General Debate 22 November 2010

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Nookin

Sometimes its hard to look on the bright side. Hats off to this guy
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/golf/4371467/Unfazed-golfer-eyes-pro-career-but-admits-he-has-a-fairway-to-go
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November 22, 2010 8:07am
Yvette

Someone has to
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November 22, 2010 8:07am
Yvette

OK, so they don’t
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November 22, 2010 8:08am
Nookin

Yvette
Don’t think they can. They are stuck on the electoral ad.
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November 22, 2010 8:45am
kaya

I posted this last night but it was late. Talking about religion, I’m reading the “Lost Science of Money” trying to get an understanding of the monetary system, the greatest religion in the world and the one all the others are based on.
The latest chapter talked about the South Sea Bubble, one of the earliest accounts of market manipulation and crash. The last couple of paragraphs of this chapter:

the people occasionally understood the issue (monetary system corruption and manipulation in the 19th century), but mostly did not, and in the 20th century, almost never. The ever escalating horror of the wars engendered in large part by the bankers, combined with immense national debt loads and ever increasing taxation, ground the people down, reducing their ability to rationally consider political and social questions. This further concentrated control into the hands of the malefactors.
Financial control of mass communications, starting with the pulpit and newspapers, then radio, movies and television, to say nothing of the universities, would keep the money question out of view or out of focus.

Only the greatest expenditure of energy and money over the last three centuries have kept that form of economic organisation from being defined and understood in terms of fraud and theft. That brings our study to the propoganda apparatus charged with the task of keeping this plutocratic system whitewashed.

The next chapter is called “POLITICAL ECONOMISTS: PRIESTHOOD OF THE BANKER THEOLOGY”

I think this is going to be good.
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November 22, 2010 8:57am
pdm

A question for rugby refs or other experts on the tackle area.

My understanding is that once the tackler gets to his feet, having released the ball carrier, he can then play the ball immediately without having to go through the gate and assuming it is still a tackle and not a ruck.

The reason I ask is that McCaw has been penalised at least twice in the last two weeks for doing exactly that and I am sure he knows the tackle rule as well as anyone. What do others say.
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November 22, 2010 8:57am
Pete George

Pdm – that applied last year, not sure exactly what the priorities are this year. The only thing that’s unchanged is that you have to play to the ref.
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November 22, 2010 9:05am
pdm

Playing to the ref is not an issue with me PG, as long as the ref is refereeing to the laws of the game.
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November 22, 2010 9:16am
Manolo

All this while the deranged incompetent Nick Smith goes to another meeting in Mexico for more “talks”: http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/politics/4370613/1b-bill-feared-for-ambitious-emission-targets
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November 22, 2010 9:19am
Chuck Bird

The article on Muriel’s Forum is worth reading. Their will be public meetings tonight and tomorrow
by John Boscawen to discuss the Government’s Marine and Coastal Area (Takutai Moana) Bill.

This Bill contains provisions of major and irreversible constitutional and economic
significance, and could change the laws governing the foreshore and seabed. It is
before Parliament’s Maori Affairs Select Committee, has National and Maori Party
support, and is expected to pass in March.

But few people understand its potential consequences on our economic
well being, and way of life – unsurprising, given that the foreshore and seabed debate has raged so long that
many people are either immune to it or have simply accepted National’s view that the changes are necessary
and desirable.

I urge you to read about the Bill and understand its potential consequences, and also invite you to attend
public meetings on this issue:

Monday 22 November – 7.30pm
St Thomas Anglican Church
Cnr Kohimarama Rd & St Heliers Bay Rd

Tuesday 30 November – 7.30pm
St Heliers Church & Community Centre
100 St Heliers Bay Rd
This Bill will allow Government to give effective ownership

NZCPR Guest Forum
Opinion piece by Taipa Resident (who has asked to remain anonymous)
21 November 2010
Maori occupation of Taipa: an insiders view

Last weekend was glorious at Taipa Point and looking out over the estuary it would have been difficult to find a more tranquil or beautiful setting in ‘God’s Own’. The beach had a colourful sheen under clear skies and the sea was blue green. The reserve was buzzing as our community and visitors alike enjoyed the best of what New Zealand has.

The boat ramp was busy – the sailing boats from the sailing club on the reserve were active, some racing and others with the training group teaching children the sail. The picnic tables were full of revellers and the beach at the river mouth was packed with fishermen casting for kahawai.

This picture of pure paradise was completed by the sound of children’s laughter from the jetty used as a diving board. It was a special day as people appeared to be celebrating being free again to use the public reserve and the beaches, after the eviction of the Maori occupation from the Point.

What a contrast to the period from the 14th to the 30th of October. This was the time of the first occupation of the public reserve. It was a sad, bleak and desolate place. It could also be dangerous to visit after the Popata brothers – the puppets of Hone Harawera and Margaret Mutu – had decided that in the name of Ngati Kahu, the land was theirs.

For 7 years I had walked the Point. On the afternoon of the 14th October I found Maori building a shanty shack against the side of the Taipa Sailing Club on the reserve. When I entered to find out what was happening I was confronted by an aggressive fellow who asked me what I was doing there. I told him I was walking the point as I have done for years and was told that it was now Maori land and I was not welcome.

For rest of article

http://www.nzcpr.com/guest220.htm
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November 22, 2010 9:19am
jackp

kaya -Financial control of mass communications, starting with the pulpit and newspapers, then radio, movies and television, to say nothing of the universities, would keep the money question out of view or out of focus.

This is why I tell Tom Hunter that lobbying in Washington DC should be illegal. This has been going on in the states for the last 30 years. Another term is “dumbing down the public” and look at the crap coming out of the states. The same thing is happening here. Who ever has control over the media will win the race.
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November 22, 2010 9:22am
James Stephenson

pdm – my understanding is the same as yours, however I believe refs have been told to police the releasing of the player by the tackler quite strictly and to ensure that the tackler is properly on his feet before getting hands on the ball. I think that’s proved quite difficult for a lot of the players who were so good at the “all in one movement” trick (McCaw, G.Smith etc), so the emphasis tactics-wise seems to be on the second player arriving to effect the turnover.
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November 22, 2010 9:28am
thedavincimode

On pdm’s theme, what about front row binding? I understood all props have to bind on the opponent’s jersey. Time after time, opposing tightheads are binding on Woodcock’s arm and then rolling him under – with us getting penalised. The refs just stand there and watch it (well, when they aren’t penalising Woodcock). Franks was binding on the arm against Ireland, although I didn’t notice him trying to roll his loosehead under.
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November 22, 2010 9:29am
pdm

js – in two of the cases I saw the player was released and McCaw was on his feet. What I think cost the penalties was he had rolled a couple of steps away and had to move to the ball.

tdvc – the reffing of scrums has been bloody awful. The gap between the front rows is too wide and the crouch, touch, pause, engage calls are too slow. Especially the gap between pause and engage. From what I read the jerseys are being blamed for the binding – I don’t know enough about that part of it.
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November 22, 2010 9:40am
jackp

Chuck Bird, this is what I am referring to by lobbying being illegal. The Maori Elite are in bed with John Key, no doubt about it and they have over 15 billion dollars backing themselves up. Hence this terrible foreshore and seabed bill. The news is doing its best to keep it quiet, perhaps DPF can explain why and why he has been so quiet about this. This bill is the most undemocratic bill I have seen, it rates higher than the anti smacking law. There are also rumors that John Key and the Treaty Minister, Chris FInlayson, are pushing this up before
Christmas break because of the shopping diversion. Just about all kiwis don’t have a clue what is happening.
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November 22, 2010 10:09am
grumpyoldhori

No rule that you have to have a sleeve on a loose heads jersey, cut the sleeve away and have a pocket sewn in the shorts so that KY jelly etc is available as the loosehead runs to the scrum.
Worked well in 91 against the poms
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November 22, 2010 10:31am
Fletch

Interesting story about LTC Terry Lakin who faces court martial in 22 days. He is an 18 year veteran who refuses to be deployed back into Afghanistan until Barrack Obama shows his long form Birth Certificate, proving his eligibility to be Commander-in -chief. Seems perfectly reasonable to me. The fact that a sitting president had overtly had sealed all his school records, birth certificate, passport, and anything to do with his political history before becoming president and other records would never have been accepted from any other president in US history.

Obama is hiding something.

Lakin’s web site HERE

A word from him on video – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fEcrrcqY0E&feature=player_embedded

He seems like a very reasonable guy making a reasonable request.
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November 22, 2010 10:38am
Pete George

Polling people’s feelings:

Most people unhappy with new taxes: poll

A nationwide HorizonPoll survey of 1558 people between November 16 and 19 found 8.2 per cent felt better off because of the changes, 53.5 per cent thought they were worse off while 35.6 per cent felt their situation was unchanged.

It would be useful to know how many of those who felt worse off were actually worse off. The odds are many of them don’t know the answer. The Herald has an online poll asking that (currently 50/50), but how many actually know?
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November 22, 2010 10:50am
grumpyoldhori

Fletch the colonel is a typical septic reich winger, an idiot.
He can kiss his career and pension good bye.
A white septic who is against blacks being in charge, oh dear, too bad.
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November 22, 2010 10:55am
grumpyoldhori

Chuck Bird cheeky bloody darkies are they not, making use of the pakeha owned foreshore.
Well they coud try a no dogs, no hories sign, that would wind up the local iwi.
,
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November 22, 2010 11:09am
Fletch

grumpy, seems like a perfectly reasonable request to me. McCain had to show his and didn’t have any problem with it. Why is Obama holding out? I bet years from now when he is no longer POTUS it will come out that he wasn’t qualified for the job at all and there will be a big uproar about it all. Will be too late then of course; he will have already done massive damage to America.
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November 22, 2010 11:14am
Lance

@Fletch
Your’e pissing on our leg and telling us it’s raining right?
“He seems like a very reasonable guy making a reasonable request”. Suitable Tui ad material.

The the very least he is making a political point.
Before I get labelled far left (Redbaiter’s favourite trick) I am centre right.
But seriously…. Why the fuck does this matter? Looks like lawyers tricks in action channeling a motivation rooted in prejudice.

By all means rip into his polices, decry his motivations as any good political debate should… but to mirk around in this shit, that sort of stuff is the realm of Labour party presidents.

I suggest to have an honest evaluation of your motives here.
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November 22, 2010 11:16am
MikeNZ

Not to mention that all the bills he signed were invalid?

I’d suggest the same from you lance.
All of society is built on Law and constitutional position.
When you ignore or break them you ignore all law.
This is big and if you can’t see that please be honest as to why.
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November 22, 2010 11:17am
AlphaKiwi

Education slowly evolves. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11735404?OCID=spttb
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November 22, 2010 11:19am
James Stephenson

Suitable Tui ad material.

You can’t deny that by taking the action he has, he’s put a considerable amount of “money” where his mouth is. Nice to see Grumpy’s knee jerk so quickly that he instantly played the racism card.
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November 22, 2010 11:23am
Lance

@MikeNZ
I have seen a lawyer use bullshit tricks like this to get kids released to grossly violent parents hands, only to shortly after see them bashed within an inch of their lives. With resulting partial brain damage.
So yes, the lawyer used the rule of law.

You win MikeNZ, we should respect law over what is right.

Hell…. Bush was told it’s legal to torture people.

I’m not saying it is right to break the rules, it’s the vociferous hypocrisy from certain individuals I find hard to take. Especially when those individuals don’t really give a flying shit about the law.
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November 22, 2010 11:28am
Fletch

Lance, it’s alright for you and I to say that it doesn’t matter, but if the person ultimately responsible (as Commander-in-chief) for sending soldiers into battle and determining whether they live or die ultimately has no real authority to do so then that is a problem.

The question to me still is: why? Why won’t he show it if he has nothing to hide? This is the guy who claimed his was going to be the most transparent Govt in history, that “sunshine is the best antiseptic” and claimed he was going to put every single bill up on the Whitehouse site for the public to critique before it was allowed to be passed. Well, that very quickly went by-the-by.

Even as recently as March this year, James Orengo, Kenyan Minister of Lands said that Obama was born in Kenya.

If America was living in a situation where they feared ethnicity and did not see itself as a multiparty state or nation, how could a young man born here in Kenya, who is not even a native American, become the President of America?

Even Sarah Obama (Barry’s paternal step-grandmother) said she was there at his birth in Kenya.

Maybe that makes me a “birther” to believe it, but I don’t care. What’s wrong in searching for the truth? Are we saying that it’s OK if the current POTUS didn’t follow the rules? Just this once?
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November 22, 2010 11:29am
Pete George

Same old Fletch. Obama has done what is legally required.

It is possible that Obama conspired his way to the precipice of the world’s biggest job, involving a vast network of people and government agencies over decades of lies. Anything’s possible.

But step back and look at the overwhelming evidence to the contrary and your sense of what’s reasonable has to take over.

There is not one shred of evidence to disprove PolitiFact’s conclusion that the candidate’s name is Barack Hussein Obama, or to support allegations that the birth certificate he released isn’t authentic.

And that’s true no matter how many people cling to some hint of doubt and use the Internet to fuel their innate sense of distrust.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/jun/27/obamas-birth-certificate-part-ii/

Not that this will change any minds. Those who desperately want to believe will continue to believe nonsense.
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November 22, 2010 11:39am
Fletch

Pete, that’s an old article had it has been proved that’s not his full birth certificate. It’s a forgery. Obama still has not shown his COLB. The State of Hawaii has never claimed the COLB as a state document. The original Obama birth record remains undisclosed, including school records, passport, and any other document that would shed light on his citizenship (Obama has had them all sealed). Even today no hospital in Hawaii will claim to be the birthplace of Obama.

The fact is that Obama’s about as transparent as tinfoil.
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November 22, 2010 11:47am
Pete George

On this Fletch it’s you who’s about as transparent as tinfoil. How many GOPPERS give this any credence?

Ken Buck was the Tea Party candidate running against establishment pick Jane Norton in Colorado’s Republican Senate primary. He caught on tape by a Democratic operative saying,

‘Will you tell those dumbasses at the Tea Party to stop asking questions about birth certificates while I’m on the camera?’.
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November 22, 2010 11:54am
Jimbob

Manolo @ 9:19 This Government is going to get us in the sh*t with all these emission targets and regulations. It is impossible to cut emissions in NZ unless you cut the number of trucks and cars on the road, followed by killing off half the livestock in NZ. Absolute economic suicide. To cut emissions from agriculture is getting to the point of science fiction, scientists have been trying for over thirty years, nothing. They are working against the evolution of the ruminant.
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November 22, 2010 11:57am
Fletch

Pete, in a recent poll, only 29% of Americans polled thought Obama was born in the US. Why can’t he just come out and say so? You can make all the arguments you want but what’s so difficult about it? I can find my birth certificate in a few minutes in the drawer, why can’t Obama produce his?

Sure, he’s the POTUS and doesn’t have to, but why doesn’t he just clear it all up?

Whichever way you believe, there is no denying that he is hiding something. But for what reason?
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November 22, 2010 12:00pm
double d

@ pdm November 22nd, 2010 at 8:57 am
A question for rugby refs or other experts on the tackle area.

My understanding is that once the tackler gets to his feet, having released the ball carrier, he can then play the ball immediately without having to go through the gate and assuming it is still a tackle and not a ruck.

The reason I ask is that McCaw has been penalised at least twice in the last two weeks for doing exactly that and I am sure he knows the tackle rule as well as anyone. What do others say.

My 5 cents:

The main change in refereeing interpretation is that the tackled player has to be allowed the opportunity to release the ball and place it. The tackler by all means has the rights to get back to his feet and is not deemed offside as he has rights as tackler, however the rights of the team in possession to retain the ball via making the ball available are now being considered.

So the tackle happens and the tackled player goes to ground and should be allowed to present the ball back to his team-mates. The delay in presenting the ball is what is making it difficult for the tackler to snaffle the ball as the interpretation is that the tackled area changes to a ruck at some point. So if the ref deems it a ruck, he penalises the tackler for using hands.

the point you make pdm is that the penalties are happening are at tackle time. i do not recall the exact incidents but it is likely that McCaw was penalised as he did not allow the tackled player to present the ball. that is why you are now seeing a lot of first tackles designed to keep the player upright so the ball can be mauled or ripped from the player in possession. the other change you are seeing is the first tackler almost giving up on regaining possession and the 2nd player being the forager.
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November 22, 2010 12:04pm
MikeNZ

Fletch
They don’t want to know, thereby showing their lack of integrity, it’s fine for all others accept those they support.

As the Prime person in America, President Obama sets the tone and example for all others, just as John Key does here (and our MP’s not that you’d notice).
An issue of the very basic integrity such as this says all you need to know about the person and those who support him.
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November 22, 2010 12:08pm
Pete George

CNN/Opinion Research Corporation survey from August 2010

11% -Obama was definitely not born in the United States
16% – the president was probably not born in the country.
42% – have absolutely no doubts that the president was born in the U.S
29% – he “probably” was.

Maybe you can link to a more recent poll. Even the 27% is an indictment on the mentality of a significant proportion of the US (and a few odds and sods here).
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November 22, 2010 12:12pm
Lance

@MikeNZ
So if Barack Obama actually provides this evidence to your personal satisfaction then will you leave off the personal shit?
Like labeling him a Muslim etc.

For some reason I’m doubting it.
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November 22, 2010 12:14pm
kaya

Fuck it. The silly bastard Irish government have caved in and given away their sovereignty. Thousands of Irishmen have died fighting against Britain for centuries to get some measure of independence and without a shot fired, the IMF have taken effective control.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10689262

The banks have a lot to answer for, I hope the people of Ireland wake up soon.
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November 22, 2010 12:17pm
Fletch

Pete, Diane West from the Examiner puts it this way –

As polled by CNN in July, [only] four in 10 American voters who believe Obama was “definitely born” in the United States. That relatively low percentage of convinced Americans surprised me given the near-100 percent figure that would surely apply to mainstream (read: liberal) and conservative media, with “alternate” exceptions.

Rounding out the poll, 29 percent believe the president was “probably born” in the United States; 16 percent think he was “probably born” in another country; 11 percent think he was “definitely born” in another country and only 2 percent had “no opinion.” This demonstrates that the topic resonates with practically every American, with a fairly whopping six in 10 Americans at least a little uncertain whether Obama was born where he says he was born.
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November 22, 2010 12:21pm
Manolo

Not all of us are happy with Labour-lite’s GST hike http://www.odt.co.nz/news/politics/137309/majority-feel-worse-after-tax-changes-poll
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November 22, 2010 12:32pm
bearhunter

@ Kaya – the Irish Government had no choice. Through their own greed, ineptness, cronyism, cupidity and all-round cute-hoorism, they’ve brought Ireland to this sad day. Hopefully the Fianna Fail party will be outlawed and its members tried on charges of treason. This is what happens when politics is not divided on idealogical lines but on where your grandfather stood during the Civil War. They are a disgrace.
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November 22, 2010 12:43pm
James Stephenson

the Irish Government had no choice

Not quite.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danielhannan/100064000/there-is-a-way-out-for-ireland-and-britain-should-stand-ready-offer-it/
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November 22, 2010 1:01pm
sparkyspitz

Kaya,

First up a big THANK YOU to yourself and nickb. Messages you two posted to each other some time ago regarding money prompted me to investigate the subject further.

I’m not sure where your research as taken you, so I shall ask some questions for you to research and ponder…

What is a STRAWMAN?

What is a PERSON?

What is the significance of your ALLCAPS NAME?

What is your BIRTH CERTIFICATE? Who does it belong to?

What happens when you Register something?

What is a license?

What is the connection and significance of HJR 192 and The Reserve Bank Act 1933?

What is a CITIZEN?

Do the Statutes of the GOVERNMENT OF NEW ZEALAND apply to you? Why?

What is ‘THE QUEEN IN RIGHT OF NEW ZEALAND’?

Who/what owns RESERVE BANK OF NEW ZEALAND?

Who/what owns the FEDERAL RESERVE BANK?

What is the connection between the FED, RBNZ and the IMF/WORLD BANK/UN?

Is there any ‘money’? Where does what we consider money come from?

What are taxes?

What is the UNIFORM COMMERCIAL CODE?

You will need a legal dictionary for some of those words.

Legalese is diferent from English, and words can have very different meanings to what we may think.

The above is not even scratching the surface of the rabbit hole. I have spent almost a year looking into these subjects and more. I can tell you that it has challenged just about everything I thought I knew about the world and my place in it.

If you are curious and willing you can set yourself free.

Everything in life is contract. Honor/dishonor

I have some fantastic resources to share if you choose to investigate further. (I’m not selling information)

Email my name above at gmail, put your Kiwiblog Nym in the subject line.

There is quite a lot of information out in the ether, separating wheat from chaffe is a big part of looking deeper.

Best to you all,

Sparky
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November 22, 2010 1:04pm
Scumsucker

Long live the EUSSR.
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November 22, 2010 1:06pm
RightNow

The Terminator has killed California, now it looks likely he’ll put politics behind him and instead bestow his great skills on the Climate Change industry:
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=10689271

Go Arnie, give it the kiss of death.

“People get stuck and fall in love with their slogans and with their little agendas. You’ve got to make it hip. You’ve got to make it sexy to be part of this movement.”

Make it sexy?
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November 22, 2010 1:06pm
big bruv

Yippee!!!!

I never even knew that I had entered.

“This email is from The London Organising Committee of the Olympic Games and Paralympic Games (LOCOG).

In an effort to give back to the society that has given so much already, the LOCOG has started a quarterly (online email) draw in conjunction with Microsoft.

The online email draw is held using thousands of active emails from a region, and four emails finally emerges as the winning emails of One million Pounds Sterling (£1 million GBP) each.

We are pleased to inform you that your email is one of the four emails that emerged as the winning emails of the first quarter draw. Please Respond for claims instructions:

Lord Sebastian Coe
1 Churchill Place
Canary Wharf
London E14 5LN
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November 22, 2010 1:09pm
Manolo

The former American ambassador to New Zealand in a race against Rahm Emmanuel, Obama’s bodyguard and henchman: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-met-chicago-mayor-race-1121-20101120,0,884053.story
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November 22, 2010 1:20pm
kowtow

Kaya

Too ra loo ra ladee, put on a big green hat and silly orange beard.

Many more thousands of Irishmen wore red coats than green and fought for King and Country.And that applied right through history down to and including WW1. Wellington ,himself an Irishman ,estimated a third of his army was Irish,that’s one reason he had a soft spot for Catholic Emancipation.

The Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers,27th Regiment of Foot, were one of the famous squares that held the centre at Waterloo and suffered 68% casualties.

The 8th (Kings Royal Irish) Hussars were part of the third line of that most famous charge at Balaklava in October 1854.

Indeed many thousands were unhappy with the Irish Dominion staying neutral in WW2 and crossed the border to join the colours. Recent publications show that nearly 5000 Irish soldiers deserted the neutral Irish army to join the British to fight.They were court martialled in absentia and secret memos sent out around the country to ensure they could not take up state employment if they returned.

Like I said on GD yesterday,there is no tiger,it’s a mangey cat. Hubris.
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November 22, 2010 1:24pm
joana

Obama’s father was a muslim , therefore he is a muslim. When he was at school in Indonesia he attended agama classes. Only muslims are allowed to attend such classes. As he now claims to be a Christian , he has committed apostasy and should face the consequences. Noone is supposed to be allowed to leave islam.
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November 22, 2010 1:28pm
James Stephenson

Wellington ,himself an Irishman

Being born in a stable does not make one a horse.
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November 22, 2010 1:55pm
kaya

kowtow – I’m not talking about Irish politics or religious affiliations ffs. That history is way too muddled to even start on. It makes the atheist v God squad debate look clear cut. I know about Irishmen fighting all over the world. It’s amazing what people do when they are starving and desperate. Some cynics would even say it is a reason why Americans keep unemployment high, easier to recruit cannon fodder. Read my post @ 8.58 for more on the subject.

I’m talking about right and wrong. I’m talking about a country being fucked over by a corrupt banking system (actually the planet but I’ll stick to Ireland for now), a corrupt administration –

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1331076/Ireland-bailout-Lets-frank-7bn-bunch-liars-crooks-bunglers.html

– and the fact that Ireland isn’t known for bending down and taking it up the arse from foreigners. I am not Nationalistic, I am originally from the North and of protestant origin.

bearhunter – The Irish people, like the American people and many others around the planet have been (and are continuing to be) fucked over by this corrupt banking system, aided and abetted by inept and/or corrupt government officials. Sean Fitzpatrick (the banker, not the outstanding AB captain) should have been hung, drawn and quatered for what he did.

http://comeheretome.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/fitzhangs.jpg?w=421&h=667

The monetary system has been compromised and is leading us into an abyss.
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November 22, 2010 2:12pm
bearhunter

Kaya, couldn’t agree more re Seanie, the devious little fucker. I hear the cops have been stopping people gathering outside Leinster House, another fine display of open democracy under Zanu-FF and the lickspittle Greens. May they scald in piss through eons of slavery every one of them.
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November 22, 2010 2:23pm
Lance

@joana
So are you like just being sarcastic/ironic or the evil twin of Sarah Palin?
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November 22, 2010 2:24pm
James Stephenson

kaya – and how close the UK came to sharing Ireland’s fate. Another reason to give thanks for Mrs T.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/peteroborne/100064330/margaret-thatcher-knew-the-single-currency-would-devastate-europe/
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November 22, 2010 2:33pm
kowtow

James Stephenson.

You quote another Irishman there,that was said by Daniel O’Connell of Wellington.

Wellington’s family had been in Ire since “time immemorial” perhaps as early as the 1170’s.
He was born in Ire ,his father was an Irish Lord,as was his brother. He himself was an MP for an Irish seat.
An Aunt ,Fanny Burney described him to King George III as “an Irishman”when asked why he was there.
In 1786 upon enlistment at school in France the entry stated “Mr Wesley, gentilhomme Irlandais,fils de Mylaidi Mornington……”
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November 22, 2010 2:41pm
joana

I am not being sarcastic Lance.
The penalty for leaving islam is death. I know about agama classes because my son went to school in this region.
Even more of a worry are the ”weekend schools” in Britain where children as young as six are being taught how to amputate hands and feet . Read more on Winds of Jihad.
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November 22, 2010 2:41pm
Manolo

Crap and more crap from “distinguished academics”: http://msn.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10689232&ref=rss
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November 22, 2010 2:56pm
James Stephenson

kowtow – I know. The point being that the Aristocracy of the British Isles had more in common with each other than the people of any of the constituent countries since they pretty much all trace their lineage back to the Norman conquest.
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November 22, 2010 3:09pm
Rick Rowling

Ha ha. Birther debate.

When the GOP is too centrist, and the Tea Party is too centrist.
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November 22, 2010 3:15pm
kowtow

Manolo;

Academics who don’t live in the real world and who are actually bullshitting socialists peddling rubbish at tax payer expense under the guise of education. If anything good can come of this recession it will be the sacking and dismantling of all these useless studies and departments. To think taxpayers support that shit.!
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November 22, 2010 3:48pm
Lance

@Joana
I know all that… lived in the middle east a while ago.
I was teasing out if you thought because Barack was within Isalmic circles at one stage he couldn’t possibly be anything other than a ‘double agent’.
Because that would be drawing a ‘very long bow’.
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November 22, 2010 4:06pm
MikeNZ

Ohh I hope that wasn’t to set her up for a polite ‘bitch slap’ was it Lance?

He is either an apostate or he is using Taqiyya — Religious Deception, one or the other.

If he is an apostate then the punishment is death as given in the Hadiths.
“Allah’s Apostle said, “The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims.”Sahih al-Bukhari, 9:83:17
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November 22, 2010 4:32pm
Pete George

It should be easy to prove where Obama was born, just get astronomers to check whether there was a bright star over Hawaii or Kenya in Aug 1961. It can’t have been a black hole.
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November 22, 2010 4:44pm
RightNow

If I’ve learned anything from ‘The Spirit Level’ it’s that rich Maori need to be giving a whole lot more of their wealth to poor Maori to fix all those Maori centric social problems. Apparently.
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November 22, 2010 4:57pm
Fletch

joanna, also Obama’s Kenyan Grandmother Sarah Obama was angry that the press had made much of Obama being Muslim, and the AP reported in 2008 that she is a Christian, yet in May 2009 the Daily Times of Pakistan reported she was going on Haj with her son Syed Obama. Only Muslims are allowed to perform Haj.
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November 22, 2010 6:50pm
Fletch

Also reported this month in the Australian, a past teacher of Obama’s remembers him going to Muslim class against the wishes of his mother –

AS a schoolboy in Jakarta, Barack Obama attended Muslim prayer sessions with his classmates against the wishes of his mother.

The US President’s former grade three teacher said that Mr Obama – who was known as “Barry” when he attended the Menteng One school in Jakarta – studied the Koran and went to classes on Islam, despite the objections of Ann Dunham, a Catholic.

The teacher’s recollections will add to speculation about Mr Obama’s links to Islam during his much-anticipated visit to Indonesia, the world’s most populous Muslim nation, as part of his ten-day tour of Asia.

His middle name, Hussein, and the fact that his stepfather was a Muslim, have combined to perpetuate rumours about Mr Obama’s religious leanings. The number of Americans who think that he is a Muslim has grown since his inauguration to one in five.

Mr Obama moved to Indonesia with his mother and Indonesian stepfather, Lolo Soetoro, when he was 6, and lived there for four years. In his memoirs he recalled his time in the country as the “bounty of a young man’s life” and there is affection and pride among Indonesians for the boy who ended up as President of the United States.

The teacher, Effendi, who taught at Menteng One for 29 years, remembers Mr Obama as a “fat, curly-haired, curious boy”. The school had an international mix of pupils, including Christians, Hindus, Buddhists and Muslims.

Mr Obama attended classes on Islam while the Christians attended classes on Christianity, said Effendi. Barry, he said, was alone among the pupils in that he insisted on attending both.

“His mother did not like him learning Islam, although his father was a Muslim. Sometimes she came to the school; she was angry with the religious teacher and said ‘Why did you teach him the Koran?'” said Effendi.

“But he kept going to the classes because he was interested in Islam. He would also join the other pupils for Muslim prayers.”

Questions over Mr Obama’s religion were fuelled, in part, by comments about his Muslim roots made by Hillary Clinton during the Democratic party leadership campaign.

The conservative American media took the speculation further by claiming that Mr Obama attended a madrassa – Islamic school – as a child. Mr Obama’s former classmates, however, have dismissed the claims as nonsense.
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November 22, 2010 6:56pm
Hagues

So… does anyone remember the National Party election slogan ’08 “Wave goodbye to high taxes, not loved ones”?

Seems National have, or maybe it was just aspirational and not something they actually were going to work on achieving.

Kiwis fleeing in record numbers… http://msn.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10689301
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November 22, 2010 6:57pm
Manolo

Maori “leadership” will keep blaming other for their dismal failure until kingdom comes. Much easier and more profitable too.

Maoridom reluctance to accept their own shortcomings is the main stumbling block, since the colonial oppressor is always responsible for their plight.

Hui anyone?
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November 22, 2010 6:58pm
big bruv

“Hui anyone?”

Just as long as you mofo’s are paying for it.
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November 22, 2010 6:59pm
Viking2

I read tonight that S& P have down graded our rating.
People leaving again.
Till Bill and John got the chopper out and slashed away some of the household expenses.
Not good at all.
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November 22, 2010 7:05pm
MikeNZ

Fletch
I listened to this earlier.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70xwXoTo2PQ&feature=player_embedded

This is Hannity of course, so as a right wing nutjob, his observations should be taken with a pinch of salt.
But it’s part of the US National dialogue.
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November 22, 2010 7:09pm
MikeNZ

Viking2
We have a similar problem to the USA, there they voted for a Man ( namely a vision and ideal) and they were fighting (they thought) to get rid of someone who they felt was doing damage to their country.
What they got is not what they thought they were voting for.
He has taken that 50% of the vote and morphed it into a mandate for whatever he wants.
As he has just found out in their midterms.

We wanted to get rid of an evil witch and the only viable option was national and John (the fixer) Key.
He has taken that vote to get rid of the incumbent as a mandate to do what the hell he likes, accept we don’t have midterms.

At least Obama isn’t intending to hasn’t give their F&S away to the so called indigenous peoples even if he ignores the polling.
If I ever get to ask a question of Key face to face it’s going to be “What don’t you understand about 80%?”
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November 22, 2010 7:16pm
MikeNZ

Fletch

Just found it for you. More inconsistancies with the Obama timeline.
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=230829

Either reporters in 1990 misheard Barack Obama, or Obama’s story about when precisely he left for Indonesia as a child and how long he stayed there changed between May 1990, when he became president of the Harvard Law Review, and July 1995, when he first published his autobiography.

Unfortunately, since Barack Obama has blocked all release of his U.S. passport and travel records, there is no public documentation of when he first traveled to Indonesia, or under what passport.

This is the man who said “I’m not going to be like these people”, referring to the Bush’s who he accused of not being transparent enough.
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November 22, 2010 7:21pm
Lucia Maria

Fletch,

I read a similar article several weeks back. Looks like the version the Australian got didn’t include the gay nanny.
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November 22, 2010 7:28pm
MikeNZ

Oh no, they’re not doing an Arafat on him are they?
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November 22, 2010 7:29pm
reid

“…referring to the Bush’s who he accused of not being transparent enough.”

Which they weren’t. One of Bush 43’s first actions was to seal his Dad’s records and guess who are the only people who have access to Bush 43’s?

I agree on Obama. He stinks.

Point is: he stinks as well as some others also stink, and strangely some sometimes seem not to acknowledge that.
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November 22, 2010 7:39pm
MikeNZ

Reid
Thanks for revealing that, He sealed his Dad’s records after his dad was out of office.
Not during or just before.

I agree Reid, He stinks and OB1 stinks too.
But OB1 is the one in power and lying through his teeth, not Bush, he’s yesterday.
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November 22, 2010 8:01pm
reid

“He sealed his Dad’s records after his dad was out of office. Not during or just before.”

Have a look at what he’s done with his own records as well.

The overall point is, why would a POTUS ever need or want their records sealed, provided they had discharged honorarily the duties of that sacred office? Either father or son could be fairly regarded as a coincidence, but both?
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November 22, 2010 8:34pm
Hurf Durf

An interesting, despairing and very unreported exchange between Ebola and a Chinese journalist in South Korea ten days ago. Which part do you sigh in exasperation at?

THE PRESIDENT: I feel obliged to take maybe one question from the Korean press — since you guys have been such excellent hosts. Anybody? This gentleman right here — he’s got his hand up. He’s the only one who took me up on it. Go ahead. And I’ll probably need a translation, though, if you’re asking the question in Korean. In fact, I definitely will need a translation. (Laughter.)

REPORTER: Unfortunately, I hate to disappoint you, President Obama, I’m actually Chinese. (Laughter.)

THE PRESIDENT: Well, it’s wonderful to see you.

REPORTER: But I think I get to represent the entire Asia.

THE PRESIDENT: Absolutely.

REPORTER: We’re one family here in this part of the world.

THE PRESIDENT: Well, your English is better than my Mandarin also. (Laughter.) But — now, in fairness, though, I did say that I was going to let the Korean press ask a question. So I think that you held up your hand anyway.

REPORTER: How about will my Korean friends allow me to ask a question on your behalf? Yes or no?

THE PRESIDENT: Well, it depends on whether there’s a Korean reporter who would rather have the question. No, no takers?

(Inaudible.)

THE PRESIDENT: This is getting more complicated than I expected. (Laughter.)

REPORTER: Take quick, one question from an Asian, President Obama.

THE PRESIDENT: Well, the — as I said, I was going to — go ahead and ask your question, but I want to make sure that the Korean press gets a question as well.

I like that none of the Koreans try and bail him out of his predicament.
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November 22, 2010 8:36pm
Hurf Durf

Manolo: that “study” has already been the subject of a lot of criticism in the UK. I like that Japan is now the model of social equality, with its decades-long economic stagnation, massive youth suicide rate, impending population crisis and this:

“Low wages and the high cost of living in Tokyo mean I have to work three jobs just to have enough to afford to live.

“If I want to take a holiday I don’t get paid, so I can’t afford to take time off. Also, I worry that it will upset the boss – there are so many young people now looking for work.”

Full speed ahead, Fabians!
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November 22, 2010 8:42pm
reid

“An interesting, despairing and very unreported exchange…”

To be fair Hurf, he was put on the spot by an aggressive questioner from the arch-enemy.

When the President speaks, lots of things arise.

What else could be do but prevaricate?
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November 22, 2010 8:49pm
Hurf Durf

He’s not exactly bright without his teleprompter either.

On that subject, may I offer belated congratulations to the President for his use of such contraptions in the Indian Parliament for the first time ever.
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November 22, 2010 8:51pm
Lucia Maria

Anyone here seen this mock ad by Saturday Night Live on the pat-downs Americans are experiencing if they reject the scanners?
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November 22, 2010 10:07pm

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