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August 11, 2014 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 11 August 2014

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UglyTruth

It’s not slander when it is the truth

But it wasn’t the truth, was it?

You couldn’t say how my 3:25 post from that thread (which was about Zionists) was evidence of the “Jew hatred” that you accused me of.

You previously posted that: “Every post you make on “Zionists” and who is or is not a “real Jew” supports my accusation Ugly.”
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August 11, 2014 12:59pm
ShawnLH

“But it wasn’t the truth, was it?”

Yes, it was UglyNazi.

“You couldn’t say how my 3:25 post from that thread (which was about Zionists) was evidence of the “Jew hatred””

Anti-Semitism & Anti-Zionism:

“There is a dangerous confluence between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism, though the two concepts are not always identical. Anti-Zionism is often used to conceal hatred of Jews. Anti-Semitic views can be easily distinguished from legitimate criticism of Israel.

Consider the source. Is the speaker someone with a history of anti-Jewish attitudes? (That’s you UglyNazi)

Critics who habitually single out Israel for condemnation while ignoring far worse actions by other countries (especially other Middle Eastern countries) are anti-Semitic. (That’s you again UglyNazi)

Likening Israel to Nazi Germany, or to traditional anti-Jewish stereotypical behavior is another sure sign of Jew-baiting. (You again)

Attacks on the merits of Israel’s existence rather than individual government policies are anti-Semitic.” (And you again)

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/anti-semitism/Anti-Semitism_&_Anti-Zionism.html

So yes, you fit the bill. If the jackboot fits UglyNazi…….
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August 11, 2014 1:06pm
stephieboy

Ugly Truth , the so called Dome Hoax spams its way through the Conspiracy , Paranoid and Jew hating community, and sure enough winds it way onto guess where, ? ,

http://beforeitsnews.com/israel/2014/08/iron-dome-fake-usa-funds-fear-porn-iron-dome-intercep

Just can’t seem to get any independent biographical info as to who Dr Motty Scheffer really is.?
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August 11, 2014 1:07pm
kowtow

The islamification of “secular” Turkey continues.

A corrupt ,Islamist to be President with increased powers.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/08/10/recep-tayyip-erdogan-wins-turkeys-first-direct-presidential-election-despite-scandal-plagued-year/
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August 11, 2014 1:11pm
UglyTruth

There is a dangerous confluence between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism, though the two concepts are not always identical. Anti-Zionism is often used to conceal hatred of Jews. Anti-Semitic views can be easily distinguished from legitimate criticism of Israel.

So is reporting the collaboration between Zionists and Nazis anti-semitism or is it legitimate criticism?

Here’s the content again:

Attacking Key on these issues achieves nothing other than to draw attention away from the real problem. The problem is bigger than Key or the National party, and relates to the collaboration between the Zionists and the Nazis in the establishment of the Zionist state in Palestine.

http://www.truetorahjews.org/lieberman

It would be wishful thinking if it could be stated that the leaders of the Zionist movement sat back and ignored the plight of their dying brothers and sisters. Not only did they publicly refuse to assist in their rescue, but they actively participated with Hitler and the Nazi regime. Early in 1935, a passenger ship bound for Haifa in Palestine left the German port of Bremerhaven. Its stern bore the Hebrew letter for its name, “Tel Aviv”, while a swastika banner fluttered from the mast. And although the ship was Zionist owned, its captain was a National Socialist Party (Nazi) member. Many years later a traveler aboard the ship recalled this symbolic combination as a “metaphysical absurdity”. Absurd or not, this is but one vignette from a little-known chapter of history: The wide ranging collaboration between Zionism and Hitler’s Third Reich. In early January 1941 a small but important Zionist organization submitted a formal proposal to German diplomats in Beirut for a military-political alliance with wartime Germany. The offer was made by the radical underground “Fighters for the Freedom of Israel”, better known as the Lehi or Stern Gang…
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August 11, 2014 1:11pm
Griff

Well, you have the same choice as regards where you want to spend the afterlife. And Christians are telling you about it – warning you about it – giving you the choice – right now..

There is no afterlife.
You have only one life live the fuckin thing.
FFS Stop peddling bronze age superstitious nonsense we are not a bunch of ignorant goat herders here to be targeted with your garbage.
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August 11, 2014 1:13pm
Lance

@stephieboy
Yep, I shit you not, I was told by an Arab in the middle east the Israeli pilots are such cowards they are strapped into their seats….

Didn’t know where to even start with that, reminds me of the loonies like UT et all on KB.
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August 11, 2014 1:15pm
ShawnLH

The so-called truetorahjews is a fringe outfit that does not represent the vast majority of Jewish people.

This is a standard tactic from neo-Nazis like Ugly. Find some fringe group or person who is Jewish and say “look they say the same thing.”

Look at the posts at the neo-Nazi web site Stormfront and you will see the same tactic being used there.

But as the article from the Jewish Library shows, UglyNazi easily fits the definition of a Jew hater.
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August 11, 2014 1:16pm
UglyTruth

Didn’t know where to even start with that, reminds me of the loonies like UT et all on KB.

Tell us how your criticism of a report about missile capability was accurate when you used a rocket launcher as your example, Lance.
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August 11, 2014 1:18pm
ShawnLH

“FFS Stop peddling bronze age superstitious nonsense”

Nobody is Griff.

“we are not a bunch of ignorant goat herders”

Neither were the authors of Scripture.

“here to be targeted with your garbage.”

Many here would say the same about your AGW posts.
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August 11, 2014 1:18pm
ShawnLH

Debunking the lie that the Iron Dome is a hoax.

“Israel’s Iron Dome missile-defense system is an ironclad success.”

http://www.jewishjournal.com/israel/article/israels_iron_dome_missile_defense_system_is_an_ironclad_success
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August 11, 2014 1:25pm
UglyTruth

A simple question disproves the critics. How can it be that more than 2,200 rockets of all kinds have been fired at Israeli population centers since July 8, but there have been so few casualties?

Because they are pathetic little things as far as rockets go, causing plenty of alarm when the sirens go off but little impact damage.
In the population centers people have got time to find cover.
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August 11, 2014 1:38pm
stephieboy

Ugly Truth, most of us I believe would just like to get more information and who this Dr Motty Scheffer is apart from the flimsy information that your link and others provided .?

Can you oblige .?
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August 11, 2014 1:40pm
Milburn35

Peter’s comments about the “Two Wong’s” reminds me of a joke I had read. “No more Political jokes – they get elected”
Winston cannot get elected, but he may still be a political joke.
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August 11, 2014 1:43pm
dime

“dime (9,525 comments) says:
I do even better in business from having a larger population to sell stuff to.
…
but you do dime. It’s called exporting!”

lol ah ok. i will just change my entire business ffs.

im an importer!
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August 11, 2014 1:52pm
Griff

Yip the findings of science as backed by the all the worlds major scientific body’s
Compared to the wittering of ignorant goat herders as told verbally for at least three hundred years.
No wonder you can not tell the difference between superstitious nonsense and reality.
By the way the post as quoted was peddling a bronze age superstition about sky fairy’s afterlife haven and hell.. Absolute dribble the a you god whackers should keep within your Sunday gatherings for the deluded and weak of mind.
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August 11, 2014 1:54pm
ShawnLH

“Yip the findings of science as backed by the all the worlds major scientific body’s”

Well Griff I happen to agree with you on that topic. My point was that there are a lot of posts from various sides that people disagree with. That’s just the nature of a blog which tolerates a high degree of free speech. Sometimes I think that tolerance goes too far, but that’s up to David, not myself or you.

“By the way the post as quoted was peddling a bronze age superstition about sky fairy’s afterlife haven and hell.. ”

Well that’s just your opinion Griff, though it’s technically incorrect. Most of the statements concerning Heaven and Hell are in the New Testament, which was not written in the Bronze Age, nor was it written by goat herders.

You can’t really claim to represent reason or science when you get basic historical facts like that wrong.
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August 11, 2014 2:09pm
mikenmild

The bulk of Christianity derives solidly from the old testament. So I don’t think ‘bronze age goat herders’ is too inaccurate.
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August 11, 2014 2:14pm
dime

David Draiman from the band Disturbed:

“The mainstream media’s biased, libelous, and often erroneous portrayal of Israel in the current conflict has fueled a wave of anti-Semitism, the likes of which I have not witnessed in my lifetime. Well done, CNN, BBC, Reuters [and] MSNBC, you’ve set the stage for a new Holocaust. Maybe you’d be happy/satisfied when the extremist nutbags you defend so much, who eagerly martyr their own children who chant for the death of all Jews, not just the Israeli’s, and whose ethics, morals and values stand diametrically opposed to your own liberal views of freedom of religion, gay marriage, pro choice, and even democracy itself, strip the region of the only bastion of true liberty that exists in the region. Well, guess what? Never again. Jews aren’t so easy to fuck with anymore.”
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August 11, 2014 2:15pm
mikenmild

That’s just what we need – political comment from a heavy metal singer. I suppose you pay lots of attention to Lucy Lawless’s opinion as well?
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August 11, 2014 2:19pm
kowtow

Yep dime and TVNZ and TV3 are well in there too.

Massively disproportionate coverage of Gaza. Christians and Yazidis genocide? Nothing to see here.
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August 11, 2014 2:21pm
mikenmild

Saw coverage on TVNZ over the weekend about the Yazidis. And about the pro-Israel demonstration in Auckland.
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August 11, 2014 2:23pm
Other_Andy

kowtow says at 12:09 pm

I wonder how many ‘Britons’, Australians or “Kiwis” were among the murderers?

A few new ‘Australians’.

Khaled Sharrouf’s son, a child raised in the suburbs of Sydney, struggles with both arms to hold up the decapitated head of a slain Syrian soldier.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/defence/thats-my-boy-sharrouf-kids-witness-wars-horror/story-e6frg8yo-1227019872823
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August 11, 2014 2:23pm
kowtow

“Saw coverage on TVNZ over the weekend about the Yazidis.”

Relatively and comparatively ,insignificant and soon to be forgotten,buried and ignored.
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August 11, 2014 2:30pm
mikenmild

Like most violent and tragic events…
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August 11, 2014 2:31pm
tom hunter

Oh well, looks like Twitchy had it right after all – there really is a coup happening in Baghdad.:

Assuming this is true – and a lot of reporters are picking up on it already – it sounds like somebody wanted al-Maliki out, but he’s not inclined to go. Actually, the WSJ predicted there was trouble afoot in the naming of the new PM earlier this week.

I suppose I’d better go check Al Jezeera. They might even have photos of Obama leaving the golf links!
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August 11, 2014 2:36pm
kowtow

otjher andy

If only that useless prick in the White House had acted sooner on the ISIS vehicle convoys ,there’d be a hell offa lot less of the fuckers to repatriate (no doubt at our expense)when it’s over ,only to give the security services a massive headache.And a lot fewer for the next genertion of jihadis at the Saudi backed mosques in Auckland,Hamilton,hristchurch ,Sydney and Melbourne, someone else to look up to and emulate.
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August 11, 2014 2:37pm
Other_Andy

ShawnLH (4,038 comments) says at 1:25 pm

“Israel’s Iron Dome missile-defense system is an ironclad success.”

As it might have saved lives I agree.
Even if it saved 1.
However….
Of the 3,360 rockets fired from Gaza, 2,303 hit Israel while ‘only’ 584 were intercepted by Iron Dome.
That is less than an 18% success rate…..

http://www.idfblog.com/blog/2014/08/05/operation-protective-edge-numbers/
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August 11, 2014 2:38pm
kowtow

tom hunter

Obama will stay on the links ,an alibi. Nothing to do with me ,I was on holiday (again).

But seriously just what Iraq needs ,a civil war in Baghdad with ISIS just up the road.

Who ever thought these fuckers could govern themselves?
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August 11, 2014 2:40pm
mikenmild

‘Who ever thought these fuckers could govern themselves?’
Say what you like about Saddam’s Iraq, but you couldn’t say it lacked a government.
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August 11, 2014 2:44pm
tom hunter

Say what you like about Saddam’s Iraq, but you couldn’t say it lacked a government.

Or bureaucrats, those essential little cogs that make the machine run!
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August 11, 2014 2:55pm
ShawnLH

“So I don’t think ‘bronze age goat herders’ is too inaccurate.”

Goat herders would be. And he was taking aim at the entire Bible, not just the OT.

Bit of a spin there Mike. 😉
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August 11, 2014 2:59pm
stephieboy

Dexter Filkins of The Forever War fame ( Afghanistan and Iraq ) has the real measure of the real complexity that is Iraq when he considers the fate of the Kurds caught up in the hell fire of this beleaguered country .
The complexity is that the Bush administration favoured a “One Iraq” solution that did not accommodate Kurdish National and Independent aspirations. This was a sop not only to the Malik government abut more especially Turkey who have strongly resisted the idea of a Sovereign Kurdish Nation.
Obama continues with that policy,

http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/will-u-s-help-kurds-fight-isis

Such is the simplistic approaches from here at KB and the Right media and blogs in the US.!
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August 11, 2014 3:13pm
goldnkiwi

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/crime/news/article.cfm?c_id=30&objectid=11306844

Louise Nicholas’s story
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August 11, 2014 3:26pm
Longknives

Wonder what is going on with the girl who fell to her death on the Gold Coast?
Has her blind date with the impossibly white teeth got something to hide?

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/10371506/Kiwis-balcony-death-link-denied

He certainly didn’t hang round for the Coppers to turn up…
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August 11, 2014 3:36pm
MH

just announced the Yellow Pages Group has under advisement from a Squashed female person that the next bunch of telephone books will not include ethnic Chinese but will publish phone no’s in Pinyin of indigenous that is local born Chinese ,those that have received an apology already. A draft apology has been sent to the UN by the leader of HM’s loyal opposition Mr Solli Cunliffe for those Chinese who have had to pay exorbitant fees to get into NZ and were subject to land discrimination policies. A Brown Pages edition is underway but due to phonetics and inter tribal differences especially over the use of Cuzzie and identifying penal institutions as bone fide addresses may not be published till after the election.
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August 11, 2014 4:30pm
mikenmild

I think that’s an attempt at satire…
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August 11, 2014 4:34pm
SGA

mikenmild at 4:34 pm

I think that’s an attempt at satire…

I guess – maybe it’s meant for lurcher1948?
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August 11, 2014 4:40pm
mikenmild

Good call. Similarly incomprehensible.
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August 11, 2014 4:44pm
MH

Iraq my brains but its more like a bunch of malarkey
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August 11, 2014 4:49pm
SGA

QED – it was for lurcher
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August 11, 2014 4:59pm
Kiwi Dave

Other Andy @2.38
“…less than an 18 per cent success rate…”

Maybe not. Anti-missile missiles are very expensive, so the Iron Dome system calculates the likely landing point of an incoming rocket and does not launch an intercept if the rocket is likely to hit empty ground.
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August 11, 2014 5:15pm
Other_Andy

Kiwi Dave at 5:15 pm

Good point.
And it appears you are correct:

“The system is designed to intercept and destroy short-range rockets and artillery shells fired from distances of 4 kilometres to 70 kilometres away and whose trajectory would take them to a populated area.”
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August 11, 2014 5:24pm
Odakyu-sen

The “top surnames” in Auckland will be biased by cultural factors. For example, some 20% of South Koreans have the family name of Kim. I don’t think 20% of English-New Zealanders have the family name of Smith.
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August 11, 2014 5:31pm
UglyTruth

“The system is designed to intercept and destroy short-range rockets and artillery shells fired from distances of 4 kilometres to 70 kilometres away and whose trajectory would take them to a populated area.”

Israeli expert says Iron Dome defence is a hoax
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/news/middle-east/12772-israeli-expert-says-iron-dome-defence-is-a-hoax
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August 11, 2014 5:49pm
Kiwi Dave

Quite true Odakyu-sen. Compared to English (plus Scots etc) surnames, the Chinese have a quite limited number of surnames. If there were two equally sized populations of Anglos and Chinese living together, I would expect pretty well all the most popular surnames to be Chinese for this reason.
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August 11, 2014 6:13pm
Fletch

Israeli expert says Iron Dome defence is a hoax

If so, then Hamas must be very, very bad shots.
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August 11, 2014 6:15pm
Griff

Tin foil boy you ever tried independent confirmation of you story’s?
The doctor quoted seems to exist only on nutty sites with an anti Israel bent.
Me thinks you have stuck your head to close to a microwave wearing you tinfoil ray concentrating device once to often.
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August 11, 2014 6:22pm
nasska

https://www.dropbox.com/s/m4j29i4dtzppw4e/UT%204.png
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August 11, 2014 6:29pm
UglyTruth

If so, then Hamas must be very, very bad shots.

Being a bad shot doesn’t come into it, you can’t target well with the little rockets they use.

They’re simply terror weapons with little destructive or strategic value. All they do is give the the state a reason to hit back.
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August 11, 2014 6:30pm
UglyTruth

Here’s a video of some fake Iron Dome explosions

Hint: the speed of sound is 330 meter/second.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69ImC4J7TQ0&list=UUV_J8–LzIOSSH5nkW06WSQ
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August 11, 2014 6:41pm
Odakyu-sen

Kiwi Dave, it gets worse for the poor Koreans.

Ref: http://jennipah.blogspot.co.nz/2006/03/our-marriage-is-no-longer-illegal-in.html

Thank goodness the ever-pragmatic Japanese don’t allow themselves to get wrapped up in this kind of nonsense.

Quote: “Under Article 809(1) of the Civil Code, individuals sharing a common ancestor in their paternal lineage, no matter how far back in time, may not marry. In contrast, under Article 815, as long as a couple does not share a common ancestor in their maternal lineage within four generations, they may marry. Introduced into Korean society with Confucianism in the fifteenth century during the Chosôn dynasty, the principle was established during China’s Han dynasty, and gradually weakened until it was abolished by China’s Qing dynasty at the turn of the century.

Given that there are only 274 Korean family names, 43% of which are Kim, Lee, or Park, the intra-clan marriage ban has been a serious problem. Based upon statistics gathered by Lee’s Korea Legal Aid Center for Family Relations, an estimated 300,000 couples have defied the ban.
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August 11, 2014 6:53pm
EAD

David Stockman warns the central bank created economic train wreck is on its way:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-08-10/train-wreck-coming-david-stockman-warns-all-hell-will-break-loose
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August 11, 2014 6:57pm
Lucia Maria

Fletch!
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August 11, 2014 7:02pm
Odakyu-sen

Stockman, shmockman…

Doom is ALWAYS 6 months away.
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August 11, 2014 7:18pm
dad4justice

EAD thanks for that link, how can the train crash not happen when facts like this look set to derail things ;

“But when you take the balance sheet of the Fed from $900 billion to $4.5 trillion in less than 70 months, and when that pattern is replicated around the world, that is a train wreck in slow motion.”
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August 11, 2014 7:26pm
stigie

Has Penny not so been dragged, kicking and screaming from the Helensville debate yet ?
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August 11, 2014 8:01pm
Nostradamus

Stigie:

Has Penny not so been dragged, kicking and screaming from the Helensville debate yet ?

Johnboy comes across as a gentleman. He would only do that if Penny failed to turn up to the debate with his barbed wire!
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August 11, 2014 8:08pm
dirty harry

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/10371830/Sex-accused-bus-driver-found-dead

Oh dear what a shame..
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August 11, 2014 8:17pm
nasska

This Ebola outbreak has got the world’s top medical specialists very concerned….. all the relevant charities and aid organisations are turning up and pitching in.

Still no sign of ‘Homeopaths Without Borders though.
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August 11, 2014 8:17pm
nasska

Nostradamus

That barbed wire Waterwoman failed to knit was to stockproof the house paddock for once & for all. JB’s getting on in years & needs good fences to shorten the chase.

It is impacting very badly on his sex life. 🙂
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August 11, 2014 8:22pm
Steve (North Shore)

Baa
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August 11, 2014 8:34pm
dirty harry

wheres that sausage smoker scottchris..show yaself ladyboy..
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August 11, 2014 8:55pm
Dave29

I see that John Stringer is the Conservatives candidate for Ilam. Is this the same John Stringer who has been a guest contributor to Kiwiblog and is or was a National party member? Is this also the same John Stringer that left National temporarily to assist the Christian Coalition’s campaign director in 1996? Apparently John Stringer not agree that the Conservatives are more trouble than they are worth.
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August 11, 2014 11:08pm
Gulag1917

The myth of Israeli democracy
http://warincontext.org/2010/09/24/the-myth-of-israeli-democracy/
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August 12, 2014 12:01am
Dave Stringer

Just saw this

Mr Cunliffe says he’s enjoying the start of his campaign. He says he likes being out of the Wellington bubble with the real people.

As a Wellington resident I find myself insulted by this comment. Mr. Cunnliffe should apologise to me, and all the other real people of Wellington, immediately, preferably on national TV..
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August 12, 2014 12:11am
Manolo

The animals at it: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2722078/IS-militants-behead-two-execute-23-brutal-crushing-rebellion-Syria.html
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August 12, 2014 7:24am

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