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July 21, 2016 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 21 July 2016

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General Debate

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Kimbo

….athough in her haste to target “poverty, alcohol, drugs, gang culture, prisons and other role models for brutal behaviour – in sport for instance – for the root causes of domestic violence in New Zealand”, I’m not sure if Salmond has properly represented Duff’s original suggestion that Maori culture needs to progress, and trying to rejuvenate what has past is a distraction:

Alan Duff: Real men don’t beat up kids

If things are to change, love must be taught as the founding base for a successful family.

We can’t let Moko Rangitoheriri’s death be forgotten – or be a vengeful mob storming the Taupo police cells to lynch Moko’s evil killers.

One of many marches around the country took place in Lower Hutt and there were some brave men who spoke out. I quote Anaru Moke: “I was bashed myself. Who wasn’t?” He says he’s breaking the cycle with his own 11 children. He’s a Mob member. Good on him for speaking out. Here’s Star Olsen: “I knew I had to say something that was at the pit of my stomach. The hardest word for some Maori males to say is sorry.” Including when they just helped torture and murder a child.

It’s a waste of breath to scream that vile punishments should be inflicted on Tania Shailer, 26, and David Haerewa, 46. We’d just be drawn into an endless cycle of violence begetting more violence. But we Maori have to ask why we totally dominate statistics in the killing of more than 200 infants in the past two decades. Why us? The leaders – I mean the cowardly ones staying silent and not joining any of the marches, the ones flying business class to dubious “conferences” overseas – will never do anything to help change the significant percentage of Maori at the bottom of the heap from falling further down into the abyss.

Some Maori have no moral values because they’re not taught them. Violence is perfectly acceptable behaviour, indeed admired; whether it’s king-hitting a stranger in a pub, beating up the wife or partner, thrashing their children.

Families should be issued books on parenting. It must be instilled in everyone’s brains from a young age that certain behaviours are totally unacceptable. Love must be taught as the founding base for a successful family. Education as the way forward. Every act of violence except in self-defence must be socially outlawed, considered a shameful let-down of the entire community.

Cultural leaders should review the entire kapa haka syllabus, I believe. I’m sick of the screaming, eye-popping haka. The standard of predictable, simplistic singing should be lifted. In everyday life, my opinion is girls should be brought up like the French are: to be feminine, take a pride in how they dress, walk with dignity and grace wherever they go out in public and always keep the standards. Boys should be taught to respect females.

Every Maori should get to parenting age knowing a whole set of values on how best to raise a child. It should have been burned into their consciousness that sacrifices for your children are not only an obligation, but a sacred duty.

There would be no shame in taking a leaf out of the Chinese book where parents, family members, all work hard to push a few more up into the educated or business-owning bracket. Reading has to be an essential part of that home environment.

Pre-European Maori culture was simple and no blame is attached. But I think it is when this too basic societal model is applied in the 21st century.

Adolescent boys – and girls – who admit to violent bullying at school or after school have to be punished. Not physically, but grounded, shamed for a period out of the family group. They must have it burned into their brains that violence sucks.

The vast majority of Maori saw the movie based on my book. I went from zero to hero in just a few weeks. Why? Because every Maori – most of whom had not read the book – came out of the theatre in a state of shock and said, “Yeah? What’s the problem? That was our life up on the screen.” Everyone had a Jake as a father, older brother, any number of uncles. Some were women.

Why oh why are we pushing this societal model and calling it our Renaissance? It is no such thing. It is simply a perpetuation of a culture that is irrelevant to this age. We need an outlook of always encouraging our children. Not discouraging, running the kids’ efforts down. From day one at primary school, Maori children should be indoctrinated that it is not done to discourage others from having aspirations.

And someone has to point out that cultural activities do not get them a job or a mortgage.

I am going to ask our Duffy Books in Homes trustees if we can produce some books on parenting to be given out free to all 100,000 homes on our programme. It just can’t go on like this, waiting for the next headline: another child – invariably Maori – tortured and murdered.

March, Maori, march. And change your ways. Real men apologise. Real men look in the mirror and change. Real men don’t beat up kids or wives or anyone else. Real men love. And their children, wives and society advance with them.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11643560
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July 21, 2016 12:35pm
Manolo

Oh dear moment at Clinton News Network, aka CNN.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2016/07/20/carl_bernstein_drudge_an_influence_unequalled_large_measure_of_why_trump_is_the_nominee.html
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July 21, 2016 12:38pm
tom hunter

Keeping Stock (12,332 comments) says:
July 21st, 2016 at 10:58 am
As a long-suffering Hurricanes, Arsenal, NZ Warriors and New Zealand Cricket fan, I am sure I will relate well with Cubs fans
…
Kimbo (6,567 comments) says:
July 21st, 2016 at 11:04 am
Um, are there any others in the KB community who agree that it is time for an intervention to deal with this tragic example of extreme denial coupled with multiple-Stockholm Syndrome?

The Warriors? The Hurricanes?

Pfft. You people know nothing of Stockholm Syndrome – or pain.

And you call yourselves Christians – try carrying the cross for a hundred years, watching the nails being hammered in every, single, year.
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July 21, 2016 12:48pm
starboard

Oh MM, go and hug a tree, or a flax bush..or a murri..
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July 21, 2016 12:50pm
Kimbo

@ tom hunter

…try carrying the cross for a hundred years, watching the nails being hammered in every, single, year.

I must confess waiting some 17 or so years from the time I first became a serious rugby fan and learning the shameful fact that the All Blacks had never beaten the Springboks in a series in South Africa was painful…especially when we weren’t even given the opportunity for the 20 years between 1976 and 1996. But when it came, well, it was worth at least two World Cups to know the great old All Blacks in good teams that had failed over there from 1928 onward were avenged. And they made a fuss about the Cavaliers being aid under the table? Shows how little they knew about the mentality of the new Zealand rugby player of that era. Most would have paid – and usually did courtesy of the thousands of dollars in lost earnings they incurred whenever they toured in those days – just to have a shot at beating those South African b%$@#^*s!

My sweetest sporting-supporters moment, far sweeter than the 2011 RWC win.
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July 21, 2016 1:06pm
Kimbo

There was a great cartoon on the front page of the NZ Herald the Monday after we won that test in Pretoria. A grave of an old All Black (denoted courtesy of the silver fern on the headstone) is disturbed by a triumphant fist from below punching through the earth with the accompanying caption, “YESSSSS!”
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July 21, 2016 1:12pm
tom hunter

@Kimbo
I know exactly how you feel, although in my case the learning came a little earlier as I sat up in the night with Dad watching that godforsaken 1976 series.

Unfortunately I was living in Chicago in the 1990’s so was only barely aware of the event. I knew roughly when it was happening, but only when emails started to arrive from excited friends did I learn the great news, and as much as I savoured it I had no one to share it with. Trying to explain it even to one American friend who knew something of rugby was like – well, trying to explain to most New Zealanders what a Cubs WS win would mean. Just no comprehension: “I thought the All Blacks won most of the time, anyway”.

But yeah – like you, it meant more to me then than any World Cup victory.
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July 21, 2016 1:15pm
Kimbo

It could be worse, tom hunter. At least you don’t also cheer for the Detroit Lions…do you?!

Apparently they had to make a script change in the Clint Eastwood movie, Gran Torino as their committed supporters are so few and resigned to failure:

Producer Robert Lorenz said that while the script was originally set in Minnesota, he chose Michigan as the actual setting as Kowalski is a retired car plant worker. Metro Detroit was the point of origin of the Ford Motor Company. Schenk said that sometimes the lines in the movie feel out of place with the Detroit setting; for instance a line about one of Walt’s sons asks if Walt still knows a person who has season tickets for Minnesota Vikings games was changed to being about a person with Detroit Lions tickets. Schenk said “They don’t sell out in Detroit. And so that bothered me. It seemed really untrue to me.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gran_Torino
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July 21, 2016 1:26pm
tom hunter

Bears supporter natch. I don’t feel as sorry for the Lions as I do for the Buffalo Bills: four successive trips to the SuperBowl and nothing to show for it. Talk about probability hell. If the poor bastards had come away with even one win it would have been bitter – but to come away with nothing after getting there for four years in a row? That’s Red Sox levels of pain.
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July 21, 2016 1:29pm
Fletch

Meme doing the rounds on Facebook. 😆

Melania Trump gave a speech, and suddenly all of Hillary Clinton’s supporters care about honesty and integrity.
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July 21, 2016 1:37pm
Keeping Stock

@ Kimbo & Tom Hunter – it was especially significant that we beat the Jaapies at Loftus Versfeld; in the shadow of the Voortrekker Monument, and the spiritual home of the Afrikaaner. That really was one of the great All Black performances, and I will never forget those last few minutes of frenzied defence, and the look of sheer relief on Fitzpatrick’s face as he punched the Loftus turf.
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July 21, 2016 1:56pm
James Stephenson

Shane “The Flying Mullet” Archbold out of the tour, but finishing today’s stage with a broken pelvis, and you though rugby players were tough.
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July 21, 2016 2:11pm
Manolo

Love according to some bros:
http://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/hone-will-tear-them-apart-labour/ar-BBuzFhm?li=BBqdk7Q&ocid=mailsignout

Potential co-operation between Mana and the Māori Party is being welcomed by Labour’s Kelvin Davis, who believes Hone Harawira will tear Māori Party apart.
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July 21, 2016 2:12pm
Chuck Bird

It must be difficult for the police when they know someone is guilty but know they do not have enough evidence for a conviction. Sadly they occasionally get it totally wrong like in the cases or Thomas, Pora and Ellis. Other times the get a conviction but do not quite join all the dots like in the case of Lundy and Bain. I thought they had it wrong with Watson until I read Ian Wishart’s latest book.

The Big Read: Elaborate police sting to catch baby killer

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11678728
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July 21, 2016 2:12pm
big bruv

Sickening.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/82331428/australian-rugby-union-player-michael-quinn-admits-us-child-sex-charge
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July 21, 2016 2:12pm
Manolo

Cruz refuses to openly endorse Trump:
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/07/20/ted-cruz-booed-at-rnc-after-not-endorsing-donald-trump.html
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July 21, 2016 2:30pm
mikenmild

it’s almost as if Trump had said some pretty nasty things about Cruz and his family. What a shame.
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July 21, 2016 2:33pm
Scott Chris

Day 3 of the RNC, the entertainment continues:

Ted Cruz came out to a hero’s welcome, and earned sustained applause as he laid out a conservative case for governance.

“We deserve an immigration system that puts America first. And yes, builds a wall to keep us safe,” said the senator, in a nod to the now formal Republican presidential nominee.

But the crowd, led by the New York delegation, grew notably restless as the speech went on and Cruz refused to mention Trump’s name. Cruz acknowledged them ― “I appreciate the enthusiasm of the New York delegation” ― but kept soldiering on, a slight smirk on his face.

The restlessness turned to outright jeers when Cruz told the crowd to “vote your conscience” ― a phrase that has been adopted by the group of Republicans who had asked delegates to not coronate Trump as the nominee. And when he declared that Republicans are “fighting, not for one particular candidate or one campaign,” the boos began.

Trump’s children looked on from their box seats, stoic and not applauding.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/ted-cruz-trump_us_579019fde4b0bdddc4d31d0c
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July 21, 2016 2:35pm
Kimbo

@ Keeping Stock

@ Kimbo & Tom Hunter – it was especially significant that we beat the Jaapies at Loftus Versfeld; in the shadow of the Voortrekker Monument, and the spiritual home of the Afrikaaner. That really was one of the great All Black performances, and I will never forget those last few minutes of frenzied defence, and the look of sheer relief on Fitzpatrick’s face as he punched the Loftus turf.

Good point, although no matter what the lead-up form and how superior we look on paper I’m always happy to come out with any win, by a squeaky 1 point if necessary, whenever we play that that nuthouse that is Ellis Park in Johannesburg.

But yes, there were a few ghosts to put to rest at Loftus Versfeld, especially as the last All Black team to play a test there (in 1970) was one of our greatest, and entered the match and series as seemingly unbeatable favourites. Until this happened:

http://springbokrugby.webs.com/Frik%20laidlaw%20tackle111.jpg

Followed by this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eh4qDqe0wuQ
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July 21, 2016 2:56pm
Manolo

Even the veteran Stalinist comrade Yoza would agree:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourdoukoutas/2016/07/18/what-destroyed-venezuelas-economy-big-government-and-anti-americanism/#1f6d51c943d4
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July 21, 2016 3:10pm
Johnboy

There is hope for Nicolas yet Manolo……he can declare his conversion to Islam! 🙂
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July 21, 2016 3:14pm
Manolo

Take a look at the scum Germany is importing with Mamma Merkel’s blessing:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3698818/Did-ISIS-axe-attacker-LIE-Afghanistan-Claims-train-jihadi-hid-Pakistani-background-higher-immigration-status-Germany.html

Pictured in a pink wig at a music festival this is the ISIS fanatic who went on an axe rampage on a German train and may have lied about being an Afghan refugee in order to secure asylum status after claims he is Pakistani.

ISIS used the name ‘Mohammed Riyadh’ to describe him, however, sources close to the investigation in Germany said that he registered in the country as Riaz Khan Ahmadzai.
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July 21, 2016 3:17pm
All_on_Red

Cruz got booed off the stage and then Trump came out and the house erupted in cheers. Cruz scuttled off. So much for Cruz using it as the platform to launch his 2020 Campaign.
This was funny. Even Trumps jet is trolling Cruz
http://www.breitbart.com/video/2016/07/20/watch-trumps-plane-silences-booing-cruz-crowd/
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July 21, 2016 3:27pm
Captain Mainwaring

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/82340521/concerns-sky-tv-curtailing-news-freedom-sees-fairfax-media-withdraw-rio-team

That’s a relief. Yes, Sky are arrogant and greedy but at least this will mean a reduction in the level of media bombardment while the no-longer-relevant Olympics are on.
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July 21, 2016 3:34pm
waripori

Gingrich was the speaker after Cruz and he had a reference on his teleprompter to Cruz endorsing Trump so it looks as though Cruz scammed the Trumpers. It was a big risk putting Cruz on in prime time after Trump insulted his wife and accused Cruz’ father of being involved in the Kennedy assassination. There must have been a chance all along that Cruz would show Trump an upraised middle finger. Lots of pressure on the Donald now to save the convention. Pence does not seem to have made much impact so the two takeaways so far are Melania being a Michelle Obama fan and Cruz standing on his principles. ( There is also the delegate under investigation for inciting Clintons murder ). It will need a big finish now to avoid being a complete disaster and an example of how not
to run a convention.
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July 21, 2016 3:59pm
Captain Mainwaring

This is not looking good.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/82323709/woman-kids-missing-in-te-urewera-for-days
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July 21, 2016 4:00pm
Manolo

How more sensitive can the crooked queen supporters be?
http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/scott-whitlock/2016/07/20/msnbc-warns-sensitive-viewers-showing-anti-hillary-buttons

Warning, sensitive MSNBC viewers may want to look away. That’s essentially what Rachel Maddow told liberal watchers on Wednesday night before showing a picture of anti-Hillary Clinton buttons at the Republican convention. Considering the hateful rhetoric that’s come out of MSNBC for years, perhaps that viewer warning should have appeared in the past.

The buttons included ones that read “Hillary for prison” and “Vote no to Monica’s ex-boyfriend’s wife in 2016.” Maddow informed viewers, “You may find it uncomfortable. And so, you may not want to look at this stuff. But these are some of the pins that are being sold at the venue.”
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July 21, 2016 4:21pm
Kimbo

@ waripori

It will need a big finish now to avoid being a complete disaster and an example of how not
to run a convention.

Oh, come on! The Democrat’s Convention in 1972 is the gold standard for “a complete disaster”. Of Hindenberg/Titanic/”oh the humanity!” proportions!

Due to George McGovern’s machinations after 1968 and the resulting changes in the rules, there was a protracted nomination and voting process for his running mate courtesy of the various radical left activist/delegates who had been given the floor, which included among the 77 nominees, “Archie Bunker” and “Chairman Mao” – both of whom, ironically, may have been less damaging to McGovern than the eventual winner at the convention, Thomas Eagleton, who had to resign when his psychiatric history emerged over the next few weeks

….so that George McGovern didn’t take the Miami stage for his acceptance speech until 2:48 a.m EST – to quote Richard Nixon’s memoirs, “Primetime in Guam, as one wit noted”.

Also from Nixon’s memoirs, recounting a post-mortem some leading Democrats conducted with Nixon’s CR(EE)P campaign staff after the inevitable Nixon landslide, “You guys think McGovern is evil. He’s not. He’s just the most stupid son-of-a-bitch you ever met!”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_Democratic_National_Convention
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July 21, 2016 4:35pm
rangitoto

Ya Cruz, ya Lose.
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July 21, 2016 4:36pm
Captain Mainwaring

This is not looking good.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/82323709/woman-kids-missing-in-te-urewera-for-days

Just as I posted, they were found.
Bad weather coming, very lucky people.
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July 21, 2016 4:43pm
waripori

I know the bar is low but only running the second worst convention since world war 2 is not really the outcome the GOP was looking for.
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July 21, 2016 4:44pm
mikenmild

H L Mencken on political conventions:

For there is something about a national convention that makes it as fascinating as a revival or a hanging. It is vulgar, it is ugly, it is stupid, it is tedious, it is hard upon both the higher cerebral centers and the gluteus maximus, and yet it is somehow charming. One sits through long sessions wishing heartily that all the delegates and alternates were dead and in hell—and then suddenly there comes a show so gaudy and hilarious, so melodramatic and obscene, unimaginably exhilarating and preposterous that one lives a gorgeous year in an hour.
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July 21, 2016 4:50pm
waripori

Just to add to the dodgy timing, Trump has just given an interview to the NYT in which he said he will not necessarily come to the aid of the Baltic states if Putin sends in the tanks. This after Christie spent his energy saying Clinton would not be the right person to stand up the Russians and Trump would be better. How does someone like Mike Pence swallow Trumps views?
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July 21, 2016 4:50pm
Kimbo

@ waipori

I know the bar is low but only running the second worst convention since world war 2 is not really the outcome the GOP was looking for.

Hmm. No, there is still one that is just below the Democrats of 1972 – the Republican Convention of 1964 that nominated Barry Goldwater. Who, having waged a bitter and divisive campaign against his ideological rival, New York Governor Nelson Rockefeller, and badly needed to unite the party, then took to the stage and included in his address the incendiary words,

“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!”

…to which the incumbent Democrat President Lyndon Johnson responded with:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Id_r6pNsus

and

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-VzZQGWOqA

…and in the post-mortem between Johnson’s campaign staff and what was left of a decimated GOP leadership after the inevitable LBJ landslide, the Republicans said, ““You guys think Goldwater is evil. He’s not. He’s just the most stupid son-of-a-bitch you ever met!” 😉
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July 21, 2016 5:01pm
mikenmild

Same anecdote about two politicians, Kimbo. Both apocryphal, I guess.
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July 21, 2016 5:03pm
Keeping Stock

@ big bruv – once again the media omits to mention until the very last line that the team Quinn was a member of was the Melbourne Chargers had travelled to the USA to play in a gay rugby tournament. He’s likely to get plenty of practice at rolling mauls and gang tackles over the next 10 to 13 years, and it’s hard to have any sympathy towards him.
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July 21, 2016 5:05pm
waripori

We will have to wait for Trump tomorrow to see what he can salvage. You would think he will have a carefully crafted masterpiece which has been polished over months but who could predict what he will do. At the moment if he just reads whatever it is without saying something really incendiary off the cuff it will probably be considered presidential.
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July 21, 2016 5:08pm
Rachael Membery

Banner ready, where’s the next march for Moko, now that an appeal has been lodged.
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July 21, 2016 6:49pm
rangitoto

Looks like Labour and Greens tactics are good.

https://public.tableau.com/static/images/Ne/NewZealandPrimaryVote2002-2014/NZVotingIntention/1_rss.png
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July 21, 2016 7:27pm
dirty harry

Hows the car grooming business going scott chris ?
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July 21, 2016 7:29pm
EAD

Prominent tribe member György Schwartz (George Soros to you Goyim) orders Europe to commit genocide or else he and fellow global banksters will force them into economic suicide.

(“George” of course being the funder of racial agitation movement Black Lives Matter + the Ukrainian Coup + the SPLC + “aid agencies” whose sole purpose is to funnel millions of Africans into Europe.)

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-07-20/george-soros-doubles-down-accept-300k-refugees-costing-30bn-or-risk-eu-collapse

I’m just waiting for Gyorgy to announce that Israel should also take even just a couple of refugees. Surely what’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander Gyorgy?

Gyorgy? Gyorgy? Gyorgy?

Crickets…………
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July 21, 2016 7:36pm
Keeping Stock

@ rangitoto – another rogue poll from Roy Morgan, surely. Labour at 25.5%; say it isn’t so!
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July 21, 2016 7:36pm
nasska

Isn’t that a low & a new record KS? 🙂
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July 21, 2016 7:38pm
EAD

Thank God Labour are on 25% and are nowhere near the levers of power.

Imagine what we would get if they ever got into power

*overwhelming levels of immigration,
*record low interest rates make our debt sustainable in the short term, but discouraging savings
*racial politics,
*nanny state interventionism,
*regulation after regulation that makes it easier on corporates but tough on small business,
*all sorts of radical social engineering,
*bowing down to radical minority parties,
*Nothing done on the RMA,
*An underfunded military
*A presidential style leadership where dissent is not allowed

Just imagine it!
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July 21, 2016 7:51pm
Happychappy

I wonder how minnie mouse at the standard is feeling after trying to take the Mikey out of National with the their poll last week that put Labour and the Greens on 45% and National on 42% makes him look like the fool he is
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July 21, 2016 8:10pm
RF

Morgan poll result and Not a mention in the standard about the dirty big elephant running riot in the room. Hope it’s not too windy in Wellington for Grants BBQ this weekend.

Not sure how Angry is going to explain 25.5 to his caucus as they have been waiting for this result as their internal polling apparently showed 35+.

I can hear the screams from the crypt….. Why Me !!!!!!!!!
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July 21, 2016 8:12pm
Stars And Stripes

“Banner ready, where’s the next march for Moko, now that an appeal has been lodged.”

Meeting place and march starts from your nearest KFC ending at your nearest appliance store where a two year old will be put through a spin cycle.
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July 21, 2016 8:14pm
Brigitte

Roy Morgan, oh dear, never mind. The lefties wanted a “rouge” poll (favouring the rouge = red) but instead the poor dyslexics only got *another* “rogue” poll.
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July 21, 2016 8:20pm
Captain Mainwaring

25.5% for Liarbore is an excellent result – it’s 0.5% better than they did in the 2014 election.
National at 53% on the other hand, seem to have picked up all of the Conservative vote, plus a big chunk of NZF, Maori and Mana.
Long may it continue. Let’s hope the next TV1 poll has the angry little unionist at 5% or less and his carcass of a party at 22% where they belong.
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July 21, 2016 8:22pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Here’s the Roy Morgan Poll result
http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/6902-roy-morgan-new-zealand-voting-intention-july-2016-201607211639

Brief summary
National 53%…… +10% from previous poll
Labour 25.5%…. . – 2.5%
Greens 11.5%…… -3%
NZ First 7%………. -2%
Act…….1%…………+0.5%
MP…….0.5%………-1.5%
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July 21, 2016 8:22pm
Johnboy

I hope Roy isn’t Gareths bro. Folk would tell him anything he wanted to hear to get rid of him! 🙂
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July 21, 2016 8:27pm
Kimbo

@ Maggy Wassilieff (& Brigitte)

Here’s the Roy Morgan Poll result…

Hmm. Genuinely seems like a rogue result IMHO, and usually consistent trends are more important than one-off results (unless it is the poll that counts – the election!).

But the Labour result I can believe. A foolish decision to abdicate their “major party” status by entering into a formal partnership with the Greens gets the scorn and contempt it deserves.

But housing has been a problem for National, so I doubt they have suddenly surged to their highest rating in the last 8 years. Mind you, maybe the full-blown recovery is underway and is being reflected in the polls, despite growing media pressure about the afore-mentioned housing “crisis” and poverty…
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July 21, 2016 8:34pm
AgentBallSack

Only a 1/4 of nzers are retarded enough to vote labour now. 10% prius driving fart sniffing greenie assholes and a cold winter killed off 1/4 of Winnies electorate.

“Excellent”
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July 21, 2016 8:54pm
Brigitte

Just a thought on the housing crisis. Clearly any mismanagement (or perception thereof) could result in middle NZ changing camps (but quite possibly to NZ First rather than Labour or Greens).

But, the lower paid and first-home buyers are possibly mainly left voting anyway. So this crisis won’t give a swing to the left from this portion of the voters. However, home owning middle NZ (particularly in Auckland) will be buoyed by the price rises (and various inactions) and more likely to stay/move to National.

The swing to National does look a bit high but I’m not convinced that its totally over the top as some might suggest. There is an opening for the left, but they have to start looking a bit more competent than at present if they want to see an upward move in their polling.
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July 21, 2016 8:56pm
RF

It’s funny. Over on the standard whose members are in shock / denial tonight – It’s a rogue poll and to be dismissed.

The last poll was good for Labour and they were singing in the tree tops, divvying up parliamentary seats amongst labour & the greens.

Kids being let loose in a sweet shop.
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July 21, 2016 9:03pm
Kimbo

@ Brigitte

The swing to National does look a bit high but I’m not convinced that its totally over the top as some might suggest. There is an opening for the left, but they have to start looking a bit more competent than at present if they want to see an upward move in their polling.

Yeah, that is fair. You think about what the opposition parties have offered by way of coherent policy, or competence, or leadership…and by default National does not deserve to be trailing the NZ First-Labour-Green triumvirate.

But if your take on rising housing prices benefiting a larger section of the electorate and lifting National’s support is correct, then any sudden “readjustment” in the market before the election next year could be very difficult for them to negotiate. As per Harold Macmillan’s reply when asked what was the driving force in politics, “events, my dear boy, events…”
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July 21, 2016 9:09pm
stephieboy

ABS. well certainly most likely more than any party you would support . Which would be what if you don’t mind me asking ?

Now let me guess ?

This fellow ?,

Xenophobic Right Wing Resistance leader fears ‘white race’s survival’ in NZ

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/xenophobic-right-wing-resistance-leader-fears-white-race-s-survival-in-nz-q08399
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July 21, 2016 9:11pm
Manolo

@stephieboy: Would you choose socialist Labour over the tree-hugging, multiculturalist, communist Green Party?
Please do tell.
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July 21, 2016 9:15pm
stephieboy

Manolo , first things first . Do you support Trump’s idea of allowing more nations to stock and use Nuclear weapons ?

Do you think Vaughan Tocker Right Wing Resistance would admit you into his party on say a honorary white basis ?
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July 21, 2016 9:18pm
Manolo

A feeble attempt at deflection, stephieboy. I guess you do not want to answer the question, do you?
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July 21, 2016 9:24pm
stephieboy

Manolo, why should I ?
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July 21, 2016 9:29pm
RRM

Say what you like about the standard – but if he says he’ll ban you for two months, he means it and he always lifts the ban at the end of the two months.

I’ve learned to push his buttons well enough that I can pretty confidently get banned in a single comment. It’s low-cost entertainment: 🙂

http://thestandard.org.nz/why-do-they-hate-us/#comment-1206851
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July 21, 2016 9:30pm
Manolo

There is a moral obligation to declare your political affiliation, i.e., I’m a proud libertarian. So Green or Labour for you?
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July 21, 2016 9:32pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@stephieboy

Manolo, why should I ?

Because we all value your political judgement.
Because we can’t think for ourselves and we need you to guide us.
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July 21, 2016 9:35pm
stephieboy

Maggy Wassilieff ,

Because we can’t think for ourselves ..?

Is it that bad ?

You may want to try this tomorrow on RNZ 7 -12pm ?

David Icke interview ,
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July 21, 2016 9:38pm
Reid

Because we can’t think for ourselves ..?

Well let’s put it this way stephie. Some are better at it than others.
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July 21, 2016 9:43pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@stephieboy

You may want to try this tomorrow on RNZ 7 -12pm ?

Alas, I’ve got another 30 or so roses to prune…….
Tell you what,…. why don’t you tell me now what I will think of the interview, as you have this fabulous facility of always knowing what I am thinking before I do.
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July 21, 2016 9:51pm
stephieboy

Reid, and what are your qualifications ?

This kind of thing,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xv0FUVeZbYA
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July 21, 2016 9:54pm
Reid

The swing to National does look a bit high but I’m not convinced that its totally over the top as some might suggest.

Maybe it’s a reflection of how unbelievably and incredibly bad Liarbore is at this point in the cyle. As well as the equally unbelievable and incredible vacuousity in the media these days.

I think when Kiwis realise they’re living on a tightrope and all that would take is a global downturn and a Chinese demand to repatriate all that money they’ve lent out to people who’ve bought in Vancouver, Melbourne, Sydney and Auckland, both of which are on the horizon, and in a heartbeat they’ll wake up.

But right now, they’re living the dream, hallucinating their new-found super-equity is wealth, not debt, so don’t be epecting any of them to recognise that anytime soon.

What it’s done is change the lifestyle equation. Because now, if one wants trade up, instead of what used to be a manageable additional debt load, it’s now massive, simply to get the minimal trade up. But no-one’s noticed that yet, but they will.

Anyway the lack of transmission of all these aspects as well as the root cause of it all used to be the vacuous media’s raison d’etre but none of them have been practicing anything like that for decades now. Shame really, it used to be quite useful.
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July 21, 2016 10:02pm
EAD

Reid,

Not sure if you’re reading other threads but here is great article by Amy Brooke that I just linked to.

https://100daystodemocracy.wordpress.com/2016/07/21/a-disengaged-government-arrogant-biased-media/

Personally, I regard here as NZs best and most courageous socio-political commentator. I’m sure you’ll appreciate her forthrightness….
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July 21, 2016 10:06pm
Reid

Excellent site EAD, thank you.
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July 21, 2016 10:22pm
wreck1080

Religion of peace strikes against Australia….

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/attempted-terror-attack-at-merrylands-police-station-in-western-sydney-report-20160721-gqb3ve.html

Saying the majority of muslims are peaceful so we should let them live here is of little comfort.
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July 21, 2016 10:56pm
chiz

Bankers dispute Trump’s story of financial comeback.
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July 21, 2016 10:56pm
All_on_Red

Manolo
More like Internet Party for Stephie and its fellow trolls
Haven’t you drawn the dots yet?
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July 21, 2016 11:00pm
Andrei

LOL – A Ukrainian sold by the Poles to the Exceptional Nation
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July 22, 2016 7:04pm

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