General Debate 2 October 2016

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Griff

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Paris climate change treaty to be ratified four years earlier than planned

The Paris climate change deal – hailed as a landmark step in the fight against global warming – is to be ratified by the European Union in a move that will bring the international treaty into force.

EU ministers approved the ratification at an extraordinary meeting of the Environment Council.

The agreement, already ratified by the US and China, the world’s biggest polluters, becomes binding after at least 55 countries who are responsible for 55 per cent of total emissions formally sign up.

Ratification by the EU, which is responsible for 12 per cent of global emissions, would take it over the threshold, allowing the treaty to come into force before the end of this year, some four years earlier than planned.

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/paris-climate-change-deal-ratified-eu-united-nations-global-warming-a7339296.html
India To Ratify Paris Climate Deal Today, President Gives Assent

India is all set to ratify the Paris climate deal today, with President Pranab Mukherjee giving his assent to a proposal approved earlier by the government, making India one of the key countries to help bring the pact into force.

“We will ratify the Paris deal in the UN tomorrow. The President has signed it. The Union Cabinet has already approved it,” Environment Minister Anil Madhav Dave told reporters on Saturday.

He said Prime Minister Narendra Modi had announced on September 25 that India will ratify it on October 2 on the birth anniversary of Mahatma Gandhi.

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/india-to-ratify-paris-climate-deal-tomorrow-president-gives-assent-1469005
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October 2, 2016 8:18am
- Ross12
  
  So China ratifies the Agreement and then increases coal production
  
  http://jakartaglobe.beritasatu.com/international/chinas-major-coal-producers-start-raising-output-media/
  
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  October 2, 2016 11:35am
  - Griff
    
    Posts a link that says this.
    
    China’s coal production this year may drop to between 3.15 to 3.35 billion tonnes, down by 6 to 12 percent from a year ago, said two coal analysts,
    
    Did you even read it or was it from some whacko webshite that knows its readership never check the links they bullshite about?
    
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    October 2, 2016 11:48am
    - Icarus
      
      That is due to manufacturing being down. They have plenty of coal and they will burn it all. Don’t you worry. They also don’t give a shit about your prophesies of doom.
      
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      October 2, 2016 11:50am
      - Griff
        
        The Paris agreement.
        They have already signed……See above.
        They are building a modern renewable electrical generation grid. http://www.energypost.eu/chinas-electricity-mix-changing-fast-co2-emissions-may-peaked/
        They have already reached peak coal twenty years ahead of projections
        So as usual your dribbling screen lick is only more retarded nonsense from a halfwitted troll living in a dream world .
        
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        October 2, 2016 12:01pm
      - Icarus
        
        “peak coal
        
        LOL 🙂
        
        Just like the peak oil lie. Production is at record levels and the price has dropped out of the market. Sorry Griff, we are no where near the end.
        
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        October 2, 2016 12:09pm
      - Griff
        
        Dear dear
        Facts pulled out your arse kea .
        https://yearbook.enerdata.net/coal-and-lignite-production.html
        Record production is it?
        Not out here in the real world .
        ROFL all right
        At someone who makes shite up all the time.
        
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        October 2, 2016 12:40pm
      - Icarus
        
        We have lots of coal in NZ Crow and its not even worth getting it out of the ground right now, because there is a glut of it.
        
        You silly little boy. Go and find a girlfriend or something.
        
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        October 2, 2016 4:15pm
      - Griff
        
        Love it when you are confronted with facts you just gibber even more rubbish.
        Shows you are a whacko .
        We have lots of coal.
        We had this big government owned coal mining firm.
        Solid energy .
        It went broke and cost us taxpayers hundreds of millions of dollars .
        
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        October 2, 2016 4:21pm
      - Icarus
        
        LOL 🙂
        
        It went broke because there is no money in coal right now. There is too much of the stuff and trillions of tons more just waiting to be harvested.
        
        NZ simply needs to build a few coal fired power stations to create jobs and use the cheap and plentiful coal. Natures gift of organic fuel.
        
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        October 2, 2016 4:25pm
    - Ross12
      
      The report is from Reuters.
      
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      October 2, 2016 12:30pm
waikatogirl

Can you please stop the rain Griff!
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October 2, 2016 8:29am
- Griff
  
  We are soaking here in sth Auckland.
  So far this episode hasn’t been enough to be concerned of further flooding .
  Other than it is way to wet to mow the bloody lawn .
  
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  October 2, 2016 8:34am
  - waikatogirl
    
    There’s always an up-side to the weather for someone ?
    
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    October 2, 2016 8:36am
    - Griff
      
      Unfortunately it is not an upside .
      Spring growth is here the longer I can not mow it the harder it is going to be.
      Bloody Kikuyu.
      
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      October 2, 2016 8:42am
      - Northland Wahine
        
        It’s raining so much I have a raft of ducks paddling on my front lawn. Thank goodness the cats hate the rain or there’d be feathers everywhere.
        
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        October 2, 2016 8:53am
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      A bit more rain along with some more of Griffs global warming and we will be beach front, result!
      
      A little little too much rain and largesse from Griff and the people behind will be beach front, not such a good result and soggy deck chairs. 🙁
      
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      October 2, 2016 8:57am
duggledog

I have a suggestion for the CEO of Youi insurance

Change your slogan – ‘We Get You’
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October 2, 2016 9:03am
- Inandout
  
  It probably has a different meaning in South Africa, but yes not a good choice of words. Their TV ads are getting fewer so they must be hurting.
  
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  October 2, 2016 9:18am
Happychappy

So the Wanabees and their great coach wont be so full of themselves now that the Springbox have put another dent in their armour
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October 2, 2016 9:11am
Happychappy

I do not or would not condone contaminated chattles being left for three days on a lawn out side a State house that was contaminated with P, but could someone tell me when and where there is a law allowing neighbours children to come and play in another persons back or front yard. MSM again sticking their nose where it does not belong.I wonder whether we could take a bus load of children to play in their head office and see how they would handle that.
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October 2, 2016 9:21am
- G152
  
  Take the children out of the MSM office and there’d be no ‘reporters’
  
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  October 2, 2016 9:34am
- waikatogirl
  
  Happychappy: I do not or would not condone contaminated chattles being left for three days on a lawn out side a State house that was contaminated with P, but could someone tell me when and where there is a law allowing neighbours children to come and play in another persons back or front yard.
  
  And neighbours to also steal those belongings from the front yard. Housing NZ are looking to track down the P contaminated belongings from those thieves, to save them from possible contamination.
  
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  October 2, 2016 9:40am
- peterwn
  
  Do not be so precious. If kids can walk in off the street like that and be in a hazardous situation, it is theoretically their problem, but it is really the occupier’s problem and if there are builders at work it is a ‘health and safety issue’. The hazardous material should have been fenced off or placed in a full size skip.
  
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  October 2, 2016 9:57am
cmm

Social justicwe arriors hang your heads in shame:

http://abcnews.go.com/Lifestyle/officer-calms-girl-afraid-police-traffic-stop/story?id=41667522

The story line about white cops shooting innocent blacks is so strong that kids are now terrified of the police.

Yet the stats do not back this up. Police (yes, even the white ones) keep Black people safe.

The people who kill blacks are other blacks (90% or more) – not white cops.

It is now more dangerous for a black guy to live in Chicago than for him to work as a military contractor in Iraq. Other blacks are more dangerous than IEDs.

If BLM really cared about black lives (instead of race baiting) they’e work with the police to improve communications rather than try drive a wedge between Blacks and what keeps them safe.
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October 2, 2016 9:43am
Morrissey

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TIME FOR A RADICAL CHANGE

As anyone who pays attention is aware, John Key, Steven Joyce, Bill English and their cronies are effectively running this country into the ground. This item by Paul Little is an indictment of the National Party’s record…

An unemployed man living in his car placed an advertisement on a supermarket notice board offering to pay rent if he could park his car in a driveway and use the house’s bathroom. Housing New Zealand – which provides housing to people who would otherwise be homeless – applied to evict 2591 of its own tenants in the 12 months to June.

The Auckland Regional Public Health Service announced that the number of cases of rheumatic fever was 36 per cent higher for the first half of this year compared with the same period last year.

Ashley Peacock, who has autism, was locked up in a mental health unit for all but 90 minutes a day for the past five years.

The Household Net Worth Survey disclosed that 10 per cent of people own 60 per cent of the country’s wealth, and 40 per cent own a total of 3 per cent.

In Kaitaia in the Far North – where median personal income was $23,400 at the last Census – six people under 25 committed suicide within three months.

The reason was “a sense of hopelessness and helplessness of the young people”, according to a community leader. “They believe the sun isn’t going to come up any more.”

Lifeline, the free phone helpline for people with mental health and other problems, notably those considering suicide, said it would close after 52 years when the Government said it would not be renewing its contract with the service.

When a paedophile was moved into a house next door to where two girls aged 5 and 6 lived, their parents complained to the Corrections Department.

It recommended that their daughters play where he couldn’t see them.

Read more about John Key’s legacy….
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11720811
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October 2, 2016 9:47am
- peterwn
  
  And Labour will do what about it, especially as it would be in power along with two parties and would be hog tied when it comes to actually trying to do things.
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:00am
  - Morrissey
    
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    I’m encouraged by the fact you acknowledge there’s a problem, peterwn. I share your skepticism about the Labour Party. That’s why I headed my post “Time for a RADICAL change.”
    
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    October 2, 2016 10:05am
    - Liberty
      
      Morrissey in your deluded dream.
      Under labour we would all live is a socialist utopia.
      Kirk ,Lange and Clark tried that. It was a total fail.
      Under National life is good.
      
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      October 2, 2016 10:54am
- Jack5
  
  Paul Little is an idiot – a Leftist journo interviewing his keyboard.
  
  He has a file in which he tucks every gripe he finds in the MSM, then packs them into one attack on National.
  
  For example, rheumatic fever is preceded by strep throat, which is transmittable. If the strep throat is treated rheumatic fever can almost always be prevented. What are the parents doing? Most GP practices don’t charge for treating children under 13, and even their prescriptions will be free.
  
  There is also a cheap, NZ developed anti-strep throat tablet that was developed by a scientist who suffered rheumatic fever as a child.
  
  How is John Key to blame for parents’ ignorance and, in many cases, neglect?
  
  I suspect Morrissey is a lone wolf from the electronic asylum for bloggers, the Standard.
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:01am
  - Morrissey
    
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    That’s right, Jack5—attack the messenger. You know everything he wrote is correct, and abuse is your only option.
    
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    October 2, 2016 10:03am
    - Jack5
      
      Morrissey, defend Little’s flawed criticism of the rheumatic fever rate, rather than going into an ad hominem attack.
      
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      October 2, 2016 10:05am
      - Morrissey
        
        The only ad hominem attack was by you, Jack. I simply pointed out what you were doing, and I also pointed out that I understood why you indulge in such tawdry behaviour: you have no other option, given that what Little wrote is irrefutable.
        
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        October 2, 2016 10:43am
    - cmm
      
      It is hardly attacking the messenger. It is shining the light on duplicitous pimping of the poor. You come across as a resonably articulate person. Pity you can’t see through his bullshit.
      
      You have to be a very dodgy sleaze to be being kicked out of state housing. Calling that a failure of Housing NZ is ridiculous.
      
      Rheumatic fever – like any infectious disease is seasonal. Some years there’s a bad season, some years not. Something like flu.
      
      Perhaps you could come up with a better strategy for Ashley Peacock. At the end of the day he’s violent and attacks everyone he deals with. His parents can’t handle him. Regular health services can’t handle him. It’s a bitch of a situation, but that’s the truth.
      
      Suicides often come in waves and Kaitia has had problems. It has a lot of Maori people who are supposed to have a high quality caring culture. Why are they not looking after each other? They’ve had huge Treaty Settlements. What are they doing with those to enrich their communities? How is that the fault of: (1) Pakeha, (2) the government.
      
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      October 2, 2016 10:53am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  The rampant lefty ‘jouno’ Paul Little missed one thing off his list:
  “Morrissey is allowed to roam free in the community.”
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:12am
- Icarus
  
  John Key is clever. He took over the center left leaving Labour no place to go except too far left, or right of National. Key knows we are a lefty country, so he makes concessions.
  
  But his real beliefs are far right. Way far right. He is a banker not a humanist. He makes concessions, but is dismantling social safety nets and services in the background. The public service is quietly being gutted, with front line services suffering the most.
  
  Sadly we are like the USA with no viable alternative. Key is the best we have for now.
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:43am
- CC40
  
  “The Auckland Regional Public Health Service announced that the number of cases of rheumatic fever was 36 per cent higher for the first half of this year compared with the same period last year.”
  
  However when looking at longer term trends things not quite so bad…
  
  In the 2015/16 financial year, the national incidence of rheumatic fever was 2.4 cases per 100,000 people – a total of 111 people were admitted to hospital for the first time with rheumatic fever. This represents a statistically significant 37 percent decrease in first episode rheumatic fever hospitalisations from baseline (2009/10).
  
  http://www.health.govt.nz/about-ministry/what-we-do/strategic-direction/better-public-services/progress-better-public-services-rheumatic-fever-target
  
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  October 2, 2016 1:05pm
Notsofast

While the attention of Aucklanders at the high court is directed to proceedings where, after disgracefully breaching all the confidences of the hapless Rachel MacGregor, Jordan Williams lurches towards a Pyrrhic victory against Colin Craig, there is a quiet and most dignified session nearby.
Justice John Fogarty, very highly ranked as fair and uncommonly attentive by barristers, considers matters that traverse nearly 5 decades of police, prosecutorial, and judicial treachery against innocent New Zealanders.
Tales of secret witnesses and prodigious inducements to lie for their fiction writing police masters.
Hyperbole? No indeed not. Everyone paying attention will be thrilled as the hoax perpetrated against David Wayne Tamihere unravels.
He is not the only one.

The highest decibel reading occurs when Arthur Taylor implores of the judge, why must I be the one to prosecute witness C? What are the nation’s police doing?

Whatever justice Fogarty decides about lifting name suppression, and allowing the citizenry to be informed of the name of a man facing criminal proceedings in this country, remember he states this:

“Life is hard enough without suffering consequences due to error of law. Judges try very hard to get the law right – to refine the issues to expose the contest as to the meaning or best application of the rule or standard to the material facts. Yes, I get passionate about that, and excited when I think I have found the just resolution of the issue.”
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October 2, 2016 9:54am
- peterwn
  
  There is something badly wrong when someone convicted of serious crimes that have caused misery to others is able to conduct a law ‘practice’ from inside a maximum security prison. Is there any other nation where this sort of thing would be tolerated?
  The trouble is Geoffrey Palmer’s Bill of Rights Act is in practice too focused on the rights of ratbags and is virtually silent on the human rights of ordinary people to go about their normal business.
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:11am
  - Notsofast
    
    Arthur Taylor is reformed, this will never be said of John Hughes. You seem to support a police culture of ignoring crimes by their own people. The issue is one of serial offending. There are lethal killers running free in New Zealand, the police and government ministers know this.
    
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    October 2, 2016 10:21am
    - peterwn
      
      Reformed? If the Parole Board concurred surely he would be out of the place.
      
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      October 2, 2016 10:40am
      - Notsofast
        
        Your concern should be directed to Judith Collins. You might consider police and corrections are the culprits in leaving Taylor to do their work. People are unaware of the collateral damage to communities when the police offend and frame the wrong man.
        Watch this and reflect
        
        https://www.nzonscreen.com/title/relative-guilt-1999
        
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        October 2, 2016 10:52am
    - howitis
      
      John Hughes was on the Crewe murder case so learnt ‘well’.
      
      He also was impersonating a police officer years after he left the force. There were no consequences for Hughes.
      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10680930
      Headline: Ambitious detectives go too far
      
      ….A young detective was taking a statement from Ngamu when Mr Hughes arrived, saw it didn’t contain a confession, screwed it up and wrote a new statement with Ngamu’s “confession”…..
      
      Bad does not even begin……
      In his defence Hughes was a long term amateur boxer. They did not know so much about head injuries in those days.
      
      in Lundy Trial 1 the cops made up a complete and utterly impossible ‘case’ involving driving at the speed of light, psychics, and cross dressing and the jury convicted. Go figure. Or maybe Lundy had access to the USS Enterprise and went at Warp speed! About as plausible.
      Years later they presented a more ‘plausible’ (if you could use that word for NZ cops) story in Trial 2. No-one got done for perjury on Trial 1 despite it being complete bullshit.
      
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      October 2, 2016 11:17am
      - Notsofast
        
        You seem to have good understanding of what is going on. The killer of Hoglin and Paakonen is fortunately dead, but the killer of Christine and Amber Lundy is not, it is not Mr Lundy, nor is the killer of Scott Guy or the driver of the car.
        The killer of Jeanette and Harvey Crewe is dead but the person who helped push the bodies in the river is not as far as I know.
        I have given case facts about Lundy to the justice minister who thanks me for my opinions.
        Everyone seems happy. The police have closed their files .
        
        Detective Superintendent Andy Lovelock:
        “Teina Pora has been convicted on two occasions. That’s the case over.”
        
        Where are the notebooks concerning the earrings that were manufactured for the second trial Andy?
        
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        October 2, 2016 11:40am
    - howitis
      
      Any hints on who the killer for Mrs and Ms Lundy might be NSF?
      
      Mr Lundy may be a bad actor, overweight, sloppy and poor with finances. I don’t know him. One can certainly have murderous intent towards ones wife or ‘other half’ but to axe to death your own daughter is drawing a long bow especially as the cops claim Lundy planned it so well – then kept an incriminating shirt. I think the lies by the cops in Trial 1 about MacDonald’s food timing and going to bed before 7pm is beyond even a Disney fantasy.
      
      Given Palmerston North is justifiably vilified and it is 15 mins drive from Feilding which has to be the nuttiest town in NZ (2010 machete attack near Taihape on a cop by Feilding Ferals;
      Scott Guy assassination same year;
      Double murder plus suicide weeks later;
      the church that kept getting burnt in Feilding and it was the local security guard doing it;
      Margaret Waldin and Ted Ferguson murders 2005;
      Feilding amputee Dean Mulligan was found guilty of bludgeoning to death Wanganui woman Marice McGregor;
      ..At 20 years old, Andrew Colin George Jacobs is already a career conman with 40 convictions….. Jacobs – a former farming worker originally from Feilding – is most well known for providing false information to police ; )
      it is entirely conceivable that it was confused crazy ferals from Feilding that committed the double murder of Mrs and Ms Lundy.
      
      There is so much crazy from that one town. You can almost see the craziness – like the end of Ghostbusters (1984) – hanging over the town from Sanson on SH1.
      Ewen McDonalds behaviour of spilling 1000s litres of milk, bludgeoning calves, and vandalising houses is just Tuesday before lunch in Feilding.
      
      Marton nearby has its own problems as well.
      
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      October 2, 2016 1:54pm
      - Notsofast
        
        In America defence attorneys solve cases as a key means to exonerations. Kathleen Zellner is claiming on behalf of Steven Avery she will eventually name the killer of Teresa Halbach. This is not cloak and dagger, it is essential. In New Zealand all the dots have been connected in the Lundy case, I have explained it often enough here.
        What was the loud crashing noise before midnight the neighbours heard? Where was Mark at that moment? Who is the witness with permanent name suppression, now deceased, whose wife called the cops to alert them to a confrontation 12 hours before Christine and Amber were killed? What are the police doing about this? New Zealanders have rocks in their heads to believe any man would embark on such a ludicrous plan to raise money insufficient anyway to make a blind bit of difference to creating a 2 million dollar vineyard enterprise.
        The police need a nuclear warhead up there lazy backsides. Sue Schwalger should reopen the case. If she has the guts.
        
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        October 2, 2016 2:34pm
redeye

http://www.domain.com.au/news/developer-destroys-young-couples-dreams-as-ryde-home-sells-for-230000-over-reserve-20161001-grsvrv/

A developer outbids struggling young couple for 1.51 Million for a 3 bedder weatherboard in Ryde NSW.

Just as well the Aussie have a capital gains tax, ban foreigners from buying existing homes and absentee landlords hoarding empty properties now ace a 1.5 per cent tax on the value of their vacant house.
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October 2, 2016 10:06am
duggledog

Morrissey

The unpalatable truth is that HNZ applied to evict 2591 of its tenants because of these reasons

Gang members
Associates or partners of gang members
Don’t pay their rent on time
Wreck the place
Use or sell meth / other drugs
Upset everyone around them or
Fraudulent occupation

You and your mate Little are a pair of geese. It’s almost impossible to be evicted from a State House, you’ve got to be a proper shit for that to happen.

What the ferals are hearing for the first time is: ‘No’, not just from the government but from the community.

They’re the ones sleeping in cars but journalists like Little want us all to believe the MSD is just evil and kicking the defenceless as opposed to calling a spade a spade.

Each and every person sleeping / and or living in unacceptable circumstances in this gold plated welfare state of a country will have a pretty gnarly story behind how they got there, but we never get to hear it eh.

Andrew Little / Paul Little, same thing.
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October 2, 2016 10:22am
- Morrissey
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  duggledog,
  
  I don’t think you believe a word of that diatribe. Why damage your credibility by recycling Leighton Smith?
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:45am
  - rangitoto
    
    I saw this first hand in a jury trial I was on the panel for. Feral scum ended up living in a car exactly as duggledog listed.
    
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    October 2, 2016 11:17am
  - Liberty
    
    What diatribe?
    It was good factual post.
    
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    October 2, 2016 11:19am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Are you allowed to do morris dancing in a state house?
    
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    October 2, 2016 12:06pm
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      Yes, but why would you; the clashing of the sticks, the tinkling of the bells, the ‘uniform’ . . .
      
      You probably need to get out more; just saying . .
      
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      October 2, 2016 12:35pm
- Icarus
  
  National have done nothing to address the feral problem. I am okay with social housing and benefits. But not as a lifestyle choice.
  
  This is not a complex problem. We need to stop paying women to have kids. It really is that simple. That will fundamentally change this countries underclass and bring massive positive effects in diverse areas of society.
  
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  October 2, 2016 11:07am
  - Viking2
    
    Nope, won’t change a thing. Women will still have kids. The ones who have multiple kids like the ones you are talking about will continue because that’s what they do, money or no money.
    They are basically uneducated or are of such a religious persuasion that doesn’t encourage contraception or they simply like having kids.
    Early education is the answer. Leaving the kids hungry doesn’t work and no politician will try that these days.
    
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    October 2, 2016 12:07pm
Manolo

MSG is the culprit:
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20160930-why-we-crave-cheese-bacon-and-ketchup
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October 2, 2016 10:38am
Manolo

The Russians laughed when the clown John Kerry said he is “concerned”:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/10/01/john-kerry-suggests-syrian-elections-include-assad-as-hospitals/
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October 2, 2016 10:42am
- Icarus
  
  Clearly Kerry is more of a Sunni supporter, just like ISIS.
  
  Maybe Assad and the evil Russians would do better if they bombed the US backed “moderate” Jihadists, instead of exclusively targeting little cute kids.
  
  Based on the msm reports, Syria must have an incredible number of “children’s hospitals”. They tell us Assad has been bombing them for years.
  
  Because that is what you do when your country is attacked by maniacs out to kill you. You bomb kiddies.
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:53am
- stephieboy
  
  Manolo ,
  I can assure you barrel and “double tap” ( in which bombing strikes are immediately followed by another strike as the dead and wounded are cleared ) is no laughing matter .
  
  http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-37528260
  
  But snigger and giggle as much as you like so becoming of a Trumpist .
  
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  October 2, 2016 11:01am
  - Andrei
    
    That’s all just propaganda Stephiebot – to demonize Syria and Russia
    
    In the real world Syria is reestablishing control over its own territory and the evil bastards who armed the terrorists are upset that their diabolical plan has been disrupted
    
    East Aleppo is in the hands of Al Nusra i.e. Al Qaeda who in theory are our enemies but become moderate rebels when they are set loose on sovereign nations that the powers thet be would see destroyed
    
    You can support baby raping, liver eating, head lopping barbarians against the legal authorities of Aleppo if you want – it shows who you are and what you stand for but I stand for law and order and justice not terrorism
    
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    October 2, 2016 2:02pm
- Paulus
  
  Putin is playing with Obama as it suits him to continue to destabilise the USA prior to the election of the weak Clinton.
  He must be laughing, as he will not take any notice of any protestations.
  
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  October 2, 2016 1:18pm
duggledog

Icarus:

“The public service is quietly being gutted, with front line services suffering the most.”

You could actually rewrite that to say ‘the public service is being trimmed back to what it was before Helen Clark’

Remember she ballooned the PS to hide unemployment and also to reward the Wellington luvvies. You could not rent office space for love nor money in Wellington at the time. Bob Jones loved her for it.

May I remind you RNZ had its funding frozen years ago, but guess what? They are now far more popular than they were at that time.

So not all bad news.

Essentially though what we’re looking at is Key’s famous ‘incremental radicalism’ – so far it’s working, and nobody’s really noticed.

Now, whether he can get the whole thing complete by November is the big question. If Trump becomes POTUS and the wheels fall off the NZ PONZI scheme next year Labour and the Greens will piss in
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October 2, 2016 10:48am
- Icarus
  
  I would have said that if it were true, but its not.
  
  The public service is not being trimmed back in terms of cost, only in terms of service to the public. Lots of dollars for consultants and the high paid people Key likes to impress.
  
  Key is a con artist. I vote for him and likely will again. He is not all bad, but not all good either.
  
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  October 2, 2016 10:56am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  You posted this once before; is that the argument, rinse and repeat?
  
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  October 2, 2016 12:40pm
Don the Kiwi

This is very accurate, even if somewhat insufficient.

1. Clinton is a transparent crook who throughout her adult life has monetized her political power to enhance her personal wealth.
2. Clinton in her use of a personal e-mail server demonstrated that she has no concept of security and was willing to jeopardize this nation in order to hide her shady activities from public view.
3. She is a leftist and will implement policies anathema to a large segment of the population.
4.Her proposed economic policies will be more of the same, continuing the economic stagnation of the past eight years.
5. She has demonstrated complete contempt for law and has used her political power to avoid prosecution in situations where lesser mortals would have found themselves facing felony charges.
6.Her lying to the families of the Benghazi dead, literally over the bodies of their loved ones.
7.Her decades long role in protecting her predator husband whose crimes include rape.
8. Her backing of the Iran deal which ensures that Iran will soon have nuclear weapons.
9. Her constant lying about matters great and small.
10.She is obviously suffering from serious illness and she will not be honest with the American people about it.
11. She has complete contempt for the Constitution, in particular the First Amendment.

Feel free to add to the list – there are plenty of options.
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October 2, 2016 11:07am
- Icarus
  
  Hillary is NOT a leftist.
  
  She serves:
  
  1. Herself.
  
  2. Her paymasters.
  
  She uses the poor to harvest votes in the same cruel and cynical way Obama has. Under the Obama regime blacks have fallen further behind and are rioting and killing people all over America as I write.
  
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  October 2, 2016 11:12am
  - holysheet
    
    you get what you wish for. The blacks voted for their messiah in droves, look what that resulted in. More civil unrest, more violence, mostly black against black than at any time in the past.
    
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    October 2, 2016 1:06pm
    - Icarus
      
      Yeah just like Klarkula was going to fix things with Maori, and instead created NZ’s first race based party, because they hated her. She could not even attend ceremonies with Maori out of fear.
      
      The modern left is not about humanism, but about power and control.
      
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      October 2, 2016 1:39pm
  - Rachael Membery
    
    I have an American lecturer at the moment and as an American he could ‘decode’ a lot of dog whistling in those speeches.
    
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    October 2, 2016 11:06pm
- tom hunter
  
  If only Hillary had a GOP opponent who could make those arguments articulately – or even inarticulately.
  
  Instead they have a clown who writes Twitter posts at 3 in the morning about twenty year old fights with a beauty queen.
  
  Moronic lack of impulse control does not even begin to cover it.
  
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  October 2, 2016 11:26am
- stephieboy
  
  Don the Kiwi , you need to be challenged on some of those propaganda points raised . A few will suffice for the moment .
  
  Is it” leftist” to want affordable health care for all such as we enjoy here or in say Canada ?
  
  Successive investigations have cleared her of any wrongdoing over Benghazi including Ambassador Steven’s family .They did not blame her for the death of their father /husband .
  
  The Iran deal does not guarantees that Iran will have Nuclear weapons and recall that Russia was also a signatory to the deal . Is Trump condemning Putin for that ?
  
  Contempt for the 1st amendment ? In what way exactly ?
  
  Allegations of rape have been made aginst her husband but none have seen the light of a police or public prosecution .Why ?
  
  Is one the lowest unemployment rate of 4.9% one post-war US history an example of economic stagnation ? How will Trump make it even lower ?
  
  An FBI investigation cleared of any wrongdoing over those emails and yes she admitted it was a mistake to delete the 30,000 etc . Again has Trump ever admitted to making a mistake ?
  
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  October 2, 2016 11:28am
  - Don the Kiwi
    
    stephie – just for you, seeing you are blinkered, and apparently incapable of fact checking for yourself.
    Yes.
    False
    False
    Denying free speech etc. – you check
    Clinton corruption
    Lowest workforce participation rate – 50 million on food stamps etc etc. – you check.
    False.
    
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    October 2, 2016 11:44am
    - stephieboy
      
      Don the Kiwi,
      
      Yes ? I can take it that it is Ok for New Zealanders to be denied access to affordable health care including traumatic disease and injury care ?
      
      False ? Where did e.g the bipartisan intelligence committees in both houses find wrongdoing on her part ? Did not Gwen Stevens family also say they felt she was not responsible for his death ?
      
      False ? Russia is not a signatory to the Nuclear deal ?
      
      Denying freedom of speech ? Examples ?
      
      Clinton corruption ? Bill Clinton indicted and tried on rape charges ?
      
      Lowest workforce etc ? You made the claim and like the alledged denial of free speech, the onus is surely on you to provide the evidence.
      
      False , Thus Comey did not clear her of criminally indictable wrong doing ?
      
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      October 2, 2016 12:28pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    Mistake, it was criminal, and so was the fact that the decision to delete (and wipe !) most of them was taken and carried out AFTER a subpoena from Congress. And the testimony before a federal judge that all emails had been turned over – perjury.
    
    Tell me, what crime does Hillary have to commit to actually be treated as a lawbreaker instead of being given a free pass ? “It was a mistake, I’ll admit, to point that gun at him officer, but I didn’t think it would go off like that, can I go now…”
    
    And how many times to do we have to point out to you that if you measure unemployment only by those unemployed for less than a year, 8 years into a long recession you will see low “unemployment”. Why does the participation rate in employment, now at a 30 year low, not matter to you ?
    
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    October 3, 2016 10:15am
Icarus

Ways to stop producing carbon dioxide

Stop breathing – When you exhale you release carbon dioxide

Dont drive – We all know how bad driving is

Don’t live in a house/apartment/condo or any building that uses gas or electricity – Homes produce 2-3 times as much carbon as cars.

Don’t wear shoes or any sort of clothing produced in a factory. Grow a cotton field and make your own clothes by hand.

Quit school – Those school buildings produce more carbon in a year then you do in 20 years.

Eat meat raw – Whether you’re using gas or electric both produce carbon dioxide.

Turn off this monitor and computer – You hypocrite.

Don’t use toilets, urinate or poo in your back yard.- The water to your house is cleaned and sent to your house using pumps that use electricity.

Stop exercising – Increasing your heart rate increases the amount of oxygen you take in and turn into carbon dioxide.

Die – Dying younger means you will do all of the above less. Living one year less means you will save the earth 8.4 tons of carbon dioxide every year you’re not here!

http://www.globalwarminglies.com/
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October 2, 2016 11:39am
- mandk
  
  Crikey!
  
  I think I’ve just read the Greens’ manifesto.
  
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  October 2, 2016 12:05pm
  - Icarus
    
    You nailed it. This is a political issue, not a science issue.
    
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    October 2, 2016 12:35pm
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Almost; it differs insofar as it was more interesting and readable than just about any gween pronouncement.
    
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    October 2, 2016 12:43pm
- GoVege
  
  Stop eating meat especially beef and reduce your intake of milk.
  Took a drive in the country yesterday and the smell of cow manure was unbearable.
  No doubt it’s worse in all those factory-farmed piggies and chicken barns.
  Plus growing plants and trees reduces carbon dioxide.
  Avos, oranges, nuts….yummy!!
  
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  October 2, 2016 3:46pm
  - Icarus
    
    Plant based diets, particularly grains, are killing millions. New research has revealed the lie of high carb, low fat diets.
    
    In nature most plants are toxic and most animals are safe to eat. You would starve to death in a forest full of animals.
    
    Not eating animals does not make you more; moral, caring, ethical, enlightened, healthy, pure, good, or “aware”. It just makes you sickly and smug.
    
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    October 2, 2016 4:10pm
    - GoVege
      
      What nonsense, lcarus!
      A few years ago Time magazine ( a right-wing rag according to some Lefties I have spoken with) listed the top 10 healthiest foods in the world.
      9 were plants, the 10th (and only animal food) was salmon.
      This is about saving the planet and our own species, not “smugness” etc.
      I admit it’s extremely hard to change your diet, but at least try to eat more fish, it’s better for you.
      
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      October 2, 2016 5:14pm
Manolo

Anything goes:
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/09/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-supporters-audio-leak-228997
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October 2, 2016 1:39pm
- Icarus
  
  The Hillarites won’t like that. She mocks Northern European countries with the best social outcomes in the world and confesses to be right of center. No fan of free anything for the poor.
  
  Trump is far more of a humanist.
  
  Big difference between what she says to wealthy donors and what she says to the sheeple.
  
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  October 2, 2016 1:52pm
MH

the latest rumour coming from esteemed lecturer Steve the Elers based at his alma martyr, Masa Cow University, is that Michael Joseph Savage got his surname because he ate one.
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October 2, 2016 2:05pm
tom hunter

Loved these comments on Trump from Jonah Goldberg.

When he took on Jeb Bush, Reince Priebus, the media, Washington, etc., he was punching up. He wasn’t just the outsider coming into town to blow things up, he was Godzilla smashing all before him. In the standard Godzilla movie there’s always that scene where the hapless Japanese army tries to lure the beast toward some electric power lines. Godzilla takes the bait and bites the power lines. But the shock doesn’t kill him, it makes him stronger! That was Trump in the primaries.

But here’s the problem: Everyone thinks Godzilla is cool when he’s fighting Monster Zero or swatting away fighter jets. But when they have that close up shot of Godzilla’s clawed foot coming down on a child or a screaming woman, all of a sudden, you can’t cheer the King of Monsters. So it is with Trump: He wins when he punches up. He loses when he punches down.

And that’s Trump’s Achilles’ heel: He can’t resist punching down. He can no more stop himself from “counter-punching” the little guy than my dog can agree not to chase rabbits. (“It’s just so hoppy! I must kill it!”)

Everyone knows this. Hillary Clinton knew it and she baited him. She almost literally could have said, “Donald, I’m going to bait you. You would be a fool to take the bait. But I know you will.” And he still would take the bait. In fact, I think he would be more likely to take the bait if she said she were baiting him, because he would want to prove that he could take the bait and win.

Giant Orange Fucktard.

I thought the following was a pretty good description of what’s happened since the first debate…

But then, Hillary implemented “Bait Trump Protocol Alpha-1,” when she brought up how he got his start with a $14 million loan from his father. (She got the details wrong, but it doesn’t matter. When you’re baiting fish or Trumpzilla, the lure doesn’t have to be real, it just has to be shiny. In fact, getting the bait just slightly wrong makes it even more irresistible, because we all have a natural instinct to correct falsehoods aimed at us, and Trump more than most.)

So Trump bit the shiny thing, and for the rest of the night, plodding, dull Hillary Clinton led Trump around the stage like a matador with a red cape.

Pretty good metaphor for where he is now. No wonder the Trumpitistas have been so quiet of late.

The following is as true of Trump now as it was a year ago:

If Trump could stay on message, if he could be a disciplined candidate, I think he’d be ten points ahead by now. But realistically, this is no different from saying if he could control anything metal with his mind, he would be Magneto.
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October 2, 2016 2:35pm
Manolo

Hungary goes to the polls:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/oct/01/hungarian-referendum-slam-door-migrants-new-era-europe

Hungarians head to the polls on Sunday for a referendum on immigration that ministers have portrayed as a make-or-break moment for the Hungarian nation, and a watershed for Europe as a whole.
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October 2, 2016 2:41pm
Don the Kiwi

So much for the likes of Stephen Boyle et al. who bag Trump over his treatment of women, because they are in love with Hillary.
Here are some real women who support Trump with REAL stories:
http://video.foxnews.com/v/5150309827001/women-who-know-trump-defend-the-gop-candidates-character/?#sp=show-clips
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October 2, 2016 2:47pm
- tom hunter
  
  That’s excellent news, Don. The Donald, his surrogates and all his supporters should argue that from now until Nov 8.
  
  Politics 101. FFS.
  
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  October 2, 2016 2:51pm
Icarus

Well this should get the Russian hating swivel eyed loons baying at the moon. Obama’s propaganda machine has worked wonders on the intellectually corrupt and morally crippled.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/home-property/84872148/russian-billionaires-helena-bay-resort-is-now-taking-bookings
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October 2, 2016 2:58pm
- Reid
  
  The idiots probably don’t even know Abramov lives in London because Putin booted him out. The idiots probably don’t even know what happened in Russia in the 90’s, re: the Western-financed oligarchs stealing Russian resources. Which is why Putin imprisoned Khordokovsky and so many oligarchs now live in London. Fuck sheeple are dumb.
  
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  October 2, 2016 3:25pm
  - Icarus
    
    They don’t think Reid. They let the media tell them how to react. There is no thought process going on, just crude emotion.
    
    That is why they can not explain their position and only have personal abuse and cries of “troll” when you try and engage with them.
    
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    October 2, 2016 4:39pm
    - Reid
      
      No evidently not. The interesting thing is, they know the MSM lies, but they still wait for it to tell them what to think, like about Russia, terrorists, Syria, Libya, Europe, etc etc etc and notwithstanding they know it lies, they still nevertheless swallow it hook, line and sinker.
      
      The only time they recognise the lies as lies is when it doesn’t conflict with their chosen political persuasion, such as where they see Killary for who she is.
      
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      October 2, 2016 5:03pm
Don the Kiwi

More evidence of Democrat debate moderator, Lester Holt showing anti Trump prejudice and lying during the first debate:

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/10/lester_holt_says_stop_and_frisk_is_unconstitutional_but_its_not.html
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October 2, 2016 3:17pm
Manolo

Isn’t Islam terribly primitive?
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/09/30/middleeast/chess-iran-women-hijab-row/

Some of the world’s top female chess players are upset that the next world championship will be held in Iran, where players are expected to wear head scarves.
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October 2, 2016 4:29pm
Don the Kiwi

Good result for Joe Parker last night. 🙂
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October 2, 2016 5:15pm
Reid

Trump Demands That Obama Not Pardon Hillary! This Video is Explosive! Best 15 min Of Trump To Date!

Trump just elevated the intensity of the campaign to a new level. He gives specific information about donations to the Clinton Foundation and who the donors are. He is pushing the “C Word”, Clinton and Corruption! He directly demands that Obama not give a pardon to Hillary or the 5 people that got immunity. It almost seems like Trump knows Hillary is about to be indicted and wants to warn Obama. At the 5:00 min mark he explodes. New accusations he has never said before today in a campaign speech.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXDxB9AORV4
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October 2, 2016 5:39pm
- wiseowl
  
  Makes one think about parallels with another country.
  
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  October 2, 2016 7:18pm
Chuck Bird

On TV1 8:30 – 10:30

Doubt: The Scott Watson Case
Premiere: In the early hours of New Year’s Day Olivia Hope and Ben Smart boarded a yacht. They were never seen again. Doubt re-examines the case from a fresh perspective.What if Watson didn’t do it?
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October 2, 2016 5:44pm
- Andrei
  
  We’ve done David Bain to death now introducing SCOTT WATSON
  
  And when SCOTT WATSON has been through the mill we have the next one on the horizon the STOP GO KILLER
  
  It’s a New Zealand industry – a way for hack writers to make a living
  
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  October 2, 2016 5:55pm
- Longknives
  
  How is there any freaking doubt at all in the Sounds Murders? DNA doesn’t lie…Watson is a fucking Psycho (this is well documented)
  
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  October 2, 2016 7:08pm
  - Chuck Bird
    
    I agree with you Longknives. I am not sure why I got the down ticks for just letting people know about a possibly interesting “doco”.
    
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    October 2, 2016 8:08pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    Longknives, sorry but accidentally pressed report, moderator’s please ignore.
    
    However, the reply to the DNA doesn’t lie is why wasn’t the hair found the first time the blanket was searched. And why was it found only AFTER a sample of the hair was sent to the lab. Cross contamination is a real possibility; forensic crime work is riddled with such errors.
    
    I’m not one of the “Watson is innocent” campaigners, but to me there are real issues with the case. Not just the dodgy hair sample, but the whole Ketch incident bothers me. The Water taxi driver is adamant that the yacht boarded by the missing pair was a ketch, Watson’s boat was a sloop totally unlike a ketch. Witnesses can be mistaken especially late at night, but the driver is perhaps the one person who was almost certainly completely sober. I’d still like to see an answer to why the police never even looked for a ketch when information was provided on one.
    
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    October 3, 2016 10:23am
Viking2

Bulgaria bans the burka – with offenders LOSING their benefits

Bulgaria’s parliament banned the wearing of face veils on Friday in a bid to boost security in the wake of Islamist militant attacks in Europe.

The new “burqa ban” law, which had been driven by the nationalist Patriotic Front coalition, comes after France, the Netherlands and Belgium banned the wearing of burqas or niqabs in public.
The ban will not only apply to Bulgarian citizens but also to anyone temporarily in the country.

The new law states that clothing that conceals the face may not be worn in the institutions of Bulgaria’s central and local administrations, schools, cultural institutions, and places of public recreation, sports and communications.

http://britishfreepress.com/world-news/bulgaria-bans-the-burka-with-offenders-losing-their-benefits

Now that’s more like it.
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October 2, 2016 6:16pm
cha

Short fingers could be the least of his worries.
/

The shocking diagnosis that kept Donald Trump out of the military. Remember that odd Dr. Oz reaction about his testosterone level? #XYY pic.twitter.com/ZQcNCYp7zX— Terra Firma (@SDzzz) October 2, 2016

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CtumjKUVMAAogQw.jpg
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October 2, 2016 6:39pm
- Andrei
  
  Seems highly unlikely cha given such individuals noted for low sex drive and are usually sterile
  
  Whereas D. Trump is noted for his glamorous women and good looking children
  
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  October 2, 2016 7:16pm
  - Griff
    
    So either.
    He lied about his condition to dodge the draft.
    Or they are not his kids .
    Popcorn time …..
    Gorgeous woman had nothing to do with .
    He pays for them and trades in for a more modern model now and again .
    
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    October 2, 2016 7:22pm
    - Andrei
      
      He got college deferments, so did Bill Clinton who was born the same year and so did George W Bush who was also born in the same year
      
      The last US President to serve in the military was George H W Bush though George W was in the National guard
      
      Obama spent his youth toking on joints and in Hillary Clinton’s parallel universe she was rejected by the US Marine Corps because of sexism
      
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      October 2, 2016 7:33pm
      - Griff
        
        Here in the ofical record 1972 Trump was 4f unfit for service 1972 and notes yxx .
        https://static01.nyt.com/images/2016/08/02/us/politics/02trumpvietnam-record/02trumpvietnam-record-superJumbo.jpg
        
        Still we can all be KGB….. eh .
        
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        October 2, 2016 7:48pm
      - Andrei
        
        That almost proves that it isn’t what it is claimed Griff
        
        The condition is written xxy not yxx and on that page in that column there are other yxx’s as well as yx- and zyx
        
        What do these letters mean – who knows but not what is claimed I’d suggest
        
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        October 2, 2016 7:58pm
  - cha
    
    Indeed Andrei, but combined with the recent income tax revelations his ego will be taking a hammering.
    
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    October 2, 2016 7:30pm
    - nasska
      
      Good grief! Obama can slide into the presidency without ado or questions answered yet Trump is being asked for a taddy test.
      
      Talk about different standards for the right vs the left.
      
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      October 2, 2016 8:09pm
      - stephieboy
        
        At least the President declared his income and taxes and there is no reason why Trump can’t do the same .Why a different standard there ?
        
        http://time.com/4326267/donald-trump-presidential-tax-returns-list/
        
        Regarding Trump’s draft dodging ? It was in the context of his criticism of John Mc Cain war service record that included time as a POW which Trump mocked.
        
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        October 3, 2016 10:35am
- Andrei
  
  Found xyz they are codes that represent an individuals capacity for service
  
  In order they are physical, mental and administrative abilities
  
  X means suitable
  Y means suitable only in time of war (ie declared war national emergency)
  Z unsuitable
  
  So physically D Trump was deemed suitable only if necessary in emergency situations ie major war declared
  
  Another ftttt
  
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  October 2, 2016 8:13pm
  - cha
    
    Of course it’s a wind up but wtf, right now remote diagnosis of aspiring candidates is a popular pastime.
    
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    October 2, 2016 8:18pm
    - nasska
      
      Yes….but it would be interesting to see how previous presidents would have responded to a request for a sperm sample. Reagan was so old that a wank would have produced dust, Bush 1 & 2 would have had to consult God to see if He would grant dispensation for seminal fluid wastage & Bill Clinton would have told Monica to spit into the jar. 🙂
      
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      October 2, 2016 8:31pm
Jack5

I hadn’t noticed any reports of this before: systems for monitoring those on detention doesn’t work over the new fibre network.

I understand some other alarm systems, such as those for invalids, don’t work on it either.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/84847217/fibre-causes-sentencing-hiccup
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October 2, 2016 8:03pm
- Rachael Membery
  
  Plus the receiving unit has a battery in case of powercut, not that they are closely monitored. Anecdotally couldn’t you take the unit for a walk and plug it in elsewhere?
  
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  October 2, 2016 11:20pm
Nostradamus

Tauranga house goes to online auction with $1 reserve

Ray White real estate agent Rodney Fong said the $1 reserve was to generate strong interest in the house.

The strategy was to generate more interest and therefore more bidders. The more bidders, the more competition which would potentially fetch a higher price for the home, Mr Fong said. Mr Fong said the vendors were on board with the tactic despite the obvious risk of the house selling for a price that did not meet their expectations.

“They said let’s give it a crack, bring it on.”

Of course, unlike the vendors, Mr Fong has nothing to lose from the words “potentially” and “obvious risk”.
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October 2, 2016 9:12pm
sooty

Scott Watson case on tv. Stiched up! How do you you stop watching for a ketch! Another Aruther Alan Thomas me thinks!
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October 2, 2016 9:32pm
Left Right and Centre

Steve Hansen . . .
‘learnings’
These are our ‘learnings’ from the Argentina game (or something)
In the monodrone voice – wow – makes it sound even more intelligent.
I wonder – if he wasn’t a sports coach – what would this fella be doing in life ?
*looking some shit up later*
Copper. Okay . . .
One point at home 2011.
Two points semi-final 2015.
What are the ‘learnings’ from that mate ?
Three points in 2019 ?
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October 3, 2016 4:59am
Left Right and Centre

Another day, another feral . . .
On the cellphone talking with someone close to them, trying to work out why the ATM card won’t work . . .

Pet hates . . . dickheads that stand waiting at self-checkout finished while the other dickhead goes off and *does more farking shopping*. Ooo – forgot to get ice cream – I’ll be back whenever. Me me me me me me me me me me me

But then another time – I needed the code for ‘chocolate chunks’ – so I *ran* to get it. (Same normal price as pick n mix – but that was on special, so couldn’t do that – not on their screen menu either – and not on supervisor A4 page list. Sure – I know it now – 11079 – fuck it).

Fags, booze, lotto and junk food, fags, booze, lotto and junk food, fags, booze, lotto and junk food . . .
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October 3, 2016 5:12am
Rachael Membery

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11720158
Another discharge without conviction!!! Should be deported too.
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October 3, 2016 6:42am
Manolo

Never short of morons, do-gooders and useful idiots:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3818038/Police-Calais-use-tear-gas-water-cannons-violent-clashes-BRITISH-protesters-travelled-Jungle-oppose-migrant-camp-s-closure.html
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October 3, 2016 6:54am
- Morrissey
  
  I feel your pain, Manolo. You feel the same outrage that people like you felt against the “morons, do-gooders and useful idiots”, AKA the Freedom Riders, in the early 1960s….
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1EDOL9II0s
  
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  October 3, 2016 8:21pm
  - labrator
    
    Your inability to differentiate between civil rights and open borders must make all sorts of distinctions difficult for you.
    
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    October 3, 2016 9:01pm

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