General Debate 2 March 2010

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Tassman

THE SOCIALIST EDUCATION STRATEGY
Children were regulated arbitrary rights to do as they wish. They are no longer answerable to their parents or to teachers as both supervisors and guardians are reprimanded by law for any form of physical discipline.

Children having their freedom have done more extreme antisocial behavior to now, but in this particular example, more than 30,000 students a day cut class. 2500 truants are not enrolled. So the government is offering financial help to prosecute parents and a school officer is employed to prepare court documents and lawyers fees. The government will double the money to $32million next year to pay for the process.

When the government gave merit to children the freedom to do as they wish, but still pulls the parent for the responsibility then this is not right! Freedom is sanctioned by the responsibility therefore children should be prosecuted and not parents.

And at the same time, having reprimanded by the school and the authority for their child’s non attendance, a mother is sent to prison for assaulting her child (for skipping school). The father is awaiting his sentence for the same offense.

Now, the whole family is separated, and the child will end up on his/her own and in the arms of the street gangs or relatives. This is happening as $32million of redirected tax payer money is divided among lawyers, social workers, doctors, truant officers and etc.

Nothing is spent to prevent the problem or even to resolve it at the bottom of the cliff. Parents and children are worse of while beneficiaries of the socialist system maintain a luxurious lifestyle.
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March 2, 2010 9:03am
queenstfarmer

Who saw that politics lecturer on Media7 last night who started the “Save Radio NZ” campaign? What a pathetic display. His only point was “Radio NZ needs more money not less”. He couldn’t put up any coherent argument in support, and gave non-answers to the intelligent and balanced questions from Russell. He said his campaign wasn’t political, then said it was. He said he didn’t support Labour, then said he was a Labour party member. If that is the standard of the average politics faculty member at an NZ university, I pity the students.
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March 2, 2010 9:07am
Murray

A lot of wildly failing hysteria there from tassman. Can someone translate?
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March 2, 2010 9:09am
Pete George

Insulation effectiveness in cold regions questioned

“A confidential report obtained by Radio New Zealand under the Official Information Act estimates the cost of bringing houses up to World Health Organisation standards would be about $10 billion.

The report’s author, Otago University energy studies director Professor Bob Lloyd, says while the insulation programme has improved standards for underfloor heating, homes in colder regions need costly wall insulation.”

I’d question this further.

I got a quote under this scheme and they wanted to top up existing ceiling insulation and install underfloor insulation – the quote was far too high, they seemed to be trying to sell me up to more expensive options. It will be more cost effective to just get underfloor done myself.

In any case I don’t think the scheme provides the most effective solution for me – double glazing. In the winter it is easier keeping my house warmer at night with curtains closed than during the day with them open, which suggests the window heat loss is my biggest problem.
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March 2, 2010 9:12am
Tim Ellis

I don’t know what your point is Tassman, but I don’t think tha ta child skipping school is a reasonable excuse for either the father or the mother to assault that child.
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March 2, 2010 9:13am
Brian Smaller

A lot of wildly failing hysteria there from tassman. Can someone translate?

I will try.

1. Government took power of discipline away from parents giving children rights and no responsibility.
2. Kids skip school but government sanctions parents who cannot do anything about their kids not being at school because of #1.
3. He gives example of parents being prosecuted for giving their kid a whack for skipping school. Goes back to #1.

How does that sound?
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March 2, 2010 9:17am
Stuart Mackey

Interesting stuff in the UK, from a government minister no less. Seems the Islamic radicals have been copying the methods of the far left rather well.
We should be cautious

*******************************************
Islamic radicals ‘infiltrate’ the Labour Party (UK)
http://www.telegraph.co.uk

The Islamic Forum of Europe (IFE) — which believes in jihad and sharia law, and wants to turn Britain and Europe into an Islamic state — has placed sympathisers in elected office and claims, correctly, to be able to achieve “mass mobilisation” of voters.
Speaking to The Sunday Telegraph, Jim Fitzpatrick, the Environment Minister, said the IFE had become, in effect, a secret party within Labour and other political parties.

“They are acting almost as an entryist organisation, placing people within the political parties, recruiting members to those political parties, trying to get individuals selected and elected so they can exercise political influence and power, whether it’s at local government level or national level,” he said.
“They are completely at odds with Labour’s programme, with our support for secularism.”
Mr Fitzpatrick, the MP for Poplar and Canning Town, said the IFE had infiltrated and “corrupted” his party in east London in the same way that the far-Left Militant Tendency did in the 1980s. Leaked Labour lists show a 110 per cent rise in party membership in one constituency in two years.
In a six-month investigation by this newspaper and Channel 4’s Dispatches, involving weeks of covert filming by the programme’s reporters:
IFE activists boasted to the undercover reporters that they had already “consolidated … a lot of influence and power” over Tower Hamlets, a London borough council with a £1 billion budget.
We have established that the group and its allies were awarded more than £10 million of taxpayers’ money, much of it from government funds designed to “prevent violent extremism”.
***********************************************************
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March 2, 2010 9:23am
Pete George

The Government haven’t taken any power of discipline away from me.
I think children have a right not to be assaulted.
I had a problem with a kid skipping school, whacking them would have created more serious problems, it wouldn’t have solved anything.
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March 2, 2010 9:24am
Inventory2

At the risk of giving the Christian-bashers an opening, ! would hope that this might be the first fissure in the Destiny Church empire …

http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/2010/03/he-would-do-that.html
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March 2, 2010 9:29am
Murray

Destiny isn’t a Christian church. Its a cult that uses a tailored version of Chrsitianity as its vehical.

Chrsitianity is no more to blame for Destiny church than a tea bush is for the East India Company.
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March 2, 2010 9:35am
malcolm

In the time-honoured tradition, Bishop Tamaki will simply portray these ex-members as being led astray by sin and false prophets. A terrible warning to the true followers. He can probably find something in the Bible to ‘prove’ it.

Keep looking inward folks, and don’t touch the bubble.
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March 2, 2010 9:39am
NeillR

More than 30,000 children a day are cutting classes, a new report on truancy says. and Education Minister Anne Tolley is promising to tackle the problem.

And we all know that they’ll grow up to be good little dole bludgers. So here’s a solution – there is enough computing power to be able to record the truants and when their names come up for a dole/DPB application it should be declined. Pure, simple. If you can’t be bothered looking after yourself then why the fuck should the state look after you?
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March 2, 2010 9:40am
andrei

Tassman is right – the heathen government has gone out of its way to undermine parental authority and then punishes parents when they can’t exercise it – or punishes them when they try to.

Well they haven’t built utopia yet and they never will – they will just continue to grasp power and feed at the trough.
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March 2, 2010 9:41am
Jack5

New topic for a moment..

Who is the biggest sucker over southern developer Dave Henderson? Rodney Hide, his old mate and co-campaigner on the IRD, or the Christchurch City Council? The city has given Henderson an option to buy back some big-dollar property. The report in the Christchurch Press today comes on the same day as a report that a move to bankrupt Henderson is delayed again.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/3391759/Bankruptcy-bid-put-off

http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/3391765/Henderson-buys-back-site-from-city
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March 2, 2010 9:43am
Pete George

And we all know that they’ll grow up to be good little dole bludgers.

“We all” don’t jump to sweeping conclusions.

I’ve had experience with truancy, it got worse and worse until they dropped out of school altogether. We hung in there, provided a mixture of support and advice, and they chose to go back to school the following year, completed high school and tertiary, is working now and has not been on the dole. No violence necessary.
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March 2, 2010 9:48am
Tassman

Playing innocent is not an argument.

The law of cause and effect provides the impetus to motivate the action and traced from the policy to the child on the street.
The material science law does not allow for thinking persons to change the cause of their action – they don’t act on commonsense.

When the child skipped school, the mother got angry because she was prosecuted, her anger got the better of her and hit her child. The government gave money to the professionals to carry out legal duties, while the mother and the child are left at the bottom of the cliff.

I can’t believe I’m describing this… My English gate keeper teacher used the same ploy to confuse Asian students..
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March 2, 2010 9:49am
Richard Hurst

Jack5 the biggest suckers over Dave (the council is my bank) Henderson are the ratepayers of christchurch.
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March 2, 2010 9:50am
malcolm

Tassman, you’re certainly confusing me.
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March 2, 2010 9:51am
Tassman

The bus used for advertisement is not a universal platform or public asset as such. Its use is totally controlled by measures put in place by the private owner and not by regulation. But there might be an economic interest involved with the controversial advertisement. If all the believers feel the bus’ structure and design is a cause of offense to their belief and decide not to use the bus anymore, I would say the private owner has a cause for concern. Note out he/she would have measured the pros and cons to decide against the atheists’ propaganda.

May be Mr. Cardy and the atheists should join in Destiny’s exodus!
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March 2, 2010 9:57am
LeftRightOut

Pete, you’ll never get away from one thing with the right whingers – their index finger that follows the words on the page is permanently connected to their jerky knees.

Truancy? Yep, that was me at 14. One period turned into half a day, to a day, to a week to finally clearing out altogether and hitching to another city.

Since then I have completed high school, several diploma courses, raised 2 succesful children and paid far more in tax than I ever received in benefits.

But yeah, I’m only one example, and we know you guys like 1000 successes for every failure.
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March 2, 2010 10:00am
Brian Smaller

LRO – yeah, let’s just let kids decide if they go to school or not. Great idea. The trouble is there are 1000 failures for every success.
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March 2, 2010 10:02am
Pete George

Truancy is a problem, especially with problem kids from problem families. Do you think that is because those families are “no longer allowed” to hit their kids?

I’d suggest that those families are over-represented in the whack-them-regardless category.
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March 2, 2010 10:06am
Inventory2

Murray said

Destiny isn’t a Christian church. Its a cult that uses a tailored version of Chrsitianity as its vehical.

Chrsitianity is no more to blame for Destiny church than a tea bush is for the East India Company.

I agree Murray – but Christianity and Christians get a bad rap from outfits like Destiny; we are tarred with the same brush. Some of it is from those who don’t know any better; some of it is from those who just need an excuse to further slag off Christianity.
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March 2, 2010 10:13am
cha

Perhaps Tassmans jail term for a whipping truant has been upheld.
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March 2, 2010 10:40am
MikeNZ

Tassman
you’re not confusing me but then I don’t support socialism.
It could be worse so look on the bright side it isn’t like Helen’s utopia Sweden yet!
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=125602
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March 2, 2010 10:44am
Darren

I wait with bated breath to see how this will be spun:)

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/3387850/Wage-gap-with-Australia-set-to-widen
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March 2, 2010 10:48am
Tassman

I might be close to the bone among the socialists in here, I mean those who are Police men and women, social workers, policy makers, politicians, doctors, nurses, lawyers, and especially private practice who get referrals from the school system. So I understand the ploy it has taken to avoid the TRUTH.
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March 2, 2010 11:12am
RightNow

LeftRightOut – I’m inclined to agree with your position on truancy and think it’s the kids’ choice, let them live their own lives.
I knew you were really a libertarian!
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March 2, 2010 11:24am
Yvette

Why is New Zealand’s SAS activities being publicised the way they are in the last 24 hours –
television yesterday on a gun battle, today facing winter weather conditions [stuff.com] ?
Is it a conscious drive to raise New Zealand’s status to that of a country worth targeting by terrorists in retaliation? And since any idiot with half a pack of cheap sausages can easily get within striking range of our Prime Minister, how easy would it be?
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March 2, 2010 12:54pm
KiwiGreg

I cant believe you are wasting time on truancy issues when we in the midst of a constitutional crisis. Who will lead us if the “King” abdicates?

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/3393749/Maori-King-threatens-to-abdicate
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March 2, 2010 1:47pm
ISeeRed

Yes, Darren. The only way to lift wages in the long-term is create a labour shortage. That’s achieved by pro-growth, pro-employment, pro-business policies where companies and enterprises are expanding so much they’re desperate for staff. For New Zealand, income tax and company tax has to drop to under 20% NOW, with significant welfare and employment reform. NZ already ranks highly in terms of economic freedom, e.g. the ease of starting a company. Dropping taxes to Hong Kong or Singapore levels would go a huge way towards boosting employment and wages in this country.
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March 2, 2010 1:47pm
Hurf Durf

Billybonkers thought process:

If I think I did it, then it really happened, and I won’t have to come to terms with my own failure!

Good thinking, Billy.

In other news, Violent, crazed, teabagger nutjobs kill themselves and their two year old child. Wait, did I say teabaggers? I meant enviro-cretins. My mistake.
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March 2, 2010 5:18pm
Hugh Manatee

Truancy must be stamped out now!
I never played hookey, so no one else must be allowed to bunk school!!
Truants are refusing to conform so we must smash their independent thinking!
National!
Act now!
Smash non-conformists!
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March 2, 2010 5:42pm
Steve

Oh look, another Socialist Bleeding Heart.
Humanity
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March 2, 2010 7:08pm
Hugh Manatee

No Steve, No!

Truants are Deviants.
They don’t Conform.
They are Choosing to Absent themselves from School.
Remove that Choice.

Fine their Parents.
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March 2, 2010 8:19pm
Whafe

Man alive these clotts hosting Topgear Australia are well, like a torn sack of ass holes…. Try hards for sure….
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March 2, 2010 8:35pm
NeillR

I’ve had experience with truancy, it got worse and worse until they dropped out of school altogether. We hung in there, provided a mixture of support and advice, and they chose to go back to school the following year, completed high school and tertiary, is working now and has not been on the dole.

Excellent – so you’re quite in favour of my idea then? It’s good to know that no-one opposes stopping the dole for recidivist truants. That should make it easier to become law.
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March 4, 2010 9:19am

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