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November 3, 2012 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 3 November 2012

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General Debate

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Luc Hansen

That’s better.

Do try to be original.

Poor old Tom, he just trawls the mega-conservative blogs and posts extracts as fact.

But you do good line in insults that are at least creative and entertaining.
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November 3, 2012 8:26pm
Viking2

Luc Hansen (4,202) Says:
November 3rd, 2012 at 7:32 pm

They have a five year term V2.

Let’s not get too excited too soon.

iTs the banks you dipwit. They are compromised to their eyeballs.
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November 3, 2012 8:35pm
Steve (North Shore)

Ban the Fireworks for personal sale I say. Too many stupid immature people.
Most celebrations are on the day/night, but here we have fuckheads lighting fireworks at 9am friday morning – they obviously were not at work.
These fuckwits, oh never mind
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November 3, 2012 8:45pm
Luc Hansen

V2

The banks are fine. The ECB is swapping their toxic debt for bonds, although they can’t say this explicitly because the Germans get upset. The have a strong view of economics as morality. Very Teutonic.
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November 3, 2012 9:09pm
Viking2

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/world/naked-flasher-ruins-wedding/story-fnd14032-1226508983224
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November 3, 2012 9:13pm
Scott Chris

Nah, tom hunter’s really Bob Jones.
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November 3, 2012 9:33pm
Pauleastbay

http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/arts/7903110/Exercise-sex-hibit-doesn-t-work-out

Titahi Bay resident Lea Thoms said she was horrified when she and three of her children, aged between 6 and 20 months, came across the exhibit yesterday.

I’m sure the 6 month old remarked about the size of the dildo to mum. Dear oh dear
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November 3, 2012 9:39pm
RightNow

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2227171/Screen-legend-Leonard-Rossiter-accused-performing-sex-act-BBC-staff-tried-rape-18-year-old-TV-extra.html

NOOO!!! Not Reginald Perrin…grot!

On the plus side there’s some great video clips at the bottom of the article.
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November 3, 2012 10:38pm
Manolo

He’s the greatest: http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/auckland/news/nbint/1902766883-obama-juggles-campaign-and-storm-relief
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November 4, 2012 8:06am
Manolo

Lemming-like: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/nov/03/obama-african-americans-paradox
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November 4, 2012 8:30am
Kea

Manolo, I always wonder why he is described as a “Black” President. One of his parents was white, he could equally be described as a “White” President. His links to America are through his white mother. Using the logic of his supporters, he is descendent from slave owners, not slaves.

But it is not that simple either!

His links to former slaves are from his white mothers side of the family.

“The president’s diverse roots are widely known to range from Kenya to Kansas, but researchers have found a new link.

“President Obama is the 11th great-grandson of John Punch, who was the first documented African to be enslaved for life in the American colonies,” says Joseph Shumway, a genealogist at Ancestry.com.

He says the president’s white mother is a direct descendant of the first known slave in the American colonies through a family by the name of Bunch.”

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505263_162-57482046/surprising-link-found-in-obamas-family-tree/
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November 4, 2012 9:05am
Viking2

The Paid Parental Leave and Employment Protection Act is disturbing legislation that requires an employer to keep their employee’s position open for a year and mandates that holiday pay accrues during their 12-month sabbatical.

Pregnant staff cannot be dismissed because they can no longer do their job; the employer must find them another role.

Paid Parental Leave costs $163 million a year. Labour MP Sue Moroney has a bill before Parliament to increase this to six months. Bill English plans to veto the bill on financial grounds.

Under Moroney’s law, taxpayers would pay every employed yet unworking mother $12,354 over six months, regardless of the parents’ finances. The mother’s firm would be forced to keep her job open, yet she is under no obligation to return permanently. Most don’t.

In submissions on the Bill, a number of government agencies favour spending this money.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10844909
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November 4, 2012 9:49am
Luc Hansen

Employers are still getting off lightly, V2. In other jurisdictions the employer pays the entitlement. Self interest is always a strong motivator, hence your opposition, I suspect, and delayed gratification is not a strong suit of your political ilk, but the measure would, in the long term, lead to a happier, healthier, wealthier society.

Of course, our deeply Christian Minister of Finance won’t hear of it!
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November 4, 2012 10:17am
mikenmild

V2
We are faced with a fair number of social programmes that will be difficult to sustain over the medium to long term. We desperately need wide agreement on long term policies for income, welfare, health and education. Superannuation is already off the table, despite the easy and gradual changes that could be made but cannot be mentioned within the political lifetime of the all-highest.
It’s long since overdue for serious consideration of what we pay for collectively and what we leave to the individual. Adding new entitlements ad hoc is ridiculous, even when the case for them is as blindingly obvious as the case for better paid parental leave.
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November 4, 2012 10:21am
Viking2

Bullshit to both of you.
Feed your own urchins.

Communism couldn’t do everything for everybody and its about time you fucking learnt that.
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November 4, 2012 10:24am
Luc Hansen

A nicely considered and intellectually rigorous response, V2.

You have obviously been paying attention to Whale Oil!
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November 4, 2012 10:28am
Luc Hansen

Talking about Whale Oil, isn’t there something not-so-faintly oxymoronic about the association of Whale Oil with truth?
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November 4, 2012 10:32am
mikenmild

Oh V2, why won’t you play nicely? I promise to be nice. I’m sure Luc will behave too.
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November 4, 2012 10:33am
Harriet

Luc#

Paid parental leave is complicated in australia.

Not all mothers are treated the same as highly paid women have to take a pay cut if they take time off work. Low paid mothers can be paid more.

Meanwhile ‘stay at home mothers’ arn’t paid anything even though child professionals say it is better for kids that their mothers are ‘stay at home mums’. Not all stay at home mothers have husbands on ‘large incomes’, lots are ‘battlers’.

If a women takes PPL with their first child and takes ‘extended leave'[not returning to work till the baby is say 2] and then unintentionly falls pregnant a second time, she too does not get PPL.

In other words, if PPL was applied fairly to every woman, then it would cost a lot more.
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November 4, 2012 10:35am
mikenmild

That’s quite true Harriet. As with every other form of social assistance, there will be anomalies. I’d be quite in favour of extending paid parental leave as currently proposed, should compensating savings be found elsewhere.
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November 4, 2012 10:41am
Harriet

Milky#

“…Superannuation is already off the table, despite the easy and gradual changes that could be made but cannot be mentioned within the political lifetime of the all-highest…”

I live in Aus and up till a week ago, I too thought that ‘super’ was a very good way of saving. It still is, but I have since found out it has quite serious flaws.

The ‘red zone’ is 5 yrs either side of retirement, when if there is a large market ‘correction’ you are pretty much wiped out. This point is not often stressed by the fund managers as ‘super’ in Aus is a trillion dollar industry. And the fees on a trillion dollars gets those in the ‘industry’ a lot of flash cars and houses. Tarts too.

Most people don’t understand the ‘in’s and out’s of super regarding fees and types of investments. Since the gfc, returns have been low each year and in lots of cases even negative returns, however the fees remain the same! This is due to the fact that your money is deposited with a fund[bank etc] who have a ‘fee structure’ for ‘managing’ your money, but they then foward your money to money ‘managers’ who ‘invest’ your money into a particular fund, and they too have a fee structure. Take away the excess fees over a lifetime and people would have a resonable sized account.

The size of funds under management is good for the ASX up to a point – it puts a ‘floor price’ under the sharemarket but can also make shares ‘overpriced’, so the % allocation of super funds in Australia allowed to be invested overseas has now been increased. This of course carrys extra ‘fees’.

All of this is due to the government ’rounding up’ 12% of ALL INCOME EACH AND EVERY WEEK FROM ALL AUSTRALIANS and then getting EVERYONE to invest it in the ONE PLACE.

In otherwords, no one in the industry has to ‘perform’ to get paid lots. Nor are they obligated to maintain your ‘capital’ balance that is invested with them.
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November 4, 2012 11:06am
Harriet

Milky#

“…I’d be quite in favour of extending paid parental leave as currently proposed, should compensating savings be found elsewhere….”

Taxes are not for the benefit of those who are taxed!

Other than the cost of policing and navy etc it is nothing more than wealth redistribution.

Years ago, people paid basic taxes for policing etc and got a pension when they retired for being ‘productive citizens’ and the fact that they would no longer be ‘able-bodied’ enough to earn a weekly wage to feed and cloth themselves. It was a good system: A reward system.

Now the system is one of –

you need all the money in your early years to pay for ‘any education the individual chooses’, ‘home ownership’ and the ‘welfare of your kids’ and this is done by the government making ‘savings’ from elsewhere: your retirement pension.It is a system of entitlement.
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November 4, 2012 11:29am
Luc Hansen

The true entitlement rorters are those who garner the majority of a country’s wealth and essentially put it in their back pockets.

In a civil society, what Harriet sees as evil – taxation according to ability to pay – is in fact an indicator of a well functioning system that humans con thrive in.

And the fact that thousands of years of past economic outcomes solidly demonstrate that Harriet’s way is the way to the triumph of greed and conflict is blithely brushed aside.
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November 4, 2012 11:41am
Harriet

Luc#

“….And the fact that thousands of years of past economic outcomes solidly demonstrate that Harriet’s way is the way to the triumph of greed and conflict is blithely brushed aside…”

Idiot.

We are by-and-far richer that previous generations.

When computers were invented they were only in the realms of big business and the wealthy, but when industry[the allocation of capital and labour] got hold of them they became nessesities in most homes – a basic desktop is about $400.00.

Bill Gates was a student from the suburbs working in the family garage. A few million Chinese are now not in poverty because they make computer componants.

The Japanese just back in the 70’s started making componants for transistor radios. Now look at their country and it’s wealth and technology.

‘Triumph of greed’ is it Luc?
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November 4, 2012 12:04pm

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