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January 13, 2015 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 13 January 2014

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publicwatchdog

Whilst I have your undivided attention Shawn Herles – do you see any criticisms of
the State of Israel / Zionism / Judaism as all one and the same – ie any criticisms of ANY of the
above ALL being anti-Semitic?

Yes or no?

Just asking …..

‘Seeking truth from FACTS’ – sort of thing.

Penny Bright
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January 13, 2015 1:39pm
publicwatchdog

‘Reptilian shape-shifter’ is not an expression I have EVER used.

Kind regards

Penny Bright
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January 13, 2015 1:41pm
stephieboy

Shawn Herles, so you belive that Jes Bush and the GOP will continue with the Holy Crusade left unfinished by GWB with both happy to ratchet up military spending once again to unprecedent levels

Paid for by how? Another credit card for a $ 3 trillion war by more deficit spending ?Sashing of course welfare programs and any hope of affordable medical care ?

Another point.Last weekend you I believe you made a rather outstanding claim that the U.S. in fact won the war in South Vietnam Thus saving SE Asia , Australia l and us from falling to the communist dominoes ?

Thus the victorious NVRA and Vietcong arriving in Saigon to take control and America’s ignominious exit was entirely illusory ?

Clarify please ?
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January 13, 2015 1:42pm
iMP

Where were the Americans at the Paris love-in? There’s radioctive fallout, ya’ll.

https://conzervative.wordpress.com/2015/01/13/american-no-show-in-paris-why/
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January 13, 2015 1:43pm
cricko

Kimbo

You accuse me of failing to address your question on 8/1/15

And today you invite me to ‘care to have a go ?’

Put your glasses on mate, go back and have a look.

@1.31. I replied to your question, “All”

Could I have been clearer than that ?

Now I get to ask you one in return, lets see if you can be as clear and forthright as I was.

Why will New Zealands experience be different than any other western society that has imported muslims ?

And please don’t reply with the usual PC crap such as, because we embrace them and celebrate them more
than any other country.

And by the way, not just Kimbo, I invite anyone to address that ?

But in particular, love to hear from you Kimbo as you were the one who wrongly accused me of failing to
reply to yours.

P.S. I do not duck direct questions nor do I answer a question with a question.
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January 13, 2015 1:45pm
Kimbo

@ publicwatchdog

‘Reptilian shape-shifter’ is not an expression I have EVER used.

Yeah, but be honest: if you haven’t written it, let alone thought it…you wish you had! 🙂
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January 13, 2015 1:46pm
Albert_Ross

I see that Dame Anne Salmond thinks that the right of free speech in NZ is compromised because

Journalists including Jon Stephenson (for reporting on New Zealand’s involvement in Afghanistan), Andrea Vance (over a suspected leak of a report about the GCSB spy agency), and Nicky Hager (for exposing scurrilous relationships between senior politicians and muck-raking bloggers) have been intimidated and attacked.

What do folk think? Does the right of free speech extend to stealing and publishing information that the generators of that information don’t want published?

edit: the extract is from a comment piece in today’s DomPost but I am too inept to provide a link directly, sorry
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January 13, 2015 1:47pm
publicwatchdog

Which FACTS that substantiate my considered opinions do you particularly dislike Mikenmild?

Funny how Kiwiblog seems to attract, in my opinion, a certain variety of pompous old gits of the male (as opposed to the MANly) variety, of which you appear to be one, Mikenmild.

On some issues, I agree with you, but hey!

Even a stopped watch is right twice a day …..

(Referring to YOU – not me in that regard)

Meant of course in a caring way 😉

Kind regards

Penny Bright
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January 13, 2015 1:49pm
publicwatchdog

Actually NO Kimbo.

Kind regards

Penny Bright
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January 13, 2015 1:53pm
Kimbo

@ cricko

Kimbo

You accuse me of failing to address your question on 8/1/15

And today you invite me to ‘care to have a go ?’

Put your glasses on mate, go back and have a look.

@1.31. I replied to your question, “All”

Could I have been clearer than that ?

Apologies, cricko. Your full response (which is not really “All”, because you actually qualiy) was: –

@ Kimbo

Good on you for having a try at answering those questions, others will judge just how credible your
effort was.

One point others may consider, you state that, ” Germany became a post WW2 economic powerhouse on the back of cheap
Turkish labour.” Jeez…

Ever hear of the Marshall Plan Kimbo ? Look it up.

And in reply to your later question.
The answer is All muslims. muslims cannot integrate into our society because they would cease to be muslims if they did.
It’s quite a simple reality most will grasp.

…so just to be clear, how many of those who arrive here, by your own criterion, “cease” to be Muslims? “All”, “most”, “many”, “a significant portion”, “some”, “a few”, or “hardly any”? Seems a reasonable question considering your thought processes (I am being cgaritable and indulging you) appear circular.

Answer that, and I’ll move on to your latest question.
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January 13, 2015 1:56pm
publicwatchdog

What’s the matter Shawn Herles?

Still can’t / won’t give a straight answer to my straight questions?

Why’s that?

Penny Bright

(Persistent / determined / therefore highly irritating 😉
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January 13, 2015 1:56pm
publicwatchdog

Don’t expect too much in the form of reasoned or sensible debate with Shawn Herles Stephieboy – when it comes to history he has a proven tendency just to ‘make shit up ‘ – and when he’s challenged – he ducks for cover like a rat down a drainpipe.

Penny Bright
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January 13, 2015 2:04pm
Kimbo

@ publicwatchdog

Actually NO Kimbo.

For someone so ready to question the intentions and motives of others on what is usually the most wafer-thin “evidence”, I don’t know why I should extend the courtesy of taking you at your word. Nevertheless, if that is really the case, try this one:

Oscar Wilde: I wish I had said that.
James McNeill Whistler: You will, Oscar, you will.
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January 13, 2015 2:09pm
stigie

This has turned out to be a Penny Bright thread.

Wouldn’t it be better if it was a masturbation thread ? Just askin !~

I know the two dont go together….
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January 13, 2015 2:09pm
mikenmild

Albert
I should have thought a journalist’s duty was to publish information where there was a genuine public interest, regardless of how that information was obtained. Where a journalist has acted illegally, he or she should be punished. the two things are related, but separate. It is easy to conceive of information being hidden by the state but which should be available to the public. Whistle blowing and leaks have their place.
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January 13, 2015 2:10pm
Nookin

“This has turned out to be a Penny Bright thread.

Don’t they all? And don’t you get sick of it?
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January 13, 2015 2:19pm
hj

Pleasures and perils of name-calling

http://www.economist.com/blogs/erasmus/2015/01/america-europe-and-islam?page=1&fsrc=nlw%7Cnewe%7C12-01-2015%7CAP#sort-comments
Comments
” And however awkward the reality…For the record, Erasmus has often reported from that city, and some parts of it, though certainly not all, are still comfortable places for non-Muslims to live and go about their business.”

===

Yes Christians, Europeans, and Englishmen are uncomfortable in Birmingham.

Yes the UK’s second largest city has a Muslim majority.
And more Mosques than churches. And an active conversion process to disinfect cathedrals and make them proper mosques.

And the #1 male baby name in the UK is Muhummed.

–

Since 2010, in the UK the #1 name for baby boys is ‘Muhammed’ with various spellings.
Yes Muhammad, Mohammad, Muhammed, Mohamed, Mohamad, Muhamed, Mohammod, Mahamed, Muhamad, Mahammed and Mohmmed all spell the same founder. And carry the same life implications.

(BTW the #2 UK Name is Jack.)

It is the same way in France, Germany, Italy, Greece, Sweden, and the Nederlands.

Kids prefer the playground nickname ‘Mo’.
Call out Mo in a school recess and a dozen heads turn your way.

These new citizens are Muslim first…European a distant second.

They will be highly pius if not overly religious.

Imagine if your name was Muhummad.
There is no half-*ssed religious zealotry. You are all-in when your birth name is Muhummed. He was The Prophet!

They will not be secular.
They will not become jaded rationalists or atheists.

And they are changing Western Europe permanently either by peaceful means and demography,
or in the worse case by violence and terror like the Koachi brothers.

===

Sometimes countries are conquered not by tanks and planes
but by baby footsteps.

Demographics is the ultimate, invincible army.

Sorry Charlie. At the end of the protests everyone will go home to smug self-congratulations.

But Muhummeds by simple demographics will dominate the classroom, the university, the jobs, and the workplace.
And perhaps one day the leadership and the religions.

But I would hope the new Young Muhummads in Europe will prove rational, tolerant, secular and wise leaders.

And then Europe’s future will be bright.
Just like Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Lebanon, Turkey, Yemen, Somalia, Nigeria, Mali and Pakistan.

It is hard to argue with demographics.
Cities like Birmingham are not the last to turn Islamic: Just the cutting edge of Eurarabia.

===

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1324194/Mohammed-popular-baby-bo…

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Jinteloin reply to Connect The DotsJan 12th, 18:07
Secularization is inevitable, in 40 years France went from over 90% christian to over 60% under 40 having no religion, https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_en_France#S.C3.A9cularisation (that includes the 13% Muslims). That Muslims will follow the west on literacy, education, fertility rates, and industrial production, but wont on dereligionization is absurd. In the enlightened environment of the west that process will happen quicker. It might take one or two generations but its guaranteed….
…
Note the confidence.
where will they be if/when they are wrong? Whose decision was that (name)?
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January 13, 2015 2:52pm
Redbaiter

PB is not much worse than Kimbo, who apparently wants to turn every thread into an exhibition of how much he knows about the bible.
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January 13, 2015 2:53pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@hj 10:08… sorry for the delay in replying… but as a good little hominin I’ve been indulging in some social grooming.
My problem with sociobiology is that the biology of social animals has been hijacked to justify political ideologies.

@Jack 10:36… Of course E.O. Wilson isn’t a crank, but cranks have lept into the study of the evolution of human social behaviours. Yep, ants are endlessly fascinating.
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January 13, 2015 2:55pm
cricko

Kimbo,

Distorting what I said and then posing a question based on your distortion is a pathetic and risible
tactic.

If you lack the intellect to respond to my one simple question just admit it.

Please do not ask me any more stupid questions.

Meanwhile my simple straight forward question to you stands. (simple straight forward, meaning that anyone who is not an idiot could understand it. Your not an idiot Kimbo, or are you ?)

You are either capable of addressing it or not.
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January 13, 2015 2:59pm
Reboot

A lack of balls is what I see on the front page of the Herald online today as they crop out the photo of Mohammad on the Charlie Hebdo magazine cover leaving only its title, instead pretending a security guard standing in front of the magazine’s headquarters is what people are more interested in seeing.

Very rich of them to start the article with: “Charlie Hebdo says it will “cede nothing” to terrorists – and has defiantly placed a new cartoon of the Prophet Muhammad on its cover. ”

My own country’s leading newspaper has obviously ceded its balls to the terrorists.
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January 13, 2015 3:00pm
hj

Maggy Wassilieff do you prefer the idearly of a blank slate?
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January 13, 2015 3:00pm
Albert_Ross

Ha, that doesn’t get us very far mikenmild. Who is to decide where there is a “genuine public interest” (NOT the same thing as “interesting to the public”, which is easily determined by how many of them choose to buy newspapers or books containing the information)? The damage has already been done by the time a case gets to court.

Have journalists a greater right than elected politicians and duly appointed public officials to decide what “should be available to the public”? Given their clear commercial interest in revealing information, are they really reliable arbiters on this point? You say this is related but separate to the issue of illegal behavior, but how is it separate? Dame Anne and her ilk seem precisely to want the “genuine public interest” to trump the “illegality”, since she condemns the Government’s attempts to enforce laws against stealing, copyright violation, invasion of privacy, betrayal of official secrets etc.
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January 13, 2015 3:02pm
Kimbo

@ cricko

Please do not ask me any more stupid questions.

Sorry, cricko. but your essential argument that

“all Muslims are incapable of integrating into our society,

…except the ones who do, who thereby cease (by your definition) to be Muslims”

has some obvious logical problems.

Or maybe you’d like to take the opportunity to clarify what you did say and mean?
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January 13, 2015 3:06pm
cricko

So Kimbo, you admit that you are an idiot.
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January 13, 2015 3:16pm
Kimbo

@ cricko

So Kimbo, you admit that you are an idiot.

Well, cricko, if it means I refuse to automatically accept the suspect logic of your question-framing which you refuse to examine, let alone address, then, yeah, slap a sign on me and call me “stupid”.
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January 13, 2015 3:21pm
Fletch

and framework of thinking Protestants formally rejected at the time of the Reformation

Actually, all forms of artificial contraception were condemned WITHOUT EXCEPTION by all major Christian denominations up until 1930, when the ecumenical Lambeth Conference voted to allow the usage of these means, but restricting them to “hard cases”.
I believe it was not fully accepted until after 1960. A constant Christian teaching was completely undone among Protestants in a mere thirty years. So, protestants have to believe that either the Holy Spirit was not guiding Christians before 1930 or Protestant Churches have been ignoring His guidance after 1960.
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January 13, 2015 3:22pm
mikenmild

I’m not so sure about that Albert. Ultimately, the public will decide what is in its interest, I guess. Journalists charged with a crime might want to argue for a public interest defence, and that argument could be settled by the courts. These questions are difficult to argue without considering the specifics of a case, but any specific case always seems to engage the emotions rather than the principles.
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January 13, 2015 3:23pm
Redbaiter

Have journalists a greater right than elected politicians and duly appointed public officials to decide what “should be available to the public”?

Good question, and gives rise to the question, what for the purpose of legal or other argument, is a journalist.

Did not Cameron Slater recently win the right to call himself one?

And then we have the three names already mentioned, and the same question arises there. What makes them “journalists” and not mere political advocates? With the line so blurred, it’s virtually a carte blanche for anyone who wants to call themselves a journalist to release whatever information they come upon if they deem it to be “in the public interest”.

This cannot be policed, so something has to change, and I think the most obvious way out is to deny so called or self professed journalists the traditional right to refuse to identify their sources. For example Vance released information from a report on NZ’s security service. I think this was a crime that should have seen her and the person who released the report sanctioned.

Vance with her constant political advocacy is in my humble opinion one of the worst examples of a one sided political advocate employed to write stuff and through her blatant partisanship white anting the tradition of journalism.
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January 13, 2015 3:26pm
Kimbo

@ Fletch

Actually, all forms of artificial contraception were condemned WITHOUT EXCEPTION by all major Christian denomination up until 1930, when the ecumenical Lambeth Conference voted to allow the usage of these means, but restricting them to “hard cases”.
I believe it was not fully accepted until after 1960. So, protestants have to believe that either the Holy Spirit was not guiding Christians before 1930 or Protestant Churches have been ignoring His guidance after 1960.

Ecclesia reformata semper reformanda est/the church that is reformed is constantly reforming. IMHO whatever views Protestants initially held on the matter, originally inherited from Roman Catholicism, they were not consistent with their stated principle of “Scripture Alone”. So no, at the time, IMHO on that matter they were not guided by the Holy Spirit.

Would be the same with a great Reformer like Calvin being complicit in the burning at the stake of the heretic Servetus in Geneva in 1553.

Was Calvin right? No.

Was everything he taught falsified as a result? No.

Am I glad the church has since revised her then-universal doctrine and practice of executing heretics? You bet!
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January 13, 2015 3:31pm
Maggy Wassilieff

hj @3:00pm….

“Maggy Wassilieff do you prefer the idearly of a blank slate?”

of course not.
(I’m a biologist, for goodness sake!… I’m aware of genes, evolutionary history….. but I’m also aware of the limits of our understanding of how genes influence individual behaviour (let alone social groupings) and I’m well aware of how social Darwinism can be pushed in any direction by folk wanting to justify aspects of human behaviour.
….. a pause for thought…. what conclusions could we draw about human behaviour if the favoured animals of social researchers were barnacles or garden snails?
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January 13, 2015 3:40pm
UglyTruth

In fact, scripture does mention it. It is known as the sin of Onan, which is why masturbation is often referred to as onanism. So yes, the only recorded instance of it in the Bible was punished with death.

Much as I’m wary of getting into an argument over the ethics of having a wank, I’d just like to make this point:
The sin of Onan was about not acting as a brother should according to Judaic law, it wasn’t simply about masturbation.
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January 13, 2015 3:42pm
Fletch

Kimbo, yes, well….
What else are you wrong about then? 😉

There are about 50,000 denominations in the United States alone and yes, they have some things in common, but there are also differences. Who is right? I worked with some Christians at one time, and I remember friends of theirs coming in and mentioned that they (or some others) had had a disagreement with their pastor, so went off and started another church. That seems to be quite common – to have a disagreement over some religious point or teaching and to go off and start yet another church.

What is the Truth (with a capital “T”) and who has the authority to say so? In my opinion, the truth is the truth and does not change. Yes, we can be mistaken about things etc, but I believe that that is why Jesus gave authority to Peter and his successors, to lead the Church inerrantly (is that a word?).

I also say to you that you are [Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.”
~Matthew 16:18-19

Jesus Himself set up his Church here to guide and instruct the faithful, making Peter the head of the Church and the Apostles the Bishops. Jesus also instructs Peter three times in John 21 to “feed my sheep”, and “tend my lambs” – ie, to shepherd his Church.

So when they had finished breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon,son of John, do you love Me more than these?” He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.” He said to him, “Tend My lambs.” He said to him again a second time, “Simon, son of John, do you love Me?” He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.” He said to him,“Shepherd My sheep.” He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of John, do you love Me?” Peter was grieved because He said to him the third time,“Do you love Me?” And he said to Him, “Lord, You know all things; You know that I love You.” Jesus said to him, “Tend My sheep.

So, yes. The Catholic Church is the authority through Peter (the first pope) and his successors. And it cannot be in error in its teaching, because it has been given the grace from Jesus not to be – as Jesus said, “the gates of Hell will not stand against it”. It would not last very long if it started teaching in error.

Even martin Luther himself wrote –

“Why are you searching heavenward in search of my keys? Do you not understand, Jesus said, ‘I gave them to Peter. They are indeed the keys of heaven, but they are not in heaven for I left them on earth.’ This is Jesus talking, ‘Peter’s mouth is My mouth, his tongue is My key case. His keys are My keys. They are an office. They are a power, a command given by God through Christ to all of Christendom for the retaining and remitting of the sins of men.'” and “We concede – as we must – that, what the Catholic Church says is true: that the Papacy has God’s Word and the office of the Apostles; and that we have received Holy Scripture, Baptism, the Sacraments, and the pulpit from them. What would we know of these if it were not for them.”

It should be noted that this was written after he left the Catholic Church.
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January 13, 2015 3:44pm
freemark

Are you here lying AGAIN Penny?
Still being CORRUPT?
Still stealing Rate & Taxpayers money?
Man, for the most hypocritical woman in NZ, with about the least credibiltiy, you certainly do have a fair bit of cheek.
But we all know some very juicy information is out there regarding your Funding, don’t we dear Penny?
I think your owners may be even more embarrassed than you…
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January 13, 2015 3:57pm
Kimbo

@ Fletch

Kimbo, yes, well….
What else are you wrong about then?

Certainly plenty. Hence the corporate and personal need to strive to hear the voice of the Spirit speaking through Scripture…and resist the temptation to rely on supposedly infallible men, offices, and institutions, irrespective of any claim they are inheritors of Peter’s office 🙂

After all, there is little likelihood of repentance and reform if you are convinced your knowledge of the truth is settled. And even less likelihood the Scriptures will speak afresh if you have decided they cannot and do not say anything to the contrary to what your dogma currently affirms.

Tune in tomorrow for another edition of “Catholics and Protestants: 500 years of talking past one another!”

PS: What is your source for Luther’s quote, and what year did he write it?

PPS: There are only two sacraments, not seven 🙂
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January 13, 2015 4:03pm
EAD

A lot of people here blame Obama here for America’s downfall. Yes he is the worst president they’ve ever had but the real problem is the American public has become so infantile it is they who elected 0 twice. Judging by who he labels as a “terrorist”, Americans must like living in a police state.:

http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/obama-declares-war-extremism-extremist-according-definition

And rather than blame Obama for everything, surely we need to look at the State itself? Ever since 1871 when America became a corporation but particularly since 1913 when International Banking interests took over with the the establishment of the Federal Reserve, America has been on a 1 way ticket to destruction as the parasites sucked the country dry?

2015 will merely be the final coup de tat as reality finally destroys all notions of hope and change.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-01-10/ron-paul-reality-now-setting-america-it-was-all-based-lies-ignorance
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January 13, 2015 4:10pm
Kimbo

@ Fletch

…and where is the link in Luther’s thought between Petrine authority and the ministry of the bishop of Rome?
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January 13, 2015 4:11pm
mikenmild

Zero Hedge – predicting imminent economic collapse for quite a few years now. You really going to get hung up on 2015 for the year the prophecies will come true, EAD?
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January 13, 2015 4:12pm
EAD

That was a quick reply Mikey – are you part of my fan club?

If you look at any of my posts here, I’ve always said 2015 will be the year of the big collapse. I know this not because I have special powers, but all bubbles follow the same wave like pattern of false booms caused by easy central bank money followed by a corresponding crash. Or as Mises put it:

“The wavelike movement affecting the economic system, the recurrence of periods of boom which are followed by periods of depression, is the unavoidable outcome of the attempts, repeated again and again, to lower the gross market rate of interest by means of credit expansion”
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January 13, 2015 4:21pm
Fletch

Kimbo, sources –

Luther was excommunicated from the Catholic Church in January 1521.

“Accordingly, we concede to the papacy that they sit in the true Church, possessing the office instituted by Christ and inherited from the apostles, to teach, baptize, administer the sacrament, absolve, ordain, etc., ”
Sermon for the Sunday after Christ’s Ascension; John 15:26-16:4 (2nd sermon) A Sermon by Martin Luther; taken from his Church Postil, 1522. [This sermon is taken from volume III:254-271 of The Sermons of Martin Luther]

and

“We concede — as we must — that so much of what they [the Catholic Church] say is true: that the papacy has God’s word and the office of the apostles, and that we have received Holy Scriptures, Baptism, the Sacrament, and the pulpit from them. What would we know of these if it were not for them?”
Sermon on the gospel of St. John, chaps. 14 – 16 (1537), in vol. 24 of LUTHER’S WORKS,
St. Louis, Mo., Concordia, 1961, 304

The last quote is harder to pin down, but is supposed to have been written in 1530 –

“Why are you searching heavenward in search of my keys? Do you not understand, Jesus said, ‘I gave them to Peter. They are indeed the keys of heaven, but they are not found in heaven for I left them on earth. Peter’s mouth is my mouth, his tongue is my key case, his keys are my keys. They are an office. They are a power, a command given by God through Christ to all of Christendom for the retaining and remitting of the sins of men. (Martin Luther 1530 – after he left the Church)
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January 13, 2015 4:23pm
EAD

5 downticks in 7 minutes!

Can I have some of the kool aid you Central Planning Worshippers are drinking?
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January 13, 2015 4:32pm
Ryan Sproull

In fact, scripture does mention it. It is known as the sin of Onan, which is why masturbation is often referred to as onanism. So yes, the only recorded instance of it in the Bible was punished with death.

For the record, Onan’s sins were disobedience and greed, not masturbation.

He was ordered by his father to have a child with his older brother’s widow, pulled out before ejaculating and “spilled his seed”. This was because if he got his older brother’s widow pregnant and she had a kid, the kid would get his dead older brother’s sweeter inheritance, rather than him.

So God killed him. Not for jerking off, but for pulling out.
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January 13, 2015 4:33pm
Ryan Sproull

“You spent two years studying to be a minister?” they ask me. “Have you found that useful?” they inquire.

“Sure,” I say. “All the time.”
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January 13, 2015 4:33pm
cricko

OK Kimbo

I accept that you admit that you are an idiot.

Anyone who was interested (not that there will be many)
can simply go back and see what I wrote, compare it to what you claim I wrote and see the part that
you maliciously added and attributed to me.

A pathetic and risible tactic to try and squirm out of a hole you dug for yourself.
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January 13, 2015 4:35pm
Fletch

As far as contraception, even Sigmund Freud called contraceptive sex a “perversion”.

“. . . it is a characteristic common to all the perversions that in them reproduction as an aim is put aside. This is actually the criterion by which we judge whether a sexual activity is perverse – if it departs from reproduction in its aims and pursues the attainment of gratification independently . . . Everything that . . . serves the pursuit of gratification alone is called by the unhonored title of ‘perversion’ and as such is despised.”
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January 13, 2015 4:36pm
Shawn Herles

@ Penny, Public bludger, Left Wing hypocrite in Chief.

The difference is Shawn Herles – that I answered your question – but you have not yet answered mine.

You spun a story. Whether or not it’s true is another matter. I have no reason to take your word for anything.

Are YOU Shawn Herles being paid by anyone to promote or protect the interests of the State of Israel, the Government of the USA (of which you have stated you are a proud citizen), John Key, or any other person or matter?

No. I defend Israel, the US and National because that is the right thing to do.

And – if you think me or my comments are ‘too silly to be taken seriously’ – why do you bother reading them – let alone replying to them?

Because your lies about JK, Israel and the US have to be answered publicly, or simple minds may be tempted to believe the crap you spin.

Especially when have previously stated that you weren’t going to?

A ‘man of your word’ eh Shawn Herles?

NOT.

No surprises there ….

No surprises that you resort to changing the subject when your own hypocrisy is exposed.

You have inferred repeatedly that John Key was responsible for the GFC, that he is a tool of Israel and/or the US, and that anybody on this forum who questions your claims may be corrupt and feeding at the public trough.

Then when someone uses the same tactics on you, you cry like a spoiled child, threaten people with legal action and make complaints.

Your hypocrisy is impressive Penny. But no surprise. You think your special, above the law and the rules, while holding everyone else to account. You steal from ratepayers to fund your lifestyle, and spend the time you have, because you don’t bother working and contributing to the country, accusing other people of corruption, theft, and being under the control of foreign powers. All of which is, morally speaking, defaming others and engaging in character assassination.

But woe betide anyone who does exactly the same thing to Queen Penny! Oh no, that won’t do at all! Nobody can question you or your motives and funding, that is a privilege reserved to you alone apparently!

You are a fraud and a hypocrite Penny.
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January 13, 2015 4:42pm
Kimbo

@ Fletch

Luther was excommunicated from the Catholic Church in January 1521.

Yep. Although he had decided a long time before then that she had no authority over him. From the time he nailed the 95 theses to the Wittenburg Castle Church doors (31 October 1517) as a faithful Catholic to then was a slowly evolving process. By the time of his final address to the Diet of Worms (18 April 1521) he was quite clear when the authority of Rome was put to him as the reason to recant:

Unless I am convinced by the testimony of the Scriptures or by clear reason (for I do not trust either in the pope or in councils alone, since it is well known that they have often erred and contradicted themselves), I am bound by the Scriptures I have quoted and my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and will not recant anything, since it is neither safe nor right to go against conscience. May God help me. Amen.

“Accordingly, we concede to the papacy that they sit in the true Church, possessing the office instituted by Christ and inherited from the apostles, to teach, baptize, administer the sacrament, absolve, ordain, etc.,

Yes, not “ARE the true Church”. “Sitting in” – which most charitable Protestants will acknowledge of Rome – is not the same as what Rome claims of herself. Rome: WE are the true church. Protestants: Catholics, Protestants, Eastern Orthodox comprise the true visible church.

“Why are you searching heavenward in search of my keys? Do you not understand, Jesus said, ‘I gave them to Peter. They are indeed the keys of heaven, but they are not found in heaven for I left them on earth. Peter’s mouth is my mouth, his tongue is my key case, his keys are my keys. They are an office. They are a power, a command given by God through Christ to all of Christendom for the retaining and remitting of the sins of men. (Martin Luther 1530 – after he left the Church)

Yes, but as I asked before, there is no automatic connection in Luther’s between the keys of Peter..and their sole or primary continuing repository in the hands of the bishop of Rome. In fact I can guarantee you he thought the contrary…certainly at the time of the Borgias and Leo X the galloping gourmet who supposedly excommunicated him.

Remember it is best to read and understand Luther as a former Catholic slowly but surely becoming more Protestant (on some matters!) the further he went on in life.
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January 13, 2015 4:44pm
Manolo

The Messiah has attained invisibility:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ_t9QQsIU4
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January 13, 2015 4:45pm
Ryan Sproull

As far as contraception, even Sigmund Freud called contraceptive sex a “perversion”.

From the same book:

Even the kiss can be claimed to be perverse, for it consists in the union of two erogenous mouth zones in place of the respective genitals.

Are you of the opinion that kissing is perverse, Fletch? It’s a sexual activity whose aims are pleasure and not reproduction.
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January 13, 2015 4:47pm
cricko

Manolo

Maybe Michelle knew that the blonde chick he took the selfie with at Mandelas service (shes standing on the right) was going and threw a little tanty and wouldn’t let him out.
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January 13, 2015 4:49pm
Shawn Herles

@ Stephie

Shawn Herles, so you belive that Jes Bush and the GOP will continue with the Holy Crusade left unfinished by GWB with both happy to ratchet up military spending once again to unprecedent levels

Why do assume Jeb will be Pres?

Military spending is too low for the current challenges. And national defense is not a holy crusade. Real crusades are never holy. I support dealing effective with Islamic terrorism. Note that. Islamic TERRORISM, not Islam itself.

Paid for by how? Another credit card for a $ 3 trillion war by more deficit spending ?Sashing of course welfare programs and any hope of affordable medical care ?

Welfare spending is too high. Reducing it to pay for national defense makes sense.

Another point.Last weekend you I believe you made a rather outstanding claim that the U.S. in fact won the war in South Vietnam Thus saving SE Asia , Australia l and us from falling to the communist dominoes ?

No I didn’t say that stephie. I said that the resolve over ten years in SV helped convince nascent communist revolutionaries elsewhere to think twice. And that is true. Nor am I the first person to say that by a long shot. An article in the Chch Press some years ago said the same thing. That does not mean the US won in SV. It does mean it helped stop further communist revolutions elsewhere in southeast Asia.
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January 13, 2015 4:54pm
hj

Maggy Wassilieff (542 comments) says:
January 13th, 2015 at 2:55 pm
@hj 10:08… sorry for the delay in replying… but as a good little hominin I’ve been indulging in some social grooming.
My problem with sociobiology is that the biology of social animals has been hijacked to justify political ideologies.
…….
The reason I posted the above quote is that it argues that evolved human ethnocentrism extends to the nation. There are advantages and disadvatages in such a situation. The advantages include a feeling of well-being (especially for poorer people in a country like NZ- “don’t let them sell *our* farms) and it is easier to mobilise people in a common cause. Under current policy it is assumed “new citizens” are made but this is just a technicality, their ethnic identity may me at odds with the interests of the rest of the population. Humans are in competition with humans. Those who see betrayel are not wrong (unless you believe in the mantra – lack of evidence aside- that are large (er) inflow of migrants will make us (not just some of us) better off.
The notion of the wellbeing of the population is bourne out by the Putnam study (diversity v cohesion) and by modelling plus by experiments involving oxytocin. Why mess with success?
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January 13, 2015 4:54pm
Brian Smaller

Griff – that vid was funny. Just realised the dark haired actress is in Big Bang Theory. But once again the same “liberal” lefties who made it would never ever make any sort of mockery of the Religion of Peace for fear of causing offence (or because it would not fit with their narrative).
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January 13, 2015 4:56pm
Fletch

Kimbo, ahh yes, the keys. That is a topic unto itself. Scott Hahn (a former protestant) explains –

http://catholicfaithdefenders.com/tag/old-testament
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January 13, 2015 5:05pm
Kimbo

@ Fletch

Scott Hahn (a former protestant) explains…

Yes, I’ve read Hahn’s stuff before. He wrote a story of his conversion to Catholicism, Rome sweet Rome. Sorry, Fletch, unimpressed. More another Catholic theologian talking past Protestants, or only engaging with that strain of diverse Protestant thought that is useful to rebut.

Although I will acknowledge it is often amusing seeing Protestants bend over backwards when dealing with Matthew 16: 18 and 19 to avoid anything that could imply the recipient of the keys is Peter himself or an on-going ordained office
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January 13, 2015 5:10pm
stigie

The head of the GCSB Ian Fletcher resigned today for family reasons….

I wonder what conspiracy the left and Penny Bright will come with, with this anouncement ?
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January 13, 2015 5:17pm
hj

Maggy Wassilieff (542 comments) says:
January 13th, 2015 at 2:55 pm
@hj 10:08… sorry for the delay in replying… but as a good little hominin I’ve been indulging in some social grooming.
My problem with sociobiology is that the biology of social animals has been hijacked to justify political ideologies.
……….

I’ll restate that: the biological basis of human ethnocentrism extends to the nation and is something the base of the pyramid cares deeply about. It is what inspires people to “die for their country”. The goal of multicultural policy is to “unlearn” this innate behaviour (but only in the west). Elites control the narrative and undermine the interests of the population.
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January 13, 2015 5:18pm
Shawn Herles

Although I will acknowledge it is often amusing seeing Protestants bend over backwards when dealing with Matthew 16: 18 and 19 to avoid anything that could imply the recipient of the keys is Peter himself or an on-going ordained office

Peter was the personal recipient of the Keys, and the office he holds is ongoing. However, that has nothing to do with the Bishop of Rome, or for that matter any issue of Church authority.
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January 13, 2015 5:19pm
Fletch

ps, I think the “sitting…” point you make above is mere semantics. What follows immediately after, of course, is, “possessing the office instituted by Christ and inherited from the apostles.” That about says it all.
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January 13, 2015 5:20pm
hj

Maggy Wassilieff (542 comments) says
:My problem with sociobiology is that the biology of social animals has been hijacked to justify political ideologies.
……

An example would be helpful?
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January 13, 2015 5:28pm
Harriet

“….The National Party are the modern day equivalent of Nero – fiddling will Rome burned….”

Slowcialism is my take on National EAD.

And they’re recreating the worst of the Roman and Greek societies too.
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January 13, 2015 5:42pm
Ryan Sproull

An example would be helpful?

There was this obscure movement in Germany in the first half of the 20th century…
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January 13, 2015 5:42pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@hj 5.28…. oh dear, we are going to get into murky water here aren’t we…

ok,….. male lions taking over a new pride kill the cubs of defeated males…. oh look, now we can understand why step-dads kill babies….. its all programmed into their genes.

perhaps it’d be better if you looked at some of the crap evolutionary “pop” psychology that appears in Stuff’s “well & Good”” columns…..

and how about this chap
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satoshi_Kanazawa
(hope you’re not a fan!)
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January 13, 2015 5:49pm
SGA

Maggy Wassilieff at 5:49 pm
It’s too easy to drift into “just so stories” with sociobiology or evolutionary psychology. Sure, it’s ok to speculate and hypothesize, but more than a few grains of salt are required.
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January 13, 2015 5:58pm
SGA

Ryan Sproull at 5:42 pm
Although somewhat related, I think that eugenics and Wilson’s sociobiology aren’t really the same thing. Happy to be corrected.
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January 13, 2015 6:02pm
Ryan Sproull

Although somewhat related, I think that eugenics and Wilson’s sociobiology aren’t really the same thing. Happy to be corrected.

Ah, apologies. I just assumed from the quote that she was talking about a broader field into which social Darwinism would fit.
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January 13, 2015 6:05pm
stephieboy

Shawn Herles ,

Your wrong about the domino theory .It actually and originally applied to the spread of international Communism by the Soviet Union and Red China .That made room for the rationale of it to develop after the French were defeated by the Viet Minh .This would open the floodgates for Communist expansion in Indo China and beyond .Thus was the rationale for US intervention in Vietnam.

But the US did not count on the ideological split between the two Communist giants which in turn led to splits over their military policy and support for North Vietnam including the Vietcong .This certainly can’t of helped NorthVietnam and the Vietcong , let alone fight a war against 500,000 US soldiers ,their South Vietnam and other allies. .Furthermore what the ideological split also emphasised is that a countries external policies are largely defined by its respective national interests which are heavily influenced by historical factors including geography.

Then of course we have the collapse of the monolith bogey man the Soviet Union and the PRC decision to use market capitalism as a way forward .Thus I think your claim that the US stand in South Vietnam stopped the Dominos spreading is both disingenuous and a superficial analysis that bears no relational to what actually happened in SE Asia and beyond .The spread of communism by a domino effect was in fact never a practical reality or long term ideological goal by North Vietnam or the Vietcong .Historical and ideological realities made sure of that.
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January 13, 2015 6:05pm
Monique Angel

I believe Jeb will be next Pres. He’s American royalty. The main criteria by which you can run for President. You either come from a former First Family or you remake yourself in the image of a past American hero. Obama made it into the White House pitching himself as a modern day Martin Luther King.
And as a pagan I have to say my state of non religion doesn’t prohibit masturbation. It positively encourages it. Don’t knock it till you’ve tried it Lucia.
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January 13, 2015 6:05pm
Kimbo

@ Fletch

ps, I think the “sitting…” point you make above is mere semantics. What follows immediately after, of course, is, “possessing the office instituted by Christ and inherited from the apostles.” That about says it all.

No, Fletch, not semantics at all. Not when Luther claimed the keys of Peter for the Protestant Churches as well. Which, last I heard, is not something Rome acknowledges of Protestants. So the understanding of how the keys of Peter are possessed, and how the true church is identified are different.

Kindly stop reading Protestant scholars like a Roman Catholic. It leads to all sorts of confusion. I realise RC’s don’t necessarily have a lot of inclination or practise (in contrast to Protestants who are often obesessed with Rome – after all, we originally defined ourselves in “protest” against her), but nevertheless, I recommend you give it a go 🙂
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January 13, 2015 6:13pm
hj

Maggy Wassilieff (543 comments) says:
January 13th, 2015 at 5:49 pm

@hj 5.28…. oh dear, we are going to get into murky water here aren’t we…
….
not a good answer for someone who says they are a biologist. More like someone who doesn’t like the evidence?

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/11/science/11hormone.html?_r=0

Oxytocin has been described as the hormone of love. This tiny chemical, released from the hypothalamus region of the brain, gives rat mothers the urge to nurse their pups, keeps male prairie voles monogamous and, even more remarkable, makes people trust each other more.

Yes, you knew there had to be a catch. As oxytocin comes into sharper focus, its social radius of action turns out to have definite limits. The love and trust it promotes are not toward the world in general, just toward a person’s in-group. Oxytocin turns out to be the hormone of the clan, not of universal brotherhood. Psychologists trying to specify its role have now concluded it is the agent of ethnocentrism.

Oxytocin

Results show that oxytocin creates intergroup bias because oxytocin motivates in-group favoritism and, to a lesser extent, out-group derogation. These findings call into question the view of oxytocin as an indiscriminate “love drug” or “cuddle chemical” and suggest that oxytocin has a role in the emergence of intergroup conflict and violence.
To survive and prosper, individuals need groups whose members contribute information and resources. Because contributing resources and information makes oneself vulnerable to exploitation by others, group members need to know who to trust or to distrust, who can be expected to also contribute to the group and to reciprocate cooperation, and who may abuse in-group generosity and free-ride on others (1). A key mechanism facilitating such in-group cooperation is ethnocentrism, the tendency to view one’s own group as centrally important and as superior to other groups. Ethnocentrism manifests itself in positive valuation of (members of) one’s in-group. Such in-group favoritism signals loyalty and positive commitment to the group, thus rendering the ethnocentric individual a reliable and trustworthy partner. Ethnocentrism may also show up in negative valuation of (members of) out-groups. Such out-group derogation signals to in-group members who should be excluded from in-group resources and exchanges, and reduces the probability that in-group resources are inadvertently extended to out-groups (1–6).

If in-group favoritism and out-group derogation have adaptive value and sustain in-group functioning, coordination, and cooperation, it follows that (i) throughout evolution those individuals who displayed in-group favoritism and out-group derogation and who detected such tendencies in others were more likely to spread than individuals lacking these capacities (5–8) and (ii) the human brain may have evolved to sustain ethnocentrism through yet-unknown neurobiological systems

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3029708/

Then there’s the population issue “J” shaped curve as it relates to the swap factor in immigration.
http://www.globalchange.umich.edu/globalchange2/current/lectures/human_pop/human_pop.html
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January 13, 2015 6:24pm
hj

SGA (1,425 comments) says:
January 13th, 2015 at 5:58 pm

Maggy Wassilieff at 5:49 pm
It’s too easy to drift into “just so stories” with sociobiology or evolutionary psychology. Sure, it’s ok to speculate and hypothesize, but more than a few grains of salt are required.
…
yes it is threatening isn’t it. Feminists hate it.

The Liberals’ War on Science
How politics distorts science on both ends of the spectrum

The left’s war on science begins with the stats cited above: 41 percent of Democrats are young Earth creationists, and 19 percent doubt that Earth is getting warmer. These numbers do not exactly bolster the common belief that liberals are the people of the science book. In addition, consider “cognitive creationists”—whom I define as those who accept the theory of evolution for the human body but not the brain. As Harvard University psychologist Steven Pinker documents in his 2002 book The Blank Slate (Viking), belief in the mind as a tabula rasa shaped almost entirely by culture has been mostly the mantra of liberal intellectuals, who in the 1980s and 1990s led an all-out assault against evolutionary psychology via such Orwellian-named far-left groups as Science for the People, for proffering the now uncontroversial idea that human thought and behavior are at least partially the result of our evolutionary past.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-liberals-war-on-science/
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January 13, 2015 6:47pm
jcuk

Had a thought awhile ago before I came to KB to read the various dog fights ….

Price of petrol going down is dreadful … it is such a problem in getting enough litres to cost $40 plus to get the discount …. urrrgh!
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January 13, 2015 7:15pm
SGA

hj at 6:47 pm
Threatening “no”, confusing and warranting caution “yes”.
The problem with the study you cited, from a quick read, lies in the definition of “in-group” because individuals are simultaneously members of a number of overlapping “in-groups” (country, “race”, religion, class, city, etc). Oxytocin doesn’t “know” or define “in-group” – from the sounds of things it may prime pumps but which pumps it’s going to prime seem an open question. At least that’s my impression from a quick read. No?
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January 13, 2015 7:16pm
Lucia Maria

Monique Angel,

I always enjoy your comments, and I doubt I’m the only one.

With regards to what I may or may not have tried, I was not a practicing Catholic for 20 years from my late teens to late thirties, so there is wide experience there.
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January 13, 2015 7:22pm
Viking2

OOOO, are you saying you have been naughty Lucia???

Tell us about it. We will forgive you, no charge.
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January 13, 2015 7:23pm
stigie

Just as well Johnboy is not around tonight Lucia otherwise he could have got you into an awkward position ???
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January 13, 2015 7:27pm
Viking2

jcuk (803 comments) says:
January 13th, 2015 at 7:15 pm

Had a thought awhile ago before I came to KB to read the various dog fights ….

Price of petrol going down is dreadful … it is such a problem in getting enough litres to cost $40 plus to get the discount …. urrrgh!
===============================
Easy fixed , dump the pious and buy yourself a real car.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/01/11/2015-detroit-auto-show-preview/21594871/

The Dodge stand will attract those who want to see a pair of Hellcats. The Dodge Charger and Dodge Challenger SRT Hellcats wrestled a 6.2-liter supercharged Hemi V8 under the hood, which puts out a mind-numbing 707 horsepower. It makes the Charger the most powerful production sedan in the world. The Viper also will be on display.
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January 13, 2015 7:31pm
Viking2

Digital government begins

Largely unheralded, the government digital service is one of the current administration’s success stories. Tirelessly championed by Francis Maude, as minister for the Cabinet Office, egged on by Baroness Lane-Fox, and run by Mike Bracken, brought in from outside, the GDS is not just trying to make government services online as easy as shopping at Amazon or booking an airline ticket. It is also reshaping the way the public sector does big IT projects to make sure cost and time overruns are history.

http://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.co.nz/2015/01/matt-ridley-from-uk-digital-government.html

Lesson here for our big spenders. Especially the IRD.
Before they waste and spend.
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January 13, 2015 7:36pm
Viking2

I see that martyn.Matin is frothing at the mouth claiming the PM is detoothing the Human Rights commission.

Well if he is then get on with and good riddance

http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2015/01/13/last-watchdog-has-its-teeth-removed-by-key-government/
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January 13, 2015 7:44pm
EAD

Ex – Muslim asks Americans just what it’ll take for them to wake up to the threat of Islam?

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/01/ex-muslims-open-letter-to-america-what-else-has-to-happen-so-you-wake-up

Same question over here – why exactly should NZ be immune to the problems Islam is giving every other country where their virus takes root.
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January 13, 2015 7:49pm
Nostradamus

Why is this mob living in the West?

Controversial Australian Islamic group Hizb ut-Tahrir refuses to condemn terrorist attacks in Paris… and calls on Muslims to resist the ‘vile and racist’ West

– Hizb ut-Tahrir Australia has refused to condemn the Paris attacks
– The group released a statement entitled We Will Not Abandon Our Prophet
– Say response is disproportionate to countless others who die every day
– Group believes political leaders are using the situation for own agenda
– They have called on Muslims to resist the ‘vile and racist’ West

More details in this article.
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January 13, 2015 7:51pm
nasska

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dzeeylsw2nhfj4c/Muslim%2022.jpg?dl=0
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January 13, 2015 7:56pm
Griff

So now we have to much information about both Lucia Maria and Monique
I blame v2 and his deliberate rark of the god addled this morning
The resulting confessions giving me haunting images that will fester for a long time.
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January 13, 2015 7:59pm
stigie

So much for the burkha Nasska…sometimes it comes in handy !~
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January 13, 2015 8:02pm
nasska

Intensive counselling may help Griff. 🙂
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January 13, 2015 8:08pm
stigie

Are those haunting images of thigh high boots Griff…? You poor bastard you !~

Take Nasskas advice ?
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January 13, 2015 8:09pm
Griff

I believe such counselling can be found in a self help format on line in pictorial form nasska.
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January 13, 2015 8:11pm
kowtow

Charlie Hebdo sacked its own cartoonist .

Je suis Charlie?

As i said before france has draconian anti free speech laws. What’s that liar Hollande on about freedom for?

January 2009

” Maurice Sinet, 80, who works under the pen name Sine, faces charges of “inciting racial hatred” for a column he wrote last July in the satirical weekly Charlie Hebdo. The piece sparked a summer slanging match among the Parisian intelligentsia and ended in his dismissal from the magazine.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/4351672/French-cartoonist-Sine-on-trial-on-charges-of-anti-Semitism-over-Sarkozy-jibe.html
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January 13, 2015 8:14pm
Viking2

Aha I just knew it would get the day off good. Pleased you enjoyed it.

Always liked the Wgtn Catholic Girls with their short skirts, long black tights, knee boots and man friendly attitude. Horny tarts.
😆
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January 13, 2015 8:25pm
waikatogirl

There is nobody or anything else in my bedroom other than my husband and myself, so whateve happens between myself and I is nobody else’s business.

Whatever makes you happy I say 🙂
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January 13, 2015 8:27pm
nasska

….”There is nobody or anything else in my bedroom other than my husband and myself, so whateve happens between myself and I is nobody else’s business. “….

Not so fast waikatogirl! 🙂

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4uq8xu0x68wljri/Consent.jpg?dl=0
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January 13, 2015 8:33pm
stigie

And i thought Minus lurked about because JB was here…seems im wrong !~
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January 13, 2015 8:39pm
RF

Jesus wept. Crusaders were in training today. Guess who was injured… Daniel Carter.
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January 13, 2015 8:42pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@hj 6:24pm….. gosh, I’m 30 years too late… as a lactating female, I could have gone around raising the oxytocin levels of all and sundry and we’d all be a happy group of cooperating humans …. for I’m not very particular who I fancy.

(Some folk don’t even need a lactating female in their presence…. just reading the previous postings on masturbation might be all they need to raise their hormone levels).

Thank goodness some humans decided to strike out beyond their immediate “in-groups” and took to migrating and interbreeding…
That’s our history hj…. just a big mish-mash of oxytocin-loaded encounters.
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January 13, 2015 8:56pm
cricko

Jeez, we all make mistakes.

My big mistake today was in engageing with a now self declared idiot like Kimbo in the mistaken belief that
he was an honest broker. He is not.

Seems that it’s true that…..

Most/all of these religious obsessive types are the most fucked up and devious of all.

‘Sex,’ is the subject where they are always found out.

Poor sick sods. Whenit comes right down to it, pulling themselves is the subject they are all about
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January 13, 2015 9:23pm
cha

The Messiah has attained invisibility:

Yeah, lazy prick skipped the photo-op.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/paris-march-tv-wide-shots-reveal-a-different-perspective-on-world-leaders-at-largest-demonstration-in-frances-history-9972895.html
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January 13, 2015 9:38pm
cricko

Sorry, i meant to say,

‘Guilt’ about pulling themselves is what they are really on about.
That is what drives them to this very day.
Maybe it all started when their Mum caught them at it,

Poor sick sods.
Right Kimbo ?
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January 13, 2015 9:40pm
cha

Opportunist!.
/

Netanyahu initially planned not to go, but he changed his mind after learning that his two main competitors in the upcoming election for the votes of the Israeli right-wing, Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman and Economy Minister Naftali Bennet, would be attending.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:riQMjGEJUqoJ:www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/.premium-1.636737+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=nz
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January 13, 2015 9:47pm
stephieboy

cha, good one .I take it the GOP representatives were out in force as well for the photo op ?

Ah , is that them second row far left ?
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January 13, 2015 9:52pm
hj

Maggy Wassilieff (544 comments) says:
Thank goodness some humans decided to strike out beyond their immediate “in-groups” and took to migrating and interbreeding…
That’s our history hj…. just a big mish-mash of oxytocin-loaded encounters.
….
I thought you would at least understand the theory
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January 13, 2015 10:19pm

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