General Debate 15 June 2017

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William of Ockham

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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jun/14/canada-hudson-bay-climate-change-study-warm-temperatures
Climate change study in Canada’s Hudson Bay thwarted by climate change

Scientists in Canada have been forced to abandon an expedition to the Hudson Bay to research the impact of climate change, after warming temperatures created perilous ice conditions off the coast of Newfoundland.

The icebreaker was soon diverted. Dense ice – up to 8 metres thick – had filled the waters off the northern coast of Newfoundland, trapping fishing boats and ferries.

Barber and other scientists did what they could to help the Coast Guard rescue the vessels and carved a path for the tankers. They also took the time to study the ice that surrounded them, discovering that much of it was the multiyear ice typically seen in the high Arctic.

It was an unexpected find given the time of year and how far south they were. “It’s not something you would expect to see there and not something we’ve seen there before. In the high Arctic, climate change is causing the ice to get thinner and there to be less of it. What that does is that it increases the mobility of ice.”

Barber – who has spent decades researching the impact of climate change on sea ice – described his week spent on the frontlines of battling a changing climate as a stark reminder of the reality the world is facing. “We’re very poorly prepared for climate change,” he said. “We pay lip service to the fact that we think we know it’s coming and society is trying to grapple with the complexity of it, but when it really comes down to brass tacks, our systems are ill prepared for it.”
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June 15, 2017 8:00am
- Sponge
  
  DPF, do we really have to endure this shit day after day?
  
  It adds nothing to the blog or to the sum of human knowledge.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:19am
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    I reckon it is about time that DPF got rid of the function that enables people, in this case the climate deniers, from censoring the views they don’t like. I guess the climate deniers hate the idea of being exposed to scientific rationality.
    
    The “low comment rating” is antithetical to the idea of a blog where all views are able to be expressed.
    
    In any event it absurd when all the comments opposing William of Ockham are visible but his is not.
    
    The absolutely worst thing I have seen on Kiwiblog in recent days was JasonJohn’s straight out racist views supporting apartheid and PW Botha, but even he he was not blocked.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:34am
    - Kimbo
      
      Well said, not that I touch the climate change debate. Israel-Palestine is enough for me! 😉
      
      However, JJ is a troll, Wayne, adopting a false persona and insincerely advocating outrageous views for a bite.
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:40am
    - Keeping Stock
      
      I disagree Wayne. Any comment which is unpopular still remains available to be viewed, if you choose to. It just saves everyone having to scroll past screeds of information, which in WoO’s case, by his own admission today is designed to provoke a reaction – “Now let’s be clear: I’m not here to change anyone’s mind. I’m here to mock people…”
      
      However I do agree with your characterisation of Jason Johns.
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:44am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      @ Wayne Mapp
      You need to look back at some of the commentary against me, from Dennis Horne (aka William of Ockham), Griff and fellow believers to figure out who has being doing the censorship of climate-change issues on this blog.
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:52am
      - stephieboy
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Maggy Wassilieff , please provide KB links to the alleged posts ?
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:20am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @stephieboy
        what do you mean “alleged posts”
        
        You can work the archives here can’t you?
        
        Try this one..
        http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2015/12/general_debate_18_december_2015.html/comment-page-3#comment-1637930
        
        And before you try and justify any of this.. remember my postings here were about the work of NIWA and not individual scientists.
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:01pm
      - Jack5
        
        The Stephie troll’s post at 11.20 is a great example of why Kiwiblog readers should be able to “blot out” a post.
        
        As has been pointed out above, all this means is that you have to make one extra click to read the “blotted out” post.
        
        It’s a good trollicide.
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:43pm
      - William of Ockham
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        You’ve got a bee in your bonnet about the NIWA fiddling the temperature sets. The 7-series raw data show ~1C warming. You’ve also described 30,000 climate scientists’ published work as “a scam”. Anything disabusing your crackpot views is justified.
        
        You got Griff moderated out, didn’t you? Whatever he called you — “WaffleWeed”, wasn’t it — was well deserved.
        
        Please forgive my comments if you are senile.
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:46pm
      - Stars And Stripes
        
        By the way Dennis Horne I sold those coal shares a few weeks ago which you and your mate Jim Salinger were “roaring with laughter about” a while back.
        One of the best investments I ever made so out of pity if our paths ever cross I will buy you some sour grapes.
        
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        June 15, 2017 1:04pm
      - waikatogirl
        
        Glad you stuck around despite all that terrible abuse Maggy. ?
        
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        June 15, 2017 3:44pm
    - Colville
      
      Wayne.
      I would hope that DPF takes the thumbs down function a step further and makes it so if someone gets say 300 reds in a day they are blocked for the remainder of that day.
      Its just an anti trolling measure.
      As said above, there are people posting crap here just to get a bite. it adds nothing to the blog.
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:04am
      - ross411
        
        The kind of people that think they get value out of spending so much time posting irrelevant data and posting it to the few who read and comment here, likely think nothing of creating another account.
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:19am
      - stephieboy
        
        Colville , more often than not it is not trolling but someone merely disagreeing or challenging alt right ideological and theological belief systems .
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:22am
      - Keeping Stock
        
        What’s with your obsession about “alt-right ideology” Stephie? Apart from the fact that I don’t really have a clue what you mean by “alt-right ideology”, there are just as many people here who push a far-left ideology, but I don’t see you abusing or labelling them.
        
        That leads me to conclude that you are nothing more than a left-wing troll, with nothing better to offer.
        
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        June 15, 2017 1:14pm
    - Garbageman
      
      Yeah good try Wayne except this is a guy that will actively follow his comments and often abuse & sneer at those that don’t follow his hard line approach and the low rating block is useful for not having to view long winded cut & paste comments but you got your “climate denier” dig in twice slow clap mate
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:09am
      - stephieboy
        
        Garbageman , examples of this alleged” abuse and sneers ” ?
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:23am
    - Sponge
      
      I guess the climate deniers hate the idea of being exposed to scientific rationality.
      
      I can only speak for myself but you have guessed incorrectly.
      
      I have no issue at all with people putting up anything they like. What I object to is straight out spamming of blogs by people like Horne and Pavelitch. They are not trying to have a discussion or convince anyone that their views are correct. They just splatter post after post and add absolutely nothing of value.
      
      If DPF got rid of the ability of readers to downtick a post away it would only encourage these people and make the general debate, and many other posts, even worse to read. I enjoy Kiwiblog and don’t want these individuals to ruin it – hence my suggestion.
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:12am
    - Biscuit
      
      Wayne, I quite like something Clive James once wrote:
      ‘There is almost nothing that can’t be made uninteresting provided it is approached with sufficient fervour.’
      
      WoO, Penny, Hugh and a few other Kiwibloggers who are invariably single-subject folk need to branch out a bit…
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:28am
      - stephieboy
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Biscuit , rich irony alert on the alt right front
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:24am
    - howitis
      
      Oh boo hoo private citizen W Mapp.
      
      Most other blogs and YouTube have disallowed down ticks which is otherwise community moderation.
      This has allowed some blogs to be echo chambers where views are not able to be challenged.
      This hiding comments after a certain number of down ticks is fine and better than most.
      It means that the particular audience or community finds it contrary to their norms.
      KB still allows it and if someone wants to read it they can do so by clicking on it.
      
      You might want to check your ego at the door private citizen Mapp.
      There have been multiple ice ages in the last 300,000 years and the period of the last 2000 years has been warmer than long term averages.
      It is nature and there are interim cooling (early 1700s) and warming periods (circa 1000 AD) due to naturally occurring influencers.
      These ‘taxing nature’ schemes that National and Labour signed us taxpayers up to are about control over our citizens.
      NZ is a first world country because the early citizens pulled finger 150 years ago (sans cry baby political correctness) and got things up and running. Countries like China and India are behind in health and education because of their own internal cultures even though they have had longer to get their stuff together.
      Because they are slackers they don’t have to pay ‘tax on nature’ for imaginary naughty cars and naughty cows (farting as nature intended).
      Climate change is a rort and improvable.
      Real issues to address are things like Myrtle rust & Fruit flies. This is where cost and energy should go.
      
      You mention apartheid and how bad it is but when you were not private citizen Mapp but a paid-by-the-taxpayer MP your were part of a government that has extended apartheid and done nothing to curtail it.
      Your govt has paid Billions of taxpayer dollars to Maori elite while taxpayers still have had to pay billions more for the broken ones at the bottom;
      This Saturday the Lions play a racially selected Maori rugby team (you know, like Minto and co protested about 40 years ago) ;
      Maori under National have been given paid-for unelected decision making positions on Local Authority Councils so they have representation without any taxation and contrary to good governance;
      National has happily supported the separate voting for 7 racially selected seats that only those of Maori ancestry can vote for;
      Maori driving without a licence get a second chance but non-Maori get a fine;
      The taxpayer pays out more than one million dollars a week to fund Maori television.
      
      National promotes apartheid even more than Labour.
      Of course climate-fairy chasers hate facts. Tough.
      
      So Mapp if apartheid is so bad, why does your Government support it and even enhance it?
      
      Quite frankly Mr. Mapp recent history has shown that the apartheid system established in the 1940s was better for South Africa than the current state. Even Minto cannot deny that. The agitation against it was Marxists and unthinking people went blindly along with it. History has proven them wrong.
      The National /Mapp mantra I guess is
      Apartheid: South Africa bad, two legs uumm… Apartheid New Zealand: Good.
      
      Now you can down tick me Mr. Mapp as is your prerogative. You could not in Facebook or YouTube.
      If enough down tick me, my comment is hidden which is also appropriate for the smash-and-grab troll you support.
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:49am
      - stephieboy
        
        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        howitis ,more rabid right blah, blah, blah !
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:25am
      - Kleva Kiwi
        
        You will also note Mr Mapp that howitis in no way makes a personal attack or insult towards yourself in his post.
        You would do well to take note of this as all your post manifest derogatory terms attacking individuals and/or groups of people.
        This in no way helps your message nor attempts to deliver your argument.
        It simply demonstrates you have lost the argument before you have even tried to make a point, hence why you get so many down ticks.
        People on this blog are not shouting you down because they may not agree (in whole or in part) but because of your delivery.
        People like stephieboy however appear (at least from their posts on this blog) to not be intelligent enough to make an argument in the first place.
        
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        June 15, 2017 2:45pm
    - kowtow
      
      What is a “climate denier”?
      
      I think it frightening that on the one hand Wayne advocates for WoO views , which he agrees with must not be moderated or censored , while he thinks those of JJs ,whom he disagrees with should be.
      
      A case of free speech for me but not for thee?
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:02am
      - stephieboy
        
        kowtow , from one who holds all manner of beliefs included restricted property franchise and as though the Battle of the Boyne were held yesterday .
        
        Not forgetting a smorgasbaord of loony Obummer and other conspiracy theories .
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:28am
      - SGA
        
        I think it frightening that on the one hand Wayne advocates for WoO views , which he agrees with must not be moderated or censored , while he thinks those of JJs ,whom he disagrees with should be.
        
        I didn’t read his comment that way. He was trying to understand why JJs most extreme rants were acceptable and WoO’s comments were not.
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:49am
      - Kimbo
        
        He was trying to understand why JJs most extreme rants were acceptable and WoO’s comments were not.
        
        I find the same conundrum trying to work out why some rightly insist that the Irish Troubles were a nationalist/sectarian conflict in which religion, while present, was not the primary problem, nor in any way symptomatic of an alleged endemic Irish propensity to violence
        
        …but they are also insistent that the Israeli ~~Jewish~~ / ~~Palestinian~~ Muslim dispute is another round in a religious war stretching back to the time of Muhammed, perhaps even Ishmael and the Patriarch Isaac, and is incontrovertible proof that Muslims and Arabs, in contrast to Christian Europeanss, automatically resort to violence as a first option rather than more peaceful attempts at dispute resolution.
        
        I’m guessing their heritage is Irish, not Muslim Arab 😉
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:01pm
    - Peter
      
      What is a climate denier, Wayne Mapp? I don’t know anyone who denies climate. “Denier” isn’t even a scientific term and is a dead giveaway the person using it is engaged in a religious debate, not a scientific one.
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:12am
    - calendar girl
      
      You are entitled to commence your own Blog, Mr Mapp, thereby enabling you to set whatever rules take your fancy.
      
      If you do, good luck in attracting the levels of engagement and debate that characterise Kiwiblog as a result of DPF’s tolerance and even-handedness.
      
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      June 15, 2017 12:45pm
    - Liberty
      
      Wayne Mapp
      I suspect there is an element of mob rule going on.
      Then William would have been down ticked anyway
      Simply because he is pushing a theory that is twaddle.
      Plus the fact he is only doing it to incite .
      “Now let’s be clear: I’m not here to change anyone’s mind. I’m here to mock people”
      
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      June 15, 2017 12:46pm
    - RRM
      
      @ Wayne Mapp
      
      The thing about DPF’s uptick/downtick system is that it isn’t perfect, but all of the alternatives are even worse:
      
      ➡ DPF could do absolutely nothing to moderate comments, and in no time these threads would resemble the comments on YouTube or Facebook.
      
      ➡ DPF could moderate Kiwiblog like the standard, ontheleft, and all of the other lefty blogs, i.e. delete any comment that disagrees with party orthodoxy and ban the author responsible.
      
      Even when I was left wing in my youth, Kiwiblog was a far better place to discuss stuff, spar, make a friend and maybe even learn a thing or two , than any of the left blogs. DPF’s sense of how to moderate is the main reason! 🙂
      
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      June 15, 2017 2:50pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  So Barber discovers thick, multiyear ice in the arctic in 2017…… due to global warming
  
  In 2009 he was claiming the end of multiyear ice in the arctic..due to global warming
  http://www.reuters.com/article/us-climate-canada-arctic-idUSTRE59S3LT20091029
  
  Seems this arctic expert has the same explanation for opposite phenomena.
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:33am
RalphT

Beat him!

Edit: Bugger! Too late.
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June 15, 2017 8:00am
- William of Ockham
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Now let’s be clear: I’m not here to change anyone’s mind. I’m here to mock people who think cranks, fools and loonies know more science than the global community of scientists. Deniers. Deniers don’t change their minds. Ever. Deniers die wrong.
  
  Science advances one funeral at a time – Max Planck
  
  Covfefe. Covfefe. Covfefe.
  Amen.
  🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:04am
  - Kimbo
    
    Now let’s be clear: I’m not here to change anyone’s mind. I’m here to mock people…
    
    Hmm. OK. On that basis I move that an application be made to the Kiwiblog “maintenance of orthodoxy and decorum committee” to reassess WoO’s posts, and, despite his eccentricities and…zeal, accept him as an ordinary member of the gang. After all, he’s not that different from most of us. Indeed, he is one of us!
    
    Anyone prepared to second my motion? 😉
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:10am
    - Keeping Stock
      
      Yep; DPF’s comments policy is quite clear, especially the bits about not starting flame wars, and attacking the argument, not the person:
      
      http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/comments_policy
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:14am
      - SGA
        
        especially the bits about not starting flame wars, and attacking the argument, not the person
        
        hmmm… does that include all those guilty of attacking/mocking Penny Bright, Hugh P. and even WoO (three that pop into mind immediately) as a person rather than their arguments? How many sheeple and morons would that leave?
        
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        June 15, 2017 8:54am
    - SGA
      
      @Kimbo
      I’m left wondering if people read your post carefully 😉
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:12am
      - Kimbo
        
        I suspect not. Whatever can it mean when those who seem to be up ticking it claim to have read and understood scientific data that falsifies AGW? 😉
        
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        June 15, 2017 9:14am
      - William of Ockham
        
        Very carefully? 😉
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:58pm
      - Kimbo
        
        Well done, WoO. Good to see you broadening out from climate change, and raising our consciousness concerning the threat that is…emphatic adverbs.
        
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        June 15, 2017 2:58pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    So you won’t be changing your mind ? You are the denier after all, you deny that climate changes unless changed by humans. That’s denial.
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:28am
    - PhilBest
      
      Exactly; the real deniers are the ones who write things out of history, like the Hockey Stick charlatans tried to write out all the warm periods and little ice ages.
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:45am
  - KevOB
    
    When “scientists” stop being partial advocates then we will listen. There is too much bias evident. The IPCC is a political machine to enforce global UN control.
    
    When do we ever hear contrary concerns that solar activity may be possibly bringing serious near term cooling.
    
    The danger is false positions are taken as a cause for action. The Pacific Islands states are not sinking from warming. Tuvalu has a population problem: it grew from a supportable 10,000 to 50,000 on a miniscule land area surrounding its lagoon. The lagoon was closed in after the war and the toilet arrangements have fouled the whole place. The country is only 2m above sea level so tides wash over it depositing salt.
    
    Global warming activism is not going to fix bad choices.
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:38am
  - PhilBest
    
    80 graphs from 52 peer-reviewed papers last year show no “hockey stick” temperature trend.
    
    http://notrickszone.com/2017/05/29/80-graphs-from-58-new-2017-papers-invalidate-claims-of-unprecedented-global-scale-modern-warming/#sthash.ktF0tSb7.hn3ie8f2.dpbs
    
    The alarmists including the entire MSM have always been telling a “big lie” on the classic Goebbels principle that it is easier to sell a big lie to ignorant people than a small one.
    
    The big lie is that “scientists are unanimous” except for a handful of fringe cranks who can’t get published in proper peer review processes, that “human induced global warming is a catastrophe”.
    
    Even in the case of the IPCC Reports themselves, it is unlikely that a numerical majority of the peer reviewers even agreed with that. But their comments have been kept confidential and under secrecy all along by the IPCC, which really, really looks as though they have nothing to hide, hmmmm? Leaked draft reports and comment summaries have always told another story.
    
    Furthermore, there has always been thousands of scientists who disagree with the full alarmist position; the alarmists deliberately fudge belief in the greenhouse effect with belief in the full catastrophic human-induced thing. And there has always been dozens or hundreds of peer reviewed papers annually, that do not support the alarmist position.
    
    It is telling that in our era of the internet, there are so many true believers who uncritically lap up the MSM fake news, and sadly this includes sell-out centre-right politicians like John Key and David Cameron and Malcolm Turnbull.
    
    If there is a “small fringe of hucksters” with an agenda driven by something non-scientific, it is the cabal who were infiltrated into the key positions of Lead Authors and “Summary for Policy Makers” authors at the IPCC when it was first formed by Maurice Strong et al. The peer-reviewers were originally appointed by multiple governments back before there was a monolithic political agenda, which led to the spectacle years later when all those governments had got the memo about the agenda, of governments damning the reviewers they had themselves appointed some years before.
    
    For example, Vincent Gray in Wellington, who Wayne Mapp despicably refused to even admit to a climate science committee discussion at Parliament a few years later even though Dr Gray had been invited by Rodney Hide. And some people get upset when I use the term “Vichy” about National!
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:44am
    - stephieboy
      
      Phil Best , please provide a sampling of those so called 58 papers ( presumably peer reviews in repuatable and credible scientfic journals )
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:26am
    - Ross12
      
      A lesson for you stephieboy
      1. Click on the link given in Phil’s post.
      2. Read it.
      3. Click on the links provided above the graphs in the article.
      4. Make your assessment of the journal referred to.
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:36am
  - Liberty
    
    “Now let’s be clear: I’m not here to change anyone’s mind. I’m here to mock people…”
    So you are deliberately posting twaddle. What a Noddy.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:19am
William of Ockham

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2017/06/why-global-emissions-must-peak-by-2020/#more-20427
Why global emissions must peak by 2020. 2 June 2017

The world’s nations have committed to holding the increase in the global average temperature to well below 2 °C above pre-industrial levels… necessary to avoid incalculable risks to humanity, and it is feasible – but realistically only if global emissions peak by the year 2020.

The World Meteorological Organization climate report for the past year has highlighted that global temperature and sea levels keep rising, reaching record highs once again in 2016. Global sea ice cover reached a record low, and mountain glaciers and the huge ice sheets in Greenland and Antarctica are on a trajectory of accelerating mass loss. More and more people are suffering from increasing and often unprecedented extreme weather events, both in terms of casualties and financial losses. This is the situation after about 1°C global warming since the late 19th Century.

Not only will these impacts get progressively worse as warming continues, but our planet also runs a growing risk of crossing critical tipping points where major and largely irreversible changes to the Earthsystem are triggered.

The West Antarctic Ice Sheet has likely already been destabilised, committing the world to at least three meters of global sea-level rise in coming centuries – an outcome that scientists have warned about since the 1970s. The Greenland Ice Sheet – holding enough ice to eventually raise global sea levels by seven meters – may likewise be destabilised below 2°C. Coral reefs have suffered pan-tropical mass bleaching in 2016 and are doing so again in 2017 as a result of warming oceans, and only if global temperature stays well below 2°C some remnants of the world’s coral reefs can be saved. The Gulf Stream system (THC) appears to be already slowing and recent research indicates it is far more unstable than previously thought. [continues]
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June 15, 2017 8:00am
- ross411
  
  Hysteria.
  
  It’s convenient you don’t mention the Arctic.
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:04am
  - stephieboy
    
    http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2017/06/why-global-emissions-must-peak-by-2020/#more-20427
    Why global emissions must peak by 2020. 2 June 2017
    
    The world’s nations have committed to holding the increase in the global average temperature to well below 2 °C above pre-industrial levels… necessary to avoid incalculable risks to humanity, and it is feasible – but realistically only if global emissions peak by the year 2020.
    
    The World Meteorological Organization climate report for the past year has highlighted that global temperature and sea levels keep rising, reaching record highs once again in 2016. Global sea ice cover reached a record low, and mountain glaciers and the huge ice sheets in Greenland and Antarctica are on a trajectory of accelerating mass loss. More and more people are suffering from increasing and often unprecedented extreme weather events, both in terms of casualties and financial losses. This is the situation after about 1°C global warming since the late 19th Century.
    
    Not only will these impacts get progressively worse as warming continues, but our planet also runs a growing risk of crossing critical tipping points where major and largely irreversible changes to the Earthsystem are triggered.
    
    The West Antarctic Ice Sheet has likely already been destabilised, committing the world to at least three meters of global sea-level rise in coming centuries – an outcome that scientists have warned about since the 1970s. The Greenland Ice Sheet – holding enough ice to eventually raise global sea levels by seven meters – may likewise be destabilised below 2°C. Coral reefs have suffered pan-tropical mass bleaching in 2016 and are doing so again in 2017 as a result of warming oceans, and only if global temperature stays well below 2°C some remnants of the world’s coral reefs can be saved. The Gulf Stream system (THC) appears to be already slowing and recent research indicates it is far more unstable than previously thought. [continues]
    
    Downtickers ,
    
    A reasoned and rational response is in order . The world wasn’t created in 7 earth days and associated blah, blah, blah like Trump calling climate change a China conspiracy .
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:31am
- JIV
  
  So 2020 is the new tipping point, is it? I assume this will pass without incident like all the other tipping points. Have you told India and China that their emissions must peak in 2020 as their Paris Agreement allows them to carry on until 2030. Doesnt that mean we’re all doomed, or are you going to rely on per capita statistics?
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:06am
  - William of Ockham
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    You mean like the SI lakes being worryingly and unseasonably low?
    
    The unexpectedly high flood of the Rangitaiki?
    
    Take then date 2020 up with Stefan. Go to the webpage. Argue with the climate scientists … since you know so much.
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:14am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Read p.13-18 of this report.
      https://www.boprc.govt.nz/media/33373/Report-080900-RangitaikiTaraweraFloodplainStrategy.pdf
      Not an unexpectedly high flood at all…. just a lousy stop bank.
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:29am
      - stephieboy
        
        “When truth is replaced by silence,the silence is a lie.”
        ― Yevgeny Yevtushenko
        
        One of William of Ockhams downtickers ?
        
        Yes ?
        
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        June 15, 2017 9:28am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @stephieboy
        
        The rainfall in the Rangitaiki catchment was not unprecedented or unexpected… it was a normal autumn-winter heavy rainfall event.
        
        It’s folks like you that want silence…
        
        *silence about the poorly constructed stopbanks
        *silence about the control of the dam that spills into the Rangitaiki
        *silence about the location of Edgecumbe in the centre of a floodplain
        http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11833754
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:07am
      - stephieboy
        
        Maggy Wassilieff , you beleive like the POTUS that climate change is a China conspiracy ?
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:32am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        No stephieboy
        
        when you check back in Kiwiblog archives, you might discover that I came on here wondering why NIWA was having great difficulty in presenting the public with a peer-reviewed account of the NZ Temperature record and getting it published in an internationally recognised scientific journal.
        
        Because that is what was going to happen, according to the Honourable Dr Wayne Mapp.
        http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2016/12/sure_looks_like_a_trend_to_me.html#comment-1846460
        
        But we’ve covered all this ground before.
        
        Don’t you remember what people post?
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:26pm
    - kowtow
      
      The South Island Lakes ?
      
      Now why are they there?
      
      Climate change. Massive climate change that ended the last ice age some 20 000 years ago. If it wasn’t for climate change we couldn’t live on most of the planet.
      
      Funny how the nutters only 50 or so years ago were the “Repent .Stop your sinning.the world is ending, Jesus is coming to get you” types.
      
      Now the nutters are into carbon sinners. “Repent ,stop your carbon emissions, the end is nigh” And the date is of the second coming is 2020.
      
      Fuck knuckles.
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:32am
    - PhilBest
      
      The alarmists expect us to accept EVERY piece of evidence as “proof” of their theory.
      
      Less rain, more rain, both = proof
      
      Less snow, more snow, both = proof
      
      Less ice, more ice, both = proof
      
      Memo: around the world there are constantly “weather events” of all kinds including record-setting ones of both extremities. Somewhere there is a record heatwave, somewhere else there is a record flood. Somewhere there is a glacier advancing, somewhere else there is a glacier retreating. Somewhere there is record summer ice melt, somewhere else there is record winter ice buildup.
      
      Pack of charlatans, and a pox on the global MSM for enabling this fraud.
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:52am
      - Peter
        
        Williams insecurity shows through each day. Deep down, he must know his position is a logical fallacy (argumentum ad populum). His cut n’ pastes of other people’s work indicates he doesn’t understand the science well enough to put it in his own words.
        
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        June 15, 2017 9:04am
      - stephieboy
        
        Phil Best , the world was create in 7 days and 6,000 years ago ?
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2O3kvvTxPk
        
        I understand a Climate Change deniers non negotiable !
        
        LOL
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:33am
    - Kleva Kiwi
      
      Yes, some of the man made lakes are low from the historical running average, but to generate an average, by definition some must be below the average. None of the levels are alarming like periods in the past.
      
      At the same time, inflows in the north island are above average.
      
      You also do understand that if the earth warms, rainfall will be higher? So the lakes your so worried about will full up thus raising the average levels?
      
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      June 15, 2017 3:34pm
      - William of Ockham
        
        The glaciers are retreating and I believe it’s ice that feeds those rivers and lakes.
        
        Interesting you now agree Earth is warming. Yes, more precipitation on average. But the warming is not even. The pattern of rainfall changes. Dry areas tend to get drier.
        
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        June 15, 2017 5:07pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        How much do you think the Planet will warm by 2100 Dennis?
        Griff says 9C.
        
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        June 15, 2017 5:24pm
BarryB

There was a post on this website a couple of weeks ago – posted by DF labelled “the longest suicide note” from the Telegraph – all about how stupid the UK Labour party manifesto was and how it would be the end of the party.

However the world is in a new age of politics. Manifesto’s are for those who believe everything they are told. There are still some people who believed the promise of building 10 bridges in Northland …..

If the UK had MMP – then Corbyn would now be the UK Prime Minister having won with a landslide win.

I predict the in September there will be a similar effect in NZ. National strategists are asleep at the wheel. They seem to be purposely ignoring some of the major challenges that this country has: Water policy, TPPA, Housing (its not a housing problem – its an economy problem in that the buying power of our wages has been cut at least in half by the policies of Douglas, Richardson and all those who have followed), Transport (and not just Auckland – try Hamilton at 8.30 or 3pm onwards. And Its not a roading problem – it’s all as a result of tearing up those tram lines years ago AND not listening to Robby), Basic Education (and teacher unions think that gender neutral toilets will fix it all…), Intensive Agriculture, Policing, Immigration, Border Control (since 2000 some 80+ plant pest have got into NZ. Most are ruinous to pastures ) and so on. And festering on in the background are things like the liqour industry free-for-all local liquor sales rules, and the mess that Christchurch is (it does seem that it will never be fully repaired – its as though the government has abandoned the city ), the announcememnt yesterday about tidying up the dairy industry – (a do-nothing policy) etc. These and other areas seem to be out of control and it seems that the government just doesn’t want to know about them. I don’t think it will need young non-voters to give things a kick – Im hearing from quite a few well established voters that – after 30 years of almost criminally ignorant leadership – they have had enough and will try almost anything as an alternate.
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June 15, 2017 8:02am
- Simon
  
  Problems with National can’t be solved by statist mongs like Labo. Immigration paper over NZ low wage chicken shit economy but head mong Little offers no solutions
  
  Tram lines…. yep thats the state of it
  
  NZ First will pick up a lot of votes. Even if Little was identifiable as part human he has the Greens stinking Labo up. No solutions.
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:11am
- PhilBest
  
  Housing (its not a housing problem – its an economy problem in that the buying power of our wages has been cut at least in half by the policies of Douglas, Richardson and all those who have followed)…
  
  Bullshit. Its the fad for urban planning and growth boundaries. A decent full global data set is absolutely conclusive on this. When the “supply of land” side is rigged, everything feeds into land prices by a process of extraction of economic rent. This was economics 101 in the 19th century, there would not have even been Marxist economics at all without it.
  
  In the 1800’s the problem was merely that people didn’t have cars, hence the land supply was limited to what was accessible in a reasonable time on foot. Economists and non-economists opposed to Marxism always said that improving transport systems would solve the problem. For example, Raymond Unwin, an architect / town planner in a 1912 book called “Nothing Gained by Overcrowding”.
  
  It epitomises the way the Left has hijacked areas of “government expertise” these days, that all this land economics 101 stuff has been conveniently forgotten. Same with climate science, same with social outcomes, same with colonial history, the Left can always be relied on to be pushing lies.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:06am
  - BarryB
    
    So in all those cities – like sydney and vancouver and melbourne and london and paris and frankfurt and chicago and portland and san francisico and zurich and so on – its all simply a supply of land thats the cause is it? Well thats also bullshit. Yes – there are lots of contributing factors such as town planning and health and safety zelots – but the common factor is that purchasing power in the west has been savagely cut in the last 30 years.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:19am
    - PhilBest
      
      You can have high-income cities with a median multiple of 12, low income cities with a median multiple of 12, high income cities with a median multiple of 3, and low income cities with a median multiple of 3.
      
      The explanation in all cases is preventions on the conversion of land in other uses, to urban use. It is not always an explicit growth boundary; the problem in many US cities is that municipalities have their own zoning rules, including rural municipalities that sometimes completely surround a growing city. It is the same phenomenon as Green-belt residents in the UK opposing all rezoning.
      
      In Las Vegas and Phoenix, the problem is government departments (eg Defence, National Parks) owning all the land around the city and these land holdings are not for sale.
      
      Typically, leftist apologists for central planning use examples like these as “disproof” that planned growth boundaries cause housing unaffordability. Dishonest use of data; the fact that there are other causes, does not mean that the main cause isn’t one.
      
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      June 15, 2017 2:26pm
  - KevOB
    
    Market price and value are separate. Supply will moderate value but the quantity of money moderates price.
    
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    June 15, 2017 12:05pm
    - PhilBest
      
      How do you explain a median multiple for tiny average house sizes, of 12+ in developing nations where most people have no access at all to mortgage credit?
      
      The other outlier: how do you explain dozens of cities in the USA having a median multiple of 3 all those years Helicopter Alan Greenspan was letting rip?
      
      Supply of land for housing use is NOT just one of many peripheral factors, it is the primary “order of magnitude” determinant.
      
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      June 15, 2017 2:19pm
      - KevOB
        
        Value varies between communities.
        
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        June 15, 2017 7:46pm
ross411

Jesus, what an ear-beating you pre-prepared William…

I was staying at someone’s place last night, and they were watching TV1. What comes on, but an advertisement for the channel and the news saying how honest they were. It was literally fake news about fake news.

Watching the news it was the same old nonsense. Partisan stories and tabloid pop culture bollocks, told honestly, I guess.

There’s a reason more people watch YouTube.
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June 15, 2017 8:02am
- Rich Prick
  
  There’s always something suspicious about self affirmation. It’s usually employed to give the affirmor comfort, not others.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:08am
Chuck Bird

The same thing happens here. If this guy does not pay child support to the mother should he be considered a dead beat Dad?

Father’s heartbreaking letter to daughter he’s not allowed to see

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=11875801
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June 15, 2017 8:11am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Ah, so the Herald IS an accurate news source when they post something you agree with Chuck, but not at other times; interesting…
  
  Chuck Bird
  
  Keeping Stock, the Herald is not an accurate source. The authors of the report said they would be willing to go in the drift. They did not say they would leave the charge.
  Thumb up 0 Thumb down 12 REPORT MAY 11, 2017 8:28AM
  
  https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2017/05/morris_on_pike_river.html
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:19am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    KS, what has parental alienation got to do with Pike River? If you are so sure the Pike River is the most dangerous work place on the planet what will you say if Bill English agrees to a maned re-entry?
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:38am
    - Kimbo
      
      KS, what has parental alienation got to do with Pike River?
      
      He he he. No, Chuck. We choose Ben Smith to use guile and deception to avoid and overcome an obstacle, not you. You sourced the info for both your posts about parental alienation and Pike River from the one source, a source you rejected had rejected in one instance as unreliable. So have another go…
      
      And I loved this:
      
      If you are so sure the Pike River is the most dangerous work place on the planet what will you say if Bill English agrees to a maned re-entry?
      
      Not only do you engage in your regular foul practice of demanding answers from others when you refuse to reciprocate, but you also misrepresent them. So come on mate, let’s see you distract again, and turn this into a discussion about the difference between paedophilia and statutory rape…
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:56am
      - Keeping Stock
        
        Well said Kimbo. Bill English would have to change the law to have a manned re-entry to Pike River, and that’s not going to happen before the 51st Parliament rises for the General Election.
        
        Then again, if coalition negotiations get testy after 23rd September, perhaps Bill could sign an Executive Order, and Winston Peters could lead a rescue mission into the mine. That may solve all manner of problems 😀
        
        Disclaimer: Just kidding…
        
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        June 15, 2017 9:05am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        KS, English obviously would not agree to re-entry before the election. He is a politician and he is far from stupid even though some may think he is for his conservative views on a number of moral issues.
        
        Why would he give away a barging point for nothing in return? Winston will having a number of demands for both parties. I am sure English would agree to Pike River re-entry before many other issues because any risk is minimal.
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:22am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        My comment was about parental alienation of fathers not Pike River.
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:17am
      - Kimbo
        
        …relying on a source you previously described as “not accurate”.
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:21am
    - Keeping Stock
      
      KS, what has parental alienation got to do with Pike River?
      
      Absolutely nothing Chuck. But you can’t claim the Herald to be “not an accurate source” when they publish something you disagree with, then a few weeks later urge us to read a story in the Herald which just happens to be about one of your hot-button issues. Either the Herald is a reliable news source or it isn’t, but you can’t cherry-pick.
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:57am
      - PhilBest
        
        It is surely not necessary or even possible for a media outlet to always be conveying a distorted or one-sided version of things? That is a bit of a high bar to set before we can accept that there are systemic biases in the MSM.
        
        When it comes to Pike River, the MSM’s bias is displayed in their non-coverage in the role of DoC and enviro protection rules that prevent mining being done safely. It is always about evil private enterprise and their cutting corners on safety. But when it comes to getting some dead bodies out, there is not quite the same imperative for political agenda-serving.
        
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        June 15, 2017 9:11am
      - stephieboy
        
        Phil Best ,
        
        “systemic biases in the MSM.”
        
        And your sources ? Fox , Daily Mail , Sun,elocal ,Infowars , WT etc etc ?
        
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        June 15, 2017 9:32am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        KS, I said “Keeping Stock, the Herald is not an accurate source.”
        
        I should have said the Herald did not quote Winston accurately.
        
        What I said was a blog comment. John Key made promises to the families of Pike River. It was not an off the cuff remark. You expect me to be 100% accurate in my meaning but try say John Key did not mean what he said,
        
        On the topic of cherry picking why ignore my question of what you will say if Bill English sensibly agrees to Pike River re-entry?
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:06am
      - Keeping Stock
        
        I should have said the Herald did not quote Winston accurately.
        
        Yes Chuck, you should have, in which case we wouldn’t be having this debate. Have a nice day 😀
        
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        June 15, 2017 1:23pm
    - waikatogirl
      
      When will people get that the PM, Bill English is not able to make the decision to re-enter the mine without complete clarity from the mine experts who disagree on the safety of doing so. BE would be breaching NZ health and safety laws unless mine experts can prove beyond doubt that it is Safe to enter the mine.
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:00am
      - Kimbo
        
        Ah, but they believe of the Banana Republic solution of waving the magic wand of make-up-legislation-on-the-spot, and abracadabra-ing that problem away.
        
        Because, hey, that’s how to run a country – change the law every time some alleged exception arises. //
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:08am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        waikatogirl, Parliament is the highest court in the land. The mine can be entered legally and it likely will be if Winston hold the balance of power.
        
        mine experts can prove beyond doubt that it is Safe to enter the mine.
        
        I see you use a cap with Safe. That term is used in regards sex. If someone gets infected if a condom is used is anyone at fault? Nothing is 100% save. The mining expert employed by the families does not claim re-entry it would be. However, like Winston he said he would be willing to enter the mine.
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:02am
      - KevOB
        
        The matter is statutory with personal legal liability falling on the Directors if their excercise of judgement is faulty. The PM can’t intervene; that would take another Act of Parliament.
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:12pm
      - waikatogirl
        
        Chuck, as I said, and kimbo described, Winston and his magic can not make the decision to re-enter the mine any more than BE can unless Parliament change the strict health and safety laws, which ironically were brought in as a result of the Pike River Mine explosion.
        
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        June 15, 2017 4:02pm
    - Chuck Bird
      
      Phil, the argument about re-entry is not just recovering bodies. The families want to know if any of the men could have been saved if PC plod had not interfered with the mine recovery experts.
      
      A missing woman’s car has been found in Lake Arapuni. Divers are trying to find and recover her body. That is not risk free. There is risk in everything.
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:36am
      - PhilBest
        
        Good point, I wasn’t talking about that.
        
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        June 15, 2017 2:28pm
- Happychappy
  
  It is easy to take sides and the Herald is not known for telling the whole story in some cases. Go read another story on John Banks today.
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:22am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    Happy, you make a good point. All media get things wrong sometimes. There is also a difference between reporting news and an opinion piece or an editorial.
    
    In the case of the John Banks article they seem to imply that Banks has not agreed to a DNA case but it could be the other party although that does not seem logical. Do you think Banks should agree to a DNA test to determine if he is the father?
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:49am
    - Happychappy
      
      Chuck: It puts him in a unhealthy situation as how do you know that when you die and having adopted three other children that what you leave to your family will be obeyed and not put through the courts as the person involved could legally take all as he is your only sibling.
      
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      June 15, 2017 1:07pm
  - 4077th
    
    I read that and was left with a feeling of disgust. Why put the boot into Banks when they only have half the story? Or they have all the story and chose to put the boot in anyway? Perhaps what they do have was handed to them by a still smouldering Sgt. Dot Shultz? Banks is no longer in the public eye, FFS leave the poor bastard alone. Lane Nichols should stick to his unhealthy obsession with realestate agents.
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:26am
  - Chuck Bird
    
    If John Banks had done the right thing and agreed to a DNA test he would save both parties and the taxpayer money and also the public embarrassment.
    
    I am sure when he was an MP and a Minister he would not be happy with fathers denying paternity.
    
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    June 15, 2017 12:04pm
    - Kimbo
      
      If John Banks had done the right thing and agreed to a DNA test …
      
      J’accuse!
      
      I accuse Chuck Bird of not stopping beating his wife, murder, larceny, piracy, and stealing lollipops from little kids
      
      …and DEMAND Chuck Bird must prove that none of those things are true! 😉
      
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      June 15, 2017 12:09pm
      - 4077th
        
        Thank you for demonstrating my point Kimbo.
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:31pm
      - Chuck Bird
        
        I accuse you of being stupid and illogical. I am glad you oblige me and prove I am right.
        
        If someone had good reason to believe I was their father I like most decent people would agree to a DNA test.
        
        Would you agree to a test in such circumstance?
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:33pm
      - Kimbo
        
        If I had ~~good~~ reason to ~~believe~~ suspect someone of falsely accusing me of being their father, with the additional immoral pressure of satisfying tabloid journalism and the mean-spirited quasi-witch hunt demands of eccentric and busybody members for whom it is none of their business, and also cement in place the crap precedent that people must surrender their DNA on demand
        
        I like most ~~decent~~ sensible people would NOT agree to a DNA test in such a circumstance
        
        There! Fixed that for ya.
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:45pm
kowtow

If the media want to make the fire about Muslims then they might also like to ask if the fire was caused by ramadan cooking.

“Grenfell Tower fire: Muslims awake for Ramadan among heroes who helped save lives”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/14/local-heroes-saved-lives-helped-residents-grenfell-tower-fire/
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June 15, 2017 8:14am
- RRM
  
  Someone’s fridge exploded didn’t it?
  
  Absolutely horrendous disaster…
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:23am
  - waikatogirl
    
    Lots of questions and accusations being made about why the building burned so quickly, cladding used in recent renovation, etc. One very concerning accusation is that the Fire Evacuation Plan included tenants being told to stay put in the case of fire.
    Started on the 4th floor. 12 confirmed dead so far, 60 odd in hospital, nobody on the top 3 floors survived.
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:34am
    - Keeping Stock
      
      I suspect they are going to let the scale of this disaster sink in slowly, and that the loss of life is going to be far, far greater than 12.
      
      Until firemen can access every room of every flat, the true toll will not be known. It’s a real tragedy.
      
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      June 15, 2017 8:41am
      - waikatogirl
        
        Yes KS, 12 Confirmed deaths. There will be a backlog at the morgue. The death toll will skyrocket.
        What a horrible job for those involved in recovery and identification. My heart goes out to all those involved. There will be an inquiry into this and heads will probably be on the block for inadequate health and safety breaches.
        
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        June 15, 2017 8:50am
    - RF
      
      The upper floors will have 100+ bodies.
      
      So sad but apparently avoidable.
      
      Heads must roll.
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:13am
  - Ross12
    
    Agree RRM — terrible disaster and not something anyone should have to endure.
    
    The thing I don’t understand about it is has it spread so much and so fast. I saw a woman interviewed who lived nearby –she woke up and saw a fire on one corner of a floor , she went back to sleep thinking the fire guys would be there soon and put it out. She woke up again about an hour later to see most of the building on fire.
    Given buildings like this are of largely concrete construction it seems strange how it moved so quick.
    I am NOT suggesting anything or pointing fingers in any direction , just saying it is strange and the fire inspectors will have a hard job but they will need to get to the bottom of it as the UK has plenty of accommodation blocks like it.
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:35am
    - PhilBest
      
      “…the UK has plenty of accommodation blocks like it…”
      
      Thanks to an Urban Planning system adopted in 1947, and people being denied the choice at a fair price, of the kind of homes they would prefer. Sadly NZ with 5% of the population density, is being taken down the same lunatic policy path.
      
      I recommend “The Great British Housing Disaster” TV documentary series from 1984, available on YouTube. A lot of the disastrous apartment blocks built before that time in pursuit of political “housing supply” goals have had to be demolished long since. But it is almost inevitable under this kind of urban planning, that the prices will keep going up even as the quality goes down.
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:21am
      - G152
        
        We referred to the towers as vertical slum blocks
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:02am
  - Swifty
    
    An islamist fridge.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:28am
    - Kimbo
      
      Yes, wondered when someone would blame the Muslims. Is all a conspiracy to distract from…the architects! Take a bow, Le Corbusier, who, as per PhilBest’s town-planning plot theory….was a Marxist! 😉
      
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Corbusier
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:14am
- Lance
  
  It doesn’t matter what caused it. Fires happen, always will.
  There is absolutely no way that many people should have been caught out and the building should never have burnt like that with working fire alarms and active sprinklers.
  There has been criminal level negligence here
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:28am
  - Keeping Stock
    
    I agree Lance. Heads should roll, but they probably won’t.
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:41am
  - Colville
    
    Council owned building, “managed” by committee of 8 unpaid do-gooders and 4 councilors.
    Ten million quid renovation.
    I wonder how many got back handers to approve the ACM cladding.
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:15am
    - Reid
      
      If you look at the management company’s CEO’s linkedin profile he gets 140k (pounds).
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:35am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  kowtow, of course nothing coming from you but your more typical filthy venom of alt right nastiness and vindictive .
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:34am
  - kowtow
    
    My comment was not about the tragedy.
    
    It was about the media making it about Muslims.
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:35am
    - stephieboy
      
      kowtow , therefore relevance to the tower block fire ?
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:37am
  - Manolo
    
    Even when trying to insult/offend someone you are unable to get your English writing right. I feel sorry for you, semi-literate stephieboy.
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:40am
- calendar girl
  
  Without attempting to pre-empt the fully-considered findings of the eventual formal enquiry, my layperson’s instincts about this tragedy are that there appear to be glaring safety shortcomings everywhere – especially in respect of the following alleged ‘facts’:
  
  (a) the building’s failure to ‘compartmentalise’ any fire to its flat of origin (or relevant public area);
  (b) lack of a fire-alarm sound unit within each flat;
  (c) formal instructions, posted within each flat, for tenants to stay in the flat if it was not affected directly by a fire; and
  (d) apparent flammability of the recently-installed exterior cladding.
  
  Who had ultimate responsibility for Council sign-offs of the building, in respect of issues (a) to (c) – whenever such sign-offs were last provided – and in respect of (d) following the building’s 2016 re-fit?
  
  At this early stage, the exterior cladding issue appears to be particularly egregious. It may not be complete fantasy to investigate whether that factor involved some kind of commercial fraud and / or bribery of an official.
  
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  June 15, 2017 1:49pm
Stars And Stripes

Auckland Council spends $15k on Pacific leaders lunch
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/333059/auckland-council-spends-15k-on-pacific-leaders-lunch.
“An Auckland councillor is demanding answers over why $15,000 was spent on an invitation-only lunch to ask Pacific leaders about their views on Easter Sunday trading.
The invitation to a buffet lunch last Tuesday at the Waipuna Lodge was sent out to 58 Pacific community and church leaders”.

Sounds good if you are the right ethnic group and part of the treasured diversity dividend.
The troughing at local council level is becoming unbelievable.
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June 15, 2017 8:15am
- krazykiwi
  
  $258 per head. Must have been quite a lunch. Lobster a bit pricey at the market perhaps? Only vintage French champagne available that day?
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:20am
  - G152
    
    Big boys big appetites need a big trough
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:43am
- Keeping Stock
  
  $15,000 divided by 58 comes to $258.62 per head. There must have been one helluva lot of Auckland Council hangers-on there, because there is no way the food at the Waipuna is that good!
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:27am
  - VicParking
    
    Knowing Auckland Council there would be at least 58 council empolyees troughing it. Any excuse to spend other peoples money
    
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    June 15, 2017 8:55am
  - Colville
    
    Not to excuse this behaviour but I do assume the $15K included venue hire?
    
    But sheesh, I went to a dinner on friday, 4 courses and 15 aged wines. That wasnt $250 and it was great 🙂
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:20am
- Left Right and Centre
  
  People that are ten times the size cost ten times as much to feed – duh !!
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:36am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    Maybe that’s why some of the Pacific atolls are sinking…
    
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    June 15, 2017 1:14pm
- Paulus
  
  Assume there will be another lunch first for Maori, but many more attendees, then the Indian Community, then Chinese and then Muslims.
  Finally vagrants.
  There will of course be many Council staff attendees at each one.
  Nothing like a free lunch.
  Do not blame the PI people.
  
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  June 15, 2017 1:40pm
krazykiwi

Leaked Report: Sweden Sees More Than 50 Per Cent Rise in ‘No-Go Zones’

The number of areas classed as “vulnerable” by Swedish police has risen from 15 to 23 in two years, according to leaked documents held back from release by Sweden’s national police chief.

Police hoped that increased resources would have reduced the number of “vulnerable” areas — typically migrant-dominated neighbourhoods which have been turned into virtual no-go zones as a result of rampant drug trafficking, gang crime, and religious extremism.

But the classified report, which was produced by the intelligence department of Sweden’s National Operations Department (NOA) and has been seen by Dagens Nyheter, showed that law enforcement has been helpless to halt the spread of criminality and extremism.

Police forces “find it difficult to carry out [their] mission” in neighbourhoods classed as “vulnerable”, according to NOA’s research, for a number of reasons which include “an unwillingness of the population to participate in legal proceedings”.

Unwillingness indeed. That suggests the communities are either openly supportive of illegal activity, or more fearful of their ‘own’ peoples’ response than that of the authorities.
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June 15, 2017 8:18am
- stephieboy
  
  krazykiwi , why should we trust or believe Breitbart when they got this report so wrong ,
  
  http://www.politico.eu/article/germany-fires-back-at-breitbart-for-report-on-new-years-riot/
  
  Not forgtting the pitiful and laughable Pizzagate .,
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wM38BeQ9DQE
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:39am
  - ross411
    
    So, if I understand you right, if one of your comments is wrong, we should by your own reasoning discount every comment you make for the rest of your days.
    
    Or does this logic only apply to other people?
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:10am
    - stephieboy
      
      ross411 , all I know is that Breitbart (like you ) can be absolutely moronic !
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:38am
      - ross411
        
        So someone who applies your logic, back onto you, is a moron? You should think more of yourself, than that.
        
        11 2
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        June 15, 2017 11:49am
oldpark

A shortage of rental property in Wellington. When a so called learned Judge ruled that tenants were not liable for damage, in the properties they were renting,putting the onus and liability onto the landlord. That being hard to accept for people who had gone into debt to buy the properties. On the heels of that ,came a couple of fat controllers from Lie-bour/Green Party.Namely Materialistic Turei,and Grant Robertson,from Liebour. They voiced their parties hate against Landlords ,and threatened all sorts of punitive penalties . Seems Landlords and potential landlords have bolted,selling down their debt laden properties and so called legal liability for tenant damage. Who the hell would want to be a landlord,Just read the headline of todays daily newspaper,as they continue , perpetuate the fashionable assault on Landlords.
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June 15, 2017 8:21am
- Rich Prick
  
  Bingo. Although for a slightly different reason. The capital gain now outweighs the hassel tenants present. Lump in some more hassel from the courts and Government, and the capital responds accordingly.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:19am
- Peter
  
  Ex-Wellington landlord here.
  
  Sold out of apartments for that very reason. Not enough return for the risk. Now the brains trust on the left want to increase the risk even further.
  
  So utterly clueless. Don’t they talk to anyone before announcing “policy”?
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:21am
  - dime
    
    this is what they want.
    
    a massive rental shortage so the government has to step in and provide even more housing.
    
    govt gets stronger. people get more reliant (and entitled).
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:24am
    - ross411
      
      I suspect that it isn’t that they all actually know they want that, but rather their mindless virtue signalling driven politicking, heads that way.
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:09am
Left Right and Centre

Did anyone see any of David Latta and John Campbell on TV1 ?

I didn’t watch the whole thing – the part I did see was some brown woman; part of a circle of PC spewing useful morons, explaining how awful it was that an ever growing low skill brown people are going to have to support all of these ageing white folks as they enter pension time.

So – idiots who breed until they bleed and then it’s magic wand time to lift their intellect and income levels to pay for old white folks – the poor little darlings. There’s some brown la la logic for ya – it’s all whitey’s fault that they’re thick, poor with 5-10 kids playing social problem bingo. It’s all just about exploiting them to pay tax to retiring whities.
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June 15, 2017 8:21am
- Tauhei Notts
  
  One of our biggest costs is NZ Superannuation, closely followed by retirement village subsidies for poor aged people.
  Because of their life style brown people do not live as long, so one can see their grief at paying taxes to keep aged whiteys alive. But not many of them are net taxpayers, so their grief might be mistaken.
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:52am
  - Longknives
    
    “Because of their life style brown people do not live as long, so one can see their grief at paying taxes to keep aged whiteys alive”
    
    I share their grief! I’m seeing so much of my Taxpayer dollar going to Prisons, Bullshit TOW ‘Gravy Train’ payouts, and paying teenage Mums to spit out feral kid after feral kid on the DPB..
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:49am
- Keeping Stock
  
  LRC – it’s actually Nigel Latta. David “Crazy” Latta was the Otago hooker who will forever be remembered for conceding a penalty in the dying stages of the 1994 Ranfurly Shield challenge at Lancaster Park, consigning the blue and golds to another heart-breaking loss.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:07am
  - Kimbo
    
    SHUT UP!!!!! YOU BASTARD!!!!! Took me years to forget that. Don’t lose it, Kimbo. Take deep breaths, think happy things…Vic Cavanagh, 1998 NPC win, lots of victory over the Lions…”I’m a Southern Man, and I’m Southern bred….”
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:10am
    - Nookin
      
      I was nicely positioned, Kimbo. Behind and slightly to the right of the posts as we looked at them. Merhts was aiming directly at us. Would you like me take take you thru the kick?
      Need something to take my mind off last week.
      
      14 1
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      June 15, 2017 9:22am
      - Kimbo
        
        May the fate of the sainted and martyred Keith Murdoch of Zingari-Richmond befall you, so that you are forced to wander a parched and barren desert in search on anonymity and respite, you Sassenach cur!
        
        So, um, no, no need thanks, Nookin. Am coping well with the emotional-equilibrium-after-trauma thing. 😉
        
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        June 15, 2017 9:34am
    - Longknives
      
      I was at that game! Mehrts had dropped back and was lining up for the drop goal right in front of the sticks..
      It was all over anyway-Latta simply had to try something.
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:51am
      - Kimbo
        
        Oh, and now you’re chiming in too! Listen, we already know your Pub Quiz team specialist subjects include sporting tragedies (the Otago 1994 Ranfurly Shield challenge is up there with the 1958 Manchester United Munich air crash, the death of Ayrton Senna, and the George Gregan tackle on Jeff Wilson)
        
        … so how about you “take one for the team” and go work on your weaknesses by boning up on some Te Reo, rather than spewing your message of hate, Mr clever dicky smarty pants Longknives, Short Dessert Spoon thingee?!
        
        Deep breaths, Kimbo, deep breaths… 😉
        
        7 1
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        June 15, 2017 10:02am
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        Very funny, but what is the adjective count in there Kimbo?
        
        Or is it adverbs that are your bag?
        
        An A word for sure
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:30am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Paulus Gnome
        
        Or is it emphatic adverbs that are your bag?
        
        There! Fixed that for ya, as per the recent work of my IP lawyer and Kimbo’s law enthusiast, David Garrett, and my reply to Maggy Wassilief below at 10:34AM
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:53am
    - Happychappy
      
      Kimbo : Did you ever see Trevor Drake play for Otago in the 1970’s a very good 1st five that was one of several that fought for that position. Lived in Balclutha and was a real hardcase.
      
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      June 15, 2017 10:03am
      - Kimbo
        
        No, sorry, before my time. Duncan Robertson from that era (in the twilight of his career – Sid Going’s non-passing killed off his test career after the 1st test of 1977, as Sid did to many of his first five eighths!) is the only one I can recall.
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:15am
      - SGA
        
        And yet the North Auckland teams of that era had pretty exciting backline play. Perhaps Brian and Ken would have a “chat” with him behind the cowshed if Sid didn’t pass enough.
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:28am
      - Kimbo
        
        Yes. You compare how many no. 10s played outside Chris Laidlaw in 20 test matches and how well they did:
        
        Bruce Watt
        Peter Murdoch
        Mac Herewini
        Earle Kirton
        Wayne Cottrell
        
        compared to Sid Going’s 29 tests:
        
        Mac Herewini
        Earle Kirton
        Wayne Cottrell
        Bruce Furlong
        Bob Burgess
        John Dougan
        Lyn Jaffray
        Ian Stevens
        Duncan Robertson
        Doug Bruce
        
        ..and I’d suggest it was the other Going brothers threatening to perform the “triple scissors” on Super Sid if he didn’t pass that made the difference! 😉
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:48am
      - Kimbo
        
        Plus. to be fair, the strength of All Blacks teams in Going’s era was the back row, especially Tremain, Lochore, Kirkpatrick, Wyllie and Sutherland
        
        …whereas the North Auckland packs of that era had to scratch around for ball, so they were better to run it with the likes of Brian and Ken, Joe Morgan, Dennis Panther and later, Eddie Dunn in their back line. Almost beat the 1971 Lions, indeed it was the only non-test game where the Lions deliberately switched tactics from trying to score, to keeping the North Aucklanders out. Took an all time great tackle by JPR on Sid to stop him scoring from a triple scissors. And a few weeks later they won the Ranfurly Shield…
        
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        June 15, 2017 11:01am
    - Keeping Stock
      
      Sorry Kimbo – I had no intention of ripping the scab off a slow-to-heal wound.
      
      Now; where did I put that can of Tui 😎
      
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      June 15, 2017 1:33pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    Arrgh,
    I thought that memory was long gone.
    Thats below the belt KS.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:50am
- thedavincimode
  
  Have you got a job yet or are those low skill brown people still helping to support you?
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:14am
- Peter
  
  I saw five minutes of it.
  
  Virtue signalling, PC mindless nonsense. They were trying to tell us business was no longer about profit, but about “sharing”
  
  Uh-huh.
  
  Who will be paying all the tax, then, given tax is collected on profits?
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:30am
  - ross411
    
    Clearly you aren’t aware of how well this kind of business works in Venezuela. I suggest someone starts a GoFundMe and sends Latta and Campbell over there backpacking around.
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:07am
- gravedodger
  
  You meant Nigel I hope, David that close to the infuriating JC Mk 2 would not go so well me thinks.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:57am
- BarryB
  
  I expected to see some sensible ideas from these two – but I gave up after the first programme. (last night I watched a replay of the Lions/Highlanders game on some channel I found on the internet.)
  
  Whenever I hear these future predictions I remind myself of the prediction about “The Paperless Society” that the internet would bring. What crap – more paper now than ever. Then there was the “Cash-Less Society” – again a load of crap.
  
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  June 15, 2017 10:46am
  - ross411
    
    BarryB.
    
    I suspect you, like me, remember Beyond 2000. I used to watch that all the time as a kid, and they’d continually advertise the wonderful products that were being developed that never seemed to eventuate now that we’re actually beyond 2000.
    
    Where is the spray that goes into my mouth, and introduces bacteria that not only eats plaque, but repairs my teeth? Etc. Etc.
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:06am
- ross411
  
  David Latta and John Campbell are both people I actively avoid seeing or hearing.
  
  I can still recall Campbell making fake news and crocodile tears, not asking questions of people he was trying to portray in some way, that begged to be asked.
  
  Latta’s limp partisan portrayal of science is painful. If I saw him on, way back when I watched TV more, I’d change the channel.
  
  I had to sit through this last night. What a random load of garbage. Portraying random interpretations of the future, and getting charts showing 40% coverage, that showed 90% of people cared about their staged issues. I couldn’t work it out.
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:04am
- 4077th
  
  I refuse to watch any of them. The “programs” are nothing more than a thinly disguised hit job on the government. I thought I’d seen that last of Campbell when he got the push from TV3…sadly, it seems, he is the proverbial bad penny.
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:40am
Maggy Wassilieff

Dear folks,
do you realise Mikenmild is leaving KB before his 30,000?
http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2017/06/government_targets_sudden_infant_deaths.html#comment-1950357
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June 15, 2017 8:21am
- Manolo
  
  Hell will freeze over first!
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:30am
- RalphT
  
  When I was young one of the rules of backyard cricket was that you retired when you got to 50; do you think we should suggest to DPF that he does something similar, with a compulsory retirement once you get to 30,000 comments?
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:40am
  - Biscuit
    
    50?
    
    Sheesh, I nobly stroll to the crease in OUR backyard cricket sessions, agree to play by their rules (they can’t be out first ball no matter what; a rule that, sniff, does NOT apply to me, heh heh) and I can’t even reach double figures without being accused of playing a like a bully!
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:34am
    - RalphT
      
      I have to confess the yard was small and thus the boundaries near; getting to 50 didn’t take long and was often achieved.
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:31am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  He’ll be back.
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:41am
- Keeping Stock
  
  I reckon he’s a Green Party list candidate, and will be back after the election when he doesn’t get a new gig.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:08am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Maggy Wassilieff ,with Manolo close to follow at 26,289 !
  
  Another of your laregly inane and childish 6,187 pointless posts ?
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:18am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    @Kimbo
    
    kimbo, kimbo, where are you?
    whatcha reckon… is laregly a superfluous adverb?
    (actually, is it an adverb?; is it even a word?)
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:16am
    - stephieboy
      
      Maggy Wassilieff , how do you marry your pretence to scientific judgement and thinking with Manolo’s crude conspiracy theories like Obama ‘s birth certificate ?
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:41am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Now stephieboy if you are concerned about my pretence to scientific judgement, perhaps you should take your concern up with the Councils of Massey University, Victoria University, Melbourne University and the Head of State Services, NZ, because you could be on to the Scam of the Century.
        
        As for Manolo’s “alleged” conspiracy theories, perhaps you’d like to provide a link to said postings.
        
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        June 15, 2017 4:54pm
  - Manolo
    
    Your tenderness towards this humble darkie is appreciated. Thank you, stephieboy.
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:20am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    @stephieboy
    
    when Manolo gets to 30,000, I’m going out celebrating in a pair of these.
    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/QZloN7vqsOs/maxresdefault.jpg
    
    14 1
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    June 15, 2017 10:20am
    - Manolo
      
      Your taste in shoes is impeccable, dear Maggy.
      Long live people of discerning and discriminating taste!
      
      12 2
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      June 15, 2017 10:25am
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        Shoes!
        
        I am devastated!
        
        From what I glean about MW here that she is a homie girl from Island Bay with a passion for gardening amongst other things.
        
        I thought it was a stylish blue dibbler with seed holder!
        
        Another illusion in the bin of life!
        
        7 1
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        June 15, 2017 11:40am
      - stephieboy
        
        Manolo , its called kitsch ( in poor taste , vulgar etc )
        
        1 21
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        June 15, 2017 11:43am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @stephieboy
        
        at over $1,000 these Hangisi Pumps are not kitsch!
        https://www.farfetch.com/nz/shopping/women/manolo-blahnik-hangisi-pumps-item-12019914.aspx?storeid=9728&size=25&gclid=CjwKEAjwvYPKBRCYr5GLgNCJ_jsSJABqwfw7yInoBof30xCLSuIaEsasznxApiQKe3M6HT9pH4BUiBoCVynw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
        They’ll look fabulous with my Theresa May outfit
        
        @Paulus Gnome… fabulous idea for when I repurpose them.. tho’ they’ll have a few seasons out on the croquet lawn before I consign them to the potting shed.
        
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        June 15, 2017 2:32pm
    - Keeping Stock
      
      You and my wife are obviously kindred spirits Maggy. SWMBO is the Imelda Marcos of Whanganui 😀
      
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      June 15, 2017 1:36pm
  - Kimbo
    
    @ Maggy Wassilieff
    
    kimbo, kimbo, where are you?
    whatcha reckon… is laregly a superfluous adverb?
    (actually, is it an adverb?; is it even a word?)
    
    As per my public service announcement of JUNE 12, 2017 9:58AM:
    
    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2017/06/general_debate_12_june_2017.html
    
    …concerning and gazetting the new copyright and trademark certification I have recently received via the legal services of David Garrett (a wasted expense according to a pro bono second opinion from holysheet, and esteemed partner of the law firm “bush lawyer”)
    
    …Kimbo’s law has been re-formulated and re-formatted as follows: “in blogworld the validity of an argument is in inverse proportion to the use of emphatic adverbs”
    
    So, no, it is not just superfluity that constitutes a breah, although in context laregly (sic) was probably (justified adverb!) that. However, it is not an adverb shill such as “absolutely”, “definitely” or “positively”, but rather gives nuance and precision to the extent of your allegedly (justified adverb!) “inane and childish…posts”.
    
    Nonetheless, I and my IP lawyer, David Garrett thank you for your contribution to turn Kimbo’s law into a meme, including relieving me of the burden of introducing the matter today.
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:34am
- dime
  
  a huge loss…
  
  he will be back. my guess is a new name. one he introduced a while back.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:29am
- thedavincimode
  
  Man overboard!
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:32am
- starboard
  
  mm’s parole has been rescinded ..” back to the big house with daily visits from bubba”. Ya wont be needing the rubber bum..but Id take the oil heh.
  
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  June 15, 2017 10:08am
  - starboard
    
    …dont let the door hit ya arse on the way out milky
    bawhaha !
    
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    June 15, 2017 6:51pm
- All_on_Red
  
  I shall remember Mikey fondly for giving us the description of Stephie as ‘Kiwiblogs Dumbest Commentator’!
  Good old Stephie proves it everyday.
  
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  June 15, 2017 2:19pm
Happychappy

What other alias will he using as you know Trevor Mallard had to ask DPF to announce he was not ztev.
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June 15, 2017 8:27am
- Chuck Bird
  
  ztev might not be Mallard but could be very close to him.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:05am
  - Happychappy
    
    You could be right there Chuck they both have the same mentality and seem to think they are the only ones in the room.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:23am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Where has ztev been lately? Is the Liarbore strategy team now in campaign mode?
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:44am
    - alex Masterley
      
      Naughty step.
      
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      June 15, 2017 9:52am
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        Thought his two weeks off expired about a week ago.
        
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        June 15, 2017 10:10am
waikatogirl

The deputy leader of Liarbore, Jacindar Adhern’s preferred PM status has dropped now below that of her great leader Angry Andy. Oh dear, the intitial flush of winning has gone. ?
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June 15, 2017 8:27am
- VicParking
  
  It did not take long for people to she how shallow she realy is
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:58am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Interestingly, Little and Ms Ardern were in Whanganui this week. When their public meeting was first advertised by the local candidate, it was “Meet Andrew Little and Jacinda Ardern”.
  
  That changed a wee bit later though to “Meet Andrew Little introduced by Jacinda Ardern”, which I wondered was a subtle response to Little trailing his deputy in the polls.
  
  The Reid Research PM poll is bad news for both of them though, with Little on 7% and Ardern on 6.6%, a combined total around where David Shearer was polling when he was “snappered” by you-know-who.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:19am
- 4077th
  
  Beauty is only skin deep.
  
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  June 15, 2017 12:42pm
Manolo

Big teeth falters:
http://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/poll-jacinda-arderns-popularity-plummets/ar-BBCFX2A?li=BBqdg4K&ocid=mailsignout
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June 15, 2017 8:29am
Manolo

The vile Left at work:
https://news.grabien.com/story-left-wing-twitter-celebrates-shooting-rep-scalise

No sooner did news break that a gunman shot Rep. Steve Scalise (R-La.) were left-wing Twitter users celebrating the attack — in which two Capitol Police were also shot, as well as a congressional staffer, and possibly more.

Activist and media personality, Tariq Nasheed, appeared to indicate support for the shooting on Twitter.
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June 15, 2017 8:36am
- kowtow
  
  They’re pretty disgusting all right,
  
  Seems every time a cop shoots a non white that black lives matter and guns are so naughty.
  
  When a loopy lefty does it , guns are good and republican lives don’t matter.
  
  Must be part of the “resistance” that Hilary and the media keep banging on about.
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:11am
Odakyu-sen

Here’s a chilling comment about the Grenfell Tower fire.

“The fire went under a new cover which had been put on with wooden slats. Most of the residents were worried about this.”

You can see from the photo how the exterior of the building is on fire.

Ref: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4602436/No-sprinklers-fire-alarm-residents-stay-INSIDE.html
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June 15, 2017 8:40am
- Inandout
  
  Leighton Smith is discussing this fire and the owners KCTMO. There were warnings last year this disaster may occur.
  
  http://www.kctmo.org.uk/
  
  Our Mission:
  
  • Delivering excellent housing services through resident led management
  
  Our Key Objectives:
  
  • Keeping residents and customers at the centre of everything we do
  
  • Raising housing service standards and expectations by delivering quality and accessible services
  
  • Confidently growing our business to meet the needs of residents
  
  Our Values:
  
  • Delighting residents and customers by exceeding expectations
  
  • Being open and accountable for all we do
  
  • Valuing the individuality and culture of residents, staff and communities
  
  • Inspiring change for the better by improving homes and communities
  
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  June 15, 2017 8:50am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    Didn’t you know?
    Mission Statements are a form of Doublespeak.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:31am
krazykiwi

The tower fire. I had to suggest to Mrs KK that she stop reading about it last night. Her imagining the horror of those trapped was just too disturbing.

There will be an inquiry and the blame will be laid at someone’s door, however disasters like this are almost always the result of a whole string of seemingly minor failings which when sequenced and timed in a particular way lead to the images we saw yesterday.

I hope more effort is made identifying and resolving these sequenced failing, than on finding one person to ‘blame’
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June 15, 2017 8:43am
- Reid
  
  Fire service took awhie (20 mins) to arrive and witnesses said didn’t do much when they first arrived
  
  In 2016 some external rainsheild cladding was installed which passed fire safety regs but which witnesses said ‘went up like a matchstick’ when the fire got to it
  
  From witness reports of debris falling and the intensity it would appear the cladding had a flammable internal core like polyester or polystyrene
  
  Company that installed the cladding is a major international firm
  
  The tenants association had a long-standing dispute with the management company and they had said on their website that the lack of response to complaints about fire hazards they had raised with them, made them think it would take a major incident before the company was stirred into action. One of their complaints was to do with the blocking off of some chimney-like structure which was recommended in an inspector’s report but which the company had not done.
  
  Possibly it was a combo of this chimney-like thing doing the internal and the cladding doing the external. Witnesses say the fire travelled up extremely rapidly.
  
  Lots of tragic and shocking reports of people trapped inside and a few jumpers, including a kid on fire off the 22nd floor.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:15am
  - Colville
    
    I think the core of ACM is polyethylene covered by 1/4 mm of ali.
    its meant to not sustain a flame.
    My understanding is that because the cladding was standing off the old cladding it formed a chimney effect so the flames went up between the old and new cladding.
    Think blast furnace effect.
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:31am
  - kowtow
    
    “Fire service took awhie (20 mins) to arrive and witnesses said didn’t do much when they first arrived”
    
    I don’t believe that at all.
    
    As to they didn’t do much ,that’s just someones’ opinion.
    
    Firemen (and cops) are very brave “ordinary” heroes. They run towards danger while the rest of us can away. And they don’t get paid nearly enough for the work they do.
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:15am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Reports do vary, but I saw one that said first responders (firemen) were at the site around 6 minutes after the first reports.
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:38am
  - Paulus
    
    The area has very little road space as roads traditionally in Kensington are narrow and cars are parked anywhere on both sides of the road making access for large say Fire vehicles very difficult at 1 am in the morning and as such it was not easy.
    
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    June 15, 2017 1:52pm
Happychappy

Why has it taken three months for a Three News Reid Research Poll to be released. Have Paddy Gower and Lisa Owen been working the Labour voter to find and make issues to suit Andrew Little and Labours Narritives like immigration and charging firms who take our fresh water for overseas markets or is it just a coincidence.
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June 15, 2017 8:49am
- VicParking
  
  Red radio came out with a “poll of polls” today.
  Last four polls PLUS LABOUR AND NATIONALS internal polling. Nationals internal polling is in line with the Four national polls but Liebours poll is so biased how can you use it.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:02am
  - Happychappy
    
    VicParking: Any Party that can only muster 29% from Labours favorite Radio Station are in trouble leading into a General Election. I wonder how long we will have to wait for Andrew Little to call this Poll “Rogue.”
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:31am
    - kowtow
      
      If it’s from RNZ it won’t be rogue , it’ll be rouge.
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:17am
krazykiwi

To “Fly the Friendly Skys” one must first get past the unfriendly ground staff: United Airlines apologises after video shows employee pushing 71-year-old passenger to floor.
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June 15, 2017 8:55am
- VicParking
  
  United who?
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:04am
Manolo

Eternal Rome has taken enough invaders, says its mayor:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4603470/Rome-s-mayor-says-no-migrants-city.html

Rome’s populist mayor called on Tuesday for a moratorium on new migrants arriving in the city, warning that setting up additional reception centres risked sparking explosive social tensions in the capital.

In the most significant challenge yet to the centre-left Italian government’s policy of distributing across the country the thousands of migrants arriving at southern ports, Virginia Raggi said it was ‘time to listen to the citizens of Rome.’
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June 15, 2017 9:08am
- dime
  
  Dime was there recently. The train station is just awful. Felt like i was in africa.
  
  I feel sorry for the migrants there. what a shit life. if the left cared, they would improve the shit countries from where these poor people came. not through them into an entirelynew culture where they live like scum.
  
  course, the left dont care about them. they just want the evil west burnt down in flames.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:33am
  - Manolo
    
    The EU is unable to see its mistake. It will continue to import and absorb thousands and thousands of invaders, despite opposition from the Italian people directly affected. Take a look at Lampedusa, for example.
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:50am
  - Lance
    
    There was some mindless woman from Oxfam in NZ recently blaming corporations not paying enough tax for all the worlds poor.
    Idiotic drivel…
    
    Wars and corruption are 99% of the problem. Fix that and then come back to us about mega-corps being to blame.
    
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    June 15, 2017 10:18am
    - Paulus
      
      Not forgetting the huge salaries paid to the administrators of these NGOs.
      The worst would still be the corrupt UN.
      
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      June 15, 2017 1:58pm
  - Gabby
    
    Dim’s gettin maudlin..
    
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    June 15, 2017 9:14pm
- cmm
  
  The pope should put his money where his moth is and import a whole lot into the Vatican.
  
  Lots of space to put in a mosque or two.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:59am
  - kowtow
    
    “Lots of space to put in a mosque or two.”
    
    Just a matter of time.
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:20am
DifferentPerspective

If only white people listened to black people about white privilege

Hilarious, apparently black people think white privilege is bullshit!

But socialist whitey knows best!

Love ’em or hate ’em – WOBH post some winners!
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June 15, 2017 9:08am
- Garbageman
  
  He sure does todays cartoon of the day is pure gold,
  https://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2017/06/cartoon-of-the-day-507/
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:40am
dime

“Green MP and Rangitata candidate Mojo Mathers labelled the case “appalling”, and said immigration should not rule out people health issues or disabilities “solely on the basis of cost”.”

fuck off commie.

start raising money through donations. you fund this shit. send the kid somewhere nice.

good ole stuff – trying to get policy changed based on the “feels”.
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June 15, 2017 10:08am
- cmm
  
  No Mojo is is not “soley on the basis of cost”. It is looking at the whole value of the family immigrating to NZ.
  
  Immigrants should be a nett benefit to NZ otherwise they should not come.
  
  If the parents were highly skilled and a huge benefit to NZ then the sums would work out.
  
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  June 15, 2017 10:24am
- dime
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vab9K4RJ9qc
  
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  June 15, 2017 10:48am
- Stars And Stripes
  
  The immigration authorities and government love white families in situations like this because it gives them the opportunity to be tough and show the public how staunch at protecting the border they are.
  However if this had been an unskilled vibrant from some foreign shit hole like Nigeria or Somalia they would have been trotting out every reason under the sun why it would be unfair to send them home.
  In fact they would be also giving them a free state house and signing them up for welfare.
  PS- the family in question should be gone too however.
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:08am
Maggy Wassilieff

I think Mikenmild has been called up for higher duties.
If you click on the Labour Party website
http://www.labour.org.nz/
there’s a place where you can “Join the Team”…. “Then donate”.

Surely, there is no-one else in NZ as accomplished as MM in being able to promptly respond to each of those new applications and donation bequests that must be streaming in by the minute.
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June 15, 2017 10:34am
- Garbageman
  
  I can only think of 1 other Maggy but without being able to use words like Breitbart, alt-right Fox , Daily Mail , Sun, elocal ,Infowars , WT etc etc ? I believe that individual would struggle to form a cohesive sentence as is already shown on a daily basis
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:24am
Hugh Pavletich

‘Completely broken’? Widening inequality fuels discontent among Kiwis | Stuff.co.nz

http://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/93679813/completely-broken-widening-inequality-fuels-discontent-among-kiwis

… extracts …

… Are those in the Beehive today getting too smug and out of touch? Could similar things happen here? …

… The Stuff.co.nz/Massey University Election Survey asked questions that other polls don’t ask, to find out how much political discontent may be simmering in New Zealand. …

… Seventy-three per cent agreed that inequality is “too high and/or growing fast”, while slightly more (74 per cent) agreed that “there is a major housing crisis in New Zealand right now”.

Health, housing and environment (in that order) were the three most widely chosen issues likely to influence voters at the election. … read more via hyperlink above …

The risk is greater than the GFC if we can’t fix the housing crisis … John Hewson … The Age / SMH

http://www.smh.com.au/comment/the-risk-is-greater-than-the-gfc-if-we-cant-fix-the-housing-crisis-20170309-guu4sf.html

Inequality & Housing: through the roof … The Economist

http://www.economist.com/news/finance-and-economics/21647349-rising-house-prices-may-be-chiefly-responsible-rising-inequality-through

Socialist Thomas Piketty’s Theory on Income Equality Wrecked by 26-Year-Old MIT Grad Student … Breitbart

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/03/26/socialist-thomas-pikettys-theory-on-income-equality-wrecked-by-26-year-old-mit-grad-student/
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June 15, 2017 11:15am
- mandk
  
  If you had bothered reading the story you would have found that the reference to “completely broken” refers to the system of government.
  
  It was unrelated to the misconception that inequality is widening (it’s not).
  
  Moreover, the report lumped those thinking the system of government is completely broken together with those who think that the system is “working but needs to change”, so we don’t actually know how widespread the perception of a completely broken system is.
  
  And you also need to bear in mind that the sample, although large, was self-selecting and “not calibrated to represent the population”.
  
  Pretty worthless survey, I would say.
  
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  June 15, 2017 12:00pm
  - Hugh Pavletich
    
    mandk … points which were generally noted within the Fairfax / Stuff article.
    
    Like you, I would have much preferred a rigorous scientific poll.
    
    My sense is that this Government will deservedly get a hiding in a 100 days time … 23 September … for its deceit and gross incompetence with respect to housing and other issues.
    
    It infuriates me how a supposedly centre-right government has failed so miserably with the housing issue.
    
    For those who have not read it, the former Deputy Editor of the UK Telegraph Allister Heath’s late 2015 opinion on this issue is essential reading …
    
    The real ticking time bomb for the Tories is home ownership … Allister Heath … UK Telegraph
    
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/property/11917816/The-real-ticking-time-bomb-for-the-Tories-is-home-ownership.html
    
    Do you recall the saying … ‘Suburbia is the cradle of conservatism’ ?
    
    Why have our supposedly centre-right politicians been so blind to this hugely significant reality ?
    
    … and too … the deplorable deceit of John Key back in 2007 …
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWPgoAI1cLE
    
    https://www.google.co.nz/?gws_rd=ssl#q=john+key+housing+reform+2007+&spf=1497486229202
    
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    June 15, 2017 12:34pm
    - Hugh Pavletich
      
      The downsides of New Zealand’s inflated house prices … OECD Ecoscope … h/t JW
      
      https://oecdecoscope.wordpress.com/2017/06/14/the-downsides-of-new-zealands-inflated-house-prices/
      
      by David Carey and Andrew Barker, New Zealand Desk, OECD Economics Department
      
      In real terms, house prices in New Zealand increased more than in any other OECD country between 2010 and 2016 (Figure 1). While house price increases have supported economic growth through wealth-induced consumption growth, they have also created a number of social and economic problems. Housing affordability has been undermined, particularly for those with low incomes: housing costs for the bottom fifth of households reached 54% of income in 2015, up from under 30% in 1990. Driven by mortgage growth, the ratio of household debt to disposable income now exceeds the level recorded prior to the global financial crisis and is high compared with other OECD countries (Figure 2). This raises financial stability risks. House price increases also undermine productivity growth by inhibiting people from moving into economically successful, highly productive urban areas. … read more via hyperlink above …
      
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      June 15, 2017 12:46pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Construction takes a dip in latest GDP figures … TVNZ News
        
        https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/construction-takes-dip-in-latest-gdp-figures
        
        A dip in construction activity has taken the shine off New Zealand’s economic expansion. … view and read more via hyperlink above …
        
        Note earlier postings at Kiwiblog … http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2017/06/general_debate_14_june_2017.html/comment-page-1#comment-1950240 … further postings up-thread … and on thread at … https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2017/06/links-14-june-2017/
        
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        June 15, 2017 12:59pm
      - stigie
        
        Oh Fuck Hugh !
        
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        June 15, 2017 1:50pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        You have to laugh at the mentalness of linking back to the other times he has spammed us.
        Lol. What an idiot.
        
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        June 15, 2017 2:13pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        ISN’T THIS FASCINATING ! …
        
        HAS ANYONE TOLD BILL ? …
        
        Our Values – NZ National Party
        
        https://www.national.org.nz/our-values
        
        The National Party has always valued enterprise, hard work and the rewards that go with success. We will continue to aspire to a New Zealand where all New Zealanders can flourish.
        
        We believe this will be achieved by building a society based on the following values:
        
        •Loyalty to our country, its democratic principles, and our Sovereign as Head of State
        
        •National and personal security
        
        •Equal citizenship and equal opportunity
        
        •Individual freedom and choice
        
        •Personal Responsibility
        
        •Competitive enterprise and reward for achievement
        
        •Limited government
        
        •Strong families and caring communities
        
        •Sustainable development of our environment
        
        NOT …
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aO9tA5DWJM
        
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        June 15, 2017 4:02pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        The Caps are so convincing.
        Got any solutions yet Hugh?
        
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        June 15, 2017 5:08pm
      - Happychappy
        
        26.5% how are you going to shift that Hugh, Labour are treading water to extinction and Trevor Mallard will have to clone himself instead of Moa.
        
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        June 15, 2017 6:17pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        All on Red … The solutions are set out very clearly at my archival website http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org .
        
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        June 16, 2017 1:17am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        THE SAD BRITISH RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT DISASTER …
        
        Battery farms in the sky: Starting in the Fifties, the people who thought they knew best built multi-storey monstrosities. With the same disdain they forced others to live in them, writes RICHARD PENDLEBURY … UK Daily Mail
        … h/t GF …
        
        http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4605604/RICHARD-PENDLEBURY-Towers-battery-farms-sky.html#ixzz4k4i7MTSN
        
        They were to be Britain’s ‘streets in the sky’, bringing futuristic home comforts to former slum-dwellers and Blitz survivors.
        
        Some 6,500 local authority tower blocks were built in their post-World War II heyday.
        
        But many proved to be high-rise dead-ends. And, in the very worst cases, death-traps.
        
        The Grenfell Tower inferno is the latest tragedy in the troubled history of British multi-storey living. That it has occurred as we are witnessing a sharp revival in the construction of sky-scraping apartment blocks is a timely reminder of the hazards they can present. … read more via hyperlink above …
        
        Inquiry. The Great British Housing Disaster (Adam Curtis, 1984) – YouTube
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch5VorymiL4
        
        … via http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org
        
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        June 16, 2017 2:22am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        … MEANTIME … IN AMERICA …
        
        HAPPY 70th BIRTHDAY LEVITTOWN … 1947 MODERN SUBURBIA IS BORN’ …
        
        … Re-learning important recent history … the hard and costly way …
        
        … Housing should not cost more than 3.0 times annual household incomes with sensible mortgage loads of about 2.5 times … thanks to entrepreneurs Bill and Alfred Levitt …
        
        … Do today’s young deserve hope too ? …
        
        Levittown history in photos | Newsday
        … google search title if blocked …
        
        http://www.newsday.com/long-island/nassau/levittown-history-in-photos-1.13458781#1
        
        In 1947, William Levitt of Levitt & Sons began building mass-produced, affordable housing for veterans returning from WWII. Island Trees, or Levittown as it later became known, is widely recognized as the first modern American suburb. Families started moving into the new homes on Oct. 1, 1947.
        
        The area that would become Levittown was formerly a series of potato fields on the Hempstead Plains that were affected by the Golden Nematode, an insect from Europe that destroyed much of the crops at the time. Levitt bought the land for a reduced price and eventually built more than 17,700 homes on the land by utilizing elements borrowed from Henry Ford’s assembly line process. The homes, which sold for just $7,990, included appliances and an expandable attic.
        
        Return to Levittown: a suburban dream turns 60 – BBC News
        
        http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-15598511
        
        Levittown Classic Movies Presents: Our Home Town … Youtube
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pg4nKlMsyQ0
        
        William Levitt – Wikipedia
        
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Levitt
        
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        June 16, 2017 2:28am
Rich Prick

Kathy Griffin will be delighted.

A lone gunman who was reportedly distraught over President Trump’s election opened fire on Republican members of the congressional baseball team at a practice field in this Washington suburb on Wednesday, using a rifle to shower the field with bullets that struck four people, including Steve Scalise, the majority whip of the House of Representatives.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/14/us/steve-scalise-congress-shot-alexandria-virginia.html?_r=0
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June 15, 2017 11:34am
- stephieboy
  
  RichPrick , surely someting is wrong there ?
  
  Nefarious MSM NYT ?
  
  Well I never!
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:45am
- stephieboy
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Rich Prick , while your at it spare a thought and prayers for the 2011 Tucson shoooting ,
  
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Tucson_shooting
  
  Hypocritre much
  
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  June 15, 2017 11:47am
  - ross411
    
    You are incoherent. You make so many comments here, but few of them are able to be understood by rational people. Maybe make one rational comment, instead of dozens of incoherent ones?
    
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    June 15, 2017 11:51am
    - Inandout
      
      The stephie on this shift is a shocker.
      
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      June 15, 2017 11:56am
      - lifesgood
        
        Drinking/drug problem?
        
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        June 15, 2017 5:34pm
  - Rich Prick
    
    That was sooooo 2011 stephie. But you miss my oblique point, the encouragement from the “stars” is bearing fruit.
    
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    June 15, 2017 12:05pm
- Gabby
  
  Reblubiblubs will be appalled at the poor marksmanship but reassured that any deranged nutjob can access a firearm regardless.
  They’ll be wondering why God hates Steve though.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:07pm
mandk

From the 2017 OECD Economy Survey of New Zealand:

“New Zealand continues to enjoy a strong, broad-based economic expansion.
Strong economic growth is being driven by booming tourism, strong net inward migration, solid construction activity, and supportive monetary policy.
The fiscal position is sound, with low public debt and a balanced budget. The major vulnerability facing the economy is high levels of household debt associated with rapid house price increases, particularly in Auckland. New Zealand is also exposed to protectionist trade policies abroad and to slowing Chinese economic growth. While the short-term economic outlook is strong, there are long-term challenges from low productivity growth and a changing labour market.”
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June 15, 2017 12:30pm
cha

Why did Mueller hire people with experience in prosecuting money laundering and East European organized crime?.

.

It’s a team that contains some of the nation’s top investigators and leading experts on seemingly every aspect of the potential investigation—from specific crimes like money laundering and campaign finance violations to understanding how to navigate both sprawling globe-spanning cases and the complex local dynamics of Washington power politics.

[…]

Page has deep experience with money laundering and organized crime cases, including investigations where she’s partnered with an FBI task force in Budapest, Hungary, that focuses on eastern European organized crime. That Budapest task force helped put together the still-unfolding money laundering case against Ukrainian oligarch Dmitry Firtash, a one-time business partner of Manafort.

https://www.wired.com/story/robert-mueller-special-counsel-investigation-team/
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June 15, 2017 12:55pm
- All_on_Red
  
  Russian donations to Bill Clinton for speaking fees and donations to the Clinton Foundation?
  Shares issued to Podesta by interests associated with Ukrainians?
  Money paid to Tony Podesta?
  Also, why did he hire Democrat donors as investigators.
  
  6 1
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  June 15, 2017 2:09pm
Jack5

Especially for Happychappy – reported today:

GDP per capita decreased 0.1 percent in the March 2017 quarter, following a 0.2 percent fall in the December 2016 quarter.

A fairly grey report if you want to digest the lot:

http://stats.govt.nz/browse_for_stats/economic_indicators/GDP/GrossDomesticProduct_MRMar17qtr.aspx
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June 15, 2017 1:11pm
- Happychappy
  
  Jack5: Thanks but it can improve with what the economy will reap out of the Lions tour, and a improvement in Construction and Dairy Industries so all is not lost.
  
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  June 15, 2017 3:32pm
- Happychappy
  
  Jack5 : NZ Economy growing but house prices at risk- OECD Report. But considers the Reserve Bank should be allowed to bring Debt to Income Ratio limits for morgages to make banks safer. You can read the rest on the Hub news site under Money.
  
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  June 15, 2017 6:41pm
starboard

Nice. NZ funding North Korea.

http://www.taxpayers.org.nz/
7 1
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June 15, 2017 1:46pm
timmydevo

I was wondering when the muslim slant would get its airtime…

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/93718367/london-fire-muslims-awake-for-ramadan-meal-save-residents-of-flaming-grenfell-tower
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June 15, 2017 1:53pm
- cmm
  
  Shamelessly exploiting a tragedy to spin a pro-Muslim story.
  
  When I dragged a bloke out of a burning car there was no “atheist saves man from burning car” headline.
  
  Surely the religion is irrelevant. If someone detects fire they tell others as a matter of common decency. It really has nothing to do with Muslims or Ramadan.
  
  All I can get out of this headline is that some Muslims did something that anyone else would do. Big woopie!
  
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  June 15, 2017 4:38pm
  - nasska
    
    ….”When I dragged a bloke out of a burning car there was no “atheist saves man from burning car” headline”…..
    
    If the sensitivities of this blog’s Godfreaks are anything to go by it’s a wonder you weren’t told to put him back in the car until a Christian was available to do the job.
    
    5 4
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    June 15, 2017 5:20pm
cha

Russian meddling, preposterous……oh wait…

Senate votes 97-2 to approve new round of Russia sanctions in response to 2016 election interference— Jamie Dupree (@jamiedupree) June 14, 2017
4 4
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June 15, 2017 3:28pm
Manolo

An article to delight the warmists:
https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/06/it-just-aint-so/
5 1
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June 15, 2017 3:48pm
Happychappy

Winston First and his Party record 9.4% in the latest Three News Reid Poll and Paddy Gower is having orgasms. But they seem to forget three different polls have had him on 9% for the last couple of months and it is a long way off the 19% Paul Scott and Winston have been preaching of their internal polls for a long time now and this equals the Radio Red Poll this morning.
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June 15, 2017 4:57pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  It will be interesting when we find out tonight at who’s expense this is.
  
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  June 15, 2017 5:04pm
  - dad4justice
    
    I think Winston will poll more than 20% come election day. Anybody with a braincell should realize that he is on to it. National voters are going to vote for him this time around.
    
    5 16
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    June 15, 2017 5:12pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      I’ve seen plenty of loads of tosh before d4j, but you’ve really nailed it this time.
      Go and have a think about who he’d bring in with him and do your sums again.
      
      7 1
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      June 15, 2017 5:25pm
      - dad4justice
        
        I don’t care who he brings with him, as National is giving free our water to China and many kiwi’s are jobless as a result, for example Kaputone and Fairton workers, who are all voting against a heartless sell all bunch of timid creeps. Anything would be better for the country other than the present do nothing misfits that govern this land.$ 14 billion to the ridiculous climate change bullshit and God only knows much to the greedy magpie maoris! National are a bunch of wimps enjoying the socialist gravy train.
        
        7 8
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        June 15, 2017 5:32pm
      - Longknives
        
        “National are a bunch of wimps enjoying the socialist gravy train.”
        
        I agree 110% Dad- But I’d vote for freaking Hitler if it meant keeping the Greens away from Power in New Zealand..
        Two Ticks National.
        
        11 1
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        June 15, 2017 6:50pm
      - Stars And Stripes
        
        I used to be proud to vote National but I do so now with a feeling of shame and loathing as this party has sold just about every principle it ever stood for down the road.
        Nanny state-check, immigrant and Muslim hugging-check, beneficiary friendly-check, racist policies in favour of Māori-check, PC-check, and rampantly socialist-check.
        Pile of dirty traitors.
        
        14 3
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        June 15, 2017 7:09pm
    - dad4justice
      
      My word 9 downticks for stating the truth. My God National supporters are weak gutted cowardly jellyfish types, just look at double dipton. Labour are no different and the greens are criminally insane.
      
      5 8
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      June 15, 2017 7:12pm
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        And where on that scale is dad?
        
        3 0
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        June 15, 2017 7:19pm
      - dad4justice
        
        I guess what I like about about Winston is that he wants to deal with maori and muslims. Thank God mm has been locked up in the local mental asylum.
        
        6 4
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        June 15, 2017 7:24pm
      - stigie
        
        If you are a NZ First supporter Dad, you won’t mind going with the Labour/Greens then..?
        
        6 0
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        June 15, 2017 7:27pm
RF

Nats….47.4

Labour…26.4

Greens… 12.5

NZ First…. 9.4

Little ….7

Jacinda …..6.6

Labour are stuffed !!!!!!!!
12 1
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June 15, 2017 6:12pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Thanks RF, you beat me to it.
  At this rate (as I’ve been predicting for months), the drunken dwarf could get 15% and he still won’t be required.
  Thanks Labour and Angry for being so useless.
  
  9 1
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  June 15, 2017 6:20pm
  - Happychappy
    
    And Andrew Little smiles and says to the Three News Journalist it is not what Public are telling us. Labour are in La La land if they think they can lead a coalition to be the Government come September 23rd.
    
    9 2
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    June 15, 2017 6:52pm
    - sooty
      
      Hay, Andy. The 23rd of june is only around the corner. Is it too cold or BBQs?
      
      3 0
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      June 15, 2017 8:53pm
- Longknives
  
  “Jacinda …..6.6..
  Labour are stuffed !!!!!!!!”
  
  Maybe (Given Unicef blaming National today for Youth Suicide) it’s time for Adern to have another fake blub about the person she knew who committed suicide years ago?…
  *I mean no disrespect to victims of suicide- having experienced the horrors first-hand..But Adern’s blubbing performance was uncalled for and completely unconvincing..(I wouldn’t cast her in a School play following that awful and rather transparent effort)
  
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  June 15, 2017 7:19pm
  - Harriet
    
    The only person with any reputable worth and experience amongst the entire left is Greg O’Conner —- quarter of a century as a police union boss. You would have to be good to do that, to some degree you are responsible for the safety, welfare and morale of officers, or at least are dealing with those issues. And the people are policed very well. He’s the only one worth listening to, everyone else has been at the trough.
    
    2 2
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    June 15, 2017 7:55pm
    - RF
      
      Greg has turned out to be a flip flop poly.
      
      His former mates in the Police have gone dog on him as he now has a selective memory about what he was stressing…. i.e. Arm the Police.
      
      Now it’s .. let’s restrict the criminal being armed. The Police are currently well armed.
      
      Then again he is in the Labour Party. Say no more.
      
      7 0
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      June 15, 2017 8:46pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Aussie Actress Rebel Wilson wins her defamation case.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-15/rebel-wilson-wins-defamation-case-against-bauer-media/8609670
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June 15, 2017 6:28pm
cha

There goes the special relationship.

http://www.9news.com.au/national/2017/06/15/14/18/malcolm-turnbull-impersonates-donald-trump-in-leaked-audio/?ocid=9newstw
3 3
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June 15, 2017 7:50pm
- RF
  
  What a bloody idiot
  
  1 0
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  June 15, 2017 8:00pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Nah, Cha’s ok- got TDS and addicted to no source Twitterites though. Still, Turnbull will be gone soon. Last laugh and all that.
    
    2 0
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    June 15, 2017 8:26pm
dad4justice

Speaking of relationships the world has gone insane
https://colombiareports.com/colombia-grants-landmark-martial-union-three-husbands/
3 2
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June 15, 2017 7:55pm
- stigie
  
  Vote for the Greens and get them in, then we could have the same thing here Dad !~
  
  5 0
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  June 15, 2017 8:01pm
  - dad4justice
    
    I wouldn’t vote greens if you put a gun to my head.
    
    7 2
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    June 15, 2017 8:05pm
RF

Micky Savage is having a major melt down as the result of the TV3 poll. His phone line is overloaded.

Angry refuses to believe its Thursday and claims the poll that will be rogue is not coming out until tomorrow.

Grant has been seen making Daisy chains and skipping through Cuba Mall. A very happy Chappy. He might need a permit for all the BBQs he will be lighting.

Jacinda is hysterical with grief and wants to appear in Mad Magazine as she needs more friendly publicity. No one has told her that Alfred E Newman is dead.
12 0
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June 15, 2017 7:57pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Neuman.
  I’m a Mad Magazine fan and hate to see his name misspelled.
  
  3 0
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  June 15, 2017 8:59pm
  - RF
    
    Sorry. Blame spell check. I have committed a mortal sin…..”What me worry”
    
    1 0
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    June 15, 2017 9:33pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      You’re excused.
      And Don Martin is the greatest cartoonist of all time.
      
      0 0
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      June 15, 2017 9:45pm
nasska

“Daddy,” a little girl asked her father, “do all fairy tales begin with ‘Once upon a time’? ”

“No, sweetheart,” he answered. “Some begin with ‘If I am elected.'”
9 2
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June 15, 2017 8:50pm
Jack5

Dame Devoid has made it into the Lefty Guardian with her activist campaign against racism, or alleged racism.

Devoid is reported repeating this about New Zealanders:

“We live in one of the most ethnically diverse nations on the planet,” says Devoy.

Really? According to Fearon’s analysis as reported in Wikipedia New Zealand is the 102nd most ethnically diverse country in the world. Fearon’s ranking is based on cultural rather than genetic diversity.

In another ranking (second link below), NZ doesn’t feature in the top 10 most diverse countries. It places them all in Africa.

For NZ’s multiculturists, I guess it’s the old saying: if you tell a porky long enough the media accept it as the truth.

Devoid in the Guardian:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jun/15/new-zealand-stars-tackle-tiny-racists-helping-to-normalise-prejudice

The 10 most ethnically diverse countries:

http://www.worldatlas.com/articles/most-ethnically-diverse-countries-in-the-world.html
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June 15, 2017 9:17pm
- Jack5
  
  Is Devoid climbing into politics in the run-up to the election with her latest campaign?
  
  Immigration looks to be an emerging issue, and playing the big race card may be seen by some as a way of pushing a pro-immigration message to political parites.
  
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  June 15, 2017 9:23pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    And her new hairstyle is much more in keeping with her age.
    Will that make her any more relevant?
    Probably not.
    
    4 1
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    June 15, 2017 9:50pm
    - sam green
      
      Oooo – I have not seen her new hairstyle Captain Mainwaring – do describe it for us.
      
      0 2
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      June 16, 2017 12:07am
- sam green
  
  Oh dear. Susan Devoy is just a bit thick. She’s a great squash player!!!! Not a fucking diplomat! Didn’t someone tell John Key?
  
  “Awww -she’ll be alright – she plays international sports – she’ll know something about the real world. Not like that fucking intelligent commie de Bres.”
  
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  June 16, 2017 12:04am
Manolo

Who does not leak in the White House?
http://www.thedailybeast.com/even-trumps-aides-blame-him-for-obstruction-probe-president-did-this-to-himself
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June 16, 2017 7:06am

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