General Debate 12 August 2013

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Don the Kiwi

Wakey wakey.
Time to go to work. 🙂
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August 12, 2013 8:03am
Dennis Horne

A argument stands on its merit but an opinion is a personal judgement.

A person explains the mysteries of life by invisible gods. What value is his or her opinion on who is telling lies or where the truth lies?
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August 12, 2013 8:05am
flipper

THE FONTERRA LYNCH MOB….

There is a rather nasty lynch mob whiff about this at the moment.

ANY INQUIRY that ignores ulterior media/competitor motives, and other relevant matters, will be fundamentally flawed and open to legal challenge. Any Minister acting upon such information/advice… would be inviting Judicial Review….and good night pussy cat.

Any suggestion that ESR/Govt Health scientists are better qualified than Fonterra’s in this area will be shot down in flames.

Ten from 10 for cabinet actions to date. But time for a TOTALLY independent evaluation (NO Cabinet, NO ‘crats, NO politicians, no Select Committee BS, an inquiry headed by a High Court Judge, drafted over dead judicial bodies if necessary) of the WHOLE saga, including who has benefitted, who hast lost. Where buts need kicking great. And NO PIKE RIVER delayed inquiry. Do it yesterday…period.

And also, please move right away from blaming the Fonterra Board and top management for everything….. before culpability has been independently established.

IT is time to take a WIDER view…. and remember that fair political and media decisions are defensible.

At the moment the media, especially that shrew Wood, is in the dock. Quite an appalling Q+A display yesterday, as were the comments uttered by Edwards and Sutton.

En passant, I have no financial or interest of any other kind in Fonterra.
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August 12, 2013 8:08am
kowtow

A good piece on the adrift Obama.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/10234042/Obamas-not-to-be-trusted-on-foreign-policy.html
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August 12, 2013 8:09am
Fletch

Don @8:03 am –

Just 5 more minutes mum!
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August 12, 2013 8:12am
Griff

What is the value of any opinion when it goes against known facts ?
The motivation behind the opinion often carries more useful insight than the opinion itself.
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August 12, 2013 8:14am
Jack5

Sri Lanka giving Fonterra a hard time? You want to see some of the public hygiene arrangements in Sri Lanka. Perhaps someone’s looking for a protection payment.

If the Sri Lankans boycott Fonterra products, we should think about Sri Lanka tea. Kenyan tea is a good alternative.
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August 12, 2013 8:24am
Paulus

Am I the only one who is becoming tired of the Auckland Herald continuing to bitch about young people first home buyers who cannot afford to live in Central Auckland and cannot find a house under $600,000.
The expectation of new house buyers is that any house has to be where they want it – it has to have all the modern amenities, but they will perhaps change the wallpaper.
It must have a garden for when they have children someday.
It must be convenient to their places of work, and space for their two cars.
The Real Estate industry is not helping by verbally pushing up the sale prices, as their fees are based on the sale price.
New buyers are totally unrealistic in their expectations.
They appear on RNZ this morning for somebody (ie Government) to sell them for $250,000 a house with a value of $600,000 – or give them a first house for free preferably.
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August 12, 2013 8:25am
Kea

“Having declared an end to the War on Terror, the US president no longer has any clear idea of his country’s global role
”

kowtow, I checked out your link. It is an incredible claim for Obama to make as he spreads death and destruction around the globe. I think the victims of his drone strikes and covert wars will be suprised to hear that the war-on-terror is over. The Muslim Brotherhood trying to destroy Syria, with Obamas backing, might be nervous their millions in aid could be cut.

I do believe the US needs to focus on domestic issues and leave the rest of the world to sort out it’s own mess. Western efforts to bring peace and democracy to these places have always been dismal failures.
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August 12, 2013 8:43am
Kea

The motivation behind the opinion often carries more useful insight than the opinion itself.

Yes Griff, it does. 🙂
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August 12, 2013 8:44am
hj

Frogblog lambasting Nationals sociopathic RMA reforms.
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August 12, 2013 8:58am
flipper

Paulus says…
***New buyers are totally unrealistic in their expectations.
They appear on RNZ this morning for somebody (ie Government) to sell them for $250,000 a house with a value of $600,000 – or give them a first house for free preferably. ***

You made two mistakes this morning:
1. You read the NZ Hera;ld, circa 2013,
and
2. You listened to RNZ.

On the other hand, I watched TV One Breakfast. A big mistake in my part. That programme, apart from, J Key, was a load of crap. We are expected to ignore the TV One news producer team’s overt labour/Commissar red melon bias, and the sheer incompetence of Christie and the two bints. m POeter Williams does give the presentationsoime balanbce and his asiudes are often more perceptive that the tribe of regular “guests”.
So, Paulus, we both made errors, no?
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August 12, 2013 9:29am
flipper

How the above should have read if the XYZ phone had not beeped, and the xyz edit button had worked….
**

***New buyers are totally unrealistic in their expectations.
They appear on RNZ this morning for somebody (ie Government) to sell them for $250,000 a house with a value of $600,000 – or give them a first house for free preferably. ***

You made two mistakes this morning:
1. You read the NZ Herald, circa 2013,
and
2. You listened to RNZ.

On the other hand, I watched TV One Breakfast. A big mistake in my part. That programme, apart from, J Key, was a load of crap.
We are expected to ignore the TV One news producer team’s overt labour/Commissar red melon bias, and the sheer incompetence of Christie and the two bints. Peter Williams does give the presentation some balance, and his asides are often more perceptive than contributions by the tribe of regular “guests”.

So, Paulus, we both made errors, no?
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August 12, 2013 9:44am
Manolo

The Age of Imbecility: http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/08/10/study-posting-facebook-photos-negatively-impacts-real-life-relationships/
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August 12, 2013 9:47am
joana

Two massive bombs have been found in NSW..much bigger than the ones used in Boston..One was to be used to blow up a hospital..the other to be used to blow up a Sydney eye surgeons rooms..and still no one is allowed to criticize these people..
Winds of Jihad.
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August 12, 2013 10:04am
cha

Yeah, wannabe jihhadis flee to Catholic Malta.
/
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August 12, 2013 10:09am
Yvette

If naturally grown marijuana, with perhaps a little preservative added to qualify it as artificial – that is, not as it would be in its natural state – was submitted to the testing regime for Artificial Marijuana or Legal Highs, where would it rate?
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August 12, 2013 10:13am
flipper

FONTERRA AGAIN …..

Fonterra HAS set the bar high for the Government and, more especially the idiot MSM, with the just made announcement on the membership of its independent Board inquiry.

Ralph Norris and Judith Potter, plus another QC, as leaders of that group will be hard to top.

The media will need to take care of they decide to rubbish that group.

The Government will also struggle, and will need to look to the active judiciary, qualified (NOT BS Govt) science from abroad, and at least one other person of standing, for their inquiry. But of equal import will be the terms of reference, which must include the media and foreign interests. (Aus and Sri Lankan for example).
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August 12, 2013 10:28am
Griff

The legislation does not specify the level of potential harm required to be legal.
It would be logical to reference the harm done by the legal intoxicant Alcohol and use this as society’s default yard stick.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/dailychart/2010/11/drugs_cause_most_harm

MOST people would agree that some drugs are worse than others: heroin is probably considered to be more dangerous than marijuana, for instance. Because governments formulate criminal and social policies based upon classifications of harm, a new study published by the Lancet on November 1st makes interesting reading. Researchers led by Professor David Nutt, a former chief drugs adviser to the British government, asked drug-harm experts to rank 20 drugs (legal and illegal) on 16 measures of harm to the user and to wider society, such as damage to health, drug dependency, economic costs and crime. Alcohol is the most harmful drug in Britain, scoring 72 out of a possible 100, far more damaging than heroin (55) or crack cocaine (54). It is the most harmful to others by a wide margin, and is ranked fourth behind heroin, crack, and methamphetamine (crystal meth) for harm to the individual. The authors point out that the model’s weightings, though based on judgment, were analysed and found to be stable as large changes would be needed to change the overall rankings.
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August 12, 2013 10:39am
liarbors a joke

TV 1 Breakfast….do people still watch it?

Id rather be subject to 3 hours of Suzanne Paul advertorials pushing shitty frypans and sucky sucky machines.
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August 12, 2013 10:43am
Scott Chris

Crikey, I hope Pete George’s alright…. No posts yet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgPePk3kGZk
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August 12, 2013 11:15am
lilman

Fonterra Directors and CEO look the part,love the line-” Nothing to see here,move along”.
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August 12, 2013 11:20am
kowtow

Jack5

Kenyan tea .

Is it served in the White House?
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August 12, 2013 11:23am
wikiriwhis business

National planning Cyprus-style solution for New Zealand …The National Government are pushing a Cyprus-style solution to bank failure in New Zealand which will see small depositors lose some of their savings to fund big bank bailouts, the Green Party said today. Open Bank Resolution (OBR) is Finance Minister Bill English’s favoured option dealing with a major bank failure. If a bank fails under OBR, all depositors will have their savings reduced overnight to fund the bank’s bail out. “Bill English is proposing a Cyprus-style solution for managing bank failure here in New Zealand – a solution that will see small depositors lose some of their savings to fund big bank bailouts,” said Green Party Co-leader Dr Russel Norman. – Scoop

Dominant Social Theme: It’s all ours now.

Free-Market Analysis: First Cyprus and now New Zealand. Is it coincidence or something more?

Globalists that are trying to create an international monetary solution often implement programs in various countries at once. The question arises as to whether Money Power itself – the banking entities and those behind them that control a good deal of the world’s wealth – have decided to “send a message” about the relationship between citizens and their banks.

We’ve certainly noticed that the advent of the Internet and ever-rising level of information sharing has sparked additional assertiveness from Western governments. The US in particular, with its expanding wars in Africa and assertion that US officials are to collect taxes anywhere in the world, is becoming extraordinarily aggressive.

http://worldtruth.tv/new-zealand-plans-to-seize-bank-accounts-cyprus-style/
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August 12, 2013 12:16pm
Longknives

Christ I’m glad Adam Scott didn’t win the PGA. The crowing from NZ media over the weekend that Steve Williams was ‘winning yet another major’ was nauseating and cringeworthy.
Almost as bad as the recent article from that over-excited drooling idiot that called Lydia Ko the “greatest golfer of all time”. (That’s right- better than Nicklaus, Woods, Palmer, Player etc etc)
Our media are a bloody embarrassment!
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August 12, 2013 12:25pm
dime

Longknives – i couldnt believe it when i saw “kiwi leading the PGA”. that was just beyond sad. fucking embarrassing. fucking desperate.
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August 12, 2013 12:55pm
Kea

Maybe Lucy will listen to this guy ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYQuvwQ4y-k
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August 12, 2013 1:22pm
All_on_Red

wikiriwhis

OBR is not new. No money in any Bank is “safe”. There is no Govt guarantee and never has been. Its called taking responsibility for your investments and researching where you put your money.
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August 12, 2013 1:49pm
Thrash Cardiom

Two massive bombs have been found in NSW..much bigger than the ones used in Boston..One was to be used to blow up a hospital..the other to be used to blow up a Sydney eye surgeons rooms..and still no one is allowed to criticize these people..
Winds of Jihad.

Two fully assembled bombs were found in together in a duffle bag. Hardly massive unless they were made using some devastating explosive. Certainly nothing like a truck packed full of fertilizer.

Also seems as though the guy has a grudge against an eye surgeon which is why the targets were picked. Where did you get the idea a jihadist was involved? I can’t find anything that mentions religion in context with this story.
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August 12, 2013 1:54pm
dime

yeah! why would anyone hear the word “bomb” and think muslim? thats just weird!
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August 12, 2013 2:10pm
Kea

dime, beats me. When I hear the word “bomb” I think of Obama.

Last time I checked the ones dropping millions of tons of bombs were the Christians of the USA.
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August 12, 2013 2:19pm
dime

Kea – i know at airports im always on the lookout for suspicious looking Christians.. never followers of the religion of peace
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August 12, 2013 2:34pm
Don the Kiwi

Our resident muslim on the attack again.

Which surah from the Koran supports your theory, Kea.
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August 12, 2013 3:22pm
Manolo

The bitch is ruining her country and needs, wants, more time to finish the job:
Argentine President Cristina Fernandez faced a tough midterm election test on Sunday, with early results showing headwinds to any effort by her allies to pass a constitutional amendment allowing her to run for a third term in 2015.

http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCABRE97A09E20130812
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August 12, 2013 3:57pm
graham

Ports of Auckland to face competition?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10911483

Port of Tauranga, the country’s biggest export port, has spent $37.2 million buying property in Onehunga to expand its inland port operations in South Auckland.

I don’t know where the majority of our shipping traffic originates from or is destined to – does anybody else? I’m just wondering why they are ramping up a port on the west coast when Ports of Auckland and Port of Tauranga are both located on the east coast. Is it to cater to different markets, or is detouring around Cape Reinga not a big deal in the grand scheme of things?
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August 12, 2013 4:55pm
Jack5

Ahoy Pete George, you’re supposed to tell us first!

United Future is considering a name change (link at bottom of this post).

Name suggestions for kiwiblog Pete to pass on please.

Possum Party, Possumus Comitatus, Dunthat, Dunnie’s, Dunny Party, Road Kill, the Fur Right, Man Alones, Tweet Dreamers, United Past etc etc

Keep ’em coming gals and guys for Kiwiblog Pete to pass on.

And the link:

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/216760/united-future-looks-to-revamp-image
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August 12, 2013 4:57pm
Kea

Don the Kiwi, resident atheist actually. You must be retarded if you think it is Muslim drones and bombers attacking Christian countries. I would suggest the ratio of Christian bombs to Muslim is probably about a couple of million tons to every kg of explosive. I am not aware of any Christian country being occupied by invading Muslims either.
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August 12, 2013 5:00pm
graham

… leader Peter Dunne said the party has also discussed changing its name from United Future to United.

Yep, that’ll fix their problems. Sounds like a sure-fire winner to me.
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August 12, 2013 5:11pm
James Stephenson

@graham (4.55) Port of Tauranga are expanding their Metroport operation, which is a distribution centre for them close to Auckland, rather than an actual port on the Manukau harbour,
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August 12, 2013 5:20pm
Lucia Maria

Kea,

Why would you think I would listen to a heterodox Anglican who was the first in England to bless same-sex unions? (link)
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August 12, 2013 5:51pm
dime

“I am not aware of any Christian country being occupied by invading Muslims either.

only because they are backward as fuck 🙂

the real issue is this – we aint dropping the right kinda bombs 😀
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August 12, 2013 5:52pm
nasska

Jack5

1) Randy Aged Capricorn’s Party

2) No Values Party

3) Dunne First Party
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August 12, 2013 5:58pm
Kea

Hi Lucy, the Pope supports evolution. Creationists are considered the lunatic fringe by educated Christians. Try and keep up with the enlightment dear.

dime, Afghanistan is simply a killing ground for Americans. The Yanks are not losing, they have lost. The Afghans have no need to travel and the Taliban have never attacked anyone outside of their own borders. All that fancy kit the Yanks have cost trillions and still blows up the same with cottage industry IED .

They should try attacking the people responsible for 911. The Saudis. They won’t have far to fly, as they already have bases there, to fly missions against Afghanistan !
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August 12, 2013 6:03pm
lilman

The Islamist war faction are completely fucken nuts.
I have seen them in action and believe me if you don’t measure up to what they want,there is no meeting,no discussion ,no talkback.You are dispatched by any number of methods,shooting stabbing,strangulation ,even poisoning.
The absolute truth is they hate your guts and will sacrifice you ,me, themselves and any other Islamists in order to get their way.
So I say go to it America,do what you have to keep this shit inline.At some stage in the future they will have to be dealt with,untill then I am humbly grateful to all the forces fighting to try to hold them at bay.When the world decides enough is enough I can tell you its going to be extreme,so lets enjoy the moment.
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August 12, 2013 6:17pm
Lucia Maria

.. the Pope supports evolution.

Does he? If he does, that would be a personal view. As a Catholic, I don’t have to believe in evolution, nor do I have to believe in creationism. In fact, I believe in neither, so you must have me confused with someone else.

They should try attacking the people responsible for 911. The Saudis.

Even better, they should stop buying their oil and put more money in alternative supplies. That way the whole middle east can go back to stagnation and it won’t be a threat to anyone. It’s only oil money that keeps the whole place going, they can’t do anything else.
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August 12, 2013 6:17pm
wiseowl

New party possibilities.

Dunover, Overdunne, Together United,All Dunne, Dunne Time.
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August 12, 2013 6:23pm
Lucia Maria

Don the Kiwi, resident atheist actually. You must be retarded if you think it is Muslim drones and bombers attacking Christian countries…

Atheist, huh? Atheist don’t talk like that.
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August 12, 2013 6:28pm
Kea

Lucy, I agree that we should be distancing ourselves from the Middle East (including Israel) until they learn to be nice.

You have no idea how atheists speak and nor do I. You can tell nothing about someone from learning they are an atheist. It is not a belief, it is non belief. You are an atheist about all the other gods and presumably the tooth fairy as well. Maybe that is why we get on so well 😉
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August 12, 2013 7:09pm
Kea

…untill then I am humbly grateful to all the forces fighting to try to hold them at bay.

Yeah they are bravely fighting off masses of dirt poor Afghan goat herders on the beaches of California.
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August 12, 2013 7:13pm
nasska

Handy advice for citizens of the USA.

If you can’t afford to go to the doctors, just visit the airport.

You’ll get a free Xray and breast exam. And if you mention Al-Qaeda, you’ll get a free colonoscopy.
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August 12, 2013 8:00pm
Left Right and Centre

dime 5:52 pm Is this day one of paleo or what?

I’m still getting shitty numbers leftover from LCHF. Could take who knows how long to get back down.
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August 12, 2013 8:07pm
lilman

Kea, you know so much ,ever seen a war zone?
They aren’t nice places,in fact any person who has the balls to work ,fight,report or even live in these places are brave people.
Any person fighting in the enemies territory has got guts
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August 12, 2013 8:14pm
nasska

The only way to fly. 🙂

Ref: https://www.dropbox.com/s/iuliuh9evsuwtch/Islam%20F.jpg
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August 12, 2013 8:54pm
Kea

lilman (469) Says:
August 12th, 2013 at 8:14 pm
Kea, you know so much ,ever seen a war zone?
They aren’t nice places,in fact any person who has the balls to work ,fight,report or even live in these places are brave people.
Any person fighting in the enemies territory has got guts

Yes, my comment was not directed at the service people, but at the people pulling the strings. If I had it my way they would not be getting killed fighting pointless wars in places like Afghanistan. And don’t even bother telling me the war there is doing good or making a real difference. It is a fucking mess and getting worse.
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August 12, 2013 8:59pm
Kea

nasska, you should try sitting a on a plane where the non Muslim is the odd one out and they are all praying before take off 🙂
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August 12, 2013 9:07pm
nasska

Kea

Last time I flew I was sitting on the plane next to the nicest Muslim couple you could imagine.

Neither one of them exploded for the entire flight. 🙂
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August 12, 2013 9:12pm
Fletch

Hah, the John Key GCSB image doing the rounds on Facebook –

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/1146731_371696966267096_782141935_n.jpg
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August 12, 2013 10:43pm
Left Right and Centre

nasska 9:12 pm The fire risk of your dry sense of humour….. you’re tinder dry cuzzie….
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August 13, 2013 1:27am
Viking2

So now we are seeing the true colours of the National Party.

Rush to pass almost forgotten legislation to enable fast, effective investigation into contamination incident.

Not content with imposing a plethoria of spy laws upon us they have now found a reason to resurrect a proposed bill that has languished in the background for the last FIVE years.

No discussion with the public, just like the rest of their bad law, and actually no reason at all to be pocking thier fucking big noses into private company business.

I note that the Govt. doesn’t own 1 cent of Fonterra yet it considers it should usurp the role of the Company Directors.

When are you cow farmers going to tell this bunch of control freaks , to mind their own business or get booted out.

Next they will be grabbing your farms for the entitled brown skins.

Fonterra will conduct two internal inquiries into the incident, and the Ministry of Primary Industries yesterday gave details of its own probe into the way the problem was handled

The Government plans to FORCE a largely forgotten five-year-old bill through Parliament in three weeks to allow a short, sharp “Government inquiry” into the Fonterra botulism scare.

The move to expedite a Government investigation into the food safety scare comes hard on the heels of three other investigations into the incident which Fonterra says could cost New Zealand tens of millions of dollars in lost export earnings.

The Inquiries Bill, introduced by Labour in 2008 , gives ministerial-level inquiries new powers to compel witnesses to give evidence under oath but has been left on Parliament’s Order Paper for years.

But Prime Minister John Key yesterday said it would be passed, possibly within three weeks and under urgency, to allow a fast, effective investigation into how botulism-causing bacteria got into Fonterra whey concentrate which was then used to produce infant formula.

Mr Key had yesterday been expected to announce plans for either a ministerial inquiry or a commission of inquiry into the incident.

But he said a ministerial inquiry lacked the power to force witnesses to give evidence, and a commission of inquiry would take too long.

What a fucking disgrace this outfit are.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10911624
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August 13, 2013 7:22am

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