General Debate 21 October 2017

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tas

Detailed election results are out!

Interesting split voting figures: The electorate votes of people who gave their party vote to NZ First were distributed as follows.
40.94% NZ First
23.89% Labour
22.17% National
3.42% Greens
2.40% Maori
0.55% TOP
0.51% ACT

This tells us that NZ First voters seem to lean left, but a significant fraction (at least 20-30%) will be disappointed with Winston’s choice.
If they lose just 31% of their support, then they drop below the 5% threshold. Here’s hoping.
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October 21, 2017 8:00am
- tas
  
  87 poor souls in Epsom got confused: They gave their party vote to ACT and their electorate vote to National.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:07am
  - mikenmild
    
    Snigger. The ACT people were always on about how smart they were…
    
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    October 21, 2017 8:27am
  - trout
    
    Paul Goldsmith has 87 rellies.
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:03am
- stigie
  
  Yes but Labour/Greens/NZ First are going to change the threshold to 3% before the next election..?
  It will be like his Eminence dealing to the alter boy !~
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:36am
  - tas
    
    I wouldn’t be surprised if they decide to tinker with MMP like that. I hope they have the decency to call a referendum on it. Imagine the circus as a coalition is cobbled together with various single-issue 3% parties.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:41am
    - SPLOOGE
      
      And if they didn’t like the result they could just ignore it…. After all National has set the standard when it come to ignoring referendums that don’t go their way.
      
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      October 21, 2017 9:59am
      - Padriv Ustoev
        
        Which referendum was that?
        
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        October 21, 2017 10:12am
      - Viking2
        
        That’s so. Unfortunately I find my self agreeing with you. Padrov, try smacking.
        
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        October 21, 2017 10:20am
      - Padriv Ustoev
        
        True, I forgot about that one. That was a slap in the face for sure
        
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        October 21, 2017 10:26am
  - Ceejay
    
    Imagine the fun the Opposition from Hell are going to have with them if they try pulling a scam like that.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:46am
starboard

firs…
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October 21, 2017 8:01am
- starboard
  
  J.Arden..not my Prime Minister.
  
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  October 21, 2017 12:14pm
  - Left Right and Centre
    
    suggestion box . . .
    
    jarden common garden
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:47pm
MT_Tinman

I note the pictures of masses fleeing the cities.

The slime claim it is for the long weekend.

I shall watch on Monday with interest – will they all come back?
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October 21, 2017 8:03am
- Happychappy
  
  You would have to wonder whether those with large mortgages and house prices dropping are needing a break to weigh up their options after Winstons bombshell about capitalism and his need to change our economy that will take us backwards. Look for more problems in mental health and our suicide rate once the housing bubble bursts.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:14am
  - Nukuleka
    
    But Happychappy. The tooth fairy is going to wave her magic wand and rid Aotearoa of all mental health problems and bring the rate of suicide down to 0%. She has promised. Don’t you have faith?
    
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    October 21, 2017 8:19am
    - kowtow
      
      Legalising cannabis will do wonders for the country’s mental health , I suppose they’ll drop the tobacco free target seeing as how we now have a cannabis use target.
      
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      October 21, 2017 8:25am
    - holysheet
      
      “Lets do this” is what she said
      
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      October 21, 2017 8:50am
      - Left Right and Centre
        
        lets screw this (country)
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:49pm
    - Steve (North Shore)
      
      If only she would rid NZ if the mental disease known as Socialism
      
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      October 21, 2017 8:50am
    - KKKKatee
      
      Jazinda will be like a cat chasing it’s tail if she still believes she can bring the suicide rate down to 0%. In fact, I believe she’s being very irresponsible in making that claim in the first place. People have been committing suicide since time immemorial and they will continue to do so for very complex reasons. The ‘promise’ she’s made on that subject is absolute bullshit and she should be called to account for it. She’s also ‘promising’ everyone a home. Just more bullshit and false hope from Jazinda….
      
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      October 21, 2017 8:59am
      - KevOB
        
        Wait till the student free-fee year kicks in. My wife is already questioning why she now has to pay back in full her student loan. Others will too.
        
        This pack of amateurs have forgotten equity and the need for the appearance of fairness in taking and redistributing public moneys.
        
        The student bribe will bite them: students with free education previously partied their time away and used course loans for share market speculation. Student loans were needed to bring responsibility to wayward youth.
        
        Act were grumpy with National being generous in their view of reasonable welfare–oh well, they can flee, take their taxes with them and leave us to our new state lovein.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:23am
      - Longknives
        
        I paid back 70- odd thousand on a Student Loan ( Took me bloody years of sacrifice and hard work to pay off)
        Do I get some kind of ‘Reimbursement’ from our magical new Government?? Surely in the interests of fairness and equality…
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:41am
      - Shaun the Sheep
        
        There’ll be a way to move all the suicide stats over to voluntary euthanasia to show how successful that piece of humanitarianism is.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:32am
      - lifesgood
        
        It is a disgusting thing to promise. It’s as if people who take their lives are somehow making a rational decision to do something she sees as offensive. I have no time for her and her childish claims. God defend New Zealand.
        
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        October 21, 2017 12:18pm
      - RF
        
        Give the poor girl time. First she will be going hand in hand down the Pike River mine with one of the 7 dwarfs… grumpy.
        
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        October 21, 2017 12:58pm
      - Left Right and Centre
        
        The ‘promise’ she’s made on that subject is absolute bullshit and she should be called to account for it.
        
        What a great photo op though – talking and blubbering on cue with all of these at risk young people.
        I’m sure you can put a dollar value on how much it would cost to eliminate every last suicide. Puke.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:54pm
    - adamsmith1922
      
      No
      
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      October 21, 2017 9:00am
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        We’very thought about it further, formed and ran it through a committee and the answer is still no.
        
        Stupid you for taking personal responsibility for your life!
        
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        October 21, 2017 10:00am
  - PhilBest
    
    And on the subject of bursting the housing bubble, I am with the intelligent, principled and courageous Michael Reddell:
    
    https://croakingcassandra.com/2016/07/28/a-couple-of-cartoons/
    
    “There are no totally easy or fail-safe ways to unwind the disaster that the New Zealand – especially Auckland – housing market has become. But this is a clear example where the sooner it happens the better. If house prices rose sharply one day and were reversed the next, almost no one suffers. If prices rise sharply for six months and then fully reverse, a few people will have difficulty – but the losses will be isolated and limited, posing no sort of systemic threat. But if real house prices stay at current levels for the next 20 years, most of the housing stock will have been purchased (and borrowed against to finance) at today’s incredibly high prices. There will have been a massive real wealth transfer to this generation of sellers (sellers, not owners). And that transfer itself simply can’t be unwound no matter what happens to house prices. If house prices were to fall now, there has still been quite a redistribution, but four years of turnover is quite different from 20 years of turnover…”
    
    Arthur Grimes, NZ’s most distinguished economist, has been saying similar for a long time too.
    
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    October 21, 2017 8:21am
    - EAD_TWO
      
      I’ve enjoyed your sense of perspective and realism on economic matters these past few days Phil.
      
      As you point out, bubbles have winners and losers but it is much better and healthier if the cost of housing is low relative to wages.
      
      Rising house prices does not mean a country has become wealthier, rather it is a sign we’ve become less productive as a country as our low wages don’t buy much shelter as they once did.
      
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      October 21, 2017 8:25am
      - PhilBest
        
        Exactly: wealth is “stuff” net of debt.
        
        Atlanta may have average incomes a lot lower than Hong Kong, but if you look at the size of houses and sections in Atlanta, (and their age and quality), and the vehicles and other possessions they own, and their very low average mortgage debt and rent burdens, who is really “wealthy”? By the way, Atlanta is a “majority-minority” city.
        
        NZ is sadly well down the fool’s illusory Ponzi “wealth” path over the last 15 years.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:30am
    - PhilBest
      
      This is a matter of non-partisan principle. I despise Winston and despise most of what Labour stands for (they got my support during the Lange-Douglas era but never since). But one of the most despicable things in NZ’s entire political history, has been 9 years of National Government dereliction of duty over an obvious, insane, housing bubble.
      
      I can’t repeat too often: the highest median multiple in any Irish city at the 2006 peak, was 6.6 in Dublin. But the Irish of the South Pacific evidently think 10 in Auckland is OK, we’re different, this is a new normal. Presumably 12 next year, 14 the year after, and the moon whenever, would also be just a new normal – and any crash “instead” will be Winnie’s / Jacinda’s fault. Do you blind partisans not have any limits to your blindness?
      
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      October 21, 2017 8:27am
      - redeye
        
        I’m curious what you think they should have done?
        
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        October 21, 2017 8:36am
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        Phil, why are you saying 12 next year, 14 the next when it’s obvious that prices have already levelled out and are starting to soften?
        
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        October 21, 2017 8:53am
      - tom hunter
        
        … when it’s obvious that prices have already levelled out and are starting to soften?
        
        I think the real point that Grimes is making is that – and apologies for the repeat but it seems people are not getting this….
        
        But if real house prices stay at current levels for the next 20 years, most of the housing stock will have been purchased (and borrowed against to finance) at today’s incredibly high prices. There will have been a massive real wealth transfer to this generation of sellers (sellers, not owners). And that transfer itself simply can’t be unwound no matter what happens to house prices.
        
        If people are buying and selling in the middle of the bubble – and because prices have “softened” they don’t see it’s a bubble, thinking bubbles are only such when expanding – then the impact spreads simply because of the effect of time, as does the terrible effect when it finally crashes.
        
        And they can crash for a long time, as any interview with homeowners who bought in the late 1980’s in Tokyo can attest. Real wealth loss, and long-term because you can’t sell the asset even as you watch it decline slowly.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:35am
      - PhilBest
        
        Redeye:
        John Key should have done, in his first term, what he said in 2007 he was going to do, which is what Don Brash had said before him needed to be done. Abolish urban growth boundaries and reform the way urban expansion is planned and financed.
        
        Captain:
        My point is: what level will blind partisans accept as “too high”? I said 6 was too high, in 2004. THREE was the historical norm. The National supporter consensus was inclined to agree with me, as Helen Clark was PM then, and the urban planners were part of the whole lefty enemy complex. Where did everyone’s principles go meanwhile?
        
        People who are still blind partisan apologists at “10”, I very much doubt that they have any limits or principles at all. I doubt they would turn alarmist at 12 or 14, or even worry that speculators are virtually counting on that happening as they buy into the bubble at 10! That is my point.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:37am
      - Digmen1
        
        Yes as a two ticks blue man, like many of us I was very annoyed with National for letting houses prices spiral out of control.
        
        What could they have done?
        Anything, something
        But they did nothing
        
        They could have put more restrictions on bank lending.
        They could have listed houses sold to foreign buyers – exactly.
        They could have told councils to free up land – the next day.
        They could have relaxed costs on builders.
        They could have dropped tarrifs on building products.
        They could have made one building code for NI and one for the SI.
        They could have made councils pay their building staff by the number of houses they consented and passed
        They could have replaced Nick Smith
        etc etc etc
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:31am
    - Happychappy
      
      Phil I appreciate your reply and have no argument with experts but the problem is worldwide and the USA couldn’t fix it.
      
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      October 21, 2017 8:42am
      - PhilBest
        
        The USA has an object lesson several dozen cities that have had stable house prices throughout the worst Federal Reserve money-printing, massive population growth, sub-prime mortgages, and everything. The cause is undeniable: those cities have not capitulated, culturally, to the Malthusian “anti sprawl” we-know-what’s good for you central planning ideology.
        
        The US economy will suffer somewhat from coastal states with housing bubbles and crashes every cycle, but economic activity is constantly transferring to the sane States, and the overall mass of the sane States stops the whole nation from economic collapse of the kind Spain has had, and NZ has coming.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:26am
      - Ross12
        
        Phil
        I agree to some extent with what you say about more land needed to be available. In NZ, Palmerston North is a good example –they had relatively stable prices (compared to the rest of NZ) for a long period of time because they allowed the city to “sprawl” but even they have seen significant price increases in the last 10 years.
        So I think it is more than just one factor and as I said yesterday —cheap , freely available money must be the main one. Added to that are the tax issues and above all the “cult” factor.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:34am
      - PhilBest
        
        Ross, the problem is that even in Manawatu, no-one is buying rural land at rural land prices, and then building houses on it. There are powers of “extraction” granted to the vendors of land at the specific locations where it is known that the Council will play ball.
        
        The groupthink in Councils of all sizes, is our problem. It is noticeable that even within 50 minutes driving distance of Manhattan, there are small towns with houses 1/2 the price of Huntly and Levin. This is because it is a norm in most of the USA, that no-one will stop a development going in on what “was” farmland, and no vendor expects to sell their farm for any more than the going rate for farmland, of which there is a superabundance.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:42am
    - Nostalgia-NZ
      
      We’ve already seen what happens in Auckland if prices fall, the market shrinks because lack of sellers who decide they don’t want to lose money on their homes. Nothing different will ever happen.
      
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      October 21, 2017 9:32am
      - Happychappy
        
        I couldn’t care less about speculators but I do care for the innocent young people that have poured the savings into buying a house to raise a family and with a large mortgage. My belief is that if the coalition to change our economy to suit Winstons whims what else are they capable of doing to suit their needs and the Greens wanted to burst the bubble under their benefit fraudster so it could be easy to force it to happen especially when you hold the cards to keep the coalition together.
        
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        October 21, 2017 5:02pm
    - flipper
      
      ” … Arthur Grimes, NZ’s most distinguished economist……”
      
      Bollocks!
      
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      October 21, 2017 9:40am
      - PhilBest
        
        Who do you nominate? Some pinko like Easton?
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:45am
    - KevOB
      
      I don’t know how the unwinding will come about here but it is going to be a real dance. Our banks (foreign) are seriously exposed to global pressures The 2008 GFC was taken advantage of and the following credit creation has benefited the richest.
      Now the debt-takers have had their fill to overflowing the debts are being called in. Are zero interest rates seriously viable in any economic model? Don’t savers need reward? Can price be separated from value in any market? There is more… An unwinding can’t be stopped.
      
      Taxinda hopes to step into this mess and wave a wand. The external forces are likely to overwhelm her ignorance and overwhelm the country too. What happens if our export prices crash?
      
      Government is too important to let the amateurs have a go.
      
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      October 21, 2017 9:53am
      - Piniwi
        
        Yes KevOB there is a correction coming in the real estate market and the banks will be glad if finance demands ease for a short time. The RBNZ have already highlighted that many lending institutions are struggling to access funds for our low interest market. Those lenders are only there for the money.
        
        Thus it will be way beyond this toxic Government to control the rate of prices dropping as it is being controlled by a greater power. In fact their inflationary policies will be one of the biggest accelerants to the correction. Rampant inflation is coming very soon and even bloated wage increases will not help absorb it. Most observers understand the result that cause and effect can have on the economy even before others start to feel the unintended consequences. Never fear though as Taxinda has a vision and has told us capitalism is blatant failure.
        
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        October 22, 2017 12:44am
    - Viking2
      
      So which bit is wrong?
      The prices that one freely pays for a house, the price which banks in cohort with the RBNZ pay for money that they pass on to the borrower. The level of borrowing encouraged by the banks, the market issue of supply and demand or what people earn in a market place where minimum rates are legislated where their incomes are subject to state intervention and theft, where employment conditions are legislated, where the governments have demanded by legislation in concert with councils the standards houses are built too and where they can be built and forcing councils to be responsible for building standards established by BRANZ and over which they then guarantee the work via the ratepayer?
      
      Is it to do with the statist attitude of people who just have to live in a particular school zone or possibly because the Education dept decided a longtime ago that bigger schools are more beautiful thus causing people to want to live close to schools rather than an hours road trip away?
      
      And then of course there are covenants that describe what your house will be like in any given subdivision.
      
      It is not a simple conversation where one or two parties can be heaped with the blame.
      
      People have extremely short memories. Yesterday I was talking to a builder who came to Tauranga in 2007. He reckoned that it was all go for ever now. I pointed out to him that in 2007 we had a major subdivision go under because they couldn’t sell the sections even at $100k. That didn’t change till 2010 when things began to move. (at the time I recall there were something like 15 subdivisions sitting around with no buyers.)( This is the forth or fifth boom I have seen here so we will see how long it lasts and how many go broke once more.)
      
      Where Micheal et all are wrong is assuming that one generation gets all the wealth.
      I can tell you from meeting many people that there are very many young rich. Rich via inherited wealth. That’s not to say they don’t work hard but they do have the luxury of beach apartments and all manner of things that others don’t. Many will never ever know what scraping by each week is because their families have built incomes and assets that become generational. Someone who bought a house in central Auckland in 1950-60 has a great gain to pass on. More so if they have a bunch of commercial property or shares or many other things. Just because your family didn’t/couldn’t is no reason to denigrate those that have.
      
      House owning has never been easy if you wanted to live in the “right” places. The best way to fix that is to have more schools where people live and limit the growth of CBD’s. Tauranga is embarking on the foolish behavoir of building up its CBD. Already traffic access is a joke and its only just started. No need for CDB’s anymore.
      
      As I said the answer isn’t simple and until there is a clear picture of what causes the problems then nothing will change other than houses will continue to be expensive.
      
      In the end it all comes down to legislation, supply and demand in its many forms.
      
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      October 21, 2017 10:56am
      - Digmen1
        
        Yes Tauranga’s cbd is a joke.
        
        As you say, who needs a cbd these days?
        
        Build the banks and insurance offices out in different suburbs. One here, one there. We could then easily drive there in the opposite direction to the traffic.
        
        The only thing you need in the cbd is the council building. (not even that really) and a library and a museum and arts centre.
        
        The rest can be shops and restaurants. And green spaces.
        
        That would solve all of Tauranga’s traffic problems.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:41am
      - KevOB
        
        Not all, but a lot.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:49am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        “Someone who bought a house in central Auckland in 1950-60 has a great gain to pass on.” It’s still just a house. Not a great gain, if you mean something that should suffer CGT when inherited or sold. A house is just a house, currently at a highly inflated cost.
        
        I do think that huge immigration numbers are really just an inflationary Ponzi scheme, and upset though I am by our new hydra, a bit of a limit on immigration isn’t one of their worst ideas.
        
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        October 21, 2017 12:51pm
      - Paulus
        
        In Tauranga the Tradies are the richest young families as they have moved with the new and rebuild property booms.
        Look at their stay at home wives super cars whilst they go off in a battered truck.
        A number we know have more than one property.
        They saw and made the best of the opportunity on offer – they may well suffer for it though and soon as the property market slumps as it appears to be doing now. The builders have new houses on their books waiting sales.
        Appears to have started about three months ago.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:50pm
    - Doubledimp
      
      (sorry pressed report instead of reply)
      I look at the lack of property availability in the Auckland Housing market as tied in some portion to the crap nature of National in dealing with local council politics. Imagine if a former National minister had been in charge of Auckland Mayoralty instead of Pants-Down-Brown. We would have seen administration streamlined, smooth dealings with central govt and loads of land released (in my humble opinion).
      
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      October 21, 2017 5:00pm
  - peterwn
    
    The worst burst would be a 20% drop which would pick up after a few years. As long as the population keeps growing house prices are in general governed by the cost of developing land and building a new house. Also relatively few people would be in a ‘must sell’ situation at the time of a price drop. Unlike other banks around the world the Aussie banks and their NZ subsidiaries have been prudent with their lending and were hardly affected by the last economic slump. This helps avoid any significant ‘bubble’. By the way, people need houses but not tulips, so using tulips as an example of a bubble with respect to houses is not a reasonable comparison.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:48am
    - PhilBest
      
      Median multiples in crashes, have typically fallen from 12 to 4.5 (Los Angeles) and 6.6 to 3.8 (Dublin).
      
      Nice little 20% soft landings are not usually an option that one can select from a range of options once the crash starts, consequent on years of dereliction of duty by government as the bubble inflated.
      
      I suggest the higher they have gone, the further they have to revert towards historical mean. This is not genius to work out.
      
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      October 21, 2017 11:16am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        But median multiple of one wage or two? Historically, only the man worked for money. Now the usual house is bought by two wage earners.
        
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        October 21, 2017 12:54pm
      - PhilBest
        
        Classical Liberal: median multiples are based on “household income”. In which case the severity of the deviation from historical norm is understated. 3 times a predominantly single income average household was once a norm. Now it is a factor of an average that includes a significant number of dual income households. However, this is not as dramatic as you might think because along with an increase in dual-income households, there has been an increase in “one person” households. The old “two parent” household with a single income earner has been replaced by a mix of TWO things in the modern day: “dual income” households and “single person” households.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:14pm
Viking2

Suns out so that’s good.

Back to the 90’s we go.
No chasing loan dodgers. Free education for uni students. you know the ones who can’t get jobs now.

Teachers not accountable again.
Charter Schools stuffed again.
Of course they won’t attack the Catholic Schools or the other religious schools but non religious are the whipping boy for the teachers unions.
Unionists are arseholes, always have been always will be.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11935250
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October 21, 2017 8:03am
krazykiwi

The 100 day wrecking ball is hoisted and ready.
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October 21, 2017 8:04am
- KKKKatee
  
  Yes, Jazinda’s good to go. She’s gonna fix all the rich pricks once and for all…….
  Meanwhile enjoying a $500K salary while she goes about her grand plan to turn NZ into a marxist paradise…..
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:03am
  - Longknives
    
    Ha Ha Kateee I heard The People’s Princess bemoaning her ‘White Privilege’ a while back.
    Surely she will be donating that 500k to Charity then??
    *As an aside- $500k is a pretty good starting salary for your first real job since School
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:44am
    - Viking2
      
      Next she will be apologizing for being a **man.
      
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      October 21, 2017 10:59am
      - sooty
        
        After all John Key worked for free! You will never beat that Labour.
        
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        October 21, 2017 5:46pm
Pongo

I am I alone in being a little annoyed at the arrogance shown by our new leaders, first we had the Winston show who instead of cracking on with negotiations seized the opportunity of everyone talking about him for an extra fortnight. He then announces the new government while his young prom date waited in a room somewhere clutching her skirts wondering if he would choose her.
She then takes 2 hours to bother talking to the voters but the thing that is annoying me is where is the policy agreement ? for all we know NZ First could have all their policies implemented before April the first. No journo wants to ask that question.
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October 21, 2017 8:06am
- PhilBest
  
  I am reserving judgement until I see what policies have been agreed on. It wouldn’t be too bad if Winnie has made Labour abandon the crazy new tax ideas and the 1970’s industrial relations, and reverse the Treaty gravy train, but still do the right thing on Council Planning and the housing bubble.
  
  There are bad things National is guilty of, that I would have hoped Winnie would have forced them to reverse if it had gone that way – especially the Treaty gravy train and the Iwi mafia enabling that is a massive shameful blot on National’s record along with the craven capitulation to Council Planning sabotage of the economy and wanton, iniquitous policy-pumping of one of the world’s biggest ever housing bubbles.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:34am
  - VicParking
    
    I’m sure the negotiations with Labour went like this:
    Bottom line 1 ?
    No
    Bottom line 2 ?
    No
    Bottom line 3 ?
    No
    Bottom line 4 ?
    Maybe
    Bottom line 5 ?
    How about Deputy Prime Minister
    Yes yes yes we will support U.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:10am
  - KevOB
    
    No policies: no government.
    
    Shouldn’t that be a pre-requisite for HM Governor General to be satisfied on prior to any swearing in?
    
    Is this a Magna Carta moment?
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:05am
- niggly
  
  Plus someone mentioned just after Winston made his announcement, Winnie and Shane Jones were seen on the piss down Courtney Place way.
  
  If that’s true – then what a bad look. Instead of staying up late that night (like Labour did) working on the new govt arrangements, Winston/NZF show further contempt of the public by getting drunk and ignoring their responsibilities. Were there any MSM appearances the next day (Friday – yesterday), or were they too hung over and couldn’t be bothered doing any work that the taxpayer generously pays them to do?
  
  What a fckn joke NZ First is. I hope a good portion of their membership is telling NZF hierarchy to stick it after being betrayed!
  
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  October 21, 2017 12:58pm
The only red for me is that of Manchester United

Change the government.
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October 21, 2017 8:06am
- yossarian
  
  Hopefully I see the ‘do you want to change the govt’ box that everyone keeps talking about next time
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:10am
- VicParking
  
  Problem is the group that lost are not left wing snowflakes so we can’t march and protest and do that.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:11am
Manolo

Rumblings in the ruling family:
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/10/20/singapore-leader-faces-fresh-criticism-from-brother-amid-family-feud.html

An unprecedented public feud between Singaporean Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong and his siblings took another unexpected twist on Friday.
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October 21, 2017 8:08am
Pongo

The announcements have started such as vaping is OK and the new Auckland airport flight path and no doubt more to come. National were so risk averse it was ridiculous, Uber and 12 months WOFs were quite representative of overly cautious legislating and where National cared little for consumers and more for business owners.
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October 21, 2017 8:10am
oldpark

Message for all the Gold Card supporters clubs that campaigned for your so called knight in shining armour Winston Peters. Well if you havent caught up with it you have been betrayed and shafted.
Remember the promised increase by Bill English in your fixed pension income.
You wont be getting it .In fact your wee now tarnished Knight in shining armour Winston Peters will be voting against it.
Seems he feels that the $1500 per day he has negoiated for himself ,is a lot more important than the few extra dollars ,you now wont be getting.
Suck it up ,until the next election ,when you will be lied to and conned again.Its all about Peters,what part of that have you been blinded to believe otherwise.
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October 21, 2017 8:11am
- MrTips
  
  Indeed, it needs to be pushed back at Peters time and time again, and remind the public what he said in negotiations:
  
  “Its my decision I’m worried about, NOT your outcome”.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:14am
- PhilBest
  
  Wow, is that right? Delicious!!!
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:42am
- MCos
  
  It’s a funny old world we live in.
  On the one hand throw stones at the old buggers for voting against a party who promise a few extra shekels every fortnight and on the other hand pouring scorn on people who vote for people who promise some other benefits.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:49am
  - VicParking
    
    With the promised increase in the “Living wage” (min wage) we will need to see if that is passed on to the superannuitants?. I gather they are living, just. Will however the new government relent on the 60% of the average wage rule. How will Winston react. I will be looking forward to my $480 heating allowance, a case of brandy should keep me warm over winter.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:20am
- KKKKatee
  
  There will be a reasonable proportion of those 40.94% rs who gave NZF their party vote who will be very, very, very pissed off right now by the betrayal of Winston Peters. They didn’t see this coming.
  “A” grade Arsehole………….
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:23am
- KevOB
  
  What will we all be getting apart from the run around?
  
  It’s not apparent what our family income will be next year. I am married on NS with an underage (NS) dependent wife. Add three dependent children 10, 13,16–What changes to WFF? Accommodation supplement— is that to be changed?
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:32am
- Nermal
  
  But aren’t we getting a winter fuel bonus?
  
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  October 21, 2017 4:45pm
Viking2

NZ First policy is to introduce a universal living allowance, and a student debt write-off scheme that would give students free tertiary study by requiring them to work in NZ for the same period as their length of study.

Provided that they can write off that non living part of the loan against their earnings in NZ then I’m happy with that. Been suggesting this approach for years.

Makes that the same as someone whose employer pays their tuition fees.
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October 21, 2017 8:13am
- PhilBest
  
  What I’ve been suggesting for years, is Tertiary Study Savings accounts, where a few years work and pay-in happens BEFORE the Uni study and the loan! Then the loan could also be written off over the years as far as I am concerned, the main thing is that the little idiot school-leavers have had a dose of the real world and probably been awakened to make more sensible study choices than what is happening under the status quo.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:49am
  - KevOB
    
    Incomes don’t allow for that level of savings.
    We got student loans because many students partied away their time and advances for course costs.
    
    Many students go straight from College and haven’t the opportunity to earn nor is work available for the mass of young people. The student loan is the only practical way.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:14am
- Steve (North Shore)
  
  Students work? Not likely, they don’t know the meaning of the word. Rather spend a life career at University
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:06am
Nukuleka

Had the election results been reversed and Labour gained 44% and National 37% with Peters anointing Bill English as PM the left and the MSM would have gone ballistic with an outcry about an unfair, sexist outcome and hashtags of ‘not my PM’. We of the right are far too gracious and generous in ‘defeat’where the progressives would be shrill and vicious in their retaliation and response.

In Germany, the home of MMP, this would not have happened. My German friends cannot comprehend why the leader of National as the biggest party holding the largest number of seats has not had the right to form a government. Merkel on 33% had that right and it was a given in Germany from the outset that she would be Chancellor.

This is a disgrace. Comrade Jacinda ain’t my PM!
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October 21, 2017 8:16am
- tas
  
  I think the germans have had the second-largest party form the government before.
  
  That’s MMP. There’s no use crying about the rules.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:30am
  - Than
    
    Actually, yes there is.
    
    Just because an outcome obeys the rules of the system doesn’t mean people will regard that outcome as fair. The FPP case of a government being able to win a majority of seats despite losing the popular vote followed the rules of that system too. But people didn’t like that outcome, so we got MMP. If people don’t think the outcome from MMP is right (and a lot of people who voted for National will be feeling that way right now) we could potentially change to something else again.
    
    This particular problem could well solve itself. If NZF disappears and no new parties emerge, then we would be back to a two-party system (well, two blocks, treating Labour+Greens as one). No messy coalition negotiations and small-party tails wagging the dog, but the party lists would still solve the seats versus popular vote disparity of FPP.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:12am
    - tas
      
      Sure, change the rules for next time. But you can’t change the rules retroactively.
      
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      October 21, 2017 2:00pm
  - Nukuleka
    
    The FACT is that in Germany it is EXPECTED that the Chancellor will be the leader of the biggest party in the Bundestag- that person has the MORAL RIGHT to at least attempt to form a government. Germany does not have the habit of allowing the 3rd place getter to have the right to choose the Chancellor. That is not in the spirit of MMP at all. It is not in the ‘rules’ of MMP as you so quaintly put it.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:27am
    - tas
      
      In 1980 the second and third largest parties formed a government in Germany (if you count the CDU and CSU as one party). That is how MMP works. It’s simply not true that this couldn’t happen in Germany.
      
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      October 21, 2017 1:58pm
- mikenmild
  
  “Not my President!”
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:32am
  - Nukuleka
    
    Quite different in the USA where the outcome of the presidential election is in law determined by the Electoral College. Don’t compare apples with bananas.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:28am
    - Than
      
      No, that’s very much an apples and apples comparison.
      
      Trump won the electoral college and therefore the presidency. But he lost the popular vote by a large margin (please, don’t waste my time bringing up the bullshit claims of vote fraud). This isn’t the first time that has happened in presidental elections, and it doesn’t sit well with many people. There is a significant part of the population who would like to change the electoral college system, and there has been for some time. Naturally those who benefit from the current system are opposed to change.
      
      The situation is similar here in NZ. Yes, under the rules of MMP the combination of Labour+NZF+Greens have a majority and can form a government. But it doesn’t sit well with many people that the party that got the largest share of the vote (National got more votes than Labour and the Greens combined) gets shut out. It doesn’t sit well with people that the leader of a party getting only 7% effectively got to pick the next PM. This will be especially true if they try and push through major changes on such a dubious mandate.
      
      People can keep repeating “those are the rules” all they like. That won’t make people like the outcome any better. Which is true in both the US and NZ.
      
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      October 21, 2017 1:34pm
      - tas
        
        You are completely correct that many people will be very unhappy with how this government was formed (myself included). But that doesn’t make it “illegitimate” — the rules are clearly established and have been supported in two referenda. I know it’s splitting hairs, but people should direct their displeasure towards MMP, not the new government.
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:06pm
      - Surely Knott
        
        But Americas system of electing a government, the president is only one part of their govt, and is at least balanced by the fact that the senate (per state) and house (per population) are elected by other measures. The interest of the state and the direct population are represented.
        
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        October 21, 2017 3:36pm
  - Viking2
    
    Yeh but watch out cuase Cindy will anoint Clark to the job. That’s the game plan didn’t you know?
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:06am
- Gabby
  
  Poor bloody Germans eh nukkilukk.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:34am
- PhilBest
  
  The Germans have several times formed Grand Coalitions of the two biggest parties. The way things are in NZ with National being like Helen Clark’s 4th, 5th and 6th terms anyway (capitulation on CAGW, the Iwi racket, urban planning, anti smacking, the RMA, the rainbow agenda, urban train sets, etc) I saw no reason they couldn’t have done this here and just left Winnie out in the cold.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:02am
- Disaster Area
  
  Pretty sure that the largest party is also in opposition in Australia as well.
  
  If anything, this election result should be hammering home the fact that this isn’t a FPP system anymore. As I said repeatedly before Winston’s announcement, it isn’t about who gets the most seats, its about who can form the biggest coalition.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:33am
- MCos
  
  “We of the right are far too gracious and generous in ‘defeat’”
  Examples are few on this forum . . . . .
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:35am
  - GazzaW
    
    If you don’t like this forum MCos then fuck off to The Standard. Mickey Savage and his cohorts are renowned for their graciousness and generosity.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:17am
- Kimbo
  
  We of the right are far too gracious and generous in ‘defeat’where the progressives would be shrill and vicious in their retaliation and response.
  
  Hmm, I don’t know about the “right”, and I’m most sure no one elected you to speak on their behalf, but judging by the standard of your regular posts, Nukuleka, you’ve never been “gracious” or “generous”.
  
  Mean-spirited?
  Shrill?
  Tribal?
  Vicious?
  Partisan?
  Paranoid?
  Yep, all of the above…
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:50am
  - Kimbo
    
    Examples of Nukuleka “of the right” being gracious and generous just on this thread:
    
    “The tooth fairy is going to wave her magic wand…”
    
    “This is a disgrace. Comrade Jacinda ain’t my PM!”.
    
    Hate to see what you are like when you are bitchy! 😉
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:19am
    - Viking2
      
      By standards standard that very gracious. What’s more it’s fair comment.
      
      7 1
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      October 21, 2017 11:08am
      - Kimbo
        
        What kind of grub wants to compare themselves to the Standard as a pass mark for “generosity” and “graciousness”?!
        
        And fair comment? Leaving aside Nukuleka hypocrisy (which, by implication you acknowledge) that his comment was made in a “gracious” and “generous” manner, (and that was his point!)
        
        …since when is Ardern not our PM (elect)?
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:14am
      - treadingthemill
        
        Political tribalism mystifies me. It is rare that in a democracy which party is in power is a matter of life and death, and the differences between parties, especially large centrist parties, are not always as great as some people tend to think.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:22am
      - Kimbo
        
        Political tribalism mystifies me.
        
        Is rooted in human nature, both “belonging”, and also defining yourself and your tribe against “the other”. Is why it is a delusion, for example, to say if we abolished religion we would have no more wars.
        
        Lots of moaning around here for years about “Key Derangement Syndrome (KDS)”.
        
        And yet already many of the same are lapsing into Ardern Derangement Syndrome (ADS). Don’t get me wrong – I doubt think she will make a competent PM, and I have grave doubts about her coalition government
        
        …but she is our PM. Which means to some extent we need her to do well.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:34am
- flipper
  
  Yes, and there is much Peters bullshit about German MMP and the time tken to form a Government post election.
  For fucks sake, not one (NOT ONE) of the gutless MSM circa 2017 have asked Peters if there is a difference between 80 million and 4.8 million. Either those prima donnas lack the courage, or the basic education, to understand that there is a fucking big difference between 80 and 4.8(tops).
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:01am
  - tas
    
    Peters may be correct that the Germans (and others) take much longer to form a government, but that doesn’t make it a good thing.
    
    The video of that conniving prick standing on his pedestal making a long speech before announcing the outcome of our election really made my blood boil. That’s not how democracy should work.
    
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    October 21, 2017 2:11pm
- KevOB
  
  She hasn’t been sworn in yet. The GG should consider this as it feels like a constitutional outrage is in the making.
  
  Can HM Governor General be satisfied that Jacinda’a amateur crew can actually be a stable government?<
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:16am
- greybeard
  
  I think we are about to find out that Helen Clark is in fact the PM, speaking through her proxy Jacinda.
  
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  October 21, 2017 11:23am
- Piniwi
  
  Sorry Nukuleka he was always going to go to Labour as pointed out so often to weak protest voters. Vote black get red.
  
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  October 22, 2017 1:04am
flipper

The Herald, late last night, bannered a piece with toothfairy saying it has been agreed that the April tax cuts (supported by NZF and Redmelons when passed into law) will be canned.

Bye, bye Peters/Ardern !
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October 21, 2017 8:17am
- Happychappy
  
  The Maori seat referendum has been canned to so I wonder how far Labour’s bribe for everyone to have a warm home with a one off payment in the beginning of winter will pan out now. The broken promises will come on a regular basis over the coming months
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:31am
sooty

What’s Robertsons address scam?
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October 21, 2017 8:19am
oldpark

There she was living in a world of make believe .The woman known as “Commie Chic” Comrade Ardern. Basking in the illusion ,and confusion that as an also ran silver medalist in the election stakes,she had won the election.
She will always be known as the plastic Prime Minister of NZ, who had her position allocated to her by NZs wee dictator and meglamaniac Winston Peters.
Interesting that the first Announcement the Winston Peters allocated PM made ,was to say that Bill Englishs’ promised tax cuts and pensioners a little extra ,would be cancelled.
It was a sly dig to her wee puppet master Peters,that he would be assissting in the cancelled legislation. His betrayal of his gold card supporters would then be complete.
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October 21, 2017 8:24am
- RF
  
  Two important things to remember….
  
  Ardern way back when she was a school girl wanted to be the Prime Minister. That is bloody scary and a worry. Proves that to obtain her goal she would sell her soul to the devil.
  
  Peters was offered the deputy PM job. He is playing his usual hard ball and not disclosing if he will take the job. He will want people to chase him around asking what he intends to do. It’s all about him and warning bells should be clanging in the airheads empty head as he eyes up her throne
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:21am
  - Disaster Area
    
    And the former All Black Captain who had the motivation quote stuck on his bedroom wall? Joe Satriani who practiced guitar for 8 hours a day?
    
    I would have thought that the fact that she has had a goal and worked to achieve it makes her admirable, as opposed to someone like John Key who just sort of fell into politics.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:59am
    - Viking2
      
      I thnik you need to revisit that. Key had the same ambition if I remember right. Probably not from childhood though.
      
      Wouldn’t you think that if that was your ambition you would educate yourself to assume that responsibility?
      
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      October 21, 2017 11:13am
      - Disaster Area
        
        That was kind of my point: Jacinda wanted to be PM since she was at school = bad, John Key wanted to be PM since school = good.
        
        I happen to think that there is a lot of spite and denial on here at the moment because like it or not, National lost the election.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:17pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Disaster Area
        
        😉
        
        Denial
        Anger
        Bargaining
        Depression
        Acceptance.
        
        Could be awhile for some. 😉
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:20pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        ‘I happen to think that there is a lot of spite and denial on here at the moment’
        
        Nah, I reckon that’s more wishful thinking on your part- and that’s a reflection of your own spite.
        I think most here knew it was a big ask to win. Frankly I was surprised the Nats got as a high a vote.
        Not sure you were in NZ ( you’re an immigrant Pom right?) when Winston was last in Govt but I remember.
        It was a disaster.
        I reckon the Nats might have lost a battle but we will win the war in the long term.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:28pm
    - RF
      
      Disaster Area.
      
      She does not pass the smell test.
      
      Remember prior to being deputy she did not want that job and Lordy me she did not want to be PM. Too much pressure and would impact on a family.
      
      Remind me where she is now.
      
      Squaw speaks with fork tongue…..
      
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      October 21, 2017 1:10pm
      - Disaster Area
        
        And if she said that she did want to be leader? She’d have been crucified on here for being disloyal or too ambitious.
        
        Did Bill English say that he wanted to be PM whilst John Key was still around?
        
        Its almost as if she isn’t allowed to change her mind, or re-evaluate her options when a situation changes.
        
        Edited to add: Lets see how many of the National cabinet who have previously denied wanting to be leader, put their hand up for the Leadership if Bill English steps down.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:21pm
      - treadingthemill
        
        speaks with fork tongue…..
        
        All politicians do sometimes, especially when it comes to that question. I don’t think that says anything about her personally.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:25pm
  - lifesgood
    
    I don’t believe Peters wants DPM. He’s too lazy, less drinking time. After all he will have to take over when Jacinda goes on maternity leave.
    
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    October 21, 2017 12:29pm
    - Salacious Crumb
      
      I’d suggest stress leave is more likely.
      
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      October 21, 2017 12:50pm
      - Nermal
        
        Maternity leave
        
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        October 21, 2017 4:52pm
      - Rachael Membery
        
        Both?
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:33pm
Colville

When will the media wite a detailed article about the price the Unions will now extract for Labour being in power?
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October 21, 2017 8:28am
- PhilBest
  
  If Winston has put limits on that, that would be a consolation. Anyone know?
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:05am
- Ross12
  
  The first indication is the list in the Cabinet –mainly all ex union or union affiliated people.
  
  Phil –I’d be very surprised if the Labour industrial relations policy was mentioned by Peters. He’s probably not aware of it, as it was hardly mentioned in the campaign
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:41am
  - Colville
    
    the useless twat Little is still there which tells us he is the union go between.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:30am
    - sooty
      
      Mr hero to zero!
      
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      October 21, 2017 5:51pm
JibberJabber

So what is first on the agenda for the WinstonLabGreen govt, invade Poland?
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October 21, 2017 8:30am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  That was the plan until Ron looked in the cupboard and found we didn’t have any tanks and the Tasman as well as other bodies of water were not good driving surfaces . . . .
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:14am
dime

So apparently I’m missing out on some tax cut that I never actually got. Ummmmm bummer I guess?

Maybe I’d care a bit more if said tax cut had kicked in 6 months ago… Easy come easy go

I don’t even know how much it was.

Maybe don’t play so many games next time round national. Ya just got a bit too clever
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October 21, 2017 8:31am
- Gabby
  
  dim’s geddin philosophickle. wtf?
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:37am
- flipper
  
  C R A P you ignoramus
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:53am
EAD_TWO

Yet another Jew entertainer done for rape.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11935206

This time it is magician David Blaine raping Gentiles.

This is a good article from America’s leading Jewish Magazine about the phenomenon of rapey Jews:

http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/246724/the-specifically-jewy-perviness-of-harvey-weinstein
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October 21, 2017 8:34am
- realityczech
  
  It is nothing compared to the child rape scandals that have rocked the orthodox Jewish communities around the world.
  
  Funny how the media don’t splash it all over the news like they do when goy do it.
  
  We will never know the truth as the Jews teach none of their tribe should tell such things to the filthy dirty sub human goy. It has hampered investigations into the epic scale of child rape by jews
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:42am
  - EAD_TWO
    
    I don’t know why people are downticking RealityCzech for telling the truth.
    
    It is is a sin in Jewish teachings to help out the Goyim and tell the truth if it gets another tribesman in trouble:
    
    http://www.smh.com.au/national/jewish-sex-abuse-victims-pressured-not-to-assist-police-secret-tapes-and-emails-reveal-20150127-12zcfa.html
    
    “I am not exactly delighted that another Yid [Jew] would assist police against an accused no matter whatever he is accused of and that is the reason why I was very disappointed,” Mr Lewenberg, who was defending Cyprys at the time of the conversation, told the victim.
    
    “Because there is a tradition, if not a religious requirement that you do not assist against Abraham and I was concerned about that … moser principle. Moseris well known.”
    
    Mr Lewenberg was referring to the Jewish tradition of mesirah under which a Jew does not inform secular authorities about another Jew
    
    Then there Is the Talmud
    
    Sanhedrin 59a
    “To communicate anything to a Goy about our religious relations would be equal to the killing of all Jews, for if the Goyim knew what we teach about them, they would kill us openly”.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:04am
    - realityczech
      
      Apparently they too support pedophiles. But only if they are Jewish. They claim all Muslims are pedos if even one of them touches a kid. A claim I do not make about Jews.
      
      Another example of how religion damages morality and decency.
      
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      October 21, 2017 10:42am
- realityczech
  
  “This is a good article from America’s leading Jewish Magazine”
  
  Given they teach that goy are on about the level of beasts, except for goy women who live in perpetual filth and are worthy of even less consideration… why is anyone surprised. ?
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:46am
  - realityczech
    
    Hundreds of Jews turn out to support a pedophile. What putrid people.
    
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/may/17/ultra-orthodox-jews-accused-offender
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:33am
Paulus

Did anybody expect Peters to keep his word ?
Now we have the Government we deserve – a local BOP newspaper (sic) only street interviewed the women voters who all think that it is wonderful.
Their partners etc if they have one, probably no longer, may not agree in a year or sooner.
Remember all taxpayers were to get a tax reduction in April not just Superannuitants.
Lower paid would have got another $1,000 a year similarly.
I thought that Peters and his Ngapuhi led party troughers would be Cinderella’s problem but now it appears very early on that the Greens are on a roll above their mentality and will cause he no end of problems. If she thinks their will toe their line think again – Shaw is already telling up what they are going to do.
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October 21, 2017 8:35am
JibberJabber

Tax cut? TAX FUCKING CUT?
You don`t appear to understand Kulaks, it is our fucking money and you will be grateful for what we allow you to keep.
Now, get back to work, lazy pricks, the Motherland has to pay for the Chardonnay to keep the intelligentsia in the style they have become accustomed to.
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October 21, 2017 8:38am
Keeping Stock

Great to see Brendon Hartley making a really good fist of his first seat-time in F1. He was 14th fastest in the first 90-minute practice session, clocking up 28 laps, more than any other driver.

P2 is taking place right at the moment, and Hartley is currently in 12th, with some very good drivers below him on the standings. Unfortunately he will start off the back of the grid on Monday due to Toro Rossa having changed a power unit on his car, but thus far he hasn’t looked at all out of place.
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October 21, 2017 8:39am
- fernglas
  
  Is he genuinely racing, or is he just doing a glorified test drive?
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:44am
  - Keeping Stock
    
    Seems pretty genuine to me. He has driven a lot on the Texas circuit before in a car that is 12 seconds slower per lap than an F1 car. He’s already erased more than 75% of that differential and is getting quicker with each session.
    
    Although it won’t count, he will still take part in qualifying tomorrow. It will be interesting to see what he can pull out of the hat in an all-or-nothing qualifying lap.
    
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    October 21, 2017 8:51am
- James Stephenson
  
  When did engines become “power units”?
  
  7 2
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  October 21, 2017 9:00am
  - cmm
    
    When it became more than just an engine.
    
    It includes a whole bunch of electronics and at least part of the gearbox etc too.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:15am
  - PhilBest
    
    Are you a descendant of Robert Stephenson?
    
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    October 21, 2017 1:16pm
  - softail 1450
    
    they have the ability to engage an electric motor as well,actually they must use that motor for a set %of the race,the absolute peak of technology .
    
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    October 21, 2017 1:44pm
  - rangitoto
    
    F1 engines are complex hybrids. They generate electricity from two devices called mgu-kinetic, which recovers energy from braking and mgu-heat which recovers energy from the exhaust gases that aren’t needed to drive the turbo. They are actually much more efficient than even road car hybrids.
    
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    October 21, 2017 3:32pm
- VicParking
  
  Pity he has to start from the back of the grid, team penalty.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:25am
- Longknives
  
  This is an amazing achievement- First F1 Driver for thirty odd years.
  Sadly it’s been virtually ignored by NZ Media (Motorsport seems to be off their Radar these days)
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:51am
  - MCos
    
    I’ve seen quite a bit about the chap on the TV news
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:56am
kowtow

“Zimbabwean human rights activists have accused the World Health Organization of hypocrisy after it appointed Robert Mugabe as a goodwill ambassador.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/10/20/zimbabwean-activists-condemn-absurdworld-health-organization/
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October 21, 2017 8:44am
- PhilBest
  
  That’s fiction, isn’t it? Satirical fiction???
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:09am
oldpark

Saw a head line in a trade union infested Australian owned Newspaper. It said something like this in,fact it summed up the sicko biased we know best lefties. “Get used to it Bill.”you lost”.If that deranged newpaper editor had cared to tell the truth the headline should have read. “NZ has lost the many many freedoms they enjoy”” which will come to pass” ,with the decision of the meglamaniac Dictator Peters decision to elect a “communist” Government,and allocate the position of PM to a woman known as Comrade Ardern.
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October 21, 2017 8:52am
- Disaster Area
  
  I suppose it won’t make any difference to some of the ranting on here, but I would like to point out that the only place I have ever heard Jacinda referred to as ‘Commie Chic’ or ‘Comrade Adern’ is on here.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:38am
  - Longknives
    
    Umm- Your Hero’s ‘Comrades,Comrades’ speech is pretty well known Disaster Area..
    Her little Marxist fantasy (President of Junior Communists- Wasn’t it?…) is one of the reasons a large proportion of of New Zealanders think she is a pathetic joke..
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:56am
    - KKKKatee
      
      Agree. And the Comrade Adern will most certainly stick. After viewing that fiasco of a video where she is shouting “Comrade” at least fifteen times, it ‘aint gonna go away in a hurry. Hitler in drag.
      
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      October 21, 2017 12:03pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Are you joking, Longknives? Please go on to youtube and type in ‘Comrade Jacinda’. Watch her speech. ‘Comrades’ is the hard left label she uses 15 times in her IUSY speech. She is happy to associate herself with that label, the one of mass murderer Stalin.
      
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      October 21, 2017 1:28pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    You obviously don’t get out much.
    
    9 1
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    October 21, 2017 10:01am
JasonJohns

with the nz government being usurped by imposters the new seat of authentic people’s power might well be considered the delta tavern in ngaruawahia. great night there last night. a conclave of us retreated to the toilets for security reasons when the talk got political and options for resistance to the new regime were being put forward. some profound talk flowed beside those urinals! a big fat russian guy came in at and spent far too long in one of the shitters. he eventually flushed loudly and left behind a really bad stink. pretty antisocial if you ask me. we had to adjourn the session of our ‘parliament’.
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October 21, 2017 8:56am
JasonJohns

if anyone wants in on the next dignity patrol you can contact me thru facebook.
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October 21, 2017 9:01am
- JibberJabber
  
  Do you supply the flaming cross or do we have to bring our own?
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:15am
rightoverlabour

I believe in [deleted by DPF for advocating murder and Strike 1. Do not do again]
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October 21, 2017 9:04am
- oldpark
  
  Total agree what an indictment. Why compare him to Nero,how about Poll Pot,who caused the well being and deaths of Millions. Peters Legacy will be a blue print for many years to come and be studied.When a sicko like him can destroy the aspirations of so many Hardworking NZs who believe in fair play.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:14am
  - rightoverlabour
    
    Nero appeals to my ancestry, but Pol Pot fits the bill!
    
    5 2
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    October 21, 2017 9:21am
- JasonJohns
  
  be careful inciting assassination is a crime
  
  7 4
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  October 21, 2017 9:29am
  - rightoverlabour
    
    Hmm, I’m not inciting it as such, just wouldn’t care if it happened. However, eliminating terrorism is not a crime. I suppose it depends on how one defines terrorism. I am quite happy to retract the post if it is in breach of rules etc, ( in which case, DPF delete it) but then where does freedom of speech come in?
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:47am
  - KevOB
    
    Indeed.
    Winston seems to be living on borrowed time anyway–his health can’t be hidden.
    
    5 2
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    October 21, 2017 10:41am
Ash

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
It’s always a fantastic day when you butthurt right wingers are crying about the election result.
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October 21, 2017 9:08am
- All_on_Red
  
  Let’s see how well your post ages in a few months when the reality of Winston combined with Labours incompetence sinks in.
  This may come as a shock to you but many of us view not going with Winston as winning.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:12am
  - Ash
    
    Confirming suspicions that right wingers aren’t great with understanding the meaning of words.
    
    3 30
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    October 21, 2017 9:15am
    - All_on_Red
      
      Lol, Lefty Troll confirms its a fuckwit.
      Speaking of words. I reckon Jacinda is going to loathe seeing these ones.
      ‘Does she stand by her statements?’
      
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      October 21, 2017 9:19am
      - Digmen1
        
        And I had a vision
        And I was transparent
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:29am
    - Salacious Crumb
      
      Who in the government has progressive dementia and will be gone within a year…..?
      
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      October 21, 2017 12:55pm
  - rightoverlabour
    
    As I get over my rage and frustration, I do try and see the silver lining. National is not encumbered with this fuckwit, and hopefully all his right leaning supporters will desert him in disgust. As the economy tanks, the housing crisis gets worse and homelessness increases, (landlords will sell up if it becomes uneconomic, and their restriction on immigration means no new houses) more and more poor people will suffer even more. They voted for this shit, they can suffer the consequences. I might have to settle for Lindauer rather than Moet, but I’ll survive.
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:19am
    - Ash
      
      What ever helps with the darkness in your mind buddy.
      
      2 27
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      October 21, 2017 9:21am
      - All_on_Red
        
        Jacinda epitomises the high standard of expertise which exists today in the Labour Party.
        ‘Would you like fries with that?’
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:25am
      - treadingthemill
        
        What ever helps with the darkness in your mind buddy.
        
        What helps you with the darkness in your mind? That is to say this…
        
        It’s always a fantastic day when you butthurt right wingers are crying about the election result.
        
        Us vs Them is a dark way to think about life.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:27am
      - GoVege
        
        Ash: AOR is very depressed about the election result.
        He has been on the turps and was up at midnight trolling me last night.
        He is a very sad guy right now.
        Pray for him… 🙂
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:13pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Telling lies again Vege.
        Can’t help yourself can you. Must hurt getting pulled up on your racism and bullshit.
        Btw- I don’t drink
        And it wasn’t midnight either- liar
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:16pm
    - Gruffydd
      
      As the economy tanks, the housing crisis gets worse and homelessness increases, (landlords will sell up if it becomes uneconomic, and their restriction on immigration means no new houses)
      
      WTF.
      If landlords sell up the houses don’t evaporate.
      Do immigrants bring houses with them?
      
      Less immigration will give the construction industry more chance of keeping up with demand .
      
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      October 21, 2017 9:33am
      - rightoverlabour
        
        they need 56,000 builders to build the houses. Much of the housing crisis is returning New Zealanders, (although that may stop now). Go back to writing fairy tails on stuff you nothing about.
        
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        October 21, 2017 9:42am
      - Gruffydd
        
        56,000 more builders .
        
        It takes about eight Weeks for two chippys to build a house.
        So 27,000 crews building a house every eight weeks.
        Is 182,000 a year …
        AKA
        http://WWW.facts@myarse.com.
        
        Supply
        Council zoning restrictions limit the availability of land.
        Building capacity restraint as we are at a high point in one of the building industry,s perennial boom bust cycles.
        
        Demand
        Driven mostly by Immigration.
        There is this really strange thing you find difficult to cope with.
        Facts.
        As I consider you full of shite I had a quick look.
        Seems kiwi net migration is at a historic low.
        
        “The other half relates to flows of New Zealanders in and out of the country. On an annual basis, this is at the lowest level since 1984.
        
        http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/91921252/net-migration-gain-near-72000-as-arrivals-continue-to-climb
        
        Its not kiwis returning home driving housing demand halfwit.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:19am
      - Ross12
        
        Gruffydd
        Yesterday you mentioned the figure of 75,000 net increase of immigrants. Just FYI I heard Larry Williams talking Tuariki Delamere (sp?) –the ex Cabinet Minister turned Immigration Consultant –last night.
        He said that figure comes from airport arrival stats for people who have not been here for 12mths. So it includes foreign students , returning NZers, seasonal workers (some of them) etc. When Larry asked how many “genuine” long term/permanent immigrants were included in the figure Delamere said he did not know and wasn’t aware of an available figure.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:24am
      - mikenmild
        
        Right now, the inflow of qualified builders is insufficient to even build the houses required by the current inflow of migrants.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:26am
      - Gruffydd
        
        http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/91921252/net-migration-gain-near-72000-as-arrivals-continue-to-climb
        
        New figures from Statistics New Zealand have revealed New Zealand’s net gain from migration hit 71,300 in the year to January 31.
        
        Net gain.
        These all need housing even if they are here on temporary work visas.
        
        As well as replacing existing stock and expanding household numbers from population growth.
        
        Import large numbers to build will only result in more problems when the market eventually collapses.
        
        In my life I have seen enough boom bust cycles in construction to know history will repeat.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:38am
    - KevOB
      
      You might be having a similar vision to me–Jacinda may yet wish she had gone into a grand coalition. This could be one of the most difficult parliamentary terms ever.
      
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      October 21, 2017 10:45am
      - Evadne
        
        Wait til the North Korea thing gets going…then we’ll see a difficult time for Jacinda, having to provide a credible response, with the defence-protesting Greens on one side and the military posturing of Winston on the other.
        
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        October 21, 2017 3:43pm
  - Longknives
    
    All_on_Red
    I suspect like most Labour Voters Ash will be pretty happy when his Unemployment Benefit goes up..
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:58am
- PhilBest
  
  I’m a true free market right winger and I don’t really mind that rentier-capitalist, Ponzi economy, housing-bubble-pumping National has got a time in the naughty corner now. The people crying now are the blind partisans who wouldn’t know a principle if they tripped over it. People of principle would have been crying over National’s performance during the last 9 years.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:14am
  - Rodney Randall
    
    Keep up the great work Phil and thankyou for your honesty and conviction.
    
    As a centre/right voter, I can only hope that additional right wing parties are now formed. A counterbalance in this MMP environment is now required leading up to the next election.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:20am
    - PhilBest
      
      Thanks, Rodney – one reason I returned to the blogosphere after a few years absence having given up all hope, was that a few people, including you, had seen the light and joined the fight.
      
      KB-ers will hate this, but this includes a few people of the Left, and their work made a convert of Phil Twyford. In National, by contrast, we have Nick Smith and others who are “challenged”, to put it mildly, in the attributes of listening, learning, and humility.
      
      It’s not history repeating on the scale of Roger Douglas’ insights versus Muldoon’s intransigence, which would have made NZ Venezuela if anything would – but it is akin to it.
      
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      October 21, 2017 11:41am
      - Flash
        
        I’ll be pleased to vote for a 2020 version of Roger Douglas if one emerges. New Zealand needs re-energising.
        
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        October 21, 2017 11:01pm
    - Kimbo
      
      @ Rodney Randall
      
      As a ~~centre/~~ to the right of Genghis Khan voter…
      
      There! Fixed that for ya. 😉
      
      Not that there’s anything wrong with that. And yes, there will be opportunities to take a more right-wing approach in opposition against this government, especially Green silliness. But a sharp lurch to the right? Nope – gotta take votes of NZ First and soft Labour voters to win in 2020, which, as always, means National has to head to the centre. And sell the message they are more competent. After three terms they nearly did it in 2017, in 2020, after three years of this government it will be a whole lot easier.
      
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      October 21, 2017 11:42am
      - Rodney Randall
        
        “But a sharp lurch to the right?”
        
        Self absorbed psychological projection there Kimbo;)
        
        There…fixed that for ya! lol
        
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        October 21, 2017 12:31pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Rodney Randall
        
        “But a sharp lurch to the right?”
        
        Self absorbed psychological projection there Kimbo;)
        
        How so? Based on the regular posts that you and Philbest make – and good luck to you, I’m not criticising your views as such, and you are entitled to both have and state them – but if you got your way it would be, in the NZ political, a hard right lurch.
        
        But deluding yourself you are (my emphasis) “centre/right” in an echo-chamber with Philbest?! And more to the point, what voter demographic of the electorate did National lose to the other side of the political divide in 2017…that another party on the right could have picked up? Maybe a few of the anti-Maori seats brigade who voted for NZ First, but then National could have lost even more soft-urban liberals to Labour if they had adopted Winston’s policy.
        
        But hey, in line with your hard-right authoritarianism (and good luck to ya for it – again, I’m not criticising you as such for it), if you want to post that assertion without an explanation and pertinent facts to back it up yet expect it to be taken as self-evident truth, go for it…
        
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        October 21, 2017 12:47pm
      - Rodney Randall
        
        Kimbo:
        
        “But hey, in line with your hard-right authoritarianism”
        
        “if you want to post that assertion without an explanation and pertinent facts to back it up yet expect it to be taken as self-evident truth, go for it”
        
        Self absorbed paradoxical psychological projection… ad infinitum;) lol
        
        Phil deserves continual praise for his his unwaivering, non- partisan critique of the current housing Bubble. If that is an echo-chamber you are uncomfortable with, then I am very comfortable.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:01pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ The proof was in my original wording. You posted
        
        Self absorbed psychological projection there Kimbo;)
        
        and have followed up with…
        
        Self absorbed paradoxical psychological projection… ad infinitum;) lol
        
        …yet in contrast to my posts at 11:42AM and 12:47PM (admittedly verbose in the manner in which Kiwibloggers like yourself have come to expect and appreciate from me 😉 )
        
        …you have marshaled no facts. Instead, like an authoritarian, you expect your assertion to be accepted as self-evident for no other reason than…you have asserted it.
        
        Let’s cut through the faff and get to the nitty-gritty – in what way, and in respect of what particular political, social and economic policies lead you to the conclusion you are (again, to quote you but with my emphasis) “centre/right”? Is an important point, I’d suggest, as victory for the centre-right in 2020 depends on good analysis of the 2017 result…and I’m not convinced that you (and Philbest and DifferentPerspective for example) represent the demographic and perspective you purport. Instead, you offer the temptation of a false and radical turn that could entrench the new government for up to three terms…because it would occupy the centre.
        
        But anyway, back to those policies, perspectives and values of yours you think are centre/right…
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:10pm
      - PhilBest
        
        Hard-right authoritarianism???????
        
        You can’t tell the difference between a fascist and a classical liberal? I stand with the inheritors of the Winston Churchill tradition: opposed to authoritarianism both left and right – of which urban planning is one of the most repugnant modern-day manifestations. If you are an apologist for that and a defender of the spineless “centre right” politicians who won’t push back against it, you are at the very least a sellout to authoritarianism.
        
        But smearing the strongest opponents of authoritarianism, AS “the authoritarians”, is all par for the course in these upside-down SJW times, where the alleged “Nazis” are the Winston Churchill types and the alleged “anti Nazis” are the PC thought police, the eco-Goebbells’s, the imposers of anti-white-male quotas, the indoctrinators of children, etc etc.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:26pm
      - Rodney Randall
        
        Kimbo:
        
        “As a centre/ to the right of Genghis Khan voter”
        
        “But a sharp lurch to the right”
        
        “But deluding yourself”
        
        “But hey, in line with your hard-right authoritarianism”
        
        “you have marshaled no facts”
        
        “Instead, like an authoritarian, you expect your assertion to be accepted as self-evident for no other reason than…you have asserted it.”
        
        All authoritative assumptions:)
        
        I praised Phil for his continuing non-partisan critique of the dreadful state of the housing market in New Zealand and you assume albeit with a disclaimer “?” (I’ll give you that) that I am a hard right authoritarian.
        
        If the new government can deal to the great big ponzi scheme then all power to them. This is Phil Twyford’s chance to shine.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:32pm
      - PhilBest
        
        How many seats did Don Brash pick up for National in 2005 after the 2002 record low? And you’ve got the chutzpah to say principles Brash stood for, like honesty about colonial history and documents and Treaties; pushing back against Eco propaganda lies and economic strangulation; having a decent defence force; restoring parental authority over children; giving more education choice (allowing escape from the Left’s indoctrination factories); etc – is electorally unsaleable?
        
        This is a self-fulfilling prophecy – once you have had years of a centre right government that betrayed all its former principles and largely assented to the once-radical, easily debunked lie based program of its predecessors, the people are lulled into a whole left-shifted new values system. It is not even a question of opposing “opinions” – when you don’t even use the facts and evidence that are at your disposal, you aren’t “noble” in any way at all – not even on the grounds that you put “consensus” first. If you won’t put truth first, you are an agent of the monstrous. Period. We forget classical good advice about civilisations and vigilance, at our peril.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:37pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ PhilBest
        
        Hard-right authoritarianism???????
        
        No, I was confining that statement to Rodney Randell alone.
        
        I have no doubt about your political and ideological pedigree, Philbest. Don’t agree with some of it, not convinced it is the primary means by which a National-led government will regain power in 2020, but I acknowledge your position is indeed that of a classical liberal – which, in the current NZ context is…right wing, not centre/right.
        
        At least you know what you are and/or don’t misrepresent yourself. My problem is that Rodney Randall seems at best confused, at worst trying to act as a “concern troll”/ideological shill among us mushy centrists! 😉 From what I’ve seen of his comments and style he is no libertarian, nor a centrist of any description. Hence, unlike you or me, there is no real discussion of facts and issues forthcoming from him.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:38pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Rodney Randall
        
        So still no explanation of those policies, views and values of yours that make you (here, I’ll repeat your words yet again, with emphasis) “centre/right”? 😉
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:40pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Philbest
        
        How many seats did Don Brash pick up for National in 2005 after the 2002 record low?
        
        Um, less than Labour in 2005, and even less than the Labour and the Greens combined that year.
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_general_election,_2005
        
        Compare and contrast with Bill English in 2017 who won more than both, and you think Brash’s strategy is a winning one for 2020?!
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_general_election,_2017
        
        And you’ve got the chutzpah to say principles Brash stood for, like honesty about colonial history and documents and Treaties; pushing back against Eco propaganda lies and economic strangulation; having a decent defence force; restoring parental authority over children; giving more education choice (allowing escape from the Left’s indoctrination factories); etc – is electorally unsaleable?
        
        And you’ve got the chutzpah to say that yours is likely to be the primary winning strategy for National and the right in 2020…but you don’t answer the challenge I set Rodney Randell – where from the votes that NZ First/Labour/Greens is this great flood going to come from?! Until you answer that, you are selling moonshine.
        
        This is a self-fulfilling prophecy – once you have had years of a centre right government that betrayed all its former principles and largely assented to the once-radical, easily debunked lie based program of its predecessors, the people are lulled into a whole left-shifted new values system. It is not even a question of opposing “opinions” – when you don’t even use the facts and evidence that are at your disposal, you aren’t “noble” in any way at all – not even on the grounds that you put “consensus” first. If you won’t put truth first, you are an agent of the monstrous. Period. We forget classical good advice about civilisations and vigilance, at our peril.
        
        yes, and that confirms you are way out on the margins in an echo chamber. Me? I’m a floating centrist happy to have found a home in pragmatic National. That you feel let down and disappointed and talking about National’s “principles” (people have been moaning like you since 1949!)
        
        …confirms yours is not the perspective that should be given much heed when it comes to strategising for 2020. Like it or not, based on every NZ election sine..forever, there are more of me than you. The centre decides elections, not the margins, be they left or right.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:49pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Philbest
        
        And did you also notice in that link to the 2005 election result, that ACT went from 9 seats to 2! That’s right, Don Brash,
        
        …the man who managed to lose East Coast Bays a safe National seat twice in 1980 and 1981,
        
        …and who plucked defeat out of the jaws of victory with the Exclusive Brethren saga in the closing stages of the 2005 election campaign
        
        …is the man whose right-ward march with National ended up dealing the fatal blow that put National’s one right-wing coalition partner, ACT, on Epsom-electorate life-support where it has been as a bit-player ever since. And you think going right is where extra votes are to be found for a National and partner coalition?!
        
        Oh, yes, and then when Brash finally went to ACT where he should have been all along, he nearly killed it off altogether by ditching Hide and installing the most non-libertarian candidate he could find, John Banks, as the Epsom candidate lifeline.
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:09pm
      - Rodney Randall
        
        Kimbo:
        
        “So still no explanation of those policies, views and values of yours that make you (here, I’ll repeat your words yet again, with emphasis) “centre/right”?”
        
        You appear, at least to me, to be over-conceptualising/fetishising the term centre right with respect to my statement) Read my last comment in my last post if you are genuinely struggling to understand my position?
        
        If you need some tissues yell out;)
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:19pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Philbest
        
        Love your passion, Philbest, although I find your rhetoric about “Vichy National” tedious, shallow and repetitive at times – but good luck to you, as others no doubt find much of what I post tedious -but you don’t have the winning prescription. “It’s the economy, Stupid” is still what wins and loses elections. At least in the long-haul.
        
        After three terms, not burdened with a coalition with Peters and still at 44% and in good shape for 2020? Is as good as National – and any partners – were ever going to do. You can’t win ’em all, and if Labour had stayed with Little, and Peters had got, say 15-20%, you would still have seen a NZ First-Labour-Green government. The slimy old bastard would have got more, maybe even the Prime Ministership. All Jacindamania did was rearrange the chairs on the centre-left side of the divide. Now, when NZ First goes under the 5% in 2020, and there is a wasted vote, not to mention disillusioned soft-Labour centrists who will desert Labour, National could well be 49-51%. A winning result.
        
        Is not a given, and it will have to be earned by National with hard work and unity, and there is always that most tricky of political determinants – events! – to take into account. But I would not despair if I was National. But you? Sorry, cant see enough of voters like you to ever get what you want in NZ. We are,after all, the home of the welfare state! 😉
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:21pm
      - treadingthemill
        
        I was happy to vote for John Key. I would never vote for someone like Brash. Brash is the sort of person who would dump toxic waste on children’s playgrounds if he thought there was money to be made from it.
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:25pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Rodney Randall
        
        You appear, at least to me, to be over-conceptualising/fetishising the term centre right with respect to my statement)
        
        He he he. No, it is a specific and definable term characterised by distinguishable values and policies, just as “authoritarian” and “libertarian” are – which, I note Philbest defined in this same thread. But then I guess he was “over-conceptualising/fetishising” too! 😉 Bottom line for a sensible discussion, especially concerning ideology and politics: always define your terms. 😉 An accurate self-assessment also helps.
        
        Read my last comment in my last post if you are genuinely struggling to understand my position?
        
        OK, now that would be:
        
        I praised Phil for his continuing non-partisan critique of the dreadful state of the housing market in New Zealand
        
        But Philbest, of his own admission is a partisan who blogs for partisan political purposes – and good luck to him for it. For example, just today he posted on this very thread:
        
        one reason I returned to the blogosphere after a few years absence having given up all hope, was that a few people, including you, had seen the light and joined the fight.
        
        Doesn’t mean Philbest can’t give a non-partisan analysis, but then his solution to the overvalued housing market – abolishing central planning and urban planning controls – is far right. Yet again, doesn’t make it wrong, but back to my point – you are deluding yourself and others if you think, on that basis, you are “centre/right”. Philbest sure ain’t and he knows it!
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:36pm
      - Rodney Randall
        
        Kimbo.
        
        You have gone off half-cocked.
        In your haste, to cast further aspersions, for fetishisations unbeknownst, you did not read the precise last statement of the post I was referring to. You read the second to last statement:)
        
        For your benefit, here is the last statement of the post I was referring to:
        
        “If the new government can deal to the great big ponzi scheme then all power to them. This is Phil Twyford’s chance to shine.”
        
        They have my full support in addressing the issues National were proven to be dilatory on, until proven otherwise.
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:53pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Rodney Randell
        
        Yeah, nah. Everyone of every political persuasion agrees that housing prices should ease/become more affordable, and there is currently an under-supply.
        
        What based on their policy announcements do you expect PhilTwyford to do, and more to the point what would you have him do…and how is that “centre/right”?
        
        Sorry, Rodney, but based on your comments on Kiwiblog for a while on a number of issues – social ones too including religious tolerance – you don’t strike me as “centre-right”. Again, it doesn’t make you wrong, but centre/right. Let’s just say your evasiveness on the issue including values and policies reinforces my original assessment until contrary data is forthcoming. Not that it counts for anything, nor are you answerable to me…
        
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        October 21, 2017 3:07pm
      - Rodney Randall
        
        “Everyone of every political persuasion (agrees) that housing prices should ease/become more affordable, and there is currently an under-supply.” Maybe in principal Kimbo, maybe. The genuflecting is over:)
        
        Action is now required.
        
        http://www.labour.org.nz/government_should_abolish_auckland_urban_growth_boundary
        
        What would I like to see?
        
        A fair/equitable housing system. An end to speculation and land banking, the removal of the RUB/MUL’s.
        
        Segregated Sharia swimming lanes in the name of inclusivity/diversity feels:)
        
        Let’s give Labour a chance. Phil is acutely aware of what is required;)
        
        Far/Alt Right Authoritative message over lol
        
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        October 21, 2017 3:35pm
      - PhilBest
        
        Kimbo, thanks for embodying Vichy National with your comments, and proving my point.
        
        Of course you didn’t “lose” an actual war; you just were enlightened enough to go with the winning side, the wave of the future for humanity! And Don Brash / Charles de Gaulle and their supporters are just losers living inside echo chambers. In fact they are “evil”; the comment from “Treadingthemill” is typical virtue-signalling parroting of Leftist smears of an honourable man (while Key the real Wall Street stooge played the lot of them for the suckers they are). And never mind about facts and evidence (CAGW, colonial history, urban planning outcomes etc), you can’t fight the “Goebbels/Francis Galton/Margaret Sanger complex” / the mainstream media.
        
        And who is “partisan”: people who in 2005 – 2008 would have gladly added Green Red Tape and “housing unaffordability” to the list of Helen’s evils, only to be saying in 2017 that a median multiple of 10 is OK, just the way the world is these days, and those caring Greenies are right, the planet must be saved from urban sprawl after all – just because “their team” is keeping the government benches warm with their Vichy arses?
        
        How come a guy who supported Lange-Douglas Labour, Bolger-Richardson National, Don Brash National, and now gives credit to Phil Twyford while criticising Nick Smith – and heavily criticised Muldoon and Helen Clark – is “partisan”? You are unable to recognise “principles” as someone’s guiding light? Of course, when you support the sellout of principles by your own “team”, I suppose you call that “principled” rather than “partisan”.
        
        As for your smear of Rodney Randall, I fail to see any evidence from his postings on here that he is an “authoritarian” of any kind – he defies SJW thought policing, which makes him anti authoritarian, and he opposes urban growth boundaries, which also makes him anti authoritarian.
        
        In an upside-down world, the long work of evil cultural marxists, you epitomise Vichy-ish embracing of your conquerors evils as a matter of expedience, and the self-deluding mental gymnastics that go along with this.
        
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        October 21, 2017 6:33pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Philbest
        
        So still no explanation of how, if National and some as-yet-non-existent coalition partner move rightward they will take enough votes off the 3-headed hydra to muster a winning majority?
        
        Oh, and I didn’t say that Brash wasn’t “honourable”. Just incompetent when it really counted – and I’m not responsible for treadingthemill’s assessment of the man, indeed it’s not one I agree with. I think Brash cares deeply for people. Just like those Greens to whom you ascribe bad faith. It’s just I reject the extremism of both. Which leads me to…
        
        …you accuse others, including me of being “Vichy” (as I never subscribed to your point of view how does that make me a traitor/compromiser?)
        
        …and you take offense at being labelled a partisan (with the clarification “and good luck to him for it…doesn’t make it wrong”)?!
        
        Ho hum, “Steel fist/glass jaw syndrome”. Thought you were made of sterner stuff and didn’t mind actually challenging your assumptions. Seems I’ve made a mistake. I’ll leave you to stroke your existing mindset while accusing others of moral and intellectual deficiencies…
        
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        October 21, 2017 7:51pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Philbest
        
        …oh, yes, and if you had read the thread carefully you would have seen that my skepticism of Rodney Randell’s self-assessment that he is a “centre/right voter” is based on his posts over a period of time. Drop in and out like you do, usually on a Saturday and you miss what can get posted that reveals mindsets over more frequent visits.
        
        My throw-away line that he was authoritarian was based solely, as I explained in my post at 1:10PM, that he made an assertion without backing it up. Nothing more. Not on this thread, anyway.
        
        But you tell me: Is opposing urban growth boundaries traditionally a center or a far-right policy? Note, I’m making no judgement on whether it is right or wrong, nor whether it would work more effectively than the current status quo (and it says something about your partisan level of engagement that I have to – yet again!!! – give that sort of caveat!)
        
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        October 21, 2017 8:09pm
      - Rodney Randall
        
        Kimbo: Still fetishising over the centre-right statement?
        Ritalin run out?
        
        I note you have chosen to ignore my statements re. what it is, I would like to see happen, and the link to Phil Twyford’s post, outlining Labour’s plans to address the housing bubble.
        
        Perhaps you don’t agree with Labour’s plans to do away with the abitrary black squiggles on maps?
        Perhaps you have some legitimate concerns over the authenticity of the policy?
        Perhaps you simply prefer the status quo?
        
        Trying to frame solutions as historically right or left are futile. We are in a different environment now.
        
        There is cross party consensus on many of the solutions, at least in principal. National had their chance to enact the most critical and chose the status quo.
        
        It is up to Labour now to prove that they have the political willpower/fortitude to see these instrumental changes through.
        
        We at least owe them this chance. Perhaps, they like National, will kowtow to vested interests?
        
        Time will tell.
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWPgoAI1cLE
        
        PM John Key on Housing Reform 2007 R.I.P.
        
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        October 21, 2017 10:38pm
- kowtow
  
  Pleb
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:15am
- emmess
  
  I was quite happy with the election result.
  It is the selection result that I am disgusted with, but I know it is for the best in the long run.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:45am
- labrator
  
  I’ve reported your comment to the Minister of Domestic and Sexual Violence. Your promotion of sexual assault is at minimum a homophobic microaggression.
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:13am
  - KevOB
    
    Minister of Domestic and Sexual Violence
    
    Minster: James Shaw.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:47am
- lifesgood
  
  It may come as a surprise to you that we right wingers do not sell our souls to the devil, which is exactly what you have done. Totally unprincipled. I don’t know how you can hold your head up.
  
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  October 21, 2017 12:35pm
- MrTips
  
  If your happiness depends on political butthurt, you really need to get out more.
  
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  October 21, 2017 1:02pm
- Nermal
  
  The next 2-3 years will be a blogger’s dream as this government of incompetents make stuff up after stuff up, let alone the scandals that will inevitably follow as they try to cover them up.
  
  Think of all the borax you will be able to throw at our resident lefties while they are still suffused with their current victorious glow.
  
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  October 21, 2017 5:00pm
  - Rachael Membery
    
    Only if the media chooses to report it.
    
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    October 22, 2017 12:14pm
kowtow

If “African” Americans are so unhappy with the US why don’t they go back to their cultural homeland in Africa.

“I have no problem with players taking a knee during these protests. I haven’t stood up for the flag since I was in the army nearly 50 years ago,”

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/10/knee-anti-racist-protests-move-nfl-171019153538456.html
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October 21, 2017 9:14am
- PhilBest
  
  Martin Luther King was honourable enough to constantly remind his people of the “bright side” like this. African-Americans even in the 1960’s, were still better off than many Europeans, let alone Africans. King said more than once, something like this; while America is the best-off nation in the world, if African Americans were considered to be a separate nation, they would be 7th best off in the world.
  
  He also took the ground that African-Americans were merely trying to “cash a cheque drawn on the bank of the inheritance of western civilisation”. No cultural Marxism for him. Sir Apirana Ngata was similar here. He’d be spinning in his grave at the subterfuges of the Waitangi Tribunal.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:18am
- VicParking
  
  They did, Liberia “The Republic of Liberia began as a settlement of the American Colonization Society, who believed black people would face better chances for freedom in Africa than in the United States.” Look what a shit hole that turned out to be.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:29am
- realityczech
  
  They are dirty stinking beasts who need to be trained with the lash. Along with all other Trump haters regardless of their skin tone.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:29am
- Disaster Area
  
  Could it be the same reason that ‘Irish-Americans’ don’t go back to Ireland?
  
  It is ironic that people are getting criticized for refusing to stand for the national anthem when those criticizing them keep banging on about service people paying the ultimate sacrifice for keeping America free.
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:44am
Pongo

Its quite a pale and male cabinet from our new right on PM, this was usually quite the talking point with Key,s cabinet picks but I am sure the media are busy preparing their stories.
I am waiting to hear Willie Jackson complain that all the Maoris are outside cabinet.
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October 21, 2017 9:15am
Steve (North Shore)

“Not my Prime Minister”
“Commie Chic”

3 tee shirts being made this afternoon
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October 21, 2017 9:15am
- PhilBest
  
  Don’t forget the tie-dying….!
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:48am
James Stephenson

What’s the betting our “unbiased” media fail to challenge Chip Shop Girl when she cancels tax cuts for the low paid in order yous subsidise university education for the rich?
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October 21, 2017 9:19am
- Disaster Area
  
  You do realise that its not just the rich that go to university?
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:45am
  - Milhous
    
    Correct. But that does not preclude the fact she has chosen to subsidise a huge number of teenagers, from Auckland , whose parents have made millions on the property market, to go to university.It makes no sense . There is no rational economic argument for this . This is very very poor use of your money .
    
    This was the purchase of votes . I find it disgusting.
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:40am
    - rightoverlabour
      
      My daughter will be going to university in 2019. We have saved for this so she would not be burdened by a loan. However, if student loans are 0% and there is free education, I am going to ask her to take out the largest loan she can get, chuck it in against the mortgage and then we can pay that back interest free later on. Thought I’d find at least one silver lining. Thanks “Chicky Babe”…
      
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      October 21, 2017 12:44pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Owning a house in Auckland is not ‘making millions’ though. It’s just owning a house, going to work, paying a mortgage, paying for maintenance, paying huge rates. You’d only ‘make millions’ if you sold up and went to live in Dunedin. People really need to understand that a house is just a house, however ridiculous its inflation.
      
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      October 21, 2017 1:45pm
      - realityczech
        
        People are greedy and ignorant. They can’t see it.
        
        0 1
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        October 21, 2017 6:43pm
      - treadingthemill
        
        People are greedy and ignorant. They can’t see it.
        
        Not all people.
        
        5 0
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        October 21, 2017 6:50pm
      - realityczech
        
        More than enough to decide the market Milhouse.
        
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        October 21, 2017 6:53pm
      - RF
        
        I know a cop on promotion transferred to Auckland. His wife is a nurse so they managed to buy a reasonable house for a huge deposit and massive mortgage.
        
        Labours policies are to crash the market and the cop is going to be left with a house far less than what he paid but still coughing up a massive mortgage.
        
        Obviously there are many other examples that are worse.
        
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        October 21, 2017 8:50pm
  - lifesgood
    
    DA, those who have low income parents were already heavily subsidised. In fact, I didn’t think that was fair either. My kids worked part time to pay their own way through because we thought it would be good for them to take responsibility. They graduated well and now have good jobs.
    
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    October 21, 2017 12:40pm
    - Paulus
      
      Are you saying that certain ethnic groupings get special treatment including financial incentives in getting into Universities ?
      Surely not !
      
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      October 21, 2017 2:05pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      ” They graduated well and now have good jobs.”
      
      I hope those jobs are still there after a couple of years of Tooth Fairy magic.
      
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      October 21, 2017 3:37pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    The lazy poor go to Uni – too lazy to work
    
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    October 21, 2017 6:32pm
Southern Raider

Would be great if someone could create and keep live a web page documenting
– policies before election of all three parties
– policies decided as part of coalition
– which actually get implemented
– which promises and timeframes get missed

MSM won’t keep them honest
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October 21, 2017 9:20am
- Digmen1
  
  And could you add
  The number of houses built
  The number of new drug addicts
  The total tax take
  The number of Charter schools
  The number of kiwis deserting New Zealand
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:26am
  - VicParking
    
    Dont forget ‘childern in poverty’
    
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    October 21, 2017 9:30am
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Ah, easy: they’ll just change the definition.
      
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      October 21, 2017 1:47pm
      - Nermal
        
        Won’t need too. When poverty becomes widespread like Venezuela those kids will be just like the rest of us.
        
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        October 21, 2017 5:04pm
Digmen1

I remember under the last few years of Helen Clarks term there was a collective feeling of oppression over us all. Nanny State etc.
With Labour back in its going to happen again – unions, taxes, social welfare gone mad.
The only good thing is that this time it will be tempered by NZF.
That’s why I don’t see this coalition lasting very long.
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October 21, 2017 9:23am
- All_on_Red
  
  I hope it lasts awhile though. Long enough for some lulz and for the public to be reminded how truly hopeless this bunch is.
  It’s way different being on the outside lobbing bricks in than having to defend what you are doing- everyday…
  
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  October 21, 2017 9:31am
Pongo

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5001452/Man-NOT-guilty-rape-did-not-know-illegal.html

Canada did contortions on this one, I would suggest if it was a white supremecist that did this he would be looking at quite a long stretch. Justice is not quite so blind it seems and arguably some of the most vulnerable of women have just lost yet a little more control of their lives and bodies under Trudeaus watch.
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October 21, 2017 9:31am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Yes, when it comes to who ‘wins’, women, gays or muslims, it seems now muslims are winning. Equal rights for women and gays take second place.
  
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  October 21, 2017 1:50pm
RF

When John Key was PM the left threw all the filth they could find at him.

This included threats to rape his daughter etc…

I now wonder how the left will react if someone makes similar threats about socialist Cindy.

As an aside I am finding that many people did not know about Cindy’s Marxist beliefs and when I showed them the video etc, were disgusted. There is now more documentation on the net about this.

That’s one area that must be made more public as having her as a PM is not a good look for this country.
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October 21, 2017 9:33am
- MCos
  
  “I now wonder how the left will react if someone makes similar threats about socialist Cindy.”
  You must be naive if you think all manner of similar, if not much worse, threats have not already been made.
  Anyone in her position is subjected to attacks such as this, particularly women.
  By the way, when Yingluck was PM of Thailand people used to go to anti government rallies with stomach churning banners and otherwise respectable people would make appalling sexist speeches from the stage.
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:28am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Yes, people are ignorant and naive. Either they haven’t seen the youtube video of Comrade Jacinda’s IUSY speech, or they are totally ignorant about the evils of socialism and communism. They know about the holocaust, but not about Stalin’s millions of murders. I met a twentysomething woman claiming to be studying film who didn’t even know what ‘former East Germany’ and ‘the wall’ meant!
  
  Young people think communism is harmless.
  
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  October 21, 2017 1:54pm
  - Paulus
    
    But so many voters have never known before MMP as they were like Cinderella probably very young or not born.
    
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    October 21, 2017 2:07pm
VicParking

Union hack on Red radio this morning talking about the living wage and how wonderful it will be.
Was asked to comment on all the rest homes going out of business she commented that ‘its about time all the captialist pricks who have been carpet bagging off the old and the sick realise there is a new order in NZ.’
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October 21, 2017 9:34am
- Digmen1
  
  Yes those union hacks need to remember that probably the bosses they are talking about were once workers themselves.
  And they are probably mortgaged up to the hilt, and not making much moire than the office cleaner.
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:22am
  - Evadne
    
    Not forgetting all the “old and sick” people now forced out of their rest homes.
    
    5 0
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    October 21, 2017 1:28pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  Can’t wait for unemployment to rise as the living wage kicks in. Sorry no jobs, can’t afford to pay you… You voted for this shit, suck it up losers, yes the real losers will ultimately be the supporters of those parties….
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:30am
  - holysheet
    
    In any recession, it is always the poor who get shafted the most. Oh well, they all voted for this clusterfuck so they reap what they voted for.
    
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    October 21, 2017 10:48am
  - KKKKatee
    
    But will Jacinda care sitting on $500K for imposing her Marxist ‘visions’ up on all of us? Nope
    
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    October 21, 2017 12:08pm
- Ross12
  
  I did not hear it all yesterday but someone made the comment on radio along the lines of –employers are reluctant to pay the living wage because their workers are worse off because the increase affects WFF (I think it was).
  
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  October 21, 2017 11:31am
  - KevOB
    
    That is highly likely: the benefit abatements can result in more than a dollar loss for an apparent dollar gained–tax is in the equation too.
    
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    October 21, 2017 2:01pm
- Nermal
  
  Gonna demand a “Living Superannuation “ in parity.
  
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  October 21, 2017 5:06pm
Southern Raider

My major concerns aren’t around taxes and new spending as those can be reversed and you can’t spend lots of money that quickly

It’s employment reform which will fuck up businesses and education reform which will fuck up our children’s education

Just as National Standards is starting to improve outcomes they will scrap it
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October 21, 2017 9:38am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Has a tax ever been reversed though? I’m worried about Labour’s love of CGT, Land Tax, Wealth Tax. Punishing those of us who have taken responsibility and saved and invested for our future.
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:00pm
Steve (North Shore)

The Nation. Taxcinder’s answer to every question “Labour’s Policy remains in place” “Labour’s Policy remains in place” “Labour’s Policy remains in place”
How about telling NZ what those Policies are?
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October 21, 2017 9:49am
- Digmen1
  
  Yes, and I heard on the radio talking about this being a Labour government.
  
  She needs to understand MMP and realise that she is in a coalition.
  
  Winston will soon make her realise that!
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:24am
  - Paulus
    
    Shaw has already done that by announcing the Greens policies, for example of Cannabis this morning.
    Understand he did this without getting Cindy’s permission – a real no no.
    She is the H1 and H2 remember.
    
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    October 21, 2017 2:11pm
Dave Mann

I’ve just read an opionion piece on Stuff by Duncan Garner about the Election and surprisingly its not just a fluffy left wing rave…. but the point of my comment is the sheer inadequacy if his writing style. If this is the level of journalism we can expect from one of New Zealand’s more widely known and active commenters, then god help the MSM:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/98090961/duncan-garner-the-accidental-prime-minister-and-the-utopian-expectations

DPF, your writing style and journalistic talent far outstrips this every day!
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October 21, 2017 10:09am
- brett68
  
  Duncan Donuts has shit for brains, this is as good as he can do.
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:24am
- Kimbo
  
  Thought it was good and punchy. But then he is a broadcaster and maybe it was for broadcast in the first instance. Spoken and written prose are different.
  
  And like his protege Paddy Gower, Garner has always been a non-partisan, equal-opportunity muck-raker. You will enjoy his work holding the new government to account for the next three years.
  
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  October 21, 2017 12:16pm
  - Dave Mann
    
    OK yes good point. He is a broadcaster rather than a written journalist. And the article didn’t seem to be partisan lefty fluff….
    
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    October 21, 2017 12:29pm
- Disaster Area
  
  Much the same as Mike Hosking.
  
  All the one sentence paragraphs.
  
  Its as if he’s spoken into a machine. That turns his speech into prose.
  
  Happy Days.
  
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  October 21, 2017 1:30pm
david

Impertinent question of the day.

Do any Government diplomatic appointees overseas need to consider resigning if they are related to a member of the incoming ruling party ( coalition)

I have nothing against the NZ High Commissioner to Nuie but as father to the PM is his position compromised?
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October 21, 2017 10:12am
JibberJabber

The bullshit was flowing thick and fast on the Lisa Owen show with Taxinda this morn, tho` she is showing up Shaw for the complete and utter milquetoast lickspittle that he is.
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October 21, 2017 10:24am
rightoverlabour

What is it with Stuff making shit up? Now they are talking about Bill’s replacement. https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/98089719/if-bill-english-goes-these-people-are-his-likely-replacements

Bill English did not lose the election. He did better than the three times Hellen won her elections. National gained 200,000 more votes than the last election. The only reason he is not PM today is that he decided not to be ambushed by the Terrorist Winston. Jacinda rolled over and said she’d take it any way he wanted, and didn’t care if Shaw got a bit of action on the side. Principles vs Prostitution.
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October 21, 2017 10:26am
- brett68
  
  The medias job over the next six months will be to trash and vilify National at every opportunity.
  
  This will be a two-pronged attack
  
  1) Try and splinter National and make them look like they’re in disarray because this is the only way Ardern and the socialists get a second term.
  
  2) Paint them as incompetent.
  Quickly forgotten will be the budget surplus and how well the economy was, the narrative will rapidly change to the economy was actually in terrible shape because National had given all the money to their rich prick mates here and overseas and had somehow pulled the wool over everyone’s eyes
  
  Any economic downturn will be the fault of National caused by their economic stupidity and Nationals foreign investor mates purposely throwing spanners into the works to make Queen Jacinda look bad
  
  The fake news that’s going to be coming out the media will make your head spin.
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:47am
  - kowtow
    
    It was fake news perpetrated by the Media party that got Jax elected.
    
    Child poverty , global warming , inequality , dirty rivers. Apart from the so called housing crisis and Indian student rorts ,these were the constant messages pushed . Nothing positive , just relentless attack.
    
    Like they did , and still do , towards Brash’s “infamous ” Orewa speech that resonated so strongly with the New Zealand mainstream.
    
    And in respect to child poverty that Labour claim to end , they won’t because it is a statistical measure and faikls to account for human nature. There will always be a small but significant proportions of shit heads who no matter what you do for them or how much you give them , will always fuck up through bad choices .
    
    Same with suicides. Personal choice.
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:28am
    - Classic Liberal
      
      Child poverty can be defined in various ways. Here are the options now: 1. Media stop reporting it because they love Taxinda. 2. Taxinda’s Team just change the definition.
      
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      October 21, 2017 2:05pm
    - Brito
      
      Brash’s Orewa speech was stupidity personified. His minders should have told him that the truth in this PC world will always be distorted or not reported at all.
      
      If he was going to have this ‘truth’ as his bridgehead to the Treasury he should have banned media coverage. He should have set up a schedule of media free meetings around NZ and had security around the hall to ‘remove’ the trouble when it started.
      
      This is how a message needs to be spread in this world dominated by a myopic, left wing media. Look how freedom of speech is stymied around the world if it is at odds with the distorted realities of SJW or entitled feminist greenies.
      
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      October 21, 2017 2:32pm
- Nermal
  
  He is in opposition. He did lose. We have had MMP for 21 years and if he hasn’t worked out the rules yet he needs to step aside. Obviously can’t teach that old dog new tricks.
  
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  October 21, 2017 5:18pm
  - Brito
    
    Dork!!!!
    
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    October 21, 2017 8:43pm
kevn

“Houses for everyone” … rentals to be “warm and dry” as well. Who wouldn’t vote for that semi-promise?
They could ban unvented/portable LPG heaters, that would certainly be a big help. They dump huge amounts of moisture into a room when lit.
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October 21, 2017 10:32am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Most sensible landlords have that in the contract already.
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:06pm
publicwatchdog

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
NZ WHISTLE-BLOWER ALERT!

21 October 2017

Maltese investigative journalist Daphne Caruana-Galizia, played a pivotal role in exposing NZ foreign trusts involvement in corrupt money-laundering – and now she’s dead.

Daphne Carauna-Galizia was blown to pieces in a car bomb assassination on 16 October 2017.

https://www.google.co.nz/amp/www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/car-bomb-killed-panama-papers-11378880.amp

Matthew Carauna-Galizia, son:

“I am never going to forget, running around the inferno in the field, trying to figure out a way to open the door, the horn of the car still blaring, screaming at two policemen who turned up with a single fire extinguisher to use it.

“They stared at me. “I’m sorry, there is nothing we can do”, one of them said.

“I looked down and there were my mother’s body parts all around me. I realised they were right, it was hopeless.

“Who is in the car?”, they asked me.

“My mother is in the car. She is dead.

She is dead because of your incompetence.”
__________________

Malta scandal exposes New Zealand trusts again

Neil Chenoweth and Susan Edmunds

April 28 2017

http://i.stuff.co.nz/business/world/91999096/malta-scandal-exposes-new-zealand-trusts-again

A Malta magistrate is investigating explosive claims of money laundering and corruption that have put New Zealand in the middle of a global cash trail from the family of Azerbaijan president Ilham Aliyev.

President Aliyev’s daughter, Leyla Aliyeva, is alleged to have channelled more than NZ$1.6 million to senior figures of the Malta government, including Prime Minister Joseph Muscat’s wife.

These include alleged payments to Panama companies owned by New Zealand trusts set up by the Malta Energy Minister Karl Mizzi and Muscat’s chief of staff, Keith Schembri.

On April 20, Maltese blogger Daphne Caruana-Galizia reported that she held copies of documents originally stored in a kitchen at Pilatus Bank, which showed that Egrant Inc, a mystery Panama Papers company identified by the Financial Review last year, was secretly owned by the Maltese Prime Minister’s wife, Michelle Muscat.

In March 2016, a Dubai company controlled by Leyla Aliyeva had transferred US$1.017 million (NZ$1.47 million) marked as a loan into Egrant’s account at Pilatus Bank, Caruana-Galizia reported.

Joseph Muscat denied the claims, calling it the “biggest political lie in Malta’s history”.

Caruana-Galizia reported that other payments were made from Leyla Aliyeva’s company to Pilatus accounts held by Egrant as well as Tillgate Inc and Hearnville Inc, two Panama companies that are owned by Schembri and Mizzi, through New Zealand trusts.

Schembri and Mizzi vehemently deny Caruana-Galizia’s reports. Mizzi has produced audited accounts for his New Zealand trust which shows it as dormant with no assets or income.

LUXURY YACHTS

Muscat announced on April 20 that magistrate Aaron Buge would conduct an inquiry into the allegations.

In a controversial energy deal, the Maltese government in 2013 contracted with a consortium led by the State Oil Company of Azerbaijan Republic (SOCAR), which has financed a string of luxury yachts and homes across the world for the Aliyev family, to build a power station and gasification plant in Malta, with SOCAR taking an 18-year contract to supply LPG to Malta.

In 2015, Malta’s auditor general questioned €14 million (NZ$22 million) lost on fuel hedging contracts that the government-owned EneMalta took with SOCAR “at ministerial direction” from Mizzi.

The latest revelations, if substantiated, are an embarrassment for the New Zealand government, which announced an inquiry into its offshore trust laws on April 11 last year, the day after the Financial Review revealed details of how Panama law firm Mossack Fonseca’s Malta agent, BT Nexia, began setting up Tillson, Hearnville and Egrant five days after Muscat’s election victory in 2013.

Mossack Fonseca’s files were obtained by the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists and German newspaper Süddeutsche Zeitung.

New Zealand subsequently amended its offshore trusts regime, requiring foreign trusts to file annual accounts with the New Zealand tax office, but with no further restrictions.

At that time, it appeared the Malta trusts had never been used, after Mizzi and Schembri’s Panama companies were turned down by eight banks who refused to open accounts for them because they were Politically Exposed Persons (PEPs).

The Panama Papers, however, show repeated cases of overseas investors filing false or implausible sets of accounts with New Zealand lawyers, who have limited means to verify the figures.

SIGNIFICANT ROLE

The latest wave of allegations in Malta underline how easily the New Zealand disclosure laws can be avoided, which the new laws do not change.

If the reports are substantiated, they raise a far more serious picture of money-laundering from one of the most corrupt countries in the world, in which New Zealand’s foreign trusts played a significant role.

The saga began in February 2016 when Caruana-Galizia revealed that Schembri and Mizzi had set up two Panama companies, Tillgate Inc and Hearnville Inc, owned by the Haast Trust and Rotorua Trust in New Zealand.

In April 2016, the Financial Review published new details of Schembri and Mizzi’s New Zealand trusts and their attempts to open a bank account in Dubai.

Mossack Fonseca’s Malta files read like a whodunnit.
…..”

RIP Daphne Carauna-Galizia.

Penny Bright

‘Anti-corruption whistle-blower’.
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October 21, 2017 10:38am
- Steve (North Shore)
  
  See?
  I Spray And Walk Away
  Rubbish Stays
  I walk away
  
  Steve N/S
  Attendee Glenfield Trolley Derby 1986
  Fuck I got trolleyed
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:46am
- nasska
  
  Be kind commentators……she’s finally fallen off the edge. 🙂
  
  15 3
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  October 21, 2017 10:50am
- mikenmild
  
  Do you think John Key had the journalist assassinated, Penny? Maybe by a special ANZ hit squad?
  
  20 4
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  October 21, 2017 10:58am
  - stigie
    
    John Key and Ron Mark got their heads together and had the journalist assassinated Penny and all under the cover of darkness.
    Please don’t tell anyone Penny, just you and i know !~
    
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    October 21, 2017 1:24pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    Mike, you did it again. Uptick for you sonny
    
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    October 21, 2017 6:35pm
- KevOB
  
  I’m taking up anti-corruption too.
  Your rates and lack of payment are concerning. There appears to be an issue for the Auditors to investigate. It may also be a police matter. The delays in enforcing judgments against you suggest subversion of due process which is a crime–are you implicated?
  This is a serious scandal and completely domestic.
  
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  October 21, 2017 11:01am
- Rich Prick
  
  The longer your comments, the more insane you appear.
  
  14 3
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  October 21, 2017 11:01am
- Northland Wahine
  
  Lodges a claim with ACC for RSI…
  
  12 1
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  October 21, 2017 11:05am
- treadingthemill
  
  Do you not have your own blog? I think Mr Farrar provides this forum for people to talk, not to make your own blog posts.
  
  13 4
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  October 21, 2017 11:08am
- rightoverlabour
  
  Fuck Off.
  
  11 2
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  October 21, 2017 11:17am
- softail 1450
  
  public watchdog,,,,,,Do you ever answer questions penny ?
  here’s one and I’m serious ,are you ok ,do you need help ? your posts are becoming longer and more bizarre.
  
  14 2
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  October 21, 2017 11:17am
- Yvette
  
  Penny, since the validity of your rates protest against Auckland Council relies on a certain amount of publicity in what you are doing and their response, can you please state what has now happened, since there has been no coverage I am aware of for quite some time.
  
  For the sake of the transparency you espouse, what currently sets you apart from anyone else who is not bothering to pay rates.
  Has the courts ruled you are to have the information you require, or have they decided Auckland Council is acting in accordance with the law.
  What is the current position? I am genuinely interested.
  
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  October 21, 2017 3:46pm
Michael

Ross,
Re house prices in Palmy. I bought at peak in 2007 [also sold in Wanganui at peak the same year] and I can tell you that up until last year had I sold my house I would have got no more for it than I paid back in 2007. In fact I was looking at selling in 2013 and the best offer I received was $50000 less than I paid. Prices have gone up a little in the past few months, mainly in the lower price range [$250000- $400000] My rateable value today is exactly the same as it was back in 2007.
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October 21, 2017 10:46am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  because in palmy (and most non-cities in NZ) the land supply is not restricted and the houses therefore mostly correspond to the cost of developing a section and building a house which stays pretty close to inflation.
  
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  October 21, 2017 11:14am
  - PhilBest
    
    It actually still is restricted, but not to such an extent that other cities are relative to its growth rates. (Note that it is possible to have such tight restrictions that even when the population is shrinking, you have extractive powers for zoned land owners, and unaffordable housing – Liverpool is the object lesson there).
    
    The underlying problem in all of NZ, is really the way the rules got changed back in the 1990’s, about Councils allowable debt burdens. The ideological shift to “save the planet” urban planning was coincidental in time, and is still a major problem in Council Planning departments in Auckland, Wellington and Christchurch at least.
    
    But people like Hugh Pavletich and the late Owen McShane have suggested practical solutions all along, the working model is there for all to learn from, in “most of the USA”. It is the way urban growth is financed that is actually the key.
    
    Ironically if you don’t finance the urban growth because you were scared of the debt burden, you end up with the debt burden anyway, for mortgages – which is really a debt burden for “nothing” (the houses you could have bought anyway at a sane price), along with an infrastructure deficit. It is better to have the debt burden and actually have a whole lot more infrastructure.
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:29am
- Ross12
  
  Thanks Micheal. I don’t have any stats , just going on what my younger relatives, living there, have experienced with their houses. Also I don’t rateable values are much of a guide these days.
  ( Many moons ago I went to Massey Uni so I have a reasonable idea of how the city has spread in the last 30+ years)
  
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  October 21, 2017 11:37am
- Viking2
  
  And in Rotorua and in some area’s in Tauranga.
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:12pm
Longknives

So it Begins-

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11935456

‘Comrades,Comrades,Comrades…’
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October 21, 2017 10:46am
- Steve (North Shore)
  
  I just put my wallet in the safe
  
  13 0
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  October 21, 2017 10:50am
- brett68
  
  Jacinda is going to do a Corybn us, money will start leaving NZ quicker than water going down a plug hole, Jacinda will smile and say
  “There’s going to be some pain NZ but it will be worth it as NZ will be a much better country where no one is hungry and everyone will be happy”
  
  By Christmas, NZ will be a very different place.
  
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  October 21, 2017 10:56am
  - softail 1450
    
    I’m still waiting for piggy muldoons “light at the end of the tunnel” fucking hideously long wait it’s been.
    at least we will all see a new culture,we are all going to know how the folk in Venezuela feel.
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:25am
- kowtow
  
  Welcome to “Venezlandia” , comrade.
  
  16 1
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  October 21, 2017 11:11am
  - Nermal
    
    Venezuela has the oil, we have the refinery and toilet paper factories. Opportunity for a Free Trade agreement.
    
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    October 21, 2017 5:22pm
arkhad

Just watching Adern on the Nation this morning… is the tooth fairy now wearing braces?
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October 21, 2017 10:58am
Captain Mainwaring

Here we go. Two days into the job and we’ll have communism before we know it.
Thanks Winnie.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11935456
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October 21, 2017 11:02am
- rightoverlabour
  
  When will the first statue go up, to be worshipped and idolised…. and what’s the Maori ( fuck the macrons) word for Gulag?
  
  10 3
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  October 21, 2017 11:23am
- Southern Raider
  
  Where is the proof for her claim “NZ has the highest level of homelessness in the developed world”
  
  Has this woman ever been overseas?
  
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  October 21, 2017 3:14pm
Digmen1

From our new glorious leader..

“She said the measures of success must change away from just counting economic growth.

They needed to include things like people’s ability to lead a meaningful life, enjoyment of life, and whether their income was enough to survive and support a family.”

It depends how they get their income. Are they working, or are they staying at home on drugs and watching tv, or burglarising other peoples houses. Or are they women who support their children and their latest partner by having more children so they can stay on the dpb?
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October 21, 2017 11:03am
- Classic Liberal
  
  Not wrong for a country to measure wellbeing and happiness as well as wealth, but not the way she intends to, but stealing from those of us who scratched together a few savings for our future!
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:16pm
Digmen1

I’m sure many pensioners would like a few hundred dollars a week extra so that they can enjoy life.

Where would that come from?
13 0
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October 21, 2017 11:06am
- Steve (North Shore)
  
  Continue to work, then your super gets taxed at 33%.
  $477 per week goes nowhere.
  Wear the old bastards out first.
  
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  October 21, 2017 11:22am
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    No Edit function.
    That should read $477 per fortnight
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:23am
Fletch

Looking back at the NZ Taxpayer Union website, they calculated before the election that a Labour + NZ First + Greens coalition would cost every household $35,787 (or $229.41 a week). The disclaimer at the bottom does point out the amounts may differ based on overlap of policy, but any way you look at it, it is going to be expensive.

http://www.taxpayers.org.nz/bribe_o_meter

Tax and spend. It’s the liberal way.
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October 21, 2017 11:09am
- Nermal
  
  Don’t forget: and borrow
  
  6 0
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  October 21, 2017 5:24pm
  - Flash
    
    That’s the scary bit. Maybe the lenders will check with John Key, and he’ll warn them off –
    
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    October 21, 2017 11:31pm
Digmen1

What is the definition of a “warm and dry” home?

I am very lucky (and grateful) to live in a dry home and one that is insulated.

But it is not “warm” unless I have the heater on all day during the winter. (unless its a really sunny day)
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October 21, 2017 11:09am
- Viking2
  
  yep, rather a conundrum which no doubt the educated and hippies and socialists will have a formula for.
  
  Still some would consider 18 degrees cold while others would consider that hot.
  No pleasing anyone.
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:16pm
brett68

I’ve come to the conclusion that Labour/Greens and NZ First are going to purposely crash the economy.
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October 21, 2017 11:19am
- PhilBest
  
  Which brings me back to what I posted near the top of the thread:
  
  https://croakingcassandra.com/2016/07/28/a-couple-of-cartoons/
  
  “There are no totally easy or fail-safe ways to unwind the disaster that the New Zealand – especially Auckland – housing market has become. But this is a clear example where the sooner it happens the better…”
  
  It should have been done in 2008. I am actually not going to blame Jacinda and Winston if it happens on their watch. It would be a much worse disaster if it didn’t happen until during the term of PM Chris Bishop’s National government in, say, 2025 – by which time the number of people who will be left in negative equity will be much greater, and the total losses much greater.
  
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  October 21, 2017 11:34am
  - brett68
    
    I’m sure this isn’t going to be some noble sacrifice by Labour and Peters, take the fall for the good of NZ long term.
    
    What’s their strategy to retain power? that’s what’s concerning me.
    
    Are we going to be looking at independent media like Kiwi blog shut down?, tilting of the electoral playing field so it will be almost impossible for National to get back in?
    
    These people are ideologues who believe they’re on some holy mission to save NZ, they’re not going without a fight, I really see bad times ahead
    
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    October 21, 2017 12:28pm
- rightoverlabour
  
  What will that do for interest rates?
  
  5 1
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  October 21, 2017 12:20pm
  - brett68
    
    They’ll rapidly increase.
    
    7 0
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    October 21, 2017 12:33pm
    - rightoverlabour
      
      Thanks, so fixing now would be prudent..Mine are fixed but I was thinking of going on a Spending Spree (just following the government’s example) if rates dropped. Probably won’t now.
      
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      October 21, 2017 12:51pm
    - rightoverlabour
      
      Just a followup question, why then after the GFC, did interest rates drop to record lows in the US etc? When we enter our “NZFC”, shouldn’t the same occur?
      
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      October 21, 2017 1:55pm
      - Evadne
        
        Following the GFC, the central banks dropped interest rates to in an effort to stimulate spending (and therefore growth).
        
        NZFC would be a local recession. Since our economy is so small, we’re reliant on overseas banks to lend us the money first. If our economy has tanked, then our cost of borrowing will be higher, hence the hike in interest rates.
        
        Basically, NZ will be seen as a poor or riskier investment, so we will only be able to borrow at higher rates. Coupled with a low NZD, we’ll be stung all round.
        
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        October 21, 2017 3:52pm
      - Piniwi
        
        Wow Evadne thats the quick version that might sound painless to so many who know that wheel has a lot more spokes.
        This toxic mob will drive inflation so fast it will start the wheel spinning with the first rush of wage increases.
        That will be like expecting a pearl by introducing a bit of grit into a green lipped mussel. No pearl but a smelly piece of grit from the wage/cost/price spiral cranking up the revs. Fuel prices and imported consumer goods will skyrocket as the dollar plummets.
        That drags the debt level up even before the borrowing starts to grow of which will be considerable from the get go.
        Things will surely spiral out of control when the NZ credit rating is downgraded.
        More inflationary interventionism will drive up mortgage rates to double their current levels. If anybody thinks that is outrageous has drunk too much Koolade.
        
        Sure we are yet to find out what the true policies that resulted from the negotiations are which another big failure of MMP. No voter can ever expect to get what they voted for from such a farcical Government formation.
        No big deal since most have no idea of policy intentions from the left including the authors. All we can be assured of is that we are being led down the path from boom to bust.
        
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        October 22, 2017 2:56am
- Paulus
  
  The only way to true Socialism is to create destruction first so that it can be seen that growth will come from the ashes – and that can be controlled – see Orwell 1984
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:16pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  “Labour/Greens and NZ First are going to purposely crash the economy.”
  
  Yes.
  
  If you look at the AntiFa types in Europe, running around wearing black and destroying cities, that’s exactly how the hard left think, what they’ve always dreamed of: a revolution. Destroy ‘capitalism’, smash up small businesses, burn cars and motorbikes, beat up anyone who might be ‘right wing’ {ie just a normal centrist or apolitical person going for a walk}. And when those types get a bit older, they enter politics and the media and try to destroy capitalism from the inside. Notice how Comrade Taxinda *refused* to give capitalism any number from one to ten in the interview. Seems like she thinks it has no value, no place at all.
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:26pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    The left have never been good with numbers, they just don’t understand simple math. That’s why they avoid it. Variable arithmetic is just fine in their minds
    
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    October 21, 2017 4:12pm
Kimbo

Hmm.

https://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2017/10/act-party-retards-people-like-louis-houlbrooke/

Here’s the direct accusation the Whale Oil response didn’t address: did you or did you not shill for Winston Peters? 😉
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October 21, 2017 11:23am
Viking2

TSB offers a market-leading new 4.79% three year fixed mortgage rate,

https://www.interest.co.nz/news/90463/just-hsbc-ends-its-387-one-year-special-tsb-offers-market-leading-new-479-three-year
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October 21, 2017 11:31am
Pongo

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11935456

So capitalism has failed because NZ counts its homeless rate in a different way than every other country in the OECD. If we measured it the same way as everyone else we would 4th best in the world ipso facto capitalism is a success. And I quote from the OECD
In New Zealand homelessness is defined as “living situations
where people with no other options to acquire safe and secure housing: are without shelter, in temporary
accommodation, sharing accommodation with a household or living in uninhabitable housing.”
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October 21, 2017 11:51am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Relax folks, communism will fix it, and it’s just around the corner.
  
  11 1
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  October 21, 2017 12:10pm
  - treadingthemill
    
    I like a toke now and then myself. And hopefully it will be made legal before too long.
    
    4 6
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    October 21, 2017 12:19pm
    - starboard
      
      So you knowingly break the law?
      
      3 6
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      October 21, 2017 12:25pm
      - treadingthemill
        
        So you knowingly break the law?
        
        Sure, Dumb laws beg to be broken.
        
        4 4
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        October 21, 2017 12:28pm
      - starboard
        
        I think travelling at 50K’s is a dumb law..it needs breaking…
        
        4 2
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        October 21, 2017 1:27pm
      - treadingthemill
        
        I think travelling at 50K’s is a dumb law
        
        There is a difference. Speeding is likely to put other peoples lives at risk. What I do on very rare occasions does not put anyone’s life at risk. My ethical compass is based on the principle of ‘and it harm none, do what you will.’
        
        But, if you truly believe the law is wrong, break it, and take responsibility for your fate. That would at least be better than being a sheep who obeys any law just because it is law, regardless of whether the law is reasonable or just.
        
        3 5
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        October 21, 2017 1:39pm
      - rightoverlabour
        
        Sorry reported someone, meant to reply. We have a government that supports breaking the law. Me Tu has never been sanctioned by Labour or the Greens. I can’t remember what Terrorist Winston said.
        
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        October 21, 2017 1:59pm
      - treadingthemill
        
        Me Tu has never been sanctioned by Labour or the Greens.
        
        That is not entirely accurate. Jacinda ruled her out of any ministerial position, which is a form of sanctioning.
        
        I can’t remember what Terrorist Winston said
        
        In what way is he a terrorist?
        
        3 3
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        October 21, 2017 2:41pm
      - rightoverlabour
        
        Ok, calling Winston a Terrorist is probably pushing the definition a bit far. The Latin verb terrere means: to frighten. The English word ‘terror’, just like the French terreur, derives from that Latin word and means from of old: fright, alarm, anguish, (mortal) fear, panic.
        Oxford English Dictionary reportedly states that the word ‘terrorist’ (French: terroriste) was invented in the year 1794, during the French Revolution. The first meaning of the word ‘terrorist’ was then: adherent or supporter of the Jacobins. The given definition in Oxford Dictionary shows, the term ‘terrorist’ in its first use was meant as abusive term for someone’s political or historical ideas or allegiances, not as description of his personal actions.
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism
        
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        October 21, 2017 6:30pm
    - Classic Liberal
      
      “My ethical compass is based on the principle of ‘and it harm none, do what you will.’”
      
      So people getting mental health or lung problems from dope can then please pay for their own care? Their problems harm the taxpayer.
      
      5 4
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      October 21, 2017 2:37pm
      - treadingthemill
        
        So people getting mental health or lung problems from dope
        
        Mental health or lung problems stem from immoderate abuse, not moderate and responsible usage. Some people abuse food or alcohol and the resulting health problems cost taxpayers, but we don’t ban food or alcohol or criminalise those who eat and drink.
        
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        October 21, 2017 2:48pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        You are welcome to make cannabis users contribute tax to offset their health care .
        
        Of course alcohol users will do the same.
        
        I look forward to cheaper pot as well as a tax reduction when the piss drinkers have to fund a considerable portion of both justice and health care costs.
        
        5 2
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        October 21, 2017 6:43pm
      - nasska
        
        What I’ll enjoy will be the sounds of silence from this blog’s conservatives when the health costs of alcohol vs marijuana are costed using actuarial science.
        
        Expect expensive drinkies & a cheap toke.
        
        5 2
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        October 21, 2017 6:52pm
      - realityczech
        
        Mr Classical Totalitarian seems to think its okay for the armed state to force his views about weed onto the rest of us.
        
        5 0
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        October 21, 2017 6:57pm
- Jack5
  
  Well spotted, Pongo.
  
  It’s typical of the lies served up frequently: NZ has the worst child abuse in the world, the worst child family, the worst family violence, the worst X, the worst Y.
  
  Usually the report doesn’t tell you the comparisons are from a small group such as the OECD (35 of the world’s 195 nations), let alone the different definition standards in each country.
  
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  October 21, 2017 12:14pm
  - Digmen1
    
    Also they don’t tell the UN or OECD that just about all of the abuse is caused by two racial groups. And that if they were not here, or not included we would probably be one of the best in the world.
    
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    October 21, 2017 12:35pm
  - Digmen1
    
    That’s because most people in the undeveloped world don’t beat their children.
    
    5 2
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    October 21, 2017 12:37pm
    - Jack5
      
      Digmen1 says “..most people in the undeveloped world don’t beat their children.”
      
      But then there’s child marriage and genital mutilation of young girls in the Third World, and millions of young children are in slave labour in the Third World.
      
      7 2
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      October 21, 2017 1:05pm
      - Classic Liberal
        
        Yes, I think he was being sarcastic. Quran 4.34: beat your wife if you ‘fear disobedience’. But that’s hunky dory compared to dreadful NZ.
        
        3 2
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        October 21, 2017 2:39pm
    - Brito
      
      What utter bullshit.
      
      I’ve been to places where the shit they do to children would take your breath away. If you think that the adults of the under-developed world have this bearing of nobility, go with your virtuous rose coloured paradigm and have a look. It will make your fucking skin crawl.
      
      Idiot!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      
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      October 21, 2017 2:39pm
- Digmen1
  
  As I’ve said before, in Bangladesh the Rohinga refugees have built about 100,000 homes in four weeks!
  
  Probably all by themselves.
  So there is no excuse for our lazy homeless.
  
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  October 21, 2017 12:16pm
  - PhilBest
    
    That is the way they do things in most developing countries. They are called slums, and they don’t need refugees or disasters, they are a norm and a status quo. The Rohinga refugees were merely doing exactly what millions of Bangladeshis excluded from the legal housing market, have been doing all along.
    
    In first world countries, the first sign of this kind of initiative, and you would have the Council inspectors around pulling the stuff down.
    
    EDIT: but I strongly agree with any suggestion that young Kiwis should organise a bit of mass home-building civil disobedience. You could do some quite livable mobile prefab homes with off-grid technology, on legally bought farmland outside the urban growth boundary, at a fraction of the cost of the rent of a chicken coop in the “legal housing market”.
    
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    October 21, 2017 1:44pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  “living situations
  where people with no other options to acquire safe and secure housing: are without shelter, in temporary
  accommodation, sharing accommodation with a household or living in uninhabitable housing.”
  
  Wow, I’ve had a few friends ‘homeless’ then, staying with me while they looked around for something.
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:33pm
starboard

Will angel Cindy sort out the maori beating and killing their own offspring issue in her first hundred days? If not, why not?
15 3
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October 21, 2017 12:21pm
- Digmen1
  
  Yes, they’ll all be busy working building houses and driving trucks, and they’ll all want to get married and stop doing drugs and go to church every Sunday.
  
  10 1
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  October 21, 2017 12:31pm
- GoVege
  
  What did National do about that in 9 years while in coalition with the Maori Party?
  
  3 11
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  October 21, 2017 12:58pm
  - starboard
    
    nothing at all.
    
    3 4
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    October 21, 2017 1:25pm
    - PhilBest
      
      Correct! And the next question is, what were the policy concessions the Maori Party extracted from National, exploiting their coalition position, to effectively do something about those problems?
      
      7 1
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      October 21, 2017 1:48pm
- GoVege
  
  They’re not “killing their own offspring” most of the time, starboard.
  They’re killing someone else’s offspring.
  This is the unfortunate consequence of having leaders who convince their people that 13 to 17 year old kids having babies at 4 times the rate of any other ethnic group, is “our fertility”.
  Most of the youngsters who get killed or badly beaten do not live with their biological dads.
  Society supports the mum and mum’s boyfriend abuses the children.
  
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  October 21, 2017 7:35pm
Digmen1

I see Jacinda is going to implement ways of measuring child poverty.

Probably how many times a week they can get given KFC. Where 6 would be good and 7 would be Shangrilah
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October 21, 2017 12:33pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  Nah, she’d want them all to become vegans!
  
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  October 21, 2017 2:42pm
  - GoVege
    
    Hope so! 🙂
    
    0 5
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    October 21, 2017 4:08pm
    - realityczech
      
      You would be smarter if you ate some people food Vege. B-12 helps the brain.
      
      7 1
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      October 21, 2017 7:02pm
      - GoVege
        
        I refuse to be a cannibal RC….and I try not to be a carnivore too often too…. 🙂
        
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        October 21, 2017 7:29pm
Viking2

Breaking news; Team New Zealand has just discovered they have lost the America’s Cup as Oracle, Artemus and Team Japan combine their points to become the new coalition winners. 😆 😆
22 1
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October 21, 2017 12:35pm
Digmen1

from Stuff

“One of the things I think is quite important and that makes politics in New Zealand special and unique is accessibility,” she said.

People could – and likely would – come say hi if they saw her out, including at the supermarket, Ardern said.

“I wouldn’t change that for the world. I think it’s a good sign if people feel like they can just come and talk to you. That’s how it should be.”

So that means If I see her in the supermarket I can tell her that she is an evil socialist.
13 3
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October 21, 2017 12:41pm
- starboard
  
  Can you check her trolley for chardonnay if you see her at P&S..
  
  6 3
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  October 21, 2017 1:23pm
  - kowtow
    
    Haha
    
    I remember a tv piece on Chris Trotsky at some bar be que .
    
    In hand a bottle of globalist , multinationalist , capitalist HEINEKEN!, no less.
    
    No cheap domestic shit for the politibureau ,lecture the masses ,elitists.
    
    6 2
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    October 21, 2017 1:44pm
    - Gabby
      
      Trotsker is a very comfortable Economy-size socialist kobknob.
      
      2 4
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      October 21, 2017 7:46pm
      - Brito
        
        Gobby you are a completely unadulterated fuck wit.
        
        6 1
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        October 21, 2017 8:46pm
- PhilBest
  
  Ruth Richardson was a regular customer at a health food shop in Lambton Quay. The staff (mostly hemp-wearers and tofu-munchers) always had grumpy comments to make to each other once she was gone, but they were always pleasant to her face.
  
  7 2
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  October 21, 2017 1:51pm
- Gabby
  
  Is that the sort of thing you’re likely to foam at someone in the supermarket dicman.
  
  2 3
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  October 21, 2017 7:48pm
Viking2

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/10/homelessness-proves-capitalism-is-a-blatant-failure-jacinda-ardern.html

how sad.
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October 21, 2017 1:24pm
- Gabby
  
  Fuck ’em eh ThievingScandyGit2
  
  0 4
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  October 21, 2017 7:45pm
Viking2

Labour’s first 100-days plan

Make the first year of tertiary education or training fees free from January 1, 2018
Increase student allowances and living cost loans by $50 a week from January 1, 2018
Pass the Healthy Homes Guarantee Bill, requiring all rentals to be warm and dry
Ban overseas speculators from buying existing houses
Issue an instruction to Housing New Zealand to stop the state house sell-off
Begin work to establish the Affordable Housing Authority and begin the KiwiBuild programme
Legislate to pass the Families Package, including the Winter Fuel Payment, Best Start and increases to Paid Parental Leave, to take effect from July 1, 2018
Set up a ministerial inquiry to fix our mental health crisis
Introduce legislation to make medicinal cannabis available for people with terminal illnesses or in chronic pain
Resume contributions to the New Zealand Superannuation Fund to help safeguard the provision of universal superannuation at age 65
Introduce legislation to set a child poverty reduction target and to change the Public Finance Act, so the Budget reports progress on reducing child poverty
Increase the minimum wage to $16.50 an hour, to take effect from April 1, 2018, and introduce legislation to improve fairness in the workplace
Establish the Tax Working Group
Establish the Pike River Recovery Agency and assign a responsible minister
Set up an inquiry into the abuse of children in state care
Hold a Clean Waters Summit on cleaning up our rivers and lakes
Set the zero carbon emissions goal and begin setting up the independent Climate Commission
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October 21, 2017 1:28pm
- Brito
  
  Where’s all the ‘free’ money coming from you idiot? Nothing is free some other sap has to pay for it. Fuck wits!!!
  
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  October 21, 2017 3:30pm
- Left Right and Centre
  
  Establish the Pike River Recovery Agency and assign a responsible minister
  
  You need to do that to work out a chimney sweep is the best option ?
  
  3 0
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  October 22, 2017 1:19am
Digmen1

So what is The Greens Pardy 100 day plan?

And what is New Zealand First Plans?
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October 21, 2017 1:37pm
- stigie
  
  A commission will have to be set up first before we even discuss it Digmen !~
  
  5 1
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  October 21, 2017 1:42pm
  - Digmen1
    
    Or a “working group”
    
    3 1
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    October 21, 2017 1:44pm
Manolo

It did not take long for comrade Ardern to drop the mask:
https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/capitalism-is-a-blatant-failure-ardern/ar-AAtMp1j?li=BBqdg4K&ocid=mailsignout
11 1
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October 21, 2017 2:03pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  The more she puts her true face out there, the further our share market will drop, I expect.
  
  7 2
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  October 21, 2017 2:44pm
  - Left Right and Centre
    
    Ain’t that the tooth.
    
    3 0
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    October 22, 2017 1:21am
starboard

I wonder if Cindy will get a funny haircut now that she is in charge. Something manly, like klarkula’s…or that fat little despot from North Korea.
6 4
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October 21, 2017 2:07pm
- Twinkletoes
  
  Jacinda’s hairstyle is very unflattering for a woman her age – only teenage girls can carry off long tousled frazzled rats tails that continuously need pushing behind the ears. It is not even that they are luscious, thick and shiny locks a la Princess Kate. Wear it up or in a a pony tail and at least get a good cutter to style it properly – a classic bob would suit her but even that simple style takes a bit of time and effort put into it . How many professional women at the top does one see sporting this unkempt rag tag poor student style?
  
  9 8
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  October 21, 2017 3:27pm
  - GoVege
    
    How catty can you be, TT?
    
    4 6
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    October 21, 2017 3:32pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      Have you read the shit you write?
      Talk about having a lack of self awareness.
      
      6 4
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      October 21, 2017 3:38pm
      - GoVege
        
        Believe me, my grumpy AOR, the feeling is mutual.
        
        0 7
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        October 21, 2017 4:06pm
    - Happychappy
      
      That’s the pot calling the kettle black. Jesus have you got any friends and if you have I bet they don’t discus to much with you.
      
      2 1
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      October 21, 2017 5:35pm
    - Left Right and Centre
      
      She’s head of state now moron.
      Presentation matters.
      
      1 0
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      October 22, 2017 1:23am
  - Gabby
    
    Ponyboy’s bonce wasn’t too flash either was it tinkledick.
    
    2 7
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    October 21, 2017 7:43pm
Manolo

Marie Antoinette could not help herself:
During President Barack Obama’s first year in office, 16 people were listed working for Michelle Obama, earning a combined $1.24 million a year.

This year, just four people were listed working for Melania Trump as of June. Their salaries totaled $486,700.
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October 21, 2017 2:11pm
- gump
  
  Why are you ignoring the horrendous spending by Donnie Antoinette?
  
  He has already spent close $75 million on golfing trips, and we aren’t even through the first year of his Presidency.
  
  Source:
  
  http://trumpgolfcount.com
  
  4 3
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  October 21, 2017 5:24pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    The difference is Trump uses golf for government business.
    Obama didn’t,
    The last two golf games Trump had were with Senator Lindsay Graham and Senator Rand Paul. He talked about Healthcare and Tax reform.
    Obamas golfing was holidays.
    Care to mention Mrs Obamas Italian holiday? Amongst others.
    
    3 5
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    October 21, 2017 5:28pm
    - gump
      
      Trump’s first golf outing as President was on 4 February at Palm Beach. He played with his friend Jim Arrigo and two golf pros – John Nieporte and David Frost.
      
      None of those players are in Government. Tell me again how this is Government business?
      
      4 3
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      October 21, 2017 5:49pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Ffs, I didn’t say every game was. That he USED it for business and Obama usually didn’t.
        Tell you what. List every game Obama and Trump has played and who with.
        Off you go.
        You’re an idiot.
        Seriously, get some help for your TDS
        Oh and give us some costs for the Obamas holidays.
        
        5 5
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        October 21, 2017 6:01pm
      - mikenmild
        
        You could start with this AoR:
        https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2017/02/22/trumps-family-trips-cost-taxpayers-nearly-as-much-in-a-month-as-obamas-cost-in-a-whole-year/#1501b62936e4
        Trump is on track to spend more on travel in his first year as president than Obama did in his entire two terms.
        But I guess you will probably just claim that most of Trump’s trips are ‘work’.
        
        3 4
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        October 21, 2017 7:33pm
      - Flash
        
        And wasn’t this own golf course? The one he bought because the locals wouldn’t let him join?
        
        1 1
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        October 21, 2017 11:44pm
    - Gabby
      
      Sounds like bullshit gonnhy. He was workin out how to piss off widows.
      
      2 3
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      October 21, 2017 7:26pm
starboard

Welcome to Aotearoa…now gives us ya money bro..
Feral brown scum.

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/98118165/samaritan-offers-to-reimburse-tourist-robbed-while-hitchhiking
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October 21, 2017 2:34pm
- Digmen1
  
  As I said above.
  If two racial groups were not in New Zealand, our crime rate would be very low
  Plus many other negative statistics.
  
  8 1
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  October 21, 2017 2:39pm
  - GoVege
    
    We know the first Diggy….what’s the 2nd?
    
    1 4
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    October 21, 2017 3:34pm
    - rangitoto
      
      Sanctimonious vegetarians
      
      6 2
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      October 21, 2017 4:33pm
  - Brito
    
    Correct and the fat shaming shit (BMI) would show that the rest of us aren’t the problem. Christ I get sick of this. We bleat away on this site and nothing changes. What the fuck is going to change in the next three years – I’ll tell you!!! An economy in crisis, a society divided and the working people fucking off.
    
    7 3
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    October 21, 2017 3:34pm
    - GoVege
      
      Well, Brito, things are looking up now.
      The Maori Party that claimed gangs were “just another form of whanau” and apparently “are an acceptable lifestyle choice”, have gone.
      That proves most Maori don’t support them.
      Labour, which is all about working for a living, will increase wages so more of the poor have an incentive to work.
      As our Northland Wahine said recently, Maori are not stupid, so if bennies pay more than work, they will choose the former.
      Hopefully this will change under Labour.
      
      2 10
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      October 21, 2017 3:56pm
      - Brito
        
        Fuck off!!!
        
        4 3
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        October 21, 2017 8:53pm
    - Gabby
      
      Sure Bitcho, you’re not fat. Just fucking big boned.
      
      2 8
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      October 21, 2017 7:23pm
      - Brito
        
        Gobby you are a piece of shit. I don’t know why the censor doesn’t just tell you to fuck off and shrivel up in a corner. Your comments are boring and non-productive. Christ girl, get a life or try and contribute. Take a position and let people become aware of what it is you’re really thinking. If you can’ then fuck off.
        
        8 3
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        October 21, 2017 8:51pm
- GoVege
  
  Probably from a huge family of neglected kids, turfed out at 13.
  A victim of “our Maori fertility” as promoted by Maori Party founder Dame Turia.
  
  1 5
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  October 21, 2017 3:40pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Sheesh, any chance you get, you have a go at Maori.
    
    4 5
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    October 21, 2017 3:45pm
    - GoVege
      
      Is Digmen correct or not, AOR? (BTW…I don’t blame Maori, I blame the stone-age mentality of their present leadership.
      And I don’t mean Winston or Kelvin. )
      
      3 5
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      October 21, 2017 3:49pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        You’re just a racist looking for any excuse to have a go.
        So don’t hide behind Digman. We can see you for what you are.
        
        4 8
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        October 21, 2017 3:52pm
      - GoVege
        
        AOR: The essence of debate is to argue the issues, not attack the person making a point.
        If anything I have said here is not true in your opinion, feel free to point it out.
        
        4 6
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        October 21, 2017 4:03pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Lol, you bullshit all the time with your *stories*. Remember your Chemist and the armed robberies in Auckland every day?
        Just one among many.
        Hahahahaha
        And you being a racist is the truth. All your ‘points’ are.
        So funny.
        
        5 5
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        October 21, 2017 4:09pm
- Nermal
  
  That’s why Kelvin Davis will be getting Corrections and Tourism, as there’s such an overlap.
  
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  October 21, 2017 5:30pm
btb

The Nats are out because they have no friends. The right wing bloc has been consolidated to basically just them. MMP seems unfair sometimes and I do feel for Bill English but I’m picking he made the right decision for what he thought his constituents wanted which shows integrity. Having said that they have no political friends because the sum of their policies have become unattractive to a slim majority of people. And that is democracy in action.
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October 21, 2017 3:15pm
- GoVege
  
  They have pi**ed off heaps of other politicians with their sneaky devious tactics, that’s all.
  
  2 14
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  October 21, 2017 3:36pm
- kowtow
  
  45% is not slim . As a block it is a clear majority.
  
  6 1
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  October 21, 2017 4:10pm
All_on_Red

When do we get to see the list of dead rats Jacinda had to swallow for Winston?
It’s clear James Shaw has got his mouth full-yum yum. He’s just Labour and Winston’s Poodle.
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October 21, 2017 3:29pm
Viking2

Can we expect this from Andrew and Jacinda?

A SECRET industrial agreement shows that the wages of state electricity workers will soar past $206,000 to appease the militant Electrical Trades Union that funds the ALP.

The skilled electricians may get even more, thanks to generous overtime loadings of up to 22.5 per cent in new 10-day rosters.

And some tradies will get more than $65 a day to sit at home and do nothing.

That is the proposed new duty allowance to be paid to workers who are on call.

The Energy Queensland workers will get double pay for the hours they have to work in the rain with wet clothes. Sooks.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/des-houghton-comment-secret-deal-to-net-tradies-200k-a-year/news-story/f69ba399372ae8f00a0d518f39a82e00
7 1
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October 21, 2017 3:35pm
- sooty
  
  I worked in NT, you would get as wet working in the sunshine as in the rain. No differance.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:12pm
  - JasonJohns
    
    Australia has its own government of losers, with Malcolm Turnbull being PM despite having fewer MPs than Labour. Like Ardern, Turnbull is propped up by minor parties. He should do the principled thing and resign. That would add to the moral pressure on the NZ GG to refuse Ardern as PM and approach Bill English instead.
    
    Uptick if you agree that Aussie’s government of losers should go as well as Ardern’s.
    
    2 3
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    October 21, 2017 8:18pm
Jack5

Will Jacinda send her congratulations to the old mongrel?

The United Nations has appointed Robert Mugabe a goodwill ambassador for the World Health Organisation.

This after, as the Daily Mail reports:

Life expectancy in Zimbabwe dropped from 61 in 1985 to 44 in 2003, according to World Bank figures, largely down to the nation’s crumbling economy and widespread poverty. Life expectancy has since recovered – but is still not as high as it was in the mid-1980s.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-5001502/Robert-Mugabe-appointed-goodwill-ambassador-WHO.html
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October 21, 2017 3:37pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  someone proofreads what they post.
  
  6 0
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  October 21, 2017 3:40pm
  - Brito
    
    Maggie you pulled me up last week for comments. Ok! I’ve watched you throw links to articles but they don’t actually mean anything. Why don’t you say what you really think and mean? Proofreads! Jesus!!!!
    
    1 5
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    October 21, 2017 8:55pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      @Brito
      Why don’t you say what you really think and mean
      
      Why?
      Why does it matter what I think?
      
      You”ll have to pay mega$$$$ to find out what I think….much cheaper to think it out yourself.
      
      Anyway my message was to Jack5 who had initially posted a different link.
      
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      October 21, 2017 10:31pm
- GoVege
  
  Proof that only the good die young.
  
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  October 21, 2017 4:04pm
- realityczech
  
  Some of them tried to seek refuge in Mandelas “rainbow nation” and ended up with the Mandela Necklace, a burning tyre around their necks. Except for those just simply beaten to death.
  
  Imagine the stink if white people carried on like this.
  
  African migrants in South Africa are in fear for their lives—again
  
  “We write to you so that when South Africa experiences a repeat of the 2008 xenophobic violence which left at least 62 people dead, you will not be surprised,” the forum said in a letter, urging South Africa’s president to act.
  The 2008 wave of attacks left thousands displaced, 342 immigrant-owned shops looted and 213 burned down. The violence and hate was captured with the image of a Mozambican man burned alive.
  The shame was quickly forgotten and again in 2015, Zulu King Goodwill Zwelithini’s comments that foreigners should “pack their bags” and leave, sparked violence that ended once South Africa deployed the army. At least five people were killed and nearly 2,000 migrants forced into refugee camps, again.
  
  https://qz.com/915845/nigerians-somalis-and-malawians-have-been-attacked-in-south-africa-sparking-fears-of-a-repeat-of-xenophobic-violence/
  
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  October 21, 2017 6:27pm
  - realityczech
    
    South Africa: Survival migrants and refugees from Zimbabwe face xenophobic violence
    
    http://www.msf.ca/en/article/south-africa-survival-migrants-and-refugees-zimbabwe-face-xenophobic-violence
    
    4 0
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    October 21, 2017 6:29pm
- Longknives
  
  Mugabe is considered quite the Hero to the Left..
  
  4 2
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  October 21, 2017 7:03pm
Keeping Stock

It’s almost time to fire up the Weber Q I bought last weekend, and see how it goes with a loin of pork. The lamb rack last night was maybe a minute underdone, but delicious nonetheless 😀
8 5
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October 21, 2017 4:36pm
- Viking2
  
  Great BBQ’s K.S.
  Like the old gas ovens of yesteryear.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:24pm
- RF
  
  KS.
  
  I have the baby Q. At what temp and how long for the lamb Rack.
  
  Just trying to get an idea.
  
  0 2
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  October 21, 2017 8:27pm
Johnboy

Reason’s why the West Coasters vote labour! ! 🙂 🙂
1. https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/98122487/west-coast-lotto-fans-make-2hour-trip-to-buy-tickets-after-local-stores-machine-fails
9 2
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October 21, 2017 6:01pm
- nasska
  
  It’s a wonder that Overbite hasn’t stepped in & sent the West Coasters a new Lotto terminal & free tickets.
  
  Shows that once Labour’s got your vote you’re dog tucker. 🙂
  
  7 3
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  October 21, 2017 6:34pm
- mikenmild
  
  Some people apparently unaware that Lotto can be purchased online…
  
  7 2
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  October 21, 2017 7:37pm
  - nasska
    
    Labourites are thicker than average people Mike. Downloading their daily fix of porn is a challenge never mind gambling! 🙂
    
    6 0
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    October 21, 2017 7:44pm
    - mikenmild
      
      That seems a cruel thing to say about an electorate where National won the party vote…
      
      6 0
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      October 21, 2017 7:50pm
      - nasska
        
        I’d bet there wouldn’t have been many of those National party votes cast in Reefton.
        
        I openly despise religious conservatives but they’re not all RWNJs. The most socially conservative species extant in NZ would be Catholic West Coast miners (or ex miners).
        
        6 1
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        October 21, 2017 7:56pm
      - Viking2
        
        The most socially conservative species extant in NZ would be Catholic West Coast miners (or ex miners).
        
        Well naaska, Jacinda and Winston are going to open their grave for them.
        Remember Winston stated categorically he would be first to go in.
        
        6 1
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        October 21, 2017 8:27pm
  - Viking2
    
    Haven’t got the telegraph down there yet MM.
    
    3 0
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    October 21, 2017 8:25pm
    - RF
      
      On wet cloudy days they have runners carrying willow sticks with a forked end where correspondence is wedged in.
      
      On a clear day they light fires on Hill tops and burn branches covered in fresh green leaves. A wet blanket is used to control puffs of heavy smoke.
      
      5 0
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      October 21, 2017 8:35pm
BananaLlama

Hows opposition treating you commie shits? sent that Chinese spy on his way yet?
3 11
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October 21, 2017 6:50pm
- rangitoto
  
  Token commies aren’t needed now Winnie has installed the real deal.
  
  10 3
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  October 21, 2017 7:35pm
  - BananaLlama
    
    Sorry to break the bad news but he went with Labour not National.
    
    2 8
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    October 21, 2017 8:11pm
    - Viking2
      
      Not hard to sell your soul for sixpence even in 2017.
      
      7 2
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      October 21, 2017 8:28pm
      - BananaLlama
        
        Harder than you think given that National couldn’t buy the Greens.
        
        2 5
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        October 21, 2017 8:38pm
Longknives

Nice bit of Casual Racism from Peter Williams-

https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/98049118/wanakas-rich-white-growing-pains

I might write an Opinion piece on South Auckland Crime and call it ‘Auckland’s Black Problem’
Reckon it will get past the Subs?
12 2
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October 21, 2017 7:05pm
- nasska
  
  …..”Reckon it will get past the Subs?”…..
  
  By the time Overbite & her queer mates get settled in it will earn you a few months at a mid winter re education course in Waiouru.
  
  8 3
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  October 21, 2017 7:10pm
  - Longknives
    
    I think I’m already on the list Nasska! Purely because I’m not drowning in White Guilt and don’t believe in the myth of ‘White Privilege’..
    
    5 2
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    October 21, 2017 7:24pm
  - Left Right and Centre
    
    pro commie chic msm = ‘clickbite’ ?
    
    1 0
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    October 22, 2017 1:33am
- Gabby
  
  But wherever will their servants live lungnuts.
  
  1 10
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  October 21, 2017 7:18pm
  - Brito
    
    Gobby, I’ve read your threads for a few weeks and I think you are a piece of shit. Try and be constructive and take a position instead of offering smarmy one-liners. If you can’t contribute why don’t you fuck off.
    
    9 3
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    October 21, 2017 8:57pm
JasonJohns

Stunning claim today in GD by rightoverlabour, who said Winston Peters was a terrorist and that it would be reasonable to assassinate him. At first I didn’t understand the link to terrorism and the likes of Osama but then I got to thinking…

let’s just say that a Jason Johns Investigation into the still-unsolved Trades Hall Bombing of 1984 and its possible link to a certain then-National MP is beginning…

keep you posted…and yes, rightoverlabour is right…if Peters has indeed been active in terrorist attacks, then he should be held accountable…
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October 21, 2017 7:34pm
JasonJohns

rightoverlabour’s powerful words

‘I believe in eliminating terrorism. Winston is a political and economic terrorist. He has held the country to ransom, and is obfuscating on everything.
Sometimes the elimination of a clear and present danger is a necessity for the survival of a reasonable society. Assassination may seem a step too far, but a society has to protect itself from these types of individuals gaining power. Ask the Russians, Germans, North Koreans.’
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October 21, 2017 7:41pm
Jack5

Where are the Kingston Trio when you need them?

In the jungle, the blogging jungle
the keas fly tonight .
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October 21, 2017 8:27pm
JasonJohns

what’s your position on the asassination of peters jack?
and do you reckon he deserves the label terrorist?
intriguing questions.
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October 21, 2017 8:41pm
- realityczech
  
  JJ National did not win the election. They did not get a majority. What we got was an MMP coalition. The thing we voted for as a country.
  
  You are as bad as the anti Trumpers and anti Brexit loons with your contempt for the democratic expression of the people.
  
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  October 21, 2017 8:46pm
JasonJohns

I am not saying peters is a terrorist RC. I think a terrorist is someone who commits violence against civilians for political ends – like Osama bin Laden.

But I figure that if rightoverlabour calls Peters a terrorist he must have a ‘trick’ up his sleeve. Maybe he knows something about Peters’ involvement in a terrorist attack? Did Winston ‘do’ Trade Hall?

Nor do I join the many here who have upticked rightoverlabour’s comment supporting the assassination of Peters. Peters was democratically elected after all. I am more worried about fighting the mozzies here in Ngaruawahia tbh
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October 21, 2017 8:49pm
realityczech

➡ Brito pace yourself ❗ 🙂
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October 21, 2017 9:05pm
Brito

Can’t! Angry at the drivel! It drives me to distraction. This is a great forum but people spend so much time dribbling their venom they waste the opportunity this guy has presented to us on a plate. Bah!!!
1 2
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October 21, 2017 9:19pm
- realityczech
  
  They are just excited about our new leader ☭
  
  2 0
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  October 21, 2017 9:23pm
  - Brito
    
    I need a drink (if I drank). A nice cup of tea and a ginger nut. Can’t deal with pathetic cowards who won’t put up a position and then target others who do. I’m guilty of it when it comes to left leaning swivel heads but they should go to the Standard and rub oil on each other. I hate buck teeth!! Is that too personal?
    
    2 3
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    October 21, 2017 9:27pm
    - nasska
      
      Don’t sweat Brito. Give it another month & most of the left wing trolls will have crawled back into their holes in the woodwork.
      
      It happens every election…..they get overwrought & start spoofing all over the place. 🙂
      
      5 1
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      October 21, 2017 9:38pm
      - realityczech
        
        Most of the lefties were removed in the pre-election pogrom. They are either exterminated or in the gulag.
        
        1 0
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        October 21, 2017 9:43pm
nasska

In an attempt to promote peace the leaders of the Catholic church and the Muslim faith agreed to practice each others religions for a month.

Unfortunately it was a failure. The Muslims didn’t like sex with the choirboys and the priests didn’t like sex with nine year old girls.
5 0
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October 21, 2017 9:34pm
- realityczech
  
  ⛪ ☪ ☠
  
  2 0
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  October 21, 2017 9:39pm
- stigie
  
  Of course his Eminence would prefer 9 year old boys !~
  
  1 0
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  October 21, 2017 11:06pm
Brito

Very funny nasska.

But what about this piece of shit and his mate.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/98118165/samaritan-offers-to-reimburse-tourist-robbed-while-hitchhiking

What planet does this turd think he’s on? Why is there not an app which allows you to fry these cretinous pieces of shit into a pile of ash.

Sorry, he’s Maori (with a macron) and he was assaulted and he’s been colonised and he’s been left behind…fucking arse wipes. These are the type of people who will become more prominent in the MSM as the next three years grind on.

And do you know what they’ll say? It’s our fault.

Fuck is it our fault!!!
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October 21, 2017 9:40pm
- nasska
  
  No argument from me on that score Brito. Odds on that the offender was from a “family” who believed in breeding for quantity rather than quality.
  
  There’ll be plenty more like him in the pipeline.
  
  2 0
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  October 21, 2017 9:51pm
- realityczech
  
  Kill them with fire before they lay eggs ☣
  
  1 0
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  October 21, 2017 9:54pm
  - nasska
    
    Probably a bit drastic but we get the society we incentivise individuals to make. If we pay money for breeding poorly brought up meal tickets then that is what we’ll get.
    
    In that sense it is our fault.
    
    4 0
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    October 21, 2017 10:00pm
    - realityczech
      
      We pay them to breed. They are no worse off than they would be working in a low paid job. Why work at a low paid job when the govt will pay you to stay home and fuck for the same money ?
      
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      October 21, 2017 10:08pm
Brito

Nasska that thinking is enough to make me want to move to Antarctica.
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October 21, 2017 10:05pm
Rachael Membery

What’s the saying again?
Fool me once shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me
For those of you that were fooled thrice…thanks a bunch.
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October 22, 2017 1:47pm

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