  May 29, 2020 12:27pm
  - brett68
    
    Yep, It just shows how dim caucus is and that it lacks the ability to see the big picture.
    
    Thanks to Trumpy boy, politics is now presidential, you have to elect a presidential type of leader.
    The main skill required is to be good in front of the camera
    
    Collins is a presidential type of leader, Bridges and Muller are not.
    
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    May 29, 2020 12:44pm
    - brett68
      
      National seems to be trying to play rugby when the game is now soccer and they can’t understand why they’re going wrong.
      
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      May 29, 2020 12:51pm
- freethinker
  
  Brett68 – you may be right but I will give Todd a little time to adapt to his new position and learn how to handle the media and his own caucus. If he adapts he has my support if not time for another change.
  
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  May 29, 2020 1:16pm
burt

When the country voted to go for elimination rather than flattening the curve to protect the health system from overload many people already knew this – why did they not think of this when voting to change path and go for a harder lock down?
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300023404/coronavirus-may-never-go-away-even-with-a-vaccine

We have flu vaccines and flu still kills about 500 people a year in NZ – who was so stupid they thought we’d be able to just lock down and get a vaccine quickly and that would be the virus eliminaded?
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May 29, 2020 8:45am
- All_on_Red
  
  ‘who was so stupid they thought we’d be able to just lock down and get a Vaccine’
  Jacinda?
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:57am
- MCos
  
  Last year about 1.35mil Kiwis took the opportunity to get the flu vaccine. Not even a third of the population.
  Furthermore there are a plethora of strains of flu out there (one of them Spanish flu, I believe), not all covered by the jab, so at best it’s around 80% effective. Consequently about 15% of the population got the flu, 500 of whom die! About 0.07%.
  
  I guessing here, but I would suggest that if an effective Covid-19 vaccine becomes available in NZ people will be beating down the doors of the local clinics to get a jab. (except the anti vaxxers)
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:28am
  - burt
    
    Right, so we have multiple strains that have lasted multiple decades but we’re going to eliminade covit by locking down. Right…..
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:01am
  - burt
    
    I guessing here, but I would suggest that if an effective Covid-19 vaccine becomes available in NZ people will be beating down the doors of the local clinics to get a jab.
    
    That’s if by the time it’s delivered the doors haven’t been pulled down years earlier and burnt for warmth by people living under bridges.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:50am
  - fernglas
    
    The potential uptake in the US of such a vaccine has been said to be about 50%.
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:13am
- Michael NZ
  
  Voted!
  
  I never was asked……
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:58am
  - burt
    
    Your memory is faulty comrade.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:01am
- kowtow
  
  Socialists are utopians. Under us all things will be perfect.
  
  Sadly 56% seem to think there is perfection.
  
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  May 29, 2020 11:18am
- Tony Stuart
  
  When the country voted to go for elimination rather than flattening the curve…
  
  I wasn’t aware we were given any choice in the matter burt.
  
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  May 29, 2020 12:28pm
  - burt
    
    Comrade, there was a vote and we all queued 2m apart in the rain and cast our votes. The country decided that elimination was better than flattening the curve. It’s a decision we all had a part in since it effected us all.
    
    How did you forget this – I hope you don’t think the decision was made by one person acting in their own self interest?
    
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    May 29, 2020 1:20pm
Maggie Pie

Everybody knows Newshub is in deep doodoo’s financially.
Heading home this morning, i couldn’t help but think there’s 7 ways, that if they implemented them, would turn their fortunes around.
1. Replace Duncan Garner on TV Breakfast with Ryan Bridge. Duncan possesses neither the sex – appeal, or delivery, that Ryan offers viewers.
2. Get rid of that guy Aziz. He gives my partner the willies.
3. Peter Williams on MagicTalk is abfab. Leave him exactly where he is.
4. Shorn Plunket’s sort of ok doing the noon till 4 slot, when he’s not away ill or sharing his personal problems . (Although anyone would be better than those other two sickly dorks over on 1ZB.)
5. Banksie to take over the’Drive Show’ full time (Masterstroke)
6. Duncan G. moves to 8 till midnight, up against the umming & ahhing shit-talking Marcus Lush (he’s totally lost it these days)
7. Leah Panapa to do midnight till dawn…(she would be great listening on nightshift)

Just saying.
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May 29, 2020 8:46am
- burt
  
  Alternately we could stop throwing tax payers money at them and let the listeners and viewers decide who stays rather than the PM with the tax payers eftpos card.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:51am
- Sacha
  
  Ryan Bridge? He was ok when he first started, but his ego has ballooned, and the pitch of his voice risen – and sometimes his youth betrays his ignorance.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:03am
- oldpark
  
  Yes bad enough the Kerre agony aunt of the morning show . Just when we thought it was safe to come out along comes the two agony uncles .What a couple of pestos . Shaun Plunket jury is still out on him . That is when he turns up for work .
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:15am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Banksy has aced the drive show recently. Ryan Bridge is sadly getting away on himself and turning it into a magazine chat show, getting very light and fluffy.
    
    I miss Larry Williams, and Heather DPA is just painful.
    
    Getting hard to find anything worth listening to!
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:30am
    - burt
      
      It’s OK, tax payers money will make sure that their ratings are inconsequential and the people most favoured by the piper, who calls the tune, remain.
      
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      May 29, 2020 11:19am
    - freethinker
      
      the deity – Try Pink Floyds The Wall – Berlin version an hour of pure enjoyment with subtle and accurate predictive messages. Think We don’t need no education – & mentally play it when Chris Hipkins waffles on TV. For more stimulation hear You cant hide your lyin eyes, when ardern is gobbing off.
      
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      May 29, 2020 1:26pm
- MCos
  
  It’s rating that pull in the do-re-me
  In that respect TV3 might as well replace Newshub with Country Calendar, which they could pinch off TV1.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:44am
  - Ruawai
    
    Country Calendar is mostly organic lifestyle blocks now in niche markets trying to sell their products by a bit of free marketing on TV.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:28am
    - MCos
      
      Whatever it is it’s the highest rating programme on TV.
      
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      May 29, 2020 3:24pm
- Miritu
  
  Why waste precious time following Newshub indoctrination when there is so much choice available by way of informative and intelligent podcasts.
  
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  May 29, 2020 10:17am
Durden

Another attempt to overreach by the beardy pundits based on their faulty models jst like the one used for Covid.. They want to have a veto against any “shovel ready” projects they think might affect de-carbonisation.

In the meantime the peasants can shut up and have gruel — no jobs only dole.

Sweet dreams (of revolution) are made of these.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/121652199/highcarbon-shovelready-projects-should-be-denied–commission
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May 29, 2020 8:58am
- cmm
  
  This is already creating a huge trough that will just get worse and will become less productive. We already have Woods and ner new hydrogen economy soaking up taxpayer modey and extremely unlikely to produce anything more substantial than a few PowerPoint slides.
  
  Shovel ready jobs are OKish so long as they build something of lasting value.
  
  Just shovelling stuff in random directions to make work is a complete waste.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:09am
  - Tall Man
    
    And yet we hear there will be redundancies on the “Transmission Gully” job.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:13am
    - Paulus
      
      Transmission Gully Engineers are mainly from Australia and are not being allowed back.
      
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      May 29, 2020 11:32am
      - Tall Man
        
        So much for the bubble.
        
        Avatar gets 1500 crew back in but not a roading project.
        
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        May 29, 2020 1:55pm
      - MCos
        
        Something of an exaggeration.
        “By last Tuesday, Immigration New Zealand had received 9,140 border exemption requests – 1478 were granted.”
        Some of those are to kick start stalled film productions.
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12333398
        
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        May 29, 2020 3:34pm
      - Tall Man
        
        Is that you “what’s in it for wynston”?
        
        https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-05-26/avatar-crew-let-into-new-zealand-covid19-restrictions-border/12288482
        
        Got a mate on the crew.
        
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        May 29, 2020 9:28pm
- Tall Man
  
  Sounds like they need to get their arses up on my roof and do a bit of chimney cleaning.
  
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  May 29, 2020 10:13am
cmm

Should we really be putting effort into pronouncing Maori words “correctly”?

I don’t think so.

Once a word from Maori has been adopted into English, it becomes an English word and it is up to the English speakers how they want to pronounce that word.

That is the way it has always been when adopting words across languages.

When English people talk of Paris they don’t say Pahree (unless they are affected knobheads). They say Paris. Same to with the pronounciation of thousands of place names: Johannesburg, Munich, … as well as objects and food etc.

When Zulu people needed a Zulu word for fork, something unseen before, they adopted the English “fork”. However that was isiZulu-ised to “foloko”.

What’s “Pirihimana”? A Maori-isation of policeman. When Maori adopted this word they get to redefine it.

So what is wrong with English speakers saying Towpoe or koomara?
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May 29, 2020 9:06am
- Mike
  
  There is nothing super-wring with that. However, you may have noticed that some politicians get regular criticism on Kiwiblog for their pronunciation of English words. So, for some at least, correct pronunciation seems to matter.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:15am
  - cmm
    
    My point is that the same basic word has different pronunciations in different languages.
    
    Within a language you keep the correct pronunciation.
    
    If you’re speaking French, then say Pahree. In English say Paris.
    
    If you’re speaking Maori then say pirihimana, in English say police.
    
    In English there is no poverdee, eliminade etc.
    
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    May 29, 2020 9:55am
    - Mike
      
      That rule seems logical, but it has no relation to how languages actually work, are used, and develop overtime.
      
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      May 29, 2020 10:10am
- MT_Tinman
  
  I can only comment about myself but I put exactly the same effort into pronouncing stone-age as they do correctly pronouncing English.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:18am
  - Ruawai
    
    Don’t arks me.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:30am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Can you be more pacific?
      
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      May 29, 2020 11:33am
      - Pharmachick
        
        Surely youse aren’t serious
        
        (I am serious, and don’t call me Shirley…)
        
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        May 29, 2020 3:39pm
- Odakyu-sen
  
  It’s all about the assertion of power and control.
  If I can force you to say words in the way that I dictate they be said, then I exert a form of dominance over you and induce you to defer to me for approval in various matters. In other words, you become dependent upon me to “give my approval” to you for your actions.
  You are no longer a free man.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:30am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Well done.
    
    I have never had my Maori pronunciation corrected by a Maori when speaking to them (unless I had specifically asked to hear their rendition of a word).
    
    In contrast, I can recall at least 6 occasions that a pakeha (with limited te reo fluency) has attempted to correct my pronunciation of Maori words.
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:46am
    - Pharmachick
      
      Agreed Maggy. Although I have been corrected on certain words that are now taught differently as “Standard Māori” that I learned as a different dialect (having learned the language in the early 1980s from a speaker who learned it from his family down Whanganui way, still in the oral tradition).
      
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      May 29, 2020 3:14pm
- alphabeatrium
  
  I like this. Next time someone pulls me up for mispronunciation (and I only really do it for words and placenames that are well-established in NZ vernacular English, e.g. Towpoe/Taupō), I’ll simply ask them how they pronounce Paris. Masterstroke.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:57am
  - kowtow
    
    I’m going on holiday to Majorca. (J pronounced)
    
    No , no , no , the J is silent in Majorca.
    
    When are you going ?
    
    In ‘une and ‘uly.
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:26am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      My wife’s going on holiday to Indonesia…
      
      Jakarta?
      
      No, she’s flying. Last year she went to the West Indies…
      
      Jamaica?
      
      No, it was her decision…
      
      Boom, boom 😀
      
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      May 29, 2020 12:32pm
      - jonno1
        
        ‘My name’s Mark Knopfler, but the k is silent’. ‘Thanks for clearing that up Mar’.
        
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        May 29, 2020 1:17pm
- Michael NZ
  
  CMM
  I don’t, I do my best.
  I am not going to learn Maori, it is useless in Europe OZ and USA where I used to travel to.
  It is useless here.
  
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  May 29, 2020 10:01am
  - burt
    
    You might regret this decision when you’re on a hospital waiting list for years and the only thing stopping you from getting treatment is your skin colour and your inability to speak a special privilege language.
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:30am
- burt
  
  Once a word from Maori has been adopted into English, it becomes an English word and it is up to the English speakers how they want to pronounce that word.
  
  I disagree with that, and anyone who has a name that is incorrect when pronounced based only on English phonetics would probably also disagree with you.
  
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  May 29, 2020 11:13am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Most NZers (and Taiwanese) with zilch knowledge of East-European languages pronounce my (married) surname as…
    
    was- lif or wassil-if…..
    
    I can usually recognize that they are referring to me…
    (but once nearly missed a call-out at Taoyuan Airport as I didn’t recognize the pronunciation of my name…. my daughter did, though).
    
    (Va-see-lee-iv)
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:43am
lastmanstanding

A government that passes draconian laws as this government has done doesnt trust its citizens.

They in turn are fools if they trust their government.
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May 29, 2020 9:07am
- cmm
  
  Do you trust your livestock?
  
  No, I bet you have fences.
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:27am
  - Tall Man
    
    That’s to keep the nasties out not the goodies in 😉
    
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    May 29, 2020 10:11am
    - Harriet
      
      You mean like Troy?
      
      Asking for a friend. 😎
      
      4 1
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      May 29, 2020 11:24am
    - freethinker
      
      Tall Man – A good mains electric fence pulser works wonders for the uninvited night time visitors.
      
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      May 29, 2020 1:37pm
KevO'Brien

Is our present law constitutionally lawful?
https://www.nzcpr.com/democracy-under-threat/#more-32240
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May 29, 2020 9:40am
JibberJabber

‘Quarantine’ is when you restrict the movement of sick people.
‘Tyranny’ is when you restrict the movement of healthy people.
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May 29, 2020 9:41am
- Michael NZ
  
  Very Good Jibber Jabber
  I will pinch that for a TShirt for the next Summer.
  
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  May 29, 2020 10:05am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Before the Election is a better time
    
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    May 29, 2020 11:36am
    - burt
      
      Go hard and early, start wearing it after March 15th next year.
      
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      May 29, 2020 11:45am
- MCos
  
  Wrong. If your were to add ‘potentially’ in front of ‘sick people’ you’d be pretty much on the mark.
  
  quarantine
  /ˈkwɒrəntiːn/
  noun
  a state, period, or place of isolation in which people or animals that have arrived from elsewhere or been exposed to infectious or contagious disease are placed.
  
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  May 29, 2020 3:45pm
I remember when

Are Political Donations really the big problem they once were?
Has the use of social media made the traditional forms of advertising far less influential?
In fact should use of social media be given a value in the same way donations are at present?
Is the biggest political influence in fact social media?
4 2
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May 29, 2020 9:47am
I remember when

Burt @ 8.55am
I now wonder was Winston’s poor performance in the Leaders’ responses to the Budget because he didn’t want to hold his notes and does he really need glasses?
11 0
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May 29, 2020 9:51am
- Tall Man
  
  Maybe he didn’t want to look like a nervous geisha holding a fan.
  
  I tried to find a video/gif for that comment and I’m sure you can all guess what popped up !!!!
  
  6 2
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  May 29, 2020 10:10am
niggly

Anti-government graffiti has appeared:

KINDNESS KILLS
-Anon 2020
18 0
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May 29, 2020 9:57am
- Ruawai
  
  Have a look at this poster advertising Arderns Aroha (love) compared to Stalins Truth poster.
  https://www.facebook.com/nznpmwg/posts/897961037283172
  
  9 0
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  May 29, 2020 10:50am
  - burt
    
    Read Animal Farm, all is explained.
    
    10 0
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    May 29, 2020 11:43am
- burt
  
  Are NZTA still running election advertising with “Be Kind” on the road signs ? I’ve not seem any in the last few days.
  
  2 0
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  May 29, 2020 1:36pm
Maggie Pie

We watched that vid on CNN this morning of African – American George Floyd being restrained by a white Minneapolis cop.
As my partner said, nothing screams “black lives matter” better than a stolen 60″ flat screen.
8 1
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May 29, 2020 10:33am
- burt
  
  Burning down a lower socioeconomic housing development has got to be the crowning glory of own goals.
  
  14 0
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  May 29, 2020 10:47am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    One of my twitter besties tweets….
    
    https://twitter.com/CassandraRules/status/1266051039939178496
    
    5 0
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    May 29, 2020 10:54am
Fletch

So the govt is going to spend $700 million on our waterways, which include oppressive restrictions that farmers will have to implement and follow. Is now really the time to push this? Our two main forms of income in this country are tourism and the farming industry. Tourism is dead at the moment, and Labour seem intent on hobbling farming as well.

It’s the same all over the world. Liberals are intent on using the virus as an excuse to push pet projects or advance their agenda.
25 5
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May 29, 2020 10:44am
- chukar
  
  Fletch,
  This Government just can’t help themselves, they love bullying and stealing productive New Zealanders output.
  See the little red hen morphing into a deceased golden goose
  
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  May 29, 2020 9:49pm
Fletch

ps, Just look in the US where Dems are trying to push voting by mail, which has already been abused. About 20 South Carolina absentee ballots were found in Maryland last week. In Nevada unclaimed mail-in ballots were piling up outside apartment complexes and in trash cans. Thousands are sitting in crates. And that’s not open to abuse?

https://www.foxnews.com/media/nevada-adam-laxalt-mail-in-voting-election-fraud

In LA County, 112% are registered to vote, and ballots will obviously be sent to all. It’s another chance for the Dems to cheat, and they will.
15 1
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May 29, 2020 10:46am
MH

And they didn’t have an analog watch with hands on. is that tautology?
3 0
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May 29, 2020 10:59am
I remember when

Is it only me and is it an addiction?
Do you find yourself sitting/standing with the phone to the ear listening to covid-19 messages, messages about what to do if it is a medical emergency or systems produced music?
Apart from personal calls to people you know have you ever, or can you remember when you, had a person answer your call.
Is it now compulsory that you wait, listen to instructions, get advise on where you are in the queue (remember when you stood in queues not waited on line in them), listen to music. Listen to music being interrupted to advise you on covid-19 instructions, receive advice on online internet option to your call, return to music.
Will we eventually have a robot at our end of the phone to ring us when our call has a person on the other end!
10 1
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May 29, 2020 11:34am
- krazykiwi
  
  I called PBT transport recently to enquire about transporting a bulky item. The first minute of the call was Covid-19 messaging most of which I understood. But when the message exhorted me to “… be kind…” I hung up. Another company got my business. PBT take note.
  
  8 0
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  May 29, 2020 2:05pm
- greybeard
  
  Those Covid-19 radio advertisements are beginning to sound like Soviet-era propaganda announcements over street loudspeakers.
  
  1 0
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  May 29, 2020 7:49pm
Captain Mainwaring

Has anyone caught up with Heather Simpson’s report on the DHB’s? Apparently it’s fairly damning but has not been made public.
15 0
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May 29, 2020 11:40am
- burt
  
  Most transparent government ever!
  
  9 1
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  May 29, 2020 11:44am
  - Tall Man
    
    Yep, you can see right through the lying bastards.
    
    13 2
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    May 29, 2020 11:57am
  - Nickc2
    
    We (taxpayers) paid for it, it belongs to us and we should be able to see it! If the government wishes to hide such reports, they should pay for them out of their own (party) funds IMHO.
    
    6 0
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    May 29, 2020 2:32pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I thought David Clark is refusing to accept it.
  My singular focus is on the health response to Covid-19,” said Clark. “I have advised Heather Simpson I won’t receive her report anytime in the near future as I don’t want any resources diverted from the Covid response.”
  
  Too much work for him?
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/120761572/government-fends-off-major-health-system-review-to-avoid-distraction-from-covid19
  
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  May 29, 2020 4:55pm
kevn

@Captn…. Oh, that. Under the carpet along with all the dirt?
8 0
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May 29, 2020 11:42am
I remember when

Incidentally.
If a covid-19 vaccine becomes available in the next couple of months we will be in exactly the same position as the Swedes.
There will have been limited benefit in our relative courses of action.
5 1
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May 29, 2020 11:44am
- Pharmachick
  
  “If a covid-19 vaccine becomes available in the next couple of months… “…
  
  It won’t, so don’t get too worked up about that one.
  
  3 0
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  May 29, 2020 3:29pm
- MCos
  
  “If a covid-19 vaccine becomes available in the next couple of months… “
  
  It probably won’t be a vaccine that deters Covid-19.
  
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  May 29, 2020 3:55pm
I remember when

When the news was wall to wall covid-19 and nothing but covid-19 the Governments actions looked fine.
When it was growing numbers of cases being added to the number already accumulated the Governments actions looked even better.
The ever increasing number of deaths and horror stories of the dangers of covid-19 made the Government look great.
When the media is full of wall to wall story about the economy how is the Government going to look?
News will be about increasing numbers of businesses fighting to continue trading or becoming bankrupt. How will the Government look then?
Will the increasing number of people losing their jobs, competing with those already jobless and those who have returned home, make to the Government look fine, even better or great?
11 1
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May 29, 2020 11:57am
Maggie Pie

PULLING NO PUNCHES : OUT 2nd JULY 😀

I’ve just ordered 3 signed copies online from Unity Books

https://twitter.com/JudithCollinsMP/status/1265821489720221696
7 0
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May 29, 2020 11:58am
- burt
  
  Better buy it quickly before it’s banned for not having the right racial mix of people on the front cover.
  
  7 1
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  May 29, 2020 12:01pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    My partners gun club is selling these Tee-Shirts…
    
    BLACK OLIVES MATTER
    
    😀
    
    11 0
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    May 29, 2020 12:41pm
    - Tall Man
      
      You’ll keep.
      
      https://media.tenor.com/images/624a38e48c94fe4dc02e0ee17463e0e0/tenor.gif
      
      This is what a real greeny looks like.
      
      1 0
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      May 29, 2020 2:00pm
  - stigie
    
    And Willie Jackson will be the first in to buy one !~
    … [OTT, sorry. Mod.] !!
    
    4 0
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    May 29, 2020 12:51pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I’ll buy a copy for my Bookgroup…they’ll never forgive me.
  
  3 0
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  May 29, 2020 5:07pm
oldfella

So, while nasty, communist, yukky China plans to make it an offense for anyone to mock their national anthem, the much nicer liberal, tolerant EU is going to throw people in jail for burning the EU flag which they have now labelled a ‘hate crime’. (Thank goodness for Brexit.)
https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2020/05/15/germany-declares-burning-eu-flag-a-hate-crime-punishable-by-three-years-in-prison/
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May 29, 2020 12:15pm
Tall Man

This was the image that accompanied Adam Creighton’s article on ardern’s destruction of our economy.

https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/86f51e62bfd694ce27880d7f6cbf66f2

Rather apt I thought.
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May 29, 2020 12:23pm
greybeard

I hear a fair bit these days about working from home. Apparently many people are intending to continue the practice, if not 5 days per week then maybe 3 or 4 days. Reasons vary: no travel, near to family, more productive (??) , reduced costs, fewer meetings etc etc.
OK, I agree that they would save travel costs and maybe parking fees, as well as the actual time taken to commute if that is what they normally do.
But there are downsides to this, especially if lots of office workers and government employees are involved.

– companies and government departments end up with buildings which suddenly become too big, and they may choose to ( or have to ) move into smaller premises thereby causing a sudden change in the commercial real estate supply and demand ( Wellington would be a good example of this ).

– businesses associated with supplying offices will have reduced orders

– coffee bars, cafes and other food outlets suddenly find their patronage has almost disappeared overnight
( Wellington would be a good example of this too).

– public transport loses many users. Transport companies base their supply of buses and trains on the current passenger volumes and expect these volumes to increase, not decrease.
A lot of ratepayer and taxpayer money is currently invested in public transport infrastructure, buses and rail rolling stock and staffing.

– if fewer cars and buses are on the roads then roading projects may have to be re-evaluated as lower volumes could change the cost-benefit ratio.

– fewer cars = less fuel required, therefore a direct effect of petrol stations & their staff

– fewer cars = fewer carparks required ( see article on Wilson Carparking in today’s Stuff )

– use of private homes for business, particularly government business, may have some ramifications as far as IRD is concerned. It may also have ramifications as far as property insurance is concerned.

– the speed, reliability and especially the security of the various internet providers will be tested

These were my initial thoughts, no doubt I have missed a lot of things.
I do have doubts about the “increased productivity” bit. This depends a lot on the honesty and integrity of the worker at home, as the temptation to go and do your own thing instead of working must be strong at times. Maybe the government will come up with an app for that………….
5 1
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May 29, 2020 12:36pm
artemisia

Bit of a bunfight in Gisborne about council voting not to consult iwi about Endeavour (replacement) replica. Councillor Meredith Akuhata-Brown is stunned and shocked.

Nothing to do with this, then …

“Last year’s Tuia 250 commemorations, which saw a life-sized replica Endeavour sail around the country, prompted protests and saw Gisborne iwi refuse to allow it to be used during commemorations.”

Chttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/121665644/vote-to-erect-endeavour-replicas-in-gisborne-without-iwi-consultation-stuns-councillor
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May 29, 2020 12:55pm
cmm

Oes, noes, CV19 won’t ever go away. Even if there’s a vaccine.
Be Frightened! Keep the Stazi!

Geez, get these things in context. We still have H1N1. We still have HK flu. We don’t live in our basements for that. No need to do so with CV19 either.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300023404/coronavirus-may-never-go-away-even-with-a-vaccine
8 1
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May 29, 2020 1:16pm
- burt
  
  cmm
  
  Neve will want to travel one day so we won’t stay locked down forever.
  
  7 1
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  May 29, 2020 1:31pm
Libertarians are right

Stuff has an article by Elspeth Tilley comparing breaching someone’s 2m area to rape.

The new ownership is onto a winner for sure!
11 0
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May 29, 2020 1:23pm
- Inandout
  
  Lib, this Tilley woman is so educated.
  ‘Cultural Studies, Theatre, Performance Theory, Communication, Ethics’.
  
  7 0
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  May 29, 2020 2:59pm
- alex Masterley
  
  She teaches, if that is the correct word, at Massey University. Enough said.
  
  6 0
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  May 29, 2020 3:35pm
burt

Should we just resign from 5-eyes now or shall we wait to be kicked out?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/121667644/new-zealand-missing-in-five-eyes-condemnation-of-beijing-over-hong-kong-security-law
14 0
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May 29, 2020 1:29pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  5 eyes works, it is just the transparent Govt thinks the intelligence is not in the public interest.
  They knew and they lied
  
  4 1
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  May 29, 2020 2:31pm
RW Capitalist

Are the govt. that desperate?
Got this from my bank today.
Hi
On 31 March 2020, we deducted your Resident Withholding Tax from the interest you earned. Unfortunately, due to a system error we deducted less than the amount due.
We’ve now deducted the remaining tax
We are required to deduct your full tax payment. To do so, we deducted the remaining amount of $0.01 from your interest-bearing account, ending in suffix 50. We made this deduction between 17 and 18 April, which will appear on your statement as TAX CORRECTION 01/04/2020.

We apologise for this inconvenience. Please be assured we have corrected our system to prevent this happening again.
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May 29, 2020 1:48pm
- Inandout
  
  RW, I am astounded and hurt; no kia ora, just Hi.
  
  6 0
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  May 29, 2020 3:01pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Still have a check that IRD sent to my Father in the late 60’s. Six cents
  
  7 0
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  May 29, 2020 3:03pm
lifesgood

It appears milky has changed his name to Mike
8 1
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May 29, 2020 1:49pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  And he never even told us – how rude
  
  6 0
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  May 29, 2020 3:04pm
- Mike
  
  I logged in with Patreon. For some reason, that way makes my user name Mike.
  
  1 0
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  May 29, 2020 7:16pm
Nickc2

I don’t think a Pussy Cat whimper from Peters is going to mean anything to China. China has Cindy in their pocket and they are well aware they can really screw NZ’s economy (if Cindy hasn’t done it) any time they like.
As for NZ’s place in the 5-Eyes agreement, I believe all info we receive is already being censured by Australia who are a trusted ally of the US.
We (NZ) blotted our copybook with the US years ago under that arch Communist David Lange.
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May 29, 2020 2:17pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Hey PTPM. Got something for you, and all of your sycophants. This will be on play school TV1 news at 6pm right? Liz Wheeler on WHO and their friends.
Lefties, don’t get triggered with the truth.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nADYnnL-JUs
3 1
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May 29, 2020 2:29pm
kevn

You wouldn’t want to be first up for this rushed, lightly tested vaccine that is in the pipeline…
1 0
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May 29, 2020 2:31pm
surfing

Chinese are teaching the US a little lesson about who benefits most when you export your manufacturing base….services sector is all very nice, but, manufacturing is still king when it comes to a scrap!! The US will ultimately be victorious though because a democracy produces creators and innovators. As opposed to the communist-style system where people are automatons.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12335755

“Beijing warned the US would “suffer the most” if a financial trade war between the two countries were to grow.

“If a financial war spirals out of control, it is the US that will suffer the most. With its real economy shrinking, the US economy is largely relying on the financial sector, which means launching a financial war equals self-harm.

“The Chinese people are pragmatic and hardworking. We have constructed a comprehensive manufacturing system and built the technological ability to make breakthroughs. We also have a vast market. Hardly can such a country be isolated and contained.”
“
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May 29, 2020 2:38pm
- Peter S
  
  China forgets it is in real trouble real quick if people stop buying their manufactured goods. They don’t have the domestic market to sustain themselves, and they spend all their export earnings.
  
  Think of it as being like your local shop picking a fight with you.
  You might have to go without some things, but you can usually pick up the essentials elsewhere in the short term, and there will always be another shop that will find a way to supply the other stuff eventually.
  Shops need customers more than customers need any particular shop.
  
  China has a huge trade surplus with the US and the world in general, so it is vulnerable.
  Just look at what happened to our log exports when China stopped buying and turn it round to China’s manufacturing base if the US and other markets stop buying.
  
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  May 29, 2020 5:37pm
info@cruzpro.com

Easy way for the government to decrease the cost for businesses that import goods while saving the government money at the same time…

Stop charging GST on imports to businesses that are GST registered. We get the GST back anyway!

Right now the system requires us to hire a customs broker to process imported goods through customs and customs charges us GST. We then have to file a GST return to get the money back.

Seems like a lot of effort for zero gain.
3 1
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May 29, 2020 3:08pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Poker. Trump has raised Twitter, CNN (fact checker) and Washington Post (fact checker)
Would you play Poker with this man? He owns Casinos for fuck’s sake
8 1
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May 29, 2020 3:41pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  It is not the money for Trump, it is the level playing field and dealing shit to your enemies.
  
  6 1
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  May 29, 2020 3:44pm
- Mike
  
  Did you say he bankrupts casinos?
  
  0 0
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  May 29, 2020 7:13pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/121670130/i-was-on-an-adventure-teen-who-crossed-cook-strait-in-dinghy-speaks-out

What a self-obsessed entitled little shit.
Send him the bill.
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May 29, 2020 5:36pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/121672141/nido-new-zealands-largest-homewares-store-to-open-in-henderson
And how much will be Chinese rubbish ?
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May 29, 2020 6:56pm
- Tall Man
  
  How much won’t be?
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:48pm
Harriet

Muller will pump Australia between now and the election as that is where ALL your immediate gains are going to come from.
And with the China matter, manufacturing and the US, Australia will be CENTRAL for the next term of the NZ government. And business know it.

And so to does Scott Morrison. And who do you think he will want on his side? 😎
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May 29, 2020 7:05pm
- Tall Man
  
  You’re a bit confusing there Harriet but I want a stronger relationship between NZ & Oz.
  
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  May 29, 2020 8:47pm
niggly

Heh and WTF all rolled into one article!

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/05/kiwi-lefties-pile-on-british-writer-who-praised-nz-and-jacinda-ardern.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Sounds like the far-left also don’t like the adulation of the Cult of Ardern???
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May 29, 2020 8:16pm
RightNow

I accidentally went to some clickbait site called newshub. Everything began with “Revealed” but it turned out it was never hidden. They quoted some tweets.
I hope I didn’t get a virus from it
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May 29, 2020 10:44pm

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