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May 22, 2014 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 22 May 2014

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General Debate

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UglyTruth

If you are then you’re not doing very well at it.
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May 22, 2014 8:50pm
mikenmild

That fact that you entertain the possibility that I might be is very revealing as to your mindset.
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May 22, 2014 8:51pm
UglyTruth

The fact that you have no answer to the problem of excess energy at “ground zero” and yet you remain opposed to the logical conclusion that the MSM account is false is very revealing as to yours.
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May 22, 2014 8:54pm
mikenmild

I’ve done arguing with you over PRATT.
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May 22, 2014 8:57pm
UglyTruth

You can’t rebut the facts so you lie by pretending that a rebuttal exists.
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May 22, 2014 8:58pm
mikenmild

But rebuttals do exist. You just refuse to accept them because they conflict with your cherished beliefs.
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May 22, 2014 9:01pm
UglyTruth

No they don’t. You can’t rebut the existence of the extraordinary amounts of heat at ground zero because the fact has been reported in many different ways:
1. witness reports of molten steel
2. infrared photos showing 700 degree hotspots days after the event
3. video evidence of steel fused with concrete
4. reports of underground fires burning months after the event

You are accusing me of what you yourself are guilty of.
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May 22, 2014 9:07pm
mikenmild

All of those points have been definitively answered. PRATT
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May 22, 2014 9:08pm
UglyTruth

Stop lying, milky.
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May 22, 2014 9:10pm
mikenmild

But I’m not. Deep down you know that and wish that you could stop lying to yourself.
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May 22, 2014 9:12pm
UglyTruth

If you were telling the truth you could post a link to your “definitive answers”.

All that I’ve seen from the debunkers is misdirection, arguing about the molten metal that was seen falling from the towers, never addressing the problem of the amount of energy required to keep the site hot for so long.
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May 22, 2014 9:15pm
Sidey

Buy new drapes UT, all us surveillance guys are getting bored seeing the same curtains on the tapes every debrief.

And you really should change your underwear more often. Just because you live in your Mum’s basement doesn’t mean she should have to de-crust your jocks every Saturday.
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May 22, 2014 9:18pm
mikenmild

You could start with the very helpful RationalWiki, but you might have theological objections to that site. Really, the answers to your questions are just a short google away.
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May 22, 2014 9:19pm
Reid

The amount of thermal energy present was far in excess of that which would have been available from the energy sources which were described in the MSM account of events.

Mere physics and logic and stupid things like the moronic laws of thermodynamics and Newtonian mechanics cannot compete with the galloping mentalism of someone who has already made up their mind as to what the facts are.

Tolstoy was right. It’s happened before and it will happen again and it happens all the fucking time. It’s a real shame that even when said laws are laid out before the mentals in a perfectly straightforward manner leading to no other possible conclusion, even then, still the appalling morons can’t fucking see it, because they don’t want to.

It’s a shame, but it’s a shame for the morons, not for the logical ones, who are capable of stepping out of their emotional comfort zone and following the logic and the evidence where it leads to, even when it leads to dark and disturbing places.

But that’s evidence and logic for you. Leave the hysteria to those who can’t and won’t think, the amusing thing is, the morons actually believe they’re the ones who have logic and evidence on their side, when really, it’s merely their big ball of ego that prevents them from admitting they have no fucking idea of how the world really works.
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May 22, 2014 9:20pm
UglyTruth

From RationalWiki:

Molten steel was found in the basement seven weeks later and jet fuel can’t melt steel.

This assertion is a strawman because it does not address the issue of the amount of energy required to keep the site hot for so long.

Rebuttal: There is no documented evidence of the presence of actually-melted steel at ground zero.

Witnesses reported molten steel, describing it as like being in a foundry. The lack of documented evidence can the attributed to the fact that crime scene investigators where kept away from the site until most of the steel had been removed.
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May 22, 2014 9:26pm
mikenmild

That’s Reid’s way of saying he’s so much cleverer than the sheeple…
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May 22, 2014 9:26pm
UglyTruth

The average sheeple is way, way smarter than you are, milky.
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May 22, 2014 9:30pm
mikenmild

Another one of your beliefs not founded upon reason.
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May 22, 2014 9:31pm
UglyTruth

Here’s the reason for it:

Scientific Poll: 84% Reject Official 9/11 Story
Only 16% now believe official fable according to New York Times/CBS News poll

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/October2006/141006poll.htm
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May 22, 2014 9:34pm
nasska

At last!

After this promising beginning I feel confident that consensus over 9/11 will finally be reached tonight. 🙂
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May 22, 2014 9:36pm
mikenmild

A poll reported by PrisonPlanet will convince very few, Ugly.
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May 22, 2014 9:37pm
UglyTruth

You’ve already been snapped for lying, why should anyone believe you?
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May 22, 2014 9:39pm
Nostradamus

Nasska:

I don’t think we’re in a position to start looking for consensus yet.

As Sidey explains above:

And you [UglyTruth] really should change your underwear more often. Just because you live in your Mum’s basement doesn’t mean she should have to de-crust your jocks every Saturday.

So, first clean underwear, then consensus!
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May 22, 2014 9:42pm
mikenmild

And you’ve been repeatedly reminded that linking to websites like PrisonPlanet works against your credibility.
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May 22, 2014 9:43pm
UglyTruth

You lie about a fictional rebuttal, then argue about the credibility of my link?

Can you say “galloping hypocrite”, milky?
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May 22, 2014 9:46pm
nasska

….”So, first clean underwear, then consensus”….

Right Nostradamus….if we do it the other way round there’s a risk that UT will be chipping off his jockey juniors. 🙂
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May 22, 2014 9:46pm
mikenmild

But I haven’t lied, Ugly. A lie is a knowing misrepresentation of the truth. I don’t lie. What you call lies are simply others’ opinions based on their assessment of a situation. The fact that you so readily resort to calling other Kiwibloggers ‘liars’ is more revealing about you than about them.
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May 22, 2014 9:49pm
UglyTruth

Again, if you were telling the truth you could post a link to your “definitive answers”.

You suggested RationalWiki, but they don’t address the issue. None of the debunkers do.
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May 22, 2014 9:51pm
mikenmild

I don’t have to post any other links. All of your points have been refuted before. You choose to ignore this because you have a deep personal investment in your version of the ‘truth’. I suspect it all goes back to the court-ordered psychiatric evaluation. Did that reveal some things that made you uncomfortable, Ugly?
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May 22, 2014 9:55pm
Nostradamus

UglyTruth:

Speaking of pressing earthly matters, have you managed to get to the bottom of the conspiracy theory involving the previously-unknown link between Jabba the Hutt’s relative and the faked moon landing?

Jabba the Hutt’s Uncle Ziro conspired with Count Dooku to kidnap Jabba’s son Rotta, reasoning that when the Jedi sent to retrieve Rotta died, the Republic would be forced to apprehend Jabba, leading to Ziro gaining control of their clan.
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May 22, 2014 9:56pm
UglyTruth

The fact that you don’t post any other links shows that you are unable to tell the truth about your fictional “definitive answers’, mikenmild.

Attempting to change the subject won’t work either, liar.
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May 22, 2014 9:57pm
mikenmild

Again, I am not a liar. The fact that you so readily resort to calling other Kiwibloggers liars suggests to me that you have your own issues with the truth.
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May 22, 2014 9:59pm
UglyTruth

Why would anyone believe you?
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May 22, 2014 10:06pm
mikenmild

Because I tell the truth, and provide arguments grounded in reason and evidence.
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May 22, 2014 10:07pm
UglyTruth

You are lying again. You have no evidence to support your position.
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May 22, 2014 10:11pm
mikenmild

Yes I do.
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May 22, 2014 10:12pm
UglyTruth

Liar.
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May 22, 2014 10:13pm
mikenmild

Ouch, that hurts. Please don’t call me a liar again.
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May 22, 2014 10:14pm
UglyTruth

You can’t rebut the existence of the extraordinary amounts of heat at ground zero because the fact has been reported in many different ways:
1. witness reports of molten steel
2. infrared photos showing 700 degree hotspots days after the event
3. video evidence of steel fused with concrete
4. reports of underground fires burning months after the event
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May 22, 2014 10:16pm
mikenmild

Points
Refuted
A
Thousand
Times
PRATT
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May 22, 2014 10:18pm
Sidey

You do know Mikenmild, that you’ll never get UT to concede on pretty much anything that seems obvious and normal to us, well, normal folk?

As much fun as it is, the guys obviously a piss-taker. If he totally believed everything he posts i.e. that almost nothing on this planet happens without something sinister behind it, he’d have no friends that visit, no family that visit, and be regarded as “that nutball” by everyone who has had even a passing dealing with him. I cling to the hope that people that deluded are under some sort of care and don’t have regular (as in, all day, every day, every damn thread) access to the online world.

Putting my “UT” CT hat on for a minute, the obvious answer is that he’s just taking the piss big time, and not to be taken seriously on any topic. I think he’s a plant by the CIA in conjunction with Elvis. By acting so obviously nutbarish, we’ll discount his nutbarish utterances, and thereby fall into his trap.

Quite what that trap may be, I have no idea. But it will devilish, to be sure.
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May 22, 2014 10:18pm
mikenmild

Sidey
Your description of Ugly is likely spot on. There is some hope for him. Unlike Reid, for example, Ugly has been known to modify his positions in the face of evidence.
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May 22, 2014 10:22pm
UglyTruth

I’m not taking the piss. Milky is lying when he says that the points have been refuted.
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May 22, 2014 10:23pm
mikenmild

Again, I’m not lying. But that’s enough fun for one evening.
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May 22, 2014 10:25pm
UglyTruth

Liar
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May 22, 2014 10:26pm
Scott Chris

Liar.

Ah Freddie Mercury at his best:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oU7rqB9E_0M
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May 22, 2014 11:14pm
publicwatchdog

Always (at least) two sides to the story Kiwibloggers?

FYI

http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/05/court-reporting-public-gallery-circus-high-court-6/#more-137180

“From the dead cat wearing rates avoider Penny Bright to the feral in front of me in the public gallery wearing socks with his jandals and track pants, I cannot help feeling sorry for John Banks having to put up with his career and legacy tried in front of a bunch of rabble. I do not particularly like John Banks as a politician, but no one deserves this….”

errrr….I was actually wearing a beret Cathy?

And I wouldn’t describe you as ‘rabble’ 🙂

“Rates avoider Bright is allowed to harangue witnesses right down to the Hyatt Hotel. It is a scenario that awaits a Steve Braunias column.”

errr….. to whom were you referring Cathy?

“And David Fisher nice punk for informing the rates avoider Bright I was in attendance. The only ray of sunshine was that I got to say to her face what I had previously published. I don’t think she’s ever experienced that before.

There is a first and a last time for everything.”

What a wee SPINNER you are Cathy!

My side of the story is that I recognised your face, and asked David Fisher if it was indeed ‘Cactus Kate’.
He said it was and that your name was ‘Cathy’.

You may recall that it was I who approached you, in Auckland High Court room 6, (before proceedings commenced), extended my hand and said “Hello Cathy – I’m Penny Bright – we haven’t yet met.”

You looked VERY much like you didn’t want to shake my hand and – quite frankly – it was the most revolting handshake I have ever experienced (even worse than John Key’s – and that is saying something!).

I then said words to the effect “Hypocritical rich prick? (Which is how you described me in this NBR article you wrote
http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/rich-prick-doesnt-want-pay-rates-ck-135024 – 29 January 2013)

(My home is freehold – I was lucky enough to pay off a 24 year loan in less than 9 years as a result of falling interest rates)

“Isn’t that the politics of envy? I thought you people didn’t do that sort of thing?”

When you asked me if I had paid my rates, I said ‘absolutely not’.

(Which is still the case.

Auckland Council is not complying with the Public Records Act 2005, and giving citizens and ratepayers the ‘devilish detail’ and showing where exactly rates monies are being spent on private sector contracts.)

You see Cathy Odgers – you may not be interested in ‘open, transparent and democratically accountable’ local government – which is probably unsurprising, given that I understand you are connected with tax havens for the wealthy?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathy_Odgers

“Odgers holds bachelor of commerce and bachelor of laws degrees from the University of Auckland and is an admitted barrister and solicitor in New Zealand.[2] Odgers is a full member of STEP (Society of Trust and Estate Practitioners), the Asia Offshore Association and the Inter-Pacific Bar Association.[2] ”

http://www.fbsemirates.com/confidential-banking-and-banks-in-the-dubai/

Confidential Banking and Banks in the Dubai

Click Here – Essential UAE Company Practical Information and Facts.

Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) – An Absolute “Must Read” …

What does the ‘Near Future’ hold and Dubai – ‘The New Switzerland’ for the Rich

Anonymity / confidentiality of beneficial owners

Here is a list of benefits of the UAE relating to SAFE and confidential banking in a rich and economically stable country with huge financial (and oil) reserves.

14th largest economy in the world having the 5th largest oil reserves and notably the reserves of the emirate of Abu Dhabi alone amount to over 1 trillion USD$!

FULL confidentiality for beneficial owners at banks and the authorities and NO information exchange agreements with any other country. Do we disclose UBO details / identity to the authorities? In RAK we do not! (the reason for choosing RAK) in Jebel Ali (Dubai) we do and authorities need bank ref of UBO! To the banks? Yes as a general rule we disclose BUT there are no information exchange agreements

Solid bank confidentiality with NO exchange of information agreements with any country

The emirates have not signed exchange of information treaties with any nation, not even the European Union

…………….”

(Of course – you can’t believe everything you read on Wikileaks – so please correct any information which is wrong (as I am doing with that which you have written about me 🙂

You see Cathy Odgers – you may not be into ‘transparency’ (understandable if you’re into tax havens and the like) – but I am.

Maybe you’re not used to people approaching you directly, and challenging you to your face over what you have previously
published?

I very much doubt that you’ve previously experienced that before.

But I did enjoy your ‘spin’ (sorry – ‘take’) on this event 🙂

Is it your intention to visit the Defendant John Banks, if and when he is incarcerated following this trial?

He’ll probably appreciate visitors.

(“Even rats have feelings” ).

I understand that Kim Dotcom was looking forward to a visit from John Banks when he was imprisoned.

Possibly if Kim Dotcom had been a beagle or a ‘lab rat’ John Banks would have been more concerned about his circumstances?

Of course – I’d post this directly on Whaleoil – but unfortunately Cameron Slater doesn’t believe in ‘freedom of expression’ on HIS ‘blog’ (like the equally phony Martyn Bradbury with HIS ‘Daily Blog’)

Kind regards

Penny Bright
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May 22, 2014 11:52pm
Pete George

Latest Roy Morgan – National bounce back

– National 45.5% (up 3%)
– Labour 30.5% (down 0.5%)
– Green Party 13.5% (down 0.5)
– NZ First 6.0% (no change)
– Maori Party 1.0% (no change)
– Mana Party 1.0% (no change)
– Conservative Party 1.0% (up 0.5)
– ACT NZ 0.5% (no change)
– Internet Party 0.5% (down 1)
– UnitedFuture 0% (down 0.5)

National have bounced back a bit but are still vulnerable with a lack of partners, little change for the others with Labour still struggling and the small parties all 1% or less.
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May 23, 2014 6:28am
griffith

Penny Tarnish is right….

Bradbury is a nob and few righties comment on both kb and slaters rotten wood pile for much the same reason.

Well done Mz Hysterical Cat wearing rate stealing Fraud.

or do we thank the thousand monkey typing thing?

Penny for your consideration is the revelation that many former act voters including Griff dislike con sedative jonnywanks as much as you do. He finally destroyed any faith in the party holding true to its founding charter as a liberal RW party.
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May 23, 2014 7:24am

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