General Debate 4 June 2012

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Pete George

A campaign has been running to try and save TVNZ 7. There have been public meeetings around the country, there is one in Dunedin this Thursday night. I’ll have a chance to speak at that.

Any ideas on TVNZ 7 and public broadcasting? For or against? Saveable or not? Innovate ideas for public broadcasting? Any worthwhile comments here will be added to the meeting mix.
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June 4, 2012 8:02am
Chuck Bird

There needs to be a review of the double jeopardy laws.

Not guilty again
For five years he and his close-knit family lived a nightmare. George Gwaze, accused of murdering and violating his own adopted daughter.
Acquitted at his first trial the Crown had another go. But expert after expert from overseas came forth saying that her death was related to overwhelming infection alongside her HIV.
Local doctors got it wrong they said. And the DNA found on underwear&nothing more than we would see in our own laundry baskets. It’s a case that should concern us all.
Watch the full story on the case against George Gwaze.

http://tvnz.co.nz/sunday-news/coming-up-4905349
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June 4, 2012 8:20am
Keeping Stock

So much for the Greens being above personality politics. It’s all becoming clearer; Russel Norman is the statesman-like good cop, and Metiria Turei is the attack-dog bad cop. So much for them being the party of principle. They just need to remenber that what goes around comes around…

http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2012/06/we-thought-they-were-above-that.html
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June 4, 2012 8:21am
hj

Cycling infrastructure in the netherlands:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOR6zm_Yziw
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June 4, 2012 8:25am
philu

oh do unpurse yr lips there..k.s..

..it’s called politics…

..and the attacks are about policies…and eyewatering-hypocrisy..

..and given the untrammeled abuse/sneers the greens have worn over the years..(from you too..?..)

..yr ‘sniff’…is only worthy of a snot-wipe…

..eh..?

..phillip ure@whoar.co.nz
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June 4, 2012 8:30am
mister nui

Sick to the stomach that the horrible prick Cullen has been knighted.

This is the guy who went and emptied the cupboard on frivolous shit and then gloated about it, so poor kiwis have had to do it even tougher than they possibly should have.

The prick should be in a cell keeping Bubba warm.
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June 4, 2012 8:34am
bhudson

KS,

I think Metiria is going to hold back their attempt to woo more of the centre vote. As you suggested yesterday, this could lead to a stand off with Russel. I can’t see them turning to one of the new MPs if Metiria were to be rolled though – that doesn’t leave any real choice for them.

On reflection of their list though, I think Russel will be hard pressed to shift them dramatically to the centre (which is what would be needed.). I think this [his] will turn out to be a lot of rhetoric with no substance, which people will see through (a lot like the ‘green jobs’ plank in their election campaign.)

A minor resurgence of Labour under Shearer or Cunnliffe would be a good thing to show the Greens just where their 2011 support actually came from.
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June 4, 2012 8:34am
hj

Keeping Stock:
“Russel Norman is the statesman-like good cop, and Metiria Turei is the attack-dog bad cop.”
………..
I think the Greens are factionalised. Meteria wanted the foreshore and seabed to be an election issue (for instance, whereas it wisely wasn’t) and you have Claire Browning blogging on the values party and talking about the Club of Rome. I don’t think “Club of Rome” thinking sits well with incentivising unsupported birth as advocated by Meteria etc. Also people who identify as “green” tend to be peak-oilers, inclined to the view that population growth is linked to energy and over population equals hardship for most people.
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June 4, 2012 8:37am
Pete George

Turei also had some inaccuaricies in her speech.

We must work to devise a cross party consensus to raise our children out of poverty – in a similar way we all reached an accord over superannuation.”

There’s a distinct lack of action on Super. Metiria: Cross-party poverty?

And on education:

“I’m amazed that the Prime Minister could be so blatant in saying that his pathway out of poverty was education and then so clearly stripping away that pathway today.

Turei was complaining about just one aspect of funding. But as reported in the ODT today – University funding up 13% (over three years).
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June 4, 2012 8:38am
mikenmild

Congratulations to Sir John Kirwan – a very well deserved honour.
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June 4, 2012 8:43am
Nick K

Turei inaccurate? Par for the course with the Watermelons.

Sir Michael Cullen!! What next? Sir David Bain?
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June 4, 2012 8:45am
db..

Pete, TVNZ 7 died because of program choice decisions.

Consider the possibility of recycling the discards from the $Sky library.
Although hugely exposed these dropped out items must still attract the viewers who only watch free to air.

Certainly this smaller group of potential viewers is larger than the present TVNZ 7 fans.

db.
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June 4, 2012 8:45am
hj

Funding shortfall: shocking response from Gerry Brownlie
http://www.greens.org.nz/oralquestions/julie-anne-genter-minister-transport-governments-planned-transport-expenditure
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June 4, 2012 8:49am
Monique Watson

Pete you’re like the Clark Kent of bloggers. A mild, bald Clark Kent – I chuckled to myself after The Standard yesterday. 😉

Back to Superannuation, I’m not sure I’ve seen any fresh ideas out there lately:

http://nowoccupy.blogspot.com/2012/06/superannuation-timebomb.html
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June 4, 2012 8:49am
bhudson

PG,

I saw that yesterday. Her ‘living wage’ solution would do nothing more than put some money in the pockets of some parents for them to make their own decisions on what to do with it (which wouldn’t guarantee that children went to school with full lunch boxes.)

It would also led to higher unemployment due to the increased wage bills for businesses. This, in turn, would mean the ‘living wage’ would actually affect a smaller group than they target it at today. Not to mention the increase in the welfare bill.

Less positive impact, for more cost. I think she has the idea of ‘cost-benefit’ ratios completely messed up.

She is a “danger Will Robinson”. As are those who think like her in the Greens, Labour and Mana.
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June 4, 2012 8:50am
JeffW

Agree Mister Nui – Cullen should be in prison for what he has done to the NZ taxpayer.
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June 4, 2012 8:54am
Other_Andy

Twilight of the West

developed world is all playing the same recessional.

By Mark Steyn

The unsustainable “bubble” is not student debt or subprime mortgages or anything else. The bubble is us, and the assumptions of entitlement.
Too many citizens of advanced Western democracies live a life they have not earned, and are not willing to earn. Indeed, much of our present fiscal woe derives from two phases of human existence that are entirely the invention of the modern world.
Once upon a time, you were a kid till you were 13 or so; then you worked; then you died.
That bit between childhood and death has been chewed away at both ends.
We invented something called “adolescence” that now extends not merely through the teenage years but through a desultory half decade of Whatever Studies at Complacency U up till you’re 26 and no longer eligible for coverage on your parents’ health-insurance policy.
At the other end of the spectrum, we introduced something called “retirement” that, in the space of two generations, has led to the presumption that able-bodied citizens are entitled to spend the last couple of decades, or one-third of their adult lives, as a long holiday weekend.
The bit in between adolescence and retirement is your working life, and it’s been getting shorter and shorter. Which is unfortunate, as it has to pay for everything else. This structural deformity in the life cycle of Western man is at the root of most of our problems.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/301585/twilight-west-mark-steyn
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June 4, 2012 8:54am
BillODrees

Sick to the stomach that Michael Cullen accepted a silly knighthood. A man, with his sense of history and with a great reputation for both his intellectual ability and wit, should not have let his name be sullied by a tacky title. Embarassing.
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June 4, 2012 8:54am
TimG_Oz

There’s a new movie – feature documentary just released in the US: “UN Me”. It’s been made in the style of Michael Moore, but it looks at the inner workings of the UN. Or rather, the inner not-workings.

YouTube links to the trailers here

http://timgoz.blogspot.com.au/2012/06/documentary-coming-soon-un-me.html

Remember this is where Helen Clark works now.
In Australia, there are completely leftist movie reviewers on the ABC (David Stratton and Margaret Poeranz). They called Fahrenheit 911 the best and most important film of the year. They will probably want to get this one banned.

It kinda reminds me of The Dictator, only that it’s not fiction… I review SBC here:

http://timgoz.blogspot.com.au/2012/06/dictator.html
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June 4, 2012 8:55am
Keeping Stock

Who is going to be the first person to notice the irony of Michael Cullen accepting one of the honours he voted to abolish?
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June 4, 2012 8:55am
Manolo

The shameless liar: http://www.weeklystandard.com/articles/barack-pinocchio-obama_646431.html
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June 4, 2012 8:57am
mikenmild

When did Cullen vote to abolish honours?
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June 4, 2012 8:59am
Manolo

Sir Michael Cullen??
Does anyone need further proof of the “arrangements” between Labour and Labour Lite (aka National Party)?
The correct reward for squandering the NZ economy. Key and his weak government should be ashamed, very ashamed.
Sickening!
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June 4, 2012 9:01am
mikenmild

At least some MPs are looking at significant changes to combat alcohol harm:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/7039241/More-MPs-piping-up-over-liquor-reforms
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June 4, 2012 9:06am
Leaping Jimmy

Any ideas on TVNZ 7 and public broadcasting?

Pete personally I would suggest that the issue has to be decided on principle not on whether or not TVNZ 7 is any good or not. I suspect many people will subconsciously base their opinions on their answer to the latter not the former perspective, unless someone points out to them the differences on the two approaches.
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June 4, 2012 9:09am
Viking2

hj (2,291) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 8:25 am

Cycling infrastructure in the netherlands:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOR6zm_Yziw

Please note the infrastructure provided for the motor vehicles in this same video.
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June 4, 2012 9:12am
Other_Andy

@Tim

Would love to see that docu.
But like this one:

http://windfallthemovie.com/index_1.html

it will never be shown to the proles (that’s us).
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June 4, 2012 9:13am
bhudson

@mikey,

Minimum pricing forces those who use alcohol responsibly to pay more tax and those who would abuse it merely to expend more of their money on it, as opposed to other priorities/essentials.

It will do little to nothing to reduce binge drinking or other, problematic, consumption. It is a typical ‘spray and pray’ type approach (in this case the ‘spray’ is excise.)
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June 4, 2012 9:14am
hj

Sir Chris Carter?
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June 4, 2012 9:15am
Keeping Stock

@ mikenmild – Labour abolished titular honours in 2000. Michael Cullen was the Deputy PM, and as such is bound by collective Cabinet responsibility for the decision.
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June 4, 2012 9:15am
Megatron

Sir Michael fucking Cullen – what a joke! Based on his observation on “rich pricks” he should send back the gong. But the two-faced little twat will not do such a thing.
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June 4, 2012 9:16am
mikenmild

Is that the documentary that alleges negative health effects from wind turbines?
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June 4, 2012 9:16am
mikenmild

KS – I thought you said he voted to abolish honours. Now what you are saying is you don’t really even know whether he even voted to abolish titles. Might one presume from his acceptance of a knighthood that he possibly was not in favour?
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June 4, 2012 9:21am
MT_Tinman

TV7?

What’s that?
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June 4, 2012 9:24am
hj

Cycling infrastructure in the netherlands:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOR6zm_Yziw
………….
The row houses’s aren’t such a bad idea either as (apart from windows) the bits between bungalows on small sections is wasted. A good idea to have common places for crafts and alotments for those who want them.
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June 4, 2012 9:29am
Keeping Stock

@ mikenmild – I said “one of the honours he voted to abolish”, i.e. a knighthood. One of the drawbacks of being a Minister is that you’re forever stuck with the consequences of a decision made by Cabinet. Your personal opinion is gazzumped by that of the majority. If Cabinet in 2000 voted to abolish knighthoods, then so did Michael Cullen, but he’s now accepted one. Is that a final upraised middle finger to Helen Clark?
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June 4, 2012 9:29am
mikenmild

I see there’s a bit of hating going on for Michael Cullen. I should have thought a senior honour was entirely appropriate for a former Deputy PM. I see that only three former deputes have (so far) not received an equivalent honour.
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June 4, 2012 9:31am
thedavincimode

mikeymould

You’re touting Sir Winston Peters?
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June 4, 2012 9:34am
philu

(todays’ best-of..)

“…5 Films to Change How You View the World..”

“…Playlist: 10 Songs for a Solid Sleep…”

“…10 Infographics On Energy…”

“…Google Blockly Lets Kids Hack With No Keyboard…”

“…Wes Anderson on “Moonrise Kingdom”: I’m trying to make something unfamiliar…”

“…Paul Krugman – European celebrity…”

“…Our new era of anxiety…”

“…Your words matter…”

“…Anonymous strikes back…”

“…The Great Taliban Jailbreak…”

“…Maxim Interrogates the Makers and Stars of The Wire…”

“…Video – George Carlin On Bankers…”

“…Europe Moves Closer to Banktatorship…”

“…John Pilger:..The Leveson Inquiry into the British press – oh, what a lovely game…”

“…Former UK Adviser: Cannabis and Ecstasy Bans Prevent Scientific Research…”

“…Birthers, Billionaires and Fox: The GOP Freak Show in Full Effect…”

Sadiq Khan: ‘Labour became arrogant when we should be the hope givers’ – Profiles – People – The Independent

“…Conspiracy theorists join the world’s elite…”

“…New Climate Change Strategy: Flee…”

“…15 Worst Comedy Sequels Of All Time…” (photos..)

“…Singer Attacked By Former Bandmates…”

“…Jeremy Scahill Says Obama Strikes In Yemen Constitute ‘Murder’..”

“…The Kindle’s achilles heel is hard to find…”

“…Michael Sandel:..What money can’t buy..”

“…Vatican leaks: No respite for Pope Benedict as more documents published…”

“…Libya sees claims of beatings and human rights abuses as elections near…”

“…Diamond jubilee marks 60 years of British economic potential squandered…”

“…Syrian president denied responsibility for the Houla massacre…”

“…Haven’t we had enough of murder on the telly? | Charlie Brooker…”

“…Leaked documents reveal UK fight to dilute EU green energy targets…”

why the hell should phil-the-greek receive our top award…?…(that accident-of-marriage still paying off/out big-time for him…eh..?..)

“…Auckland widens the property gap…”

“…Minimum prices on alcohol review’s wish list…”

“…Greens launch attack on Bennett and Key…”

“…After obesity rates in the United States began soaring in the 1980s, federal, state and local governments started to push back…”

New Zealand Economists Explain Economics In Simple Lanugage…”

“…There is a growing political chorus in favour of minimum pricing and alcohol advertising restrictions as liquor law reforms near their final stages…”

“…From The Price of Inequality: Joseph Stiglitz on the 1 Percent Problem…”

phillip ute@whoar.co.nz
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June 4, 2012 9:36am
mikenmild

davinci
It could happen, although his tenure in the job was rather short.
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June 4, 2012 9:37am
hj

Winston: Take away Dom Rd’s Asian takeaways
……………..
the point is that while we are told that migrants are srcreened and a benefit to NZ, a large number are strugglers who come here and struggle. Also they use and need infrastructure and existing services. The “but Asian food is tasty” argument has its limits.
Do we really have to help with other countries overpopulation problems???
http://www.3news.co.nz/Winston-Take-away-Dom-Rds-Asian-takeaways/tabid/370/articleID/254653/Default.aspx
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June 4, 2012 9:38am
hj

philu (12,549) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 9:36 am

(todays’ best-of..)
………
self-confirming selections.
Why don’t you design wallpaper?
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June 4, 2012 9:45am
mikenmild

Yes hj, immigration is very bad. But the exception made for your ancestors was maybe ok?
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June 4, 2012 9:45am
Fletch

Looking at the NZ Herald site now of the honours list.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10810472

How does one distinguish between who is receiving the Order of New Zealand and a Knighthood? Or are they the same thing now? Or can one refuse a knighthood and still become a member of the ONZ?
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June 4, 2012 9:47am
Keeping Stock

I’m not “hating” Cullen mikenmild. I’m just surprised that any member of Helen Clark’s Cabinet would accept in 2012 one of the honours that they deemed unworthy of New Zealand in 2000.
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June 4, 2012 9:48am
mikenmild

Fletch
The ONZ is our highest honour, limited to 20 persons at one time. It carries no title, but the post-nominal letters ONZ. Knight and dames have the title and DNZM or KNZM as post-nominals.
Anyone can refuse a knighthood. My understanding is that Jim Bolger did not want to be knighted, so was appointed to the higher ranking ONZ instead, and his wife given a separate honour.
KS
I don’t think the titles were deemed unworthy, just a bit archaic and unnecessary as we inch towards republican status.
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June 4, 2012 9:53am
philu

“..self-confirming selections…”

in the sense it is not neo-lib/fox talking-points/lies…?

..and at least 26 of them are non-ideological..

phillip ure@whoar.co.nz
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June 4, 2012 9:54am
Fletch

Ahh OK, I was probably thinking of the NZ Order of Merit. It’s all a bit confusing. Still not quite clear to me. So, if someone is given the NZ Order of Merit award, is that the same as getting a Knighthood?
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June 4, 2012 10:15am
flipper

Climate Realists allow the IPCC and WWF to condemn themselves with their own words…….

” ….. In the IPCC’s own words

“The IPCC produce “The Physical Science Basis” that they know few read or understand. It’s completed and set aside while a Synthesis Report or Summary for Policymakers is written and released at an orchestrated press conference months before the Science Report. The two are markedly different.

“The Summary claims that computer models are scientifically sound. Media focus on temperature projections invariably putting the highest increase in the headlines. These projections are predetermined, and always wrong. The Science Report explains why they cannot be correct. Here are 17 quotes from Chapter 8 of the 2007 Science Report.
Nevertheless, models still show significant errors. Although these are generally greater at smaller scales, important large-scale problems also remain.

” Due to the limited resolutions of the models, many of these processes are not resolved adequately by the model grid and must therefore be parametrized. The differences between parameterizations are an important reason why climate model results differ.
Unfortunately, the total surface heat and water fluxes (see Supplementary Material, Figure S8.14) are not well observed.
These errors in oceanic heat uptake will also have a large impact on the reliability of the sea level rise projections.
Evaluation of the land surface component in coupled models is severely limited by the lack of suitable observations. Large discrepancies remain in albedo for forested areas under snowy conditions, due to difficulties in determining the extent of masking of snow by vegetation (Roesch, 2006).

“The evaluation of the hydrological component of climate models has mainly been conducted uncoupled from AOGCMs (Bowling et al., 2003; Nijssen et al., 2003; Boone et al., 2004). This is due in part to the difficulties of evaluating runoff simulations across a range of climate models due to variations in rainfall, snowmelt and net radiation…………….

Read full article at:
http://www.climaterealists.org.nz/node/896

”
********************************************************************************************************
” Fight on we must!!!-WWF calls for global poverty to save planet

The World Wildlife Fund has released a report which calls for all carbon emissions to be banned by 2050 and for the entire human population to live in a state of poverty in the name of preserving rare species and saving the planet.
“Extremist green campaigning group WWF – endorsed by no less a body than the European Space Agency – has stated that economic growth should be abandoned, that citizens of the world’s wealthy nations should prepare for poverty and that all the human race’s energy should be produced as renewable electricity within 38 years from now. Most astonishingly of all, the green hardliners demand that the enormous numbers of wind farms, tidal barriers and solar powerplants required under their plans should somehow be built while at the same time severely rationing supplies of concrete, steel, copper and glass,”…………

http://www.prisonplanet.com/wwf-calls-for-global-poverty-to-save-the-planet.html

Perhaps the toad, luc, milky and chrissie wussie might like to offer pleas in mitigation ??????
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June 4, 2012 10:22am
mikenmild

Fletch
The Order of NZ has one grade – ONZ, our top hounr.

The New Zealand Order of Merit has more grades – knight/dame grand companion (GNZM), knight/dame (K/DNZM), companion (CNZM), officer (ONZM) and member (MNZM). Then we also have the Queen’s Service Order and medal (QSO/QSM) and the military awards.
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June 4, 2012 10:28am
Lazybum

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/06/03/shocker-the-hansengiss-team-paper-that-says-we-argue-that-rapid-warming-in-recent-decades-has-been-driven-mainly-by-non-co2-greenhouse-gases/

Seems Hansen/GISS forgot this paper they published in 2000.

moneyball Quotation:
‘..we argue that rapid warming in recent decades has been driven mainly by non-CO2 greenhouse gases (GHGs), such as chlorofluorocarbons, CH4, and N2O, not by the products of fossil fuel burning, CO2 and aerosols..’

Also:
‘If sources of CH4 and O3 precursors were reduced in the future, the change in climate forcing by non-CO2 GHGs in the next 50 years could be near zero. Combined with a reduction of black carbon emissions and plausible success in slowing CO2 emissions, this reduction of non-CO2 GHGs could lead to a decline in the rate of global warming, reducing the danger of dramatic climate change.’

They were not talking about lowering CO2 emissions, just plausible success in slowing CO2 emissions.

The warmers arguements has more holes in it than Swiss Cheeze.
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June 4, 2012 10:48am
calendar girl

MM @ 9:21 – “Might one presume from his acceptance of a knighthood that he possibly was not in favour?”

Sir Michael Cullen has said in today’s press: “Bluntly, I wasn’t the most enthusiastic supporter of what we did.” So he himself has confirmed his support for the Labour Government’s move to abolish knighthoods.

A person with such flexible principles must live with his own decisions.
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June 4, 2012 10:58am
Mark

I am pleased for Cullen. Don’t agree with his politics or the financial management that he undertook but political ideology is not a prerequisite to honors and nor should it be part of the process.
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June 4, 2012 11:05am
Don the Kiwi

Cullen was, and is, a smarmy prick.
This acceptance demonstrates his duplicity. I am very disappointed with the govt. for even suggesting that he get an award. He didn’t help the country – he screwed it for his own political, ideological, and spiteful ends.
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June 4, 2012 11:11am
Fletch

Go here to the link at Rolling Stone to listen to Joe Walsh’s new album Analog Man in it’s entirety.

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/album-premiere-joe-walsh-analog-man-20120529

It’s not bad actually. I have most of his other albums on vinyl from years ago.
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June 4, 2012 11:13am
philu

fact/reality check for don:..

while finance minister cullen paid our foreign debt down to $6 billion…

..and resisted the whines from the right for tax-cuts..(remember..?..)

..wheras english/key (kenglish..) gave billions in tax cuts for the richest…

..and plans to blow out our foreign debt to over $75 billion…

..just who here is ‘screwing the country’..?

..( do you allow facts to intrude on yr rightwing fairytales/fantasies there..don..

..if so…how do you explain/defend running up $75 billion+ foreign debt..?

..as the elites kenglish serve…screw us blind…

..phillip ure@whoar.co.nz
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June 4, 2012 11:20am
Scott Chris

Yes hj, immigration is very bad. But the exception made for your ancestors was maybe ok?

Yeah, but hj’s ancestors weren’t coolie chinks*.

*denotes irony.
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June 4, 2012 11:23am
philu

always thought he was over-rated..that walsh..

..lacking much subtlety..and too much bombast..

..somehow..too american…

phillip ure@whoar.co.nz
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June 4, 2012 11:25am
MT_Tinman

Perhaps Mark you can explain what, if not Cullen’s financial (mis)management, you think his services to The State were that gained him this title?
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June 4, 2012 11:29am
Leaping Jimmy

Suggested non-Jubilee change of subject – the suppression of Tesla’s science which essentially established for a fact – read him – that energy can in fact be drawn for free from the atmosphere, yes it can – read him – as told by some people who have demonstrated that and what happened to their inventions:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jImdQtZdktY&feature=player_embedded

Like I say, fantastic as it may seem, if you read the history of his experiments and what he actually did you realise his technology was viable to commercialise and that is a fact. It could be done, but someone/thing doesn’t want it done. It’s quite obvious. Regardless of what that fact says about the world around us today, it cannot be denied once you know who Tesla was and what he did as proven by what happened in his experiments – that fact – that it could be done but someone/thing doesn’t want it done – cannot be denied.
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June 4, 2012 11:33am
labours a joke

Sickening. Cullen being knighted. What an arsehole. Now we know what key is after…its all starting to add up…job for clarkula at the UN..jobs for the boys, cullen et al……when are we going to get a real opposition party. Bastards, the whole lot of ’em.
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June 4, 2012 11:33am
publicwatchdog

Good moaning Kiwibloggers! 🙂

Seen this article by Professor Prem Sikka

Professor of Accounting
Centre for Global Accountability
Essex Business School
University of Essex

on the Guardian website “Auditors must be held to account”?

The by-line is that “The shareholder spring is the perfect time to challenge the poor performance of unscrutinised accountancy firms”. It argues that auditing firms continue to fail but collect vast fees. Parliamentary committees have accused major accountancy firms of “dereliction of duty” “complacency” and basking in a culture of “box ticking”, but their gravy train rolls-on. The article encourages a greater scrutiny and accountability of their performance.

The article is available at http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/may/31/auditors-held-account-shareholder-spring

Kind regards,

Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com
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June 4, 2012 11:39am
philu

this whole shock/horror from the right/some media at the greens acting like a real opposition party is amusing…

..it is the result of the ending of that mouth-gag otherwise known as the ‘memorandum of understanding’…

..and the greens doing what they should have done years ago..

..they have started challenging the govt of the day on their policies..and arguing their alternatives..

..the greens have been far too polite for far too long to both national and labour…

..good to see a bit of mongrel..

..long may it last..

..phillip ure@whoar.co.nz
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June 4, 2012 11:43am
graham

Penny asked on yesterday’s GD to “Please provide the EVIDENCE which proves that I have ever advocated ‘stealing’ water Elaycee?”

I have done that on yesterday’s GD.

Have a LOVELY day! 🙂

graham
Attendee: Royal Wedding 2011 (watched it on telly)
Attendee: Sheep Racing Grand Finals at Helensville A&P 2011 & 2012
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June 4, 2012 11:44am
hj

mikenmild (4,302) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 9:45 am

Yes hj, immigration is very bad. But the exception made for your ancestors was maybe ok?
………………………..
is that the “once here, musn’t close the door ” argument
or the “Aotearoa is Maori” one?
Either way it is weak.
The point I make is that if there are arguments against immigration (and there are). They are drowned out because it is one thing the left and right (eg Green Party and Labour on the left and National Act on the right) agree on due to ideology and self interest, so it is a debate which is immediately stifled with cries of either “racism” or “economic illiteracy”.
The red greens are just marxists encased in a green outer layer and have nothing in common with Club of Rome type thinking.
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June 4, 2012 12:03pm
Monique Watson

As a close friend of mine commented re Cullen: “It’s not hard to see why you’d want to point a sword in his direction”.
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June 4, 2012 12:05pm
chuk

Graham says:

Penny asked on yesterday’s GD to “Please provide the EVIDENCE which proves that I have ever advocated ‘stealing’ water Elaycee?” I have done that on yesterday’s GD.

Nice one, Graham. You should post it here as well.

Penny bat-shit crazy “anti corruption campaigner” well and truly hoist by her own petard.
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June 4, 2012 12:06pm
wat dabney

hj,

The argument for free immigration is purely one of individual liberty. It has nothing at all to do with economics.
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June 4, 2012 12:20pm
hj

Scott Chris
Yeah, but hj’s ancestors weren’t coolie chinks*.

*denotes irony.
…………………………………..
but isn’t that just a lame shoot the messenger response (from the arrogant left)?
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June 4, 2012 12:24pm
hj

wat dabney (1,494) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 12:20 pm

hj,

The argument for free immigration is purely one of individual liberty. It has nothing at all to do with economics.
…..
Well how about population biology?
http://www.globalchange.umich.edu/globalchange2/current/lectures/human_pop/human_pop.html
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June 4, 2012 12:28pm
bhudson

Tax the income earners. Tax the businesses. Overlay a carbon tax on our largest producers of export dollars. Do not exploit any mineral wealth. Do not use economic growth to resolve the country’s problems.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/7040526/Greens-Quake-cost-leaving-debt

The Greens go wild on taxes until the economy is forced to contract through shortage of capital and too high operating costs (watch those wages bills skyrocket.)

Normal service has been restored it would seem..
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June 4, 2012 12:30pm
Viking2

mikenmild (4,302) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 9:06 am

At least some MPs are looking at significant changes to combat alcohol harm:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/7039241/More-MPs-piping-up-over-liquor-reforms

Like that would have made a difference to the four killed on Saturday or the four killed in January on the same road.

Too many marshmallow brains among them MP’s.

Attitude and training are the only things that can be changed. Taxing only makes home brew so much cheaper. Plenty growing their own. Indeed its a prerequsite of getting to 70 here in the Bay.

The big problem is the young drinking alcopops and I have yet to see any noise about pricing them off the market and making them less available.

Prior to alcopops our drinking weas mostly confined to beer and it takes a lot of beer to become bloody silly. Compare a bollte of beer versus a bottle of alcopops and the result on a teenager. Increase the use to three or four and magnify the problem expotentially.

Not hard really.
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June 4, 2012 12:32pm
bhudson

hj,

Well how about population biology?

Are you suggesting that you and joana get the job of standing at NZ immigration and determining what colours and eye shapes are allowed in?
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June 4, 2012 12:33pm
Yvette

The wilful destruction of property and the illegal accessing of water
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzccHIB3paQ
The only thing transparent here is the water.

PS: A lot of people have been ‘Judicially Recognised’ … for stealing
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June 4, 2012 12:33pm
Paulus

I note that Cullen’s wife Ann somthing or other – loudmouth former Labour MP, is obviously against her husband accepting the Knighthood – she says that she will never be a Lady –

which she never was in Parliament.
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June 4, 2012 12:34pm
Leaping Jimmy

Quite a good article on how Apple and other corporations avoid tax by setting up a Nevada subsidiary – since Nevada has zero coporate tax rate and no capitcal gains. Which undercuts the state tax rate from wherever their corporate headquarters is. I didn’t know Nevada had those rates. Gee I wonder if the gambling industry ever lobbied for that one?

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/business/apples-tax-strategy-aims-at-low-tax-states-and-nations.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all
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June 4, 2012 12:36pm
Viking2

Paulus

Quite so.
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June 4, 2012 12:36pm
Other_Andy

Samoan Independence Celebrations – 50th Anniversary.
In 1962, Samoa became the first South Pacific island to gain independence.

Independence?
How can you claim independence if you rely on foreign aid?
I don’t think Samoa has been independent since 1900.
Are any of the Pacific Islands (Apart from New Zealand) actually independent?
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June 4, 2012 12:43pm
hj

bhudson (1,925) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 12:33 pm

hj,

Well how about population biology?

Are you suggesting that you and joana get the job of standing at NZ immigration and determining what colours and eye shapes are allowed in?
…..
You (apparently) haven’t studied biology (agar in petrie dish and all that. “J” shaped curve , “S” shaped curve))?
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June 4, 2012 12:44pm
Leaping Jimmy

Normal service has been restored it would seem..

Yes it would seem so wouldn’t it bhudson. Isn’t it a shame the only thing the Gweens understand how to do is how to paint a dream. Except they never tell the punters it’s only a fucking dream, do they. No, they don’t explain that yes of course everyone would want to spend much more to get the ideal whatever, but wishing doesn’t make it so, fool. They don’t explain they haven’t ever thought about that bit, to the punter, do they. Not once, not ever. I mean anyone can come up with dozens of “wouldn’t it be wonderful if …” schemes and ideas but the Gweens seem to think there’s endless elasticity in the equation and it sits with what they call “the rich” and if only “the rich” were to be a bit poorer then it would all be a better place. But they don’t explain to the punters do they that when they talk about “the rich” the only way, the only way their latest mental suite of expensive pointless idiocy could ever be paid for is if “the rich” means everyone who earns over $60,000. They never explain that bit of it do they.

I mean it wouldn’t be so bad if it weren’t for the fact not only does it mean less wealth for “the rich” it also means nothing good becomes of it because all, repeat all their expensive ideas are based on naive, child-like fantasies often containing a large petulant element as well. Such as we shouldn’t dig up our valuable high-grade coking coal and sell it to the Chinese because they’d only burn it. Therefore we’ll just leave that in the ground forever and we’ll just tax “the rich” a little bit more to cover that particular cost. So the fact China simply gets it from Aus is neither here nor there to the mentals, in terms of what did their leaving it in the ground policy ever achieve except to hurt us for no positive outcome since China is still burning heaps of coal.

Still this has always been extremely obvious to everyone except they themselves hasn’t it. It’s like a giant, Shakespearean farce, but it’s years if not decades long and it’s completely unscripted which makes it all the better.
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June 4, 2012 12:49pm
hj

Other_Andy (1,644) Says:
How can you claim independence if you rely on foreign aid?
…..
what about claims about indigenous people and sustainability? Their population growth has powered over the sustainability of their islands. I imagine the size of the PI’s give a good indication of how squabbles over scarce resources were settled?
PI’s adopt their Isand lifestyle to the poorer suburbs where they flourish due to the size of their family groups and physical proportions. In other words they become the alpha group.
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June 4, 2012 12:56pm
MT_Tinman

V2 I realise that intelligence, common sense and fact does not come into consideration where you anti-booze people are concerned but I must point out that many “alcopops”, if not most, have a lower alcohol level than many bottled beer brands.

The suggestion that drinking prior to the advent of “alcopops” was mostly confined to beer is also wrong, in fact an outright lie.

Even in my young days, many, many moons ago, drinks like bourbon, white rum (Bacardi), scotch, dark rum, fortified wine (particularly Port) and things like Gimlet, Screwdriver etc. were both popular and regularly consumed.

With the spirits, we mixed our own, most often a damned sight stronger than the premixes and be assured even then we regularly got pissed.

What we did lack, of course, was pig ignorant, know-nothing lying scum attempting to ensure we had no fun by legislating against it.
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June 4, 2012 12:58pm
graham

Yvette at 12:33 pm: Thanks for that, I knew it was on Youtube somewhere, but didn’t have time to find it.

Let us not forget, Penny has also admitted that she illegally STOLE electricity from the Auckland City Council as part of the Occupy movement, then tried to make it seem okay by snootily instructing the Council how much Occupy were willing to pay. Newsflash Penny: Stealing something, THEN offering to pay for it, doesn’t make it right.
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June 4, 2012 1:06pm
Leaping Jimmy

This is quite interesting.

http://zen-haven.dk/vulnerabilities-pervade-the-digital-universe/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/understanding-cyberspace-is-key-to-defending-against-digital-attacks/2012/06/02/gJQAsIr19U_story_1.html
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June 4, 2012 1:23pm
Viking2

MT_Tinman (1,794) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 12:58 pm

V2 I realise that intelligence, common sense and fact does not come into consideration where you anti-booze people

Quite incorrect. The intelligence low level is yours I’m afraid.
No amount of fucking about, tinkering with age or price will change anything. Never has Never will. Look at the antyi smoking and anti drugs organisations, the money they spend or have spent and basically a nil all result after theiving money from the ordinary taxpayer to fund their jobs.
Until people can be 3 stikes for being intoxicated in a public place nothing will change. After all we have people who have up to 26 convictions for DIC and that hasn’t changed anything in their behavoir.

Its the habits and attitudes that need to change.
Oh and I am old enough to remember the 6 oclock swill. When men left the pub loaded to the hilt.
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June 4, 2012 1:52pm
hmmokrightitis

I just about snorted my lunch out my nose…

“Professor of Accounting
Centre for Global Accountability
Essex Business School
University of Essex”

Riigghhtttt. The University of Essex. That hotbed of learning, the centre of the universe when it comes to Global Accountability. Essex.

LMFAO. Literally.
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June 4, 2012 1:53pm
bhudson

You (apparently) haven’t studied biology

hj, I was referring to your very apparent aversion hem foreigners and their money (particularly the Chinese it would seem.) You and joana would both seem to think we should be keeping certain types out (those types being defined by colour, eye shape or religion it would seem, not the capital or skills they might be able to bring.)
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June 4, 2012 1:56pm
Leaping Jimmy

Newsflash Penny: Stealing something, THEN offering to pay for it, doesn’t make it right.

graham it’s not stealing when the thing is owned by a big faceless corporation, it’s repatriation.

It’s even more noble when it’s done in the name of any cause at all for then one gets bonus martyr points. If not officially, then at least in one’s own mind and tummy. It’s a natural part of being a lefty you see, like breathing is to us. That warm little smugness they all have, this is where it comes from.
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June 4, 2012 2:02pm
jonno1

@Yvette 12.33pm – very interesting; that certainly blows Ms Bright’s credibility right out of the (ahem) water. Theft and willful damage in one hit, and all recorded for posterity. Amazing! Had to laugh at Method 1 which she demonstrated by attempting to turn the tap in the wrong direction.

I looked up my Watercare bills for the last year – a little over $700. So around $15pw for potable water plus disposal; a no-brainer really. Of course, another option is roof water and tanks, but I suspect the capital cost may make that non-viable. So why not just be grateful that we are privileged to live in a modern society and pay up for goodness sake? Now, the cost of electricity & gas at around $10 a day is another matter…
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June 4, 2012 2:08pm
hj

hj, I was referring to your very apparent aversion hem foreigners and their money (particularly the Chinese it would seem.) You and joana would both seem to think we should be keeping certain types out (those types being defined by colour, eye shape or religion it would seem, not the capital or skills they might be able to bring.)
…
Being an English speaking person of European descent my natural instincts are for people who look like me. I am married to an Asian, however.

I take it you don’t agree with the Australian Productivity Commission, which concluded that there was no discernible benefit to Australians from immigration. It had all been captured by the migrants?
http://www.treasury.govt.nz/downloads/pdfs/mi-jarrett-comm.pdf
Or Rod Oram when he notes that population growth in Auckland had strained infrastructure and reduced the quality of life.
Or the Savings Working Group when they say that immigration policy (while meant to improve productivity) worked against us as we have had to keep on providing infrastructure rather than invest in business?
http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/4622459/Government-policies-blamed-for-house-prices
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June 4, 2012 2:27pm
DJP6-25

Manolo 9:01 am. I agree.

cheers

David Prosser
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June 4, 2012 2:51pm
bhudson

No hj I don’t agree with your interpretation of their reports. The Savings Working Group, for instance, were very clear that they were not opposed to, nor recommending a reduction in, immigration.

How have you distorted the other pieces to fit your agenda?
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June 4, 2012 2:55pm
wat dabney

“I take it you don’t agree with the Australian Productivity Commission, which concluded that there was no discernible benefit to Australians from immigration. It had all been captured by the migrants?”

Whether or not the benefits accrue to immigrants and/or the existing population is irrelevant: all individuals must be treated equally.
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June 4, 2012 3:17pm
Viking2

wat dabney (1,496) Says:
June 4th, 2012 at 3:17 pm

“I take it you don’t agree with the Australian Productivity Commission, which concluded that there was no discernible benefit to Australians from immigration. It had all been captured by the migrants?”

Whether or not the benefits accrue to immigrants and/or the existing population is irrelevant: all individuals must be treated equally.

Spoken like a true socialist.
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June 4, 2012 3:49pm
wat dabney

Viking2,

I said people must be treated equally, not made equal.

There is all the difference in the world between the two.
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June 4, 2012 3:52pm
Leaping Jimmy

Quite a good summary of the Syrian situation.

Did you know Wolfowitz told Wesley Clark in 1991 that the US strategy was to attack and destroy the governments of 7 nations: Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya Somalia, Sudan, and Iran.

Isn’t that interesting. As I keep telling you, its obvious Syria is an engineered situation, it has had those Brezhinsky pawprints over it from day one, just like Libya did.

http://www.activistpost.com/2012/06/save-syria-us-israel-and-saudi-arabia.html
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June 4, 2012 4:52pm
slijmbal

@hj

on Dutch cycling infrastructure – this is a real apples with zebras comparison

1) Most of Holland is reclaimed land and is flat as a pancake and perfect for cycling (except for the > Wellington wind on the west coast that can actually push you backwards) … and building roads is cheap of course – they have a lot of roads despite the public transport. Biggest issue with transport in NL Is the amount of water and requirement for bridges – lots and lots of bridges that are bottlenecks.

2) The area of Holland called the Randstad (triangle between Rotterdam, Amsterdam and Utrecht) holds the bulk of the population of NL and is one of the most densely populated places on the planet. You don’t really see cycle lanes as much outside of there. It is a perfect area to do cost effective public transport

3) You will see cycle lanes in general in places where the city suffered during the 2nd world war eg Rotterdam or newer suburbs and a lot less in older cities eg Amsterdam – they recognise that reverse engineering cycle lanes is expensive

4) It’s fun crossing the road where there are cycle lanes and tram lines as the cycle lanes include ‘bromfietsers’ (mopeds) doing 40K and they don’t have to follow the vehicle direction and can come from both directions. So you cross cycle lane, road, tram tracks, road, cycle lane. They have a lot of pedestrian accidents involving cycle lanes.

5) Holland has the 2nd busiest bit of motorway in the world south of Rotterdam (used to be busiest until M25 built) and they frequently have ‘files’ (traffic jams) measuring 50/60 km all over the Randstad area not just there – they have significant traffic problems.

6) The weather in NL is s**t. Huge wind combined with horizontal rain means that cycle lanes aren’t that well used in the extended winter though mopeds obviously continue to use them.

7) Public transport is very good there in the cities. Interestingly, many Dutch commute by car a fair distance as they prefer to live in the suburbs.

I’ve tried biking in Auckland – you cannot do it and arrive at work without being covered in sweat and needing to shower. It’s just too hilly.

I can see bike lanes working in flat areas like Christchurch but otherwise they are a waste of road space and $
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June 4, 2012 4:56pm
grumpyoldhori

Some upset about Cullen ? I have the answer, NO politicians should be given knighthoods at all.
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June 4, 2012 5:06pm
WebWrat

My old man worked his passage to England in 1936 and joined the RAF. After the war started he did TWO tours (81 raids) flying Wellington bombers on night raids over Germany. After his TWO tours (DFC & Bar) he came home and became a founding member of RNZAF 40 Squadron flying resupply to Pacific Islands in UNARMED Lodestars and C-47’s. When that tour was over he went back to England, turned down promotion as CO 75 Squadron and joined a Mosquito squadron in which he flew on low level raids over France and Europe until the end of the war. Pop was never offered a knighthood and I daresay he wouldn’t have wanted one. His only concern that I know of since I got to know him was for all his young mates that died in their efforts to beat the NAZIS.

To see that commo CUNT Cullen get a knighthood for his efforts to undo all that my father and his mates fought for should be an offense to all Kiwis. It sure is to me!!
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June 4, 2012 5:49pm
mikenmild

Any other politicians that shouldn’t have received honours? Or just ones whose views you disagree with?
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June 4, 2012 5:56pm

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