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March 4, 2020 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 4 March 2020

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General Debate

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Pete George

The Abortion Legislation Bill had it’s Second Reading debate last night and passed on a personal (conscience) vote easily, 81-39.

There is strong opposition but that’s from a minority. It looks like the Bill should get right through Parliament, with or without NZ First MP votes who want it to go to a referendum (I don’t think ithat’ss necessary).

A summary of the speeches both for and against the Bill.
https://yournz.org/2020/03/04/abortion-legislation-bill-passes-second-reading-81-39/
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March 4, 2020 8:06am
- Pete George
  
  Hansard with full speech transcripts and who voted for and against:
  https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20200303_20200303_16
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:09am
  - Simon
    
    Any updates from one month ago when you claimed Trump had fallen into Iran’s trap?
    
    Didnt know you were an Iranian expert?
    
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    March 4, 2020 8:11am
    - Pete George
      
      I don’t know much about Iran. And you are wrong about me claiming anything.
      
      All I did (was post (in January) different reports on what was happening. It included:
      Attack on U.S. Embassy in Iraq Shows Trump Is Failing Wendy Sherman, USA Today “He walked into Iran’s trap.”
      
      It was clear it wasn’t my words.
      
      Preceding that was:
      Trump Calls the Ayatollah’s Bluff Matthew Continetti, Washington Free Beacon
      “The successful operation against Qassem Soleimani, head of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard, is a stunning blow to international terrorism and a reassertion of American might.”
      
      So you have cherry picked one quote and falsely attributed it to me, and ignored other quotes with different opinions.
      
      All I said responded with “All we can do is watch and hope it doesn’t get too nasty or widespread.”
      
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      March 4, 2020 11:18am
- Scott
  
  Well thank the Lord that there is at least some MPs who will vote against this terrible bill. By taking abortion out of the crimes act, the unborn child now has no legal protection. Having an abortion will become like any other medical procedure, such as having a tumour cut out.
  
  It is amazing to me that liberals who just love people and just love to embrace the marginalised and the underdog, are so adamant that the most vulnerable person, the unborn child, will have no legal protection and no rights under the law??
  
  Thankfully Christians and people of sound moral values are appalled by this. How is it that an unborn child, at say six months, can now be aborted if this bill goes through, with the agreement of the mother, her doctor and another doctor, that this is all okay? Does no one see that this is a travesty???
  
  How can you be a moral person and believe that a baby in the womb, because that is what it is after six months or seven months or eight months, has no rights and no legal protection and no personhood? How can you?
  
  This is a terrible bill and a terrible blow to our nation. We are literally killing the next generation. We are literally in a suicide pact.
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:21am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    This is where I do agree with NZF. It should go to a binding referendum. I know plenty of liberals who support the existing legislation but would vote against this bill because of allowing late term abortion.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:04am
    - Pete George
      
      “because of allowing late term abortion”
      
      The bill allows those in very limited circumstances only, where the health of the women is a deciding factor. Do people really think that the law should dictate that a woman can’t have an abortion if her life is in danger?
      
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      March 4, 2020 9:14am
      - Two fish and a scoop thanks Cindy
        
        #SafeLegalAndRare
        
        /sarc.
        
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        March 4, 2020 9:37am
      - David Garrett
        
        PG: You are aware that 90% of the abortions performed now are on “health of the woman” grounds don’t you?
        
        But a wider point: Is your own blog so underread that you have to shill here??
        
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        March 4, 2020 9:40am
      - MrTips
        
        Pete
        go and find out how many woman have an abortion because their life is GENUINELY in danger. Then find out how many of those are late in the term.
        until then – cut out the strawman arguments based on emotion, not facts.
        
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        March 4, 2020 9:41am
      - Phronesis
        
        .
        
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        March 4, 2020 9:42am
      - Pete George
        
        DG: I’m aware that now all women and girls who want an abortion have to claim they are for medical grounds, which is a well known sham – I presume you know that.
        
        This always some who whinge about linking to more detailed information (ignorant of the fundamental nature of the world wide web, or just being petty), but there are more who are interested in it and with just a brief summary here.
        
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        March 4, 2020 10:09am
      - Local Miller
        
        The “health of the mother” is a hollow argument. Neonatal Maternal death rates in NZ are in the 2 – 8 per 100,000 range, and the most common cause is suicide.
        This article is a few years old (2018), but the figures should have improved since then, not got worse. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12077499
        The “health of the mother” is just a catch all so a woman can get an abortion if there’s no identifiable issue.
        We have become a society that is sacrificing our children on the alter of our selfish desires, and are no better than the Romans were the father was (supposedly) able to reject a child and it would be killed. We have become barbarians killing the helpless, and we will pay a steep price one day.
        
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        March 4, 2020 10:57am
      - Michael NZ
        
        I call Bullshit Pete.
        It always was based on the mental health of the mother.
        Your inference would mean only 1 or 2 a year.
        
        But that’s not what the Law reads……
        
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        March 4, 2020 12:09pm
      - MCos
        
        Approx 0.4% of abortions were performed after the twentieth week of pregnancy last year. That is 57.
        https://nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12255624
        60% before the tenth week.
        
        Abortions in NZ have decreased markedly since the beginning of this century. It doesn’t take much imagination to figure out why that should be.
        https://www.stats.govt.nz/information-releases/abortion-statistics-year-ended-december-2018
        
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        March 4, 2020 12:29pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        PG, stop making things up. What health grounds make neccesary for a woman to have an abortion at 35 weeks.
        
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        March 4, 2020 12:55pm
      - Pete George
        
        Chuck, at 35 weeks it wouldn’t be an abortion being considered. It would be rare (if not never) that anyone would be considering a straight abortion after 20 or so weeks, and certainly not after 22-24 weeks when birth viability begins.
        
        If there are health issues at that (35 week) stage of a pregnancy then the mother has chosen to try to go to full term and have a birth. She should be informed of the health (and potentially death) implications for her and any unborn children. As in any health situation she should then be able to decide what is done about it.
        
        As a man I can’t contemplate what it would be like having to weigh up the risks to ones own life against the risks to an unborn child.
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:20pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        PG, are you claiming that there is no woman who found her partner was cheating on he would not have a abortion to hurt him?
        
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        March 4, 2020 3:06pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        “As a man I can’t contemplate what it would be like having to weigh up the risks to ones own life against the risks to an unborn child.”
        
        As an fully developed adult I can not contemplate what it would be like for a 35 week unborn child to be torn apart.
        
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        March 4, 2020 3:14pm
      - Pete George
        
        I’m not surprised. It would be difficult to contemplate something that doesn’t happen beyond the imaginations of scaremongers or scaremongered.
        
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        March 4, 2020 3:24pm
    - Sacha
      
      I would not support ‘late term’ abortion.
      I remember the original Abortion Law Reform Act, and the resistance encountered by the reformers. Back then, it was mostly to try and make abortions safer by taking them away from the back-yard operators. (I worked in a Women’s emergency ward at Wellington Hospital, and we saw plenty of women admitted for post abortion care – often 1 or 2 in an evening shift, and especially on a Friday . Ironically, the other patients admitted were women who arrived in labour, having not had any antenatal care.) The ‘pill’ was just being introduced, but was only considered safe for women who had ‘completed’ their families.
      Of course there are arguments galore – what about the men involved and why should the woman always be the one responsible? What about the moral aspect, the sanctity of human life, religious beliefs, and so on.
      
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      March 4, 2020 11:08am
      - Batman
        
        What about late term if the pregnancy threatens to seriously harm or kill the mother?
        
        That’s where I think we need a pathway for doctors to perform one in such situations.
        
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        March 4, 2020 11:15am
      - Ed Snack
        
        If, late term, there is a serious threat to the life of the mother AND the fetus is viable, it can of course be delivered by Caesarean section.
        
        My sister was pregnant with twins and had severe pre-eclampsia that was potentially life threatening. Went into hospital but it suddenly flared up to critical so they did an emergency Caesar at just on 24 weeks – youngest surviving twins in NZ for a few years.
        
        Complicated and dangerous for all, but can be done. May result in death as not all very prem babies survive, but if they are viable and not known to be severely handicapped then an abortion after, say 24 weeks, is unnecessary unless the intention is to not have the child survive.
        
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        March 4, 2020 11:37am
      - Batman
        
        Ed that is not what I was aiming at. I was not talking about situations where a foetus can survive outside the womb. I’m talking about unviable situations. You appear to have intentionally dodged the point by talking about c sections and your own personal story.
        
        So I take it that you don’t have a good answer other that you’d rather women die than have a doctor perform a sadly necessary medical procedure.
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:12pm
      - Ed Snack
        
        You miss read Batman, try the first sentence with its prominent AND. I’m picking on a specific situation, viable child in the womb and a life-threatening situation.
        
        There’s always a balancing situation that doctors perform in such cases, sometimes an emergency Caesar is not possible.
        
        But if the fetus, regardless of the gestation point, is not viable, again there’s no real argument. Another personal anecdote, a sad one this time, an acquaintance’s wife was pregnant but by about week 24 something was obviously wrong – eventually diagnosed as microcephaly – basically the brain did not develop. It was alive as the hind brain did develop so the autonomous functions existed, but nothing else. Terminated at around 32 weeks, and who could argue ? Carried to term it might last weeks or even months, but no functioning brain it is never going to be a person. And there are other defects with similar outcomes.
        
        So to argue that I insist on carrying to term regardless is simply being obtuse.
        
        But a healthy fetus at, say, 30 weeks, do you think it has zero independent rights and is entirely dependent on the mother to decide ? Even though if delivered it would probably survive and be able to live as a human ? What about at 40 weeks, just terminate at will, ? What about 40 weeks and a botched abortion so it is born alive and viable – just kill then and there ? This by the way is the position of the mainstream abortion left in the USA – an abortion is always possible until birth, and if the decision was to abort the “thing” can be killed even if born alive if the mother so wishes.
        
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        March 4, 2020 3:26pm
  - MrTips
    
    Scott – absolutely right. And to make it even worse, the logical conclusion of this bill is that children in the womb have NO rights at all.
    
    So why is there going to be no change to the other part of the Crimes Act with reference to injury/endangerment to children whereby the mother is attacked? Does it REALLY come down to whether mum wants the child or not? If so, why stop at in the womb. There is no logical reason not allow murder of children up til say 2.
    
    This law says Peter Singer is right.
    
    May God have mercy on the 81 who voted yes.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:45am
    - Michael NZ
      
      No Mr Tips, I disagree, they are adults, let them have the mercy they’ve shown the unborn children.
      
      We will reap what they have sown as a country and as a society.
      
      Abortion to medically save the mother is fine, but lifestyle abortions are murder.
      
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      March 4, 2020 12:14pm
      - Crisplion
        
        Sorry Michael but whatever moral position one occupies on abortion, your two assertions sem to me to be incompatible.
        
        If abortion on a whim is murder then how can any abortion be “fine”? The first implies that foetuses have full human status. But if they do, how can it be “fine” to kill one, even to save another human life? That would be like saying, killing someone for fun is murder – which it obviously is – but killing them to harvest an organ that I need to save my own life is “fine”.
        
        For the record, I think abortion to save a mother is absolutely defensible, because I don’t think that foetuses have full human status. But that doesn’t mean that they lack all rights either. It’s a complex issue and reducing it to simplistic generalities is unhelpful.
        
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        March 4, 2020 12:33pm
  - Fletch
    
    What is even more ironic is that pro-life protesters on Tuesday held up signs showing different aborted fetuses, and Andrew Little labelled them as “sick”. Um, well… where does he think those images come from?
    
    After World War II, when the Allies liberated the German death camps, they forced the German citizenry to walk through the camps after they were liberated to force them to see what they had condoned through their leaders. They also took film of the bodies and of the emaciated survivors there to show the world. It was confronting, but necessary.
    
    If Andrew doesn’t like it, perhaps he should take stock of what he is actually voting for.
    
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/03/pro-life-protesters-signs-labelled-sick-by-justice-minister-andrew-little.html
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:50am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Who the actual eff downvoted the concept that Little should see the results of what he wants to do to the unborn. (Rhetorical – no answer required).
      
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      March 4, 2020 11:05am
      - Batman
        
        I just have, thanks to your comment.
        
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        March 4, 2020 11:17am
  - pb
    
    Easier to bribe a few politicians than an entire nation. How you treat the innocent, sets the stage for all values. If we are willing to slaughter the unborn there are no other roadblocks. It is no wonder the kids are getting beat up. It’s the new altar of human sacrifice. There are many guilty, hence many willing to support this bill. The guilty love company.
    
    There are some shocking videos of late term abortions. Kids swirling around in the placenta. You can not sophist your way past that, justify it. It is sick.
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:59am
    - Sacha
      
      @ Batman. When I was doing my maternity training way, way back in the day, a young woman gave birth to an anacephalic infant. To all intents and purposes it had been a normal pregnancy, but the labour had been long and unproductive. The Specialist was called in, and realised what the problem was. He performed a very difficult delivery, after the exhausted woman was sedated, and the child was swiftly wrapped and taken to a back room where it died a few hours later.
      Later, my sister-in-law was made to have a normal delivery after the baby died in utero at 28 weeks.
      There are some real tragedies out there.
      
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      March 4, 2020 8:10pm
  - Michael NZ
    
    This is worse Lee
    Unless they’ve added another clause after 20wks the woman can get signoff from 2 medics right up to 8mnths
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:07pm
- BananaLlama
  
  Sums up New Zealands attitude towards unwanted children doesn’t it.
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:23am
  - kowtow
    
    Our politicians , media, commentariat love to make lots of virtue signalling noise around our horrific child abuse and yet the same people are quite prepared to engage in a virtual genocide ……..
    
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    March 4, 2020 8:47am
    - lifesgood
      
      Great point, kowtow. They want to get people to believe that you can kill a child right up to birth but it is forbidden one day after. Are they wilful morons because it suits their agenda. There are many people, those who bash babies for example, who can’t see the difference and tbh, who can blame them if this is what they are being told.. You either respect human life or you don’t.
      
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      March 4, 2020 10:29am
  - Sideoiler
    
    Sums up New Zealands attitude towards unwanted children doesn’t it.
    
    Yes much better to wait and bash them to death a bit further down the track.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:16am
    - BananaLlama
      
      How about not bashing them or is that too much to ask.
      
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      March 4, 2020 10:29am
      - Sideoiler
        
        ….. or is that too much to ask.
        
        It would seem so unfortunately.
        No end of money has been allocated to social agencies, social agencies reorganized and re branded.
        Legislation enacted to prevent just such outcomes, and yet……
        
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        March 4, 2020 10:49am
- lifesgood
  
  Pete George You sound delighted that the govt will sanction murdering babies. I’m speechless.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:22am
- Albert_Ross
  
  The right to life doesn’t outweigh the right to bodily autonomy in law in any other case. No law enables you to be required against your will to donate a kidney or even half an armful of blood – procedures far less onerous than going through with an unwanted pregnancy – even where another’s life depends upon it. Why would the weighting of the respective rights be different in this case?
  
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  March 4, 2020 11:04am
  - Fletch
    
    I don’t think it is the same thing. In the case of pregnancy, the woman brought life into the world through her own action in the form of her son or daughter. I blogged about this once –
    
    I have to say, we all know where babies come from, so a woman having sex – performing the action that creates a baby – and then complaining because she has lost her autonomy seems a specious argument, like jumping in the water and complaining about getting wet. Getting pregnant is what a woman’s body is supposed to do and is a result of having sex (of course, not all of the time). It is not something that is involuntarily forced on a woman (discounting rape) but something she chooses to do. This is where the woman makes her choice. It is entirely her decision: she has the choice to say yes or no to having sex. Ultimately the baby is a direct result of that choice, even though she may not want a baby. She can refrain from the actions that naturally lead to it. After that, it is too late. You make it sound like it isn’t fair to her that she got pregnant, and is something other than the direct result of her actions.
    
    I have the choice to drive very fast in my car or not. I may find the speed pleasurable, and getting a ticket is obviously not the outcome I want. If I speed (my own choice) and then get a speeding ticket (something that may not happen every time I speed, but depends on the chance of a police officer spotting me) do I then have a right to complain and to ask the officer to tear up the ticket because it isn’t the outcome I wanted? I exercised my choice, took all the precautions I could in order not to get caught, decided to drive at the speed I wanted, and must live with the consequences of the result that naturally flowed from that.
    
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    March 4, 2020 5:50pm
- Critical Thinker
  
  The stripping away of all human rights from the viable unborn if a pregnant woman wants them terminated is absolutely abhorrent.
  
  It truly shocks me that the leader of the ACT party David Seymour, whose platform used to be for the sanctity of individual human rights, is now one of the top advocates for this disgusting abortion legislation.
  
  I voted for ACT in the last 2 elections. I most definitely will not be voting for them this year ?
  
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  March 4, 2020 11:32am
  - Batman
    
    You are clearly a New Conservatives voter. There’s no issue here.
    
    ACT has always supported personal freedom and choice.
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:41am
    - Critical Thinker
      
      “ACT has always supported personal freedom and choice.”
      
      Not anymore. The viable unborn person does not have the freedom or choice whether to live or be terminated. And also the new law doesn’t cover abortion rights for pregnant people that don’t identify as a woman.
      
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      March 4, 2020 2:30pm
      - Batman
        
        I hadn’t picked you as a transgender activist..
        
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        March 4, 2020 2:54pm
      - Critical Thinker
        
        @Batman: I hadn’t picked you as a transgender activist”
        
        Well you don’t know me ?‍♀️
        
        I strongly believe that people should have the right to identify as the gender of their choice. Just like I support the right for people to have sexual attraction to the genders of their choice.
        
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        March 4, 2020 3:02pm
  - Pharmachick
    
    Ah, but prior to 22-24 weeks it is not viable. What then? Enforced incubation status?
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:45am
    - Critical Thinker
      
      An unborn person is currently viable from 21 weeks and 6 days. The current NZ law is mostly sufficient for early term abortions. With over 13,000 are performed each year. And I don’t think I have ever seen any news of people being arrested in NZ for performing abortions ?
      
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      March 4, 2020 2:36pm
      - Batman
        
        That’s a very specific and blanket determination, Dr Thinker ??
        
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        March 4, 2020 2:48pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        Oy vey – 21 weeks 6 days eh? Thats very specific – wherefore perchance?
        
        I have seen all of this, and even the one that survive at 24 weeks are … catastrophic.
        
        You didn’t answer my question about viability at e.g. 10 weeks?
        
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        March 4, 2020 5:10pm
      - Critical Thinker
        
        I got that from fetal viability Wikipedia.
        
        The current NZ law allows for abortion up until 20 weeks. Which I think is probably the best middle ground solution to this devisive issue.
        
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        March 4, 2020 6:35pm
      - Sacha
        
        Woops SORRY!!! Didn’t mean to report!
        
        @ Critical Thinker: There hasn’t been any need for arrests since the passing of the Abortion Law Reform Act –
        
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        March 4, 2020 8:25pm
    - MrTips
      
      Umm.. Pharma. Viability is present at conception. Just ask the companies developing neonatal stem cell based therapies. And as far as I’m aware, no species in nature gets pregnant to immediately develop a fully functional child.
      
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      March 4, 2020 6:07pm
  - Michael NZ
    
    I will be as he is the only one advocating for our rights (though not the unborn).
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:16pm
  - Albert_Ross
    
    What right is being taken away from unborn children? Nobody else has a right to life at the expense of another’s bodily autonomy. You’re not obliged to comply if somebody else needs your kidney, even if it’s to save their life, no matter how precious and innocent the would-be recipient. You don’t need to give reasons, or get a doctor’s agreement that it’s a medical necessity for you not to give up your kidney. Why should a woman’s choice whether to continue with an unwanted pregnancy be any more restricted then your choice whether to agree to a far less onerous procedure?
    
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    March 4, 2020 4:18pm
    - Critical Thinker
      
      We’re also talking about the viable babies bodily autonomy here. Both the unborn baby & pregnant person have the human right to life. Maybe if the person pregnant with the viable baby doesn’t want it then they can have the viable baby surgically removed & have it given up to adoption.
      
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      March 4, 2020 5:27pm
    - Ian Boag
      
      And trying to “debate” abortion law reform on KB is pretty much a waste of bandwidth. Positions are ensconced, noone is convinced enough to change views. There is a border line introduced which generates the normal borderline problem of nonsense results close to the line …
      
      Me – I’m pro-choice or a baby-killer depending on where you stand …
      
      I agree with Little that the signs were sick, but – like him – I don’t argue with people’s rights to wave them around. I don’t think they qualify as hate speech …
      
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      March 4, 2020 5:38pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        The signs weren’t necessarily sick. That is a version of what it truly looks like. Naturally it is a version that is maximized to support the protestors ideas, but marketing… well; ’twas ever thus.
        
        I am still waiting for any of the “human rights” advocates on this Blog to tell me about how they would “gently ensure” a human incubator from e.g. 8 weeks [when you know you’re pregnant] until he baby is “viable” [arguably 22-24 weeks, better off at 36-40… Handmaids anybody?
        
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        March 4, 2020 5:58pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        @Pchick
        
        I guess “sick” vs “not necessarily sick” is a subjective thing when applied to signs with pictures of aborted fetuses. No way we are going to change each other’s opinion.
        
        Ditto for “I am still waiting …” anyone who took you up on that would encounter a closed mind just like mine. So KB is not where this will be decided – 81/39 in Parliament.
        
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        March 4, 2020 6:19pm
Simon

There will not be a public organised event at Mount Maunganui Main Beach again this year.

https://www.tauranga.govt.nz/exploring/whats-on/annual-council-run-events/new-years-eve

They had to call this off a few years ago after all the sexual attacks by the migrant Indian fruit workers.

Had to keep it quiet though. Not allowed to make the “news”
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March 4, 2020 8:10am
- Classic Liberal
  
  OK, we know that the UK tried to hide grooming to not appear ‘racist’, so authorities can make very bad decisions just to appear PC.
  
  But a claim like that (against Indian migrant workers specifically) needs evidence.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:19am
Maggy Wassilieff

23 MPs in Iran’s Parliament have coronavirus.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/03/iran-steps-up-coronavirus-efforts-as-23-mps-said-to-be-infected
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March 4, 2020 8:13am
- sooty
  
  There is a rumour that bacon cures it!
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:38am
  - NoCash
    
    For argument’s sake, say bacon does cure it, would the supreme leaders eat it? A true test of faith I guess.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:14am
  - Raphael
    
    I’m also in favour of spreading the rumour that rhino horn causes it.
    
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    March 4, 2020 10:43am
- Simon
  
  Dont worry about it. Mandela Soleimani will have killed more Iranians in December 2019 that the Chinavirus will.
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:54am
  - SB 2
    
    Simon, Chinaphobia or yellow peril language please. After all we don;t call Legionioners disease the Yank bug/ virus .
    
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    March 4, 2020 10:51am
    - Jack5
      
      Duty Stephie: Respectfully, I suggest you Stephiestani bloggers lay off nibbling on ?khat for at least 12 hours before posting.
      
      ❓ Not sure of the meaning or intent of your 10.51 post.
      
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      March 4, 2020 11:52am
Simon

The amount of death and destruction around the country that isnt reported is staggering. Anyone who knows Police will tell you.

Tragic stories often involving P.
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March 4, 2020 8:19am
Swifty

Especially for the ‘new’ New Zealanders among us – a small dose of the highbrow art we NZ’ers are renowned for throughout the world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6IobvsApc0

“At the dog-dosing strip in Dunsandel, I fell in love with you…..”

A lovely piece written by Ken Avery and performed by Ash Burton and The Nightcaps.

🙂
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March 4, 2020 8:33am
- G152
  
  One of my favourites and at the time a once a year requisite for shepherds and their working dogs was the dosing strip
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:50am
- David Garrett
  
  Swifty: Ah yes…who of our age group can forget dog dosing strips? “Dronset” was, IIRC, the drug of choice…but hydatids have been eliminated I think” I see the KB spell checker doesn’t even recognise the word…
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:57am
  - Tall Man
    
    Shot a rabbit about 10 years ago and it had the cysts on the liver.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:12am
    - Swifty
      
      I ALWAYS check – irrespective of species.
      
      If in doubt, chuck it out – but a good cooking sorts it too.
      
      🙂
      
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      March 4, 2020 11:01am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    NZ was declared free of hydatids in 2002
    https://www.beehive.govt.nz/speech/freedom-hydatids
    
    The Hydatids tapeworm lifecycle was imprinted on my brain in 6th Form bio classes (assisted by samples of infected meat from Imlay Freezing works)
    
    https://media.springernature.com/original/springer-static/image/chp%3A10.1007%2F978-3-319-68795-7_11/MediaObjects/394795_1_En_11_Fig9_HTML.jpg
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:15am
    - Jack5
      
      Human hydatids has also been a problem in Iceland:
      
      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2483078/pdf/bullwho00179-0016.pdf
      
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      March 4, 2020 12:09pm
    - lifesgood
      
      Just as children today are being terrified of climate change I was terrified of hydatids as a kid. We had lessons on it at primary school and I was certain I would catch it one day. Adults have a lot to answer for.
      
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      March 4, 2020 1:30pm
  - G152
    
    Yomesan or something like that was for sheep measles (I was shepherding near Featherston at the time)
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:58am
TWEEDSE

Mike Hoskins writes, When will Government tell the truth about theIhumātao deal. He makes a good point, “The longer they stall on this, the worse it is. The worse it is, clearly the longer they stall.”
They seem to be waiting for a big story they can hide the deal behind. Would have to be a pretty big story to hide this blatent over riding of property rights deal.

https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/mike-hosking-breakfast/opinion/mike-hosking-when-will-government-tell-the-truth-about-ihumatao-deal/
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March 4, 2020 8:35am
- cmm
  
  Kick the can down the road and it becomes National’s problem to mop up.
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:48am
  - Nickc2
    
    This was nothing but a Law and Order problem until Cindy opened her big mouth. As the voice in Mallard’s head says, “stupid little girl”.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:25am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Around Easter would be a good time to bury this story.
  Parliament will be in recess for a couple of weeks….
  The virus will have exploded through other countries…
  Our Economy will be tanking…
  
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  March 4, 2020 8:53am
  - tf78
    
    We were starting to tank before the virus, now they will use it as an excuse as it will be”out of our control”. Aussie have had bush fires and floods then the virus. We have just had the COL virus.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:07am
  - TWEEDSE
    
    Good guess Maggy, will make a note in my Calendar. I can’t see fletcher waiting till after the election.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:24am
  - MCos
    
    Simon told us it was going to happen when the PM was in Fiji.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:26am
  - mark15
    
    Dont say that please!
    We are in the process of buying a house with a pool.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:28am
  - Prince
    
    March 15 ?
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:31am
    - Sofia
      
      If the Ihumātao decision was released on March 15th, the desecration in using such a national atrocity in that way, should surely add the death of the Coalition to what is being commemorated.
      
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      March 4, 2020 10:15am
  - Tarquin North
    
    You’ve got to be careful burying things at Easter – they may come back to haunt you three days later.
    
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    March 4, 2020 9:31am
    - Biscuit
      
      Brilliant, Tarquin.
      
      You win this here very-lonely-looking Rocky Road Mallowpuff as a prize.
      
      Oh, wait, I see a flaw in that last statement!
      
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      March 4, 2020 9:50am
  - SB 2
    
    “The virus will have exploded through other countries”
    
    ???
    
    Coronavirus – floods of information in a misinfodemic
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/the-detail/story/2018735864/coronavirus-floods-of-information-in-a-misinfodemic
    
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    March 4, 2020 10:54am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      @SB2
      
      I suggest you take a wee lesson on Exponential growth rates.
      
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      March 4, 2020 1:13pm
- alex Masterley
  
  Heritage NZ have extended the protected area around the stonefields following a “review”.
  The presser is buried on the Heritage website, but i cannot find details of the extended area. Given the review was completed before the occupation I am wondering if the review magically re-opened to enable things like an extension to be considered.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:01am
Mike22240

“The new ARTs will be based in the districts with the highest number of firearms seized, located and surrendered.”

Go to the places we know people no longer have guns with our guns … why not go to the gangs that say (even in this article) that they have no intention of giving up their guns.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/401685/armed-response-team-cops-criticism-nothing-good-can-come-out-of-this
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March 4, 2020 8:40am
Yvette

Here I sit, wondering a bit
What a way, to start the day
Just trying to give a shit.

Blocked arteries and dicky heart
Could instigate a cardiac infarction,
If I fart –
So, let it go, or hold it back
May ease things gently, or just start
A fucking heart attack.

Then it strikes me – an explanation!
About New Zealand First’s Foundation!
Surely ’tis inspiration for Shane’s pork barrel
Provincial Growth Fund – it’s only got a different name –
But both use other people’s cash
And both function just the same:
To put New Zealand First first – well, one would reckon,
But Winston still comes First, so the Party must be Second.

Now turn to Ardern and Meng Foon, Tuesday afternoon
Said Shane is “Racist, ignorant and harmful”
So they are two “wrongs”, while Winston says Shane is ‘right” –
Increasing Ardern’s plight: yet another racial fight
With Ihumātao
But too many “from New Delhi”, dairies, “CURRY TO GO”
Oh, yes! – last time I had one, I certainly went
Hey, perhaps a thought that’s Heaven sent –

Blurp! plop! – well, what do you know.
All things great, come to those who wait

But before you diagnose yourself with depression
Or low self-esteem, seeming there alone,
Best check how many aerosols you’re really dealing with
While sitting on the throne.
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March 4, 2020 8:43am
oldpark

Just been watching the track record of Angry Andrew Little who was virtually run out of New Plymouth twice when he sucked a lemon trying for an electorate seat .
He got a lifeline from the ne’er do well Peters.
Yes Angry Andrew Little with tits for hands was given the title of “Justice Minister”.
Talk about putting a beggar on horseback . Amongst the latest of some of his questionable comments is the one on his attack on free speech .
He wants to call it “Hate Speech” and have any free speech comments banned . In fact he is out to mirror the same type of law in the UK which is a bloody disaster . Last night he also led the charge on the removal of the legal rights of unborn children,aided and abetted by a crowd of 81.
Minister of Justice . Hmmmm. Perhaps to quote a well known phrase .
“The evil that men/women do, lives after them. “.”The good if any, is interred in their bones” .Just Saying ..
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March 4, 2020 8:47am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Who are these crazy downtickers? Don’t you see that these daft laws could just as easily go against you? Because ‘hate speech’ is a vague concept, always in the eye of the beholder. I think you are hateful for downticking against the basic Human Right of Free Speech. So, should you be shut up by an authoritarian government?
  
  Spend a bit of time on Spiked, who make excellent comments on Free Speech, for instance here: https://www.spiked-online.com/2019/12/26/in-2020-we-need-to-fight-the-new-thoughtpolice/
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:34am
NoCash

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/03/australian-doctors-soon-to-be-briefed-on-role-if-coronavirus-outbreak-worsens

Apparently the Oz govt will have a plan in a week or two to confirm the role of GPs in a widespread outbreak.

WTF, what have they been doing in the over 6 weeks time since China locked down some 60 million people and crippled the economy in doing so? Do the Oz officials think China was doing that for fun?

I doubt our govt is much better neither…
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March 4, 2020 8:56am
- Aunty
  
  Don’t worry about Australia. You worry about New Zealand! We now have our second case of the virus in a woman who returned from Northern Italy last week. And rather than self-isolating herself for 14 days upon returning to New Zealand as she came from an area with a known heavy outbreak, this dumb bitch took a flight to Palmerston North this week!
  
  Where is our Health Authorities in that? She was required to self-isolate, why aren’t they monitoring that?
  
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  March 4, 2020 1:07pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Our Govt only put in a request for folks coming from Italy to self-isolate on Monday (2nd March).
    
    This woman arrived back on the 26th Feb… and had 6 days out in the community before symptoms appeared.
    https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20200304_20200304_02
    
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    March 4, 2020 3:52pm
    - Aunty
      
      I don’t think it matters, Maggy. She has been to an area with a serious outbreak, and as a precaution when she got back home she should have self-isolated anyway, and most certainly she should not have undertaken domestic air travel within New Zealand until she had been back in the country for 14 days and was symptom free. This is common sense and requires a minimum of effort and intelligence to take the matter seriously and to act responsibly. She has failed to do that as far as I am concerned.
      
      Moreover, once the MOH issued the self-isolation rule for travelers from Northern Italy, they said people who had traveled to or through the region within the last 14 days, and that very much includes her. What did she do about it? And what did the MOH do about those people who fitted this passengers profile?
      
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      March 4, 2020 5:27pm
slightlyrighty

NZ First takes secret donations from industry groups.

NZ First formulates policy in favour of those interest groups.

NZ First actively hides those donations.

NZ First appoints the government that gives in to it’s demands, which are in favour of those interest groups.

NZ First and Labour hide the coalition agreement.

If National had done this, the media would be baying for blood. The current level of oh dear reporting from the media just does not cut it.
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March 4, 2020 8:57am
- Yvette
  
  slightlyrighty, to support your comment with an example –
  
  Winston Peters has repaid the electoral support of the racing industry with changes to the bloodstock tax rules and plans for an all-weather track.
  
  Peters regained the racing portfolio when he negotiated a coalition with Labour last year. This came after Ardern declined to give NZ First the fisheries portfolio, due to his party receiving significant donations from seafood magnate Peter Talley and others in the fisheries industry.
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/racing/104046573/winston-peters-changes-tax-rules-for-racing-industry-that-backed-nz-first
  
  Peters has written what some see as his commitment to donors, into the Coalition Agreement, making it a Government commitment –
  The Coalition will :
  • Support New Zealand First’s Racing policy.
  https://www.nzdoctor.co.nz/sites/default/files/2017-10/Labour%20and%20New%20Zealand%20First%20%20Coalition%20Agreement.pdf
  
  If Ardern now knows of NZ First Foundation donations, as there are from racing interests, and given her previous action of not appointing NZ First people to fishing, why is she not consistent and revise her decisions in the area of racing?
  
  The Manual is crystal-clear. Whether acting in political capacity as an MP or in a personal capacity, Cabinet ministers must act lawfully and behave in a way that “upholds, and is seen to uphold, the highest ethical standards“ – John Armstrong
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:03am
Nick R

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
I see Jian Yang has been reselected by National. They kept that very quiet. I wonder why?
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March 4, 2020 9:10am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Get over your obsession Nick. Move on.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:04am
  - Jack5
    
    It’s a valid point, Nick. Not only because of Yang’s past as a Communist Party member who spent 15 years as a trainer in the PLA intelligence system, but because of what Yang didn’t disclose in his application for NZ citizenship.
    
    Some of us will take this into consideration when we decide who will get our party vote this year:
    
    https://croakingcassandra.com/2019/09/16/recalling-jian-yangs-past-questions-for-him-and-his-leader
    
    and, on Yang’s citizenship application:
    
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11932407
    
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    March 4, 2020 10:13am
    - SB 2
      
      jack5, John Birch Society stuff. Look how they got thing so wrong!
      
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      March 4, 2020 10:58am
    - Michael NZ
      
      I’ve pretty much decided against National for my Party vote, based on Simon’s silence, Jian’s presence and Judith’s vicious little tongue against David Seymour saying Golriz & Greens were dangerous for our basic freedoms..
      
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      March 4, 2020 12:23pm
      - lifesgood
        
        I would hazard a guess, Michael, you were never going to vote for them. Another lefty troll, I presume.
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:33pm
      - Cobolt24
        
        Re; MichaelNZ, lifesgood: There’s always ACT to vote for.
        
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        March 4, 2020 2:07pm
- Rachael Membery
  
  Where did you see it?
  
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  March 4, 2020 12:00pm
- Tony Stuart
  
  Care to post a link for that Nick? Yang will have to take his chances with being ranked high enough on National’s Party List to get back in, and I can tell you with authority that the list won’t be decided for several months yet. To the best of my knowledge, Yang isn’t contesting an electorate, so at this point, he hasn’t been “selected” for anything.
  
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  March 4, 2020 12:48pm
Sir Cullen's Sidekick

Good morning bros of Cindy Kingdom. She is riding all controversies successfully. Defending Shane Jones by saying he is from another party. MSM are compliant. She is on track for second term. They very thought of James Shaw as C0-Deputy PM along with Marama Davidson as Defence Minister thrills me to bits.
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March 4, 2020 9:10am
- Lance
  
  We clearly have a significant percentage of the population that is as dumb as a sack of hammers, whom are panic buying water and toilet paper FFS, no wonder Cindy and her CoL can continuously clusterfuck anything and everything they touch and yet still show up as an option to retain power in the polls.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:01am
  - lifesgood
    
    So rain is not going to fall and the dams will run dry. Wow! I didn’t know corona virus had so much power. BTW toilet paper is made in NZ. Sack of hammers, indeed.
    
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    March 4, 2020 10:32am
    - Ed Snack
      
      Toilet paper uses binders in the paper that is sourced from overseas. It is not impossible that production will be restricted, or changed to a different type of less “forgiving” paper.
      
      The international supply chain web is very all-encompassing.
      
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      March 4, 2020 11:44am
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        At last, an use for the Auckland chip wrapper in a traditional and sustainable way
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:06pm
  - DeepBlue
    
    Yesterday, the government’s official advice was for households to have 9l pp pday water. So they’ve gone for the standard Earthquake preparedness kit. Very weird advice.
    
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    March 4, 2020 2:45pm
    - Batman
      
      I mean, if people will be more prepared in general then that’s a good thing.
      
      But yeah it’s not like the virus is coming out of ya taps haha
      
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      March 4, 2020 2:48pm
- SB 2
  
  Should she act promptly and and sack shane Jones or does he represent mainstream thinking among many KB’s poster
  
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  March 4, 2020 11:00am
  - hullkiwi
    
    SB 2 go and read how upset your mates are at the Standard that Jacinda is being seen to have a spine of jelly.
    
    Oh and another point SB 2, why don’t you just call yourself Stephieboy 3?
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:07pm
  - Michael NZ
    
    personally I’m against people using the student route to get residency and then citizenship Stephie.
    Especially when they are used to be the anchor for rellies later.
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:25pm
  - Swifty
    
    Well, I’ll say something for the mainstream community here on KB – they don’t post links to explicit pornographic pictures here as you have done.
    
    Nor do they get repeatedly banned for abusive behaviour as you do here.
    
    Come to think of it – aren’t you quite the oddball?
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:53pm
kowtow

Today’s ODT world section has two climate catastrophe stories (and of course a Wuflu panic inducer) .
One is about sandy beaches to disappear , always some time in the future ……. the other about children in the UK suffering nightmares due to the alarmism and reference to something called eco anxiety.

I wonder if the academics , politicians , NGO’s and particularly the MSM have ever taken time to reflect on how mach damage they are doing to people’s peace of mind with all this doom and gloom they’re purveying.

PS , If anyone’s concerned about sandy beaches disappearing perhaps they should turn off their lights or stop charging their e cars , a lot of that is caused by hydro electric dams blocking nature’s way of bringing mountains to the sea.
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March 4, 2020 9:16am
Maggie Pie

Actually caught ‘Speakers Briefing’ for the first time this year yesterday.

Looked to me like Trevor may have spent the Xmas recess having a Mini-Face Lift.

😛
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March 4, 2020 9:17am
- Biscuit
  
  He’s TERRIBLE on TV, isn’t he, Maggie?
  
  Monotoned, every um second ah word an ‘um’ or an ‘ah’, a face made for Radio…
  
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  March 4, 2020 9:53am
UrbanNeocolonialist

Government is fiddling while Rome burns. Unless they harden up their Wuflu response immediately we are nearly guaranteed to have 100k unecessarily dead this year. Their continued laxity means it may already be too late, and their complacency is just stunning – numbers are going up 10x every 2 weeks internationally!! It’s a building Tsunami.

You can tell they are in a staggering state of denial when Grant Robinson just announced $11million funding to promote tourism! I can’t imagine a more negligent attitude to a clear and impending Armageddon that will kill more than all wars NZ has ever fought in

Mandatory quarantine of all arrivals (it’s everywhere in the world, people returning from overseas (eg Bali and Egypt where huge hidden clusters are forming like they did in Iran) are bringing it into every other country and probably NZ too) and as much testing as possible – and work on expansion of testing capacity ASAP. We should also quarantine everyone in country for 2 weeks ASAP to root out any infections that are already here. We can possibly still avoid this disaster, but only if the govt wake the fuck up.
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March 4, 2020 9:19am
- Tricati
  
  They cocked up the meningitis out-break in Northland, and the measles epidemic, that heavily impacted on Samoa; so why do you think they will have this latest health issue under control.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:23am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    The stakes are a 10,000x higher than measles. It’s taken just 2 weeks for Korea to go from 30 infections (similar to NZ per capita) to having insufficient hospital beds to treat critical patients (who then died). Death rate will be up to 5% without hospitals.
    
    Time for everyone to get energized and yes, even panic, to force government into action. We have a narrow window of maybe a week or two tops before up to 1 in 20 people in NZ are doomed to a horrible death, or watching loved ones die at home without access to overwhelmed hospital treatment, during the 2020 winter months.
    
    Massive action (quarantining arrivals and all sniffling NZer’s + testing them) will be jarring, but it needs to be done now, not in a week or two when it will be too late.
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:05pm
  - hullkiwi
    
    Because JAG is not in control of matters. Oh dear, that means the Red Reverend (call me Dr) Clark and Jacinda have to front matters.
    
    What could possibly go wrong?
    
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    March 4, 2020 3:43pm
- MCos
  
  There are a two extreme responses to the Covid-19 situation.
  Do nothing and hope for the best.
  Shut down the borders, which would collapse the economy and likewise hope for the best.
  We seem to be steering a middle course with limited restrictions on those entering the country and a reliance on the local population to show common sense in the matter, take reasonable precautions and not expect to be provided a perfectly safe living environment.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:37am
  - Michael NZ
    
    MCos
    It might come right in 6 mnths.
    Someone we know has a conference in Vienna in April, the organisers aren’t cancelling, rather wait it out and cancel 2 weeks out if need be.
    5000 attendants from the world over.
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:27pm
RW Capitalist

Anyone still think they should move PoA to Whangarei?
Just got my quote for freight from Shanghai, just a small order.
2 cub m
300Kg
Was expecting $900- $1000
Quote….$1250
Looked down the bill:
Delivery charge Auckland- Wgtn……..$180
Fuel surcharge……………………………….$20
Will similar for EVERY 2 cub m from Whangarei to Auckland.
Also begs the question, why isn’t Wellington container terminal working yet and surely it would be better for the country to spend $220mill on that, than a gold plated stadium in Christchurch.
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March 4, 2020 9:22am
- Jack5
  
  I agree the Christchurch stadium is a waste, but is Wellington’s container terminal not working again yet?
  
  Container traffic previously was small at Wellington’s CentrePort: not quite half compared with Napier’s, let alone comparison with Auckland, Tauranga, Lyttelton.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:05am
  - MCos
    
    Someone on Twitter this morning said that NZ lives in a state of permanent austerity.
    If you’re a rugby fan in Christchurch it would be hard to disagree.
    The current stadium, home to one of the best rugby teams in the world, is not much better than the Ghazi Stadium in Kabul.
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:19am
    - Batman
      
      Perhaps the private sector can invest in a profitable new facility? Or the successful Rigby Union and franchise?
      
      12 1
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      March 4, 2020 11:23am
      - KH
        
        Dunedin stadium is nice. But an economic disaster.
        A classic case of the in crowd spending other peoples money.
        Those who advocate for a stadum should offer to pay for one. Or shut up.
        Very happy for them to receive the profits. LOL.
        
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        March 4, 2020 10:33pm
    - Jack5
      
      Fair enough point, MCos, but why an overhead roof? Southerners are supposed to be hardy.
      
      Taxpayers will pay $220 million of the $473m stadium cost. The other $253m will be funded by council. That will be loaded on to ratepayers, who are already being squashed.
      
      Christchurch City Council is like a spending addict with a limitless credit card. Built, or in the shopping cart: $100 million library, $253m of ratepayer money on a stadium with an artificial roof, cycle tracks every where, a flash convention centre, art gallery, museum.
      
      Meanwhile many roads are potholed, and the city’s water supply has deteriorated.
      
      Here’s a flaky argument for the covered stadium from Megan Woods, speaking as Greater Christchurch Regeneration Minister:
      
      “The arena, once completed, will spark and develop business confidence and growth by drawing people into the central city.”
      
      An argument against American public financing of big sports stadiums (in the US, they benefit billionaire sports team owners rather than our more modest sports establishment):
      
      https://econreview.berkeley.edu/the-economics-of-sports-stadiums-does-public-financing-of-sports-stadiums-create-local-economic-growth-or-just-help-billionaires-improve-their-profit-margin/
      
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      March 4, 2020 12:33pm
      - Tony Stuart
        
        Given that most rugby now is played under lights, in the evening, it would be an absolute folly not to build a stadium with a roof for Christchurch.
        
        And personally, I have no problem with the government making a contribution. You only have to look at the variety of events that Forsyth Barr in Dunedin hosts, and Christchurch has several times the population base to draw from. Just as long as it’s not named after Lianne Dalziel…
        
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        March 4, 2020 12:57pm
      - SGA
        
        Fair enough point, MCos, but why an overhead roof?
        
        Probably because Dunedin has one which it can offer as a less weather-dependent venue for major events coming from overseas?
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:09pm
      - SGA
        
        You only have to look at the variety of events that Forsyth Barr in Dunedin hosts
        
        How much did the government contribute to that?
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:10pm
      - MCos
        
        I read that the average ticket price for the recent Super Bowl was in the order of $US6000.
        The Las Vegas Raiders new stadium cost $US1.9bill to construct.
        Las Vegas isn’t an awful lot bigger than Auckland and far less attractive, but it’s got a rather striking Main Street.
        
        Christchurch has a nice kids’ playground . . . .
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:12pm
      - Paulus
        
        It will still finish up at over $1, 000,000,000 when all the overruns and SNAFU’s are found.
        
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        March 4, 2020 1:16pm
      - cmm
        
        SGA: How much did the government contribute?
        
        Trick question eh?
        
        NOTHING. The government has nothing and can give nothing.
        
        It is less than 200,000 of us net tax payers that pay EVERYTHING.
        
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        March 4, 2020 2:20pm
      - Jack5
        
        Some good points by commenters at the bottom of this old Stuff thread. They highlight the flakiness of the “economic benefit” dollars claimed by stadium promoters.
        
        https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/93680097/dunedins-financial-windfall-from-covered-forsyth-barr-stadium-outweighs-councils-cost-venue-managers
        
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        March 4, 2020 2:38pm
- fightingtemeraire
  
  RW C
  
  When I was running my business with my wife we imported a lot from Japan. Unless you had a large amount it was cheaper to bring in by air freight than sea freight, The INTERNAL costs in Japan pickup/container stuffing etc were horrendous.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:11am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    At approx. $25-$30USD per Kg plus inspection fees etc
    $300Kg = Approx. $9000USD
    For small light items OK
    eg 100 toaster ovens adds about $140NZDto the price each which on this MOQ the freight can be dearer than the product.
    
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    March 4, 2020 5:52pm
Happychappy

I thought Journalism was about about quality and truth in what you pen, not attack your opposition with the help of taxpayers money to gain a edge.
The media are all the same can’t tell the truth and very one sided but can’t understand why people don’t wish to read the crap they want to print. Is this about Labour wanting to control the media and the best way to do it is attack with unlimited funds from the Taxpayer, let’s hope not but who would Trust Jacinda and her Political misfits.
https://thespinoff.co.nz/media/04-03-2020/the-first-salvo-in-a-war-new-rnz-ad-campaign-attacks-herald-stuff/
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March 4, 2020 9:25am
- Tricati
  
  Well said Happy – I absolutely despair at what gets presented as ‘objective’ journalism these days.
  My question is – who holds the media to account when NZ really turns to custard, as its well on the way there.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:11am
  - Jack5
    
    Time for some quotations …
    
    Thomas Jefferson: The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the man who reads only newspapers.
    
    American musician Frank Ocean: “Here’s what I think about music and journalism: The most important thing is to just press play.”
    
    British civil servant Humbert Wolfe:
    
    You cannot hope to bribe or twist
    (thank God!) the British journalist.
    But, seeing what the man will do
    unbribed, there’s no occasion to.
    
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    March 4, 2020 10:36am
    - SB 2
      
      Jack5 , thank you for that. Why it makes me think of the journos on Breitbart and Fox News!
      
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      March 4, 2020 11:26am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The Journos are losing their jobs in droves all around the western World.
  
  Time for them all to start looking for a new career path and stop flogging a dead horse.
  
  Australian Associated Press to shut down after 85 years
  https://apnews.com/c9d2809aaa0e8fa47c629723444d7b51
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:39am
  - curry4me
    
    Maggy Wassilieff: I wonder if there is any provision for late enrolment in coding courses?
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:22am
Monique Watson

The decision On Ilhumatao will be wheeled out around the 15th by the Labour racist coalition. Anybody who disagrees will be labeled a racist. It’s the old bait and switch.
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March 4, 2020 9:38am
Maggy Wassilieff

Jacinda’s burden of responsibility

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/jacinda-ardern-feeling-huge-burden-of-responsibility-ahead-of-christchurch-terror-anniversary

She’s starting to remind me of the Leader (Binder) on the Ascent of Rum Doodle
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March 4, 2020 9:40am
- Poppa
  
  What a lot of crap Maggy. She is so excited at the thought of being able to dress up again & get in the magazines which is her happy place
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:01am
  - calendar girl
    
    She started dressing-up again some days ago, the veil colour white instead of last year’s black.
    
    Her world is all about photo-shoots.
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:41pm
- Gravelroad
  
  Ms Ardern is “feeling a huge burden of responsibility “.
  No, what she is feeling is how can she use any March 15th event to ensure that there is a lift in the polls for the Labour Party and enhance her security as Prime Minister.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:20am
  - Rachael Membery
    
    Or the opposite effect. Since we claim responsibility for people after 10 years apparently does that include after ten-year jail sentences? So Jcinda tells Aus.
    
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    March 4, 2020 1:02pm
- SB 2
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  MW, and why not considering this and other kinds of Islamaphobia that still lingers on KB and out there in NZ Society,
  
  From your link,
  ‘
  “New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said she feels a weight on her shoulders to protect people of faith as new threats to the safety of mosque-going Kiwis emerge.”
  
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  March 4, 2020 11:04am
  - Swifty
    
    “Islamophobia….”
    
    You’re one to talk, you steaming hypocrite.
    
    You regularly slur, slander, abuse, label, ridicule and sneer at other members of your community for their beliefs here on KB – and you think it’s a badge of courage. You seem proud of it in fact.
    
    Why don’t you take the log of wood out of your own eye before you try to remove the splinter from others’.
    
    PS – how long will it be before you are given another strike here on KB for yet more abusive behaviour?
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:40am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    @SB2
    
    Yes, it is great to see our PM as the Defender of Faiths. (Of course QE2 is “The Defender of the Faith”).
    I do hope she has a word in the ear of her racist Cabinet Minister about this matter… might be reassuring to the Hindus and Sikhs from New Delhi.
    
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    March 4, 2020 1:19pm
MrTips

To all youse worrying about the Coronavirus.

Points to consider:

1) 2009 pigpox. H1N1. End of the world. In NZ killed 35/1,120 hospitalisations. 3,175 actual recorded cases. 2/3 needed no hospital stay.

2) 2015 or so. ESR went back and found nearly 1,000,000 cases of likely or definite H1N1 over the following years. Death rate therefore dropped like a stone and estimates that 1:25 MINIMUM cases were not bought to the attention of authorities.

3) 2020. 2019-nCOV. End of the world. Death rate ~3% but who knows? Is highly likely actual cases VASTLY underestimated.

By all means be careful, but I suspect this is highly overblown.
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March 4, 2020 9:53am
- NoCash
  
  People’s concern isn’t just the fatality rate but the high % of hospitalisation required based on overseas data so far, as covid19 is far more contagious than other previous outbreaks, it can easily overwhelm our health system if we can’t manage it properly.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:27am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Thanks, and nothing as comforting as the really kiwi ‘youse’ :).
  
  English has always needed a distinct 2nd person plural which most languages have. Maori wanted it and made it happen: excellent :).
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:48am
  - Twinkletoes
    
    You’se was in common use amongst the less educated in Northern Ireland where I was brought up, one which incurred a very sharp and immediate reprimand from nearest adult in my family. I was surprised to find it in NZ having always thought it was purely an Ulster peculiarity.
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:49pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  16 days ago S.Korea had 30 cases, now they have over 5,000 and at least 31 dead.
  
  And it’s not as if they have been slack with testing and disinfecting and trying to control the spread.
  https://www.aa.com.tr/en/asia-pacific/south-korea-declares-war-on-coronavirus/1753336
  
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  March 4, 2020 11:29am
  - NoCash
    
    Well that irresponsible cult took the authorities off guard though. So they’re now doing catch up and damage control.
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:38am
- Ian Boag
  
  Given that covid can be quite mild for some folk, estimating the infection rate can be a bit hard. The only accurate way to do is is to go out some time after the pan/epi/whatever demic has been around for a while and test a whole lot of people for antibodies. This will give a handle on the infection rate ….
  
  This will not happen for a while …
  
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  March 4, 2020 5:50pm
Liberty

When a Government member has the no 1 question. In questions in the house.
All he does is ask a patsy question in Maori.
Nothing more than an ego trip.
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March 4, 2020 10:02am
lastmanstanding

If you want an example of Central and Local Government taking away citizens freedoms look no further than Auckland traffic. Rather than providing for and building roads to accommodate citizens travel choices they have knowingly not done so i order to create congestion that they can then tax.

In addition they have created cycle lanes that are twice the width they need to be and will stay empty most of the time in order to narrow the vehicle lanes.

This is a planned attack on citizens freedom to accommodate the twisted ideas of Lefties who hate citizens having the means to travel unencumbered.
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March 4, 2020 10:18am
- MCos
  
  Most of the streets are empty of cars most of the time, if you want to go down that route.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:51am
- SB 2
  
  lastmanstanding, try e scooters. It could transform you life .
  
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  March 4, 2020 11:24am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Like when you fall off, helmetless, at 25 kph and spend the next few months rehabilitating ?
    
    A cousin has one, fell off avoiding a “wayward” pedestrian (in other words, some poor sod trying to use the footpath), and has been in Physio for about 6 weeks but at least can hobble around unaided now.
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:51am
  - Jack5
    
    ?But e-scooter riders would be advised to wear a crash hat, Duty Stephie.
    
    Not sure that, if they make such hats compulsory, there should be an exemption for Stephiestani-style head gear. I’m not sure I accept the argument that banging heads on the prayer mat gives your people an imperviously thick skull.
    
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    March 4, 2020 11:59am
    - SB 2
      
      My son like many others wears one.
      
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      March 4, 2020 12:11pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P50Y6lmQHVs
What’s going on with Joe Biden? Is it super Thursday yet? Did he remember his pants? Is he running for the Senate? Is there any malarkey involved? Stay tuned folks!
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March 4, 2020 10:46am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6r2owNemd_Q
Greece is defending Europes’ borders. Fourth Reich is supportive. Teachers’ pet offers assistance to Greece and Bulgaria. Leftists see an influx of refugees as an electoral liability. The offer of help from the EU surprised me.
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March 4, 2020 10:47am
Two fish and a scoop thanks Cindy

This is disgusting;
PTPM BFFFL BlackFace Castro lover threatening Rebel Media’s Ezra Levant over anti Trudeau book published during recent elections.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2rDt7eOHQo
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March 4, 2020 11:04am
SB 2

I believe being educated and well informed about Covid 19 is among the best ways to protect yourself and against it For example consider this,

The Chinese government very quickly released the genome sequence of Covid 19

This in turns spurred unprecedented international co operation among health , research and other scientific agencies to understand more about the virus . Such co operation means that it will be likely an effective vaccine will be developed as early as next month

The true benefits of the much maligned globalism among the ignorant and fear mongers.

Coronavirus – floods of information in a misinfodemic

https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/the-detail/story/2018735864/coronavirus-floods-of-information-in-a-misinfodemic
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March 4, 2020 11:20am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  You are the one who has spread misinformation about the virus here.
  
  You were the one mocking the brain of a leading virologist.
  
  You were the one who had to have one of your posts deleted after accusing me of posting hysteria.
  
  On Monday I was at my local Civil Defence briefing about the virus and possible courses of action here in the Gisborne/Tairawhiti District.
  
  Perhaps you need to be very careful about what you post on this blog, because I think you are poorly informed.
  
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  March 4, 2020 1:27pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Why the heck was it necessary to have Gang represention at the Commission of Inquiry into Historical Abuse in State Care?

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/03/controversial-mongrel-mob-member-harry-tam-leaves-role-in-royal-commission-inquiry.html

It was individuals that entered State Care… not gangs.
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March 4, 2020 11:34am
- Tall Man
  
  Probably because the “gang” have a close relationship with violence so could be deemed to be “experts” 😉
  
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  March 4, 2020 12:25pm
- Ruahine
  
  Harry Tam was probably considered to be an ‘expert’ on abuse. Probably as a giver.
  
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  March 4, 2020 1:19pm
- cmm
  
  Vested interest. Where are their next batch of recruits going to come from?
  
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  March 4, 2020 2:06pm
Maggy Wassilieff

#2 has arrived

https://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/wellington/119994409/coronavirus-second-confirmed-new-zealand-case
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March 4, 2020 11:44am
- Ed Snack
  
  From Italy, wonder if we are testing/restricting people from there generally. A lot of “western” spread seems to have come from there.
  
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  March 4, 2020 11:54am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Interesting paper – SARS-CoV2 mortality rate may be because it invades areas of the brain, especially areas that control breathing. Many patients admitted to ICU cannot breath spontaneously.
    
    See: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/jmv.25728#.Xl4ZRRCdUsA.twitter
    
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    March 4, 2020 1:24pm
- Tall Man
  
  3 journalists to write this?
  
  “where the woman’s child attend school.
  
  The child are also in self isolation but are showing no symptoms”
  
  Perhaps one should speak english…….
  
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  March 4, 2020 12:23pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Govt left the gate open and the horse has bolted.
  Some of you reading this will die this year, drowning in mucus, at home, with (at best) sick relatives to provide succor. Some of your friends and family will die the same way.
  
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  March 4, 2020 12:30pm
  - MCos
    
    Bugger
    
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    March 4, 2020 5:52pm
  - Ian Boag
    
    Yep. Mainly old folk. Viral pneumonia …. home or hospital. Oxygen and wait to get better (or not).
    
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    March 4, 2020 5:54pm
  - JibberJabber
    
    Luxury…. I can`t afford to die.
    
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    March 4, 2020 6:35pm
- MrTips
  
  Based on reading that, we’ll be at 100 by end of the month.
  
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  March 4, 2020 1:26pm
maxritchie

@curry4me: Biden would appear to have the momentum now. All could come unstuck as we speak of course, if Super T swings to Sanders or Bloomberg (however unlikely). Or if Joe misspeaks (likely). Biden/Klobuchar is my pick. Polls show Biden beating trump but of course November is a long way off.
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March 4, 2020 11:52am
- Ed Snack
  
  Biden is suffering from cognitive deterioration that will be cruelly exposed in any debates. Makes you wonder if he’s just being pushed as a strategic move – deny Bernie the nomination and appoint the real candidate in the VP slot. Then Joe pulls out citing health concerns (which would be true enough) and the VP steps up – being someone who simply couldn’t get the nomination otherwise. They appoint a new VP candidate, and the Democrat establishment is back firmly in control.
  
  Cynical, but strategically simple.
  
  So who would that VP pick be, Warren, Harris, O’Rourke, Pete, Amy, Hillary, plenty of choices who couldn’t succeed at a convention but could slide in as VP pick.
  
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  March 4, 2020 12:07pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Harris
    
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    March 4, 2020 12:52pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Biden/Harris vs Trump/Haley
      
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      March 4, 2020 1:21pm
  - curry4me
    
    Ed Snack: That’s plausible. Possibly though, Senator Biden’s campaign manager confronted him about dementia; and he said: “I’m fine. It’s my last chance at the Whitehouse. Butt out” If Senator Biden does pull out, it doesn’t really matter who replaces him. They’ll get beaten like a rented mule.
    
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    March 4, 2020 5:46pm
- curry4me
  
  maxritchie: I’d be surprised if Seantor Biden is coherent by November. As for beating President Trump, I doubt it. Short of a recession anyway. The Dems are running on hate and negativity, and the economy is thriving.
  
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  March 4, 2020 5:36pm
rangitoto

Trump schools the fake news media again. They didn’t even realise the good doctor was standing right beside him. LOL.

https://twitter.com/RitaPanahi/status/1234967342968238080
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March 4, 2020 11:56am
- SB 2
  
  rangitoto, why wasn’t the US Surgeon general there?
  
  Incumbent. Vice Admiral Jerome Adams
  The surgeon general of the United States is the operational head of the U.S. Public Health Service Commissioned Corps (PHSCC) and thus the leading spokesperson on matters of public health in the federal government of the United States.
  
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  March 4, 2020 12:16pm
Tasman Terror

Jacinda is just so Neve, eg she thinks that by the whanau car being a Tesla rather than a gay ford she is saving the planet. Will good luck with that.

[Mod: don’t push your luck. ]
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March 4, 2020 12:06pm
SB 2

An interesting political battle( not unlike here ) playing out in the US over Covid 19 with the Democrats maybe overstating the rsik and GOP understating it.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/03/anthony-fauci-trump-coronavirus-crisis-118961
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March 4, 2020 12:23pm
Tasman Terror

With Carona virus encircling the planet will our Dear Leader Jacinda relentlessly try and hug random strangers at the 15 March atrocity commemoration? She Should give the huggy routine a rest for now , and set an example to rest of the planet.
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March 4, 2020 12:35pm
- Tony Stuart
  
  Indeed; her only physical contact with anyone should be fistbumps…
  
  https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/02/sports/basketball/nba-coronavirus.html
  
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  March 4, 2020 1:01pm
  - rangitoto
    
    The Hindu greeting namaste is the way to go.
    
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    March 4, 2020 1:52pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Shake hands like a man, just make sure they are clean and stop touching your face.
      
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      March 4, 2020 4:28pm
cmm

Hey Mods, something to look into:

https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/comments_policy

Stephieboy, aka Stephieboy 2 is currently riding “7th strike” as of a few weeks ago.

7th strike is three months suspension, so until sometime in May.

Now suddenly we seem to have a new member called SB2 who I’ll bet 50c and a servo pie is the same person due to writing style and general pissing-in-the-well behaviour.

According to the comments policy: “If you try to get around a suspension, by setting up a second account, then that may result in a permanent ban. Writing styles tend to be quite distinctive, and it is often easy to spot if someone has set up a second account.”

So does this mean time for a permanent ban?

It would certainly clean up the air around KB.
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March 4, 2020 1:32pm
- Tall Man
  
  While I support free speech and the right to annoy others, steffy generally adds little to the conversation but, she does motivate people to look right rather than left as she clearly epitomises the ignorance of the left.
  
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  March 4, 2020 4:27pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    My beef with him is he attacks the person not the argument. I know I have retaliated in kind. So I won’t claim the moral high ground here. But the blog flows a lot better without his puerile interjections. Bit like Griff…..
    
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    March 4, 2020 6:54pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  Nah. Purely coincidence. Proves that twats come in swarms… I suspect he gets off on the abuse…. Somebody should write a book on his condition……
  
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  March 4, 2020 4:33pm
  - cmm
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    
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    March 4, 2020 4:43pm
- Ian Boag
  
  What do you mean “hey mods”? Don’t you mean “hey DPF” …. ?
  
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  March 4, 2020 5:56pm
cmm

New gin pulled for “cultural appropriation”.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/119998091/social-media-backlash-for-cultural-appropriation-sees-new-zealand-gin-bottle-label-dropped

Oh please.

Is it cultural appropriation when Maori drink RTDs, put on pants, use a phone?
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March 4, 2020 1:38pm
- david
  
  Or drink Lion Red or play the guitar, or both simultaneously.
  Just speaking proper English would be a big start though eh!
  
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  March 4, 2020 1:52pm
- Tall Man
  
  Pathetic response.
  
  They should enjoy the “backlash” and increase production.
  
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  March 4, 2020 4:25pm
JerJer

Just received an invoice from my kids school. They want $1300 per year in ‘donations’. I already pay taxes in the region of 2-3 times the average gross income, and schools are supposed to be government funded, and one of the primary responsibilities of govenment is to educate the population. So, I already paid as far as I am concerned more than 95% of the population did. Now it would be a different matter if there was a cause to donate to, but this is just an invoice with a please pay written on it. Nothing about it being voluntary.

I get that I will have to pay private secondary schooling most probably to have the kids educated properly (as opposed to this ridiculous group learning shambles where the teacher sits at edge of the group and does nothing except urge the brighter kids to teach the thick ones).

Wasn’t the ‘gummint’ supposed to have done something good to education, like fund it properly, like ensure the kids are actually getting an education ? I remember they made a big song and dance about this, but nothing has happened, and I am being asked to pay twice……

So, should I pay to make up for supposedly under funding by the govenment (which they say they solved already) ?
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March 4, 2020 2:24pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  It is voluntary… You don’t have to pay.
  
  (I’m assuming that your bill isn’t for attendance fees at a Kura or an Integrated school)
  
  https://www.education.govt.nz/assets/Documents/School/donations/MOE-Donations-Scheme-Opt-Out-A3-FA-2-DEC.PDF
  
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  March 4, 2020 3:25pm
- MCos
  
  Send your kids to a school that doesn’t ask for a donation if it makes you feel better.
  State schools are funded to a certain standard and I think you’ll find schools that ask for a high level of donations also have much better facilities than lower decile schools.
  
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  March 4, 2020 4:13pm
  - JerJer
    
    That the problem. It is a decile 10 school, and to be honest, I’m disappointed in the performance.
    
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    March 4, 2020 4:29pm
rangitoto

Shaw calls out Jones:

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/03/major-ruction-in-government-over-shane-jones-racist-indian-remarks.html
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March 4, 2020 3:14pm
- alex Masterley
  
  It sounds like Shaw is growing some balls at last.
  
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  March 4, 2020 4:17pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Not really. It’s what happens next that shows if anyone has some balls.
    
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    March 4, 2020 8:44pm
- cmm
  
  Talk is cheap Mr Shaw. If you really have integrity then show us by walking away from the CoL.
  
  Greens are staring into a future of inconsequence. This would provide an excellent chance to make yourselves relevant and save yourselves from irrelevance.
  
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  March 4, 2020 4:36pm
  - sooty
    
    Shaw has hurty feelings!
    
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    March 4, 2020 5:30pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Perhaps ardern will lend him a scarf.
      
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      March 4, 2020 8:48pm
oldfella

Beware little ‘Angry Andy’ if he goes all ‘Finnish’ on us with his proposed hate speech laws.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/03/03/europe-death-by-censorship/
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March 4, 2020 3:49pm
oldfella

How long before NZ sees its first Drag Queen Story Time? Would Cindy [ Mod : family nono ]
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/03/03/drag-queen-story-time-is-not-okay/
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March 4, 2020 3:53pm
greybeard

This business about health authorities contacting the passengers in the two rows ahead-of and behind those identified with CoronaVirus is just rubbish.

The infected passengers have probably already infected the taxi-driver or shuttle-driver who took them to the airport. Or likely one or more of their family or friends who drove them to the airport.
Or the bus driver ( and passengers ) who did the same.

Then, while they were waiting in a check-in queue, they coughed and spluttered all over the people behind them or in front of them.
Then the person or persons behind the airline counter. Or luggage counter.

Then all the people they were next to between checking-in and actually boarding: in the public toilets, the coffee-bar, the duty-free shops, etc etc

Potentially, HUNDREDS.

And once on the plane the infected ones touched seats, glassware, toilets, books, headsets, the list goes on.

The whole thing is a CROCK: just a pathetic ploy to assure people that things are being done.

Pardon my negativity & cynicism, but this just really annoys me.
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March 4, 2020 4:16pm
- JerJer
  
  The whole thing is a crock. Completely unnessary panic. How can China have 100,000 cases (which is probably actually over a million), and their stock market since the so called crisis started, has actually gone up, and yet their businesses are apparently closed. We get two cases from travellers coming into the country and our stock market collapsesand we all start to panic. What’s going on here.
  
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  March 4, 2020 4:59pm
JibberJabber

New law in San Francisco makes shoplifting products under $950 is a no-arresting misdemeanor. This is the result in the first day,

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/fd3s9g/new_law_in_san_francisco_makes_shoplifting/
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March 4, 2020 4:40pm
MrTips

Oh God, Siouxsie Bloody Wiles has gone off the deep end, writing a school girl level tome to Simon Bridges in the SpinOff.

For God’s sake, I am sick of these “celebrity scientists”.

Siouxsie, a reality check dear, from one biomedical “expert” to another: you are NOT a clinician. You have never dispensed antibiotics, diagnosed a patient. Nor have you been part of a rapid response pandemic team. Stick to your glowbug knitting and left wing smug activism. And tell your other sidekick activist Nanogirl that she too can bugger right off: she knows nothing about biology and should stick to programming and nanobots. And her school shows. She’s good at those. She is not an expert on hand washing.

Apart from your Twitter fan-club, no-one knows who you are anyway.
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March 4, 2020 5:10pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  Heard the silly tart ‘chick scientist? ” on the radio. Not too impressed. Why was she given air time?
  
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  March 4, 2020 7:00pm
rangitoto

Govt says they have a plan for Covid-19. How about they tell Health professionals. I talked to a pharmacist who tells me they have had no contact from MoH. The guys staff are nervous as pharmacy and doctor is where sick people tend to go.
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March 4, 2020 7:28pm
- rockape
  
  Wife is a nurse practiser in a DHB plan is ,carry on as normal.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:04pm
  - Tall Man
    
    And no pay if on quarantine FFS.
    
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    March 5, 2020 8:57am
- rockape
  
  Wife is a ED nurse practiser in a DHB plan is ,carry on as normal.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:11pm
Debbie

God knows what is going on in Iran: they have temporarily freed 54000 prisoners to combat Coronavirus spread.

I have never heard of such a thing before and the only remotely logical explanation would be that it is spreading through prisons and killing inmates at such a rate that they consider it safer to release criminals in the community.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51723398?SThisFB&fbclid=IwAR2GTHOoXgh2sMi7JIaVfeIj8qhrtn80lef9EqZHYwfcnPqfD64LBKov59Q
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March 4, 2020 9:06pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  A week ago there were probably about 100k infected in Iran, based on 1400 deaths that the deputy minister of health there said there had been. The number of infected had been going up at about 10x per 10days. Now it is likely nearing 1% of their 80 million population. Their society will be falling apart and they won’t be able to find staff for anything – people will be hiding at home with family hoping for worst to pass – likely no one to guard or feed prisoners and probably a lot of critical functions no longer staffed.
  
  A lot of Iran’s prison population are harmless political prisoners anyway.
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:17pm
- sooty
  
  Don’t give angry ideas!
  
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  March 4, 2020 10:38pm
Swifty

Elsie Tanner slaps Suzie Birchall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVLxOxAa5eQ
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March 4, 2020 9:09pm

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