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January 2, 2016 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 2 January 2016

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General Debate

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Jack5

Good night folk. Blaze, you’ve reinforced my prejudices about economics degrees.
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January 2, 2016 11:27pm
blazeoflight

Jack5

This is not the 1840s

FFS.
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January 2, 2016 11:28pm
The Bangles

Jack5, I don’t disagree with your last point. You have to have money to make money, in that I’m in total agreement. However all I’m simply saying is the definition of native means you are Maori. 2ndly, Maori have certain rights. Now, if a group of Maori want to sell their land, to start up a business their is no reason that they cannot. If 20 people own the land, they can sell it and start up a business. But 1 person can’t unless the lot of them agree.
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January 2, 2016 11:28pm
blazeoflight

@The Bangles

Jack5 is obviously either ignoring or is ignorant of the many ways Europeans devised to dispossess Maori of their land. Legally or otherwise.

One tactic was to isolate one man in a tribe, invest in him the authority to act in the name of the tribe, and get him to sell the land.

Another was to impose a tax, knowing that the tribe couldn’t pay, and take the tribe to court to confiscate the land for non payment of the tax.

And, of course, if all else failed, there was always always the Army.
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January 2, 2016 11:50pm
The Bangles

Well Blaze this is how I interpret things. A contract is only valid if both people have of their own choice given something of value, in a non pressured way. So any land that was not sold in this way, has not been sold in a legally enforceable way. So therefore compensation must be paid. Having said that, Maoris have received a certain level of compensation. Some would say enough, some would say not enough. What I’m simply saying, is that because at least some of the land was not sold in a legally enforceable way to begin with, this is why compensation has been demanded.
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January 2, 2016 11:58pm
blazeoflight

Sure, Bangles.

On a different plane, I would argue that this English legal principle A contract is only valid if both people have of their own choice given something of value, in a non pressured way. doesn’t apply in the case of European colonisation of New Zealand.

In every case.

But I appreciate your intervention.
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January 3, 2016 12:04am
blazeoflight

I see we made 300 before midnight.

Johnboy will be pleased.
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January 3, 2016 12:06am
The Bangles

Blaze, I’m not saying that, that principle was applicable many decades ago. What I’m simply saying is that, compensation is applicable because the Maori were not treaty fairly. And the fact that some of the sale of land was sold at gunpoint has something to do with compensation.
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January 3, 2016 12:12am
blazeoflight

Ok

No argument there.
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January 3, 2016 12:21am
blazeoflight

From NZ Herald

Israel’s Arabs, who make up a fifth of the country’s 8.4 million population, enjoy full rights but have long complained of discrimination and unfair treatment in areas such as housing and employment opportunities.

-AP

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11568439

On the other hand

http://www.onepalestine.org/resources/Israeli_Apartheid_Laws.html
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January 3, 2016 12:29am
Kiwi_in_Paris

https://nz.news.yahoo.com/top-stories/a/30469441/warning-over-new-border-tax/

I wonder what would happen with returning New Zealand citizens who refuse to pay or don’t have the bucks?

Would they be held in transit? Or an IOU I suppose.

Either way, it sucks to have to pay to return to your home country. So much for the welcome home and the free cup of tea.

Key may have been better to not let the terrorists in, in the first place.
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January 3, 2016 12:41am
itstricky

He said, “Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912.” I said, “Die, heretic!” And I pushed him over.

Under the status quo, no part of what is designated as common territory may be so much as rearranged without consent from all communities. This often leads to the neglect of badly needed repairs when the communities cannot come to an agreement among themselves about the final shape of a project

In another incident in 2004, during Orthodox celebrations of the Exaltation of the Holy Cross, a door to the Franciscan chapel was left open. This was taken as a sign of disrespect by the Orthodox and a fistfight broke out.
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January 3, 2016 1:12am
rangitoto

“Maori were warriors, no question about that. However, they had been isolated from most of the world for so long, their warfare was almost a millennium behind. ”

More like six millenia or more, they didn’t even have the bow prior to European contact. Their technology was at the neolithic stage. Not to say they weren’t good fighters or quick on the uptake.
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January 3, 2016 1:51am
Manolo

The mullahs are taking Obama for a ride:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/01/02/lawmakers-blast-white-house-delay-on-iran-sanctions.html?intcmp=hpbt2

Leading lawmakers, including supporters of President Obama’s nuclear deal with Iran, rapped the White House for delaying fresh sanctions on Tehran over its missile program, warning that the move would embolden it to further destabilize the Middle East.
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January 3, 2016 2:58am
Left Right and Centre

They’ve certainly learnt enough rudimentary English to communicate with the evil oppressors . . .

Shut up. Shut up honkey. Fuck you. Shut up. Think you own this country ? Fuck up honkey. Fuckin honkey.
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January 3, 2016 6:05am

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