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May 1, 2015 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 1 May 2015

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Shawn Herles

THERE IS NO ILLUMINATI, YOU IDIOTS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAQ9AdThGpo
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May 1, 2015 4:15pm
stephieboy

Reid , would appreciate for a change a focus on factual emperical evidence and data than mere vague hazy assertions and surmise that is the substance of your conspiracy theories.
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May 1, 2015 4:19pm
Shawn Herles

“Reid , would appreciate for a change a focus on factual emperical evidence and data than mere vague hazy assertions and surmise that is the substance of your conspiracy theories.”

Don’t hold your breath.
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May 1, 2015 4:21pm
Reid

And you thought Tamaki was bad?

The pastor who asked followers to buy him a new $65 million aircraft blames the devil for losing the old one—and says he may need a spaceship to evangelize on Mars.
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May 1, 2015 4:26pm
Shawn Herles

Anti-Semitism: Anti-Semitism & Anti-Zionism

When approached by a student who attacked Zionism, Dr. Martin Luther King responded: “When people criticize Zionists, they mean Jews. You’re talking anti-Semitism.”

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/anti-semitism/Anti-Semitism_&_Anti-Zionism.html

German judge rules: Anti-Zionism is code for anti-Semitism

http://www.timesofisrael.com/german-judge-rules-anti-zionism-is-code-for-anti-semitism/

Judeophobia: Anti-Judaism, Anti-Semitism, Anti-Zionism

“When anti-Zionism enters into the realm of paranoid conspiracy theories (as it has in the Arab and Muslim world, and has begun to occur among the radical left), when one views the US government as ZOG (Zionist Occupied Government), then anti-Zionism steps over into the realm of a news strain of anti-Semitism. While, strictly speaking, not all anti-Semitism is anti-Zionist (e.g., Richard Nixon, Jean-Marie Le Pen), the vast majority of virulent anti-Zionists are anti-Semitic.

And anti-Semitism has strong tendencies towards genocidal violence. When you believe that the Jews are planning to massacre or enslave all the rest of mankind (Protocols of the Elders of Zion), you have a “warrant for genocide.”

http://www.theaugeanstables.com/reflections-from-second-draft/judeophobia-anti-judaism-anti-semitism-anti-zionism/
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May 1, 2015 4:31pm
Reid

I told you above why the commies celebrate May Day and the zionists will one day too, since communism = zionism = illuminati.

But did you know about Black Friday?

On Friday October 13, 1307, all the Knights Templars in France were arrested by agents of King Philip and he ordered any still residing in the country to be thrown into prison where they were tortured until confessing to accusations of heresy, homosexuality, and dishonest business activities. They were charged with capital offenses and their properties seized. More than likely, many of the confessions were meaningless but following these admissions, a Papal command was issued by Pope Clement V to all Christian sovereigns in 1312 which ordered that all Knights Templars be disbanded. The order of the Templar Knights went underground and their movements have been shrouded in mystery ever since. Friday the 13th is linked with this historical event.

http://www.ancient-origins.net/history/mystery-knights-templars-protectors-or-treasure-hunters-secret-mission-002971

And guess what happened to the Knights Templar.
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May 1, 2015 4:32pm
Ryan Sproull

And guess what happened to the Knights Templar.

I’m guessing… you think you know, even though “their movements have been shrouded in mystery”?
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May 1, 2015 4:37pm
Shawn Herles

“since communism = zionism = illuminati.”

No it doesn’t. which is why you cannot provide any evidence for the claim.

“And guess what happened to the Knights Templar.”

They were all killed off. So, given that the vast majority of the worlds Jews are Zionists, you are saying that almost all the worlds Jews will be killed, and that it’s their own fault.

Sick Reid, very, very sick. Haven’t the worlds Jews suffered enough with you promoting yet more? And for what? Conspiracy theories that you cannot provide a shred of evidence for.

As I have said before, you are like a child playing with a loaded gun with no comprehension of the damage your views can inflict.
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May 1, 2015 4:40pm
Reid

The more I read about the F-35 and understanding that unmanned aircraft are the future, the more I think this is a deliberately engineered debacle to screw the US taxpayer out of as many dollars as possible for as long as possible by as many players involved as possible before the whole thing gets trashed because suddenly a UAV with twice the performance and hitting power and half the unit cost is developed, just as the bugs are finally but fucking finally ironed out.

How else do you explain such a massive massive cluster fuck across all sectors of the program from start to finish when normally since every single player involved has been in the game all their lives and know exactly what they’re doing every step of the way this program should have been a home run hit out of the ballpark about five years ago.

http://sputniknews.com/military/20150428/1021456612.html

I’m guessing… you think you know, even though “their movements have been shrouded in mystery”?

No I have no idea Ryan. I was hoping someone might enlighten us all.
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May 1, 2015 4:44pm
Longknives

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/australian-catholic-university-reveals-scholarships-to-honour-executed-bali-9-duo-20150501-1mxmdp.html

For Fuck’s Sake….What next? Canonisation??
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May 1, 2015 4:55pm
Reid

The Obama regime and its neocon monsters and European vassals have resurrected a Nazi government and located it in Ukraine…

The Western media has created a fictional account of events in Ukraine. The coup organized by the Obama regime that overthrew the elected democratic government in Ukraine is never mentioned. The militias decked out in Nazi symbols are ignored. These militias are the principle source of the violence that has been inflicted on the Russian populations, resulting in the formation of the break-away republics. Instead of reporting this fact, the corrupt Western media delivers Washington’s propaganda that Russia has invaded and is annexing eastern and southern Ukraine. British and European politicians parrot Washington’s lies.

The Western media is complicit in many war crimes covered up with lies, but the false story that the Western media has woven of Ukraine is the most audacious collection of lies yet. Truly, truth in the Western world has been murdered…

The coup in Ukraine is Washington’s effort to thrust a dagger into Russia’s heart. The recklessness of such a criminal act has been covered up by constructing a false reality of a people’s revolution against a corrupt and oppressive government. The world should be stunned that “bringing democracy” has become Washington’s cover for resurrecting a Nazi state.

But who’s surprised. Neocons have been running Obama since forever. McCain and Brzezhinsky, of course they support the Nazis – why wouldn’t they? Their ideology and methods and techniques mirror each other down to a T.

And of course, the media say nothing. You’d think they would, wouldn’t you. But they don’t, do they. Instead they lie and obfuscate the obvious and clear connexions. Indeed.

Truth has been murdered, and the neocons are standing over it, their hands dripping with the blood of millions of innocent.
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May 1, 2015 5:03pm
Reid

For Fuck’s Sake….What next? Canonisation?

Oh there’ll be a twitter trend of biblical proportion Longknives. All the witterers will witter and witter and trend and trend and trend and nothing at all will happen apart from a lot of vapour escaping the atmosphere and quite a few brain cells dying because they suddenly discovered their owners didn’t need them anymore since they were so busy wittering.
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May 1, 2015 5:08pm
Shawn Herles

Failed Military Reform, Modernization, and Russian Foreign Policy

“In the early-2000s, Russia embarked on a plan to replace its anachronistic mass conscription based military with a more modern, volunteer-based system. This was in part a concession to serious demographic problems that made filling an old-style military well nigh impossible. It also reflected a recognition that a traditional conscript-based military was ill-adapted to the modern technology dominated battlefield, as had been demonstrated by the remarkable prowess of American forces. The dysfunction of the Russian conscript army, most notably the notorious дедовщина, also made change imperative.

It is now widely recognized that the effort has been an unmitigated disaster. Russian military performance in the Georgian War was less than stellar. The контрактники were never recruited in the planned numbers, and were bedeviled by the same deficiencies as the conscript troops, including widespread brutality and criminality.

But if Russia has proved incapable of creating a viable volunteer force, the demographic deficit has not gone away, making it virtually impossible for Russia to maintain a conscript army of the desired size. Furthermore, reforms intended to mitigate дедовщина, notably cutting the term of service to a mere year, have exacerbated these problems.

Russian, in brief, cannot sustain a conscript military, and cannot create a volunteer force.”

http://wallstreetpit.com/28155-failed-military-reform-modernization-and-russian-foreign-policy/
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May 1, 2015 5:09pm
Shawn Herles

Russia Hosting Europe’s Neo-Nazis, Nationalists and Anti-Semites, Putin Supporters All.

“Even as Moscow denounces anything it views as a manifestation of fascism abroad and prepares to mark the anniversary of the victory over Nazi Germany, the Russian authorities are hosting tomorrow a meeting of Europe’s neo-Nazis, extreme nationalists, and anti-Semites who share one thing in common – their unqualified support for Vladimir Putin.”

http://www.interpretermag.com/russia-hosting-europes-neo-nazis-nationalists-and-anti-semites-putin-supporters-all/

Putin is against Nazis in Ukraine, but he loves them in Russia

“The Russian government is now claiming that it had to invade Crimea, Ukraine in order to stop “Nazis” from taking over the country.

Russian UN ambassador Vitaly Churkin has been especially vocal about the Ukrainian Nazi threat, repeatedly lashing out at western governments for supporting what he calls “fascist thugs” in the country.

Russian propaganda organ RT (aka Russia Today) was more direct a week ago when, after expressing concern that the Ukrainians were taking down statues of Lenin that were still oddly ubiquitous in the country, “Exit Communism. Enter Nazism?”

It’s therefore more than a tad ironic that Russian President Vladimir Putin, while terribly concerned about Ukraine’s made-up “Nazi threat,” couldn’t care less about his own very real fascist thug problem at home.

Russia has a serious neo-Nazi problem, and Putin does little about it”

http://americablog.com/2014/03/meet-vladimir-putin-favorite-neo-nazis-russia-crimea.html
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May 1, 2015 5:14pm
stephieboy

Reid, odd don’t you think that Paul Craig Roberts makes a pile of sweeping assertions and generalisation about the “Obama regime and Neo cons etc ” within and living under the very same” regime, ” ?

Or are his 1st amendment and other US constitutional protections entirely illusory or part of his deluded imagination ?
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May 1, 2015 5:17pm
Sir Leslie Bottocks

It’s just the guilty consciences of the leftards, who only just previously were death riding Abbott’s very attempts to save the condemned Bali duo, and now, somewhat in desperation and self loathing, are trying to compensate for their own despicable behaviour with these displays of public canonisation of the two. The left do often seem to be prone to these displays of moral exhibitionism, for some reason.
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May 1, 2015 5:22pm
Shawn Herles

Buh-Bye To Paul Craig Roberts

“Let’s bid farewell to Paul Craig Roberts, a favourite guest of both Jones and the white supremacists at Republic Broadcasting Network’s Political Cesspool. (David Duke once wrote that before PC debuted in 2004, the white man had no voice in mainstream radio. Apparently Rush Limbaugh, Michael Savage, Imus, Glenn Beck et al don’t qualify as mainstream. Or white men.)

Roberts is retiring from professional paranoia, though he might return to The Alex Jones Show once or twice.

I won’t call Roberts a racist or an anti-Semite, because like all the people he excoriates for sitting on or ignoring the *truth* about his pet topics, Roberts likes to coyly dance around certain issues so that you can’t quite pin him down. While his anti-war views can be appreciated even by liberals, his other views … um, not so much. He has spent the last decade shredding the reputation he spent the other 60+ years building. Kinda sad, but also kinda familiar. I mean, Morley Safer is doing infomercials these days. I guess when you reach an advanced age, you get to be a complete moron and no one will call you on it.

To PCR fans, cheer up: There are plenty more paranoid white guys where he came from.”

http://leavingalexjonestown.blogspot.ca/2010/04/buh-bye-to-paul-craig-roberts.html
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May 1, 2015 5:28pm
Andrei

What is your malfunction Shawn Herles?

Just about everything you post is a swipe aginst Russia, including taking a giant shit on the graves of the Heroes who defeated Fascism 70 years ago – which is totally contemptable, actually beneath contempt,

The South Ossetian war which you claim

Russian military performance in the Georgian War was less than stellar

actually it lasted five whole days with all its objectives met – Hows things going in Iraq mate?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnlweYcAxo8
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May 1, 2015 5:34pm
Sir Leslie Bottocks

Make sure to go here ->http://laudafinem.com/

for the latest news and views on corruption in NZ!
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May 1, 2015 5:40pm
Shawn Herles

“Just about everything you post is a swipe aginst Russia,”

Just about everything you post, long before I began debating with you, was and is a swipe against the US. If you are surprised that an American might fight back, then you really don’t understand the US and it’s people.

“Hows things going in Iraq mate?”

Ask Saddam and the Baathist regime. Oh wait…..

“including taking a giant shit on the graves of the Heroes who defeated Fascism 70 years ago ”

The heroes who defeated fascism were Great Britain and the US.

Russian under Stalin was fascist.

‘Stalin Was a Greater Fascist Than Bandera or Mussolini,’ Zubov Says:

http://www.interpretermag.com/stalin-was-a-greater-fascist-than-bandera-or-mussolini-zubov-says/
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May 1, 2015 5:46pm
Shawn Herles

A Forward Strategy of Freedom: It’s neither perfect nor pretty, but the Arab Spring proves that neoconservatives were right all along.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2012/01/23/a-forward-strategy-of-freedom/
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May 1, 2015 5:47pm
Shawn Herles

By the way Andrei, you don’t just post streams of Kremlin propaganda against the US, but against the West in general.

New Zealand, the country that you live in and which provides you with freedoms and rights, is, culturally and politically, a Western nation.

Yet according to you the West is a decadent, immoral and evil civilization that does, according to you, do terrible things like provide basic rights to women and gays. By your own definition, that includes New Zealand.

Yet here you are, and not in Putin’s glorious Russian Holy Empire.

Why? Could it be that you don’t really believe your own propaganda?
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May 1, 2015 5:57pm
nasska

….”, but the Arab Spring proves that neoconservatives were right all along.”….

Bollocks. The writer of this article should schedule a visit to planet Earth.

In the lands where dictators were blasted out of power & existence the mullahs or their puppets have stepped into the vacuum created. The proletariat have merely swapped one cruel oppressor for another & because their new masters also have control of their minds through Islam they can never be deposed.

Good one meddlers…not!
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May 1, 2015 6:07pm
Andrei

but the Arab Spring proves that neoconservatives were right all along

Tht article is three years old Nasska, poor Shawn is really clutching at straws
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May 1, 2015 6:16pm
Reid

for the latest news and views on corruption in NZ!

The interesting thing Sir Leslie is that the Sabin case as covered by LF is the perfect opportunity for the NZ media to demonstrate that they’re not corrupt and controlled poodles regardless of who’s in power.

We all know their talking [air]heads disguised as journalists are as left as hell, yet here, when there’s an opportunity to tear the Nats a news one in six ways till Sunday without even coming close to breaching suppression, they’re all, every single organisation, quiet as church mice.

Aren’t they.

Fact.

Observe.

Draw your own conclusions about their reliability accordingly.
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May 1, 2015 6:24pm
Shawn Herles

“”Bollocks. The writer of this article should schedule a visit to planet Earth.”

If you read the article naaska, what he is saying makes sense. He was not saying the Arab Spring was successful, but that the desire for freedom amongst oppressed peoples will, sooner or later rise up. In time they will rise again, and the West should support any desire for real democracy.

“The Arab Spring is therefore not a peculiarity of history, but a natural outcome for regimes that had quite simply become illegitimate in the eyes of their subjects. Of the possible sources of legitimacy — such as democracy, religion, monarchic succession, or the creation of great prosperity — they had none. They were kept in place solely by force, and they were far less stable than the vast majority of scholars, diplomats, and political leaders thought. They were not overthrown because Bush criticized them or President Barack Obama failed to shore them up, but because they lacked a coherent defense of their own rule.

Thus the neocons, democrats, and others who applauded the Arab uprisings were right, for what was the alternative? To applaud continued oppression? To instruct the rulers on better tactics, the way Iran is presumably lecturing (and arming) Syria’s Bashar al-Assad? Such a stance would have made a mockery of American ideals, would have failed to keep these hated regimes in place for very long, and would have left behind a deep, almost ineradicable anti-Americanism. This kind of so-called “realpolitik” is the path U.S. President Richard Nixon’s administration took after the Greek military coup in 1967, and nearly a half-century later the Greeks have still not forgiven the United States.

Of course, the best answer is that we should have been pushing harder for reform all along, but that is after all the Bush/neocon/democracy activist line. Take U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice’s 2005 speech at the American University in Cairo or Bush’s second inaugural address — both reviled by “realists.” It would be nice if some of the critics now admitted that such speeches were prophetic, even if the United States was far too tentative in adopting, as Bush put it at the National Endowment for Democracy, “a forward strategy of freedom in the Middle East.”

Instead, the critics condemn such a strategy for producing the dangers we now see. That is exactly wrong, for it was in fact the policy of ignoring gross oppression that helped bring us to the precipice of today’s dangers. Bush, after all, was not urging instant remedies; he said democratization was “the concentrated work of generations.” He was urging reform, in part because it is usually far safer than revolution. Those who thought “durable authoritarianism” could persist forever have far more to apologize for than Bush, democracy activists, or neocons do.

But we are where we are, so the next question is whether the Arab Spring will actually fulfill its promise of greater democratic rights or whether it will simply usher in an era of extremist Islamist regimes or new forms of authoritarianism. The pessimists might yet be proved right — any comparison of the Arab lands to Eastern Europe suggests that many positive elements are missing, not least the magnet and model of the European Union.

Nothing is inevitable, though. African countries such as Botswana, Ghana, and Mali — and India, for that matter — have attained democracy despite poverty, low literacy rates, and social divisions roughly similar to those that exist in the Arab world. Nor does experience suggest that Islamist victories are unavoidable — or at least, are permanent. A study of 21 Islamic countries conducted by scholars Charles Kurzman and Ijlal Naqvi found that Islamist parties fare far more poorly than popularly believed and gain their highest vote total in the first election.”
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May 1, 2015 6:37pm
Johnboy

Evening Reid. I trust the fogs prevalent in Hamilton have cleared your vision? 🙂
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May 1, 2015 6:39pm
EAD

Reid 6.33pm – well said

Even when Shawn is provided with empirical and historical facts that proves that he has been wrong in his beliefs for a long period of time, he typically ignores the facts provided or results to other efforts to thwart the evidence by counter attacking the argument with lies, strawmen, misrepresentations, vague arguments or just walk away and not face the truth.

Look at the image below, any objective person knows its true but watch SH enter a parallel universe as tries to rationalise it away:

http://hw.infowars.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/fabled-economy.jpg
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May 1, 2015 6:41pm
nasska

….” the desire for freedom amongst oppressed peoples will, sooner or later rise up”….

The entire article is wishful pap laced with speculation intertwined with hope & faith.

It isn’t happening…..a few years have past & they still promote the virtue of stoning women for being raped.
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May 1, 2015 6:45pm
cha

Inerrant, huh.

In the Geneva translation of the Bible, John 6:67 is supposed to say: “Then Jesus said to the twelve, will ye also go away?” But in some copies, printed in 1611, it says this instead: “Then Judas said to the twelve, will ye also go away?”

Oops.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/style-blog/wp/2015/02/10/when-jesus-was-judas-and-other-pretty-stupendous-bible-typos/
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May 1, 2015 6:46pm
nasska

Evening JB…..you’ve been only an occasional visitor of late.

Busy cutting & pasting sheep into your bed I don’t suppose. 🙂
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May 1, 2015 6:46pm
Reid

Just about everything you post, long before I began debating with you, was and is a swipe against the US.

No they’re not actually Shawn, they’re statements of truth which both you and some-to-many of your compatriots obviously can’t face up to so you arrogantly and blusteringly deny in the idiot and blockheaded way you yanks sometimes behave when you get a false idea in your skull and nothing even nuclear weapons can shift it out.

This is why millions of you idiots elected politicians who guaranteed the Vietnam War would end the way it did, instead of being wise as a nation and ending it quietly with a managed withdrawal like JFK wanted to do before he was murdered and a small handful of you yanks made squillions selling explosives which the rest of you blockhead idiots agreed to pay for which then murdered several million other human beings until that fateful day in Saigon when the last helicopter left and the gravy train stopped until another one started, in South America, and the whole cycle repeated itself, word for word, blockhead for blockhead.

Correct me where that history that happened didn’t actually happen, Shawn.

Go on.

And the point is, this is not totally caused by your stupid yank propensity to take an idea and stick it in your head and hold onto it for dear life as if it means something no matter what till death part you from it, but your stupid yank propensity to do precisely that as a national trait sure as hell didn’t help in preventing that and your other national tragedies that did and continue to play out, like oh I don’t know, the war on terror say?

And it also doesn’t help in the combined delving into the what really happened investigation that a blog with intelligent people should really be about, either.

Does it.

Hello John, been awhile mate. Hamilton’s got great fog, it lets me go lurking round the streets in my cloak looking for clues and no-one laughs at me like used to happen in Eastbourne.

Reid 6.33pm – well said

I withdrew and posted the above instead EAD. Perhaps I was wrong.
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May 1, 2015 6:48pm
Awww C-mon

Reid

“The Western media has created a fictional account of events in Ukraine. The coup organized by the Obama regime that overthrew the elected democratic government in Ukraine is never mentioned. The militias decked out in Nazi symbols are ignored.”

Are you expecting to believe that a/ militia are walking around in swastika’s and no photo’s are appearing on any media, social or mainstream in this global village we live in, especially the online village or that b/ the ‘western governments’ are destroying any evidence before it can be released?

Really?
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May 1, 2015 6:49pm
Johnboy

Cutting and pasting a fucking factory nasska! 🙂

Bastard of a job!

Soon I shall retire and haunt these pages a little more. 🙂
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May 1, 2015 6:59pm
Johnboy

Nacht und nebel Reid? 🙂

Keep rooting them out! 🙂
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May 1, 2015 7:02pm
Reid

AC-mon, you really need to get a much better name. How bout I call you Awww for short?

So Awww, media control is like control of any other organisation.

Politics, military, whatever, mechanism works the same.

The uneducated hallucinate in their profound ignorance and foolish naive stupidity that control means that thousands of people would have to be involved and one of them would talk therefore control doesn’t and cannot exist.

That’s just mental Awww and shows how stupid these idiots really are. They simply don’t understand the mechanism, that’s all.

It’d be better for the world if people like that were all thrown into a giant blender and liquidated and their remains used to fertilise the soil, that’s how much value they add to the human experience.

Are you with me so far, Awww? Just my stories are starting on telly and I might leave it there for now.

Soon I shall retire and haunt these pages a little more.

We all look forward to that.
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May 1, 2015 7:05pm
Andrei

Are you expecting to believe that a/ militia are walking around in swastika’s and no photo’s are appearing on any media, social or mainstream in this global village we live in

But they are, just not in the New York Times, BBC or Washington Post

http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/7/24/ukraine-azov-battalion.html

Even Wikipedia notes it

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion
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May 1, 2015 7:10pm
Johnboy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4HHT_V294Co
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May 1, 2015 7:10pm
stephieboy

Andrei, yeah right and Putin is against Nazis in the Ukraine but loves them in Russia,

http://americablog.com/2014/03/meet-vladimir-putin-favorite-neo-nazis-russia-crimea.html

Introducing the Russian National Socialist Party,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_National_Socialist_Party
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May 1, 2015 7:39pm
Andrei

Lol Stephieboy you expect me to believe that homophobic Russian neo Nazis post messages on Russian message boards in the English language using latin script?

That is beyond dumb

http://americablog.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/daniil-solicits-bait-on-vk-e1393906267381.jpg
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May 1, 2015 7:51pm
stephieboy

Andrei, you can confidently assert with the assurance of a sleep walker that Mother Russia does not presently have any kind of ultra nationalist neo Nazi related movements ?
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May 1, 2015 7:59pm
Reid

Andrei, you can confidently assert with the assurance of a sleep walker that Mother Russia does not presently have any kind of ultra nationalist neo Nazi related movements ?

stephie Russia has 250m+ people. We have 4+. If someone from overseas asked your question of an NZer, how would you expect them to respond?

In addition, so what if there is a segment in every country who thinks like that?

THIS DOESN’T MEAN THEY’RE IN CHARGE OF ANY FUCKING THING AT ALL, DOES IT?

Well?

Does it?

If [you hallucinate in your fantasy this indeed is so], (your favourite phrase stephie): EVIDENCE PLEASE.

Well?

Where is it?
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May 1, 2015 8:20pm
Reid

Seriously, for those who really do know what’s going on, and that numbers three on my reading of those here, why is the US doing this? They know what Russia has, yet they still do this. And while both know what each other has, surely the US doesn’t hallucinate Russia doesn’t have what it has and more, not to mention China.

Is it a shell game?

That’s what fries my noodle.

I wish we had a fora where we could fully discuss these issues without the distractions, I really do.
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May 1, 2015 8:32pm
nasska

….”I wish we had a fora where we could fully discuss these issues without the distractions, “….

Do our dissertations on making the most of your mutton derail the thread Reid? 🙂
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May 1, 2015 8:37pm
Andrei

I’ll try Reid

The United States is bankrupt Reid, it can sweep it under the carpet because the US dollar is the worlds default reserve currency, for now.

But the Nation with the biggest GDP is China and the Nation with the largest deposits of just about any natural resource you can think of including energy is Russia

And these Nations are rising as the USA is fading.

And the poliitical elites of the USA don’t like it so they are becoming ever more bellicose, not knowing what else to do

They may start WW3 as they grow ever more desperate – its actually underway now, so far confined to North Africa and the ME but the fire they have started in Ukraine could engulf us all
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May 1, 2015 8:42pm
Reid

Do our dissertations on making the most of your mutton derail the thread Reid? 🙂

Not at all nasska, it’s when we’re forced to engage with someone who:

* refuses to debate his opponents
* arrogantly dismisses their arguments and denies their credibility
* approves of, encourages and facilitates suppression of opinion different from his own
* appeals to authority or consensus rather than to facts and logic
* raises noticeably his emotional temperature in the presence of counter-arguments
* typically labels his opponents as ‘fill in the [many] blanks.’

That’s the distraction, plain and simple.

Since you like me have been around for years, you’ll appreciate my current style is not my usual style. While my beliefs haven’t changed, my style has, and I’m not that happy with it, I simply wish we could lay out our case whatever it may be and not have a braying ignorant fool come along and lie not just about the case laid out but also about the person who laid it out.

It’s not a lot to ask if we were living in reasonable land but as you know and as you’re about to discover Johnboy we haven’t been for a couple of years now.

Of course that’s only my side of the story, but at least unlike Captain Bananas, I don’t bray like a donkey that’s the only possible side.

Unless you’re all morons who don’t get it.

Then I do.

But even if I do that, I never make things up and slander others, as Captain Bananas does, as a matter of standard operating procedure. Which wouldn’t be so bad, if his slander wasn’t composed of 100% total and absolute lying bullshit made up exclusively inside his own, evidently tiny, head.
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May 1, 2015 8:47pm
EAD

Reid,

No time for GD tonight, but re your 8.32pm, here is another angle. We both know the Soviets were the same people who control the US so is it plausible that the globalists just let Russia go when Communism collapsed? I don’t know for sure but perhaps Putin is part of the Dog and Pony show as well?

Have a read of this and let me your thoughts (I’ll check in tomorrow morning)

http://www.alt-market.com/articles/2126-false-eastwest-paradigm-hides-the-rise-of-global-currency

Some extracts:

“The centralization of power is best achieved during moments of bewildering calamity. The conjuring of crises is one of the oldest methods of elitist dominance. Not only can they confuse and frighten the masses into malleability, but they can also ride to the public’s rescue as heroes and saviors later on. The Hegelian dialectic is the mainstay of tyrants”

“In either case, the elitist plan is to use scapegoats and false enemies to draw our attention away from the real culprits: the international banks themselves. Make no mistake: This fight is not about President Barack Obama, it is not about Putin and it is not even about the Federal Reserve. These men are tools, errand boys, public mascots. Do not be fooled by the global stage play being perpetrated. Whatever happens in Ukraine and whatever happens between Russia, China and the West, there are only two real sides to this battle: the elitist establishment, and those who are smart enough to recognize their poison”
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May 1, 2015 8:59pm
stephieboy

Reid, I beg your pardon -both you and Andrei readily place the accusing finger at the Ukraine in terms of Neo Nazism etc but a more than coy when it comes to Putin’s Russia.

Why is that given the fact, as you seem to suggest, about every country has its own version of the same including our very own home grown Right Wing Resistance , rather laughable as it is .

Andrei , you can harp on as much as you like about the decline and fall of the US etc but consider the fact that the PC , Tablet, Smartphone of Laptop your using has more than likely US made operating system , software ncluding hardware components etc.

Its also worth considering their marvellous ingenuity in Interplanetary space exploration with the recent Mercury probe that has considerably expanded our knowledge of that planet not forgetting Mars and of course the Hubble space telescope etc

http://www.popsci.com/nasas-messenger-probe-set-slam-mercury-today

All rather impressive and hardly the acts of a country in terminal decline .
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May 1, 2015 9:14pm
Reid

They may start WW3 as they grow ever more desperate – its actually underway now, so far confined to North Africa and the ME but the fire they have started in Ukraine could engulf us all

Andrei thanks. Some prelim thoughts as I see it when 2050 rolls round:

Asia is the key to the new order and how that fits into their plans is our conundrum as I see it. Russia is one of the two new powers, China the other, Moscow and Shanghai will be the new London and NY respectively.

The US will be a spent shell of itself albeit still hugely valuable not because of its by-then stripped out mineral wealth but its geographical location on the sea lanes and a source of skilled slave labour for the new economies. NAFTA would have long conquered its sovereignty on behalf of the UN/EU and it’ll basically be a vassal state of South America who are cannibalizing it with all the ruthlessness and waste those people are known to exercise. Just like they’re doing to themselves in Mexico right now, with all those gangs and all that meth at stake. That’s the destiny for the US.

The EU. What’s going to happen there? As we all know that’s the NWO prototype. The EU parliament is the politics and NATO is the military arm. Which brings me back to Asia.

Why is Canberra geared to host a seat of govt five times bigger than what it currently hosts?

What do the evil ones have in store for us down here?

Should we care?

Why all this Asian immigration?

What are they doing?

EAD, I’ll read your link and get back to you tomorrow, hope that’s OK
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May 1, 2015 9:27pm
stephieboy

Reid, copy and pasted from RT, Veterans Today, Infowars or Global Research etc ?
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May 1, 2015 9:34pm
Reid

Reid, I beg your pardon -both you and Andrei readily place the accusing finger at the Ukraine in terms of Neo Nazism etc but a more than coy when it comes to Putin’s Russia.

stephie you seem like a nice guy but there’s something about you which doesn’t ring true. You portray yourself as naive but then you come out with astute observations at times. It’s like you’re pretending to be someone you’re not.

Which would normally be fine except you then take advantage of that at times to appear to those less observant as a mere simple child alone in the woods, in need of help and the big bad meanies are attacking you at every turn.

It’s that quality in you my friend which I can’t abide because it’s pure 24 caret disingenuity and frankly I hate that simply because that’s what the evil ones do. And while I know you’re not an evil one, you’re too incompetent so to be, the display of that attribute still fucks me off.

Frankly stephie I’m very happy to engage you just as I engage EAD, UT, Andrei, Johnboy, nasska or almost every other person here. However, you need either to come out and be to me always, who you really are, or alternatively you need to slink away from me forever and never engage with me again. One of the two. No third alternative. Don’t hide behind your naive demeanor and act all hurt, whatever you do. And of course, this only applies to how you act with me, who cares what you do with others here. But those are my rules for you mate.

Don’t tell me by replying to this. Just show me by your actions what your response is.
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May 1, 2015 9:39pm
Andrei

iPads are manufactured in China Stephieboy

The software comes from all over but Indians predominate in that industry

The spacecraft you mention rode into space on rockets powered by Russian rocket motors and Astronauts go into space in Russian spacecraft.

You pointed out on another thread that all the worlds big shipyards are in Asia and th chances are if you don’t drive a Japanese car you drive a Korean one.

How much does the USA’s gargantuan military cost, how much do all those wars cost and how is it all being paid for?

The writing is on the wall my friend
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May 1, 2015 9:54pm
stephieboy

Reid, we might be getting somewhere thus you do concede that Neo Nazism is a widespread social and political phenomena not by any means confined to Russia and the Ukraine.

..”24 caret disingenuity and frankly I hate that simply because that’s what the evil ones do ..” ?

Ahh your Illuminati masonry stuff ?

I really think EAD and yourself need to seriously consider yourselves suitable candidates for presentation, research and study at the next International Psychiatric Convention.
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May 1, 2015 9:59pm
Reid

stephie just to let you know I’ve reported your abuse for putting words into my mouth; viz:”thus you do concede that… ”

As you know it’s not acceptable in civilised human debate to portray to other people that people who you don’t even know have said or think things which you’ve made up yourself. That’s the height really of arrogance, rudeness and many other things.

Good luck sorting yourself out with DPF.

I look forward to your next transgression in this area. Since you do it all the time, I know it won’t be long.

Sleep well.

P.S. DPF if you care to scroll up you’ll see the tone has been calm and civilised prior to stephie’s uncalled for intervention. Cheers.
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May 1, 2015 10:16pm
stephieboy

Andrei, very disingenuous . Yes iPads are made in china but the thinking and engineering behind them are at Cupertino Califonnia I believe . Yes Microsoft happily acknowledges and are very grateful for the Indian input but who originally invented it and developed it ?

The Messenger mercury probe was in fact launched on the US made Delta II 7925H-9.5 at Cape Canaveral April 4 2011.

I happen to drive a Japanese car . Your point ?

Yes the US has a large military budget paid for in part out of its Technological expertise like the above and in numerous other areas such as Boeing , Medical and Biological sciences, resurgent car and mechanical transport and equipment industry etc, etc. Of course military manufacturing too.

The US dollar like any other currency, including our own, represents the sum total of its GDP = paying its way in the world by what to manufactures and produces for export.

Russia ?
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May 1, 2015 10:20pm
Inandout

I am beginning to feel sorry for John Campbell as he is desperately trying to save his show. The clip with the Chinese restaurant owner was embarrassing when the shop had Hosking on the TV screen, and John looked so uncomfortable trying to joke with the Chinese guy. John, just stay in the studio and leave the field stories to your reporters.
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May 1, 2015 10:24pm
stephieboy

Reid, good luck and I trust DPF carefully scrutinises this earlier post of yours ,

Reid (17,710 comments) says:
May 1st, 2015 at 5:03 pm

The Obama regime and its neocon monsters and European vassals have resurrected a Nazi government and located it in Ukraine…

The Western media has created a fictional account of events in Ukraine. The coup organized by the Obama regime that overthrew the elected democratic government in Ukraine is never mentioned. The militias decked out in Nazi symbols are ignored. These militias are the principle source of the violence that has been inflicted on the Russian populations, resulting in the formation of the break-away republics. Instead of reporting this fact, the corrupt Western media delivers Washington’s propaganda that Russia has invaded and is annexing eastern and southern Ukraine. British and European politicians parrot Washington’s lies.

The Western media is complicit in many war crimes covered up with lies, but the false story that the Western media has woven of Ukraine is the most audacious collection of lies yet. Truly, truth in the Western world has been murdered…

The coup in Ukraine is Washington’s effort to thrust a dagger into Russia’s heart. The recklessness of such a criminal act has been covered up by constructing a false reality of a people’s revolution against a corrupt and oppressive government. The world should be stunned that “bringing democracy” has become Washington’s cover for resurrecting a Nazi state.

But who’s surprised. Neocons have been running Obama since forever. McCain and Brzezhinsky, of course they support the Nazis – why wouldn’t they? Their ideology and methods and techniques mirror each other down to a T.

And of course, the media say nothing. You’d think they would, wouldn’t you. But they don’t, do they. Instead they lie and obfuscate the obvious and clear connexions. Indeed.

Truth has been murdered, and the neocons are standing over it, their hands dripping with the blood of millions of innocent.”
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May 1, 2015 10:29pm
Reid

I hope he does too stephie and I especially hope DPF takes note of the fact that you have deliberately lied, yet again, and made it appear as if I said the whole of that post, whereas of course when you look at the original you realise naturally when you see it, that these words were said mostly by another, and I added a few at the end, whereupon it has a whole new meaning.

These are lies stephie, they really are, no other words for it. You’ve revealed yourself plain and simple. What I’m going to do is report this one as an abusive post as well.

Sorry mate, you’re a real liar aren’t you. Not acceptable stephie. Not at all.
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May 1, 2015 10:49pm
Dennis Horne

@Reid. I don’t think Mr Farrar will be banning people from General Debate.

They’ve gone already.
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May 1, 2015 11:22pm
Reid

No time for GD tonight, but re your 8.32pm, here is another angle

EAD indeed and this is something that’s been puzzling me for some time. Putin is NWO because if he wasn’t, he would not have got where he is in the first place and if he’d genuinely turned rogue would have been taken out long ago, just like they took out JFK.

And leaders can be taken out anytime.

And while the useful idiots hallucinate that the deterrent of their own leader being taken out is what prevents US vs Russian snipers from taking pot shots at each other all the time, in the real world, as we know, that doesn’t work. Look who really did JFK, for example.

And that means China, Russia, whoever can be taken out. But that’s not the issue, is it.

It’s the punch and judy show with real bananas at the bottom of it.

That’s the key I think. Where’s the money: show us the money. What course of action is most likely to produce the most money.

But ya gotta spend it to make it, dont’cha.

And China is the new arena.

Is it possible it’s as simple as calculating the Chinese extreme propensity to look after oneself and immediate family and if everyone outside that tiny clique goes to hell in a handcart, your average Chinese doesn’t really care? Is it possible it’s that simple?

I mean if so it makes it real easy for the NWO to control the Chinese doesn’t it. On paper.

I don’t myself think the Chinese are that easily fooled. But I would not be surprised if the NWO hallucinate they are. After all, that’s basically what’s worked for them in the West, isn’t it.

Then you’ve got the Russians but my take on them is they’re builders: They’re mathematicians, scientists, engineers. Not financiers, not bankers, not power-hungry. Chinese are. Russians aren’t.

Fascinating isn’t it.

@Reid. I don’t think Mr Farrar will be banning people from General Debate.

Yes Dennis. Well I’ve been here since it started in 2003. And my style hasn’t changed, I’m the same now as I was back then. Don’t believe me, go look.

So if you’ve got a dry bush blowing through Main Street, look to something else, because nothing’s changed for me.
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May 1, 2015 11:25pm
Awww C-mon

Reid, Rugby was good, hope you enjoyed your TV shows.

Thanks for your response although the statement “The uneducated hallucinate in their profound ignorance and foolish naive stupidity that control means that thousands of people would have to be involved and one of them would talk therefore control doesn’t and cannot exist” confuses me somewhat.
It could be that I am one of the uneducated but if that statement is true, the counter must also be true that the highly educated and intelligent of the world would see right through the deception and presumably they would call it out. However none do, I mean Hawkins never goes on about these conspiracy theories and he is the biggest brainic around!
Also you mention that no-one would ever ‘talk’ or expose the conspiracy, I think history shows that when individuals do not agree with actions or plans of a government or similar large group (like the media you have mentioned of ‘thousands’) they will talk, Snowden is a current example who broke ranks and exposed what he didn’t agree with. Just perhaps the reason no-one has broken rank in the MSM conspiracy of yours in the last 70 odds years could mean that it doesn’t actually exist!

More Rugby all day tomorrow, will look for your response with anticipation and an expectation of enlightenment!

C-mon
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May 1, 2015 11:45pm
Dennis Horne

Reid (17,712 comments) says: May 1st, 2015 at 11:25 pm
Yes Dennis. Well I’ve been here since it started in 2003. And my style hasn’t changed, I’m the same now as I was back then. Don’t believe me, go look.

Okay. Let’s see, style. Oh look:

Reid (17,712 comments) says: May 1st, 2015 at 8:47 pm
Since you like me have been around for years, you’ll appreciate my current style is not my usual style. While my beliefs haven’t changed, my style has, and I’m not that happy with it,
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May 1, 2015 11:46pm
SPC

Andrei claims the USA is bankrupt …

Its public debt is lower than that of Germany.

In 2013, United States public debt-to-GDP ratio was 71.8%, according to the CIA World Factbook,[2] or 104.5%, according to the IMF including external debt.[3] The level of public debt in Japan 2013 was 243.2% of GDP, in China 22.4% and in India 66.7%, according to the IMF,[4] while the public debt-to-GDP ratio in 2013 was at 76.9% of GDP in Germany, 87.2% in the United Kingdom, 92.2% in France and 127.9% in Italy, according to Eurostat.[5]

Two thirds of US public debt is owned by US citizens, banks, corporations, and the Federal Reserve Bank;[6] approximately one third of US public debt is held by foreign countries – particularly China and Japan.
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May 2, 2015 12:20am
Manolo

Will his Kenyan books be part of it? http://www.forbes.com/sites/brucejapsen/2015/04/30/chicago-will-get-the-obama-library/

President Obama will choose the University of Chicago as the site for his presidential library, according to several reports and sources close to the Obama family.
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May 2, 2015 12:21am
SPC

Andrei also claimed that China is the largest economy. Wrong.

Andrei also claimed that and the Nation with the largest deposits of just about any natural resource you can think of including energy is Russia – not exactly, it has the largest reserves of natural gas (though some say Iran has as much) and exports the most, has the second most coal, but has only the 8th largest oil reserves. Although some suspect it has the most undiscovered reserves.

Currently the USA produces more oil and gas than any other country.
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May 2, 2015 12:30am
Left Right and Centre

Since you like me have been around for years, you’ll appreciate my current style is not my usual style.

Phew – I thought – this fella must know he’s turned into a right git 🙂

The clip with the Chinese restaurant owner was embarrassing when the shop had Hosking on the TV screen, and John looked so uncomfortable trying to joke with the Chinese guy

I saw that – I actually thought the whole thing was a laugh. Chinese fella (is he Chinese?) said he opened his first shop in NZ in fucking *1959* – holy how long shit ago was that ? And I’m counting 69, 79, 89 . . . at least 55 years ago – he’s still churning out chips and frying fish and he’s older than fucking Yoda. Great kiwi accent after spending virtually his whole life here – still needs subtitles.

And then they went to the actual stories – yerugh.
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May 2, 2015 2:19am
Manolo

A dinosaur-age crook:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/05/01/us-usa-election-clinton-age-idUSKBN0NM34V20150501

Her campaign barely three weeks old, Hillary Clinton already has been attacked by Republicans on everything from donations to her family’s charitable foundation, to her tenure as secretary of state and her ties to Wall Street. But her rivals, and the political action committees that support them, are treading more carefully on one incendiary subject: her age.

If elected in November 2016, Clinton would be, at 69, the second-oldest person to take the presidential oath for the first time, behind only Ronald Reagan, who turned 70 weeks after being sworn into office in 1981.
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May 2, 2015 3:03am
hj

Malcolm Mulholland held an occupation of Brighton Pier as a foreshore and seabed protest.
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May 2, 2015 5:36am
Reid

C’mon:

e.g. http://thedesk.matthewkeys.net/2013/12/heres-how-conan-obrien-gets-news-anchors-to-say-the-same-thing/

e.g. http://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/1lnlmi/proof_that_every_news_station_is_reading_from_the/

e.g. http://www.globalresearch.ca/who-killed-michael-hastings/5355606 – why no coverage when one of their own gets taken out?

e.g. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0418038/ – was everyone in this vid lying?

etc
etc
etc

Found in two minutes.

So can you, when you look for it.

But you need to decide to.

Pretending it’s not there because you haven’t found it because you haven’t even looked for it, doesn’t count as grounds for concluding it doesn’t exist C’mon.
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May 2, 2015 6:40am
EAD

@ Reid 11.25am,

thanks for your considered response. The truth is we don’t how this sh*tstorm is going to play out but it’s not going to give me any pleasure to tell the sheeple “I told you so”.

They should have let the system collapse in 2008 we might have had a chance to for a positive future but they pulled all the levers out and are doubling down on everything at the moment – the debt, the mass immigration, the propaganda, the war/terror rhetoric, the militiraisation of place, TPP, the social engineering, restrictions on liberty etc.

That there has been a notable ramp up in intnesity of the above leads me to believe that the collapse is not far away and they want to condition us as much as possible before things really get out of control.

As to China & Russia I don’t know. Are their leaders bought and paid for by the NWO or are they buying time by playing along before they turn on the globalists? Russians & Chinese throughout their history have always played the long game which gives me hope of the later but maybe I’m being to optimistic. All I know the American Empire is not going to go with a whimper and it is why I hold two passports as I don’t know how this is going to play out and what they’ve got planned for NZ.

One thing I will say about NZ, having been to numerous countries in my time, is just how distracted our population is by bread and circuses and just how much they trust Politicians which believes leads me to believe that our transition to the NWO may be more peaceful (relatively speaking) than Europe and especially America.
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May 2, 2015 7:58am

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