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August 22, 2015 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 22 August 2015

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General Debate

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Dennis Horne

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
There was a Pin-Up-PM called Key
Who was pretty slick with repartee
You couldn’t catch him out
And he’d wander about
Looking like Crocodile Dundee
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August 22, 2015 8:01am
igm

The time has now arrived for taxpayers to totally fund State housing by way of free power, free heaters, free rodent eradication, free section clearing and lawn mowing, free food for the kids bred for income whilst attending school, free access to all medical requirements, interest free loans for the purchase of late model cars seen parked on berms with impunity. This seems to be the demands MSM and leeches of the left require those already paying too much support for the wrong types breeding feral brats.
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August 22, 2015 8:02am
duggledog

The Auckland Housing Crisis is solved!!! And Labour never even thought of it –

Maori King Tuheita (the illiterate truck driver) lays claim to the Entire Auckland Region!!!

Chinese speculators run a mile from this illogical nightmare in an irrational country

All Hail King Tuheita!!
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August 22, 2015 8:04am
Paulus

In the Ashley Madison scandal – being the theft of theoretically private data, who is and is intent of causing the most distress
– yes the Media of course.
I have not ever used such a site so really couldn’t’ care less, but still respect privacy whatever.
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August 22, 2015 8:12am
duggledog

Unfortunately you are right on the money IGM. The problem is not that there are just so many of them (who depend on the state and expect the state to be the answer to everything) – but there are even more who will have somehow got themselves just over the line in life and will be sympathetic to their ‘plight’.

By this I mean folk who f***ed around for most of their working lives, then got it together at the last minute, got settled, got a mortgage and say a government job. Who don’t – and never have – made a net contribution. So many of them. I know loads.

Add to this the many many more sickly hand wringing well off John Campbell types and you have got the massive (potential) voting block that keeps this country back and will do for some time yet.

Wouldn’t it be interesting if, every year, every citizen of New Zealand was given a breakdown of what they earned, and what they cost.

Roll on the day when Chinese outnumber Europeans. But then it won’t be New Zealand any more. Funny old world.
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August 22, 2015 8:14am
UglyTruth

Fuck Wikipedia.

This is a great piece about astroturfing by Sharyl Attkisson. The Wikipedia info starts at around 4:00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bYAQ-ZZtEU
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August 22, 2015 8:14am
peterwn

Latest state house ‘episode’ appears to be a weathertightness issue. Hopefully Housing New Zealand gives high priority to such issues although are somewhat dependent on tenants reporting issues with sufficient accuracy. One would also hope that Housing New Zealand are not so hidebound with its procedures and its relationship with tradies that it is unable to arrange urgent responses to weathertightness issues.

Interestingly the family in question refused alternative housing as location was inconvenient and even refused the offer of a motel pending repairs. If the family was really concerned about health of their children, they would have rapidly availed themselves of such options.
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August 22, 2015 8:23am
BananaLama

Apparently three US Marines stopped a terror attack in France after they heard him loading his Kalashnikov in the toilets.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/france-3-people-wounded-in-shooting-on-high-speed-train/

#IWillRideWithYou
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August 22, 2015 8:23am
ross411

Dennis Horne (3,992 comments) says:
August 22nd, 2015 at 8:01 am
There was a Pin-Up-PM called Key
Who was pretty slick with repartee
You couldn’t catch him out
And he’d wander about
Looking like Crocodile Dundee

I know you like to sit there waiting for the daily GD post to appear so you can get this schlock in first, but it’s getting pretty weak.

Downvote if you want more poetry from Dennis.
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August 22, 2015 8:25am
FeralScrote

Oh dear,Russell “the Constitutional Peasant” Brand has chucked in the towel ,the multi-millionaire vegetarian commie appears to be suffering a crisis of cognitive dissonance.
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August 22, 2015 8:26am
stephieboy

Ugly Truth, but of course the Kremlin never manipulates their media over e.g flight M17 and the Ukraine ?,

http://www.whathappenedtoflightmh17.com/how-the-kremlin-tries-to-manipulate-your-opinion-using-trolls/

Wiki pedia a tool of of the Zionist / jews ?
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August 22, 2015 8:31am
big bruv

I was sitting early this morning at Auckland international airport awaiting the arrival of a family member from the UK, whilst waiting I was reflecting on the impression that our national airline’s cabin crew give first time arrivals into New Zealand.

I had more time than I have anticipated to ponder this question and used that time to come to the conclusion that at first international visitors must wonder just why so many men who work for Air NZ as cabin crew members are gay, however, very quickly they would have the answer to that question. All these visitors have to do is look at the female cabin crew, I have never seen such a collection of old boilers and fat arsed (just how do they make it down the aisles?) female cabin crew. I am sure that many first time arrivals think they are going to a country that idolises 1970’s Russian discuss throwers.

There must be a way to pension off these old dragons, surely it must be a safety issue if their arses block the aisle of the plane. Either way it is not a great look.
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August 22, 2015 8:33am
holysheet

There was an old scroat called Dennis
He thought he was a bit of a poet
Alas it was true
that he was caught trying to prove it
until someone cried
He’s not a poet
but doesn’t yet know it
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August 22, 2015 8:40am
srylands

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11501042

So essentially the Council is forcing people to park dangerously. The quoted Council spokesperson sounds brain dead.

This is the same Council that Penny Bright wants to run more services because she thinks Council workers are more efficient than the private sector.
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August 22, 2015 8:40am
srylands

Big Bruv I fly frequently. I have experienced many more hot Air New Zealand flight attendants than I have lard arses.
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August 22, 2015 8:42am
Paulus

Both the Herald and Dom have copies of handwritten notes left by Estate Agents trying to drum up business.

In Tauranga they have no hesitation in phoning you. Why waste paper. They are in a real state the Agents as houses are selling to people on waiting lists within days – only a hardened few go to auction. If you want to move locally or downsize or whatever you call on the offices and tell them what you are looking for.
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August 22, 2015 8:42am
G152

Watching that item on the ‘bad’ conditions of the house with
mold and holes in the walls and the ill child made me wonder
as to what exactly is going on there.
Mold can be cleaned up, it takes a little work I know and the
holes in the wall didn’t get there by accident.
And why didn’t they accept alternate accommodation?
It didn’t appear that the mother was employed…

I suspect another media beatup
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August 22, 2015 8:47am
oldpark

Heard on the Larry show last night,with his interview with a guy called Paul Moon from AUT on maori claims for Auckland. Their claims according to him are occupancy in the seventeen hundreds by Maori in Auckland district. { I KID YOU NOT}
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August 22, 2015 8:47am
calendar girl

Bruv, we’ll all be quite happy for you to post a photo of your arse for comparison!
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August 22, 2015 8:49am
Inandout

duggledog: King Twoheater, the Logistics Transportation Executive, will be on every Auckland real estate agents’ lips this fine morning. The hurdles that homeowners now jump when a Maori ‘cultural site is ordained, will be nothing compared with a Maori owned Auckland, where an Iwi levy will have to be paid on every house sale, and every rental payment. Key will need to move swiftly on this because the property market and shoal fish have similar behavioural patterns. Thanks to the internet these insane Maori claims are witnessed by every potential international investor, and the mere fact that Paul Moon and other ‘experts’ say this claim has basis, should be a flashing red light.
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August 22, 2015 8:50am
Viking2

The worst part of king Two Heaters speech was that Key sat there and soaked it all up. His minister has said that there may be a claim.
Time the Nats. and their brown fear got sacked.
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August 22, 2015 8:55am
BananaLama

The rest of New Zealand might get their wish and have Auckland become a separate part of NZ if that went ahead Inabout.
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August 22, 2015 8:56am
mikenmild

We read poetry on Kiwiblog
Lacking rhythm or a rhyme
Dennis brought it down
Wrecked for all of time

I think Kiwiblog is going through a (probably unnecessary) phase of demonstrating the mechanics of bad verse.
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August 22, 2015 8:58am
Nostalgia-NZ

I’m not looking forward to it but the size of bruv’s arse will be interesting compared to other NZ hostesses, as will any cultural tattoos showing above or below his flax ‘dress’ when he throws down the challenge to you his UK guests one of whom is rumoured to be Boy George.
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August 22, 2015 8:59am
Jacob

Looking at the down ticks for Dennis’s inane “poem”, and the upticks for ross411, 8.35am comment, one could wonder why Dennis would, of his own free will, reduce himself to the popularity of Penny Bright.
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August 22, 2015 9:06am
Viking2

Now one would think that doing a property inspection after giving the required notice is a normal innocuos part of a rental Property Managers role.
Well apparently not.

An Invercargill company will give its property managers self-defence lessons and perhaps arm them with pepper spray after allegations that one of its employees was attacked during a routine house inspection.
Pride Property general manager Jackie Alexander said the incident on Thursday was a “big wake-up call” for property managers in Invercargill.
Alexander said Pride Property had 500 properties on its books and had been in business for a decade, but the alleged assault on one of its staff members was a first.
“Nothing like this has ever happened before,” she said.
She has postponed all the company’s house inspections until they had done everything they could to make sure the staff were safe when going into people’s homes.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/southland-times/news/71325571/southland-property-company-to-give-selfdefence-lessons
========================================
Of course Now the Nats. the bumbling fools have introduced the new H & S rules where does that go?
I pointed out to Mr Foss some months ago after the Oamaru shooting of the Winz people and the subsequent prosecution of Winz by Mobie that we are entering the stupidity of armed guards for everyone.

Does every property manager now have to go to inspections with armed guards because that’s what is the ultimate end to this H & S discussion.
No matter what you do Mobie will say you should have done more to protect your staff.

Just last week I went with a property manager to inspect a house only to be accosted by a very unreasonable stupid fucking doped up Maori in the neighboring house on the same driveway,who was intent on having a fight. Was it my fault that the state can’t/won’t lock these arseholes up where they belong.?

Were we supposed to take an armed guard or a policeman to enter our own property along a shared driveway?

What would Mobie have done had he attacked the Lady Property Manager going aboput her lawful business. would her employer been liable because they didn’t foresee being attacked by a fucking mad fruit cake?

We are entering the state of mind of the yanks with there guns etc. Ask any traveler that goes there these days how it is.
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August 22, 2015 9:07am
Inandout

Viking2: I well remember when the Maori airwaves claim was announced and the people said ‘no, this is crazy’, they had no radios or TV pre white man, it won’t have legs. Well we witnessed a meltdown by soft cock politicians and Maori got their way, with lots of sweeteners thrown in. The biggest worry is that thus far Key has not shown the steel that Helen displayed when dealing with the foreshore debate, he merely crumbles or passes the bomb to Maori loving Chrissy Finlayson.
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August 22, 2015 9:08am
oldpark

THE EMBARGO SAGA. Ancient Celtic in New Zealand. In view of believe it or not Maori claims for the Auckland district. The time has come to lift the 75 year embargo to 2063 on the Celtic structures around Taupo. The result would prove once and for all the type of residents in NZ long before a guy called Kupe or similar arrived in the country.Makes one wonder what is there to hide,by restricting further investigations on the structures by archeological excavation. The great embargo until 2063 needs some sunlight placed on it.
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August 22, 2015 9:08am
mikenmild

Bu there are no ‘Celtic structures’ around Taupo. Idiot.
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August 22, 2015 9:16am
duggledog

Inandout

Key will not ‘move swiftly on this’

That I can promise you. He doesn’t move swiftly on anything; ‘incremental radicalism’ remember. Look at all the bloody crooks running about with guns in the last couple of weeks or cutting off ankle bracelets – precisely f*** all in response from Government, who I pay vast amounts of tax to, to enfore job #1: keep me and my fellow citizens safe.

F*** all.

You really can’t blame the maories, they are taking advantage of the situation that opens up before them. They know they’re untouchable.

It’ll be interesting to watch this one unfold.
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August 22, 2015 9:16am
wiseowl

You’re right Viking.
Foss is indeed a bumbling fool of the first order.

On Auckland and king Two Heated.

Talkback last night was painful with a host that says we really need to address these claims and how whitey took away their land even after they sold it. blah, blah, blah, blah.
Same old crap.
This is going to continue until we have someone with the balls to say enough.
Time for Maari to start thanking us and paying us back for their saviour.
National are a major fail and finlayson should be removed.
Special thanks to Palmer.
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August 22, 2015 9:19am
Inandout

duggledog: I fear you are correct on this, Key will procrastinate. Shit I wish we had a decent (sane) alternative to National.
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August 22, 2015 9:19am
stephieboy

DPF and David Seymour dipping into your pockets with venture capital ?

School cash flows to owners’ pockets,

Charter schools pay hundreds of thousands in governance fees.

“Some of the country’s flagship charter schools are paying their owners hundreds of thousands in governance fees to help manage average rolls of just 70 children.
An analysis of audited financial returns has shown administration and management at the publicly funded, privately run schools form a large part of their costs – up to 40 per cent of total salaries.
Principals from state schools say the proportion they spend on administration staff ranges between 10 and 25 per cent.
All of the $14 million of charter school funding came from the Government, with none of the first five schools partnering with business or other private backers in the way envisaged under an election deal between National and the Act Party…… “

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11501047
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August 22, 2015 9:22am
Inandout

wiseowl: I listened to that (radio live?) host as well; what a dick. And all the born again Moddies phoning in supporting the claim, seeing lots of $$$$$.
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August 22, 2015 9:23am
duggledog

Oldpark: I’ve seen those in Taupo and the fabled ones in Waipoua, and the wall etc, all total bull shit dreamed up by conspiracy nutters!

Don’t get your hopes up old chap – !

But inandout – if Paul Moon thinks there may be something in it, then I would take it very very seriously. That guy knows more about this country’s history than anyone else including Finlayson I would warrant.
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August 22, 2015 9:23am
igm

Finlayson and Woodhouse should both be arseholed immediately. Like many others, I am seriously considering defecting to another party to support and donate to. In the past few months these two MPs have proven to be absolute goobers. Slobcom should have been in the States and Murri should have been told “go away the cupboard is bare”.
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August 22, 2015 9:25am
Inandout

igm: ‘Finlayson and Woodhouse should both be arseholed immediately’. Not sure Woodhouse would enjoy that.
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August 22, 2015 9:27am
SGA

big bruv at 8:33 am

the conclusion that at first international visitors must wonder just why so many men who work for Air NZ as cabin crew members are gay.

I suspect that’s an international perception of male cabin crew, big bruv.
Check out The Foo Fighters video release of “Learn to Fly” as an example. Fun video, imho.
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August 22, 2015 9:29am
oldpark

The government enigma ,The Kaimanawa wall on the Southern end of Lake Taupo. A proven Celtic structure. Government have embargoed information until 2063.
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August 22, 2015 9:31am
mikenmild

The Kaimanawa ‘wall’ is a natural rock formation. Not ‘proven’ at all.
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August 22, 2015 9:33am
billmurray

I am not sure but I think that I can hear a very faint drumbeat, hardly discernible, coming from the Labour party. Started by a guy called Roy Morgan.
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August 22, 2015 9:38am
UglyTruth

The Kaimanawa ‘wall’ is a natural rock formation. Not ‘proven’ at all.

Yeah, and NIST really wasn’t lying about the explosions.

http://www.ancient-origins.net/sites/default/files/field/image/kaimanawa.jpg
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August 22, 2015 9:38am
SGA

Amateur Poets
Test the limit of free speech
Who would have thought it
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August 22, 2015 9:40am
mikenmild

Hi Ugly
Check out this fun game:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Fun:The_9/11_Truth_Drinking_Game

I shouldn’t believe anything on the ‘ancient origins’ website if I were you. All theories of pre-Maori settlement have been thoroughly debunked.
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August 22, 2015 9:41am
oldpark

Daily a sicko pest who goes under the name of meat head mild or similar,is single handedly daily destroying Davids very good blog site. I notice the person who calls himself milkenmild takes every chance to personally abuse every blogger that does not suit his sicko psyche. Wonder why such a self appointed bully has been getting away with total written verbal abuse,for such a long time. There appears to be no leeway by such a self appointed pest.Wonder what the criteria is on Davids blog site is for self appointed sicko psychopaths hiding under the name Milkenmild,who should have been admitted to a mental facility,a long time ago.
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August 22, 2015 9:44am
mikenmild

I’m sorry I called you an idiot, oldpark. ‘Deluded’ would have been a more appropriate label for a believer in the Kaimanawa ‘wall’.
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August 22, 2015 9:47am
stephieboy

Ugly Truth, and old park ,Kaimanawa wall ?? Including artefacts-flints, pot shards , tools , ash pits and other signs pre Maori habitation ?

Dargaville’s media should honour the town’s intellectuals, not its resident crackpot

http://readingthemaps.blogspot.co.nz/2010/11/dargavilles-media-should-honour-towns.html
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August 22, 2015 9:52am
Paulus Gnome

I emailed the horrid yesterday asking about reporting on the latest Roy Morgan poll; they have said they will get back to me in two days . . . . .

Did I miss it reported somewhere or should I continue not holding my breath?
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August 22, 2015 9:55am
publicwatchdog

I don’t ‘blow the whistle’ to be popular.

Feel free to provide the evidence which proves I’m factually inaccurate?

Penny Bright
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August 22, 2015 10:09am
publicwatchdog

Whistleblower Penny Bright
Posts FACTS which often cause great fright
Politically – like Dennis
She’s obviously a menace?

There you go Dennis!

LOVE your poetry 🙂

It’s helped inspire me!

Carry on …. 😉

Her Warship
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August 22, 2015 10:18am
mikenmild

Usually you make a lot of sense, Penny. But loving Dennis’s ‘poetry’? Seriously, that puts you well within the fringe. Luckily, it’s not too late to seek professional help.
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August 22, 2015 10:20am
Inandout

Paulus Gnome: The Morgan Poll was in the Horrid, but you had to dig for it, and most people just skim over the site.
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August 22, 2015 10:31am
UglyTruth

I shouldn’t believe anything on the ‘ancient origins’ website if I were you. All theories of pre-Maori settlement have been thoroughly debunked.

Is that like when you lie about a point being rebutted a thousand times, mikenmild?
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August 22, 2015 10:34am
publicwatchdog

Mikenmild – I am consistent in my defence of ‘freedom of expression’ and this IS ‘General Debate’?

Feel free to robustly debate my opinion 🙂

Kind regards

Penny Bright
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August 22, 2015 10:35am
doggone7

big bruv (@ 8:33 am

Indeed there are ways to address those serious problems. Get members from your wider family to line up at Air NZ doors applying, nay demanding, the jobs.

I realise those many from the whanau involved in the Miss Universe, Miss World and myriad Miss Gorgeous contests will be delighted to divert their pulchritude to the airways for the sake of national dignity. The ‘real men’ you have in the NRL Aussie Rugby league comp. would crash over and through each other with more power and oomph than they give to their everyday shoulder charges to get on board. Those lining up to receive their PHDs will surely love to flourish their diplomas up and down the aisles with the coffee carts too.

The would be recipients missing out will be perturbed, but your other lot, those lining up to donate their brains for transplant to the needy, could turn back from their supreme sacrifice for the good of the nation.

Direct them all to: https://careers.airnz.co.nz/search-jobs/recruitment-process
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August 22, 2015 10:36am
Inandout

stephieboy: I don’t know if there is evidence of other peoples settling before Maori, but if there was do you honestly think that the Maori industry would allow the government to reveal it? The truth will out some day (one way or the other) when Maori culture doesn’t hold the government to ransom.
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August 22, 2015 10:37am
mikenmild

Ok Penny. Your opinion about Dennis’s poetry is rubbish.

Ugly: once again, disagreeing with you does not constitute ‘lying’. Feel free to advance any evidence you think may indicate pre-Maori settlement of New Zealand. I shall attempt to convince you that it is a load of nonsense.
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August 22, 2015 10:38am
calendar girl

stephieboy @ 9:22am – Given your customary political views, it’s no surprise that you’re against charter schools. But seriously, I don’t think you understand the differences between “governance”, “management” and “administration”.
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August 22, 2015 10:39am
stephieboy

Ugly Truth, shall wee begin with two items :

1 . As mentioned earlier any artefacts , tools, pot shards , cooling ash pits etc constant with a pre Maori white celtic settlement ?

2. DNA evidence from skeletal remains especially those Maoris who is claimed inter married with the celtics ?
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August 22, 2015 10:40am
G152

This statement has been proven wrong many times

The government enigma ,The Kaimanawa wall on the Southern end of Lake Taupo. A proven Celtic structure. Government have embargoed information until 2063.

It is a natural formation and that sort of fracture pattern is common in the area..
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August 22, 2015 10:41am
stephieboy

calendar girl, what id understand is that according to the Herald report an inordinate amount is going into running these charter schools as opposed to actual teaching their students.

ACT and David Seymour also envisaged that private investment would feature in the running of these schools and so far none is forth coming .

Why ?
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August 22, 2015 10:46am
UglyTruth

Ugly: once again, disagreeing with you does not constitute ‘lying’.

Right. You calling PRATT when the point hasn’t been rebutted once constitutes lying.
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August 22, 2015 10:47am
mikenmild

But I only call PRATT when some crazy theory has indeed been rebutted a thousand time. Like all the 9/11 myths or the moon landing ‘hoax’.

But today I’m more interested in fringe theories about pre-Maori New Zealand settlement. The basics of New Zealand’s settlement were well known by the late 1960s and archaeological, linguistic and DNA evidence since has only strengthened the consensus. The motivations behind the ‘alternative’ theories are fascinating. Disturbingly, there seems to be a strong link to white supremacy and neo-Nazi ideas.
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August 22, 2015 10:52am
wiseowl

Inandout @9.23
Both hosts last night were illinformed .
What was surprising is the one that is a lawyer started to commend the decision of Cook re the so called (not any) principles of the treety and suggested that judges are the right people to give us guidance.
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August 22, 2015 10:52am
nasska

mikenmild

….”There are over 100 historical sites around the country pointing to the reality of settlement here long before the Maori arrived and the Government has slapped embargoes on the scientific findings to ensure our current generation never learns of their findings.”….

http://www.openureyes.org.nz/blog/?q=node/4180

Given that we supposedly live in an open democracy with no need to muzzle scientists why on earth do you think an embargo on knowledge should have been imposed?
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August 22, 2015 10:52am
UglyTruth

It is a natural formation and that sort of fracture pattern is common in the area..

Why do you say that the similar rock patterns in that area are natural?
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August 22, 2015 10:53am
nasska

Straight lines are extremely rare in nature. Some good photos at this site.

http://www.everythingselectric.com/forum/index.php?topic=311.0
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August 22, 2015 10:57am
UglyTruth

But I only call PRATT when some crazy theory has indeed been rebutted a thousand time.

More lies from mikenmild

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/06/the_fluoridation_backlash.html#comment-1155335
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August 22, 2015 10:57am
mikenmild

nasska
There is zero evidence of pre-Maori settlement. The fact that some archaeological sites are protected from intrusion does not make it otherwise.
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August 22, 2015 10:57am
mikenmild

Ugly
i don’t know how many times I should have to explain this. Genuine disagreement with someone’s position does not constitute ‘lying’. A lie is a deliberate falsehood when someone is well aware of the truth of the matter. I don’t think you are ‘lying’ when you espouse your fringe theories – you are merely misguided.
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August 22, 2015 11:00am
nasska

….”There is zero evidence of pre-Maori settlement.”…..

How do we know? We insist on peer reviewed, exhaustive & open studies on everything else under the sun so why is this different?
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August 22, 2015 11:04am
UglyTruth

i don’t know how many times I should have to explain this. Genuine disagreement with someone’s position does not constitute ‘lying’.

Pretending that I don’t know the difference between genuine disagreement and lying won’t help you any, mikenmild.
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August 22, 2015 11:05am
wiseowl

Be calm.
Sharples has weighed in and said he hopes the two heated claim doesn’t undermine other claims.
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August 22, 2015 11:07am
Fletch

The embargoed Stone City in the Waipoua Forest is slowly degrading.

But most of the people of New Zealand do not know what was found in Waipoua Forest over the three year investigation, at a cost to the taxpayer then of $500,000. The detailed mapping and notes of the complex of stone walls, hearths, stone structures defined as altars by the archaeologists, incised obelisks, petroglyphs (rock carvings), standing stone circles, circular stone mounds and stone-lined waterways were instead sent away to remain hidden under a 75 year embargo, restricted until 2063. In 1988, archaeological records on the Waipoua Forest excavations were transferred from Kaikohe to the National Archives in Auckland. The Transfer of Archives form states: “Prior consultation requires approval of the Te Roroa-Waipoua Archaeological Advisory committee or other appropriate subsequent Te Roroa authority.”

To be honest, why would the government embargo anything until 2063 unless there was something to hide?
HERE is a scan of the agreement for transfer of archives with the handwritten note on the embargo. I’m guessing that 2063 is an arbitrary date meaning “long enough in the future that all evidence will have disappeared”.
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August 22, 2015 11:15am
nasska

Also:

….”The fact that some archaeological sites are protected from intrusion does not make it otherwise.”…..

Somewhat deceptive. Not only is further investigation thwarted through access to the site being prevented but information already discovered is being hidden from all of us until 2063. And not only at this particular location.

From: http://www.amkon.net/showthread.php?4703-Early-People-of-NZ

….”Some of the most fascinating research is being compiled by journalist Gary Cook, who for the past three years has been extensively investigating, photographing and recording stone megaliths, domes, observatories and ritual burial sites with his small team.

Mr Cook says he has seen much work and art forms that are not of Maori origin. One of his biggest finds was in Waipoua Forest in Northland, which he says is a treasure trove of pre-Maori stone structures. What makes them intriguing is that the area was subject to a three-year $500,000 survey by the Forest Service (now DoC) in the mid-80s.

A 75-year embargo until 2063 was placed on the release of 300 pages of documents on the site. Although Mr Cook was able to get some material released through the Official Information Act, what still eludes him is information on radio carbon dating of up to 16 sites in a 242 ha area with nearly 2000 stones structures.”…..

Why?
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August 22, 2015 11:18am
itstricky

Openureyes also has lots of informative information about chemtrails, nasska. Never took you for “one of those”

Besides which, a name like ‘open your eyes’ is a dead give away. I’m not really sure why anyone would take that seriously. Apart from Reid, that is, after burly Colin Craig has stolen my girlfriend, of course.

Surely you’re just taking the mickey.
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August 22, 2015 11:35am
nasska

….”Never took you for “one of those””….

Thank you……your faith & belief is touching.

Still, you may note that I never actually endorsed any of the opinions expressed on any of the three sites I linked to. My question is why the info was embargoed until 2063 if there was nothing to hide.

Any ideas?
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August 22, 2015 11:41am
SGA

@nasska

… what still eludes him is information on radio carbon dating of up to 16 sites in a 242 ha area with nearly 2000 stones structures.

What would be radiocarbon-dated? I don’t think that it is useful to radiocarbon-date stone, is it? Doesn’t it have to be organic or manufactured (e.g., pottery) – I think that’s right, but happy to be corrected.
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August 22, 2015 11:44am
Southern Raider

Good to see that fat fuck king and his silk underpants wearing jester aren’t interested in solving systemic issues like lack of motivation, lack of education and kids continually being killed. But instead focus on the gravey train to fill their wallets even more that will never trickle down to Iwi members.

The Maori attitude was on display in Wanganui this week were a relative of police shooting Kohu was more worried about people mispronounciating the family name instead of condemning the fuck tart criminal in his family
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August 22, 2015 11:45am
mikenmild

nasska
I’m going to give you the courtesy of replying in a fuller fashion than I tend to do on these subjects, as I don’t count you as one of the resident crazies.
All sorts of bizarre theories have been advanced about supposed pre-Maori inhabitants of New Zealand. There is no physical evidence of such settlement. Maori settlement has been reliably dated to about the 14th century. No artifacts have been discovered which pre-date Maori settlement.
The Waipoua Forest is a significant archaeological site that has been investigated in some detail. Access to the site is restricted, but plenty of people have examined them. They appear to be remains of garden structures, etc, common in other Polynesian sites.
The more remarkable a claim, the stronger the evidence should be. On the face of it, voyages round the world by ancient Egyptians or Celts seem pretty unlikely. The fact that there is no supporting evidence for such claims should be conclusive.
Unfortunately, as readers of this blog will be well aware, there is always a fairly vocal minority ready to believe that the ‘truth’ is being hidden.
For anyone genuinely interested, I would recommend that you read K R Howe’s excellent book, ‘The quest for origins: who first discovered and settled New Zealand and the Pacific islands?’.
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August 22, 2015 11:49am
nasska

SGA

It’s not a field I claim any expertise in but my understanding is that the evidence is found in carbon dating the rubbish found on the site eg bones & ashes.

It still makes no sense to effectively censor the results which in any case could be proved/disproved with the better technology now available.
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August 22, 2015 11:50am
itstricky

My question is why the info was embargoed until 2063 if there was nothing to hide.

Any ideas?

Sure. One question back again should be enough. Who told you any information was embargoed?
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August 22, 2015 11:50am
Nostalgia-NZ

The ‘new’ claim brings with it a lot of interest. I don’t know the details but on speculation alone I’d like to know if conquest extinguishes a claim to land, for example if in pre-European times Waikato held land which they lost to other tribes through conquest if they have claim to the Crown over land they had lost to other maori. That doesn’t seem logical, particularly when they have been paid out on other claims. Also, if they have signed full and final settlements knowing that it was their intention, or had the opportunity to make further claims. That also seems, if it is correct, to be big hurdle – particularly if they did not formally protest pay outs to other tribes over land they may now say is of disputed ownership.

Palmer has been much maligned in some quarters for speaking about the spirit or intentions of the TOW. However, here could be an example where settlements having been made in the modern era are looked to be unpicked beyond the spirit or intentions of two or more parties having put things right. Falling in behind that is the fact the Crown entered settlements in good faith, and accordingly where settlements were made then all parties signatures were in good faith – particularly where it had already been entered that the settlement process was to finally finish.

If the Crown are to look at claims of impoverishment, humiliation or loss when deciding a claim then it is probably only right that they also look at wealth from treaty settlements and wise administration of treaty funds as reasons to reject claims such as that of Tainui may be, or in fact offer a gold coin in the spirit of what has gone on before. Finally, if a tribe has obtained settlement on particular land that Tainui now place claim on – then it would appear to be fair that the Crown took no part in that, pointing the way to any tribe which had received settlement funds for the same land as the correct respondent.

All just speculation here, guess work. But to finish from what little I know about this there are smaller tribes whose claims have been ‘gathered up’ into those of larger tribes in a way that could be argued to be unfair – perhaps those situations deserve to see the light of day, particularly because all settlements are not cash in hand, but also assets. Whilst on the other hands ‘corporate’ tribes in the opinion of many, and in the spirit that has made such tribes ‘corporate’, should be the very last to put a hand out draped in gold rings asking for more. All things in proportion and with common sense.
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August 22, 2015 11:51am
Manolo

Is EAD a veritable seer, a Kiwi Nostradamus? http://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-stock-futures-point-to-more-losses-1440159610

Stocks plummeted on global-growth fears for a second straight day Friday in a plunge that dragged the Dow industrials into correction territory.
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August 22, 2015 11:56am
nasska

mikenmild

Thank you…..I mostly agree with the points you raised especially the level of proof required.

Regrettably your reply failed to address the nub of my concerns……why the 75 year knowledge embargo?
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August 22, 2015 11:56am
mikenmild

don’t even know if there is such an embargo. If there is, it would seem counter-productive.
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August 22, 2015 12:01pm
itstricky

Who told you there was an emargo, nasska?
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August 22, 2015 12:02pm
SGA

mikenmild at 11:49 am

The more remarkable a claim, the stronger the evidence should be. On the face of it, voyages round the world by ancient Egyptians or Celts seem pretty unlikely. The fact that there is no supporting evidence for such claims should be conclusive.

As I was reading the comments above, I was wondering about this aspect of it. For example, you can sort of follow the “trail” of viking exploration westward to the New World (e.g., UK, Iceland, Greenland). It seems highly implausible that pre-maori European or Middle Eastern exploration could reach New Zealand without a similar trail.
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August 22, 2015 12:05pm
Manolo

Family love Muslim-style: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3206273/Fully-radicalised-schoolgirl-16-tried-travel-Syria-jihadi-bride-removed-family-judge-rules.html

A girl radicalised in a family home filled with Islamic State propaganda must be removed from her parents, a judge ruled on Friday.

Bombmaking guides and pictures of beheadings were found at the home of the 16-year-old, who this week achieved a string of As and A*s at GCSE.
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August 22, 2015 12:07pm
Manolo

stephieboy would answer in the affirmative, but should Brits accept this crap? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3206301/Germany-demands-Britain-urgently-takes-migrants-help-Europe-cope-growing-refugee-crisis.html

Germany has called on Britain to take more of a share of migrants coming into Europe.

Interior minister Thomas de Maiziere said along with other countries it needed to be ‘more aware’ of its responsibilities as a member of the European Union. He made his call for the British to welcome more refugees after it was revealed Germany expects to receive 800,000 asylum applications this year – more than all 28 EU countries combined in 2014.
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August 22, 2015 12:09pm
nasska

Itsticky

http://www.elocal.co.nz/Articles/b050ec04-5772-4e87-876d-3d17a1a54793.jpg

Poor quality but I’m trying to find better.
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August 22, 2015 12:09pm
itstricky

It’s seems highly implausible that pre-maori European or Middle Eastern exploration could reach New Zealand without a similar trail.

Completely logical. I”m willing to be convinced otherwise by the first person who shows me the evidence of red headed, blue eyed, predecessors in China, or Tonga. I mean Tonga is a small place, right, should be easy to find. Mind you, the Tongan Government is secretly in cahoots with ours… ….so…. 911 WAS AN IINSIDE JOB!
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August 22, 2015 12:12pm
nasska

itstricky

https://www.dropbox.com/s/6puuk9uujukwmvn/Embargo%201.png?dl=0
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August 22, 2015 12:18pm
mikenmild

Could I steer you away from the Franklin e-local, nasska? It’s rather notorious for its bullshit.
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August 22, 2015 12:18pm
itstricky

Nasska. From what-his-face’s TreatyGate page, in one of his typical Maori bashing “exposes”:

My thanks to elocal editor Mykeljon Winckel, who has allowed me to release this story to you a day before it appears in his publication

That’s the reliable source you’ve quoted.

No need to thank me for stopping you from wasting the rest of your day
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August 22, 2015 12:21pm
duggledog

Oh god and jesus

Mikenmild is absolutely right. I wonder who he is.

I’ve been to the Waipoua sites and the Kaimanawa wall and a couple of other supposedly nation shattering places that prove the country had been settled long before Maori and it’s all complete and utter bull shit. You can get into Waipoua especially piece of piss if you know the right people, ask any of the friendly farmers around Puketi and you’ll get in there no worries.

There are just piles of stones here and there, bits of low wall, similar arrangements you see around Auckland and Kaikohe. If too many kiwibloggers fall for this ridiculous conspiracy I’ll be forced to take my cynicism and grumpy comments elsewhere!
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August 22, 2015 12:21pm
nasska

….”That’s the reliable source you’ve quoted.”…..

Your opinion of the source is at best subjective & you asked “Who told you any information was embargoed?”

Did you see that little bit of handwritten script with the red outline? It said something like “Restricted until 2063”.
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August 22, 2015 12:33pm
stephieboy

nasska, if there was celtic presence predating the Maori arrival c 1300 AD then we would expect to find artefacts like pot shards, tools , weapons like arrow heads , axes etc associated with their culture . None have been forthcoming . Also no evidence of the use of the wheel.

Interesting .. !

Why?

Maori would surely make contact with them and inter married. DNA analysis doesn’t suggests this .

Why ?
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August 22, 2015 12:34pm
nasska

stephieboy

No idea. My interest in the matter lies only in the secrecy & the implied importance of the research documents.
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August 22, 2015 12:40pm
mikenmild

nasska
Maybe if Scott Hamilton reads this, he could shed some light on the ’embargo’. His blog, ‘Reading the Maps’, is very strong on the pseudohistory crowd and their motivations.
Thanks duggledog. It’s a subject that has fascinated me for some tiime.
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August 22, 2015 12:40pm

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