General Debate 15 August 2012

Email
Facebook
Twitter
Comment44

Uncategorized
General Debate

Comments (44)

Login to comment or vote

Pete George

The MMP Review made very poor arguments for a 4% threshold, and there’s a strong case for a 3% threshold.

Apart from being more representative small parties add to stability of government.

Voters clearly don’t want single party government, so multiple small parties give the large parties multiple options, spreading power more evenly.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:06am
wreck1080

Whats going on in the UK?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2188075/Jobless-mother-seven-insists-family-deserve-1-25MILLION-taxpayer-funded-home-trashed.html

Wow! I wonder if this happens here to any degree? Mind you, the UK are a lot richer than us (even with the recession).
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:46am
Carlos

@ Wreck1080

The British have probably become the most PC-brainwashed nation on Earth. They have become masochists and are told to enjoy it to make up for their past centuries of conquest.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 9:01am
MikeG

Borrowing to build roads? Where’s the outcry about that DPF?

“They’ve basically drained the bank account – and now they want access to the credit card.” Phil Twyford
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 9:08am
Puzzled in Ekatahuna

Wilson, 65, is set to be freed in two weeks’ time after being jailed for 21 years in March 1996. He was convicted on 22 sex charges against women and children between 1971 and 1994.

OK, I’ll set myself up for being told I’m bloody stupid – obviously missed something important.
But why is Wilson not kept in jail until March 2017?
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 9:09am
Brian Smaller

@wreck – It is the duty of kaffirs to pay for the support of true believers. Just look at it as a form of jizya.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 9:37am
Longknives

That’s strange- I don’t remember Tariana Turia being so concerned when she was dropping names and pulling strings to get her own ‘Whanau’ released from Prison a few years ago….

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10826833
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 9:39am
David Garrett

Puzzled In Eka: Because of the Orwellian doublespeak – “no sentence means what it says” – created by the Sentencing Act 2002. Graeme E and others will fill in the fine detail, but basically “ten years” as given by the Judge actually means “even if the Parole Board hasn’t already let you out long before, you won’t be doing any longer than seven”.

Three strikes has changed that. A second strike sentence of three years now MEANS three years, and a third strike sentence of 14 years means 14 years.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 9:45am
dime

puzzled – i think they let you out early so they can supervise you or some such.

eg 5 year sentence, serve 3 and parole for 2.

otherwise you serve your 5 and then youre on your own.

i think
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 9:56am
kowtow

wreck1080

A dangerous combination of welfarism ,human rights and immigration.

Some day the English people will have had enough and it will get very ugly.

Kinda like Serbia. The west, and the media stoke this, are very anti Serb. Serbs have seen Muslim invasion,conversion and loss of territory over hundreds of years.

There’s a reason why the term “Balkanisation” is getting more usage these days. And it’s coming to a neighbourhood near you soon. Already in Sydney and Melbourne.

In the meantime it’s important to encourage “inclusiveness”,respect human rights,and celebrate diversity and multiculturalism. If you don’t you might just be breaking the law.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 10:03am
iMP

Agreed. The “diversity” culture is now having serious political and social implications especially in condensed urban centres, but its more about unemployment and large youth populations than it is race or culture. However, Australia and Holland have both moved to reiterate “Dutchness” and “Aussie-ness” and the French have moved against creeping Muslim-ism. The Germans will move against Turkishness. This will be the big political issue of the next generation. “Diversity” in a recession just gets ugly (Chinese were treated terribly in NZ., even in the gold rush). They still are.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 10:24am
kowtow

imp

Its more than unemployment and youth. It’s about mass ,uncontrolled immigration. It’s also about the type of immigrant ,ones’ who won’t ever integrate.
In a legal and secular environment where “equality” and human rights are placed centre stage then no appeal to national or nationalist identity will ever be successful.
The Germans kept the Turks legally as guests for 40 years but have now dropped that distinction.There will be no official “move” against Turkishness. Turks and other Muslim immigrants will continue to undermine the notion of “heimat.”

Talking of Turks ,now that the little prick Sarkozy is gone ,one of Turkey’s main obstacles to EU membership is gone. The Brits are mad keen on it,God knows why, and Merkels looking like she’ll be gone next year too.If Turkey ever gets in the European collapse will be complete. The Turks have been at this for one thousand years.

With any luck theEuro crisis will forestall any EU enlargement.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 10:51am
slijmbal

I’m getting stories from blighty of a feeling of invasion. If it’s not jumping all the various waiting lists on entering the country with no money, home, job etc , forced acceptance of different cultures (or else), it’s the imported organised crime and corruption.

Many of the relatives still live in Liverpool, which always was crime ridden and violent but apparently the eastern european gangs have reached new highs in violence, for instance.

I could see a backlash.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:02am
Manolo

A valid question: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/314016/giuliani-wonders-whether-biden-has-mental-capacity-presidency-robert-costa
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:22am
kowtow

Talking of countries that have undergone remarkable change under enlightened ,even saintly leaders and St Nelson Mandela comes immediately to mind, I’m not at all surprised that the international media give no prominence to bad news from the republic. After all it was only under whitey that evil predominated.

Trubl’atmill.
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/africa/2012/08/2012814183824972874.html

And related is continuing high levels of extreme violence. But of course it’s a natural reaction to apartheid…so it’s still whitey’s fault.
http://blogs.aljazeera.com/blog/africa/mob-justice-south-africa
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:23am
James Stephenson

The Brits are mad keen on it,God knows why

Two reasons:

1) Enlarging the EU in this way strengthens the not-aiming for Federalisation side of that argument
2) It solves the Cyprus (former Brit-administered territory therefore a pet cause) problem, by forcing Turkey to relinquish its claims.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:31am
James Stephenson

While we’re on the subject, it’ll be interesting to see what effect the Olympics will have. All of Britain have just cheered themselves stupid watching a Somali-born bloke called Mohammed win two gold medals…
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:35am
Graeme Edgeler

Puzzled In Eka: Because of the Orwellian doublespeak – “no sentence means what it says” – created by the Sentencing Act 2002. Graeme E and others will fill in the fine detail, but basically “ten years” as given by the Judge actually means “even if the Parole Board hasn’t already let you out long before, you won’t be doing any longer than seven”.

Nothing to do with the Sentencing Act 2002. He was sentenced in 1996, the Sentencing Act wasn’t then in force. And nothing to do with the Parole Act 2002 either.

Had Wilson been sentenced to a determinate sentence under the current law provided in the Sentencing Act 2002 he could have been required by the Parole Board to serve the whole thing.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:42am
Keeping Stock

@ James – I can’t help but wonder if anyone every called the original prophet Mohammed “Mo” 😛
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:48am
Lance

Priceless.. raving Hungarian anti-Semite far right politician discovers he’s Jewish

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10827074
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 11:57am
James Stephenson

@KS – I was disappointed when I discovered more about Farah’s background. It’s one thing being a Somali-born muslim, quite another to find he’s a bloody Arsenal fan.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 12:04pm
David Garrett

Graeme E: I am going to stop having a go at these ones! You are quite right of course…Anything pre 3S I think I will leave to you.

Post 3S however, a Rotorua armed robber, Tama Turei Brown, has just received his final warning (i.e. convicted of his second strike offence) which I think makes him number eight of the second strikers. Judge Phil Cooper said when giving the mandatory final warning:

” I can’t emphasise enough the seriousness of the situation you are in if you commit a further serious violent offence”, and told him if he was convicted again for a serious violent offence he will serve the maximum sentence.

We will have our first third striker within a year or two…eight recidivist violent offenders are now serving strike 2 with no parole. No much for the claim that it would be “years” before the legislation took effect.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 12:04pm
Brian Smaller

@Lance – self-hating Jews are hardly new.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 12:08pm
Reid

Yet more evidence to the feeble-minded that no, Syria is NOT a spontaneous uprising of oppressed peoples but is rather and always has been, merely yet another western-backed bloody revolution using Al-Qa’ida forces. And given that Al-Qa’ida is supposed to be public enemy No. 1 to all the western good guys who were unfairly attacked by it over ten years ago, you’d think that even the feeble-minded ones would pause to think, WTF is going on? But no, the feeble-minded ones don’t even blink as their cognitive dissonance continues to lead them down the totally illogical path one has to follow if one imagines that Syria really is about democracy and freedom for the Syrian people. Total morons aren’t they, these feeble-minded fools.
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/NH14Ak01.html
http://sjlendman.blogspot.co.nz/

And for the feeble-minded who can’t add 2 + 2, this is why they’re doing what they’re doing in Syria:
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/davidblair/100176498/israel-hints-that-it-has-already-decided-to-bomb-iran/

And this is the enabler for it all, a phenomena being bought about by all the feeble-minded failing to see the utterly obvious despite it being part of their daily lives within the country they live in:
http://www.thiscantbehappening.net/node/1278
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 12:11pm
Pete George

David Shearer was on frontline this morning, less hesitancy, more PR puffery. Shearer trying to pull the wool.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 12:12pm
Yvette

Australia’s highest court has upheld a new government law on mandatory packaging for cigarettes that removes brand colours and logos from packaging.
– http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19264245

As 4 billion of Australia’s cigarettes are to be made each year in Imperial Tobacco’s factory, Petone, will New Zealand supply those cigarettes in bulk or packets that comply with both New Zealand and Australian law when the two are not the same?
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 4:58pm
Reid

Yvette, you may or may not know that the whole Madison Avenue industry (both PR and advertising) was started by Freud’s nephew.

He worked on various campaigns. One of them for tobacco companies who wanted to start women smoking. He started women smoking (who didn’t used to pre WWI – it was taboo) by such tricks organising a suffragette march in NYC then getting journo’s to take pictures of them smoking as they marched and arranging for headlines such as “Suffragettes smoke for freedom.” As you’ll appreciate there’s a great deal of subconscious emotive linkage going on there, with the particular product in question.

And that is how advertising works. Our consumer society today is driven by subconscious processes initiated by advertising linking irrelevant products to a positive emotion. The net result of doing this for years and years combined with the actual physical performance of the product(s) themselves, together builds a “brand.”

Why for example do petrol companies sell their product using concepts of convenience, travel (freedom and meeting up with loved ones) and no-brainer derivatives such as engine performance, rather than say, how chemically efficacious their particular compound is? (The latter of which is clearly the most logical but it doesn’t appeal of course to the emotions, which is where advertising aims.)

This destroys all of that. And it will be fascinating to see what happens over time to sales. Sadly, they will be closely guarded commercial secrets, but this development is the best opportunity in the world to understand precisely what value advertising versus performance, adds to product sales. The collective sales data on how the brands fare over the past 10 years and the next 10 years would be worth billions to anyone wishing to understand that question, and that’s every single corporation in business today.

So even if they can’t sell tobacco, they’ll be in business for a very long time to come, I predict.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 5:54pm
Fletch

The AUSA (who recently tried to disaffiliate a pro-life campus group in Auckland), possibly to be investigated for serious fraud charges by the SFO.

MEDIA RELEASE — FOR IMMEDIATE USE
10am — 15.8.12

Students ask SFO to investigate AUSA

This morning three Auckland University students laid a complaint with the Serious Fraud Office concerning transactions made between their student union, the Auckland University Students’ Association, and its related entities.

AUSA is an organisation of 16,000 student members.

The students have reason to believe that over $600,000 of related party transactions made by AUSA to a related business was improperly accounted for by that business or duly authorised by the executive of AUSA.

The students also believe the loans have been unlawfully capitalised by the related business in 2011.

The students claim that these transactions bring the solvency of AUSA into question and jeopardise AUSA’s ability to provide services to students. Assets and services at risk include 95bfm radio station, Shadows bar, Craccum magazine, funding for clubs, welfare services, student events and advocacy.

The students urge the SFO to investigate this and any other instances of improper transactions within AUSA and its related entities as a matter of priority and public interest.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/AK1208/S00335/students-ask-sfo-to-investigate-ausa.htm
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 6:15pm
Reid

Economist Nouriel Roubini says that he believes that the coming crisis will be even worse than 2008….

“Worse because like 2008 you will have an economic and financial crisis but unlike 2008, you are running out of policy bullets. In 2008, you could cut rates; do QE1, QE2; you could do fiscal stimulus; you could backstop/ringfence/guarantee banks and everybody else. Today, more QEs are becoming less and less effective because the problems are of solvency not liquidity. Fiscal deficits are already so large and you cannot bail out the banks because 1) there is a political opposition to it; and 2) governments are near-insolvent – they cannot bailout themselves let alone their banks. The problem is that we are running out of policy rabbits to pull out of the hat!“

The truth is that a massive worldwide financial collapse is coming. It is inevitable, and it is going to be extremely painful.

The AUSA (who recently tried to disaffiliate a pro-life campus group in Auckland)

Really. I wonder if this is because young people who bother to get involved with student politics are predominantly lefties and since they’re young, their lefty self-righteous I’m the only one who cares arrogance is worn on their sleeves.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 6:15pm
Andrei

Yevette – this is Government getting way too big for its boots and a prototype for controlling everything we eat and drink. they are already starting down this track with fast food.

In fact any successful business model will be targets for these repentant people.

Perhaps it is a good thing that Western civilization is committing suicide
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 6:19pm
kowtow

Andrei/yvette

This is very much the “we know best and will legislate you to utopia”

Watch out,fizzy drinks,donuts,fast foods etc etc booze is already in the gun.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 6:24pm
Yvette

I am not concerned so much with smoking itself but rather the irony of Government policy and to some extent the obvious questions journalists never ask.

Like how can New Zealand be smokefree by 2020 [2025, whenever] because tobacco products kill so many New Zealanders, but manufacture cigarettes for Australia.

How will giant tobacco corporations hammer us for plain packets when we need only say, as a manufacturer, we are complying with the Australian market.

How will the TPP {Pacific Trade Deal] – being negotiated so secretly – effect both Australia’s just adopted position and New Zealand’s proposed same position, if international corporations can sue member Governments who disadvantage their markets and brands?
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 7:01pm
Andrei

Yvette – all these anti smoking measures are achieving is to create a black market for tobacco.

These people are truly dumb or perhaps the Honourable (ahem) Tariana Turia is seeking to create new opportunities for the gangs – who knows
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 7:35pm
Viking2

SHOULD I BE ON THE ‘NET?

Why should I be on the Internet?

Watch this hilarious public service announcement about the Internet circa 1995.
http://video.couriermail.com.au/2267416025/Why-should-I-be-on-the-Internet
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 7:42pm
nasska

There is presently a black market for tobacco in NZ. Anyone with the right connections can buy “Chop Chop” which is tobacco grown illegally which obviously doesn’t attract taxes nor duty. It’s cheaper by far & I’ve been told that cultivating it is as lucrative as growing marijuana.

Tell me that gangs aren’t involved now & I’ve got you a real good deal on a bridge.
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 7:51pm
nasska

The shipwrecked mariner had spent several years on a
deserted island. Then one morning he was thrilled to see
a ship offshore and a smaller vessel pulling out toward him.

When the boat grounded on the beach, the officer in charge
handed the marooned sailor a bundle of newspapers and told
him, “The captain said to read through these and let us know
if you still want to be rescued.”
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:01pm
Steve (North Shore)

nasska@ 8.01pm
‘The shipwrecked mariner’
Who the hell is gonna rescue the Labour Party, or do they want to be rescued?
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:21pm
Viking2

Try this for excitement

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqbvJ-mVOhQ
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:23pm
Viking2

Description: cid:D46220CA92B0450E9AD9E698FB2F8745@RowbottomPC

A man was riding a bus, minding his own business, when the gorgeous woman next to him started

to breastfeed her baby.

The baby wouldn’t take it, so she said,

“Come on,
eat it all up or … I’ll have

to give it to this nice man here.”

Five minutes later, the baby was still not feeding,
so she said,

“Come on, honey.

Take it or I’ll give it to this nice
man here.”

A few minutes later, the anxious man

blurted out,

“Come on, kid.

Make up your mind!
I was supposed to get off four stops ago!”
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:24pm
nasska

Steve

Just leave the Labour Party to that nice Mr Shearer….he’s doing a great job. 🙂

#######

There were these two 95 year old men sitting at the senior
center one day when the one states,
“I have to get right home!”

“What’s your hurry?” asks the other.

“Me and the wife are having sex again today”.

“Again? How often do you have sex?”

“Every day! I don’t have time to talk but I’ll tell you what the
secret is…Pumpernickel Bread”. And he scurried off.

As the other old guy was walking home, he passed a
bakery and wandered in. “Do you have any Pumpernickel
Bread?” he asked the lady behind the counter.

“Yes, we have 3 shelves of Pumpernickel Bread”.

“I’ll take it all.” the old man blurts out.

The lady was surprised and says “All of it! It’ll get hard”

The old man replies “WHY DOES EVERYONE KNOW
ABOUT THIS BUT ME?”
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:31pm
kowtow

Another joke.

Sydney police say shootings not related to religion or politics.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/shootings-unrelated-to-religion-or-politics-police-20120815-247pk.html#ixzz23a1LKOGU
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 15, 2012 8:36pm
Manolo

Some koha, please.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/hutt-valley/7484471/Thieves-target-Kathmandu-stores
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 16, 2012 12:37am
Manolo

Corrupt to the core: http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/314025/how-did-harry-reid-get-rich-betsy-woodruff
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 16, 2012 2:26am
Manolo

This will change the world. The hopeless Turia shows her priorities.
http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8516675/aussie-govt-wins-tobacco-plain-packaging
0 0
Log in to Reply
Report
August 16, 2012 2:48am

Add a Comment Cancel reply

Login to comment or vote

« A Communications Tribunal for the Internet?

Listener on DPF »

Donations

You can now donate to Kiwiblog

Exclusive content from DPF on Patreon

Become a Patron!

Never miss a post

Email Address

Join 37.4K other subscribers

Highlights

Health Target 5 – elective treatments
Health Target 4 – Specialist appointments
Health Target 3 – Emergency Dept Waiting Times
Health Target 2 – Immunisations

Links

Justice in Brazil
No Right Turn
The Presidential Bicameral Adjournment Clause Is Almost An American Equivalent to Prorogation
Utopia
"Seymour is only doing openly what M?ori nationalists and their Pakeha allies have been doing, quietly for the past 50 years."
Not PC
This Weeks Email To Prime Minister Luxon.
No Minister
Daily review 22/11/2024
The Standard
More young offenders will get boot camp, bus drivers will get some protection – and there’s relief for southern farmers
Point of Order
Sowell says
Hompaddock
New Zealand government urged to back ICC arrest warrants for Israeli leaders without equivocation
The Daily Blog
The transgender agenda sunk Kamala
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
SETTING THE RECORD STRAIGHT
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
What does “reciprocity” mean in New Zealand laws?
Croaking Cassandra
A Day of Reckoning
NZCPR
Media Link: “A View from Afar” on the US elections.
Kiwipolitico
This will not end well
Offsetting Behaviour
Top 14 Predictions for Round 10
Stats Chat
Tory Whanau may have to sell Wellington mayoralty to make ends meet
The Civilian
The Accidental Engagement
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz

editor@kiwiblog.co.nz

PO Box 12270, Thorndon, Wellington 6144

Facebook
Twitter
FourSquare
Instagram
LinkedIn
Google+

Archives
Disclosure Statement
Editorial Policy
Privacy Policy
Complaints Policy
Comments Policy

Design by cre8d