General Debate 15 December 2015

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Manolo

@Johnboy: I could not possibly comment, mate. 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:00pm
Johnboy

It was Lucy Lawless I was thinking of Don. But seeing you’ve put a vision into my tiny brain I may just have to pop off for a wank old chap! 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:02pm
EAD

http://henrymakow.com/2015/12/terrorism-the-bitter-truth.html

Their power originates in the private central banking cartel which produces the means of exchange (currency) in the form of a debt to itself. Currency is nothing but a coupon that government could easily produce debt-and-interest free. The Bankers must prevent any country from doing this by establishing a world tyranny (“world government, globalism”). As soon as one country tries to escape the net, the others will invade.

They use false flag terror to concentrate totalitarian power in the State (which they control.) They are not satisfied with a monopoly over credit. They seek a complete monopoly on human life–political, economic, mental, cultural and spiritual. They want your property. More important, they want your soul. They want your spouse and your children (feminism, homosexuality, sex ed). This is the meaning of Communism and the goal of the NWO.

Because of the “debt,” most governments (and nation states) are nothing but facades for the bankers. I liken them to high school student councils……

All major social institutions have been subverted. But thanks to the media, the public is none the wiser. Their secret societies control government, business, the church, military, education and law. It is considered a breach of good taste to even mention this.

Democracy is a form of social control and a charade. TPTB sponsor most “grass roots” activism.

Our political leaders are Freemasons. The only difference is the speed with which they enact the NWO agenda.

We have de facto Communism. The news consists of psy ops and propaganda. Entertainment is social engineering and satanism. Religion is suppressed.

Would so many Fortune 500 companies spontaneously promote diversity and homosexuality if they weren’t all controlled by the bankers? “Political correctness” is an old Communist Party term.

Multiculturalism, miscegenation, homosexuality and feminism are not about “tolerance and human rights.” They are about shredding the social fabric, dissolving European Christian culture and civilization.
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December 15, 2015 7:09pm
Johnboy

Yer bloody slow today minus old chap….You’ve missed one at 11:12! 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:10pm
stigie

That was a quick wank JB…?
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December 15, 2015 7:11pm
Johnboy

And another at 10:44! 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:13pm
blazeoflight

This lady has been reading my posts on Kiwiblog

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/our-addiction-to-oil-means-that-climate-change-and-conflict-in-the-middle-east-now-go-hand-in-hand-a6771471.html
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December 15, 2015 7:14pm
nasska

EAD’s diary entry 15th December 2015:

“Attention US government: I am NOT a paranoid conspiracy theorist.”
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December 15, 2015 7:14pm
Johnboy

Lucy the nun just doesn’t do it for me anymore stigie?

Still I can see why the Aussie Red can get his rocks off saving the planet with Lucy! 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:15pm
SPC

The blue and black fern and stars has stayed in front of red and blue fern and stars and won the first round of flag voting. FWIW.

It will lose 60-40 to the current flag in March.

Both flags could do with an upgrade (like America’s Cup boats do between rounds) before the final “run off”.

The black and blue blue is too dark and the stars should be white only. A better radical re-design would have taken the stars off, and placed the fern across the diagonal or in the centre, with black above and a lighter blue below.

The current flag, should also go to a lighter Pacific or Sky blue to distinguish it from the Oz flag colours. And more radically incorporate a white racing stripe – to note that Aotearoa is now one of the official names of New Zealand.
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December 15, 2015 7:19pm
EAD

@ Nasska,

Much better a “paranoid conspiracy theorist” than a docile consumer of the shit they pass off for news these days. I mean, even average schmoes like yourself can detect the b/s they give us when it comes to “climate change”, “multiculturalism”, “ISIS” etc. so what makes you think anything else they push upon you is actually real or not part a bigger NWO agenda?

I mean, look at what they were pushing nearly 100 years ago:

http://irishsavant.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/unnerving-report-from-washington-post.html?m=0
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December 15, 2015 7:23pm
Reid

Reid, I don’t see how China is advantaged by the City of London clipping the ticket on Chinese financial investment abroad

SPC if you’d bothered to have read the article you’d have seen that wasn’t at all what it was saying, so I therefore conclude you’re one of the stephiebots and not the real, often astute (but not this time) SPC.

I’m hoping this logical conundrum causes a power surge in the CPU and at least one of the stephiebot drones crashes and burns and no longer blights the otherwise bright KB GD skies.

OTOH if it really was you SPC, you should be ashamed and I hope you are.
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December 15, 2015 7:23pm
Johnboy

Just to remind all you folk what a class act Red Norman has lined himself up with! 🙂

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pk-qKY_sFR8
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December 15, 2015 7:25pm
nasska

….” average schmoes like yourself can detect the b/s they give us when it comes to “climate change”, “multiculturalism”, “ISIS”, so makes you think anything else they push upon you is actually real or not part a bigger NWO agenda?”….

In my defense I don’t believe in God or Allah so I’m not terminally gullible. 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:26pm
Johnboy

Surely you believe in Abracadabra nasska?

I do…. If it wasn’t magic how do they get those eggs out of their ears and that big fluffy bunny out of the empty top hat eh? 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:31pm
nasska

Compared with religion, Greenpeace & the US government a bit of magic seems pretty straightforward & credible JB. 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:35pm
Shawn Herles

“In my defense I don’t believe in God or Allah so I’m not terminally gullible.”

Good distinction between God and Allah there nasska. You’re half way there! 😉
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December 15, 2015 7:35pm
SPC

nasska, Allah is just Arabic for “the God”. People joining them in using the Arabic term Allah turns Arabs into special people who think they can kill others to please “the God”.

Thus it is a form of dhimmitude to terrorists.
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December 15, 2015 7:36pm
Shawn Herles

“Much better a “paranoid conspiracy theorist” than a docile consumer of the shit they pass off for news these days.”

False choice EAD. It’s perfectly possible to be skeptical about the liberal bias of the msm, without being a gullible, docile consumer of loons like Makow, or Kremlin funded outfits Global Research and Veterans Today.
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December 15, 2015 7:38pm
Johnboy

I’d still like to believe in Santa but I am starting to wonder how a real fatarse like him can get down the six inch diameter chimney on the woodburner? 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:39pm
Johnboy

If Santa isn’t real I’d really like to know who drinks the bottle of scotch I leave out for him. 🙂

I asked the wife if she knew but she just said drink your bottle and go to sleep like you always do on Christmas eve.
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December 15, 2015 7:41pm
Reid

It’s perfectly possible to be skeptical about the liberal bias of msm, without being a gullible, docile consumer of loons like ~~Makow~~ National Review.

Plus of course getting purple with furious rage whenever anyone disagrees with me.

Possible?

Certainly.

Correct?

Captain Bananas springs to mind.

Acceptable?

Ditto.

Sane?

Ditto.

Logical?

~~Ditto.~~ Furious anger building.

Sensible?

~~Right, that’s fucking it~~ Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh.
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December 15, 2015 7:42pm
Don the Kiwi

Partly right, SPC

You may recall a couple of years ago that a radical Muslim group in Malaysia said the Christians could not use the word “Allah” for God.

Problem is, Christian Arabs used the name “Allah” for God 600 years before Islam – Muslims – came on the scene.
The main difference is, of course, that Christians have a totally different understanding of the nature of God to what Muslims do. And that is one of the main causes of conflict between Christians and Muslims.
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December 15, 2015 7:42pm
nasska

It’s actually a form of dhimmitude to the paper thin sensitivities of the Godwhacked amongst us SPC. If you don’t despise all the terminally confused equally they think they’re being discriminated against.

I hate to be accused of favouritism! 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:42pm
Manolo

Miss Dim could make a buck selling (hot) Auckland air:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/peoplesdaily/article-3359154/Bottles-fresh-air-Canada-hot-sale-China-smog-remains-high.html

Since China’s capital city Beijing issued its first ever air pollution red alert last week, sales of bottled Canadian fresh mountain air to Chinese customers have soared.
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December 15, 2015 7:44pm
Shawn Herles

http://www.someecards.com/usercards/viewcard/MjAxMS1lZWIzMzAwODIxOGFjMWQ3
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December 15, 2015 7:45pm
Shawn Herles

Take your meds Reid, your insanity is showing again. 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:46pm
SPC

Shawn there is a dual bias to the MSM – in favour of the global market/capitalism and liberal social progressiveness. The social conservative nationalist (anti-immigration) for nation state autonomy and self-government and the socialist are the ones marginalised and vulnerable to alternative media CT.
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December 15, 2015 7:47pm
Reid

If Santa isn’t real I’d really like to know who drinks the bottle of scotch I leave out for him.

We used to leave lots of bottles of our parent’s booze out for Santa Johnboy and we all made sure they knew how disappointed we’d be if they weren’t all empty on Christmas morning.

Worked well for both parties.
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December 15, 2015 7:47pm
stigie

I believe in Santa JB when Mrs Claus yelled out the back door, “come in out of the rain dear”.
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December 15, 2015 7:48pm
Don the Kiwi

Time to introduce some Christmas cheer 🙂

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af7LwnA913g
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December 15, 2015 7:49pm
Manolo

Unintended consequences:
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/isis-terror/university-iowa-change-name-isis-online-portal-after-complaints-n479686

The University of Iowa plans to change the name of its online portal — the “Iowa Student Information System” or “ISIS” — in the wake of recent attacks by the terror group that uses the same acronym.
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December 15, 2015 7:52pm
SPC

Don, there is some difference between Arabs using the term Allah before Islam and non Arabs using the term Allah after Islam was established. The later indicates dhimmitude, in the sense of a second class status to non Arab Moslems.

I see a parallel to the use of a Hebrew term for God as a name for God, it encourages a more dogmatic and intolerant faith.
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December 15, 2015 7:52pm
nasska

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8m2fqyanw5j7jf7/Xmas%2028.jpg?dl=0
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December 15, 2015 7:52pm
Don the Kiwi

SPC.

Agreed. 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:53pm
Johnboy

I think you should say five Hail Marys and ten Our Fathers for posting the 7:49 Don! 🙂
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December 15, 2015 7:56pm
Don the Kiwi

Humour is always humour, johnboy.

Language is mainly subjective. 😉
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December 15, 2015 8:00pm
Manolo

@Johnboy: Nothing beats a good selection of Christmas carols sung by Frank Sinatra and Ella Fitzgerald. Great music!
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December 15, 2015 8:02pm
Lucia Maria

Morrissey,

Jack5: I’d wager Bill Clinton’s weekly whoring budget that “Lucia Maria” has never read a sentence of Dostoevsky in her life. Certainly, her credulous recycling of anti-Russian propaganda shows that she hasn’t read anything about the bloody U.S.-backed neo-fascist coup in Ukraine.

No, you’d be wrong. A number of authors that I have read have quoted Dostoevsky.

And since as of the writing of this post you are at a whopping 12 comments, I’d wager you’ve missed all the arguments I’ve had over nearly the last 2 years with proponents of the “U.S.-backed neo-fascist coup in Ukraine” myth.

I’m amazed that anyone still believes it, but here you are.

Ukraine: The Haze of Propaganda
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December 15, 2015 8:06pm
Manolo

Incredible. The lunacy or incompetence of the American government
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/12/14/agents-reportedly-blocked-by-secret-us-policy-from-looking-at-social-media-visa-applicants.html?intcmp=latestnews

A secret U.S. policy that prohibits immigration officials from reviewing the social media messages of foreign citizens applying for U.S. visas was reportedly kept in place over fears of a civil liberties backlash and “bad public relations.”
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December 15, 2015 8:08pm
Manolo

Seeing is believing:
http://www.foxiness.com/world/2015/12/15/saudi-arabia-announces-anti-terror-alliance-islamic-nations/?intcmp=hplnws

RIYADH, Saudi Arabia – Saudi Arabia said Tuesday that 34 nations have agreed to form a new “Islamic military alliance” to fight terrorism with a joint operations center based in the kingdom’s capital, Riyadh.
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December 15, 2015 8:14pm
Reid

The Russian Defense Ministry won the quote of the week award with its “theater of the absurd” description of the US State Department’s and Pentagon’s denials that they knew anything about Turkey’s aiding and abetting ISIL via the massive oil smuggling operations from Syria. They were lying of course, and admitted that Turkey was guilty for not only the oil smuggling but all the other supplies crossing the border for ISIL.

US Special Envoy Amos Hochstein had earlier said the amount of oil being trafficked into Turkey was insignificant. And then US coalition spokesman Colonel Steve Warren went even further by saying, “Any thought that the Turkish government is somehow working with ISIL is just preposterous and completely untrue.”

Every major intelligence agency and military with communication intercept and satellite capability has been watching this go on for a long time now. And what cab driver in the world does not know that nothing moves through Turkey without Turkish Intelligence knowing, and getting a piece of the action for its bosses? If ISIL were a problem in Turkey, it would not last over 48 hours.

How did all the Western ISIL smuggling deniers pull the scam off for so long? The possibilities are that they were stupid and incompetent; they had been ordered to lie to the world and their own people for political reasons; or legal ones, like aiding and abetting in a crime against humanity. Or… maybe they are the real Axis of Evil, something I do not say flippantly, as the pile of dead and wounded, the tortures and executions, and over ten million refugees is no joking matter.

When democratic governments pander such pathological lies in front of those they have taken an oath to protect and defend, is it unfair to describe them as evil? And when the evil train leaves the station and we see more state leaders running after it, like David Cameron with his claim that Britain had an obligation to bomb ISIL in Syria to help protect the 70,000 in the Free Syrian Army, is that not manipulation on an evil level?

I can’t leave out the Qataris and Saudis, with their undying support for their Wahhabi brethren who became the Founding Fathers of the Muslim Axis of Evil. They of course think they are accountable to no one, including God, which I think was a bad move on their part and one they will regret.

But none of this has bothered their Western partners who make money selling them huge amounts of weapons to protect themselves from the retribution that they know they are due. Having a nuclear big brother with not only a Navy but a huge air transportation capacity to project power is not a luxury but a necessity when being a smaller country-sponsor of terror…

http://journal-neo.org/2015/12/13/who-is-the-real-axis-of-evil/
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December 15, 2015 8:43pm
Shawn Herles

“I’m amazed that anyone still believes it, but here you are.”

It fits an anti-Western narrative Lucia, so the facts of the issue just don’t matter to some people. But good on you for fighting the good fight.
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December 15, 2015 8:49pm
Reid

This is a good article, written by someone quite intelligent who doesn’t mince words.

Tummy warning ahead: Russians aren’t the dummies most of you guys are. As I’ve said before, a Russian Masters degree is the equivalent of a Western Ph.D. and you can tell, from this article, they understand. Whereas we in the West, don’t. Or more correctly, a few of us do, but the problem is, those of us who do and aren’t evil try to explain it to you but you don’t listen, and those of us who do and are evil, just do whatever the fuck they feel like and the rest of you just go:

Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

http://thesaker.is/russia-in-an-invisible-war/

If you care to educate yourself, like the Russians did in this article, everything changes. If you don’t, you’ll be destroyed.

I wish I was joking.

And education has nothing to do with IQ and everything to do with an open mind.
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December 15, 2015 8:53pm
Andrei

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USGm321weVM
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December 15, 2015 9:04pm
Shawn Herles

“f you care to educate yourself”

Reading Kremlin funded web sites and loon sites like Makow and GR is not educating yourself, it’s being gullible.

“If you don’t, you’ll be destroyed.”

By whom?

“I wish I was joking.”

Well you do provide a lot of humor for the rest of us. 🙂
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December 15, 2015 9:05pm
Shawn Herles

The worse Russia’s economy gets, the more dangerous Putin becomes

“You might reasonably conclude that the destruction of Russia’s economy is great news for the United States of America. After all, won’t it humble Vladimir Putin, forcing him to finally back out of his disastrous Ukraine invasion, soften his growing hostility toward Europe and the US, and generally ratchet down the brinksmanship and aggression that have made him so troublesome?

Actually, it’s the opposite. The odds are that Russia’s freefalling economy will make Putin even more aggressive, more unpredictable, and less willing to compromise. The weaker that Russia becomes, the more dangerous it will get, and that’s terrible news for everyone, including the US.

It is precisely because the cratering economy is weakening Putin that it will force him to bolster his rule, which he will almost certainly do by drumming up nationalism, foreign confrontations, and state propaganda. Russia, already hostile and isolated, is likely to become even more so, worsening both its behavior abroad and the already-significant economic suffering of regular Russians. The country’s propaganda bubble will further seal off Russians from the outside world, telling them that Russia’s decline is the fault of Western aggression that they must rally against.

In all, this effect is starting to look something like the North Koreaification of Russia. That does not mean that Russia is about to become or will ever be as isolated, hostile, or aggressive as North Korea, but it only has to edge a little bit in that direction to bring terrible consequences for the world and for Russians themselves.”

http://www.vox.com/2014/12/17/7401681/russia-putin-ruble
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December 15, 2015 9:15pm
Shawn Herles

Is Putin a pedophile?

“Putin says: ..kissing boy’s stomach was like stroking a cat.. Russians finally got an answer to the question thousands of people wanted to ask President Vladimir Putin – why did he kiss a small boy on the stomach? During a live webcast today Mr Putin explained that the incident in the Kremlin on June 28, when he encountered the boy, called Nikita, lifted his shirt and kissed his stomach, was a spontaneous gesture similar to stroking a cat. It seems like President Putin is totally unable to handle his desires – even in public.”

http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-67573
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December 15, 2015 9:18pm
Reid

Andrei thanks for that 9.04.

This is v worthwhile if you haven’t already read it.

http://galacticconnection.com/secret-history-revealed-putin-played-critical-role-after-the-pre-planned-collapse-of-the-ussr/#sthash.qZ2Am3uN.c1bLDlAh.dpbs

Captain Bananas of course gets all excited because he can’t distinguish site from content. More fool him. Hardly possible is it, considering how much a fool he already is, even without that addition to his fool-ish repertoire.
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December 15, 2015 9:23pm
Awww C-mon

The Shawn and Reid show on GD,

Bored enough to Squizz at both whale-get-fucked and stranded, normally loonies at both of them.

Rather pluck eyeballs than even check on PG…

Options??
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December 15, 2015 9:25pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@Awww C-mon

how about reading some Dostoevsky….
suitable titles for today….
“Poor Folk”
“the Idiot”
“Demons”
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December 15, 2015 9:29pm
mikenmild

AC
Sticking pins in your eyes?
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December 15, 2015 9:34pm
nasska

….”Options??”…..

It must be about your turn to check up on Baity. 🙂
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December 15, 2015 9:35pm
mikenmild

The institution has visiting hours, nasska?
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December 15, 2015 9:39pm
Awww C-mon

I will take MM’s idea over yours Nasska

If I can’t pronounce it why read it Maggy, and ‘Poor Folk’ would be a struggle
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December 15, 2015 9:43pm
blazeoflight

@Shawn Herles

Have you seen Putin’s horizontal folk dance partner?

I would go slippery seconds on her any day!
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December 15, 2015 9:47pm
Awww C-mon

“Poor Folk”
“the Idiot”
“Demons”

According to my reading tonight this describes those going for the Dorkland mayoralty
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December 15, 2015 9:48pm
Awww C-mon

Have you seen Putin’s horizontal folk dance partner?

I would go seconds on her any day!

Wow! Someone has changed and relaxed of the weeks, now even keen for Putins sloppy seconds!

(Sorry Maggy)
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December 15, 2015 9:50pm
blazeoflight

Turkey complains Russian jets are compromising its sovereignty.

Great is the furore within NATO.

Turkey shoots down a Russian jet, killing one person.

Great are the threats emanating from NATO towards Russia.

Turkey invades Iraq, capturing a large swathe of Northern Iraq.

Iraq’s government protests vehemently.

NATO is quiet as a mouse.
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December 15, 2015 9:56pm
Andrei

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wr485UBwhNg
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December 15, 2015 9:57pm
cha

All class.

Trump Supporter Yells “Light The Motherfucker On Fire” As Protester Is Dragged Away At Rally

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mbvd/trump-supporter-yells-light-the-motherfucker-on-fire-as-prot#.nnWObYMyX3
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December 15, 2015 10:57pm
Jack5

More on comparative court penalties and the weird imbalance of penalties.

As posted above, the guy whose little Jack Russell terrier jumped out he truck window at Milford Sound and mauled a weka was fined more than $1200.

In Christchurch today, a property developer who, in a fit of road rage, tried to run down a man out walking with his children, terrifying the family and fatally injuring the family dog, has been sentenced to a mere eight months home detention. Twenty-four-hour TV. I hope he chokes on his popcorn.

If the MSM would republish a photograph of this scumbag it would help those of us living around Christchurch to stay out of his way. Some might be tempted to carry something heavy in their vehicles in case they have the misfortune to be the subject of his next outburst. Self-protection seems to be required.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/crime/news/article.cfm?c_id=30&objectid=11561461
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December 15, 2015 11:10pm
UrbanNeocolonialist

Religious kids less altruistic than non-religious:
http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822%2815%2901167-7
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December 15, 2015 11:12pm
Jack5

Further to the road rage thug in my 11.10 post.

This link gives a fuller picture of the road rage attack on the man out walking with his family.

Part of the sentence is anger management. A good hiding would be the most effect anger management lesson for this ratbag.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/75140467/home-detention-for-driver-andrew-george-mcdaniel-who-ran-over-puppy-and-hit-man
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December 15, 2015 11:23pm
Viking2

What a fucking stupid condescending out of touch woman this MP is.
Absolutely no ideaat all. Doesn’t even know what happens in her own home town.

(Not excusing the fellow but reality is a long long way from her experience in life. No wonder we have problems. )

Bishop’s arrival in Southland has been met with strong comments from politicians, who are debating Australia’s new immigration rules, which state non-citizens can be deported if they fail a “character test”.

National MP Sarah Dowie said she had some simple advice for Bishop.
Te Tai Tokerau MP Kelvin Davis says this is what he predicted will happen.
CAROLYN ROBERTSON/FAIRFAX NZ

Te Tai Tokerau MP Kelvin Davis says this is what he predicted will happen.

“My message is he better keep his nose clean,” she said.

“We have a great police force down here and we’ve got one of the lowest crime rates in the country. So my advice is he better take himself down to WINZ and get a job.”

Police were doing a “fantastic job” keeping tabs on deportees arriving from Christmas Island and elsewhere, as well as reducing general offending, Dowie said.

“At the end of the day, we have New Zealanders here that are offending regardless of the deportee issue. But the police are doing a fantastic job.”

=============================

So because she sucks up to the plods that’s the answer to everything. What a wanker she is. she should actually go get herself involved in helping some of these people. Many of us have done for years. It just ain’t that simple.Human emotions being what they are.

Its not the police he and others need but rehab services and work.

And before you all rant would you as an employer take someone on?
It’s not an easy thing to do without agency support. If you think so put your hand up.
It can be and often is successful., but takes patience and like any journey has it’s ups and downs.
but it’s not your job is it?

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/75105509/christmas-island-deportee-andre-bishop-feels-like-a-foreign-person-in-home-town-of-invercargill

National MP for Invercargill Sarah Dowie advises Bishop to “take himself down to WINZ and get a job”.

I’ve been here over a month and I’ve applied for about 50 or 60 jobs. So far I’ve only had four interviews.”

Bishop said as soon as potential employers learned he had been in prison, they terminated the interview.

“I’m not going to lie, so I say I’ve been in jail. That’s it and they say ‘see you later’.

A long way between Downies reality and that of any offender. (regardless of the offending.)
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December 16, 2015 6:15am
Manolo

A prediction that did not eventuate:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2015/12/15/jeb-bush-vowed-that-donald-trump-would-be-in-decline-by-dec-15-that-didnt-happen/
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December 16, 2015 6:40am
Manolo

His political opponents riot:
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/263221-scuffles-erupt-at-trump-rally

A campaign rally for Donald Trump on the eve of the GOP presidential debate in Las Vegas was repeatedly interrupted by protesters and marred by several scuffles, according to reporters at the scene Monday night.

A Washington Post reporter described “chaotic physical confrontations” at the rally, with Trump turning to mock members of the media for covering the protests, suggesting cameras only show the size of his audiences when there’s conflict in the room.
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December 16, 2015 6:47am
tom hunter

That’s because you have a lot of serious reading to do. You know nothing about the coup against Iranian democracy. I suggest you start by clicking on the link I provided.

Zzzzzzzz

Read it over a decade ago in the NYT, and even then it added little to the information that had been seeping out into the public domain since the 1970’s. I’ve been aware of the “coup” in Iran in 1953 since I first read about it in the 1980’s: how could I not be, being surrounded by lefties who’ve been screeching about it since at least then. Funny how Guatemala hardly gets a look in, probably because the “blowback” argument can’t be tied to that one very convincingly.

It always amuses me that almost every new lefty on KB is determined to spread The Way, The Truth, and The Light about subjects they’re convinced right-wingers know nothing about. Next it’ll be Jimmy Carter telling Saddam to attack Iran, or the Iraq sanctions and dead children, or Vietnam, or quotes from Pilger – or some other shit that’s been debated here almost from the start of Kiwiblog in 2003.

By contrast, I’ll bet you’d never read about those aspects of Mossadegh, who is always portrayed in that fairy tale as the great democrat and liberal. I might as well just watch the opening monologue of Argo.
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December 16, 2015 7:05am
SGA

@tom hunter at 7:05 am
tom, small ask. Would you mind putting the author/time when you quote someone – that way another reader can quickly flick back to see the context of the original comment? (If it’s very recent, obviously it’s less of a hassle, but when it is hours ago…).
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December 16, 2015 7:20am
tom hunter

Good point SGA. Thanks. Will try to remember to do that.
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December 16, 2015 7:24am
SGA

Cheers.
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December 16, 2015 7:25am
mikenmild

tom
I’m not such a fan of ‘good guy/bad guy’ versions of history. What probably counts is what people take way from events. Many Iranians still regard Mossadegh as a true patriot who tried to combat the autocratic tendencies of the Shah and rein in the foreign oil companies. He failed: the UK and USA overthrew him and the coup remained a rallying point for all opposition to the Shah’s regime and to foreign dominance in Iran.
Whether Mossadegh was a true democract of not doesn’t really matter to this narrative, which emphasises his patriotism.
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December 16, 2015 7:27am
SGA

General comment – I’m not an expert on Iranian history, but what I do know leaves me with a sense that there was a missed opportunity there. Even with it’s theocratic elements, relatively speaking it even now seems more progressively inclined than some of its neighbours (some of which are seen as more “friendly” to the West). Fair?
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December 16, 2015 7:36am
Manolo

The savages know how to make money:
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/12/15/terror-tax-isis-turns-to-religious-tithes-to-pay-jihadists-salaries-services/

The ISIS terror group has earned hundreds of millions of dollars through taxation and confiscation, enabling it to pay the salaries of jihadists and cover the cost of other local services, according to a published report.
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December 16, 2015 7:45am
tom hunter

mikenmild (17,957 comments) says:
December 16th, 2015 at 7:27 am

Practice, even though it’s redundant here.

I’m not such a fan of ‘good guy/bad guy’ versions of history.

Me neither, but history as a morality play is the standard, and I don’t object to that too much until I’m confronted with the whole, you really don’t know much about …. that accompanies the tale. Cue eye-rolling.

What probably counts is what people take way from events. Many Iranians still regard Mossadegh as a true patriot who tried to combat the autocratic tendencies of the Shah and rein in the foreign oil companies.

Sure, but why dress up that common wisdom as being all there is to know? Just the brief note I gave yesterday should be enough to question the myth of the “autocratic” Shah. The place was a constitutional monarchy, not a democracy, and the Shah fired quite a few PM’s before the “coup” as well as afterward, with nobody claiming they were coups, even though the country had seen riots and protests on the streets in earlier times as well. Moreover, the fact that Mossadegh actually demanded emergency powers from the Shah – and failed to get them, in the Shah’s usual feckless, vacillating style – should cause anybody to question who was the autocrat?

And this is before even getting to the internal politics of the CIA and the egos of those involved, for whom the Iranian events were almost forgotten before they found the need to build the story up in the early 1960’s to compensate for their clusterfuck in the Bay of Pigs: See! We can overthrow governments. Here’s Kermit Roosevelt, he knows how to do it.

Not to mention the fact that the current Iranian government love grinding this particular mill to serve their own ends – even though their own school text books play down Mossadegh and praise the Mullahs of the day – not mentioning how many of them were opposed to Mossadegh and wanted him gone.
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December 16, 2015 7:46am

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