General Debate 18 April 2010

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s.russell

Extraordinary developments in UK general election….
Three polls overnight put Labour in third place, and one has the Liberal Democrats leading both Labour AND the Conservatives.
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April 18, 2010 9:22am
Pita

I’m tired of people praising the virtue of Clark and her Gowernment so I thought perhaps a list should be prepared of all the poor decisions and fuck ups they were responsible for, as individuals and as a government, over their nine years in power. To list a few in no particular order to get the ball rolling:

Foreshore and seabed
Anti smacking Bill
Electoral Finance Act
Retrospective legislation to legitimise their theft
Purchase of railways at something like three times its value
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April 18, 2010 9:22am
Inventory2

That Andrew Williams eh? Does he not realise that Custer came a distant second in the Battle of Little Big Horn?

http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/2010/04/mayor-and-indians.html
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April 18, 2010 9:31am
philu

someone please shield redbaiter..and our other local tea-baggers..from this shocking news..!

http://whoar.co.nz/2010/the-roots-of-stalin-in-the-tea-party-movement/

“..The Tea Party movement’s dirty little secret is that its chief financial backers owe their family fortune to the granddaddy of all their hatred: ..

.. Stalin’s godless empire of the USSR.

The secretive oil billionaires of the Koch family, the main supporters of the right-wing groups that orchestrated the Tea Party movement ..

.. would not have the means to bankroll their favorite causes ..

. had it not been for the pile of money the family made working for the Bolsheviks in the late 1920s and early 1930s ..

.. building refineries .. training Communist engineers ..

.. and laying down the foundation of Soviet oil infrastructure..”

whoar..!..

(‘..holy ideological-cleft-of-a-dilema..!..batman..!.’.)

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 9:31am
Pete George

Who said this about what movement?

For those in the movement, “the deficit is a symbol of the mess in Washington.” They are “deeply anti-political” and hold “deep antipathy to Congress.” They are “anti-government and anti-establishment.”
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April 18, 2010 9:37am
jims_whare

heh I wonder if the volcano in iceland will have an effect on the uk elections…….might piss the people off to get rid of Brown.
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April 18, 2010 10:00am
Shunda barunda

Speaking of volcano’s, guess where the biggest eruption in the past 70,000 years was…….
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April 18, 2010 10:17am
reid

Anyone following the Goldman Sachs prosecution?

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/world/3593552/Goldman-Sachs-charged-with-fraud-by-SEC

Goldman Sachs Group Inc was charged with fraud by the US Securities and Exchange Commission over its marketing of a debt product tied to subprime mortgages that was designed to fail. Goldman shares fell as much as 15.6 percent and broader stock markets fell after the news.

The SEC alleged that Paulson & Co, a major hedge fund run by billionaire John Paulson, worked with Goldman in creating a collateralised debt obligation, and stood to benefit as its value fell, costing investors more than US$1 billion. That is roughly the amount that Paulson is estimated to have made by betting against the CDO. Fabrice Tourre, a Goldman vice president who the SEC said was principally responsible for creating the product, was also charged with fraud. Paulson was not charged….

Goldman vowed to fight the SEC civil suit.

“The SEC’s charges are completely unfounded in law and fact and we will vigorously contest them and defend the firm and its reputation,” it said.

In its lawsuit, the SEC alleged that Goldman structured and marketed a synthetic CDO, ABACUS, that hinged on the performance of subprime residential mortgage-backed securities.

It alleged that Goldman did not tell investors “vital information” about ABACUS, including that Paulson & Co was involved in choosing which securities would be part of the portfolio. It also alleged that Paulson took a short position against the CDO in a bet that its value would fall…

According to the SEC, the marketing materials for the CDO showed that a third party, ACA Management LLC, chose the securities underlying the CDO, without revealing Paulson’s involvement…

The SEC charges are expected to fuel anti-Wall Street sentiment on Capitol Hill, where sweeping financial industry reforms are expected to soon arrive on the Senate floor for a vote…

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/columnists/article7100312.ece

Michel Barnier, the EU’s Financial Services Commissioner, yesterday said that… “None of the players in the financial services industry should have a short memory and our role is to prevent that people should have a short memory.”

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/banking_and_finance/article7100320.ece

Royal Bank of Scotland was the biggest victim of the alleged scam, according to the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), the Wall Street financial watchdog… One of the insurers was ABN Amro, the Dutch bank bought by RBS in 2007. A year after buying ABN, RBS paid Goldman Sachs almost $841 million to get out of the insurance deal. Another alleged scam victim, IKB, a German bank, lost $150 million after buying into the product.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/18/business/18goldman.html?hp

It is a particularly sensitive time for Wall Street. Washington policy makers are hotly debating a sweeping overhaul of the nation’s financial regulations, and the news could embolden those seeking to rein in the banks. President Obama on Saturday stepped up pressure for financial reform by accusing Republicans of “cynical and deceptive” attacks on the measure.

The S.E.C.’s action could also hit Wall Street where it really hurts: the wallet. It could prompt dozens of investor claims against Goldman and other Wall Street titans that devised and sold toxic mortgage investments.

On Saturday, several European banks that lost money in the deal said they were reviewing the matter. They could try to recoup the money from Goldman.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/18/us/politics/18address.html?hp

“Obama Vows to Move on Regulation”
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April 18, 2010 10:35am
s.russell

The biggest eruption in the past 70,000 years?

Taupo?
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April 18, 2010 11:12am
Inky_the_Red

The BBC have a ‘device’ on their website which translate votes (actually % of votes) to seats.
If you put the Mail on Sunday poll (where the Lib Dem have the lead and Labour 3rd) the results look
LDP 118 seats (32%)
Con 226 seats (31%)
Lab 277 seats (28%)
Oth 29 (9%)
I know that the prediction is based on standard uniform National swing (that will not happen), but isn’t first past the post great.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/election_2010/8609989.stm

I think other will do better especially in Scotland
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April 18, 2010 11:21am
Redbaiter

New York Daily News Poll-

Do you feel the conspiracy theory of President Obama’s birth has been settled, or remains unanswered?

29% Settled – Evidence clearly shows he was born in Hawaii.

59% Unanswered – Obama needs to show the world his birth certificate.

12% – People either believe it or they don’t, nothing will change their minds at this point.

..and its no conspiracy. Obama merely needs to show proof, and the question is settled.

Anyone else out there noticing the growing crescendo of lies and propaganda from the left?

Sounds like they’re seriously worried. They need to be.
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April 18, 2010 12:07pm
reid

Interesting article from Pepe Escobar on the rise and rise of the BRIC group.
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April 18, 2010 12:10pm
LeftRightOut

Anyone else out there noticing the growing crescendo of lies and propaganda from the left?

Nope, just a lot of shrill shrieking from those who once worshipped Perot now running around in dumb costumes and making dumber statements. Look at the demographic of the teabirtherpartiers; they’re Ross Perot’s troops, just older and dumber.
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April 18, 2010 12:19pm
Redbaiter

Mayor from city (Champaign) in Obama’s own state says Obama not American-

http://www.breitbart.tv/illinois-mayor-expresses-doubts-about-obamas-citizenship
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April 18, 2010 12:33pm
stuarts-burgers

Maybe somebody should send Sue Bradford this link. Hey an offshore role would be good for her but sailing or rowing to Texas may be a bit of an ask as of course Air Travel would cause to much of a Carbon Foot Print for her
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/15/AR2010041505964.html?nav=hcmodule
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April 18, 2010 2:04pm
Rex Widerstrom

I wonder how many other nations who claim to be democracies have a jingositic restriction on the birthplace of their political leader(s)? Is the US the only one who thinks only a “natural born citizen” is fit to lead their country, or are there others? And I wonder what the motive is for retaining the restriction, when so many people born outside the US have clearly contributed so much to that nation over the centuries?

Having said that, I tend to agree with Redbaiter. Why the hell doesn’t Obama just show the certificate and be done with it?! Not that I’m following the debate, so my question may already have been answered, in which case ‘scuse my ignorance…
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April 18, 2010 3:13pm
reid

“Why the hell doesn’t Obama just show the certificate and be done with it?! Not that I’m following the debate, so my question may already have been answered…”

No it hasn’t been answered yet Rex. Short-form vs long-form certificate – he’s shown the former but not the latter, which is the real clincher. Lots of questions that could be very easily cleared up in a jiffy, so as you say, why the hell doesn’t he just dig it out of his drawer, if he has it.

Point is, that if he doesn’t have it, then it clearly gives anyone who has evidence to the contrary, blackmail material. It’s a security risk. Funny then that the media is so so unwilling to really look at it, isn’t it.
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April 18, 2010 3:35pm
Redbaiter

See Geraldo Riviera (FOX news lefty) get his arse handed to him on a plate by Mark Williams of the Tea Party movement, who informs him, (while Gerry tries the usual smear tactics) on what the movement is really all about.

http://videos.mediaite.com/video/FOXs-Geraldo-Rivera-SLAMMED-By

“And I wonder what the motive is for retaining the restriction”

Same as its always been. Ensuring that any President is 100% loyal to the US.

Obama isn’t, and with his selling out of the USA on so many fronts, perhaps the best indication yet as to why that clause has to be kept in the Constitution.

“Funny then that the media is so so unwilling to really look at it, isn’t it.”

Only if you’re still one of the gullible fools who has not awoken to the fact that the mainstream media is nowadays a perverted propaganda front for the left. It ceased being an objective reporter of news decades ago. Their promotion of the Global Warming scam, and their refusal to report on Obama’s probable inelligibility to be POTUS, (or uncover any detail on his background) are just two examples that prove this.

Still unconvinced? Compare their lack of curiosity regarding Obama to the enthusiasm they show in persecuting Sarah Palin or George Bush. In the US, Australia and NZ, they’re lying politically partisan scum. No doubt about it.
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April 18, 2010 3:51pm
malcolm

http://factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

I’m guessing you won’t accept that. A good question to ask conspiracy theorists is what evidence would satisfy them? The answer is nothing because they’ve already bought into the idea and any evidence can be misconstrued as more evidence of conspiracy. Kind of like religion.

Reid, why do you think none of the various appeals to the Supreme Court on this issue have been successful? This is very like the 911 conspiracy theory – you’d need a hell of a conspiracy to pull it off and even more effort to keep a lid on it.
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April 18, 2010 3:52pm
Redbaiter

Uh oh, here’s the leg humping queer chihuahua again. On schedule.
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April 18, 2010 3:55pm
Banana Llama

They share alot in common the Roman and Greek republics as well Rex (lmao at the name now) which would go some way to explaining the natural citizen requirement.
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April 18, 2010 3:55pm
Pete George

The birthers are just a bizarre side show. Obama doesn’t need to do anything more to legally prove his birth.

It is possible that Obama conspired his way to the precipice of the world’s biggest job, involving a vast network of people and government agencies over decades of lies. Anything’s possible.

But step back and look at the overwhelming evidence to the contrary and your sense of what’s reasonable has to take over.

There is not one shred of evidence to disprove PolitiFact’s conclusion that the candidate’s name is Barack Hussein Obama, or to support allegations that the birth certificate he released isn’t authentic.

And that’s true no matter how many people cling to some hint of doubt and use the Internet to fuel their innate sense of distrust.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/jun/27/obamas-birth-certificate-part-ii/

“These claims are promoted by a number of fringe theorists and political opponents who filed lawsuits that sought to disqualify Obama from standing or being confirmed as President, or to obtain additional proof that he is qualified. Three were filed with and dismissed by the Supreme Court of the United States. None of the cases have prevailed in lower courts.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp

Hinkelman, Michael. “Judge Rejects Montco Lawyer’s Bid to Have Obama Removed from Ballot.”
Philadelphia Daily News. 25 October 2008.

Koppelman, Alex. “Sex, Lies and Creatively Edited Interviews with Sarah Obama.”
Salon. 5 December 2008.

Nakaso, Dan. “Obama’s Certificate of Birth OK, State Says.”
Honolulu Advertiser. 1 November 2008.

Nakaso, Dan. “Hawaii: Obama Birth Certificate Is Real.”
Honolulu Advertiser. 27 July 2009.

Nakaso, Dan. “Hawaii officials confirm Obama’s Original Birth Certificate Still Exists.”
Honolulu Advertiser. 28 July 2009.

Voell, Paula. “Teacher from Kenmore Recalls Obama Was a Focused Student.”
The Buffalo News. 20 January 2009.

Associated Press. “State Department of Health Declares Obama Birth Certificate Legal.”
Honolulu Star-Bulletin. 31 October 2008.

Associated Press. “Challenge to Obama Is Dismissed.”
The New York Times. 5 March 2009.

The Economist. “Born Under a Bad Sign.”
28 November 2008.
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April 18, 2010 4:03pm
malcolm

Dear oh dear, Redbaiter. You really do get most upset when people disagree with you. And I wasn’t talking to you.

You should really see someone about your problems.
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April 18, 2010 4:05pm
eszett

Never mind that facts, Red.
Obama has proven over and over again that he was born in Hawaii.

Repeating your braindead rightwing crap conspiracy theories is getting boring.
So you can’t bring up any sensible arguments against Obama policies, you just keep repeating the same old, same old again and again. Typical right wing sore looser mentality.
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April 18, 2010 4:06pm
reid

“Reid, why do you think none of the various appeals to the Supreme Court on this issue have been successful? This is very like the 911 conspiracy theory – you’d need a hell of a conspiracy to pull it off and even more effort to keep a lid on it.”

Malcolm, let’s keep it simple. Fact is, he hasn’t shown it. Period. Why not.

You can if you like speculate theoretically about what it might take to “pull it off” but I’m not. Just like with 911, my position is simple.
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April 18, 2010 4:10pm
Pete George

What does he need to do legally that hasn’t already been done Reid?

Have you wondered why no Republican officials pursue this issue?
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April 18, 2010 4:13pm
malcolm

Malcolm, let’s keep it simple. Fact is, he hasn’t shown it. Period. Why not.

This is an important qualifying requirement to be POTUS. Do you really think there’s no one ensuring that this requirement is meet? And the Supreme Court have considered a number of petitions in this regard and none have been successful. Why do you think that is?

I’ll ask again, what would it take for you to be convinced? Given that the only direct evidence that anyone is born where they say they were is their birth certificate, and the records held by the city?

Note for Redbaiter: This question isn’t directed at you. If you want to response, try to be civil and remember that despite what the voices in your head say, Kiwiblog isn’t your blog and every comment here isn’t directed at you.
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April 18, 2010 4:17pm
eszett

Malcolm, let’s keep it simple. Fact is, he hasn’t shown it. Period. Why not.

But he has. Not only has he shown it, it was conformed by the Health Department in Honolulu.
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April 18, 2010 4:19pm
Pete George

Profile of a Redbirther:

The faux controversy isn’t going to go away soon. Yes, Obama was born in Hawaii, and yes, he is eligible to be president. But according to several experts in conspiracy theories, and in the psychology of people who believe in conspiracy theories, there’s little chance those people who think Obama is barred from the presidency will ever be convinced otherwise.

“There’s no amount of evidence or data that will change somebody’s mind,” says Michael Shermer, who is the publisher of Skeptic magazine and a columnist for Scientific American, and who holds an undergraduate and a master’s degree in psychology. “The more data you present a person, the more they doubt it … Once you’re committed, especially behaviorally committed or financially committed, the more impossible it becomes to change your mind.”

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/12/05/birth_certificate
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April 18, 2010 4:19pm
Redbaiter

Pete, neither you or the queer chihuahua have a goddamn clue. You’re just blowing smoke here. Mainstream media junk that is actually of no import to the real case.

The issue is not that the COLB might have been forged. The issue is that there is plenty of doubt about where Obama may have been born, in the way of reports in the media prior to the election where even he claimed to be of Kenyan birth, statements by Kenyan officials, conversations with people where he admitted being born in Mombassa, the words of his own wife, the fact that no Obamas ever lived at the address given in the birth advertisements, and Obama’s own confusion over which hospital (so far he has named two).

As well, there is the decree issued immediately he became President that sealed all of his past records from public view. (WHY???). There is also the fact that COLBs were once frequently issued to non native Americans. The birth notice could have been posted by anyone, as they frequently are to advise people in towns where mothers might hail from.

Fact Check makes hay with the pathetic claim that if these advertisements were fake, it woudl be proof of a presidential plot stretching way back then and therefore an absurd notion. This is smoke screening subjective rot. The ads could have been placed for many motives, including as a means to help his mother gain US citizenry for her child, or as suggested above, merely to inform interested Hawaiians of Obama’s birth.

There is also the question as to why fine print relating to Obama’s certification as a US citizen by the Democrat party organisation was removed from that document prior to its signing

There is plenty of reason to doubt Obama’s birth, and as he once hounded John McCain for proof of his US birth, (not being satisfied until the long form was produced) so should this arrogant scum produce his own evidence. Instead, rather than allowing the documentation that allowed the COLB to be produced to be shown to the public, he spends millions in legal fees to keep it under wraps. (WHY??)

The law suits have all been dismissed on technical grounds before the real issue got to the bench. The issue has not in fact been tested in the courts.

There is plenty of reason to doubts Obama’s US birth and all he has to do is provide something more substantial than the COLB and two faded newspaper ads. This is good enough to ID a US President? Not even close to it.
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April 18, 2010 4:26pm
Redbaiter

” You really do get most upset when people disagree with you.”

The day an obsessive stalking whining little fag like you upsets me is the day pigs orbit the sun in interplanetary flying ships.
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April 18, 2010 4:30pm
Pete George

Sorry, Red, you may be right, I don’t have a clue, the US courts don’t have a clue, the Hawaii Health Department don’t have a clue, any official group with an interest doesn’t have a clue.

Redbaiter, Rush and Orly Taitz are the only ones who have credibility and really know that a grand conspiracy was started in 1961 faking multiple sources of information and have consistently perpetuated it ever since. Obama becoming president must be god’s will, and to hell with the evolution of facts.

Or this must be the dumbest of all conspiracy theories.
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April 18, 2010 4:35pm
Redbaiter

” Redbaiter, Rush and Orly Taitz are the only ones who have credibility and really know that a grand conspiracy was started in 1961 faking multiple sources of information ”

I wonder why you bother showing up here when the evidence is quite clear that you cannot read or comprehend what others write. Nobody has ever claimed this, and in fact I have gone to pains to point out this is clearly not the case. You’re a flailing low IQ time wasting fool with nothing but smoke. Go away.
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April 18, 2010 4:40pm
eszett

As well, there is the decree issued immediately he became President that sealed all of his past records from public view. (WHY???). There is also the fact that COLBs were once frequently issued to non native Americans. The birth notice could have been posted by anyone, as they frequently are to advise people in towns where mothers might hail from.

Actually, he didn’t. He bought on an Executive Order 13233 which changed the way Regan and later Bush wanted to handle their records
(http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ExecutiveOrderPresidentialRecords) and here is a good analysis of that order (left wing lies and propaganda, yes, I know. *yawn*) http://www.huffingtonpost.com/peter-m-shane/obamas-first-executive-or_b_160002.html

It deals mostly with the records in the archives(!) and that of former presidents.

In any case the Birth Cetrificate was shown way before the order. I don’t even think the prder covers it, as it is not in the National Archives.

And all those other points you raised have been answered ad nauseum.

Anyway, you have to also ask the question, why?
Why would anyone go through all this trouble, especially if it can be proven that easily?
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April 18, 2010 4:48pm
Whafe

It is a little like the fact that the film “The Hurt Locker” won the awards it did….. (the film is shit, hyped up political BS, to swing the population etc etc etc)

But most would accept that it was the best film… PPpfffftttttt….. People only see what they want to see……
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April 18, 2010 4:51pm
Johnboy

I love watching the History Channel on Sky as the peoples channels are just shit but is anybody getting as pissed off as me watching the fucking Aussie’s claiming ANZAC day for themselves.

They obviously are utter dumb pricks as they can’t spell and don’t understand what the NZ in ANZAC stands for.
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April 18, 2010 4:54pm
Pete George

If the birther conspirators are right the deceit would have had to have started from the time of Obama’s birth. I know you aren’t pushing that line Red, but there is as much chance of everything being a successful scam since then without any proof than there is of pigs flying around the sun.

All you do is use the anti evolution tactic, trying to convince people there is doubt rather than bother to try and prove the unprovable.

The funny thing about this one is that Obama doesn’t have to do a thing except laugh at the nutters wasting their time. As POTUS he has no credible legal challenge.
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April 18, 2010 4:58pm
Redbaiter

John McCain produced his long form birth certificate in an instant when a government commission asked him to. Why can’t Obama?
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April 18, 2010 4:58pm
Redbaiter

“If the birther conspirators are right the deceit would have had to have started from the time of Obama’s birth.”

Clueless rubbish. Stop wasting people’s time.
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April 18, 2010 4:59pm
philu

how about all that dirty commie-money funding the ‘baggers’..eh..?

reddy..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 4:59pm
Ed Snack

Epic sigh. First, the so called “birthers” are absolutely not directly connected with the “tea party” grouping. Some Birthers may also be part of the tea party, hell, some may be democrats, but the tea party in no way depends on or promotes birtherism. There is indeed an active attempt by the more feral left to imply that it is so, but in practice birtherism has nothing to do with what the tea party people are protesting about.

Second, Obama’s birthplace. he has a valid short form Hawaiian birth certificate, but that quite emphatically doesn’t prove he was born in Hawaii. As I have pointed out several times before, it was perfectly possible to get a hawaiian birth certificate in 1960 if you were born outside of the place. Ones parents (or even grandparents) merely had to claim that the child was born in Hawaii at a non-licenced facility and was not attended by a licensed professional, and probably swear an affidavit to that end. The long-form birth certificate would show the place of birth and any attending professional. Obama claims to have been born at a hospital, if so, those details should be on the long form and would be essentially incontrovertible proof.

However, it is extremely likely he was born in Hawaii. The Governor of Hawaii has made a public statement that she has seen proof that he was, without however stating what she was referring to, as has I believe the chief medical officer. This isn’t absolute, but pretty good. Also, I have yet to see a reasonable explanation of how the child could have been brought in without some details being recorded. However it is true that others exploited the loophole mentioned above to gain US Citizenship, so presumably it is possible. So far no law suit to gain access has got past first base as the courts have consistently refused to recognize that any of the plaintiffs have a legitimate interest in gaining access to the long form certificate. It is difficult to see who might have the standing in the light of the courts view, although IMHO any US Citizen should in my mind have such an interest. “Shrug”.

Why doesn’t he show the long form ? Who knows, maybe an embarrassing statement on it, maybe just a tactical move to bring out the more lunatic fringe and thus tar other groups by association, exactly as is being done with the tea partiers. Obama though certainly guards his past records closely.

McCain is an interesting case. In a strict sense he would be ineligible, having been born outside the USA. Never going to have to find out now.
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April 18, 2010 5:04pm
Pete George

Obama has had a Hawaiian birth certificate verified. His birth notice was in two Hawaiian newspapers. It doesn’t prove he was born their 100%, very few people can prove where they were born 100%. So what.

The fact is that Obama is unchallenged as legal POTUS. And it looks like Redbirther will keep bringing up his conspiracy “doubt” here until Obama’s term or terms have ended and make no difference whatsoever.

There is plenty of doubt about Redbirther’s sanity. Most weeks there are indications of doubt. All he has to do to prove he is sane is to produce a psychiatrist’s certificate of sanity. Will you do that Red? Or will the doubt continue?
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April 18, 2010 5:16pm
eszett

Red, what commision did John MCain show his certificate to? And whatmakes you think the Obama didn’t?
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April 18, 2010 5:18pm
Johnboy

Yeah but can he surf on a long board? Get up to speed PG!
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April 18, 2010 5:19pm
Redbaiter

“The Governor of Hawaii has made a public statement that she has seen proof that he was, without however stating what she was referring to, as has I believe the chief medical officer.”

Ed see above- Information posted by PG too stupid to know he’s actually undermining his own position.

Quote-

Nakaso, Dan. “Hawaii officials confirm Obama’s Original Birth Certificate Still Exists.”
Honolulu Advertiser. 28 July 2009.

Unquote.

In fact this information has been contradicted by other releases and media reports, including some that claim the records have been expunged or others saying they were destroyed in a fire. The Hawaii Dept of Health is completely unreliable as a source of fact on this issue.
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April 18, 2010 5:20pm
Johnboy

Whats this ABC shit? I’ve been away for a while. Is Davy worried about our spelling now? Sheesh!!
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April 18, 2010 5:21pm
Whafe

+1 on johnboy’s question……

More so will it filter the man whom is on the tit 100% of his lifes verbal BS?
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April 18, 2010 5:25pm
Rex Widerstrom

“100% loyalty to the US” the reason for the “born in the US” requirement?

The founding fathers were born in another age, I guess. Nowadays being born in a country is absolutely no guarantee you won’t rort it’s system of government for your own ends. Sure, no US President has yet been outed as a Manchurian Candidate, but given the way things have been going for quite some time now the change from selling out for money and power to selling out to a foreign ideology can’t be too far off.

Personally, I find many immigrants form a stronger attachment to their “new” country than the people who were lucky enough to be born in it, and thus take it for granted.

Banana Llama: Ah yeah, you’re right of course. Why didn’t I think of that? (That was rhetorical, BTW 😛 )
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April 18, 2010 5:41pm
Pete George

I never thought of that John, from Hawaii, why doesn’t he surf?

Oh hang on, he did: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Jk7DxDPgkk

He couldn’t have learnt that in Kenya. What more proof do you need?

Forgot, everyone apart from Redbirther is unreliable on this. Red – where is your birth certificate? Or is there doubt about your existence?
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April 18, 2010 5:53pm
Johnboy

Where de great white pointer to eat de darkie mon den???
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April 18, 2010 5:56pm
Johnboy

Come on Petey you are scraping the bottom of the barrel here. That could be me surfing Hougton Bay in 1968 as I did.

Wanker!!!!!!!!!
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April 18, 2010 6:00pm
philu

shouldn’t you be calling yourself johnoldman..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 6:11pm
starboard

…latest TV one poll puts Liarbor about a million miles behind National …. Goof on a paltry 8% as prefered PM…me thinking maybe a BBQ coming up soon at full moon kings place …
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April 18, 2010 6:17pm
Johnboy

Unlike you, I haven’t spent enough time on the dole phil old man, old gouger to call myself johnoldman.
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April 18, 2010 6:21pm
philu

if you surfed houghton in ’68..

you are an old man..

..(btw..i am that bastard who kept dropping in on you..eh..?..remember..?..)

..stop pretending to be something you aren’t..

(were they your ‘best’ years..?..the ‘little house on the prairie’ ones..?

..awww..!!!..)

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 6:26pm
philu

i see those meat-pimp rowing twins are in a new ad..peddling lies/foul muck..

‘eating meat is good for you..!..”

oh really..?..

proof/footnotes please..

fact:..eating flesh/fat/blood causes a raft of health issues..

..it is anything but..’good for you’..

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 6:30pm
Johnboy

Shit I was only 18 in 68 phil.

I suspect that if you dropped in on me then you were a seagull not a magpie.

I really suspect you were then what you still are now.

A fucking dreamer that can’t tell if your hand is on the keyboard or your cock.

You really are an utter tosser.
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April 18, 2010 6:49pm
krazykiwi

The biggest eruption in the past 70,000 years?

Taupo?

Indeed. Apparently there have been rocks – yes rocks – from this eruption discovered in Queensland. Now there’s a big bag!
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April 18, 2010 6:54pm
Inventory2

The Twins say eating meet is good for you

Philip Ure says smoking dope is good for you

Oh, the dilemma; who to believe. Pass me the eye fillet please 🙂
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April 18, 2010 7:05pm
philu

i’ll take the joint..

..and pass on the flesh/fat/blood..

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 8:14pm
Pete George

Meat grows the mind, dope blows the mind.
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April 18, 2010 8:21pm
Tauhei Notts

krazykiwi,
My sister in law in Broadbeach always takes some pumice home with her. She uses it to remove dry skin from her feet. That pumice she discarded; it might be the Taupo rocks found in Queensland.
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April 18, 2010 8:26pm
philu

got any proof/footnotes for that claim that eating the flesh/fat/blood of other creatures..’grows the mind’..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 8:30pm
philu

actually..pete george..you have just set a new benchmark in mindless/unthinking drivel..eh..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 18, 2010 8:35pm
Shunda barunda

“Indeed. Apparently there have been rocks – yes rocks – from this eruption discovered in Queensland. Now there’s a big bag!”

And apparently the biggest eruption in the last 5000 years was also..you guessed it… Taupo.
No volcano in the last 70,000 years has matched the 1,170 CUBIC KILOMETRES! 😯 of deposits from this eruption, and no volcano in the past 5000 years has matched the last (smaller) eruption that flattened most of the central North Island.

Living next to the Alpine Fault suddenly just became so much easier!!
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April 18, 2010 8:59pm
Viking2

Finlayson Compromised.

Top lawyers criticised for refusal to talk
By PHIL KITCHIN – The Dominion Post
Last updated 05:00 19/04/2010

The Crown’s two top lawyers are under fire for not explaining their failure to correct a submission to the Supreme Court.

The submission – on a case involving a Supreme Court judge now under investigation – was later found to be glaringly wrong.

Solicitor-General David Collins, QC, said he would not comment on any issues involving a complaint to the judicial conduct commissioner about Justice Bill Wilson.

Dr Collins said that, because Attorney-General Chris Finlayson, the Crown’s senior lawyer, might have to make a decision on the complaint, it would be inappropriate for either to comment.

Their refusal to speak on the subject was criticised yesterday by Peter Radford, a wool grower at the centre of the controversy.

“It is too late now for the attorney-general to take off his boots, clean his fingernails and pretend he is an independent referee,” Mr Radford said. “His elbows are still muddy from intervening in the Supreme Court, where he encouraged the court to adopt the statement of his friend Justice Wilson.”

Mr Finlayson has previously said all decisions on Justice Wilson were made by Dr Collins. He once told Parliament the real test of a politician was not if he stood up to his enemies but if he stood up to his friends.

Justice Wilson failed to disclose that he owed Queen’s Counsel Alan Galbraith $242,000 when he sat on a case in which Mr Galbraith represented the former Wool Board.

The board was appealing against a High Court decision in favour of a group of wool growers seeking millions of dollars from the board. Justice Wilson and two other Court of Appeal judges found in favour of the board.

But then Mr Radford – one of the growers – discovered deeper business links between Justice Wilson and Mr Galbraith than the judge disclosed.

The Supreme Court then heard Mr Radford’s claim of apparent bias by Justice Wilson, and at that hearing the solicitor-general intervened on behalf of the attorney-general because the case involved the administration of justice.

The attorney-general’s submission said Justice Wilson’s disclosure of his financial ties to Mr Galbraith should be accepted and there was no reason for the judge to have stepped aside.

The court agreed, but also said that, if Justice Wilson had been in debt to Mr Galbraith, the outcome might have been different.

In the following months Mr Radford discovered more on the business links.

At the same time, retired judge Sir Edmund Thomas alerted Chief Justice Dame Sian Elias, Mr Finlayson and Dr Collins to allegations that Justice Wilson owed Mr Galbraith hundreds of thousands of dollars and was being pressed to pay it.
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Sir Edmund alleged Justice Wilson had not made full disclosure to the Supreme Court “when under an obligation to do so”.

“The integrity of the court must be the primary concern,” he said.

Justice Wilson was asked to provide more information and finally disclosed that he owed Mr Galbraith hundreds of thousands of dollars.

The Supreme Court then held a second hearing and ruled that its earlier decision was unsustainable and Justice Wilson should not have sat on the case.

The attorney-general made no submissions to the second hearing.

Judicial Conduct Commissioner Sir David Gascoigne is now investigating complaints against the judge.

The Dominion Post asked Mr Finlayson and Dr Collins if they had felt an obligation as officers of the court to correct their earlier submission immediately on knowing the facts had changed.

Mr Finlayson referred the question to Dr Collins, who would not comment, but said more details “may be” provided when Sir David completed his investigation.

Mr Radford said that, considering Mr Finlayson’s “actions to date and his friendship with Justice Wilson”, the attorney-general should not be making decisions when the judicial conduct commissioner’s investigation was concluded.

He should explain why his submission was not corrected when he became aware that Justice Wilson’s statement was not full and frank, Mr Radford said.
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April 19, 2010 6:37am

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