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March 29, 2020 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 29 March 2020

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General Debate

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PhilBest

Practical suggestion for the authorities to show a bit of “kindness” – seeing kindness has allowed a lot of Kiwis to come home from overseas late in the crisis.

People who live alone. How about these people being allowed to nominate one other “single” – or couple at the max – household unit nearby with which they are allowed to form “one bubble”?
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March 29, 2020 8:00am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  That could get awfully messy with the IQ of some of our citizens
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:00am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    You mean those who vote Labour and believe that their new Kiwibuild house key will be in their mail box soon??
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:45am
- Brian McDonald
  
  I read days ago that is allowed.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:49am
  - rouppe
    
    It is. Though if you were going to do that then it should have been at the start of the lock down.
    
    You can’t just decide half way through that you’re special and need a buddy
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:58am
    - PhilBest
      
      I’m suggesting, from common sense, that there is stuff-all “public risk” difference between moving in with someone at the start of the lockdown (which is what you are referring to, aren’t you), or popping round to see them occasionally right through the lockdown if there is only one person at each place.
      
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      March 29, 2020 12:53pm
Scott

Scott has managed to obtain an advanced copy of the prime Minister’s Monday briefing to the nation –

“Further to the banning of all weekly magazines and newspapers it has been decided to shut down all non approved websites such as Kiwiblog. DPF has been sent his home arrest bracelet. He has criticised me on numerous occasions and his comments section is totally out of my control.
NZers must go only to approved news sites from the Dom Post and the NZ Herald. Also TV 1 and TV 3 news are approved by this government.

NZers must shop at supermarkets only, butchers and dairies must close immediately.
The government has decided that too many varieties of products are on the shelves and so has sent to those outlets a list of approved grocery items.

Churches which will be closed for Easter for the first time in our history will also be closed right through to Christmas. In the meantime a stock of approved sermons will be sent to all ministers and Pastors to be preached online.

People are still doing non approved activities outside and the police will be making extensive use of facial recognition software to arrest anyone smiling or seeming to enjoy themselves.

Lastly I have read George Orwell’s book 1984 and I have found it to be aspirational. The full range of new government measures will be rolled out over the next 4 years. Better 40 years late than never.
NZers can stay safe at home for a very long time knowing that Big Sister is watching over you. “
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March 29, 2020 8:01am
- Paulus
  
  Day 4 – only 24 Days to go !
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:31am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    24 days. If you’re lucky.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:14am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    24 if you are lucky. The current losers are getting a taste of ‘control’ and they can’t get enough of it
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:22am
    - Inandout
      
      Steve, ‘control’ is a two edged sword because the Labour voters don’t take kindly to being told they can’t visit the Warehouse or such. Add to this that many of Jacinda’s lot are brain deficient and will simply breed through boredom, or simply ignore the rules. She is out of her depth and it shows on a daily basis with her ‘announcements’ and warnings.
      
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      March 29, 2020 9:43am
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        PTPM has a propaganda message today at 3pm.
        Don’t miss it or else
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:04am
      - Humble Capitalist
        
        Viva la presidente!
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:35am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    You missed a zero at the end Paulus bro!!
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:46am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Where have they said it will end???
    Initially on TV they promoted 4 weeks.
    Very quickly they took that down and started talking about….weeks.
    and
    Saying if it is longer it is our fault, without justifying anything or telling us what the criteria would be for ending this imposed lock down.
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:48pm
    - RW Capitalist
      
      4 weeks becomes
      for weeks
      
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      March 29, 2020 3:49pm
  - Pheobe
    
    The Netherlands is on lockdown till thec1st June.
    
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    March 29, 2020 4:45pm
    - Ian Boag
      
      I thought they were doing the “build herd immunity” thing by locking up the oldies and letting it rip everywhere else …. did make them a bit of an outlier.
      
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      March 30, 2020 10:59am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  …. don’t forget: “be kind”
  
  As the jackboot descends, it will be a kind one!
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:03am
- G152
  
  You realise Scott that your spoof may sadly be correct in many areas…….
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:13am
- Akarak
  
  One look at today’s Herald on-line should be enough for anyone with an ounce of intelligence to realise that if anything should be banned it’s our daily newspapers.
  I’d be interested find out if the government will be responsible for refunding those magazine subscriptions that will no doubt need to be paid?
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:28am
- oldfella
  
  Please note, in the interests of being kind, the closure of all churches will not apply to mosques, and current restrictions on food outlets will not apply to halal butchers. Remember, they are us. Allahu Akbar.
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:40pm
  - Nutta
    
    Sadly correct ‘re Halal butchers. Very prescient of you.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:44pm
- hullkiwi
  
  I have read 1984 too, and Smith’s Dream (it was the topical anti Muldoon book when I was at high school) and the movie Sleeping Dogs.
  
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  March 29, 2020 7:07pm
PhilBest

James Delingpole proposes a #CovidNazis meme

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2020/03/26/covidnazis-uk-police-force-clamps-down-on-rural-dog-walkers/

It’s disturbing to consider how many closet jackboot-fantasy people might make a career in the plods and it is times like these that they get to enact their fantasies.
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March 29, 2020 8:02am
- PhilBest
  
  Had a further thought now: seeing the “long march through the institutions” progressive Left co-opts national Police forces as their enforcement wing, of course crypto-Gestapo wet dreamers are the ideal recruits, possibly they actively try to identify and promote these people. “Centre right” politicians who let this rot get started on their watch are very responsible.
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:22am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    It helps that they focus on physical fitness (well at least for the men on the force) not IQ.
    
    Time for a minimum IQ test to be a cop.
    
    Probably time to have a more transparent process for appointing top cops too. With better accountability for behaviour.
    
    Gauleiter Busch is starting to worry me.
    
    The revelations from Waitangi that the drinkie, rapie culture is still alive and well, doesn’t bode well either.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:07am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Certainly not the same cops as 30 or 40 years ago
      
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      March 29, 2020 9:29am
      - PhilBest
        
        Another concerning thought: all the decent people in the force end up quitting in disgust. Or being pushed (remember Doonegate, that the Nats never did anything about?)
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:02am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        I had the same thought. It wasn’t that long ago that I used to observe how young the new police recruits looked.
        
        Now I observe that they all have English accents.
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:33am
      - rouppe
        
        @Loddenthinks: what I’ve noticed from a lot of recent immigrants is that they’ve left their country of origin because it has become a shit hole place to live.
        
        But they come here, and bring their shit hole behaviours with them. It’s as true of the British as anyone else.
        
        There are a lot of British accents in the police and the unions. And the attitudes of both are deteriorating.
        
        I’ve also noticed that the accents of many activists, environmentalists, feminists and lobbyists are foreign.
        
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        March 29, 2020 11:21am
      - kevn
        
        @Steve.. yep much worse back then.
        
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        March 29, 2020 12:50pm
- krazykiwi
  
  From the article:
  
  For years, Britain’s police forces have proved themselves incapable of many things — catching burglars, stopping knife crime, stopping gangs of Muslims raping girls — but when it comes to stopping people popping out for an illicit country stroll, boy, are they on top of the situation.
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:45am
  - kowtow
    
    The same Farce that was using drones to harass dog walkers has put black dye in a lake to discourage instagrammer selfie takers…….
    
    …….if this was April 1 I’d have taken that to be the usual media silly story .
    
    But when you see what the Chief Constable , an English LIt and Language university graduate does in his spare time , you start to understand the problem.
    
    ‘In his spare time, CC Goodman told the local paper he enjoys watching the BBC’s Line of Duty series.’
    
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8163209/Police-dump-black-dye-blue-lagoon-discourage-Instagram-selfies.html
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:12am
- Inandout
  
  Muslims never took kindly to dogs and even barred dog owners from some of the areas they control. They will be happy.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:46am
Than

Oh, FFS. The police are harassing people for going for random drives.

Do the cops really have that few brain cells?

To spell it out for the completely thick (which apparently includes the New Zealand police) a car is an enclosed box, usually travelling at a reasonable speed. An individual inside said box has absolutely zero chance of passing on an infection to anybody outside the box. None. Zip. Nada. People travelling in cars are every bit as socially isolated as if they were at home.

This shutdown is going to be stressful enough. Going for a drive is a perfectly safe way to get a change of scene and avoid going stir-crazy. With a caveat around what people are doing at their destination we should be actively encouraging going for drives, not discouraging it.

Stopping people from doing this is not just pointless harassment, it is actively counter-productive. It will reduce public support for the shutdown. It could lead to people breaking the shutdown in ways that actually will spread the infection.

On this matter the police need to be told to pull their fucken heads in.
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March 29, 2020 8:03am
- Padraig Payne
  
  I’d love to go for a scenic drive. Their thinking will be you could break down or be in an accident. And if they allow it you will have hundreds of cars on the road, using “scenic drive” as an excuse to do many things.
  
  I live alone and would love to do it. My car has never broken down in 8 years. But I can kind of see their point on this.
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:53am
  - Than
    
    Sure, somebody driving could break down. And a house can catch fire, a tree could fall on it, a drunk-driver could plow through the living room…
    
    No isolation is going to be 100% airtight.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:14am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Sure, but we can cut down unnecessary activities of all kinds. Another point is that cars need to be refueled, so reducing the frequency you visit that point of multiple contacts is helpful too.
      
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      March 29, 2020 9:30am
      - Than
        
        Everything in life is risk/reward.
        
        I’m not going to claim that going for a drive has absolutely zero risk. That’s not true at any time. But the risk even now is so utterly negligible that its not worth worrying about.
        
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        March 29, 2020 9:52am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        I guess you haven’t been to a petrol station for a while. Wear a pair of disposable gloves, or use the ones that a gas station would willingly provide, and you can do it all without interacting with, or having any kind of contact with, a single person.
        
        Technology, aye, who’d a thunk it?
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:35am
      - Rich Prick
        
        A clipboard and a hi-vis vest would really suit you. You’d have had kittens had you seen me up a ladder painting yesterday.
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:36am
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        If the govt had organised forecourt attendants then people would not even need to get out of cars. Unfortunately they are asleep at the wheel on organising logistics.
        
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        March 29, 2020 12:19pm
- igm
  
  If we cannot drive cars/ride motor bikes, why are lycra-clad road maggots allowed to ride around with gay abandon?
  Suppose they support Labour/Green doctrine.
  Sitting in a car/wearing helmet, are a bloody lot less likely to spread virus than road maggots or runners puffing around the streets/roads.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:08am
  - PhilBest
    
    A group-bicycle ride chat group I belong to (blush) are pretty unanimous that we’re only meant to do small circuits around our own neighbourhood, alone
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:05am
    - Rich Prick
      
      Define “neighbourhood”. The Police use that word too, but haven’t measured it out for us to comply with. Arbitrary law isn’t good law.
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:41am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    I guess better to be out getting some exercise and fresh air, than being a fat nobody in a company car.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:37am
    - igm
      
      Obviously someone who has jealousy of those with the ability to command a company car . . . bit of the old Labourite envy here!
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:52am
      - herb1
        
        you really are a dick IGM and a small one at that
        
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        March 29, 2020 12:55pm
- tf78
  
  If you get stopped say you are in your ‘bubble’ car.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:11am
- Tall Man
  
  Imagine if the dumbasses really did do there job. The first person to arrest would be ardern for leaving the border open without full medical screening and isolation.
  
  There is only one person responsible for the problem we have and her reason for doing so was vanity.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:13am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Good on the Taranaki cops. If a car has more than 1 person it could be people from different bubbles mixing – the very reason there is a lockdown. No time for idiots in the time of the Corona Virus. Time to toughen up, putting others unnecessarily at risk during wartime is dealt with severely.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:22am
  - Padraig Payne
    
    So a car with one person is OK? I have already been stopped twice by the police. I live alone and was driving alone. Today I would love to drive to a deserted beach, go for a walk and drive home. But I cannot do that.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:47am
  - kowtow
    
    War time ?
    
    War on terror / drugs bad . War on virus good .
    
    Who knew?
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:17am
- Alex13
  
  What a stupid post! The author has no understanding of the purpose of the lockdown, which is to minimise physical contacts between people and other ways of virus spreading as much as possible.
  What if you car breaks down and you may need assistance?
  You driving will increase the frequency of your having to go to the petrol station too.
  What if you have an accident (regardless of who may be at fault) – will this potentially increase the workload and physical contact for many people working in various support areas (ambulance, police, towing, mechanics, etc.)?
  Making the roads busier does not help urgent assistance vehicles either.
  Stay the **** home!
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:27am
  - Rich Prick
    
    Oh, look, a gulag enthusiast. Yes, we’re all morons who need every aspect of our lives controlled in the name of “safety”.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:44am
    - Alex13
      
      No, not all. But you are a moron – you don’t know what gulag was like (otherwise you would not have brought it up here), and your post contains not a single valid argument, just unsubstantiated exaggerations and hot air.
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:18am
      - Rich Prick
        
        I didn’t realise that in these Statist times hyperbole has been banned too. Lighten up, we get enough serious face from Cindy.
        
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        March 29, 2020 11:32am
  - gravedodger
    
    Rather daft Alex13, this is not East Germany driving Trabants,,,yet.
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:44pm
    - Rich Prick
      
      He’s only 13, I’d cut him some slack, 1988 is pre-history for our freshly minted troll, Alex.
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:20pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  It also exposes Police to an increased risk of catching any lurking virus or other infection.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:39am
- Rich Prick
  
  I’m about to sneak out for a sly drive (to the supermarket Mr Bush, I know you’re watching and I’m not keen on a “visit to your place”) and I think I’ll take the back roads just to be safe.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:51am
  - calendar girl
    
    To be safe, RP, keep a shopping list for the supermarket in your car at all times.
    
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    March 29, 2020 4:07pm
krazykiwi

I’ve done the math. My model is telling me that by the time this lockdown finishes, wine-o-clock will have moved to 9am
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March 29, 2020 8:07am
- MT_Tinman
  
  That late?
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:34am
  - tf78
    
    It’s not too bad if you sleep in.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:12am
    - GT Build
      
      Yes it is just like a month of Sundays
      
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      March 29, 2020 9:51am
- Tall Man
  
  Pffft, sleeping late are we ?
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:15am
  - tf78
    
    Did this morning which leaves less time to wait for wine o’clock. Wonderful!
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:13am
Happychappy

In the last couple of days I have heard from a very good source that not only nurses and doctors that have retired or left the profession are being asked to return and help, former Police Officers are also being requested to return and help. So it seems that they need the experience of the old hands to help control the public as they don’t have the experience on the front line that is needed.
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March 29, 2020 8:08am
- Southern Bear
  
  It’s the numbers. They simply don’t have the numbers to enforce the upcoming tighter restrictions. Measures such as “not allowed to go more than 100 meters from your house” etc. That takes a lot of enforcement.
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:38am
  - PhilBest
    
    100 metres?? Seriously?? I’ve missed that. Plenty of people doing proper walks in my neighborhood still this morning.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:07am
    - Nickc2
      
      Speaking of neighborhoods, try this for size:
      A neighborhood is a geographic community in a larger city, town or suburb. Neighborhoods are often social communities because the people that live in them commonly talk with each other. Researchers have not agreed on an exact definition. Courtesy of Google.
      No agreement as to what a neighborhood is eh? Well, given that, how the F can you be charged with being outside your neighborhood?
      Ok, I’m off to drive around my neighborhood and check it out. My neighborhood is Auckland’s North Shore.
      
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      March 29, 2020 12:51pm
- Brian McDonald
  
  It’s been going on for weeks.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:24am
  - Albert_Ross
    
    Well that’s good, isn’t it? They anticipated that there would be a need for more staff, and they took early action to address that need. Is there supposed to be some criticism here?
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:40am
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Some professional experience would be a good idea. The current ones just fill in report forms
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:35am
  - Albert_Ross
    
    Now is really, really not the time to be carping at health professionals.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:42am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      I was referring to the Police
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:06am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Or police.
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:14am
The Proper Ghandi

https://www.tripadvisor.com/COVID-2019

Among the many useful sources of aggregated Covid-19 statistics, I find this to be a very good one. Importantly, it includes the ‘recovered’ stats (50 in NZ as of yesterday). As usual, the media only gives you the total diagnosed cases, but fails to point out that many have and will recover, having been barely adversely affected.
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March 29, 2020 8:09am
- krazykiwi
  
  I predict that once widespread testing is available, we will suddenly learn that many millions of people have had, and recovered from this virus with few symptoms and with no intervention.
  
  The CFR will plummet, and democratic governments who have been enjoying their day in the totalitarian sun will have more than a few questions to answer.
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:35am
  - PhilBest
    
    Agree! I’ve been coming to the same conclusions. This might be thought of like the “2000 bug” in retrospect.
    
    What always would have been justified, is telling the elderly and vulnerable people to self isolate, way back. And there should be, for the future (and should have been already) ramp-up intensive care facilities, like Singapore has. Far cheaper to ramp up the intensive care as necessary for the 0.1% of people who will need it, than to crash the entire economy just because our limit on saving victims was “x per week”. The lesson from this is, increase the “x”.
    
    Otherwise the whole thing stinks of power tripping for the sake of it.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:12am
    - Nickc2
      
      Get used to it Phil. Now they (Government and Police) have a taste for it, there will be no stopping them. IMHO, they will wheel this draconian measure out anytime things get contentious.
      I’m picking if Andrew Little gets his anti-free speech bill up and there are enough marches against it, the populace will be forced to remain in their abodes.
      
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      March 29, 2020 1:19pm
      - V
        
        Andrew will only be too happy to let all the prisoners out on compassionate grounds, such as they might get Covid in prison.
        
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        March 29, 2020 4:47pm
  - Brian McDonald
    
    That’s not a prediction it’s an evident fact.
    However, the data from widespread testing is needed.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:56am
    - krazykiwi
      
      No, it’s a prediction because the data isn’t yet available. I predict that my prediction will become a fact once the data is available 🙂
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:37am
    - Ed Snack
      
      We don’t actually have much information at all about the prevalence of the virus in NZ. It is pure speculation to assume that it is widespread.
      
      And until we do a proper random sample survey looking for the virus and for antibodies from a past infection, we won’t know either.
      
      I wonder if NZ hospitals are using the chloroquine and antibiotic treatment yet, even in limited cases. There is mounting evidence that it works very well in a majority of cases and has few side effects. Note though that some seriously affected people cannot use the drugs as they can be life threatening for some illnesses especially heart arrhythmias.
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:44am
- Morphyoss
  
  No conspiracy mate. Recovered cases clearly reported on RNZ yesterday
  
  Coronavirus: 83 new cases in New Zealand, two patients in intensive care https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/412818/coronavirus-83-new-cases-in-new-zealand-two-patients-in-intensive-care
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:45am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    I didn’t claim any conspiracy. I merely point out that they are not giving the full picture when they say “x number of positive tests today.” The omission of the good news pertaining to recoveries makes the situation seem a lot worse than it is, to people who don’t think beyond only the information they are being fed.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:36am
    - PhilBest
      
      Yes, and only a few smart analysts are trying to calculate the likely numbers of people infected and not even ill enough to seek testing. When a “subset of the entire population” has been tested, in a few situations around the world, a far higher proportion of them have COVID-19 than the proportion of the overall population that is “confirmed cases” two weeks later.
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:15am
      - Loddenthinks
        
        Yes, and correspondingly the number of infected cases and those requiring hospitalisation, and those dying, will turn out to be a fraction of the percentage being breathlessly “modelled” and reported by the media.
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:41am
      - Ed Snack
        
        True enough, when one only tests based on certain criteria (the assessed risk in NZ) then you are not going to get a necessarily accurate picture of the viral presence.
        
        It could be relatively accurate if the the virus isn’t widespread, but we don’t know if that is true. So until the authorities take the time to find this out, any strategies are at best founded on guesses.
        
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        March 29, 2020 11:57am
      - PhilBest
        
        Ed, we’ve already had a few links posted on these discussions, over the last few days, to experts re-crunching the numbers based on examples of “random subset being tested in entirety”. For example, it happened when several nations evacuated their citizens from Wuhan. They tested all of them; far more of them had it than what the “confirmed cases” rate was in Wuhan.
        
        It was also done for a small town in Italy. It’s been done in Iceland. One New York hospital has started testing everyone who comes in, for absolutely anything, including car crashes. The findings are clear that a lot more people have COVID-19 than what the “confirmed cases” stats suggest, and most of them don’t get crook enough to even reach out to a doctor.
        
        Something else is going on, with the people who get really crook and die. For example, maybe it is getting a Pneumonia infection at the same time as the COVID one, that is really the cause of extreme sickness and possible death.
        
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        March 29, 2020 1:14pm
  - Alboy
    
    You’re correct, they are reporting recoveries but…… the issue is that our testing is so limited, we actually have no idea how many have had the virus and recovered. They’re only testing those that are 99% likely to have it so all the data is going to be skewed. I’m sure DPF would label this as bad research.
    
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    March 29, 2020 12:35pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The Min of Health website with the daily Media Releases has been reporting the recovered numbers.
  
  https://www.health.govt.nz/news-media/media-releases/83-new-cases-covid-19-new-zealand
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:08am
artemisia

There is an election in September. There is a lockdown that should be at least partly lifted well before then. There is a large and experienced Opposition with more experience it can call on.
National has to support the government at the moment but will be planning ahead because that’s their job.

I hope that National / Act come roaring out of the blocks fast and furious with a small number of slogans backed up by detailed planning. For example –

SUPPORT THEN GET OUT OF THE WAY

As a detail level project, how about Rodney Hide’s experimental idea. Set aside a block of land, sell off sections and remove all or most of the rules about who can build what. Caveat Emptor. Just like thousands of baches were put together by weekend warriors back in the day, but now might be tiny houses with composting toilets, or motor homes with gardens.

No 8 wire.

There have been a lot of good posts here about projects and ideas. Would a sticky thread be a plan to gather these together as an ongoing resource?
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March 29, 2020 8:14am
- Padraig Payne
  
  This would be a perfect time to repeal the RMA.
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:55am
- Tall Man
  
  From memory a few countries in southern Europe have that system but not in big cities or for big buildings.
  
  You can apply for “permission” after building during occasional amnesty periods.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:19am
  - artemisia
    
    Sounds like a plan. I envisage a couple of brown fields sites not too far away from employers with say 30 sections as pilot schemes. It would not be long before residents set up a vege swap.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:51am
    - Tall Man
      
      2 meters apart of course.
      
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      March 29, 2020 2:26pm
- coge
  
  The provisions of existing use.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:41am
- PhilBest
  
  Everyone should know about THIS:
  
  https://croakingcassandra.com/category/housing/
  
  “…Graeme Farr isn’t willing to give up. He’s launched House Club, a club and political party in one, designed to make affordable housing an option again. As the website puts it, the gist is
  
  House Club does not want to change any of the crazy number of rules and regulations that affect housing – it just wants it’s own areas where none of them apply!
  
  House Club creates its own “Club Zone” which is outside the RMA, the Building Act and council zoning rules and can have from 5 to 5,000+ houses…”
  
  Graeme Farr is a smart cookie and a good guy.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:19am
  - Mummy
    
    Yes I know Graeme Farr from a previous life. Really good guy with fantastic ideas. Hope this one works out for him.
    
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    March 29, 2020 12:09pm
  - artemisia
    
    I had never heard of it, so thank you. I’ve joined up. Is Rodney Hide associated with this? If not it may be an idea the world is ready for. At least in our zeitgeist.
    
    National, ACT – what about it?
    
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    March 29, 2020 4:11pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    OK, so maybe the Building Act has become too restrictive, but how would such a zone ensure buildings were at least safe and sound?
    
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    March 29, 2020 5:43pm
Happychappy

It seems like Bernard Hickey and Newsroom want and need NZ to move on to Basic Universal Income to solve what is going to be hard time in NZ after the Coronavirus has been eradicated.
https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/universal-basic-income-superannuation-could-option-help-economy-recover-coronavirus-bernard-hickey
This is something Grant Robertson promoted at the last election only to pull the plug a month before we went to the polls and this has been one of the priorities for the Left leaning Economists recently.
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March 29, 2020 8:25am
- Simon
  
  The Clown Show will start to print currency on a massive scale. (They started just before home detention got underway but it was relatively small beer.) What this means is higher interest rates.
  
  NZ is a massive debtor nation. Auckland City Council for eg spends 25% of its rates revenue on paying interest. When interest rates increase then Auckland City is insolvent. In a failed economy high rate rises are untenable and would never cover Auckland City debts regardless. Mass Auckland City asset sales coming up – cents on the dollar.
  
  A lot of people are in the same boat as Auckland City. Insolvent.
  
  The train has come off the tracks = where NZ is now. Next comes the flash flood to drown the survivors.
  
  The low interest debt bubble party is over.
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:41am
  - tf78
    
    What percentage of rates revenue goes on salaries and wages. I think it’s in the billions.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:17am
  - yossarian
    
    Don’t worry, they’ve put Twyford and Shane Jones in charge of the economic rebuild. Their huge successes in both Kiwibuild and the transparent Provincial Growth Fund, means we have the A team on board
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:26am
    - tf78
      
      At least with those two in charge because they achieve nothing, they will cause less damage.
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:20am
    - backster
      
      Might be some investment opportunities for the NZ First Foundation. (The one Winston knows nothing about.)
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:15am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  I think there could be a couple of things back on the cards that Ardern said wouldnt happen on her watch
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:07am
- emmess
  
  That is hands down one of the worst ideas that they could possibly even think of implementing.
  I am okay with most stuff the government does in this time of crisis as long as it is temporary.
  All countries are going to have a massive spike in unemployment but watch for ours to stay stubbornly higher for a longer period of time.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:23am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Those who give out the money expect to be in control of the the recipients–communism by stealth.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:43am
Close Hen Counters

Gosh the propaganda machine is working in fifth gear -on one news last night, a breathless Simon Dallow announced before the ad break, that All Birds entrepreneur and ex soccer player was providing shoes to the front line medical staff. Ad break over, glass of wine downed we finally get to clip about shoes…. no shoes for NZ healthcare front line because we are in lockdown but shoes for doctors in America (and the same company provided all birds to the NHS long before the viral situation) ….. best he talk to his best mate and walking advertisement, the bint in the black slippers to break through enemy lines and deliver to people in his own country since we have paid for the free tv advert on one news?
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March 29, 2020 8:27am
peterwn

See:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/120646913/coronavirus-new-world-workers-on-unpaid-leave-over-lockdown
It seems New World in Thorndon thinks that because it is not eligible for Government assistance it can play hardball with staff with health concerns who need to take leave.
Now, far from suffering from Government restrictions, supermarkets are benefiting from the restrictions since they are doing significantly more trade especially in the liquor, fruit & veg, butchery and bakery areas. The only limitation is Lotto since the Commission has stopped all ‘counter’ sales.
Therefore surely the extra profit from increased turnover (noting overheads stay the same) should be used to help support staff in need.
So come on, Mr Owner/Operator (I will give you the courtesy of not naming you) of New World Thorndon and the other New Worlds – how about showing some compassion.
The owner-operator there
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March 29, 2020 8:27am
- Andrei
  
  I think that story has more to do with staff not wanting to work, when work is available than not receiving Government assistance for them..
  
  In crisis people who can contribute should do so, even if it is in modest tasks like replenishing the cans of baked beans on the shelves.
  
  Im out of sugar and flour now
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:44am
  - Humble Capitalist
    
    The staff are unable to work as they are classed at risk by Ministry of Health eg compromised immunity, respiratory conditions like asthma
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:14am
  - godruelf
    
    Others affected in the New World situation could be those over 70 who are advised to stay home. They are however already getting National Super. As the unemployment rises those over 65 will need to make way for the younger workers.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:29am
  - stewmar
    
    What baked beans I haven’t seen any for weeks!!
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:35am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  I agree Peter re New World owners, but how about other essential businesses running at big losses whose at risk staff need support. Come on Ardern and Robertson that should have been sorted before the bennies
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:12am
  - peterwn
    
    You mean those classed as non-essential businesses. OK there are some essential businesses where only part of the business is ‘essential’ or despite being ‘essential’ sales would have significantly dropped – Air NZ, commuter buses and trains, service stations etc.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:58am
- Akarak
  
  And now Countdown have learnt the art of ‘government speak’.
  Countdown have introduced a Priority Assistance service which prioritises those people who are 70 years old or older, who are immune-compromised, have chronic illnesses or have a disability which makes it difficult to get to their stores.
  Having then encouraged qualifying customers to register they send out an email to all on-line One Card customers which states “We’re expecting high demand for Priority Assistance. While we cannot guarantee availability of delivery slots for these customers, our team is doing its best to scale up and increase delivery times as much as possible, so please bear with us.
  To help free up online shopping for those who most need it, we’d encourage any customers who can shop in our stores to do so. We’re open right through the lockdown”.
  So there appears that the whole assistance package relies simply on trying to speed up the existing service and asking non-qualifying customers to stop using home delivery and go to the supermarket to do their shopping instead.
  I can see this working well.
  Sounds more like a bad case of Twyford think!
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:50am
-D

So Why Aren’t The Public Sector On $585.50 a Week?
Cathy Odgers asks: https://asianinvasion2019.blogspot.com/2020/03/so-why-arent-public-sector-workers-on.html
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March 29, 2020 8:32am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  Good point but one we’ll never get an answer to
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:15am
- yossarian
  
  Does that mean teachers are on 16 weeks of paid leave a year? 4 months of holiday leave!
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:29am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Surely that will depend on whether people are working or not. I should think many public servants are working from home quite satisfactorily.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:33am
  - -D
    
    At least your first sentence is correct.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:24am
- peterwn
  
  But it is all about votes at the next election.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:03am
- KevO'Brien
  
  The $585.50/week is not that either–it’s reduced by income tax, KiwiSaver and other deductions.
  That’s a gross amount paid to employers, free of GST and exempt from income tax to them but not their employees.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:52am
  - Jules99
    
    It’s only exempt from income tax for employers because the full amount is supposed to be passed on to staff so the income is immediately converted to an expense, hence no tax payable. And with GST, they are not collecting GST from the government so they don’t have to pay it to the government.
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:29pm
    - KevO'Brien
      
      As an employer, do I have to pay tax on the wage subsidy I receive for an employee?
      No, you don’t have to pay tax on a wage subsidy as it’s classified as excluded income.
      
      https://www.workandincome.govt.nz/products/a-z-benefits/employer-questions-and-answers.html
      
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      March 29, 2020 5:47pm
Simon

Vote the bums out.
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March 29, 2020 8:36am
- Akarak
  
  We’re all in this to.get.her out!
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:52am
Simon

brenton tarrant will get better treatment than any Labour Party rape victim.
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March 29, 2020 8:37am
gravedodger

Had a kerbside with neighbour who is a significant part of local Plod and a gd bstd.
He is not so pleased with his current leader but is very hopeful for the chief designate.

For me Bush is enjoying his new found powers too much!!
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March 29, 2020 8:40am
Maggy Wassilieff

Remember the Australian bushfires?
Three arsonists arrested yesterday
https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/three-men-arrested-over-40-fires-near-bendigo-during-bushfire-season-20200328-p54eth.html
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March 29, 2020 8:43am
- the deity formerly known as nigel6888
  
  Were they climate arsonists?
  
  I thought the official media line was that these were spontaneous outbreaks of climate change?
  
  The claims of arson were right wing fantasies.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:11am
- Critical Thinker
  
  They should be charged with terrorism & attempted mass murder.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:52am
mark15

Anyone see the #bekind puff piece on the dunedin dementia home?
Did you see the wide angle shot of the two carers together and the ‘reporter’ stood 20 feet away that they slipped in for no apparent reason?

Did you see the two ‘reporters’ talking about the lockdown? One was at a beach and the other on a high street.
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March 29, 2020 8:49am
- mikenmildagain
  
  It’s a good practice to remind viewers that the reporters are trying to keep a distance too.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:34am
  - mark15
    
    Why were the ‘reporters’ there during a ‘lockdown’?
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:44am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Here’s the link:
  
  https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/dunedin-rest-home-staff-move-in-residents-dementia-amid-coronavirus-lockdown
  
  I didn’t view it as a puff-piece.
  
  The nurses/care-givers and their own families are deserving of our support and fulsome praise.
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12320238
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:19am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    I agree Maggie. It may have been the nurses/care-givers I saw on TV last night. Real heroines.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:01am
Wangas Feral

We are planning a road trip tomorrow. Well one of us is the rest are staying home. Be a nice 100km round trip and gas is really cheap at the moment too.
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March 29, 2020 8:50am
- mikenmildagain
  
  That’s just foolish.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:34am
  - Wangas Feral
    
    Well, We live 50km from the nearest supply of milk, bread, flour and other staples. What are we supposed to do?
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:13am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Heck, milk the cow and rev up your local flour mill
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawana_flour_mill.
      
      Do a bit of eeling down the creek…and Bob’s your uncle.
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:34am
      - Wangas Feral
        
        I don’t know about where you are but there are no dairy cows and no flour mills in our valley. Also, the river is acidic and there are no eels. I want a fucking cup of tea with milk and a sandwich.
        
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        March 29, 2020 1:09pm
      - kowtow
        
        Eeling ? Nein.
        
        Fishing verbotten!
        
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        March 29, 2020 1:43pm
      - Rich Prick
        
        Fishing is banned. Not sure about eeling. Most probably.
        
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        March 29, 2020 3:04pm
    - mikenmildagain
      
      That’s fine. Not what your first comment suggested.
      
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      March 29, 2020 1:08pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Big of you Milky. Glad you’re the arbiter of what we’re allowed to do…
        
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        March 29, 2020 5:57pm
    - gravedodger
      
      Just like the morons pretending to rule over us an apologist for the socialists has no fucking idea, carryon mikenmildagain.
      Nice you thought Wangas was joyriding!!!
      
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      March 29, 2020 3:32pm
MrTips

Dear diary
Day 4: the walls are closing in. Wife’s taken up knitting to relieve the boredom. She tells me my noose should be ready by Tuesday.
Sunday, the Lord’s day. Think I’ll Nerfgun all the neighbours frozen dogshit back over the fence to his doorstep. It’s better to give than receive, says the Lord.
Learning to cook. They don’t tell you about having to disconnect the smoke alarm in the recipe. Annoying.
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March 29, 2020 8:55am
Belinda

So now the govt are spending $1000’s a week to keep one person in an upmarket hotel, cooked breakfast, nice meals, snack boxes delivered, free phone calls.
There are police guarding the hotel but the “residents” are free to wander in the grounds and heres the kicker, he has been told he can wander down to the supermarket.
If this is quarantine show me how to get it.
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March 29, 2020 8:57am
- Loddenthinks
  
  Find a discarded boarding pass from an arriving traveler, disinfect it and rock on up to the nearest 5-star hotel, give that a shot!
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:40am
  - Belinda
    
    Now that sounds a good plan, or if your kids in Aus are doing it hard, tell them to get themselves to Akld quickly and hunker down in a nice hotel.
    
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    March 29, 2020 12:15pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Putting *all* arrivals into a luxurious quarantine (except those supermarket visits of course) at the first whiff of this virus would have been far cheaper than causing this total economic crisis.
  
  They could have prevented lockdown that way, even allowed students, long-term tourists and other visitors in just by enforcing a 2 week quarantine for all arrivals, no exceptions.
  
  Then we would still have an economy.
  
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  March 29, 2020 6:02pm
greybeard

Apparently it is forbidden to go mountain-biking and surfing and tramping because of the potential for injury, and therefore the added strain on health resources.
I would suggest that with so many people at home now doing maintenance and DIY projects, up ladders and on trestles etc that there will be far more injuries than those from outdoor pursuits.
Will we ever know ?
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March 29, 2020 8:58am
- godruelf
  
  One might also ask how many more mental health issues domestic violence cases etc will be caused by the ban on low contact outdoor activities and eventual slowdown on DIY due to the hardware store shutdowns.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:22am
- yossarian
  
  My wife works at Waikato Hospital, and these Friday and Saturday nights have been the quietest on record.
  
  Look I support healthcare service providers but they’re not doing it tough, in fact due to visitor restrictions and no boozed up yobbos filing in on the weekends, their jobs have never been easier.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:34am
  - kowtow
    
    Yep , the Mediacl Director guy just said they’re working at 50 % capacity now that elective’s been cancelled .
    Hope that all continues to go well and the shit does not hit the fan.
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:46pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Not so much the strain on health resources treating injuries, as the risks of having to mount rescues, getting lots of people out searching, etc.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:36am
- Joely Doe
  
  Been out on the MTB every day so far… as have the kids (20 & 18 yrs). So many people out in the forest (Bottle Lake, Chch) that have, quite obviously, never been on a bike or in the forest previously.
  Lost walkers and pram pushers, ‘riders’ going the wrong way, family ‘bubbles’ who last got on a bike about 10yrs ago…
  House is also getting the spring clean it needs.
  Yes, Mike Bush, it IS a 4 week holiday.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:50am
  - kowtow
    
    4 week ?
    
    In order to sound the ‘all clear ‘ they’ll need 28 days of no new cases .
    
    As to holiday , will there be any jobs to go back to when the “holiday” is over .
    
    “Public service” definitely as tax payers pay their salaries , private sector , maybe not so much.
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:49pm
  - geekatwork
    
    4 week holiday NOT, all 3 in our house working full time remotely now. As I’m antisocial the only difference is I don’t interact with my work collegues as much and am rapidly losing weight as I can’t get junk food anymore.
    
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    March 30, 2020 7:53am
- Wangas Feral
  
  They can go f themselves. I am going biking every day.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:53am
  - PhilBest
    
    If you’re 50kms from anywhere, “staying in your neighbourhood” will be pretty hard for the plods to define….
    
    4 1
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    March 29, 2020 1:18pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  The risks of domestic accidents have surely been dramatically increased. My family have a planned garden building project just waiting on the weather.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:57am
- Mummy
  
  What about a solitary round of golf? I can’t think of anything more therapeutic and safe than that. Sure the 19th hole is closed, as it should be, but how dangerous is it to get out in a wide open space by yourself and hit a little white ball around?
  
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  March 29, 2020 12:13pm
Vallager

What happens at the other end of this? Will we have been cowed into permanent submission, our lives ruled by the fear?
Will we simply accept what the government tells us to do because it is for our own good?
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March 29, 2020 9:02am
- tf78
  
  We must never give into them – be fair and reasonable before now and then take back our liberties post haste.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:24am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I think we will all be ensuring that money and effort is not diverted into nebulous projects.
  
  We will want to see that our Hospitals are well equipped and well staffed.
  
  We will want to see that our economy is placed back onto a strong footing.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:26am
bruceavon

Article in the Herald about how ‘hard’ this lock down is only 4 Days in.
I first heard about this from Britain where on hearing about the lock down an old guy said “Let’s get this straight. to defeat this enemy I have to sit on the couch and watch Netflix for a month? I think we can muster that..”
it was a response to growing claims from people that “this is our WWII”. No. No it isn’t. Comparing what’s happening now In the UK to the Battle Of Britain or the Blitz is insulting. Now some young ‘social media tending reporter’ in the Herald has taken offence to the idea here.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=12320608
I get it is the biggest challenge in a lifetime for many people but comparing being paid to stay home with plenty of food bears no comparison to the horror of WWII. Even here. Sons of being killed in battles, the Nazi taking over Europe and the Japanese barrelling through the pacific, it was terrifying. we will have, but have had no deaths so far. My mum was around during the war and she doesn’t know what the fuss is.
“So I just have to stay home? Is that it?”
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March 29, 2020 9:17am
- kowtow
  
  Quite .Notice across much of the MSM they are deliberately using war type rhetoric in their reporting .
  It is not “appropriate” , is frightening (that’s what they want) and is simply playing into the hands of the authoritarians .
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:54pm
Tony Stuart

One News slipped to a new low last night. Despite the 1pm briefing yesterday saying that they weren’t going to give details of the two patients in ICU for privacy reasons, ONE News had a reporter outside Nelson Hospital report on facts already known about the seriously ill person.

Has TVNZ decided that this patient will be New Zealand’s first coronavirus death? Are they hoping to get shots of grieving family, or of the funeral director arriving to uplift the body?

It’s all ghoulish, tabloid journalism, and completely unnecessary. Pick up your game TVNZ!
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March 29, 2020 9:20am
- MrTips
  
  I would chip in for the family to sue TVNZ and all staff personally involved in that story for breach of privacy if it came to it.
  
  TV news folk really excel at blowing smoke up their own ass. Repulsive, stupid people mostly.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:26am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    There was no breach of privacy,
    
    3 25
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    March 29, 2020 10:03am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      Not yet, but the reporter has been stationed there since it was revealed there was a person in Nelson’s ICU. It’s gratuitous and unnecessary; TVNZ should spare a thought for the family.
      
      29 3
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      March 29, 2020 10:07am
      - alex Masterley
        
        I thought TVNZ’s coverage in Nelson was disgraceful. Some sympathy for the person in ICU was called for but not shown.
        
        17 1
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        March 29, 2020 11:37am
- krazykiwi
  
  Jacinda will be sectetly hoping some someone dies soon. Anyone really, just so long as it can be attributed to Covid19 no matter the extent of the deceased’s COPD, hypertension, diabetes etc.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:28am
  - Alex13
    
    What a silly post! There are times for partisanship and politics, and there are times when they are inappropriate.
    
    5 14
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    March 29, 2020 10:47am
    - krazykiwi
      
      I genuinely believe that any politician, from any side of the political spectrum who had enacted such draconian measures would want to see justification for their decision. So far the PM woke up late, then quickly implemented one of the strictest lock-down regimes in the [democratic] world … while we have no deaths recorded.
      
      Even if/when this first happens it is highly probably (>99%) that the deceased will have one or more significant health issues, and was already at risk of dying from the regular flue, or a common cold, or some other routine aliment.
      
      But just you watch.
      
      Our PM will put on her legendary sad face for the cameras to announce the death, and use it to remind us of how important it is to comply with the new police state rules she’s implemented.
      
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      March 29, 2020 12:39pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        quod erat demonstrandum.
        
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        March 29, 2020 4:48pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Seems like you might be her speechwriter.
        
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        March 29, 2020 8:33pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Maggy, I wish I was wrong. But look where we’ve arrived: Emotional manipulation by the state.
        
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        March 29, 2020 9:54pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Sorry Tony I missed that as I haven’t watched One News for about 25 years.
  
  22 4
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  March 29, 2020 9:32am
  - sooty
    
    In the whole of 25yrs, you haven’t missed much!
    
    9 2
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    March 29, 2020 10:51am
- Poppa
  
  You are so right Tony
  
  The media in this country are a bloody disgrace
  
  26 2
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  March 29, 2020 9:44am
- mikenmildagain
  
  How was this report ghoulish, tabloid, or completely unnecessary?
  
  What we do know is that this patient here at Nelson Hospital, they have been here for a few days now, and originally their condition was described as not so bad, but it has deteriorated since and they remain in that critical condition. And what we’ve also learned is that they did have and they do have significant underlying health conditions.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:49am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    That much was known on Friday, and reported, by the same reporter. The MoH has requested privacy, so why is TVNZ splashing the details around again by regurgitating them, and incurring the cost of having a live team outside the hospital?
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:09am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Perhaps you could identify the breach of privacy in the report.
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:17am
- Padraig Payne
  
  I suggest you stop watching it. I have not watched any New Zealand broadcast TV for 10 years. What can you possibly gain by watching TVNZ ‘news’?
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:53am
  - kowtow
    
    KYE.
    
    Know your enemy.
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:56pm
- PhilBest
  
  “Ghoulish” is exactly the word that I’ve thought of about global coverage of ICU wards in Italy and elsewhere too.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:25am
- KevO'Brien
  
  It would have been better if they had told us of the ages of the people in ICU. Without any other details that would not be a breach of privacy.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:59am
Tauhei Notts

Will this lockdown still be in place on 25th of next month?
That is day that we commemorate people who fought(and some died) to protect us from a tyrannical dictatorship.
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March 29, 2020 9:20am
- Komata
  
  Tauhei@0920
  
  Apparently not. Our local (No location) ANZAC day commemoration has been cancelled due to the virus. No doubt it will be followed by many more.
  
  Given her political views, I don’t think that the PTPM will shed many tears, although she WILL probably have to forego a photo op…
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:10am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Isn’t there a commemoration scheduled to be held off Cape Reinga with a naval flotilla carefully separated with the PTPM and the Commodore holding the baby on the bow of the lead ship?
    
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    March 29, 2020 12:05pm
- Mummy
  
  We are all supposed to go and stand at our gates for 2 min silence at 6.00 am.
  
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  March 29, 2020 12:15pm
Gravelroad

I’ve been “keeping my powder dry” regarding any future support/vote for Mr Simon Bridges.
But if he, and his committee (not to mention the National Party generally) have gone along with this dangerous campaign to control the newspapers, then that’s me done with him.
Trouble is, he and his party are showing no leadership whatsoever in any of these current events.
What are your thoughts, Mr Bridges? Do you have anything to contribute at this time? Or is the media not letting you speak?
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March 29, 2020 9:31am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Bridges on Twitter last night, with regard to the newspaper issue (he was retweeting the link to DPF’s post on the ban):
  
  “This is wrong and needs to change”
  
  https://twitter.com/simonjbridges/status/1243803939746615297
  
  An issue for Tuesday’s meeting of the COVID-19 select committee, I suspect.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:53am
  - MrTips
    
    I wondered that, thanks TS. As for coolas who came on here yesterday and lied that the committee had approved it – sod off. Ardern approved this herself, it’s her portfolio.
    
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    March 29, 2020 9:58am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    It is exactly the sort of issue the select committee should discuss. There is no doubt many tricky balances to be sought between maximum health protection and preserving other important values, so I think it is very helpful that this parliamentary mechanism has been established to provide a level of scrutiny independent of the government.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:06am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      How can it work if they are denied publicity?
      
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      March 29, 2020 12:07pm
  - Gravelroad
    
    #Tony Stuart -Not everyone on Twitter. Limited cellphone coverage in many rural areas.
    During the 2017 election campaign, Mr Winston Peters hired a very effective propaganda writer who disseminated regular media releases outlining NZ1’s alleged policies.
    We had them emailed here. We are not members of any political party but got them anyway so obviously on mailing databases.
    It’s a fine line between sending out stuff that is, or might be, considered party policy and that which is just straight out dodgy electioneering. But, maybe time Mr Bridges considered communicating some thoughts directly so that we can see where he is coming from.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:16am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      National has suspended all campaign activities for the foreseeable future. Bridges sent out an email on Thursday to all party members and supporters.
      
      If you want to receive his regular communications, go to the National Party website and subscribe. I’m sure the emails from Peters in 2017 weren’t unsolicited, and that at some point you had given NZF permission to send them.
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:35am
      - Gravelroad
        
        No, we did not subscribe to what actually were media releases (thus disseminated to a wide range of outlets) but could have unsubscribed.
        At least they afforded us some amusement at the time.
        I guess if one is not a paid up member of a political party, that party isn’t too bothered about communicating to potential voters anyway.
        
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        March 29, 2020 11:03am
      - Tony Stuart
        
        On the contrary; you don’t have to be a paid-up member of National to engage with them on policy issues.
        
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        March 29, 2020 4:46pm
  - PhilBest
    
    Excellent; learning Trump tactics. But in the USA, the MSM gives Trump leverage by reporting his Tweets, assuming that everyone will find them as distasteful as they do, when in fact many people are thinking “go, The Donald”!
    
    Is the MSM here going to do the same for Simon’s “controversial” Tweets?
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:28am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  https://www.national.org.nz/government_needs_to_reverse_community_newspaper_ban_quickly
  
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  March 29, 2020 8:39pm
  - Nutta
    
    The coverage in MSM (<0) of the National Party thinking on this issue probably explains why they're saving their money to campaign when it will stand any chance of being effective.
    
    The MSM will report nothing other than what Jacinda says, including potty training for the baby.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:06pm
Ipanema69

As of yesterday the percentage of known infections requiring ICU admission in New Zealand was 0.4%.

The percentage of known infections requiring ICU admission and ventilation was 0.2%.

The mortality percentage of known infections is currently 0%.

The number of known infections is 451.

The number of actual infections is unknown and probably won’t ever be known until we can perform widespread blood testing for the presence of Covid-19 antibodies. This would indicate the number of people who had been exposed and had either not developed symptoms or alternatively had had a relatively benign symptoms and recovered. Note that this set of people would not currently test positive for the presence of the virus.

Thus if we take the sample of 451 known positive tests which is essentially a self selected sample of persons with sufficiently serious symptoms to warrant testing.

The probability that we would have had zero deaths in 451 cases with an actual mortality rate of 4% is roughly one in one hundred million.

The probability that we would have had zero deaths in 451 cases with an actual mortality rate of 3% is roughly one in a million.

The probability that we would have had zero deaths in 451 cases with an actual mortality rate of 2% is roughly one in ten thousand.

The probability that we would have had zero deaths in 451 cases with an actual mortality rate of 1% is roughly 1 in one hundred.

Again these statistics are flawed as the sample of 451 cases is known to not be representative of the actual population.

However there is nothing to suggest in the data that the often quoted 2% to 4% mortality rate is correct. Noting that this comes from the original imperial college modelling which has been widely discredited.

The true value is likely to be well south of 1%.
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March 29, 2020 9:32am
- septic skeptic
  
  Some of these 451 will die though, won’t they?
  We have had 50 recoveries.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:51am
  - Ipanema69
    
    Yes that is true. Some may die, however the key point is that there is no evidence in New Zealand that the mortality rate will be anything like the 3% to 4% that was used to justify the lockdown.
    
    Yes this is possibly a bit worse than a bad influenza season, however its not worth crashing the economy.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:54am
  - gravedodger
    
    Every single one of those 451 will die. The unknown is when!
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:40pm
- Alex13
  
  Maybe. But this is still likely to be higher than mortality rate of seasonal flu, – possibly due to higher virulence of the new virus.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:54am
- MrTips
  
  Indeed. Shaun Hendy’s hysterical and wild modelling of 80,000 deaths needs to be directly challenged. Prof Baker was very “polite” in stating his own assessment was maybe 30,000 deaths IF NOTHING WAS DONE ONLY. https://blogs.otago.ac.nz/pubhealthexpert/2020/03/23/the-maths-and-ethics-of-minimising-covid-19-deaths-in-nz/
  
  This is worse than std flu, and should be taken seriously, but not so bad that everyone should be locked up. It would be easier to lockdown the risky groups (elderly, immunocompromised) and have everyone else at Level 3. And test, test test – just like the WHO called for. And close the borders, bit late for that.
  
  Hendy has done himself no favours at at all, but is behaving consistent with his climate change zealotry.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:58am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    How do you know we have the testing capacity? If you don’t know, an answer to why we are having the lockdown could be part of the reason.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:15am
    - Pharmachick
      
      He’s on the emergency call list for performing tests if ESR needs help. I suggest Mr Tips knows exactly what he’s talking about.
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:57am
      - Brian McDonald
        
        Do you mean about test kit availability? He didn’t say anything about it.
        Being able to test is of high importance, but if we have got the test kits available is the question.
        
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        March 29, 2020 12:39pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        Oh, sorry about that, I thought you were asking about testing itself. I am sure we have enough people that can do PCR to do the tests (and you can empty out AKL Uni Med School and Biological Sciences labs if you need more), whether they’re certified is another thing. There’s a few of wrinkles here that might not be immediately obvious: (1) Labs need to be correctly clinically certified to give a public test result, (2) Personnel need to be suitably trained and, depending on test; certified, (3) The test itself needs to be approved in NZ and (4) independent QA/QC needs to continuously occur to prevent false +ve or -ve. I don’t know the status of what NZ has approved or how many approved tests there are, but I am sure Abbott will be willing to sell as many of their 15 minute tests as possible as soon as they have ramped up manufacturing capacity. Its also likely the the company for whom MrTips serves as a reference lab has a product that is in development/production right now… they usually do. So that would depend on approval, supply, and resource ($, human capital) allocation.
        
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        March 29, 2020 3:07pm
  - Stu2
    
    The 80,000 figure is not explicitly in the paper, it is probably from the do nothing scenario. And if so, it is a paper tiger as we fired up case isolation straight away (see the counter measure list at the bottom)
    
    In the do nothing option, each infected person infects 2.5 more. The model drops the amount of transmission depending on the measures taken.
    
    The model uses a fatality rate of 1%, which doubles if the ICR beds are full.
    
    The changes in the transmission rate (how many people a new infection infects) are :
    
    2.5 – do nothing
    2.3 – close schools and universities
    2.0 – case isolation
    1.75 – case isolation and household quarantine
    1.2 – Case isolation, household quarantine,
    population-wide social distancing
    0.75 – all of the above
    
    You can see why it produces large numbers off the back of limited or no countermeasues – a lot of infections happen quickly and the health system is swamped
    
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    March 29, 2020 12:35pm
- Brian McDonald
  
  Thanks for the data.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:13am
lastmanstanding

A couple of points.

1. I note ScoMo said yesterday the lockdown MIGHT continue for 6 months. This is at least the second time I have heard him say this. As I see it until Wuhan Flu is eradicated world wide there is a risk to any country that moves out of lockdown. There is also a risk from the crew of air craft and ships bringing good here.
In addition if we keep our borders closed to incoming as we must noone will be able to fly out as Air NZ arent going to return with empty planes and other airlines arent going to fly here empty to pick up Kiwis.

2. I received the IR3 for my company in the mail. Like rust the IRD never sleeps.
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March 29, 2020 9:33am
- Brian McDonald
  
  He’s kicking into gear. He also mentioned a freeze on commercial rent payments. That could be good here with Government possibly picking up interest rates for commercial landlords who froze their mortgage payments for the six months on offer.
  A general rate payments freeze (even if offered as a credit in advance) could also be fair as many council and other such employees drop onto the 3 months ‘wage’ payment of 585 (plus top-ups by employers.)
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:50am
  - mark15
    
    Taxpayer
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:51am
  - tf78
    
    My mother told me that during the depression the councils suspended rate payments. Can’t see Goff doing that though – their monster is way too big from taking on non-core council responsibilities. A good time to drain the council swamp.
    
    8 1
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    March 29, 2020 10:55am
    - Brian McDonald
      
      Morrison put it beautifully, ‘putting businesses to sleep’ (or similar) so that when things are reading to go they are ready.
      I think Mr Goff’s crew, could largely be readily put to sleep until things are moving again.
      I’d like to know why rates can’t be abated in the meantime.
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:21am
      - NeverMindTheBollocks
        
        You mean like we put the family dog to sleep?
        
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        March 29, 2020 12:13pm
      - Nutta
        
        Can we put ATEED to sleep? Don’t see any tourism or major events kicking off in Auckland for a bit.
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:09pm
- artemisia
  
  Seems to be a test that takes only a few minutes and is going into production. Test everyone entering the country.
  
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  March 29, 2020 9:52am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Some of the test kits brought out of China by Spain had only a 30% reliability, another type 80%. The first was unlicenced and have been returned. But it is good news however as reliability should be able to be improved.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:24am
- Tauhei Notts
  
  Company tax returns have been IR4 returns for at least half a century. Why would they change it to IR3 in 2020?
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:00am
  - lastmanstanding
    
    Apologies you are right IR4. IR3 for individuals.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:53am
BK Scurfield

French researchers complete additional study of Hydroxychloroquine and Azithromycin drug combination on 80 Coronavirus patients. Results continue to look promising.

https://techstartups.com/2020/03/27/coronavirus-cure-new-results-french-study-shows-combination-hydroxychloroquine-plaquenil-azithromycin-successfully-treated-80-coronavirus-patients-significant-dr/
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March 29, 2020 9:33am
- mikenmildagain
  
  But lay off swallowing the fish-tank cleaner until further data is available…
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:08am
  - emmess
    
    No, roll it out ASAP
    Hydroxychloroquine has been safely used for about 80 years.
    And lay off the fish tank cleaner permanently, fellas.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:34am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Even with coffee it’s not great anyway.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:26am
- Pharmachick
  
  This is good news. I hope they replicate it fast and then work out how to target the dosage.
  
  I’m much happier about hydroxychloroquine, it has a lesser side-effect profile than chloroquine.
  
  Still concerned with geriatric use.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:16am
  - MrTips
    
    It was off label trial but positive. As far as I can tell, concerns re QRS syndrome and AKI never came to pass. I suspect the key will be adjunct azithromycin. The WHO considers that combo one of the promising Tx options as well as remdesivir (which Gilead will love).
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:10am
    - Pharmachick
      
      Kidney concerns in >65 re: dosage for viral efficacy vs. adjust for kidney capacity. That’s what I meant about getting dosage sorted.
      
      The QRS will be just for anybody with Ikr issues or known QRS issues, likely (e.g. Mr Pharmachick as it happens).
      
      There’ll be some side FX from the combo but that is unavoidable. I don’t like Zpak as an antibiotic, but if it works for COVID with HCQ, it works – and we’ll be grateful.
      
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      March 29, 2020 12:02pm
    - Pharmachick
      
      Oh yes and Gilead are all over this. They sent remdesivir to China over a month ago. They were shamed into pulling their FDA application for orphan drug status just this week… wonder how long that will last.
      
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      March 29, 2020 12:03pm
    - PhilBest
      
      An adjunct antibiotic is obvious because these people die of pneumonia, don’t they, which is not necessarily solely caused by COVID-19 itself? I suspect that the likely much higher rate of infection that is not serious, is because the serious cases are those who get COVID-19 AND some other pneumonia-causing bug at the same time. We might know this in a few weeks.
      
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      March 29, 2020 1:27pm
      - Pharmachick
        
        Yes, but the azithromycin and the HCQ/CQ are both eliminated by the kidney, using the same transport systems, which can become saturated when they compete with each other. This in turn alters the way each drug behaves in the body when given together.
        
        I agree, the worth of the Z-pak will not be in its anti-viral properties (almost certainly none), but in the anti-bacterial properties of the *secondary* lung infection. In reality, these people are dying because they are drowning in their own fluids and blood – they are experiencing a version of cytokine storm in their lungs. The last time I saw anything like this was the disastrous TGN1412 drug trial.
        
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        March 29, 2020 3:50pm
rightoverlabour

Is the worm turning?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120646079/policing-the-pandemic-the-unprecedented-powers-deployed-to-keep-kiwis-at-home

Not the usual fawning….
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March 29, 2020 9:34am
- lastmanstanding
  
  Plod need to understand there are many more of us than them. If they try and push the envelope too far it will come back and bite them on the arse big time.
  Tolerance will only go so far. Citizens will not tolerate a facist Police force throwing its weight around.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:57am
  - gravedodger
    
    Maybe seperate your local plod doing what their commanders tell them to do and Gauleiter Bush and his Police HQ desk riders too many have little or zero public contact for too long.
    Talk about keeping to a “Bubble”
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:50pm
- kowtow
  
  Not the usual fawning.
  
  Only cos one of their own got the biff.
  
  Where have they been while licensed firearms owners got the biffo , oh that’s right , they were cheerleading.
  
  MSM ? F#ckers .
  
  And note well the stories from them about how the farming sector are now heroes and indispensible and will lead the recovery
  
  This from an MSM that has cheerled the far left attack on same sector.
  
  Excuse me while I don’t give a shit about the bastard ,so called fourth estste.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:57pm
Tony Stuart

If you need some animal entertainment during the lockdown, try the Panda Cam at Atlanta Zoo!

https://zooatlanta.org/panda-cam/
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March 29, 2020 9:35am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Or a live stream of a Royal Albatross chick at Taiaroa Head:
  https://planeta.com/royalcam/
  
  11 5
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  March 29, 2020 10:11am
- GT Build
  
  Had a look it moved twice in 5 minutes had to stop as it was too much excitement for one day cheers
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:16am
  - Biscuit
    
    I’ve been watching Flashmob musical pieces.
    
    This one is brilliant:
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbJcQYVtZMo&feature=youtu.be&t=12
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:25pm
  - PhilBest
    
    Is there a cam somewhere for some drying paint?
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:28pm
- cha
  
  Pandas, dogs, and everything in between.
  https://explore.org/livecams/currently-live
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:43pm
MT_Tinman

For many years we have seen it in the movies.

A halfwit in the wrong place at the wrong time is made dictator of a small island state.

The halfwit, who’s only claim to fame is they can, for a very short period, look the part, has no idea – it has been put into place by people who want to control things from behind closed doors.

The populace suffers.

Those people out of sight are always rich people with dishonest intent, politically inept communists and the Chief of Police.

The halfwit gets carried away by their own sense of importance and starts making things even worse. Starts asserting it’s authority, robbing the populace of even more of their rights in an attempt to look good to the UN.

The populace starts to see how bad the halfwit and cohorts are.

The Chief of Police gets the halfwit to give his totally corrupt police force even more power. Power to act as they wish with no responsibility, no control.

The police exercise this power ruthlessly.

The populace continues to suffer.

The situation carries on and on until a hero gets a call from his girlfriend’s family – locked up for the duration.

Finally, the “A” team (or similar) come in guns blazing, shoot the rich people and the Chief of Police, arrest the halfwit so the populace can try it and then hang it (with partner) from the nearest lamppost and generally save the day.

Welcome to the movies.

Of course, before “woke” times the halfwit was always a man or a good looking sheila. How times have changed!

Now, how and where can I find Hanibal Smith?
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March 29, 2020 9:35am
- Tall Man
  
  I’d rather you “found” Hannibal Lecter.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:02am
- Jules99
  
  I was watching a clip about Idi Amin last night and it seemed similar to what you describe.
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:05pm
All_on_Red

Contrast how Taiwan reacted compared to Arderns dithering
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/coronavirus-taiwan-case-study-rapid-response-containment-2020-3?amp&r=US&IR=T
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March 29, 2020 9:42am
Brian McDonald

This model is out showing that those aged between 21 and 30 are in the highest group of infections at this point. There may be a link for that group to central Auckland and probably a more social group than others apart from school children.
Until general testing happens it would be good to know the figure of those that are tested who are not infected.
I cannot understand why we are not being told why there is no general testing such as Germany and South Korea and when it will be implemented. If it is to preserve a low number of test kits, then when more kits will be available. It probably rates very closely in importance to the number of ventilators, actually more important.
https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/nzs-451-covid-19-cases-locations-ages-genders-clusters/ar-BB11P1AC?ocid=spartanntp
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March 29, 2020 9:43am
- Paulus
  
  We are not being told why there is no general testing.
  To do so would be to admit incompetence in the first place.
  Remember, too little, too late.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:35am
  - PhilBest
    
    Even general testing on a sample-subset would reveal what is the likely rate of “infection that does not turn serious”. There is evidence of this already from the few general testings of subsets that have occurred around the world. Re-running the numbers suggests high contagion and a much lower morbidity than guessed thus far. The people dying may have been unlucky to have contracted some other bug as well as COVID-19; that might be the decider. We know about smoking, hypertension, compromised immune system. There might be something else as well, that is being “caught” rather than pre-existing.
    
    I’m forming a hunch that the places where a lot of old people are dying, is where they’re living in dingy ancient 3 to 5 storey blocks, probably below average for sanitation. Often crowded, too, three generations together. Yes, parts of Italy is like this even if it is “first world” status. Same with much of Europe. Germany less so, hence their better outcomes now.
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:38pm
Notsofast

Listen to
“Magic Talk” radio today at 10am
And comment here after
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March 29, 2020 9:52am
Surely Knott

Interesting article in Quillette.com about the role of super spreaders in pandemics. Eg Typhoid Mary. That a few super spreaders cause the vast majority of infections – hence the clusters. In our case that would surely be the Hereford conference. Where the govt were told on May 17 that there was a positive test result for an attendee. And gave their blessings for the remaining conference goers to tour the country. And told them to keep the positive result confidential, resulting in the largest and most spread NZ cluster. This was known a week before we shut down – they must have known what was coming. Article conclusion more and faster testing needed.

Also the article notes that , “While we are at it, we need to stop wasting resources on pointless measures such as closing remote parks and natural reserves, where few people come close to one another anyway. In an especially important section of the aforementioned CDC report, the authors note that even COVID-19 super-spreaders can’t seem to infect people effectively in open spaces: “Rapid person-to-person transmission of COVID-19 appears likely to have occurred in healthcare settings, on a cruise ship, and in a church. In a study of 110 case-patients from 11 clusters in Japan, all clusters were associated with closed environments, including fitness centers, shared eating environments, and hospitals, [where] the odds for transmission from a primary case-patient were 18.7 times higher than in open-air environments.” These closed environments represent the sort of scenario we need to target—not British couples out on a jaunt to Sugar Loaf, Pen-y-Fan and other rustic destinations.”
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March 29, 2020 9:56am
- PhilBest
  
  Another one that occurs to me: internet cafes?
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:39pm
nickle

This is a very good video – it’s subtitled, but you’ve got time to read… Interview with a South Korean Professor of Infectious Disease (I think ?) He recommends masks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAk7aX5hksU
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March 29, 2020 10:00am
- Surely Knott
  
  Just watched the video. Excellent and very informative. Thanks for the share. Wear your glasses and a mask 🙂
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:08am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Best yet.
  
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  March 29, 2020 12:28pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

4th day and Jack Tame going on about cabin fever?
How fucking pathetic. Alaskans get cabin fever, spending months inside. Get real Tame
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March 29, 2020 10:02am
Fletch

Ozzie reporter smacks down both China and the WHO for their dishonesty, especially China who destroyed samples, silenced doctors and tried to cover it up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpHVrrIWe_o
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March 29, 2020 10:20am
- mark15
  
  This is a covid19 smackdown
  https://mobile.twitter.com/Derekr1959/status/1243917789624250376
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:42am
coge

The public have allowed this Govt 28 days of lockdown to address this problem. I don’t believe we will offer them more.
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March 29, 2020 10:23am
- Poppa
  
  Yes I agree
  
  I forsee civil uprising coming at the end of the lockdown if it is extended. I hope I am wrong but it just feels that way to me
  
  The police state is a very uncomfortable place to be for most. When I went to the supermarket yesterday I felt like a criminal looking for cops the whole way. And I did nothing wrong
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:43am
  - Alex13
    
    This ain’t “police state”. You’ve been asked to stay the **** home for your own sake and for the sake of many other people, both close to you and others. What is the problem? Take a rest, go and do those things around the house that have not been done due to lack of time in the past, spend more time with your family members, read some books for a change, sort that old stuff that clogs up your spaces, etc., etc.
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:09am
    - Rich Prick
      
      We’re a nanometer away.
      
      governmental control of political, economic, and social life usually by an arbitrary exercise of power by police
      
      But I get the sense you enjoy splitting hairs.
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:45am
- brett68
  
  Depends on how many people are dead.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:46am
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Something for the boredom.
https://tribunist.com/news/naked-mike-rowe-pulls-shotgun-on-drone-that-invades-his-property/?utm_source=echo&fbclid=IwAR1xRd_BCAFltVoitw3AOyVhScpDiwhCV6g5miy-QDOXjsRoQ299QY81iIc
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March 29, 2020 10:31am
Fletch

A statement by Congressman Thomas Massie who was the only “hold out” on the massive stimulus bill that Congress wants to pass. All he wanted was an official vote to be held as required by the Constitution. It wouldn’t have taken much, especially since Nancy Pelosi already held up the bill a week and refashioned it to be filled with pork.

I swore an oath to uphold the constitution, and I take that oath seriously.

In a few moments I will request a vote on the CARES Act which means members of Congress will vote on it by pushing “yes” or “no” or “present.” The Constitution requires that a quorum of members be present to conduct business in the House.

Right now, millions of essential, working-class Americans are still required to go to work during this pandemic such as manufacturing line workers, healthcare professionals, pilots, grocery clerks, cooks/chefs, delivery drivers, auto mechanics, and janitors (to name just a few). Is it too much to ask that the House do its job, just like the Senate did?

I am not delaying the bill like Nancy Pelosi did last week. The bill that was worked on in the Senate late last week was much better before Speaker Pelosi showed up to destroy it and add days and days to the process.

This bill should have been voted on much sooner in both the Senate and House and it shouldn’t be stuffed full of Nancy Pelosi’s pork- including $25 million for the Kennedy Center, grants for the National Endowment for the Humanities and Arts, and millions more for other measures that have no direct relation to the Coronavirus Pandemic. That $25 million, for example, should go directly to purchasing test kits.

The number one priority of this bill should have been to expand testing availability and creation of tests so that every American, not just the wealthy and privileged, has access to testing. We have shut down the world’s economy without adequate data. Everyone, even those with no symptoms, needs immediate access to a test.

This bill creates even more secrecy around a Federal Reserve that still refuses to be audited. It allows the Federal Reserve to make decisions about who gets what, how much money we’ll print. With no transparency. If getting us into $6 trillion more debt doesn’t matter, then why are we not getting $350 trillion more in debt so that we can give a check of $1 million to every person in the country?

This stimulus should go straight to the people rather than being funneled through banks and corporations like this bill is doing. 2 trillion divided by 150 million workers is about $13,333.00 per person. That’s much more than the $1,200 per person check authorized by this bill.
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March 29, 2020 10:32am
- mikenmildagain
  
  He is a moron. The bill was guaranteed to pass. His stunt simply forced several hundred unnecessary journeys by representatives back to Washington for a pointless vote in person.
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:17pm
Colville

Where are the Greens hiding?
If someone finds them please let them know the lockdown has been extended for another year.
I am loving the silence!
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March 29, 2020 10:33am
- coge
  
  Their Vast Climate Apocalypse has been deplatformed. Enough said.
  
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  March 29, 2020 12:46pm
  - Nutta
    
    Check the Civil Defence website for current emergencies. There is only one – COVID-19.
    
    There is not, and never has been a climate emergency listed on the CD site.
    
    When anyone mentions climate emergency to you, refer them to CD and ask them to provide details of the emergency listed there to you. Invite them to engage in fornication-for-one until they can.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:19pm
- Inandout
  
  Colville, they will be in their bubble shitting themselves, well one hopes they will be. But like all public ‘servants’ they will still be on full pay while hard working people have to survive on what Grant hands out. They really are mongrels.
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:47pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Maybe they forgot to turn their lights back on
  https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO2003/S00140/earth-hour-2020-goes-digital-in-solidarity-with-people-and-the-planet.htm
  
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  March 29, 2020 2:18pm
- JibberJabber
  
  They might be just bright enough to understand that gloating might not gain them any votes.
  
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  March 29, 2020 2:36pm
- Rich Prick
  
  Ah yes, the Greens. I wonder if they’re still keen on open borders for all comers? Especially those from the third world.
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:39pm
Spam

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120646079/policing-the-pandemic-the-unprecedented-powers-deployed-to-keep-kiwis-at-home

While I have mixed feelings about the article, this is not a good example from the journalist:

Damian Christie had a run-in with a police officer while working for an essential business on Friday, day two of the lockdown.

The former broadcaster was delivering video equipment to a client’s business, letter in hand to prove he was essential. He says the client, a large food producer he declined to name, needed the video gear to share coronavirus-related messages with its staff around the country who will continue to work.

As a journalist (although should a former journalist” be “essential”?), he is allowed to go out to do his job. I don’t think he should be able to go out to do non-work-related stuff, and I don’t see providing equipment to a private business as work related.

I am “essential”, and I can go to my office to get access to documents or other things I may need (I’m working from home and can do most of my job from there). But this doesn’t mean I can go to someone else’s house and help them with stuff.
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March 29, 2020 10:35am
- kowtow
  
  Damian Christie , part of the media bubble crowd.
  
  Sounds like a case of “Don’t you know who I amitis”
  
  They don’t like it up ’em , do they?
  
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  March 29, 2020 2:06pm
Iamright

Late yesterday I queried whether Pike River is still in operation or is it in lockdown. Does anyone know?
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March 29, 2020 10:42am
- DeepBlue
  
  It can’t possibly be essential, unless it comes under ‘mining’.
  
  The pike river website is silent.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:53am
  - sooty
    
    If angrys got anything to do with it, it will be continuing to waste money that should be returned for better use!
    Shames money the same!
    
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    March 29, 2020 11:05am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      I agree..
      In the rebuild of the NZ economy that Grant Robertson is planning, the Pike River Authority and its set-up is a non-productive use of money, manpower and resources.
      Close the entire shebang down now.
      
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      March 29, 2020 11:27am
- Humble Capitalist
  
  Big team working tirelessly from home on this
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:01pm
Happychappy

Into day three and those in NZ modelling the Coronavirus tell the Gardian that the modelling shows there could be only 20 deaths from Coronavirus in NZ.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/27/new-zealand-coronavirus-deaths-during-lockdown-could-be-just-20-modelling-suggests
Why would those in charge make these type of predictions on Day three of the lockdown.
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March 29, 2020 10:45am
- krazykiwi
  
  And there’s a >99% probability that every single one of these deaths will be from people already suffering one or more of several pre-existing conditions(COPD, hypertension, diabetes), and there will be no evidence to show that they would not have otherwise died as a result of a regular flue or cold episode.
  
  Meanwhile … 200k unemployed, a spike in suicides, a depression of the type my grandmother endured.
  
  Worth it, right?
  
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  March 29, 2020 12:47pm
Simon Gotlieb

Excellent article by David Runciman, professor of Politics at Cambridge University, on the Grauniad this morning.
Put aside your partisan beliefs for a minute and have a read. No propaganda for either side in this one, and he doesn’t mention Jacinda once.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/27/coronavirus-politics-lockdown-hobbes
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March 29, 2020 10:45am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Good read, txs
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:28am
kevn

@Colville… You can add grizzling greta to that.
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March 29, 2020 10:46am
DeepBlue

Forgive me, market forces have one out.

The Herald subscription has fallen to $1 per week for four weeks. I have signed up and if they don’t deliver market forces will act again and I will cancel.

($5 pw thereafter).
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March 29, 2020 10:50am
- sooty
  
  Every little bit helps to send them under!
  Comon folks do your bit!
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:07am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Cheap fire-lighter, I s’pose.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:29am
- Biscuit
  
  DeepBlue, the Dominion-Post tried the same tack with me late last year.
  
  I replied along the lines that ‘Listen, you leftish ranter, a quick scan of ANY poll taken since John Key was about will show that National remain the single largest political blok in this country.
  
  So how come you, a so-called national newspaper, rarely reflect that reality but, instead, hammer us left, right and centre about how wonderful life is under this Coalition of Losers?
  
  I decline your ‘offer’ … and will continue, amusedly, to watch your circulation numbers continue to drop.’
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:14pm
MT_Tinman

I’ve just read this column

One question asked in it I can answer.

Dr Joel Kettner, a professor of community health sciences and surgery at Manitoba University, said “I have never seen anything like this, anything anywhere near like this. I’m not talking about the pandemic, because I’ve seen 30 of them, one every year. It is called influenza. And other respiratory illness viruses, we don’t always know what they are. But I’ve never seen this reaction, and I’m trying to understand why.”

The answer is simple: For many years now The People have been fighting back, making their own decisions, electing politicians who are more likely to provide what those people want.

This minor virus is the excuse those with a god-given right to rule can take back the reigns (yes, the “g” is deliberate)..
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March 29, 2020 10:56am
- Tall Man
  
  The number of idiots has grown.
  
  I haven’t been on this blog that long but even in that time I have seen the tone of the lefties a little more strident and a lot more stupid.
  
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  March 29, 2020 11:42am
  - JibberJabber
    
    It is almost as if Thomas Sowell knows some of the Lefty that comment here personally,
    
    Thomas Sowell
    
    Mar 25
    No one can really understand the political left without understanding that they are about making themselves feel superior, however much they may talk piously about what they are going to do to help others.
    
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    March 29, 2020 12:19pm
  - Simon Gotlieb
    
    I wonder if there’s a correlation there?
    
    5 2
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    March 29, 2020 1:19pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Yep, I’ve counted you in there so don’t fret.
      
      5 6
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      March 29, 2020 2:25pm
      - Simon Gotlieb
        
        Sorry, I was being too subtle. I was suggesting that perhaps the responses were a reaction to your posting style. 🙂
        
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        March 29, 2020 4:39pm
      - Tall Man
        
        And if they only replied to me you’d have a point, but they don’t so they’re not.
        
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        March 29, 2020 5:28pm
- kowtow
  
  Some very good reading in today’s UK Daily Telegraph on the whole thing ( pity out own media can’t provide)
  Anyway here’s a quote from a prof in democratic studies : “Governments are increasingly derogating from common law. In the name of protecting the population the exception becomes the norm.There is a real need to justify these freedom restrictions legally and convince the population of their need”
  
  We’ve seen this trend for a long time now. Don’t discpline your children , don’t smoke , don’t drink, don’t consume sugar , don’t use plastic bags ,straws,any bloody plastic, don’t use petrol , don’t use coal, don’t heat your home by the method of your choice, don’t use ladders, ( you must get expensive scaffolds)
  
  And now , don’t get sick.
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:02pm
curry4me

https://donsurber.blogspot.com/2020/03/democrats-fear-cure.html
Dems fear a cure. Not The Cure.
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March 29, 2020 11:18am
- Simon Gotlieb
  
  What a load of baseless rubbish.
  
  5 7
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  March 29, 2020 1:20pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Just another one of curry’s links then?
    
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    March 29, 2020 2:19pm
    - Simon Gotlieb
      
      It’s just another one of those articles that try and prove motive by extrapolating it from presumed benefit. Specious to say the least. Sadly, I see more and more of this from both sides of the political spectrum. Although, I guess, that’s good news, as it proves that intelligent and idiotic folk can be found independent of political viewpoint.
      
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      March 29, 2020 4:42pm
mark15

Is (#insertbaselesssupposionhere) responsible for covid19?
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March 29, 2020 11:19am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CU6MMoU5Z1I
CCP virus strains US-China relations.

No exchange of Christmas cards this year, I guess.
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March 29, 2020 11:20am
JibberJabber

Meanwhile in Sydney…
https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/fqf7lw/meanwhile_in_sydney/
Possibly the only…er…job lower than a reporter.
Beware.
Language NSFW ?
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March 29, 2020 11:22am
- David Garrett
  
  Jibber: Isn’t the commentator right though? What a total fucking egg…I guess you don’t have to have much in the way of a brain – or anything else – to be a Parking Warden
  
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  March 29, 2020 2:06pm
- V
  
  As much as people despise parking inspectors, he is just doing his job and providing for his family, so probably lucky to have a job when so many have been lost. Definitely no need for that in your face abuse. As far as I have read they are only enforcing fines where it is hazardous to traffic, pedestrians or emergency vehicle access.
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:13pm
Sir Cullen's Sidekick

I was disappointed that our dear leader didn’t address the nation yesterday…..
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March 29, 2020 11:34am
- Biscuit
  
  Sir C, previous posts of mind will doubtless have clued you in that I am no Jacinda fan.
  
  But, as she was re the Mosque atrocities, she has been superb in this crisis.
  
  My two real stars in proceedings have been:
  
  Director-General of Health Ashley Bloomfield
  [It has been interesting to see the Government hide away the Minister of Health, ‘Dr’ David Clark (his doctorate was in bloody Divinity!) who has, another Kiwiblogger obbserved, now presided over three crises (Meningococcal disease, Measles and COVID-19) where the Government was too slow to react.]
  
  The interestingly-haired (and daftly-named) microbiologist and science communicator Siouxsie Wiles
  
  You could argue that ‘both are just doing their (well-paid) jobs’ … but Jacinda’s Cabinet is full of folk provably NOT doing their jobs.
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:06pm
  - V
    
    I would have thought that the case of the measles reemergence a pretty good indicator of people not doing their jobs?
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:15pm
  - Pharmachick
    
    Co-sign. Both are doing fairly good jobs under difficult circumstances.
    
    WHERE is the PM’s Science Advisor in all of this … *crickets*
    
    I would like to hear more from Professor Sir Peter Gluckman.
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:33pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      I’ve been disappointed in the output from the Office of the Prime Minister’s Chief Science Advisor about Covid-19
      
      https://www.pmcsa.ac.nz/who-we-are/our-office/
      
      I find 2 items about it on their website…and the first I heard anything mentioned in the media with her name attached was on Monday after epidemiologist Sir David Skeggs expressed concern that Prof Michael Baker’s advice hadn’t been adopted to date.
      
      https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2020/03/22/1095363/david-skeggs
      
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      March 29, 2020 4:00pm
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    Biscuit bro – Coming and saying something fluently with a concerned look and tilted head is not superb in a crisis. Many questions are being asked now about how Cindy was slow in closing the border, what measures we have at the border etc. Also testing is still not adequate.
    
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    March 29, 2020 4:27pm
  - Nutta
    
    If the politicians backed out and left things to the competent Director General of Health, and the Director of CDEM, we’d not miss them at all.
    
    Ardern adds nothing except a nodding head and inability to announce the letter “t” to proceedings.
    
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    March 29, 2020 10:28pm
- Happychappy
  
  That will be alright you can toss yourself today.
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:19pm
- Ruahine
  
  SCS. It is a sin to tell a lie.
  
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  March 29, 2020 2:04pm
Fletch

Sunday Mass, if anyone wants to see, with new Bishop Michael Gielen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sh2wSDn-mws
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March 29, 2020 11:36am
emmess

Regarding shoplifting being turned a blind eye too,
I suggest we all do this.

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-51498230/customer-knocks-shoplifting-suspect-off-his-feet
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March 29, 2020 12:27pm
- V
  
  In NZ you would be arrested – for aggrevated assault with a weapon (shopping trolley).
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:08pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120623076/coronavirus-company-that-built-chinese-hospital-in-10-days-offers-nz-assistance

No thanks, the bloody Chinese have given us enough already this year.
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March 29, 2020 12:41pm
cmm

Why is the MoH website only updated at 1:30pm?

This is the data that PriNZess uses in her 1pm updates, so it is clearly available before 1pm and is being deliberately withheld for political reasons.

In the interests of open and transparent, the MoH website should be updated when the information is available and not after waiting for PriNZess to do her grandstanding.

https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-current-situation/covid-19-current-cases
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March 29, 2020 1:00pm
- cmm
  
  I notice that the MoH gather data as at 9am, so allowing 2 hours to process that there is absolutely no reason it is not published by 11 am!
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:12pm
  - Loddenthinks
    
    You spelled “manipulate” wrong.
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:26pm
kowtow

She’s just reiterated that Gauleiter Busch has enough man power to enforce the rules which she insists must be adhered to to save lives.

OK , how does that apply to the Plod on duty with Hones’ Henchmen ?

Why are some people allowed to break the ‘strict’ rules put in place when the rest of us are commanded to stay at home ?
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March 29, 2020 1:27pm
kevn

I wonder if Hosking will get to ‘chat’ with JA on Monday morning?
So many questions…
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March 29, 2020 1:29pm
- Tall Man
  
  But how many will be allowed and how many answered.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:18pm
kowtow

Someone’s taking the piss.

‘Britons in New Zealand told the Observer that the only available flights to the UK are prohibitively priced with even the cheaper tickets costing as much as £15,000. A Qatari Airlines flight from Auckland to London on 31 March was priced at NZ$83,534 (£40,096).’

https://www.theguardian.com/global/2020/mar/28/stranded-britons-quoted-40000-each-to-fly-home-from-new-zealand
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March 29, 2020 1:30pm
- Lance
  
  Considering it will cost something like 1/2 a million dollars to cover the costs for a flight half way round the world.
  It all depends on the numbers on board, freight etc.
  If no freight and a handful of passengers… then it actually sounds like a bargain.
  Airlines are high finance enterprises with enormous costs but also high returns with a relatively small profit.
  Repatriating Brits is more a matter for the UK govt to finance, or send the airforce or something.
  
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  March 29, 2020 4:12pm
David Garrett

So here we are, the first death…and Dr Bloomfield let slip that it was a WOMAN in her 70’s, from the West Coast…before reverting to the script and referring thereafter to “that person” and “their family” as if the gender of the victim is some sort of state fucking secret…I’m surprised we were even allowed to know her age! I imagine there was much earnest discussion behind the scenes regarding “privacy” before that Press conference.
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March 29, 2020 1:40pm
- cmm
  
  She also had sufficient preexisting problems that they did not suspect Covid and they were expecting her to get pneumonia anyway.
  
  Massive bungle in not protecting the medical staff properly!
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:46pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Alas, she was treated as if she had influenza for the first few days… potentially exposing her health-carers to the virus.
    
    Presumably she hadn’t initially presented as a recent traveller or a close contact of a traveller.
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:54pm
    - Ruahine
      
      So did the woman die of the virus or with the virus.
      I guess that will be a state secret. Information will be given out to reinforce the country’s ‘need’ for internal imprisonment.
      
      ‘Halleluiah Halleluia.
      See.
      Someone has died. You are wrong. I am correct. Another month more of confinement’
      
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      March 29, 2020 2:13pm
    - kowtow
      
      Bloomfield did say there was a travel connection. How close , not yet known.
      
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      March 29, 2020 3:41pm
cmm

This first death is a good example of the statistical problem with small numbers that I was banging on about yesterday.

If you look at the percentages, then 1 out of two cases in West Coast has died. Oh no, 50% death rate on the coast! That’s worse than anywhere in the world!

Meanwhile over in Canterbury 0 out of 50: 0% death rate. Excellent.

This is exactly the reason small numbers (as many NZ numbers are) are so hard to work with.

The actual true rate for both is somewhere inbetween, but we don’t have big enough numbers to actually know what they are.

And, for the slow of wit, I am not making light of a person’s death. My condolences to the family & friends.
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March 29, 2020 1:40pm
- David Garrett
  
  cmm: FFS man now you are doing it!! We KNOW because of Bloomfield’s slip of the tongue that the first victim is a WOMAN…so why not offer your condolences – as I do – to HER rather than THE family ??
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:44pm
  - cmm
    
    DG: Sorry old chap, I shall put in better effort.
    
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    March 29, 2020 1:47pm
- David Garrett
  
  …But you make an excellent point re our numbers…murder stats are just the same; a couple of double murders in a year – which sadly are not all that uncommon – let alone an Aramoana or a Christchurch – and “average” and “per 100,000” figures are significantly skewed.
  
  Even a semi-numerate like me can understand that!
  
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  March 29, 2020 1:48pm
  - Poppa
    
    I am prepared to bet that more people died in the mosque attack than will die from the virus in NZ
    
    Time will tell
    
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    March 29, 2020 2:13pm
    - krazykiwi
      
      Indeed. And I’m prepared to bet that more people will suicide, divorce, suffer psychological trauma, lose their life savings, and lose their businesses as a result of this government’s stasi-like overreach.
      
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      March 29, 2020 4:37pm
    - Simon Gotlieb
      
      Well, given that we’re all locked up for the duration, I should bloody well hope so.
      
      I certainly hope if the deaths are low that nobody is going to be stupid enough to try and suggest that we should not have had a lockdown.
      
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      March 29, 2020 4:49pm
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Oh, that’s exactly what they’ll suggest.
        
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        March 29, 2020 4:57pm
      - cmm
        
        The problem is that currently the infected people that continue to arrive in the country without adequate quarantine are making a joke of the efforts.
        
        That is means we’re paying way more social cost than we’re should for less payback than we should get.
        
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        March 29, 2020 6:31pm
      - Poppa
        
        So if there is a flu outbreak this winter, which there will be, do you think we should all stay at home for 4 weeks?
        
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        March 29, 2020 7:21pm
- MCos
  
  Right now there are around 450 who are infected, with one death.
  However there are only 56 who have recovered and that is the important number.
  Currently it’s a ratio of 1:56, that is about 2% death rate.
  
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  March 29, 2020 2:10pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    The 450 are mainly new arrivals. That tells us nothing about the real incidence in the population as a whole. It does tell us that those people were intercepted that might otherwise have infected others and some information about their age/infection ratio/source country. It’s a flag, not data adequate for proper predictions.
    
    The best info so far on the results of testing a whole population was the Diamond Princess, 3700, lock down. Only 17% of the total got infected and half of them were never aware of it. The 7 deaths were all in the 80+ age group giving a less than 0.2% fatality rate. For our 5 million that would be 10K. How many deaths do we have from that age cohort each year? The virus people may die with is not necessarily what has killed them. When people have high blood pressure, diabetes II, kidney disease… they are naturally expiring at those later stages of life. It will be very rare for younger person to succumb. There is a special genetic expression of the Covid-10 among some ethnic groups and that was a problem in Wuhan, not here.
    Cheer up, we will overcome.
    
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    March 29, 2020 4:02pm
    - SGA
      
      The best info so far on the results of testing a whole population was the Diamond Princess
      
      I doubt that cruise ship passengers represent a representative sample of the whole population.
      
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      March 29, 2020 5:08pm
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Will the third leg of that will be when there is general testing including those not showing symptoms? Wouldn’t that allow a comparison into the larger pool of undetected cases – that, and potential spread, is the basis for the lockdown at this stage.
    Then figures of those tested showing probable symptoms that don’t test positive – they should have that now.
    Also, we don’t appear to be getting the number sent into self-isolation or released from it. Or that is that already included in the recovered figure?
    
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    March 29, 2020 4:51pm
  - cmm
    
    MCos: Please read what I have said about small nmbers.
    
    Trying to invoke anything from small numbers is severely misguided.
    
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    March 29, 2020 5:10pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  I had to turn the PM off when I accidentally encountered her basking in the delights of her announcement.
  No one is pleased with any deaths and they are to be expected at present. Like any person unknown to us we will all feel sorry for the grieving. Bonfires will be unnecessary.
  
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  March 29, 2020 4:10pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Oh Heck,
I missed Earth Hour Aotearoa 2020

https://www.earthhour.org.nz/
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March 29, 2020 2:10pm
MCos

Some advice from an ex prisoner
https://twitter.com/te_taipo/status/1244064032820088832?s=21

My father was a POW for about four years. He might have had advice for anyone grizzling about being half pie confined for a few weeks on account of something out of their control.
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March 29, 2020 2:15pm
- Pharmachick
  
  Thank you to you father for his sacrifice, and your family for theirs.
  
  My step-father’s father was also a POW, along with his brother and cousin. Germany.
  
  My great uncle was in Changi.
  
  And all we need to do is stay ****ing home.
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:42pm
- MT_Tinman
  
  Sorry, was he?
  
  Are you certain?
  
  He must be fucking disappointed.
  
  He fought for freedom and you’re trying to use his fight to support the cause of communism and dictatorship?
  
  Actually . not ?
  
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  March 29, 2020 7:42pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Someone got bored with his lockdown

https://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/120655815/man-arrested-after-wellington-school-fire
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March 29, 2020 2:15pm
MrTips

According to the MoH, 5 of the current cases have no determined gender. Welcome to 21st C public health.
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March 29, 2020 2:23pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Is the virus now being assigned gender neutrality?
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:39pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Or else ?
    
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    March 29, 2020 5:11pm
- Simon Gotlieb
  
  You’re showing your age MrTips. You sound a bit like the folks who used to carp on about women wearing trousers.
  
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  March 29, 2020 4:51pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    That reminds me of those folks who lost it when Helen Clark wore trousers to a state dinner with the Queen.
    
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    March 29, 2020 4:56pm
  - MrTips
    
    I somehow think I’m younger than you Simon. And I bet your skirts so tight it comes with musical pole.
    
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    March 29, 2020 6:04pm
RW Capitalist

It is now 74Hrs since I sent this to MBIE

I supply services to pharmacies, that mean, under normal times they can continue to be pharmacies.
Still heard nothing.
Please don’t tell me it is Saturday (now Sunday).
If this is indeed a “war footing” type reaction, there is no such thing as a weekend.
Yesterday, I tried to EMail this to Simon Bridges parliamentary EMail account, it bounced twice.
His National party EMail account says it has been treated as spam (no so worried about this).
BUT his parliamentary account?
Since he the head of this new select committee, how is he to get any info.?
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March 29, 2020 2:41pm
- Batman
  
  email the PM’s office via j.ardern@ministers.govt.nz
  
  The non-politcal staff are pretty quick with referring stuff to the right place and a transfer from the PMO comes with a bit of added weight.
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:12pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Since he the head of this new select committee, how is he to get any info.?
    He is the right person.
    SLG is too busy with her self promotion.
    
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    March 29, 2020 3:44pm
    - Batman
      
      Select Committees have the power to call officials and to seek information.
      
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      March 29, 2020 4:21pm
      - RW Capitalist
        
        So why does his EMail appear to be blocked?
        
        2 1
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        March 29, 2020 4:52pm
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Parliamentary Services as well.
    
    3 1
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    March 29, 2020 4:56pm
- SGA
  
  It is now 74Hrs since I sent this to MBIE
  
  I supply services to pharmacies, that mean, under normal times they can continue to be pharmacies.
  
  That was your entire message? Surely not. If so, they probably thought you were some sort of crank.
  
  Maybe there was something in a earlier comment of yours that provides more context.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:04pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  flick it to nikki.kaye@parliament.govt.nz I know for a fact she answers emails of this nature.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:14pm
  - andydownhere
    
    Who is the moron who downticked that? Why would you?
    
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    March 29, 2020 6:57pm
RW Capitalist

https://www.national.org.nz/news
To help you see a different story.
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March 29, 2020 2:55pm
Wired-one

I know I may have an outlier view here, but I still think the worlds reaction to this pandemic and in particular New Zealands reaction has been overblown. Crippling the economy, destroying businesses, financially decimating people livelihoods and everything that has come with it for a frankly minuscule mortality rate is in my opinion idiotic. The worst part of this pandemic wont be the virus itself, it will be the decades of deficits to follow. I guarentee that Labour will use this debacle to force upon us, all of their socialist verging on communist ideals. Rent freezes are staying, there will be a new top tax rate, I have a feeling Ardern will do a backflip on a CGT and dont expect civil liberties to go back to how they were. Just look at how many people die each day from heart attacks, strokes, influenza, malaria or suicide. They all far outweigh this pandemic. I understand we had to do something, but destroying the financial future of the country for half a dozen deaths? Come on it’s an overreaction at best. Is it really worth it?
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March 29, 2020 3:12pm
- SGA
  
  destroying the financial future of the country for half a dozen deaths?
  
  Even with the measures in place there will be more than half a dozen deaths. Without them, the overseas experience would suggest thousands of deaths at least, probably tens of thousands.
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:44pm
  - Wired-one
    
    As I said I no my views are in the minority. It’s just the way I feel. I think we will look back on this and wonder why we panicked do much. But time will tell..
    
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    March 29, 2020 5:32pm
    - SGA
      
      I’m genuinely curious why you think that Covid19 would only kill half a dozen people if left to its own devices. It is so grossly at odds with what is happening in the rest of the world, I am wondering if you are merely a troll.
      
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      March 29, 2020 5:54pm
      - Wired-one
        
        Poor language on my behalf. I think it will kill dozens if not hundreds but so does influenza. We dont destroy the economy to try and stop that. I’ve been here long enough for people to know I’m not a troll. I just say what I think.
        
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        March 29, 2020 9:00pm
    - Poppa
      
      I am with you all the way Wired. If this had happened when I was young the country would certainly not be in lockdown
      
      We would have simply got on with it & there may have been deaths but we would have taken it in our stride
      
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      March 29, 2020 6:56pm
- barnacle bill
  
  @wired-one
  Some of the comparisons that you mentioned don’t have the ability to infect other people, a couple do.
  This Corona Virus is lethal and any one can die from it.
  
  Stopping it comes with a huge price tag and there is very little we can do about it, or any other country in the world.
  
  I am sure if you were one of the half dozen deaths you mention, you may see the situation in another light.
  
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  March 29, 2020 4:05pm
  - cmm
    
    ” This Corona Virus is lethal and any one can die from it.”
    
    Anyone can die from it? Really?
    
    So far it has been the frail and ill who have died. Very few healthy younger people. Hardly “anyone can die from it”.
    
    Sure, there have been a few cases of young and otherwise healthy people, but they are rare.
    
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    March 29, 2020 5:25pm
    - barnacle bill
      
      @cmm
      You contradict yourself there cmm.
      
      However, when this virus gets a hold in the wider Asian regions, and in Africa and other poor countries without the means of control, then no body will be safe.
      
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      March 29, 2020 9:12pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Seem to be quite a few Doctors and nurses that
      have died from it.
      
      https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/26/as-if-a-storm-hit-33-italian-health-workers-have-died-since-crisis-began
      
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      March 29, 2020 9:15pm
- Tall Man
  
  I’m on your side.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:07pm
- V
  
  I think people share your concerns, but by definition if we get on top of it, it will look like an overreaction, that is the nature of exponential mathematics.
  As I look at it, the question needs to be asked as to how the economy restarts, because while 4 weeks might be do-able, there will be huge trouble if it goes on for longer. To that end some of the things in terms of what is essential versus non-essential outlined by the govt is a ridiculous way of going about it.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:21pm
Lee C

Wired – I think you are expressing what many feel but are too cowed by peer-pressure to express openly.
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March 29, 2020 3:18pm
Captain Mainwaring

So the new cases over the last 3 days have been 85, 83 and 63. And this with much more testing going on.
Does this mean we’re close to turning the corner, or is it too early to tell?
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March 29, 2020 3:21pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  It’s probably the new arrivals as usual. We could not have a population wide test measure without a wide random testing regime at the same time.
  Just checking the borders tells almost nothing about current population levels.
  
  Have basic stats been dismissed because they are not alarming enough? Is the real issue the COL’s desire for full control of NZ?
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:36pm
- SGA
  
  Too few data points to tell, Captain. But it’s a better result than a sudden jump of 234, say. It will probably go up over the next few days as people spread it within their bubbles (families, flats). So long as the bubbles don’t touch, as it were, it will remain subdued. That’s the theory anyway.
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:39pm
  - cmm
    
    Your bubbles touch every time someone goes to the supermarket.
    
    And they don’t just touch with your neighbour. They could be touching with Miss self-isolation from Denmark.
    
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    March 29, 2020 6:57pm
    - SGA
      
      How did you find out about her? We’ve been very discrete.
      
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      March 29, 2020 7:14pm
- septic skeptic
  
  The real problem for us is of course local transmission. I’m sure imported cases will dry up as arrival numbers continue to fall.
  A good place to look for local transmission is the Ministry of health covid page, drill down to “clusters”. If these don’t grow in size or number of clusters, we might be containing it.
  
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  March 29, 2020 3:47pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The numbers aren’t doubling every 2 days now…so we are heading in the right direction.
  But much too early to release the pressure.
  
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  March 29, 2020 4:48pm
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Yes, and there is a concentration on the original pool where infection arrived from – those coming from overseas.
    
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    March 29, 2020 5:09pm
  - Ian Boag
    
    “Modelling” seems to be a bit of a dunno thing
    
    So here is another model. Italy has had 10,000 deaths in an area (Lombardy) with a population of about 10 million. About the same population and death rate as the Wuhan area give or take a bit.
    
    We have about 5 million and not as many old smokers. So forget about 5000 Italy/Wuhan deaths and crank it down to only 3500. …. ???
    
    So what should we do ….
    
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    March 29, 2020 8:30pm
- MCos
  
  Around 23 of the cases are connected to Marist College. The school has now closed for awhile so further cases connected to these ones will eventually dry up, but it might take awhile if it spreads around families or any of those infected spread it around supermarkets, or break their isolation.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:16pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    I may have been infected by one there. However, because it took them so long to notify me, I may have spread it around half of the eastern suburbs of Auckland. I don’t have symptoms, but have no idea if I am actually positive as they won’t test me. Bugger because I interacted with a hell of a lot of people until I got notified…..
    
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    March 29, 2020 7:35pm
- cmm
  
  Cap’n: We need at least another week I’d think before we can start to say anything.
  
  Part of the reason for that is the lag from when people are infected to when it shows up.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:22pm
Fletch

Back from my pickup at the supermarket. Those that had masks and gloves were wearing them. I only had a really basic mask, but I wore it, and gloves. Tried to wipe down the groceries with wipes when I got it back… Trying to be super careful.
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March 29, 2020 3:23pm
- Brian McDonald
  
  Way to go Fletch.
  
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  March 29, 2020 5:11pm
Rich Prick

Well, that didn’t take long. Report your family and neighbours folks. If only East Germany had the internet back in the day.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12320692
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March 29, 2020 3:26pm
- freemark
  
  My better half 🙂 was born and grew up in East Germany – 7 years old when The Wall came down.
  Day 4 of the much predicted Venezuelan Satellite State of Aotearoa Lockdown we’re looking at some of her kiddy photos – grey, depressed, queues etc. Could be NZ right now…
  
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  March 29, 2020 4:01pm
  - David Garrett
    
    freemark; Ah Yes, East Berlin when the Wall was still very much up…one of my most vivid travel memories…the contrast between West and East was literally like another planet…in the West, everything was bright, well lighted, Beemers and Mercs everywhere, the shops full. No evidence of bomb damage from the War.
    
    On the other side of Checkpoint Charlie…hardly any cars – even fewer that were obviously going – everything was grey, the streets filthy, uncleared bomb sites everywhere…I remember going into a restaurant where we were “served” by this crone with stubble and a cigarette hanging out her mouth…she threw a menu at us, then recited the items which were “nicht” – None. About half the bill of fare from memory.
    
    My mate and I had decided to go in at Checkpoint Charlie – where you had to change about $50 of today’s money into East German marks, useless in the West – and work our way across the city over the course of the day and come out at another checkpoint on the far side of the city…Ah, No…that was illegal….so we had to literally run about five miles – no taxis – to get back to Checkpoint Charlie before our day visa expired, and we would have had to spend a night in the hinaki.
    
    Socialism…aint it just wonderbar?
    
    14 2
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    March 29, 2020 5:14pm
    - mark15
      
      So wonderful they had minefields to keep everyone else out…
      
      0 0
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      March 29, 2020 9:41pm
    - Rich Prick
      
      Likewise, I obtained a day visa in 1989. Want back 5 years ago. What’s amazing is how Germany preserved the Stasi HQ as a museum, and a reminder. Those library-like drawers of cards on their citizens. Minor offences against the state, reported by neighbours and family alike. I think we should flood our Stasi with bullshit sightings of Elvis, UFOs and JFK.
      
      1 1
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      March 29, 2020 10:33pm
      - Rich Prick
        
        “My bitch ex” may well become the Police’s ground zero. Please say there are lots of them at it and make sure you give his/her address as somewhere upbush of Ruatoria, that way we can all go shopping without having to explain the supermarket bags on the backseat to high school dropouts in blue uniforms. If just for a day.
        
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        March 29, 2020 10:50pm
      - Nickc2
        
        Well Rick Prick, we are rapidly heading that way ourselves. I heard on the radio this morning that we can e-mail X and fill in an online form to dob people in who are breaking the stay at home dictate. Likewise, another online cite offers a form which can be filled in to dob in anyone who may indulge in violence as a result of the lock down. I think the only difference between life under Cindy’s mob and East German life under the Stasi is the internet.
        
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        March 30, 2020 12:05pm
- Harriet
  
  Like I said, the senior public servants who are advising Morrison have faith in the public doing the right thing, social distancing and limited travel, as the reality being that is what NZ will be doing in 3 weeks anyway.
  
  While NZ parliament, departments, councils and media just can’t not be in charge, it’s always been that way in NZ. And the First Responder herself has taken charge. Everything has now been shut down. 200,000 are predicted to be unemployed. That’s the state.
  
  Where I live it’s honestly 70 % business as usual and Morrison is bringing out a third stimulus package this week, while the first package will be going into employee and welfare bank accounts this week, along with some business. I don’t think too many more will be losing their jobs. Woolworths and Coles have almost employed 50,000 more between them. Some manufactures and logistics groups would have also. That’s capitalism and the free market place.
  
  Some here think there won’t be an election in NZ this year – well November is 8 whole months away and a week is a long time in politics, and just this week she put Bridges in charge.
  
  Now all she is left with is being a drama queen. 😎
  
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  March 29, 2020 4:14pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Simon Bridges is not in charge, merely the chairman of a “review” committee in reality.
    
    6 2
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    March 29, 2020 5:04pm
    - kevn
      
      @Tallman… Yes, Bridges has been kneecapped with the new role. He couldn’t even refuse it, would seem churlish.
      Just has to roll with it.
      
      2 1
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      March 29, 2020 8:59pm
      - Brian McDonald
        
        He’ll do the job properly without a doubt.
        
        1 0
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        March 29, 2020 10:01pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  Is there a special number for “untermensch”? Is anyone making yellow stars?
  
  Disgusting, and to think that our grandparents fought and died so that this would not happen again.
  
  5 3
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  March 29, 2020 5:11pm
- kowtow
  
  Welcome to the new New Zealand.
  
  How’s Your Neighbour.
  
  0800 STASI
  
  1 1
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  March 29, 2020 5:43pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    After this, we need a giant wall around Hamilton and a permanent lockdown, because of the clap.
    
    0 1
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    March 29, 2020 11:02pm
- JibberJabber
  
  Wait til the kids are back at school and the teachers get `em telling tales of what their parents did during the lockdown.
  Marama will be fizzing at the bung hole with gulag envy.
  
  3 1
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  March 29, 2020 6:19pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    Oh do please keep those dungeon ones to yourself. On a related topic, apparently pornhub hits have gone through the roof. Tauranga is clearly keeping itself cheerful during our blitz.
    
    0 1
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    March 29, 2020 11:05pm
freemark

Breaking news NZ:
Officials are continuously updating & clarifying Covid-19 Lockdown Regulations.
Positive reporting by Journalists on the Leader’s and Govt actions is recognised as essential work, and will be rewarded with well paying Govt positions.
Scrutiny is Un- Patriotic and is being monitored by the Police, who have been given Enhanced Powers.
Special Treatment Emergency Powers given to the Horse Racing Industry by the Deputy have been withdrawn after unfortunate exposure to the Public by Non-Approved Media
Approved Groups of Vigilantes have been given Special Powers to block roads & ignore Isolation Rules. Questioning of this Policy is declared Racist & Punishable.
Butchers are confirmed as closed, meat is available only from Supermarkets, and plastic wrapped.
Climate Change Hysteria is briefly suspended until new Taxes will fix the problem.
It is confirmed that Taxpayer-funded people from Govt, UN, Humanitarian, NGO & other entities should continue to Fly to Important Conferences to discuss Travel Bans and Global Warming.
20 2
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March 29, 2020 3:53pm
Fletch

Question: what is going to happen when the govt says we can all come out of quarantine on such-and-such a date? Will there be a massive stampede as everyone rushes to get out and shop etc? Will the virus blow up again with such huge crowds?
7 1
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March 29, 2020 4:29pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  That will be a key consideration. I should expect a gradual easing of restrictions.
  
  4 6
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  March 29, 2020 4:55pm
  - cmm
    
    Do you really think there would be compliance if they had a gradual easing?
    
    Why?
    
    7 1
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    March 29, 2020 5:14pm
    - Brian McDonald
      
      If there is a compliance code that goes with a general easing the people that I work with that get a bit of dirt under their nails would be self-policing and be happy to be so. And woe betides drifters.
      
      3 1
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      March 29, 2020 5:25pm
      - David Garrett
        
        Do tell us what you would do to “drifters” Brian…
        
        5 4
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        March 29, 2020 5:29pm
    - Brian McDonald
      
      Little fat ducks.
      
      0 0
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      March 29, 2020 10:00pm
- SGA
  
  Perhaps it won’t be a complete removal of all restrictions. A drop back to Level 3, then Level 2?
  
  7 0
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  March 29, 2020 4:58pm
- Simon Gotlieb
  
  Probably yes on both counts. This is why they suggested that they would change the Level status different amount at different places, so I would imagine it’s staged in order to manage that.
  
  6 2
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  March 29, 2020 4:59pm
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Yes to regionally. Wairarapa I think it is has no cases.
    The type of job will probably be a factor. I can’t see any reason for those working at home to rush back to the city. I think all businesses are likely to be required to display a Covid 19 Health and Safety Plan – maybe that is already happening at the supermarkets.
    But not getting ahead of myself, if a week is a lap – we haven’t run a quarter of a mile yet.
    
    4 0
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    March 29, 2020 5:19pm
    - cmm
      
      Brian
      
      HTF do you think that’s going to work?
      
      Let all the people in Wairarapa out of lockdown and the people in Auckland will feel it is unfair and go nuts.
      
      You can only exert soft power when people feel it is fair. Anything that looks unfair and you can kiss compliance good bye.
      
      Cops can maybe rough up a single person here and there, but it won’t work on large numbers.
      
      7 3
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      March 29, 2020 7:05pm
      - Brian McDonald
        
        I know how I will feel living in Auckland, that it is a step forward. Our primary producers are at the head of the queue.
        
        2 0
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        March 29, 2020 9:52pm
- cmm
  
  VE Day
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuhnGbkvu8o
  
  How is a gradual reduction going to work? Two hours freedom a day, then three, then…?
  
  Opening Mitre 10 for 1 day a week, then 2, then three?
  
  No, as soon as people get a whiff of “it’s over” they will be uncontrollable.
  
  4 3
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  March 29, 2020 5:18pm
rightoverlabour

Maybe we shouldn’t complain too much… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGex7ckhMPk&fbclid=IwAR10ocJ6oYkoo7JQ0IcsPFV32-4AGF8cXiNI6qw79EtAQoVgjymlVaTA1hM

Hey CMM, good old days?
4 1
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March 29, 2020 5:21pm
- cmm
  
  You can have my share mate!
  
  The SA cops & soldiers elsewhere have gone completely feral. They’re making Zim cops look like saints!
  
  They still have full bellies. See what happens in 3 days or so…
  
  5 3
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  March 29, 2020 7:11pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    I tell you, this is going to end in a complete Cluster Fuck in SA. They have banned the sale of alcohol and cigarettes. People I have spoken to over there are really worried. We are in paradise compared to what will go down in Africa….
    However, we need to keep the pressure on Arderne. So many people are saying ” isn’t she doing a lovely job”. Actually she is scrambling to fix the fuck up she and her inept ministers created. I will probably be excommunicated from my family and have a lot less friends, but I will not swallow the Gulag Cool aide.
    
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    March 29, 2020 7:25pm
    - Brian McDonald
      
      Actually, the f up was wet markets in Asia being allowed to continue after many warnings.
      
      2 0
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      March 29, 2020 9:56pm
    - Rich Prick
      
      This is KiwiBuild Mk2.
      
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      March 29, 2020 10:27pm
Poppa

I hope I heard wrong

Halal butchers are allowed to open but others not

If that is right , we have a major problem Houston & Cindy won’t like the backlash

Please tell me that is wrong
2 0
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March 29, 2020 7:26pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  Bring it on… Time to start getting those old tyres out….
  
  0 0
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  March 29, 2020 9:44pm
- Brian McDonald
  
  Why, can’t you buy meat?
  
  1 0
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  March 29, 2020 9:57pm
- Newbie
  
  Does anyone remember the Holmes Show, some years ago, where they investigated illegal butchering of meat in some South Auckland backyard? The meat was sold as being “halal”.
  
  At the end of the item, Paul Holmes made the observation that no one had died from eating this so called halal meat.
  
  0 0
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  March 29, 2020 10:05pm
- Rich Prick
  
  If so, massage some pork and then go fondle their meat. I’m an advocate of level playing fields.
  
  0 0
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  March 29, 2020 10:25pm
- Nutta
  
  You heard right. Religious discrimination is alive and well in NZ.
  
  0 0
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  March 29, 2020 10:39pm
- Nickc2
  
  Ok, put a platter of halal killed curried goats eyes, pickled sheep’s anuses and rice in front of one Muslim group and another platter of the same food non halal killed in front of the other and after both platters of food are consumed, ask each individual whether the food they consumed was halal killed or not. Even though they won’t be able to tell the difference, your lifespan will be somewhat limited.
  IMHO, Halal killed produce is just another sales scam on non Muslims.
  
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  March 30, 2020 12:16pm
MrTips

It’s a steaming pile of shit most likely, run a mile from this test.

Emma Hart. Why have you said your test is FDA approved? It is FDA allowed only surely? Your antibody tests are only allowed to be distributed by FDA as long as they register their intent with the FDA and go on the “list”. So, if on the list it’s public record – name the supplier please, it’s a matter of public record.
2 0
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March 29, 2020 7:42pm
- V
  
  The only ‘rapid’ out of lab test, (that could be run at say an ED department/point of care) I am aware of at this point is based on isothermal amplification of the viral RNA, uses a machine from Abbott Laboratories called IDNow. Antibody tests are a definite con because of the time it takes for the body to produce antibody.
  
  I note some of these Chinese kits showing up in Spain are defective.
  
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  March 29, 2020 10:39pm
rightoverlabour

Is this another Government cock up…
“The German government had a program to bring back the people but the New Zealand Government has stopped it and we don’t know what will happen,” Andy says.”

WTF?
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/03/coronavirus-over-10k-foreign-nationals-still-trapped-in-new-zealand-desperate-to-leave.html?fbclid=IwAR1z0RAt59j3lUuFfEI8XwQIM-bIlmpqG9Ij1oXaEKphPnaju11s5-bwyl0
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March 29, 2020 10:32pm
- Nickc2
  
  Well, who F_d up here? Surprise, surprise, our illustrious Minister or Transport, none other than Phil Twyford. Has he ever undertaken any portfolio that has through his management been F_up free?
  
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  March 30, 2020 11:44am

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