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February 6, 2012 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 6 February 2012

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General Debate

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reid

See they certainly know how to treat Labour MPs in the UK. Perhaps we should be doing more of that over here, to Mana Mps as well, they’re the ones here who need this sort of thing the most:

LONDON – England – MP Diane Abbott has been threatened with dismissal back to the cabbage fields if she speaks out again against her masters.

“She better not step out of line again or we will turf her out into the fields to work with the other negros. We let her stay in the house but recently she has been displaying rather insubordinate, impudent, behaviour not befitting her place. We’re even thinking of shipping her back to Jamiaca in one of those special ships if she gets any worse,” chief whip master, Ed Miliband told Sky News…

“We certainly can’t have people like Diane Abbott going around answering back to us. She needs to keep her place, and if she does answer back or make any such remarks not befitting her status in the house, she will be unduly removed from her position and despatched either back to where she was first appropriated or put to work in the fields where the lesser of her kind are made to work to death,” the plantation owner said on Sunday.
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February 6, 2012 1:16pm
Viking2

Is that for real. If it is it is just so funny. No wonder the worlds a mess with shit heads like Millibrand.
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February 6, 2012 1:23pm
Griff

http://web.me.com/waltergehr/The_International_Law_of_treaties/Defects_of_consent.html
“An error (Article 48) is a mistaken impression of facts which nullifies consensus. A State may invoke an error if it relates to a fact or situation which was assumed by that State to exist at the time when the treaty was concluded and formed an essential basis of its consent to be bound (Article 48). This provision echoes the adage “omnis conventio intelligitur sic stantibus”: A genuine consensus only exists where all essential facts were equally known by all parties. Nevertheless, a State may only invoke an error, if it has not contributed to it by its own conduct. ”

Time to invoke the error clause
AS there is a distinct difference in the interpretation between government and Maori. This is an error in the treaty which nullifies it
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February 6, 2012 1:25pm
Alan Wilkinson

Griff, absolutely right. Not only that, but some Maori refused to sign, some rebelled and were put down by force and there is no evidence those who signed had free informed consent from those they were committing to it. No question but it fails completely as a valid agreement between two parties.

Neither was it a requirement for sovereignty. The whole South Island was claimed on the basis of discovery, not consent.
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February 6, 2012 1:31pm
Griff

http://web.me.com/waltergehr/The_International_Law_of_treaties/Bona_fide.html
A State Party who wishes to impeach the validity of a treaty, to terminate it, to withdraw from it of to suspend its operation must notify the other parties of its claim in order to give them an opportunity to raise an objection against it. For this purpose, the Vienna Convention foresees a time limit of three months after the receipt of the notification (Article 65(2)). After the end of this time limit, the State can declare the invalidity of the treaty through a document signed by one of its representatives.

give them three months and watch the sparks fly
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February 6, 2012 1:31pm
Southern Raider

So Guyon Espiner gets married by Labour’s Darren Hughes and his fiancee was Darren Hughes PA.

And how was TVNZ expecting this guy to provide a balanced political view?
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February 6, 2012 1:49pm
wat dabney

grumpy,

“Are you saying the right wing types in Aus would welcome boat people who are not white ?”

I’m saying a right-winger, by definition, wouldn’t legislate to obstruct immigration.
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February 6, 2012 2:01pm
F E Smith

wat,

a right-winger, by definition, wouldn’t legislate to obstruct immigration.

Really? By what definition? And when you use the word ‘obstruct’, do you include ‘regulate’?
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February 6, 2012 2:07pm
Southern Raider

As per the Herald article about income disparity in Auckland.

How come the “struggling” family decided to have a 3rd child even though they suggest they struggle to put food on the table for them and their existing two kids?

What cars do they own that cost $160 per week in payments? I’ve got a 23 year old Surf and my wife a Suzuki Swift we live in the “wealthiest” area of Orakei. So they don’t have any money but decided to get some new cars.

They also admit putting a new bedroom suite on credit.

The issue the Herald should focus on is lack of personal responsibility.
1) Don’t have kids if you can’t afford them
2) Save for something or go without instead of using HP/credit
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February 6, 2012 2:12pm
Manolo

More from the demented mullahs that run Iran: http://www.wnd.com/2012/02/ayatollah-kill-all-jews-annihilate-israel/
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February 6, 2012 2:13pm
wat dabney

FES,

By the definition of leftists being collectivists and right-wingers being not.

A right-winger’s legislation would follow from the belief that there is no “them” and “us.”

As for precise wording, you’ll know full well that “regulate” can be used to justify anything and everything.
It is the reason that the federal government in the US came to usurp the intention of the Constitution and came to control the entire economy of the country and the lives of everyone in it (I’m referring to Commerce Clause here of course.)
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February 6, 2012 2:26pm
reid

Don’t see this too often on CNN do we. Wonder why.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhqdguQdG-M&feature=player_embedded

Juggler Pulls Off Epic Recovery
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gegl-NSE-Cs&feature=player_embedded
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February 6, 2012 2:30pm
F E Smith

wat,

but many communists, who are most definitely left wing, are also internationalist in outlook. The Soviet Union spent many years using the Comintern to advance the internationalist outlook. Indeed, one of the main differences between the communists and the Nazis was that the communists were international socialists whereas the Nazis were, of course, nationalist socialists. Both shared a commitment to a controlled, planned economy etc, but differed in outlook.

Even into the 1990s, socialists, as distinct from communists, have often been internationalist in outlook. The current state of the EU is a good example of what happens when predominently socialist governments get together. Indeed, it is well known that Labour in the UK encouraged wholesale immigration during its 1997-2010 stint in power as a means of diversifying the UK- and that decision was made from a Fabian socialist viewpoint.

At the same time, people on the right can either support or oppose unrestricted immigration. I myself do not support unrestricted immigration (although it has some attraction) but definitely support the concept and reasoning behind encouraging immigration as a policy.

So I don’t accept your definition at all. I think it is incorrect.

And you have dodged my question re ‘regulate’. Do you include ‘regulate’ within your defintion of ‘obstruct’? So if immigration is regulated, then that means it is obstructed.
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February 6, 2012 2:36pm
F E Smith

Actually, just while I am bringing in the communists, a great statement from Powerlineblog’s John Hinderaker in response to an interesting column by Janet Daley in The Daily Telegraph:

I think a very partial answer to the question Ms. Daley poses is that leftism has never been based on idealism. It has always been based, for the most part, on hate and envy. So when Communism was conclusively proved to be a failure, leftists (including not only leftists in politics, but more important, leftists in the media and in academia) didn’t change their minds or admit their mistake. For in their eyes, while there may have been disappointment, there was no mistake. Their resentments and hatreds remained. They merely sought other vehicles, other terminologies, other tactics to bring down the West and the free enterprise system and democratic institutions that define it. Yesterday’s socialists are today’s progressives. They barely missed a beat.
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February 6, 2012 2:45pm
reid

Their resentments and hatreds remained. They merely sought other vehicles, other terminologies, other tactics to bring down the West and the free enterprise system and democratic institutions that define it. Yesterday’s socialists are today’s progressives. They barely missed a beat.

It’s a great shame this isn’t mere accepted wisdom as it should be especially amongst the media, for this is exactly and expectedly what has happened. Just like in AGW when the warming data doesn’t suit so the lefties turn to something else and now pretend it’s causing extreme weather. They simply change the meme instead of what a normal person would do which is to realise they were wrong, pack up quietly, go home and never speak of it again. But no, the idiots are so mental they can’t and don’t do that, they just pretend they were merely in a state of temporary misunderstanding about one of the minor and finer nuances of their magnificent theory.

It’s like some mass delusion marching across the land a bit like one of those huge black super-storms they get in Kansas, except this one happens every day, even in summer when its calm.
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February 6, 2012 3:01pm
Griff

thought we were not discussing climate change
so you bring it up you of all people reid

AGW when the warming data doesn’t suit so the lefties turn to something else and now pretend it’s causing extreme weather.

Its always been about the change in climate=extreme weather silly man
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February 6, 2012 3:25pm
Scott Chris

I agree with Wat. If you consider a right winger to be an economic liberal, then a flexible and mobile workforce should ideally be able to move without hindrance, and be motivated to move by labour demand and market forces.

A proponent of a planned economy on the other hand will be far more interested in regulating population movement.
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February 6, 2012 3:37pm
reid

Its always been about the change in climate=extreme weather silly man

No actually Griff until about 5 years ago the global propaganda meme was all about warming temperatures. Which it was. Don’t pretend it wasn’t. We all lived through it. We can all remember. Just because you chose to have a selective memory here don’t pretend to the rest of us who don’t that your meme shifting on AGW didn’t happen about then because it did and you know it.

I’m using AGW to illustrate the point since this is what you do with your poverty and inequality memes as well. You do. It happens. Plain as day. Cannot be denied. Don’t even bother trying because you can’t win. You and every other lefty who promotes any of those memes be they AGW, poverty or inequality, is exposed and naked over your meme shifting and you can’t hide it, except to those within your own ranks who are too emotional about the whole thing to accept they’ve been guilty of the most appalling stupidity but the last I heard, it’s a pretty stupid logic that says the theory is correct just because someone is too emotionally wrapped up in it to admit the plain bald fact that its completely and utterly wrong in every single possible way.
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February 6, 2012 3:39pm
F E Smith

a flexible and mobile workforce should ideally be able to move without hindrance, and be motivated to move by labour demand and market forces.

Yes, and it is just like a lefty to see only extremes when applying ideology. Why is that? Because they don’t want to tell the truth, but instead want to label those they oppose with tags like ‘inconsistent’ or ‘hypocrite’.

A ‘flexible and mobile workforce’ is a good thing and should be able to move with little hindrance. Every country has both the right and obligation to determine who lives within, that is a part of being sovereign. Therefore, if a highly qualified person with a criminal past wishes to enter a country as part of that ‘flexible and mobile’ workforce, then that sovereign nation has the right to refuse that person entry.

Similarly, if an unskilled person wishes to move to a country whose language they do not speak, then there is likely little benefit to the country and therefore that country should be able to refuse that person entry as well.

And if a gangster who makes his money in people trafficking wishes to reside in a new country, then by all means refuse them as well.

All of that is regulation of immigration. All of that is common sense. I am not talking about the racial hatred practiced by the morons of the left wing BNP. I am speaking of good government, not a planned economy.

It is not possible to have a free-for-all, which is what the lefties seem to be implying is right wing ideology, and being an economic liberal does not mean you are terminally stupid. Allowing anybody to emigrate to your country is a recipe for disaster, as is making it difficult for good and constructive people to emigrate to your country.
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February 6, 2012 3:52pm
wat dabney

FES,

If anything Communism is an even more extreme version of ‘them and us,’ albeit based on ideology as much as national boundaries. Whilst they might indeed have let you immigrate it would be on the proviso that you submitted totally as a slave to their commissars. So there is no comparison with a right-wing policy of open immigration (and in practise many those who did immigrate to the workers’ paradise of the Soviet Union were later murdered after falling under suspicion as foreigners.)
The vaunted internationalism of Communism was largely a device to fool useful idiots like George Bernard Shaw. In practise it meant mass murder and the extension of tyranny. Only Capitalism is truly internationalist.

The EU is multilateralist rather than internationalist. It’s still all about ‘them and us.’ And if you’re not one of ‘us’ then you can’t go and live there (and high import tariffs prevent ‘them’ and ‘us’ trading freely with each other.) It’s very hard to see the point of the EU – it has done nothing that individual countries could not have implemented for themselves, and in fact has stripped them of their powers to act truly internationally. It’s just the corrupt political elite who have benefitted. Plus ca change.

“Indeed, it is well known that Labour in the UK encouraged wholesale immigration during its 1997-2010 stint in power as a means of diversifying the UK- and that decision was made from a Fabian socialist viewpoint.”

It was actually made from a cynical political viewpoint. Labour was effectively gerrymandering the entire country in a bid to become the permanent government.

“Every country has both the right and obligation to determine who lives within, that is a part of being sovereign”

By ‘country’ you mean government. And no, it doesn’t have that right or obligation; any more than if we have a show of hands then tell you to pack your bags. I don’t distinguish between you and some bloke from darkest Peru. I’ve never met you. You are the same to me.

“if an unskilled person wishes to move to a country whose language they do not speak, then there is likely little benefit to the country and therefore that country should be able to refuse that person entry as well.”

I should be clear that open immigration goes hand in hand with the abolition of state handouts. A person can only go and live somewhere if he can support himself and his family.
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February 6, 2012 4:03pm
nasska

F E Smith

If a country such as NZ limits its immigration policies to accepting only well qualified, fluent speakers of English who will easily find well paid employment it solves many of its social problems as well. Such new citizens don’t put pressure on welfare, housing or education & may actually be net taxpayers.

Contrast this with the plane loads of uneducated, unhealthy free loaders incapable of working in an iron lung that NZ actually accepts year in & year out.
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February 6, 2012 4:13pm
Scott Chris

F E Smith says:- “Yes, and it is just like a lefty to see only extremes when applying ideology. Why is that? Because they don’t want to tell the truth”

Absolute rubbish. I point out a simple contradiction in your prescribed belief system and you call me a liar because you are too proud to allow for that belief system to be modified.

What I stated in my previous post was not extreme, it’s basic free market theory.

What you could have pointed out is that it is the historic regulation of population movement has actually led to unnatural pressures, which if released would flood the world with economic refugees, but no, you chose to insult me instead.
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February 6, 2012 4:29pm
F E Smith

wat,

By ‘country’ you mean government. And no, it doesn’t have that right or obligation;

Perhaps I should have been clearer: the government of that country is entitled to determine who it allows to emigrate to that country if an application is made by a person wishing to do so.

Others knew what I meant, I apologise that it wasn’t clear enough for you.

The EU is multilateralist rather than internationalist.

Only to a certain extent. The overal goal of many politicians within the EU is integration. That takes it out of a multilateral basis and into an international basis. Your point about tarrifs etc is fair, but not pertinent to immigration.

It was actually made from a cynical political viewpoint. Labour was effectively gerrymandering the entire country in a bid to become the permanent government.

Wow, you said what I was trying to be moderate about! I agree with you completely. That is also why they are vehemently opposed to the re-drawing of parliamentary boundaries on a population basis.

I should be clear that open immigration goes hand in hand with the abolition of state handouts. A person can only go and live somewhere if he can support himself and his family.

On that basis I could be persuaded that (almost complete) open immigration could be acceptable, but try getting that policy through! I still reject your opinion re the right wing and open immigration, however.

So there is no comparison with a right-wing policy of open immigration

I would point you to both the UK and the US immigration policies of the mid/late 19th century.

With regards your points about communism, I allow some of that is accurate, but I disagree with you in a couple of areas:

Whilst they might indeed have let you immigrate it would be on the proviso that you submitted totally as a slave to their commissars.

Without taking you up on the accuracy of the commisar statement, you miss my point a bit: communist ideology is internationalist. It sees revolution as inevitable and as a consequence national boundaries become unnecessary. It is unworkable, but even in trying it out, the implementation fell afoul of your typical left wing problem of a ‘we know best therefore do as we say’ attitude from the Bolsheviks. That attitude permeates the left to this day.

Only Capitalism is truly internationalist.

That is because it isn’t actually an ideology.

Actually, looking back, I think you may be using a different idea of ‘internationalist’ than I am.

Nasska,

exactly. However, I am happy to substitute ‘fluent’ for ‘competent’, or even ‘some’ when it comes to English. But ‘none’ or ‘little’ is not an option.
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February 6, 2012 4:35pm
Griff

reid
The possibility was discussed in lovelocks work around gaiai theory 1978
I was defiantly aware of the impacts of global warming in the mid eighties
Maybe you were only aware of msm at that time pre net and all that
Calling proponents of global warming theory leftist is a straw man I am definitly free market liberal
Got my Christmas cards from roger d to prove it
You often confuse liberal/conservative social policy with free/command market economics
hence your lefty slur
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February 6, 2012 4:39pm
grumpyoldhori

Alan Wilkinson interesting argument you are putting forward, the treaty should be null and void.
And of course you are saying that all NZ laws should be reset back to 1840 with we Maori owning all the land.
Hey, great idea that land my neighbors house sits on will bring me a few bob in ground rental.

It boils down to be careful of what you wish for, you may get it in spades
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February 6, 2012 4:42pm
F E Smith

Scott Chris,

I point out a simple contradiction in your prescribed belief system and you call me a liar because you are too proud to allow for that belief system to be modified.

There is no contradiction in my belief system. I just see the right wing as a broad church that allows for differences of view within the same basic structure. You, being a lefty, want to shoehorn us into one particular view that you can then mock us when we don’t adhere to it strictly.

because you are too proud to allow for that belief system to be modified.

Not at all. As I said, being right wing is a broad church, with everything from true economic liberals (such as ACT try to be) to the moderates (like the Nats) and so on. Ergo, one can want to control immigration and still be right wing.

What you could have pointed out is that it is the historic regulation of population movement has actually led to unnatural pressures, which if released would flood the world with economic refugees,

Regulation has been haphazard over the centuries, but it is a reality today that we cannot get away from. The UK is a great example of what happens when there is unrestricted immigration of the unskilled.

But why am I discussing this with you? That is a complete waste of time given your propensities.
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February 6, 2012 4:44pm
bereal

Interested in getting up to speed on Maori culture ?

Get hold of a copy of ‘ Defenders of New Zealand.’ (T W Gudgeon) published 1856 odd
Try page 609 for eg. ‘Tales of the Maori’

It begins, “Some of the torture inflicted at times on prisoners of war may be interesting to show
the strange spirit that existed, especially by those who were acknowledged by the tribe to be
first class warriors.”

What follows in the next few pages is a graphic description of several methods and would turn the
guts of anyone. i am so sorry that i read it because i will not be able to erase it from my mind for a long time.

The section concludes, “The man who could stand by and see all this without showing by speech
or action that he pittied the sufferer was considered a warrior of the first degree, as his heart was
hard and all pity had left his breast.”

The way the children were encouraged to participte is instructive.

They could make a good torture session last for days before the toturee was eaten.

When you consider that this shit was going on less than 200 years ago you can get a bit of a handle
on why Maori are able to murder so many of their children without any real word of condemnation from
their current leaders.
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February 6, 2012 4:46pm
mikenmild

So Maori today can be violent because 200 years ago some of them were torturers? Gee, how long ago did the English stop hanging, drawing and quartering – 300 years? So we only have 100 years to go and all will be hunky dory in Maoridom?
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February 6, 2012 4:53pm
Griff

null and viod the treaty does not change the laws of land ownership it just puts the treaty back were it belongs history
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February 6, 2012 4:56pm
bereal

mikenmild,
Not many English were cannibals.
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February 6, 2012 5:09pm
mikenmild

Probably only those who believed in transubstantiation!
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February 6, 2012 5:19pm
bereal

Even those ones were not cannibals and even the poms only hung drawn and quartered criminals.

They didn’t make on art form out of systematic torture and involve their children in it as a matter
of culture.

See the difference mikenmild ?
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February 6, 2012 5:36pm
Other_Andy

@Griff
Ah, the great switcheroo.
Yes, Global Warming and Climate Change have been used intermittingly. However, until recently Climate Change meant Global warming. The meme was that “Anthropogenic CO2 was a greenhouse gas that was the cause of global warming”. ALL Global Warming proponents (Including you) warned that the Climate Change we would see was warming as a result of Anthropogenic CO2. As a result of Global warming we would see glaciers melt, the Arctic sea ice disappear and no more snow in the UK. You agreed with the Global Warming meme. Any evidence we posted that temperature rises were not out of the ordinary or caused by Anthropogenic CO2 were dismissed by you. You earlier stated that you believe that anthropogenic CO2 is the dominant cause of the global warming.
For you, Mann, Gore, Trenberth and all the others, Climate Change is and always has been synonymous with Global Warming. Even this week you protested when I posted cold records on Kiwiblog.
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February 6, 2012 5:36pm
reid

Experts view: The Euro has no future:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/the-experts-view-on-the-euros-future-it-doesnt-have-one-6298180.html
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February 6, 2012 5:40pm
Viking2

Talking of immigaration and its great scams.
this last week we have been interviewing young ladies for a job vacancy.
So winz send us some along with their CV’s etc. Now we have had good results with this so am happy to continue.
Interviewee.
Um. Just moved to the area to be with her dad. Been in NZ about 1 year.
questions. Ok so not your Dad really. Well no. I come from Samoa and they came up and adopted me as a family member so I could get NZ residence etc. so you have been adopted just before you arrived. Well yes. I am whanau though.

so you have been here and collecting a benefit since when ? A while ago.
So who is the other girls that you referred? Oh well that’s my adopted sister. and it goes on along the same lines.

Now what pisses us off is. She could hardly manage an English conversation which is no use to us. Her schooling was average which my be ok but not good.
She apparently has been collecting a benefit. How she is entitled I have no idea.
Winz have her on a job placement list ahead of Kiwi’s born and bred.
What the fucks going on here?
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February 6, 2012 5:56pm
Griff

Other_Andy
climate change, global warming, anthropological climate change etc are all the same thing
We will not win you or me
Why not wait a couple of years and bring it up again
I only hit Reid up for his definition that only lefty’s believe in global warming
I find as a member of act for twenty two years his accusation insulting
I have all ready stated that the larger temperature difference between pole and equator will bring more extremes of weather this is well known As is the fact that cyclones need 26 c water to stay a tropical cyclone our summer water temp can hit as high as 24c 2 more degrees and we will get tropical cyclones
Go read lovelock on gaiai theory its in there and that dates from 1978

Any way the discussion around global warming has been flogged to death on KB so can it just be dropped
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February 6, 2012 5:59pm
fatnuts

Griff, I’d drop it when NZ drops any carbon trading, Kyoto protol or any other wealth distributions being inflicted on the basis of its ‘truth’.
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February 6, 2012 6:05pm
Griff

carbon trading, Kyoto protol or any other wealth distributions

Is the problem with it that you all have as do I

shit you think thats bad go to frog blog and read for a bit there is crap on there that would make you reach for the ak47 if they get in to power
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February 6, 2012 6:10pm
fatnuts

Yep, there’s a real danger when a society increasingly values things that have no intrinsic value.
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February 6, 2012 6:16pm
Griff

The “green” part of me says best option release this shit and watch the co2 problem disappear
http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/6369414/Kiwi-scientist-urges-halt-to-doomsday-flu-research
😈
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February 6, 2012 6:21pm
Scott Chris

F E Smith says:- “I just see the right wing as a broad church that allows for differences of view within the same basic structure.”

Of course you do. Those who blindly accept any prescribed code with all its inherent anomalies have no choice but to hold that view, and the doubt they inevitably harbour manifests itself as hostility towards those who seek to reconcile those anomalies.

>>”But why am I discussing this with you?”

Y’know, one of the things I do like about most religions is their emphasis on coming to terms the blindness that stems from human pride. I suggest you focus on that aspect of your faith.

>>”That is a complete waste of time given your propensities”

I have a propensity to try to rationalize everything in an attempt to move closer to the Truth, so I guess you are right in that regard:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hGvQtumNAY
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February 6, 2012 6:21pm
fatnuts

Griff, I think you just made the CIA watch list.
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February 6, 2012 6:27pm
bereal

Watching the Superbowl today i was struck with a thought.

‘What the fuck has gone wrong with New Zealand and why ?

When you see the obvious emotion in the players and crowd when America the Beautiful and
the National Anthem are sung, hands on hearts, tears, genuine emotion and love of their country
and then, back here in New Zealand.

Nobody seems to give much of a fuck about Anzac Day anymore, certainly nothing like it was even
just a few years ago. Cut back so its all over by midday.
Nothing in comparison to how the Aussies regard it.

Waitangi Day is a fuckup, everything screamed down by a bunch of shitheads.
Can you immagine the yanks tolerating that sort of crap on Thanksgiving day ?

Even the fucking All Blacks wont sing our national anthem.

What the fuck has gone wrong ?
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February 6, 2012 6:30pm
Viking2

For bereal and others of his ilk.

http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/430021_318333161546262_233900959989483_955937_965955593_n.jpg
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February 6, 2012 6:37pm
Griff

http://www.nzsis.govt.nz/methods/collect.html

NZSIS collects information from a variety of places. Some is available from open or official sources, such as the internet,
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February 6, 2012 6:38pm
Southern Raider

Agree Bereal

Just saw on the news they made a concession for some protesters to walk around the flag pole. How did they pay this back? One of them smacking it with a stick and another spitting on it.

Its always nice to see that most of the white protesters hanging out with the lunatic Maori fringe aren’t actually Kiwi’s. Just look at that Irish prick from Unite that managed to make his way to Waitangi
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February 6, 2012 6:44pm
Nostalgia-NZ

bereal 6.30

The Superbowl is a sport event, loved by its enthusiasts. I don’t think you can link it to more than that.

Generational changes might be effecting Anzac Day, but RSA’s and the like have been on the decline for 30years, a time before children and grandchildren of ex servicemen could become members.

Waitangi Day is what you make of it as an individual, for some the result of the Courts recognising ‘the spirit’ of the agreement between those fluent in English and writing and those fluent in oral history and with expectation of fairness and partnership. There must have been honesty intended that day because the written word was chosen to be sealed with those unable to read but expressing faith. As a kiwi I feel an obligation to that and recognition of the shortcomings in language or even having an education should not be to the detriment of the party less favoured by time with the results of the Treaty.

On your final point – The All Blacks won the world cup, so nothing is wrong.
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February 6, 2012 6:55pm
Griff

Three guys are captured by a tribe of natives in New Zealand. They are brought before the tribal leader who gives them a choice. He says, “what will you have, death or bunga?”. The first guys thinks, hmmm wonder what bunga is. “I’ll take the bunga”. The tribal leader says, “good”. Then a dozen tribal members line up and give it to him in the rear. The tribal leader turns to the second guy and gives him the choice, death, or bunga. The second guy thinks, hmm, that bunga thing is pretty nasty. But death is permanent, “I’ll take the bunga”. Tribal leader says, “good”, and a hundred tribesmen line up and give him the bunga. The tribal leader gives the choice to the third captive. He thinks a while, hmm, first it was a dozen, then it was a hundred, I don’t know man. Heck with it, “I’ll take death”. The tribal leader says, “good, death …. by bunga”.
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February 6, 2012 7:02pm
nasska

Ban Dihydrogen Monoxide! The Invisible Killer

Dihydrogen monoxide is colorless, odorless, tasteless, and kills uncounted thousands of people every year. Most of these deaths are caused by accidental inhalation of DHMO, but the dangers of dihydrogen monoxide do not end there. Prolonged exposure to its solid form causes severe tissue damage. Symptoms of DHMO ingestion can include excessive sweating and urination, and possibly a bloated feeling, nausea, vomiting and body electrolyte imbalance. For those who have become dependent, DHMO withdrawal means certain death.

Dihydrogen monoxide:

is also known as hydric acid, and is the major component of acid rain.
contributes to the “greenhouse effect.”
may cause severe burns.
contributes to the erosion of our natural landscape.
accelerates corrosion and rusting of many metals.
may cause electrical failures and decreased effectiveness of automobile brakes.
has been found in excised tumors of terminal cancer patients.

CONTAMINATION IS REACHING EPIDEMIC PROPORTIONS!

Quantities of dihydrogen monoxide have been found in almost every stream, lake, and reservoir in America today. The pollution is global, and the contaminant has even been found in Antarctic ice. In the midwest alone DHMO has caused millions of dollars of property damage.

Despite the danger, dihydrogen monoxide is often used:

as an industrial solvent and coolant.
in nuclear power plants.
in the production of styrofoam.
as a fire retardant.
in many forms of cruel animal research.
in the distribution of pesticides. Even after washing, produce remains contaminated by this chemical.
as an additive in certain “junk-foods” and other food products.

Companies dump waste DHMO into rivers and the ocean, and nothing can be done to stop them because this practice is still legal. The impact on wildlife is extreme, and we cannot afford to ignore it any longer!

THE HORROR MUST BE STOPPED!

The American government has refused to ban the production, distribution, or use of this damaging chemical due to its “importance to the economic health of this nation.” In fact, the navy and other military organizations are conducting experiments with DHMO, and designing multi-billion dollar devices to control and utilize it during warfare situations. Hundreds of military research facilities receive tons of it through a highly sophisticated underground distribution network. Many store large quantities for later use.

IT’S NOT TOO LATE!

Act NOW to prevent further contamination. Find out more about this dangerous chemical. What you don’t know can hurt you and others throughout the world.
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February 6, 2012 7:42pm
Griff

ha ha did not some one in the greens once fall for that

just like when the Maori woman league and the Anglican church indorsed a re written apartheid leaflet from south Africa
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February 6, 2012 7:43pm
Pauleastbay

Sue Kedgley was on it big time – because this stuff was flowing into Wellington Harbour
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February 6, 2012 7:45pm
Griff

The first is Smurf Sex. This happens during the honeymoon; you both keep doing it until you’re blue in the face. The second is Kitchen Sex. This is at the beginning of the marriage; you’ll have sex anywhere, anytime. Including the kitchen. The third kind is Bedroom Sex. You’ve calmed down a bit, perhaps have kids, so you’ve got to do it in the bedroom. The fourth kind is Hallway Sex. This is where you pass each other in the hallway and say, “Screw you!” There is also a fifth kind of sex: Courtroom Sex. This is when you get divorced and your wife screws you in front of everyone in the court.
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February 6, 2012 7:48pm
Scott Chris

bereal says:- “What the fuck has gone wrong ?”

It’s miserable fuckwits like you who don’t have a good word to say about anyone ‘that’s gone wrong’.

Fortunately you’re in the minority.
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February 6, 2012 7:48pm
bereal

Viking2 , thanks for that link, you might not be a bad bloke after all.

Nostalgia-NZ, you just missed the point entirely.
It was obvious watching the Superbowl that Americans love their country.
They show it unashamedly. As Southern Raider says, people here spit on their country
and that sort of shit is accepted. Also you seem to be totally fucked up over the ‘Treaty.”
Take a trip to anywhere in Australia next Anzac day Nostalgia you will learn something.
Your whole post is a load of PC crap.

i just saw that prize fucking prick Joris de Bres on the TV. i don’t know where that prick comes
from but he can fuck off back. He just said,
“Protest is part of who we are in New Zealand, we must accept that.”

Guess what Joris, i don’t accept it, you bludging parasite.
You are a big part of the problem Joris, fuck off.
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February 6, 2012 7:48pm
bereal

Hey, little Scot Chris,
i just said something almost nice to Viking2
You little tosspot.
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February 6, 2012 7:52pm
Griff

i just saw that prize fucking prick Joris de Bres on the TV. i don’t know where that prick comes
from but he can fuck off back.

So do we all problem is the racist bastard is from here
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February 6, 2012 7:58pm
nasska

A university graduate applied for a job at the Security
Intelligence Service.

Together with several other applicants, he was given a
sealed envelope and told to take it to the fourth floor.

As soon as the young man was alone, he stepped into
an empty hallway and opened the packet.

Inside, a message read:
“You’re our kind of person. Report to the fifth floor.”
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February 6, 2012 8:00pm
Griff

The officer reported to the watch commander about having no luck with the witness.
“Did you browbeat him, yell at him, and ask him every question you could come up with?” asked the watch commander.
“I certainly did.”
“And?”
“And he said, ‘Yes dear you’re right,’ and dozed off!”

1 4 luc
A man was made the police chief in a nudist colony. He liked the job, but putting on the badge was murder!
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February 6, 2012 8:01pm
Nostalgia-NZ

bereal 7.48

Americans don’t all love their country or the American way and to that get confused with a sports event is a bit of a worry.

One person spits on a flag pole that in any other day of the year is regularly visited. So what?

Jorez de Bres made a good point, people are entitled to protest in a lawful way, and in NZ quite often in ways that might be unlawful. Apart from that I agree with you.
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February 6, 2012 8:02pm
bereal

That talk about Maoris calling each other niggers yesterday brought to mind
a quote from John Gotti, recorded on an FBI tape.

“Me, I dont wish ill to anyone, not even to a nigger, not even to a fucking, sucking nigger.”

Needs to be heard in a Brooklyn accent to get the full benefit.
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February 6, 2012 8:07pm
Nostalgia-NZ

Old John Gotti had way with words.
I expect he wrote some poems as well.
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February 6, 2012 8:15pm
nasska

A woman in South Auckland asks her husband, “Where are you going Wiremu?”.

“Down to the pub”, he replies.

She says “I’m really tired. Hit me now so you don’t wake me up later”.
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February 6, 2012 8:16pm
Nostalgia-NZ

Of course you don’t ‘write’ a poem.
You compose it.
I was just having a bit of fun between the full stops.
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February 6, 2012 8:20pm
Griff

A litle old Amish lady is trotting down the road in her horse and buggy when she is pulled over by a cop.
“Ma’am, I’m not going to ticket you, but I do have to issue you a warning. You have a broken reflector on your buggy.”
“Oh, I’ll let my husband Jacob know as soon as I get home,” said the little old Amish lady.
“That’s fine,” said the officer.
“Another thing, ma’am. I don’t like the way that one rein loops across the horse’s back and around one of his testicles. I consider that animal abuse. That’s cruelty to animals. Have your husband take care of that right away!”
Later that day, the little old Amish lady is home telling her husband about her encounter with the cop.
“Well, what exactly did he say?” said the husband.
“He said the reflector is broken.”
“I can fix that in two minutes. What else?”
“I’m not sure,” said the little old Amish lady, “something about the emergency brake….”
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February 6, 2012 8:24pm
fatnuts

“Piri feeding daughter inappropriate: pro-breastfeeding groups”

Who do these people think they are to tell a man he can’t feed his kid?

Full marks to Piri for telling them to get stuffed. None of their damned business.
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February 6, 2012 8:29pm
Nostalgia-NZ

What about a poem called…

‘Waitangi my flagpole baby.’

Sort of Austin Powers style,
except for eating the babies
like fat bastard wrote.
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February 6, 2012 8:31pm
nasska

At the senior citizens luncheon, an elderly gentleman and
an elderly lady struck up a conversation and discovered that they both
loved to fish. Since both of them were widowed, they decided to go
fishing together the next day.

The gentleman picked the lady up and they headed to the river to his
fishing boat and started out on their adventure. They were riding along,
when they came upon a fork in the river and the gentleman asked, “Do you
want to go up or down?”

All of a sudden, the lady stripped off her shirt and pants
and made mad passionate love to the man right there in the boat. When
they finished, the man couldn’t believe what had just happened, but he
had experienced the best sex that he’d had in years.

They fished for a while and then continued riding along, when soon they
came upon another fork in the river. He asked the lady, “Do you want
to go up or down?”

There she went again, stripping off her clothes to make wild,
passionate love to him again. This really impressed the old
gentleman, so he asked her to go fishing again the next day.

She said yes, and so there they were the next day riding in the boat,
when they came upon the fork in the river. The gentleman asked, “Well,
do you want to go up or down?” The woman replied, “Down.”

A little puzzled, the gentleman drove the boat down the river, when he
came upon another fork. He asked the lady, “Do you want to go up or
down?” She replied, “Up.”

This really confused the gentleman, so he asked “What’s the deal?
Yesterday, every time I asked you if you wanted to go up or down, you
made passionate love to me. Now today, nothing.”

She replied, “Well, yesterday I didn’t have my hearing aid in, and I
thought you were saying, ‘Fuck or drown!'”
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February 6, 2012 8:32pm
Griff

A police officer came upon a terrible wreck where the driver and passenger had been killed.
As he looked upon the wreckage a little monkey came out of the brush and hopped around the crashed car. The officer looked down at the monkey and said “I wish you could talk.”
The monkey looked up at the officer and shook his head up and down.
“You can understand what I’m saying?” asked the officer.
Again, the monkey shook his head up and down.
“Well, did you see this?”
“Yes,” motioned the monkey.
“What happened?”
The monkey pretended to have a can in his hand and turned it up by his mouth.
“They were drinking?” asked the officer.
“Yes.”
“What else?”
The monkey pinched his fingers together and held them to his mouth.
“They were smoking marijuana?”
“Yes.”
“Now wait, you’re saying your owners were drinking and smoking before they wrecked.”
“Yes.”
“What were you doing during all this?”
“Driving” motioned the monkey.
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February 6, 2012 8:33pm
nasska

If you think you have had a bad day……
On your way home from work, stop at your pharmacy and go to the
thermometer section and purchase a rectal thermometer made by Johnson &
Johnson, be very sure you get this brand. When you get home, lock your
doors, draw the curtains and disconnect the phone so you will not be
disturbed.

Change into very comfortable clothing and sit in your favorite chair.
Open the package and remove the thermometer. Now, carefully place it on
a table or a surface so that it will not become chipped or broken.

Now the fun part begins. Take out the literature from the box and read
it carefully. You will notice that in small print there is a statement:

“Every Rectal Thermometer made by Johnson & Johnson is personally tested
and then sanitized “.

Your day could be worse, you could work for Johnson & Johnson.
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February 6, 2012 8:43pm
Griff

The elderly Italian man went to his parish priest and asked if the priest would hear his confession.

“Of course, my son,” said the priest.

“Well, Father, at the beginning of World War Two, a beautiful woman knocked on my door and asked me to hide her from the Germans; I hid her in my attic, and they never found her.”

“That’s a wonderful thing, my son, and nothing that you need to confess,” said the priest.

“It’s worse, Father; I was weak, and told her that she had to pay for rent of the attic with her sexual favors,” continued the old man.

“Well, it was a very difficult time, and you took a large risk – you would have suffered terribly at their hands if the Germans had found you hiding her; I know that God, in his wisdom and mercy, will balance the good and the evil, and judge you kindly,” said the priest.

“Thanks, Father,” said the old man. “That’s a load off of my mind. Can I ask another question?”

“Of course, my son,” said the priest.

The old man asked, “Do I need to tell her that the war is over?”
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February 6, 2012 8:54pm
nasska

Man walks into a shrink`s office..

Shrink: “I know exactly why you are here. You suffer from an addiction to internet porn, and you masturbate constantly.”
Patient: “That`s amazing”! “How can you tell all that without even asking me one question?”
Shrink: “I saw the wedding ring on your finger.”
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February 6, 2012 9:00pm
Griff

My girlfriend came and sat next to me on the sofa with a sad look on her face.

“Cheer up,” I said.

“Oh I’m OK,” she sighed, “just a bit sad.”

“You’re fab,” I said.

“Thanks,” she said.

“You’re mine,” I said.

“I know silly!” she chuckled.

“I love you,” I said.

“Aww!” she gushed, “that’s so lovely!”

“Marry me,” I said.

She squealed with joy and stood up and started clapping like a seal: “Yes!” she bellowed. “Yes! Yes! Yes!”

I looked up at her and said, “Yes what?”

“Yes, I will marry you!” she beamed.

“Fuck off!” I said. “Here, have a Love Heart.”
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February 6, 2012 9:03pm
bereal

a couple of contestants are sitting in the waiting room to go on a game show where the
panel of experts have to guess their occupation. She asks him, ‘Well. what are you ?”
He replies,’I’m a cowboy, i ride the range, I rope and I brand and I muster the cattle, what about you ?

She says,” I’m a lesbian, I think about cunt all day long, I wake up thinking about cunt, I’m obsessed with
cunt, when I go to bed I think about cunt and then when I fall asleep I dream about cunt, I can
almost smell it, I’m a lesbian.”

The coyboy is called out first. The gameshow host says, ‘Now before we begin, the panel can’t hear you yet,
please tell the lsteners at home what you are.

He says, “well when I came in here I thought I was a cowboy, but now I’m pretty sure that
I’m a lesbian.”
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February 6, 2012 9:04pm
Griff

Democracy: Where any two idiots outvote a genius.

You should never argue with idiots because they will just drag you down to their level….then beat you with experience!!!!!!!
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February 6, 2012 9:08pm
Griff

Mary had a little sheep,
And with this sheep
She went to sleep.
The sheep turned out
To be a ram
And Mary had a little lamb!

Under SOPA, you could get 5 years for uploading a Michael Jackson song. One year more than the doctor who killed him
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February 6, 2012 9:15pm
nasska

One for “kowtow” & I’m off:

I’ve written a play about the Irish potato famine….

Murphy: “Have you got any potatoes, Paddy?”

Paddy: “No.”

The end.
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February 6, 2012 9:21pm
bereal

One of the best jokes this year is Dotcoms bodyguard, Wayne Tempero.

When the cops raided Dotcoms mansion and couldn’t find Dotcom it took Wayne about 30 seconds of questioning before Wayne spilt his guts and
took them to where his boss was hiding in his panic room.

Now there is a dude that was realy worth every penny of what Dotcom was paying him.

i don’t think Wayne is going to be getting much more bodyguarding work any time soon.
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February 6, 2012 9:26pm
Griff

This one is for marina
And any one who knows the song nothing rhymes with …..

There is a young girl from Regina
who got a hairy vagina
if you give it a lick
a hair it will stick
and give you something to remind ya
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February 6, 2012 9:31pm
Griff

bereal

good to see you have cheered up today
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February 6, 2012 9:33pm
bereal

Thanks Griff,
feeling much better today.

Hey, i was Ok yesterday till about 9 pm or so, then i lost it a bit.
“tis a terrible thing, the drink.”

Good luck to your family.
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February 6, 2012 11:50pm
Manolo

A beast is set free: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2097108/Extraordinarily-dangerous-radical-Muslim-cleric-Abu-Qatada-freed-days-judge-grants-bail.html
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February 7, 2012 6:42am

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