General Debate 18 December 2012

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Carlos

Sorry, Pete George. Bet you to it. 🙂
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December 18, 2012 8:15am
Carlos

*Beat
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December 18, 2012 8:16am
graham

A man who was protesting during an army ceremony in Auckland, refused to move out of the way when asked by a police officer and was arrested, then proceeded to swear at the policeman, told him to “f*** off” and used the C-word.

Jack Daylight (really?) was duly convicted. This prat then appealed his conviction claiming the sentencing judge was wrong to classify the C-word as obscene. Luckily the appeal judge was not some namby-pamby “Of course you have the right to express yourself” moron, and rejected his appeal.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/8092056/C-word-not-offensive-says-protester

At his sentencing Daylight was described as “an indignant and childish person.” Sounds fairly typical of most protestors in New Zealand nowadays.

It’s when I read stories like this that I feel truly sorry for the average police man or woman. They have a job to do, they generally try to do it to the best of their abilities – just like the rest of us workers – and it’s a crying shame that part of their job involves getting roundly abused and screamed at by idiots like Daylight for simply being the poor plod who just happens to be on the scene. And they’re supposed to calmly take the torrents of abuse these societal rejects hurl at them, when the temptation to just smack them one must be overwhelming at times.
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December 18, 2012 8:24am
nasska

The Edit Function

After a long & useful life died December 2012. Rest in Peace.

[DPF: Not dead. It was incompatible with the latest version of WordPress. Once the designer has done an updated version, we’ll stick it back in]
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December 18, 2012 8:26am
flipper

So, DPF,

I kniow it wasn’t on at Circa or Downstage, but the audience was knowledgable, many (hundreds of?) thousands bigger, and the subjct much more important than the esoteric nonsence often reviewed here. Where is your review of the Knight and Shag crying in “The weight of the Nation” ?

Two hours of reporting/viewing (Sky Sport One, 7.30pm, Sunday last) that must go down as the BEST TV doco for many, many years.

Oh, sorry. I forgot you and others were tired from your nature walk. 🙂 🙂

[DPF: I was hosting a party Sunday night, so didn’t see it]
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December 18, 2012 8:31am
Manolo

One of the two animals was acquitted. Mind boggling decision from the jury.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/8091663/The-streets-aren-t-any-safer-than-a-year-ago
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December 18, 2012 8:34am
jedmo

I just heard a radio news item about a teacher trying to get one of her students with gang links, to perform a “hit” on her principal, who she had issues with. She is allowed to keep on teaching. I cannot believe this.
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December 18, 2012 8:36am
iMP

NZ First?
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December 18, 2012 8:45am
flipper

The mail from a Wellingtin friend this morning brought two interesting items:

” An entrepreneur I once worked for, and who had difficulties with bureaucrats and the like, referred to some of the more irritating as “Over educated idiots” Fisher [aka The ***** Judge] seems to fit that categorisation quite nicely!”

and……

The Compost (aka DomPost), in their letters to the Editor, “points” section posted his billboard:

” A Tui Billboard – “The superb performance of Parata and Collins is a strong argument for equal pay and gender balance. – Yeah Right” 🙂
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December 18, 2012 8:55am
Pete George

No need to be sorry Carlos, someone does it most the time. Actually today I didn’t have much to say (yet) as is obvious by this comment. Over the last week this is the ‘beat me’ stats:

Today 9
Monday 3
Sunday 3
Saturday 4
Friday 14
Thursday 0
Wednesday 10
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December 18, 2012 8:58am
Ashley Schaeffer

Manolo (8,451) Says:
December 18th, 2012 at 8:34 am
One of the two animals was acquitted. Mind boggling decision from the jury.

The problem is with our law, not the jury. When someone intentionally commits an act of violence against another, and death results, it should be classified as murder. It shouldn’t matter whether the perpetrator was trying to kill or not and the hury shouldn’t have to concern themselves with trying to figure this out. As the law currently stands, it’s just too easy a defence for these scumbags. There has been no justice in this Cottrell case.
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December 18, 2012 8:59am
trout

You may have seen the reports in the weekend of 4 kids being taken from neglectful, abusive parents, after slackness on the part of CYFS. The parents were in a custody battle; not because they wanted to look after the kids properly (they are clearly incapable) but because 4 kids are a meal ticket. FGS.
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December 18, 2012 9:01am
RRM

manolo – yes, unbelievable…

I haven’t followed the trial but based on what’s been reported it appears to be pretty clear cut:

POS decides to bash Cottrell —> POS bashes Cottrell –> Cottrell dies.

It just seems wrong (IMHO) that the POS be considered anything less than a murderer under these circumstances. Don’t blame the victim’s brittle bones.
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December 18, 2012 9:06am
peterwn

manolo – At least the main one is in line for a stiff jail sentence. Maximum sentence for manslaughter is life – Dean Wickliffe got that when the appeal judges downgraded shooting of Paul Miet (the jeweller) to manslaughter (he claimed successfully it was an ‘accident’). I doubt this guy will get life but there should be a decent ‘starting point’ – he will get the usual ‘guilty plea’ discount as he was prepared to plead guilty to manslaughter but was tried for murder.
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December 18, 2012 9:11am
hamnidaV2

The current gun control poll on this website gives me some hope that Right-Wingers aren’t all complete nutters.

I would still be interested in knowing who the 25% are who think we should live in a society where people carry guns around.
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December 18, 2012 9:27am
Carlos

@ Pete George. Ha ha!

How’s things going on in Dunedin? I hope to buy my first house down there in about three years time. Love Dunedin.
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December 18, 2012 9:37am
Longknives

Seems Mr ‘Daylight’ appears at quite a few protests…..

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10834975
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December 18, 2012 9:39am
Pete George

Things are going well here (for me anyway), I love Dunedin too. Even been getting some god summer weather lately, with a good soaking rain yesterday that was needed.

I went to a speccial meeting at the Centre for Theology and Public Issues last night, reviewing their progress and looking ahead. CTPI has done a fantastic job of promoting public debate here over the last few years on a wide range of topical issues.

Looking forward to doing more in social media with them to help widen their coverage. Might even promote them here a bit more.

http://www.otago.ac.nz/ctpi
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December 18, 2012 9:45am
Pete George

Bugger again, missed a typo and no chance to edit. I didn’t mean to refer to ‘god weather’ and that comment had nothing to do with my references to theology.

BTW Carlos, house prices are moving up a bit here again but nothing drastic, and still a lot better than big city prices.
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December 18, 2012 9:47am
Longknives

“and still a lot better than big city prices.”

That’s because Dunedin is a cold old dump Pete.
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December 18, 2012 10:10am
Viking2

ah City of Scottish Dropouts.
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December 18, 2012 10:26am
Colville

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/8092875/Russian-fans-demand-no-black-or-gay-players

No blacks but not racist.?
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December 18, 2012 10:34am
krazykiwi

I just heard a radio news item about a teacher trying to get one of her students with gang links, to perform a “hit” on her principal, who she had issues with. She is allowed to keep on teaching. I cannot believe this.

This is the reason the teaching profession (incl so many capable professionals) is the subject of such scorn. The useless are protected, and the useful are tarnished. Victorian-era unions at work.
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December 18, 2012 10:48am
gopolks

The hypocrisy at “the standard” amazes me, for the last few days over the tragic event at Newtown, their posters failed to garner sympathy for the victims because the USA has their military in Iraq. (I dont see the connection myself) Yet they are giving thoughts and wishes to Fiji.

Its one thing to be left wing, but this anti USA bullshit the left in New Zealand has, drives me nuts.
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December 18, 2012 11:04am
Pete George

Longknives – I don’t see Dunedin as ‘a cold old dump’ at all. Sure it gets chilly at times and the weather can be very variable but that adds to the character. And cold winters mean accentuated seasonal changes which I really like. Spring is better appreciated if winter is a bit bleak.

The ‘old’ part is correct (in NZ terms) – much of the character of Dunedin is it’s old buildings. I’d far prefer Dunedin’s retained architectural heritage than the modern mishmash of downtown Auckland.

Viking2 – while a bit is made of Dunedin’s Scottish heritage it’s not a big factor here. Apart from a bit of bagpipes and whiskey there’s not much of Scotland here. It’s culturally very diverse.

Having said that I’m going to the Scotia restaurant on Saturday night, it’s an excellent place for food, and has a bigger range than haggis, bashed neeps & tatties and cullen skink. And they have a bar with bar menu upstairs.

You don’t have to be Scottish to enjoy whiskey, and Scotia’s the place to go if you like a wee dram, with about 300 to choose from.
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December 18, 2012 11:04am
Manolo

You don’t have to be Scottish to enjoy whiskey,….

I’m living proof of it. Single malt is bliss.
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December 18, 2012 11:27am
Colville

Single malt is indeed bliss..I just wish it didnt bite so hard in the mornings…
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December 18, 2012 11:32am
Scott Chris

Over the last week this is the ‘beat me’ stats:

Today 9
Monday 3
Sunday 3
Saturday 4
Friday 14
Thursday 0
Wednesday 10

Crikey Pete, that’s a lotta self abuse… Too much viagra maybe?
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December 18, 2012 11:37am
Mary Rose

You don’t have to be Scottish to enjoy whiskey,….

I thought whiskey with an e was Irish?
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December 18, 2012 11:37am
Monique Watson

Have you ever been told to “Zip It Petey”? 🙂

Some personal experience in the states:

http://nowoccupy.blogspot.com/2012/12/in-wake.html
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December 18, 2012 11:49am
Longknives

” much of the character of Dunedin is it’s old buildings.”

Like the rotten old dumps I used to flat in back in my Varsity days?
The only places with any ‘character’ were the Cook, The Ori’ and The Robbie (and I hear most the old pubs are gone now anyway?)
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December 18, 2012 12:05pm
Chthoniid

@Manolo

You don’t have to be Scottish to enjoy whiskey,….

I’m living proof of it. Single malt is bliss.

I think this is the most insightful thing I’ve read today. Well done.
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December 18, 2012 12:27pm
Pete George

Mary Rose – you could be right, shows you how Scottish I am.

Longknives – the Cook, the Ori and the Robbie are still there. The Bowling Green and Gardens are now otherwise occupied. Depends how far back you want to go, the European is long gone, as is the City and Excelsior and New Club, same for Sheraton/Shoreline, don’t know if the Empire is still going.

There’s been a number of other name changes and there’s more numbers and variety of bars now – a few in the Octagon where the nightlife seems to be centred.

But while you may have had trouble staying standing on your nights out there’s a lot of good old architecture still standing, including New Zealand’s most photographed building, the railway station. The old art deco bus station is now the Settlers museum, the Victorian prison is now a tourist attraction, although the future of the Law Courts is in doubt due to earthquake requirements.
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December 18, 2012 12:38pm
Viking2

while a bit is made of Dunedin’s Scottish heritage it’s not a big factor here. Apart from a bit of bagpipes and whiskey there’s not much of Scotland here. It’s culturally very diverse.

Just like the place they eminated from. No white men left in Edinburgh either.

Oh and so how do you explain your castle and your Scots accent? eh
Came from Blackpool Sir?
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December 18, 2012 12:43pm
Pete George

I’ve not been a whiskey/whisky drinker so any recommendations for a good single malt? There’s a good chance Scotia will have them.
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December 18, 2012 12:45pm
Pete George

Oh and so how do you explain your castle and your Scots accent? eh
Came from Blackpool Sir?

?? I don’t have a Scots accent, I’ve never been to Scotland (or any of the British Isles). I might have a bit of a Lowburnian twang, if there’s such a thing..
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December 18, 2012 12:51pm
Harriet

PG#

There is a scotch for sale here in Aus at Dan Murphy’s called Monkey Shoulder – it’s pretty good and at about $40 750ml – good value. Although I am told that spirits are still cheap in NZ. Cheers.
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December 18, 2012 1:04pm
iMP

Apparently we’ve run out of gorgeous young things in Christchurch?

http://conzervative.wordpress.com/2012/12/18/bright-young-things-drought-in-christchurch/
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December 18, 2012 1:20pm
Manolo

P.G, I prefer Speyside malts, so order a Macallan Oak Reserve or a Glenfiddich 18 y.o. and savour them
You will not regret it.
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December 18, 2012 1:34pm
Weihana

Manolo (8,459) Says:
December 18th, 2012 at 8:34 am

One of the two animals was acquitted. Mind boggling decision from the jury.

From stuff:

Some witnesses had earlier made statements to police saying both Waipuka and Robinson admitted kicking Mr Cottrell, but they backed away from those statements when the time came for them to give evidence in court.

Perhaps that is why.

The problem is with our law, not the jury. When someone intentionally commits an act of violence against another, and death results, it should be classified as murder. It shouldn’t matter whether the perpetrator was trying to kill or not and the hury shouldn’t have to concern themselves with trying to figure this out. As the law currently stands, it’s just too easy a defence for these scumbags. There has been no justice in this Cottrell case.

I disagree. The person who intentionally kills (or is extremely reckless) is more culpable than the person who does not. The two acts should be differentiated and that is the purpose of having the two classifications. However, I would agree that since it followed an act of violence then sentencing should be at the high end of the scale.
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December 18, 2012 1:54pm
Weihana

Sorry second part was in response to

Ashley Schaeffer (5) Says:
December 18th, 2012 at 8:59 am
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December 18, 2012 1:54pm
James Stephenson

I disagree. The person who intentionally kills (or is extremely reckless) is more culpable than the person who does not. The two acts should be differentiated and that is the purpose of having the two classifications.

It’s one of the things that the Yanks got right, to have degrees of Murder.
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December 18, 2012 2:29pm
marcw

I know this is not really relevant, but following on from the Cottrell jury decision, will we now see rapists being given a lesser conviction because the woman raped was wearing provocative clothing (nicely dressed and with makeup) and therefore could be said to be “asking for it?”

If a person is minding their own business and is assaulted on the street and which results in death – in my opinion it is murder, nothing less. This jury decision is madness, not justice. The man is still dead, and he would be alive if not for these PsOS. If you happen to have an inherited weakness, the assault actually should result in a higher condemnation and (hopefully) sentence, as the victim could not defend himself normally. In fact, it is just assaulting an elderly or a disabled person. There is a lot about this case which I find extremely troubling, and our Justice system has a lot to answer to. The feral underbelly appear to be gaining on the rest of society, and without any restraint from those we charge with our protection.
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December 18, 2012 2:34pm
Manolo

Supreme gullibility in HK: http://www.thestandard.com.hk/news_detail.asp?pp_cat=30&art_id=129248&sid=38463132&con_type=1
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December 18, 2012 2:51pm
kowtow

Mary Rose

Traditionally the Irish spell it with the e while the Scots don’t.

The word whiskey is gaelic, from “uisce beatha”,meaning water of life.

It seems monks called it that as a direct translation from the latin,aqua vitae.

All part of our rich western heritage. Cheers.
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December 18, 2012 3:26pm
Akaroa

PG at 1245.

Don’t look any further than either Laphroig, an Islay Malt. In Edinburgh a few years ago someone I care for bought me a Scottish sporran flask. You know. Its a round metal/silver flat container for – oddly enough (!) containing a goodly measure of heaven’s breath across one’s kilt.

So. Into a friendly hostelry en route to the castle to see the Edinburgh Tattoo we popped.

To mein host, “Tell me sir, what is the finest Scottish Whisky that I should pour into this recently acquired genuine Scottish sporran flask of mine, and of which I am so proud and plan to brandish before the covetous eyes of various larrikins of my acquaintance back home in God’s Own Country?

Mein host regarded me long and cool, and replied in a brooooad Heee-land brogue, ‘Whist, ye man, ’tis the Laphroig ye’re after’

And so saying he swiftly and expertly filled my brand new sporran flask with said heaven’s breath, spilling not a drop in the process.

And though my sporran flask has been filled many-a-time since that day, not a drop of any spirit other than Laphroig has ever entered its rotund shape.
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December 18, 2012 5:49pm
labrator

What on earth has happened to the edit button? I’ve seen other people mention its absence but is the absence intentional or other?
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December 18, 2012 5:55pm
mikenmild

DPF mentioned earlier that it is coming back.
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December 18, 2012 6:02pm
nasska

labrator

See DPF’s comment @ 8.26am today.
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December 18, 2012 6:04pm
nasska

Just in case!

Ref: http://imgur.com/gallery/wmmbO
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December 18, 2012 6:44pm
calendar girl

Thanks for that, Akaroa. A lovely story, delivered with the skill of a true raconteur.
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December 18, 2012 6:45pm
Manolo

Double Dipton keeps denying the undeniable: http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/123775/petrol-tax-for-roads-not-surplus-english
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December 18, 2012 6:47pm
nasska

On the first day of Christmas, my true love gave to me, a bottle of malt whisky…

On the fourth day of Christmas, my true love said to me, “Where the fuck have you been for the last 3 days?”
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December 18, 2012 8:00pm
Pauleastbay

A duck walks into a pub and orders a pint of beer and a ham sandwich.
The barman looks at him and says,
“Hang on! You’re a duck.”
“I see your eyes are working,” replies the duck.
“And you can talk!”
Exclaims the barman.
“I see your ears are working, too,”
Says the duck.
“Now if you don’t mind, can I have my beer and my sandwich please?”
“Certainly, sorry about that,”

Says the barman as he pulls the duck’s pint.
“It’s just we don’t get many ducks in this pub.. What are you doing round this way?”
“I’m working on the building site across the road,”
Explains the duck. “I’m a plasterer.”
The flabbergasted barman cannot believe the duck and wants to learn more, but takes the hint when the duck pulls out a newspaper from his bag and proceeds to read it. So, the duck reads his paper, drinks his beer, eats his sandwich, bids the barman good day and leaves. The same thing happens for two weeks.
Then one day the circus comes to town. The ringmaster comes into the pub for a pint and the barman says to him
“You’re with the circus, aren’t you? Well, I know this duck that could be just brilliant in your circus. He talks, drinks beer, eats sandwiches, reads the newspaper and everything!”
“Sounds marvelous,” says the ringmaster, handing over his business card.
“Get him to give me a call.”
So the next day when the duck comes into the pub the barman says,
“Hey Mr. Duck, I reckon I can line you up with a top job, paying really good money.”
“I’m always looking for the next job,” Says the duck.
“Where is it?”
“At the circus,” Says the barman.
“The circus?” Repeats the duck.
“That’s right,” Replies the barman.
“The circus?” The duck asks again, “with the big tent?”
“Yeah,” the barman replies.
“With all the animals who live in cages, and performers who live in caravans?” says the duck.
“Of course,” the barman replies.
“And the tent has canvas sides and a big canvas roof with a hole in the middle?” persists the duck.
“That’s right!” says the barman.
The duck shakes his head in amazement, and says
“What the hell would they want with a plasterer??!”
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December 18, 2012 8:08pm
Fletch

John Lott making some very good points for the argument that gun-free zones don’t work – they are chosen by criminals for just that reason; that they know no one will fight back. Gun-free zones are actually “helpless victim zones”.

http://youtu.be/Oms0lqQQoGY
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December 18, 2012 8:09pm
nasska

A young vampire bat came flapping in from the night,
covered in fresh blood, and perched himself on the roof
of the cave to get some sleep.

Before long, all the other bats smelled the blood and began
hassling him about where he got it. He was tired and needing
a rest, so he told them to please leave him alone. However,
it was clear that he wasn’t going to get any sleep until he
satisfied their curiosity.

“OK!” he said with exasperation, “follow me,” and he flew
out of the cave with hundreds of bats following close behind
him.

Down through the valley they went, across the river and into
the deep forest. Finally he slowed down and all the other
bats excitedly gathered around him.

“Do you see that tree over there?” he asked.

“Yes, yes, yes!” the bats all screamed in a frenzy.

“Good,” said the first bat, “Because I DIDN’T!”
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December 18, 2012 8:11pm
Pauleastbay

A blind guy on a bar stool shouts to the bartender, “Wanna hear a
blonde joke?”In a hushed voice, the guy next to him says, “Before you tell that joke, you should know something.”Our bartender IS blonde, the bouncer is blonde. I’m 6′ tall and 15 stone . The guy sitting next to me is 6’2″, weighs 16 stone he’s a rugby player. The fella to your right is 6’5” pushing 20 stone and he’s a wrestler. Each one of US is blonde. Think about it, Mister. Do you still wanna tell that joke?”The blind guy says, “Nah, not if I’m gonna have to explain it five times.”
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December 18, 2012 8:14pm
nasska

Things you can only say at Christmas

1: I prefer breasts to legs.
2: Tying the legs together keeps the inside moist.
3: Smother the butter all over the breasts.
4: If I don’t undo my trousers, I’ll burst!
5: I’ve never seen a better spread!
6: I fancy a little dark meat for a change.
7: Are you ready for seconds yet?
8: It’s a little dry, do you still want to eat it?
9: Just wait your turn, you’ll get some!
10: Don’t play with your meat!
11. Stuff it up between the legs as far as it will go.
12: Do you think you’ll be able to handle all these people at once?
13: I didn’t expect everyone to come at the same time!
14: You still have a little bit on your chin.
15: How long will it take after you put it in.
16: You’ll know it’s ready when it pops up
17: Just pull the end and wait for the bang.
18: That’s the biggest bird I’ve ever had!
19: I’ve been gobbling nuts all morning
20: Wow, I didn’t think I could handle all that and still want more.
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December 18, 2012 8:25pm
cha

RIP Daniel K. Inouye>.
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December 18, 2012 8:27pm
cha

Apparently the NRA release Freedom in Peril is genuine.

http://www.boingboing.net/images/NR-F8_PERILFINAL.pdf
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December 18, 2012 8:37pm
cha

Helpful, an 11 year old turns up at school with a handgun.

http://www.ksl.com/?sid=23430406&nid=148
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December 18, 2012 8:49pm
mikenmild

Good one Fletch – John Lott. Ha ha.
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December 18, 2012 9:18pm
mikenmild

Two senate elections coming up cha?
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December 18, 2012 9:21pm
Rodders

Mike, it appears most states allow the Governor to appoint someone to fill a vacancy without a special election-

http://www.ncsl.org/legislatures-elections/elections/vacancies-in-the-united-states-senate.aspx
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December 18, 2012 9:42pm
cha

Seems Inouye was quite a guy.

http://www.badassoftheweek.com/inouye.html
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December 18, 2012 10:01pm
Manolo

A Gallic saga: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/9750510/France-warms-to-Gerard-Depardieu-the-heroic-exile.html
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December 19, 2012 6:24am
Viking2

More blackmail.

Taranaki has been labelled the “waste dump of the country” over plans to truck oil and gas drilling waste from the East Coast to the region.

But Maori from both sides of the North Island are unhappy about the proposal by Tag Oil and Apache Corporation.

The companies’ resource consent application for exploration on the East Coast says waste will be trucked to consented facilities in Taranaki.

But cultural issues are being raised about dumping waste from one’s iwi rohe (territory) in another’s.

Taranaki iwi advocate Peter Moeahu said he did not want East Coast waste on “our rohe”.

“We will fight them on the beaches, we will fight them on the land, we will fight them anywhere we can to keep their crap out of our place.”

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/8097068/Iwi-riled-by-plan-to-dump-oil-waste
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December 19, 2012 6:36am
Viking2

MPs to receive end of year pay rise
7:47 PM Tuesday Dec 18, 2012

Email
Print

Bowen House, the Beehive and Parliament. Photo / Mark Mitchell
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Bowen House, the Beehive and Parliament. Photo / Mark Mitchell

While many people struggle financially at Christmas, politicians will be enjoying early holiday cheer with a pay rise.

The independent Remuneration Authority has again made an end of year recommendation for a pay increase for the MPs.

Prime Minister John Key said said today he was comfortable with politicians getting more in their pay packets this year.

Since 2005, backbencher salaries have risen by $24,000 to $141,000.

Over the same period the Prime Minister’s rose by $64,510 to $411,510.

Mr Key said the Remuneration Authority had recommended a “small increase”.

“It seems to be in line with the national average, maybe slightly lower, so I’ve written back saying in principle we’re comfortable with that,” he told 3 News.

The pay rise, to be confirmed on Thursday, would be back-paid – giving politicians a Christmas lump sum.
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That’s nice.for them. Have you had a pay rise this year?
They still haven’t got it have they.
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December 19, 2012 6:52am
Manolo

Yes, Viking2: the Stone Agers are looking to extract some “koha” from the oil companies, after which all issues will be happily resolved. Ah, the greed of the natives.
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December 19, 2012 6:55am
Manolo

Cynical is a very mild term for this vampire: http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/politics/8096709/Excise-hike-generates-11th-hour-surplus
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December 19, 2012 7:03am

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