General Debate 1 October 2016

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duggledog

Re Brash’s pressure group called ‘Hobson’s Pledge’. As usual, we have had a completely superficial analysis of the organisation’s real aim.

Barely discussed was his assertion that the gravy train & special privilege: ‘…is engendering a great deal of ill will on the part of non Maori’

That’s what he’s really driving at – the essential problem that will not become apparent to a large number of Maori until they become a much smaller percentage of the newly enlarged, alien-augmented society we are growing at a phenomenal rate.

In other words, today 12% of 4.5 million, in 2050, 6% of 9 million

Those numbers are precisely why Turia encourages Maori women to breed as fast as they can, because she knows once you get below a certain % of the population, the largesse from others (who may not have had favourable experiences with, or attitudes towards Maori over the years) become so much harder to extract.

I’d say 5% would be the event horizon and after this the decline would become irreversible.

Ordinary Maori, (not those who rely on their bloodline to get paid such as Willie Jackson, Mihi Forbes and so many more), should take a cold, hard, dispassionate look at the future for their children and strongly support Don Brash’s pressure group.

I suspect they won’t.

I’d also like Brash to articulate to Maori that as a people, they have tens of billions of assets, and if someone is struggling, to find their tribe, and start agitating for a share.

I suspect he won’t.
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October 1, 2016 8:03am
- Chuck Bird
  
  In other words, today 12% of 4.5 million, in 2050, 6% of 9 million
  
  Your figures are not accurate. The percent of people with some Maori ancestry will not drop to 6% in 34 years.
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:13am
  - Paulus
    
    Please – what is a Maori ?
    As I understand it anybody who thinks he or she is a Maori can call themselves a Maori and get special treatment.
    Look at University Entrance where it is believed that some people get preferential entrance despite not having to achieve academic results of the others.
    Apartheid ?
    
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    October 1, 2016 8:33am
    - kowtow
      
      Second year law at Otago. Can use race to override not making the cut. Fact.
      
      “Candidates considered for standard entry shall be selected on the basis of their academic record, with particular emphasis placed on the marks obtained in the 100-level Law paper (LAWS 101). However, the Committee may admit a candidate whose academic record would not otherwise qualify him or her for admission if it is satisfied that the candidate’s academic results do not reflect his or her true ability.
      Candidates for alternative entry
      shall be considered by virtue of their Māori descent;”
      
      http://www.otago.ac.nz/courses/qualifications/llb.html
      
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      October 1, 2016 9:01am
      - Odakyu-sen
        
        There’s your problem: “Māori descent”
        
        This can range from <1/32nd to 1/2. I also suspect that gene expression plans an important part, with the selectors favoring the "browner-looking" candidate.
        
        Gene expression can be a little random.
        
        I wonder what an inspection panel would do if they had to choose between two "Māori descent" candidates where the first one is very "Maori-looking" but is only 1/16th Maori, but the second candidate has a fair complexion, a Scottish surname, but is documented as having a Maori great-grandfather.
        
        Discussion?
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:11am
      - Dave Mann
        
        My God… its as OPEN as that??? We’re in real trouble.
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:32am
      - peterwn
        
        The issue here is there needs to be reasonable ethnic diversity which reflects population makeup in human interaction professions such as law and health sciences. Also there is a need for professionals in the Pacific Islands where the Island communities are too small to support such tertiary courses. Similarly ‘small town’ applicants are given some preference for medicine on the basis that most will practice or work for hospitals in smaller communities when qualified. Although this may seem racist or discriminatory, it is probably the only realistic method of getting a reasonable diversity of graduates in these important professions.
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:38am
      - Zed
        
        must be fair though because bleedinghearts are not shouting “Racism” oh wait; institutionalised racism exist ONLY when laws disadvantage non-whites
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:49am
      - Kimbo
        
        @ Odakyu-sen
        
        There’s your problem: “Māori descent”…
        
        I wonder what an inspection panel would do if they had to choose between two “Māori descent” candidates where the first one is very “Maori-looking” but is only 1/16th Maori, but the second candidate has a fair complexion, a Scottish surname, but is documented as having a Maori great-grandfather.
        
        Discussion?
        
        You are imposing a non-Maori set of values on the matter. As the resident “expert” on matters Japanese, you are no doubt familiar with how easy it is for “outsiders” to do that on a culture they are viewing through their own lenses…and misunderstand, and then extrapolate incorrectly.
        
        From a Maori perspective there are no “genetic percentages”. If you have Maori whakapapa/genealogy, or more particularly ancestors from a particular iwi, you are 100% Maori, and 100% of that iwi, no matter what other ancestry you share – be it from another iwi, or non-Maori. End of discussion.
        
        And yes, judging by those who get selected for the NZ Maori rugby team, at times the blonde and blue eyed members of the Ngati-Scottish are included – based on the fact they are the most suitable candidate, but also have Maori iwi whakapapa. 😉
        
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        October 1, 2016 11:20am
      - Chuck Bird
        
        Odakyu-sen, You can get two siblings both 1/4 Maori where one is obviously Maori and the other has blond hair and blue eyes.
        
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        October 1, 2016 1:06pm
    - RF
      
      Another example that I am aware of was a Maori entrant into the NZ Police College some years ago that was nursed through the course and graduated in spite of failing a large number of tests / assignments.
      
      You hear of Medical students aso receiving special treatment because of race.
      
      Sadly all this does is reduce Maori to second class citizens. Nothing to be proud of.
      
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      October 1, 2016 9:24am
      - Sideoiler
        
        Another example that I am aware of was a Maori entrant into the NZ Police College some years ago
        
        Clint Rickard ring any bells?
        
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        October 1, 2016 12:43pm
    - DifferentPerspective
      
      And preferential marking if they write in the made up Te Reo (so useful when forging trade relations with China).
      
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      October 1, 2016 10:09am
      - sooty
        
        There are no maori in nz. But there is alot of part maori in nz.
        
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        October 1, 2016 11:41am
      - eandlbufe
        
        Or in Parliament where an interrupter is needed and the person reading it hasn’t a foggy what they have just read.
        
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        October 1, 2016 4:06pm
Captain Mainwaring

Electric car makers are exploiting child labour. Who would have thunk it?

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2016/09/electric-vehicles-loved-environmentalists-child-slavery/

Wonder what the ‘squeaky-clean’ Greenies have got to say about it.
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October 1, 2016 8:07am
- Griff
  
  Typing that on a portable device ?
  Most of us use one.
  gee they use the same technology for power storage.
  What have you got to say about supporting child labor then?
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:10am
  - stephen2d
    
    Difference is, he is not rubbing your nose in it and not a hypocrite happily using it while hiding, like your green slime lot.
    
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    October 1, 2016 8:32am
    - Griff
      
      Oh dear the green slime lot.
      Sorry I have never meet a green slime.
      Does it live under your bed and come out on dark nights when mummy is asleep?
      Personally I use a laptop.
      However as its plugged in I have removed the battery pack as lithium batteries dont like to be 100% charged all the time it kills them…..
      
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      October 1, 2016 8:38am
      - G152
        
        No. It usually posts here under your ‘name’ causing slight amusement
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:19am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    No, a PC. But so what? I’m not being a hypocrite by pretending I’m saving the world and using child labour in my products.
    
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    October 1, 2016 8:45am
  - DifferentPerspective
    
    Exactly, to criticise one industry for supporting child labour is (lol) infantile.
    
    Typical of the single-issue virtue-signalling that passes for ‘do-gooding’.
    
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    October 1, 2016 10:10am
Hajji

Thought for today:

(_:_)
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October 1, 2016 8:10am
- stephen2d
  
  8==D
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:32am
- B.L.Zeebub
  
  Ah, a picture of Allahs speaking orifice.
  You`re going straight to hell for that one Hajji,do not collect your virgins.
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:44am
- Don the Kiwi
  
  Hajji.
  Is that the Arabic writing for bi-sexual, or transgender? 😉
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:27am
Tauhei Notts

I cannot comment on the Whaleoil site, so will comment here. That site has a wonderfully written piece about the Losi Filipo case that puts a different slant on it. The alleged assault occurred in an area swimming in closed circuit television cameras. The cameras must have caught the assault on screen. But the footage of the CCTV systems was suppressed upon application made by a lawyer. But the lawyer who sought suppression was the legal representative of one of the victims.
That has put my bullshit detectors on high alert.
There seems to be a vision of the main stream media to bring alarm to the populace, with a very one sided view of things. After the truth comes out the story disappears from sight. What nefarious purpose does our msm have in mind?
It’s a bit of a worry.
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October 1, 2016 8:10am
- G152
  
  So the photographs of the bruises and other damage are not evidence of an assault by a couple of thugs ?
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:26am
- Mr_Blobby
  
  Same here banned from Whaleshit, without any explanation.
  
  Offending comment
  
  “makes no difference keep up the good work uncle phil is going to romp in.”
  
  I would seriously like to know what is so bad about that comment.
  
  Reply from Blubberboy “not my problem”
  
  The truth has been massaged for the story.
  
  But assault is still assault.
  
  Celebrities should be role models and held to a higher standard not a lesser standard.
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:40am
  - DifferentPerspective
    
    “Celebrities should be role models and held to a higher, not lesser standard”
    
    Exactly! And why Hillary should be in jail for how appallingly unprofessional she was at handling secret documents.
    
    Similarly, why Hillary should be laughed off the campaign trail for a lifetime of enabling her serial sexual abuser and predator husband.
    
    And why I’m still bemused that David Bowie is still a saint when he also predated on underage girls the same way as the rest of the statutory-raping pop scene did like Gary Glitter etc?
    
    Why are some (more left-leaning) celebrities given a free pass when others aren’t? Why is Trump so heavily fact-checked when Hillary lies all the time?
    
    BTW thank you for going into an unhinged state at the mention of WOBH and starting the name-calling. The name-calling of socialism is what is killing the movement and you just did your bit to keep National in power for another three years. (“Whaleshit” and “Blubberboy” – I thought body shaming was only something that ultra-right wing nazi fascists did so that liberal, progressive, kinder types could viciously attack them about?)
    
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    October 1, 2016 10:19am
  - Paulus
    
    As also banned for unknown reason from Whaleshit we should form a Club as I know of others similarly inflicted.
    Funny lot there !
    
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    October 1, 2016 1:46pm
- Chuck Bird
  
  Hopefully, the public get more of the facts. Provocation does make a difference. The public have a right to know about this high profile case if there are mitigating factors. There may be some explanation for the judge saying the genesis of is not clear but the photos do not lie. There is no justification for his comment that assault on the women was more in the nature of pushing and shoving of each of them. That is clearly wrong.
  
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  October 1, 2016 1:16pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Provocation has been repealed from the section on self-defence in the Crimes Act.
    
    A person is only justified in using reasonable force to defend him/herself or another person against attack.
    
    http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1961/0043/latest/DLM328267.html
    
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    October 1, 2016 2:17pm
    - Chuck Bird
      
      It might not be a defense but surely it could be a factor in sentencing.
      
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      October 1, 2016 3:39pm
Viking2

~~ TODAY IN HISTORY ~~ 1 Oct 1986
– GST was introduced 30 years ago today –

GST was introduced by the Fourth Labour Government on 1 Oct 1986 at a rate of 10% on most goods and services. It replaced existing sales taxes for some goods and services. GST was a part of the economic reforms initiated by Labour Finance Minister Roger Douglas dubbed Rogernomics.
Since 1986 it has had two increases. On 1 July 1989 the rate increased to 12.5% and on 1 Oct 2010 it increased again to 15%

* AND as of today the taxation of digital ‘remote’ services supplied by offshore companies (non-NZ) to consumers based in NZ changes. From today onward a GST of 15% (dubbed the ‘Netflix Tax’) will be applied to all supplies from offshore digital service suppliers to New Zealand based consumers
The Government is missing out on $180 million a year by not collecting GST on online purchases, including $40 million from shopping on iTunes, Netflix, Spotify and other online services, so the new tax will affect things like e-books, music and video downloads and streaming services like Netflix

Finance Minister Roger Douglas 24 Oct 1985
https://natlib.govt.nz/records/22403766…
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October 1, 2016 8:16am
- Reid
  
  I wonder how they’re planning on collecting it.
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:30am
- Mr_Blobby
  
  How are they going to TAX the pirates
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:13am
- Southern Raider
  
  Had to update the companies AWS account details this week with our GST number so this is a very broad net they are casting which is good for NZ. It’s only small at the moment but in 10 years could be a massive source of tax revenue
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:24am
duggledog

Chuck

It was just a projection to illustrate a point. Maybe there are undiscovered tribes of Maori in other countries.

Essentially Maori are unable to maintain their current % of the population. New Zealand’s general population is going to increase massively as the rest of the world gets more crowded.

This is clear. What is not clear, is how Maori will fare as a smaller percentage of a much larger population.
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October 1, 2016 8:21am
- Paulus
  
  Very well as they are now – the elite will prosper and the others – well what do you expect from a tribal section of society.
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:34am
- AgentBallSack
  
  Look to the blacks in America. That’s how poor Maori will adapt. Live in slums on welfare, join gangs, kill each other and commit the majority of violent depressing crime and blame whitey.
  
  Oh….
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:57am
Happychappy

i see the union for postal workers thought it was stress for the failure to deliver election pamphlets.Why is it bad employers when the worker has a problem with their employer and stress when voting papers are found in rubbish bins which is a crime.Not a mention of this offence by the Union backed Labour Leader Andrew Little so it looks like they think this is just a minor hick up for NZs
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October 1, 2016 8:32am
minus

Hajji – since one can not tell if (_:_) is your upper torso or Mrs Hajji’s lower posterior abdominal aspect, one does not know what to think
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October 1, 2016 8:34am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Let’s ask the MSM for their opinion, they are always pretty keen to tell us what we are thinking aside from gaffer Garner who constantly asks ‘what do you think’ and then proceeds to belittle or convert any response to the current barrow that he is pushing.
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:00am
Manolo

The UN speaks:
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/09/un-news-agency-scrubs-tweet-calling-on-foreign-citizens-to-end-trump-228934

The United Nations News Centre — the official U.N. news service — tweeted, then quickly pulled, a post that called for “8 million Americans abroad” to “stop Trump.”
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October 1, 2016 8:38am
- Mr_Blobby
  
  We should seriously be looking at a UNEXIT.
  
  I would say we could have a referendum but it would just be ignored by the Politicians.
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:27am
Manolo

Los Angeles Times polls:
http://graphics.latimes.com/usc-presidential-poll-dashboard/
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October 1, 2016 8:41am
- All_on_Red
  
  Love your work Manolo but the LA Times poll isn’t that great. They are experimenting with new methods so I would put too much credence on the accuracy.
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:59am
- Griff
  
  538 poll of polls.
  http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-election-forecast/?ex_cid=rrpromo
  Love the winning trump has done since the debate.
  Look forward to even more winning along the same lines after the next one .
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:10am
  - DifferentPerspective
    
    You can’t be doing that!
    
    You can’t be pointing out that the political classes lied to us by insisting Hillary won the voters hearts and minds at the debate when it was clear she did not.
    
    You can’t show evidence that doesn’t fit with the MSM line.
    
    Just as an example of what you can’t do you can’t post links like this one – showing Trump’s lead extending
    
    That would be bad and inciting ((socialist thought-crime de jour)) .
    
    Oh wait my poll shows exactly the opposite to what your one does – how can that happen??? (oh yes that’s right you can’t believe anything you see in the media re Trump vs Clinton)
    
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    October 1, 2016 10:23am
    - mikenmild
      
      You can rely on one poll, if that makes you feel better, or you can look at the aggregating sites, like 538, which scan hundreds of different polls. Which do you think is more likely to be accurate?
      
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      October 1, 2016 10:25am
      - Griff
        
        According to our Trumpets any poll that places trump ahead is gospel truth any one that places him behind is MSM propaganda,
        Such a simple idea why haven’t you got it yet mike?
        
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        October 1, 2016 10:29am
Reid

Funneling anti-aircraft missiles to guys who idolize Osama bin Laden — another bright idea by the super thoughtful and intelligent American empire-builders that is sure not to ever result in any blowback whatsoever. How long until the first airliner in western Europe is brought down with these same weapons?

The psychopaths running the American deep state are so petulant and narcissistic they would ramp up the terror threat against Americans and Europeans just because they’re angry that Russians are beating their terrorists.

The only people dumb enough to argue against that logic, are the sheeple. And no doubt, when said airliners ARE bought down in Europe, the idiot sheeple will believe the execrable MSM when it tells the fools that it’s Russia’s fault.

http://russia-insider.com/en/us-deep-state-threatens-russia-back-down-or-we-flood-syria-manpads/ri16711
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October 1, 2016 8:42am
- stephieboy
  
  Reid ,
  
  I very much doubt Russia Insider won’t report this kind of thing,
  
  “MH17 missile ‘came from Russia’, Dutch-led investigators say”
  
  International prosecutors say Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was downed over eastern Ukraine in 2014 by a Buk missile that had come from Russia.
  
  They also narrowed down the area it was fired from to a field in territory controlled by Russian-backed rebels.
  
  All 298 people on board the Boeing 777 died when it broke apart in mid-air flying from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur.
  
  Russia says it cannot accept the findings as the final truth, saying no Russian weapons were taken to Ukraine.
  
  “Based on the criminal investigation, we have concluded that flight MH17 was downed by a Buk missile of the series 9M83 that came from the territory of the Russian Federation,” chief Dutch police investigator Wilbert Paulissen told a news conference on Wednesday.
  
  http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-37495067
  
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  October 1, 2016 8:54am
  - Andrei
    
    Is that the bleating of an empty headed sheep I hear?
    
    Baa baa baaaa
    
    Have you got any functioning brain cells Stephiebot or do you just mindlessly accept what you are told?
    
    I think we all know the answer to that
    
    Go back to docilely munching on your grass there’s a good fellow
    
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    October 1, 2016 9:10am
  - Jack5
    
    One question is why were the Malaysians flying airliners over a war zone?
    
    An answer is that they didn’t think the pro-Russia rebels in Ukraine had missiles that could reach the height the airliner would fly. That surely was a gamble.
    
    Are airlines flying over other war zones right now? It would be nice to know.
    
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    October 1, 2016 9:18am
    - G152
      
      There was a Great Circle route that over laid the area with air traffic required to fly at or above a certain altitude.
      And there were many airliners in that area on that day.
      I rather suspect the Russians were trying to knock down a particular aircraft from a particular country and got it wrong.
      Time to ring fence Russia until they start acting like they’re civilised
      
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      October 1, 2016 9:26am
      - Andrei
        
        “Time to ring fence Russia until they start acting like they’re civilised”
        
        Who was it that illegally invaded Iraq in 2003 and left it in chaos and ruins? hmmm
        
        And who was it that conducted a secret bombing campaign for years against the people of Yemen?
        
        And Somalia and Sudan, leaving them all in ruins
        
        And who was it who illegally trashed Libya with a sustained illegal bombing campaign?
        
        And yet you the Russians are uncivilized
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:35am
      - Jack5
        
        G152 – thank you. Sounds like airlines don’t care too much what’s going on below their routes.
        
        Is anyone flying airliners over ISIS-held territory? It would be nice for the travelling public to know.
        
        I guess the safest way to go to Europe from NZ at present is via North America.
        
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        October 1, 2016 1:59pm
    - stephen2d
      
      No, they’re not flying over them anymore, they’ve changed their flight paths since.
      
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      October 1, 2016 3:06pm
  - Icarus
    
    “the evidence is overwhelming that a Russian-made Buk Missile 9M83 was used fired from a Russian BUK launcher downed M17 .”
    
    Yes it is. For sure.
    
    But the Ukrainians use Russian military equipment. Just like ISIS use USA made equipment.
    
    Using your absurd logic, the USA must be ISIS.
    
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    October 1, 2016 10:00am
- Mr_Blobby
  
  Well what do you do when you need to justify your existence.
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:29am
mikenmild

I see Hillary Clinton’s tactic for the next debate will be clear – find another target of Trump’s misogynistic bullying and needle him about it.
Check out his meltdown about former Miss Universe Alicia Machado:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/84859573/donald-trump-continues-attack-on-former-miss-universe-with-sex-tape-allegation
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October 1, 2016 8:58am
- All_on_Red
  
  You’re probably right Mikey. Anything to avoid talking about the issues- where she will lose.
  Although Trump did avoid biting back at her during the debate. It’s going to be good to watch the next one.
  What’s the story with Hilary having what looks like a electronic box taped to her back? Ear piece transmitter – cheating?
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:04am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  Always helps to have the script in advance like Hills did.
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:26am
- Fletch
  
  If that is the only person she has, it not going to do her much good. Trump actually supported the woman after she won her title.
  
  In an excerpt from his book The Art of the Comeback, Rush Limbaugh noted Thursday, Trump recalled the episode:
  
  “First, she wins. Second, she gains fifty pounds. Third, I urged the committee not to fire her. Fourth, I go to the gym with her in a show of support. Final act: She trashes me in the Washington Post — after I stood by her the entire time. What’s wrong with this picture? Anyway, the best part about the evening was the knowledge that next year she would no longer be Miss Universe. What’s maddening is that I supported her.
  
  “Even in Palm Beach, where I haven’t always gotten the greatest press, Shannon Donnelly, society columnist for the Palm Beach Daily News,” known here as the Shiny Sheet, “wrote, ‘Here’s a new one for the Donald: Protector-Advocate for large women. His acquisition from ITT has put Alicia Machado under the Trump Aegis. The Donald, bless his heart, doesn’t want to fire her because “it would be a terrible message to send.” He is instead bringing her to the spa at Mar-a-Lago where she can work out in earnest, eat sensibly and generally decompress.’ That sounds pretty gentlike to me.”
  
  The woman also threatened to kill a judge, drove the getaway car for her boyfriend after he attempted murder, had a drug lord’s baby and posed nude for Playboy.
  
  http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/09/30/fact-check-five-things-to-know-alicia-machado/
  
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  October 1, 2016 1:59pm
  - cha
    
    The woman also threatened to kill a judge, drove the getaway car for her boyfriend after he attempted murder, had a drug lord’s baby and posed nude for Playboy.
    
    Twenty years ago those accusations were investigated and dropped because there was no evidence nor did they prevent her from obtaining US citizenship following character and background checks.
    
    But here’s a pic from Melania’s lesbian porn shoot.
    
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CtnMBp2WcAQ21hC.jpg:large
    
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    October 1, 2016 2:28pm
Happychappy

I wonder whether MSM might have a different narrative of the phrase “Dirty Politics” now that Colin Craig is learning the hard way,through his pocket.I say this as they report this story they are only using in context to what Craig has inferred and this is not how they have used this phrase over the last three years.It will be interesting to see if in the future they place as much em’phasis of avoiding this saying when doing story’s for Nicky Hagar or about Cameron Slater in the forseable future.
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October 1, 2016 9:10am
stephieboy

The Dutch Safety Board and more details on why they concluded the Buk missile of the series 9M83 came from Russia ( it also includes other aspects of their comprehensive investigation and findings that accumulatively point to Russian complicity in the crime )

https://www.onderzoeksraad.nl/en/onderzoek/2049/investigation-crash-mh17-17-july-2014/publicatie/1686/found-buk-missile-parts-in-final-report-dutch-safety-board#fasen
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October 1, 2016 9:14am
- Andrei
  
  Its stupid people such as yourself Stephiebot that allow the criminals who run this world to get away with their crimes
  
  Now why would Russia down a Malaysian plane in Ukraine?
  
  It makes no sense whatsoever
  
  Now if you were trying to provoke a situation that might require an excuse to secure of an area with NATO troops that would make sense to do this – to create a casus belli if you will
  
  I’ll tell you this my friend the Day of Judgement is coming when all will be revealed and true Justice will be administered and doctored reports will serve the real culprits of no avail then
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:23am
  - RF
    
    I understood it was the case of mistaken identity. They thought it was a military transport aircraft.
    
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    October 1, 2016 9:33am
    - Andrei
      
      They thought it was a military transport aircraft.
      
      It was at 10 thousand meters and five minutes away from entering Russian Airspace – they already had it on their air traffic control Radar in Rostov
      
      That dog don’t hunt
      
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      October 1, 2016 9:37am
      - stephieboy
        
        Andrei,
        the only logical conclusion is that similar to the downing of Russian Airline ( Which Ukraine owned up and paid compensation ) that it was an accident .
        
        Otherwise, the evidence is overwhelming that a Russian-made Buk Missile 9M83 was used fired from a Russian BUK launcher downed M17 .
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:40am
      - Andrei
        
        Otherwise, the evidence is overwhelming that a Russian-made Buk Missile 9M83 was used fired from a Russian BUK launcher downed M17 .
        
        No the evidence is not overwhelming – it is mostly drawn from social media and its provenance is dubious to say the least
        
        The evidence from air traffic control has been suppressed, the evidence from Russian Radar and air traffic control has been ignored and the evidence from NATO monitoring not even provided
        
        The answer is known at the higher levels of Government because they have the real data but they will not provide it for plebs like you to examine with an open mind ( not that you have one)
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:47am
      - All_on_Red
        
        Doesn’t the Ukrainian Army have Buk launchers? In fact , doesn’t the Ukraine armed forces have a lot of Russian equipment.
        Personally I think the rebels fired it , but that doesn’t mean ‘Russia’ fired it.
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:50am
      - Icarus
        
        ( Which Ukraine owned up and paid compensation )
        
        So this is just about the money stephieboy ?
        
        Tell that to the families of those killed in the most recent Ukrainian attack on a passenger jet.
        
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        October 1, 2016 10:07am
    - Icarus
      
      Yes it was an accident. Just like when the Ukrainians shot down a Russian passenger jet full of Israelis, with Russian military equipment.
      
      http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ukraine/1359353/Ukraine-admits-it-shot-down-Russian-airliner.html
      
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      October 1, 2016 10:05am
    - G152
      
      Aircraft have electronics.
      They ident the aircraft on RADAR as being Airline/Flight/ALT/heading.
      It is -impossible- to screw up unless you’re Russian apparently
      
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      October 1, 2016 11:06am
      - All_on_Red
        
        Only if you know how to tune the radar to pick that up. That’s how that US destroyer messed up when they shot down that Iranian plane
        
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        October 1, 2016 2:11pm
  - stephieboy
    
    Andrei,
    
    Read the Dutch Safety Board first before jumping to conclusions,
    
    https://www.onderzoeksraad.nl/en/onderzoek/2049/investigation-crash-mh17-17-july-2014/publicatie/1686/found-buk-missile-parts-in-final-report-dutch-safety-board#fasen
    
    The numerous reports also include the fact that both the Russain Federation and Ukraine surrendered all ATC and other relevant transmissions to the Dutch Safety Board .
    
    Icarus , yes and the Ukraine acknowledged fault and paid out generous compensation to the deceased families !
    
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    October 1, 2016 10:06am
  - G152
    
    Russian apologist must be fair tuckered out running from explaining Soviet stuffup to explanation of Soviet stuffup being the US’s fault….
    
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    October 1, 2016 11:01am
Jack5

Average IQ’s are going up round the world, but people aren’t smarter.

That’s the subject of an interesting read on the BBC web site. The BBC has interviewed an under-appreciated NZ intellectual, James Flynn, the Otago professor who is the world authority on IQ.

Flynn worries that, despite the gains in IQ, people aren’t getting smarter. He notes they aren’t engaging their minds effectively on issues that matter.

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20160929-our-iqs-have-never-been-higher-but-it-hasnt-made-us-smart
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October 1, 2016 9:14am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  Jack5,
  
  There is little relationship between an IQ test and the effective application of one’s mind on issues that matter.
  (How do you define an “issue that matters”?) In this context, does an “issue that matters” = an issue that is given a lot of exposure in the MSM?
  
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  October 1, 2016 9:21am
  - Jack5
    
    In the remote chance that James Flynn is back in NZ by now and someone brings his attention to these posts, maybe he can tell us.
    
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    October 1, 2016 9:25am
  - waikatogirl
    
    IQ is failing when many appear to think ‘seriously’ about which Kardashian is in the news this week instead of real life issues and problems.
    Seriously, you don’t need a professor to work that one out. ?
    
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    October 1, 2016 10:04am
  - Reid
    
    That could be because people’s subconsciousness is based on emotion such as love, pride, anger etc thus the intellectual argument has little chance when it conflicts with an emotionally anchored belief.
    
    This is probably why many people with high IQs still believe the palpable bollocks spewed by the Western MSM, on most issues you care to name.
    
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    October 1, 2016 10:08am
    - stephieboy
      
      Reid ,
      
      Yeah right !
      
      And you believe in your Illuminati signage bollocks !
      
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      October 1, 2016 10:14am
      - Reid
        
        I was talking to people with high IQs stephie.
        
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        October 1, 2016 11:01am
- Flash
  
  “ . . . . despite the gains in IQ, people aren’t getting smarter. “
  Intelligent fools have always been with us.
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:26am
All_on_Red

‘Delete it’ with Hillary Clinton
Apologies to Michael Jackson

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fo7qMRSPwUg
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October 1, 2016 9:18am
- Inandout
  
  There are some really talented people in the Trump camp.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3bYb7qtkbo
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:12am
Dave Mann

Meanwhile, in Auckland an exciting social initiative was announced yesterday. The Met Service is to be merged with the NZ Depression Foundation and all calls to the weather line (cost $NZ0.85 per min) will now be staffed by trained suicide prevention counsellors. The money raised will be used to help research ways of making global warming a reality….
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October 1, 2016 9:24am
- Jack5
  
  Dave Mann: Did you get that stuff about the Met Service initiative from the environmental public relations consutlant, Mr G. Riff?
  
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  October 1, 2016 3:38pm
  - Dave Mann
    
    ????
    
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    October 1, 2016 6:57pm
stephieboy

In the next debate, Hillary not only wants to focus on Trumps meltdown about former Miss Universe Alicia Machado etc but also the overwhelming evidence that Russia has and continues to mount a cyber offensive that is trying to influence the outcome of the US Presidential election through hacked emails, stolen documents etc and even actual voting infrastructure designed to try and influence the outcome of the US election .

Trump, of course, has more or less gone along with the intrusions with his effusive and high praise of Putin and of course goading him to continue the onslaught .

Much more here ,

http://time.com/4512771/how-russia-wants-undermine-us-election/?xid=newsletter-brief

Also, Hilary should attempt to goad Trump on the Dutch Safety Board findings on the downing of M17
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October 1, 2016 9:30am
Icarus

Propaganda & brainwashing

The media campaign – telling us what to think – has become more brazen. Check out Stuff news. A banner at the top of the front page contains 26 stories attacking Trump, praising Hillary.

Not a single story addresses the concerns about Hillary. This is in addition to the leading front page story attacking Trump. This goes beyond the sickening propaganda campaign that got an Obama elected.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/us-election-2016
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October 1, 2016 9:52am
- Inandout
  
  Stuff is not the place to go for news, unless it is local and involving a vehicle crash or such. But yes, the flood of anti Trump articles has become hilarious in that they think our minds can be bent in the direction they dictate. Sorry MSM, those days are well over.
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:23am
- AgentBallSack
  
  That doesnt even count the story they ran about the poisonous caterpillar that looks like Trumps hair. The headline?
  
  Why you should never touch anything that looks like Trumps hair.
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/84835932/never-touch-anything-that-looks-like-donald-trumps-hair
  
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  October 1, 2016 11:10am
- Morrissey
  
  The responsibility for all the embarrassing stories about Trump rests with Trump. …..
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtvK1Biaq9Q
  
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  October 1, 2016 5:16pm
All_on_Red

Hillary Clinton at Fort Pierce
‘“Do we lift each other up? Or do we tear each other down?” she asked the audience. “Do we listen and respect each other or do we scapegoat point fingers and insult each other?”

“Can someone help me down the stairs?”
http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/09/30/watch-hillary-clinton-steady-going-stairs/

Apparently only a few hundred turned out to support her against two hundred Trump supporters protesting her. If she didn’t have the help of the Media undermining the election she would be toast.
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October 1, 2016 10:06am
- stephieboy
  
  All On Red ,
  
  What might Donald Trump be hiding in those tax returns he won’t disclose?
  
  Donald Trump is the first nominee from a major US political party in recent memory to decline to release at least a summary of his taxes.
  
  This generates speculation that he’s hiding something big, that he’s not worth as much as he claims or even that he’s squirrelling money away in offshore tax havens.
  
  He compounded the speculation during the first presidential debate by boasting he’d paid no taxes in at least one year.
  
  Never before has a presidential hopeful had such a complex tax profile, associated with at least 515 companies.
  
  CAN IT BE TRUE HE PAYS NO TAXES?
  
  Trump has said he does pay federal taxes, but he won’t say how much and insists he can’t release his returns because of an audit. What little is known about his taxes comes from dated tax and court documents. A report from a New Jersey casino commission said that in 1978 and 1979 Trump reported negative income and paid no federal taxes, even as he publicly boasted of being a multimillionaire.
  
  HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE?
  
  “One way you can do it is with leverage (borrowed money), lots of interest deductions, depreciation,” said Len Burman, a leading tax authority and professor at Syracuse University’s Maxwell School. “My impression is that people who are involved in the (commercial) real estate business can often go for years without taxable income.”
  
  In plain speaking, Trump can write off the interest he pays on his debt and depreciate his properties. This is using a legitimate tax break that allows for the declining value of an asset over time. That’s allowed even though the assets are often growing in value. Tax law provides a formula for writing off portions of assets over time….”
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/84858381/what-might-donald-trump-be-hiding-in-those-tax-returns-he-wont-disclose
  
  All Hillary needs to do on the 9th is keep hammering these points home and more and Trump is toast !
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:21am
  - All_on_Red
    
    Trump said in the debate he will release his returns when Hillary releases those 30,000 emails she deleted. So over to Hillary.
    That said, only an idiot would pay Tax when they didn’t have to. I do all I can to reduce my bill.
    Don’t you? Oh wait, when you are on the benefit they pay it for you huh.
    Didn’t Hillary donate $1.4 million to the Clinton Foundation, claim the deduction, then the Foundation paid it back to her for expenses? Cough hypocrite, cough
    Personally I think Hillary should stop trying to claim any moral high ground. She should stick to the issues. Because she has such a good track record there / sarc.
    
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    October 1, 2016 11:00am
  - Inandout
    
    Bob Jones once complained he paid no taxes, quite legally of course. What’s the problem stephslam?
    
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    October 1, 2016 11:26am
cha

Having overridden Obama’s veto the GOP brains trust thinks they might have to rewrite the 9/11 bill because unintended consequences. Fucking pathetic.
/

Before the vote, senior administration officials warned lawmakers of this exact problem — that weakening the concept of sovereign immunity could backfire if foreign countries tried to do the same for the U.S. Secretary of Defense Ash Carter sent House Armed Services Chairman Mac Thornberry of Texas a letter saying that could potentially expose Americans to lawsuits and “an intrusive discovery process” even if the U.S. is ultimately found not to be responsible for a particular event.

But Republicans said the White House didn’t make a forceful case, putting themselves in the awkward position of blaming the president for a bill they enacted into law over Obama’s veto.

http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2016-09-29/congress-signals-regret-after-overriding-veto-of-saudi-9-11-bill
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October 1, 2016 10:29am
- All_on_Red
  
  Wasn’t the Veto 97 to 1? So all the Dems voted against it too. Apart from Harry Reid.
  Speaking of Harry. How does a 25 year Public Servant on a max salary of $250,000 pa amass a fortune of $25 million?
  It wasn’t through sponsorship of exercise machines.
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:53am
  - cha
    
    Election year. Democrats vote against and veto stands – Republican campaign – Democrats hate 911 victims.
    
    All are morans.
    
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    October 1, 2016 11:34am
- Gabby
  
  They really are a pack of retarded clowns.
  
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  October 1, 2016 12:26pm
cha

Trump’s reaction to news about his Cuba connections – lie.

It gets worse, though.

Not only is Trump lying about his business ties with Cuba, but during the time his company was illegally spending money in the country, Trump was trying to figure out how to pass the expenses off as “charity,” which is the only way it wouldn’t be considered a violation of the embargo.

Once again, the Republican nominee is hoping that if he repeats a lie enough times, people will either start believing him or just brush off the story entirely.

http://www.politicususa.com/2016/09/29/donald-trump-lie-explosive-cuban-scandal.html
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October 1, 2016 10:55am
- mikenmild
  
  Don’t worry, cha, All_on_Red will be able to tell us this was all Democrats’ fault too.
  
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  October 1, 2016 10:58am
  - All_on_Red
    
    97 to 1. Don’t like those inconvenient facts eh
    Snarky little a…….e
    
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    October 1, 2016 11:03am
- Icarus
  
  So you must be a fan of the wall & stopping immigration of these undesirables ?
  
  “illegally spending money”
  
  Refreshing to see someone so upfront about their lust for fascism isn’t it cha ?
  
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  October 1, 2016 11:02am
- cha
  
  heh
  
  Wonder who anonymously registered these 5 urls via GoDaddy on same day in December 2008 (all now expired)… #TrumpinCuba pic.twitter.com/IwI8lrLiMc— The Smoking Gun (@tsgnews) September 29, 2016
  
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  October 1, 2016 11:06am
  - Icarus
    
    Great ~~defective~~ detective work cha.
    
    Now see what you can find on Hillary ? That should keep you busy ~~trolling~~ trawling the internet for days. 🙂
    
    10 4
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    October 1, 2016 11:09am
- Inandout
  
  That site is pure Clinton-love.
  
  It should be named politicusdem.
  
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  October 1, 2016 11:29am
- tom hunter
  
  You really thinking call any candidate a liar or highlighting their lies in this year’s election will have any effect?
  
  This year it’s not even good for LOL. Everybody seems to be shrugging their shoulders and saying, Yeah, my candidate’s a liar! And?
  
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  October 1, 2016 12:04pm
  - cha
    
    Florida’s Cuban exiles and their families might not have a problem with the tiny fingered vulgarian’s lies. But dealing with the Castro regime?.
    
    Could well be a line that they will not cross.
    
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    October 1, 2016 12:15pm
    - tom hunter
      
      In the same way that all those feminists are turning away from The Enabler of Rape?
      
      Nah – tribalism rules. I think it was Nina Burleigh (“Journalist” – ha, ha) who years agro wrote that, far from investigating Bill Clinton’s shadier events, she’d be willing to get down on her knees and give him a blowjob because he’d protected abortion.
      
      Cuban exiles will likely think and vote similarly;”bigger picture” and all that.
      
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      October 1, 2016 12:32pm
      - Kimbo
        
        Plus it’s a long time since the Cuban-exile community had sufficient clout to have a direct effect on who occupies the White House. Five of ’em in particular, found in DNC national headquarters late one Saturday night in June 1972…
        
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        October 1, 2016 12:44pm
      - cha
        
        Cuban exiles will likely think and vote similarly;”bigger picture” and all that.
        
        Perhaps…
        
        Donald Trump is the catalyst who could force a decisive break between Miami-Dade County’s influential Cuban-American voters and the Republican Party, a new poll has found.
        
        Local Cuban Americans dislike Trump so much — and are increasingly so accepting of renewed U.S.-Cuba ties pushed by Democratic President Barack Obama — that Trump’s likely presidential nomination might accentuate the voters’ political shift away from the GOP, according to the survey shared with the Miami Herald and conducted by Dario Moreno, a Coral Gables pollster and a Florida International University associate politics professor.
        
        Thirty-seven percent of respondents supported Trump, a number that is still higher than the 31 percent who backed Clinton — but also “the lowest in history that any potential Republican candidate polls among this traditionally loyal demographic,” according to Moreno. He added that the results put likely Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton within “striking distance” of winning over the influential voting demographic. Trump won the March 15 Florida GOP primary in a rout.
        
        http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/article75100892.html
        
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        October 1, 2016 1:06pm
      - Griff
        
        http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-election-forecast/florida/
        
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        October 1, 2016 1:13pm
Icarus

These loons are always good for a laugh.

This time they predict ” Climate Armageddon” if we don’t do what Obama wants 🙂

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/greens-u.s.-europe-trade-deal-promises-climate-armageddon/article/2596175
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October 1, 2016 10:56am
Viking2

Some pictures just say it all without a caption.
https://scontent.fakl1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13516267_981540941964730_3261597231373145229_n.jpg?oh=f2aaf51a3133ac8dea731e4da999969d&oe=586667AC
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October 1, 2016 11:00am
Viking2

How not to attract votes.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/84860809/sex-boast-sinks-waikato-university-candidate?cid=facebook.post.84860809
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October 1, 2016 11:04am
- Icarus
  
  What this tells me is that he is a very loving young man with great people skills. Particularly with women.
  
  Unless his critics are trying to tell us women sleep with guys they hate… because …. reasons ?
  
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  October 1, 2016 11:07am
- AgentBallSack
  
  Feminists have got him now.
  Lucky he’s not a rich young white boy, he can blame it on his dick size and regressive genes. Feminists lap that sort of thing up!
  
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  October 1, 2016 11:18am
Reid

Pat Caddell talked to Breitbart News Daily SiriusXM host Alex Marlow Thursday about election developments.

Caddell said, “One of the things we’ll see, and I’ll predict this now and why if Trump’s going to win he has to go to this higher ground, is, you’re going to see … just how much the establishment order will fight to hold onto its power and privilege at all costs.”

He continued, “It is going to be the most broad-based assault in every direction to try to keep [Trump] out of the White House. And so this is headed to Armageddon, if you will, politically.”

“This is an election where the American people have bolted,” asserted Caddell, adding:

They want control back of their government, and they are very anti-establishment and political class. That’s why you see such a united effort by the Democrats and Republicans in the establishment who are terrified that Trump represents the diminution of their power.

http://www.breitbart.com/radio/2016/09/29/pat-caddell-election-headed-toward-armageddon-establishment-fights-hold-onto-power-privilege-all-costs/
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October 1, 2016 11:09am
- Inandout
  
  The Washington elite, those who view their positions as entitlement, will without a doubt fight viciously to hold onto power. I fear Trump will be the target of an assassination attempt, but if elected will have a few scores to settle. The FBI is now so corrupt that even J Edgar Hoover would not recognise it. The US foreign policy is in tatters, thanks to the likes of John Kerry. The Obama cartel has done the US serious damage.
  
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  October 1, 2016 11:46am
Kimbo

It was probably noted on the Colin Craig thread yesterday, but John Key is no doubt delighted he didn’t take the ~~advice~~ demands of some two years ago that he make an accommodation to help get the Conservatives into Parliament via the East Coast Bays electorate.

John Banks, even though he was ultimately vindicated was enough indirect damage control to deal with. And as eccentric as Banks can appear, he was still an experienced and proven pair of political hands.

Colin Craig on the other hand…complete obsessive with a tsunami-like ego, an EQ of -100 (plenty of them around. Just check out Kimbo on Kiwiblog!)…but most dangerous of all bucket loads of cash to catapult himself into ranks of political players. Having him as National’s coalition partner would truly have seen them shackled to a corpse.
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October 1, 2016 11:35am
Morrissey

As we might have suspected, Donald Trump
is a member of New Zealand’s wacky ACT cult.
Here’s the proof….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkvG3g7hEJE
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October 1, 2016 11:41am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  Not that you are one-eyed at all, but I’m looking forward to how you demonstrate balance by attacking the legion of concerning features to Hillary’s personal interactions. Oh that’s right you don’t want to, do you, because everyone who does ends up dead in bizarre circumstances (cue 50 youtube videos on the subject!).
  
  Alternatively, you could always pick up on how the “Feminist” candidate has made a career out of enabling slick Willies serial sexual abuse and philandering.
  
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  October 1, 2016 12:03pm
  - Morrissey
    
    My friend, I have been more critical of Hillary Clinton than anyone on this forum. True enough, I have nothing but contempt for that racist, science-denying, woman-hating, lying chickenhawk that the Republican Party has chosen to be its candidate; however, that does not make me a Hillary supporter.
    
    I’ve been a critic of the Clintons for many years. Here’s one of my posts about Hillary’s even more horrible husband, just in case you doubt my creds…..
    
    http://nz.general.narkive.com/qkLsQaM1/who-is-the-more-violent-and-despicable-character-bill-clinton-or-chris-brown
    
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    October 1, 2016 12:19pm
    - Kimbo
      
      One post…and there are seven 1st person pronouns (‘I’, ‘me’, or ‘my’). Plus a 1st person plural (‘we’) in the initial post
      
      As we might have suspected, Donald Trump
      is a member of New Zealand’s wacky ACT cult.
      
      …which begs the questions, what do you mean ‘we’, paleface, and who elected you to speak on anyone’s behalf other than your own?
      
      Just observing. But then DifferentPerspective did engage the troll, most likely as Morrissey’s recent absence from these parts has dulled the memories of some 😉
      
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      October 1, 2016 12:35pm
      - Morrissey
        
        Thanks for the heads-up, Kimbo. One will attempt to minimize the use of all those personal pronouns in future. You are right to be irritated.
        
        Once again, thanks for the style tip. It’s appreciated….
        http://i.imgur.com/hbgtV4y.gif
        
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        October 1, 2016 12:50pm
      - Kimbo
        
        Not irritated. Amused. So your assumption deserves a down tick in the ordinary course of events.
        
        But despite the humourless sarcasm, you redeemed yourself in that last post by avoiding adverbs to over-egg your rhetorical pudding, such as “certainly”, “absolutely” or “truly” – or variants such as in your 12:19 post:
        
        True enough I have nothing but contempt…
        
        And those, folks, are some of the tricks that trolls use to get your engagement…
        
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        October 1, 2016 12:59pm
DifferentPerspective

I’m still laughing about the Rick Roll

Meleina Trump

Weeks later and I’m still in tears of laughter everytime I think about how they trivialised the ‘sainted’ Michelle like this. Also how they ‘triggered’ an appalling wave of sexist attacks on Meleina – socialists showing their passion for double-standards.
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October 1, 2016 12:07pm
stephieboy

DifferentPerspective,

Melanie Trump’s plagiarised Michelle Obama’s speech ?

Is that is what rattling on about ?

Or those silicone implants ?
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October 1, 2016 12:46pm
- Inandout
  
  Michelle’s speech was not original either, and as for implants can you be sure Hillary hasn’t had one in her brain?
  
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  October 1, 2016 1:40pm
Morrissey

But despite the humourless sarcasm, you redeemed yourself in that last post by avoiding adverbs to over-egg your rhetorical pudding…

I appreciate the feedback….

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-odDchx7gI7Y/US4KOR1ouPI/AAAAAAAAKyg/_G8VXleTOVY/s400/i_love_my_teacher_sm.gif
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October 1, 2016 1:04pm
Reid

Escellent Syria prognosis from the Saker.

http://thesaker.is/the-war-against-syria-both-sides-go-to-plan-b/
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October 1, 2016 1:20pm
- stephieboy
  
  Reid , from what I can gather The Saker is merely a variation on Russian Propaganda Media organs such as RT, Sputnik, Inside Russia and collaborators like Global Research,
  
  http://thesaker.is/category/war-news/
  
  Not very encouraging .
  
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  October 1, 2016 1:38pm
  - Andrei
    
    You don’t think the New York Times and the Washington Post are propaganda organs for US Government Stephiebot?
    
    Do you think they tell the truth?
    
    I’ve got news for you they don’t
    
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    October 1, 2016 1:56pm
    - stephieboy
      
      The Washington Post and NYT are not the propaganda media in the same manner as RT and Sputnik or The Saker !
      
      1 5
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      October 1, 2016 4:30pm
      - Morrissey
        
        Yes they are, stephieboy. I suggest you actually have a read of them one of these days.
        
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        October 1, 2016 5:52pm
  - Reid
    
    No he’s not like that at all stephie. The problem is you have to read him to find that out. And if you don’t why, you wind up with an opinion like yours, doesn’t one.
    
    6 4
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    October 1, 2016 3:16pm
- SPC
  
  We have Libya where Russia did not use its veto on western intervention and Syria where it did and then got involved itself. Which Russian option has worked better?
  
  What we had was a no fly zone in Libya that over-reached its mandate to attack Libyan ground forces, and Syria where the government and now Russia have been bombing civilians.
  
  The most consistent option in both cases was a no fly zone to prevent the government using air power in domestic civil war scenarios – for safety of civilians. And otherwise for the rest of the world to keep out of it (a western economic embargo on Syria for using military force on Arab Spring protestors was the measured response).
  
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  October 1, 2016 1:45pm
  - Andrei
    
    The Arab spring wasn’t real SPC – there were real people with real grievances who were used as a front for creating Salafist mayhem to topple Governments the USA wanted toppled
    
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    October 1, 2016 1:58pm
    - SPC
      
      I disagree. There were young people on-line who were able to organise protest against their governments.
      
      The agenda was disparate, and impact distinct in each of the countries involved.
      
      In Egypt the opposition centred around the Moslem Brotherhood so they were best placed to do well in elections. I doubt the US wanted Mubarak replaced by the Moslem Brotherhood, but they were stuck with the Bush mantra of support for democratic regime change (used to justify removing a left wing regime in Iraq).
      
      With Syria, there were Sunni Moslems who as a majority wanted what Shia Moslems had achieved in Iraq – an ethnic majority ruling in place of a Baath Party regime. And Sunni Islamists in the Gulf and Turkey who were prepared to back them.
      
      Just one problem, this was not (largely) democratic activism, and the chaos in Syria allowed al Qaeda in Iraq a bolt-hole to establish themselves for a push back into Iraq. Thus leaving a President opposed to the Iraq play of Bush “supporting democratic regime change” in a region where Islamists would take advantage of disorder for their own purposes.
      
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      October 1, 2016 2:11pm
- All_on_Red
  
  Good article Reid. Those 400 missile systems are pretty impressive.
  
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  October 1, 2016 2:31pm
- SPC
  
  If it was going for credibility it would not have claimed the Americans were supplying weapons to al Qaeda in Iraq/IS-daesh.
  
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  October 1, 2016 2:38pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Heh, yeah that parts a bit far fetched, but how a military response might be handled?
    I know enough about military hardware to agree that establishing any no fly zone would be very costly to the US
    
    2 2
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    October 1, 2016 2:46pm
    - SPC
      
      Sure, establishing a no fly zone requires UNSC mandate (related to absence of big 5 tech on the ground or equivalent also in the hands of some other nations -Israel/Iran etc).
      
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      October 1, 2016 3:00pm
  - Reid
    
    Where the fuck else do you think it gets them from? They go from the US to Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Kuwait and then straight into al Qaeda’s hands. How the fuck do you think the terrorists wind up with e.g. TOW missiles? Where the fuck do all those brand new Toyotas come from. etc etc etc etc etc etc.
    
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    October 1, 2016 3:19pm
    - SPC
      
      I would (fuckn) imagine some comes from acquisition from defeated parties in the field, some comes from purchase from arms dealers (they do have money), some from other recipients backed by Gulf states and Turkey (on-selling to raise cash).
      
      And if they have been sold weapons direct from the Gulf states, this still does not back up the articles claims of the US potentially acting to supply further such weaponry to them. Given that you say it is a decision of others of others if they get passed on or not.
      
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      October 1, 2016 3:36pm
      - Reid
        
        And if they have been sold weapons direct from the Gulf states, this still does not back up the articles claims of the US potentially acting to supply further such weaponry to them.
        
        Don’t you know the US has just threatened to supply them with MANPADS as a result of the Russian actions in Alleppo? For example.
        
        There are none so blind as those who will not see.
        
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        October 1, 2016 4:14pm
      - SPC
        
        Stop misrepresenting stuff, they did NOT propose supplying anything to THEM/daesh.
        
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        October 1, 2016 4:29pm
      - Reid
        
        http://journal-neo.org/2016/09/30/us-threatens-to-arm-al-qaeda-isis-with-anti-air-missiles/
        
        There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.
        
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        October 1, 2016 5:43pm
      - SPC
        
        Reid, your own linked article says the USA warns Russia that if the cease-fire does not hold Gulf states may arm rebels with anti-aircraft weaponry.
        
        Gulf states (not the USA) might arm rebels (it odes not state IS/daesh.
        
        Either you cannot read or you conflate this with that for your own nefarious reasons.
        
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        October 1, 2016 7:01pm
      - Andrei
        
        SPC if the “Gulf States” supply the “moderate rebels” with anti aircraft weapons they will be American antiaircraft weapons and they will be supplied with the USA’s blessing
        
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        October 1, 2016 7:05pm
      - SPC
        
        Well they will certainly not be going to daesh as reid claimed – the idea of Americans supplying anti-aircraft weaponry to people being bombed by Americans/allied aircraft was ridiculous.
        
        The real issue is whether the Gulf states have their own supply lines to the rebels or would need US help to get the weapons to them (there is the issue of whether this is that easy to do given rebel areas are being enclosed).
        
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        October 1, 2016 7:18pm
  - Andrei
    
    Who do you think got the $500,000,000 worth of weapons the US congress approved for Syria?
    
    Peter Pan and Tinkerbell perhaps
    
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    October 1, 2016 3:24pm
    - SPC
      
      Hard to say one group (FSA) trained and armed in Turkey, were either captured, killed or fled as soon as they entered Syria and had their weapons taken by more Islamist groups – supposedly tipped off by someone in Turkey.
      
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      October 1, 2016 3:39pm
SPC

Is it possible that if Trump releases his tax records, they will conflict with information he has supplied to banks when seeking loans?

Or will they conflict with information supplied to creditors when declaring bankruptcy to arrange better loan repayment conditions?
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October 1, 2016 1:49pm
- Fletch
  
  I don’t see why Trump should have to release his tax records, when the current president of the United States has paid millions to hide just about every personal record he has. Double standards much?
  
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  October 1, 2016 2:42pm
  - mikenmild
    
    Didn’t Obama release his tax returns?
    Or are you still worried that his birth certificate might be a forgery?
    
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    October 1, 2016 3:36pm
  - stephieboy
    
    Fletch ,
    
    “..when the current president of the United States has paid millions to hide just about every personal record he has. ..”
    
    Substantiate that claim, please ?
    
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    October 1, 2016 4:26pm
    - Fletch
      
      Stephieboy, it is common knoweldge that he has sealed his medical records, his school records, his birth records and his passport records. He will not release his Harvard records, his Columbia College records, or his Occidental College records—he will not even release his Columbia College thesis. All his legislative records from the Illinois State Senate are missing and he claims his scheduling records during those State Senate years are lost as well. In addition, no one can find his school records for the elite K-12 college prep school, Punahou School, he attended in Hawaii.
      
      It’s called EXECUTIVE ORDER 13489.
      
      https://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ExecutiveOrderPresidentialRecords
      
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      October 1, 2016 5:25pm
      - stephieboy
        
        The claim that Obama has sealed his medical , academic etc records is a myth . There was a scurrilous and false claim with 16 points made leading up to the 2012 Presidential election.
        
        Like any other President prior to him many of his personal records are confidential but not “sealed “ so that know one can ever have access to them ,
        
        All of the 16 claims are refuted here ,
        
        http://www.factcheck.org/2012/07/obamas-sealed-records/
        
        As to so-called Executive order 13489 . The claims are refuted here and with what” Presidential record “actually means ,
        
        § 2201 Definitions… 2) The term “Presidential records” means documentary materials, or any reasonably segregable portion thereof, created or received by the President, his immediate staff, or a unit or individual of the Executive Office of the President whose function is to advise and assist the President, in the course of conducting activities which relate to or have an effect upon the carrying out of the constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President.
        
        http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2009/08/more-faux-record-hiding/
        
        It is obvious that “Presidential records” are not those records being sought by eligibility doubters, documents created before Obama became President.
        
        Nothing to see here. Now I suggest move along and maybe help that Arizona Sheriff revive his tired and debunked birth certificate conspiracy claims .
        
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        October 1, 2016 5:49pm
  - Morrissey
    
    I don’t see why Trump should have to release his tax records
    
    Oh yes you do. You must have been burning up inside as you watched Trump’s humiliation on Wednesday.
    
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    October 1, 2016 5:19pm
Fletch

Paul Joseph Watson spells out the facts about Alicia Machado. Even includes video of Trump defending her weight at the time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwVxJFF6afA
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October 1, 2016 2:24pm
- stephieboy
  
  Fletch ,
  
  Paul Joseph Watson Infowars frontman and his whacko Clinton body count and google censorship theories ,
  
  http://www.infowars.com/google-hides-clinton-body-count-search-suggestions/
  
  LOL !
  
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  October 1, 2016 4:42pm
  - Fletch
    
    So, rather than attacking the man, tell me on what points you think Watson is wrong in the video I posted.
    
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    October 1, 2016 5:28pm
    - stephieboy
      
      Fletch ,
      
      CLAIM: Former Miss Universe Alicia Machado was a ‘porn star.’
      
      MOSTLY FALSE
      WHAT’S TRUE: Former Miss Universe Alicia Machado made an allegedly risqué appearance on a TV reality show and was pictured topless in Playboy magazine.
      
      WHAT’S FALSE: Alicia Machado has not starred in a series of pornographic films.
      
      ORIGIN:During the first presidential debate between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton on 26 September 2016, the latter noted that her opponent had made several highly public sexist remarks over the course of his career. One instance cited by the Clinton occurred in 1996 when Trump called the recently crowned Miss Universe, Alicia Machado of Venezuela, “Miss Piggy” due to her post-pageant weight gain:….
      
      “..Shortly afterwards, various web sites began reporting that Machado, the former Miss Universe, had also “appeared in pornographic videos..
      
      However, although searching on terms such as “Alicia Machado Porn Star” turns up several videos from free porn web sites, these videos don’t actually star Alicia Machado:
      
      It should come as no surprise that celebrity nude photographs and sex videos drive major traffic on the Internet. But when legitimate photographs or videos are not available, hoaxsters often resort to creating their own. In some cases, this involves Photoshopping a famous face onto a nude or near-nude body (as was done with Sarah Palin), or changing the title of a sex video if it features a porn actress who bears a resemblance to a celebrity
      
      The latter is the case with Alicia Machado. In 2009, a video clip purportedly showing the former Miss Universe winner engaging in anal sex was circulated online, and that is the clip that now most frequently shows up in response to web searches on the phrase “Alicia Machado porn.” However, the woman seen in that video is not Alicia Machado — the clip was taken from the 2004 DVD Apprentass 4, which features porn actress Angel Dark, and was later retitled to suggest it showed Alicia Machado:…”
      
      http://www.snopes.com/alicia-machado-adult-star/
      
      The alleged sex tape is actually very tame and innocuous.
      
      So much for Paul Joseph Watson I was justified alerting to his credibility in the first place . The fact he chooses fronts Infowars and Prison Planet should raise suspicions !
      
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      October 1, 2016 6:05pm
      - Fletch
        
        stephie, no one claimed that she was a porn star, or had starred in a series of pornographic films. She made a sex tape – like Pamela Anderson, or Miley Cyrus. It is pretty common knowledge, apparently.
        
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        October 2, 2016 8:42am
    - cha
      
      Here’s the Machado sex tape – lotsa canoodling under the blankets.
      
      youtube. com/watch?v=3h7rWkSq2cE
      
      (nsfw so age restricted and take the gaps out of the url)
      
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      October 1, 2016 6:18pm
      - Icarus
        
        Got any of Bill CLINTONS sex tapes ?
        
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        October 1, 2016 6:21pm
Komata

In case anyone missed it, Mr. Trump actually did tell Hillary that he would release his tax records ‘When she retrieves the 33,000 emails she deleted’.

It’s a small point, but possibly important…
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October 1, 2016 3:42pm
- SPC
  
  Cannot vs willnot.
  
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  October 1, 2016 3:45pm
- stephieboy
  
  Komata , she admitted it was a mistake to delete those emails and which was prior to the Comey investigation .
  
  Trump, on the other hand, can simply allow the media and public access to his IRS returns ( if any ) .
  
  A very big and important point .
  
  It ‘s problematic in that Trump’s huge ego would forever prevent him admitting to making a mistake .
  
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  October 1, 2016 4:48pm
Manolo

Nigel to the rescue:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3816822/Send-Nigel-Trump-flies-Farage-help-sharpen-debating-skills-clash-Hillary-Clinton.html
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October 1, 2016 3:46pm
- stephieboy
  
  Manolo, have to bring an import ? No local talent on Team Trump .
  
  Nevertheless, Farage can impart useful advice about not e.g making false claims about an alleged assassination attempt .
  
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  October 1, 2016 4:52pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    Known winner like Farage is a good team member.
    Oh shit, he is a right winger.
    Stupid boy
    
    4 3
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    October 1, 2016 5:59pm
    - stephieboy
      
      No, that Farage made a false claim about an assassination attempt on him might also give Trump some useful ideas for like claims .
      
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      October 1, 2016 6:34pm
Griff

As the polling comes out after the debate it is amazing how much trump is winning .
As in winning in less states after he won the debate so easily.
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-election-forecast/

ps
Don’t tell the trumpies as they will go all conspirawacky on us causing a run on tinfoil supply’s.
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October 1, 2016 3:52pm
- Icarus
  
  Stick to lying about the weather and cut and pasting retard. I know you dont understand what you cut and paste, but I can tell you it makes you look even more stupid and rotten.
  
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  October 1, 2016 6:40pm
  - Griff
    
    The weather mon ?
    There is a big storm coming to Jamaica mon .
    Cat 5 hurricane Mathew.
    No one thought it would get this big this fast.
    After Jamaica and Cuba maybe it will blow away trumpets arse .
    Jah be willin.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCGoOPM2_x0&sns=tw
    
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    October 1, 2016 6:52pm
Jack5

With accusations of “racism” flying in all directions in NZ it’s interesting to look at racism in other countries.

Take India, where an attractive darker skinned actress has been telling of skin-colour discrimination. Here’s a bit from her Facebook posting:

In a country where … people don’t get jobs because of their complexion, where every matrimonial advert demands a fair bride or groom … in a country where dark skin is marginalised, making fun of it is not a roast.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/30/skin-tone-jibes-actor-india-debate-prejudice-caste
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October 1, 2016 5:22pm
- Morrissey
  
  Why did you put the word “racism” in scare quotes, as if to imply it doesn’t really exist in this country?
  
  Surely you’ve read or listened to the likes of Leighton Smith, Don Brash, Jamie Whyte, David Round, Murray Deaker, Andy Haden, [insert name of any sad, reflex, nasty, virulent Kiwi racist].
  
  And of course you will be familiar with the contributions to community goodwill made by this leading thinker….
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNdk7Hsj_R0
  
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  October 1, 2016 5:37pm
  - Jack5
    
    Morrissey (5.37 post): “scare quotes” – I think that’s a news term when an editor would pluck a word or a phrase from a report and put it in a headline.
    
    When it didn’t fully reflect the report, or when it represented opinion, or what someone said, or similar, the word or phrase in the headline would be put in quotation marks.
    
    I put the word, racism, inside quotation marks because I hoped this might convey that I was talking about alleged racism as well as established racism.
    
    How you extrapolated from the quotes that I don’t think racism exists in NZ, I’m fucked if I know. Racism exists everywhere. It’s near-universal. False allegations of racism are also near-universal.
    
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    October 1, 2016 5:48pm
    - Reid
      
      Turei, Hone, Minto are three of the worst racists this country has ever seen.
      
      As far as countries go of course, we have to look at Japan and Israel as the international champions there. The Israelis are of course much, much worse than Japan making them king of the racist heap.
      
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      October 1, 2016 6:05pm
  - Icarus
    
    Morrissey, please tell us where “racism” does not exist in this world ?
    
    I know it is not even considered in China, Africa, India, South America, which is most of the world.
    
    Tell us why you hate 87% of humanity and 100% of non white people ?
    
    6 4
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    October 1, 2016 5:52pm
    - Morrissey
      
      Icarus,
      
      Your first two paragraphs are well thought out, and make very good points. Sadly, the last one is utterly nonsensical.
      
      3 9
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      October 1, 2016 5:55pm
      - Icarus
        
        A predictable reply attacking the messenger and not the point. I now know the level to pitch this chat at.
        
        It is implicit in your statement that YT is the problem. In spite of you using YT values as the standard.
        
        You can not even give a head nod to brown people. Your hate runs deep.
        
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        October 1, 2016 6:00pm
    - Kimbo
      
      Icarus,
      
      Your first two paragraphs are well thought out, and make very good points. Sadly, the last one is utterly nonsensical.
      
      —————-
      
      A predictable reply attacking the messenger and not the point. I now know the level to pitch this chat at.
      
      It is implicit in your statement that YT is the problem. In spite of you using YT values as the standard.
      
      You can not even give a head nod to brown people. Your hate runs deep.
      
      This will be good. ~~Jimmy~~ Icarus vs ~~Timmy~~ Morrissey: ~~Cripple~~ Troll Fight!!
      
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfgHVSvxZUA
      
      7 2
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      October 1, 2016 6:03pm
      - Icarus
        
        Oh look the sub normal and vile are chanting “troll”. Decent folk know they are reading things the troll callers could never understand.
        
        Why are troll callers such filthy immoral smears on humanity ? The world is a poorer place for having such people in it. Why do decent people tolerate their infestation of society ?
        
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        October 1, 2016 7:07pm
Reid

“Tens of thousands” of fraudulent Clinton votes found in Ohio warehouse

http://christiantimesnewspaper.com/breaking-tens-of-thousands-of-fraudulent-clinton-votes-found-in-ohio-warehouse/
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October 1, 2016 5:59pm
- stephieboy
  
  There have been a number of voter irregularities made in Ohio including County Wood with many maybes , could bes and possibilities ,
  
  http://www.politifact.com/ohio/statements/2016/aug/16/viral-image/viral-post-alleges-voter-fraud-wood-county-ohio/
  
  Obviously, we will have to see how this plays out and whether a department of justice or FBI investigation is justified.
  
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  October 1, 2016 6:23pm
  - Reid
    
    with many maybes , could bes and possibilities ,
    
    Maybe in your tiny mind there is stephie but for the rest of us, ballot boxes stuffed with nothing but current Democratic voting slips same as would be used in the election, found in a warehouse 10 days before special voting begins in Ohio, there’s not much doubt at all.
    
    There are none so blind as those who refuse to see. Those too stupid to see are a close second.
    
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    October 1, 2016 6:45pm
- SPC
  
  Yeah na, sorry found to be a false story.
  
  http://www.snopes.com/clinton-votes-found-in-warehouse/
  
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  October 1, 2016 7:28pm
  - Icarus
    
    Cut and pasting a link to a manufactured cover story to a source promised favors by Clinton, hardly disproves the claim. If you had a credible source you would have used it.
    
    The “myth” has therefore been proven
    
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    October 1, 2016 7:32pm
Reid

Hillary’s Teleprompter inside debate podium and Cleaner Man – evidence Killary cheated.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=os5fe-ADtZA
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October 1, 2016 6:10pm
- stephieboy
  
  Reid , this comment about the alleged Teleprompter is germane ,
  
  K-Riddle936 hours ago
  If you look closely, you see that Trump’s podium also has a piece of paper. Later in the video you see a guy with long hair walking towards the Trump podium, then the video cuts and the man also has notes under his arm. What is the logical conclusion to this? The candidates were given a piece of paper to use during the debate to write down some notes for a response while their opponent is talking. The “Teleprompter” look like a bright white bar, which is more likely a light to shed on the candidates faces for Television purposes, not a nefarious teleprompter (mainly because those don’t shine bright white lights, but rather are dark so the letters would be more visible.) Donald even has the same thing in his podium, it’s just turned off faster than Clinton.
  
  LOL !
  
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  October 1, 2016 6:30pm
- Icarus
  
  If she had a teleprompter then why did she appear fumbling and confused. ?
  
  Sorry but myth busted.
  
  Hillary was on her own, shrouded in lies, afraid, frail and confused. Her treason and deception weighing her every word down.
  
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  October 1, 2016 7:35pm
Reid

‘US has always been main sponsor of Islamic State’ – former CIA contractor

Well duh. Who doesn’t know that?

Apart from stephie and SPC.

https://www.rt.com/op-edge/361033-syria-russia-us-kerry/
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October 1, 2016 6:43pm
- stephieboy
  
  Reid ,
  
  Omar Mateen, the suspect in the Orlando nightclub shooting, was very closely connected to the US government, which is committing crimes on American soil using their own operatives, according to Steven D Kelley, a former NSA/CIA contractor.
  
  http://rinf.com/alt-news/latest-news/orlando-shooter-closely-connected-to-us-govt-ex-cia-contractor/
  
  I think there is every reason that Kelly is a somewhat deluded conspiracy theorist much like you !
  
  That RT takes him seriously speaks volumes !
  
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  October 1, 2016 7:07pm
  - Icarus
    
    That CNN and the msm takes Obama and Hillary seriously demonstrates they are on the loony fringe.
    
    Obama is a brutal savage beast who has killed hundreds of thousands. His African savagery has destroyed entire countries affecting millions.
    
    This animal should be stopped and his supporters dealt with by any means.
    
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    October 1, 2016 7:17pm
    - stephieboy
      
      Icarus , not even RT or Putin would take your kind of garbage seriously .
      
      2 1
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      October 1, 2016 9:00pm
      - Icarus
        
        Unlike you, my goal is to find the truth. Not run cover for a savage black warlord.
        
        The animal need to stand trial in the same way other war criminals have.
        
        https://pbs.twimg.com/media/AyUGdpNCIAAey2U.jpg
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:04pm
SPC

Reid, you have peddled more lies on this site than anyone else.

As for your proclaimed insight, do you still hold to the view that Trump was only running to help Clinton win, or did your opinion change once he became Putin fanboy?
6 6
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October 1, 2016 7:04pm
- Icarus
  
  SPC, why don’t you confine your fake and contrived virtue signalling to another forum. You do not believe a work of what you say and are only trying to impress your dull YT middle class friends with this SJW act .
  
  You could be a smart and good person. You have the brains. But you have chosen to be a self serving fake.
  
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  October 1, 2016 7:11pm
- Reid
  
  Name one, SPC.
  
  Hint: just because you don’t: like it/know it/refuse to recognise it, doesn’t mean it’s not true.
  
  Since I said that about Trump its become evident there is such ubiquitous resistance from the establishment it’s unlikely. It’s not impossible but it’s now unlikely.
  
  Of course if your position is that it’s not even possible for him to have entered the race on that basis then there’s no point discussing anything with you because your ignorance of politics is far too profound for you to ever understand anything at all beyond the trite lies the MSM feeds people.
  
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  October 1, 2016 7:31pm
  - SPC
    
    1. Your claim Stalin and Lenin were Jews.
    
    When is political ignorance questioning your latest supposition. That would replacing MSM with your opinion as the source of news.
    
    And as we know Trump running to help Clinton was just enough burst bubble of insight. But it should have been apparent from the beginning – Trump had long postulated the idea of running.
    
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    October 1, 2016 7:37pm
    - Nostradamus
      
      On the one hand:
      
      SPC: Reid, you have peddled more lies on this site than anyone else.
      
      Reid: Name one, SPC.
      
      SPC: 1. Your claim Stalin and Lenin were Jews.
      
      On the other hand:
      
      India 316
      New Zealand 21/2 (5.0 ov)
      
      I think I’ll go with Reid v SPC for tonight’s entertainment. Can both of you guys go at it for at least 10 rounds please?
      
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      October 1, 2016 7:42pm
      - SPC
        
        I’ll be too busy streaming, sorry.
        
        1 0
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        October 1, 2016 7:54pm
    - Icarus
      
      Stalin and Lenin were not Jews. The people that promoted their thinking were Jews. The brand of communism that spread terror through Central Asia and Europe was a Jewish thing. They killed tens of millions. They ran an extensive network of death camps across many nations. They did far worse than the moderate Nazi party ever intended to.
      
      And the Jewish led holocaust only ended a few years ago.
      
      2 7
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      October 1, 2016 7:58pm
    - Reid
      
      Stalin was, I can’t recall saying that about Lenin. I have said most of the Bolshevik leadership were Jews. Solzhenitzen agrees with me. Like I said, just cos you don’t like it or don’t know it, doesn’t mean it’s not true. Educate yourself.
      
      1 4
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      October 1, 2016 8:31pm
      - stephieboy
        
        Reid , Solzhenitsyn never endorsed your and Hitler’s fantasy about a Jewish Bolshevik conspiracy.
        
        (possibly the deluded Icarus too ? )
        
        .
        
        2 2
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        October 1, 2016 9:06pm
      - Nostradamus
        
        Reid:
        
        I’m pretty sure SPC will link to this comment, so to save time, let’s skip to the endgame:
        
        FC that was the exact same question stupidboy asked, and I won’t be answering it because I explained what the point of that was last night and if you want to know then you should read yesterday’s GD. BTW it wasn’t false. Stalin was a Jew, so was Lenin, and 97%+ of the central committee were also Jews. But I’m not going to discuss that because it wasn’t the point I was making and I don’t care about it. If you do, follow my suggestion below.
        
        As for your other three questions again the same response applies to that which I gave stupidboy. Look it up for yourself. Why do you expect me to explain basic history to you?
        
        Just so you understand, Reid, I want to see both of you debate each other with a sense of gladiatorial spirit. We’ve barely got past one round – and I wanted 10!
        
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        October 1, 2016 9:07pm
      - Jack5
        
        Reid:
        
        Stalin was definitely not Jewish.
        
        He born in Georgia, son of a Georgian cobbler and a Georgian mother, though in a famous poem, Mandelstam, who was to die in a Siberian camp, labelled Stalin an Ossetian. Ossetians are a Caucasian minority who have a language linked to Iran’s Farsi, and whose maternal DNA is Iranian and paternal DNA is Caucasian.
        
        Stalin was educated in an Orthodox Christian seminary in Georgia, and was initially destined to be a priest.
        
        Just before he died Stalin launched a pogrom against Jewish doctors in Russia.
        
        3 0
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        October 1, 2016 10:59pm
Icarus

Give nem boys a peace prize they killed less blacks than Obama. They earned it.
4 6
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October 1, 2016 7:23pm
Don the Kiwi

This is why its getting harder to prevent a Democrat win – those cheating Dems……..

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/09/the_election_is_being_stolen_right_before_our_eyes.html
4 3
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October 1, 2016 7:23pm
- SPC
  
  The USA lacks a neutral bureaucracy, they really should establish one, at least for elections.
  
  Then they might have fair boundaries, and more reasonable rolls for/enrolment of voters.
  
  Nationwide criteria (suit Republicans) and access to convenient places to register (suit Democrats).
  
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  October 1, 2016 7:53pm
Don the Kiwi

Who could doubt this – Democrat controlled cities are socialist shitholes………

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/09/why_the_obamas_did_not_send_their_daughters_to_chicagos_public_schools_.html
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October 1, 2016 7:29pm
Griff

Ok Don the god deluded reading stuff that was not for you is a sin.
Now you have gone all conspirawacky .
No self respected person will be able to buy tinfoil for making up the tinnys because you and the rest of the trumpies will be buying it all for making little hats. .
FWIW
Documented voter fraud is almost non existent in the USA.
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October 1, 2016 7:44pm
- Don the Kiwi
  
  “….voter fraud is almost non existent in the USA.”
  
  AAHhh…hahahahahahahahaha.
  
  Take another toke brother.
  
  And where does this come from???
  “… the god deluded reading stuff that was not for you is a sin.”
  
  Griff, if bullshit was a musical note, you’d be a one hundred piece orchestra.
  
  2 5
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  October 1, 2016 7:50pm
  - Griff
    
    Dear dear .
    
    Would you like to show me proof significant voter fraud ?
    By significant I mean more than say 0.001 percent of eligible votes .
    To swing an election you would need far more than that.
    https://www.brennancenter.org/issues/voter-fraud
    Whacks and conspiracy nonsense .
    Goes with the belief that a teen age girl named Mary is never going to lie about how she got pregnant….The magic sky pixie did it honest……
    
    5 4
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    October 1, 2016 8:03pm
    - Icarus
      
      So did you make those comments when your democrat friends accused Bush of voter fraud ?
      
      Or when your prophet Gore lost ?
      
      Try and think before you comment fool. I don’t enjoy seeing people disgrace themselves as you do.
      
      3 6
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      October 1, 2016 8:07pm
    - nasska
      
      Mary must have been able to spin a good yarn Griff.
      
      How she got Joseph onside has got me beat. 🙂
      
      5 2
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      October 1, 2016 8:12pm
      - Griff
        
        That is simple nasska .
        The old twat Joseph was thinking.
        All I gotta do is put up with the sprog and I can screw this nice young thing into my dotage .
        
        6 3
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        October 1, 2016 8:20pm
    - Griff
      
      Gee its the screen licker Icarus the troll.
      More retarded nonsense from our resident expert.
      I have never said anything but voter fraud is almost non existent in the USA.
      I even back this up with a reputable source.
      I think Al Gore is fat and am not a fan having never even seen his movie .
      In fact strikingly the only ones who gibber on about fat Al Gore are the wackos who think he is some sort of scientist.
      Fat Al is not a scientist you know he is a failed politician.
      
      5 5
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      October 1, 2016 8:17pm
      - Icarus
        
        Do not shame the Prophet’s [Gore] name [may ice be upon him] on KB simply to try and gain an “up-tick”
        
        The world is ending and we can only save it by buying more of the carbon credits from his company that made him a billionaire that can fly private jets around.
        
        2 5
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        October 1, 2016 8:23pm
Reid

The Complete A To Z Of Nations Destroyed By Hillary Clinton’s “Hubris”

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-30/handy-chart-countries-destroyed-hillary
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October 1, 2016 7:45pm
- Icarus
  
  It is not even close to a complete list. And she has promised, her paymasters, to carry on Obama’s war work.
  
  Violent black warmonger, now available in white.
  
  4 5
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  October 1, 2016 7:54pm
  - nasska
    
    …..”Violent black warmonger”….
    
    Yet there are millions of demented SJWs who would happily gargle his bathwater for no other reason than the colour of his skin.
    
    3 2
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    October 1, 2016 8:08pm
    - Icarus
      
      There are plenty of ardent lefties who share my view. They have been cut off by the msm. Even Noam Chomsky and John Pilger are on the outer, and you do not get more lefty than them.
      
      They may be commies, but they are sincere and honest. The two things Obama supporters fear most.
      
      6 2
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      October 1, 2016 8:20pm
    - stigie
      
      Be a darn sight better and healthier to gargle Penny’s bath water Nasska if you were to hang around for a few days i reckon..?
      
      3 0
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      October 1, 2016 8:34pm
      - nasska
        
        I don’t think she has any bathwater stigie. 🙁
        
        6 0
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        October 1, 2016 8:39pm
      - Nostradamus
        
        Stigie:
        
        Be a darn sight better and healthier to gargle Penny’s bath water
        
        Is everything alright at home? Are you getting enough sleep? I’m a bit worried about you to be honest!
        
        5 0
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        October 1, 2016 8:55pm
      - stigie
        
        Thanks for the concern Nostra but it was a bit tongue in cheek. When i get as cranky as Dad, it will be my time to exit ole chap !~
        
        2 0
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        October 1, 2016 9:55pm
- stephieboy
  
  Reid , you can remove Libya and Kosovo from your list . Actions against the respective regimes were sanctioned respectively be Security Council Resolutions 1973 and 1244 with both Russia and China abstaining in the former and China in the latter .
  
  Facts that Tyler Durden will not dare mention !
  
  2 2
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  October 1, 2016 9:15pm
cha

heh

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CtmR7T4WcAApjkS.jpg:large
2 2
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October 1, 2016 8:26pm
- nasska
  
  Which one would you tap cha? 🙂
  
  2 1
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  October 1, 2016 8:29pm
  - cha
    
    . I’ve always been rather keen on the roundie girls.
    
    3 3
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    October 1, 2016 8:36pm
    - nasska
      
      So you’re a chubby chaser then?
      
      Sick bastard! 🙂
      
      4 0
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      October 1, 2016 8:41pm
      - Icarus
        
        People like Griff and cha do not have sex with women, unless they pay for it. Typically they may have some woman give them mercy fucks while the women screw around on them and milk them dry.
        
        3 3
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        October 1, 2016 8:47pm
      - cha
        
        I must confess to rooting the odd ugly manager, too.
        
        2 1
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        October 1, 2016 8:48pm
      - Icarus
        
        Good honest answer spotted ^^^ 🙂
        
        1 1
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        October 1, 2016 10:00pm
- Griff
  
  Its the trumbies ye gotta worry about .
  They pick the one on the right .
  But they got it wrong way around .
  He is gonna screw them Yuge.
  
  3 1
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  October 1, 2016 8:31pm
  - Icarus
    
    Ask Bill who he would screw dimwit.
    
    He did not support Hillary even then.
    
    1 2
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    October 1, 2016 8:34pm
Nostradamus

Father shocked at $1700 bill for teenage daughter’s paintball birthday

Tony Blackwood thought he was giving his 15-year-old daughter the dream birthday party – a day out paintballing with 12 friends. Instead, he was charged $1700 – and he says he was misled by the company.

His wife paid Delta Force a $280 deposit, and expected to only have to purchase paintball pellets on the day.

But when he arrived at the paintball site at Woodhill Forest, west of Auckland, Blackwood was told he needed to pay for upgraded safety equipment, and sold thousands of paintball pellets.

Everything went downhill from there!
4 1
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October 1, 2016 8:33pm
- Icarus
  
  I actually read the link. Why the picture of the tat covered skank with a hicky on its neck ?
  
  2 3
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  October 1, 2016 8:41pm
  - Nostradamus
    
    I think the “hicky” is a series of welts caused by a couple of well-directed paintball pellets. Which makes you wonder why dad thought it was a good idea to buy thousands of paintball pellets!
    
    5 0
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    October 1, 2016 8:50pm
    - Icarus
      
      Nostradamus, I felt like shooting her myself She can help pay dad back from her bennie when when she pumps one out from some random.
      
      This sort of manipulation makes me sick. The photo had nothing to do with the charge of the service. The media are taking the piss.
      
      4 2
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      October 1, 2016 8:58pm
- nasska
  
  …..” he was charged $1700″….
  
  Tony Blackwood doesn’t know he’s alive. If the man ever wants to experience expenditure on teenage daughters he should try raising two of them who are horse mad.
  
  Then he’ll know what wasting money is. 🙂
  
  9 0
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  October 1, 2016 8:50pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Oh goodness..
    try walking past a make-up counter with teenage daughters in tow…
    
    5 0
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    October 1, 2016 9:27pm
    - Nostradamus
      
      Want to tell me the full story Maggy? (I have 3 hours to spare, and Reid v SPC turned out to be a fizzer so I have plenty of popcorn to share.)
      
      6 0
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      October 1, 2016 9:35pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Love to Nostradamus, but I’ll have to rush off to paint my toenails in a bit.
        The little darlings left me with all their one-tenth used bottles of muck…
        Once I never bothered, but now I’m Gizzy, I realise there’s standards to be kept up with… you can’t wear your jandals downtown with exposed footrotted nails.
        
        6 0
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        October 1, 2016 9:59pm
Nostradamus

Family time for Colin Craig in wake of ‘breathtaking’ defamation award

Colin Craig has been enjoying family time and catching up on some work today while digesting the $1.27 million defamation verdict against him.

“I’ve done some work today – I have a busy life – I’ve had some time with the kids and I’ve been doing some work,” said the former Conservative Party leader who was found by a jury yesterday to have defamed Taxpayers’ Union executive director Jordan Williams.

Just a normal day for Colin then. I hear rumours that his next publication will be called “Poetic Justice”.
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October 1, 2016 8:46pm
Icarus

BLACK LIVES MATTER
2 2
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October 1, 2016 9:09pm
- stephieboy
  
  WHITE LIVES MATTER,
  
  https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/07/eb/e5/07ebe5449b7a0ce61580da96401ac684.jpg
  
  1 2
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  October 1, 2016 9:22pm
  - Icarus
    
    Wrong photo. That was a picture of some child rapists hanging after a fair trial.
    
    2 3
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    October 1, 2016 9:32pm
    - stephieboy
      
      Evil nasty troll,
      
      WHITE LIVES MATTER 2 ,
      
      http://img12.deviantart.net/32b0/i/2012/335/d/5/execution_of_a_jew_in_a_nazi_death_camp_by_shitalloverhumanity-d5mq1lr.jpg
      
      and ,
      
      https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/27/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-A0706-0018-030,_Ukraine,_ermordete_Familie.jpg
      
      1 3
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      October 1, 2016 9:42pm
      - Icarus
        
        Why do you hate white people so much ?
        
        If not for them blacks would still be in the stone age selling their people to Arab slave traders.
        
        Why do you think this is okay ? BLACK LIVES MATTER
        
        1 4
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        October 1, 2016 9:45pm
cha

Trump’s sex tape.

https://boingboing.net/2016/09/30/donaldtrumpsextape.html

https://video-cdn.buzzfeed.com/11182/mp4_1920X1080/1475271247
5 2
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October 1, 2016 9:40pm
- Icarus
  
  Great stuff. Now have you got any of the Clinton series, or are you not into rape porn ?
  
  4 5
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  October 1, 2016 10:02pm
RF

After watching Clinton & Trump on CNN & Fox I feel like getting down on my hands and knees and thanking god we only have JK & Angry to worry about.

Both Clinton & Trump are bat shit crazy.

It’s not God save America. It’s god help America.

Time to raise the draw bridge.
5 1
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October 1, 2016 9:53pm
- Icarus
  
  Yes indeed. Its an epic arsehole, or world war 3. Take ya pick Merica.
  
  2 2
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  October 1, 2016 10:03pm
BeeSting

For Stephie Boy

Hmm the people who stopped Napoleon and
Hitler ?

Don’t poke the Bear Folks

Arise, vast country,
Arise for a fight to the death
Against the dark fascist forces,
Against the cursed hordes.

Chorus: (2x)
Let noble wrath
Boil over like a wave!
This is the peoples’ war,
a sacred war!

We shall repulse the oppressors
Of all ardent ideas.
The rapists and the plunderers,
The torturers of people.

Chorus

The black wings shall not dare
Fly over the Motherland,
On her spacious fields
The enemy shall not dare tread!

Chorus

We shall drive a bullet into the forehead
Of the rotten fascist filth,
For the scum of humanity
We shall build a solid coffin!

https://youtu.be/xLi0Fxfqtdk
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October 2, 2016 12:37am
BeeSting

More information to share with Stephie

http://rocksolidpolitics.blogspot.com.au/2014/06/ukraine-bee-war.html
1 0
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October 2, 2016 1:00am

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