About
Contact
Advertise

Facebook
Twitter

July 10, 2014 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 10 July 2014

Email
Facebook
Twitter
Comment203

Uncategorized
General Debate

Comments (203)

Login to comment or vote

Pete George

Tha campaign against McCully ramps up:

Daily Blog: Murray McCully must go: sign the petition to demand his resignation
Facebook: Murray McCully must go
Petition: Murray McCully must go

There’s no indication that Colin Craig is behind all this. Chloe King did the Daily Blog post and is named on the petition.
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:09pm
ShawnLH

“FFS, I can’t think of a better reason NOT to vote for National if that is a party philosophy.”

Don’t be dense. Of course it’s not party philosophy. But there is the smell of a rat here. The problem is that your blinded by your irrational and baseless hatred of Key.
14 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:19pm
Judith

Elaycee (4,259 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 11:40 am

But if the rumours are true, maybe she is not the politically innocent waif portrayed on screen.

I didn’t see her as an innocent waif – I guess it depends from which political angle you are looking, but the rest of your post proves my point – you couldn’t care less about what has happened to the victim, (or at least you haven’t demonstrated that caring), nor anything other than the fact that as a political activist, she is somehow not ‘innocent’ and therefore by inference you are suggesting she ‘deserved’ what happened to her, and she has NO right to complain?

Any decent person in the same circumstances would be complaining – there was serious wrongdoing through mismanagement, and whilst I don’t think heads should roll, the victim speaking out about that incompetence and airing her feelings is perfectly acceptable – after all, McCully got to voice his opinions, so what is wrong with her doing it.

You are a fine person to throw the political bias allegation at me, when your own is blatantly obvious – lets face it, you are trying to mitigate the circumstances by insinuating that the victim is to blame – is not a nice person because of her political interests, and by inference, therefore shouldn’t get justice or be entitled to express her opinion.

You quite literally make me sick.
4 16
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:19pm
stephieboy

I see yesterday Ugly Truth was having a real meltdown over his “molten Steel ” WTC 9/11 canard.

It appears that in a hissy fit of pique he signed off with unsurprisingly another outrageous claim about the US Government and its secret UFO agenda .

The link provided seeks to confirm this conspiracy by purporting to show actual sitings.A couple suggest secret skullduggery going on at various US military bases and installations, notably area 51. This is where many of the alleged sightings have taken place.

Yes Area 51 was a top secret testing e.g various military aircraft like spy planes like the Lockheed X 1, U2, SR 71 Blackbird etc.led by Lockheed Flight designer Kelly Johnson.

It was a certain Robery Lazar who claimed to whistle blow the bases stating also various alien aircraft were under development . His claims were rejected and himself known to be a fraud and liar ,
More here about Area 51 and much of it is now declassified and most working there now released from there vows of secrecy. No alien aircraft or bodies stored there at all.

http://www.skepticblog.org/2014/01/08/area-51-myth-and-reality/

Another sighting from U T’s highly dubious ink concerns the Phoenix sightings of an alleged V formation of UFO’s over the city and Arizona March 13 1997. This in fact was shown to be ia formation of aircraft the noise of their jet engines actually discernible and heard by many witnesses .

http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/08-05-21/

As we can see all the claims can be put down to more prosaic explanations as the Phoenix lights perfectly show. But this didn’t stop NBC airing the item in the battle of ratings games. To be fair they did give time to those who easily and readily debunked the claims . However this post and the links provided also wont’t necessarily stop those like UT persisting with their inane and crazy beliefs .
2 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:23pm
kowtow

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2686711/Dont-make-mistake-As-assisted-suicide-bill-goes-Lords-Dutch-regulator-backed-euthanasia-warns-Britain-leads-mass-killing.html

But on a lighter note there might be a few cloggies thinking of it right now.
1 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:23pm
Judith

@ ShawnLH (2,856 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 12:19 pm

So you accept wrongdoing, but you’d like to blame the victims political preference for talking about it?

So, other women and men that have spoken out when their situation has been mismanaged by government departments (e.g. ACC over privacy details) – their complaints should be dealt with according to their level of political opinion?

In fact, should any complaint, police complaints as well, all be dealt with depending on the level of a the victims political activism, and which party they support.

In short, please explain how a person’s political preference has anything to do with the fact that a potential rapist will get away with a serious crime, due to the mismanagement of senior government officials and the victim rightfully feels annoyed by that?

The only rat I can smell is the fact that you and others are scrambling around trying to shift the blame from the people responsible. – In short, you are doing the very thing you are accusing me of, and not seeing the fault here, because of your own political bias – so hows about you stop being a bloody hypocrite yourself.
5 14
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:25pm
Viking2

A bloody good reason to go electronic.

The Electoral Commission is hiring more than 18,000 people to help out during the election in September.

It is advertising for 3000 headquarters staff to help with details such as vote counting, as well as for 15,500 election-day staff – all paid roles.

Almost 200 managers and trainers have also already been hired.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10252650/Election-needs-18-000-vote-counters
0 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:26pm
Pete George

Drugs trial

JUDGE: How many grams are there in an ounce?
PROSECUTOR [scratches chin]
DEF COUNSEL [searches papers]
DEFENDANT: 28.3

(@garyslapper )
4 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:34pm
Yvette

Malaysia asked to drop sex assault charge against envoy, NZ documents show
UPDATED: JULY 01, 2014 09:38 PM
KUALA LUMPUR, July 1 — Amid a potential diplomatic firestorm, the New Zealand government released today documents it says shows Malaysia asked it to drop a sexual assault case against its diplomat Muhammad Rizalman Ismail.

The documents were released scant hours after Malaysia’s Foreign Minister Datuk Seri Anifah Aman told a news conference in Putrajaya that New Zealand officials had offered to let Muhammad Rizalman return home and face an inquiry here instead of standing trial there.
The minister had said earlier news reports claiming Muhammad Rizalman had claimed diplomatic immunity to escape the sexual assault and burglary charges were misreporting.

In its report, the New Zealand Herald cited the correspondence between New Zealand’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade (MFAT) and the Malaysian High Commission, with the latter saying it would not waive Muhammad Rizalman’s diplomatic immunity.
The Malaysian High Commission also said it will recall the Wellington-based military staff assistant “as soon as possible”.

The Malaysian High Commission also asked MFAT and the New Zealand police to “kindly consider sealing all documentations pertaining to the above mentioned matter and [withdraw] all charges against Mr Muhammad Rizalman Bin Ismail”, the New Zealand Herald reported.
The High Commission also said it would ensure that Muhammad Rizalman would not step foot in New Zealand anymore.

According to New Zealand Herald, the Malaysian High Commission was replying to the MFAT, which had written that it wanted Malaysia to waive the personal immunity that was given to diplomats under the Vienna Convention.
“The New Zealand police believes it is in the public interest to prosecute these offenses due to the serious nature of the offending,” MFAT was quoted as writing to the High Commission.

Muhammad Rizalman, 38, was arrested by Kiwi police on May 9 on allegations of attempted burglary and sexual assault on a 21-year-old woman.
He was charged in a New Zealand court a day later for burglary and assault with intent to commit rape, with both charges carrying the maximum penalty of a 10-year jail term.

In its letter to the Malaysian High Commission
https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/1211343/malaysia-tpn-nz-request.pdf — published along with Malaysia’s reply on the New Zealand Herald’s website — MFAT cited Article 41 of the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations as the basis for seeking a waiver of immunity enjoyed by Muhammad Rizalman.
New Zealand’s foreign ministry stressed that it becomes the responsibility of foreign diplomats to “respect the laws and regulations of the receiving State”.
“It is on this basis and on the advice of police that the ministry seeks a waiver of immunity to allow a prosecution to proceed,” the letter, dated May 10, said.
The Malaysian High Commission replied almost two weeks later
https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/1211342/malaysian-tpn-response.pdf on May 21, to inform their counterparts that Muhammad Rizalman and his family would be sent home the next day without giving reasons for the decision.

“In choosing this course of action, the High Commission of Malaysia would like to assure the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade of New Zealand that the government of Malaysia will ensure that Mr Muhammad RIzalman Ismail does not return to New Zealand in the future,” said the diplomatic letter.
A New Zealand court had initially issued a suppression order when Muhammad Rizalman was charged for the two offences on May 10, but it was lifted earlier today amid growing outrage in the South Pacific island nation.

New Zealand Prime Minister John Key today repeated his position that Muhammad Rizalman should be tried for his alleged crimes before a Kiwi court, giving his assurance he would get a fair trial and that his life would not be in danger.
“We don’t have the death penalty in New Zealand and he’ll absolutely get a free and fair trial in New Zealand.
“One thing that we can pride ourselves is having a judicial system that’s completely fair,” Key was quoted saying by New Zealand news agency Dominion Post on the website stuff.co.nz.
http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/malaysia-asked-to-drop-sex-assault-charge-against-envoy-nz-documents-show
1 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:36pm
Judith

@ Pete George (22,508 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 12:09 pm

That is ridiculous – this is not a resignation ‘offence’ – there was no deliberate intention involved (unlike trying to interfere in a police investigation into domestic violence) and there was no deliberate dishonesty or attempt to evade the truth being known. Whilst I think McCully needs to (and basically has) acknowledge his mismanagement, and meet with the victim to apologise for the stress it has caused, I personally would not like to see Ministers sacked/resign for something like this. We’d be left with nothing but inexperienced newbies in the house.
7 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:40pm
kowtow

“Drugs trial

JUDGE: How many grams are there in an ounce?
PROSECUTOR [scratches chin]
DEF COUNSEL [searches papers]
DEFENDANT: 28.3

(@garyslapper )”

JUDGE; Guilty as charged!

DEFENDANT; Doh!
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:43pm
Manolo

A call to arms for Ugly Truth: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/07/09/isis-destroys-shrines-and-mosques-sets-sights-on-mecca/

ISIS is leaving a path of destroyed churches, shrines and mosques in its wake as it storms across Syria and Iraq, and has even set its sights on Mecca — Islam’s holiest site.
6 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:44pm
Kimbo

In short, please explain how a person’s political preference has anything to do with the fact that a potential rapist will get away with a serious crime, due to the mismanagement of senior government officials and the victim rightfully feels annoyed by that?

@ Judith

No one with a proper understanding of the facts disputes Mfat failed Tania Billingsley.

Nevertheless, just as McCully’s competence in the matter is quite rightly being questioned – and as the matter has now gone public and significantly ramped up via Tania Billingsley appearance-

….it is only right that the true extent and motivation for Tania Billingsley’s (to paraphrase you) “annoyance”should and must also be subject to scrutiny. She has called for “political” decisions and put in her two cents worth (McCully and Key should resign), and good on her for it – that is her prerogative, irrespective of her politics.

But now as a result her politics are rightly being questioned.
8 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:44pm
kowtow

That’s a but like the crim picked out at the ID parade,protesting, “He couldn’t possibly recognise me, it was dark at the time”.
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:45pm
dirty harry

Fine. McCully stands down. Story stops right there. No more howling and screeching from the loony left. Oxygen has been cut.

Nats win election…McCully gets his old job back October 1st.
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:46pm
dirty harry

“SIS is leaving a path of destroyed churches, shrines and mosques in its wake as it storms across Syria and Iraq, and has even set its sights on Mecca — Islam’s holiest site.”

Great ! Coke…popcorn..
1 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:47pm
nasska

Judith

…”We’d be left with nothing but inexperienced newbies in the house.”…..

Agreed. We’d also lower the calibre of potential ministers. Decent people who seek to have a life after politics will not offer themselves as political candidates if they are going to be pilloried for events or actions they have only nominal control over.
6 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:49pm
Nookin

Murray McCully became aware of the incident on or about 10 May 2014. On that date, an official, written request was made to waive diplomatic immunity. His next involvement appears to have been when the matter became public at the end of June.
Some random questions and random answers

1. Assuming that McCully knew that the letter had been sent (and this is a reasonable assumption), should McCully have foreseen the possibility that staff at the coalface would be negotiating a position directly contrary to the expressed government position? Answer: Probably not.

2. If McCully had decided to take a hands-on approach, would he have been blamed for the return of the diplomat to Malaysia? Answer: Almost inevitably.

3. As an extension of the previous question, would McCully have been condemned for flying in the face of the Cabinet manual and taking an active involvement in the day-to-day management of the Ministry for which he was responsible? Answer: Almost inevitably.

4. Is it surprising that the CEO of MFAT had no knowledge of the incident until it became public? Answer: No, not surprising. Astonishing is probably the better word.

5. Is it surprising that McCully did not at least make some form of enquiry about progress? Answer: Yes, assuming that the statement is in fact correct. On the other hand, how forthcoming would his source have been with information given that the source may well have been aware (even involved in) the under the table and underhand negotiations that were being pursued and that the fox had fled the coop.

6. Are there serious communication problems in MFAT? Answer: Based on what we know about this case, indubitably.

7. Is this McCully’s fault? Answer: possibly. It is also possible that a diplomat made it an extremely serious and one-off mistake, details of which were deliberately withheld from the CEO and the Minister.

8. Should McCully have apologised personally to Ms Billingsley? Answer: Yes, assuming that the police informed him of her name and address contrary to the suppression order made by the court and the she had first consented to such disclosure.

9. Would McCully have been demonised had he approached her directly and, in consequence, her identity became known contrary to the suppression order? Answer: Inevitably.

10. Does she have a right to speak out? Answer: Absolutely.

11. Is her opinion on culpability immune from all criticism simply because she is the victim? Absolutely not – so long as any criticism is measured and well-considered.

12 Is she an expert on MFAT protocols and therefore an authoritative source? Answer: Were Colin Meads and Richard Long experts on finance companies?

13. Is she correct in saying that McCully should resign? Answer: Possibly but not until we know more facts.

14. Is she correct when she says that Key looked bored and disinterested? Answer: This is an extremely subjective analysis and therefore clearly influenced by emotive issues. To me, he looked seriously pissed off.

15. Will the Malaysian government become aware of any outpouring of public sympathy for Ms Billingsley, condemnation of the diplomat (a la Judith above) condemnation of the rape culture and political brouhaha arising out of the whole matter and question whether he will get a fair trial. Answer: I hope not but it won’t be helping.

16. Have the Greens dived into the mud with the pigs? Answer: Definitely — and they are wallowing in it. Perhaps they should take note of the fact that a government might make a hasty ill-considered or, perhaps unduly reactive decision on, for example, claiming diplomatic immunity and if Malaysia did that justice would not be served. Who knows what Malaysia may now be thinking. Sometimes governments make inappropriate, instinctive decisions. I have even heard of a political party that has said it would oppose extradition of an alleged criminal just after talks with said alleged criminal over his political aspirations.
19 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:49pm
labrator

I’m still struggling to make the connection between a Malaysian diplomat allegedly trying to sexually assault a woman in Wellington is a indicative of New Zealand’s “rape culture”. Surely it’s indicative of Malaysia’s “rape culture”? Or did spending some time immersed in Wellington’s “rape culture” turn this Malaysian Diplomat into an alleged rapist?
19 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:52pm
Viking2

ightNow (6,611 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 10:45 am

“Diplomatic Immunity does not allow a person to randomly commit crime and then be shipped home at the first convenience let alone to Muslim Country where had a Christian perpetrated a crime against Islam as opposed to a female in our country that person would be in jail and subject to harsh law.”

Do tell, it seems to allow exactly that.

Well there was an opinion in one of the papers today that doesn’t support your carte blanche view.

If it is the case then it is another 1700 type doctrine that needs updating urgently. Bend your mind to making that happen instead of excusing a rat bag nasty piece of shit intent on rape.
0 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:54pm
Grendel

actually judith, she might be a horrible person, we dont know and its not relevant to the case.

why do you not understand that no one is denying that if she was attacked then she deserves justice (i only say if becuase of the whole innocent until proven etc, it seems pretty obvious she was).

what sensible people are not thrilled with is:

1. how she has fled to the media to get her story out there, as this might compromise the trial
2. the fact that she is a political activist and teaming up with her preferred party to get free advertising attacking the govt over this, as if they are somehow responsible.
3. how the greens have rushed in there to use her to push their agenda. to me it shows they dont really care about her, but about points scoring at the expense of a victim. the speed at which logie ran in there to ‘manage’ this is horrifying.

if the malaysian guy is guilty (see above for disclaimer) he deserves the full brunt of justice, but nothing about that makes her politicising this in favour of her favorite political party less distasteful.

would she be doing this if the greens were in power? i doubt it. she would be focused to the person who attacked her and not calling for the green ministers resignation. thats what makes this shitty.

your one-eyed view of the world cannot percieve how rational people can side with someone on the key issue but disagree with how they handle it and the situation they are trying to manipulate. its easy, you just have to tone down the crazy hate, but without your hatred of John Key, there is nothing much of interest about you is there?
18 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:54pm
Pete George

One politician apologises: Harawira U-turn in diplomat sex case

Mana Party leader Hone Harawira has apologised for calling the row over a sexual assault charge against a diplomat “bugger all.”

The Te Tai Tokerau MP made the remarks on political panel show Backbenches last week.

Asked on the show about the political storm around alleged attacker Muhammad Rizalman bin Ismail, Harawira said: “I think all of the media, their heads should roll for making a big fuss about bugger all.”

The country was facing more pressing matters such as “kids starving”, he said.

Harawira added: “Let’s just keep it there, it’s allegedly, and so until such time that this sorts its self out, let’s get on with running the country in the best interests of all off the citizens.”

Now Harawira says he made a “big mistake” and praised Tania Billingsley, the 22-year-old victim of the alleged attack, for speaking out about mishandling of the case.

In a Facebook post this morning, Harawira said: “I want to sincerely apologise if my comments on Backbenches may seem to have minimised the gravity of the situation regarding the young woman who asked police to investigate the complaint of sexual assault against the Malaysian diplomat.

“I have reviewed the tape and I accept that my comments were not helpful at all.

“Sexual assault IS a big deal, and I applaud Tania Rose Billingsley for her brave and courageous appearance on television last night.”

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10252967/Harawira-sorry-he-said-sex-case-was-bugger-all

Good of Harawira to recognise his mistake and apologise for it.
3 8
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:56pm
lilman

Pity all these concerned MPs were not around when the Labour Mp who tried to sexually assault a young male in Annette Kings house,I guess it just bad timing,nothing pollitical.
28 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:56pm
stephieboy

Ten of the most craziest things Sarah Palin has said on Fox News,

http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/01/26/the-10-worst-things-sarah-palin-said-on-fox-new/192403

Unsurprisingly she next calls for Obama’a impeachment ,

http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/01/26/the-10-worst-things-sarah-palin-said-on-fox-new/192403

For exactly what.?

Notably Senator John McCain has not much to say about her latest inanity .!
2 8
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 12:57pm
Judith

@ Kimbo (638 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 12:44 pm

If she had been the first ever victim of sexual assault or intended sexual assault, to go public when they felt their interests were not being addressed correctly – I’d agree with you. But victims of crime frequently come forward and criticize those they deem responsible for mismanagement of their case etc.

There have been some pretty strong statements made about this woman, and not just her politics. IMO the only reason she is being treated so harshly, is because her politics varies from the majority of the posters here. That is just not acceptable.

Other victims of crime have spoken out, and not been subjected to this sort of interrogation over their politics – so I don’t accept your explanation that because she has spoken out, she should be – it is election year, and clearly National supporters don’t have faith in their party to win the election by merit alone, they feel they have to destroy the opposition and anyone that dares to support it, in order for their party to win – that is really sad, such a lack of faith.
3 11
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:00pm
RightNow

“Well there was an opinion in one of the papers today that doesn’t support your carte blanche view.”

Yep, you got me there. Hard to argue against a vague reference to an opinion.
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:00pm
Don the Kiwi

Good heavens – surely not.

Griff will be apoplectic at this news.

“The sky fell on Hawaii last month, all because carbon dioxide levels peeped above the much-hyped 400 ppm hurdle. Chicken Littles all over the world squawked into their friendly media megaphones about numerous imminent global warming disasters. One warned: “the fate of the world hangs in the balance.” (Similar alarms were rung when the 350 ppm level was passed).

But nobody else noticed anything scary.

Four pieces of well-established evidence say that 400 ppm of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is not a concern.

Firstly, there has been no increase in global temperatures since 1998 despite 16 years of rising carbon dioxide levels and heavy usage of carbon fuels. Clearly, CO2 is not the main driver of global temperatures.

Secondly, the ice core records show clearly, with no exceptions, that all recent ice ages have commenced when the atmosphere contained relatively high levels of carbon dioxide. The temperature fell first, and then carbon dioxide levels fell. This proves that high carbon dioxide levels do not guarantee a warm globe, but could suggest that they may be a harbinger of a coming ice age. Ice will cause far more damage to the biosphere than even the worst warming forecast.

Thirdly, current levels of atmospheric carbon dioxide are not extreme or unusual. Carbon dioxide reached 2,000 ppm in the luxuriant era of the dinosaurs, and ten times current levels (4,000 ppm) when the great Devonian coral reefs were flourishing. There is no tipping point into runaway global warming, or we would have tipped eons ago.

Finally, current carbon dioxide levels are just above starvation levels for plants. All vegetation would grow stronger, faster, and be more drought resistant and heat resistant if carbon dioxide levels trebled to 1,200 ppm. Such levels are no threat to humans – US submarines operate at up to 8,000 ppm for cruises of 90 days. Topping 400 ppm should be a cause for celebration – it shows that Earth is emerging from the cold hungry years of the ice ages.

Climate Cassandras have blown false trumpets once again.”
10 3
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:06pm
Kimbo

@ labrator

I’m still struggling to make the connection between a Malaysian diplomat allegedly trying to sexually assault a woman in Wellington is a indicative of New Zealand’s “rape culture”. Surely it’s indicative of Malaysia’s “rape culture”? Or did spending some time immersed in Wellington’s “rape culture” turn this Malaysian Diplomat into an alleged rapist?

Nope.

As I understand it, “rape culture” is a general attitude that discourages and hinders transparency, justice and accountability for victims (aka “the marginalised”) by minimising, tolerating, or in some way aiding and abetting rape or those accused of it. It is especially demonstrated in entrenched and privileged positions of power (aka “the hegemony”)

…such as a government official giving a back channel message in contradiction to our official diplomatic position that we would prefer and desire the Malaysian government to waive diplomatic immunity.

I don’t usually have much time for left-wing dialectic analysis, and even less for its supposed solutions. However, in this case I think that the cap may very well fit…
6 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:07pm
Kimbo

@ Judith

I’d agree with you. But victims of crime frequently come forward and criticize those they deem responsible for mismanagement of their case etc.

There have been some pretty strong statements made about this woman, and not just her politics. IMO the only reason she is being treated so harshly, is because her politics varies from the majority of the posters here. That is just not acceptable.

I’ll still almost certainly be voting National. But nonetheless there is an element of truth in what you say.

But folks are gonna do what folks are gonna do. And irrespective of her being a victim, she has taken a “political action” – which I reiterate is her prerogative. Which means she can and should also be subject to responsible scrutiny

As Nookin astutely posted earlier (July 10th, 2014 at 11:49 am)

“Nothing is “simple”. There may be some who discount, possibly even reject altogether, her comments because she is now seen as politically tainted.

At the other end of the continuum, there are those who will conclude that, as the victim, she is an expert in process and diplomacy and her opinions cannot be challenged.

In between there will be many that are troubled by the course of events but who, at the same time, do not necessarily share her views on culpability. When members this group lift their heads above the parapet walls they are immediately targeted by more cynical commentators who condemn them for victim bashing and preserving the rape culture.

There is also a distinction between the right to speak out and the wisdom of speaking out.”
9 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:17pm
kowtow

Destruction of Shia sites?

When sunnis do it to shias the world’s MSM :ho hum,move along please.

When the Americans or Israelis do it (in the heat of action) it’s Oh my gosh how evil ,and several hundred Pakis kill each other in anger.

So it’s not that they are destroyed ,it’s who is destroying.

Islam,the religion of perpetual outrage,along with their enablers, the west’s “liberal” media.
8 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:19pm
Paulus

Has the Deputy Head of the Protocol Division of MFAT who made the unfortunate decision resigned yet ?
Presumably she cannot be sacked, so probably she will be promoted to another Ministry.
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:20pm
Kimbo

@ Paulus

Presumably she cannot be sacked, so probably she will be promoted to another Ministry.

Seconded to assist Chris Carter in Afghanistan, and help set up a New Zealand embassy in Kabul?
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:32pm
MH

It is not the Navy’s job nor intention to tow the yacht especially in high seas but I’m sure over the various communications the state of the hull would have been discused and the Navy’s on board chippie shipwright would have tried to assist without compromising salvage or insurance worries and concerns over a surging towing hawser wrapped around the propeller. The Lt Diver would presumably have had a good look as well and made an assesment. They cut the original line for fear of the liferaft they were in being crushed under the rolling OPV.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:36pm
Manolo

Is P.G. providing expert advice to this victim of NZ’s “rape culture”? If not, why not?
7 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:41pm
labrator

… aiding and abetting rape or those accused of it … …such as a government official giving a back channel message

So you’re accusing the unnamed Government official of aiding and abetting the alleged intended rapist as part of New Zealand’s larger “rape culture”?
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:45pm
Other_Andy

Don the Kiwi says:

“…..current levels of atmospheric carbon dioxide are not extreme or unusual. ”

Or the most important factor when it comes to temperature….
While the late Ordovian Period was the start of an ice age, CO2 levels were 11 times (4400 PPM) higher than today.
(They dropped from 7000 to 4400 PPM before the late Ordovian.
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:45pm
Kimbo

@ labrator

So you’re accusing the unnamed Government official of aiding and abetting the alleged intended rapist as part of New Zealand’s larger “rape culture”?

By inattention to the true values that should have directed his or her actions – possibly yes.

“Rape culture” is not just the act. It is also the “sins of omission” that allow it to occur…and/or allow others to get away with it.

It is not necessarily a fully conscious decision. In fact often it is sub-conscious. To use the left-wing jargon, there has been insufficient “consciousness-raising” to realise there were much more important values in the play than NZ’s smooth diplomatic and trading relationship with Malaysia that should never have been up for negotiation.

Let me turn it around. What other mental process could explain the message that this “unnamed Government official” gave to the Malaysians? Calling it “stupid” is a correct description, but that doesn’t explain how the stupidity came about.
1 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:58pm
Judith

@ Kimbo (641 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 1:17 pm

There certainly is a difference between right and wisdom, and given what she is receiving, clearly she needed more wisdom – the fact she is only young, may have contributed to that.

And of course you will still vote National, as you should do, you have great faith in their ability and that is important. Sadly, there are many people, like myself who don’t have faith in any of the parties, which leaves us with a dilemma.

What worries me, with this latest carry on is how it will effect the electorate. As you have shown, those with great faith in National would not let it deter that faith, however, as we all know, there is quite a large group of people currently offering their support to National, who can change that support on a whim.

Whilst I understand the desire to point out this young victims political bias, and the possibility that she is being coerced by the less than ‘desirable’, I think those people dissing the victim should step back and consider just how their speech looks to others.

Those that are ‘swinging voters’ are fickle, like me – impressions matter. Should this latest criticism be picked up and promoted by the media (all they’d have to do is read this thread), then National supporters could come across as ‘bullies’, picking on the victim of crime, trying to discredit her, to save ‘their man’. It’s the sort of stuff that swings votes, and that could impact badly – whilst wisdom would have dictated the young woman didn’t speak out, wisdom should also dictate that National supporters don’t gamble with this one – because it risks being something that could turn quite ugly against them.
1 11
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 1:59pm
Griff

>Firstly, there has been no increase in global temperatures since 1998 despite 16 years of rising carbon dioxide levels and heavy usage of carbon fuels. Clearly, CO2 is not the main driver of global temperatures.

http://skepticalscience.com/trend.php
The sun heats the planet don the co2 retains more heat acting like a blanket your are obvious ignorant of the facts
using 1998 as the start date is cherrypicking the biggest El Nino experienced in recorded history and the .3 degree jump in temperature this caused .The warmest years are 2010 and 2005 we now are having warmer temperatures without an El Nino
http://skepticalscience.com/graphics.php?g=67
http://skepticalscience.com/graphics.php?g=52

Secondly, the ice core records show clearly, with no exceptions, that all recent ice ages have commenced when the atmosphere contained relatively high levels of carbon dioxide. The temperature fell first, and then carbon dioxide levels fell.

logic fail. the ice cores don’t have the effect of man increasing co2 its a new phenomenon so you can not expect ancient history to show the present effects due to man. previous changes are mostly due to solar cycles or volcanism.

Thirdly, current levels of atmospheric carbon dioxide are not extreme or unusual. Carbon dioxide reached 2,000 ppm in the luxuriant era of the dinosaurs,

The sun at the time is known to be weaker and global temperatures were far higher due to the amount of co2
You are proving the effect on the global climate with this statement if we return to that global temperature the tropics will be a uninhabitable desert and sea levels will be 50m plus higher good bye to most of the worlds great city’s..

Finally, current carbon dioxide levels are just above starvation levels for plants. All vegetation would grow stronger, faster, and be more drought resistant and heat resistant if carbon dioxide levels trebled to 1,200 ppm.

http://www.liebertpub.com/MContent/Files/Kleinman_ch19_p379-398.pdf
This is a very simplistic idea
Weeds respond far faster to growth in co2 than most food crops increasing competition and decreasing yields. Most food crops don’t respond well to increasing co2 unless you also increase other inputs like water and sunlight and fertilizer all of which will be restricted by increasing climate change.
Increasing hot extremes will have a greater effect on reducing yields than co2 will; have in increasing them .

It would help my amusement level if you give a link to the site where you sourced you misinformation from. It will be an unknown wing nut at a blog for such pathetic wingnuttery .
3 12
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:01pm
Kimbo

Whilst I understand the desire to point our this young victims political bias, and the possibility that she is being coerced by the less than ‘desirable’, I think those people should step back and consider just how their speech looks to others…wisdom should also dictate that National supporters don’t gamble with this one – because it risks being something that could turn quite ugly against them.

Indeed – which is why Key, McCully and anyone directly connected to the National Parliamentary team or Party have got rocks in their head if they ever considered it.
2 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:04pm
Judith

@ Kimbo (643 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 2:04 pm

Exactly. May the best team win – but win because they are the best, and not because they’ve managed to be on top of the gossip pile come election day.

I’m hoping the next few weeks will be about policy – policy against policy – but somehow I don’t think that is going to happen.
1 10
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:08pm
muggins

Re that Malaysian diplomat.
It may have already been mentioned but what I would like to know is why diplomatic immunity wasn’t waived in the first place?
I realise the Malaysian Government were given a way out, but why did they accept it if they were prepared to waive immunity in the first place?
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:14pm
Kimbo

I’m hoping the next few weeks will be about policy – policy against policy – but somehow I don’t think that is going to happen.

The other requirement is testing of competence. Which is why I’m interested to see how this McCully matter pans out. Seems the Greens may have stuffed it up already by giving the Malaysians an excuse not to send their man back. Mind you, lawyers, law professors and “law experts” are always fussing about something – usually coinciding with the interests of the purchaser of their whore-for-hire services.

But I do think Key was just a bit too quick to accept McCully was not responsible. Time will tell if he will regret that decision, both objectively and politically. Mind you, he doesn’t seem to get the important decisions wrong. But at some point, just as happened with Helen Clark after Brash’s Orewa speech, the “tipping point” will come for the electorate’s collective confidence in Key’s abilities.

Like Harold McMillan replied when asked what was the moving force in politics, “Events, my dear fellow, events…”
3 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:19pm
ciaron

Click and collect from the Warehouse…
All the pain and aggravation of going to the dentist, without actually getting your teeth fixed.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:20pm
muggins

Re my previous post. It now appears that the Malaysian Government weren’t prepared to waive diplomatic immunity, but that after the whatsit hit the fan they said were.
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:22pm
muggins

Malaysia asked to drop sex assault charge against envoy, NZ documents show
UPDATED: JULY 01, 2014 09:38 PM
KUALA LUMPUR, July 1 — Amid a potential diplomatic firestorm, the New Zealand government released today documents it says shows Malaysia asked it to drop a sexual assault case against its diplomat Muhammad Rizalman Ismail.

The documents were released scant hours after Malaysia’s Foreign Minister Datuk Seri Anifah Aman told a news conference in Putrajaya that New Zealand officials had offered to let Muhammad Rizalman return home and face an inquiry here instead of standing trial there.
The minister had said earlier news reports claiming Muhammad Rizalman had claimed diplomatic immunity to escape the sexual assault and burglary charges were misreporting.

This report is what I was referring to. Malaysia asked the NZ government to drop a sexual assault charge against one of it’s diplomats. Isn’t that much the same as asking for diplomatic immunity, without actually asking for it?
3 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:28pm
goldnkiwi

Ffs all this only happened 8 weeks ago. If he was still in the country would a trial date be set by now?

He is effectively in custody in his home country, how quickly would the alleged victim like to jump the queue?

Have the police even had time to make proper enquiries.

I absolutely agree that this is being used as political capital and that I would consider a trial prejudiced.

Personally I do not see why he should languish at the NZ tax payers expense if found guilty. In some ways his guilt has been already decided. That is an abuse of due process imo.
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:36pm
Elaycee

‘Judith’ / Ginny (12.19pm): ….lets face it, you are trying to mitigate the circumstances by insinuating that the victim is to blame…..

Jeez you really write some drivel, ‘Judith’…. but this effort lowers the bar even further. There was no such insinuation at all.

Only a moron could think otherwise… 😯
17 3
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:55pm
thedavincimode

Somebody has to, so it may as well be me:

Billingsleygate.
10 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 2:57pm
thedavincimode

I’ve only heard the odd selected snippet and was only half listening (half listening was likely an immune system response) but I gather that Ms Billingsley stepped enthusiastically into the limelight in order to raise rape awareness or some such. That explains why the apparent focus of her comments was on Key (“bored” – and rightly so if he was) and McCully (“incompetent”, but then we knew that already) not travelling hotfoot to prostrate themselves on her doorstep in abject apology.
13 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 3:03pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@ Griff.(2.01pm)… looks like I’m gonna attack you again….. but since you’ve expressed some knowledge about CO2 compensation limits in crop and weed plants I thought you might like to come up to speed with some CO2 experiments on a C3 crop – (rice) and its C4 weed (barnyard grass).
Here’s Matt Ridley’s take on it….. (you’ve got to read to the end).

http://www.rationaloptimist.com/blog/two-rival-kinds-of-plants-and-their-future.aspx

For those who can’t be bothered getting into the biochemistry of photosynthesis ( the most basic process for our life!!!) , I think Griff is simplifying matters by stating weeds respond faster to Co2 increases….. all depends on which weed, which crop, temperature levels, nitrogen concentrations, and water availability.
10 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 3:06pm
thedavincimode

Maggy

In Grief’s case, we all know what the weed/crop is; but we aren’t really in a position to assess temperature, nitrogen and water conditions in his hall cupboard.
10 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 3:17pm
Griff

Maggy

Matt Ridley’

Ridley was chairman of Northern Rock from 2004 to 2007, having joined the board in 1994. His father had been chairman from 1987 to 1992 and sat on the board for 30 years.[32]

In September 2007 Northern Rock became the first British bank since 1878 to suffer a run on its finances at the start of the credit crunch. It was forced to apply to the Bank of England for emergency liquidity funding, following problems caused by the financial crisis of 2007–08.[33] The failure of the bank eventually led to the nationalization of Northern Rock. Ridley went before a parliamentary committee which criticized him for not recognizing the risks of the bank’s financial strategy and thereby “harming the reputation of the British banking industry.”[11] He resigned as chairman in October 2007

temperature levels, nitrogen concentrations, and water availability.

All heading for negative effects under climate change.
Temperature extremes are significantly effecting the global corn and soy crop already As have drought effected crop yields due to shifts in rainfall pattern. Nitrogen is sourced from? and results in emission into the atmosphere of? Simplification… you expect a thesis is going to make any difference to the likes of the post I was replying to?
I find it disturbing that you of all people on here are in the camp of denial of sound science. Choosing to quote a failed banker when there is a huge resource available for the mechanics of crop growth and the outlook under climate change.
1 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 3:52pm
Griff

😆
bedroom and its been many years since I last played god with temperature, nutrients levels and ratios, duration intensity and wavelength of light and co2 /o2 ratio in a cupboard.
When you do its easy to get massive yields but the energy input and effort is large as well.
It was interesting but not any more than my prior hobby of breeding tropical fish basically a very similar exercise in environmental control.
3 3
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:03pm
nasska

God made weed
Man made beer
In God we trust. 🙂
3 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:13pm
Manolo

Highway robbery: http://money.msn.co.nz/businessnews/national/8872612/christchurch-taxis-most-expensive-in-the-world
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:25pm
thedavincimode

Poor old Hone. Happiness used to be never having to say you’re sorry.

He’ll be needing a regular supply of frozen peas to keep his balls iced down.
3 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:37pm
Judith

@ nasska (10,444 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 4:13 pm

Don’t get too carried away, God also made me 😛
3 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:39pm
thedavincimode

I know that was you nursey.
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:40pm
nasska

….”Don’t get too carried away, God also made me”….

At my age it pays not to get over excited Judith. 🙂
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:44pm
Judith

@ Elaycee (4,260 comments) says:
July 10th, 2014 at 2:55 pm

That’s right, you carry on “Elaycee”. In fact why don’t you go to the media with your accusations about the victim and make a great big stink on behalf of Key etc. The bigger the stink the better – let everyone know that you think because the victim supports a different party, she has no right to speak about her concerns over the fact that the government dropped the ball.
4 8
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:46pm
Maggy Wassilieff

@ Griff…. Don’t be disturbed about me being “in the camp of denial of sound science”. I can assure you I’ve still got a few brain cells functioning and its evidence-based, falsifiable science that I adhere to.

All I do here is post up links that may enhance folks understanding of some topics (really just the ones that interest me).
Whether Ridley was a good or bad banker is irrelevant to me…… He is a Zoologist and a talented science communicator, but that’s not really relevant either……. its the Chinese experiment that interested me.

I know it bugs some people that I don’t fall into their little camp of green thought, but it shouldn’t disturb you. It is a scientist’s role to look at information/data with a critical eye….if I come across information that helps to shape some of the debates/postings that I’m following here, I’ll put them up. Feel free to ignore my postings….
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 4:53pm
Nookin

“The bigger the stink the better – let everyone know that you think because the victim supports a different party, she has no right to speak about her concerns over the fact that the government dropped the ball.”

Help me, Elaycee.

I think I have read the whole thread reasonably carefully but try as I might, I cannot see where you have said that she has no rights to express her concerns because she may or may not support another party (a fact that has not really been established but which Judith seems to regard as a foregone conclusion).

Give me a clue.

Please?
3 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 5:19pm
Rowan

http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/10253079/Labour-would-axe-earthquake-authority

Cunliffe has well and truly lost the plot, another reason not to vote for labour. CERA like the National party are a neccessary evil.
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 5:39pm
Rowan

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/10253082/Helen-Milner-appeal-decision-reserved

Wouldn’t waste to much time on this one, maybe the COA could extend the sentance on this pyscopathic bitch like was done for Lundy back in 2002!
2 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 5:45pm
Redbaiter

“Billingsleygate.”

FFS..!!

These media fuckheads trying hard to keep their dying cash crippled industry afloat only get traction on these beat ups because you allow them to.
3 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 5:45pm
Elaycee

Help me, Elaycee.

@Nookin: Sorry…. I’m unable to help. ‘Judith’ (nee Ginny) is off on another of her tangents. How she can reach such a daft conclusion defies logic. But she still manages to do it….

I can understand why she was given the arse card from the Trade Me Community – folk can only take ‘so’ much….
6 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 5:51pm
Tom Jackson

@Kimbo

As I understand it, “rape culture” is a general attitude that discourages and hinders transparency, justice and accountability for victims (aka “the marginalised”) by minimising, tolerating, or in some way aiding and abetting rape or those accused of it. It is especially demonstrated in entrenched and privileged positions of power (aka “the hegemony”)

It’s a lot more than that. Were it just pointing out (a) that many people and institutions in our society have attitudes that sometimes make it hard to bring rapists to justice or recognise rapes for what they are, there wouldn’t be much to disagree with.

But of course it doesn’t stop there: it also means (b) that our society normalises and accepts rape as a means of keeping women down (rapes for rape culture theorists serve the same function as lynchings), and that the motivation of rapists is essentially the same. Rapists are one man lynch mobs on this view (the “all rape is about power” meme). The fact that there is little to no empirical evidence that this is the case (along with it being absurd on the face of it) doesn’t bother them at all. For those interested, Steven Pinker takes only a couple of pages to completely obliterate this view in the Blank Slate.

(a) is something that all reasonable and decent people could agree with. (b) is the ravings of a lunatic. Unfortunately, those who do most to promote the meme invariably believe in (b).
2 3
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 5:56pm
adze

Terrible pack attack during a liquor store robbery from security footage just shown on One News. Just appalling.

I hope they catch the feral shits.
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 6:03pm
labrator

…let everyone know that you think because the victim supports a different party…

alleged victim. Innocent until proven guilty and all that. By politicising the case she’s now damaged her case and chances of ever getting “justice”. Which is why everyone is hypothesising about motivations and political connections. Unless your prescribe to Labour’s new policy of “guilty until proven innocent”?
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 6:08pm
Griff

Matt Ridley is not in any way in the camp of sound science.
http://www.skepticalscience.com/matt-ridley-wired-for-lukewarm-catastrophe.html
http://www.desmogblog.com/matt-ridley
He is talking of risk in his book the rational optimist. On examination he has a track record of badly underestimating risk.He also works for an oil industry sponsored pressure group that is involved in climate change denial

.Still back to the grass.

Fertilizer nitrogen based is made from natural gas increasing use will result in more co2 emissions.

Water is projected to decrease in availability and reliability significantly.

Temperature extremes are projected to increase giving more days with temperatures over 100F impacting on most of our common food crops ability to grow successfully.

Moving towards the poles with agriculture to avoid the effects of the warming projected in the tropics and mid latitudes results in less available sunlight for plant growth.

All these things add up to a negative prognoses in humanity’s ability to reliably feed the earths growing population.

Not the rosy scenario that dons post on 1200ppm being good for plants suggest.

This
http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/
http://trs-new.jpl.nasa.gov/dspace/bitstream/2014/8560/1/02-1084.pdf?origin=publication_detail
http://ecco2.jpl.nasa.gov/opendap/data1/misc/articles/96GL00723.pdf
In conjunction with the the 1981 projection.

Publication Abstracts
Hansen et al. 1981

Hansen, J., D. Johnson, A. Lacis, S. Lebedeff, P. Lee, D. Rind, and G. Russell, 1981: Climate impact of increasing atmospheric carbon dioxide. Science, 213, 957-966, doi:10.1126/science.213.4511.957.

The global temperature rose 0.2°C between the middle 1960s and 1980, yielding a warming of 0.4°C in the past century. This temperature increase is consistent with the calculated effect due to measured increases of atmospheric carbon dioxide. Variations of volcanic aerosols and possibly solar luminosity appear to be primary causes of observed fluctuations about the mean trend of increasing temperature. It is shown that the anthropogenic carbon dioxide warming should emerge from the noise level of natural climate variability by the end of the century, and there is a high probability of warming in the 1980s. Potential effects on climate in the 21st century include the creation of drought-prone regions in North America and central Asia as part of a shifting of climatic zones, erosion of the West Antarctic ice sheet with a consequent worldwide rise in sea level, and opening of the fabled Northwest Passage.

as well as this 1990 one
http://pubs.giss.nasa.gov/abs/ri01500p.html

gives just cause for a Negative prognoses.
2 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 6:13pm
goldnkiwi

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/10251917/Incest-paedophilia-like-being-gay-judge-says

At least he isn’t one of ours.
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 6:26pm
OneTrack

chris2 – “Anyone who knows anything about diplomatic status knows diplomats can not be detained or prevented by the host country from leaving.”

It appears the Labour party and our left-wing news media don’t know anything about diplomatic status.
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 6:31pm
nasska

On a par with Justice Cunningham I would think goldnkiwi.

Both would be out of their depth in a bath.
2 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 6:34pm
big bruv

I have no sympathy for Tania Billingsworth, and, an even deeper hatred for the stinking Greens and the left in general.

That the Greens and the scum on the left would use the alleged attempted sexual attack on a female to score cheap political points just proves how low those wankers will go. Why does our media let scum like Jan Logie get away with this?

As for Billingsworth, well I am sorry, she has outed herself as a political activist, one sympathetic to the left and therefore fully aware of what she was getting herself into when she went to TV3 wanting to tell her story. To then use that story as a naked attempt to score a hit on the Government means that she is no longer deserved of any sympathy.

I actually doubt that Billngsworth is traumatised at all, anybody who genuinely was traumatised would not suffer through such an alleged attack and think “how can I spin this in favour of my political leanings”. I suspect that she knows she is going to hamper the chances of this man getting a fair trial, I suspect that she really does not care about her day in court, I suspect she has been encouraged by her Green scum mates to make the most of this while vermin like Logie can sit back and pour out faux concern.

Once again the golden rule applies when dealing with the stinking Greens. Trust NOTHING they do and NOTHING they say.
7 11
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:05pm
EAD

Good article over on Lew Rockwell which describes the cold hard naked truth about the current American Police State that began under Bush and has flourished under Obama:

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2014/07/john-w-whitehead/on-the-way-to-gestapo-land/

The author lays out all of the facts, so naked that a child could can see it for what it is, and yet it is so politically inconvenient, incorrect and uncomfortable that few dare to speak of the truth right in front of them.

“The most dangerous man, to any government, is the man who is able to think things out for himself…Almost inevitably, he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, and intolerable.”—H.L. Mencken, American journalist”
2 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:11pm
cha

I actually doubt that Billngsworth is traumatised at all, anybody who genuinely was traumatised would not suffer through such an alleged attack and think

So you’re familiar with how victims are supposed to re-act?.
1 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:16pm
MH

anyone else notice the conspicuous by their absence of TV presenters Campbell, Hosking and Paul Henry. Are they one and the same? Or on some sort of Treasure Island contest or subliminal re indoctrination by the SIS. Dogs tracing tales.
3 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:18pm
stephieboy

EAD , name prominent far right individuals like Lew Rockwell, Sarah Palin, Dinesh D’ Souza, Alex Jones etc who are under direct threat by this so called “gestapo land “.?

http://sonsofgrizzly.com/blog/view/2908/myths-about-the-coming-obama-police-state
1 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:18pm
dad4justice

“I have no sympathy for Tania Billingsworth”

Why doesn’t that surprise me. What a vile creepy thing to say.
4 7
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:25pm
Harriet

bruv#

They always have a ‘war on women’ item for the general election – this election it is rape.
1 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:32pm
freemark

A professor at Wayne State University in Detroit was giving a lecture on Paranormal Studies. To get a feel for his audience, he asks, “How many people here believe in ghosts?” About 90 students raise their hands. “Well, that’s a good start. Out of those who believe in ghosts, do any of you think you have seen a ghost?” About 40 students raise their hands. “That’s really good. I’m really glad you take this seriously. Has anyone here ever talked to a ghost?” About 15 students raise their hand. “Has anyone here ever touched a ghost?” Three students raise their hands. “That’s fantastic. Now let me ask you one question further…Have any of you ever made love to a ghost?” Way in the back, Ahmed raises his hand. The professor takes off his glasses and says, “Son, all the years I’ve been giving this lecture, no one has ever claimed to have made love to a ghost. You’ve got to come up here and tell us about your experience.” The Middle Eastern muslim student replied with a nod and a grin, and began to make his way up to the podium. When he reached the front of the room, the professor asks, “So, Ahmed, tell us what it’s like to have sex with a ghost?” Ahmed replied, “****, from way back there I thought you said Goats.”
4 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:35pm
goldnkiwi

So now all victims or alleged victims of ‘anything’ are going to want to appear on tv?
Surely all ‘things’ being equal or is this girl a special kind of victim?
3 3
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:49pm
goldnkiwi

Hypothetically, I imagine that someone that didn’t ‘like’ men in the first instance might be particularly affronted with an attempted or successful male upon female sexual assault.

I find the politicising of this matter extraordinary.
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:54pm
dirty harry

Feral natives out of control again..they are the lowest form of scum and deserve nothing less than a bullet in their empty heads.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/10253051/Attack-leaves-shopkeeper-unconscious
5 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 7:57pm
nasska

With all your honour and dignity what would you do? This test only has one
question, but it’s a very important one. Please don’t answer it without
giving it some serious thought. By giving an honest answer you will be able
to test where you stand morally. The test features an unlikely, completely
fictional situation, where you will have to make a decision one way or the
other.
Remember that your answer needs to be honest, yet spontaneous.

You’re in the North Island, North Auckland to be exact. There is great chaos going on around
you, caused by gale force winds and severe floods. There are huge masses of water
all over you. You are a Stuff photographer and you are in the middle of this
great disaster. The situation is nearly hopeless.
You’re trying to shoot very impressive photos. There are houses and people
floating around you, disappearing into the rushing water. Nature is showing
all of its destructive power and is ripping
everything away with it. Suddenly you see a man in the water. He is fighting
for his life, trying not to be taken away by the masses of water and mud.
You move closer. Somehow the man looks familiar. Suddenly you recognize him.
IT’S COLIN CRAIG!!!!!! At the same time, you notice that the raging
waters are about to take him away forever. You have two options. You can
save him or you can take the best photo of your life. So, you can save the
life of the CCCP leader, or you can shoot a NZPA prize winning photo, a
unique photo displaying the death of one of New Zealand’s conservative politicians.

HERE’S THE QUESTION, AND PLEASE GIVE AN HONEST ANSWER:
Would you select colour film, or go instead with the simplicity of classic
black and white?
5 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 8:03pm
cha

Goats!.

It was fun, it was an adventure to be out there in the country and to see what goes on, picking up pecans, from that to all kinds of indecent things with animals. And I know some of you know what that is.

– Thad Cochran.
1 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 8:11pm
Viking2

BB, whilst agreeing generally with your sentiment about the Greens IMHO you are way off with attacking Billingworth.

I have yet to see her refer at all to being a Green and using that in any way. It is clear others are using that as an excuse to lambast her as you have but what if she was your daughter. Would you sit back in your comfortable taxi cab and do nothing.
I doubt it. You would be on here and everywhere else you could type and be making an even bigger fuss. Especially if it was a labour Govt. in charge.

That guy was a Muhammad that was married and he chose to commit a home invasion (although that was excused as a burglary, which it wasn’t, it was a premeditated home invasion), and an attempted rape.
As I said somewhere else if that had been a Maori you and thousands like you would have been yelling and screaming all over the blogsphere about it. But no you come here to attack the person whose home was invaded and who was an intended rape victim.
Sure she has had assistance but that’s fair. Her comments on McCully were right on the mark especially as in earlier posts on other days McCully has been called a control freak by more than one or two posters. Clearly its not working.
She is right about Key looking bored or half asleep at the wheel. He has looked like that all year. Go back and look at some 3 year old photo’s of him and compare them to today.
He overworks like many exec’s. Of course he can’t delegate because he is so bloody short of decent talent after after losing his best to leaving Parliament. He is stuck with a bunch, half of who are hopeless and half who want his job.
And he has himself to blame for that.

As a taxpayer like myself you should be totally pissed off with the Malaysian Govt. A few weeks back they lost an airliner, you will recall. Well you and I as taxpayers fronted up with more than a few dollars and personnel and aircraft to look for the missing plane.
Our thanks for that decent gesture was to have them to tell our police and Govt. to get fucked and recall the slime that perpetrated this crime so he could avoid being held accountable.

Perhaps we should stop hosting Malaysians in our Universities again using the generous support of the taxpayer in NZ to help educate them as we have done for 50 years or so.
Would we miss them, probably not as there are plenty to take their place.

This is a cockup of National Party proportions and they deserve all the condemnation they get.
4 6
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 8:11pm
Steve (North Shore)

Nasska,
You get on an SD card and as soon as you can, contact Jan Logie.
Make many copies for TV1, TV3, Horrid, Stuffed; and of course the special bits for No Idea and Womans Daze
5 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 8:29pm
big bruv

Viking2

“I have yet to see her refer at all to being a Green and using that in any way.”

Had she not outed herself as “an activist and Green” I would not have made those comments. Given that she has then as far as I am concerned she is no longer deserved of sympathy.

You ask what if she was my daughter?, a not entirely unfair question. My response to that question would be that I would still feel the same way. I would not want my daughter to politicise a crime that had allegedly been committed against her and I sure as hell would not have wanted a politician of any party within one hundred miles of her.

Billingsworth has given up all rights for public sympathy, all though both she and the Greens know they can use this to their advantage given there is nobody in our media who will call this for what it is. She and the stinking Greens can blame anybody they like, stretch the facts as far as they wish because our media is not brave enough to go after scum like Logie for attempting to make political gain out of an alleged sexual attack.
1 6
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 9:08pm
goldnkiwi

Did Paki’s burglary victims get on tv before the case was heard? I am sure they could have got some publicity for their business, could have pushed a barrow, politicised even since the verdict or have I missed something.

Is this alleged sexual incident only ‘news’ because of the position of the perpetrator and connection to the government?

Rhetorical.
3 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 9:08pm
Rowan

“I have no sympathy for Tania Billingsworth, and, an even deeper hatred for the stinking Greens”

Should we be surprised or expect anything better from Bigot Blouse?, blouse seems to have an intense hatred of many here simply because they don’t share his opinion, what a creep!
7 4
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 9:10pm
dad4justice

Well said Rowan.
3 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 9:19pm
Sofia

The “essay” by Tania Billingsley
http://www.3news.co.nz/Portals/0/images/TANIA-ESSAY.pdf
1 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 9:27pm
Nostalgia-NZ

I guess that will be evidence for the defence if the ‘dear’ diplomat overcomes his psychiatric difficulties. Poor chap seems to have been put in a compromising position, he probably thought she was sexually or politically confused and needed some sweet loving from a real little man so he followed her home. Probably happens all the time.
1 1
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 9:44pm
Griff

Another case defending the right to bear arms http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/suspect-surrenders-slayings-four-children-two-adults-texas-n152361

A man involved in a domestic dispute shot dead four child relatives, killed two adults who were with them, and critically wounded a teenage relative in a suburb of Houston Wednesday, before surrendering to police following a tense standoff, authorities said.

Remember this is what New Zealand needs more assault weapons available just in-case .
0 7
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 9:50pm
Don the Kiwi

Griff.

Lets ban cars – they kill about 500 people per year in NZ alone.
7 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 10:45pm
cha

Last year 254 people lost their lives on our roads Don, and… twice as many people people died every week in America, more than 300,000 people since 9/11, as a result of gunfire.

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2012/07/under-a-blood-red-sky/260147/
1 5
Log in to Reply
Report
July 10, 2014 11:22pm
Gulag1917

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrmwB0bwtYQ
1 0
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2014 12:44am
balletgirl68

The little amount Ive seen of Tania Billingsley she seems pretty calculating to me. Far from being a distraught young woman she appears to be full of revenge for the wrong people. It was the Malaysian diplomat she should be angry at not the politicians (even though they were tardy). She has milked this for all she is worth…. whether a Green or not she has now prejudiced the whole case and the diplomat could get away scot free. I suspect in her naivety she though she could usurp the whole process and “make a difference” What a joke. No sympathy from me for this stupid woman.
4 2
Log in to Reply
Report
July 11, 2014 7:31am

More comments:

‹
1
2
3
›

Add a Comment Cancel reply

Login to comment or vote

« No Right Turn on the presumption of innocence

Is the Christchurch Town Hall affordable? »

Donations

You can now donate to Kiwiblog

Exclusive content from DPF on Patreon

Become a Patron!

Never miss a post

Email Address

Join 37.4K other subscribers

Highlights

Health Target 5 – elective treatments
Health Target 4 – Specialist appointments
Health Target 3 – Emergency Dept Waiting Times
Health Target 2 – Immunisations

Links

Green Party out of the woke frying pan into the woke fire
The Daily Blog
ComCom lays criminal charges on OneNZ – but not on Otago University for far worse breaches of the Fair Trading Act.
Point of Order
Quotes of the Week
Hompaddock
Open mike 25/11/2024
The Standard
Schadenfreudeliciousness VII: The MSM Are Dying!
No Minister
Automakers’ Costly Gamble on EVs: A Lesson in Ignoring Consumer Demand
Utopia
Treaty Principles Debate
NZCPR
Justice in Brazil
No Right Turn
"Seymour is only doing openly what M?ori nationalists and their Pakeha allies have been doing, quietly for the past 50 years."
Not PC
The transgender agenda sunk Kamala
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
SETTING THE RECORD STRAIGHT
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
What does “reciprocity” mean in New Zealand laws?
Croaking Cassandra
Media Link: “A View from Afar” on the US elections.
Kiwipolitico
This will not end well
Offsetting Behaviour
Top 14 Predictions for Round 10
Stats Chat
Tory Whanau may have to sell Wellington mayoralty to make ends meet
The Civilian
The Accidental Engagement
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz

editor@kiwiblog.co.nz

PO Box 12270, Thorndon, Wellington 6144

Facebook
Twitter
FourSquare
Instagram
LinkedIn
Google+

Archives
Disclosure Statement
Editorial Policy
Privacy Policy
Complaints Policy
Comments Policy

Design by cre8d