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August 6, 2014 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 6 August 2014

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General Debate

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Griff

Meh
Sarah gets a plug at mad.

After her disastrous Vice Presidential run and equally-doomed reality show, we were all left wondering what Sarah Palin would do next. Lucky for us (we were running low on material), the Sarah Palin Channel launched today! A brand new, one-stop shop for lame-brained ideas and right wing lunatic fringe talking points, it’s already giving Fox News a run for it’s money! Speaking of money, for those who can’t afford the $9.95 monthly subscription, we cut through the media filters and present…
http://www.madmagazine.com/blog/2014/07/28/mads-unfiltered-look-at-the-new-sarah-palin-channel
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August 6, 2014 2:26pm
stephieboy

Shawn LH , our former US resident and self appointed sole expert on that country’s affairs . You’ve obviously forgotten that the US is a democracy with constitutional protections of free speech. Jimmy Carter is entitled to his opinions even if we may find them disagreeable. Opinions that if you even had half your way would almost evaporate in the land of the free.et the mid term congressional elections roll on and in the name of the Constitution and free speech . As indicated a sentiment you do not obviously share.

Meanwhile at least amore nuanced Rand Paul appreciates the real complexities of Foreign Policy which a clown like you Palin and Ted Cruz could never grasp,

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/rand-paul-foreign-policy-2013-2

Meanwhile l
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August 6, 2014 2:30pm
lilman

Love the thought that Penny may pay her rates one day.

Pay what you owe.

Pay your rates.

Why are you dishonest?

Why are you stealing?

When will you do the right thing?

Penny,what does it feel like to knowingly take services and the lie about your reason for the theft.

Pay your rates.
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August 6, 2014 2:36pm
Other_Andy

Hamas Body Armour

http://tinyurl.com/px7cctl
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August 6, 2014 2:39pm
ShawnLH

“Shawn LH , our former US resident and self appointed sole expert on that country’s affairs”

Stephie, our resident internet expert on the US. 🙂

” You’ve obviously forgotten that the US is a democracy with constitutional protections of free speech”

No, that would be the Democrats who promote hate speech laws.

“. Jimmy Carter is entitled to his opinions”

And because of free speech I’m entitled to call him a stain on the US.

“Opinions that if you even had half your way would almost evaporate in the land of the free.et the mid term congressional elections”

Real; free speech is better protected by Republicans, not Dems.

“Meanwhile at least amore nuanced Rand Paul appreciates the real complexities of Foreign Policy which a clown like you Palin and Ted Cruz could never grasp,”

Rand Paul? The Tea Party guy? The guys you attack on a regular basis?

Any port in a storm eh Stephie?
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August 6, 2014 2:39pm
graham

Funny thing – Penny has been asked several questions that are VERY pertinent for somebody who supposedly wishes to represent the people of Helensville in Parliament, and is standing on a platform of transparency, accountability and openness. And yet she refuses to answer ANY of them.

On the 4th of August, Nostradamus asked some VERY good questions here:

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/08/general_debate_5_august_2014.html#comment-1373380

I noted the following statement on your blog:

I believe that is high time that NZ got our ‘House’ in order, and established the legislative framework to prevent and fight corruption, and ensure genuine transparency and accountability in local and central government and within the judiciary.
…
If you support the ‘self-funded’ work I am doing – your donations are welcome and appreciated.

Kiwibank

Account Name: P M Bright
Account Number: [redacted]

Thanks! 🙂

So, Penny, let’s put your transparency claims to the test:

1. How many people have made donations through your website since you posted your bank account details?

2. In the last financial year:

– What was the total amount donated?
– Who made the smallest donation, and how much was their donation?
– Who made the largest donation, and how much was their donation?

3. Have you spent any of the total amount donated in the last financial year?

4. If yes to 3, please specify: (i) each item purchased; (ii) when it was purchased; (iii) the purpose for which it was purchased; and (iv) the relevant amount.

5. In your Return of Electoral Donations and Expenses form, you declared an amount of $42.78 spent on “4 cans spray ink”? Given the unusual nature of that purchase in the context of a mayoral campaign, did the amount of $42.78 come from donations? Were the “4 cans spray ink” used to deface other candidates’ signs?

6. Have you retained any of the total amount donated in the last financial year as remuneration (however characterised) for your “self-funded work”?

7. If yes to 6, how much have you retained, and for what purpose?

8. If yes to 6, have you, or do you intend to, declare the retained amount in your tax return?

Your answers – all in the name of transparency – will be of considerable interest to Kiwiblog readers and the IRD!

Just in case Penny missed it, I pointed her to it again on the 5th of August.

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/08/christchurch_council_considers_partial_privatisations.html#comment-1373862

On a different subject, on the 4th of August, Penny was singing the praises of Grace Haden for her policies and “proven track record in fighting corruption”. I asked Penny to provide the INDEPENDENT evidence of what Grace Haden has actually achieved.

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/08/rankin_for_epsom.html#comment-1373364

Not surprisingly, Penny – outspoken champion of TRANSPARENCY and ACCOUNTABILITY – has not answered any of these questions.
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August 6, 2014 2:40pm
stephieboy

ShawnLH (3,761 comments) says:
August 6th, 2014 at 2:39 pm

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…!
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August 6, 2014 2:43pm
lurcher1948

i have to smile when some of our more rabid posters here on Mr Farrars great site,say with complete sincerity that its COMMUNISTIC to stop a CAPITALIST selling land to COMMUNIST CHINA….rabid ranters what a laugh and you believe in what you post………………….WTF
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August 6, 2014 2:51pm
Ross12

This morning Cunliffe was almost gloating about the dairy price dropping , saying this put the recovery in danger. Since then, all day Labour have been announcing new spending initiatives .

So where is the money coming from ??? Surely he learnt something at Boston consulting !! Sorry , I forgot about Russel’s printing press –that makes it easy for them
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August 6, 2014 2:54pm
ShawnLH

“ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…!”

Yes Stephie, I already knew you were asleep at the wheel! 🙂

P.S. If you have lost the debate and are lost for words there is no shame in admitting it. 🙂
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August 6, 2014 2:56pm
Pete George

Guy McCallum explains his resignation:

So on Thursday I made a decision to leave ACT because of differences in approach to Race Relations policy. This news has inevitably made it (big deep breath) into the world of public opinion.

This is where I’m coming from.

According to Radio Live, Jamie still likes me. However, that doesn’t change the fact that if Maori had their so-called ‘privilege’ taken away, I would still have mine as a Pakeha male. This is why I believe that indigenous rights are important; in Canada, indigenous rights are enshrined. Indigenous First Nation and Inuit people no longer have to tolerate neglect nor prejudice from governments and from other people. Their individual rights are protected from ethnic discrimination.

In NZ, all of our rights can be changed by law with astonishing speed and arrogance. Despite Maori legal rights being subject to that danger too, they are there to prevent discrimination based on someone’s identification as Maori. It is fair, still, that these rights imply obligations on the authority which violated those rights for so, so long.

Opposition to Maori legal rights cannot be excused by having Maori friends. I have taken this stand to show that one must defend their friends’ rights to be counted the same as I.

Neither can we appeal to voters, reporters and commentators for a civil debate, when we intend to shoot down those who disagree. That is no way to conduct a civil debate about a long and undignified chapter of NZ history.

When this is understood, and the lessons of this moment (and history) are learned, we could right a lot of wrongs and confidently open our worlds to one another. I patiently await the day.

And a big shout out to Dr Janine Hayward. She singled me out in an Indigenous Politics class and said that Don Brash had a lot of explaining to do. Instead, I took that moment to do a lot of thinking. I also want to thank those who have supported me as I enter this vulnerable chapter.

https://www.facebook.com/guy.mccallum1/posts/10204566153413769

He is getting a lot of support for his comments and stance.

It shouldn’t be underestimated how much differently younger people understand indigenous rights and Maori issues – even young ACT Party members – than the older generations.
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August 6, 2014 2:59pm
ShawnLH

“He is getting a lot of support for his comments and stance.”

I support him Pete. Whyte’s cynical attempt to bump up his dismal poll ratings was transparent. And given that ACT’s alternative budget supported current funding for treaty claims, it can reasonably be said that he’s not being entirely honest, or at least clear, about where ACT stands.

Good on McCallum for actually showing some consistent principles.
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August 6, 2014 3:04pm
Yoza

mandk (830 comments) says:
August 6th, 2014 at 1:28 pm

@Yoza,

Q. Why aren’t Egypt, Jordan and Saudi Arabia vociferously supporting Hamas and condemning Israel?

A. Because they are US client states.
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August 6, 2014 3:07pm
ShawnLH

“A. Because they are US client states.”

No, because unlike you they want real peace and they understand that HAMAS is a front for Iran.
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August 6, 2014 3:11pm
Nostradamus

The Sesame Street word of the day is *drum roll* Pete Georgeism (noun): to sit on the fence.

Pete George (22,917 comments) says:
August 6th, 2014 at 8:11 am

Act candidate for Dunedin North (and Act board member) Guy McCallum has officially resigned and withdrawn his candidacy as the result of “the development of a race relations policy” that “blindsided” him.
…
This publicity may help or hinder Act. It could also adversely affect National’s chances.

Further illustrations:

– Today it may or may not rain.
– Dunedin may or may not be the best city in New Zealand.
– Peter Dunne may or may not be the best New Zealand politician in living memory.
– Pete George may or may not laugh at this comment 🙂
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August 6, 2014 3:21pm
Pete George

I’ve become disappointed with Jamie Whyte. He is intelligent and interesting but his communication skills are letting him (and Act) down badly. It was not just the content of his legal equality/Maori speech and responses that created an adverse reaction, it was how he handled it that’s of concern.

David Seymour looks good for Epsom so Act may survive for another term but the wider rebuilding of the party is under serious jeopardy unless Whyte switches on to engaging with people effectively.

If he doesn’t get it right quickly Whyte may end up being another David Shearer – nice guy, good at some things but sucks as a leader.
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August 6, 2014 3:23pm
Pete George

Laugh more at you Nostradamus. Act will gain something and lose something from more publicity on this issue. Who knows how much it will help or hinder their chances at this stage?

Nostradamus may or may not be right, but who knows? Naming yourself after one of the most vague soothsayers is also funny.

Perhaps you’ve already written a quatrain predicting the election outcome.
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August 6, 2014 3:27pm
lurcher1948

You go Penny Bright even if i disagreed with your stance on ISRAEL/gaza, you have more balls and do more things than the nah saying wankers who doubt your passion and are online bullies and you keyboard whimps stand out like pimples on a smooth backside,you should form a group
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August 6, 2014 3:28pm
ShawnLH

“I’ve become disappointed with Jamie Whyte.”

Well, he is a Liberal, so I never expected much anyway.
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August 6, 2014 3:28pm
Nostradamus

Pete George:

Here’s how you avoid impaling yourself on the fence post:

– Voters who agree with a significant proportion of Act’s policies, including the one-law-for-all principle, will probably vote for Act.
– Voters who agree with a significant proportion of Act’s policies, excluding the one-law-for-all principle, may still vote for Act.
– Voters who disagree with a significant proportion of Act’s policies, regardless of their view on the one-law-for-all principle, won’t vote for Act.

So, in terms of your help/hinder question, the recent development will (for the most part) simply confirm existing voter preferences, won’t it?
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August 6, 2014 3:37pm
kowtow

McCallum and so called “indigenous rights”.

Canada.

Those rights are so entrenched that the law requires judges to take the race of an offender,if he is so called “indigenous” into account when sentencing!!!

Equality before the law? Nope. Special treatment based on race.

That’s racism and should be illegal.
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August 6, 2014 3:38pm
Sofia

Kumeu Baptist Church is a Christian congregation serving the Kumeu community in Auckland, and seeking, engaging, and encouraging others through a life-changing Christian journey.
Kumeu Baptist Church seeks to be a loving, friendly community that worships God, and serves others.

We place a high priority on teaching from the Bible and following the example of Jesus.
Our vision is to impact and renew Kumeu, Auckland and beyond with the transforming message of Jesus Christ through words and actions.

Penny Tarnish, give unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s – in this case Len Brown
In other words, Jesus would pay his rates. So should you 🙂
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August 6, 2014 3:45pm
Pete George

“So, in terms of your help/hinder question, the recent development will (for the most part) simply confirm existing voter preferences, won’t it?”

Not necessarily. Many voters ponder many things before deciding who to vote for, and one significant issue, policy or stuffup can make the difference. Here’s one reaction:

To be honest, if ACT believe that Jamie Whyte is the answer, it must have been a stupid question!

I have been an ACT supporter for the last three elections – but no more.

I’ve never encountered someone so aloof, and seemingly uninterested, as Jamie Whyte. It sounds to me like he considers politics to be beneath him.

As John Banks was recently quoted as saying in the NZ Herald, “Jamie struggles to relate to people, and, as such, will never make it in politics”

Not sure where that fits into your three options.
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August 6, 2014 3:46pm
Ross12

Greenpeace lose their charity status court case. Fantastic !!!
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August 6, 2014 3:52pm
Pete George

The claims following that are confusing Ross12.

Greenpeace Win Supreme Court Battle

Campaigning organisations can register as charities, the Supreme Court ruled this afternoon.

The ruling comes after a long-running court battle waged by Greenpeace.

Today, the Supreme Court overruled the Court of Appeal, saying that that charities can engage in political activities.

Bunny McDiarmid, Greenpeace’s executive director, said: “This decision makes New Zealand democracy a little stronger. It means that the Supreme Court has now recognised that trying to change our world for the better, and taking on government to do that, is a public good.

“This has been a legal marathon, and it’s great to see that New Zealand democracy took out the gold.”

But…

@GraemeEdgeler

I’ve read the Supreme Court’s decision. It did not do this. @GreenpeaceNZ

Who is right?
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August 6, 2014 3:58pm
Ross12

PG — I was only going on what the radio news reports said and Yahoo News. Good to see Graeme Edgeler agreeing.
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August 6, 2014 4:06pm
Nostradamus

Pete George:

The decision and media release can be found here.

Quoting from the media release:

This appeal concerned the extent to which purposes that are “political” (including those that advocate particular views) can be charitable and the extent to which an entity which engages in illegal activities or has illegal purposes can be charitable.
…
The Supreme Court by majority (comprising Elias CJ, McGrath and Glazebrook JJ) allowed the appeal against the Court of Appeal’s determination that a political purpose cannot be a charitable purpose.

The majority held that a political purpose exclusion should no longer be applied in New Zealand. They concluded that a blanket exclusion of political purposes is unnecessary and distracts from the underlying inquiry whether a purpose is of public benefit within the sense the law recognises as charitable. They rejected the conclusion of the Court of Appeal that s 5(3) of the Charities Act enacts a political purpose exclusion with an exemption if political activities are no more than “ancillary”. Rather, s 5(3) provides an exemption for noncharitable activities if ancillary.
…
The Court unanimously dismissed the appeal against the Court of Appeal’s determination that purposes or activities that are illegal or unlawful preclude charitable status. The Court held that an illegal purpose is disqualifying and that illegal activity may disqualify an entity from registration when it indicates a purpose which is not charitable even though such activity would not justify removal from the register of charities under the statute.

I’ve bolded what I consider to be the key sentence.
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August 6, 2014 4:10pm
Nostradamus

And the relevant part of the court decision (paragraph [104]):

The matter of the charitable status of the purposes of Greenpeace has not been considered on the correct basis. Although it may be doubtful on the material before the Court that charitable purpose can be established, it is inappropriate for such assessment to be undertaken as a matter of first and last impression in this Court. The Court of Appeal has acknowledged that the changes to Greenpeace’s objects make it necessary for Greenpeace to have the opportunity to provide further evidence about its activities. That was the basis on which the case was returned to the chief executive and Board for further consideration. The assessment of charitable purpose is theirs in the first instance. If it is concluded that the object of promoting nuclear disarmament and the elimination of weapons of mass destruction is not shown to be charitable, then the question whether the activities undertaken by Greenpeace are no more than ancillary to its charitable purposes will require further assessment by the chief executive and Board, as the Court of Appeal required. In all the circumstances, the best course seems to us to be to remit the application for reconsideration in the light of the changes to the Greenpeace objects and in the light of the reasons in this Court.

So, the Supreme Court has doubts about whether Greenpeace’s purposes are charitable, but the matter will be determined by the chief executive of the Department of Internal Affairs and the Charities Board.
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August 6, 2014 4:21pm
Manolo

Stephieboy will be worried:
The frustration carries over to the nation’s political leaders, with President Barack Obama’s overall approval rating hitting a new low at 40 percent…

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/americas-fed-obama-approval-rating-hits-all-time-low-poll-n173271
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August 6, 2014 4:23pm
Judith

For those that are interested in the Crewe murders, 3 Degrees is featuring it tonight.

The Murder Weapon
One of New Zealand’s most controversial crimes is back in the spotlight – so who killed the Crewes? An in depth investigation with journalist Melanie Reid.
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August 6, 2014 4:23pm
Manolo

Worth reading: http://www.wnd.com/2014/08/is-thinking-now-obsolete/

Some have said that we are living in a post-industrial era, while others have said that we are living in a post-racial era. But growing evidence suggests that we are living in a post-thinking era.

Many people in Europe and the Western Hemisphere are staging angry protests against Israel’s military action in Gaza. One of the talking points against Israel is that far more Palestinian civilians have been killed by Israeli military attacks than the number of Israeli civilians killed by the Hamas rocket attacks on Israel that started this latest military conflict.

Are these protesters aware that vastly more German civilians were killed by American bombers attacking Nazi Germany during World War II than American civilians killed in the United States by Hitler’s forces?

Has any other country, in any other war, been expected to keep the enemy’s civilian casualties no higher than its own civilian casualties? The idea that Israel should do so did not originate among the masses but among the educated intelligentsia.
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August 6, 2014 4:26pm
Ross12

Nostradamus @ 4.21pm

Thanks for your posts. If it is now back in the hands of the Dept of Internal Affairs CEO then it is back to where it started and I’d expect their original decision to stand. That is, they lose their charity status and pay tax.
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August 6, 2014 4:31pm
stephieboy

Judith, just hope long time David Bain supporter Melanie Reid makes a better job than she did against his fathers alleged gun shot residue marks.?
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August 6, 2014 4:39pm
stephieboy

Manolo, not bad when considering your GWB “s lowest rating was 19%,

http://www.ropercenter.uconn.edu/data_access/data/presidential_approval.html
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August 6, 2014 4:43pm
Sofia

Penny, I would pay special interest to the wording of ads for the meeting you want to attend – if it purports relating to or representative of the Helensville Electroate and doesn’t include you, there may be a case for the Electoral Commission to answer in terms of misrepresentation or inaccuracy of not publicizing ALL candidates standing.
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August 6, 2014 4:45pm
UglyTruth

Ugly quoting the New Testament when he does not believe in it in the first place is amusing.

You don’t know what I believe, Shawn. The original verse was from Isaiah, and was about Israel.

Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.
Isaiah 6:10
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August 6, 2014 4:49pm
Harriet

Manolo#

You’re right – people don’t think.

We didn’t fuck around with a ceasefire over Dresden and Horishima.

We leveled Dresden and burnt Horishima to the ground.

We don’t currently have a ceasefire with terrorists either.

Israel is not allowed to defend itself. Israel instead is expected to have continual ceasefires with everyone —– including terrorists who continuly ignore them.
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August 6, 2014 4:56pm
cricko

Wow.

Some would find it hard tp credit that here we have, ” UglyTruth” back again, still trying to push a non point that
was demolished on GD yesterday. (I’ll give you chapter and verse if I can be buggered looking up the times, and I can’t at present.)

This person even got to the stage of having to agree that they had it all wrong, but here they are, popping up again
pushing the same sicko, silly barrow.

Wanna do it all over again Ugly ?

Have you no shame ?
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August 6, 2014 5:15pm
UglyTruth

We didn’t fuck around with a ceasefire over Dresden and Horishima.

Which resulted in holocaust for those unfortunate enough to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.
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August 6, 2014 5:16pm
UglyTruth

Some would find it hard tp credit that here we have, ” UglyTruth” back again, still trying to push a non point that
was demolished on GD yesterday.

You mean when you tried to make a point using a mistranslation of the Quran, and didn’t quite seem to get the point about the nature of abrogation in Islam?
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August 6, 2014 5:19pm
Scott Chris

Anyone who likes astronomy will find this interesting:

For the past year, astronomers around the world have been watching the center of the Milky Way in anticipation of a once-per-eon event. Right around now (or, technically, 24,000 years ago—that’s roughly how far away the galactic center is in light years), a cloud of gas and dust plummeting toward our galaxy’s supermassive black hole, Sagittarius A*, is expected to make its closest approach. The black hole’s tidal forces should then rip the cloud to shreds. Eventually, Sagittarius A* might even swallow some of those shreds. And if that happens? Fireworks. X-rays and other radiation should rain down on all those watchful telescopes back on Earth. For the first time, we will have witnessed a black hole eating in real time.

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/dark-star-diaries/2014/05/02/cloud-bound-for-milky-ways-black-hole-puzzles-astronomers/
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August 6, 2014 5:23pm
Gulag1917

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAyo1BfO0TE
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August 6, 2014 5:28pm
Gulag1917

“Israel is not allowed to defend itself”
Wonder why they spend 5.6% % of the economy on defence?
http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/MS.MIL.XPND.GD.ZS
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August 6, 2014 5:33pm
cricko

UglyTruth

stop digging you fool.

No. I mean the part where you said that you had it wrong.

Sillybilly.
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August 6, 2014 5:38pm
Fletch

It is looking like that U.N school that people say Israel bombed on Sunday was not. Missiles were fired at the outside of the school, where Israel was targetting launchers. Gazans then dragged dead bodies inside the school to make it look like the school had been hit, when it hadn’t.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-lpadAkXb4

http://israelmatzav.blogspot.co.nz/2014/08/pallywood-how-hamas-set-up-attack.html
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August 6, 2014 6:22pm
EAD

I love this image and quote:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-08-05/difference-between-war-revolution

“War is when Governments tell you who is the enemy, Revolution is when you finally figure out who is the real enemy”
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August 6, 2014 6:32pm
itstricky

And… In the Things You Won’t See On KB category today, we have:

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11304781

“Act’s policies are about reminding you of scary burglars, zealous bureaucrats with a hidden green agenda, and resentful Maori of taking an equal placing. This is the imagery the vague words are designed to create. Liberals and libertarians are getting a rough deal from ACT.

“The positive ideals they represent are used as currency to hedge conservative influence, like the Tea Party. A lot of libertarians have avoided ACT for these reasons. For wanting to change that, I find myself in present circumstances.”

Mr McCallum said he had spoken to other members of the party “who are becoming concerned that ACT is focusing more on fear and prejudice to gain votes”.

Tomorrow we’ll have a report on the National chap in Hamilton who might be charged with Electoral advertising wrong doings -won’t we Keeping Stock?
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August 6, 2014 6:36pm
itstricky

“War is when Governments tell you who is the enemy, Revolution is when you finally figure out who is the real enemy”

Is that like when Jamie tells you Maori are the enemy?
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August 6, 2014 6:38pm
EAD

No tricky – the current divide in New Zealand is not created by the people. I play rugby, work alongside and have many friends who are Maori. When I interact with them, I treat them as equals – I judge them as individuals based on their character and that is it.

It is the succession of Labour & National Governments that want to play divide and conquer and insist on giving some of my group of friends legal & financial privileges depending on who their ancestors are. These manipulative governments are the enemy, not my friends, they are the ones that want to create division when there was none.

Jamie Whyte, Colin Craig et all would much rather we lived in a united country rather than a divided country of competing tribes on our knees to Big Government begging for favours and handouts.
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August 6, 2014 6:45pm
Scott Chris

Not the expected fireworks it turns out:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/22/gas-cloud-black-hole-video_n_5609134.html
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August 6, 2014 6:45pm
stephieboy

Ugly Truth,

A recent German Commission has established at best estimates that no more than 25,000 were killed as result of the Dresden bombing , This out of a total population of 3/4 of a million plus increase due to the arrival of refugees from the East .
Hardly a Holocaust ,

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/death-toll-debate-how-many-died-in-the-bombing-of

At Hiroshima some 135, 000 casualties out of a population of 255,000.Still hardly a holocaust when one considers the Nazis almost completely murdered and eliminated Poland’s 2.3 million Jews.

http://www.atomicarchive.com/Docs/MED/med_chp10.shtml

Your comparisons are often used by Jewish Holocaust Deniers to advanced their spurious arguments of ” equivalence ” i.e the fate of the Jews in WW2 is equivalent to those experienced at Dresden and Hiroshima .

Not true.
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August 6, 2014 6:47pm
Reid

Traumatized by Israel’s atrocities, Gazan kids are the most important problem the besieged enclave is facing, Press TV reports.

“Children refuse to talk. I could barely make anyone speak to me today because they are so traumatized they cannot even comprehend what’s happening around them,” said Halla Alsafadi, Press TV’s correspondent in Gaza, on Tuesday…

…“The amount of destruction in unbearable and it needs years to be rebuilt,” Alsafadi said.

Pernille Ironside, the head of the United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF) in Gaza, said earlier in the day that the war has had a “catastrophic and tragic impact” on children.

“There isn’t a single family in Gaza which hasn’t been touched by direct loss,” Ironside said, noting, “The impact that has on the ability of children to cope cannot be overstated… They have seen their friends and their parents die.”

So far, about 1,900 people have been killed and over 9,500 others injured by the Israeli regime’s massive offensive that began on July 8…

But that’s OK. According to many here, they deserve it, it’s their fault. They made Israel do it. They’re untermenschen. According to many here.

Where have we heard that before?
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August 6, 2014 7:00pm
EAD

Excellent piece by Thomas Sowell:

http://www.infowars.com/is-thinking-now-obsolete/

“Some have said that we are living in a post-industrial era, while others have said that we are living in a post-racial era. But growing evidence suggests that we are living in a post-thinking era.”

On the Western Intelligentsia views on Israel/Palestine:
“Has any other country, in any other war, been expected to keep the enemy’s civilian casualties no higher than its own civilian casualties? The idea that Israel should do so did not originate among the masses but among the educated intelligentsia”
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August 6, 2014 7:02pm
Viking2

Greenpeace has won the right to register as a charity, the Supreme Court found today.

Greenpeace has been involved in a lengthy court battle after a previous application to register as a charity was dismissed because it was found to be too political and its protests could land them on the wrong side of the law.

Today the Supreme Court found that political advocacy for a charitable undertaking is allowed.

In light of this decision Greenpeace will now have to the right to apply to the Charities Board, formerly the Charities Commission, for reconsideration.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11304925
===========================
wht a shameful day in court.
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August 6, 2014 7:02pm
Odakyu-sen

In other news: oil price drops to $US97.33 a barrell, and yet the local Zed is stuck at $2.21 a liter (as it was when oil was around $104 a barrel). The $NZ has only dropped slightly again the greenback, so I would hope to see a fall at the pumps.

Maybe I should fill up in South Auckland…
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August 6, 2014 7:03pm
stephieboy

EAD,

Interesting coming from the likes of Thomas Sowell and Alex Jones.Hardly original or profound thinkers. Both more of the birdbrain variety .

Post thinking era.?

Rich irony there.

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/page/287971_42_IDIOTIC_Alex_Jones_predicti
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August 6, 2014 7:16pm
EAD

Stephie – the article was written by Thomas Sowell. Who is this “Alex Jones” you refer to?

Doesn’t the author in his piece express exactly the same opinion that you’ve been preaching on these blogs on the Israel/Palestine conflict? Are you saying he is wrong just because it comes from a source that you dismiss?

Do you know what cognitive dissonance means – it is “the mental stress or discomfort experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs”
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August 6, 2014 7:19pm
nasska

https://www.dropbox.com/s/n34ex2hfxzt3sbw/It%20must%20be%20evil%2031.jpg
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August 6, 2014 7:20pm
stephieboy

EAD,

Inforwars is hosted and run by Alex Jones . Am sure Jone’s would not of accepted Sowell’s contribution unless there was a meeting of minds in most areas .

It’s conspiracy theorist who appear to have the highest incidence of cognitive dissonance judging by my link above.
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August 6, 2014 7:27pm
oldpark

noticed on Seven Sharp tonight the woman known as Toni Street crossed the line with her political comments putting the boot into John Key when he tolds the truth regarding the gangster crook Dotcon, Harres sugar daddy.Of course all she was doing was carrying on the theme of her Labour Party Channel TVNZ and her sycophant Labour mate Corrin Dann.Seven Sharp has lost its innoncence.Street is now going down the wrong street with her holier than thou political comments supporting a paid dotcom sugar daddy prodigy.
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August 6, 2014 8:00pm
nasska

FOUR RELIGIOUS TRUTHS

1. Muslims do not recognize Jews as God’s chosen people.
2. Jews do not recognize Jesus as the Messiah.
3. Protestants do not recognize the Pope as the leader of
the Christian World.
4. Baptists do not recognize each other at strip clubs.
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August 6, 2014 8:13pm
Judith

@ nasska (10,717 comments) says:
August 6th, 2014 at 8:13 pm

So from that, one can conclude that reading religious material will affect your eyesight to the degree that you are unable to recognise people?
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August 6, 2014 8:16pm
Johnboy

I used to be a Presbyterian and I pretended I never recognised my Minister at the Quarry Inn! 🙂
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August 6, 2014 8:21pm
nasska

….”So from that, one can conclude that reading religious material will affect your eyesight to the degree that you are unable to recognise people”….

Definitely Judith. Studies suggest that it may actually be more damaging to your ocular health than gross masturbation. 🙂
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August 6, 2014 8:24pm
stigie

That link was a bit deflating Nasska…as deflating as someones blowup doll going down on him !~
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August 6, 2014 8:25pm
nasska

The Primary School concert is fast approaching, and Johnny has
still not decided what he will do. Little Mary is going to
do a piano solo, Timmy will recite a poem, but Johnny can’t
come up with anything. Finally, his frustrated teacher is
relieved when he tells her he has worked out his act.

Come the night of the concert, all the proud parents fill
the hall and watch as Mary, in her prettiest dress, tinkles
the ivories to rapturous applause.

Then Timmy steps out in his best suit and recites his poems
to the delight of the audience.

Finally, out comes Johnny, in chequered shirt and denim
overalls. He steps up to the microphone and says,
“Ladies and Gentlemen. My uncle owns a farm, and every
holiday I visit him there. Tonight, I would like to
share with you my impression of some of the many sounds
I hear on my uncle’s farm. Here is the first:
‘JOHNNY! GET THE F***K OFF THAT TRACTOR!’
‘Johhnyy, close the F*****G gate!’
‘Johnny, get off that sheep and pull up your pants!'”
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August 6, 2014 8:26pm
Johnboy

It was on a Monday after his Sunday sermon that began..”Let him who has no sin cast the first stone” 🙂
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August 6, 2014 8:28pm
Judith

@ Nasska

I’m not so sure about this ocular health thing. Maybe a bit of deterioration is good … especially when …

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOgd9hitEAE
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August 6, 2014 8:29pm
UglyTruth

No. I mean the part where you said that you had it wrong.

What, you mean this?

OK Ugly, lets have a truce.

Why? You said that I was wrong before, but couldn’t back it up.

You said that I misunderstood abrogration in Islam, but couldn’t say how that was so.

But I admit that my earlier statement that “abrogation is based on the principle of replacing with something better, not worse” was inaccurate. What I should have said was that “In Islam there is no abrogation if the situation would be made worse by it”.

If you want to continue to talk about Islam, fine. If you don’t want to then that’s OK as well.

The thing that I find interesting is that when you argue with people who are anti-Islam, it usually turns out that they are either liars or airheads.

Not sure were Cricko fits on the spectrum, but the only thing that was demolished was his idea that “if you yourself are not a muslim then they ARE your enemy” when he confused kafirs (non-belivers) with mush’rikīna (polytheists).
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August 6, 2014 8:32pm
Johnboy

When we read Psalm 23, it is so idyllic: “The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want.” For someone to say that with any conviction, they must truly believe with all their heart that they shall not want. Yet all of us are always wanting something–whether it is success, healing, heart’s desires, or a miracle of some sort. Inside of us, is a whirlpool of things we want or desire. Sometimes we pray about them, yet many never pray at all. They just assume that since God knows everything, why pray? The good shepherd is looking out for us, but even a sheep goes “Baa-a-a” when hungry or thirsty or is hurting. What is meant is simply that when we pray we believe, and that settles the matter.

“Be careful for nothing; but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God…” (Philippians 4:6)

Yesterday, I brought a message about this at our church and it focused on a particular aspect I gleaned from that book. It had to do with the very next sentence of that Psalm, “He maketh me to lie down in green pastures.” Keller wrote that sheep refuse to lie down unless they are free of all fear. Not having been around sheep much, I was not aware of that particular trait, but it leaped out at me like a red light in an intersection.

What does it mean when the psalm tells us that the Lord “maketh us to lie down in green pastures?”

I can picture it for myself: a mattress of soft, green grass, cold shade under some tree, no noisy street traffic or worry from dangers or problems–just peaceful rest! Sometimes that is a shock to my system. The tv might have been blaring when I sit down to this computer and though I was not listening to it at all, it was interfering with my thoughts. What a blessed delicacy to just turn it off! The silence was like a cool shower. You and I, as the sheep of His pasture, were made to lie down in green pastures; to enjoy the rejuvenation of mind and body. Without it, we suffer in both those areas.

But it is fear that keeps a sheep from lying down. There is a lot of tension in the flock; friction among themselves, rivalry and competition, fear of the unknown, just as in the world around us. It is only when the shepherd’s presence comes into view that things change. As Keller wrote: “It is the Shepherd’s presence that puts an end to all rivalry and fear. In our human relationships, when we become acutely aware of being in the presence of Christ, our foolish, selfish snobbery and rivalry will end. We know He will not allow anything to harm us. It is the humble heart walking quietly and contentedly in the close and intimate companionship of Christ that it can rest and relax, simply glad to lie down and let Him take care of things. When my eyes are on my Master, they are not on those around me or things that may bother me. This is the place of peace.”

When we think of ourselves, we naturally focus on our problems, our situations. The things that are going on in our lives. But if they constantly bombard our thoughts, we form a roadway that eventually becomes a rut, and ruts are a problem with sheep too. Those well-worn areas get infested quickly and eventually destroy everything around it. Sheep are notorious for ruining the land, but only if they do not have a good shepherd that does not allow them to stay in one place for a long time. That is why the Shepherd keeps sheep “on the move”. The Greek for “sheep” is the word “probaton”: something that walks forward.

Remember, fear keeps a sheep from lying down in green pastures. Can’t you see how we can easily end up as a sickly, wasted, confused, bitter and worn-out person when fear dominates our thoughts? Despite all the Shepherd’s efforts to save us, sheep cannot be made to do something contrary to their nature. It is their decision to trust or not to trust, to lie down in the green pastures provide them, or to wander off where predators await a ready meal.
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August 6, 2014 8:35pm
nasska

Sniff! That was beautiful JB…..just beautiful 🙂
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August 6, 2014 8:39pm
Judith

@ Johnboy (15,116 comments) says:
August 6th, 2014 at 8:35 pm

Very philosophical Johnboy –
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August 6, 2014 8:39pm
mikenmild

I hope it consoles you after the trauma of the Jubilee Cup final.
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August 6, 2014 8:45pm
Johnboy

After Sunday I’ve finally found the Lord and I am his shepherd! 🙂
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August 6, 2014 8:49pm
Griff

You can bugger the bear, if you do it with care,
in the winter, when he is asleep in his lair,
Though I would not advise it in spring or in fall–
but the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
2.
If you’re feeling quite coarse, you can bugger the horse,
or the palfrey, the jennet, the stallion (with force),
You can bugger the donkey, the mare, or the mule,
Though to bugger the pony is needlessly cruel.
3.
You can bugger the ox (if you stand on a box)
And vulpologists say you can bugger the fox,
You can bugger the shrew, though it’s awfully small–
but the hedgehog cvan never be buggered at all.
4.
Herptologists gasp you can bugger the asp,
Entymologists claim you can bugger the wasp.
If an insects your thing, man, then just have a ball–
But the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
5.
And the elephant too, that you meet in the zoo,
Can be buggered if you are sure just what to do,
You will need a large mattress upon which to fall–
but the hedgehog cvan never be buggered at all.
6.
You can bugger the bees if your down on your knees,
You can bugger the termites with terminal ease
you can bugger the beetle, the ladybug (bird!) too,
there’s no end to the buggering that you can do.
7.
You can bugger the cat if it isn’t to fat
You can bugger the rabbit you draw from your hat
You can bugger the shark that you’ve chased in your yawl–
but the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
8.
You can bugger the ermine, and all other vermine,
like rats, mice, and roaches, if your not discernin’.
You can bugger the dog, it will come when you call–
but the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
9.
Although Mr. Tiggy is not very big, he
Avoids with great ease those who fancy his arse.
He just curls in a ball, shows his prickles and all–
And the would-be seducer leaves himin the grass
10.
If you’re that kind of fool, and you have a long tool,
Do it with a giraffe, if you stand on a stool,
Catch a yeti, who lives in the snows of Nepal–
but the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
11.
For the hedgehog escapes the posterior rapes
Performed upon others of different shapes
Those who run, swim, or slither, they get it withal–
But the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
12.
It is said, if you try, you can bugger the fly,
Or the swallow as it skims so skilfully by,
Use a noose or a net, or lime (if you’ve the gall)–
but the hedgehog can never be buggered at all
13.
You can bugger the cow (I will not tell you how),
Or the boar, or the piglet, the shoat or the sow,
You can bugger the ass as it stands in the stall–
But the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
14.
You can order or shoo ‘im, or run a knife through ‘im
The one thing you cannot do is stick it to ‘im.
If you try to seduce ‘im, you’ll end in a fix,
His prickles defend him against rampant pricks.
15.
You can bugger the ram, you can bugger the lamb,
You can bugger the ewe, though the wether’s a sham,
You can bugger the tiger (it may caterwaul)
But the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
16.
You can bugger the seal, you can bugger the eel,
You can bugger the crab, though they say it can’t feel,
You can bugger the bat as the night casts its pall,
But the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
17.
You can bugger the snake (hold it down with a rake),
Though to bugger the quetzal may be a mistake.
You can bugger the billy, the nanny the kid,
But to bugger the hedeghog just cannot be did.
18.
You can bugger the slug, though it messes the rug,
You can bugger the different species of bug,
Or do it with a snail, if you slow to a crawl,
But the hedgehog can never be buggered at all.
19.
At the end of the day, when you’ve had your rough way
With all of those creatures, you’ll just have to say
“That damned Erinaceous has been my downfall–”
For the hedgehog can never be buggered at all!
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August 6, 2014 8:49pm
Johnboy

I’m going to stop eating triple cheeseburgers after watching Judith’s uplifting video as well! 🙂
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August 6, 2014 8:51pm
Johnboy

What of the Porcupine Griff? 🙂
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August 6, 2014 8:53pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@ Griff
These hedgehogs are managing
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p00vdxxd
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August 6, 2014 9:09pm
Fletch

If the hedgehog could never be buggered (at least by other hedgehogs), I daresay it would be extinct by now?
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August 6, 2014 9:27pm
Tauhei Notts

Sort of off topic but for those who have My Sky the channel 90 Al Jazeera has a bit on New Zealand at 8.00 a.m. tomorrow.
It will be a test of that channel’s credibility.
As I have written before; when I commenced in professional practice I was solemnly told that;
“Credibility is like virginity. You only lose it once.”
I hope the Al Jazeera channel does not deflower itself.
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August 6, 2014 9:28pm
SPC

An election about ACT and United enabling National to sell off public assets at below fair value and also sell off farmland to foreigners at world market prices with no CGT applying to the profits to the domestic sellers.
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August 6, 2014 10:56pm
Manolo

Scum of the worst kind: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/11011634/Islamic-States-new-icon-is-a-hipster-jihadi.html
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August 7, 2014 7:12am
UglyTruth

Speaking of liars and airheads, here’s Manolo….
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August 7, 2014 7:15am
Griff

Manolo has been sitting in his darkened room for the last two hours slowly typing out his latest single sentence blurt.
The real question is.
Where is Manolos brain ?
Sure aint with him .
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August 7, 2014 7:37am

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