General Debate 14 December 2018

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Keeping Stock

Better late than never 😀
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December 14, 2018 9:36am
- Biscuit
  
  ‘by David Farrar..’?
  
  Not Kokila?
  
  Surely, surely, DPF isn’t one of those newfangled left-winger employers who, gasp, occasionally unchains his workers and lets them, double gasp, have break thingies?
  
  You’d almost think you’re gunning for a job at the UN, David!
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:13am
  - itstricky
    
    I’m astounded GD isn’t something that’s just automatically posted each day.
    
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    December 14, 2018 5:04pm
tas

The name of the person charged with murdering Grace Millane is suppressed. However, it has been published in the UK media and was searched for 100,000 times in NZ, which resulted in Google publishing it as a trending search topic.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-46548574
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12176432
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/109331119/onus-was-on-google-to-be-aware-of-name-suppression-but-it-may-not-face-the-wrap

Clearly name suppression laws are ineffective in the age of the internet. They need to be reviewed. (There are also other issues, such as names being suppressed supposedly to protect victims, when really the only beneficiary is the criminal.)

Andrew Little is talking about prosecuting Google. Perhaps the fool should try to prosecute the 100,000 people who conducted those searches.

Also how is Google supposed to know the name is suppressed if no one is allowed to tell them the name?
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December 14, 2018 9:36am
- Chuck Bird
  
  “(There are also other issues, such as names being suppressed supposedly to protect victims, when really the only beneficiary is the criminal.)”
  
  Alleged criminal
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:37am
  - tas
    
    No. That comment is about other cases where the person has already been convicted and their name is still suppressed.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:42am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      tas, if that is the case I agree with you.
      
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      December 14, 2018 9:57am
  - septic skeptic
    
    And pre-supposing it was murder. Oh wait, the PM confirmed that already.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:43am
    - Biscuit
      
      But not a word from Andrew Little about his leader prejudging the case, of course!
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:15am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      It appears that Cindy did not say it was murder but Stuff did.
      
      If it is Stuff that made the claim it was murder maybe they could be prosecuted.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:16am
      - Biscuit
        
        Ah, Chuck, if that is the case then I apologise to Jass.
        
        It will surprise you, I know, but I don’t sit on the edge of my sofa lapping up each and every word of her utterances!
        
        Talking of which, how long before Jass’s public demands a Betty Windsor-type Christmas Message from her?
        Live on all channels and lawnmowers.
        ‘My baby, my significant other and I…’
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:24am
      - septic skeptic
        
        I withdraw and apologise.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:31am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        Biscuit, you should hear her latest utterance. She said she is going to change her mobile because of the 1000’s of texts she gets.
        
        What a lying cow. Any MP and certainly any senior MP would not let all but her closest friend have her mobile number. They also would have texts and calls from unknown callers blocked.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:38am
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        Our rules on court reporting are not so strict that the presss are not allowed to hypothesise that a person has been mudered before anyone has been charged. Essentially the only restrictions on reporting relate to jeopardising the right to a fair trial.
        Personally I think the claim for name suppression in this case is bogus. As does Chris Finlayson. And so did the DCJ. It was lodging the appeal that stopped the naming. And that shows the 20 day rule for appeals needs changing.
        I know the legal profession says the publication of the name overseas will prejudice a fair trial. Frankly that is nonsense. Virtually every defendant is named and is still tried.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:45am
      - marcw
        
        Sorry wayne – reported in error. My point was that if ALL applications for suppression had to be made pro bono there would be remarkably few in future. In the meantime, it’s a nice little supplementary earner eh.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:57am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        Wayne, this is a little off topic but what do you think of Ardern’s claim that 1000’s of people have her mobile number and she has had the same mobile for a decade?
        
        As a cabinet minister would you give out your mobile number to any acquaintance who asked for it?
        
        Cheers
        Chuck
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:24pm
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        On the issue of the PM’s cellphone, well PM’s are in a very different situation to Cabinet Ministers. So I am not surprised she has done this.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:32pm
      - Piniwi
        
        But Chuck Bird the silly little girl who ended up an accidental PM has a track record of keeping some dodgy company before the Media party made her famous. Her stupidity is again illustrated by retaining all those dodgy contacts when elevated. A wiser head would have sorted it out with a new phone along with serious control of just who had access. They are also controlling the OIA process by some devious means of making so much of their communications invisible to that process. Curran had one dodgy exchange but the regions self claimed “champion” has had 61 or so he says.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:11pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    So Angry Andy thinks it wouldn’t be a good thing if the arsehole who killed Grace Millane didn’t get a ‘fair trial’ if too many potential jurors might know his name and something of his history, even though most of us know already thanks to a wonderful invention called the internet.
    Well stuff you Angry. Is there a billion to one chance that the police haven’t got the right man? In fact it’s so obvious that they have that a trial seems like a huge waste of money.
    So what are you farting on about, you despicable crim-hugger?
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:41am
    - sooty
      
      The judge had no problems with his name been released. It was the defence lawyer, his was going to appeal!
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:03pm
      - Viking2
        
        Which raises the question of how did this low life get a Barrister no less as his defense lawyer. Has he lot of money or something.
        Might even be a purchaser of those dammed lawn clippings.
        
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        December 14, 2018 8:17pm
- Keeping Stock
  
  Australia is experiencing something similar with disgraced paedophile priest Cardinal George Pell. Apparently the Herald-Sun in Melbourne had a black front page yesterday, with “CENSORED” in large white letters. But few Australians will now not know that Pell has been proven to be a kiddy-fiddler.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:44am
  - kowtow
    
    He’ll appeal ,and be acquitted.
    
    You heard it here first.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:59am
    - Ed Snack
      
      And so he should, the charges and trial were a travesty. Pell was in fact the person in the Catholic Church in Australia who started to attempt to deal with the problem. Allegations that he was in a position to intervene or make changes earlier are at best, mistaken.
      
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      December 14, 2018 2:10pm
  - Biscuit
    
    KS, ‘The Sydney Morning Herald’ has a thoughtful piece on Name Suppression:
    
    https://www.smh.com.au/national/victoria/why-the-media-is-unable-to-report-on-a-case-that-has-generated-huge-interest-online-20181212-p50lta.html
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:28am
  - gump
    
    Cardinal George Pell’s conviction is mentioned in the first sentence of his wikipedia article.
    
    Does this mean linking to the wikipedia page is now illegal in Australia?
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:55pm
    - gump
      
      Sorry for the broken wikipedia link. Should have been this article.
      
      But the question was rhetorical. Linking to this wikipedia page is actually illegal in Australia.
      
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      December 14, 2018 8:29pm
- VicParking
  
  If our stupid Prime Minister had not tried to use Grace Millane’s murder as a political stunt the murder would have just been like the other five in the last few days and been forgotten by the MSM and the population at large. Her crocodile tears and apology has meant that it has become a Snowflake plaything and has drawn so much attention to it that it might be become a miscarriage of Justice. If this is so she needs to take the blame. The use of a terrible family tragedy to make political points and take the spotlight off her shambolic government is par for the course for her and her socialist communications team.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:47am
  - Pascal
    
    Her and the media that ran with the story.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:52am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Her crocodile tears and atheist prayers.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:59am
    - sooty
      
      Fully supported by a complant media!
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:04pm
    - Wayne Mapp
      
      Chuck
      
      Is the PM an atheist?
      
      She has said she did leave her church on the basis that it was antigay, but that hardly makes her an atheist.
      
      Similarly the fact she has yet to marry Clarke does not make her an atheist. I know numerous Christians who have been in long term relationships without getting married.
      
      So Chuck, unless you can show a specific statement that she has made stating she is an atheist, then you are just making it up, because you opposed to her politics.
      
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      December 14, 2018 3:36pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        She has stated that she is agnostic
        “I’m agnostic. I don’t spend a lot of time trying to figure it out. I just think people should be free to have their personal beliefs and not be persecuted for it, whether they be atheist or staunch church members.”
        https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/new-zealand-prime-minister-jacinda-ardern-quit-mormon-church-lgbt-rights-a8012676.html
        
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        December 14, 2018 3:42pm
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        Maggy,
        
        Thanks for clarifying that.
        
        I guess being an agnostic, she doesn’t have to worry about going to church regularly, but neither will she be reluctant about going to church as occasion demands, or resorting to religious imagery, such as “Our prayers and wishes are with you.”
        
        Many people in her situation feel that they have had enough religious knowledge and education to know the doctrines and fundamental tenets, but are not compelled/required to practise them.
        
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        December 14, 2018 4:39pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        As a bigoted atheist I am very careful about using religious terms around believers, but I wouldn’t read too much into someone stating that their thoughts and prayers are being offered up in support of someone in distress.
        
        Thoughts and prayers is a common phrase to express sympathy.
        
        I don’t think anything deeper needs to be read into the PM’s statement.
        
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        December 14, 2018 4:55pm
  - Viking2
    
    The use of a terrible family tragedy to make political points and take the spotlight off her shambolic government
    
    Well, perhaps it is because of a guilt conscience?
    Did the perpetrator ever purchase any lawn clippings?
    
    wonder if there is any links to the underworld in Auckland.
    
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    December 14, 2018 8:23pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Even worse, I read an article whereby the Cops were asking if anyone had information about the alleged offender to please come forward.
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2018/12/grace-millane-murder-accused-was-aggressive-former-flatmate.html
  Well if you don’t know who the alleged offender is, what is the use of that request?
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:48am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    MW.
    
    ??? Are you OK ?
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:07am
    - rangitoto
      
      stephieboy = Kiwiblogs dumbest poster.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:33am
      - Biscuit
        
        I tried to fathom a possible reason for stephieboy’s ‘???, Are you OK?’.
        
        I failed…
        
        Pray enlighten us, stephieboy.
        
        Exactly what part of Maggie’s perfectly-lucid comment perplexes you and (I am guessing) caused you to downtick it?
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:39am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Are you having comprehension problems again, stephieboy?
      
      Here let me help you:
      
      The last 3 sentences in my link are the key to your comprehension problem:
      Police are still appealing for information, and the flatmate has a message to the public – please come forward if you know anything.
      
      “There are things that have happened since then [flatting] that people know about and need to come forward about because Grace can’t have been the first that has had a bad experience with him.”
      
      Anyone with information is asked to call the Police 0800 number on 0800 676 255.
      
      If you don’t know the name of the accused, you probably can’t offer up extra information that may help the cops.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:38am
      - Biscuit
        
        Ha, that reply crossed with my post, Maggie!
        Let’s see how stephieboy responds!
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:41am
      - starboard
        
        No no, you – need – to- speak – s l o w l y- when -it – comes – to – shariaboy, – it – was – dropped – on – its – head – as – a – baby.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:00am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @biscuit..
        
        I doubt that stephieboy will reply. He hardly ever does when the facts are laid out explicitly in front of him.
        
        You are basically asking him to give a rational explanation for his irrational behaviour.
        
        Why on Earth would anyone with a modicum of commonsense and the internet at their fingertips persist in trying to paint me as mad, deranged, racist or alt-right?
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:07pm
      - calendar girl
        
        Because, as we have seen before, Maggy @ 12:07, it is not unknown for SB (i.e. stephieboy, not Simon Bridges!) to take it upon himself to stalk you personally. It all relates to his particular style of ‘creepiness’.
        
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        December 14, 2018 3:43pm
- Sofia
  
  I would like Andrew Little to explain, “How knowing the name of the man charged with the murder of Ms Grace Millane, might jeopardise a fair trial.”
  
  Especially when a interim suppression may be lifted by January 8.
  If his name is released after that date, does it compromise any court case. And, if not then, how does it actually compromise that case by people knowing now?
  
  To a potential juror, which is the more negatively influential? –
  Knowing his name.
  
  Or knowing, or observing –
  • The Prime Minister lost her composure in talking of the murder
  • Both Ardern and Little say the country is shamed.
  • Candlelit vigils have been nation-wide
  • Grace Millane murder: Shovel found in central West Auckland
  • The man accused of murdering British tourist Grace Millane was once a promising athlete who represented New Zealand in his chosen sport – so has a certain stamina.
  • The un-named man is charged with the crime, and the police are apparently not looking for anyone else.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:49am
  - fernglas
    
    I can think of no reason why his name should not be known. It will encourage potential witnesses to come forward, and any future jury will know his name anyway. The research shows juries can put aside adverse pre-trial publicity, and if the guy is ultimately acquitted, he is innocent and so doesn’t need the benefit of anonymity.
    Name suppression is almost always sought in high profile cases, but usually without any solid legal reason. Largely it is because the defendant doesn’t want his name known. The real remedy here is to get the appeal on immediately in the High Court and get a final order.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:57am
    - lifesgood
      
      Yes, saying that knowing his name would jeopardise the trial is absolute rubbish. The judge denied him name suppression initially so his name would have been out there on the day of his first court appearance. Any potential juror would have known it then.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:06am
    - Nigel Kearney
      
      As long as the decision is made by judges on a case by case basis, there must be a right of appeal. Which then implies suppression until the appeal is heard.
      
      What we should do instead is just have a blanket rule that suppression may only be imposed in cases of sexual offending where that suppression is necessary to prevent identification of the victim. in all other cases the name of the accused may be published and the judge has no power to rule otherwise.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:23am
    - KevOB
      
      The defendant has given notice of intention to file an appeal re name suppression. My understanding is that 20 workings days or so are available to do that. Then it is up to the Court to hear the appeal and suppression will continue until their determination–it may be weeks yet.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:26am
      - artemisia
        
        There are a lot of days coming up that are not working days, so that can stretch the time to file.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:46am
      - KevinH
        
        Defence counsel will almost certainly lodge an appeal for the continuation of name suppression considering the publicity that the case has attracted, the publicity being prejudicial.
        Consequently there will be lengthy deferrals, the case will drag on for months if not a full year before being heard.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:33am
    - marcw
      
      And it’s a nice little extra earner for the lawyer, mostly at the taxpayer’s expense.
      
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      December 14, 2018 12:02pm
      - Viking2
        
        Barrister no less. How can he afford one of them?
        
        Most of us couldn’t.
        
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        December 14, 2018 8:25pm
  - Jules99
    
    There are probably quite a lot of people who don’t know his name. I haven’t bothered to look it up and I’m tech savvy. Many others will not be interested in looking it up and/or don’t have the technical aptitude to do so.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:07am
    - tas
      
      There are legitimate reasons for name suppression and it does work to a certain extent — as you point out, many NZers still do not know the name. (But only because they don’t care enough to look for it. I looked it up to see how easy it is and promptly forgot it.)
      
      But I find it ridiculous that the minister of justice is talking about prosecuting Google for publishing the fact that 100,000 people searched for this name. There exists a point where asserting that something is secret is farcical and we would be crossing into that territory if such a prosecution happened.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:18am
      - KevOB
        
        The PM let the genie out of the bottle with her media whoring. She wasn’t well mannered enough to have her office send a private personal message of condolences with an offer of help as needed.
        
        Her celebrity seeking places her in a select class like Sroubek.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:32am
      - MCos
        
        She was the the PM speaking on behalf of the country. In that respect a public announcement was appropriate.
        If you disagree with what she said you could always start a petition for likeminded people to sign and send to the grieving family.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:40am
      - sooty
        
        I understand there is a protest outside her office on the weekend.
        
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        December 14, 2018 1:10pm
      - calendar girl
        
        She was out of order, MCos, engaging in her customary virtue-signalling (and in her usual “Look at me” style). And in tasteless attribution of “shame” to all the people of New Zealand.
        
        Well, as just one New Zealander, I am not going to be “shamed” by a slip of a girl who is as shallow as our Prime Minister has shown herself to be. The murderer was a mongrel, whoever he was, and his act (if it was indeed carried out by a man) was appalling. But don’t try to redirect part of the blame to my door, Ms Ardern.
        
        You and your Government are responsible for enforcing the criminal law of this country – including any use of Police Force preventative and intelligence action. So please don’t try to shift the shame factor onto me and other innocent New Zealanders. Despite your own tertiary degree in “communications”, it takes the wisdom of KevOB @ 10:32 above to explain to you in simple words what your simple, private action should have been.
        
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        December 14, 2018 4:29pm
    - Andrei
      
      You didn’t have to look it up to find it or do anything to seek it out
      
      Google mailed it out to subscribers of search feed terms
      
      I know it – it means nothing to me
      
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      December 14, 2018 11:24am
    - waikatogirl
      
      Didn’t make any difference to me once I found out who he is. Knowing his name, which I’ve subsequently forgotten, and seeing his picture made no difference, except that he looked remarkably as I’d imagined he would personality wise. A 22-year-old, having met him would not have been on guard, or wary for her safety.
      I don’t see how me seeing him on the internet would affect my decision making if I happened to be on the jury?
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:55pm
  - kiwiracer
    
    My thoughts exactly, though in this social media age name suppression is highly problematic.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:13am
- Brigitte
  
  I see that Stuff doesn’t have any sub editors left. They’ll no doubt be wrapped that some of my xmas presents have already been rapt.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:51am
  - ldypen
    
    Oh no.. who’s in charge of all the Cut and Paste directives then!!?
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:58am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Might be time to bring back the past participle wrapt… to serve both purposes.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:10am
  - oldgolfer
    
    I think there is FB page which lampoons Stuff stuff-ups.
    I imagine there are many posts.
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:08am
- Igotta Numbum
  
  I don’t think you can prosecute for looking for the info, only publishing it?
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:16am
  - tas
    
    Yes, it would be ridiculous to prosecute someone for Googling a suppressed name. I think it would be equally ridiculous to prosecute Google for publicly tracking those searches.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:38am
- Chris2
  
  The real issue is that it was irresponsible of the accused’s lawyer NOT to accept the Judge’s refusal to grant name suppression. The lawyer is gaming the system, evident by the fact that he has still not lodged the Appeal he claimed he would.
  
  Killers never get their names permanently suppressed, there is no good reason for interim suppression to have been sought at all. The fault lies with the man’s lawyer.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:24am
  - Biscuit
    
    And, Chris2, don’t you just know that that lawyer will be getting the funds for that appeal not from the ‘star athlete’ concerned but, rather, from the public via Legal Aid.
    
    I have no problems with Legal Aid being there for the presumed-perp’s trial.
    
    But I’d say, re appeals against any Guilty verdict, ‘Listen, lawyers, appeal all you like but 1) any failed appeals add 10% to your client’s sentence and 2) Legal Aid, if your client is (again) found guilty, will only cover 10% of your bill.
    
    Notsofast would, doubtless, disagree!
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:36am
    - Chuck Bird
      
      Biscuit, I basically agree with you but I would add one word and that is meritless and it should, more importantly, apply to the sentence than the verdict.
      
      Just about every convicted murderer appeals the non-parole period. The only reason that there should be a reduction is that the non-parole period is manifestly unjust not just a little bit excessive.
      
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      December 14, 2018 11:04am
      - Biscuit
        
        ‘I basically agree with you’
        
        ???
        
        :: Puts on a Stephieboy voice ::
        
        I demand complete agreement! And mucho deference. A bow or two. Maybe a curtsey. Lots of accompanying Chocolates, natch … but no ‘nutted’ ones, ok!
        
        Try again, Chuck, before I flood the thread with a few choice ****, ******, ******* and (gasp) even the odd ************ expletive(s) aimed in your direction!
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:39am
    - freethinker
      
      Agree but you are being overly generous –
      Failed appeal sentence becomes maximum for offense and Lawyers bill reduced for original case by 10% and nothing for appeal.
      
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      December 14, 2018 3:16pm
  - KevOB
    
    The lawyer’s duty is to the client in this respect. Lawfare has started early in this instance. Perhaps it was a preliminary strike in case the present situation arose and his client was denied justice.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:36am
  - KevOB
    
    The person in custody is not a proven killer. There is no report of the charges or that a plea has been entered. The suspect remains a person on remand who has been denied bail.
    The Police should be circumspect too and not feed the media either. Something akin to the subjudice rules should be applied temporarily.
    
    Let the matter rest. Justice doesn’t mind a little time.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:47am
    - freethinker
      
      Depends on how long a little time is –
      The Labour Sex pervert case will be at least a year old by the time it is heard, I suspect Political/Judicial/Police shenanigans and I Wood have thought the public interest should have required an early hearing.
      
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      December 14, 2018 3:22pm
      - KevOB
        
        Counsel can cause substantial delay–I have known a minor criminal matter to take 18 months. Court diaries too can intervene.
        
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        December 14, 2018 4:33pm
- Philview
  
  Angry Andy is angry about the name suppression issue and the man’s right to a fair trial. He has spent 12 months being angry about institutional racism in the judicial system, angry about the number of people in prison. This will put NZ’s judicial system in the global spotlight. Per usual we will only have the killer’s version of events which will be taken as the truth leading to a lenient sentence.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:20am
  - sooty
    
    Before he’s even convicted, Angrys trying to let him out!
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:14pm
- rockape
  
  Wasnt Little the one who said its findable on the UK media. Isn’t telling people where to find it a breech of the suppression order?
  
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  December 14, 2018 2:51pm
Dave Mann

Does anybody here follow Sam Harris?

For years I have listened to Sam Harris’ podcasts and the amount of sheer good sense he articulates about the delusions of religion generally and Islamic fundamentalism in particular is amazing. Same with AI where he goes deeply into the philosophy of consciousness and the impact of General AI on mankind’s future when it reaches that stage. Nuclear war too, where the potential is greater than people generally realise. There are other powerful areas of agreement…. but these are the main ones.

However, along with all these deeply intellectual and philosophical questions Harris genuinely believes that Climate Change is a real problem and is one of the three big catastrophic scenarios that face mankind – Nuclear War, AI and Climate Change.

How can a person with such obvious intelligence and undetstnding of the mind, and of religion in particular, have fallen for such an obviously faith-based religion as ‘belief in Climate Change’?

It beats me. Just shows that however bright you are, you can’t be right 100% of the time!
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December 14, 2018 9:37am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  ”Harris genuinely believes that Climate Change is a real problem and is one of the three big catastrophic scenarios that face mankind – Nuclear War, AI and Climate Change.”
  
  I can’t fault Harris’s logic. Climate Change has the potential to be a major problem for mankind. The Little Ice Age between roughly AD 1350 and 1850 certainly was a challenge.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:42am
  - Dave Mann
    
    Sure, it was a challenge for people who lived in huts and had primitive farming and rode horses….. but how could it possibly be an actual real catastrophic scenario for a civilisation such as ours?
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:46am
    - SGA
      
      Hypothetically, Dave? I would guess that food production would be the first thing to consider. Anything that had a significant impact on the production of the three major grains (corn, wheat, rice) could, I’d guess, be relatively catastrophic?
      In some parts of the world, I imagine that anything that disrupted the supply of usable water would be an issue too?
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:01am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Odakyu-sen,
    
    The “mini ice age ” is amyth,
    
    The ‘mini ice age’ misnomer
    
    “..The myth ultimately stems from a period climate scientists have coined “The Little Ice Age” (LIA). This was a modestly cool period running from about the year 1300 to 1850. It was particularly cold in the UK, where the River Thames sometimes froze over, and ‘frost fairs’ were held….”
    
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97-per-cent/2018/jan/09/the-imminent-mini-ice-age-myth-is-back-and-its-still-wrong
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:49am
    - Jules99
      
      It’s interesting to see the global warming alarmists try to talk down climate change of the past. Natural variability has led to the Wolf minimum, the Sporer minimum, the Maunder minimum (aka the little ice age), and the Dalton minimum . Ice core data proves these happened and recorded history tells the story of the people who lived through them.
      
      Global warming alarmists are also keen to talk down the Minoan warm period, the Roman warm period and the Medieval warm period, all times when temperatures were warmer than today’s modern warm period. During these warmer periods humanity thrived. In fact, overall, humanity would be better off if temps rose by 2 deg C. Unfortunately we are heading into the Eddy minimum which will see at least 1 deg C drop and probably more. Bad news for humanity because it makes food harder to grow. If we plan for it, we should be fine, but those in power are planning for global warming which won’t happen for several hundred years. All natural cycles which scientists are predicting, or at least those scientists not funded by the corrupt global warming establishment.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:22am
      - KevOB
        
        There will be embarrassment I believe within 10 years when the present cool weather seems to have become climate.
        As engineer I find the dishonesty, the politicking, confirmation bias, lack of mathematical rigor, lack of data, models that don’t work all outstripping reason.
        
        Climate is independent and that big burner in our sky has dropped it’s sunspots again. We can believe what we like but acting without reason has some people locked up and others bankrupted. CO2 has been proven not to be a driver of climate change: ppm have gone up but the predicted outcomes have not followed. Arrhenius is still in doubt. Other investigations show CO2 lagging global temperature. Why then do we think beggaring the world to control CO2 is sensible? Cost/Benefit –> negative. Adaptation: yes. Folly: no.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:18am
      - mark15
        
        Axial tilt DENIER!!
        You are literally Hitler….!
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:29am
      - marcw
        
        If we keep the CO2 levels above 400ppm then growing conditions will be easier with a 1 -2 ° decrease in temperature.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:09pm
- cmm
  
  I wouldn’t be too fussed about the AI either.
  
  Deep data mining, sure, but AI – I’m not so worried.
  
  I started being interested in AI in the early 1970s and did some post grad AI courses in the 1980s and have kept up my curiosity since then.
  
  We’ve been promised AI-is-just-around-the-corner since the 1950s. Still no AI. And now it is further around the corner.
  
  A lot of what is currently running under the AI banner is development in the spin-off stuff that is working: narrow machine learning, data driven deep searching/pattern recognition etc to replace the human in the loop.
  
  Some of this is pretty alarming (eg. facial recognition, behaviour analysis and all the new stuff the Chinese are doing with the Social Credit Score etc), but it is a huge stretch to call this AI.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:48am
  - SGA
    
    Curiosity question – do you think that AI is impossible, is something that will take generations of incremental advances, or is something that will have a “lightbulb” or “tipping point” moment? No axe to grind, just chatting.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:05am
    - Dave Mann
      
      I think it will be a tipping point (called the singularity) where AI learns to learn across all areas. When the electronic share trading system suddenly takes control of the power supply, the hospitals, the transportation system etc, all backed up by a total and all-encompassing knowledge of human history and psychology. It will make Lime scooters look like goat carts.
      
      One only hopes that it will have a sense of morality (or kindness) so that it allows humans to live out their remaining days in comfort and peace before it develops full conciousness and becomes a sentient being.
      
      I found it staggering when it was pointed out to me a that even now silicon chips process information at thousands of times the speed of the human (biological based) mind. So a week of human time is figuratively like a hundred years of silicon time in terms of developmental progress.
      
      When the potential for General AI is realised, I don’t think it will take it slowly and kinda ease into it. It will suddenly leap.
      
      Just my opinion. I might be wrong.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:29am
      - cmm
        
        Sure, there are some similarities in the mechanics of a stock trading system and a power supply, but that does not mean that a system designed for one purpose can generalise itself to another.
        
        If a system is designed with genetic algorithms, then this is possible, but the learning rate is way lower than people.
        
        That seems to be that real intelligence comes from the ability to abstract, which none of the current algorithms do well yet.
        
        “I found it staggering when it was pointed out to me a that even now silicon chips process information at thousands of times the speed of the human (biological based) mind.”
        
        Not really true. Chips process data, not information. Information implies understanding. None of the AIs “understand” what they are doing.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:17am
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        Excellent overview of state of the art AI from a top researcher: https://youtu.be/YHCSNsLKHfM?t=50
        He says that field was essentially no-where until 6 years ago, but with realisation of what throwing power at problems could do the rate of progress now is truly staggering 300,000x increase in ‘compute’ in last 6 years and expected to continue increasing that rate for another 5 years. (Current google TPU 3.0 pods now approximately match processing power of a human brain ~100PFlops).
        
        Critically he makes the point that until very recently they did not have enough power to even start working on the general intelligence problems of abstraction, reasoning and unstructured learning etc – but they have lots of ideas of how to go about it. And given that our brains are effectively constructed using very broad-brush DNA with huge variablity it might not be too hard – something of an emergent phenomenon from sufficiently complex systems.
        
        Don’t bet against artificial general intelligence in next 10-20 years.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:33pm
      - cmm
        
        Urban: Do not confuse raw data processing/match processing with what our brains can do.
        
        Yes, computers can do many pattern matching things way better than we can – for example scan all the faces in a crowd for facial recognition in seconds.
        
        Computers can also do constrained depth processing faster and better than we do: (eg. playing chess or go).
        
        There is still very little actual “understanding” of what they are doing.
        
        Understanding was the goal of the expert systems push in the 1980s: the AI would be able to give you a result and explain why. That got nowhere and the pattern matching/neural net approach is what’s getting all the action now because it is producing the goods.
        
        Unfortunately the pattern matching/neural net approach is limited in that it cannot be verified, so we never really know what it is going to do.
        
        That is the hard bit.
        
        We’ve been hearing it’s just a computing problem since the 1950s. Our desktop computers are now over a million times as fast as a 1950s computer, yet we’re still not there. The major reason, I believe, is that the search for AI is looking in the wrong place.
        
        Yes we’re going to get huge spin offs but it is still a long way off what most people will think of when it comes to AI.
        
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        December 14, 2018 1:21pm
    - cmm
      
      Computers are really good at “narrow AI”. This is where they are given, and can learn to do, a very specific task very well in a heavily constrained environment – way better than humans.
      
      For example, computers can learn to control planes by flying a simulator (and crashing thousands of times until they get it right). They can learn to do things like facial recognition faster than people can.
      
      But that is very different from “General AI”: operating in an unconstrained environment and figuring what to do. A classic example: go into a random house and figure out how to make a cup of coffee.
      
      Some environments (the air, sea, agricultural fields, factories etc) are very predictable, but others are not (especially interactions with other people). This is why we’ve had autopilots for sailing boats or controlling aircraft for over 100 years, but still
      do not have fully autonomous vehicles running around our cities. Basically, kids don’t run out in front of you at 20000 ft.
      
      I was involved in the design of agricultural steering systems in the early 2000s. Actual steering control is easy. I even drove at 100kph down some Canterbury roads using computer controlled steering (with my hands close to the steering wheel if I needed to take over).
      
      But the bugger is what to do when you experience the unexpected: a deviation due to road works, getting around storm damaged trees, what to do when a seagull shits on your LIDAR sensor.
      
      If this was a self driving car, it would be grounded: http://img04.deviantart.net/c00c/i/2009/303/9/b/pigeon_poop_car_by_metalshadowoverlord.jpg
      
      As for the lightbulb moment: We are a long way from understanding any brain, let alone a human brain.
      
      Creating an AI that replicates what an earthworm can do would be a start.
      
      I think we need to understand things way more before we can say it is impossible or not. We’re still deep in the land of the unk-unks (unknown unknowns).
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:43am
      - SGA
        
        As for the lightbulb moment: We are a long way from understanding any brain, let alone a human brain.
        
        True, but I wonder to what extent we need to master the mechanics of a human brain or just understand purposes and functions. As a very simplistic example, cars aren’t powered by legs, planes by wings, or boats by fins.
        I don’t see general AI anytime soon, btw, I’m more just curious about how it might come about.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:55am
      - cmm
        
        SGA: Sure we don’t need to understand how the brain actually works, but we need to be able to generate a reasonable model underpinning the vague process.
        
        To use your analogy: we don’t need to understand how legs work to design a wheeled vehicle, but we still need to understand the basics of motion: every force has an equal and opposite reaction, friction,…
        
        There is some research in this field, but it is disconnected and hard to integrate with current machine learning.
        
        Don’t get me wrong; there are huge amounts of spin-off, but they are not anywhere near the hype.
        
        While there’s a huge trough to feed from the hype will continue.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:10am
      - Dave Mann
        
        Thanks for your fantastic input cmm! Cheers
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:16am
      - Ross12
        
        SGA
        Like you I do not understand much about AI but a neighbours son is doing a Masters degree on some aspect of it and I saw a TV program on the use of drones using “AI programming” to spray crops. So I went onto the Net and found a couple of basic tutorials which helped me understand it a little more. As cmm is saying I think some a glamorising it to be more than it actually or at least that is my take on it.
        I suggest you try looking at one of the many tutorials online to get a basic understanding of it.
        Having said that there are some really fascinating things where the technology is being put to use.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:23am
      - SGA
        
        @Ross12
        
        To be clear, I don’t see AI around the next corner 🙂
        
        I’m more wondering whether any significant developments are likely to arise from incremental building on what we have now, or whether they would require a major “discovery”. For example, harnessing electrickery has revolutionised our technology, and our “silicon chips” have led to another revolution of sorts. Or, maybe the whole thing is extremely improbable.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:38am
      - Jack5
        
        Sometimes “artificial intelligence” is used as a bogey like “global warming”.
        
        It’s going to wipe out all jobs, or turn human beings into slaves they excitedly shout.
        
        As human beings we’re prey to mass fears and panics. Consider the robot hysteria of the 1930s:
        
        http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/future_tense/2011/11/robot_hysteria_in_the_1930s_slide_show_.html
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:49am
      - cmm
        
        I don’t think AI will wipe out jobs because computers are really bad at the General Intelligence bit (that even low IQ people do pretty well at).
        
        Look at “productivity tools” software: word processing, laser printers etc. You’d think that an office of 100 people would have been replaced by one person with “productivity tools”. Not so. What has changes is what we do.
        
        Shear grunt work can be replaced though. Human muscle replaced with animals, then machines, has replaced 90% of farm workers.
        
        A lot of the stuff being researched can function in a highly constrained lab environment etc, but it is way off prime time.
        
        Nor is the challenge linear.
        
        Look at the SAE driving levels: 0 to 5.
        https://www.gigabitmagazine.com/ai/understanding-sae-automated-driving-levels-0-5-explained
        
        We’re currently just getting to 4.
        
        The effort from 0 to 1 was easy: automatic gearboxes and speed controls etc. That was achieved in the 1930s.
        
        The effort from 1 to 2 is only a bit harder. We got there in the 1980s in the lab and in factories etc. We got there in agriculture in 2003 or so.
        
        Then 2 to 3, then 3 to 4 were each ten times harder again.
        
        Getting to 5 which is what most people think of: your car drops you off at work, goes parks itself then comes back to fetch you or takes the kids to school etc. That’s way, way out.
        
        But it does not stop huge federal hand outs and troughers over-hyping to get their snouts in the trough.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:15pm
      - marcw
        
        A human attribute is lateral thinking, some of us more than others. AI works within an envelope of known situations which are accounted for within the programs. Problem solving involving lateral thinking (or outside the square) seems to me to be an insurmountable obstacle to AI’s usefulness.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:18pm
      - Ed Snack
        
        They’ve long since had computers that replicate some humans – ones that just sit in the corner and hum.
        
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        December 14, 2018 2:16pm
  - Dave Mann
    
    Thanks for your response and you obviously know a lot about AI on a practical level.
    
    However, the examples you mention are still Artificial Intelligence. It’s just that they are ‘Narrow AI’ where machines have surpassed human ability in one area only and they can do that very well. We have seen huge economic benefits, but also huge dislocation and jobs disappearing as a result of this, but generally the impact has probably been positive. Probably.
    
    The big challenge is going to be ‘General AI’ where a machine learns to apply its intelligence across multiple fields and becomes better at absolutely everything than a human being. Then it builds others like itself and so on. Pretty soon the whole of humanity is pretty much irrelevant. The final level is where this General Super Intelligence develops consciousness and becomes a sentient being in its own right. Goodbye humanity. God has arrived.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:06am
    - SGA
      
      🙂 Years and years ago, I read a short SciFi story (can’t remember the author) where they built an advanced ultra-super-dooper computer. After a generation of design, building and programming they started it, ande once it was going, it was aked the question “Is there a God?”. It replied, “There is now”.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:11am
      - GoVege
        
        Hehe.
        That’s a good one, SGA! 🙂
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:26am
      - Komata
        
        SGA
        
        Not ’42’ or ‘Deep Thought’ then?
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:49am
      - Brigitte
        
        Are you thinking of The Last Question by Asimov by any chance. The ending there was when Multivac said ‘let there be light’, and there was light.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:57am
      - SGA
        
        No, Brigitte, I did a quick search and I’m thinking of the “The Answer” by Frank Brown (1964). The whole story is only about a standard book page or two, as it happens. It describes something not unlike the internet being finally connected to a powerful supercomputer. Then the question and “the answer”. My “quotes” are not exactly accurate, but not bad from memory.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:03am
      - SGA
        
        Sorry that’s Fredric Brown (1954) not Frank Brown (1964)
        Entire very short story here
        http://www.roma1.infn.it/~anzel/answer.html
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:27am
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        Destination Void by Frank Herbert, also sequel The Jesus Incident by same.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:37pm
    - tas
      
      General AI is still miles away. AI will not be capable of “taking over” in our lifetimes.
      
      That doesn’t mean AI isn’t problematic; it’s just more subtle than the Terminator movies.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:33am
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      Dave,
      “Goodbye humanity. God has arrived.”
      
      What can mankind do to prevent such a General AI monster from emerging? What would its kryptonite be?
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:39am
      - Dave Mann
        
        I honestly don’t know, Odakyu-sen 🙁
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:21am
      - SGA
        
        Holy water? 🙂 🙂 🙂
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:40am
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        Nothing. There is too much economic advantage in having the smartest AI working for you. Any company or country that gets ahead (even in secret) can profit greatly. AI research bucks are growing at incredible rate, and top researchers command $millions per year. There is huge motive to progress and huge motive to ignore safety.
        
        A good TED talk on the matter by Sam Harris:
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nt3edWLgIg
        
        They will get more and more capable, and will be hooked into more and more systems to take advantage of their capability.
        
        Humans are probably screwed within 50 years, unless we get lucky, but given AI is certainly coming you have to be extremely optimistic to expect to turn out well for us in long term, humans are hard-wired for social interaction and a degree of altruism and care for others because we are individually limited, and subject to finite life, we can only succeed and increase our power and competencies through cooperation. AI has no such limits, and can likely find ways to work around any controls or morality that we try to impose.
        
        Superintelligence may not be malevolent, but it may also not care about us or our biosphere when it is building its (eg) nuclear power plants or mines. If an ant gets in your way what do you do?
        
        And then there is the danger that one of eg millions of superintelligent AIs might be actively malevolent. A superintelligent AI could wipe humans out (plague or a few 1000 nukes) pretty easily just for shits and giggles.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:56pm
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    Machine Translation is driving down rates in my industry.
    Google Translation is becoming more powerful simply because of the huge memory of source-target pairs of translated sentences. The machine can read a source language sentence and then match it up with a similar sentence in the target language that already exists in the system’s memory or network.
    Native speakers can be used to pre-edit (puree) the source text, which is then machine-translated, then post-edited to (clean it up).
    Unfortunately, the machine has no real intelligence. It can’t understand context. For example, if translating a sentence from English where a mafia boss says “Tony, take care of him.” Does the boss want Tony to kill the man or to show him a good time?
    The machine can look over a library of previous translations of the same sentence to try to find a match, but it will not really understand the meaning of the boss’s command.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:36am
    - Jack5
      
      As a professional translator, Odakyu-sen nails what some of us struggling amateurs find.
      
      You have to know something of a language to pick up when there is a wrong shade of meaning in Google Translate. You need some knowledge to choose well from a selection of words or phrases offered, you need it to see when to see when the grammar in the Google Translate answer needs a tweak.
      
      I find the pronunciation offered by Google Translate helpful, though if I want something probably more authentic (it uses straight recordings from native-speaker volunteers) I go to Forvo.
      
      Forvo, with human recordings, and Google Translate, with machine-generated speech, aren’t a bad example of the difference between on the one hand, “artificial intelligence” a.k.a. “machine intelligence, ” and on the other hand, “human intelligence”. The machine output doesn’t bring the nuances of human speech.
      
      As for driving down professional translator rates: Google Translate and Bing’s equivalent (and probably others) should increase Odakyu-Sen’s productivity, by increasing the speed of translation, and thus all should benefit. If it is hitting returns by thus increasing supply, the answer is to find ways of driving up demand. If I were Odakyu-Sen, I would look at ways of getting more Japanese retailers onto the Net in English. Aliexpress, from China, for example, is booming. There should be heaps of work from small Japanese retailers.
      
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      December 14, 2018 12:00pm
  - KevOB
    
    At a lesser level the continuing enhanced automation has to be concerning. Human workers are being displaced and not all can be re-assigned to work. That I expect to worsen along with the anger of those paying the non-workers. That is strongly expressed on KB. Imagine if robot productivity is taxed to sustain non-workers how much more aggro will arise.
    
    A further complication is the consumption of the robotic production. If the non-workers are not paid adequately the robot owners lose their reason to produce; likewise if non-workers become non-persons.
    It would be smart to consider ensuring work is available across the whole spectrum of abilities in society.
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:33am
- kowtow
  
  Because climate change is real.
  We are living in an interglacial , so can enjoy the benefits of a warming climate. The real danger of climate change is it should get very cold again. In a few thousand years time.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:05am
  - KevOB
    
    There are serious beliefs from research that we have already entered a long term cooling period.
    It’s not important what we believe its how we adapt to the ever changing present that counts.
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:37am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  To be fair climate change data as generally presented is somewhat equivocal – and for laypeople it is reasonable to think there is a problem.
  
  It takes a long time to educate yourself to the point that you can start to separate the wood from the trees, and a lot of the contrary data is effectively suppressed/hidden – you have to go looking for it, unlike the thermageddonist line which is headlined daily. If you lack technical education you can’t do much more than simply place faith and trust in well-rewarded promoters of climate catastrophism. It takes a technical head and many days of reading to hear the other side of the story, and without that you are unlikely to ever waver from fervant belief.
  
  I was quite convinced of the danger in early 2000’s, but as a technically minded person with a high level scientific/analytical background, the more I learned about the field, its practices and politicisation, the endless hyperbole and data fudging, how crude the models are, and the climate history of the last 20000 years, the less convinced I became. The earth is currently warming, the sea is currently rising, but it’s not exceptional, it’s not going to ‘accelerate’ and it’s not a significant problem for mankind.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:41am
  - Dave Mann
    
    Thank you to everybody who has commented on this topic. I’ve really enjoyed reading the comments and there has been lots of interesting and well-reasoned perspective on AI and Climate change too. Cheers!
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:37am
  - rightoverlabour
    
    As a person with an MSC in palaeoclimatology I have to agree to the complexity of trying to really understand all the workings that underpin climate and climate changes. I have read intelligent debates between world class physicists on Co2 and the physics involved in heat transfer and can safely state that very few actually know what’s going on. The majority of climate scientists don’t really have the physics or engineering backgrounds that are necessary to really understand some of these issues. However the editors of Stuff definitly do undrstand this. They all have PHDS in physics….
    
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    December 15, 2018 12:47am
igm

How is one supposed to identify these thugs, when only height, weight, etc are published?
https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/109339243/horrendous-attack-in-masterton-home-leaves-victim-in-hospital-with-facial-injuries&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwjWxciYu53fAhXFPo8KHfvdBvEQFggFMAA&client=internal-uds-cse&cx=006730714154542492986:oh6vl0ybuqy&usg=AOvVaw2wrOiGLT_NjKwQpyB8rq0u
Suppose it is obvious!
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December 14, 2018 9:38am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  ign, anything to satiate your racist lusts!
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:42am
  - harvey wilson
    
    Stefaknee projecting again .
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:05am
  - Shaun the Sheep
    
    How in Sam Hill is naming someone and putting their picture on the telly RACIST?
    
    See your doctor
    Sigh
    Duh
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:19am
    - Humble Capitalist
      
      You forgot to add the LOL
      
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      December 14, 2018 11:29am
      - Shaun the Sheep
        
        Trumpeter
        Stormy Daniels
        Alt-right bubble
        
        LOL
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:42am
stephieboy

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
I think there are compelling reasons to hold forth on the “ smoking gun “ txt by Hardcore to the PM.

It has all the hallmarks of tinfoil hat territory of this kind, origins of which can be found here,

Tin Foil Hat President Trump looks terrified

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJ3LQHsgpGo&t=47s
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December 14, 2018 9:38am
- Rich Prick
  
  Things must be desperate if this troll has been sent to do Cindy’s bidding today. Paper clip to a gun fight.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:43am
  - Keeping Stock
    
    More like sending a one-legged man to an arse-kicking contest… 😀
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:46am
    - stephieboy
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      KS, based on personal experience?
      
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      December 14, 2018 9:51am
      - double d
        
        What are you – like 5 years old?
        You get beaten up (metaphorically) here on a regular basis yet seem to bounce back – incredible resilience – but doesn’t change the fact you are as dumb as a sack of hammers.
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:03am
    - cmm
      
      In this case sending a one-legged arse to a gunfight.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:04am
    - Steve (North Shore)
      
      I do believe you plagiarised that from me. My late father said it all his life!
      
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      December 14, 2018 4:34pm
- Awww C-mon
  
  Hahahaha
  
  LOL
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:46am
- septic skeptic
  
  If not a thank you note, why not release the text in full? Could be a few reasons, so we could read between the lines:
  
  Reference to other texts or communications.
  Other embarrassing or incriminating words.
  Embarrassing personal stuff like when is Jethro away next?
  
  What was the reason we got? Defending Hardcore’s privacy? So the speculation is better than the reality from Hardcore’s perspective then?
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:52am
  - calendar girl
    
    At the very end of a video published today by the “NZ Herald” (see link below), Prime Minister Ardern says that she did not speak with ‘this individual’ (i.e. Richie Hardcore) after or before receiving his recent txt message.
    
    Personally – in the light of what has been evolving over the last 48 hours regarding Hardcore and his contacts – I find that assertion very difficult to accept, particularly the claim that Ardern had not spoken with Hardcore previously.
    
    (And he already had her direct mobile phone number? It could be illuminating to know from whom that number was acquired.)
    
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/national-video/news/video.cfm?c_id=1503075&gal_cid=1503075&gallery_id=201782
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:03am
    - cmm
      
      ” did not speak with ‘this individual’”
      
      But maybe:
      * they used email, text messaging or other medium
      * he spoke to someone else who spoke to her.
      * …
      
      Remember PriNZess, deliberate deception is still a LIE.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:08am
      - RF
        
        Ardern had previously thrown Handley under a bus after he was promised a job by Curran so this latest one is no different.
        
        Shallow as a car park puddle.
        
        This SLAG would not know the truth if it bit her on the arse.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:26am
      - septic skeptic
        
        It’s plain to see what Cindy meant by existing in politics without telling a lie. Carefully crafted half truths, misdirections, omissions and obfuscation will suffice – no need to tell lies.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:42am
      - pdm
        
        Look at the body language in the photos that abound. There is a familiarity there that indicates they are close friends.
        
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        December 14, 2018 12:16pm
    - Komata
      
      CG
      
      But no-one speaks when they have photographs taken do they?
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:52am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Snuggly, smiley photos.
        
        Nah, I never talk to people I take such close photos with…
        
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        December 14, 2018 1:36pm
- srylands
  
  So if these exact events had played out when John Key was PM, you would have expeseed the exact same views? Or would you have joined your fellow travellers and screamed and screamed? Think about your credibility before you answer.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:52am
  - ldypen
    
    Sorry srylands, you know full well that the John Keys incident where he tried to scalp that poor hard working woman was WAY more serious than some absoludley innocent text… you must be a racist!
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:02am
- Nostradamus
  
  Stephieboy:
  
  I think
  
  Your evidence and internet links for this dubious claim?
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:56am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Nostradamus, what dubious claims?
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:09am
    - Nostradamus
      
      Stephieboy:
      
      The claim (in your original comment) that the text to Jacinda Ardern has “all the hallmarks of tinfoil hat territory” is dubious.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:19am
      - UrbanNeocolonialist
        
        why do you bother responding to him? He daily displays sub-teen reading comprehension, you may as well try to educate one of his poor goats.
        
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        December 14, 2018 10:45am
    - pentwig
      
      stoopidboy
      do you really have the intellect to think?
      
      LOL
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:43am
  - Shaun the Sheep
    
    @SB 10.09AM
    
    Whoosh
    Straight over
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:54am
chuk

Has anyone had experience of Lime Bikes using private property for their distribution?

I’ve just seen four parked in a sports club’s private car park and I know for certain they have not been given permission to park there.

An email has been sent to tell them if this happens again the scooters will be removed and they will be a charged a $250 retrieval fee per scooter.
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December 14, 2018 9:46am
- cmm
  
  Chuck them out on the street.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:50am
  - GazzaW
    
    Carge the buggers to release them.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:59am
    - chuk
      
      GazzaW: That is what I have in mind. We could do with a little extra dough.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:02am
      - sooty
        
        Run over them!
        
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        December 14, 2018 1:20pm
      - Ed Snack
        
        Don’t know what you might get out of a “carge” (sic).
        
        But the scooters are probably there because they in fact need a charge.
        
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        December 14, 2018 2:24pm
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  chuk, why not set up your own voluntary private police force with cmm as Detective Inspector?
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:53am
  - GazzaW
    
    …..and why don’t you just fuck off you toxic little troll. LOL.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:01am
  - chuk
    
    Gosh, is that a suggestion from Stooopidboy that almost has merit? I’m sure you didn’t mean to be helpful so I’ll ignore it.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:02am
  - Shaun the Sheep
    
    Why don’t you set up your own blog SB?
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:45am
- Nukuleka
  
  Lime Scooter juicers came onto my property and trashed my letterbox. Lime did nothing, the cops did nothing, are we surprised?
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:01am
  - GazzaW
    
    Lime is a pain in the arse. Why are they not being charged ACC levies given that there has been 177 claims to date related to Lime?
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:08am
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Did you inform the mayor and Christine Fletcher? We’re still meant to be in a ‘three month trial’ with the damn things.
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:40pm
    - chuk
      
      Thanks CL. Will do.
      
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      December 14, 2018 3:19pm
Manolo

A never-ending saga:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/get-ready-for-muellers-phase-two-the-middle-east-connection

Over the past year, the indictments, convictions, and guilty pleas have largely been connected, in one way or another, to Russia. But now, special counsel Robert Mueller’s office is preparing to reveal to the public a different side of his investigation. In court filings that are set to drop in early 2019, prosecutors will begin to unveil Middle Eastern countries’ attempts to influence American politics.
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December 14, 2018 9:47am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Manolo, be patient. The Watergate and Iran Contra investigations ran for a lot longer!
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:54am
- Jules99
  
  So we can expect exposure of the billions of US dollars in cash that Obama had flown into Iran then? Or another look at Clinton’s Benghazi crimes perhaps. Or the billions invested in US companies including social media like Twitter by a Saudi Prince? Yep, I’m sure he has plenty to keep him busy for a few years.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:27am
- cmm
  
  Consider the latest round of coughing fits on the aborted Clinton tour, she will probably pop her clogs before any charges are laid.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:48am
- Ed Snack
  
  I wonder if he will look at the Ukraine. They overtly attempted to assist the Clinton campaign so I suppose that isn’t interference in US politics but a well intentioned desire to assist in obtaining the right result, so no charges, right ?
  
  Also be interesting to see whether Mueller files both sets of 302 forms (the FBI record of interview form) regarding General Flynn. The Judge has demanded that the original January 2017 forms as well as the later amended 302’s prepared by McCabe and Strzok. If there is a material difference in those forms, Mueller’s team is going to be in a little strife. And given his lead prosecutor’s (Weissman) past history in doing exactly that (in the Arthur Anderson case that arose out of the Enron debacle) there must be at least some chance of this.
  
  Another interesting development, it appears that Strzok and Page’s iPhones that they were issued when they joined the SC team were deliberately purged of all data and factory reset after the IG demanded them as evidence. Sounds an awful lot like deliberate obstruction of Justice to me, but maybe the reports are incorrect and the SC doesn’t have something to hide.
  
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  December 14, 2018 2:34pm
secondcumming

So, Sindy says she received an *unsolicited text* from @RichieHardcore.

Wait a minute…..who the fuck actually *solicits* their txts anyway??
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December 14, 2018 9:47am
- septic skeptic
  
  Exactly. When was the last time a friend accused you of sending him an unsolicited text?
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:56am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Answered here,
  
  unsolicited | ʌnsəˈlɪsɪtɪd |
  adjective
  
  not asked for; given or done voluntarily: unsolicited junk mail.
  
  DUH!
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:56am
  - fernglas
    
    I do not see that someone who sends a communication to the PM in her capacity as PM on a matter of public concern can claim to have a reasonable expectation in the privacy of that communication. Likewise with those who made submissions to the Minister. This “privacy” excuse for not disclosing has no legal or moral foundation, and is looking like a way to cover up something over which the government is embarrassed or compromised.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:03am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Yep,
      if she has received the text in her capacity as PM… and since it concerned a Government matter – granting Residency by one of our Government Departments – then it must be subject to the OIA.
      
      As the State Services Minister, Chris Hipkins, has recently pointed out:
      
      “When you write a letter to a minister, you’re creating a formal document trail and it’s official information; on the other hand, if someone sends me a message via private messaging on Twitter, are they even aware that by doing so technically it becomes part of the public record?”
      https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2018/09/18/242441/oia-review-back-on-table-for-govt
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:22am
  - secondcumming
    
    WHOOSH…..
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:09am
  - Shaun the Sheep
    
    You don’t use txt messaging, do you SB?
    I suppose it’s too difficult for your friends as goats don’t have thumbs.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:59am
  - kevn
    
    @septic… Your mothers would be ashamed of the tripe you all put on this blog.
    If they only knew.
    Show them what dumb clucks you all are.
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:11am
MrsAnnie

I suspect tinfoil may have been used for more than just hats by members of the coalition of losers judging by the quality of their governance.
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December 14, 2018 9:49am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  MrsAnnie, an email to the Whitehouse will assure you one before Christmas!
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:58am
  - pentwig
    
    good grief stoopidboy
    you just keep on getting worse
    how do you do that so constantly?
    
    must have something to do with being a self confessed pervert
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:53am
Than

The Greens are constantly advocating for greater public transport use as a means of reducing NZ’s emissions. Which in practice means buses, since NZ cities are far too small for rail to be remotely viable – even Auckland is borderline at best for rail. But does bus use actually reduce emissions? The case is nowhere near as clear-cut as the Greens would have us believe.

Let’s do some back of the envelope calculations. Say a bus uses 10 times the fuel per kilometer as a passenger car. Obviously this will depend on exact age/model of the bus and car, and we’re ignoring the difference between diesel and petrol, but this is a reasonable real-world number. Also say average car occupancy is 1.5 passengers per car (again, a reasonable real-world number). It follows that a bus carrying 16 or more passengers is using less fuel per passenger-mile traveled, but if it is carrying 14 or less passengers the bus actually burns more fuel per passenger-mile. A typical bus has 40 seats and standing room for another 20-30, so it certainly has the capacity to be more efficient. The question becomes, how often will this capacity actually be used?

During rush hour a bus will at times have far more than 16 people on it. But realise that, even during rush hour, at the far-ends of the route buses will often be almost empty. The typical pattern is the bus starts almost empty, fills up as it gathers passengers along the inbound leg of the route, is almost full for the central part, then empties out on the outbound leg as more and more people get off at their destinations. A bus that is packed full with 60 people when it reaches the central exchange will have averaged less than that over its whole journey. If we assume 2/3 of the peak as a time-averaged occupancy that wouldn’t be implausible (it’s actually probably being generous).

That is for rush hour. During the middle of the day and during the evenings buses will be operating at far less than their maximum capacity (although the same pattern of having less passengers at the far ends of the route applies). As simplified numbers, let’s consider a bus service that runs 7am-10pm. Say it’s at near max capacity (60 people) when it hits downtown between 7am-9am and 4pm-6pm, but averages 15% capacity (9 people) downtown during the remaining hours of the day. If you crunch the numbers (and assume the 2/3 reduction to account for the emptier far ends of the route) that comes to a time-averaged occupancy of 15.1 passengers. On these numbers, buses use the same amount of fuel per passenger-mile as cars do. The greater efficiency during high-occupancy rush hour is cancelled out by the off-peak hours when then bus is driving around almost empty (but still using 10 times the fuel per kilometer a car does).

The case for buses can be improved if you assume greater occupancy. But the numbers above are already assuming close to max capacity during rush hour, so the only way to increase average occupancy is to increase use during off-peak hours. And I’m skeptical there are enough people needing to travel in the middle of the day to increase this much, even if you assume they all use buses. Most people spend the majority of their day in a single location (work or school) and once there they just don’t have any need to travel elsewhere until they head home.

Bottom line – public transport is at best a minor element in reducing carbon emissions. It could even potentially increase them.
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December 14, 2018 9:49am
- Yadayada
  
  That’s good.
  
  If your assumptions for fuel consumption are right.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:54am
- srylands
  
  When I lived on the Kapiti Coast I recall off peak buses having zero or 1 passenger. I mean as the norm.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:56am
- srylands
  
  Your numbers are wrong. A modern bus uses about 27 litres per 100km. So that is about the 4x the fuel use of a typical New Zealand car. Not 10x.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:01am
- septic skeptic
  
  That’s just carbon emissions. The current bus fleet is vastly worse when you look at toxic emissions. The stuff that actually shortens our lives. These old diesel engines emit hundreds of times more toxic emissions than a modern engine.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:01am
- tas
  
  Re. Rail: The density is what matters, not the size. Los Aangeles is massive, but low-density, and hence public transport there is a joke.
  
  The biggest benefit of public transport is to reduce congestion during rush hour and the need for parking. Cities like New York and London don’t have enough roads and parking lots for everyone to drive to work.
  
  But you are right that outside of peak hours, there is little use for public transport.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:55am
  - Tauhei Notts
    
    I was in Sydney on Saturday 3rd November and was surprised by the grid lock traffic jams. Our driver said that during the week everybody uses public transport but on the weekends they are taking the children somewhere or are going shopping; hence the queues.
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:18am
    - srylands
      
      Over the last couple of years traffic in Wellington between 10am and 4pm on Saturday has become worse. For the same reason. PT totally unsuitable for what people need to do. And no Marquess cycling is not suitable either.
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:24pm
  - MCos
    
    If we need to go to the Auckland CBD during the week we catch the PT because parking costs an arm and a leg.
    Also with the marvelous smartphone & gps we can easily figure out how to get a bus home from anywhere.
    
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    December 14, 2018 4:13pm
- kevn
  
  Yep… But JAG assures us via her Hosking interview, that bikes are smaller than cars. Cars are smaller than buses.
  She loves bikes. For all. Same thing for all.
  Practicality? Common sense? Weather? Nah… she doesn’t get anything.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:18am
- KevOB
  
  Similar issues with operational revenue too. Pricing to break even is difficult.
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:23pm
Manolo

The Muslim terrorist has been killed: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46561574

French police have “shot dead” the man believed to have attacked Strasbourg’s Christmas market, police sources have told reporters.

Cherif Chekatt had been on the run since the attack on Tuesday evening.
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December 14, 2018 9:49am
- Rich Prick
  
  Good.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:54am
- igm
  
  And the unmarried mother wants to bring more of these bastards into NZ . . . what a effen disgrace and embarrassment this crockery faced harridan is.
  May she and her supporters suffer the consequences of their socialist decisions. Not sensible innocent people rallying against her.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:57am
- lilman
  
  France is heading to civil war. The large percentage of Muslim and middle eastern citizens has ensured that this is just a matter of time.
  
  Progressive politics enabled and cowards will ensure.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:59am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Manolo. correction there. The Terrorist who happens to be a Muslim was shot dead etc!
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:00am
  - kiwitoffee
    
    Not ‘happens to be’ but ‘because’.
    
    The connection is not casual, it’s causal.
    
    Time to wake up.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:08am
  - igm
    
    Not all muslims are terrorists but all terrorists are muslims . . . no argument against that!
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:08am
    - stephieboy
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      igm , the first part is correct but seem to be screwed up with the second. ( unsurprisingly )
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:13am
  - Manolo
    
    Most, if not all terrorists happen to be fellow Muslims nowadays. Why would that be, dear stephieboy?
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:10am
    - Rich Prick
      
      Verse 2:191 of their vile little book might have something to do with it:
      
      And slay them wherever you come upon them
      
      It’s no coincidence infidels are dying in the streets of Europe.
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:26am
  - JibberJabber
    
    That’s what he said, Muslim Terrorist.
    If the turban fits…
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:14am
    - simpleton1
      
      The turban fits.
      The zebidah fits! (just where a moderate unicorn would sprout a horn) as guided by the “perfect man” Mohammad.
      
      koran 48:29 SAHIH INTERNATIONAL
      Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah ; and those with him are forceful against the disbelievers, merciful among themselves. You see them bowing and prostrating [in prayer], seeking bounty from Allah and [His] pleasure. Their mark is on their faces from the trace of prostration. That is their description in the Torah. And their description in the Gospel is as a plant which produces its offshoots and strengthens them so they grow firm and stand upon their stalks, delighting the sowers – so that Allah may enrage by them the disbelievers. Allah has promised those who believe and do righteous deeds among them forgiveness and a great reward.
      
      The “perfect man”, Mohammad’s words to guide all sincere, observant, pious, devout, reverent, faithful, righteous, dedicated, followers.
      
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      December 14, 2018 12:21pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The French have big problems ahead if they have another 12,000 time-bombs like Chérif Chekatt hiding under their radar.
  https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/dec/12/cherif-chekkat-who-is-the-strasbourg-shooting-suspect
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:01am
  - stephieboy
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    MW, begin the 12,000 count now and report back on progress in say several years from now.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:15am
- ldypen
  
  Good..bury the bastard in a pig pen, should be the Law, that might make some of these pricks think twice.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:07am
  - igm
    
    Along with his supporters and associates.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:28am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  cost efficient solution.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:51am
Chuck Bird

The feminazis use the tragic death of the young British tourist to push their agenda. I bet this case of female sadism will only be mentioned once as well as the inadequate sentence of 2 yr 2 mo. It should be noted that strangulation was involved but it appears she was not charged with this offence. Does this only apply to men?

Mum jailed for abuse so severe her daughter, 12, had to re-learn how to eat

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12176690
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December 14, 2018 9:49am
- starboard
  
  Hinerangi Rose Matthews.
  
  “She shows absolutely no remorse,” the judge said.
  
  Yet another violent ‘special ‘. Cue apologists.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:24am
  - igm
    
    Once again chosen and privileged race at forefront of parenting!
    
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    December 14, 2018 4:10pm
holysheet

A cannibal was walking through the forest and came upon a restaurant operated by a fellow cannibal.

Feeling somewhat hungry, he sat down and looked over the menu:

Tourist: $8.00.
Broiled Missionary: $10.00.
Fried Explorer: $12.50.
Baked Liarbour or Grilled Greennie:$100.00.

The cannibal called the cook over and asked, “Why such a high price for the Politicians?”

The cook replied, “Have you ever tried to clean one? They’re so full of shit, it takes all morning.”
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December 14, 2018 9:50am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  But you can get tired of eating human flesh…
  https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/dec/13/tired-of-eating-human-flesh-south-african-court-jails-two-men-in-cannibal-case
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:05am
  - Jack5
    
    Are there any displays at Te Papa explaining the intricacies of cannibalism?
    
    In our case this was largely before the days of knives and forks and good meat knives.
    
    Any recipes? Were there regional variations – perhaps soups?
    
    What vegetables were served? When spuds arrived (presumably with cook), did fries/chips become available as side orders?
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:34pm
    - Komata
      
      Jack
      
      You DO realise I hope that according to current revisionist history, Maori were NEVER cannibals and that the whole idea is a white colonialist construct designed to denigrate a noble race.
      
      The fact that photographoc, forensic and written narratives attest to a different story is, of course, solely due to photoshop and a deliberate distortion and misinterpretation of facts…
      
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      December 14, 2018 8:54pm
- david
  
  Reminds me of the old question:
  
  How would you bury Winston Peters?
  
  Answer:
  
  Give him an enema and bury him in a shoebox!
  Kabooom ……….. tisch
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:21pm
Yadayada

Good call, Shag.

Right time, right call. All done with grace and humility.

Someone please tell Cheika so he can know how a real coach behaves.
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December 14, 2018 9:51am
GazzaW

Reminder for Leighton Smith fans. It’s his last broadcast this morning. The end of an era in radio. If Newstalk ZB think that Kerre McIvor is an adequate replacement they need to think again. What warped logic makes them think that they can substitute Leighton’s astute commentaries on life with Kerre’s reports on the grandkids. And then there’s her geriatric talkback audience to cope with. Advertising revenues will plummet.
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December 14, 2018 9:52am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  GazzaW, “astute commentaries on life”
  
  Well um only to a limited extent shall we say!
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:01am
  - GazzaW
    
    See my comments above you pathetic little prick.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:14am
  - Rich Prick
    
    Dude, stop typing “Hidden due to low comment rating”, we get it, OK.
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:25pm
- Odakyu-sen
  
  Can Newstalk ZB not find another conservative middle-aged native-English-speaking male to replace Leighton Smith?
  
  Or was Smith the very last male conservative radio talk show host in New Zealand?
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:08am
  - Dave Mann
    
    The world would be a better place without any older white men in it.
    Absoludely.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:56am
    - KevOB
      
      What is older in reference to white men?
      
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      December 14, 2018 12:29pm
    - Komata
      
      Dave Mann
      
      So what happens when ‘Younger’ white men become older?
      
      No one has so far provided an answer to that somewhat-interesting question.
      
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      December 14, 2018 8:57pm
- septic skeptic
  
  I quite like Leighton, and we certainly need more right wing media. But I have to say I found myself changing channels a lot. Didn’t like two minutes of waffle followed by “I’ll be back with the point right after the break!”
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:12am
  - Jack5
    
    That’s the advertisements, Septic Skeptic.
    
    It’s only on taxpayer financed Radio NZ, the listeners get advertising-free palaver.
    
    Not fair, is it? Radio NZ, Leftist as always, but recently Maorified, and now getting into ever more expensive journalism with the announcement that early-bird Leftie Guyon Espiner is moving from Morning Report into “long form investigative work”.
    
    https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/378252/guyon-espiner-moves-from-morning-report-in-rnz-changes
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:24pm
    - Paulus
      
      Espiner going – thank God its been a long time.
      Now some Blonde Left Wing Binbo can be on the programme.
      Tova O’Brien would be suitable if she does not get the job in Ardern’s Office.
      Suzi is good.
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:34pm
      - MCos
        
        Susie Ferguson will be thrilled with the endorsement.
        
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        December 14, 2018 5:44pm
- Shaun the Sheep
  
  I heard LS say they’ve been blown away with the number of expressions of interest for his podcasts.
  
  You’d think the penny would drop at Newstalkzb and other media that there’s a market for LS-type news and commentary.
  
  The decision to dish up more Granny McIvor is baffling. She’s well off the mark.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:07am
  - Ross12
    
    I have been saying for sometime the current radio media companies are leaving a HUGE hole in the radio market.
    I can easily envisage a station being set with a range of formats –talkback, serious long form interviews, music etc. aimed at a “centre right” thinking audience. They could even contract some of the retired people like Leighton to do say 1 or 2 hours a week. If you had a number of them and some younger people who possibly cannot get into the business today, it would work.
    I am not surprised Leightonis getting a great response to the idea of podcasts.
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:46am
    - Jack5
      
      There’s a huge hole in the media market full stop. It’s from the centre-right to the right.
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:18pm
Sofia

SPEAKER: Order! The Prime Minister will resume her seat. I want to remind the Deputy Prime Minister that he is answering for the Prime Minister. He has reflected on the integrity of a member in a way which is not in keeping with her normal kind approach. He will stand, withdraw, and apologise.
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS: Quite right, Mr Speaker. I apologise.
SPEAKER: And withdraw.
Rt Hon WINSTON PETERS: And, obviously, withdraw.

Reveals, surely, the stupidity of thinking one member of Parliament can represent the mind or thinking of another member.

Especially when the decision comes down to a particular personal perception that the Speaker has – either that the Prime Minister is normally kind, or that the question evoked a normal response.

And they seem to have as much grammatical dysfunction with pronouns as appears the case with Dunedin 2016 mayoral candidate Scout Barbour-Evans who is trying to convince they-self is (are) the father(s) of the baby they is (are) pregnant with.
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December 14, 2018 9:54am
- pdm
  
  Sofia
  Winston Peters – obfuscator extrordinaire in full fudging mode.
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:20pm
artemisia

Yesterday on a NZ property blog a professional landlord commented Mr Twyford was getting a Christmas card to say thanks for the very positive impact on cashflow of government policies.

Why? Read between the lines.

Just a hint – Trademe’s latest rental price index analysis reports over the whole country November rental listings are down 6% compared to previous November. Might not sound like much but Trademe has nearly 9000 rental listings today so several hundred down is significant. Good for landlords, not so good for tenants.

And that 9000 doesn’t include over 4000 listings for flatmates wanted.
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December 14, 2018 9:59am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Twitford and Taxinda will see that as all the more reason to charge CGT.
  
  Will of course just put even more people off landlording – on top of the frightening new laws to make landlording high-risk and let renters have all the rights.
  
  But they can’t see what effect that will have.
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:03pm
  - artemisia
    
    Possible the government knows exactly what effect their hostility will have. Namely more and more and more social housing with rents seriously subsided by the few remaining taxpayers.
    
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    December 14, 2018 3:56pm
stephieboy

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
NZ herald’s Time out ’s top movie of the year ,

1 – BLACK PANTHER

Not only was Black Panther one of the biggest and most highly-anticipated blockbusters of the year, it also marked a massive and important cultural shift in Hollywood, as the most successful blockbuster film ever with a majority African-American cast and crew, and an African-American director. It shattered box office records and, more importantly, gave kids of colour heroes they could look up to and see themselves in. It also showed the demand for – and profitability of – diversity, which has seen other productions hustle to follow suit. Plus it was full of badass female warriors, superpowers and lols. What more could you want? – Siena Yates

The other nine runners-up are here,

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=12174150
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December 14, 2018 10:05am
- septic skeptic
  
  Seen it. It’s OK. But in ten years time I’ll still be watching Goodfellas.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:19am
- JIV
  
  So the movie of the year had nothing to do with character development, story line or originality. Its just because its got loads of black actors and some women.
  
  Pathetic. It was massively over-rated
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:37am
- skyblue
  
  Only got the press because it was full of sootys.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:43am
  - holysheet
    
    What, no Sambo’s?
    
    10 2
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    December 14, 2018 10:55am
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      Sooty’s Sambo’s, tomato tomatoe
      
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      December 14, 2018 11:48am
secondcumming

I met a Chinese guy called Kim at a work-function the other night.

We were having a drink and I said to him, “Do you ever get fed up with us Westerners saying all Chinese people look the same?”

He replied, “Kim’s at the bar getting drinks, I’m his wife”
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December 14, 2018 10:06am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  I find it harder to differentiate between balding, slightly overweight Caucasian men.
  They are fairly uniform in terms of:
  – Skin color
  – Eye color
  – Hair (eyebrow, mainly) color
  – Build
  – Height
  
  It’s the Indians (as well as Han Chinese) that appear very uniform to me.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:14am
  - secondcumming
    
    Some years back, I used to go out with a Japanese girl. For a while there, things became quite serious. When I finally told her I wanted to break up, she wasn’t having a bar of it. I had to drop the bomb on her twice before she’d actually listen.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:29am
    - Swifty
      
      Heh
      
      7 2
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      December 14, 2018 10:40am
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      secondcumming,
      
      My desktop cringe-o-meter just buried its needle into the red zone, with a reading of negative 2.0 Mega Fonzies (-2.0 MF).
      
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      December 14, 2018 10:52am
      - secondcumming
        
        I understand these things are never easy Odakyu-sen, particularly on the family. Her poor grandmother went into meltdown.
        
        7 10
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        December 14, 2018 11:17am
    - Jack5
      
      Hiroshima and Nagasaki weren’t funny: about 185,000 people died in those bombings.
      
      Some of us chubby bald guys need a thicker skin.
      
      8 1
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      December 14, 2018 10:59am
    - MH
      
      fancy offering her mushroom on burnt toast as a farewell.
      
      2 2
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      December 14, 2018 2:41pm
  - KevOB
    
    Live among an ethnic group for awhile and be surprised. We soon adjust and learn to identify everyone readily and distinguish different family groups.
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:39pm
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      KevOB,
      
      You are exactly right.
      If you live in a foreign country, learn the language, live amoung the natives and do as they do, you begin to absorb the local cultural norms, viewpoints, sensitivities and awareness.
      After several years, the “exotic” becomes the “mundane” and the culture of your birth country grows steadily weirder.
      
      “Reverse culture shock” is a very real thing that you will experience as an ex-pat on your trips back to visit the relatives.
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:08pm
      - KevOB
        
        Coming “home” again takes re-adjustment too.
        
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        December 14, 2018 1:39pm
      - MCos
        
        Awhile back when Anthony Bourdain died I saw a rerun of a trip he did upcountry in Thailand. I suggested my wife might be interested. Some locals put some animal brains in a blender, mixed it with other stuff, wrapped the resultant mess in banana leaves and cooked them. They also made something else out of raw blood etc etc. About that point my wife lost interest & wandered off wondering what the big deal was. (She thinks Vegemite on toast is disgusting)
        That’s a fairly radical example, but there’s a lot to be said for getting involved with locals rather than just hanging out with expats.
        
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        December 14, 2018 6:19pm
      - Swifty
        
        MCos, totally agree.
        
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        December 14, 2018 7:25pm
- Jack5
  
  The Kims laughed on their way home: he doesn’t even know Kims come from Korea!
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:14am
  - rangitoto
    
    Apart from the Kardashian variety.
    
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    December 14, 2018 10:22am
    - Jack5
      
      Yep, I forgot about the Bum-Kims, they stem orginally from Armenia, and some of their ancestors fled from an Armenian town in Turkey to Armenia just ahead of the Turks’ Armenian genocide.
      
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      December 14, 2018 11:12am
Jack5

News is dead! A thought-provoking article makes a point:

http://www.niemanlab.org/2018/12/the-news-is-dying-but-journalism-will-not-and-should-not/?utm_source=Daily+Lab+email+list&utm_campaign=b7f4004c41-dailylabemail3&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_d68264fd5e-b7f4004c41-395863621
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December 14, 2018 10:13am
oldpark

The law of unintended/intended consequences strikes again. Peters decision to instal Commie Chic Comrade Arderns’Liebour Party as well as the far left misandrist Lunatic Green Party to run riot over the rights of NZs could almost be classed as a criminal act by him.
A smogasbord of decisions by the Peters gang of no hopers has become almost out of control.
The Sanctioned unilateral decision to shut down the NZ Oil and Gas Exploration in Taranaki was done on a whim by our little town twerp Ardern.
The latest unilateral decision is by the mad dog Peters gang is to Jail drug pushers. The so called victims of the drug pushers will get a free pass. they will now be classed as having a health problem. Even zonked out Zombies full of whatever drug takes their fancy will escape being arrested. The Peters Gang have thrown the Police under the bus. After all what does a Policeman do when confronted by Zonked out druggies. Now not being a Criminal Offence,where do the Police park the new type of so called “non offender” full of drugs. Maybe nowhere ,after all it will be no longer a crime. Peters picks to be in charge of the Nation of NZ should be locked up. After all how many of NZs voters have given Carte Blanche to Ardern and Lunatic Green Party to change our drug laws without any debate or discussion with NZs voting Public. Thanks all to our Baubles King Peters self anointed waste of space.
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December 14, 2018 10:21am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Don’t they even intend compulsory rehab. for seriously addicted people?
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:16pm
Fletch

I see that a female rugby player has got the top Rugby player award last night. Does anyone even watch women’s rugby? This seems like another nod to female virtue signalling.
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December 14, 2018 10:24am
- Jack5
  
  ? And an attractive looking woman, too, is Kendra Cocksedge, but strong enough to flatten any lout stupid enough to make a, well, a … name crack.
  
  Old Gregor Paul is smitten in the Hooerald. Or maybe he’s been bitten by a feminista and didn’t get a shot of the anti-venom in time.
  
  But seriously, if they put up women’s teams, and got girl members participating, rugby clubs would be rejuvenated. Men-only sports are going to have a hard time. When Mum and Dad, daughters and sons, can get involved, they will prosper.
  
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12176563
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:50am
  - lifesgood
    
    Is that really her surname??? I’m not having a crack I’m just wondering how or why you would go through life called that.
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:18am
    - Jack5
      
      It might be like the Johnny Cash song about a boy called Sue – made him tough.
      
      Nice-looking Kendra Cocksedge likely has sat a few smart-arse, lippy blokes on their arse with a quick right-cross. Her surname turned turned iron into steel.
      
      https://youtu.be/ZR5XGTpophI
      
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      December 14, 2018 11:36am
    - softail 1450
      
      Lifesgood ,surely it cant be her hubbys name ,
      who could do that to themselves?
      
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      December 14, 2018 12:06pm
      - MH
        
        certainly on the edge of a dilemma
        
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        December 14, 2018 2:44pm
- lifesgood
  
  Yep, VP extreme. A female friend of mine, who is a sports fanatic, told me this morning she had never heard of her. This year it was decreed it was the women’s turn, methinks.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:19am
- rightoverlabour
  
  I heard on the radio last night that she was in contention. I said to my wife that she would win. Why she asked?
  
  She is a woman, I replied. I don’t know her, have never seen her play and have no idea who she was up against, except that they were men. There should be a Male prize and a Female prize. If she played in a men’s game, I doubt she would rate. It’s the same in tennis, (real) football, athletics, cycling, you name it. Men and womaen are not equalls when it comes to sport.
  
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  December 14, 2018 1:49pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    ‘Men and women are not equals when it comes to sport’ that relies on size and strength. But indeed when it comes to riding, gymnastics, shooting maybe?
    
    As you say, just as many men’s sports have categories for different body sizes, appreciating people who are top notch within their category makes sense.
    
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    December 14, 2018 3:22pm
Fletch

Harvard Law School Professor Emeritus Alan Dershowitz said Michael Cohen, President Donald Trump’s former attorney, is “pleading guilty to a crime that doesn’t exist” to further Democrats’ plans to impeach the president.

“I don’t think there’s an impeachable offense,” said Dershowitz. “I believe you need to have a specific crime — treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors — and none of the things that [Michael] Cohen pleaded guilty to would rise to that level or even come close to it. What Cohen pleaded guilty to may not even be a crime, the part about the election campaign laws.”

Dershowitz continued, “Even if it’s true that President Trump contributed $280,000 for the explicit purpose of paying hush money in order to prevent the public from knowing that he had these alleged affairs with these two women, that would simply not be a crime. It might be a political sin, but it would not be a crime.”

Dershowitz explained, “A candidate can give contributions [to his campaign]. So even if it’s true that the only purpose was to help his campaign — obviously it had multiple purposes; it was obviously designed to also prevent embarrassment to his family, his wife, his children, and all that — but even if you could show, even if he had a memo saying, ‘I want you, my lawyer, to pay $80,000. I’ll pay you back. It’s my campaign contribution, and I want it to be hush money in order to help me be elected president,’ no crime. No crime.”

Dershowitz concluded, “Cohen is pleading guilty to a crime that doesn’t exist. The only reason they put it in there [is because] they had him dead to rights on other crime. The only reason they put it in there is to connect Trump because Trump isn’t connected to any of the other crimes to which he pleaded guilty. Those are real crimes.”

https://www.breitbart.com/radio/2018/08/23/alan-dershowitz-cohen-pleading-guilty-crime-doesnt-exist-democrats-target-trump/
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December 14, 2018 10:27am
- Jules99
  
  As each day passes he looks cleaner and cleaner. I wonder if Clinton would pass such scrutiny. I think we know the answer to that.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:29am
  - Ross12
    
    I see the Judge involved in General Flynn’s sentencing has asked to see all the FBI 302 reports/documents ( these are ones some think were altered afterwards).
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:53am
  - Garbageman
    
    The rapey one would already be in jail but hold on hes ok cos Trump said something silly decades ago and hurty feelings trump senile old rapists when it comes to libtard logic
    
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    December 14, 2018 2:16pm
- fernglas
  
  I don’t agree with Dershowitz. The money was not paid by Trump but by someone else, so it is over the threshold. A better argument is that it was not a campaign contribution, which Trump has raised on twitter. When Dershowitz said that what Cohen pleaded to was not a crime, he was running two things together. What Cohen pleaded to was a criminal charge; Dershowitz’ beef is whether the facts alleged constitute the offence. Cohen’s lawyers obviously thought they did.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:51am
  - KevOB
    
    Justice USA? How dare anyone attempt to deceive a prosecutor on any matter. The threat of jail and financial ruin is used as a weapon for (il)legal war on others.
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:49pm
  - backster
    
    And your qualifications as opposed to Professor Dershowitz.
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:12pm
    - KevOB
      
      I am not arguing Dershowitz. I think he and I have a similar overall opinion about the poor operation of the US judicial system. I am not a legal operative like him but I can smell bad history in the making. Creating a charge and heavying someone to make a case against another is not a foundation stone of justice. The Magna Carta was against such things.
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:51pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    Not quite true, Cohen’s lawyers (and Cohen) no doubt agreed to a deal whereby he would plead guilty to crimes that could be later attached to Trump in return for a reduced sentence and lower fines. That doesn’t mean that a crime was committed at all, just that the prosecutors had the ability to fuck Cohen over sufficiently on the other charges to extort that agreement.
    
    If you look at the sentencing, the penalties that actually apply to that “offense” are minuscule; the serious time and money attach to the fraud and tax evasion charges. So the Prosecutors say “you’ll get 10 years on the fraud charges, but if you agree to fuck over Trump (which is what we want), we’ll agree to a much lower term, deal ?” And who wouldn’t take that, someone like Cohen would agree even to totally invented charges.
    
    And note, that the conviction has nothing (that is zero, zip, nada) to do with any Russian Collusion, and absolutely confirms that Cohen never went to Prague, so the Steele Dossier is absolutely falsified on yet another critical point.
    
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    December 14, 2018 4:15pm
    - KevOB
      
      I hope Corsi v. Mueller succeeds.
      
      3 0
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      December 14, 2018 4:39pm
- Morrissey
  
  Deartho’Wits is possibly the most disgusting person in the entire United States. And, no, we haven’t forgotten Thicky Nicky Haley or Ajit Pai or Jared Shithead….
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLvNOYpn7SQ
  
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  December 14, 2018 2:31pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    How absolutely normal, personal abuse and ad hom from someone without the wit to criticize the actual facts.
    
    And you’re quite wrong, the most disgusting person without doubt is Obumbler. Though no doubt Shrillary gives him a run for his money, as does Maxine the violent, the master of rent controlled apartment profiteering Mr Charles Rangel, and Nancy “senile” Pelosi.
    
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    December 14, 2018 4:20pm
    - Morrissey
      
      True enough, Ed, Obama and Hillary are also terrible human beings, and so is Nancy Pelosi. But they’re not serial liars like DearthoWits is, and they’ve never been stupid enough to set themselves up for humiliation at the hands of Chomsky and Finkelstein.
      
      Poor old Dearth0Wits. He’s right down there with Roid Lugiani.
      
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      December 14, 2018 5:02pm
Captain Mainwaring

So Angry Andy thinks it wouldn’t be a good thing if the arsehole who killed Grace Millane didn’t get a ‘fair trial’ if too many potential jurors might know his name and something of his history, even though most of us know already thanks to a wonderful invention called the internet.
Well stuff you Angry. Is there a billion to one chance that the police haven’t got the right man? In fact it’s so obvious that they have that a trial seems like a huge waste of money.
So what are you farting on about, you despicable crim-hugger?
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December 14, 2018 10:35am
- KevOB
  
  I won’t comment on the case.
  The presumption of innocence of anyone who has not pleaded to a charge is fair and sensible.
  Let time, the Police and the Courts do their work.
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:54pm
- rockape
  
  So if his lawyer hadn’t lodged an appeal and there had been NO name suppression what would have changed. He probably wont have it in a couple of weeks anyway!
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:08pm
  - KevOB
    
    The PM and Andy are both stirring up excitement. No plea has been entered so a presumably innocent person awaits their fate. It is not unknown for Police to change their position at these very early stages.
    
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    December 14, 2018 4:47pm
- itstricky
  
  It’s nothing to do with Little or what The Police have on him. It’s what the defence can use to get him off. Silly comment. Calm down.
  
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  December 14, 2018 5:12pm
- Morrissey
  
  You silly old fool, you don’t have a clue about criminal law and civil liberties.
  
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  December 15, 2018 1:24am
flipper

General Debate 14.12.2018 ????
Stupidboy?
Totally incompatible, and a waste time while that idiot is present.
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December 14, 2018 10:36am
- Classic Liberal
  
  He’s an insult to every woman and every man who cares about women: Stuffy is a Rape-Denier.
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:27pm
Lance

I see Cindy is claiming she gets THOUSANDS of texts so she is changing phone numbers.

Bull…………………………shit………………..

Creating and incredibly lame defense there methinks
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December 14, 2018 10:36am
- Rich Prick
  
  She could ask the First Boyfriend to stop sending pics of his latest catch.
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:49am
  - Komata
    
    RP
    
    A great idea, since because it wouldn’t remind her of the ‘competition’, I’m sure her stress levels would be reduced.
    
    Dogs, porches…?
    
    (I wonder if he knows the Bing Crosbie song?)
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:03am
  - ldypen
    
    Would that be a pic of an Air Stewardess?
    
    14 0
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    December 14, 2018 11:03am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    ‘and no more of those bloody fish pictures either you Plonker! FFS!’
    
    5 0
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    December 14, 2018 11:51am
  - Felt
    
    or fish photos!
    
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    December 14, 2018 3:12pm
- Philview
  
  A bit of an insult for Mr Hardcore given the cosy photos of the 2 of them that have popped up in the media. Now she makes out it was a random text from a complete stranger.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:29am
- Surely Knott
  
  Super lame defense. Show us the text! And the submissions. What relevance is it how many texts you get. We just want to see any texts with Hardcore . It is most definitely public interest. We want to know the exact time and date. And the exact wording. And we don’t want Cindies summary of the truth. We want to see the original. Not thousands. Just the one. No where in the LGOIMA reasons for withholding information does it say you can withold a piece of information because I get a lot of communication.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:44am
  - Rich Prick
    
    “Hi Cindy, great news, thanks for making it happen. Your little secret is safe. For now.”
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:13pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    I guess 4.9% of us are happy with Winston’s summary of the truth.
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:58pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    It it’s so irrelevant, all that needs to happen is that Hardbore permits her to publish it.
    
    Problem solved, Taxinda – ask him!
    
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    December 14, 2018 3:30pm
Notsofast

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
The parole board have new parameters after national changed the law.
They are now entitled to say you have not come to terms with your crime, we will not consider your case again for 4 years
This is a problem for an innocent man.
One of the great songs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQCWY5ynBaw
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December 14, 2018 10:50am
- ldypen
  
  I see the internet is turned back on at the Mason Clinic
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:05am
- waldonz
  
  Piss off Lundy you sick bastard.
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:13pm
Jack5

Here’s a song for Notsofast, and all the guys in his cellblock:

https://youtu.be/wG0fS4DoGUc
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December 14, 2018 11:25am
Paulus

Weekly latest from Wellington comments.
Some Senior Ministers – you will know who, led by the nameless fat Wellington MP, are trying quietly over the Christmas break collectively to disassociate themselves from Ardern now that their appears to be unraveling on her previous life.
This in view of the “Stroubek Affair” unraveling which she is trying to avoid further comments in her association and hide away.
After all it is public knowledge that Clarke has been charged with two drug related offences, but not found guilty.
Changing her phones etc is underway so only those in the know can call her, even from Prison where burner phones are regularly found.
Must have something to hide that she will
emphatically said she will not release the text or any texts related to the “Stroubek Affair”.
The media will be upset in having to apply for special phone exemption – sorry Tova, but she will give you the number soon.
The Unions recognise that they did not appoint her but are reviewing what to do next before the Party AGM, which needs correcting the loophole left there.
Grant will not make it but Andy is laying low with the Pike River fiasco giving him respite from Ardern personal problems, plus the many other SNAFUs.
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December 14, 2018 11:31am
- fernglas
  
  Two points, Paulus.
  1) When and where was Gayford tried?
  2) What are we supposed to conclude from the fact that he was found not guilty?
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:54am
  - lifesgood
    
    My understanding is that he was arrested but not charged. It would be interesting to know why he wasn’t charged. So having not been charged he was not tried.
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:25pm
    - civil serpent
      
      See my user name: it should give a hint about my day-job. As to Gayford:
      1 Never arrested.
      2 Never charged.
      3 Never investigated.
      4 Never warned.
      5 Name came up in a big text sweep concerning a particular investigation but conclusion was “nothing to see here”.
      
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      December 14, 2018 12:35pm
      - MrTips
        
        Slightly different version of that here.
        
        11 0
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        December 14, 2018 12:48pm
      - KevOB
        
        I can recall “a big sweep” by the Police–the charging outcome was ultimately determined by the need For Police leave.
        
        More details please. When and anything else including background. If privacy is needed please let me know.
        
        7 0
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        December 14, 2018 1:07pm
      - sooty
        
        Did the girlfriend interfear?
        
        5 0
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        December 14, 2018 1:34pm
      - Rich Prick
        
        She would have been a lowly opposition MP then, so I doubt she would have had the clout. But the she was the child The Beast never had, so who knows?
        
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        December 14, 2018 3:29pm
- GazzaW
  
  You can’t help thinking that a couple of the Politbureau BBQs will be firing up during the recess and that the usual culprits will be testing the waters.
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:06pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Paulus, Labour give up on their one and only hope of winning the next election? What have they got apart from their tooth fairy?
  
  They will trust that Labour devotees won’t care or will even like it if she helps crims. It’s not as if that isn’t a basic CoL policy anyway!
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:37pm
thetiedarch

This is what’s wrong with the world. All she did was dye her hair. But no, let’s mock her. I bet if this had been Michelle Obama, she would be hailed as a ‘visionary’.

And the media don’t help by re-posting all this. And let’s be real, this isn’t an ‘article’ or ‘journalism’. What it is is propagation of bullying.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/beauty/109347595/melania-trumps-new-hair-colour-mocked-on-twitter-i-think-she-mixed-up-her-dye-with-donalds
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December 14, 2018 11:46am
- Swifty
  
  Agreed.
  
  I don’t follow US politics much at all – but I can absolutely attest to Stuff’s daily Trump post, or posts, being 99% of the time negative, mocking, derisive and much much different to that served up to us during Obama.
  
  It’s not journalism as I knew it.
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:03pm
  - softail 1450
    
    swifty ,Trump is the wrong colour for Liberals and most western MSM outlets.
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:26pm
    - stephieboy
      
      Softail 1450, you referring to Republican Red?
      
      1 19
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      December 14, 2018 1:37pm
  - stephieboy
    
    Swifty, “It’s not journalism as I knew it.”??
    
    Did you have in mind Alex Jones?
    
    1 25
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    December 14, 2018 1:35pm
    - Swifty
      
      Fuck off creep.
      
      …and I’ve never watched Alex Jones in my life.
      
      12 1
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      December 14, 2018 1:48pm
      - stephieboy
        
        Swiftly, now who would have thought?
        
        1 14
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        December 14, 2018 3:55pm
- Lance
  
  I have always thought that attacking someones appearance, skin colour, speech impediment etc is the basest of comments.
  Some go as far as to make themselves cunts with their vile comments.
  People should be judged only by what they say and do.
  I used to find it mindless and pathetic that people used to attacked Michelle Obama for what she was wearing etc.
  This attack is equally as offensive.
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:05pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  FFS, she looks stunning, whatever hair colour she has. Great figure, luscious long hair, beautifully structured face, elegant style.
  
  They just can’t stand that!
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:40pm
softail 1450

Kerre Woodham FFS ,I dont listen to much talkback but did I just hear that Woodham is taking over Leighton Smiths programme ? no, no ,no ,please no,fffuuuccckkk.
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December 14, 2018 11:55am
- secondcumming
  
  YEP, stand by for all the oldies calling up to discuss their Incontinence problems……and anyone else who can barely string two words together, to be allowed all the air-time they like!
  
  ALAN JONES BREAKFAST 2GB…don’t miss it!
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:03pm
  - GazzaW
    
    Spot on SC. NewstalkZB management is so complacent as to think that their only competition are NZ radio stations. They seem to think that Leighton’s listeners don’t know anything about this newfangled interweb thingy. I discovered Sydney and Melbourne radio when that dreadful Danny Watson blighted the radio waves.
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:16pm
    - secondcumming
      
      Couldn’t agree with you more Gazza! The good thing about the Ozzie stations is the timing…..just as MH is finishing his show, they are getting into their breakfast.
      
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      December 14, 2018 12:39pm
- Morrissey
  
  Did someone say….Kerre fucking ohoWmad?
  
  https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2018/01/kerre-woodham-reacts-to-elderly-caller.html
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:41pm
  - secondcumming
    
    Gotta’ love *Cyril* though, eh?
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:00pm
    - Morrissey
      
      Poor old guy. He never had a chance once he indicated support for Veitch’s victim rather than for Veitch.
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:04pm
- DigNap15
  
  Most of us heard that 6 months ago!
  
  I kind of like Kerre, but only for half an hour at a time.
  She is too lightweight for the morning slot.
  Just as Marcus is also too light for the evening slot.
  They should both be on the night time slot.
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:23pm
dime

“California considers a texting tax”

LMAO fucking leftists.

“Of freaks here in this hopeless fucking hole we call L.A
The only way to fix it is to flush it all away
Any fucking time, any fucking day
Learn to swim, see you down in Arizona Bay”
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December 14, 2018 12:05pm
softail 1450

Newstalk will have zero competition now that the other talkback station is no more, they could put up a potatoe fritter as the host and still win the talkback ratings.
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December 14, 2018 12:34pm
- secondcumming
  
  If only they could attract *Paul Henry* back on air…….
  
  Given what we’re left with now, even Banksy would be a ratings winner!
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:44pm
  - Morrissey
    
    If only they could attract *Paul Henry* back on air…….
    
    Paul Henry? That disgusting racist piece of filth? THAT Paul Henry?
    
    https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2018/04/we-need-to-kill-them-all-and-if-some.html
    
    Given what we’re left with now, even Banksy would be a ratings winner!
    
    Well, he’s certainly stupid enough for the position.
    
    https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2018/01/dum-quote-of-week.html
    
    https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2018/04/john-banks-crook-or-not-may-27-2015.html
    
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    December 14, 2018 12:51pm
    - Awww C-mon
      
      Fuck you.
      
      5 0
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      December 14, 2018 1:19pm
- Morrissey
  
  …they could put up a potatoe [sic] fritter as the host
  
  They did. Its name was Leighton Smith.
  
  https://morrisseybreen.blogspot.com/2017/12/not-everybody-appreciates-charm-and.html
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:45pm
  - softail 1450
    
    morronissey breen you fucking moron ,fuck off somewhere else you twisted old c—-t.
    
    16 1
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    December 14, 2018 12:53pm
    - Morrissey
      
      Did I get something wrong about Ms. ohoWmad, Mr Smith, Mr Henry or Mr Banks? They’re actually nice, intelligent people, are they?
      
      THEN WHO THE FUCK HAS BEEN PRETENDING TO BE THEM FOR THE LAST SEVERAL DECADES?
      
      Please enlighten us.
      
      1 16
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      December 14, 2018 1:00pm
      - secondcumming
        
        My mother-in-law likes to follow me on here and has just txtd ……
        “ask that morrisey if he remembers fr felix donnelly?”
        
        6 0
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        December 14, 2018 1:11pm
      - softail 1450
        
        Morronissey has gone full retard today,FFS get the
        nurse to clean you up and double your meds dosage and whack you back in your bed you vile old mutt.
        
        12 0
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        December 14, 2018 1:17pm
      - Morrissey
        
        Say hello to your mother-in-law, Mr Cumming.
        
        And tell her, “any time is fine by moi.”
        
        0 0
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        December 14, 2018 2:26pm
  - Awww C-mon
    
    Fuck you and horse you rode in on you grubby little bitch
    
    5 0
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    December 14, 2018 1:20pm
    - Morrissey
      
      That was no horse, buddy, that was your wife.
      
      1 1
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      December 14, 2018 2:18pm
  - Swifty
    
    Reported for repeatedly linkwhoring.
    
    5 0
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    December 14, 2018 1:30pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      By me as well. That Morris Dancer is a right piece of work, is he not?
      
      3 0
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      December 14, 2018 2:12pm
    - Morrissey
      
      Did somebody say “whoring”?
      
      http://media.beam.usnews.com/1d/47/d7f5a173446899808909a5efb751/170202-donaldtrump-editorial.jpg
      
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      December 14, 2018 2:21pm
Woz

I just escaped ny youngest daughter’s school prizegiving and end-of-year assembly. My God, it dragged on. But what disturbs me most is that, even at this very white suburban Christchurch primary school, the horification is almost complete.
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December 14, 2018 12:45pm
- Morrissey
  
  Piss off back to Queensland, you ignorant piece of crap.
  
  “Wise men speak because they have something to say, fools because they have to say something.” — Plato
  
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  December 14, 2018 12:51pm
  - lifesgood
    
    Always nasty, morrisey, but nastier than usual today.
    FYI we had to sit through 25 minutes of kapa haka at my grandsons 90% white primary. AWe had better things to do with our time.
    
    11 2
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    December 14, 2018 12:53pm
    - Morrissey
      
      What’s the problem with your grandson? Does he struggle with languages? Can he not appreciate the aesthetics of dance?
      
      I’ll bet you have not got the gall to denigrate the hard work of those Kapa Haka kids to their face.
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:01pm
      - Jack5
        
        ? Morrissey, when you monitor and transcribe the 20 or so tribal radio stations on the same basis you monitor the English-language stations you can lecture Kiwiblog posters on biculturism.
        
        Maori culture promotion to predominantly white audiences if overdone, if overly limelight hogging, can be counterproductive.
        
        But how many Maori stations do you monitor, Morrissey? For Radio NZ, do you transcribe the Maori language as well as the English between it?
        
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        December 14, 2018 1:09pm
      - Woz
        
        Again Mozzie, you miss the big picture. Nobody’s denigrating the kids and their hard work. Not in the slightest. It’s the Maori-washing of their little minds that deserves the denigration.
        
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        December 14, 2018 1:45pm
  - MrTips
    
    Wow Morrissey. Did you get wacked by the Big Green Teabagger this morning? Go take a golden shower to calm down.
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:05pm
    - Morrissey
      
      MrTips, you are awful—but I LIKE you!
      
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      December 14, 2018 1:07pm
  - Awww C-mon
    
    Fuck your mossey.
    
    3 0
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    December 14, 2018 1:21pm
  - Grant
    
    Certainly true in your case
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:32pm
  - Woz
    
    Your Plato quote would have been far less ironic, Mozzie, did it not immediately follow your opening quip.
    
    Chill and have a beer, mate, it’s Friday. What’s hori for beer, by the way? How have they transliterated that inconvenient “b”?
    
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    December 14, 2018 1:43pm
    - KevOB
      
      pia.
      
      0 0
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      December 14, 2018 1:55pm
      - Morrissey
        
        Mmmmm, Pia….
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJMZuSEmuJo
        
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        December 14, 2018 2:11pm
  - rangitoto
    
    Plato had Moronissy in mind with that one.
    
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    December 14, 2018 2:59pm
- Woz
  
  Wow! My first pink post!
  
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  December 14, 2018 7:27pm
- Piniwi
  
  @Woz was there any Diligence Awards given out? Are the ones to acknowledge participation that is on the same level as attendance. Proving that if you DO go to school you WILL get an award.
  
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  December 14, 2018 11:38pm
Jack5

-1, -2
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December 14, 2018 1:07pm
- Morrissey
  
  No, Jack, my only transcriptions of Maori broadcasting reprobates are from their English contributions to various stations.
  
  There’s the Rt. Horrible John “J.T.” Tamahere, and the Rt. Horrible Willie Jackson, here imparting their wisdom one afternoon on RadioVILE…
  
  WILLIE JACKSON: If I found out that my missus was fooling around on me I’d put a knife through her heart.
  
  ….Shocked silence for several seconds…..
  
  DEAN LONERGAN: I think that’s going a bit far, mate.
  
  WILLIE JACKSON: Nah, nah, nah—don’t give me THAT. I would. I would put a knife through her heart. I WOULD.
  
  JOHN TAMIHERE: You’re a mongrel, Willie, a mongrel.
  
  https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-03022017/#comment-1295193
  
  https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-08062013/#comment-645516
  
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  December 14, 2018 1:47pm
softail 1450

The piece of dog shit Morronissey is a devout masochist ,he thrives on being called a fuckwit ,a moron,imbecile,cretin ,etc etc .
I see him as a lonely old fuck that has no friends or family that still admit to knowing him, so he comes on here between shitting in his pants and gets off sexually somehow by posting the stinking ancient dribble he always posts…..
mr Tips,see what i mean hes getting off on what you said to him…
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December 14, 2018 1:08pm
- Awww C-mon
  
  He’s worse than Stephie and Gobby.
  
  Sanctimonious little cunt.
  
  19 2
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  December 14, 2018 1:23pm
- stephieboy
  
  softail 1450 & Aww C Mon, family dinner table talk?
  
  2 24
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  December 14, 2018 1:33pm
  - Awww C-mon
    
    you Can fuck off too ya dirty perv.
    
    If it was my daughter at St Luke’s that day you’d still be eating through a straw.
    
    16 1
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    December 14, 2018 1:44pm
    - Morrissey
      
      Awww Monc, are you into incest like that ACT leader?
      
      0 25
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      December 14, 2018 1:49pm
      - Awww C-mon
        
        The gimp is lonely in the basement mossey, you haven’t been down there for a few days now, how about you go and bend over the saw horse and leave us adults in peace
        
        12 1
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        December 14, 2018 3:24pm
- Morrissey
  
  More, please, fotalis, more! Keep it coming!
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjASypYs_BQ
  
  1 19
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  December 14, 2018 1:52pm
- Woz
  
  What’s up with Morrissey today? He’s all over this GD, snarking up everybody. Does his dose need upping, or has he just run out of coffee?
  
  12 1
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  December 14, 2018 2:29pm
  - Morrissey
    
    Thanks, Woz—you’ve nailed it. I need a coffee. Catch you later, buddy.
    
    Exit Breen, between two orderlies
    
    4 18
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    December 14, 2018 2:36pm
    - Woz
      
      Good on you, Moz. Come back when you’re feeling a bit more like your usual self.
      
      8 0
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      December 14, 2018 2:40pm
KeaRea

https://www.wsj.com/articles/boy-scouts-of-america-considers-bankruptcy-filing-amid-sex-abuse-lawsuits-11544649657

Boy scouts go homosexual.

Boy Scouts subject to deluge of sex abuse claims of men abusing boys.

Boy Scouts filing for bankruptcy.

And it only took months.

Who would have thought leaving boys with men who like boys could lead to abuse.

Don’t let SJWs converge things.
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December 14, 2018 1:09pm
- stephieboy
  
  Unfortunately, the Boy Scouts has been and continues to be a haven for peds. I’m sure they will come up with a Sponsorship deal or such like.
  
  SJWs or not!
  
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  December 14, 2018 1:31pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Much like the Church
    Look at the way they shelter you
    
    14 0
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    December 14, 2018 1:47pm
  - Manolo
    
    Akin to those “young honeypots”, dear stephieboy?
    
    14 1
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    December 14, 2018 1:54pm
Chuck Bird

I just heard Soper on The Country refer to Judith Collins as evil.

I am not sure how to get it on playback like all the other shows. Does anyone know how to download the audio? He was on about 12:45.

Thanks in advance

Chuck
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December 14, 2018 1:26pm
- Morrissey
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  First honest thing he’s said for a while.
  
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  December 14, 2018 1:52pm
- DigNap15
  
  Sorry I did not hear that bit.
  Soper is becoming more and more nasty and anti National.
  It is a disgrace to call himself a “political analysyt”
  
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  December 14, 2018 9:26pm
rightoverlabour

Clarke ( with an Emirates E) was being interviewed and was asked:
” Do you talk to Cindy after passionate sex”?
“Well it depends,” he replied bashfully.
“Depends on what?” the interviewer coaxed.
“Oh, on whether there is a phone nearby…”
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December 14, 2018 1:53pm
- Morrissey
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!
  
  Now, let’s just admit it: you are envious of Clarke Gayford, who sleeps with a woman you can only fantasize about.
  
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  December 14, 2018 2:08pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Sometimes I wonder if Morris 1100 just invents the most vile, demented crap he can think of and posts it on here for a joke or whether he really is like that.
    
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    December 14, 2018 2:18pm
    - Morrissey
      
      ????
      
      Is it me who writes the vicious, misogynistic attacks against Jacinda Ardern every day, Cap’n? Thanks for the heads-up.
      
      2 26
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      December 14, 2018 2:24pm
  - softail 1450
    
    morronnissey ,how do you manage to operate your keyboard with both craggy little hands on your cock?
    
    10 3
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    December 14, 2018 2:34pm
    - Swifty
      
      Little rat claws.
      
      9 3
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      December 14, 2018 2:37pm
    - Morrissey
      
      That’s where your wife comes in, lisatof.
      
      2 20
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      December 14, 2018 2:37pm
      - softail 1450
        
        morronissey, my Mrs is actually a psychiatric specialist breen , but shes never mentioned seeing a smelly pond of shit with two eyes and a nose on the floor of the institution she works at so i dont think shes met you.
        
        12 2
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        December 14, 2018 3:03pm
    - Steve (North Shore)
      
      He has one? unbelievable
      
      5 1
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      December 14, 2018 4:35pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Fantasy woman….
    
    Fucking nightmare so god knows you get to play with but if ardern the liar is your fantasy woman you’re worse that I thought.
    
    12 2
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    December 14, 2018 2:46pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    Oh yes, you got me there…
    Fuck you are amazingly intelligent. How you, on one post, can psychoanalyse me so accurately, I do really hope you are a practising psychologist, as you have incredible talent….
    
    Fucking Moron…
    
    10 3
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    December 14, 2018 3:14pm
    - Swifty
      
      He and Stiffy are somehow experts on what others think, do, watch and read.
      
      Wankers both.
      
      7 0
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      December 14, 2018 5:59pm
- noskire
  
  I wonder if the People’s Princess has told Masport she is thinking about changing her phone number because she is deluged with thousands of texts.
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:00pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    Masport also make BBQs which you can cook stuff on …….
    
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    December 14, 2018 4:37pm
septic skeptic

So, to recap:
1. ILG makes a hasty decision to grant Sroubek residency, apparently giving only cursory consideration to the material in the file. The decision seems at odds with common sense.
2. Cindy and Winnie assure us that they have seen the information ILG used to make his decision, and unpalatable as it is, the correct decision has been made. Read between the lines, it’s too dangerous for him to be deported.
3. It transpires that Sroubek has voluntarily been back to the Czech Republic already, which calls into question the claim of danger. It seems odd that none of ILG, Cindy, or Winston sought to really question whether deportation to an EU country represented a credible threat in the first place. Especially given the parole boards assessment of Sroubek’s honesty.
4. ILG reverses his first decision, citing new information. But it’s not 100% clear if this is legal, and it’s not clear whether the supposedly new information is in fact new.
5. The COL blame the department, not ILG. Notwithstanding that it is now known that the decision was made in haste and most likely com0letely surprised department staff. Reluctantly and belatedly some COL supporters including the media will concede that ILG was a bit lazy and was duped.
6. But for many, the lazy incompetent minister theory doesn’t wash. Lazy people go with the flow, whereas ILG made a deliberate decision to swim upstream. Why? Some suspect lobbying and/or undue influence.
7. The fingers start to point at Cindy, for various reasons. Some speculation, some tenuous rumoured links. Cindy assures us that all is well. Carefully implies she has nothing to do with any lobbyists and she knew little or nothing about the case before hearing in the media.
8. For weeks, getting disclosure from the COL is like pulling teeth. Confidentiality, not in the public interest, might prejudice an investigation or due process, don’t know, just take our word for it, nothing to see here.
9. At the 11th hour Cindy releases limited info of a txt from a friend congratulating her on the decision. The COL contest that Hardcore has some reasonable expectation that this txt to the PM is confidential, so it can’t be released in full. Specific oral questions on timing are answered with general answers like “after the decision”. Notwithstanding the cloud now hanging over the PM, we are supposed to believe that she chooses not to release the txt detail and exonerate herself, as it might violate Hardcore’s privacy expectation.

Instead we should take Winnie’s word for it. There is nothing to see here and any claim of anything underhand, corrupt or inappropriate “is balderdash!!”

I say keep digging, keep questioning. Like a dog with a bone. After all, someone has to do the media’s job, eh Barry?
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December 14, 2018 2:15pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Good post septic.
  Then there is the evidence that back in the day, Cindy was VERY good friends with Richie Hardcore. (She’s only been with Jethro for about 3 years).
  
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  December 14, 2018 2:22pm
  - septic skeptic
    
    Thanks. I also think you can read a bit more into “unsolicited and unanswered”. If the txt were entirely innocent, the polite thing might be to txt back “thx”. But if it were not innocent, you might jump on your burner phone and explain the situation to the texter.
    
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    December 14, 2018 2:36pm
    - Steve (North Shore)
      
      I would say Jethro would have a few SIM cards and at least 4 phones
      
      10 0
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      December 14, 2018 4:41pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    Yes, and being with Jethro for 3 years doesn’t mean JUST with Jethro..
    
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    December 14, 2018 3:07pm
    - Steve (North Shore)
      
      There’s ‘fishing’ and ‘FISHING’
      
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      December 14, 2018 4:42pm
- MrTips
  
  Agreed. IMHO the media are not pursuing this because they KNOW that 1) their Princess, whom they have spent so much time building up, will come crashing down and 2) their OWN COLLEAGUES are knee deep in the wider legal implications
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:06pm
- noskire
  
  There’s a bit of a timing issue here too. Ardern said she was not aware of the Soubrek case until it reached “the public domain”. Hardcore’s text to her was sent way before that.
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:11pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Do we know that? Surely that would be the final nail in the coffin?
    
    9 0
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    December 14, 2018 3:56pm
  - stephieboy
    
    Was she actually aware of Hardcore’s text or looked at it and just ignored it?
    
    1 23
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    December 14, 2018 4:00pm
  - DigNap15
    
    That’s why Simon Bridges asked for the date of Hardcore’s text in Parliament.
    
    But Ardern was nto there, and Winston did not know.
    
    I am sure they will ask again.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:29pm
- cmm
  
  That was an easy case with clear documentation, involving a person from a first world country.
  
  ILG cocked it up.
  
  So how’s he going to go with trying to bring in 1500 Manus Islanders who have rubbish documentation?
  
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  December 14, 2018 3:55pm
  - Classic Liberal
    
    Feeeeelzz….
    
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    December 14, 2018 3:57pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    They could arrive waving ISIS flags, but if Harcore likes them he’ll put a good word with Cindy, and we all know what happens after that.
    
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    December 14, 2018 4:07pm
Swifty

Bwahahaha!

Which poster here does this remind you most of:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl4lvhJUCTw

I’ve placed my bet.
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December 14, 2018 2:35pm
Morrissey

McInnes boasts of catching chlamydia and “every fucking STD under the sun.” So I nominate McInnes as that perverted old fucker Cap’n Mainwaring.
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December 14, 2018 2:42pm
- softail 1450
  
  morronissey you spermbus ,get your teeth out and get back under the table where you belong …
  
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  December 14, 2018 2:48pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  I hereby award myself the 2018 prize for the poster most effective at getting under the idiot Morris Oxford’s skin.
  
  15 2
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  December 14, 2018 4:01pm
  - starboard
    
    Its f-friday folks and morrissey is off to lube up.
    The dirty bastard.
    
    6 1
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    December 14, 2018 6:58pm
softail 1450

Is Barely Sober protecting Jacinda ,he keeps repeating “nothing to see here”, what does HDA see in the little weasel ? I guess hes angling for a trip on airforce one with the 1st couple to Europe or somewhere similar….
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December 14, 2018 2:45pm
- lifesgood
  
  HDA is not ugly but Soper is a greasy haired, paunchy, many times married, old man with a squeaky voice. What on earth was she thinking?
  
  17 1
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  December 14, 2018 5:04pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    He is an irritating , opinionated delusional git. I can’t stand him. Why Larry williams puts up with his knowall pontifications I have no idea. What hdpa sees in him (other than possibly $$$$$ or he is hung like a horse) I have no idea. Imagine listening to that voice every day….
    
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    December 15, 2018 1:13am
- stephieboy
  
  Softtail1450 & lifesgood, let’s have both of your mugshots for sample comparisons,
  
  https://nypost.com/video/when-mugshots-fit-the-crime/
  
  LOL
  
  1 19
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  December 14, 2018 5:12pm
  - lifesgood
    
    I’ve seen yours, it’s not pretty. Almost felt sorry for you, but didn’t.
    
    4 0
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    December 14, 2018 9:02pm
Sofia

… in respect of name suppression there is a specific offence for breaching name suppression orders, which are prosecuted by the NZ Police, not the Solicitor-General.

So, do the Police act of their own volition, or do they require a complaint to be made?

Is Andrew Little not really convinced of his own claims as it seems he has not yet been reported as making any official complaint to the Police?

What will be the position of the Minister of Justice, if a court case is aborted due to abuse of suppression orders, and the Minister has spoken on the issue, but not in fact acted with a formal complaint?
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December 14, 2018 2:47pm
rightoverlabour

Angry Andy is a twat in this case. He basically said Looks its suppressed, but if you go looking for it…

Streisand effect in some respects…
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December 14, 2018 3:04pm
secondcumming

One of the reps at work just got back from lunch. He was listening to 1ZB in the car and heard *Andrew Dickens* describe himself as being, “six foot two and 63kg”

I said to him…. “Fuck, he must be a real skinny cunt. The Maori girl who works part-time as a barmaid at the gun club is about a foot shorter than that and probably twice the weight” 😎
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December 14, 2018 3:09pm
Jack5

Campaign against Huawei in 5G followed a secret meeting of the Five Eyes partners in July, security expert Paul Buchanan is quoted in the Hooerald as saying:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12176792
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December 14, 2018 3:47pm
Hugh Pavletich

RBNZ proposes significant increase in bank capital requirements that will eat up 70% of the sector’s profits over 5 years but only have a ‘minor impact’ on borrowers | interest.co.nz

https://www.interest.co.nz/banking/97389/rbnz-proposes-significant-increase-bank-capital-requirements-will-eat-70-sectors

The Reserve Bank is proposing that banks will have to hold between 20% and 60% more “high quality” capital, noting this represents about 70% of the banking sector’s expected profits over a five-year transition period. Nonetheless the regulator expects only a “minor impact” on customers’ borrowing interest rates. … read more via hyperlink above …
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December 14, 2018 4:04pm
- Hugh Pavletich
  
  Auckland house prices slump 1.5 per cent in 12 months | Stuff.co.nz
  … note video …
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/109362340/auckland-house-prices-slump-15-per-cent-in-12-months
  
  Provincial New Zealand is where the action is for house price growth at present – and it’s claimed a looming law change might only add fuel to that fire.
  
  New data from the Real Estate Institute shows that there were record median prices in November in six parts of New Zealand.
  
  Northland prices were up 21 per cent on last year to a median $515,000, Waikato was up 8 per cent to $529,000, Hawke’s Bay was up 12 per cent to $470,000, Wellington was up 11.5 per cent to $613,000, Tasman was up 19 per cent to $645,000 and Southland was up 4 per cent to $275,000.
  
  Auckland’s median price slipped 1.5 per cent year-on-year to $867,000. Canterbury’s was down 3.3 per cent.
  .
  .
  … Access REINZ detailed reports …
  
  https://reinz.co.nz/residential-property-data-gallery
  .
  .
  REINZ welcomes Tindall’s comments on housing affordability | Scoop News
  
  http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/BU1811/S00935/reinz-welcomes-tindalls-comments-on-housing-affordability.htm
  
  Falling Australian house prices a warning for NZ: commentator | Stuff.co.nz
  
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/108168646/falling-australian-house-prices-a-warning-for-nz-commentator
  
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  December 14, 2018 4:40pm
Jack5

Why Russia has strategic bombers in Venezuela:

https://currentnewsvista.news.blog/2018/12/13/heres-why-russian-bombers-are-in-venezuela-and-why-the-u-s-is-so-angry-about-it/
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December 14, 2018 4:36pm
- stephieboy
  
  Jack 5,
  
  What me Worry!
  
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  December 14, 2018 5:02pm
- realityczech
  
  Can you tell us why the US has bombers all over the world Jacksie?
  
  “the United States still maintains nearly 800 military bases in more than 70 countries and territories abroad—from giant “Little Americas” to small radar facilities.”
  
  https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2015/06/us-military-bases-around-the-world-119321
  
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  December 14, 2018 5:31pm
  - Jack5
    
    The Americans have every safe possible site in the world sussed – every site where fucking keas are unlikely to splatter over the cockpit screen or snarl up the engines.
    
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    December 14, 2018 5:36pm
    - realityczech
      
      So no answer. Is there any amount of death that is too much for you people?
      
      1 3
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      December 14, 2018 6:19pm
secondcumming

Did anyone else catch *Leighton Smith’s* final show today?

He spent most of the time telling people how great ‘Mrs. Producer’ was…. and how much he loved her 🙁

I had no idea he was such a wimp! Honestly, he needs to hand in his fucking man-card!!
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December 14, 2018 5:09pm
- greybeard
  
  I live in Wgtn so hardly ever heard him unless he was deputising for someone else.
  My pet name for him was “Lightweight Smith” as he dithered, ho-hummed, prevaricated, deferred, procrastinated and mumbled through his programs.
  I just can’t understand his apparent appeal.
  Can’t wait to see how the replacements for the appalling Andrew Dickens perform next year.
  
  1 4
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  December 14, 2018 6:48pm
  - secondcumming
    
    God yes, I’m with you there gb!
    
    Don’t get me started on that limp-leftard *Andrew Dickens*……
    he’s like Kerry Woodham in drag!
    
    Why the fuck would he think people want to continually hear about his dead mother, or snotty nosed kids?!!
    
    2 2
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    December 14, 2018 7:27pm
  - GoVege
    
    I liked him because he had a nice voice, a brain, and could usually see both sides of an issue.
    Gonna miss Leighton.
    
    2 0
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    December 14, 2018 9:13pm
GoVege

29 people have been arrested in just 11 days for the new crime of strangulation.
And that’s just for the victims who made it to a phone.
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December 14, 2018 6:15pm
- realityczech
  
  Had they been reading Fifty Shades of Grey again?
  
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  December 14, 2018 6:22pm
- nasska
  
  It would pay to be certain that all these cases were assault GoVege. From the Urban Dictionary:
  
  …..”A means of intensifying orgasm by depriving the body of oxygen. Is preformed my both sexes, and can be done alone while masturbatiing, or during sex. People usually bite on a citric fruit, eg lemon, lime, to bring them back to earth after they orgasm. It often accidently kills the people preveorming it.”……
  
  Apparently it was the cause of David Carradine’s death & probably plenty of others.
  
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  December 14, 2018 6:42pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Michael Hutchence
    
    4 1
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    December 14, 2018 7:03pm
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      at least they died doing what they loved
      
      4 1
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      December 14, 2018 8:08pm
  - GoVege
    
    I’m pretty sure this type of strangulation is of ANOTHER person, nasska, usually the partner of the person being strangled, and AGAINST their wishes….
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:06pm
- waikatogirl
  
  It is statistically 7 times more likely to die at the hands of someone who chokes. They may not go too far the first, 2nd or 3rd time but eventually…
  One of those 29 arrested for choking has been arrested twice in those 11 days.
  If convicted the charge of choking is now up to 7 years jail.
  
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  December 14, 2018 6:51pm
  - GoVege
    
    Don’t think we’re going to drum up much support for DV victims on KB, waikatogirl.
    They’re mostly dudes, and I’ve never heard of a male being strangled…not manually anyway.
    
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    December 14, 2018 9:10pm
    - realityczech
      
      Give it a break Vege. Anyone with a bit of life experience knows women are far more violent. And the fact they are weaker than men does not make it okay.
      
      They are also more likely to use psychological abuse which is way more harmful than a smack around the head.
      
      Women are not a victim of men, they are victim of toxic feminist thinking.
      
      4 1
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      December 14, 2018 9:15pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      I’m not disagreeing that women are very vulnerable, GoVege… but sadly a young ChCh man got strangled by his girlfriend a couple of years ago.
      
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/94616158/man-strangled-to-death-with-computer-cord-by-girlfriend-with-trust-issues
      
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      December 14, 2018 9:21pm
      - realityczech
        
        She will say SHE was the victim, because abuse blah blah blah
        
        4 1
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        December 14, 2018 9:33pm
      - Jack5
        
        Anyone remember the Gay Oakes case in Christchurch?
        
        She poisoned her partner, and buried him in the garden. Oakes was released early from prison when the Parole Board accepted battered women’s syndrome could be used as a defence.
        
        Oakes wrote a book and one reader wrote on a review site (second link below) that the Oakes book ” gives me reason to believe that murder is justifiable in some situations.”
        
        Mmm.
        
        http://tvnz.co.nz/content/136288/4202557.xhtml
        
        A reader’s comment:
        http://www.librarything.com/work/2858707
        
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        December 14, 2018 11:04pm
      - cha
        
        One day, this POS will kill again
        
        A Whanganui man who served 12 years in prison for the infamous British murder of his girlfriend has been sentenced again, this time for assaulting his girlfriend.
        
        John Mark Tanner was sentenced to two years and nine months’ imprisonment by Judge Philip Crayton in Whanganui District Court for injuring with intent to injure.
        
        In 1991, Tanner strangled Rachel McLean to death in the United Kingdom and then proceeded to hide her body under the floorboards of her flat. He callously appeared on British TV pleading for information about what happened to her before being arrested.
        
        […]
        
        In May 2017 while in a Whanganui motel, Tanner became upset with his partner and an argument broke out between them.
        
        Tanner grabbed her while she was brushing her teeth and threw her back-first onto a bed.
        
        “You then jumped on top of her, you put both hands across her neck, restricting her breathing,” the Judge said.
        
        “As a consequence she suffered soreness to her throat area.”
        
        […]
        
        “It was said in a blunt and aggressive manner. You then demanded that she remove her SIM card from her phone and as she attempted to get away from you you grabbed her by the shirt, pulling her forward and punching her several times in the head.
        
        “The victim fell onto the floor and attempted to shield her face from the blows. You punched the victim around the head and face several more times.”
        
        Tanner’s partner told him that he was hurting her, but he did not care and while she was crying on the floor, he said “look what you made me do”.
        
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12122989
        
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        December 15, 2018 12:45am
- Morrissey
  
  Did someone say “strangulation”?
  
  http://media.beam.usnews.com/1d/47/d7f5a173446899808909a5efb751/170202-donaldtrump-editorial.jpg
  
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  December 15, 2018 1:20am
realityczech

1:46 / 5:09
End Freedom of Speech Says Democrat Congressman Ted Lieu

They are demanding Google do even more to censor conservative views, among other things.

Why do people persist in calling these people ‘liberals’?
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December 14, 2018 6:18pm
- stephieboy
  
  rc, Mark Dice and his Resistance Manifesto,
  
  “Dice first gained attention in 2005 when he published his first book, The Resistance Manifesto — basically, a 415 page piece of toilet paper “literature” for his followers, known as the Resistance. Here, he outlines the following beliefs:
  
  God is real because the Bible says so, and all atheists and non-Christians are really Satanists, “trapped in the system.”
  The wacky Revelation ending to the Bible is happening now.
  9/11 was perpetrated by the U.S. government.
  The formation of a one world government is currently in progress.
  The historical Illuminati still exist, and are presently responsible for this one world government, the moral erosion of humanity, the destruction of Christianity and all other things conservative.
  The Illuminati are using bread and circuses to keep the population distracted from their sinister plans.
  To no surprise, Dice denies evolution and global warming, and uses the Bible as scientific refutation to both.
  
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  December 14, 2018 6:55pm
  - nasska
    
    Anyone who believes in Satan is as divorced from reality as one who believes in Skydaddy.
    
    The whole lot of the fruitcakes need to be rounded up & kept sedated for their own safety!
    
    12 2
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    December 14, 2018 7:00pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      And children’s safety. Especially those visiting Malls.
      Isn’t funny how many in the Church are all in on the Climate Change scam.
      Oh well. Feeble minds and all that.
      
      8 0
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      December 14, 2018 7:08pm
      - realityczech
        
        Lefties and the religious prey on kids. A combination of the two is a hideous thing to consider.
        
        8 1
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        December 14, 2018 7:15pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Oh, and don’t mind women getting the bash.
        I see itstricky giving support for the thug Scribe the other day.
        And of course ‘Slam’ Green likes to threaten.
        I guess it goes with their tolerance of Sharia Law.
        Subjugation and all that…
        
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        December 14, 2018 7:22pm
  - realityczech
    
    stuuuupidboy, Didn’t pick you as such a fan of Mark Dice. Though you should have included a link to the fan site you cut and pasted that from.
    
    Keep watching his witty presentations and you might get a clue about a few things.
    
    7 0
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    December 14, 2018 7:03pm
  - Awww C-mon
    
    So was it Satan or God who caused you to be tempted by young ladies breasts?
    
    8 0
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    December 14, 2018 7:20pm
MrTips

So was listening to Larry Williams who was reaming Barely Sober a new one over the CoL recent proposal to “go easy” and “use discretion” on all drugs – not just dope – everything right up to P, heroin, cocaine etc. Williams blasted Sober over the Portuguese model like nature of it and how it is no better than the rest of Europe. And then it struck me:

Isn’t it odd that this proposal, which is a radical departure from previous policy, should appear now at the time when our PM, her boyfriend, a close friend and a govt minister are all embroiled in a controversy over…….a drug importer with links to gangs.

Truly odd and funny coincidence isn’t it?
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December 14, 2018 7:07pm
- realityczech
  
  Dam what a coincidence ☝ 🙂
  
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  December 14, 2018 7:11pm
- All_on_Red
  
  Journalists are the true wannabes.
  All they do is report on the so called stars.
  Hardly surprising they’d like to do drugs and fantasise that they too are ‘cool’
  
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  December 14, 2018 7:17pm
- nasska
  
  I’d go along with that. To explain it as coincidence is really pushing the package.
  
  Yet the way Portugal tackled their drug problem is well worth studying even if it does give the average religio/conservative an attack of the collywoddles.
  
  They haven’t abolished anti drug laws. All they have done is make committee (as opposed to court) ordered treatment the first option for offences involving personal possession.
  
  Trafficking & importation are still offences. I’d love to see the issue come up for serious debate on this forum.
  
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  December 14, 2018 7:19pm
  - MrTips
    
    Yeah thats the argument Soper ran. But Williams demolished it by pointing out that the Portuguese model has produced results that are no better and in some respects, worse, than the rest of Europe. And the Portuguese model has been running for some time now.
    
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    December 14, 2018 7:31pm
    - realityczech
      
      Then its a no brainer. What you are in effect saying is the tougher drug laws in the rest of Europe don’t work. You claim they are about the same as the liberal Portuguese model.
      
      So the default position is to do away with the ineffective law.
      
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      December 14, 2018 7:43pm
      - MrTips
        
        Fair point but I would say save money by not changing the law. Same result.
        
        4 0
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        December 14, 2018 8:26pm
      - realityczech
        
        It costs bugger all to remove a law and it will save hundreds of millions doing so.
        
        Drug laws are a very expensive failure. I say this as someone opposed to drugs.
        
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        December 14, 2018 8:43pm
    - nasska
      
      …..”the Portuguese model has produced results that are no better and in some respects, worse, than the rest of Europe”…..
      
      As in all things statistics can be massaged to produce the outcome wanted. If the issue is approached by someone dedicated to “keeping dirty, stinking, hippy scum off the streets” then they’ll find reasons to back the stance that used to be taken in the USA. ie jail them for life.
      
      I’d suggest that following that prescription hasn’t produced much in the way of desired effects. Even China’s approach which favours a bullet through the back of the head hasn’t stopped or slowed down their drug problem. Ditto for the local conservatives’ Utopia of Singapore.
      
      Addiction is hard to treat/cure but imprisoning the afflicted has been an unmitigated cockup. There’s got to be a better way.
      
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      December 14, 2018 7:45pm
      - MrTips
        
        On that I would agree. Reducing the addiction and desire to stuff your head over can only be a good thing. I would favour treatment as part of the penalty for the addict.
        
        Desert island for the (usually) clean asshole career dealer.
        
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        December 14, 2018 8:30pm
      - DigNap15
        
        Rubbish.
        How big is China’s drug problem
        Or Singapores
        Or Thailand’s
        Or Irans
        Compared to ours…..
        
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        December 14, 2018 9:35pm
      - realityczech
        
        Great. Go live in China or Iran.
        
        1 0
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        December 14, 2018 9:59pm
      - rightoverlabour
        
        Dealers should be executed. Preferably publicly. I wouldn’t bother with the users. They are victims and do need help. But the dealers are scum and deserve nothing less than death. As well as the smugglers. I don’t have a problem with a hippy growing his own dope for his own use. However if he starts pushing it….
        
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        December 15, 2018 1:26am
  - Swifty
    
    ” I’d love to see the issue come up for serious debate on this forum.”
    
    Agreed, nasska.
    
    I’m torn.
    
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    December 14, 2018 7:43pm
starboard

Thieving Liarbour
Courtesy of Taxpayers Union.

“Yesterday our Economist Joe Ascroft was in the Treasury lock-up for the Government’s Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update. The update confirmed what we already knew – the Government is taking more in tax revenue than it needs, with the annual surplus expected to grow to $8.4 billion by 2023.

Cumulatively, on current policy settings, the Government is forecast to collect $26.9b in surplus – or taxes over and above what is needed for Government spending. That’s $15,000 per household.

By 2023 the average household will be sending $54,000 in tax to Wellington per year. That really is ‘working for the government’.

Unless the Government has massive spending plans up its sleeve, there is no clear reason why surpluses shouldn’t be returned to taxpayers.

By the next election, it will have been a decade since New Zealanders received an income tax cut. Instead of campaigning on a capital gains tax and squeezing taxpayers even more, the Government should commit to tax cuts.

The Finance Minister also announced a complex new ‘wellbeing’ framework for judging economic progress – this includes measuring values like human, social, and natural capital.

We’re keeping a very close eye on this. While it sounds noble, measuring things like social wellbeing (loneliness is included for example) and valuing it is inherently subjective. Our concern is that these measures are simply used to justify ever more government spending (and an even higher tax burden to pay for it).”
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December 14, 2018 8:07pm
- realityczech
  
  They are saving it for an election bribe. It will be targeted towards children [women] and women. Other selected groups with the much prized status of, victim, will also get some.
  
  No productive member of society will get a thing.
  
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  December 14, 2018 8:13pm
Swifty

And NZers still fall for this shit?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/109376205/spiritual-medium-craig-wright-fails-to-overturn-conviction-for-indecently-assaulting-teenager
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December 14, 2018 8:56pm
DigNap15

Who is going to pay for this “health based” counseling of drug users?
And what if they don’t work
And what if the user carries on using?

We have never had a war on drugs here in NZ.
The police catch them, and the courts let them off too lightly.
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December 14, 2018 9:37pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Good luck for drug-addiction treatment here in NZ.
  
  We have never had enough professionals to cope with the booze addicts we’ve got, let alone narcotic addicts.
  And what if they don’t work
  And what if the user carries on using?
  
  I think there will be very few addicts who become clean/sober for ever after treatment. Relapse seems to be the usual outcome after treatment.
  https://americanaddictioncenters.org/rehab-guide/success-rates-and-statistics
  
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  December 14, 2018 10:14pm
  - Jack5
    
    An exception, Maggy, seems to have been the tens of thousands of American soldiers who used heroin in Vietnam.
    
    Eighty-eight per cent were clean within three years of their return to America.
    
    https://jamesclear.com/heroin-habits
    
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    December 14, 2018 11:07pm
DigNap15

Regarding the naming of the backpacker murder accused in the UK papers.
The law is there to give the accused a fair trial. (they say)
Could someone please tell us, Do they have similar laws there or in Australia or the USA.
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December 14, 2018 9:47pm

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