General Debate 13 March 2012

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Colville

Had dinner with a chap from Utah last night who is engineering manager of a coal mine there.
Talking about health care he said that the cost to the company for health insurance was 140% of that of the wage bill.
So a miner getting $100k pa costs $140K pa to get insurance for.
Sheesh!
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March 13, 2012 8:05am
Pete George

Gordon Cambell struggles to get traction in an interview with David Shearer, not very illuminating although there are glimmers of hope.

And Anthony Robins struggles to get any sign of support on a shearer promotion at The Standard.

Shearer’s campaign has started this week but he is not yet enthusing his own, let alone the voters Labour needs back.
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March 13, 2012 8:12am
joana

How much has that ghastly Somalian woman cost the NZ tax payer thus far? Only nine countries take refugees. Few muslim countries take refugees and those that do , only take muslim refugees. France only takes French speaking refugees. Weren’t we lucky landing her..If she had gone to a muslim country , they would have executed her years ago and none of us would have had to put up with this whole silly saga.
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March 13, 2012 8:15am
AlphaKiwi

I’m increasingly impressed with the work Salman Khan is doing with his free education website KhanAcademy.org.

Here is a story from CBS this past Sunday.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7401696n&tag=contentMain%3BcontentAux

What do you think of New Zealand making his system the mainstay of the New Zealand education system?
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March 13, 2012 8:26am
Scott Chris

“Tree Rex” discovered in Norfolk ❗
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March 13, 2012 8:29am
KiwiGreg

‘Only nine countries take refugees. ”

Crap
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March 13, 2012 8:30am
KiwiGreg

@ colville Not sure of those facts (ignoring the wage level thing). Non-wage costs in our US plants are typically around 30% of wage costs. Maybe there’s something special about mining but that doesnt equate with my experience.
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March 13, 2012 8:31am
wreck1080

Trevor Mallard promised no more than 15 kids in primary school classes back when he was in power.

Ever since he made this promise , classes sizes have been increasing every year.

Now my sons primary class is around 35 children.

How does a teacher control 35 8 year olds? Let alone help one out who is having difficulty.
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March 13, 2012 8:34am
Keeping Stock

David Shearer ‘fesses up to his first significant gaffe; how long until the sharpening of the knives begins afresh?

http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2012/03/bother-and-blast.html
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March 13, 2012 8:48am
Pete George

KS – I don’t think the knives have been sheathed since the leadership contest. There’s a distinct lack of warmth for Shearer from Labourites.

If only the advice and support he got was as sharp as the hovering knives.
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March 13, 2012 8:51am
Rick Rowling

How does a teacher control 35 8 year olds?

“All right class! 260 star jumps! 1 2 3 4 5 …”
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March 13, 2012 8:56am
Murray

With drugged milk wreck.
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March 13, 2012 9:00am
Dave Mann

The warmists have upped the pressure in their propaganda war again. Now they are Wanking on about the Greenland Ice Shelf being under more ‘threat’ than they previously thought. Why are these people so afraid of change and so terrified that everything won’t remain the same for billions of years?

If this bloody miserable freezing wasteland melted then surely this would be a good thing; it would make the area more usable and hospitable to humans, wouldn’t it?

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/1144837–greenland-ice-sheet-may-melt-if-temperatures-increase-by-just-1-6-degrees-celsius
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March 13, 2012 9:02am
Tookinator

Hijacker tells court: Police threatened to ‘execute’ me

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10791572

She was worried about becoming a ‘sexual slave’

Have a look at her photo and decide if you were to have a ‘sexual slave’ would she be top of your list?
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March 13, 2012 9:04am
Brian Smaller

@joana – That woman just needs to be taken to somewhere else and dropped off. Somalia seems a good place. Not too many white men there to sexually abuse and enslave her.
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March 13, 2012 9:09am
Keeping Stock

@ Pete; you’re quite right, and that beard makes David Cunliffe look quite sinister…
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March 13, 2012 9:14am
MT_Tinman

Teachers used to manage 40 of us little bastards back in the day Wreck – of course in those days they could beat us into submission but, hey, we survived to comment on Kiwiblog.
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March 13, 2012 9:19am
tom hunter

What do you think of New Zealand making his system [KhanAcademy] the mainstay of the New Zealand education system?

We’ve already made it almost the mainstay of our oldest son’s education. One “unfortunate” side effect of this has been that he’s jumped so far ahead of his math classes that he’s bored out of his brain at school. I expect that such problems are going to grow as it (and others like it) become more widely used by self-teaching kids.

So the real question is less about “making” the system a mainstay than figuring out how we’re going to change the New Zealand education system to cope with this new world.
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March 13, 2012 9:20am
hmmokrightitis

Ah, just back from a long weekend, took the lids up to Auckland for grandparent time and movies. Glorious day here, kids off to their decile 10 school, maximum of 27 in one class. One has 18. Eldest, 11, rode his bike to school by himself; Mr 9 scootered, also by himself.

Thank god I left Auckland 🙂
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March 13, 2012 9:38am
AlphaKiwi

Isn’t the school flexible enough to let him jump a grade or two in maths classes? Sorry, not sure how old your son is.
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March 13, 2012 10:05am
Murray

Thats what I like about Auckland hmm, its so far away.
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March 13, 2012 10:06am
tom hunter

Isn’t the school flexible enough to let him jump a grade or two in maths classes?

They jumped him to Year 11 NCEA and he’s still bored. The school has been damned good to him and us, but I think we have reached the end of the line here. The real question is what is next: a different school, home schooling? We’re working through those options.
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March 13, 2012 10:10am
AlphaKiwi

@ tom hunter

I suppose it’s a good problem to have. 🙂
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March 13, 2012 10:25am
Scott Chris

Thats what I like about Auckland hmm, its so far away.

The feeling is mutual. You really are a miserable old fucker murray.
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March 13, 2012 10:40am
David Garrett

On yesterdays GD there was a fair bit of discussion about the pending release of murderer Melissa Weepa, and the Parole Board’s decision to allow it…There was a fair amount of criticism along the lines of “the members of the Parole Board are all dickheads”

Much as it pains me to agree with Milkymild, he has put his finger on the problem – although he seems to have been too lazy (no surprise there) to research the reasons his answer and the reasons he is right.

The Parole Board is governed by the Parole Act 2002, a piece of Clark legislation which in a nutshell says “you must let them out as soon as possible.” As I have pointed out before, if the Board doesnt do as it is directed by the Act, there are a line up of criminals rights lawyers like Michael Bott eager to seek judicial review of the Board’s decision.

I am aware that members of the Parole Board (I am not about to break any confidences) are most unhappy with various parts of the Act which they must work under. They have made that unahappiness know to the government. Until the Act itself is comprehensively reviewed, decisions like this will keep happening.

Having said that, there is nothing stopping the Board saying in its decisions, something like “We see this person as a continuing risk, and we are not comfortable letting him/her back into the community. However because of sections X and Y of the Parole Act, we have no practical alternative.” On very rare occasions, they do just that.
,
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March 13, 2012 10:43am
mikenmild

Thanks David. No research was required: I already happened to know those basic facts about the Parole Board. I have noticed a recent change in the narrative aboput the Parole Board though. Some seem to want to paint the Parole Act as Clark-era (codeword for ‘soft) legislation that made parole easier. My recollection is that this act came as part of a package toughening up things in the jsutice secot.
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March 13, 2012 11:04am
David Garrett

MM: You are right….to a point. There was SOME toughening up in the Sentencing Act, but no doubt a deal was done in the Labour caucus in 2002 that for every point of ‘hardening’ in either the Sentencing or Parole Acts, there had to be a “softening” provision somewhere else.

You seem quite unfamilar – or when we last exchanged textual blows you were – about the provision of the Sentencing Act which require Judges to impose the “least restrictive” sentence they can possibly impose (i.e. prison only when they absolutely can’t avoid it) and another provision which cuts all sentences of two years or less by 50%.
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March 13, 2012 11:18am
Graeme Edgeler

‘Only nine countries take refugees.’

Crap

Only nine countries participate directly in the UN refugee settlement programme and have an annual quota of refugees. Others however, do accept refugees on an ad hoc basis, and asylum can be sought directly in any country which is a signatory to the Refugee Convention.
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March 13, 2012 11:46am
joana

I don’t think the Parole Act is such a problem David..but in my experience , members of the board are. I understand a change in leadership is in the wind which may or may not improve things.
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March 13, 2012 12:19pm
F E Smith

I like David Curruthers, both as a judge and as a very nice man. He was great to appear in front of in the DC and nothing changed when he moved to the Parole Board. I don’t think the Board’s “problems” should be sheeted home to him.

First, just a reminder that very few lawyers do parole board work. The pay is rubbish and you generally make a loss every time you do a hearing.

There was a judicial review a few years ago that found that the Board was not following the law, but I don’t criticise that finding because it was correct.

But I do criticise the Corrections Dept, and especially their report writers. Often their reports are not grounded in reality. You read them and wonder if they even bothered to speak to the prisoner. For some reason, however, the Board relies on the reports implicitly. I suppose it is generally all they usually have to go on, as getting anything useful out of a prisoner in front of the Board isn’t that easy. The prisoners often clam up with nerves!

For the above reason, Board hearings are usually ‘on the papers’, with the cursory 5 minute hearing only there to see if the prisoner will say anything useful.

So the biggest influence is Corrections. And I don’t think they do that good a job of it, even accepting the subjects they are dealing with.

But don’t forget that, Parole Act notwithstanding, very few prisoners are let out at one third. And the one half kick out for sentences under two years has been standard for years, and is still better than the UK, where prisoners are often released at one fifth served!
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March 13, 2012 12:40pm
Spam

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/6565441/Student-loans-to-remain-interest-free

John should be honest. “Student loan interest to remain taxpayer funded” would be a more honest story.

Let me re-write the first paragraph:

John Key has confirmed that despite the student loan amount being forecast to increase to in excess of 14 Billion in the next 3 years, students will not be charged interest even at CPI or the official cash rate, and the interest charges will continue to be paid by the taxpayer. At the official cash rate of 2.5%, the interest costs to the taxpayer are estimated to climb to $350 Million / annum, and could be much higher if interest rates rise. Government Bonds, seen as a more reliable estimate of the cost of Government borrowing, are currently at 4.08%, indicating an interest cost of $571 Million / annum.

Charging interest would bring in considerable extra revenue for the Government, but Key said he would be voted out if National did so.

“Bluntly, if you want me to be really crude about it there are 565,000 student loans out there. If we add interest back on the student loans, it doubles repayment time of the loan.

The problem for the government is that the repayment rate for student loans is very poor, and nearly 50% of loans are in fact never repaid and must be written-off as bad debts. The true cost to the taxpayer of the student loans scheme is very high, and according to some commentators, becoming unsustainable.
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March 13, 2012 12:41pm
RRM

Excellent to see the U.S. secretary of state heading the calls at the UN for intervention in the atrocities in Syria.

So today, an entirely sincere God Bless America from me. Good on them.
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March 13, 2012 12:50pm
kowtow

PC,racism,and feminism.
And this from the private sector!

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10790995
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March 13, 2012 2:52pm
bereal

David Garrett @ 10.43

The last paragraph in that contibution was the one that made sense.

The fact that the parole board has not done that in this case is exactly what makes them prize drongos
This sadistic killer has continued to reoffend while in prison and if anyone reading this is under any illusions
as to her charecter and whether society will be safe when she is let out, try this.

Grab a knife, stab it into a chopping board, stab it again, then stab it in again, then keep on stabbing it in
again and again untill you have counted to 50. Then when you reflect that this is what this woman did to a colleague
for narking to the police, then dumped her body , how long did it take you to inflict 50 stab wounds. Do you agree with the idiots
in the parole board that it’s ‘all good.’ now because Melissa is taking her pills.

Anybody that commits a murder in this way is loving the act.

i guess there is one good thing in this for Melissa, not many people will nark on her in the future.

The main lesson for you David is that when you find yourself begining to agree with mikenmild in the future
you should give yourself a good uppercut and think again.
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March 13, 2012 3:12pm
F E Smith

An interesting blog post at the Telegraph by Ed West, pointing out the denigration of the UKIP by association with so-called ‘right wing’ groups such as the BNP and the EDL that goes on in the UK.

And a wonderful first comment that sums up the idiocy that goes with describing the BNP as being ‘right wing’:

Hang on, right, hang on.

According to the BNP manifesto, they’re in favour of high taxes on the rich, protectionism, workers co-operatives, a large state, regulation, unionisation and nationalising major industries, utilities and, wierdly, the RNLI.

Can anyone – anyone at all – explain to me how any of that is right wing?

As I have always argued here on KB, the BNP and other similar hate groups are usually left wing. The lefties just don’t like admitting it.
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March 13, 2012 3:15pm
Pete George

FES – that ‘wierdly’ looks weird.
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March 13, 2012 3:51pm
David Garrett

bereal: You have probably moved on, but your comment made me LOL, and that doesnt offen happen…trouble is I am such a caring and sharing kind of chap, if some leftie lunatic actually makes sense honour compels me to commend him or her…used to drive the socialists nuts when I did it in the House,…Dyson once announced she was going to change her vote on a conscience issue because I stood up and agreed with her…
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March 13, 2012 6:06pm
joana

Bereal
You are so funny.
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March 13, 2012 6:33pm
hj

Peak oil hitting the tertiary economy

http://www.3news.co.nz/AirAsia-X-scraps-Christchurch-flights/tabid/421/articleID/246403/Default.aspx
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March 13, 2012 7:19pm
joana

The parole board seem enamoured of Melissa but could it be the case that they are being intimidated by her mob connections? Have they notified her victims family? Has anyone from her victim’s family spoken out?
In a recent CHCh case , they released a sex offender after he had served only 11 mths of a four year sentence..No time for any courses and it seems no time to noftif his victims families..His victims were young CHCh boys..When a father went to the Press , they blamed the police for there being no victim input or notification..I thought notifying victims was apart of the act?
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March 13, 2012 7:23pm
kowtow

Peak oil bullshit.

Thanks to hydraulic fracturing the US is entering a new phase of energy production.
Let’s get fracking.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/energy/article/U-S-oil-output-set-to-boom-3345237.php
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March 13, 2012 7:45pm
nasska

There once was a bloke who had worked hard all his life, never went to the pub and had saved all of his money, and was a real miser when it came to his cash.
Just before he died, he said to his wife,”When I die, I want you to take all my money and put it in the casket with me. I want to take my money to the afterlife with me.”
And so he got his wife to promise him, with all of her heart, that when he died, she would put all of the money into the casket with him.
Well, he died.
He was stretched out in the casket, his wife was sitting there – dressed in black, and her friend was sitting next to her. When they finished the ceremony, and just before the undertakers got ready to close the casket, the wife said, “Wait just a moment!”
She had a small metal box with her; she came over with the box and put it in the casket. Then the undertakers locked the casket down and they rolled it away.
So her friend said, “Girl, I know you were not foolish enough to put all that money in there with your husband.”
The loyal wife replied, “Listen, I’m a Christian; I cannot go back on my word.
I promised him that I was going to put that money into the casket with him.”
“You mean to tell me you put that money in the casket with him!?!?!?”
“I sure did,” said the wife.
“I got it all together, put it into my account, and wrote him a cheque….
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March 13, 2012 8:03pm
Johnboy

Ah. It is just like Coro! 🙂

A group of primary school infants, accompanied by two female teachers, went on a field trip to Trentham races to see and learn about thoroughbred horses..
When it was time to take the children to the toilet, it was decided that the girls would go with one teacher and the boys would go with the other.
The teacher assigned to the boys was waiting outside the men’s toilet when one of the boys came out and told her that none of them could reach the urinal.
Having no choice, she went inside, helped the boys with their underpants, and began hoisting the children up, one by one, holding their willies to direct the flow away from their clothes.
As she lifted one, she couldn’t help but notice that he was unusually well endowed.
Trying not to show that she was staring, the teacher said, ‘You must be in Year Four.’
“No, love,” he replied.
“I’m riding Silver Arrow in the 2.15”
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March 13, 2012 8:07pm
nasska

There was a woman who spent some months serving God in
Kenya. On her final visit to a remote township she attended
a medical clinic. As the Maasai women there began to sing
together, she found herself deeply moved by their hauntingly
beautiful harmonies. She wanted to always remember this
moment and try to share it with friends when she arrived home.

With tears flowing down her cheeks, she turned to her friend
and asked, “Can you please tell me the translation of the words
to this song?”

Her friend looked at her an solemnly replied, “If you boil the
water, you won’t get dysentery.”
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March 13, 2012 8:18pm
bereal

The other thing i forgot to mention above in my criticism of the dork fuckwits that currently make up the parole
board is that in this case they have the psycology report in front of them that says Melissa has a, ‘medium to high
risk of reoffending.’
But in their wisdom they choose to believe that it’s ‘all good.’ because she is taking her pills.

Still we must take note of well meaning jurists such as, say, F E Smith that declare that Caruthers is, “a very nice man.” and
‘Great to appear in front of.”
dear old F E Smith likes him.
Oh dear me.
How fucked up can we get ?

F E Smith seems to say that the problem is that lawyers get paid fuck all for parole hearings.

OK F E Smith, if we trippled what we paid lawyers for parole hearings then that would fix the system ?

What say you, F E Smith ? FFS
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March 13, 2012 8:39pm
Johnboy

FE Smith says $451,883……… whatever aint enough Beryl!

Not that he is a greedy little prick with a huge sense of entitlement mind you! 🙂
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March 13, 2012 8:45pm
Johnboy

Sorry $401,951.81. 🙂

http://www.justice.govt.nz/publications/global-publications/l/legal-aid-payments-to-firms-1-july-2010-to-30-june-2011
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March 13, 2012 8:49pm
bereal

thanks for that Johnboy,
it will be interesting to see when our legal eagle mate FE Smith gets up the gall to show his face again on Kiwiblog.
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March 13, 2012 9:04pm
Johnboy

He will be back anon Beryl.

Huge sense of entitlement backed up by an ego the size of the universe will ensure his rapid return! 🙂
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March 13, 2012 9:13pm
Nostalgia-NZ

Why wouldn’t he bereal? Suddenly he’s responsible for the parole board whose decision you don’t like?
Catch up will ya?
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March 13, 2012 9:16pm
Johnboy

FE Smith is approached by a charity worker who is concerned that the lawyer didn’t donate any money to charity, despite making over $500,000 that year. “First of all,” says Smith, “my mother is bedridden and gets no help from social services. Second, I have five kids through three divorce marriages. Third, my sister’s husband recently died and she has no one to support her four children.”

“I’m terribly sorry,” says the charity worker, “I feel bad about asking for your money.”

” So you should,” replies Smith. “If I’m not giving them any money, why should I give you any?”
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March 13, 2012 9:24pm
adze

Some lessons for this part of the world?

http://12most.com/2012/01/17/12-learn-japan/

I especially like the politeness. God that would be bliss after living in urban centres in this country.
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March 13, 2012 10:59pm
Viking2

Dotcom claims US Govt used website

Tuesday, 13, Mar, 2012 1:02PM

Kim Dotcom is claiming US Government officials were among website users.

The internet mogul is facing a raft of piracy charges with regards to his website MegaUpload, which was shutdown in January.

Website TorrentFreak reports Dotcom is fighting another legal battle, to allow users to access their content on the site.

Dotcom told the website the company has been looking into options they have to grant users temporary access, and says they found a large number of accounts from US Government officials.

He says he’s hoping negotiations with the Ministry of Justice will allow access to former users.

Wonder how high up those Govt. officails are and what they were storing and accessing. Oh dear, just might turn out to be a big cluster fuck for the FBI and its Govt. Servants.
Justice is done in many ways. hahaha.
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March 13, 2012 11:27pm
Viking2

according to Finance Minister Bill English.

People were saving more in KiwiSaver because of government incentives( other taxpayers money),, but that had been offset by lower savings in other forms, so the overall pool of savings was not growing, he said yesterday.

does he not understand that a taxpayer mostly only has one money pipe to fill the bucket?

Suppossedly this highly paid taxpayer understands finance. Appoint a housewife to his job.
Uneducated clown.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/6569123/Debt-being-paid-off-but-savings-not-growing
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March 14, 2012 6:45am
Viking2

Students happy to pay more for booze but but, still want the taxpayer to porvide interest free loans.

So should we have a special rate of tax for students booze. Seems like a plus to me.

Fuck there is a warpe sense of entitlement in this country.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/6569734/Higher-booze-tax-doesn-t-faze-students
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March 14, 2012 6:47am
KiwiGreg

Actually Viking2 I would have thought the point was quite valid. Labour’s proposition was that by taking a whole bunch of other people’s money they could increase saving by providing incentives. Unsurprisingly, those taxed to provide the incentives saved less and those who could get the incentives simply transferred savings from other purposes to derive the incentive. Net net a bit of wealth transfer, a lot of bureaucracy and not much saving.
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March 14, 2012 7:36am
KiwiGreg

Johnboy and bereal – maybe you two could get a room?

From my perspective FE Smith is one of the value adders to the debate here on kiwiblog.
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March 14, 2012 7:38am

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