General Debate 5 September 2011

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Scott Chris

Florida Bans Saggy Pants:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/30/us-florida-saggypants-idUSTRE77T60Y20110830

Kids told to belt up.

Morning Elaycee. Found that sense of humour yet?
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September 5, 2011 8:14am
Elaycee

Morning, Scott Chris. Humour is alive and well at this end. Only thing that sours the mood here, is when someone tells porkies. 🙂
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September 5, 2011 8:21am
Longknives

Scott Chris- The Baggy Pants saga continues:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/celebrities/5561799/Green-Day-singer-ejected-from-flight
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September 5, 2011 8:22am
Griff

Scott Chris
At times your comments need careful reading and thought to dissimulate what you are saying. Please keep that up as it is at times extremely amusing to see the misunderstandings of your comments.
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September 5, 2011 8:33am
Scott Chris

Longknives – yes, apparently it has happened before:

http://greendayblog.canalblog.com/images/Green_Day1.jpg

I don’t object to low-slung pants, but this is going a bit far.
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September 5, 2011 8:35am
Scott Chris

Griff – cheers. Life is full of contradictions, which can be quite funny.
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September 5, 2011 8:39am
nasska

It’s good to know that despite the GFC & the orchestrated crap over AGW there are still social engineers & pedagogues out there prepared to give up their time & channel their efforts into dictating the altitude of waistbands. Regardless of whether we would wear our clothes in a similar fashion it is simply none of our business.

First they came for baggy pants…next will be builders’ crack.
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September 5, 2011 8:40am
Longknives

I do however, strongly object to the article referring to Green Day as a “Punk’ band.
A 40 year old mainstream pop star wearing eyeliner and pretending he’s a 15 year-old skater doesn’t meet the definition of “Punk’ in my books. The Sex Pistols or Black Flag they certainly are not….
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September 5, 2011 8:41am
hj

In Aotearoa/NZ Maori studies departments are politically rather than academically based.
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September 5, 2011 8:42am
Scott Chris

Yeah – more “Punk Pop” than “Punk Rock”. Still, I quite like Basket Case and American Idiot.
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September 5, 2011 8:54am
pdm

Hawkes Bay ITM Championship Winners and automatically promoted to the premiership in 2012.

WELL DONE THE BAY!!!!!
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September 5, 2011 8:59am
Inventory2

Does anyone else find it ironic (and of deep concern) that The Comedian was discharged without conviction for sexually abusing his four-year-old daughter, whilst Cameron Slater was convicted for revelaing The Comedian’s name?

http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/2011/09/irony-for-monday-morning.html

Where’s the justice?
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September 5, 2011 9:08am
leftyliberal

The early stuff was better (get off my lawn), you know, when they actually were 15 year-old skaters, though the lyrical content has generally improved (American Idiot onwards)
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September 5, 2011 9:11am
Longknives

I had their Dookie Album when I was a young buck- They were okay back then. Still, they are about as ‘punk rock’ as Avril Lavigne.
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September 5, 2011 9:15am
kowtow

IV2

No matter what happens on the streets or elsewhere the courts are very serious about guarding their position as almost sacrosanct. So as Slaters actions are a form of contempt of court and he therefor warrants serious action.

There are good reasons for a serious approach to contempt of court that I agree with but in many instances it only leads to the law being considered an ass. You make a good point and this surely is one of those occassions.
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September 5, 2011 9:24am
Longknives

IV2- I’d use the term ‘Comedian’ sparingly… I suspect if this guy ever has the nerve/gall to front the TV cameras in NZ again most viewers will throw up all over their TV sets.
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September 5, 2011 9:36am
Elaycee

@Inventory2 / Longknives – I find it totally appalling that someone (regardless of whether they have been ‘partying’ for 12 hours or not), couldn’t differentiate between an adult and a four year old.

I can totally understand why the former partner has given him the flick – his actions were repugnant and a total betrayal of trust for the kiddie concerned. The fact that he has not been punished by the Court, is totally unbelievable.

Un-fricken-believable.
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September 5, 2011 9:44am
DavidC

Well with any luck…

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/5564731/Call-to-sack-racist-Maori-academic
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September 5, 2011 9:49am
Longknives

Elaycee- Agree 100%- From what I’ve read a staggering decision.

DavidC- Fat chance. Could you imagine the screams of ‘racism’ if anyone tried to wedge Mutu out of her cosy taxpayer -funded ‘Academic’ position?
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September 5, 2011 10:02am
DavidC

Yip..as the article said…Auck Uni is scared of her.
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September 5, 2011 10:08am
Murray

I’m not, nor should any other Kiwi be. http://www.howtolaw.co.nz/html/ml212.asp

write a letter today. I say I’ve been insulted to the value of $1. As has every other New Zealander. Open the wallet and lets make this right lady.

ALL of us.

My compensation can be donated to the SPCA.
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September 5, 2011 10:28am
Sonny Blount

Longknives (397) Says:
September 5th, 2011 at 8:41 am
I do however, strongly object to the article referring to Green Day as a “Punk’ band.
A 40 year old mainstream pop star wearing eyeliner and pretending he’s a 15 year-old skater doesn’t meet the definition of “Punk’ in my books. The Sex Pistols or Black Flag they certainly are not….

Ah the Sex Pistols. Malcolm McClarens manufactured pop group.
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September 5, 2011 10:31am
Longknives

According to Malcolm McLaren Sonny- But his version of history was always rather distorted. Malcolm always claimed he was the ‘evil svengali’ of the Sex Pistols but in reality they were always Steve Jones’s band. Malcolm also claimed they couldn’t play any instruments when he ‘discovered them’- yet they formed from another band! Have a listen to Never Mind the Bollocks some day and tell me if these guys were simply a group of ‘kids who couldn’t play an instrument’ as McLaren always claimed…
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September 5, 2011 10:38am
Inventory2

@ Elaycee/Longknives/Kowtow – according to media reports from the sentencing, one of the factors taken into account was the child’s comment on a video interview that she wanted to be with her daddy. What four-year-old DOESN’T want to be with her father, if she has one? It’s almost as though the learned judge was looking for reasons to justify a decision made on emotion rather than according to law.

Could one of our legal eagles please advise whether or not it is possible for the Crown to appeal against a discharge without conviction?
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September 5, 2011 10:57am
Mick Mac

Inventory
I’ve often thought that we should be able to appeal what we think is an unjust sentence or not and cause a review of the magistrate or judge!

Remember the lads in Queenstown who were let off after failing at a burglary and got caught on camera in the act?
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September 5, 2011 11:11am
Courage Wolf

Who wants a tax receipt?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXZBynk44d4
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September 5, 2011 1:07pm
Griff

Is this what the comic was thinking that night?
http://tvnz.co.nz/entertainment-news/fake-boobs-child-beauty-pageant-4383642
some things are sick
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September 5, 2011 1:49pm
bc

Re: The Green Day singer

While still “low-riding” at 39 shows an appalling lack of fashion sense, you really got to wonder what power trip that flight attendant was on. Delusions of grandeur of being a waiter in the sky!
Besides, at least the Green Day singer wasn’t doing a Gerard!!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/celebritynews/8707789/Gerard-Depardieu-sorry-to-have-urinated-on-plane-carpet.html
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September 5, 2011 2:44pm
bc

And speaking of singers not showing their age – it appears Tiki Taane and the police have “kissed and made up”.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=10749466

(ie the police knew it would be thrown out of court so kept it going as long as they could to make things uncomfortable for him).
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September 5, 2011 3:26pm
tom hunter

So we have freedom of speech, breastfeeding while driving, the adventures of Happy Foot and child abuse as the day’s topics – plus some of the usual politics with ACT and the Greens.

Can I make plea for this as a worthy subject: Greek Two Year Bonds Hit 50%. I think they were 40% when I last checked a couple of weeks ago: in just two weeks there has been a 10% rise in the interest rate needed to get somebody to buy the damned things:

Talks over new bailout funds for Greece were suspended Friday amid disagreements over how to fill a government-deficit gap that once again is veering off track
…
“I expect a hard default definitely before March, maybe this year, and it could come with this program review,” said a senior IMF economist who is keeping close tabs on the situation. “The chances for a second program are slim.”

Bye bye Greece. But don’t worry – you’ll be better off back with the Drachma, even if the import prices kill you for a while.

The real question is what it means for the rest of us?
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September 5, 2011 3:30pm
mikenmild

And those Greeks still haven’t said thank you to the Germans for lending them the money!
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September 5, 2011 4:02pm
Griff

mikenmild

Do you know when the musket wars ended?
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September 5, 2011 4:08pm
mikenmild

Yes.
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September 5, 2011 4:16pm
tom hunter

And those Greeks still haven’t said thank you to the Germans for lending them the money!

Indeed, they’re even sueing the German magazine that summarised the Greek attitude towards Europe with this photoshop.

I admit I pissed myself laughing when I saw it.
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September 5, 2011 4:34pm
Griff

mikenmild
You have in the past stated that the musket wars were over by 1830 Still have that view point?
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September 5, 2011 4:34pm
mikenmild

Griff
No, they were largely over by the mid-1830s, but there were some conflicts up to about 1842 I believe.
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September 5, 2011 4:37pm
Scott Chris

“The real question is what it means for the rest of us?”

According to Bernard Hickey, the Greeks’ best option is to default on their loans, and refinance, forcing their bankers to take a ‘haircut’. If the new European rules forcing banks to carry greater liquid reserves has actually eventuated, it will determine whether or not another credit crunch will occur. Hopefully the Aussi banks are fairly well insulated from the risk, but in Europe, who knows how many businesses are on the cusp of folding in the face of disappearing credit?
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September 5, 2011 4:39pm
mikenmild

tom
Ha ha. So they want their money back? Poor Germans, why are they so disliked?
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September 5, 2011 4:39pm
Griff

That means that the musket wars must have had some relevance to the signing of the treaty
A current internal conflict would be taken into account when sighing a treaty with a foreign power
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September 5, 2011 4:45pm
tom hunter

According to Bernard Hickey,….

Cough. Hack!

But in this case I agree with him. The Greek people surely cannot go on with this nonsense, which is seeing them get broken just to hold the bloody Euro together; if Greece goes how far behind might Spain, Italy and others be in ther words? My answer is that they’ll go anyway and that the Euro is doomed – or at least will be left as a glorified Deutschmark.

Of course there have been all the usual threats about Greece being unable to borrow on international capital markets if they default. However, I can’t help wondering if more Europeans are looking at the example of Iceland. Admittedly they’re a tiny economy, but the same threats were made at the time and they don’t appear to have suffered greatly from voting against the tax-payer bailout of their insane banks. They actually did give the finger to all the screamers, mainly in Britain, who’d swallowed the sales pitches and ploughed their money into these Icelandic shams, basically reinforcing the old message of caveat emptor.

When I put up my first post I have to admit that I’d missed the very bottom of the article I linked to, re the impact of a Greek default on other institutions. I’d assumed all the usual suspects like RBS and Barclays, but if the LIBOR chart is anything to go by …

That’s right: CSFB and UBS. It appears that in a parody of Biblical allegory, the first shall indeed be last, as what was once a bastion of liquidity and solvency, Switzerland and its indomitable banks, is the first to topple should Greece finally be kicked out.

The Swiss banks? Holy shit!
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September 5, 2011 4:54pm
mikenmild

Griff

‘A current internal conflict would be taken into account when sig[n]ing a treaty with a foreign power’.

You make it sound like some question of international law. The Musket Wars had some effect on British opinion, especially in terms of concerns about those suplying the muskets, but the primary motivation for Hobson’s mission was the prospect of uncontrolled colonisation. In particular, the plans of the NZ Company seemed to have moved thye British to act.
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September 5, 2011 5:08pm
Griff

The musket wars were a factor in the treaty by your own admission. Then why is this not included on the official sites?
That 25% or more of Maori had been killed by other Maori in the preceding 30 years must have been on the minds of the chiefs when they signed. After all many in the interior had little contact with settlers at this time.
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September 5, 2011 5:26pm
Scott Chris

Apparently, the European credit crunch is not imminent, according to reuters:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/05/eurozone-crisis-outlook-idUSL3E7K509Q20110905

“The European Central Bank, internally split over its bond market intervention to protect Italy, is expected to review the programme. And Greece will find out how successful it has been in persuading private investors to take part in a bond swap designed to cut its 340 billion euro debt mountain.

None of these challenges looks likely to doom policymakers’ frantic attempts to keep indebted euro zone countries afloat while they try to regain the confidence of financial markets.”
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September 5, 2011 5:44pm
Lipo

Can someone please explain why the statutory managers need to release funds from a company to fund Alan Hubbard’s funeral?
Surely the so called richest man in the South Island would have is own bank account with money in it?
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September 5, 2011 5:45pm
kowtow

tom hunter
Your plea for finance as a worthy subject is sadly lost among other more important prioities.
The populace is now so deeply mired in welfare,celebrity,cooking or dancing shows that it is only a crisis that forces our attention.
And as in the Greek case the lesson is also clear. The statue was most eloquent,hands off my benefits and unearned standard of living.

Alot is beginning to happen now that the northern hemisphere holidays are over.

Here’s an interesting one from the Torygraph.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/ambroseevans_pritchard/8740389/German-endgame-for-EMU-draws-ever-nearer.html
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September 5, 2011 5:46pm
Scott Chris

Am I the only one who doesn’t know who this guy is?

It’s not this guy is it?

http://home.nzcity.co.nz/news/article.aspx?id=45521&cat=975
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September 5, 2011 5:54pm
KH

Not suggesting this as such — but some things need thinking about.
a. If the Greek Government defaulted, because they could not pay.
b. Banks etc would hurt, and also go out of existence etc.
c. Other lenders would then be more careful about who they lent too.
d. Loans to countries would be priced for risk. Like loans should be.
e. Countries right out of control financially would find they could not borrow.
f. And would that be a good thing. Yes?
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September 5, 2011 6:05pm
mikenmild

C’mon Scott, it only took me 5 minutes to find who it is.
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September 5, 2011 6:06pm
Scott Chris

re my 5.54 post… apparently that is not the guy.
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September 5, 2011 6:07pm
KH

50% interest rate for Greek bonds !!!!
Still. I would not purchase those.
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September 5, 2011 6:11pm
reid

This is interesting. Perhaps not surprising, but interesting.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2033502/Revealed-Chamberlains-secret-bid-reach-deal-Hitler.html
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September 5, 2011 6:50pm
nasska

SOUTH AUCKLAND OLYMPIC BID

In an attempt to influence the members of the International Olympic Committee on their choice of venue for the games in the year 2024, the organizers of South Auckland’s bid have already drawn up an itinerary and schedule of events. A copy of this has been leaked, and is reproduced below…..

OPENING CEREMONY
The Olympic flame will be ignited with a flaming NZ flag by a native of the city wearing the traditional patch & red scarf.
THE EVENTS
In previous Olympic games, South Auckland’s competitors have not been particularly successful. In order to redress the balance, some of the events have been altered slightly to the advantage of local athletes.
100 METRES SPRINT
Competitors will have to hold a DVD recorder and a flat screen TV (one in each arm) and on the sound of the starting pistol, a police dog will be released from a cage 10 metres behind the athletes.
110 METRES HURDLES
As above but with added obstacles (i.e. car bonnets, hedges, garden fences, walls etc.)
HAMMER
Competitors in this event may choose the type of hammer they wish to use claw, sledge etc.) the winner will be the one who can cause the most grievous bodily harm to members of the public within the time allowed.
FENCING
Entrants will be asked to dispose of as much stolen silver and jewellery as possible in 5 minutes.
SHOOTING
A strong challenge is expected from local men in this event. The first target will be a moving police car. In the second round, competitors will aim at a bottle store employee, bank teller or security firm van servicing ATMs.
BOXING
Entry to the boxing will be restricted to husband and wife teams, and will take place on a Friday night. The husband will be given 15 pints of Lion Red while the wife will be told not to make him any tea when he gets home.The bout will then commence.
CYCLING TIME TRIALS
Competitors will be asked to break into the local bike shop and take an expensive racing bike. All against the clock.
CYCLING PURSUIT
As above, but the bike will be owned by Whaleoil, who will witness the theft.
MODERN PENTATHLON
Amended to include assault, breaking and entering, rape, car conversion and arson.
THE MARATHON
A safe route has yet to be decided, but the competitors will be issued with sharp sticks and bags with which to pick up litter on their way round the course.
SWIMMING
Competitors will be thrown into the Waitemata Harbour. The first three survivors back will decide the medals.
MEN’S 50KM WALK
Unfortunately this will have to be cancelled, as the police cannot guarantee the safety of anyone walking the streets of South Auckland.
THE CLOSING CEREMONY
Entertainment will include formation hiphop dancing by members of the Mangere Health in the Community anti-drug campaigners, synchronized rock throwing, and music by the Papakura community choir. The Olympic flame will be extinguished by someone dropping an old washing machine onto it from the top floor of the block of Housing Corp flats next to the stadium. The stadium itself will then be boarded up before the local athletes break into it and remove all the copper piping and water heating cylinders.
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September 5, 2011 7:00pm
reid

nasska you didn’t hack Hone’s phone to get this, did you?

It just sounds like one of John’s ideas, that’s all.
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September 5, 2011 7:04pm
nasska

reid

My lips are sealed!
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September 5, 2011 7:06pm
Steve

More like Len Brown’s idea
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September 5, 2011 7:16pm
wat dabney

“NZ universities slip in international ranking”

The University of Auckland is the top-ranked New Zealand university, in 82nd place, down from 68th last year.

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/84367/nz-universities-slip-in-international-ranking

I guess that’s what happens when you abandon educational standards in order to hoover up those state subsidies, churning out toilet paper “degrees” in “Maori studies” and the like.

Honestly, who would go to Auckland University if they had the choice of going somewhere decent?
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September 5, 2011 7:24pm
nasska

A nun gets into a cab and the driver keeps staring at her through the rear view mirror.

“You know, Sister,” the cab driver says, “I hope you aren’t too offended, but I’ve always had this fantasy of getting a blowjob from a nun.”

The nun thinks for a moment and says, “I’m not too offended. I just have two requirements. One, that you be single, and two, that you be Catholic.”

“Oh yes, Sister, I am single and Catholic,” the cab drive replies, so they pull into an alley and the nun proceeds to satisfy the cab driver orally. After they’re done, the cab driver begins laughing.

“What’s so funny?” the nun asks.

“Ha ha!” the cab driver annnounces, “I fooled you sister. The truth is I’m really married and I’m Jewish!”

“That’s okay,” the nun replies, “My name is Bob and I’m on my way to a fancy dress party.”
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September 5, 2011 7:33pm
mikenmild

Actually wat, Auckland University is considerably far in front of the rest of the NZ institutions. Probably NZ can only maintain one world-class university and Auckland is it.
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September 5, 2011 8:02pm
tom hunter

kowtow

You’ve probably already seen this one on the Euro crisis – Spengler: Why the Germans bought toxic waste.

It’s a response to the Michael Lewis article of a couple of weeks ago. I’ve always enjoyed Lewis’s writing style and I think he does (or did) know what he was talking about in the classic that first brought him to attention, Liar’s Poker. But that Vanity Fair article on Germany, as funny as it was, really went too far with the whole excrement-cleanliness theory.

Spengler (aka David Goldman) has a different take on the matter:

Why didn’t the Germans and all the other overseas investors buy mortgages in their own countries, instead of scraping the bottom of the credit barrel in the United States?
…
The aging pensioners of Europe and Asia must find young people to pay interest into their pensions, and they do not have enough young people at home. Germans aged 15 to 24, on the threshold of family formation, comprise only 12% of the country’s population today and will fall to only 8% by 2030. But one-fifth of Germans now are on the threshold of retirement and half will be there by mid-century.

Shades of Mark Steyn’s 2005 classic America Alone, with it’s blunt statement that demography is destiny. I doubt he included mortgage investment analysis in the book but the retiree vs. employee conundrum got a good workout so one could easily draw similar conclusions in areas other than culture.

Spengler also finished with the following comment, which carries weight because he was head of Credit Strategy at Credit Suisse from 1998 to 2002:

The German economy, by the way, has long since moved on from dependency on its Southern or Western neighbors (die Welschen) for export growth: during the past several years virtually all the growth in German exports has come from the East, from China and to some extent Russia.

That leads me to believe that after the proverbial decent interval, Greece, Italy and Spain will be thrown out of European monetary union, their debt will be reorganized along the lines of Brady bonds, their banking systems sold to foreigners at a fraction of book value — and no-one will care very much.

Ouch!
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September 5, 2011 8:31pm
reid

This isn’t very good news, is it?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/phone-hacking-victims-lawyers-were-targeted-2348387.html

Guess what happens when you piss off some very capable lawyers at a time when that segment of the MSM which you don’t own happens coincidentally to have a vested interest in taking you down?

Oh dear.

Rebekkah will almost certainly serve time, poor girl. Now it looks like James might as well.

I wonder what Rupert’s going to do when it touches personally his own family?

That will be interesting.

Notice Lachlan’s appearing in the news as well, he’s the saviour. You watch.
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September 5, 2011 8:38pm
thedavincimode

Was it just my imagination, or was that dreadful quadruple-jowelled slug Williams trying to crawl up the gummint’s arse this morning when he was on Radio Pinko with Hooten?

Looking for an earner Williams? Why not just buy a KFC?
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September 5, 2011 8:49pm
Viking2

Google fun
push play
http://www.google.co.nz/
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September 5, 2011 8:56pm
Nookin

“This isn’t very good news, is it?”
I thinks it’s wonderful news. The odd phone hack here or there will result in the ministrations of a wet bus ticket. Perverting the course of justice raises the bar somewhat. As you say, Rebekah might need to stock up on toothbrushes (teethbrush?}.
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September 5, 2011 9:19pm
Scott Chris

Latest conspiracy theory:

NRL to engineer Warriors premiership win to undermine RWC

TAB odds of 7.50, be interesting to see if they shorten.
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September 5, 2011 9:39pm
kiwisimplexity

SMILE! Two thugs on robbing spree
Welcome to a new episode of Simplexity Crimewatch. Today in the show we have the above guest stars.
http://kiwisimplexity.wordpress.com/2011/09/05/smile-two-thugs-on-robbing-spree/

What!? 10.000 Euros for not having sex
Married 21 years. A hell of an accomplishment.
http://kiwisimplexity.wordpress.com/2011/09/05/what-10-000-euros-for-not-having-sex/

Sheep commit mass suicide
At some point you can just be done with it. Time to pull the plug.
http://kiwisimplexity.wordpress.com/2011/09/05/sheep-commit-mass-suicide/

Blog: http://kiwisimplexity.wordpress.com/
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September 5, 2011 10:07pm
reid

NRL to engineer Warriors premiership win to undermine RWC

TAB odds of 7.50, be interesting to see if they shorten.

Let’s hope ipredict open a stock Scott. Then those Sports people will see some real finesse.

Personally I’d put some ipredict money on the SA-poisoning-AB-at-pre-match-carb-intake stock, but that’s just me.
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September 5, 2011 10:15pm
kowtow

tom hunter
I hadn’t seen that >Thank you.Sheds some light on western govts obsession with demographics.The next couple of weeks will be very interesting.
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September 5, 2011 10:34pm
reid

Thank you too Tom and kowtow for prompting me. A v good site.
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September 5, 2011 11:11pm

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Health Target 5 – elective treatments
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Health Target 3 – Emergency Dept Waiting Times
Health Target 2 – Immunisations

Links

Automakers’ Costly Gamble on EVs: A Lesson in Ignoring Consumer Demand
Utopia
Hey Razor – What The Hell Is Going On With The All Blacks
No Minister
END GAME
The Standard
MEDIAWATCH: Q+A – Jack Tame destroys David Seymour
The Daily Blog
Word of the day
Hompaddock
Treaty Principles Debate
NZCPR
Much ado about cussing…
Point of Order
Justice in Brazil
No Right Turn
"Seymour is only doing openly what M?ori nationalists and their Pakeha allies have been doing, quietly for the past 50 years."
Not PC
The transgender agenda sunk Kamala
Bob McCoskrie's McBlog
SETTING THE RECORD STRAIGHT
No Punches Pulled (Bob Jones)
What does “reciprocity” mean in New Zealand laws?
Croaking Cassandra
This will not end well
Offsetting Behaviour
Top 14 Predictions for Round 10
Stats Chat
Tory Whanau may have to sell Wellington mayoralty to make ends meet
The Civilian
The Accidental Engagement
Imperator Fish
Legal Beagle: Election '23: The Special Votes
Public Address
Making this movie might have been a mistake
Liam Hehir
Why I am retiring from political blogging
Kiwi FireWalker
Angie Warren-Clark: Meet the Newbies
Dan Moskovitz

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