General Debate 18 April 2019

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krazykiwi

If you truly believe in something, and the country you were appointed to lead doesn’t, then anyone with a half spine would step down.
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April 18, 2019 8:00am
- cmm
  
  Come on, she loves us so much she will still kindly give us her leadership, even if we don’t want it.
  
  It is like the perfect love of a mother with a stroppy child.
  
  Or something like that.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:17am
- alien
  
  can you list a pm who has lead the country and quit when the country didn’t support something you did? I can’t
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:03am
  - sooty
    
    Easy, it was Andrew Little!
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:50am
    - projectman
      
      Fortunately Little did not lead the country.
      
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      April 18, 2019 10:47am
  - Tall Man
    
    David Lange.
    
    He backed down on economic reforms and so effectively lost his job. He didn’t resign but his stance lost him the confidence of his mps.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:36am
    - alien
      
      yeah but as you said, he didn’t quit. She wont lose the confidence of her mp’s because they know without the jacinda dust they will be out.
      
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      April 18, 2019 2:36pm
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    David Cameron
    
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    April 18, 2019 3:39pm
  - hullkiwi
    
    Yes, David Cameron gave up after he lost the Brexit vote in 2016.
    
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    April 18, 2019 5:28pm
- Rich Prick
  
  The Greens, by their co-leader’s own words don’t deserve to be in Government. So, when will they bugger off? Or do they have all the substance of a tissue in water?
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:14am
  - Rachael Membery
    
    Kermadec water?
    
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    April 18, 2019 12:10pm
  - hullkiwi
    
    He was playing with words this morning on the radio.
    
    He is now saying he “we should take a good look at ourselves and see if we deserve to be in government.”
    
    He has changed what he said. Like all politicians he can’t be trusted to keep to what he actually said/promised.
    
    He typifies why politicians are held in low esteem by the public.
    
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    April 18, 2019 5:33pm
andrew davies

Does anyone else wonder if Peters and Ardern traded CGT for hate speech legislation?
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April 18, 2019 8:01am
- Tony Stuart
  
  I doubt it Andrew. Why would Peters support legislation that he is likely to break every time he opens his mouth?
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:12am
  - cmm
    
    Because laws only apply to other people.
    
    Climate change does not matter when she wants to fly. Peters cares little about tax so long as he gets his face in the trough.
    
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    April 18, 2019 8:18am
- Simon
  
  “Peters and Ardern traded CGT ”
  
  No it was down to Simon Bridges holding the line and staring Labo down.
  
  Bridges gave Peters the courage to say no to an already frightened Ardern. Ardern turned and Labo adopted National’s policy on CGT.
  
  What ever happens in the election Bridges has done his job well, which is to serve the people.
  
  Labo adopted National’s policy on CGT. Massive win.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:21am
  - MrsAnnie
    
    More to this- Hooton gave Simon a hard time for no fresh policy this morning. My understanding on speaking with many MPs is that its all coming in 2020. Labour stealing Nationals policy and vice versa is nothing new. A clear tactic of leaving new policy until election year is what it is all about. The idea of no CGT now so National is left firing blanks in rubbish. We have a falling GDP, failed kiwi build, tomorrows schools marxism, rising fuel prices, inefficient govt- more than enough to keep the opposition happy. Not even mentioning lawn mower sales and other scandals.
    
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    April 18, 2019 8:33am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      Hooton will know as well as anyone that National is hard-out working on election-year policy. It starts with grassroots party members such as myself, and goes right through to the parliamentary caucus.
      
      Now is not the time to be releasing policy to a population with an increasingly short attention span. There will be plenty of time for that in the six months before the election, once everything has been tested and costed.
      
      Just as an example, Judith Collins has, for the last year or more, been working on reform of the RMA. Other key MP’s are working on policies specific to their own areas of expertise and experience. Come election time next year, there will be plenty to differentiate National from Labour/NZF/Green.
      
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      April 18, 2019 9:12am
    - Paulus
      
      With this Peters know that Simon will have one less arrow to fire at the COLL.
      He still wants to destroy the National Party – silly old fool – some of us will give two blues every time – it is not a presidential election for a funny girl and baby.
      
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      April 18, 2019 4:02pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    I’m just glad all of my appreciating assets are safe and that the guys over at The Standard are so upset with their Cindy. Life’s good.
    
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    April 18, 2019 8:45am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      Dead right Rich Prick. Had the CGT been applied to Kiwisaver, I would have been pulling mine out as soon as I turn 65 next year, to avoid a future tax. Now, if I decide to keep working beyond 65, I can continue to top up the one nest egg I have.
      
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      April 18, 2019 9:31am
      - Rich Prick
        
        I’m pretty convinced that the CGT was only ever intended to raid our KiwiSaver accounts because so little tax would have been raised on other assets.
        
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        April 18, 2019 9:44am
    - tf78
      
      I’m sure they will have plenty of replacement taxes up their sleeves, such as death duties and stamp duties for a start. The punishment for the people rejecting CGT will come back to bite us ten fold – it’s going to be ugly.
      
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      April 18, 2019 11:38am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Nope, huge fail. Bridges bet the farm on fighting CGT. He caved on Parliamentary due process round gun laws like a craven fool, so that he would have clear decks for a CGT fight.
    
    Now he has nothing. All the speeches, facts and figures, and rhetoric, all no longer needed.
    
    What he does have is 240,000 increasingly angry constituents who have been turned into criminals through a breathtakingly aweful Parliamentary process.
    
    What crisis was being managed that meant tossing out Law, due process, consultation and democracy?
    
    The OIC had already frozen the alleged “loophole” Parliament could have done what Norway did, and do a proper review, moved all semi-automatics onto a stricter management regime, and done it in a way that cost next to nothing.
    
    But no.
    
    And now it seems that Federated Farmers have just noticed that their pest control tools are a prohibited item. Oops chaps, perhaps you might have paid attention!
    
    May 1 is going to be fun, with police popping up at every mai mai to check that law obiding NZers dont have a dreadful 6 shot shotgun.
    
    And just about every old .22 in the country is now prohibited (all the old ones had 15 round mags, and they have had for 130 years)
    
    Not to mention all the sporting shooting clubs, and sporting shooters – about 14,000 legally registered E cat firearms…
    
    And where were National?
    
    “acting responsibly”???
    
    More like, keeping their powder dry to fight CGT, by hiding under a rock.
    
    Well that turned out well didnt it?
    
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    April 18, 2019 8:49am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      Yes Nigel, he bet the farm, won, and can now bank the political capital. When even the PM’s best mate in the media, Jack Tame, is slagging her off (see the link below, to Tame on with Larry Williams yesterday), the worm has turned a little. Even One News last night described it as a backdown from the government.
      
      https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/larry-williams-drive/audio/the-huddle-is-this-jacinda-arderns-biggest-failure/
      
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      April 18, 2019 9:14am
    - softail 1450
      
      Nigel6888,can’t understand why you have so many downticks,everything you just posted is 100% spot on ,Bridges and his gutless cowardly mob should have stood up to the lefty F—Ks and said “hang on slow down whats the rush on this firearms legislation” but no they folded like the spineless shits they are ….
      Theres no point moaning and whinging when the opposition are a mirror image of her rabble FFS.
      
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      April 18, 2019 1:57pm
      - RW Capitalist
        
        Wasn’t it Napoleon that said:
        Never interrupt an opponent, while they are in the process of making a mistake.
        
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        April 18, 2019 4:45pm
      - The King
        
        Bridges was brought up in a Labour household and was a protege of labours Chris Carter.
        
        He is about as ‘conservative’ as Bernie Sanders.
        
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        April 19, 2019 9:46am
  - Hacked-Off
    
    Well said Simon.
    Peters can only veto the silly ideas of Labour if National opposes these same policies, otherwise Mr 7% has not got a leg to stand on.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:51am
- hullkiwi
  
  It has been reported this morning that Politik have reported that the trade was that Peters will not object to any of the Labour/Green agreements on climate change and emissions trading.
  
  Which means we are going to get a “Feelz” policy that is going to cost New Zealand dearly.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:51am
  - Happychappy
    
    Hullkiwi : and a 39% increase in power costs across the country, Jacinda is in it for her own fame not for the country and those that are struggling like she makes out and who will suffer then the Children that they say need to be lifted out of poverty.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:33am
  - projectman
    
    Very interesting that in the just-held Finnish elections climate sceptics is now the second largest party in Finland.
    
    The Finns political party campaigned against ambitious climate change policies and won the second-highest number of seats in parliamentary elections on Sunday, in a vote in which global warming became a polarizing issue.
    (https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/world/europe/finland-election-climate.html)
    
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    April 18, 2019 11:17am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    The good news is that long term cooling seems to be emerging and the climate scare is going to be largely dishonest.
    
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    April 18, 2019 12:38pm
Micky

Green party launch anti-Free Speech campaign with a poster portraying 3 white males (authorized by Golriz Pokemon). Where is the gender balance & race inclusivity?

https://twitter.com/NZGreens/status/1118046366255722496
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April 18, 2019 8:01am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Too right; she ought to have at least included a picture of herself and Marama Davidson on the poster!
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:14am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Good Lord
  Is this woman really a lawyer?
  
  So now we can’t criticise a group….. such as a Political Party, or a bunch of News Media hacks?
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:21am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    And you can’t criticise religious groups, unless of course, they happen to be Christian.
    
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    April 18, 2019 8:26am
- srylands
  
  Good grief.
  
  They could have had a poster of Don Brash with the vc of Massey cowering before his hate speech. ?
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:28am
- Ruawai
  
  Because in her world only old white men preach hate speech.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:31am
- 3-coil
  
  Correction Micky (8:01am) – all of those horrid “hate” speakers shown on the Green Party’s puerile poster are actually Green! Own goal!!
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:50am
- hullkiwi
  
  Micky, Thanks for the link. You should read some of the comments attached to the Tweet. Readfing the comments, we should keep on encouraging all the Red Melons to keep at it, because at this rate they will have no support left by election time next year.
  
  They are alienating any real green supporters, oh dear how sad, never mind!
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:03am
  - Micky
    
    You’re right – a lot of people vote for them purely because of the environment and are now tired of their extreme left identity politics.
    
    If NZ First do not clean shop in regards to Shane Jones – I think there is a large gap in the market for a new party based on disgruntled voters from NZ First, Greens, Labour and yes dare I say it on here – even National (particularly if they simply replace 5% Simon with 5% Judith).
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:04am
- The King
  
  They are being encouraged by the anti-White media.
  
  Example 10986298: https://twitter.com/LibraryJournal/status/1118232615847329802
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:23am
- Rich Prick
  
  Yeah, yeah, I get it … Orange Man bad. The Greens really are our Ministry of Love.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:27am
artemisia

Mr Twyford recently gave an insight into the cost of Kiwibuild bureaucracy, in response to written questions from Ms Collins. 74 built, 64 sold. Mind you, there are more than 10,000 more contracted, though some are 10 years off completion. Value for money?

Public servants – 38 officials work full or part time, and of these 35 are full time. The total salary of all officials that work full time on the KiwiBuild programme is $4,883,000.

External legal advisers – Minter Ellison Rudd Watts so far paid $1.02m + GST.
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April 18, 2019 8:02am
- Toko
  
  What about the unbudgeted holding costs and losses on sale of the overpriced houses, that didn’t fly off the Kiwibuild shelf?
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:14am
  - artemisia
    
    I’m sure Ms Collins will be onto that, if not already.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:34am
- krazykiwi
  
  35 full time? Take away their laptops and lattes, and give them hammers. They’d do less damage.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:22am
  - G152
    
    That would only work if they were capable of work.
    Somehow I think driving a desk in Wellywood wouldn’t be up to the life of a hammerhand
    
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    April 18, 2019 8:38am
krazykiwi

Never let it be said that some journalists aren’t hard working. One of Red Radio’s hapless hacks went to the “plush seaside suburb” of Herne Bay and actually managed to find someone complaining about the demise of the CGT. I guess standing on a street corner for hours holding a sign : “If you wanted a CGT and you’d like to be on the radio come and see me” must have paid dividends.

I also heard Cullen on Red Radio. Must have been recorded yesterday, where he observed that the CGT had been killed off by NZ First because “their voters demographic is older, more wealthy, and more pakeha”.

I truly believe Cullen is the most spiteful, vile politician of my lifetime.
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April 18, 2019 8:02am
- Ruawai
  
  But Cullen is old, wealthy and white and he wanted CGT.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:34am
- BobbyS
  
  This morning on ZB Shane Te Pou claimed JA’s leadership in throwing out the CGT was strong & that Cullen killed it because he’s an extremist
  I believe the polar opposite, she was stupid & made a rookie call to appoint Cullen.
  Her lack of leadership skills proven by picking someone who is the most spiteful, vile politicians of OUR lifetime
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:35am
  - Tall Man
    
    I’m not sure “what’s in it for wynston” would be too happy about you stealing his crown….
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:54am
  - hullkiwi
    
    You should read his rubbish post on the Standard. It was the same.
    
    After years of telling us that NZ needed CGT , they are now trying to deny:
    1. Ardern was leading this whole farce (Captain’s call & all);
    2. That this was not a cornerstone of their tax policy; and
    3. It damages National not having the CGT policy.
    
    Talk about turning the truth on its head!
    
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    April 18, 2019 5:48pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Big call, but surely strong competition from Hone Harawira, And the Green’s coven of hate (Marama Davidson, Golriz Gjskadhfal)
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:39am
- ducklin71
  
  He’s a pig.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:52am
- septic skeptic
  
  So he did want CGT after all then. It wasn’t a Trojan horse.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:53am
artemisia

What exactly is a pragmatic idealist, apart from being an oxymoron.

Sounds remarkably like – if you don’t like these principles …..
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April 18, 2019 8:04am
- SGA
  
  I’d never heard the term, but apparently Pragmatic, or Practical (which is where the Google search took me)), idealism exists. From Wikipedia
  
  Practical idealism is a term first used by John Dewey in 1917 and subsequently adopted by Mahatma Gandhi (Gandhi Marg 2002). It describes a philosophy that holds it to be an ethical imperative to implement ideals of virtue or good. It further holds it to be equally immoral to either refuse to make the compromises necessary to realise high ideals, or to discard ideals in the name of expediency. Practical idealism in its broadest sense may be compared to utilitarianism in its emphasis on outcomes, and to political economy and enlightened self-interest in its emphasis on the alignment of what is right with what is possible.
  
  Just FYI.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:24am
John Warren

Regarding the CGT, Jacinda Ardern says she’s delivering what the public asked for. That would be a duplicitous way of saying that she is being forced to NOT deliver what the public DIDN’T ask for.
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April 18, 2019 8:07am
- septic skeptic
  
  So the year of delivery is nothing changes? I’m sure she convinces herself with this PR spin, but not many others will fall for it.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:56am
  - Tricati
    
    Unfortunately 51% in the latest poll believe her bullshit
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:58am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      That was BEFORE this CGT joke.
      Wait till she gets a poll that includes this, rising unemployment, falling growth, rising “poverty” under HER definition, no kiwibuild, no forests planted etc etc
      
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      April 18, 2019 10:56am
      - tf78
        
        RWC – I’d like to see that in the front of the Time Magazine, but reality sucks.
        
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        April 18, 2019 12:46pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  and made clear time after time, no matter how they asked the question, that they DID NOT want it.
  But they kept pushing it and promoting it…because WE didn’t understand and just needed “reeducation” and Convincing of it’s merits.
  That Communications degree, she has, didn’t work this time did it.
  Maybe she should go back to her “concern face” or maybe put the Hijab (scarf) back on or just maybe we could go back to ……”BABY”.
  
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  April 18, 2019 10:44am
- Rachael Membery
  
  So we can revisit Oil and Gas? It was apparently the Greens call, so shouldn’t be hard to re-calibrate then.
  
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  April 18, 2019 12:47pm
sooty

The wellness budget is blown out of the water!
Poverdy every where!
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April 18, 2019 8:07am
- ducklin71
  
  Wellness budget lol. I’ll give her a wellness budget- stop direct credit WINZ benefits. Do like the States and give them a card that cannot be used for anything but food and essentials. NO pokies, NO TAB, NO tobacco and booze. NO KFC etc. NO fancy cell phones. Sound cruel? Get a f*cking job.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:57am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    They knew the answer 150 years ago.
    “Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pound ought and six, result misery.”
    
    ― Charles Dickens, David Copperfield
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:48am
  - mark15
    
    I’ll vote for you!
    
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    April 18, 2019 12:05pm
  - tf78
    
    Didn’t Bill English have a process like that in place with new teenage mum’s which resulted in the lowest teen birth rates ever.
    
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    April 18, 2019 2:32pm
    - artemisia
      
      Yes, Young Parent Payment, part of the social investment approach. Still there, doesn’t get any airtime though.
      
      Basically these teens are being parented. Bills paid, supermarket card, some free money that they can increase by meeting certain responsibilities. Like enrolling children in ECE or with a health care provider. Attending parenting and budgeting courses.
      
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      April 18, 2019 6:42pm
lastmanstanding

Great leaders develop sound policy and sell it to their people and then say the people did it.

Poor leaders blame the people for not buying into their policies.
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April 18, 2019 8:15am
- 3-coil
  
  Winston yanked her chain, and Jacinda choked – at least we know who’s really running the country.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:23am
  - Tall Man
    
    Plus I think a few “fringe” mps were very concerned that they would lose their place at the trough.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:50am
  - Hacked-Off
    
    Actually he can only do this and get away with it so long as National opposes the same policies, otherwise Labour and the Greens would give Peters small and pathetic party the short-shift. Peters in fact can do nothing without National support.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:01am
Scott

The Israel Folau issue raises big questions about religious liberty and freedom of speech.

Folau has had his contract terminated by the Australian rugby union for his religious beliefs which he expressed on social media. He is now fighting that termination as unlawful.

Regarding free-speech here is the issue. If the Australian rugby union, the employer, can terminate the contract of Israel Folau, the employee, because of his religious views then who else can be terminated?

If you are not a Christian but don’t particularly like homosexuality and express that on social media, can your employer fire you?

Given this controversy and the government’s desire to institute new laws about “hate speech” this is a real issue. If you are a public servant and you express views that do not endorse homosexuality for example, can you be fired? Because of the government’s view is that homosexuality is marvellous and should be celebrated at all times, then a government employee who does not support homosexuality and writes about that on social media, could be charged with bringing the public service into disrepute.

And there are issues about privacy. DPF wants people to use their real names on this blog. If they do that and behave themselves then they will not be moderated. But again what if you are a public servant or a high profile person who does express their views under their own name on this blog? Does that make you liable to censure or possible firing from your employment for expressing non-politically correct views?

It may be all right for people like ex Act MP David Garrett to express his views about Muslims on this blog. But what if you express the same view and your company objects? Because they want to be “inclusive” or some such? Can you be fired from your employment because of what you have said under your own name on this blog?

The Israel Folau case has profound implications for the free-speech and the general freedoms that we have enjoyed for many years as part of the benefit of Western Christian civilisation. To do away with those freedoms to appease a politically correct minority is a very dangerous step indeed.
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April 18, 2019 8:18am
- rightoverlabour
  
  Precisely why I won’t post under my real name. I don’t mind the moderation that much, its a bit annoying, but I have a great time on https://ysb.co.nz/ where moderation is much lighter, (there are some trigger words, but no one can actually work them out) and one can actually say what they feel without too much tut-tutting.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:28am
- mikenmildagain
  
  His contract is not being terminated due to his religious views. His contract is being terminated because his public comments, based partly on his religious views, tarnish the image of his employer, and also upset his employer’s sponsors (owners).
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:28am
  - Tall Man
    
    I accept that he has “upset” the sponsor of the ARU but please explain how his post could possibly “tarnish” the image of his employer?
    
    Perhaps the “homosexuality” issue is just a smoke screen and “his employer” is pissed because they are all a bunch of fornicating liars…….
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:45am
  - kowtow
    
    Yeah but the holier than thou sponsors are in partnership with a state owned airline from a state where homosexuality can be punished by imprisonment.
    
    The sponsors are hypocrites of the highest order.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:39am
  - kloyd0306
    
    It’s a wonder that Qantas allows Muslim Imams, whose views on homosexuality are the same as Folau’s, on to their flights.
    
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    April 18, 2019 1:23pm
- Ross12
  
  I see Folau is taking the issue to Court. I hope he is as successful as Prof Peter Ridd.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:29am
  - MickMac
    
    .
    
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    April 18, 2019 6:22pm
- Ruawai
  
  Stan Walker at the Christchurch benefit concert said we will include all people and be accepting of all religions and beliefs. But I bet not Israel Folau.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:37am
- G152
  
  And whats worse he is quoting from a ‘holy’ book which is used to administer oaths that all of note declare their fealty on …
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:42am
- SGA
  
  It may be all right for people like ex Act MP David Garrett to express his views about Muslims on this blog. But what if you express the same view and your company objects? Because they want to be “inclusive” or some such? Can you be fired from your employment because of what you have said under your own name on this blog?
  
  Forgetting Folau in particular, and considering a general case. If a company feels that a person’s private behaviour is having a negative impact on their business, should the company have the right to fire that person. For example, if a company feels that David Garrett’s comments about Muslims or (((EAD’s))) comments about Jews are bad for business, should they be able to fire them?
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:44am
  - Tall Man
    
    I think that if those beliefs or comments are directly related to the business then possibly yes.
    
    For example, David represents a large otganisation that has direct dealings with muslim communities in NZ and even possibbly overseas then he should be more circumspect than perhaps if he worked for the Israeli government.
    
    If “ead” worked for a company that had dealings with the diamond industry for example that overseas seems to be heavily involved with jewish communities then again, his feelings should be tempered.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:49am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  Isn’t Qantas (a major sponsor of the ARU) in bed with Emirates (an airline based in Duba)i?
  How can Qantas talk about “inclusivity” while taking money from a company whose principals sincerely believe that homosexuals should be put to death?
  
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  April 18, 2019 11:38am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Israel Folau, his own comments:
  https://www.playersvoice.com.au/israel-folau-im-a-sinner-too/
  
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  April 18, 2019 12:44pm
- Rachael Membery
  
  Be glad that he can afford the fight, he is fighting for all of us.
  
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  April 18, 2019 12:53pm
secondcumming

Hard on the heels of yesterdays Blockbuster announcement on the CGT, nominations are now in for our very own *OSCAR AWARDS*……..

BEST MOVIE: ‘Operation Mincemeat’ (loosely based on the WW2 deception operation)

BEST ACTOR: Jacinda Adhern

BEST SUPPORTING ACTOR: Sir Michael Cullen

BEST DIRECTOR: Winston Peters

BEST SPECIAL EFFECTS: The deaf signal guy [worth a second look 😎 ]
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April 18, 2019 8:18am
- niggly
  
  The deaf signal guy is great to watch – especially when he is interpreting Jacinda or Winston’s BS spin!
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:46am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    And words with the princesses injected d pronouncation are just priceless as his facial expression contorts into wtf?
    
    I bet he is telling the deaf readers a shaggy dog story, a better one than what he is trying to interpret for the princess.
    
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    April 18, 2019 3:00pm
sooty

Marama is not happy with wee Jimmy!
He turned over, so Cindy could rub his tummy!
Will she dump him and govern alone?
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April 18, 2019 8:20am
- BobbyS
  
  I hope so – then the Greens will plummet to under 3%
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:30am
  - Colville
    
    The Greens will rise strongly on the back of Jacinda eating the CGT dead rat.
    
    The leftist Lefties will jump from shop Labour to the purest Greens.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:37am
- septic skeptic
  
  She shouldn’t have to. Shaw should have resigned after what he said on CGT earlier. The man is a hypocrite of the highest order.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:02am
mikenmildagain

Happy World Heritage Day!
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April 18, 2019 8:22am
- SGA
  
  Not too sure that greeting would go down well in Paris at the moment, mma?
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:34am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Parisians seem to be responding to the Notre Dame fire in a manner that very much shows that they value their heritage monuments.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:34am
    - SGA
      
      Not sure that counts as “Happy” though? 🙂
      
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      April 18, 2019 9:52am
    - Rachael Membery
      
      And their heritage. A clarion call of sorts.
      
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      April 18, 2019 12:58pm
    - MickMac
      
      mma
      At least the 2-3 churches a day being defaced is now out in the open in media in France because of the fears it was deliberate arson.
      Where as it was hidden by all you liberals in the media..
      
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      April 18, 2019 6:25pm
BobbyS

JA said there wasn’t an appetite by the public for a CGT. She wanted it but NZ didn’t. Then she says there wasn’t a consensus in Cabinet for it.
So is she really telling us if Cabinet (read NZF, actually read WP) said YES, then she would have implemented it?
Going against the Public’s lack of appetite for it?
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April 18, 2019 8:22am
- rightoverlabour
  
  Basically, Winston said if you want to remain in power dump the CGT. How you spin it is your problem, and stuff the Greens. Jacinda is a weak, rudderless leader who has no idea other than portraying positive “feelz”.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:31am
- srylands
  
  I don’t sense a public appetite for a ban on gas exploration either.
  
  Leaders can change countries and introduce policies that lack support but which eventually bring people along because the benefits become apparent. Their job is to convince their colleagues and convince the country.
  
  Imagine if Roger Douglas had said in 1984 “New Zealand doesn’t want an end to massive tariff protection and farm subsidies. I believe this is what is required, but New Zealanders have spoken and I have listened…”
  
  New Zealand would now be the Argentina of the Anglo world.
  
  Looking back 20 and 30 years I thought that public policy in New Zealand would continue to improve and deliver higher productivity and growth. Little did we know that 1996 was the high water mark.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:03am
- septic skeptic
  
  And what is even more confounding is that she tells us she thinks we should have CGT, yet rules it out not just for this COL but for any future government she leads. Why rule it out in the event of a government alone or with the Greens?
  There must have been division within Labour on this.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:05am
  - Tall Man
    
    I agree. This is the crux of the matter. labour mps did not want to be turfed out in 2020 and so they voiced their opposition, not to the CGT but to unemployment.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:25am
    - BobbyS
      
      Yep – there are a few Labour MP’s left from the 9 years they spent on the opposition benches that they dare not even consider going back to them so quickly
      
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      April 18, 2019 11:02am
  - Charmaine Hawke
    
    Note the words future government she leads so what is to stop her winning the next election, Andrew Little gets his job back and CGT here we come.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:28am
    - sooty
      
      Litthe Andrew will only get back in as a list MP!
      
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      April 18, 2019 10:01am
- Ross12
  
  But it is more than just dumping the idea now –she has said Labour will not campaign on it again. That suggests the big “invisible Labour hand” behind the scenes has probably had as much influence as Peters.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:08am
  - calendar girl
    
    .
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:32am
Tony Stuart

Saying that the public had no appetite for a CGT (after having claimed, in Question Time, that polls favoured one) was bullshit. Ardern simply didn’t want to admit that Winston Peters stared her down, and she was the first to blink.

Welcome to New Zealand’s most open and transparent NZF-led government!
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April 18, 2019 8:30am
- niggly
  
  Yep and meanwhile the MSM are knocking Bridges because apparently now the CGT is dead then supposedly Bridges has no more ammo against the Govt …
  
  Really!!??? How about the simmering Sroubek affair, KiwiBuild failure, Trainset costs blowing out, poverty up, unemployment up, business confidence down, COL scaring off foreign investment, migrant numbers still high, roading gridlocks to remain as COL cut more road upgrade projects, money wasted on fee education and no additional uptake of students, Shane Jones and his $1B slush funds, umm Shane Jones just full stop, Two Green MP’s constantly running amok and effectively dissing COL policies at times, “what’s in it for Winston” deals or no deals stayed tuned to find out, energy prices rising, COL overspent spent the budget and now looking down the back of citizens couches for any loose change, fiddling the books to shift debt around, Jacinda and Roberston too chicken to front the CGT debate and had to pay Cullen $1000/day to do the selling and so on!
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:56am
  - calendar girl
    
    Has Cullen’s indecent $1,000 per day been stopped, as of yesterday? Come on National, its your job to file an OIA request and a Parliamentary question.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:38am
    - Tall Man
      
      Pretty sure he said yesterday he’s outa there.
      
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      April 18, 2019 11:14am
      - sooty
        
        Should have been tared and feathered and rode out on the rail!
        
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        April 18, 2019 8:44pm
  - Rachael Membery
    
    But Simon was apparently ineffectual anyway, which is it lol.
    The pollies know he is effective even if the media don’t let the sheeple know it.
    
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    April 18, 2019 1:07pm
- david
  
  Tony, I think you read it correctly but where are the headlines screaming “PM does not share the beliefs of NZ’s adult population”.
  By her own admission she admitted in the press conference that her belief system diverges from that of the voting public and that she does not think that she could successfully force a change to the tax system upon them.
  Never have I seen a more damning indictment of a politician so out of sync with the voters.
  But hey, democracy means that the people’s will prevails and that they elect poli’s to make decisions on their behalf, it doesn’t actually mean that they have to believe in the decisions that they make.
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:58am
srylands

I was reflecting last night on Paul Keating’s successful introduction of a capital gains tax in Australia in 1986. He did not have to contend with MMP but there was much opposition.

He was successful by both will and persuasion. But critically he combined it with serious reductions in the top marginal tax rate, policies to restore the profit share of the economy, tariff reductions, and a major assault on low quality spending. I had the privilege of working on the latter.

Compare that to today in New Zealand and weep.
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April 18, 2019 8:33am
- septic skeptic
  
  In fairness, you could only do a package like that in times of rapid house price inflation. The horse here has bolted. Prices are stagnant or falling and nobody was predicting that GCT was going to deliver much money for the first few years.
  
  In the 80’s we had Roger Douglas, not Keating. For which we should be very grateful.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:12am
- Tall Man
  
  I understand what you are saying but, why does NZ need a CGT?
  
  Isn’t that the first question to ask?
  
  The top income earners already pay the bulk of the taxes with approx 50% of the population paying no tax at all.
  
  Surely we just need a smarter government managing what is already being collected bearing in mind that after the initial crap from the coalition they then stated that this would not be tax neutral as they needed the money for other “projects”.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:22am
brett68

The CGT decision has saved both NZ First and the Greens.

I expect both to get a bump in the polls, Greens are going to get another influx of disgruntled Labour voters and NZ First may pick up a mix of both National and Labour voters who were hostile to a CGT.

Any decent news organization would be running a poll right now but the chances of that happening are nil.
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April 18, 2019 8:38am
- Tall Man
  
  Well brett, aren’t you a little cheer germ.
  
  No National voter with a working brain would ever switch to “what’s in it for wynston”…. ever.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:13am
  - brett68
    
    Less chance of a Labour outright win in 2020.
    If National can’t win I’d prefer the status quo to a Labour only or Labour/Green government.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:09am
    - Tall Man
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UkKTlzyLhQ
      
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      April 18, 2019 11:13am
- septic skeptic
  
  Nobody is going back to Winston because he was part of the decision to abandon this loser of a policy.
  People know that it was Labour policy when Winston first went with the COL. Even a fool can tell that Winston would have agreed with CGT if the price was right. Also, for Ardern to rule it out for all time there must surely be division in Labour as well.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:18am
  - Piniwi
    
    Or ss it might indicate the PM reading between the lines while getting ready to jump ship before all the deck chairs slide off the deck? Perhaps things went well between her and the recent visit of the H1 look alike from the UN? With their own lagging PR status they might welcome such such a high flyer? Hence no more chance of CGT on her watch which might be shorter now. Seem to remember her saying the same about strikes on her watch before getting the new Micky Mouse one. Many also recall her claim of “being there for a good time and not a long time”. Roll on 30th April for OQT.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:14pm
Poppa

So how are you going to fill in the hole Grant??

I know, why don’t you put your hand in my wallet and grab some more
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April 18, 2019 8:47am
- Rachael Membery
  
  Can you rephrase that please?
  
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  April 18, 2019 1:12pm
krazykiwi

The Notre Dame fire started minutes after it closed to the public, and 72 hours after a terrorist was sentenced to imprisonment for a 2016 car bomb attack on Notre Dame. Within minutes of the announcement of a prosecution (required under French law), and in the absence of an investigation, the disaster was declared ‘accidental’.

Apparently if you don’t accept all this at face value you are “far right”
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April 18, 2019 8:58am
- alien
  
  the fire broke out on the roof. The only access for that area was for the construction workers.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:18am
- MCos
  
  Nothing to do with some terrorist being sentenced to prison.
  Some Thai royalists are saying that the Notre Dame fire was divine revenge for the French fighting a war against Siam King Rama V and giving asylum to Somsak Jeamteerasakul
  
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  April 18, 2019 10:01am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  What (in the roof) could cause a fire? I assume that the rennovation crew had turned off the power to their electrical equipment.
  Was a fire risk assessment performed prior to the rennovation?
  Were there electrical cables (very old, I guess) up in the roof?
  Only someone working in the rennovation team would have knowledge of how to get up into the roof.
  So many questions…
  
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  April 18, 2019 11:45am
  - Fletch
    
    There’s a translation by a French person on Facebook, saying –
    
    ” Unfortunately, I think it’s not an accident. I am a former student of the Ecole du Louvre graduated in Art History. I visited the frame of Notre Dame with architects of the Buildings of France, several years ago. This 12th century timber frame was protected as ever! Each intervention is always accompanied by historians, architects, experts, no work is envisaged without extreme caution, no source of heat, NO TORCH, no electrical apparatus, a high-performance alarm system, and very strict supervision. I think we will eventually learn that it is a criminal fire “
    
    I guess, time will tell.
    
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    April 18, 2019 3:53pm
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      I guess the “supervision” wasn’t on duty at the time…
      
      You’d think there would be on-site CCTV installed for a major restoration like this, if only for butt-covering in case someone accidentally knocked a ladder over or something.
      
      Wasn’t the site even under security watch?
      Could anyone just walk in off the street?
      
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      April 18, 2019 4:17pm
Maggie Pie

My partner knows i spend a fair amount of time on social media. He was saying last night he actually understands now why they need to print ‘Do Not Eat’ on those silica packets.
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April 18, 2019 9:00am
- sooty
  
  If only they would put a string on them, to make them easier to get out of the cup!
  
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  April 18, 2019 10:07am
ducklin71

Labour and greens supporters are crying in their weet-bix this morning. Hee haw!!! CGT was our ticket to freely redistribute other people’s money. The greed! The injustice! Noooooo!!!!
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April 18, 2019 9:02am
waikatogirl

What a beautiful autumn and CGT free morning to wake up to. The beauty is enhanced with the fact that Cindy has lost control of her deputy Winston Raymond Peters. Wait for him to go completely rogue… Leopards don’t change their spots. ?
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April 18, 2019 9:02am
- alien
  
  she never had control of Winston to lose, obvious int he way his MP’s can act without punishment. Maybe she is realising why Key would never deal with him.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:19am
  - waikatogirl
    
    Cindy was wooed by Winston. She truly believed she and he would work in harmony with her as leader an him as her supportive old uncle deputy leader. Reality is biting and she is having to adapt to finding out she may be driving but Winston is in charge of the direction they are heading, and it isn’t where Cindy wants to go. LOL!
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:45am
    - sooty
      
      Cindy has the gearlever, but Whinney has the steering wheel!
      
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      April 18, 2019 10:09am
      - Surely Knott
        
        Did Winston and Jacinda not discuss CGT when they negotiated to form a government? It was Labours core policy? Was it all just gingernuts, babies, and regional slush funds. Would be great to get a look at the agreement in the safe.
        
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        April 18, 2019 10:42am
      - RW Capitalist
        
        and boy are they grinding up the gears.
        Probably because nobody is in control of either brake or the clutch.
        
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        April 18, 2019 4:54pm
    - ducklin71
      
      MMP! How’s that working out for you JA? Ba ha!
      
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      April 18, 2019 10:29am
Maggie Pie

From my twitter fede it shaw looks like James – is. not. happy 🙁 Wonder what hes got in mind for us now?

https://twitter.com/jamespeshaw/status/1118367687254642689
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April 18, 2019 9:15am
- alien
  
  i agree with him, they are making great progress on homelessness and the climate. They’re making it worse.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:20am
  - septic skeptic
    
    At least now the CGT distraction is over they can get on with the important issues like reclaiming the “C” word and policing the use of gender pronouns.
    
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    April 18, 2019 9:53am
    - Rachael Membery
      
      And stop paying Cullen.
      
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      April 18, 2019 1:58pm
- septic skeptic
  
  Gotta love that twitter feed. The watermelons really are on the fringe. 95% hate them and the other 5% are disappointed that they are so bloody useless!
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:34am
- ducklin71
  
  Resign James. You said you don’t deserve to be in Govt if no CGT- well the greens shouldn’t be anywhere near the halls of power anyway. You and Marama go have a cry-in.
  
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  April 18, 2019 10:32am
Cobolt24

If my calculations are correct, Stephieboy is going to be let out of KB jail today.
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April 18, 2019 9:18am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  ugh.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:31am
- Maggie Pie
  
  YAY!! Ive got so many norty ‘goat images’ saved – i hope mods allow me to link them 🙂
  
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  April 18, 2019 10:07am
Surely Knott

Barry Soper is biased and wrong. In his article on CGT Mutiny, he says “And struggling to keep his head above the Beehive’s wake is Simon Bridges who has now lost his only tub thumping cause.
The only tub he’ll be thumping now is the one in his caucus room the week after next as he struggles to keep his captain’s stripes.”
Far from losing his only cause, Simon Bridges and National have slayed Labour’s biggest dragon. Labour campaigned on Transformational government. And their two tactics to transform were CGT and Kiwibuild both failures. So what tub thumping can National do next. 1. Well how about rising Poverty under labour. 2 Labour’s failure to deliver transformation or to stand for anything at all. 3. “Year of Delivery” when they have failed to deliver cgt, failed to deliver kiwibuild, and the delivery of rail loop is a billion dollars over. Don’t worry Soper, Labour backspinning on their biggest policy which underpinned their core values, does not make them free from criticism.
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April 18, 2019 9:28am
- alien
  
  simon bridges slayed nothing. Winston was never going to swallow a CGT as it would be the death of NZ first. The only one who deserves credit for the CGT not being implented is Winston.
  
  Bridges is useless, he will not win the next election.
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:35am
  - Prince
    
    Rubbish. If Peters was the issue she would not have said “no CGT, EVER on my watch’.
    National managed the anti-CGT publicity well, Labour had no one to stand up for it other than Cullen.
    Next election now has tax cuts back on the agenda. Three years of higher taxes under Labour, no progress on poverdy. National will look after the working Kiwi with tax cuts for all, ensure benefits go to the right place, better management of economy.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:16am
    - alien
      
      sure she would of. He wouldnt let her pass her key policy and has been a thorn in her side on a number of issues.
      
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      April 18, 2019 11:34am
  - Hacked-Off
    
    But alien, you consideration is narrowly based. Peters could only do that because the largest Party in the House ie National also opposed it. Peters is only effective if National oppose a CoL policy otherwise Mr 7% does not have any clout and Labour/Greens would be able to bypass him and make him largely irrelevant. He needs National’s support, or at least opposition to any CoL policy, if he wants to disrupt CoL policy.
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:25am
    - alien
      
      National were never and have never supported a CGT, so no, she would neve rof had Nationals support on this. The ONLY other party that could of helped her pass this was NZ First and even he is on record of not supporting a CGT. Bridges had zero to do with this.
      
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      April 18, 2019 11:33am
    - simpleton1
      
      The National Party should have stated the position and voted on the gun possession laws, in that having a proper select committee time and process at the very least.
      That way it would have been a place for Winston Peters to have also headed over to, as he would have figured there were votes for him in that too.
      
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      April 18, 2019 11:46am
  - Surely Knott
    
    A vote for Winston is a vote for Labour, and if he’s under 5% or Labour can do it without him they will – so a vote for Winston could even result in Labour /Greens govt. There is only one vote that opposes a Labour lead government and that is a vote for National. A vote for any of the coalition partys is a Monty Python skit. “Sir what can I get you for govt today? Would you like spam spam, labour, nz1 and spam. Or would you like spam spam greens labour and spam. We also have spam labour with nz1 and greens and spam. Or we also have the delicious spam labour spam spam and spam. “
    
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    April 18, 2019 12:25pm
    - Rachael Membery
      
      So Jacinda should rule working with NZ First out, just like National is always advised to, you know, since she has other friends.
      
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      April 18, 2019 8:39pm
- septic skeptic
  
  I hope they box a little bit clever on the poverdy issue. They need to point out that socialist policies don’t improve people’s lives. I for one don’t want to hear that National would be more efficient in redistribution. They would lose me (again).
  
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  April 18, 2019 9:51am
  - Tall Man
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwOg88GMmbA
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xs6rkC4pIDQ
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UkKTlzyLhQ
    
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    April 18, 2019 10:43am
Rich Prick

I have a question. Will all of the lefties upset with the CGT being dropped pay it anyway? I mean if it was such a good thing, they should be personally committed, right?
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April 18, 2019 9:53am
Prince

The really interesting part of Ardern’s backflip is that she went on to say ‘never on my watch’.
So no matter what Govt the next election brings, she will not allow CGT.
Seems to me she is feeling the pressure of the job. She’s under 40, after 9 years lazing around doing not much, she suddenly has all this stuff to attend to, reading to do, complex issues to get a grip on. And a new baby and maybe considering family additions.
Why hang around until the people give you the boot, a la Helen Clark ?
No wonder she might think ‘another 2-3 years of this and I’m off’. Key stuck it out for longer but he was older, more used to hard work and complexity.
I think this is a little sign that Ardern is thinking about where she might be 5 years down the road.
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April 18, 2019 10:09am
- Im Right
  
  Agreed Prince, she suffers from anxiety/stress, it’s not a secret she took a fair bit of time off when in opposition due to stress/anxiety. Now she is PM, and has had a great MSM ‘honeymoon’ period, plus has capital in the bank due to the ChCh massacre (reluctantly agreed to by myself) NOW is her ideal opportunity to walk away and get that UN job she has been angling for…she will get the away with it by saying things like ‘need to be a mother’, ‘family more important’ etc etc and the NZ public will all be understanding and awwwww!
  If she doesn’t leave in the next month or three her ideal window would have closed.
  
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  April 18, 2019 10:30am
Hacked-Off

But alien, you consideration is narrowly based. Peters could only do that because the largest Party in the House ie National also opposed it. Peters is only effective if National oppose a CoL policy otherwise Mr 7% does not have any clout and Labour/Greens would be able to bypass him and make him largely irrelevant. He needs National’s support, or at least opposition to any CoL policy, if he wants to disrupt CoL policy.
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April 18, 2019 10:27am
Roger Douglas

New Zealand’s political parties main aim at this time is and has been to stay in power.In order to reach this goal they have been prepared to use any means available to them,(bribes.handouts tax subsidies)Clark and Cullen used all of them to win the 2005 election. Policies that could prove to be unpopular for example how we fund super and health for the retired are shifted to some future time(key).Such political decision making has resulted in the government owing us its citizens more than one trillion dollars of unfunded liabilities for our healthcare and pensions in retirement.That debt has for years been deliberately left out of the governments books. If directors of public companies did the same they would almost certainly end up in jail. As a nation we have to put quality policies policies in place before it is to late (one point six workers per retiree instead of almost three that we have today inside 40 years) The policies we need would be popular with labour voters, while the current lot of labour politicians would hate them.(why because they would lose their power over the low income workers)National voters unless they love the current handouts would also like the policies.
Roger Douglas
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April 18, 2019 10:38am
- RW Capitalist
  
  Good morning Roger
  Time to go back to basics
  Understand that MP, PM are jobs to do.
  Parliament is called “the house of representatives”, because they REPRESENT us…the citizen.
  The economy is the PRIMARY concern, without a strong economy, we have NOTHING. (everything else requires money to do)
  Parliament are the MANAGERS/ADMINISTRATORS of OUR money.
  TAX is taken from the tax payers, to managed by parliament on OUR behalf.
  Tax and the rate of tax is money mandated and rate set by PARLIAMENT that is necessary to run the things we (the citizens ) mandate/need to be done and can’t do ourselves.
  On that, my suggestion for fixing this decades old mess.
  Make a balance sheet
  On one side all the expenses, that are considered absolutely necessary for running a country.
  Police (due to their need to be independent)
  Military as for police but strictly controlled by Parliament with over sight.
  Large projects (due to NZ being a small country)
  Back stops for:
  Education
  Hospitals (health inc ACC, pharmac etc)
  Then the list of “wants”. in another column.
  Cost the needs and tax accordingly
  Cost the wants and tax at a level that will allow this list to be gradually purchased.
  My thinking is, taxes will come way down, growth will go way up, unemployment down, wages/income up.
  Minimize govt.
  Happiness/well being will take care of itself.
  
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  April 18, 2019 11:22am
  - cmm
    
    Exactly right RW.
    
    Without a solid economy you cannot do any of the other things. Everything is out of your reach.
    
    While the useless lefties will blame capitalism for poverdee and environmental destruction etc, the most basic research shows the opposite: you can only care for others (and the environment) with a solid economy.
    
    People standing in bread queues don’t give a shit about polar bears or educational outcomes for downtrodden people. They just can’t afford to.
    
    The Black Triangle was being killed by the commies. Now it is coming back.
    
    Poor people didn’t care what much flowed in the Thames, with wealth there are now fish swimming there again.
    
    Take care of the economy first so that you can afford to care about other things.
    
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    April 18, 2019 11:34am
- cmm
  
  Sure, if you don’t get into power then you don’t get to enact any policies, therefore you do need the power to do something.
  
  Power is a tool. Getting power should not be the aim in itself.
  
  But I would submit there are many people there just for the rush of power. The power is the reason to be there.
  
  Likewise it would seem there are some for whom it is just an opportunity to plant face in trough.
  
  Our PM in particular really does not have leadership or skills to bring to the table (beyond handing out selfies and hugs).
  
  I saw the same in the military. For some, getting rank and being able to swan about the officers’ mess etc was their goal.
  
  For others, having rank was what they needed to be able to do their job and provide leadership and service. These were often very humble people focusing on serving their troops/sailors as best they could.
  
  I worked with both types, real dick head officers and really good ones. The best would go in to bat for their men whenever they could and the men knew that and would do anything for them too.
  
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  April 18, 2019 11:26am
- KevO'Brien
  
  There is good reason not to fund future social benefits. It is not economic or efficient and there is no guarantee the funds will be available later. Where are they to be invested? As the liabilities are local it is best they be invested locally. That means then the govt having a large tied fund but not necessarily control. There is a simpler way: let the people retain the funds and the economy develop that will provide tax revenues needed as needed.
  
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  April 18, 2019 12:59pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Up ticked but
    All systems/people have unpredictable rainy days.
    Money is put aside, insurance taken for this.
    It is only prudent, but not more than can be estimated (engineers would call it a fudge factor).
    
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    April 18, 2019 1:07pm
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Funds are best left with the people which will ultimately develop the local economy. Socialists want to micromanage the economy while a free capitalist economy encourages a greater pie for all. Not that will give equal shares but reward for risk, greater incomes, taxes and the ability to afford social programs.
      
      There will always be risk for the future but a govt with a free economy will have more ability to accept that. The alternative is that everyone will have to fund their own personal health and pension programs but the risk still falls on the state if adversity takes out their hoped savings.
      
      Fund managers love the idea of the ticket clipping possible but the expense is ultimately with the contributors. The simple pay-as-you-go budget national pension gives a fair economical solution. Each generation takes the risk in sharing what is then available to it not having to attempt to plan for future uncertainties.
      
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      April 18, 2019 3:43pm
      - Ian Boag
        
        “The simple pay-as-you-go budget national pension gives a fair economical solution”
        
        Put the pension on the credit card and leave the bills for the kids. Some call it inter-generational theft.
        
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        April 18, 2019 4:10pm
  - Ian Boag
    
    Yep. Let today’s taxpayers fund their parents’ pensions. Totally fair. After all the current pensioner generation funded their parents’ pensions.
    
    There seems to be some encouragement for people to try to make some provision for their old age. Putting some dosh aside is a good idea. Kiwisaver and all that. There is some sort of suspicion that when today’s taxpayers get to 65 the government might not be so generous.
    
    Whatever happens about people saving for their own retirement, they definitely need to keep funding their parents’ generation …
    
    Your reasoning would suggest that the Cullen Fund is a mistake and should be wound up (?)
    
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    April 18, 2019 1:09pm
  - cmm
    
    It is never INVESTED.
    
    It is spent.
    
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    April 18, 2019 5:04pm
    - Rachael Membery
      
      Ponzi?
      
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      April 18, 2019 10:52pm
RW Capitalist

Some basic workable and FAIR economics for SLG, the fat controller and CoL in general.
http://www.shortkidstories.com/story/little-red-hen/
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April 18, 2019 10:51am
mandk

COYS!

THFC vs LFC in the Final?
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April 18, 2019 10:57am
Gravelroad

Gawd….the juvenile Jack Tame has been replaced on the Breakfast Tv “Show” with an even more left wing poseur, John Campbell.
I guess it is a reward for Campbell’s performance during the aftermath of the Mosque killings.
Hope he’s not going to sigh, look away, shrug shoulders, sigh again, shed tears behind ugly glasses, more sighs, throw hands in air at the futility of is all etc etc through breakfast.
Won’t be watching.
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April 18, 2019 12:23pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Been so many years since I’ve seen or heard anything with Campbell involved that I struggle to even remember what he looks or sounds like. Isn’t the internet wonderful.
  
  12 0
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  April 18, 2019 12:46pm
  - Rob2
    
    A whinny leftie wit a pen in his hand.
    
    7 0
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    April 18, 2019 4:31pm
    - sooty
      
      I think you left is of the sixth word!
      I don’t think I’m a loud to say.
      
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      April 18, 2019 9:04pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  Heard Tame has gone to Q+A….ratings flagging?
  Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic?
  They are as useless as each other.
  
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  April 18, 2019 1:10pm
  - alien
    
    i think their biggest stuff up was moving it to late at night. Well their second biggest, their biggest is going to be Tame.
    
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    April 18, 2019 1:30pm
    - Rob2
      
      10.30 sunday night.
      What a bunch of fuckwitted managers thinking that would work. Never watch it now.
      
      8 0
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      April 18, 2019 4:30pm
      - Inandout
        
        Rob2, that slot used to be occupied by Mahalia Jackson if my youth recalls, then came the goodnight kiwi.
        
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        April 18, 2019 4:57pm
      - RW Capitalist
        
        Stopped watching when the political balance of the show went all pro SLG and anti National.
        My suggestion for host/ manager.
        Paul Henry…..
        
        10 0
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        April 18, 2019 5:03pm
- greybeard
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/tv-radio/112127597/john-campbell-to-replace-jack-tame-on-breakfast-as-tame-takes-over-qa
  
  Stuff have already closed the comments , but check out the three comments marked as “Editor’s Pick ” !!!!
  
  Easy to see who Stuff likes.
  
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  April 18, 2019 2:01pm
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Editors pick was a one ‘marvelous’ word; says lots about the editors intellect, mind you it was one of the few comments that did not say crap when referring to Crumble
    
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    April 18, 2019 5:22pm
Inandout

I was stacking firewood and a big brown cockroach got half squashed. Even though it was dismembered the creature started crawling away and I admired its tenacity. I can now see why Winston is so named.
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April 18, 2019 2:18pm
- Fletch
  
  Ugh, I hate those things, with their big flat bodies….
  
  7 0
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  April 18, 2019 3:48pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Cockroaches or wynstons?
    
    10 0
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    April 18, 2019 4:23pm
  - RW Capitalist
    
    Learn to love them, one more term of these clowns, they may be the only edible protein left.
    
    5 0
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    April 18, 2019 5:04pm
  - alien
    
    politicans?
    
    1 0
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    April 18, 2019 6:46pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Quite a few types of insect can survive hours (days) without their heads.
  
  https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/fact-or-fiction-cockroach-can-live-without-head/
  
  5 0
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  April 18, 2019 4:40pm
  - Inandout
    
    Maggy it is true, insects will inherit the earth if we depart. One can only imagine what species infest those overcrowded Indian cities.
    
    4 2
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    April 18, 2019 4:54pm
    - rangitoto
      
      These little creatures are considered to be among the toughest.
      
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tardigrade
      
      “Tardigrades are thought to be able to survive even complete global mass extinction events due to astrophysical events, such as gamma-ray bursts, or large meteorite impacts. Some of them can withstand extremely cold temperatures down to 1 K (−458 °F; −272 °C) (close to absolute zero), while others can withstand extremely hot temperatures up to 420 K (300 °F; 150 °C) for several minutes, pressures about six times greater than those found in the deepest ocean trenches, ionizing radiation at doses hundreds of times higher than the lethal dose for a human, and the vacuum of outer space. They can go without food or water for more than 30 years, drying out to the point where they are 3% or less water, only to rehydrate, forage, and reproduce. Tardigrades that live in harsh conditions undergo an annual process of cyclomorphosis, allowing for survival in sub-zero temperatures.”
      
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      April 18, 2019 7:07pm
      - nasska
        
        Amazing. I always thought that unionists were the only form of basic life that could survive those conditions!
        
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        April 18, 2019 7:47pm
Fletch

re: The Trump-Russia collusion thing – for which there is no evidence. It is telling that the media looked the other way in 1996 when there was actual collusion between China and the Clinton Administration. This isn’t just heresay – there is evidence that Chinese govt representatives met people in the White House many times, and some have even testified to such.

In the 1990s, a hostile foreign power meddled in our presidential election. There were serious questions about whether one party’s candidate — the beneficiary — was complicit in the meddling, or at least looked the other way while it was going on. The candidate fiercely resisted the appointment of a special prosecutor, then known as an independent counsel, to investigate. Finally, amid only moderate media interest and public concern, it all faded away.

The country doing the meddling, of course, was China, and the presidential candidate was Bill Clinton, who was already in the White House and seeking re-election in 1996.

Looking back on press accounts from the era, it’s striking how brazen a number of the players were as they went about the task of funneling illegal foreign donations to the Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee. The names have been mostly forgotten now — Charlie Trie, John Huang, Johnny Chung — but the record remains.

Chung, for example, who was born in Taiwan and became a U.S. citizen, was a prolific Democratic fundraiser. Between 1994 and 1996, he gave $366,000 to the DNC and visited the Clinton White House more than 50 times.

In 1995, Chung gave a $50,000 check to First Lady Hillary Clinton’s chief of staff at an event on the White House grounds. His memorable explanation: “I see the White House is like a subway — you have to put in coins to open the gates.”

In May 1999, Chung testified before the House Government Oversight Committee. He said that in 1996, during the Clinton re-election campaign, he met with the head of Chinese military intelligence in the basement of a restaurant in Hong Kong. “We really like your president. We hope to see him re-elected,” the Chinese spy, Gen. Ji Shengde, told Chung, according to Chung’s testimony. Gen. Ji continued: “I will give you 300,000 U.S. dollars. You can give it to the president and the Democratic Party.”

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/byron-york-when-a-foreign-adversary-meddled-in-a-presidential-election

But yeh, the media didn’t care enough to follow it up – they weren’t interested, because it was a Democrat.
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April 18, 2019 3:34pm
Rob2

JOBSEEKER BENEFIT PAYMENTS LEAP
Benefit levels fell seasonally in March from December but are actually +4.8% higher than the same quarter in 2018. In fact, “work ready” Jobseeker benefits are up a massive +14% year-on-year and despite job vacancy ads being at near record levels.

https://www.interest.co.nz/news/99231/review-things-you-need-know-you-go-home-thursday-jobseeker-benefit-claims-leap-some-other
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April 18, 2019 4:29pm
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Labour led clusterfk in action!
  
  Go team red!
  
  Knobs United!
  
  9 0
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  April 18, 2019 5:24pm
- All_on_Red
  
  New Zealand can’t afford a Labour Government
  
  10 0
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  April 18, 2019 5:52pm
- PhilP
  
  Thanks to Septic Tank!
  
  0 0
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  April 18, 2019 9:19pm
Odakyu-sen

I read somewhere that AI systems tend to become “conservative” since they are based on logic and rational decision-making and are without emotion.
I heard that software “patches” then have to be applied to make the self-learning AI more “progressive.” Or something like that.

It kind of makes sense that a rational, logical system would ask to see the facts on which to base its decisions.
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April 18, 2019 5:37pm
JibberJabber

Armed Police the new normal?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/111880584/drumbeat-remains-for-permanent-arming-of-nz-police

Academics disagree, no shit?
Two academics that have never left the safe space of a university, heard a shot fired in anger or had to deal with low IQ drugged up ferals with no impulse control say the police don`t need weapons to protect themselves or the public.
But hey, they`ve got stats, so have the cops but the cops stats and experience count for nothing according to the “academics” who prefer their own numbers.
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April 18, 2019 5:41pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  say the police don`t need weapons to protect themselves or the public
  
  That’s not what they said.
  
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  April 18, 2019 6:35pm
- nasska
  
  The police are not short of weapons. At minimum they have tasers at hip, ready access to pistols in the car safe & rifles if their commander deems it necessary for them to be carried.
  
  Apart from a severe lack of training in the handling of firearms the public are already at risk because of the recruiting of midgets. An itty bitty policewoman is more likely to have a firearm grabbed off her & used against the police & public.
  
  In any case with H&S to the fore police don’t step into a situation until they have a numeric advantage. Witness the mosque shootings & the bottle store attendant left to bleed out for half an hour!
  
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  April 18, 2019 7:35pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Is there something wrong with me?
https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/387336/top-military-attache-alfred-keating-found-guilty-of-planting-hidden-camera-in-nz-embassy
I just can’t see the appeal in spying on someone on the dunny or wiping their fanny adams/ jiggling their dick.
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April 18, 2019 8:17pm
- alien
  
  i’ve often wondered what the so called secruity cameras in the the ceilings of the council public toilets see considering they are right above the toilet.
  
  3 0
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  April 18, 2019 8:23pm
- nasska
  
  For my money Xaviera Hollander summed it up best in her 1971 book “The Happy Hooker”.
  
  Chapter 11 was entitled, “Different Strokes for Different Folks or Wall St & Me”. 🙂
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:33pm
- JibberJabber
  
  Lol, just had that same conversation with my wife.
  Totally bizarre behaviour, whatever happened to the traditional Navy peccadilloes of Rum, Sodomy and the Lash?
  
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  April 18, 2019 8:35pm
alien

awww, poor unions, they just can’t get a break. THey are having to fight the government for pay rises and when they get them for their members their members aren’t happy with how little they have got, and now, sob sob, no CGT

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/04/young-labour-furious-at-capital-gains-tax-backdown-leak-reveals.html
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April 18, 2019 8:21pm

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