General Debate 18 March 2012

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Keeping Stock

Excellent column by Deborah Coddington in the HoS this morning where she ridicules David Shearer’s bill banning the sale of land to overseas investors:

http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2012/03/coddington-on-shearer.html
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March 18, 2012 8:26am
Scott Chris

Dotcom’s assets seized illegally
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March 18, 2012 8:37am
HB

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/6593846/NCEA-fee-shuts-out-hard-up-students

“A $76.70 fee is stopping thousands of students from being awarded NCEA credits they have achieved, a policy which marginalises already disadvantaged pupils, some education providers say.”

My understanding is that the fee is reduced if the student comes from a lower-income family. Many of the students I taught last year were eligible and all they had to do (from memory) is quote their community services card number. It brought the fee down to $20. For families where this was a problem (as far as I know, only 2 students in a school of over 1000) they were referred to a trust that helps with this sort of thing.
Here is what NZQA has to say about it
http://www.nzqa.govt.nz/about-us/publications/newsletters-and-circulars/secqual/fees-and-financial-assistance-2011/

I am worried the article doesn’t mention this.
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March 18, 2012 8:37am
Viking2

More Bad policing.
Making up the rules to suit themselves,once more.

Firearms restriction unlawful
SARAH HARVEY
Last updated 05:00 18/03/2012

A police refusal to allow people who have had their firearms licence revoked to apply for a new licence is “unlawful” and “legal nonsense”, a district court judge has ruled.

The direction, made in the Auckland District Court by Judge Mary-Elizabeth Sharp recently, goes against a decades-old practice by police and means that offenders who have had their firearms licence revoked will be able to apply for a new one.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/6593806/Firearms-restriction-unlawful
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March 18, 2012 8:44am
Viking2

Scott Chris (3,970) Says:
March 18th, 2012 at 8:37 am

Dotcom’s assets seized illegally

Yep but you watch the slimy Attourney General and his ilk wriggle round it in some way.
If they can’t, imagine the damages that will be payable by the taxpayer!

worse is that they knew this way back in February and have continued with imprisoment and siezure of the assets.
Not unlike the case above relating to gun law.

Way past time these actions were removed from police control and into an independent Prosecutor.
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March 18, 2012 8:49am
Viking2

Learn how to recognise when people are telling lies or don’t want to hear what they are listening too.
You will be surprised who stars.

Body language doesn’t lie

Mr Dunn said he had analysed politicians like Auckland Mayor Len Brown and Prime Minister John Key during their public appearances. Mr Brown tended to chew the side of his face when listening to something he didn’t want to hear, while Mr Key often blatantly wore his emotions on his face for all to see.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/6590114/Body-language-doesn-t-lie
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March 18, 2012 9:03am
Viking2

Another arsehole goes free.

Mongrel Mob member acquitted of rape, violence charges
ROB KIDD
Last updated 08:19 16/03/2012

A Mongrel Mob member accused of subjecting his former partner to 24 hours of rape and violence was yesterday acquitted of all 21 charges.

Colin Rangi Robyn Kiriona, 27, faced charges including kidnapping, firearm possession, assault, unlawful sexual connection, rape and threatening to kill, but the only blemish was one charge of assault he admitted before the trial started last week. At the end of the trial Judge Arthur Tompkins sentenced him to 6 1/2 months jail for the offence but Kiriona’s time already served since being remanded in custody easily covered that and he was released.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/6585251/Mongrel-Mob-member-acquitted-of-rape-violence-charges

Related story: (See story)
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March 18, 2012 9:09am
Nostalgia-NZ

The illegal warrant in Dotcom’s case apparently has to be shown to have been in ‘good faith.’ I hope the test on that extends to the ‘good faith’ in the manner of his arrest, his detention without bail that was eventually overturned, the financial pressure brought of himself and his family in particular at having all their money taken and being unable to pay their lease and staff wages, the closing down of his business and the overall consideration of whether the crimes he allegedly committed are actually crimes under nz law.
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March 18, 2012 9:21am
NeutralObserver

Dotwrong. Hmm and I thought back office cuts where supposed to have no consequence. Ohh they do Duh! Whaddya know.
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March 18, 2012 9:31am
kowtow

v2 @903

It has long been held that the best way to tell if a politician is lying is that his lips are moving!
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March 18, 2012 9:46am
niggly

Talking about liars, here’s another Matt McCarten doozy:

Under MMP, it’s not the biggest party that wins, it’s the leader of the main party who can form a majority coalition.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10792788

Really? When has that ever happened Matt?

I can’t quite work out whether Matt McCarten simply enjoys writing fiction or has some seriously deluded thoughts going on in his head all the time 😉
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March 18, 2012 9:59am
Jack5

Tim Groser’s off to China leading a trade mission. Hope there’s enough booze on the plane.

Chungking (population nearer 30 million than the 20 million quoted in the MSM) should be safe enough for him now that the Communist Party has purged the effective chief executive of the city Bo Xilai. Bo, hailed by some as a future Chinese leader, on the surface quite a Western-style man, in effect is a hard lefter who seemed to want to rekindle the Cultural Revolution. The Communist Party has also deposed the big city’s deputy mayor, Wang Lijun.

Why is John Ki’s National Party so enthusiastically licking the arse of totalitarian China?
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March 18, 2012 10:04am
Jack5

Keeping Stock posted at 8.26am:

…Excellent column by Deborah Coddington in the HoS this morning where she ridicules David Shearer’s bill banning the sale of land to overseas investors

I’m no supporter of Shearer or Labour, but given Coddington’s history in the book publishing game I am sceptical about her views on anything to do with business or dollars or trade.

Amazing how the old ACT hands, many of them devotees of that refugee from Communism, Ayn Rand, would happily see the whole of NZ sold off to the Beijing Politburo’s mates.
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March 18, 2012 10:13am
hmmokrightitis

Ah, poor Jack5, is no one listening to your bleating about the evil China? Yes, we should put our head in the sand and ignore them. They have the death penalty, hold people without trial, you name it really.

…

Sort of like the US. And India. So, lets ignore all of them. And go bankrupt. Happy now? Or do you prefer being a misery guts and just lobbing your formless and stupid arguments over the fence? Come back when you’ve something meaningful to say, and you’ve had some experience outside of the keyboard.
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March 18, 2012 10:24am
Leaping Jimmy

Jack, this is good backgrounder:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/mar/15/china-ousts-bo-xilai-chongqing

Wang Lijun was Bo’s mate and police chief and according to reports he tried to defect. Bo’s career was stellar and now side-lined. But normally there’s more underneath the headlines, would be interested if anyone knows…
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March 18, 2012 11:47am
F E Smith

Neutral Observer,

Except that the restraining order was not drafted by anybody in the ‘back room’, but by Crown prosecutors. The one mentioned is a Senior Crown Prosecutor with a lot of experience. Indeed, she rates herself very highly, although most criminal lawyers will tell you that she isn’t anywhere near as good as she thinks she is.

This is an elementary error by Anne Toohey, although I am certain that she will find some poor junior to be blamed for it.
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March 18, 2012 11:47am
kowtow

Dangerous parolee on the run. Will questions be asked of the Board that put this guy back in the public domain?

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/6593250/Police-hunting-man-reportedly-armed/
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March 18, 2012 11:57am
Jack5

hmmokrightitis posted at 10.24 trying to equate China with the democracies of the United States and India:

…Sort of like the US. And India.

Sure you don’t work in the Chinese Embassy in Wellington, hmmokrightitis? The embassy was speaking on behalf of the United States and every other foreign country by warning us that if we didn’t let the Chinese comrades buy Crafar farms, everyone would stop investing in NZ. Yeah, right!

Don’t see subjgated Tibetans burning themselves to death in India or the United States, hmmokrightitis, and don’t see anything in these two countries to match China’s censorship of the internet with the Great Firewall of China. Don’t see minorities like the Turkic folk in Sinkiang being knocked around in those two countries either.

India and the United States have their faults, but they are democracies. China is not.

Besides, we New Zealanders can buy land in India and the United States – but not in China.
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March 18, 2012 12:07pm
Manolo

Primitive but greedy: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10792849

Key’s government more pandering and selling out to Iwi.
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March 18, 2012 12:22pm
Michael Mckee

I agree with jack5
tell the chinese to stuff off until we can buy their land as they can buy ours.
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March 18, 2012 12:31pm
kowtow

I leckon we make as much as we can out of the Chinese boom, before the inevitable bust. Vely important not to put all eggs in one basket though as it is going to end vely untidyry.
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March 18, 2012 12:38pm
Jack5

Manolo posted at 12.22 and link to the Hoo-erald report of the generous settlement for the Ngati Whatua with $30 million worth of Takapuna land for $13.8 million, and the removal of its marine park status.

Treaty Negotiations Minister Chris Finlayson was the advocate for Ngai Tahu when it obtained its sweetheart treaty settlement from (Sir?) Douglas Graham. This included first and second rights of purchase to South Island Crown assets for ever.

Finlayson’s words in his maiden speech to Parliament included:

…I acted for Ngai Tahu in its claim against the Crown. The proudest moment of my professional career was being at Kaikoura on 21 November 1997 when the former Prime Minister, Jim Bolger, and Sir Tipene O’Regan for Ngai Tahu signed the Deed of Settlement…

Finlayson said ten days ago:

The Human Rights Commission recently reviewed the last five years of Treaty settlements, and concluded ‘the pace of historical Treaty of Waitangi settlements increased dramatically, from ten milestones achieved in 2007 to over 60 in 2011…

Will the settlements end Maori grievances? Or is Finlayson’s rush naive? Does it fit the Kipling poem Dane-geld? . The poem includes these lines:

But we’ve proved it again and again,
That if once you have paid him the Dane-geld
You never get rid of the Dane.
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March 18, 2012 12:47pm
Viking2

Roxon baulks at role for sharia by Australian Muslims

by: Patricia Karvelas
From: The Australian
March 17, 2012 12:00AM

ATTORNEY-GENERAL Nicola Roxon has weighed in on the use of sharia by Australian Muslims to write wills, declaring there is no place for Islamic law to settle family issues.

Muslim leaders have defended the use of Islamic law in Australia, particularly in the execution of wills that favour sons over daughters, arguing that Australian courts should respect the religious wishes of Islamic citizens.
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March 18, 2012 1:23pm
Johnboy

The wether is fine today at the top of Wainui mountain V2.

Fuck it was bloody hard work catching the bastard.

We shared a cigarette afterwards though! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 1:27pm
Don the Kiwi

The weather is supposed to be colder this winter than it has been for 20 years.

Of course, its all to do with global warming.
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March 18, 2012 1:31pm
Johnboy

My wether was quite warm Don.

Might check him out again in June.

He’ll probably fancy another fag by then. 🙂
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March 18, 2012 1:36pm
RightNow

http://www.concordy.com/article/opinions/march-7-2012/a-lords-opinion-cant-compete-with-scientific-truth/4222/

The comments are gold.
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March 18, 2012 1:52pm
Johnboy

Classic stuff RightNow! 🙂

I have bookmarked that for future quoting to the pathetic warmists here! 🙂

Must go and spray some more weeds.
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March 18, 2012 2:02pm
Scott Chris

The comments are gold.

Don’t know about that. More like stating the obvious:

Lord Monckton has combed through the published literature, including the latest (2007) IPCC report, and carefully cherry picked data sets or sections of data sets that suit his thesis that global warming is not a significant problem, and that we should not therefore spend significant resources in combating it. Regardless of his thesis, what is fundamentally nonscientific about his approach is his unwillingness to publish his own analysis of the global warming. It is impossible to scrutinize his methods, calculations, and conclusions without a complete and detailed peer-reviewed publication that presents the important details.
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March 18, 2012 4:07pm
DJP6-25

Scott Chris 8:37am. This is good news. I am assuming that most of the ‘case’ against him is hype. If he can hold out until January 21st 2013, he should be OK. Most Republican legislators have no time for Hollywood and SOPA. To put it another way, new administration, new priorities.

cheers

David Prosser
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March 18, 2012 4:13pm
MT_Tinman

Wether (whether?)?

He?

The whethers I created were no longer “he”s, I can tell you.
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March 18, 2012 4:22pm
RightNow

scotty, http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/monckton/
fill your boots, just stop being so lazy. The man publishes screeds of stuff, it’s easy to find, just not so easy to rebut hence it’s easier for your ilk to pretend it doesn’t exist.
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March 18, 2012 4:36pm
Manolo

With friends like these, who needs enemies? http://entertainment.msn.co.nz/article.aspx?id=8437057
Luddite Lawless would be proud.
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March 18, 2012 4:36pm
Johnboy

Stop splitting hairs Canman.

Georgina and Carmen liked to be called a her! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 4:40pm
Scott Chris

The man publishes screeds of stuff, it’s easy to find, just not so easy to rebut hence it’s easier for your ilk to pretend it doesn’t exist.

I had a look at the link. Couldn’t find a single paper by Monckton or anyone else for that matter that had been formatted for submission to peer review.

Why not just post a link to a scientific study of his rather than directing me to an informational garbage dump?
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March 18, 2012 5:12pm
Johnboy

“than directing me to an informational garbage dump?”

Seems an appropriate place for a bit of trash! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 5:14pm
MT_Tinman

I met Carmen once. You are correct.
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March 18, 2012 5:17pm
Johnboy

When you say MET Canman. What are you implying? 🙂
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March 18, 2012 5:20pm
Griff

“link to a scientific study”

He will link to some weird alt science blog like A Watts.
Wasn’t it we are heading into a solar activity minimum last month, opps solar storm last week shot that down.
Mockenton is not a scientist hes a pr hack for the alt science nutters paid for by Heartlands “dissuade teachers from teaching science” fund.
Why you would take such a tied old hack as you voice of science I totally fail to understand. Unless of course you do not like wot the science tells us cause its to scary for your tiny mind to deal with.
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March 18, 2012 5:26pm
Johnboy

I’m really looking forward to global warming. Be able to shear the ewes shorter and earlier. A real bugger the sort of critters that hide in the long wool and leap off them on to you when you are giving them a good sorting! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 5:35pm
Griff

Ya might have to take up gerbil farming instead JB The sheepies get a little maggoty if its too hot and sweaty
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March 18, 2012 5:43pm
Johnboy

Gerbils are no good Griff.

Their holes are too small. 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:01pm
Scott Chris

Seems an appropriate place for a bit of trash!

If you’re too stupid to add value to the conversation, then STFU.

Dickhead.
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March 18, 2012 6:04pm
Johnboy

Luv enticing true intellectuals into the debate! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:06pm
RightNow

Nah, I don’t care whether you make your criteria peer review. Neither do the facts.
Peer review is approaching being meaningless thanks to climate seance (look up Chris de Freitas)
And you still can’t rebut what he says, even if it isn’t peer reviewed.
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March 18, 2012 6:08pm
RightNow

“wot the science tells us” isn’t the same as what the empirical evidence says.
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March 18, 2012 6:11pm
mikenmild

Warning, tedious climate change discussion looming.
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March 18, 2012 6:13pm
Johnboy

Oh dear.

The enticement has been far too enticing.

Look wots arrived!! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:15pm
RightNow

Not today dikinchild, the rent boy and the illiterate halfwit are just no challenge.
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March 18, 2012 6:20pm
Johnboy

Cruel, cruel RightNow.

Thank G_d the sheepshagger is on your side! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:23pm
Griff

Pointless right now
You will not except anything by the real scientists
Just the dribble from a dozen or so Alt. science weirdos.
Cherry picking data is not valid investigation it produces opinion and bias.
Peer review is as robust as it has ever been it just does not support your anti science fantasies.

JB have you considered goats they do fine in the heat
Some guy done really well in the old god business and he had a thing for goats as well So it could earn you 73 virgins
Me id like to go to Valhalla a little plunder and lots of beer sounds like my afterlife of choice.
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March 18, 2012 6:31pm
RightNow

Stupid griff, you don’t decide who the real scientists are. They’re proved right by reality, not by models.
You poor brainless sheep, slip a stick of butter in your butthole is my advice, or you’re not going to enjoy it when Johnboy spots ya 😉
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March 18, 2012 6:39pm
Johnboy

I ain’t got nothing against goats Griff but I shot so many of them years back I’m a bit frightened to head into goat territory in case the old goats have handed down stories to the younger goats.

You know, a bit like Maori history.

Sheep are OK as far as I am concerned, despite their odd little parasites that can cause a man embarrassment now and again! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:47pm
Griff

Lovely debating style you have there RightNow
Really mature and learned
No I do not decide who the scientist are
Usually your standing in the scientific community is evaluated by the quality of your research published and peer reviewed in the relevant journals.
In climate science that would be the teams at east Anglia and pen state And those involved with IPCC.Nassa Best etc
Not by the number of alt science press releases you produce.
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March 18, 2012 6:51pm
Johnboy

Balls in your court RightNow.

Cue Scotty and Milky!! 🙂

Shit this is fun! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:53pm
Scott Chris

you don’t decide who the real scientists are

Nah, Griff’s right. Real scientists use the scientific method, of which peer review is an integral component.

Scientific method is a method or procedure that has characterized natural science since the 17th century, consisting in systematic observation measurement and experiment and the formulation testing and modification of hypotheses.

If Monckton wants to play with the big boys and girls, then he needs to learn to play their game.
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March 18, 2012 6:53pm
Johnboy

You dumb pricks must have realised by now I am only shooting for 7000 before DPF’s fighter squadrons shoot me down! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:54pm
Johnboy

“Nah, Griff’s right. Real scientists use the scientific method,”

Dumb bastards like you Scotty of course use Kiwiblog! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 6:56pm
RightNow

http://www.forbes.com/sites/patrickmichaels/2011/06/16/peer-review-and-pal-review-in-climate-science/

I am a senior fellow in climate studies at the Cato Institute and in research and economic development at George Mason University. I am a contributing author and reviewer of the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, which was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize in 2007. My writing has been published in major scientific journals, including Climate Research, Climatic Change, Geophysical Research Letters, Journal of Climate, Nature and Science, as well as publications like the Washington Post, Washington Times, Los Angeles Times, USA Today, Houston Chronicle and Journal of Commerce. I have a Ph.D. in ecological climatology from the University of Wisconsin at Madison.

WRT the scientific method, this is an integral part http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability

And we’re making the rules now scotty, the hockey team is losing. If you lie, and hide the data, we just won’t believe you.

So far we’ve already stopped the carbon trading scam.
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March 18, 2012 6:58pm
RightNow

And griff – which side has this motto: “true or not, who cares?”
http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2012/02/general_debate_18_february_2012.html#comment-934560
Want me to quote you some more?
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March 18, 2012 7:03pm
Griff

Go ahead RN
Alt science is your thing feel free to quote me as much as you like
Cherry pick any of the 1683 post i have made you will find some real good ones if you read them all
No I do not care if the “dissuade teachers from teaching science” quote is a lie So much of the weirdo science that you worship is a lie and it never bothered you in the past.

And you don’t need butter sheep have this natural lubricant called lanolin It smells a bit strait of the sheep’s back. but you sorta get used to it
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March 18, 2012 7:27pm
Other_Andy

Blame for global warming placed firmly on humankind

02 February 2007

The understanding of [human] influences on climate has improved since the [2001] report, leading to a very high confidence that human activities” are responsible for most of the warming seen since 1950, says the report’s summary for policymakers. “Very high confidence” is described as “at least a 9 out of 10 chance of being correct”.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11088-blame-for-global-warming-placed-firmly-on-humankind.html?full=true

IPCC predictions and reality.

IPCC
In 2001, the IPCC predicted that sea levels would rise by between 9 and 88 centimetres by 2100, relative to 1990 levels. The new report says rises could range from 18 cm to 59 cm. The top end of the range corresponds to a fossil-fuel intensive future.Very recent research has suggested that rises of up to 140 cm are possible.

Reality:
the rate of sea level rise continues to slow. The rate during the most recent 10-yr period is 2.32 mm/yr (or about 9 inches per century). This is not much above the 20th century average rate of 1.8mm/yr.

IPCC
Temperature rises by 2100 could, in the most extreme scenarios, range from 1.1°C and 6.4°C. The most likely range is 1.8°C to 4.0°C, with the report predicting that 4°C is most likely if the world continues to burn fossil-fuels at the same rate.

Reality:
Following a gradual rise of about 0.2 degrees from 1990 to 2000, global temperatures have stopped increasing and have actually fallen slightly. The only IPCC prediction which remains consistent with the current data is the lower prediction of a 0.7 degree rise from 1990 to 2030. The “Best” IPCC estimate and the higher 1.5 degree rise are ruled out by the data.
CO2 levels in the atmosphere have continued to rise over the last 10 years but temperatures have not risen since 2000.

IPCC
Climate change is also expected to affect the frequency and strength of tropical storms and hurricanes. The latest IPCC report says the activity of tropical cyclones is “likely” to increase over the 21st century. It says “likely” indicates a probability of more than 66%.

Reality:
Global tropical cyclone frequency and energy have decreased dramatically, and are currently at near-historical record lows.” And “…when each storm’s intensity and duration were taken into account, the total global tropical cyclone accumulated energy (ACE) was found to have fallen by half to the lowest level since 1977.”

The result of their assessment, which is done every five to six years, establishes what is considered the gold standard of consensus on climate change science.
Gold standard…….pffff.
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March 18, 2012 7:29pm
nasska

The argument of whether the skeptics or the warmists have it right enters its 579th round. Regardless of which side is favoured by fact in twenty years time it pays to keep an open mind on who could possibly benefit from having half the world disagreeing with the other half.

Last year on ‘Crusader Rabbit’, a commentator hit the bulls eye. It’s well worth quoting in full:

…..”George says:
May 4, 2011 at 8:54 pm

The Golden Rule: He who has the gold, rules.

We borrow money, we’re servants to the lenders. Lenders aren’t always good blokes. Some of them despair of the treading-water-chaos they see in world finance. Though they profit from it enormously, they know it can’t go on indefinitely. They’re insecure, so they try and organise Mammon on a world scale. Firstly they have to jack it up so the transition is not one from chaos to total disaster where the world reverts to stone age survivalism. Their paper and stocks would be worthless then and it would be mutually assured destruction. The transition has to be to a new financial order. So, the participants first have to be brought under economic subservience. Goring once said that it was impossible to convince a farmer to go to war when the most optimistic possible personal outcome for the ‘poor pig’ was to be able to come home in one piece years later. He had to be convinced that outside forces and traitorous domestic ones were threatening to remove his belongings and his way of life. A threat has to be created.
This time round it’s not the French or the dastardly Poles or Bolsheviks. It’s global warming, and we have to fight it with you poor pigs’ money or the comfortable struggles you know as life are going to end up something more akin to life in Somalia.

Oh, so your gummint wants to cadge $300 mil a week to maintain the status quo till payday? Here’s the deal sonny. We want a carbon tax from you first or we lose the paperwork. Never mind the big picture, we’ll look after the big picture.

The big picture is actually nobody buying or selling without the ‘mark of the beast’, the authority of a new world political and economic order. Nobody is going to buy into that unless every prop under every bit of stability is threatened. A total economic collapse will do that.
Bringing that about starts with a few earnest politicians needing money to keep their country stable till payday.

Bend over parliaments and congresses, here comes Mammon.”…….
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March 18, 2012 7:42pm
Johnboy

Hell nasska. So the Mayans and Nostradamus were inserted back in time by todays bankers to soften us all up for the big carbon tax rip off!

Gee wilikers. I always knew those old philosophers were fakes! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 7:49pm
RightNow

When your side is happy to lie to advance their agenda griff, you’ve lost more than the debate.
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March 18, 2012 7:51pm
Johnboy

Hell if they could do Mayans and do Nostradamus then they could do Mohammed and Jesus as well!!

Fuck!!!!! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 7:51pm
Johnboy

13 sorry 12 to go eh! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 7:52pm
nasska

Johnboy

Well, there’s nothing like a bit of intrigue to get a thread going.

Mind you, I reckon this one could be on life support.
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March 18, 2012 7:56pm
Griff

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Current_sea_level_rise
Global average sea level rose at an average rate of around 1.7 ± 0.3 mm per year over 1950 to 2009 and at a satellite-measured average rate of about 3.3 ± 0.4 mm per year from 1993 to 2009,
http://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/wg1/en/ch5s5-5-2-2.html
Numerous papers on the altimetry results (see Cazenave and Nerem, 2004, for a review) show a current rate of sea level rise of 3.1 ± 0.7 mm yr–1 over 1993 to 2003 (Cazenave and Nerem, 2004; Leuliette et al., 2004; Figure 5.14). A significant fraction of the 3 mm yr–1 rate of change has been shown to arise from changes in the Southern Ocean (Cabanes et al., 2001).

Remember this quote Guys.
Oh look linked to real science papers published in a real journal by real scientist.
oh and this one
Loopys lawyers lobbyists and sheep.

I am sure I could debunk the rest of your cut and past aunty However Its started to rain and my broadband has gone a little patchy. Why did you not link to its source. scared I would make fun of your alt science Webb site again?

You do know that there will be no winners in the future due to this.
Its called future eating and mankind is particularly good at it.
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March 18, 2012 7:57pm
Johnboy

Yeah your right nasska. Its a tad boring tonight.

I think I might head to the shower and see if the waters hot enough to wash the lanolin off! 🙂
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March 18, 2012 8:00pm
nasska

“I can’t believe that you’ve been visiting prostitutes for sex,” John’s wife screamed at him. “I’m really disappointed.”

“You can hardly blame me,” he answered. “It’s not like I was getting any from you.”

“Well that’s your fault,” she replied. “You never told me you were willing to pay for it.”
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March 18, 2012 8:02pm
Griff

The Queen of England and the Pope are guests of honour at the Annual England vs Ireland Soccer Match.

Both are getting right into the feel of things and the Queen leans over to the Pope and says, “I bet I can make all the English People in the crowd cheer wildly with a simple hand gesture.”

The Pope looks at her disbelievingly, so the Queen does her famous wave and all the English people in the crowd cheer wildly as one.

The Pope leans over and says to the Queen, “That was nothing…I bet I can make all of the Irish People in the crowd party wildy for a week with just the nod of my head.”

The Queens says, “Well that is totally unbelievable – let’s see.”
A split second later the Pope Head butts her……
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March 18, 2012 8:19pm
Scott Chris

When your side is happy to lie to advance their agenda griff

Heh. Quoth the guy who just cited lightweight Koch bros lackey Patrick Michaels as an authority on scientific method:

Michaels is another of the handful of U.S. climate-change contrarians … He has published little if anything of distinction in the professional literature, being noted rather for his shrill op-ed pieces and indiscriminate denunciations of virtually every finding of mainstream climate science.

Michaels’ statements on the subject of computer models are a catalog of misrepresentation and misinterpretation … Many of the supposedly factual statements made in Michaels’ testimony are either inaccurate or are seriously misleading

The Cato Institute is a libertarian think tank headquartered in Washington, D.C. It was founded as the Charles Koch Foundation in 1974 by Murray Rothbard, Ed Crane and Charles Koch, chairman of the board and chief executive officer of the conglomerate Koch Industries, Inc
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March 18, 2012 8:25pm
Griff

It’s the second resurection of Christ. Before the world ends he wants
to take in some fishing. So he gets his friend Moses and they head up
to Minnesota to fish. They are about to rent a canoe when Moses says:
“Jesus, can’t you still walk on water? Why not just walk out there?”
So Jesus takes his reel and tackle and steps onto the lake….and falls
knee deep in water.

Moses says, “Well….maybe you need a head start or something, why not
go to the end of the dock and try.”

So Jesus takes his reel and tackle and steps off the end of the dock and
falls up to his waist.

Moses says, ” Well why not rent the boat, go out to the center of the
lake and try there.”

So they rent the boat and go to the middle of the lake, Jesus is about
to step off and try again when…

Moses says, “Wait. Just to be safe, why not get yourself into the state
of mind you were in the first time you did it.”

So Jesus sets down, meditates for a few minutes, and finally he’s all
psyched up, and steps out of the canoe…. ..and precedes to drown.
So Moses does the water parting thing, and pulls Jesus up into the boat.
Jesus is just beating himself up over this. He just doesn’t see what’s
going wrong here. Moses just stares down at the bottom of the boat.
Suddenly, Moses says, “I got it! I know what’s wrong! Did you have those
holes in your feet last time?!?!”
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March 18, 2012 8:29pm
Other_Andy

Griff keeps on quoting outdated (2001-2004) research.

The predictions are not backed up by reality. New research has also found flaws in the methods and data used in previous reports.

Here is the most recent research.

Journal of Coastal Research
Volume 27, Issue 3
Sea-Level Acceleration Based on U.S. Tide Gauges and Extensions of Previous Global-Gauge Analyses
J. R. Houston† and R. G. Dean

Our analyses do not indicate acceleration in sea level in U.S. tide gauge records during the 20th century. Instead, for each time period we consider, the records show small decelerations that are consistent with a number of earlier studies of worldwide-gauge records.

http://www.jcronline.org/doi/abs/10.2112/JCOASTRES-D-10-00157.1

It is hard work trying to snap cult-members out of their trance.
To preserve the fantasy, reality must be distorted, because of this distortion, cult behavior results in a loss of realism. In the more extreme cases, the consequences can be drastic. Diminished realism is a problem in any situation, however, and for this reason, cult behavior is costly no matter where it takes place: affecting business decisions, governmental deliberations, day-to-day relationships in the community, or the practice of psychotherapy.

Some background that fits the AGWGaia cult to a T..

THE FOUR BASIC CULT BEHAVIORS

http://deikman.com/former.html
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March 18, 2012 8:29pm
nasska

Early one morning, the Pope was having a nice shower, when he felt a certain tingle down there. Figuring that a little sin never did anyone any harm, he proceeds to have a quick wank. Just as he climaxes though, he here’s a strange “click” noise. Quickly, he grabs a towel and exits the shower, and sees a paparazzo lens sticking through the bathroom window.

“You there!” He shouts. “You must give me that camera!”

“Are you kidding?” says the paparazzo. “I just got a photo of the Pope wanking! I’m rich”

“But my child,” says the pope, “You could bring down the Church if people knew! Think of the chaos, the heartache!”

“Sorry pal, this pic is worth millions to me.”

The pope sighs. “Very well, if I give you ten million euros will you give me the camera?”

The paparazzo thinks on this for a moment and agrees. So the Pope writes him a cheque, takes the camera and sends him on his way. Later, as he’s sitting on his bed grumbling and trying to get the film out, a maid walks in.

“Oh, your Holiness,” says the maid, “that’s a very nice camera. How much did it cost you?”

“Ten million euros.” grunts the Pope.

“Ten million euros? TEN MILLION EUROS?” They must have seen you coming!”
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March 18, 2012 8:31pm
RightNow

scotty, you’re saying Patrick Michaels has lied then? Let’s see your proof. I’ll pre-empt you and come right out and say it, you’re full of shit (as is Holdren).

And I quoted him on the corruption of peer review, but don’t let a fact hit you.
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March 18, 2012 8:34pm
Griff

RightNow dies and wakes up to find he is in hell. He’s really depressed as he stands in the processing line waiting to talk to an admittance counselor.

He thinks to himself “I know I lead a wild life but I wasn’t that bad. I never thought it would come to this.” Looking up he sees that it is his turn to be processed into hell. With fear and a heavy heart, he walks up to the counselor.

Counselor: What’s the problem, you look depressed?

RightNow: Well, what do you think? I’m in hell.

Counselor: Hell’s not so bad, we actually have a lot of fun. Do you like to drink?

RightNow: Sure, I love to drink.

Counselor: Well then, you are going to love Mondays. On Mondays we drink up a storm. You can have whiskey, rum, tequila, beer, whatever you want and as much a you want. We party all night long. You’ll love Mondays. Do you smoke?

RightNow: Yes, as a matter of fact I do.

Counselor: You are going to love Tuesdays. Tuesday is smoke day. You get to smoke the finest cigars and best cigarettes available anywhere. And you smoke to your heart’s desire without worrying about cancer because you are already dead! Is that great or what? You are going to love Tuesdays. Do you do drugs?

RightNow: Well in my younger days I experimented a little.

Counselor: You are going to love Wednesdays. That’s drug day. You can experiment with any drug you want and you don’t have to worry about overdoses or getting hooked because you are already dead. You are going to love Wednesdays. Do you gamble?

RightNow: Yes, I love to gamble. Especially with my kids future.

Counselor: You are going to love Thursdays because we gamble all day and night — black jack, craps, poker, slots, horse races, everything! You are going to love Thursdays. Are you gay?

RightNow: Uhh…no.

Counselor: Oh , you’re gonna hate Fridays…
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March 18, 2012 8:41pm
Other_Andy

You’ll like this one SC

From the BBC….
Looks like even the rats are leaving the sinking ship.
Or maybe the ship isn’t sinking but the sea levels are rising….

Q&A: Professor Phil Jones

The BBC’s environment analyst Roger Harrabin put questions to Professor Jones, including several gathered from climate sceptics. The questions were put to Professor Jones with the co-operation of UEA’s press office.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8511670.stm
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March 18, 2012 8:58pm
Griff

In the beginning God Created heaven and the earth. Quickly he was faced
with a class action suit for failure to file an environmental impact
statement. He was granted a temporary permit for the project, but was
stymied with the Cease and Desist order for the earthly part. Appearing
at the hearing, God was asked why he began his earthly project in the
first place. He replied that he just liked to be creative.

Then God said, “Let there be light.” Officials immediately demanded to
know how the light would be made. Would there be strip mining? What
about thermal pollution? God explained that the light would come from a
huge ball of fire. God was granted provisional permission to make light,
assuming that no smoke would result from the ball of fire, that he would
obtain a building permit, and (to conserve energy) would have the light
out half the time. God agreed and said he would call the light “Day” and
the darkness “Night.” Officials replied that they were not interested in
semantics.

God said, “Let the earth bring forth green herb and such as many seed.”
The EPA agreed so long as native seed was used. Then God said, “Let
waters bring forth creeping creatures having life; and the fowl that may
fly over the earth.” Officials pointed out this would require approval
from the Department of Game coordinated with the Heavenly Wildlife
Federation and the Audubongelic Society.

Everything was OK until God said he wanted to complete the project in six days.
Officials informed him it would take at least 200 days to review the application
and the environmental impact statement. After that there would be a public hearing.
Then there would be 10-12 months before…

At this point God created Hell.
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March 18, 2012 9:09pm
nasska

A patient complains he is suffering from insomnia. The doctor immediately picks up his pen and writes a prescription for Viagra.

“That’s supposed to help me fall asleep?” says the patient.

“No,” says the doctor, “but it’ll be a lot more fun staying awake.”
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March 18, 2012 9:18pm
Griff

I was walking across a bridge one day, and I saw Other_Andy standing on the edge, about to jump off. So I ran over and said, “Stop! Don’t do it!” “Why shouldn’t I?” he said. I said, “Well, there’s so much to live for!” He said, “Like what?” I said, “Well, are you religious or atheist?” He said, “Religious.” I said, “Me too! Are your Christian or Buddhist?” He said, “Christian.” I said, “Me too! Are you Catholic or Protestant?” He said, “Protestant.” I said, Me too! Are your Episcopalian or Baptist? He said, “Baptist!” I said, “Wow! Me too! Are your Baptist Church of God or Baptist Church of the Lord? He said, Baptist Church of God!” I said, “Me too! Are your Original Baptist Church of God or are you Reformed Baptist Church of God?” He said, “Reformed Baptist Church of God!” I said, “Me too! Are you Reformed Baptist Church of God, Reformation of 1879, or Reformed Baptist Church of God, Reformation of 1915?” He said, “Reformed Baptist Church of God, Reformation of 1915!” I said, “Die, heretic scum!” and pushed him off.
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March 18, 2012 9:30pm
Griff

http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/news/5415/2011-was-hottest-la-ni%C3%B1a-year-record

According to the report, 2010 and 2011 were Australia’s coolest years since 2001, due to two La Niña events, but 2011 was the world’s 11th warmest year, and the hottest on record for a La Niña year.

Sea levels often vary from year to year, but the long-term picture shows that the global average sea level for 2011 was about 210mm higher than in 1880. The sea actually rose faster in the 18 years between 1993 and 2011 than it did during the entire 20th century, according to the report.

Sea surface temperatures around Australia are also heating faster than the global average, rising by about 0.8°C since 1910, with 2010 being the highest year on record. Each decade has been getting a little warmer since 1900.
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March 18, 2012 9:39pm
Griff

Taoism
Shit happens.
Buddhism
If shit happens, it’s not really shit.
Islam
If shit happens, it’s the will of Allah.
Protestantism
Shit happens because you don’t work hard enough.
Judaism
Why does this shit always happen to us?
Hinduism
This shit happened before.
Catholicism
Shit happens because you’re bad.
Hare Krishna
Shit happens rama rama.
T.V. Evangelism
Send more shit.
Atheism
No shit.
Jehova’s Witness
Knock knock, shit happens.
Hedonism
There’s nothing like a good shit happening.
Christian Science
Shit happens in your mind.
Agnosticism
Maybe shit happens, maybe it doesn’t.
Rastafarianism
Let’s smoke this shit.
Existentialism
What is shit anyway?
Stoicism
This shit doesn’t bother me.
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March 18, 2012 9:46pm
RightNow

School Assignment 1: Citizenship and Ethics

Someone hacks your Facebook account and posts all your personal stuff online. They also insert a page with stuff you didn’t write that makes you look like a horrible person. The hacker emails 15 of his friends and says he got all the stuff, including the nasty bits, from your account. His friends show all this stuff to everyone at school and they tell them it all came from your account.

Almost everyone at school, even the teachers, now hates you and tells you so. You tell everyone that the nasty bits are fake and that you didn’t write them. But the teachers don’t believe you. They say that because most of the stuff is true the nasty bits must be as well. They post some of the pages on the school website highlighting the nasty bits and tell everyone not to talk to you.

Some of your friends speak up for you and point out some flaws in the faked parts that prove they are forgeries. The flaws are substantial enough to actually identify the hacker. The hacker then confesses but only to hacking your account. He says he got the page with the nasty bits anonymously in the mail and that he only hacked your files to find out if they were true. You’re shocked because at the same time he was hacking your files you had invited him to come and talk to your friends.

The teachers ignore the evidence of forgery and then try to justify the hacker’s actions, saying that although document phishing and impersonation is wrong, the hacker is a “hero” because they always thought you were a horrible person; horrible persons are increasing and the school is heading towards a horrible person catastrophe.

Q: Discuss the ethical implications of what just happened. There are bonus marks if you can work in a reference to polar bears.
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March 18, 2012 10:44pm
Griff

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hiltzik-20120229,0,1163347.column
“To begin with, Gleick’s disclosures have cornered Heartland into committing an act of spectacular hypocrisy. Ever since personal emails among climate scientists were abstracted from computers at Britain’s University of East Anglia and made public in 2009 and 2011, Heartland has celebrated the breach, contending that the emails show the scientists conspiring to hide or misrepresent doubts about global warming. Yet the institute labels the release of its own internal documents “a flagrant violation of ethics.”

Obfuscation is the one weapon stupidity’s got against intelligence

Climate denial = Shits not happening an alt science blog told me. 😆
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March 18, 2012 11:21pm
RightNow

“Climate denial”

That’s just dumb.
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March 18, 2012 11:52pm
Joseph Carpenter

And in more good news the tradeable carbon credit continues its collapse, the NZ spot market crashing to a new record low of $7.10/tonne for CER’s and $6.95/tonne for NZU’s (down from $11 dollars in Dec 2011, $22 in May 2011 and well under the initial float/Government mandated price of $25 which the forecasting genii at Treasury had projected to rise to $28-$35 by now in the market).
At this rate the only question is which comes sooner: the total collapse of the market and the NZ ETS (i.e. under NZ$3.00/tonne CER or NZU at which point the markets will refuse to trade because it’s just not worth it at a minimum parcel trade of 5,000 tons) or the total end of the Kyoto treaty on 31 Dec 2012? Perhaps the National government better have the substantive review of the ETS in the near future rather than 2014 to avoid the coming excrement hitting the rotary air impellor? How will National feel about the class action suits by the holders of worthless carbon credits? How much will it cost taxpayers to settle this fiasco?
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March 18, 2012 11:58pm

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