General Debate 28 September 2017

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Notsofast

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Here is the man that helped keep Brendan Dassey in jail.

“Klain attached to his memo “a very, very rough outline of a possible new crime bill,” along with a chart comparing it both to the 1994 crime bill and the new GOP bill. Klain proposed including a $1 billion cut in prevention programs (reallocating $700 million to new juvenile prisons), more cops in schools, and “tougher truth in sentencing.” In some areas, his outline was harsher than the GOP legislation — “broaden[ing] the range of offenses for which juveniles may be tried as adults” and “enhanc[ing] penalties for lesser drug crimes.”

https://theintercept.com/2016/05/04/the-untold-story-of-bill-clintons-other-crime-bill/
Sir Peter Jackson was constructive in assisting Damien Echolls’ release from 18 years on death row. Damien was also the beneficiary of rockstar help, Johnny Depp, Eddie Veda (Pearl Jam). A good cause. Sir Peter on facebook described watching “Making a Murderer” and quickly saw that Brendan Dassey falsely confessed, like Teina Pora and Echolls’ friend Jessie Miskelley. These three 17 year olds were convicted in parallel fashion with guided discovery by police of the false facts behind vicious crimes.

Now America considers Brendan’s fate. Two alternative views are here, Oh women of varying compassion.

“The investigators made my skin crawl watching this video,” Judge Diane Wood said. “He is obviously racking his brain about how he can answer in a way they will like.”

“There was no promise of leniency,” Judge Diane Sykes, apotential Trump Supreme Court nominee,countered later. “There was a vague suggestion, at best.”

http://uproxx.com/tv/making-a-murderer-brendan-dassey-seventh-circuit-appeal-en-banc-hearing-results/
Mark Lundy is innocent and Sir Peter was informed, on facebook, from America, that he might consider the log in New Zealand’s eye before weeping crocodile tears for American justice. I will find the Quote to follow, if kiwibloggers find the debate interesting.

But Silence, Sir Peter. How becoming.
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September 28, 2017 8:01am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Lundy is guilty. Twice.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:34am
  - Notsofast
    
    You have an opinion backed by a vacuum between your ears.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:01am
    - VicParking
      
      So he took her brains down to Wellington with him to keep him company after the hooker left
      
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      September 28, 2017 12:31pm
  - Lance
    
    Bugger, sorry Cap’n, upticked silly old NSF.
    Slip of the mouse
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:32am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Sir Peter’s silence is quite likely because, like thousands of other New Zealanders, he believes Lundy is guilty, and was especially disgusted at the ferocity with which Lundy attacked his daughter.
  
  And it’s bloody rich for you to demand that Sir Peter put his reputation on the line from the anonymity of your keyboard. If you are going to make demands of others, let’s find out who you really are, and whether you have a vested interest in the Lundy case.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:17am
  - MickMac
    
    Like me your handle doesn’t identify you??
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:20am
  - Notsofast
    
    All New Zealanders have a powerful interest in the case.
    The system is a dramatic fail. Science is ignored, wily prosecutors operate with a blank chequebook underwritten by tax. Morgan QC and Vanderkolk QC are dangerous predators. John Pike QC was later called out by the police when they showed he fabricated an impossible tale in 2002 when persuading Tipping Glazebrooke and McGrath that Lundy was at home at 7 pm to kill his daughter.
    
    Keeping Stock, your willingness to believe this hoax is a dangerous phenomenon.
    
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    September 28, 2017 10:58am
    - sooty
      
      Wrong 99%, could not give a shit.
      
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      September 28, 2017 12:32pm
      - Notsofast
        
        Sweep cares, sooty. Get with the program, little yellow bear.
        
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        September 28, 2017 12:39pm
    - Keeping Stock
      
      And your willingness to willingly defame people (“dangerous predators”) from behind the safety of a non-de-plume shows a lack of conviction.
      
      If what you allege is true, say so in the public domain, without a nom-de-plume, and without exposing DPF to the risk of a defamation action.
      
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      September 28, 2017 12:38pm
      - Notsofast
        
        I know what these guys have said, and what they no doubt plan to say again. They have a duty to the court to put the truth ahead of their petty careers. People who told the truth in your town were hunted out KS. DPF is welcome to reveal to (only) you my identity and contact details if you want them Keeping Stock. I will happily meet you on your turf and explain the whole case, on my way to the appeal hearing on 17 october, 2 days, before
        
        The Hon Justice Mark Cooper, QC (appointed 20 June 2014)
        The Hon Justice Helen Winkelmann (appointed 1 June 2015)
        The Hon Justice Raynor Asher, QC (appointed 22 July 2016)
        
        I know the case facts, and appallingly, so do the police.
        
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        September 28, 2017 12:47pm
    - Interested
      
      Science is NOT being ignored ..in fact it was science that convicted Lundy at both trials. Read “The Cause of Death’ by Cynric Temple-Camp the pathologist whose evidence convicted Lundy.
      
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      September 30, 2017 11:40am
duggledog

The Greens have three signature policies.

1: Eradicate ‘child poverty’
2: Reverse climate change
3: Clean rivers.

Given National is already much further along with 1 and 3 than most people understand, and the Greens have supported National initiatives in the past, I believe Shaw should attempt to convince Green membership to forgo or delay their utterly-unattainable climate change policy, and consider a blue green coalition or CaS

I think National should try to engineer it, with concessions of course. The upside – the Green vote completely collapses in 2020 as the rabid extreme left leave them for someone even more unpalatable like say Hone Harawira. Half have already flocked to the Morrinsville Messiah already anyway.

Leaves Winston nowhere to go. Effectively you could manage Shaw easier than Peters. Shaw is a pussy.
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September 28, 2017 8:02am
- Muttonbird
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Are you on National’s negotiating team?
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:08am
- holysheet
  
  “Shaw is a pussy.”
  Is that a result of his upbringing? Having two mothers must have an adverse effect on any male.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:09am
  - sooty
    
    Ha HAH, more motherinlaws for him. Talk about hen pecked. He’d be afraid to raise his head.
    
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    September 28, 2017 10:01am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  And #2 is patently impossible for a fringe NZ party. Besides which as even the IPCC ‘team’ is now effectively acknowledging the Equilibrium climate sensitivity is far below levels needed for anything bad to happen. Even the big scary monster of icesheet melting (Greenland + Antartica) is only raising sea level by 1mm per year.
  https://www.carbonbrief.org/guest-post-greenland-ice-sheet-2017
  https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/land-ice/
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:13am
  - KevOB
    
    There is a pleasing backtracking going on. The Times (UK) has picked up a story from the Daily Mail accepting that the old projections were wrong.
    
    Little by little the wriggling occurs. No one will admit to being wrong but shifting their stance to take a different perspective–that’s not an admission: just covering all ~~bases.~~ asses.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:33am
    - William of Ockham
      
      http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2017/09/is-there-really-still-a-chance-for-staying-below-1-5-c-global-warming/
      
      https://www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97-per-cent/2017/sep/27/right-wing-media-could-not-be-more-wrong-about-the-15c-carbon-budget-paper
      
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      September 28, 2017 11:43am
    - KevOB
      
      Here the reference from where I started:
      https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/09/26/its-worse-than-they-thought-warming-is-slower-than-predicted/
      
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      September 28, 2017 6:48pm
  - William of Ockham
    
    https://www.carbonbrief.org/guest-post-greenland-ice-sheet-2017
    
    But while the Greenland ice sheet has seen a neutral, or small positive, change in ice for this year, it should be noted that Greenland has lost approximately 3,600bn tonnes of ice since 2002.
    
    We should emphasise that this is an educated estimate of the Greenland total mass budget. We will have to wait for further data to become available from various satellite datasets to estimate the actual calving losses.
    
    ====================
    
    https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/land-ice/
    
    Data from NASA’s GRACE satellites show that the land ice sheets in both Antarctica (upper chart) and Greenland (lower) have been losing mass since 2002. Both ice sheets have seen an acceleration of ice mass loss since 2009. (Source: GRACE satellite data)
    
    =========================
    
    Even the big scary monster of icesheet melting (Greenland + Antartica) is only raising sea level by 1mm per year.
    
    PIDOOMA?
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:39am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      And as we can see from the DMI graphs in your Carbonbrief link
      https://www.carbonbrief.org/guest-post-greenland-ice-sheet-2017
      Greenland has just had their fifth largest surface mass gain on record.
      https://realclimatescience.com/2017/09/least-arctic-melting-in-a-decade/
      
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      September 28, 2017 11:55am
      - Kimbo
        
        Yes, but as per my reply to you yesterday, why can’t my friend observe and photograph from Te Atatu Peninsula, via his high-powered telescopic camera lens, the lower parts of the Devonport ferry terminal disappearing beneath the horizon, i.e., the earth’s curvature,…like it should if the earth is round with a radius of some 6,371 kms?! 😉
        
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        September 28, 2017 12:07pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @Kimbo
        
        Why would he expect to see the bottom of the Devonport Ferry Terminal?
        
        From what I can figure The beach at Te Atatu Peninsula (end of Beach Rd) is about 11km from Devonport F.T…..
        
        You only have line of sight for about 5km when you are standing at sea-level. (Having a high-powered telescopic lens makes no difference)
        
        Now if he is at some elevation on Te Atatu Peninsula, then he will be able to see further…. but you haven’t supplied this detail.
        
        Here’s the formula to work it out
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HorizonDistance.png
        
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        September 28, 2017 5:03pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Maggy Wassilieff
        
        No, sorry, he can see the wharf on which the ferry building stands…when he shouldn’t be able to! Distance from Te Atatu Peninsula according to google maps is about 10km, and his camera elevation is 0.5m above sea level. So according to the calculations (and bear in mind you have to do the observations over unbroken water as that takes out the possibility of undulation as on land)
        
        …the earth is not round, it is flat.
        
        https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/?d0=10&h0=0.5&unit=metric
        
        Drop off at that distance should be 4.38 metres. He reckons he can see much more of the bottom of the Devonport Ferry wharf than that
        
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        September 28, 2017 7:22pm
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Maggy Wassilieff
        
        …sorry, correction:
        
        According to Google maps, the straight distance from the Eastern edge of the Te Atatu Peninsula to the Devonport Ferry Building across the water of the inner Waitemata Harbour is 11.78km.
        
        Which means, with that elevation of 0.5 metres above sea level at which the zoom lens camera is set, that the drop off of in curvature should be…6.72 metres.
        
        Now, I’m sure you will agree that is a reasonable height, indeed it is over two storeys. Yet he can see, and has photographed much of the bottom of the wharf on which the ferry building rests. Too much according to him if the earth is indeed round. Hence it must be…flat according to his experiment.
        
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        September 28, 2017 8:38pm
- dime
  
  Judith can deal with shaw. the wimp will enjoy that
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:45am
- Piniwi
  
  What a load of bollocks dd. There is no way National will let the toxic Greens any closer to a light switch let alone power. They know it would be political suicide. They are simply bat shit crazy. They are so hamstrung they can’t even sort out their own slit leadership until their annual pow-wow.
  
  The majority are also eagerly awaiting the final election result on Oct 7th which if we are lucky they will drop to 4.9%. Then they too can settle for pressing their face to the window with the native party. Karma
  
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  September 28, 2017 7:55pm
kowtow

The media party are such snowflakes.

Winston First has a go at them and they spit the dummy.

It’s the same process in the world media , Trump calls them out and now he’s the Great Satan.
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September 28, 2017 8:08am
Happychappy

The media just keep winding Winston up to achieve their end game change the Government and with people like Barry Soper saying but it all right for him to give stories like the Pension Payment Leak who does he go and see to get the story out there yours truly Barry Soper. So who is playing the game Winston or Journalists like Barry Soper that have got stories out there for Winston or the person that is is now making out this is all the media’s fault.
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September 28, 2017 8:12am
- Paulus
  
  Looks like the Herald today (on line) is pushing for Peters to change the Government.
  No Change – neither do they like being called for what useless left wing unprincipled illiterates they are.
  Watch the next 1o days when Winston will not talk to them – how they will make up stories (lies).
  
  Actually this election fiasco is a disgrace for what is supposed to be a sane country – one man can decide an election whereby 2 million people voted and a small rabble (one man controlled) can effect the outcome for all aspects of the country -financially, economically and socially for the next three years.
  What a disgrace.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:26am
  - Happychappy
    
    Yes Paulus and they again have a stardust Photo and story leading the political news. It’s seems that they think Jacinda is the news.
    
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    September 28, 2017 8:34am
    - krazykiwi
      
      Wait until parliament resumes… and ministers start wiping the floor with her on a daily basis. Zip it sweetie was just a taste of what’s to some.
      
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      September 28, 2017 8:42am
      - brett68
        
        You’ll never hear about it, the NZ media will make Pravda look balanced and neutral
        
        It will be all about how amazeballs Jacinda is and how shitty National are.
        
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        September 28, 2017 8:54am
    - Biscuit
      
      Happychappy, that newspaper is fast becoming (if it hasn’t already become) ‘The New Zealand Jacinda’…
      
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      September 28, 2017 8:55am
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        The Herinda
        
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        September 28, 2017 10:37am
  - James Stephenson
    
    Even if Winston goes with National, it’s still a change of government.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:06am
  - KevOB
    
    This is what you get in any Westminster model government. No one holds anyone to ransom. Nothing can happen till the votes counting has finished and a time out out for fishing is a good cooling down one.
    Only the media who believe they are running the country are aggrieved–without right, but then their senses are left.
    
    We had the same under FPP: parties who did not command a majority had to negotiate with others for their votes on supply.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:46am
  - VicParking
    
    The MSM’s roll is to report the news not make up the news
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:33pm
    - KevOB
      
      Tabloids trying to ginger up sales in a declining market.
      They only want something exciting; if they have to fill in their own facts so be it.
      Ephemera–a fraud as a journal of record.
      
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      September 28, 2017 7:00pm
SteveRemmington

Winston now walking back on the abolish Maori seats rhetoric that many claimed was his signature policy that they were voting for.

Despite being warned he was a charlatan many held the line and still gave him the party vote tick.

Gullible fools!
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September 28, 2017 8:17am
- tas
  
  I’m disappointed by this news, but mostly laughing at those who believed he’d stick to it.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:52am
  - kowtow
    
    I voted for Ngati Notional as the least worst option.
    
    I seriously considered NZF because of Ron Marks very sensible approach on the parliamentary inquiry into illegal firearms. The Gnats on that body should be ashamed of themselves, idiots , but Paula B saved the day there.
    
    I couldn’t vote for NZF as it really is the Winston Party and he will never deliver on his big promises.
    
    He proved that the first time round with his anti Chinese migration rhetoric in the late ’90s , then when he was in a position to deliver ……..
    
    …….nothing.
    
    Why so many people continue to place in him is beyond me.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:15am
- yossarian
  
  Winston has principles, and if you don’t like them, he has others
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:24am
Happychappy

Man U on fire in Moscow 3 nil up after 26 minutes.
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September 28, 2017 8:21am
- mandk
  
  COYS
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:28am
  - EAD_TWO
    
    Why would you cheer for a souless, money-grubbing, rootless club like Spurs?
    
    Spurs fans are just envious the those proper European clubs with a real heritage and all they have left is hollow, long winded bamboozle rather than anything of substance like a club grounded in its roots
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:52am
- VicParking
  
  They are only playing pussys who would not get into the third division in the UK
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:28am
- Biscuit
  
  Happychappy, I suspect there’s some storm somewhere that is creating havoc with electronic communications.
  
  A check on BBC Sport just now reckoned Celtic had scored two of them goal things, in itself something distinctly odd, and were actually leading 2-0 away from home.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:58am
- MrTips
  
  wait till they bring Vlad on….he’ll fix’em
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:43am
- Muttonbird
  
  Why the interest in English football, are you English?
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:17am
  - Happychappy
    
    Muttonhead do you have to a NZ’er to follow the All Blacks.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:54am
    - kowtow
      
      “English” footballers these days are all blacks.
      
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      September 28, 2017 12:57pm
    - Muttonbird
      
      Doesn’t really answer my question, does it?
      
      You seem to have a lot to say about the way this country is run but if you’re not a real Kiwi, well…
      
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      September 28, 2017 1:09pm
      - Happychappy
        
        Muttonhead : Born and bred in NZ 67 years ago played football since I was five have been a member of Man U since we have had internet been a fan since Munich Air disaster and use to listen on Radio to cup finals and other matches before we had TV. I also follow Rugby, Tennis, Cricket,Golf, and Bowls so I hope that doesn’t make me any other Nationality also.
        
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        September 28, 2017 5:00pm
Tarquin North

I am completely sick of mmp and have to wait for god knows how long for a result while some dodgy pensioner who over 90% of the electorate didn’t vote for decides who will run the country. Something is wrong here. In Germany the party with the most votes decides who to negotiate with. Surely this system is more reflective of the electorates wishes?
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September 28, 2017 8:23am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Not so in NZ. Doesn’t matter how many losing parties there are – if they can cobble together enough votes between them they can outnumber the winning party and take office.
  Madness.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:29am
  - KevOB
    
    Not entirely so. The parties who wish to govern have to convince the Governor General they have an effective agreement as to supply and can command the confidence of the majority of the House.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:50am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  There is much anger for Winston. He is merely a symptom.
  
  If one failed to wash one’s face at all and ended up with big boils all over one’s visage, how rational would it be to be angry at the boils?
  
  Much more intelligent to rail against the failed electoral system that has 3 times out of the 8 MMP elections allowed Winston to decide who is the government.
  
  When something as important as the processes used to determine how a country is governed is found to be defective 37.5% of the time one would think that would be enough evidence to move on to something that allows better representation of the will of the people.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:40am
  - KevOB
    
    This happens with all Westminster governments. It happened recently in the UK. If a party doesn’t have a majority of seats it must negotiate with others to get that. Otherwise when a government wanted money and it was denied its back to the Governor General who may ask another leader to seek to gain the confidence of Parliament or go to the people again.
    
    There is no automatic right to have a budget passed by the party with the largest number of seats. That right is one which Parliament as a whole must grant.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:58am
- Ross12
  
  TN
  I think even in Germany it would be possible for a coalition of the minor parties being able to form a Government ahead of the major party.
  At the moment Merkel’s GDU has about 25 of the 33% in the CDU/CSU block. The CSU are not happy with Merkel’s immigration stance so if they broke away with their 8% and joined up with others a different coalition could be formed —
  ie. technically it is possible but it probably will not occur.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:48am
- namron
  
  A return to FPP becomes more and more attractive to me.
  namron
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:40am
- artemisia
  
  Not sure it will be Mr Peters who decides who to negotiate with. Sure, it will look like that as a face saving exercise. But behind the scenes there will be bottom lines from both National and Labour.
  
  If Mr Peters doesn’t like them, there are no others!
  
  NZ First is the junior party here. Any party can walk away ….
  
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  September 28, 2017 5:13pm
lastmanstanding

Winstons many bottom lines will collapse when it comes down to it.

Bill should tell him he aint getting the baubles of office cause he always says its not about those so he aint being disappointed.

Tell him here the deal take it or leave.

Hope he signs up with the Coalition from Hell that will struggle to go 3 years and probably collapse well within that time.

Nats then in government within a renews ACT 2 or 3 seats for another 3 to 4 terms with Lab/Green locked out and NZF nowhere to be seen.

Fixed it for you Bill.
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September 28, 2017 8:27am
- Digmen1
  
  No I don’t want Labour in even for 6 months.
  They would do so much damage!
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:39am
  - krazykiwi
    
    However good the last nine years’ economic performance has been, if a fourth-term National government doesn’t make some radical changes then we’ll have Labour, starved of treasury benches, back in 2020.
    
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    September 28, 2017 8:46am
  - Colville
    
    Digmen.
    I think the reality is with the three headed hydra of Taxcinda/Winston/Shaw bitching at each other nothing would ever get done so there would be very little damage other than to NZs international reputation.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:22am
- Maxx
  
  I now believe we will have a NZF/Labour/Green Government (in that order of power).
  
  I can’t see anyone in that coalition having the ability to stand up to Winston’s level of politicking, so whatever he wants, he will get. Until it crashes, but that won’t be Winstons fault as he was keeping them honest…
  
  If this does come to fruition I can’t wait to see the odds on how long it lasts. I’d be willing to put a lazy hundy on 16 months (just before the 2nd budget).
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:04am
  - KevOB
    
    Winston has already publicly ticked Jacinda off for her naivety about tax policy as an election issue.
    He is also nearly twice her age and not a communist. Over the years his social attitudes have been made well known. In my view he’s probably closer to Act than many National people. His conservatism, is hidden by populism and pragmatism. Underneath I suspect he would find Jacinda’s politics very hard to publicly affirm.
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:07pm
- SN
  
  I couldn’t agree more. I think its by far better for National to ‘lose’ these coalition talks and wait for the inevitable collapse of a Green Labour NZF government that would be an inevitable disaster. National would only have to spend maybe 2 years in opposition watching the other three mugs do serious damage to themselves.
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:06am
  - KevOB
    
    Too expensive for the country. Even worse with a GFC lurking.
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:10pm
    - freethinker
      
      The likely GFC 2 which will make the original GFC appear benign is a good reason to allow Labour on the treasury benches, drown and probably wet much of NZ who will then learn the old adage that socialists fail when they run out of other peoples money is so so true.
      
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      September 28, 2017 12:51pm
oldpark

After watching Winston Peters on a live interview on Sky news at 10.00 pm last night. Peters was full of bluster,semantics ,and obfuscation. He mumbled something about the Maori Party getting busted at the General election,with loss of one whole seat. That more or less indicated there would be no binding referenda on Maori seats. Sounded like a flip flop. He although he dosn’t know it is,painting himself into a corner. Think the Mainstream Media have worked out a plan to con the cunning Peters.By even getting him to reveal his stance on his binding referendas.
With so many flip flops by Lie-bour in the election campaign. Whats another one,who would notice it,surely not, in the interest of their anointed Lie-bour /Green/NZF mafias coalition.
National Party who have 58 seats could be sucking lemons, after listening to the interview with Peters might develope an acute attack of heartburn.
Commie Chic Comrade Ardern who campaigned on “My Generation” ,could very well get the nod from another older “My Generation” called Winston Peters ,who got most of his 9 seats from an army of over 65s Gold Card owners.
“Commie Chic” Comrade Ardern might after all see her vision of a Socialist Republic of NZ being satisfied after all ,and how ironical by a meglamaniac called Peters. Even though his legacy to his over 65s may not be what they wished and hoped for.
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September 28, 2017 8:28am
- Maxx
  
  Does anyone in Winston’s caucus actually have any influence on him?
  
  It’s pretty obvious the decision will be his and his alone but does anyone have any sway over his thinking? Genuinely curious.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:23am
Nukuleka

Yes, T N, I don’t get it. If Germany is the home of the MMP system and they have had many decades to perfect the way it operates, why is it that Angela Merkel as the leader of the party that garnered the most votes in Germany is automatically deemed to have the right to form the next government and yet Bill English is not granted the same right? The % vote for Bill’s party is significantly higher than Merkel’s and presumably they are in the same situation of having to wait for special votes to be counted as well.
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September 28, 2017 8:30am
- Dave Mann
  
  This sounds like a way of stopping the tail of MMP from wagging the dog. Genuine question: could you explain how the German process is structured differently to ours? How is it that the right to form a government can be guaranteed only to the party with the most votes?
  
  If we could operate such a system here, then MMP wouldn’t be such a mindfuck.
  
  I had thought of some sort of system where the proportion of the vote is weighted according to the number of parties that get over 15% of the vote. This would be workable, I think, because the leading party would come out as the true ‘leader’…. but I’m not sure of the mathematics involved.
  
  Can anybody elucidate on the German system, or propose a workable modification of MMP?
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:22am
  - Dave Mann
    
    As a further thought…. the key word here is ‘proportional’. What we have at the moment is ‘extortional’ rather than ‘proportional’.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:33am
- KevOB
  
  My understanding is the convention requires the Governor General to offer the task of forming a government, which can command a majority, to the party with the largest number of electoral seats–augmented now by list members?
  
  NZ operates under the model of the Parliament at Westminster. Germany does not.
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:15pm
oldpark

Heard this joke about Peters,who has nothing to say.
An empty taxi arrived at the Beehive ,and when the door was opened Winston Peters got out.
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September 28, 2017 8:36am
VicParking

I am sick of the MSM pulling up “experts” and “hard done by’s” who use the words COULD, CAPABLE OF, MIGHT, POTENTIAL TO, ABILITY TO, BRING VALUE TO and of course ‘More funding is needed’. We will get this incessantly on a daily basis until the next government budget is produced.
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September 28, 2017 8:38am
Digmen1

Sorry, but could someone tell me what MSM means?
(this is a genuine question)
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September 28, 2017 8:41am
- lifesgood
  
  Main stream media
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:43am
- Left Right and Centre
  
  meddling stupid morons
  
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  September 29, 2017 4:11am
billmurray

Everybody could take a holiday until October 7 when then special votes are released.

Why so long to count about 350,000 votes?????.
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September 28, 2017 8:43am
- cmm
  
  Give the journalists something to talk about??
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:46am
  - sooty
    
    Don’t you love it, Winston gives the fingers to all the MSM of NZ. He gives his interview to an Aussie. To hell with barely soper, commie dann, no neck garner, paddy wet pants and all the rest of them. That’ll teach them for making shit up. How you going to tell yor bosses that you are tits useless.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:51am
    - sam green
      
      Name calling? Are you twelve?
      
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      September 28, 2017 10:56am
    - softail 1450
      
      actually sooty garners official name is “drunken garner” ,thats a fact.
      
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      September 28, 2017 11:02am
- Kimbo
  
  I don’t think it is just a case of counting them. I think they have to be checked and verified against the electoral roll, including confirming there are no duplicates.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:01am
  - Colville
    
    To see if Mmmmmmmatt has been at it again?
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:26am
- waikatogirl
  
  Paid by the hour/days/weeks?
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:19am
- MrTips
  
  Have to wait for all the voting papers to arrive from overseas etc, then collate, check and then count them.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:46am
- KevOB
  
  Validation processes are underway too.
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:19pm
cmm

Dear Winston

Time to pull your head in and do your duty to the nation you have signed up to serve.

King-making is is dishonest – you are insisting on more lollies, power and influence than you earned in the elections.

You only scored 7.5% of the votes and got kicked out of Northland.

7.5% is a tiny amount. It is less than three tots in a 1 litre bottle of whisky; less than a penny in a shilling; less than one inch on a foot-long ruler.

National, on the other hand, got 46%. It is one tot less than half a bottle. That’s more than 6 times what you got.

That means the people who are hiring you (ie. the NZ taxpayer) have decided (through voting) that National should have a large influence and you should only have a tiny influence on the political process.

Even Jacinda Party got 36%. That is a tot more than a third of a bottle. 4.5 times what you got. Therefore they should also have more influence over the political landscape than you do.

You certainly should not be deciding on who is or who is not going to be running the country for the next 3 years. You have not earned that right.

So stop this kingmaking bullshit. Fit in to the role that was decided for you by the election and you have agreed to by accepting the $250k + perks.

If you don’t like that deal then resign and hand over the job to someone that does.
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September 28, 2017 8:45am
- Peter
  
  It’s true, but the problem is the system.
  
  MMP was seemingly designed by very naive people who don’t understand leverage in negotiation. Winston may only have 7%, but he has leverage of multiples well beyond 7%.
  
  MMP, the way it is setup, is a disgrace. It is undemocratic. It creates massive leverage for minor parties.
  
  Half of all New Zealanders get everything they deserve. And they deserve Winston. They had a stable, benign government who were growing the economy. They threw it to the winds.
  
  I hope National tell him to **** off.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:58am
  - cmm
    
    Most systems like this are designed with reasonable people in mind. In the last 21 or so years most coalition partners have been reasonably well behaved and have “played nicely”.
    
    Most, that is, except Winnie who always extracts the most out of anything. Bugger the rules of decent behaviour. Bugger the best interests of the voters. Winnie takes everything that Winnie can get.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:05am
    - redeye
      
      It’s amazing that a whole 7.5% of the population would raffle their vote not knowing which side of the landscape he will side with. That’s as much of the problem as the system being flawed.
      
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      September 28, 2017 9:17am
    - Surely Knott
      
      Most , that is, except Winnie and the Greens. The Greens have as much opportunity for power here as Peters. It is the Greens that are awarding Peters absolute power by not reasonably negotiating their policies with both major powers. They are not interested in MMP and allowing a mix of ideas in power. Labour have already kicked them out of negotiations. Greens have the best opportunity ever to get their policy over the line but chose not to negotiate.
      
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      September 28, 2017 10:48am
  - Swifty
    
    It’s the tyranny of the minority….
    
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    September 28, 2017 10:57am
- KevOB
  
  It’s the media who have been hyping this up. Stirrers trying to sell advertising.
  Every comment Winston has made recently has been hijacked. He can be litigious so there may be ensuing trouble from excessive “journalism”.
  It is notable that the his sensible humble comments about NZF’s present role I heard in a post election speech have not been repeated in the media.
  
  Time out is a feature of the electoral process. No one knows who has what seats until the votes are counted and the writs returned. Major parties can prepare themselves but minor ones have little to do.
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:30pm
Happychappy

If Winston does a u turn on his policy to get rid of the Maori Seats Don Brash will be spewing and will be a loser three times. So it will be interesting to know how much money they gave to Winston First and his Party. How will Chuck take this News as this is one of his main talking points the racist Maori seats.
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September 28, 2017 8:48am
- Paulus
  
  Winston has said to the Aussie media that he has changed his mind over the Maori seats.
  He will not now abolish them.
  
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  September 28, 2017 2:04pm
oldpark

See the Lie-bour/Green infested Wellington City Councils mayor called Lester has appointed an ex teacher called Jill Day as deputy mayor.
Amazing to think that someone who has been in council under 12 months.
What the media have not been told Jill Day is a personal friend of Lester. Lester told her to stand for council at the last council elections. Now he has appointed her as deputy mayor. Wonder could this be a case of alleged “nepotism”. What is going on,who watches the watchers. After all Lester seems to have as much power in council,as Peters seems to have in what type of Government he will dominate.None of it a good look in a so called democracy.
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September 28, 2017 8:51am
- sooty
  
  Just think of all the relevant experience that she brings to the job.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:54am
  - oldpark
    
    Maybe not just a pretty face.Hmmmmm.
    
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    September 28, 2017 10:40am
103PapPap

Up here in Europe on holiday reading the UK papers, can’t help noticing that they have same problems that we have back in good old NZ.
Unaffordeable housing, health care in crisis, child poverty, low wages, executive excess pay, education in disarray, racism, drugs, immigration overload and, of course, rugby prowess.
So do our countries actually have the same issues? Or have NZ politicians ‘imported’ issues from (in this case) the UK?
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September 28, 2017 8:53am
- Gabby
  
  They’ve decided that some human wastage is an acceptable price to pay for electoral survival.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:27am
Maxx

It makes me thankful that we now have craft beers and that I can collect Whiskey’s that I love to drink of all sorts. My drinking problem is now a hobby. What a time to be alive.
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September 28, 2017 8:57am
- Richard
  
  Why don’t you invite Winston for a drink? I think Winston has a fondness for the Water of Life. And while you’ve got him there..tell him which way to go in October 😉
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:05am
  - Maxx
    
    Ah, but I like to either have intelligent conversation or silence, not some incoherent ramblings. He’s probably got some good stories to tell though so it wouldn’t be all bad.
    
    I imagine it to be a bit of a Denny Crane / Alan Shore moment. We just need Winston to start answering any question at a press conference now as “Winston Peters”. “Winston Peters”.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:19am
    - Gabby
      
      dim’s gettin innerested
      
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      September 28, 2017 9:29am
      - softail 1450
        
        you are out of bed early this morning grubby, did you shit the bed again ?
        
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        September 28, 2017 11:09am
Inandout

NRL goes same sex.
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/tony-abbott-backs-call-to-ban-samesex-anthem-from-nrl-grand-final-2017
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September 28, 2017 8:57am
- VicParking
  
  “Trump is right: the league’s own rules require respect for the anthem and flag under which many Americans returned in caskets. The fact the NFL chose to ignore its own rules, its own contracts, and its own collective bargaining agreement is a sign it doesn’t consider disrespect for the flag to be “conduct detrimental” to the “public reputation” of the league. That’s what happens when you get your news from CNN.”
  http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2017/09/26/robert-barnes-no-nfl-players-not-right-kneel-boycott-american-anthem/
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:30am
  - Kimbo
    
    But is going down on one knee a sign of disrespect? I don’t think so. True, it is not the usual posture one adopts when listening to the national anthem. Nonetheless, like this famous incident from the 1968 Olympics:
    
    http://africasacountry.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/072712-sports-olympics-moments-tommie-smith-John-Carlos-black-power-salute.jpg
    
    …it is not slovenly, arrogant, or casual. Indeed, it is a deliberate posture that conveys elements of both humility…and defiance. And in doing so it communicates that all is not necessarily well or right with the nation whose flag and anthem are the focus at that particular moment. Seems a reasonable thing in a nation whose first constitutional amendment guarantees freedom of speech. Trump is free also to say what he wants, although I don’t think he is necessarily wise, or doing the best he can do to “preserve, protect and defend the constitution”. But he is flat out wrong it is an act of disrespect IMHO.
    
    Bear in mind that does not mean one has to agree with some or all of the aims and actions of BLM, or the political views of those kneeling. Indeed, you may be strongly opposed to those things, and good luck to you. But interpreting kneeling on one knee as blatant disrespect for the flag and anthem? Nope, don’t buy it…
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:39am
    - KevOB
      
      In times past public disrepect for the national flag was treason with the appropriate consequences.
      
      Either we have a state or not: there is no halfway house.
      
      In NZ we had to stand up for God Save the Queen at the commencement of all public events including Saturday morning movies.
      
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      September 28, 2017 12:39pm
      - Kimbo
        
        Either we have a state or not: there is no halfway house.
        
        What does that mean? Jehovah’s Witnesses don’t stand for or sing the national anthem, nor show respect for the flag, including in the days when you used to stand in the cinema…and I don’t think the nation, or the USA for that matter was incapable of tolerating it.
        
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        September 28, 2017 12:42pm
      - Kimbo
        
        …do I have to mention that I consider the Jehovah’s Witnesses an evil pernicious cult, not only spiritually, but also for their prohibition against blood transfusions which has cost the lives of thousands
        
        …and if their beliefs concerning government and the military were adopted wholesale it would soon result in a severe weakening of our national defence
        
        …but nonetheless it is a good thing they are given the freedom to believe, speak and act as they do?
        
        Or is the concept of religious and political pluralism something some Kiwibloggers are incapable of understanding and appreciating? Careful what you wish for, because it may be just a matter of time before your beliefs, words and actions will attract penalties too!
        
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        September 28, 2017 12:56pm
      - MCos
        
        I remember the national anthem before the pictures. I also remember that it was knocked on the head because nobody was paying it any attention.
        
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        September 28, 2017 1:59pm
    - VicParking
      
      The NFL rules say the players will line up on the sideline with their helmets in their left hand. They should place their right hand over their heart. This has been confirmed by the players union.
      
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      September 28, 2017 12:39pm
      - Kimbo
        
        But the owners have the right to waive them if they see fit.
        
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        September 28, 2017 12:43pm
      - Gabby
        
        ‘Should’ isn’t ‘must’.
        
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        September 28, 2017 6:21pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    There’s a bit more to this than freedom of speech.
    Stadiums get a lot of Federal funding not only to be built but also for maintenance because they argue it’s funding a ‘Civic Institution’
    Yeah, Corporate Cronyism at its best.
    But the point is it could be argued that when they disrespect the Flag or Anthem they contradict the ethos that the funding was intended to create and enhance.
    There’s also a lot of hypocrisy that those Stadiums have made a lot of owners and players very very rich.
    Average salary for an NFL player is about $2.4 mio pa
    All this is moot though because at the end of the day, it’s a business.
    If they lose viewers they’re going to go broke.
    And they’re losing viewers bigly.
    Look at ESPN, got political and now their numbers are in freefall. The NFL viewers are walking away too. Cable companies are giving refunds.
    So they can exercise their ‘free speech’ and disrespect the flag all they like but they’re going to go broke doing it. And they will lose their funding eventually too. It works both ways.
    If you’re upset about inequality I’d suggest cutting your own throats is not the way to protest it and fix the problem.
    Sad!
    
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    September 28, 2017 2:24pm
    - Gabby
      
      Kneeling isn’t a mark of disrespect ghonny.
      
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      September 28, 2017 6:22pm
      - KevOB
        
        Tell that to the Headmaster when the school rules require it.
        
        Anarchy doesn’t rule yet.
        
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        September 28, 2017 7:23pm
      - Kimbo
        
        You are comparing this to anarchy? Or adults to school children?
        
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        September 28, 2017 7:31pm
  - Gabby
    
    It’s a shame Ponyboy isn’t around to explain to brightfart the difference between rules and guidelines VicBarking.
    
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    September 28, 2017 6:24pm
Richard

From the NZ herald today:

“On the question of the Maori seats, it was written up as ‘Peters is opposed and is going to abolish the Maori seats’. That’s not true,” Peters said.
“I said ‘Let’s have a referendum and let the people decide’, but apparently some people don’t like democracy.
“Anyway, the Maori Party itself was one of the things behind us saying it. The Maori Party are a race-based, origin-of-race party. It got smashed in this election and is gone.
“So some of the elements to the environment in which a promise was made have since changed. That’s all I can say.”

Its all about UTU with Winston. Its all about UTU….
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September 28, 2017 8:57am
- Kimbo
  
  He he he. Wonder what he will signal next. If Peters is prepared to ditch the Maori seats referendum then he is either trying to strengthen his hand for negotiations with Bill English (National would not have a problem in principle with a referendum as their policy states they are in favour of abolition)…or Peters is indeed keeping open a way he could go with Labour.
  
  Next item to maybe be thrown on the bonfire?:
  
  Railway from Marsden Point (he is not the MP of Northland anymore so owes that electorate nothing)
  
  Pike River re-entry?
  
  Pulling out of/substantially re-negotiating the new TPPA? No way National will trade that.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:09am
- KevOB
  
  Realism.
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:40pm
- VicParking
  
  I don’t think the Maori seats are going anyware evan though the majority of voters dont want them.
  In Auckland Marguerite Delbet and her team of lefty Democracy Services staff are pushing for Auckland Council to have a specialist Maori seat on council. This of course will be as well as the Māori Statutory Board seat. Other local bodies are reviewing their Democracy situation and are using it to introduce either a Maori seat or a Moari committee.
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:50pm
PaulP

It seems to me that the Key Derangement Syndrome has now become National Derangement Syndrome.

These people seem to think that if Labour form the next Government, magically overnight the stardust will settle on their lives and they will suddenly be able to afford a home in Auckland or wherever they live, have a new high paid job and be living in a land of crisp clear rivers.

Even though I’m a “two ticks blue” person I actually hope that Winston now goes with Labour and the Greens so that these muppets realise there’s no magic bullet for their lives other than hard work and saving.

The vitriol and hatred of the left is just about becoming civic unrest. They need a dose of a left wing Government to realise not every thing is “the Governments fault”. Let’s give it to them and come back stronger after their coalition implodes and/or the people that voted for them become disillusioned when they can’t magically “fix” their lives for them.

I actually think for social cohesion of our society this would be the best thing and hopefully in one term they can’t do too much damage!
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September 28, 2017 9:04am
- Kimbo
  
  I actually hope that Winston now goes with Labour and the Greens so that these muppets realise there’s no magic bullet for their lives other than hard work and saving.
  
  The mistake you make in that scenario is that the hard core will draw the lesson, wise up how the world works and adjust accordingly. Instead, as per Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua, Kampuchea, the USSR, pick-you-left-wing-shithole….
  
  …they double-down on their efforts to end the privilege of the white colonial capitalist oppressor that is the cause of all problems in life. 😉
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:13am
  - Peter
    
    I think New Zealanders are too middle-way to accept and support the radical left. That group make a lot of noise but achieve very little vote.
    
    I also hope Winston goes with Lab/Green. There is almost certainly an economic correction coming up in the near future, and “having visions” is not going to produce a fairyland.
    
    The 50% who are under this illusion obviously need to go through the pain of reality. You can’t convince them with logic.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:17am
    - Kimbo
      
      Yep. In his first book “The Rise and Fall of a Young Turk” (1974) Rob Muldoon, when summarising his political principles wrote “there is no place for class warfare among our people”. Bear in mind that was in the middle of the Cold War. Still holds true.
      
      To be fair, Peters is no socialist – he is, like Muldoon a pragmatic nationalist with a distrust for the unfettered free market. Labour, historically, and at their best when the left wing radicals are kept at arms length are the same. The Greens? Watermelons to the core.
      
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      September 28, 2017 9:21am
- rightoverlabour
  
  Look at the wankers from the left on Trade Me over the Bill English painting. I am beginning to loathe the left.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:17am
  - Inandout
    
    Try the Guardian comments for loathsome left.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:24am
- Muttonbird
  
  These people seem to think that if Labour form the next Government, magically overnight the stardust will settle on their lives and they will suddenly be able to afford a home in Auckland or wherever they live, have a new high paid job and be living in a land of crisp clear rivers.
  
  Er, no. What they do expect is for a government to recognise a problem (there are problems with housing, inequality, infrastructure, wages, and water quality) and respond with strategic solutions for the whole society, rather than reactionary catch-up efforts aimed at minimising damage only.
  
  People realise it’s going to take some time to reverse the social damage done by the John Key government.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:29am
  - VicParking
    
    The problem with Labour is they will do nothing about it other than setup commissions, increase public sector wages and numbers, and moan that National left them in a mess so they can’t afford the promises they made pre election.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:34am
    - waikatogirl
      
      Vic, you forgot another thing, they will have their sticky fingers in your wallet with their promised increased taxes.
      
      I’m all for muttonbird, etc experiencing a period under the left. Won’t be long before he starts squawking that life isn’t fair.
      
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      September 28, 2017 9:41am
    - Maxx
      
      You forgot the copious amounts of money that will be thrown at the problem, which then becomes a jobs program in itself for mid-tier bureaucrats to line their pockets.
      
      Labour policy: It’s not about outcomes, it’s about how much you money you spend on it. “
      
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      September 28, 2017 10:22am
  - Peter
    
    They haven’t produced any in nine years, what makes you think they will now?
    
    The “problems” are either very complicated and involve costs we can’t meet or are mythical.
    
    You can have visions all you like, but the left have not produced any strategy. It’s not like they have had anything else to do.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:44am
- Longknives
  
  “These people seem to think that if Labour form the next Government, magically overnight the stardust will settle on their lives and they will suddenly be able to afford a home in Auckland”
  
  Not just Auckland- Ponsonby!
  Everyone should be able to have their ‘dream’ Ponsonby Villa Paul…
  Still remember those University Graduates crying to the Herald because they had been working ‘soo hard’ for a year or so since they Graduated and they felt they deserved the villa of their dreams!
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:37pm
- KevOB
  
  This is deranged.
  Giving to the opposition so they can prove to themselves how bad they are, so they hopefully will give the job back in future–daft.
  
  What makes you think they will cede anything except leave an economic mess.
  
  NZ can’t afford the Labour/Greens experiment. With a GFC lurking it would be foolish in the extreme to let amateurs near government.
  
  MMP gives false hopes that members elected or listed have ability to actually govern.
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:51pm
oldpark

Another joke doing the rounds the coalition. Labour/Greens/Nzf. Who is sorry now,and who is laughing. One part is funny peculiar. The other part is hahaha.
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September 28, 2017 9:11am
- sam green
  
  That makes no sense – comedic or otherwise.
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:12am
  - AgentBallSack
    
    Neither do you.
    BADOOM TISH!
    
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    September 28, 2017 3:52pm
Digmen1

The only good thing is that hopefully in the next election Winston will be too old and dodery to stand again.
The NZF will either die away, or be more upfront in which way it will go BEFORE the election.
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September 28, 2017 9:24am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  I’ve been hearing that for a long time and here we are again with MMP handing the keys to Winston for the 3rd time in 8 MMP elections.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:27am
Digmen1

Who / Where is our Governor General ?
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September 28, 2017 9:25am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Dame Patsy Reddy can do nothing until after the writs are returned and the final results of the election are declared.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:37am
- sam green
  
  Why digamen1 ?
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:14am
Peter

People keep banging on about a “legacy”. What legacy? When he retires, what is left of NZ First? If he somehow briefly makes PM, the legacy may be a rethink of MMP, the footnote being “what a strange time in history that was where a minor leader could become the nations leader”.

There is no on-going ideological cohesive movement, only a cult of personality.
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September 28, 2017 9:27am
Keeping Stock

It’s time to put some heat under the Greens. Do they actually WANT to be a part of government, or are they content to sit on the sidelines, complaining that the government is not doing enough on the areas they claim to care about.

Check out the text of this petition, which already has more than 5400 signatures, including both mine and that of DPF:

Show your support for the idea of a National/Green govt.

** By signing this petition, you are sending a message to Bill English and James Shaw that there is a community of voters out there that believe in the possibility of a Blue/Green government. We are asking them to have a genuine conversation and explore the idea before it’s too late! **

Currently we are sitting in wait for old mate Winston Peters to choose who is going to run the country. After watching all the pundits in media talk about what the next government would look like, it started to annoy me that everyone has been ruling out a National/Green coalition and rightly so as both parties have basically written it off.
BUT they have left the smallest of doors open.
That’s where we come in!

I genuinely think there is common ground between the National Party and The Green Party, which could result is practical policy wins for New Zealand. Environmental issues such as carbon neutrality and social issues like child poverty come to mind. Unfortunately, the notion that the two parties have nothing in common is so well written into their fabric, it’s considered to be not worth exploring or seen as politically dangerous.

James Shaw has said he wouldn’t consider forming a government with National because it would go against the wishes of Green voters. This maybe true but after speaking to some Green supporters, I’ve found that there are Green voters would be open to a blue/green coalition and I ask Mr Shaw to hear these people out.

Bill English also needs to take stock and be open to the potential that a blue/green government can unlock for New Zealand by hearing that this is also something a large block of National voters would love to see as well.

A National Green coalition government for the next 3 years can ensure than New Zealand will ensure a strong, clean and green economy, the same can’t be said for any government with NZF!

This election season has brought about many extraordinary results and circumstances, it’s only fitting we at least try this now.

Voting every three years is only a small part of what can do to make sure our leaders hear our voice. I would love your support via a signature, but a share on social media can make all the difference!

https://www.change.org/p/bill-english-james-shaw-show-your-support-for-the-idea-of-a-national-green-govt

Even in the time I have been typing and copy/pasting this, the number of signatures is rising quickly. There’s a real ground-swell of opinion that James Shaw should at least talk to Bill English and see what areas of commonality they have.

Who knows; National may be prepared to offer the Greens a portfolio like Environment, which is supposedly the kaupapa of the Green movement. It would be a chance for the Greens to actually be a positive force for change, rather than achieve nothing but virtue signalling.

Surely, after 21 years in Parliament, you’d expect the Greens to be open to the opportunity to influence the government. And you know with certainty, that if Winston Peters is part of any coalition deal, the Greens are once again going to be cannon-fodder to Labour. Here’s a chance for them to show their true colours.
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September 28, 2017 9:35am
- Peter
  
  I think they are showing their true colours by refusing to use their leverage.
  
  Their true colours are not green, but red.
  
  Wonder when the penny will drop for some of their voters? Right about now, I suspect.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:39am
- Manolo
  
  @KS: This sensible and logical request is going to fall on deaf ears.
  
  The Green Party is full of hard-core ideologues and dedicated communists, to whom the possibility of an alliance with English & co is anathema.
  
  The Greens could not care less about New Zealand. Advancement of their authoritarian and totalitarian agenda is all that matters.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:44am
  - sam green
    
    “The Green Party is full of hard-core ideologues and dedicated communists”
    
    No it isn’t.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:18am
    - Albert_Ross
      
      Why won’t they countenance working with National then?
      
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      September 28, 2017 3:48pm
- Muttonbird
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Such a laugh how desperate National is. For decades the Greens have been the looney left, commies, political poison, etc, and the idea of a Labour/Greens government has been though of as somewhere much worse than armageddon itself. In fact successive National campaigns have been run scaring voters that a vote for Labour is a vote for Greens!
  
  Now you are all cuddling up to them in desperation. Hypocritical flop-flop much?
  
  Things must be very dark inside the National caucus right now if they have to get their media operational arm to pimp this nonsensical idea all over town.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:49am
  - Peter
    
    They are in totality, Muttonbird. But the environmental MPs of the Greens are compatible with both Labour and National. In case you hadn’t noticed, National have been improving water quality.
    
    Now you are all cuddling up to them in desperation.
    
    No, it’s called MMP. It was supposed to be about working together.
    
    But if they aren’t interested in furthering environmental concerns within government – in working together towards a goal – then it’s clear they are more interested in socialism and tribalism.
    
    That’s fine. Personally, I hope National does not form a government. I hope the result is Winston/Labour/Green, and in that order. I will be very disappointed if National go with Peters.
    
    National should play the long game – but they won’t have to wait long, in practice.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:58am
  - SteveRemmington
    
    I just think that National and their supporters recognise the Greens may offer more stability in Govt than Winston would.
    
    Labour just don’t care, even if it means cutting the Greens off at the knees Labour will embrace instability to the detriment of country just to get into power.
    
    Just goes to show. National cares for NZ’ers. Labour couldn’t give a fuck about them.
    
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    September 28, 2017 10:09am
    - Muttonbird
      
      Just goes to show. National cares for NZ’ers. Labour couldn’t give a fuck about them.
      
      He’s here all night, folks.
      
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      September 28, 2017 10:13am
      - SteveRemmington
        
        “He’s here all night, folks.”
        
        Regrettably so are you.
        
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        September 28, 2017 10:30am
  - srylands
    
    “Now you are all cuddling up to them in desperation. Hypocritical flop-flop much?”
    
    You seem to confuse the commentators here with the National Party.
    
    Suggesting that a Green National government could be good for New Zealand, is not inconsistent with a conclusion that a Labour Green government would be bad for New Zealand.
    
    So your comment is based on both a false premise and a formal fallacy.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:02am
    - Muttonbird
      
      So it’s not the Greens which are bad, it’s Labour.
      
      How does that marry up to National campaigning over the years which focused on ‘vote for Labour and you’ll get the loony Greens’?
      
      I get it, the Greens are great as long as there are taught right and renounce all their social policy much like the Maori Party. Labour wouldn’t presume to tell the Greens what to do.
      
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      September 28, 2017 1:17pm
      - srylands
        
        “I get it, the Greens are great as long as there are taught right and renounce all their social policy”
        
        Correct.
        
        All of their social policies are damaging.
        
        Some of their environmental objectives are fine. Their choice of policy solution is often flawed. Opposition to emissions trading for example. IF we are going to have greenhouse gas emissions reduction objectives then market instruments are best. Same with water allocation.
        
        All those issues can be worked through. But those who are in the Green Party for reasons of economic sabotage would need to go off and form their own party.
        
        So a coalition with National would create a stable government and also lead to reform of the Green Party itself. It would be a win for both National and the Greens and the nation.
        
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        September 28, 2017 2:58pm
- waikatogirl
  
  KS, I’m just worried Greens going with National would be inviting a stoat into the hen house. I wouldn’t trust a stoat as that is it’s nature to attack; as I wouldn’t trust the Greens who are fanatically incompatible with National.
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:49am
  - srylands
    
    A coalition would probably end in a split with the communists leaving to form the Communist Party and the environmentalists remaining in the Green Party in coalition with National. That seems like a good outcome for everyone.
    
    I have no issue at all with a Communist Party. People have the right to form whatever party they like. I do though object to a communist party hiding within a Green Party. They are able to obtain the voting support of a bunch of naive people who would otherwise never support them.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:08am
  - Inandout
    
    Bill would have to keep the Greens well away from sensitive information, and certainly nowhere near the SIS.
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:11pm
- ROJ
  
  A lot of commentators worry that working with the Nats might gut the Greens. We might find that this would lead to the best possible outcome for MMP, where the environmentally concerned in National start feeling comfortable giving their vote to the Greens and actually make them truly independent of either left and right.
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:20am
Fletch

Winston said last night on Sky in an interview with Andrew Bolt that National in NZ are “national with a small ‘n’ and conservative with a small ‘c'”. He was also asked by Andrew, “what is the one big thing you’d want from the party you chose to go with?”

http://www.skynews.com.au/news/politics/newzealand/2017/09/27/nz-first-leader-stalls-coalition-negotiations.html
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September 28, 2017 9:55am
- ROJ
  
  So he u-turned on not saying anything until results were in?
  No surprise there.
  Not only does he have them playing his tune, he makes out the discord is their problem!
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:36am
  - Fletch
    
    No, he still isn’t going to make a decision until next month.
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:02pm
Dafixeruppa

From the stuffed up today
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/97265966/woman-who-did-not-reveal-theft-charge-to-new-boss-awarded-7000

Woman applies for a job, hides that in a previous role she was fired for theft, where the organisation she worked for backed down once she quit, signed a contract stating that she had provided full and truthful responses, then takes the company to court when they cancel her contract due to her not telling them about her theft.
AND the useless f*cken judge grants her a payout!!! WTF is with that?
SHE LIED! she signed a contract which was immediately invalid because she withheld pertinent information and then went to court when the company didn’t want her to work for them.
FFS what has happened to our country?????????
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September 28, 2017 10:06am
- Jazz-Hands Mc Feels
  
  “hides that in a previous role she was fired for theft”
  
  No she wasn’t, she resigned and successfully defended the charge of theft which was dismissed by a court of law.
  
  When I started out in the work force in one of many shitty gigs to come, I was under suspicion of stealing from the till.
  
  Guess what, the friggin business owner himself, senile old fart, was dipping into cash register treating it like the petty cash box, making no record of the fact then getting all confused and shitty about it. Didn’t even apologise to me after his wife/adult diaper changer figured out what was happening.
  
  I also have a close family member who was framed by her cockroach manager and the office whore for a large sum they stole from the business. Thank god the police investigator looked a lot closer and nailed their scheming weasel butts to the wall.
  
  So you need to keep a VERY OPEN mind about what is going down in workplaces. In my experience the vast majority of work places are rife with scheming manipulative whores, brainless idiots and Border Personality Disorders.
  
  I could write a fucking novel with all the bat shit crazy degenerates I have been forced to rub shoulders with 40 hours a week over the years.
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:41am
  - fluffykiwi
    
    I feel for you, I have been so lucky in my life and the people I have worked with. I suppose some get all the luck and only have to deal with nice people.
    
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    September 28, 2017 3:03pm
  - Dafixeruppa
    
    You missed the point.
    Whether she was guilty or not, she did not have that role on her CV, acknowledged that it was because she was concerned that it would influence the outcome and then signed a declaration that she had supplied Full and Accurate information.
    If she had been innocent AND could provide proof, then it would have been a non-issue. She lied on a legal document and then got upset when she was found out.
    WHY would you trust someone that had lied?
    
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    September 28, 2017 4:35pm
- Gabby
  
  Too right, the boss’s word should be law even when he’s fukkaddiduppa.
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:56am
  - Dafixeruppa
    
    Gabby good to see that you are still your usual f*cked up self. Please don’t change, we all need some one to laugh at.
    
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    September 28, 2017 4:36pm
    - softail 1450
      
      daf ,aint that the truth,grubby is like the old drunk granny at the xmas party that nobody wants to sit next to…….
      
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      September 28, 2017 5:11pm
    - Gabby
      
      You wouldn’t want a potential employer to be fed a line of malicious bullshit by dafukkemuppa from whom you’d just quit now would you.
      
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      September 28, 2017 6:12pm
kowtow

Reserve Bank keeps interest rate on hold.

I wonder if Cindy knows , cos she didn’t know about it last time round , and the media party who would have crucified a conservative pollie for that rank ignorance , gave her a free pass on it.
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September 28, 2017 10:12am
Prince

Logged into Stuff three times today but something’s missing. What is Jacinda doing today, where is she, where are the photos ?
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September 28, 2017 10:18am
- burt
  
  I think the people have a right to know, and we’ll be telling you soon where she is. But for now just trust that she is still thinking about you and how she will make your life sooo much better by taking money from me and giving it to others.
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:35am
  - sooty
    
    We, all know were she is. She’s at school! Just a different school each day. I bet she don’t take a packed lunch from gayford.
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:38pm
- VicParking
  
  She’s grinding up Almonds to make milk so she can bottle feed her Partner.
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:56pm
  - Poppa
    
    Is he on a bottle now?
    
    Must be growing up
    
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    September 28, 2017 1:50pm
burt

Finally….
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/97325688/mori-partys-marama-fox-to-build-60k-affordable-houses

They have a solution which isn’t just forcing other people to pay. Well done Marama, this has always been an option for you and your people and it is good you have finally seen it.
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September 28, 2017 10:23am
- Digmen1
  
  Yes that’s great!
  I have seen some of the Papakainga homes (modern ones) and they look great.
  I hope she succeeds.
  But there have been a few pre-fab style companies set up here in NZ and then fold pretty quick
  
  As a European I used to like Marama on that Back Bench program (Just the nine kids would have put me off)
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:33am
- greybeard
  
  This sounds good, but why was it not mentioned BEFORE the election? This cannot have been initiated in the last 3 days.
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:43am
  - burt
    
    Probably because they wanted tax payers to pay for it.
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:01pm
- Gabby
  
  They couldn’t while they were in cahoots with natFletchers burt. They just had to sit on their burtholes.
  
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  September 28, 2017 10:53am
- Anne Glen Eden
  
  It sounds good but how are they going to be used? Ownership or rentals?
  
  Are these intended as racial ‘reservations? Will people ‘buy’ them on a leasehold basis? What will the resale value be if they want to move on and/or how do they get their money out? Who can they sell to? How long, therefore, is it intended they stay?
  
  And a whole host of other questions…. will they do something about their social statistics or will they become ghettos? Retirement villages?
  
  It’s never as simple as ‘we’ll build houses’. There is always an ethos of ‘community’ etc. Up until now, Maori have been cruising on Treaty grievances and emotional and emotive/sentimental ties to their ‘land’ while they’re distributed around the country – and notions of ‘pride’ which some mistakenly believe will lift their social performance.
  
  This type of policy could be a furtherance of a formal parallel tribal ‘society’. Given the normally intensely racist tone of Marama Fox, that is what I would expect. A good way to recruit a captive ‘people’ and possibly no different to the concept of Destiny Church ‘compounds’ or Gloriavale.
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:31am
  - mikenmild
    
    Gosh you talk some crap, Anne. Loved the ‘racial reservations’ though. Had you thought of using the term ‘Bantustans’?
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:34am
    - Jack5
      
      Back from the blog slammer, eh, Milky?
      
      Do you think the last-minute silence because of your incarceration tilted the election result to the right?
      
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      September 28, 2017 4:47pm
Rodney Randall

https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=bill+english+and+angela+merkel&dcr=0&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjigaiWlMXWAhUJVrwKHTamAtUQ_AUICigB&biw=1436&bih=734#imgrc=9ftKqavSvnqr-M:

Besotted with the hag who detests the German flag!
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September 28, 2017 10:27am
Rodney Randall

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fi0dffrSmPI

Angela Merkel Shows Her White Guilt By Throwing The German Flag Away.

C^&T

Always worth a revisit.
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September 28, 2017 10:30am
Monique Watson

Thanks for the update on interest rates. Expected that. What else did he say? Steady for the next year to eighteen months?
Timed it perfectly. Expecting an offer of finance this week before a new government can do any mischief.
Hola! from Stepfordville.
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September 28, 2017 10:47am
Monique Watson

Nice remodeling on some shitty old properties by an entrepreneurial youg lady. NZ needs more people like this willing to get their hands dirty:
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11926485

Fark she did the hard yards though doing it all herself without hiring a contractor. They can be more trouble than they’re worth though I had to yell at one dodgy contractor and his dickhead electrician to get the off my property. If you’ve got the skills, do it yourself. I can paint, tile and hang wallpaper and hubby can pull wires. Haha we have our oldest pull them through the crawl space now. Have a fully programmed remotely operated lights, security and media center.
Dime do you do it yourself or get contractors?
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September 28, 2017 10:58am
- Kimbo
  
  Haha we have our oldest pull them through the crawl space now.
  
  Which is also good training to be a chimney sweep. As you are providing your child with life skills and inculcating a work ethic, that makes you model parents. 😉
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:01am
- Longknives
  
  That lady is the Herald is gloating over her successes while children in South Auckland go to School with Hungry Tummies! This is White Privilege at it’s worst- The ‘Rich Bitch’ must pay!
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:30pm
  - Longknives
    
    I figure if we are going to get a Labour/Greens Government- If you can’t beat ’em then join ’em….
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:32pm
- SPC
  
  An example to us all …
  
  If you work on doing up a house you get an untaxed CG as your reward when you sell (and a higher rental return on the original investment than otherwise until then). Yet if you had worked in a weekend job you would have paid PAYE tax on the income.
  
  The more people who do this, the less opportunity for first home buyers to get into the market.
  
  And the lack of tax to government on the property value gain means higher tax rates on others.
  
  PS Example does not apply in over-valued markets – as per TV3
  
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  September 28, 2017 12:42pm
- KevOB
  
  She’s an income tax dodger. She plainly went into the first property intending to do it and resell it–that’s not capital gain but a reward for purposeful work for gain and hence assessable income.
  The second property likewise. This is business activity.
  
  There is scope to enlarge the bright line test beyond two years. Five years with the tax falling on all sales but proportionally rebated to zero between 3-5 years.
  
  A further proviso that any person or technically associated person who disposes of 3 houses within any 10 year period be deemed to have entered into a money making scheme and hence the profits on all are taxable in full irrespective of the period for which any have been held and no rebate to be be applied on account of that and that any rebate previously applied may be clawed back.
  
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  September 28, 2017 1:22pm
ROJ

For years now National have been holding the carrot of millions out to Northland Ngapuhi as a Treaty settlement. Its not that they don’t want it, they just don’t want to work together to take it, OR to let each other have their own baubles.
Peters is a Northland Ngapuhi.
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September 28, 2017 11:12am
- mikenmild
  
  Is Peters even Ngapuhi? Just because he’s from Northland doesn’t automatically make it so.
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:38am
  - ROJ
    
    Well he claims to be. I accepted that, as being supported by evidence.
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:40am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    He is of Ngãti Wai descent.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ng%C4%81ti_Wai
    
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    September 28, 2017 12:02pm
    - ROJ
      
      I stand corrected.
      
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      September 28, 2017 2:14pm
    - Paulus
      
      Winston is also a Ngati dresser !
      
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      September 28, 2017 2:15pm
    - Jack5
      
      Maggy, were you deliberately using a tilde instead of a macron in your 12.02 post?
      
      Or does Winston’s tribe have some sort of common speech defect that’s got into the tribal name?
      
      Or perhaps your subconscious linked to a vision of Winston with a post-tipple lean on and thought a wiggly macron was more appropriate.
      
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      September 28, 2017 4:52pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @Jack5
        
        Maggy, were you deliberately using a tilde instead of a macron in your 12.02 post?
        
        Oh dear..I do believe that was the first time I used the pop-up accents on my Mac. The pop-up comes up in light blue… and I can’t see it very well – I just selected what looked ok.
        
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        September 28, 2017 8:16pm
      - realityczech
        
        Jackie the important thing to remember is that National’s old boy network is powerless without Winston.
        
        I know it annoys you because he is not your sort, but that is part of his attraction. He flushes out the conceited wankers.
        
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        September 28, 2017 8:23pm
New Kiwi

There could be a case for National making a public offer to NZ First setting out a few areas of NZ First Policy they would be prepared to take on board and challenging WP to accept it or walk away.
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September 28, 2017 12:20pm
Happychappy

I can not see why Andrew Little should have his definition charges dismissed because one of the complaintants has died as the appeal was lodged before he passed away. There has to be some sort of justice and politicians must be held accountable for their actions or it will become a regular occurrence with comments that could be worse than this. This ex Leader makes a habit of trout mouthing people he does not agree with and will not learn if this case does not get a verdict.
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September 28, 2017 12:42pm
- Poppa
  
  One thing you can be sure of is there will never be donation from the Hagerman estate to the Labour party
  
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  September 28, 2017 1:53pm
- calendar girl
  
  “defamation”?
  
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  September 28, 2017 3:40pm
BananaLlama

Another day of Rural and Suburban retards blaming 7.5% of the population for the other 92.5% inability to work together and form a stable government.
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September 28, 2017 2:28pm
Happychappy

A great read on the spinoff about National and their campaign to get the rural and migrant vote.
https://thespinoff.co.nz
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September 28, 2017 2:58pm
Fletch

A new report in the U.S shows the true cost of illegal immigration. It costs the U.S $135 billion a year. Illegal immigrants pay only about $19 billion in taxes leaving a shortfall of $116 billion that the American taxpayer must pay. Add to this so-called “chain migration” where immigrants are allowed to bring in family members. According to DHS, one immigrant will bring in an average of 3.5 family members as well. Each legal immigrant from Mexico has brought in an average of 6 family members.

https://fairus.org/issue/publications-resources/fiscal-burden-illegal-immigration-united-states-taxpayers
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September 28, 2017 3:39pm
Jack5

An interesting article in the blog, the Spinoff, about what looks to be something of a scam – testing homes for methamphetamine.

The article is also reproduced on the web site of the Hooerald.

But crikey, otherwise there’s a shipload of Leftist crap at the Spinoff.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/business/27-09-2017/the-great-meth-testing-scam/
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September 28, 2017 4:32pm
Longknives

RIP Hef!
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September 28, 2017 4:32pm
- big bruv
  
  Watch the line up of Bimbo’s now try and lay claim to his estate. Sadly, I suspect his reputation is about to be trashed by money hungry tarts.
  
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  September 28, 2017 4:35pm
  - Longknives
    
    Watch the Femnazis on the Left savage him as well- Despite the fact he was a long time Democrat and Philanthropist…
    
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    September 28, 2017 4:39pm
- softail 1450
  
  after all the viagra he consumed they will have to bury him in a dual plane coffin….
  
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  September 28, 2017 5:17pm
MrTips

Hugh Hefner dead. Finally, got what he wanted……… permanently stiff.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/97359381/playboy-founder-hugh-hefner-dead
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September 28, 2017 4:34pm
- Johnboy
  
  Great magazine he founded. Wonderful articles. Great bunch of cutting edge authors he got to write for it. Only ruined by those bloody dreadful pictures of course! 🙂
  
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  September 28, 2017 5:47pm
  - MrTips
    
    LOL. He’s no great loss. Promoted pornography, objectification of woman and by some accounts ended up a sad, delusional old man.
    
    Not someone to be celebrated imo. Others may think otherwise.
    
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    September 28, 2017 6:30pm
- mikenmild
  
  Rest in Pyjamas.
  
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  September 28, 2017 6:38pm
Jack5

Did life ever get boring for Hefner?

https://jokideo.com/when-hugh-hefner-dies-2/
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September 28, 2017 5:04pm
Flash

HOW can I make the most recent posts appear first in stead of having to scroll down?
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September 28, 2017 5:06pm
- softail 1450
  
  a damn good question mr jordan.
  
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  September 28, 2017 5:19pm
- Fletch
  
  If you are using a desktop computer, press the “End” key above the cursor keys.
  
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  September 28, 2017 5:42pm
Digmen1

Latest P Drug bust

So many Chinese seem to be doing this.
I have asked before what do most Chinese Immigrants do?
I see Indians working, Philipinas, I know that British and South Africans work.
But I do not see many Chinese working.
Sure a few have asian shops or restaurants.
But they are one of the biggest groups of immigrants. What do they all do? (in general)
It seems to me that most of them are in Rest Homes, or Trademe sellers, or drug dealers.
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September 28, 2017 5:11pm
- Johnboy
  
  Ah so Little Dighopper..You have hit hammer with nail! 🙂
  
  “Dr. Fu Manchu is a fictional character introduced in a series of novels by British author Sax Rohmer during the first half of the twentieth century. The character was also featured extensively in cinema, television, radio, comic strips, and comic books for over 90 years, and has become an archetype of the evil criminal genius while lending the name to the Fu Manchu moustache.”
  
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  September 28, 2017 6:12pm
  - nasska
    
    Vely, vely inscrutable Mister Johnboy. 🙂
    
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    September 28, 2017 6:22pm
    - Johnboy
      
      Thank Christ for that old chap. I thought you said I was unscrotable at first till I put on my reading specs! 🙂
      
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      September 28, 2017 7:10pm
- Viking2
  
  So here is a good article about the rip off that is meth testing.
  
  https://thespinoff.co.nz/business/27-09-2017/the-great-meth-testing-scam/
  
  Are Kiwis wasting thousands unnecessarily decontaminating their homes? Maria Slade looks into a business growth story which appears to be solving a problem which doesn’t exist.
  Sugar soap and elbow grease
  
  “Any standard detergent will do. I’ve suggested they should use two different ones if they want to be sure, and then get it retested,” he says. That’s Massey University environmental chemistry expert Nick Kim’s antidote to a bit of methamphetamine on your walls. It’s the advice he gives frantic homeowners who ring him after their properties have tested positive for P.
  
  “Those that have got back to me have said, ‘yeah, the second test came back fine’.”
  
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  September 28, 2017 6:57pm
- Gabby
  
  They’re in flash offices with flash carpets dicman.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:37pm
Viking2

election comparisons. Interesting.

http://www.interest.co.nz/news/90052/those-who-raw-numbers-here-summary-2017-election-votes-counted-and-preliminary-seats-won
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September 28, 2017 5:59pm
nasska

GoVege’s mad mates are having another crack at the poor old NZ cocky! This time it’s wool & the separating of live mutton from the same:

…..”In this week’s Guardian, Peta founder Ingrid Newkirk referred to footage from sheep shearing sheds in Australia which this year helped lead to the first convictions of sheep shearers in Australia for cruelty”……

I’m not quite sure what the well dressed wanker from Peta wears but I hear that they’re not too fussed with synthetics either. 🙂

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/97302269/animal-welfare-group-targets-wool-with-cheeky-advert
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September 28, 2017 6:30pm
EAD_TWO

One for Gruffyd/Griff & Milkenmaid. A really funny and lighthearted read when confronted by accusations of “Nazi” for expressing even a mildly right of Centre of opinion:

http://nwioqeqkdf.blogspot.com/2017/09/get-help-nazi.html

It begins:

I’ve lost count of the amount of times I’ve been advised to seek professional help to rid me of my racism and hate. It’s a standard retort ”You need help!” or ”Forgot your meds today, did we?” and ‘You’re so full of hate, perhaps counselling could help you!”. The idea of course is to mark you out as a nut whose opinions are so far off the map that they needn’t be taken seriously and, just as in the USSR, you should be sectioned, removed entirely from the public eye where you can safely drool in an asylum.

Nevertheless I’ve long been intrigued by the idea of contacting a professional and explaining to them what it is that ails so many of us, is it possible to be plugged back into the ”normie” Matrix through feelgood platitudes and ”Songs of the Whale” CD compilations? can a psychiatrist convince me that the end of the white race and the collapse of Western Civilization is ”No Biggie” or would they try and deny it?

After stumbling across one of these professionals offering help to people offended and hurt by the pro-Israel, anti-Muslim street group ”Britain First” I decided to find out, if these people are offering help to Muslims and liberals left feeling suicidal by chants such as ”Stop raping white girls” or Trannies and intergenders devastated by hate rants such as ”Ha Ha it’s a bloke in a dress!” then surely they could help me out………
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September 28, 2017 6:59pm
Happychappy

Andrew Little made another of his trout mouth opinions on Three News again tonight that his court case with Mrs Hagaman is Politically motivated. I actually hope they take him for every thing he owns as he made the statements and was given every chance not to go to court but wasn’t man enough to apologize.
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September 28, 2017 8:10pm
- sooty
  
  And still has his foot in mouth. Will Labour send him to the backbenchers to hide him away from public view?
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:15pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Hmmmm… should I sell my Tesla shares or should I hold out until the dream becomes reality?
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/27/bernstein-predicts-tesla-plunge-as-it-nears-unprecedented-cash-burn.html
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September 28, 2017 8:28pm
- Jack5
  
  You might keep a lookout in case you can spread the risk with Dyson. He’s a smart innovator and has electric car plans.
  
  Dyson’s company is private and he says in the interview (in 2013) in the second link below that he’s not taking it public.
  
  When Dyson gets near to launching his cars he will need train loads of cash. That could well nudge him into floating his present company – or a new one.
  
  Dyson’s electric car plans:
  
  http://www.bbc.com/news/business-41399497
  
  Will Dyson float?
  
  http://fortune.com/2013/09/30/questions-for-james-dyson/
  
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  September 28, 2017 9:04pm
  - rangitoto
    
    I’m all for cleaner roads.
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:24pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  Side issue maybe, but Maggy, how much does it cost for you to get your Fair Dividend Rate calculations done on your Tesla shares?
  Those foreign investment fund rules are horrendous.
  
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  September 28, 2017 11:12pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    It was hypothetical…
    
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    September 28, 2017 11:33pm
Jack5

Adult Pakistanis gatecrashing into Britain claiming to be child refugees.

It seems also that nine out of ten of the “child” refugees are male.

NZ should be taking notice. A wave of refugees from Myanmar/Burma will soon be headed this way.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/09/not-refugees-not-children/
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September 28, 2017 8:52pm
- realityczech
  
  They had this refugee problem with Jews during the war Jackie. Seems we never learn. Mind you they did not have cultural guardians like you protecting our purity back then.
  
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  September 28, 2017 8:57pm
  - Jack5
    
    Always back to the Jews, eh Kia – too often to be irony. Stop your crocodile tears.
    
    Muslim gatecrashers often lie that their position is like that of Jews in the 1930s.
    
    Jewish refugees didn’t bomb stadiums and public transport, or behead soldiers of their host nations. Jewish places of worship didn’t become recruiting agents for international terrorists.
    
    (And yes, there was the Stern gang, but its members were Polish Jews. In the 1930s Stern had the support of the Polish Government, and in the 1940s his faction tried to do a deal with the Nazis.)
    
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    September 28, 2017 9:31pm
    - realityczech
      
      Oh the Jews have used terrorism to achieve their goals and have often attempted to blame Muslims. King David Hotel for example, which targeted the very people attempting to help them. At least the Muslims admit to their offending, unlike the Jews.
      
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      September 29, 2017 6:41am
nasska

…..”Twitter is Testing a 280-Character Limit, Making Tweets Twice as Long”……

Baity will be invincible! 🙂

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/twitter-testing-280-character-limit-making-tweets-twice-long-n804991
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September 28, 2017 9:01pm
Manolo

The rest-home awaits:
http://www.theamericanmirror.com/oh-god-hot-mic-catches-pelosi-groaning-question-guns/
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September 29, 2017 2:34pm

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