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April 27, 2020 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 27 April 2020

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General Debate

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PhilBest

Someone has forwarded me a PDF of an excellent analysis by Don Brash that does not seem to be posted online anywhere. Glad to know if any others know of it. Page 1 below:

HAVE WE BEEN CONNED?
Perhaps it is dangerous to write about such a fast-moving situation as the Covid-19 pandemic when what I write may not be published for 10 days or more, but at time of writing my strong impression is that the public believe that the Government has done a remarkably good job of suppressing, perhaps even eliminating, the spread of Covid-19 in New Zealand, and that they deserve warm applause. I believe the public has been conned.
To begin with, in common with most of the countries in Europe and North America but quite unlike the countries of East Asia, the New Zealand Government was very slow to take the virus seriously. Despite the Ministry of Health issuing a statement in late January talking of the extremely serious threat posed by the disease, the Government did little or nothing to prepare for its arrival on our shores for more than a month. By contrast, and perhaps because they had had experience of the SARS epidemic some years ago, countries like South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore and Hong Kong swung swiftly into action with far-reaching testing and tracing. As a result, for example, Taiwan – geographically and economically much closer to the source of the virus in China than New Zealand – has vastly few total Covid19 cases than New Zealand has had. Indeed, on a per capita basis, New Zealand has had some 17 times as many cases as Taiwan has had. As late as the middle of March, there had been no suggestion that the very large public ceremony to mark the anniversary of the Christchurch massacre would be cancelled, even though a crowded public event would have been the perfect way of spreading the virus…
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April 27, 2020 8:01am
- PhilBest
  
  Further excerpts:
  
  “…On 23 March, the Prime Minister announced that two days later the country
  was moving into an Alert Level 4 lockdown for four weeks. We had to do this,
  we were told, because otherwise “tens of thousands” of New Zealanders
  would die from the disease and our hospital system – especially the availability
  of ICU hospital beds – would be overwhelmed. Yes, there would an economic
  cost it was acknowledged, but faced with a choice between saving lives and
  worrying about dollars, the Prime Minister was clear that she placed a higher
  value on lives saved than on dollars.
  
  Has it worked? Superficially yes. The number of new cases yesterday (I’m
  writing on 18 April) was just eight, only 14 people were in hospital, and only
  three were in ICU beds. Only 11 people have died from the virus. Perhaps we
  could even look forward to the day when New Zealand has no cases of Covid19, and we can all get back to work, though with our international borders
  permanently closed, or at least closed until an effective vaccine is discovered
  and deployed.
  
  But very serious questions must be asked.
  
  First, it is now clear that “tens of thousands of deaths” were never likely. Yes,
  some of the projections made by epidemiologists at Otago University
  suggested that deaths could rise to between 8,600 and 14,400 – not exactly
  “tens of thousands” but certainly a very large number – but those numbers
  assumed that the Ministry of Health would abandon its trace, test and isolate
  strategy…
  
  Second, it also seems clear that Australia has had fewer cases of Covid-19 than
  New Zealand has had, on a per capita basis, despite having a much more
  relaxed attitude to “lock-down”.
  
  Third, without exception all those who have died of Covid-19 in New Zealand
  are people who were over 70 (and most were over 80), all with one or more
  other serious “health issues”. While clearly overseas experience confirms that
  younger people can die of Covid-19, it appears that in other countries too
  those who have succumbed to the virus have overwhelmingly been over 70,
  and overwhelmingly people with other health issues. At no time has our
  hospital system even looked like being overwhelmed, and typically no more
  than three or four ICU beds have been occupied at one time – of the several
  hundred ICU beds which either are, or could quickly be, available…
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:06am
  - PhilBest
    
    “…More serious still is the fact that the Prime Minister seems to think that by locking the economy down tightly she is showing that she cares more about lives than about dollars. If she imagines for a single moment that locking the economy down tightly has no effect on lives lost she is even less well informed than I had imagined. We all know that four weeks of isolation in our respective bubbles has seen a marked spike in domestic violence. We can guess that seeing a business that one has spent years or decades building up destroyed in the course of a few weeks has led to an increase in suicide. And suddenly being unable to bring home a wage or salary will be having a similarly devastating effect on the mental health and lives of many tens of thousands of employees.
    
    Professor John Gibson, one of New Zealand’s leading academic economists, has drawn attention to the fact that life expectancy is to some extent a function of real GDP per capita….there can be little doubt that severely locking down much of the economy will have cost a great many lives, and very probably many more than the lives lost to Covid-19 to date. As the Prime Minister must surely know, every time the Government decides to spend money on improving road safety, or increasing the Pharmac budget, or increasing the school lunch programme, they are implicitly (and often explicitly) calculating how many dollars they are willing to spend to save a life…”
    
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    April 27, 2020 8:08am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      “As the Prime Minister must surely know,….”
      
      Well there’s your problem.
      
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      April 27, 2020 8:48am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      The lockdown is affecting high schoolers too. It’s now sleep most of the day and play all night. We have tried hard to modify that tendency for youth but all that past work has been undone. College attendance will be affected.
      Societies cannot be turned on and off like taps. Does the COL believe they can have an instant restart of our international tourism industry? Those businesses affected will have very hard times ahead. Massive uncertainties have bee created for the future for all NZ commercial activity.
      Have the COL destroyed more lives than they have potentially saved?
      
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      April 27, 2020 8:54am
      - igm
        
        Listening to unionists CoL have fulfilled their pledge to totally stuff business and take away their bargaining powers.
        Ardern is a communist and will leave no stone unturned to make this either a caliphate or socialist state.
        She is dangerous because she is out of her depth, out of control, and possibly out of her mind!
        
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        April 27, 2020 9:02am
      - Close Hen Counters
        
        I don’t think for a minute, that brainless PM has thought about the effect of incarcerating our children, the kids who will be paying the price for this for years to come – I saw Tracey Martin on tv last night waxing off about the safety of seniors now they have more freedom in quasi level four but our children are still not at school, not with their mates, not doing their sport
        
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        April 27, 2020 9:34am
    - tf78
      
      To quote Greta – Jacinda ” You have stolen our dreams”, it’s outrageous what this government have done just for Jacinda to try and look good on the world stage. Well in my opinion she is a two bit actress just like Megan Sparkle.
      
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      April 27, 2020 8:55am
    - Warren Murray
      
      Thanks Phil.
      
      Is there any more ?
      
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      April 27, 2020 8:59am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      “every time the Government decides to spend money on improving road safety, or increasing the Pharmac budget, or increasing the school lunch programme, they are implicitly (and often explicitly) calculating how many dollars they are willing to spend to save a life…”
      
      I, along with a few economists, have been saying this for several weeks. Did the Government receive any advice on the net benefits of these actions? Chanting “every life matters” is delusional. Our health system, pharmac, and transport system are all funded on the basis of “every life is costed”. The government through its agent pharmac effectively tells many young women with ovarian or breast cancer that we are not going to extend your life for a couple of years because it is not cost effective. It is that brutal.
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:00am
    - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
      
      Then there is this:
      
      https://spectator.org/flattening-the-curve-and-other-lies/
      
      Is it time to break out the tar and feathers yet?
      
      The socialists have created another “expert” driven crisis, and this time they have spooked us into involuntary Home Detention and destroyed the economy.
      
      Because China lied, and socialists saw this as a great opportunty to push the same doomsday models that predicted we would all die of Mad Cow, SARS, Birdflu, etc etc. The same models that predicted Y2K, Peak Oil, and with only a little manipulation gave us the infamous “hockey stick” that “proved” global warming (and accidentally eliminated the Medieval Warm period).
      
      So when the rubble settles, and we discover that we have killed our economy, terrified our children, and trashed our rights and liberties for “hugs”. Who do we hold to account?
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:12am
      - oldgolfer
        
        I know. J Ardern and Robertson.
        
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        April 27, 2020 10:12am
      - Don Beckett
        
        “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.” – Ben Franklin.
        
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        April 27, 2020 11:20am
    - Unity
      
      Don Brash’s comments mirror my thoughts exactly. I had been wondering whether I had been out of step with regard to doubting our glorious Leader and her actions. It is obvious we are going to suffer many times more than if she had perhaps followed Australia’s lead. There is been a gross over-reaction and I’m sure this will become more and more obvious as time passes. I feel so much for those who are going to lose their livelihoods and face poverty like they have never faced before.
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:16am
      - michael_s2
        
        Whoops. Sorry about fat finger on downtick.
        
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        April 27, 2020 9:48am
      - euro2019
        
        As a Fish n Chips Shop Assistant you barely can’t do such decisions.
        Hope people of NZ wake up to this fact, the sooner the better.
        Just wait another few months then it will show the full impact of the economy driven to the wall.
        Once the people are not getting any money for doing nothing and lesser jobs to go may be then they will wake up.
        
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        April 27, 2020 11:00am
      - theoldbloke
        
        Its interesting that everyone glibly flings around the
        “”Listen to the experts”” phrase.
        
        I am reminded regularly that everyday there are Experts on a subject having different views.
        I refer of course to lawyers.
        One for and one against a particular set of facts.
        
        I think best summed up by a deep but rational thinker Thomas Sowell.
        
        Thomas Sowell
        
        For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert, but for every fact there is not necessarily an equal and opposite fact.
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:07pm
    - Tony Stuart
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      Talking to yourself again Phil?
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:25am
      - mister nui
        
        Pot meet kettle. You’re one of the most incessant vainglorious posters here, who more often than not says sweet f^ck all.
        
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        April 27, 2020 9:45am
    - Justitia
      
      @PhilBest: thank you for these excerpts. Is there any way the whole document can be shared through this blog or elsewhere online?
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:36am
      - PhilBest
        
        I’m trying to find out from the person who sent it to me. DPF would have Don’s contact details surely though.
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:18pm
    - Ruawai
      
      For some weird reason the Govt were saying we were behind the rest of the world timing wise for CV19, which was why our numbers were low, but there is no reason we would be behind the world. People were traveling to and from NZ at the same time they were traveling to and from Wuhan, Italy USA etc just in lower numbers but probably proportional to the population. We were lower for other reasons.
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:15am
      - JackRabbit
        
        We are ahead of many other countries.
        
        https://miro.medium.com/max/2160/1*27KXU8KJRylYOHw747GEzw.png
        
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        April 27, 2020 1:48pm
      - Liberty
        
        Low population and towns and houses spread apart.
        April has been very warm and sunny.
        Districts such as Westcoast, Tasman, Nelson , and Marlborough
        And an area larger than Belgium.
        Has had only has 39 cases. Might have been nil if Dear Leader had sealed the border. .
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:13pm
      - Australis
        
        It was high summer here. Ozone hole … lots of ultra violet rays
        
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        April 27, 2020 7:39pm
    - Ruahine
      
      Thanks for all the informative posts PhilBest.
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:20am
    - Allan
      
      They have just condemned around 1400 cancer patients to an earlier death because of Pharmac withdrawing funding of Keytruda stating that they the money that had been allocated had been used up during the current debacle.
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:25pm
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Don Brash – Nobody reads anything he writes. Move on bro. Post something Cindy has written. That is hot news.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:42am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    Well, that makes me a nobody. But people call me a “nobody” because nobody’s perfect.
    
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    April 27, 2020 8:57am
  - PhilBest
    
    Actually you deserve upticks for satire but in this time, Poe’s Law is in action. It is impossible to satirize sycophancy that has achieved levels of absurdity already.
    
    IMHO, Don Brash and what he says, is akin to how Charles DeGaulle’s utterances would have been regarded in Vichy France in 1941. How dare he insinuate that we lost a war and are ignominiously “Occupied”!
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:01am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Your priorities are wrong.
    You prefer a dullard, immature, unmarried mother selected as a socialist flag bearer PM, to a proven, capable, retired statesman and internationally recognised former Governor of the Reserve Bank.
    
    No wonder this country has political problems.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:10am
    - Batman
      
      The only problem, Kev, is that Brash has already been rejected by the electorate and the National Party.
      
      He’s not a good politician.
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:10pm
      - KevO'Brien
        
        Brash doesn’t have to be a politician–he’s served NZ well as already. Some people lead from the sides.
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:49pm
      - thirteenstars
        
        By reject you would be referring to the 2005 election where National was considered by Labour to be so likely to win that Clark & Co. came up with the student loan interest write off policy, completely out of the blue, just weeks before the election, that reportedly had state employees and other government supporters celebrating in their cubicles not because they stood to benefit from the write-off but because they knew it would shift the polls in Clark’s favour?
        
        That Don Brash? Not bad for a non-politician. More of them, I say. If not for the most bald-faced election bribe in NZ history he’d have been PM.
        
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        April 27, 2020 2:52pm
  - Gravelroad
    
    Well it might be news Sidekick, if she actually wrote anything.
    She can talk, but can she write?
    I get the impression that all her outpourings are written for her by a small army of activists and spinners flat out in a dark office somewhere.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:15am
    - notreadyet
      
      Agree, all those pronouncements from the alter are definetly not written by her, evidenced by the jargon that get put in them, words never appearing in her vocabulary previously. She has the gift of the gab but her diction is like the sound of fingernails on a blackboard
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:42am
  - Unity
    
    Don Brash is the voice of reason. He says what many people are thinking. I don’t know why he is vilified so much.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:17am
    - Benedict Yu
      
      Don Brash came close to being Prime Minister in 2005. New Zealand would be a more prosperous country today if that had happened. His prescription for “closing the gap” with Australia is still archived on the Treasury website. It still resonates today.
      
      There is now a real risk that New Zealand will head down the same road as Argentina.
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:40am
      - septic skeptic
        
        Brash would have got far more done in 3 years than Key did in nine.
        
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        April 27, 2020 10:00am
      - Colville
        
        septic.
        Possibly, but it would have all been undone in the next 3 years and Labour would have been in for 9 yrs on the backlash.
        
        Centerist NZ is just very soft left… sad but true.
        
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        April 27, 2020 10:24am
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “Possibly, but it would have all been undone in the next 3 years”
        
        The only way to avoid that is to go fast and drastic on so many fronts that it is difficult for a government to undo. For example the Clark Government left most of the labour market reforms alone. This government wants to go back to the 70s and 80s of union power but so far has not managed to achieve much.
        
        There are many areas where a reforming government could change the course of New Zealand. Here are my eight, but I am sure I could list 20 if I put my mind to it:
        
        1. Resource Management Act
        2. Taxation
        3. Welfare
        4. Maori Separatism
        5. Local Government functions, financing and funding.
        6. School system
        7. Transport focus and funding.
        8. State role in media and broadcasting
        
        If you ignore the screams and howls, much of this can be done relatively easily. It just requires clarity of thought.
        
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        April 27, 2020 11:00am
      - PhilBest
        
        I remember what Roger Douglas sais about reform. Your political enemies are going to make just as much noise and frenzy regardless of whether you do timid reforms or major ones. Better therefore, to do real and substantial ones that thereby have a better chance of working and proving their validity in time for the next election. John Key National was 180 degrees different to this kind of conviction.
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:23pm
      - Justitia
        
        Benedict, another 3 years of Labour and we will be talking about “closing the gap” with Argentina.
        
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        April 27, 2020 1:52pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “I remember what Roger Douglas sais about reform. Your political enemies are going to make just as much noise and frenzy regardless of whether you do timid reforms or major ones.”
        ____
        Exactly. Remember the howls of anguish when the Key government sold off minority stakes in the power cos? It was astounding. At the time I remember thinking they should have gone for broke and sold the lot. And then Labour tried to sabotage the sale by announcing Kiwi Power or some daft idea. That only served to lower the initial price and transfer wealth from taxpayers to investors. Genius. 🙂
        
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        April 27, 2020 2:33pm
    - Rachael Membery
      
      Self-answered.
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:46am
    - Ruawai
      
      Because the MSM don’t like him and neither does Massey University, they want him shut down so they vilify him.
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:19am
    - kowtow
      
      Because the Left , esp the Media Party knew he’d get things done . That’s why they deliberately set out to destroy any chance he’d have to be PM .
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:45am
  - Nickc2
    
    Only seven up-ticks so far? I thought there were more St Cindy worshipers on this blog than that. Perhaps its too early in the day for them.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:32am
    - Rachael Membery
      
      Holiday?
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:47am
  - The Boss
    
    Can she write?
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:47am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      She tweets.
      
      14 2
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      April 27, 2020 10:31am
  - JackRabbit
    
    Truth is Truth. Focus on the truth, not the speaker.
    
    But if you have to do a comparison, I am more inclined to believe a retired Reserve Bank Governor over someone who could not be trusted to cash up at the end of the day.
    
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    April 27, 2020 1:54pm
- Shaun the Sheep
  
  The New Zealand government did nothing for a month after the risk of Covid was known.
  Every infection and every death from Covid is a direct consequence of that inaction.
  Every business closure and every job loss from Covid is a direct consequence of that inaction.
  Every dollar of debt from Covid we expect our children to pay is a direct consequence of that inaction.
  Jacinda Ardern and David Clark are not fit for purpose.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:45am
  - igm
    
    She hung on to be seen with her muslim mob at Christchurch. She is a virtue signalling danger to each and every person in this country. Time many awake to her agenda.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:15am
    - Shaun the Sheep
      
      At the time she should have been screening arrivals to New Zealand, she was lecturing ScoMo about not deporting New Zealand-born criminals because he had to own his problems.
      Maybe shoulda sorted her own problems, eh?
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:23am
    - Sacha
      
      @igm: I don’t think you should castigate all the Muslim community, just because the PM sees them as a prop to her popularity. I have known many Muslims over my fairly long life, and there would only be one or two that I could remember as being of dubious character – any more dubious than, say, the Irish immigrant community in which I was brought up here in NZ .
      The PM seems to have very little awareness of the bull-shit meter that is in danger of tipping against her –
      
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      April 27, 2020 1:47pm
  - tf78
    
    David Clark supposedly being Minister of Health should have been front and center in this – he must be sacked, there is no excuse.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:09am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Doctors explain lockdown going to cause further medical problems:
      https://www.aier.org/article/open-up-society-now-say-dr-dan-erickson-and-dr-artin-massihi/
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:45am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    “The New Zealand government did nothing for a month after the risk of Covid was known.”
    As with
    meningitis (30000 vaccinations turned down)..2 deaths
    Measles ….(removal of targets, fall in immunization rates)….80 deaths in Samoa.
    Covid19 ….late response……18 deaths…so far
    How many deaths due to lock down…???
    Flu…debacle in the supply and run out of vaccine
    …….How many deaths????
    Looks like a track record to me.
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:09am
  - quarterpack
    
    Keep it real…..it was the international response to Covid -19 that damaged the New Zealand economy….it wasn’t the Labour Government who closed down our tourism industry and laid waste to the international education industry. The cost of the Govt response in shutting things down is small change by comparisim. and seems to be in line with what every other sensible nations response has been
    
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    April 27, 2020 4:40pm
- Justitia
  
  “”The ‘Great Lockdown’ shrinks NZ economy
  By BEN MCKAY
  AUSTRALIAN ASSOCIATED PRESS
  9:57AM APRIL 15, 2020
  New International Monetary Fund projections show the depth of pain New Zealand’s economy will feel due to the coronavirus, forecasting a contraction on 7.2 per cent this year.
  
  The IMF’s World Economic Outlook, released overnight, says the spread of COVID-19 will shrink the global economy by three per cent in 2020 before a major bounce back in 2021.
  
  The IMF believes New Zealand will see the biggest fall outside of Europe, except for Venezuela, an economy already in freefall.”
  
  But surely it has all been worth it? At last we are being compared internationally to the socialist paradise of Venezuela. Jacinda’s efforts are recognised by no less than the IMF itself.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:19am
- double d
  
  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=g9rsxFaq6Ig
  Let’s not forget this wee pearl
  
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  April 27, 2020 3:35pm
Scott

US Senator Tom Cotton alleged on Sunday morning futures, Fox news, that China knew the virus passed from person to person very early. They knew it was going to cause massive problems in the Chinese economy.

Sen Cotton stated that he believes the virus did originate in a biological lab in Wuhan. That once the virus escaped from the lab and began spreading China lied about it to the rest of the world.

He alleges that China allowed their people to travel overseas knowing it would spread the infection to other countries. He alleges this was deliberate malevolence by the Chinese. If they were going to go down then other countries would go down as well.

So if this is true we must reassess our relationship with China. Allowing the virus to spread deliberately to bring down other countries economies is tantamount to an act of war.
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April 27, 2020 8:01am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  What ya goin to do bro? Start a war against China? Nobody, even God’s army can win against China.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:43am
  - Simon
    
    “What ya goin to do bro? Start a war against China?”
    
    This is a start:
    
    Tanzania President John Magufuli has cancelled a Chinese loan worth $10 billion saying that the terms of the Chinese loan agreement could only be accepted by a drunken man.
    
    https://english.khabarhub.com/2020/24/91241/
    
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    April 27, 2020 8:55am
    - igm
      
      Simon: I do hope Robertson reads your comment Simon.
      He has borrowed every cent being used for housing riff raff and now he has borrowed more to fund their unnecessary lock down of NZ economy.
      God only knows what terms of security he has committed us to, bet creditors are laughing.
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:07am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        Robertson will have the RBNZ print any money he requires.
        
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        April 27, 2020 9:12am
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      Magufuli bro in another year’s time will come begging. It is a matter of time.
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:23am
    - Sacha
      
      John Magufuli might have noticed how the Chinese move in if a poverty stricken country defaults on its loans – hasn’t it happened in Africa already?
      
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      April 27, 2020 1:58pm
    - curry4me
      
      Simon: Good for him.
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:10pm
  - Level 4 Prisoner in Cindy's Kindy
    
    @ Sir Cullen’s Sidecock
    
    The same was said about the ‘even God can’t sink’ Titanic.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:12am
    - Jack5
      
      Sir Cullen’s sidekick says: “…even God’s army can [sic, he surely means “can’t”] win against China.
      
      Mmm. There was Ghengis Khan, the Mongolian, and later, the Mongolians’ cousins from Manchuria, the Manchu.
      
      Both of these peoples were outback cowboys compared with the Chinese civilisation, yet both of them conquered China.
      
      Then there were the British invaders in the Opium Wars, and the various colonialists – German, French, Russian, Japanese as well as British – who carved out niches on the coast.
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:05am
  - Nickc2
    
    Send them COVID-19 MKII Modified. How could the UN and/or WTO object?
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:37am
  - Aunty
    
    China has had its arse kicked from one side of history to the other. It more than any other ‘major power’ that I can think of over the last 1000 years has been more invaded, subjugated, and occupied than any other. So get your facts right.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:57am
    - Don Beckett
      
      Que??
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:30am
  - freethinker
    
    The grim reaper may do Gods work with Kim and your namesake top of the list.
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:23am
- Simon
  
  Recall the good ole days when neolib globalist like Helen Clark said needed global institutions, like WHO and “international law” to help contain China’s worst excesses.
  
  Instead the CCP just corrupt everything. Everything the CCP touches turns to shit. Neolibs like Labour & National need to rethink CCP otherwise China will just poison NZ again.
  
  Neolib desperate to sell this Wuhan virus as one in a hundred year event. But just in the last 15 years China has been a train wreck of environmental, social & governance disasters that finally spilled into the rest of the world.
  
  Last century CPP butchered tens of millions of Chinese now in this century they have started butchering the rest of the world.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:51am
  - emmess
    
    Ahhhh, April 17 2020, would exactly call them the good ole days though
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/121079552/coronavirus-nz-podcast-trump-doesnt-have-a-clue-says-helen-clark
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:29am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Uptickers – How much fact checking – you know, the kind of thing we berate the media for not doing on Jacinda – did you do before upticking?
  
  Some anonymous bloke on the internet says that some US senator says something about x. That’s three layers of hearsay, and we’re buying it without reservations?
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:03am
  - Simon
    
    Here you go Albert. So much evidence.
    
    When the New Zealand government implemented travel restrictions on Chinese travellers in February 2020, the New Zealand PRC ambassador Wu Xi pressured New Zealand to lift the ban, saying that the Chinese government had the virus “under control”. Now that New Zealand is into the fourth week of lockdown, China is restricting access to purchases of PPE. Health Minister Dr David Clarke says New Zealand has “several weeks’ worth” of PPE. New Zealand companies have started making PPE, but it is not enough. As occurred in many other countries, New Zealand’s supplies of PPE were exported in bulk to China in January and February by CCP proxy groups.
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/121113908/coronavirus-could-an-alliance-with-taiwan-help-nz-survive-the-coronavirus-cataclysm
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:08am
  - BananaLlama
    
    The Chinese did know about the Virus back in November last year and they did try to cover it up. That is why i upticked.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:21am
  - Scott
    
    Albert Ross – I have commented on threads on this blog for years. So my views and personage is reasonably well-known by now. I do choose to comment with just my first name. That so I can be freer in my comments. Also given Israel Folau, there are real-world consequences for Christian commentators posting on social media.
    
    But I have given you the source. Sen Tom Cotton speaking on Sunday morning futures, on Fox News. That is what he said. That is what he alleges.
    
    Sen Tom Cotton is a deeply serious person. His claims should be taken seriously in my opinion.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:25am
    - Batman
      
      Cotton is a bullshitter and is saying this stuff to feed the administration’s latest plan of attack which is full on China blame game in order to distract from the haphazard and slow response by the admin.
      
      It has already been disproven about the origin of the virus, so Cotton is merely helping to maintain the Trump base through the usual medium for doing so.
      
      Unlike your comment or Cotton’s, I’ll provide some actual evidence.
      
      https://www.politico.com/amp/news/2020/04/24/gop-memo-anti-china-coronavirus-207244
      
      “The memo includes advice on everything from how to tie Democratic candidates to the Chinese government to how to deal with accusations of racism. It stresses three main lines of assault: That China caused the virus “by covering it up,” that Democrats are “soft on China,” and that Republicans will “push for sanctions on China for its role in spreading this pandemic.”
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:20pm
    - RichardX
      
      People also forget Scott is a young earth creationist with all the baggage that belief carries.
      
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      April 27, 2020 6:14pm
- PhilBest
  
  “… we must reassess our relationship with China…”
  
  I think a politically brilliant move would be for the free world to simply contract out to Taiwan, all “watchdog” activities relating to any public health incidents in China. Forget entrusting the WHO with this. Make official recognition of Taiwan part of the deal. This makes two statements to the CCP and their sycophants in the utopian transnational sector.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:04am
- NoCash
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12327513
  
  This AP report seems more accurate and unbiased than what Sen. Cotton believes.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:13am
TWEEDSE

In shocking news, Jacinda Ardern announced that 100 people died yesterday in New Zealand. And another 100 will die today and tomorrow and the day after…

To eradicate this all births are to be outlawed.

Ardern said “it is the nuclear free moment for New Zealand to recognise that being born is causing deaths and we must eradicate any risk”.
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April 27, 2020 8:04am
- Warren Murray
  
  Or did she say ‘eliminate any risk’?
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:02am
  - Rachael Membery
    
    Exterminate, exterminate.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:52am
- Alex13
  
  What an outstanding example of a wisdom-filled post!
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:00am
  - TWEEDSE
    
    If you look past the satirical comment to the background, yes there is a great deal of wisdom there but take what you will from it. One New Zealander dies every 15min, 100 a day, 36,000 a year. One person dies every day on our roads. So given the order of magnitude we should be eradicating all driving and births before we worry about anything else. But then logic goes out the window when your in the midst of a panic attack.
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:27pm
mjw

“This Japanese Island Lifted Its Coronavirus Lockdown Too Soon and Became a Warning to the World”

https://time.com/5826918/hokkaido-coronavirus-lockdown/
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April 27, 2020 8:04am
- Simon
  
  Time – Lol Russian truthers. Cut back on the soy.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:42am
- emmess
  
  Downtick for Bruce ‘I can’t hear you’ Aylward
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:34am
2ic

The lies continue to be perpetuated by the mainstream:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/121284555/coronavirus-five-other-countries-winning-the-battle-against-covid19

“After nearly five weeks of level 4 lockdown, New Zealand boasts one of the lowest rates of confirmed cases per 100,000 people in the world.”

A quick check on https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ shows that there are 133 countries with LESS cases per population size than New Zealand. With 210 countries listed, we are solidly in the bottom half – 2/3 of the way down the list.

There doesn’t seem to be even basic fact-checking when it comes to our media – they seem to just make this stuff up as they go.
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April 27, 2020 8:06am
- KevO'Brien
  
  They just repeat Cindy.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:44am
  - PhilBest
    
    As Steve Elers so eloquently suggested; perhaps the MSM’s journalists could try pretending Jacinda is actually Simon Bridges?
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:06am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  They are broadcasting arm of NZ Labour party.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:44am
  - kloyd0306
    
    Two non-sarcastic comments on the same thread?
    What is going on?
    We (I) miss the sarcasm.
    As a fellow golfer, can you explain why ranges attached to golf courses are closed while courses are open?
    
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    April 27, 2020 1:11pm
MT_Tinman

Today is the holiday for ANZAC Day.

I was opposed to it’s introduction (the holiday that is) and remain so because in future years and given the current clowns in Parliament I see a push for the traditional ANZAC morning shut-down to be discontinued.

Meanwhile I hope all New Zealanders sitting around on their thumbs today, afraid to upset the dictatorship and their stasi, look into the mirror and observe that they have stood by and surrendered everything those brave men and women fought for to a group of elderly high-school politicians with neither brains nor experience.

Have a nice day 🙂
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April 27, 2020 8:08am
- PhilBest
  
  One of the most sickening vignettes of the current episode: Ron Mark, allegedly a military man, saying in his ANZAC Day address, that “this could have been the 1918 Flu again if not for our decisive action”.
  
  For Pete’s sake, for a military man, I certainly don’t think he has a clue about “vigilance” in the Jeffersonian sense. One shudders to think of a nation’s police and defence forces turned into a paramilitary wing of an ideology because the personnel had long since succumbed to the general dumbing down of everyone at the hands of that ideology.
  
  The opposite of this is Sherriffs in certain Districts in the USA refusing to enforce “stay at home” mandates imposed by politicians on pretexts that the said Sherriffs are awake to.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:11am
Poppa

Who will be watching the big announcement from the throne today?

Count me out, I would rather cut up firewood, or mow the lawn for the third time this week
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April 27, 2020 8:11am
- NeverMindTheBollocks
  
  Can you pop around & mow mine?
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:46am
- Nutta
  
  Don’t mention mowing lawns. Fishermen will get excited.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:35pm
MrTips

Memo to Stuff and NZHerald:

telling us you are a trusted source of information while begging for coin is a contradiction the punters immediately pick up on.
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April 27, 2020 8:11am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Oh Sheeple can think now??? Why am I surprised??
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:45am
I remember when

Reading the “The Great Wrong War”
New Zealand Society in WW1. Southland Times protested the way state censors approved lies for publication.
The state while claiming to be waging a war on behalf of freedom tightened censorship.
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April 27, 2020 8:14am
- Evadne
  
  That’s written by Stevan Eldred-Grigg, who is a strongly left-leaning socialist.
  
  I wonder what he makes of the current Labour-led propaganda and censorship??
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:53am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    His history of NZ in the first world war make the Germans out to be the good guys…
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:18am
    - Evadne
      
      He also holds that we didn’t need to join in WWII
      
      15 1
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      April 27, 2020 9:28am
      - Evadne
        
        And the middle classes have corrupted the working class.
        
        15 1
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        April 27, 2020 9:30am
jv

Under level 3 Tracey Martin says over 70’s are going to be given back ‘sort of’ the same rights and responsibilities as everyone else because we have been well behaved. Yeah. Sounds like kindergarten.

What a contrast between our ‘leader’ and the Governor of South Dakota who said at the outset that she trusts her people and communities to take responsibility and she is guided by the Constitution to look after both their well being and their livelihoods.
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April 27, 2020 8:16am
- fernglas
  
  And is it your view that the people and communities of this country would take responsibility, or would many of them simply fall back into doing what they like and blaming others for their misfortune?
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:19am
  - alloytoo
    
    The people and communities of NZ were cancelling or postponing activities and events before the PM figured out her March 15 Reelection launch was doomed.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:36am
  - jv
    
    That of course is the point. We will never know because Jacinda decided at the outset we couldn’t be trusted. I guess we can compare with dictatorships where people are used to doing what they are told.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:43am
    - Rachael Membery
      
      Or children.
      
      10 2
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      April 27, 2020 11:05am
- PhilBest
  
  This quote should be posted daily
  
  C S Lewis, 1948:
  
  “Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be “cured” against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals.”
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:24am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Kiwis are taken to a stage by Tooth Fairy, they are now happy to accept buying KFC is a freedom that has been given due to the mercy of Cindy.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:28am
- Mr_Blobby
  
  What did we get separatists setting up illegal road blocks at their claimed borders.
  
  Police powerless to stop them.
  
  Worse government and councils powerless to even condemn them.
  
  57 3
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  April 27, 2020 8:38am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Trace martin has her own direct mail out too. Content: NIL. Self promo as usual–is she angling for a higher role in NZF?
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:42am
- tf78
  
  I could live with having that Governor, she’s a good looking Cindy with brains to match.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:01am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Indeed Tracey is superior to Windy Cindy.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:15am
  - Ian Boag
    
    As of this morning
    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/south-dakota-coronavirus-cases.html
    
    11 deaths and 2200 cases in a population of 800,000
    
    On a per-capita basis, lots more than NZ
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:39am
    - jv
      
      On a per capita basis most of us would probably prefer the risks that might go with freedom, free speech, a job and some income and a sit down meal in restaurant.
      
      35 4
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      April 27, 2020 9:51am
      - Cinematic
        
        Well said JV, the myopia of some when it comes to the trendy virus is extraordinary. So quick to trade in their liberty for such a low return.
        
        14 2
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        April 27, 2020 10:23am
    - emmess
      
      It started in (a very cold, I assume ) winter there and they are physically attached to the rest of America
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:41am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      and South Dakota has 6 states bordering it, NZ has a more than 1000Km moat called the Pacific Ocean.
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:48pm
- peterwn
  
  She has been misquoted. There has never been any special mandatory restrictions on the over 70’s. What she did mean was that over 70’s like everyone else would have more freedoms under level three, but the over 70’s should be especially careful. Hence to play it safe some over 70’s may care to self isolate under level 3 and even level 2.
  Rest homes will probably continue lockdown regimes under levels 3 or 2.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:02am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    The Chief MOH seems to set the legal rules under his weekly empowering orders.
    I understand the 80+ group remain in lockdown. I can youth a bit.
    
    9 3
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    April 27, 2020 9:20am
- KevO'Brien
  
  I don’t think it applies to the 80+’s though so I’ll be nominally locked down.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:12am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I think in your case 80 is the new 50.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:38am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Thanks, that’s why I’ve called my book “My First 80 Years”.
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:51pm
Michael NZ

https://www.health.govt.nz/system/files/documents/publications/influenza-pandemic-plan-framework-action-2nd-edn-aug17.pdf

What we are all living under.
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April 27, 2020 8:17am
- Don Beckett
  
  A blueprint for fascism.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:03am
- tf78
  
  I notice that was updated in August 2017 – so it must be National’s work that Jacinda implemented with her own modifications and stipulations.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:17am
  - Hard Cheese
    
    Additions made up on the fly. Ardern was asked in Parliament a few months ago what COVID19-specific information had been added to National’s 2017 pandemic plan and her reply was that nothing was necessary….
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:48pm
Bobba Fret

I’ve seen a lot of over 70’s people out and about and at the supermarket in level 4. I think they would rather take the risk of catching the virus than live like a prisoner in their own home.
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April 27, 2020 8:20am
- Belinda
  
  Yes I’m 70 and I get in my car and go out every single day.
  Usually I just drive somewhere, park the car and go for a walk, strangers I meet on my walk at least say hullo.
  I no longer walk around my retirement village due to the nastiness of some residents to me because they consider I’m “breaking the rules”
  It’s been so disappointing to discover you are living in a stasi like environment.
  I’ll go out today and grocery shop, then wont need to go out for a few days when the shops are full of scared old people feeling liberated.
  Grocery shopping has been a pleasure the last few weeks.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:29am
  - 7kiwi11
    
    Given the way numbers have gone I think you’d be safer in a supermarket or park than a rest home!
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:30am
    - Alex13
      
      True, but mainly because its people like her who bring the virus into the rest homes.
      
      5 17
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      April 27, 2020 11:08am
      - Batman
        
        Yep, sadly Belinda is a case study in “it won’t happen to me” thinking.
        
        Belinda, you ARE breaking the rules, I’m sorry to say. The problem is you and not your neighbours!
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:26pm
      - artemisia
        
        Retirement villages and rest homes are quite different entities.
        
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        April 27, 2020 2:14pm
    - Twinkletoes
      
      Retirement Villages are very different to rest homes in that one has one’s own apartment. One can wander in the gardens but our library, pool and all social areas are closed. No visitors allowed . Belinda obviously does not reside in any of the Ryman Villages as all the side entrances are locked and the only way out is through reception (where groceries/medications are delivered) and the front gates outside reception have 24 hour security guards to ensure noone leaves or enters the village (apart from staff). We will be on level 4 for weeks after level 3 comes into force. You can of course leave and take your chances but you will be quarantined upon return.
      
      I know which retirement village I prefer to live in and am still happy occupying my time (couldnt’ bear the lockdown without a computer which is my access to the outside world and entertainment for now.) Would not care to live or share with people going outside and returning to possibly infect the safe haven of those who have toed the line for their own and everybody elses safety. Heaven knows where they have been and what they may have been in contact with but think they are so special that they can walk the corridors and use the lifts and areas shared by the more vulnerable of us. Just my opinion, selfish as it may be as I know it is hard on everyone.
      
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      April 27, 2020 2:28pm
  - PhilBest
    
    The saddest thing about this is that spending time outside in the sun, especially in NZ with our high UV, kills viruses that might be on your skin or clothes anyway. So the restrictions on plain straight “being outside” are wrong in every way, scientifically as well as morally. Same with restrictions on parks and beaches. These are not virus-spreading environments. The ONLY “cluster” phenomena anywhere in the world, relate to indoors environments. Even in the Northern Hemisphere winter.
    
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    April 27, 2020 3:33pm
- davidp
  
  My dad is 86 and he still goes to the supermarket. I have a friend who lives nearby and has offered to drop groceries off, but he has worked out a shopping system that works for him and feels extremely low risk to me. He goes right on opening time when there aren’t crowds. He leaves mum in the car, because she would slow the process down significantly. He likes that the supermarket are sanitising the trolleys between users. And he washes his hands when he gets home.
  
  Ardern might want my dad to be frightened and lonely. He refuses to be either. I hope I’m like him when I get old.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:47am
  - DeepBlue
    
    My Mum is OK about staying in her own home during Lockdown4. Doing her bit, cleaning the pantry, cooking just like the rest of us. As a WWII child and farmer’s wife she knows about coping and isolation.
    
    The worry is all her community activities (at 85yo) are contact close so her future life has ground to a halt. She used to volunteer in an op shop, go to dance classes, garden group etc. What a terrible cost from COVID 19. Does she just stay at home and wait for a box now?
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:21am
    - Jules99
      
      Yeah, my mum has had to stop her volunteer work and exercise classes. She’s missing them terribly.
      
      10 2
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      April 27, 2020 12:20pm
  - Alex13
    
    No one wants your dad to feel frightened and lonely, but at 86 he should really avoid taking on risk unnecessarily. He can get groceries delivered to him (by either yourself or by the supermarket).
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:11am
    - freethinker
      
      Its called choice and whilst we have had that arbitrarily restricted during our free trial of Communism hopefully this coalition of clowns will be given a large arse card come Sept 19 if they don;t postpone/cancel the election.
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:37am
    - davidp
      
      It’d be illegal for me to deliver groceries. I don’t live nearby.
      
      I think dad has made a better assessment of Covid risk than Ardern has. There are a handful of well understood clusters in nursing homes, Matamata, and Southland. None of these apply to him, nor does he interact with anyone in quarantine. The chance that he is going to be even in the general vicinity of anyone with the virus is vanishingly small. Certainly much smaller than injuring himself with an axe, which is something he uses regularly.
      
      And if you disagree and think the risk is unacceptable, then you have to explain why old people shouldn’t have sheltered at home from influenza last year, or the year before. We’ve known for weeks now that the death rate for Covid is about the same as for influenza and the demographic is similar for both. The main difference is the publicity and the resulting hysteria.
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:08pm
      - Batman
        
        If he’s your bubble extension then it is not illegal. Delivering him groceries would be considered essential travel.
        
        I know this because I’m doing exactly that for a senior family member and have been given a green light by police when one stopped me to check.
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:30pm
      - artemisia
        
        Well done that dad of yours. Folk like him built this country.
        
        Of all the ways people die, this virus would have to be among the most unlikely if some rather minimal care is taken.
        
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        April 27, 2020 2:20pm
      - davidp
        
        >If he’s your bubble extension then it is not illegal. Delivering him groceries would be considered essential travel.
        
        My parents are in Wellington. I’m in Auckland. I think you need to apply for permission to travel across regions, and I hear they’re denying permission for people wanting to visit family with terminal illnesses. We can’t all be Winston Peters, heading out of town to our holiday homes.
        
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        April 27, 2020 4:09pm
    - Sacha
      
      I’m not quite 86 yet, but I do my own shopping – as I have done all my adult life. It is not for YOU Alex13 to tell others what to do as if you have the authority to do so.
      We have lived through myriad influenza/measles/polio epidemics.. We have had colds and sore throats and fevers and managed to live through them all. And if lucky like me, have no ‘co-morbidiites’ accompanying us.
      We are nearing the end of our lives, and see no need to stop making calculated choices about our own well being.
      Somebody challenged me when I commented that HM the Queen has never worn a helmet in all her horse riding years and at 94 no reason to change the habits of a lifetime: did I think that it would be ok for her to fall off and land on her head? My response was that there are worse ways to die.
      You see? At a certain point we accept the inevitable. It’s going to happen.
      
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      April 27, 2020 2:33pm
      - PhilBest
        
        I wish there was some way a “movement” of our elders who think like you, could be started, perhaps a few hundred of you could descend on a high profile location in your cars simultaneously with suitable placards as a publicity stunt. The irony of the Police trying to deal with it, is that the protesters would be the very people being “protected”, and choosing to make a statement, “not in our name, please”!!
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:37pm
- burt
  
  It’s better to die on your feet than live on your knees.
  
  https://youtu.be/6pKPNnk-JhE
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:35am
  - Jack5
    
    Sadly, when Covid-19 is fatal, you die on your back rather than on your feet.
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:15am
    - Batman
      
      Some people here are having a wonderfully dramatic time during lockdown.
      
      They’ve been watching too many movies or something ? Maybe Burt thinks he’s Captain America, making a dramatic and earnest statement before running into a fight?
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:32pm
- Sacha
  
  The fact is, we could all starve if we had to wait for click-and-collect to deliver. There is a 10-day backlog at my local supermarket. Much easier to do a 30 minute shop – get out of the house, drive a few km to keep the battery charged –
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:10pm
Lee C

It’s a mind-set…

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-collectivist-mentalit_b_8500630

https://www.verywellmind.com/what-are-collectivistic-cultures-2794962
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April 27, 2020 8:24am
Surely Knott

Much has been made of the loose unscientific comments by Trump…meanwhile
in NZ, Stuff’s facebook post today says, “Opinion: It looks like grownups spread Covid -19 to children, rather than the other way around ” as the comment for the Dr Siouxie Wiles opinion article, “Coronavirus: Dr Siouxie Wiles says Children Rarely Affected by Covid-19”
Why is our national science expert on this topic writing an opinion piece! And which bits of the article are opinion and fact. The data has been readily available that Children are rarely affected that is a hard fact.
But then she says “Can our kids can spread the virus? Again, it looks like we grownups are more likely to give them Covid-19 than the other way around.” And then Stuff features that as a facebook headline. Is there a scientific citation for this? Is it true? Can kids not spread the disease to grownups.
Which bits of the article by our official scientific spokesperson are opinion and which are fact. And why is it not clear what the difference is.
So if you think a president making speculative conversational comments isn’t ok, but what about the govt’s official media scientist?
If kids can’t spread it to grownups is it ok for them to go and visit granny in the retirement home? The answer could be dangerous. So yes we need to know if it’s facts not opinion. And scientists and media shouldn’t be conflating the two.
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April 27, 2020 8:26am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Siouxie Wiles may be the Media’s go-to Covid-19 expert.
  
  but as far as I am aware, she does not have any “official spokesperson” role.
  
  She is Not a Ministry of Health virologist or epidemiologist.
  
  She is Not the PM’s Scientific Advisor.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:49am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    And she looks like a freak show exhibit.
    
    28 2
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    April 27, 2020 10:04am
    - lifesgood
      
      Did her parents really spell her name that way or is it an affectation, like, look at me, look at me? The hair certainly is a plea for attention.
      
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      April 27, 2020 12:01pm
      - Jules99
        
        She changed it herself after some pop group or other.
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:22pm
      - alwyn
        
        I think it was that 1960’s English rock group called “The Zombies”.
        The look certainly matches the name.
        
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        April 27, 2020 2:56pm
      - Sol Invictus
        
        Siouxsie and the Banshees, not the Zombies.
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:00pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Her birth name is Susanna.
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:14pm
      - Jack5
        
        Susannah’s cultural appropriation was in fact a swap.
        
        She got her name from the Lakota people. [Mod: deleted – no need to go there]
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:27pm
      - Nickc2
        
        @ Maggy Wassilieff 1004 AM
        Says it all really.
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:32pm
      - PhilBest
        
        Ah, it was Siouxie and the Banshees was it? How mature of her!
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:39pm
    - curry4me
      
      Captain Mainwaring: The reason freak shows have disappeared from circuses is that they coulsn’t compere with the freak show that is the baby killers provide. Plus, the freaks are all volunteers
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:27pm
  - Surely Knott
    
    “She is Not a Ministry of Health virologist or epidemiologist. She is Not the PM’s Scientific Advisor.” Agree. But she is overwhelmingly the main if not the only “expert” presented by our media outside of the official press conferences. And I say media singular, because she is used as the commentator on every channel and by every paper. She is the public “expert” for coronavirus on the herald, stuff, spinoff, newshub, tvnz, rnz etc. They all use her almost exclusively as the official expert and so they all report nearly identical news from a singular perspective..
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:38am
  - Nickc2
    
    Siouxie Wiles is a leftist mouth for sale.
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:41pm
- fernglas
  
  Siouxsie Wiles is not an expert. She is someone who has scientific expertise in a related field and by a combination of bluster and ignorance on the part of the media, has been accepted as someone who is expert not only in the field of epidemiology, but in that of social science. In other words, she is accepted by the media and possibly government as someone whose opinions on Covid-19 and the moral consequences should guide our response. She is in fact not an expert in either. Nor should her opinion, particularly in respect of the social outcomes of the virus, be given any greater weight than that of the ordinary citizen. In both respects she is a charlatan, but in the latter, potentially dangerous as people are likely to give her opinion more weight than they should, not because of her supposed expertise in that area, but because of her supposed expertise in another.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:54am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Siouxsie Wiles has disqualified herself from expert status as she plainly gives what others hope to hear from her.
    Expertise requires integrity not sycophancy. Wiley plays with stats to order and puts her markle into it.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:17am
  - tf78
    
    Thank goodness for her ridiculous pink hair it stands as an immediate warning.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:23am
  - MrTips
    
    I think that’s a little harsh fernglas. Despite my obvious antipathy to Wiles, she does have qualifications and expertise to make some commentary. She needs to stop at the contact tracing, epidemiology and politics though.
    
    The real charlatan in this is Shaun Hendy. His untrained, “learn as you go” epidemiology somehow got the ear of Cindy with 80,000 deaths, a ridiculously fantastic number – not even the USA has that many deaths! He needs to be directly challenged on this publicly (he is a physicist, not a epidemiology modeler) and also Cindy needs to justify why she chose to follow him over Baker, Skeggs and other experts. Important here also is that Ayesha Verrall, a medically trained epidemiologist revealed our contact tracing to be rubbish: neither Wiles nor Hendy made any comment on that, yet Baker and Skeggs were literally screaming at the govt for it.
    
    Hendy doesn’t like being challenged. He’s been instantly blocking people on Twitter who do, even politely.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:28am
    - fernglas
      
      The PM will choose to go with whichever expert most closely echoes her feelings. And experts, despite public opinion, are as easily corrupted as anyone. It’s called confirmation bias. Ask any lawyer. Two sides to an argument, two experts with differing views, which views happen to coincide with the case of the person paying them.
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:24am
    - PhilBest
      
      “Hendy doesn’t like being challenged. He’s been instantly blocking people on Twitter who do, even politely”
      
      That says it all. We’ve seen this totalitarian behavior before among “modellers for political hire”, it is a tragedy for humanity when they get away with it as they have with the CAGW fraud. Having got away with that, people like Hendy fully expect to rinse and repeat as many times as they like on any pretext that should come up.
      
      If some lowly professional committed malpractice on just one client, that was anything like as bad as this, they could well end up in jail. But government’s favoured “experts” are part of the untouchable swamp and they know it. They can screw over the whole of society in ways that the lowly professional can’t do to a single patient or client.
      
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      April 27, 2020 3:44pm
      - Tony Stuart
        
        I believe that it is essential that an independent inquiry or a Royal Commission is launched at some point, to investigate every aspect of the Government’s response to the coronavirus pandemic. In particular, there should be real scrutiny as to whether the modeling done by Hendy and others has resulted in unnecessary economic damage.
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:49pm
- Alex13
  
  Anything that anyone else says does not make Trump’s statements any less moronic.
  
  4 11
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  April 27, 2020 11:15am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    ‘Not as bad as’ is always a popular angle…
    
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    April 27, 2020 2:36pm
seismac

Over 70s bah humbug
Soon we will only be allowed :– 2 sherries each week
Sing songs at 6pm as long as its “The red Flag”
Wear slippers to the supermarket
No bonking because it breaks the 2metre rule and always vote for the little Princess
Whats happened to relaxed casual friendly Gods Own ?
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April 27, 2020 8:28am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  “Whats happened to relaxed casual friendly Gods Own ?”
  Stolen by a power mad socialist
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:50am
  - Batman
    
    Honestly, you guys are turning into drama queens over this.
    
    There’s no prize for the most dramatic comment each day haha
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:37pm
- tf78
  
  seismac be careful you’re pushing your luck.
  
  4 1
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  April 27, 2020 10:24am
- lemuzz
  
  By the time all this is over, us over 70s will be able to bonk with our ski’s on.
  
  5 1
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  April 27, 2020 10:38am
- Alex13
  
  “Relaxed” and “casual” do not usually apply during pandemics.
  
  1 9
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  April 27, 2020 11:16am
kowtow

A scan of media stories today shows they’re beginning to move out of the panic, scare mongering stage to the post mortem , how it spread stage.

More to the point they should be asking , seeing as how most govts have pandemic plans , why were we all so ill prepared and underfunded.

Could it be that there was almost exclusive focus by gubmints and media (CCN) on the fake climate change threat and that’s where all the money and effort went.

Given this is the third major pandemic in only 60 odd years , ie one every 20 , what deserves our immediate and undivided attention, bat soup viruses or slight changes in the weather ?
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April 27, 2020 8:29am
- Classic Liberal
  
  You’re right. ‘One in a 100 years’ was never true! The next virus could be just around the corner and if we’re going to let government collapse the economy and introduce a police state each time, that really will be the end of civilization.
  
  We need a much more measured, well-prepared approach, including sensible quarantine rules, PPE not just for health staff but possibly for people to be able to continue working when social distancing isn’t possible and much better online learning when schools need to close.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:13am
  - tf78
    
    I still think you need rather a large element of herd immunity.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:26am
- mudrunner
  
  Have a look here at the MOH Site
  “Exercise Pomare Preparation for Pandemics
  The annual report https://www.health.govt.nz/publication/annual-report-year-ended-30-june-2018 page 55 stated:
  “Our achievements in 2017/18
  Pandemic Influenza Planning: Completion of Exercise Pomare
  The Ministry leads the all-of-government response for human health emergencies, including pandemics. The New Zealand Influenza Pandemic Plan (2017) provides the all-of-government framework and measures to prepare for, and respond to, an influenza pandemic.
  We led Exercise Pomare, a national inter-agency exercise series, between October 2017 and May 2018 to familiarise government agencies with their role and responsibilities before, during and after a pandemic response. The exercise series will inform updating the Plan and further pandemic planning across agencies.”
  Read the report it’s full of holes.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:06am
Fletch

Ricky Gervais takes another light hearted swipe at celebrities – now that they’re not on TV, they have to get their faces in front of people on social media singing “Imagine” and the like ?

https://www.facebook.com/bbc5live/posts/10158416117261108
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April 27, 2020 8:30am
I remember when

If I had a business with income $10,000 per week and outgoings $9000 pw that would give me an annual income of $52,000. Being closed for 8 weeks means the loss of 80,000. Even allowing for a reduction of say $2000 pw in outgoings that would only reduce my loss by $16,000. So let’s make it $64,000.
So I will work for 52 weeks and have to borrow $12,000 for the business plus have no income.
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April 27, 2020 8:32am
- Steve James
  
  Jeez…. far too complicated for Prime Minister [del. mod] and those clowns surrounding her. Any reasonable person would move aside and let experienced workers/business owner take over.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:48am
- reubee
  
  You are proving Deborah Russell right with those sort of figures.
  
  If you had a little capital in your business then you would be able to access some of that before having to goto the bank.
  
  Secondly you should be paying yourself a fair salary/wage as you go. If this is $1000pw then what you have is a business that was making no profit to begin with.
  
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  April 28, 2020 2:05am
mjw

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
And today, Donald Trump doesn’t know the difference between a Pulitzer Prize and a Nobel Prize.

He should really be putting his feet up by the fire and sipping warm cocoa, rather than acting as an increasingly erratic puppet for others’ agendas.
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April 27, 2020 8:34am
- Dougal10
  
  But isn’t that the point. The president is only a figure head of the regime in the white house.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:58am
  - Batman
    
    Only a figure head? I thought he was the head the co-equal executive branch of government and the greatest President of modern times?
    
    Making America great again and all that.
    
    No? Weird.
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:40pm
- Fletch
  
  AT least he knows the difference between his wife and his sister, unlike the presumptive Democrat presidential nominee….
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:58am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Not as bad as…
    
    4 18
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    April 27, 2020 9:21am
    - alloytoo
      
      …..not knowing the difference between GDP and crown accounts.
      
      9 1
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      April 27, 2020 1:17pm
  - virtualmark
    
    There is no mileage in attacking Biden on his relationships with women. Trump has been credibly accused of sexual assault and rape by over 20 women, has seriously assaulted at least one of his three wives, has at least one illegitimate child, flaunted his mistress in front of his first wife, banged a pornstar only a few months after his wife gave birth, has repeatedly said he’d bang Ivanka if she wasn’t his daughter, but still made her give him a lap dance, was Jeffrey Epstein’s mate but broke the friendship after Epstein did something with/to Ivanka, “grabbed em by the pussy”, and there’s a lot of interesting rumours in Queens about what he did to his sister that led to him being sent to military school …
    
    But sure, this is the hill you want to die on.
    
    While no doubt professing a love for family values.
    
    Keep digging. You’ll reach Spain one day.
    
    5 28
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    April 27, 2020 9:52am
    - All_on_Red
      
      Narrator; VMs TDS has unfortunately reached the stage where he actually believes the lies he tells.
      
      Tara Reade has filed a Police Complaint against Biden. It’s a Felony to file a false complaint.
      Sure Trump had low morals and has behaved badly but no one has ever filed a Police complaint.
      
      Hey, real funny those Russian hackers had their charges against them dropped. Very embarrassing withdrawal by the Prosecutor too.
      I recall that for months you were going on about them being charged- as if that was evidence of collusion.
      Guess you feel REAL stupid now.
      Hahahahahahaha
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:19am
      - virtualmark
        
        Red,
        
        I agree that laying a false complaint is a felony.
        
        Which is why I find it very interesting that Tara Reade’s Police complaint doesn’t name Joe Biden. I’d place a lot more credibility on her claim if she believed it enough herself to name him in the complaint and put herself at felony risk. Until she does that I don’t put much credibility on her at all.
        
        Re the dropping of charges against the Russians … yes, Bill Barr is doing a good job for Trump.
        
        But it will be interesting to see tomorrow’s data dump. And to see whether the Judge forces the release of the unredacted Mueller report (now delayed to June because of the Covid-19).
        
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        April 27, 2020 10:36am
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Definitely a topic worth exploring. If Trump really raped women, he needs to be taken to court. As does Biden.
      
      It all comes down to: ‘what is consent?’.
      
      Trump has certainly admitted to some crude behaviour, but only with consenting women. Where is the evidence that it was non consensual?
      
      Same for Biden, so far: nothing proven yet except very boorish behaviour. Even listening to Tara Reade, as a judge I’d need to ask her: ‘did you tell him to stop? Did you try to get away?’. It sounds like she was young and scared and not assertive. He could have been stupid enough to think she was consenting.
      
      That can absolutely feel like sexual assault to the victim, but brings up the question of ‘what is consent’?
      
      Both were rich, powerful men, quite good-looking back in the day. No doubt many women were pretty keen on them. They might have assumed that any woman who didn’t say anything was consenting. And what would a court decide?
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:03am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Without saying anything about this particular complaint, do you realise that
        
        ‘did you tell him to stop? Did you try to get away?’
        
        are classic excuses for rape, along the lines of “but what was she wearing?”
        
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        April 27, 2020 2:39pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        This is too important a topic for your throwaway lines, Milky.
        
        Even if everyone could agree that it felt like sexual assault for the victim and the perp was a total creep, a lack of any sign from the victim would make it very difficult *for a court* to find the perp. guilty of rape. Nothing to do with sexist notions of how a woman dresses ‘causing’ rape, for goodness sake!!
        
        What would you consider the required signal for consent or non-consent, Milky? A written agreement to have sex? Exactly what type of sex, for how long etc? People aren’t telepathic, so if they overstep a line, they need to be told.
        
        One could argue that any sexual approach towards a workplace inferior is automatically sexual harassment, that there can be no consent. But I don’t think adults should be considered helpless children.
        
        Most people have had sexual experiences that they didn’t enjoy. You’re old enough to have had such experiences yourself.
        
        Maybe someone getting too ‘handsy’ with you, maybe even something that started OK but after a while was not enjoyable anymore. If you didn’t tell the person to stop, do you think of it as sexual assault now? How would that fare in a court trial?
        
        But I’ll give you this much, Milky, if Trump and Biden are both found guilty of rape, they should be locked away and can share a cell!
        
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        April 27, 2020 4:45pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Ok down ticker, no ‘innocent until proven guilty’ when accused of sexual assault.
        
        I hereby accuse milky of sexually harassing me in his posts. No proof needed. Felt like sexual harassment and that’s enough. I didn’t want him to treat me like that and he should have telepathically known it.
        
        Mod: obviously just a rhetorical point.
        
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        April 27, 2020 5:34pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Too important a topic?
        I quite agree. The sooner rape myths like “did you say no” are exploded, the better. Frankly, I’m astonished that someone should attempt to defend such an archaic concept.
        
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        April 27, 2020 5:58pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        From what I’ve read Tara actually reports that she did pull away and that Biden stopped and looked shocked and surprised when she pulled away and said something about having been told she liked him. But I guess that’s irrelevant to you – he just needed to know that she didn’t consent, even before she pulled away?
        
        I’m obviously no Biden fan, nor a fan of creeps feeling up people without consent, but if this goes to court there still might need to be proof that he could not have reasonably assumed there was consent. And 30 years ago.
        
        But I’m glad it’s all so simple and obvious to you. You’ll be glad Biden’s finished then. Mind you I think currently he’s denying it happened at all.
        
        Again: just bc someone feels they have been sexually assaulted and one can absolutely empathise does not automatically mean it can be proven in court to have been non consensual.
        
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        April 27, 2020 7:18pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Milky give me some of your legal wisdom. A transsexual friend a few years ago was very handsy with me and kept trying to touch and kiss me though I didn’t like it. Can I accuse her of sexual assault? Do you care to know what I said and did or is that irrelevant, because I didn’t like it and that’s enough?
        
        Come on, real question.
        
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        April 27, 2020 7:38pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        That takes the cake. I explain a true, bad experience and ask if milky would consider that would fly in court as sexual assault. I get down-ticked for telling what happened to me. I thought the victim must always be believed and if the victim felt they hadn’t consented the perp should have known?
        
        So come on: was it sexual assault, irrelevant of what I said or did or what happened next? Or do these things actually matter after all? Like whether I told her to stop, whether she did, whether she tried again?
        
        Nope, none of that matters to judge milky, the perp should be charged w sexual assault and I’d be asked nothing.
        
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        April 27, 2020 8:24pm
    - Sacha
      
      @ virtual mark: And this is the quality of information that you collect? Ugh. Most people I know just call him a ‘good ol’ boy’ because they know others just like him, and shrug their shoulders.
      
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      April 27, 2020 2:40pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  mjw, and you voted for the PM who doesn’t know what GDP is, right?
  
  Tell you what: I’d prefer a leader who knows how to let a free market economy run and increase hundreds of thousands of jobs than one who gets a couple of prizes mixed up.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:16am
- virtualmark
  
  It’s worse … he doesn’t know the difference between a Pulitzer Prize and a Nobel Prize, and couldn’t spell Nobel (Noble!).
  
  Earlier this week he said the US Navy would “shoot down Iranian gunboats”, which is an unnatural choice of words too.
  
  Go back and watch interviews with Trump from the 1990s and you’ll see he’s sharp, eloquent, speaks well. Now watch him today. He’s now in the mid-stages of dementia. I think the guy should never have been President, but I still wouldn’t wish his current state on him.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:56am
  - All_on_Red
    
    “he mid-stages of dementia.”
    
    You’ve got it bad eh.
    It’s pretty funny really though.
    
    10 4
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    April 27, 2020 10:21am
    - virtualmark
      
      Red,
      
      I’ll take a bet with you that Trump won’t be the R’s Presidential candidate in November. I reckon it’s 50:50 whether the Rs think he can make it.
      
      You might have noticed that Nikki Haley has started to ramp up her profile in the last few weeks. Wonder why she thinks it’s worth doing that? Wonder what Stephen Miller would think of a Sikh as either President or VP?
      
      4 6
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      April 27, 2020 10:41am
      - Jules99
        
        Nikki Haley would be a great President – the US’s first woman, following 8 years of Trump success. FAB.
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:36pm
  - BeaB
    
    That’s a cruel thing to say. My husband died from dementia and I saw all the stages and there is no way, midway through, he could have held a press conference or wiped his own bum.
    
    14 3
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    April 27, 2020 11:12am
    - virtualmark
      
      Similar experience here. Many signs of Trump’s decline. He will get worse from here.
      
      And, respectfully … Trump can’t hold a press conference either. Hence the “what if you inject bleach” type comments. And the Noble Prize for journalism. And the shooting down boats. Just to name a few from this week alone. If you really listen to what he says it’s just re-playing old tapes, old grievances. His brain is stuck in 2016. He talks at people but he’s rapidly losing the ability to converse with them.
      
      And he can’t wipe his own bum either. He’s incontinent, and wears an adult diaper. Truly.
      
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      April 27, 2020 5:24pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        A wet diaper, at that:
        https://www.politicalflare.com/2020/03/diaperdon-is-trending-after-trump-is-caught-with-a-wet-bottom-at-tennessee-disaster-meeting/
        
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        April 27, 2020 6:00pm
  - JibberJabber
    
    So, on your Dementia scale, where do you think Biden is sitting?
    Non Compos Mentis, would be putting Bidens state politely. Imho.
    
    8 1
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    April 27, 2020 11:48am
- KevO'Brien
  
  He needs to ask Joe Biden?
  
  3 6
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  April 27, 2020 10:21am
guardianista

Internet shopping for clothes over the last few days I noticed that on the barkers site almost all jerseys were classed as essential goods that could be shipped under level 4 , except for one that was stripped (too higher fashion element?) Moving onto hallensteins I disclovered scarves were essential but gloves not. Socks could be shipped but not shoes. Plain tees ok, ones with writing on them no. Etc.

Although irrelevant now as our great leader takes us down to level three, that my taxes are paying for some bureaucrat to make such stupid rules is just mind boggling.
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April 27, 2020 8:35am
- Dougal10
  
  Communism 101 make stupid rules which must be obeyed
  
  43 4
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  April 27, 2020 8:59am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Tees with Che Guevara pictures surely OK with our Dear Leader?
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:18am
- mikenmildagain
  
  I seriously doubt that any official is going through businesses’ inventories to determine what is essential. Much more likely is that there are general guidelines that the businesses apply to their own circumstances.
  But you could find out for us by emailing Barkers and Hallensteins.
  
  2 24
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  April 27, 2020 9:23am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    All ‘essentials only’ bullshit was unnecessary. Should have just been: if you can safely trade, then do so. That could have been pretty much all online orders.
    
    28 2
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    April 27, 2020 10:02am
    - Ruawai
      
      Yes because the reason for the lockdown was safety from CV19 not following draconian rules.
      
      9 2
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      April 27, 2020 10:39am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      I agree with that. But that’s not what guardianista’s uninformed complaint was about.
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:03am
  - jv
    
    I wouldn’t seriously doubt it at all.
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:51pm
- SGA
  
  Internet shopping for clothes over the last few days I noticed that on the barkers site almost all jerseys were classed as essential goods that could be shipped under level 4 , except for one that was stripped (too higher fashion element?) Moving onto hallensteins I disclovered scarves were essential but gloves not. Socks could be shipped but not shoes. Plain tees ok, ones with writing on them no. Etc.
  
  Maybe this reflects what stock these places have in some central location suitable for organising online shipping protocols (or something similar) – I doubt that every individual store is doing it for themselves. I don’t know that, but I wonder if this reflects logistical issues with the companies themselves rather than some decrees about plain versus patterned t-shirts?
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:41am
- Close Hen Counters
  
  I hope you don’t need your essential items urgently – ezibuy as another example selling bits and pieces over two week wait on delivery ?
  
  4 1
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  April 27, 2020 12:24pm
- Jules99
  
  Reminds me of a time I was working in a social services office. We were not allowed lined refills with holes down the side. They cost more. We had to buy lined refills with no holes and punch them ourselves. Something to do with the contract negotiated.
  
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  April 27, 2020 12:37pm
KevO'Brien

Watch the COL seizing opportunities:
https://bigleaguepolitics.com/sex-selective-abortion-new-zealand-prime-minister-used-wuhan-virus-pandemic-to-sneak-worlds-most-radical-abortion-legislation-under-kiwis-noses/
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April 27, 2020 8:40am
- SGA
  
  First reading was 8th August, 2019, select committee delivered it’s report 14th of Feb, 2020. There were all sorts of “toing and froing” with NZF about a binding referendum (voted down 100 to 19, Mar 18), second reading Mar 3rd, then 3rd reading Mar 18 – passed 68 to 51 on a conscience vote. All of this was in the media.
  
  You may oppose the legislation, but that it was “sneaked through … under kiwis noses” by the COL doesn’t sound right to me.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:59am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    [Deleted – Any more offensive comments like this and you will be in time out. Mods]
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:14am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    It’s almost as if Kev deliberately repeats lie after lie…
    
    3 10
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    April 27, 2020 11:05am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Time to get your nappies changed?
      
      5 4
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      April 27, 2020 12:53pm
- Twinkletoes
  
  So we have virtually legalised ‘infanticide’?
  
  5 2
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  April 27, 2020 3:05pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    No.
    
    2 2
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    April 27, 2020 4:18pm
Jimbob

Suggest people watch this:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xfLVxxIBLU

[Mod. – video unavailable]
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April 27, 2020 8:40am
- Jimbob
  
  http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xfLVxx_IBLU
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:02am
  - Jimbob
    
    Try this:
    
    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xflvxx_lblu
    
    0 4
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    April 27, 2020 9:11am
    - Steve Todd
      
      What’s it about, Jimbob?
      
      Not that any Kiwiblogger would care, but I never click on links that have been put up without some indication as to what the subject matter is. There’s a very good chance that I will immediately realise that I have wasted my time.
      
      (In other words, I’m not a trained seal.)
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:49am
Classic Liberal

Sorry to bring this up again, but when even Newstalk ZB claims Trump suggested people inject detergents, it really is too annoying. Completely false claim about what he actually said. Anyone can go and watch what Trump said.

Those that want to be bone-headed idiots will drink bleach. Anyone else can see he was simply asking Drs about research of anything that will ‘cleanse’ the virus from the body in a similar way.

Styx has the sensible take on it all as usual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ppMRlQLDrw
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April 27, 2020 8:43am
- Fletch
  
  Yup, I heard a news clip on NewsTalkZb this morning also about how disinfectant manufacturers here in NZ are warning people not to take it because of what Trump said. This is just stupid and a way to further push the story. NO reasonable person, looking at that press conference, would infer that that is what Trump is suggesting. Unless CNN thinks their viewers are stupid and need warning (which is a possibility).
  
  I turned of NewsTalk halfway through the story.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:34am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The warnings are to keep stupid people alive – they vote you know
    
    13 3
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    April 27, 2020 10:08am
  - cmm
    
    I don’t blame the disinfectant manufacturers.
    
    They are not reacting to what Trump said.
    
    They are reacting to what the media said Trump said.
    
    Big difference.
    
    24 3
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    April 27, 2020 10:29am
    - SGA
      
      You don’t know that, cmm. They may have been simply covering themselves from any remote chance of litigation arising from bozos who take the current POTUS too seriously (i.e., “why didn’t you do more to warn people of the health hazards of injecting, ingesting, or inhaling the fumes from your product?” sort of thing)?
      
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      April 27, 2020 11:01am
      - cmm
        
        No, those dumb buggers would be reacting to what the media REPORTED too seriously.
        
        The media’s immediate attack and twisting of what Trump says is hugely destructive.
        
        Look what they did with HCQ: they basically turned off that line of investigation for 3 or 4 weeks. HCQ was not Trump’s idea. He just said something slightly positive about it, so the media and all the moron lefties jumped on it.
        
        Now even WHO is looking into HCQ-based treatments.
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:49pm
      - SGA
        
        No, those dumb buggers would be reacting to what the media REPORTED too seriously.
        
        No, I happened to catch Bryan(?) and then Trump live, cmm. I found the whole thing a bizarre train wreck at the time. I think it’s deserved the negative reaction that it has got – Trump simply doesn’t have to interject himself into these things and try to go beyond what his experts are saying.
        
        It speaks volumes that he has tried to distance himself from these foolish comments by pretending they were “very sarcastic” questions to the press (not what I saw), and that the White House have since put him on a tighter leash regarding press briefings.
        
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        April 27, 2020 7:22pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Despite his fans’ desperate attempts to provide cover, it’s quite clear what Trumpy said. Speaking to the doctors in the room:
  
  I see disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute, one minute, and is there a way we can do something like that by injection inside, or almost a cleaning. Because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs, so it’d be interesting to check that. So you’re going to have to use medical doctors, but it sounds interesting to me. So, we’ll see. But the whole concept of the light, the way it kills it in one minute, that’s pretty powerful.”
  
  Yes, the president asked if there was a way to get disinfectants inside people to kill the virus. No one knows why he asked that, but it seems to be some garbled reaction to the stunning news that disinfectant or sunlight kills viruses on external surfaces (who knew?).
  So that triggered a wave of Trumpistas seeking out obscure references to treating illnesses with UV light or misting hydrogen peroxide into the lings.
  But the next day, Trumpy claims he was being ‘sarcastic’ to troll the media.
  Now, he ain’t doing no more of those media briefings…
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:12am
  - Fletch
    
    You’ll probably find that Trump knows more about what sort of secret research is going on than the media do. I’m betting that the truth will come out later and make the media look completely foolish.
    
    8 3
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    April 27, 2020 12:20pm
    - Batman
      
      I’m sure you’re hoping that to be the case. Unfortunately it’s not likely given the state of the administration there:
      
      https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/04/internal-documents-reveal-team-trumps-chloroquine-master-plan
      
      3 4
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      April 27, 2020 12:48pm
      - cmm
        
        This would be the same HCQ that WHO and others are researching.
        
        4 2
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        April 27, 2020 3:53pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      ‘secret research’
      You think he might have read a ‘secret’ briefing about disinfecting people from the inside?
      
      2 6
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      April 27, 2020 2:42pm
      - cmm
        
        Ok, what is wrong with the idea of disinfecting people from the inside?
        
        Many pathogens live on the surface of your throat etc and disinfecting those areas could help to kill off those pathogens and stop them spreading.
        
        Nowhere did he tell people to chug Janola.
        
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        April 27, 2020 3:53pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Quite right. He only asked about injecting disinfectant.
        Why do people defend this moron?
        
        2 6
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        April 27, 2020 4:22pm
oldpark

Wonder why President Trump gets all the false news publicity by the sicko trendy lefty media. Just been reading documented evidence from an ex Employee of “Fingers” Joe Biden being feted by the same sicko trendy media to be the next President of USA.
The employee claims that “Fingers”Joe Biden penetrated her with his fingers while he kissed her and also suggested taking that type of sexual assault even further.
Of course Biden being the Democrat Candidate in this November USA elections is getting a free pass. .The claims by the alleged sexual abuse on sworn evidence by the claimant has been completely ignored .
Wonder where that bastion of Womens Rights known as #Me Too are on this one . Also not forgetting never mind the hypocriticial USA Media how about the Lovies in NZS bastion of Womens Rights such as the cue reader clowns on TVNZ an TV3 who seem to have missed the sexual claims against “Fingers” Joe Biden .Not forgetting the pests in print and sound media who also in NZ pump out fake news daily attacks on the elected USA President Donald Trump who got elected with 63,000,000Million Votes.. Yet when a documented sexual attack on one of Bidens employees gets completely ignored by, seems people who condone that type of female abuse,it is a sad indictment of selected morality by NZs news outlets not even reporting the allegations at least. .Of course what else is new .It is little wonder they have just been given $50,000,000 Dollars of NZs taxpayers money. Maybe if they had reported both sides of the news in many instances they would not have needed a handout .Just Saying .
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April 27, 2020 8:46am
- Dougal10
  
  Will Biden make it to the election or will a late replacement be instilled by the political establishment at late notice like cindy was here.
  
  28 3
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  April 27, 2020 9:03am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    We know who that will be. Joe will get sick, get thrown under the bus, or die
    
    5 2
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    April 27, 2020 1:38pm
    - Nickc2
      
      Yep, Hillary is has sent out for her favourite dress maker in preparation for the occasion (Democrat of course) and Nancy Pelosi is writing a special speech on tear proof paper. Special pens are being engraved for signing of the deeds as we speak.
      
      4 2
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      April 27, 2020 1:57pm
- Fletch
  
  The latest news is that the mother of Tara Reade, the complainant, rang up the Larry King show in the 90s to complain of abuse on behalf of her daughter, although she didn’t mention names. That is what she claims she did, anyway. CNN could easily have looked in its archives, but didn’t, and it was left to private individuals to find the clip (which they did).
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aivzaeV8qxY
  
  Apparently, CNN have now removed this entire episode from Google Play. Funny that.
  
  26 3
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  April 27, 2020 9:41am
  - Batman
    
    Google Play doesn’t hold such things, so your statement is verifiable bullshit.
    
    Besides, YouTube is owned by Google so why is it still there?
    
    Makes the rest of your claims a bit shakey matey!
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:51pm
Sir Cullen's Sidekick

The Green Party’s Covid-19 recovery plan would see unemployed tourist guides picking up shovels to plant trees. What next? retail workers planting sapplings at the side of the road and getting the same salary?
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April 27, 2020 8:46am
- JerJer
  
  Umm. Didn’t we have a policy of planting a billion trees already……..and not do it.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:28am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I’m in favour of much of this plan.
  https://www.greens.org.nz/covid_19_recovery_greens_call_for_investment_in_people_and_nature
  
  In fact, it is a damn shame that ecosystem restoration and habitat management weren’t the major focus of the Department of Conservation for the last 30 years.
  
  They initially got hijacked by the “save the iconic birds” brigade and latterly by big Tourism $$$$.
  
  And all that time the DoC estate was degrading from pest and weed invasions and general neglect of out-of-the way tracks and huts.
  
  An injection of practical, outdoor types into DoC and Local councils is desperately needed.
  
  There’s bugger all that is achieved if you spend your career writing policy papers or management guidelines, but never put boots on the ground.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:05am
  - cmm
    
    Maggy, yes, on the surface I would support this. If Labour are going to spend billions to stimulate the economy then this doesn’t look like a bad option – especially when compared to the Robbo and Cindy Show.
    
    It sounds like most of these are physical get-out-there-and-do-it jobs. Excellent for the youth to get out into the outdoors, get some physical experience and see some of the best of NZ.
    
    $1bn over 3 years is small potatoes compared to some of the other ideas and it looks like this could have some long term positive outcomes.
    
    5 2
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    April 27, 2020 4:20pm
- tf78
  
  Ah the Greens forever re-inventing the wheel. Maybe they should realize some people can actually think for themselves about obtaining a job, they usually do, the ones who don’t want to work as usual apply for the government support payment (AKA the DOLE).
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:10am
Mr_Blobby

Has anybody questioned why the price at the petrol pump is so high in NZ when the international price has dropped and they have run out of places to store it.
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April 27, 2020 8:47am
- Warren Murray
  
  Australia is now $1.00 per litre cheaper. We’re still being fleeced
  
  25 1
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  April 27, 2020 9:09am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    Not by the petrol companies. See my comment below.
    
    10 1
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    April 27, 2020 9:18am
  - igm
    
    No use listening to Stockdale from AA, he appears to be under the socialist spell, coming out with excuses for the excessive retail cost of petrol and diesel.
    
    15 2
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    April 27, 2020 9:21am
    - Rachael Membery
      
      The gas stations still need to make money to pay staff etc, no coffees. v’s or food and lollies to sell.
      
      3 2
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      April 27, 2020 2:34pm
- Kabull
  
  A major reason will be that the oil in the tanks in NZ and on the water headed our way will have been purchased some months ago, and as consumption has plummeted, there is no turnover enabling those expensive stocks to be reduced. Also, while I don’t know the exact details, I suspect that it would be 2-3 months before any cheaper bulk oil purchases – or even of Singapore refined – get here and get into the retail chain.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:17am
  - Nutta
    
    Yet when international oil prices increase, the effect on NZ pump prices can be immediate/overnight…
    
    1 0
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    April 27, 2020 11:54pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  Well that is simple to answer. Excise and tax is about 96 cents, about 60 percent of the retail price of about $1.60. Then there is the producer margin of about 20 cents. So the price of oil is only a factor in the last 44 cents of the petrol price. So as the oil price falls, you get diminishing returns at the pump. So rough calculation, if the oil price fell by 10 percent today the price at the pump would only fall from $1.60 to $1.56.
  
  Conversely in the USA the pump tax is much, much less. So the price of oil is a much bigger factor in the price at the pump.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:17am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    According to Cindy – “All the taxes imposed by National during their nine long years of misrule”. Winson nods. Free Willy smiles. Shane **** I better not write that.
    
    16 2
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    April 27, 2020 10:02am
- tf78
  
  I think they paid top dollar when they purchased it before the price dropped – it’s older stock now of course so I can understand it.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:12am
guardianista

All my golfing mates are frustrated that play is effectively being limited to solo rounds unless you have a bubble playing partner. It’s a game where social distancing is ingrained — not doing so on the tee will result in lost teeth and on the green it’s the done thing to give your partner(s) plenty of space. And there is considerable evidence that this virus is seldom transmitted outdoors or off services.

As someone who is suffering from declining mental health I crave a well-sledged game of golf with my male friends, something our glorious leader could not relate to I suspect.

I think the end result of these stupid decisions will be increasing civil disobedience. Personally, I’m not going to play by their rules any more.
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April 27, 2020 8:49am
- SGA
  
  I hadn’t heard that the virus was seldom transmitted off surfaces, do you have a source for that?
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:03am
  - 2ic
    
    The virus is very sensitive to UV light:
    
    https://www.dailywire.com/news/top-dhs-official-coronavirus-dies-fastest-in-sunlight-heat-humidity
    
    I’d suggest that outside on a sunny day – be it playing golf or at the beach – is one of the safest places to be in the pandemic.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:33am
    - SGA
      
      That’s not the same as the general claim that it is seldom transmitted off surfaces. All it means is that your chances of getting it off a surface exposed to direct sunlight is lower than other surfaces. That can be as simple as the top of a door handle versus the bottom of the same door handle, or the sunny side of a pole versus the shady side (and, of course, it won’t apply at all to many surfaces inside).
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:48am
    - virtualmark
      
      All viruses are sensitive to UV light, and to heat, and to the right level of humidity, and so on.
      
      Their outer surface is largely made up of fats. Anything that destroys the fat (such as soap or disinfectant or 70% alcohol) or that dries it out (such as UV light etc) will “kill” the virus.
      
      But viruses can last on surfaces for quite some time until any of those things take place. Up to 2-3 days in the right conditions.
      
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      April 27, 2020 10:02am
      - 2ic
        
        @SGA, @virtualmark
        If you check the link I posted, exposure to sunlight reduces the half-life of the virus from 18 hours (in the conditions tested) down to 2 minutes. That’s shortening its life over 500x, which is huge.
        
        Secondly, you are not infected if you touch an infected surface. You are only potentially infected if you subsequently then touch your mouth/nose/eyes. Just basic hand-washing and not touching your face is all that’s required.
        
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        April 27, 2020 10:41am
      - SGA
        
        Well, yeah. I’m aware of that. How does it contradict anything that I (or virtualmark) said?
        
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        April 27, 2020 10:55am
      - 2ic
        
        SGA: Sorry – I was responding to you about the UV light claim when you were referring to surface transmission. My bad 🙂
        
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        April 27, 2020 12:29pm
      - SGA
        
        No problem 🙂
        
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        April 27, 2020 1:22pm
  - tf78
    
    Apparently it can remain on plastic surfaces for up to three days.
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:13am
  - Shaun the Sheep
    
    There was a great deal of information on that matter given at the White House press conference. There were experts, and graphs and everything. The press conference lasted about an hour.
    Was it not mentioned in the global media?
    Crikey I wonder why?
    Maybe because all the quality journalists heard was a flippant comment about bleach and sunlight.
    
    Then Tova couldn’t help herself today – compelely unaware that people injest bleach every day because our councils put it in the water.
    Remember how so many people buy bottled water for drinking because of it.
    Do keep up Tova.
    
    3 1
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    April 27, 2020 6:21pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  “result in lost teeth”
  
  That’s what they’re worried about, since we currently don’t have dentists!
  
  6 1
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  April 27, 2020 9:24am
- igm
  
  I have been taking the motorbike out frequently and will bloody well continue, so long as bunches of road maggots can go where they like with impunity, hoiking and spitting as they travel.
  
  16 4
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  April 27, 2020 9:24am
  - Batman
    
    The fact that you own a motorbike igm, matches perfectly with your angry and somewhat abusive demeanour on here!
    
    4 12
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    April 27, 2020 12:53pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      mobility scooter ≠ motorbike
      
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      April 27, 2020 2:46pm
- Isobar
  
  Well considering golf is largely played by those in some form of higher-risk category such as age or demographics, its probably a smart move for now, especially if the rates of asymptomatic people are to be believed.
  
  3 18
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  April 27, 2020 9:30am
  - burt
    
    Thanks for the nanny state concern.
    
    15 2
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    April 27, 2020 10:39am
    - Batman
      
      I’m sure your family will pleased you rejected the ‘nanny state’ if and when they attend your funeral.
      
      3 9
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      April 27, 2020 12:54pm
      - cmm
        
        How often have you heard people saying: “At least he died doing what he loved”? That’s the best way to go and everyone (except nanny) acknowledges that.
        
        I’d rather kark from something I enjoy than die as a fearful wreck hiding in a basement to “keep safe”.
        
        6 2
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        April 27, 2020 4:24pm
- Belinda
  
  Can I be your caddy?
  
  5 1
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  April 27, 2020 9:38am
- Tony Stuart
  
  I plan to go and play at least nine holes one day this week. Whilst the intention will be to play by myself, if one of my mates is out there, it’d be rude not to invite him to join me; I hate having to sledge myself!
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:44am
  - cmm
    
    No, don’t invite him over. That would be wrong and unsafe.
    
    Just yell out to him a bit. Unfortunately he’s got bad hearing so he had to come closer to hear what you were saying.
    
    4 1
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    April 27, 2020 4:26pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  Women, and particularly women golfers, would never ever comprehend that delightful expression;
  “A well sledged game of golf”.
  
  9 1
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  April 27, 2020 9:45am
- emmess
  
  One upside of the lockdown is that I have enjoyed walking and cycling around Remuera golf course, which is normally way to expensive for me to go to.
  And no, I am not saying this is a reasonable trade-off for hundred of thousands of people losing their jobs.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:58am
Happychappy

How many two bedroom homes would $107.6 million build and how many house have been built since the Minister of Housing took the reigns from Phil Twyford. With all record numbers of unemployment still to hit our economy and many people on high mortgages many may not survive then where will all this money come from to help those that have actually paid taxes that is now being spent like drunken sailors by Ardern, Robertson and woods.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/415165/government-announces-100m-for-housing-homeless.
Can anyone shed any light on whether the neady pay for anything nowadays as they get rent, food, clothes and a lot more to sit on their buns and do nothing
It seems.
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April 27, 2020 8:57am
- artemisia
  
  More than half the social housing waiting list are single people or couples with no dependants. Mostly working age.
  
  Good chance many of them have issues as there are several criteria to be met before being Okd for the waiting list. Although that does not in itself explain the steep rise in list numbers under the current government.
  
  So the light to be shed strongly suggests most are unemployable / needing support – there will always be a segment of our society for which that is true.
  
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  April 27, 2020 4:41pm
I remember when

mjw
The Japanese experience shows us the problem with lockdown.
Once you have put it is place when is it time to lift it?
If you lift it and another outbreak occurs is that failure or controlling the curve?
Isn’t it great to have another headline to generate more fear.
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April 27, 2020 9:04am
Dougal10

@Guardi
Watch out for whistle blowers hiding behind trees. Maybe the stasi will send airport security to watch.
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April 27, 2020 9:06am
- SGA
  
  Or in helicopters 🙂
  https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/queensland/three-youths-on-gold-coast-rooftop-busted-breaching-covid-19-rules-20200420-p54ldz.html
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:31am
Maggy Wassilieff

How is the CoL going to manage the New Poor ?

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/04/sikh-community-feeds-15k-families-over-past-fortnight.html
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April 27, 2020 9:07am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Through communism. Wealth tax, with the meaning that everyone who has saved some assets for retirement will have to pay cuts off those each year.
  
  Ironic really, when they have been urging people to join Kiwisaver which basically makes everyone a capitalist investor.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:33am
- krazykiwi
  
  Easy. Vote for us, and we’ll give you some money next year.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:45am
- rangitoto
  
  Good to see this help from the Sikh community.
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:18pm
Suze Wainwright

By being kind I guess…
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April 27, 2020 9:09am
I remember when

Re March 23rd tens of thousands,
That would have seen us in our rightful place of a world leader. Even 10,000 would put us in undisputed sixth place as of today.
Lucky we didn’t over egg it.
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April 27, 2020 9:09am
Maggy Wassilieff

Aussies download the tracing App.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-04-27/coronavirus-tracing-app-covidsafe-one-million-downloads/12187806
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April 27, 2020 9:13am
- Benedict Yu
  
  If the New Zealand government goes down this route I will under no circumstances download such an app. Regardless of any assurances, I don’t trust them.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:25am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I will just turn the phone off and put it in a drawer. Anyone who wants me can phone my landline.
    Socialists can just fuck right off
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:16am
    - barnacle bill
      
      You wont though Steve, will you.
      
      Because important people like you think they need the phone on, all the time.
      
      2 24
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      April 27, 2020 10:57am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        Um no. Even at work the phone stays in my car. I am not a teenager that has a phone as an extension to my arm
        
        17 3
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        April 27, 2020 11:24am
  - tf78
    
    Benedict they are working on it as we speak. Within the next fortnight (haha).
    
    7 1
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    April 27, 2020 11:18am
  - Hollyfield
    
    That’s why I preferred the idea of a “digital card” floated a couple of weeks ago. At least a separate bit of plastic can be thrown away afterwards and not used to track you permanently. An app on your phone? Unless you’re knowledgeable about how to check such things I wouldn’t trust that it’s properly deleted and completely inactive afterwards. I would be comfortable carrying a bit of plastic for a few months to facilitate contact tracing, but not an app on my phone.
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:29am
    - Batman
      
      Two things:
      
      The digital card wouldn’t work, as there is no inherent processing power in the card. You’d have to rig up the entire country with an RFID scanning system. That is completely out of the realm of possibility sadly. Not to mention it would drive the 5G people even more nuts haha.
      
      Once you delete an app it is gone. Apps that try to install spyware don’t make it past the Google it Apple app store security checks.
      
      Also, once the apps are published they’ll be stripped down by enthusiasts and such, so any tracking methods would be exposed in a matter of hours or a day.
      
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      April 27, 2020 1:00pm
      - rangitoto
        
        You trust Google and Apple LOL.
        
        1 4
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        April 27, 2020 1:29pm
  - curry4me
    
    Benedict Yu: I wouldn’t d/l it if the government consisted of 120 ACT MPs; let alone this COL.
    
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    April 27, 2020 9:50pm
    - Batman
      
      You realise that the privacy act makes is extremely difficult for any data collected to be used for anything other than the original purpose?
      
      The privacy commissioner will be all over it for his time in the spotlight too haha
      
      2 0
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      April 28, 2020 12:08am
- Isobar
  
  Given Dutton’s past behaviour curtailing freedoms and vastly expanding the Australian government’s intrusion into private lives, i wouldn’t trust him or anything they say
  
  https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2019-07-10/dutton-encryption-laws-australian-tech-sector-not-consulted-foi/11283864
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:56am
I remember when

Thank goodness I didn’t miss this vital bit of news.
TV3 Newsreader last night:
“Police confront 200 protesters wanting businesses to resume.”
Pan over to group of people standing around casually. A couple of what are presumably police shown looking rather less than animated.
Slow protest day.
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April 27, 2020 9:16am
- kevn
  
  The TV1 – 3 news has become even more of a joke in recent times.
  
  30 1
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  April 27, 2020 9:47am
  - barnacle bill
    
    We have given up on TVNZ.
    
    Nothing else except repeat shows time after time.
    We enjoyed The Chase, but every damn night , just another repeat.
    It used to happen only over the Xmas New year period.
    
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    April 27, 2020 10:53am
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Red Radio has been telling kiddies’ stories many mornings. Nothing for the adult audience who could at least do with some interesting non-political documentary or something! It’s pathetic.
      
      6 1
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      April 27, 2020 1:07pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Wife: “Did I get fat during the quarantine?”
Husband: “You never were really skinny”
Time of death 11.20pm, 25,4,20.
Cause of death: Corona Virus
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April 27, 2020 9:27am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Honestly, that ‘downticker’ is wetter than the Wuhan markets.
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:44am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    The same four humourless individuals have downticked you as well Maggie; surely your partner has something to say about this 😀
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:35am
    - Maggie Pie
      
      He will when i show him Tony!
      He went to the farm this morning with his dad to put more grain out for the ducks and stock up the bar in the mai-mai ready for opening day.
      
      12 4
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      April 27, 2020 12:45pm
      - DeepBlue
        
        Delayed now, isn’t it? Mid May?
        
        4 2
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        April 27, 2020 2:35pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        My partner was saying not if it’s on private propwerty. After spending a small fortune late last year adding a deck to the south side of the mai-mai then running power and water down to it, nothing will keep them away next weekend.
        
        7 3
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        April 27, 2020 3:39pm
MCos

Everyone seems so grouchy today.
Here’s something to cheer you up!
https://twitter.com/dpa_intl/status/1254514538831138816?s=21
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April 27, 2020 9:32am
Ruahine

Was talking to an acquaintance yesterday and he was saying how happy he was to be able to get back to work and earn some decent money again.
I got to thinking about all those public servants “working” from home on their full salaries and wages. Because they do not have to pay travel expenses to get to work they have all in reality been given a pay raise for the past weeks. All the while so many other people have seen their incomes diminish badly and for many others virtually disappear. Tomorrow many people will be able to hopefully resume work and their jobs and businesses still exist. Please spare a thought for those who are not still able to resume work. No full salaries for them. I feel that Labour and the Unions especially Unite and First have deliberately tried to put as many Small Businesses as possible out of business. The goal is to create semi-government type work forces which are easier to Unionise.
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April 27, 2020 9:34am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Anyone working from home is probably enjoying more downtime just from missing the commute alone.
  That’s two hours extra in my working day.
  Where people can work from home, that’s a good thing, isn’t it?
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:24am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Yes, I can’t disagree, Milky. Less commuting is good for everyone who does need to use the roads.
    
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    April 27, 2020 1:02pm
I remember when

Kev OB 8.40am
Can’t wait and wait and wait and wait and wait and wait for that to appear in our news media.
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April 27, 2020 9:40am
- KevO'Brien
  
  The women are remembering though.
  Help spread it around.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:37am
Philview

Anyone from down South must have noticed that the Otago Daily Times has spent the lockdown printing opinion pieces on the failure of capitalism. I see another one today calling for an egalitarian utopia. The Marxists are milking this crisis and it is starting to get on my nerves to the point that I will soon stop reading that newspaper.
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April 27, 2020 9:44am
- Tony Stuart
  
  What do you expect from a city whose last four electorate MP’s were David Benson-Pope, Pete Hodgson, Clare Curran and David Clark?
  
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  April 27, 2020 9:56am
- kowtow
  
  ‘With that in mind, the Otago Daily Times has joined an international news media initiative in the run-up to the UN Climate Action Summit.’
  
  https://www.odt.co.nz/opinion/editorial/why-were-covering-climate-now
  
  Go woke , go broke.
  
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  April 27, 2020 10:57am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Happy Birthday to Melania Trump. Not too shabby at 50
39 3
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April 27, 2020 10:01am
- virtualmark
  
  I’m sure Henry Siemers will look after her well on her birthday.
  
  Google it.
  
  #TrumpFamilyValues
  
  2 13
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  April 27, 2020 10:08am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Gutter politics. I have female friends other than my partner – even my ex wife
    
    21 3
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    April 27, 2020 10:21am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Can’t wait for you to tell off anyone else who says nasty things about other politicians or their families…
      
      5 16
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      April 27, 2020 11:26am
      - Batman
        
        And yet like clockwork, it’ll be different because of such and such reason
        
        4 3
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        April 27, 2020 1:04pm
Philview

I was talking to a friend in the UK last night. He observed that our PM was very quick to cash in on the global exposure being given to nurse Jenny.
He observed that she is cut from the same cloth as Tony Blair. An expert on selling the nice person angle but devious as they come underneath.
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April 27, 2020 10:14am
- tf78
  
  Wasn’t Jacinda an adviser to Tony Blair – she taught him everything he knows (always thought he was rather stupid).
  
  15 2
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  April 27, 2020 11:23am
  - Tall Man
    
    But she never met him …. how can that be?
    
    13 3
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    April 27, 2020 11:36am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    “Wasn’t Jacinda an adviser to Tony Blair ?”
    No. Urban myth. She worked as an advisor in the Cabinet Office. The Cabinet Office employs more than 1,000 people.
    
    17 0
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    April 27, 2020 12:13pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      and look what she was doing there:
      
      “I was working alongside small businesses, trying to make their lives easier.”
      
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/96123508/jacinda-ardern-i-didnt-want-to-work-for-tony-blair
      
      Isn’t that brilliant?
      Our PM knows all about small business…
      
      18 1
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      April 27, 2020 12:44pm
      - Swifty
        
        “…..trying to make their lives easier….”
        
        I bet $1,000 that her actual results were either 1. no change or 2. the opposite effect.
        
        In other words, she failed.
        
        13 1
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        April 27, 2020 12:55pm
      - Shaun the Sheep
        
        So looking at the photo, it seems she’s been wearing that revolting pink jacket for three years.
        
        3 1
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        April 27, 2020 3:06pm
      - Nickc2
        
        I started reading your posted link Maggy but after a few paragraphs, I wanted to throw up. No kidding. As it’s getting close to my evening meal time, I had to cease reading. In future, please put a warning on stuff like that.
        
        5 1
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        April 27, 2020 4:17pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        The best thing the government can do to help small business is to stop doing things.
        
        Just a simple example of “rules” having perverse effects:
        
        I used to live in a community with more than average numbers of elderly people. There was a ‘handyman’ guy that had a good business doing odd jobs. One of the jobs was cleaning roof guttering. Then the new rules came in saying he had to use scaffolding. Totally non-viable. End of business. Of course the perverse effect would have been EITHER (1) The elderly folk cleaned their own guttering at considerable risk or (2) The guttering backed up, causing damage to the homes.
        
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        April 27, 2020 4:54pm
secondcumming

Speaking with a mate of mine in the Real Estate industry last night. He only handles *high-end residential* and was saying he’s aware of at least 6 properties in the eastern suburbs where the overseas purchasers (all Asian) have welched on the contacts. Preferring instead to forfeit their deposits rather than settle.

With a cold winter looming, there could be a few bargains to be had 😎
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April 27, 2020 10:17am
DeepBlue

Jacinda wants Aussie to pay NZrs jobless benefit, but reverse doesn’t apply to NZ’s visa holding workers. She can hardly attact Scomo on this again. What comes out of her mouth is coming back to bite her, big time.

Newshub “Immigration Minister Iain Lees-Galloway said the Government is “actively considering further options at present” but on Wednesday neither he, nor Minister Sepuloni, would commit to extending the benefit system to cover migrants.

Lees-Galloway said: “It should be remembered though that people on temporary visas are expected, as a condition of their visa, to hold sufficient funds or an arrangement to return home, and to bring their own resources when they come to New Zealand. They should access these first (e.g travel insurance, money saved for travel).”
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April 27, 2020 10:30am
- Benedict Yu
  
  ““It should be remembered though that people on temporary visas are expected, as a condition of their visa, to hold sufficient funds or an arrangement to return home”
  
  Yeah right. We bring in hard working folk from the Phillipines to pick crops because we have tens of thousands of unemployed young people who won’t do it.
  
  I’d rather throw a few bucks at these hard working folk than at the cuzzies on the couch. And how are they supposed to get home now?
  
  That statement is a prime example of the crap written by media advisors with “Communications” Degrees from Massey or Waikato.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:05am
  - ISeeRed
    
    The cuzzies on the couch are already costing us. Now you want throw money at foreigners too? You’re so generous with my money.
    
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    April 28, 2020 10:38am
Tasman Terror

Just heard from a Registered Valuer that the banks in NZ have stopped lending on bare land. That last occurred guess when in NZ? In the depression. Don’t count Nats out.
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April 27, 2020 10:44am
- Tall Man
  
  That 17% “undecided” will have a massive effect if they can be galvanised to head to the ballot boxes and I think they will be.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:35am
- chukar
  
  Scary times, drop LVR s but don’t lend on bare land.
  
  Where does that leave developers ,house building and the CoL s Kiwibuild.and plain productivity.
  
  Please say it isn’t so?
  
  9 1
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  April 27, 2020 12:14pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Let’s “eliminate” or “eradicate” the RMA and get this country moving. Open up more land and allow more suitable housing for all types of owners and break the back once and for all of the Fletcher’s/CHH monopoly.
    
    3 3
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    April 27, 2020 2:29pm
tom hunter

Good article on Jim Rose’s blog, Utopia, comparing the NZ and Australian “lockdowns” by looking at Google mobility data.. The charts are clear and simple to read and they show that we’ve been much harsher for no better result.

I’ve covered that here also:

Peter Collignon (one of Australia’s leading infectious diseases experts) said the latest data showed New Zealand, with a population of 4.7 million, had about 20 new COVID-19 cases a day compared with Australia, population 25.5 million, averaging about 50 a day.
He said the good news was that both countries had managed to reverse the curve, but while New Zealand had imposed more draconian “level four” lockdown measures, Australia’s less stringent approach appeared to have been as effective.

“New Zealand has been locking everybody in their houses, there’s no going to Bunnings, and there is no evidence they are doing any better,” Professor Collignon said.

“I actually worry that what may be happening in New Zealand is if you come down too hard, people stop complying as much as they should.’’

That’s the problem with lockdowns: they’re easier to get into that out of.
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April 27, 2020 10:45am
- Benedict Yu
  
  What will be a complete disaster is if we go from L3 to L2 and then the shit hits the fan and we go back to L4. Expect to see civil unrest.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:08am
  - Rachael Membery
    
    We never needed a level 4 in the first instance.
    
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    April 27, 2020 5:24pm
- barnacle bill
  
  @tom hunter
  
  That’s the problem with lockdowns: they’re easier to get into that out of.
  
  I keep hearing that about getting out of lockdowns Tom, but in my 76 years I cant remember ever experiencing a lockdown before.
  So we do not know how it is going go, but I cant see that it will be as hard as you say it will be.
  
  Kiwi people just get on do what is required and tomorrow will be know different.
  
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  April 27, 2020 1:01pm
  - Harriet
    
    “…..That’s the problem with lockdowns: they’re easier to get into that out of…..”
    
    Yep – we all just literally slowed down in aussie and now keep 2 feet behind someone in a queue rather than the usual 1 foot. And you have to stand outside takeaway shops until your order is ready. People for the most part are allowed to still go about their general routines like they did, just not go to the shops as much. Some states today have even lifted some sanctions and are now allowing groups of up to 10 or 20 instead of 5.
    
    NZ has no routines and that has allowed the PM to now say who is allowed to go 1st, 2nd and 3rd and under what conditions and rules.
    
    Cindy is a busy body with 100’s of 1000’s of busy body followers – no I don’t think it will be very easy for NZ to return to anything like normal, before the election anyway. 😎
    
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    April 27, 2020 1:55pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Who are Kiwi people today?
    
    People who phone the police in their thousands to “dob in a neighbour”? Not in my opinion.
    
    People who receive the bulk of their income directly from the government and are therefore invested in retaining the most useless government that promises more? I hope not.
    
    I’d love to know what you have learned in your 76 years that will enable Kiwi people whose jobs and possibly whole industry have been destroyed for the foreseeable future “get on and do what is required”.
    
    5 4
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    April 27, 2020 3:01pm
    - barnacle bill
      
      Tallboy, the one who knows everything with the solutions to nothing.
      
      I place you in exactly the same bracket as Harriet.
      Just a negative moaner and groaner.
      
      Go get a real life Cobber.
      
      3 1
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      April 27, 2020 8:51pm
Odakyu-sen

“On March 25, New York became the first state to issue a blanket rule prohibiting nursing homes from denying admission or readmission to residents because they are infected with COVID-19, and banned the facilities from testing patients for the disease before they are admitted.” Ref: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/coronavirus-spreads-new-york-nursing-home-forced-take-recovering-patients-n1191811

What could possibly go wrong?

I think Japan has more respect for its elderly than do the New Yorkers.
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April 27, 2020 10:59am
BeaB

How have we been suckered into using the word ‘lockdown’?
So it doesn’t sound like ‘lock up?
What is it now? Lock off?
14 4
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April 27, 2020 11:13am
- tf78
  
  Escape from Alcatraz – yippeeeeee! Let’s just do it.
  
  7 2
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  April 27, 2020 11:39am
- Shaun the Sheep
  
  Healthy people were locked down before infectious people were prevented from entering at the border.
  What is wrong with that picture?
  
  Before there is any talk of opening bubbles within New Zealand, the scrawny earnest one is suggesting conversations with ScoMo about combining with the Australia bubble.
  
  Our border controls are so poor, why would any sensible Australian Prime Minister risk that?
  
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  April 27, 2020 6:37pm
surfing

why do we allow maori to block roads as they see fit?
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April 27, 2020 11:27am
- Ruahine
  
  They are Cindy’s little helpers. She pays them lots of money.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:59am
oldfella

This is the new Michael Moore documentary mentioned yesterday on Sky News Australia – currently available to watch, free, on YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zk11vI-7czE
I’m sure most of it will be leftie dross, but… it really smashes the idea of renewable energy, and is in turn getting smashed by the left. Apparently, according to the doco, renewable energy is a scam, nor beneficial to the planet, only to the fat cats getting rich from it. Basically, we’d be better off just burning coal. Plan to watch it tonight, and share it will all my greenie friends. Can’t wait.
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April 27, 2020 11:33am
- Ruahine
  
  It should be compulsory viewing in all of our secondary schools and on the Gov’t run Media.
  It is an eye opener and thought provoking.
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:57am
- Fletch
  
  I’ve heard it’s good… up to the point he starts talking about population control? I will have to watch it and find out.
  
  https://earther.gizmodo.com/planet-of-the-humans-comes-this-close-to-actually-getti-1843024329
  
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  April 27, 2020 12:15pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  Some guy at the UN yesterday was saying that airlines should only receive government bailouts if they agree to switch to biofuels. I did some back of the envelope calculations based on available data about biofuel energy density. There is no airplane engine that can run on 100% biofuel. But if one were developed, you would need 1,200 hectares of corn to produce enough biofuel for a single flight in a 777-300 from Auckland to Los Angeles.
  
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  April 27, 2020 12:23pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Obvious conclusion is that he’s from the left, no ability to do math, and he’s an idiot which is a prerequisite to joining the troughers at the UN.
    
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    April 27, 2020 2:55pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Not through yet but must say: I’m really enjoying all those down-to-earth engineers who actually give honest answers about the fossil fuels needed to produce solar panels, batteries, and create a base because of the wind and solar intermittency.
  
  Often when Moore turns up, people just slam the door in his face!
  
  I’d just about given up on Moore after some of his daft projects, but good on him for looking for honest answers re green energy.
  
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  April 27, 2020 1:30pm
  - Nickc2
    
    Exactly and without taxpayer subsidies, these alternate power sources would not exist. It’s all a scam!
    
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    April 27, 2020 1:46pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Right, but his point is that huge numbers of humans using huge amounts of any type of energy long term is unrealistic.
      
      Many people in Europe saw this back in the 80s and decided not to have children (the cold war also discouraged people from reproducing). Unfortuntately, plenty of other people had more children and no gradual and voluntary reduction in population size could occur overall.
      
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      April 27, 2020 2:06pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Good points Moore makes:
  1. So-called renewable energy sources use huge amounts of fossil fuels and other non-renewable resources during their production and to back them up when wind or sun aren’t available.
  
  2. The biofuel industry is destroying forests and turning diverse environments into monocultures for biofuels such as sugar cane fields.
  
  3. Investment companies have jumped on the ‘green’ bandwagon and are fooling the public with claims of biofuels, solar and wind being able to replace fossil fuels at anywhere near our current energy use.
  
  4. Human numbers and energy consumption are simply too large to be maintained at current levels.
  
  Ozzie Zehner (author of Green Illusions: The Dirty Secrets of Clean Energy and the Future of Environmentalism) makes interesting points about how delusional people are when they buy electric cars:
  
  “My article considers how electric cars merely shift negative impacts from one place to another. Most electric-car assessments analyze only the charging of the car. This is an important factor indeed. But a more rigorous analysis would consider the environmental impacts over the vehicle’s entire life cycle, from its construction through its operation and on to its eventual retirement at the junkyard.” https://ozziezehner.com/
  
  I think Moore is wrong to try to repeatedly simply blame ‘capitalism’ and ‘billionaires’ for all this. Yeah, like communist states have been shining examples of environmentalism!
  
  I think the blame goes to every virtue-signalling hypocrite who thinks they are achieving something by investing in dubious ‘green’ projects and buying themselves an electric car.
  
  This has be obvious for a long time, but don’t try telling them that, because they are so up themselves with moral superiority that they won’t listen.
  
  And I have delusional friends who live on their lifestyle blocks and take long commutes in SUVs (of course electric cars won’t go the distance) but consider themselves wonderfully green for growing a caterpillar-riddled lettuce and having a couple of solar panels installed. Or one who smugly informs me that there is ‘no plastic in this house’, although fossil fuels are used throughout the house in furniture, paint, insulation and the whole building process. And then they’ve off in their SUV again for the commute to town…
  
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  April 27, 2020 4:03pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    One more point about Moore’s dislike of ‘capitalism’. Does Moore mean we should live under communism and government should run trade?
    
    There is nothing wrong with a free market economy with people exchanging services and achieving a decent maintenance-level amount of business (i.e. not trying to unrealistically achieve unlimited growth).
    
    This is exactly the type of economy we’re losing right now, while we’re locked in our houses.
    
    Big companies and government departments take over when communities lose that kind of decent maintenance-level small business.
    
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    April 27, 2020 4:12pm
Garbageman

Have you noticed since Stuff now has the begging bowl out on every article that their climate change statement has changed from we know all and will accept no counter arguments to this new one,.

“This story is a part of Covering Climate Now’s week of coverage focused on Climate Solutions, to mark the 50th anniversary of Earth Day. Covering Climate Now is a global journalism collaboration committed to strengthening coverage of the climate story”

I guess running an online dictatorship and telling people how to think becomes a secondary consideration when folks have had enough of your bullshit and the cash flow dries up or maybe they now realize their kowtowed audience is mostly comprised of weak minded broke assed sycophants that are only good for raging online while claiming they are Nat supporters and have now decided to water down their climate cult to appeal to those that might actually reach into their wallets & i really hate to say this about my fellow Kiwis but you made your bed now go lie with the fleas that so admire you the rest of us will get our news from the thousands of other sources available, so good luck Stuff (not really) you are going to need it.
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April 27, 2020 12:05pm
- Tony Stuart
  
  They can keep holding out the begging bowl on every post, for all I care. I am not going to contribute to a media organisation which has an editorial policy to cover only one viewpoint on a serious and contentious issue.
  
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  April 27, 2020 12:30pm
  - Harriet
    
    I think everyone who is opposed to the one sided reporting by the MSM should ring up the Police association and ask for a subscription for 10-4 [or whatever the police mag in NZ is now called]. And give them the reason why you are doing so.
    
    If the police association then ends up with more subscribers than newspapers etc. do — then it is simply then a ‘reasonable minded argument’ for not voting at all in November.
    
    And then the police minister might pull his fucken finger out regarding road blockades by the fucken Mongrel Mob. 😎
    
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    April 27, 2020 12:54pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘Most of New Zealand’s major news outlets – Stuff, New Zealand Herald, TVNZ, RNZ, Newsroom and the Spinoff – are joining the likes of the Guardian, Scientific American, CBS News, La Republica, and the Lancet in committing themselves to a week of special reporting on climate change.’
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/mediawatch/audio/2018709007/media-s-worldwide-push-for-climate-change-coverage
  
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  April 27, 2020 12:37pm
  - Sacha
    
    Well, they need to find something else to rave about, now that we’re all losing interest in viruses. Another month with no TV –
    
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    April 27, 2020 3:02pm
- Garbageman
  
  Finally found it had to go back 2 years thought it had been scrubbed wonder why they didn’t keep this one though it was how they operated before the begging bowl came out
  “Stuff accepts the overwhelming scientific consensus that climate change is real and caused by human activity. We welcome robust debate about the appropriate response to climate change, but do not intend to provide a venue for denialism or hoax advocacy. That applies equally to the stories we will publish in Quick! Save the Planet and to our moderation standards for reader comments.”
  
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  April 27, 2020 12:51pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  The climate will reveal itself within the next few years. The lower neutron flux is expected to take us in a lengthy blankets-required period.
  An expert without error bars is a failure.
  
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  April 27, 2020 1:00pm
Close Hen Counters

Would love to be fly on wall at royal oak roundabout tomorrow – one of most hazardous roundabouts in auckland …. maccas on Mt Albert road side and KFC kinda opposite Onehunga side … the queues to get takeouts will be horrendous ( and pak n save thrown in the mix). Hope they think to get a couple of cops to help traffic control yeah nah
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April 27, 2020 12:33pm
- MCos
  
  ‘Would love to be fly on wall at royal oak roundabout’
  Things are pretty desperate when you want to watch a roundabout.
  
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  April 27, 2020 1:35pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Mike, is that you? Using Mcos’s account?
    
    3 3
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    April 27, 2020 3:10pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMK7lYXunRc
Fourth Reich waters down CCP virus report. China warns
Them not to take President Trumps’ side. Fourth Reich
Leaders are fighting over the correct CCP virus response.
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April 27, 2020 12:46pm
curry4me

https://nypost.com/2020/04/26/sen-cotton-says-chinese-students-shouldnt-learn-science-in-us/
Senator Cotton says Chinese ‘students’ should be barred from studying science in the USA.
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April 27, 2020 12:46pm
- Alex13
  
  Although I agree with Sen. Cotton’s opinion, his views are too narrow: “don’t mix incompatibles” goes a lot farther than that…
  
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  April 27, 2020 4:44pm
Batman

Posted this link above but worth covering it better here. A very interesting look into the push for Chloroquine drugs and experts resisting that rush.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/04/internal-documents-reveal-team-trumps-chloroquine-master-plan

“In an internal consensus statement, a medical countermeasures group within Health and Human Services recommended that chloroquine-based COVID-19 treatments should be studied only in controlled, hospital-based clinical trials, as their safety and efficacy was “not supported by data from reliable clinical trials or from non-human primates” and carried “potential risks.” The medicines—which are used to treat malaria as well as autoimmune conditions such as lupus—can have serious side effects, including heart arrhythmias.”

“the National Institutes of Health issued detailed treatment guidelines, stating, “There are insufficient clinical data to recommend either for or against using chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine for the treatment of COVID-19.” The agency advised clinicians using the drugs to closely monitor patients for adverse effects, particularly cardiac risks.”
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April 27, 2020 1:12pm
- rangitoto
  
  “The agency advised clinicians using the drugs to closely monitor patients for adverse effects”
  
  Rather pointless. Any clinician would already know that. Even pundits on Kiwiblog.
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:13pm
dave_c_

This link explains how this corona virus was planned, and forms the framework for world wide totalitarianism.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/seven-step-path-pandemic-totalitarianism
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April 27, 2020 1:14pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  We are at Step 2, heading into Step 3
  
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  April 27, 2020 1:43pm
  - gorse
    
    Step 4
    
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    April 27, 2020 1:49pm
Sol Invictus

Just finished watching the ‘stand-up’. Not one question related to business or the economy. The press corps should be ashamed of their performance.
30 1
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April 27, 2020 1:48pm
- Jack5
  
  The press ~~corps~~ corpse.
  
  28 2
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  April 27, 2020 2:00pm
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Yep, that sums it up nicely.
    
    18 2
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    April 27, 2020 2:13pm
- rangitoto
  
  Business reporters are specifically not permitted to attend the briefings.
  
  19 3
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  April 27, 2020 2:14pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Reporters are specifically not permitted to attend the briefings, just sycophantic children.
    
    18 4
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    April 27, 2020 2:41pm
- Alex13
  
  What did you want to know / get asked? Some businesses (e.g., tourism / travel related) are impacted by the pandemic in a very hard way. The nearly 5 week shutdown will have a detrimental impact on most other businesses. There’s not many businesses that benefit from a pandemic.
  
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  April 27, 2020 4:28pm
Fletch

During the daily briefing by the PM and Ashley Bloomfield just now, some reporter asked Ashley Bloomfield about whether it was OK to drink bleach.. What a waste of time and totally unnecessary. I hope you feel better now, getting in your cheap shot.

These aren’t journalists. They are anti-Trump liberal advocates.
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April 27, 2020 1:52pm
- Tall Man
  
  So no more water purifying tablets? No more quick splash of janola to neutralise the possum shit?
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:39pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  What was the answer?
  I missed today’s brainwashing – sorry NZ
  
  12 2
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  April 27, 2020 3:13pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    We have had 1122 confirmed cases…and 1180 recovered cases
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/415226/one-new-confirmed-case-of-covid-19-today-but-one-further-death
    (at 16:25)
    
    Thus we have a surplus of 58 recovered folks.
    
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    April 27, 2020 3:29pm
    - MCos
      
      According to the article
      1469 confirmed & probable
      1180 recovered
      270 active
      
      Ashley Bloomfield is a doctor not a mathematician!
      
      3 1
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      April 27, 2020 5:11pm
      - Herodotus
        
        1469-1180-270 = 19 What are the numbers of those who have died 19 !! Similar number I think the Dr is better at maths than MCos ?
        
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        April 27, 2020 6:38pm
      - MCos
        
        Quite right!
        
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        April 27, 2020 8:21pm
      - Herodotus
        
        ?
        
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        April 27, 2020 8:51pm
  - Fletch
    
    In regards to suggestions that people should inject themselves with bleach, Bloomfield chose not to comment.
    
    He paused for a while.
    
    “Under no circumstances should they even think about doing that,” he said.
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/121288894/coronavirus-update-final-official-covid19-briefing-ahead-of-level-3
    
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    April 27, 2020 4:01pm
    - Batman
      
      Entirely reasonable answer to be fair.
      
      5 1
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      April 27, 2020 4:04pm
      - Fletch
        
        Right. But it was the question that was totally unprofessional and unnecessary. It was grandstanding to take a swipe at Trump.
        
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        April 27, 2020 4:26pm
- Alex13
  
  How else can you introduce a disinfectant into your body? Trump was not clear on that. Maybe intravenously? And shine a strong light up your backside at the same time? – According to the President, that should eradicate the coronavirus!
  
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  April 27, 2020 4:21pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Or this maybe?
    
    https://www.infectioncontroltoday.com/infections/uv-light-may-prevent-infections-catheters-cardiac-drivelines
    
    2 2
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    April 27, 2020 8:00pm
    - fernglas
      
      You do understand the difference between bacteria and viruses, don’t you?
      
      2 1
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      April 27, 2020 8:27pm
Tony Stuart

Stuff: Here’s a story about Art and Matilda’s dead cat. Aren’t we scraping the barrel?

Reporter at the 1pm presser, asking about drinking bleach: Hold my soy latte!
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April 27, 2020 2:03pm
Centrist

A couple of quick questions re level 3 (3.9):
Any clarification would help. The info online certainly doesn’t.

1. We can now travel/drive in our “region”. What is a region? Is it a province etc, or just part of a town/city? Can we drive 3, 30, or 300 km each way on a trip? The ambiguity is very frustrating.

2. It says we can “join bubbles”, but only 1 or 2 people can join another bubble. I’m in a bubble (I hate the term) of 5 (wife, 3 kids and yours truly). Does that mean no one can join our bubble (my wife and I were thinking of joining with either parents) as there are already 5 of us? It is as clear as mud.
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April 27, 2020 2:09pm
- rangitoto
  
  At least one of the neighbours and their friends around here has been totally ignoring the rules for at least the last week.
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:25pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  I have also looked at the “rules”. You are correct. They are ambiguous. Which is not totally bad because it allows you to mount a credible defence if challenged.
  
  On (1) you can drive regionally for recreation. I live in Christchurch. So I am looking forward to driving to Akaroa (80 km). I might get away with driving to Hamner Springs (130 km) but that would be at the edge of credibility. Queenstown (490 km) would not be allowed.
  
  On (2) there are no hard and fast rules. Your bubble of five could join with one or two other bubbles. However, the more people in your combined bubble, the less credible it becomes. You only need to get one person infected for everyone to get infected. So 4 x bubbles of five would not be credible.
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:26pm
- Steve Todd
  
  Centrist: There is an expression known as “common sense”.
  
  There are 16 regions in New Zealand. Let’s take, as an example, the Wellington region. Tomorrow, thousands of people are going to travel into Wellington from the Kāpiti Coast, Porirua and the Hutt Valley. They will be travelling within their region.
  
  In South Taranaki, there will be people travelling into Whanganui, to work, and there will be people travelling from, say, Marton to Palmerston North, for the same purpose. Both sets of people will be travelling between regions. For goodness sake, it’s not hard.
  
  Regarding your 2. You can join/merge bubbles if you are going to be a caregiver, or if you are an isolated person (in a one-person bubble) joining with another bubble. Neither appears to be the case, in your case.
  
  Would you have embarrassed yourself in this way had Winston selected Bill? I suspect not.
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:41pm
  - alwyn
    
    That is how I plan to interpret it.
    My Region is that area covered by the Wellington Regional Council, if any officious member of Ardern’s Cossacks wants to know. Just common sense.
    That covers the area from the South Coast up to Otaki on the west and up to Mt Bruce and Castlepoint on the East.
    Sounds about right to me.
    
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    April 27, 2020 3:21pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  It is meant to be as clear as mud. The swamp is full of mud
  
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  April 27, 2020 3:15pm
Benedict Yu

“Ardern said she was “looking forward” to supporting small retailers who have been unable to open during alert level four, and “showing them a bit of love”.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/121289245/coronavirus-count-down-to-level-3-with-1-million-kiwis-expected-back-at-work

Ugh 🙁
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April 27, 2020 2:18pm
- chukar
  
  Yep Twyford is not allowing Councils to freeze or reduce rates.
  That’s real love!
  
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  April 27, 2020 7:43pm
pct

https://www.smh.com.au/world/oceania/saint-jacinda-ardern-s-lockdown-has-not-silenced-her-critics-20200424-p54n37.html

At last look this hadnt been posted on the Stuff website yet its been written by their Political Editor?
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April 27, 2020 2:21pm
- kevn
  
  @pct… The article has been edited from it’s first outing.
  There was a pic of JA in full denial mode.
  Gone.
  
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  April 27, 2020 2:51pm
Harriet

“……Today’s Newspoll showed Morrison’s popularity skyrocketing to 68%, up from only 41% in March.

The smartest thing Morrison did (for himself, not necessarily for Australians) was suggest an excessive six-month timeframe to lift the strict restrictions…..”

Cindy will gain momentum coming out of the full lockdown all the way to the election, and it will be in the wrong direction. 😎
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April 27, 2020 2:24pm
- barnacle bill
  
  @Harriet
  
  Have you always been a negative person Harriet ?
  I have noticed almost all your posts have been in that vane.
  
  Negativity is not good for ones health.
  
  4 17
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  April 27, 2020 2:59pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Possidivity is now in fashion eh?
    
    10 4
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    April 27, 2020 4:00pm
  - Harriet
    
    “….Have you always been a negative person Harriet ?…”
    
    Not lately, I’m actually on top of the world, currently I live under the Prime ministership of Scott Morrison.
    
    How’s your 1 month free trial of communism going in $NZ ? 😎
    
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    April 27, 2020 4:21pm
    - barnacle bill
      
      @Harriet.
      
      Obviously you don’t know what the word Communism means.
      
      I bet you will be back in this country once you find out that you will get nothing out of the Australian Govt.
      
      4 12
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      April 27, 2020 5:04pm
      - Tall Man
        
        Rubbish, absolute rubbish. My son is in Oz and his business has received all the same payouts as other similar businesses.
        
        If someone chooses to live in Australia long term and also chooses to not become a citizen of that country then fuckem.
        
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        April 27, 2020 8:12pm
      - barnacle bill
        
        OK Harriet.
        
        Whatever..
        
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        April 27, 2020 9:09pm
  - Tall Man
    
    ardern is not good for the health of many.
    
    5 4
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    April 27, 2020 8:03pm
    - barnacle bill
      
      That’s you beef isn’t it.
      You cannot stand a successful female running this country.
      
      I really think you must suffer from extreme jealousy
      in your every day life.
      
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      April 27, 2020 9:14pm
  - Gazza the Giant
    
    The thing is , Sco Mo did not shut down his economy , he will be seen as a smart leader , our PM [mod edited] refused the shut down the border on March 1 like the experts keeps saying , including Bloomfield , and then she completely over reacts and smashes the whole economy down with a heavy demolition ball , for the record , we shut 87% of our economy , Aussie shut down 42% , and if you think our busted economy will just ramp back up , when its shattered on the floor , then your deluded , hence the back tracking of her popularity as people start to lose their jobs and their houses , nothing will stop this now , even if people do a 6 month stand down , they will still go to the wall thanks to Princess
    
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    April 27, 2020 11:55pm
Yvette

As the country continues to battle against the COVID-19 pandemic and its economic fallout, the Māori King has placed a rāhui on Waikato and Waipā Rivers to allow the waterways to rejuvenate during “these trying times”.
Kiingi Tūheitia Pōtatau Te Wherowhero VII announced the rāhui during his weekly speech on Sunday.
“For many people here in Waikato, our rivers and waterways are a source of spiritual uplifting,” Kiingi Tūheitia said.
“During these trying times I am placing a rāhui on the Waikato, Waipā Rivers and our waterways so they can rejuvenate and remain a source of inspiration for your collective wairua.
“I ask all marae and Kaumātua near our rivers to please enact this rāhui.”

The rāhui means that no recreational activity – including swimming and other water sports – can take place on the waterways.
It will stay in effect until lifted by Kiingi Tūheitia [1]

If the Government didn’t condone Maori covid-19 area roadblocks, would Kiingi Tūheitia Pōtatau Te Wherowhero VII still feel emboldened to call this rāhui, or does he in fact rule over these rivers and have the right to do what he has done?
And what is the consequence of breaking the rāhui?

[1] https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/04/coronavirus-m-ori-king-places-r-hui-on-waikato-and-waip-rivers-amid-covid-19.html
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April 27, 2020 2:49pm
- Nickc2
  
  How much money is he asking to lift this thing? Can it be challenged in court and what are the consequences for a non Maori swimming in any of these waters? Last I heard, nobody owns water in NZ.
  
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  April 27, 2020 3:27pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  The waters also come from as far away as Taupo.
  Maori need to be put firmly in their place.
  
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  April 27, 2020 3:59pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    What a horribly nasty comment. Just where, Kev, do you suggest is the ‘place’ for Maori?
    
    2 18
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    April 27, 2020 4:26pm
    - marcw
      
      How about the same place as all other NZers. Not in some privileged mystical fantasy world they expect us to support them in.
      
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      April 27, 2020 5:08pm
- cmm
  
  Cool.
  
  With all this upliftment from the Taniwha, they won’t be needing that special $52M handout from the taxpayer.
  
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  April 27, 2020 4:02pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  You can see that just north of the village of Taupiri. People may swim in the Mangawhara River under the new bridge on the new expressway, but they must not swim in that river immediately downstream from the old Highway One bridge. Because just downstream of the old Highway One bridge the Mangawhara becomes the Waikato and that is sacred.
  Oh Lord, please spare me from this crap.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:10pm
MrTips

I posted on this stupidity yesterday. Now the WHO has had to backtrack over their nonsense claim re post-COVID immunity: https://mobile.twitter.com/WHO/status/1254160944638447618

Tedros me ol’ chum. Time for you and your crew to slip quietly away and let somebody sensible take over.
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April 27, 2020 2:53pm
- cmm
  
  Tedros should go hide out in Zimbabwe. Unfortunately for him his BFF Robert Mugabe is now dead.
  
  That this guy is head of WHO is up there with Saudis being in charge of the human rights group an UN.
  
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  April 27, 2020 4:00pm
wilderbeast

Anyone know more about this Iwi blockade of Taranaki regional boundaries as reported by the Spinoff? apparently it’s supported by police….the longer this goes on the more I think I might pull up stumps and leave this shambles….if I was allowed out…
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April 27, 2020 2:58pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  I’m going to see my nephew in Waitara. I will have to travel over that torturous Ohura-Tongaporutu road to get there. That way I avoid the road blocks at Mokau, Whangamomona and Patea.
  If I believed in taniwha I would know there are only three ways into Taranaki.
  
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  April 27, 2020 8:30pm
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    They took heed of my comment and changed Mokau to Urenui.
    
    0 0
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    April 28, 2020 9:07am
RW Capitalist

Anyone else see, on TV last night.
The demo of a “bar code” entry into a building?
They have a bar code at the door, you take a photo of it on your phone, send to the occupant if you have the AP and it opens the door.
Any one else scared by this denial of access, if you don’t fit their criteria?
2020 version of a yellow star?
19 5
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April 27, 2020 3:09pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Great, another Nazi reference.
  
  4 22
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  April 27, 2020 4:28pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    another nazi/stazi action.
    
    16 4
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    April 27, 2020 5:00pm
  - marcw
    
    Oh dear, triggered Mikey? Have a lie down and a rest.
    
    14 4
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    April 27, 2020 5:06pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Just saddened that people could compare a public health measure to Nazi persecutions.
      
      3 19
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      April 27, 2020 5:09pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Oh.. I thought the Nazis were into Public Health Measures…
        
        In the Name of Public Health — Nazi Racial Hygiene
        https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/07192004-nazi-racial-hygiene-bachrach.pdf
        
        13 1
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        April 27, 2020 5:42pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Now, now Maggy, I respect your opinion too much to think you believe our lock-down conditions are comparable to Nazi Germany.
        
        1 17
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        April 27, 2020 5:45pm
      - chaos
        
        Still trying to twist maggy’s post I see
        
        11 2
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        April 27, 2020 6:34pm
Poppa

What I would like to know is what is the outcome of the 350 odd probable cases. Negative or positive?

I know they want those counted because it blows up the numbers, but there is a smell around that
13 3
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April 27, 2020 4:18pm
- chaos
  
  I had no idea what probable was until the other day when Bloomfield was asked a question and he said basically it was where they suspected the person had the virus but for any reason wasnt tested. One of his examples was a child living in a house with confirmed cases but not tested because the test is too uncomfortable for a child.
  
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  April 27, 2020 5:17pm
- Prince
  
  The numbers are now being ‘massaged’ as it was too embarrassing to have gone through this trauma and ended up close to Australia.
  Expect more ‘definition clarifications’ for the next few days.
  Note how the deaths are now consigned to the middle of Bloomfield’s update. That tells me quite a lot about him.
  
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  April 27, 2020 6:02pm
oldfella

So, Adern is outed as an app sceptic, but the CoL will introduce one anyway. Not on the front page of Stuffed, but in the SMH.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/coronavirus-updates-live-covidsafe-app-goes-live-as-global-covid-19-cases-near-3-million-australian-death-toll-stands-at-83-20200426-p54nep.html
6 1
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April 27, 2020 4:38pm
- gorse
  
  And, hopefully, vote with the same attitude.
  
  4 1
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  April 27, 2020 7:37pm
- Gazza the Giant
  
  What would she know , she is a sceptic of billionaires having to put up 50 mill to get residency here ,. the 50 mill had to be productive , and can never leave the country
  
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  April 27, 2020 11:57pm
lifesgood

The traffic on my road today has been constant. I think the public are saying “F**k it”
10 2
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April 27, 2020 6:05pm
info@cruzpro.com

Why is scuba diving not allowed at lockdown level 3?

Swimming is allowed, cycling is allowed, driving is allowed, mountain biking is allowed.

In New Zealand 9 scuba divers a year end up in hospital or dead. 10 cyclist are killed a year (many more just hospitalized). 165 swimmers drown (dead) per year.

I won’t even go into the road toll or driving accident count.

I have never cursed on this blog site but am getting really close.

Who comes up with these rules? I assume that the rules are there to protect the emergency services that have to respond. I spent only a few minutes researching to get the above facts. Can’t the rule makers, who get paid, spend a little time to research the facts before they make these stupid rules?
10 2
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April 27, 2020 6:30pm
- chaos
  
  Easy answer, not a real doctor or a real minister of health David Clark doesn’t scuba dive so he has no need to allow it
  
  7 1
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  April 27, 2020 6:46pm
RW Capitalist

So…2 days ago, they said 1000000 people would go back to work.
On TV1 news tonight, that appears to have gone down to 400000
WOW they lost 600000 workers…..in the numbers.
TRUST starts with honesty Jacinda.
12 2
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April 27, 2020 6:45pm
- Poppa
  
  Yeah they know you can never count them so they can say whatever sounds vaguely good
  
  6 1
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  April 27, 2020 7:48pm
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    100,000 houses . . .
    A billion trees . . .
    No need to lie in politics . . .
    Open and transparent . . .
    Hard and fast . . .
    Etc. etc. etc. . . .
    
    5 1
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    April 27, 2020 8:23pm
- fernglas
  
  The fear-mongering about this virus has scared so many people that I would be surprised if anybody went back to work
  
  5 1
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  April 27, 2020 8:31pm
Fletch

I see that media worldwide are reporting Ardern saying that NZ has beaten the virus. I sure hope she is right….
4 2
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April 27, 2020 9:24pm
- Gazza the Giant
  
  Then why cant we go back to the pub ?
  
  1 1
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  April 27, 2020 11:59pm
chaos

And yet our second biggest cluster was a school

* Schools will be safe when they reopen because children do not generally spread coronavirus, according to two public health experts.

Schools are due to reopen on Wednesday this week as New Zealand moves to level 3 of the Covid-19 alert system. *

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/121291657/coronavirus-reopening-schools-as-safe-as-ever-health-experts-say
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April 27, 2020 9:53pm
Tony Stuart

Dr David bloody Clark eh…

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12328085

Will Jacinda Ardern give him the wet bus ticket treatment again, or will she finally cut him loose?
1 1
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April 28, 2020 7:48pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  There’s a separate thread devoted to this scandal, Tony,
  
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  April 28, 2020 8:05pm
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Cheers; started to post, then got a lengthy phone call. I had checked initially.
    
    2 0
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    April 28, 2020 8:22pm

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