General Debate 2 September 2009

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tvb

No comment from you on Jim Bolger use of limos and airfares. It seems that instead of the commercial organisations he is working for picking up these costs he is directly asking the Parliamentary Service to meet them through the MPs scheme. I do not think “business” related travel should be paid for by the MPs scheme. A retired PM can be expected to attend speaking events and maintain international contacts and the Parliamentary scheme should be used for that purpose only.
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September 2, 2009 8:18am
Patrick Starr

whilst Geoffrey Palmer, 20 years ago the PM of just 13 months still clocks up $26,055 p.a on air fares and chauffeurs
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September 2, 2009 8:23am
Rick Rowling

LOL moment on National Radio this morning. Eugene Ryder “I can’t speak for other gangs, but Black Power won’t be stepping outside the law”.

If only.
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September 2, 2009 8:33am
coventry

Help a mate buy a fence.

*******

For the last 12 months he has been building 2 new bedrooms and a new lounge on to his house, Due to an unplanned baby and an inlaw moving in. But alas the money has run out. The only thing left to do is fence the section in and re-level and re-plant the lawn. So to get the money his fine wife has entered this competition http://www.nzfavouriterecipe.co.nz/recipes/desserts/95-easy-scrumptious-choc-fudge-slice

All he asks that you do, is vote for her entry (Margaret from Marlboroughs choc fudge) to help keep his kids and dogs in the section and keep the boogy man out. Needs to be a valid email address.

Thanks in advance.

*********

Note: Can I vote more than once?

You can vote for as many recipes as you like, however voting is limited to one vote per recipe, per email address. i.e. you cannot keep voting for yourself or someone else off the same email address. If we see obvious attempts at increasing votes by adding emails we may remove the recipe. The Promoter will remove votes that are attached to a non-valid email address

*********

It all for a good cause, so vote away – opt out of receiving more info. Oh and btw, you go in the draw for $100 grocery voucher for just voting too.
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September 2, 2009 8:35am
CraigM

tvb – you are provided a forum here to post your comments and you have done so, why the snide comment about DPF not posting re Bolger? You made your point about his travel costs, (and I agree with you) and it stands alone, no need for cheap shots at our host.
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September 2, 2009 8:35am
Chicken Little

tvb – Maybe you need to send David a list early each morning of the topics you wish him to cover. I’m sure he apologises profusely for not covering the topics you wish him to immediately.

Other than that – why don’t you start your own fucken blog and cover it there?

Love and xxx

CL
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September 2, 2009 8:37am
kaya

CraigM, Chicken Little – agree re the pathetic dig by tvb.

As for the issue, he makes a fair point. Is their a separation of the expenses or is the taxpayer paying for Bolger’s business travel also? If so it is wrong and we should send a bill to the relevant business for a refund.

I don’t give a toss which Party the particular people are from, if they have their nose in the trough they should get it out and stop stealing from taxpayers.
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September 2, 2009 8:49am
david

Patrick, It would seem that the Law Commission salary is insufficient to cover the good knight’s holiday trips. If only it was “good knight from him, and good night from him”

It would be interesting to see what Mike Moore’s spend was and Jenny Shipley and Helen Clark.

Question for the day: Name all the living ex-Prime Ministers of NZ?
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September 2, 2009 8:53am
TripeWryter

What I don’t understand is why the Law Commission doesn’t pay Sir Geoffrey Palmer’s expemses when he’s doing work for it, and why KiwiBank and KiwiRail don’t pay Bolger’s when he is working for them.
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September 2, 2009 8:59am
kaya

Russell Norman’s feet must look like a swiss cheese with all the bullet holes. Now he is proposing a national uniform charge for plastic bags at supermarkets…….
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September 2, 2009 9:05am
MikeNZ

Russel needs to get real.
Have you looked at all the plastic in your bags at the end of a weekly shop?
the plastic bags are a fraction of the total plastic.
maybe we should all collect all the other plastic and post it to Nick Smith and Russell.
let them drown in it. fools.
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September 2, 2009 9:12am
MikeNZ

Yeah good question TW.
Did the law commission and Kiwi whatevers work that into their packages to save money or give them more dosh?
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September 2, 2009 9:13am
scanner

Perhaps Mr Bludger does lots of traveling and all we see is the bit they want us to see?
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September 2, 2009 9:19am
Bok

Mike NZ
You are being really silly. All those plastic bags are drowning the planet. 😉 Just kidding.
We used to get our bags home, put it in a container and then
lined the bin in the kitchen with them. Luckily for us the move away from plastic bags means that we now buy plastic bags for the kitchen tidy. Some-one was obviously thinking.

Once again Green logic at work. A bit like making up a pollution trading scheme. “Here I am not going to make so much smoke and stuff this week, you can buy my share and make more…”
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September 2, 2009 9:23am
Bok

Just on the whole carbon trading schemes. People tend to get distracted by trying to be clever about the science (yes I know I am one)
However as is always the case, the real humdinger slips quietly by while every-one clamors to be heard on why AGW is or is not real.

Forget about the end result for a minute and the controversy that surrounds that, look at the solution offered. I know that every-one here probably has and understands the folly, as it is common sense, but we sort of moved past the stupidity. Surely we need to deal with the stupidity first.

Petrol or fuel is a cost factor in every thing we do or wear, or eat. I remember about two years ago when petrol became $1.20 per litre.
Every-one predicted that there would be a major slow down in retail, travel just about anything, because of the increased costs. But the manufacturer and the supplier and the retailer simply passed on the cost, and things just kept on growing. Slow down? Dont you believe it!

Then petrol got to nearly $2.40 and everybody suggested that 1) The roads would now be quieter as rail would replace road transport. That once again the economy would slow down. Again the cost was just passed on to the consumer. And growth continued.

It took the screw up of moneylenders and banks to slow things for a bit but even that has passed.

Charging people for pollution will never stop pollution. They simply pass the costs on. And as we have seen with fuel (only one element, I can name seven or eight others) Cost is simply absorbed. If the carbon taxes were going into research, one could argue a case, but it is not. It will enrich another group of traders and spawn another level of civil service that will generate even more pollution just to do the trading. Forests cut down to stop forests being cut down. Millions of miles of airline travel to talk about cutting down on airline travel.

Unless the world as a whole understand (no thats wrong, I think they do understand, they just got bamboozeled passed it) that trading emissions is as pointless as using a broom to sweep back the tide, the earth will really take a hammering, and it will not be because of carbon emissions And the sad thing is that even those elected into power is now brow beaten they cannot see past the simple facts. However the trading scheme will let politicians say, I have done my bit and move on to other stuff. The earth get polluted because we have “done our bit”

And now for the really silly part. Countries like NZ will probably produce less because they feel obligated to do something, while countries like China and India will not ever totally buy into the carbon trading nonsense. That means even more pollution because of the transportation of goods back to countries that stopped making them because of tax.

And that is the stupidity of Green logic.
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September 2, 2009 9:55am
andrei

Luckily for us the move away from plastic bags means that we now buy plastic bags for the kitchen tidy. Some-one was obviously thinking.

Its called the Law of Unintended Consequences” It fucks up big Government solutions every time

And they never learn.
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September 2, 2009 9:58am
Chicken Little

Have an extra karma Bok for that little piece. 🙂

I often think we should all just shut up about this stuff and let the pollies bring in an ETS. When every Kiwi realises that they are now going to have to pay what, $30 pw?, $40pw? in extra costs for, as you point out, little or no gain the screaming will bring down the house literally.

Cracks me up though, all those screaming loudest are still swanning round using their consumer goods, driving here and there, sipping their imported coffee, flying off for holidays ( Hey Keshia how was the very, very, very important opening for The Vinters Luck in Cannes?) whilst telling us plebs to pay more or cut back. In the next few years I predict that some smart politician is going to make huge gains from exposing this rort. ( Rodney? – and no I’m not an ACT voter though I think I might be next time )
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September 2, 2009 10:09am
gazzmaniac

Bok you are quite right.
Whether or not a anthropogenic global warming is fact (and I maintain it is not), the new emissions trading scheme will not solve it. It is barmy to think that another derivatives market will solve anything. What the big question will be is what else will it take with it when it crashes?
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September 2, 2009 10:09am
gravedodger

I hear Mr Norman.au is promoting that the gummint tax those grocers in the lower NI to bring them to heal, not 5c however but 10c. Why stop there why not a dollar. BTW it would be a little more transparent if the donation to charity that the marketing guru claims went into a sealed and labeled box.
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September 2, 2009 10:10am
kaya

ZB just made a point, it isn’t the plastic bags that fuck up wildlife and pollute our streets and countryside. it is the inconsiderate bastards who throw their shit at their arse instead of disposing of it properly.
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September 2, 2009 10:13am
gazzmaniac

From yesterday’s general debate, Cerium said:

“So what I am saying is that if we were to reduce our greenhouse emissions by 10%, all we need is a decent eruption to undo all that.”

Strange logic. Eruptions are natural and will happen anyway. Our emissions add to that. If we reduce emissions by 10% that is less than what we would have emitted, regardless of any eruptions.

My argument is that he natural variation in greenhouse gases is far greater, no matter what people do to try to mitigate their effects. Nobody is talking about atmospheric water which is a much bigger contributer to the greenhouse effect than carbon dioxide, and changes on a daily basis.
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September 2, 2009 10:15am
gazzmaniac

Plastic supermarket bags sold today biodegrade in less than a month when in sunlight. They really aren’t the problem that they once were, especially when you consider the amount of plastic in the environment from other sources (ie packaging).
A paper option would be nice though.
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September 2, 2009 10:22am
kaya

Just go this in my email, apologies if it is an old one but it made me smile!

The first day of school and a new Indian student named Chandrasekhar Subramanjan entered the ninth grade.

The teacher said, “Let’s begin by reviewing some American History. Who said ‘Give me Liberty , or give me Death’?”

She saw a sea of blank faces, except for Chandrasekhar, who had his hand up: “Patrick Henry, 1775,” he said.

“Very good! Who said ‘Government of the People, by the People, for the People, shall not perish from the Earth’?”

Again, no response except from Chandrasekhar.”Abraham Lincoln, 1863,” said Chandrasekhar.

The teacher snapped at the class, “Class, you should be ashamed. Chandrasekhar, who is new to our country, knows more about its history than you do.”

She heard a loud whisper: “F**k the Indians.”

“Who said that?” she demanded. Chandrasekhar put his hand up. “General Custer, 1862.”

At that point, a student in the back said, “I’m gonna puke.”

The teacher glared around and asked, “All right! Now, who said that?”

Again, Chandrasekhar said, “George Bush to the Japanese Prime Minister, 1991.”

Now furious, another student yelled, “Oh yeah? Suck this!”

Chandrasekhar jumped out of his chair waving his hand and shouted to the teacher, “Bill Clinton, to Monica Lewinsky, 1997!”

Now with almost mob hysteria someone said, “You little shit. If you say anything else, I’ll kill you.”

Chandrasekhar frantically yelled at the top of his voice, “Michael Jackson, to the child witnesses testifying against him, 2004.”

The teacher fainted.

And as the class gathered around the teacher slumped on the floor, someone said, “Oh shit, we’re screwed!”

And Chandrasekhar said quietly, “I think it was the American taxpayers, during the 2009 bailouts..”
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September 2, 2009 10:50am
starboard

Last week I made a stand. I went to the local supermarket and filled a trolley full of groceries and frozen foods. I proceeded to the check out , the woman scanned everything into the spare trolley and said ” how many bags do you want to buy “. I said none. I then told her that if you want to charge me for shopping bags I will walk out and leave the groceries behind. She called over the Manager , he told me sorry , ” its company policy to charge for bags now “..so I walked out without me groceries. I then went to a big red shop and did the same. Hey fuck , it filled in an hour while the missus had her hair done. Now if everyone did the same maybe the slimebags would back down on this bullshit bag charge and Wussel dickwad would have to find another crusade to charge.
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September 2, 2009 10:54am
bharmer

Starboard, why does anyone have to give you free bags? In this forum, I expect to encounter people who understand business realities. Pak’n Save have charged for bags for years. You don’t have to buy them. Where is this “I am owed something for nothing” mentality coming from?
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September 2, 2009 11:14am
gazzmaniac

What ever happened to the old boxes at the front of the store? It sorts out a waste problem for the supermarket and a problem for the customer, without the need for plastic bags. Plus they are great when you move house!
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September 2, 2009 11:25am
starboard

Pak n save have been charging for bags for years ?? I dont think so. This whole pay for bags thing is a blatant rip off and profiteering by supermarkets and The Warehouse…it has nothing to do with the enviroment. If they had a real hard on to save the planet , they would go back to paperbags like they had in the old days.
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September 2, 2009 11:27am
bharmer

How is it a rip off? How is it profiteering? They pay for the bags. They charge you for them. Get over it.

These are businesses. They do things for profit. Profit is not a dirty word. A free bag policy is a pure cost. Why would they? I ask again, why do you feel entitled to free stuff?

As to Pak’n’Save, trust me, I buy them each week, 5c each bag except for the one free green one given to users of their Shop-n’go service for items that don’t scan properly. It is a long time since their bags were free.
They still offer boxes at the front of the store, but they are clumsy things to deal with and need to be got rid of afterwards, and can’t be used as bin liners which is why I buy the bags. Four bags (20c) accommodates my weekly shop, and my financial world doesn’t come to an end.
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September 2, 2009 11:36am
bobux

starboard

Pak’n’Save in Wellington and the Hutt Valley have been charging for plastic bags for the past five years at least. Feel free to ask any local if you doubt me. 5c per bag asof yesterday.

No idea if this is standard throughout the country, as they are all owner-operators. I have no problem in paying for stuff I use, and the groceries there really are cheaper.
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September 2, 2009 11:42am
starboard

Im in the south island and Ive never been charged for bags…nor shall I ever be. I buy their groceries..they can give me their bags..as they have been doing for the last 30 years.
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September 2, 2009 11:49am
bharmer

Sounds more like a port (left) attitude than starboard.
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September 2, 2009 11:58am
starboard

..take a deep breath bharmer…tell me , where does the 5 cents go..some mysterious “charity” no doubt..??..more likely their bottom line…
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September 2, 2009 12:23pm
big bruv

It seems that Crusher may have made her first fuck up.

Closing police stations is NOT the way to get tough on crime Judith, no doubt she us under pressure from Neville fucking Key to get costs down but this is not an area where most kiwi’s want to see cost savings.

It is about time that the Nat’s developed some balls, the area to cut costs is in social welfare, one would have thought that politically there is NO downside for the government as the only ones who are going to moan about welfare cuts are those who will never vote for National.

What a pity it is that we have a gutless PM who seems determined to grab as many votes from the left as he can by shitting on those from the centre right.
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September 2, 2009 12:31pm
dime

Bruv – dont fall for the labour bullshit.

Labour obtained a report under the official information act. a report given to collins by the police after they were asked to do a line by line report of costs.

it doesnt mean she was behind it or endorses it or will act on it.
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September 2, 2009 12:43pm
joe90

So dime reckons the cutting of the police fleet numbers is something Labour made up?.
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September 2, 2009 12:54pm
tvb

I did not mean my comment about David NOT posting on Jim Bolger as a snide remark, I was stating a fact. For those that see that as a snide remark you strike me as people who have a personality problem always seeing the worst in things.

[DPF: I thought about it but I found the story boring to be honest.]
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September 2, 2009 12:57pm
joe90

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2504542/Police-vehicle-fleet-to-be-reduced-in-size
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September 2, 2009 1:01pm
gazzmaniac

Im in the south island and Ive never been charged for bags…nor shall I ever be. I buy their groceries..they can give me their bags..as they have been doing for the last 30 years.

The Pak ‘n Save in Taupo charges for bags (and has since it opened over 15 years ago), as does the one in Hamilton East, Wanganui, Palmerston North, Lower Hutt, Kilbirnie, Paraparaumu and Dunedin – those are the ones I have shopped at (and would have noticed if they didn’t charge for bags). I daresay the rest of them do too. They can charge for bags if they want to, because their food is so much cheaper than everywhere else that it more than makes up for it.

Get a box or reuse your bags if you are worried about paying for it, or shop somewhere else. Tightarse.

Judith Collins will never get my vote because I disagree with her car crushing policy. It will create discontent with car enthusiasts and the people whose cars get crushed will never vote for the National party – they are alienating a section (and the future) of their constituency with that policy.
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September 2, 2009 1:12pm
bobux

Im in the south island and Ive never been charged for bags…nor shall I ever be. I buy their groceries..they can give me their bags..as they have been doing for the last 30 years.

User-pays doesn’t bother me at all. Adds an average of 25 cents to the bill each time I shop. Going to a rival supermarket would get me free bags, but the cost of the groceries would be a hell of a lot more than 25c higher.

If I wanted to save the 25 cents, I could buy reusable bags. But then I would need to buy disposable plastic bags to line my rubbish bin, leaving the the planet no better off and me poorer.
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September 2, 2009 1:18pm
bobux

gazza

We value cheap groceries more than free bags, meaning we are the true tight-arses.

And proud of it, too!
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September 2, 2009 1:20pm
big bruv

I done care where the suggestion comes from Dime it must be stopped.

This is typical of Neville Key, we all know that costs muse be lowered, we all know that he cancelled the promised tax cuts so he could keep essential spending (Health and Education) at existing levels but to but spending on Police and Police resources is just not acceptable.

Spending cuts must be made in social welfare, that is where we can save the most and that is the largest area of waste.
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September 2, 2009 2:07pm
starboard

Pak n saves are full of bottom dwelling labour voters anyway…fuck just travel to P&S wainoni or moorhouse ave in chc to see the real dregs of society..especially on Tuesdays….
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September 2, 2009 2:16pm
llew

Pak n save have been charging for bags for years ?? I dont think so.

Heh. That’s why they’re called Pak n Save – pack your own groceries in the skanky cardboard boxes they give for free (or bring your own), & save money. They’ve always charged for plastic bags. For decades.

starboard (392) Vote: 0 0 Says:

September 2nd, 2009 at 2:16 pm
Pak n saves are full of bottom dwelling labour voters anyway…fuck just travel to P&S wainoni or moorhouse ave in chc to see the real dregs of society..especially on Tuesdays….

You’re very well informed – sounds like you’re a regular.
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September 2, 2009 2:51pm
llew

Plastic supermarket bags sold today biodegrade in less than a month when in sunlight. They really aren’t the problem that they once were, especially when you consider the amount of plastic in the environment from other sources (ie packaging).

That’s a good point, these stores should lobby some of the suppliers about the ridiculous amount pf packaging of some goods. Meat comes to mind (you can’t even recycle the polystyrene trays). At least the supermarket bags get recycled in rubbish bins (& dog owners like me usually have a couple on hand when out walking).
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September 2, 2009 2:58pm
gazzmaniac

gazza

We value cheap groceries more than free bags, meaning we are the true tight-arses.

And proud of it, too!

That’s the point I’m trying to make – Pak ‘n Save is cheaper than the other supermarkets so they can charge for bags if they want to. That’s why I prefer to shop there when I can (I wish they were in Australia – bloody Coles and Woolies are damn expensive). And avoid the place on wednesdays and thursdays so I don’t run over an old person!
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September 2, 2009 3:00pm
starboard

You’re very well informed – sounds like you’re a regular.

aw maaate..I know Ive seen you there dragin ya knuckles ’round the isles…
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September 2, 2009 3:18pm
llew

So you ARE a regular.

Mmmm lamb knuckles….
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September 2, 2009 3:25pm
Patrick Starr

I was in a meeting earlier where Nick Smith challenged anyone to explain the ETS in less than 30 seconds……
……I was very tempted to call out “bullshit ”…. and save 29 seconds
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September 2, 2009 3:28pm
jarbury

Everyone pays for plastig bags in one way or another. The only question is whether you pay for them individually from your groceries, or whether you pay for them through a little bit being added to the cost of everything you buy.

There’s no such thing as a “free” plastic bag.
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September 2, 2009 3:31pm
bharmer

Starboard asks:
..take a deep breath bharmer…tell me , where does the 5 cents go..some mysterious “charity” no doubt..??..more likely their bottom line…

Of course it goes to their bottom line, exactly as it should. We live in New Zealand, not Cuba or North Korea. This is a capitalist society. Why the heck should it go to a charity?

They are in B U S I N E S S …. the purpose of being in business is to make a return on investment … all investment, including the money spent buying bags. They don’t owe you free bags, and they are not taking away anything you are entitled to.
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September 2, 2009 3:32pm
bharmer

starboard (393) Vote: 0 1 Says:
September 2nd, 2009 at 2:16 pm
Pak n saves are full of bottom dwelling labour voters anyway…fuck just travel to P&S wainoni or moorhouse ave in chc to see the real dregs of society..especially on Tuesdays….

Please tell me how your expectation of something for nothing is consistent with a rightist point of view. Isn’t the “something for nothing” mentality exactly how you would characterise these people?
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September 2, 2009 3:37pm
llew

Starboard asks:
..take a deep breath bharmer…tell me , where does the 5 cents go..some mysterious “charity” no doubt..??..more likely their bottom line…

Of course it goes to their bottom line, exactly as it should. We live in New Zealand, not Cuba or North Korea. This is a capitalist society. Why the heck should it go to a charity?

Because that’s where they say the money is going – http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10594665

“Individual stores are donating the proceeds from the charge to local community initiatives in addition to their sponsorship of Keep New Zealand Beautiful.”

Not much fact checking going on here today is there.
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September 2, 2009 3:39pm
llew

Please tell me how your expectation of something for nothing is consistent with a rightist point of view. Isn’t the “something for nothing” mentality exactly how you would characterise these people?

Well he’s already as much as admitted he IS one of them. Just a very self deprecating one.
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September 2, 2009 3:42pm
Patrick Starr

The plastic bag ‘tax’ wouldn’t be such a bad thing if the proceeds were used for clean up campaigns – of which there are several hundred in Auckland alone, there are groups that clean up the harbour, beaches and regional parks on a voluntary basis – or dependant on sponsorship – usually from you local councils (so your rates pay for it).

The retailers who collect this plastic bag tax claim the proceeds go to such initiatives – but what they don’t tell you is they were contributing the same $$ to these groups (such a KNZB) prior to that tax, so they are making bucks out of it, in the mean time your rates are supporting cleaning up the mess these bags make
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September 2, 2009 3:43pm
Patrick Starr

If you drill down into Keep NZ Beautiful you will find it is fully sponsored and ‘governed’ by the very groups that add to most of the litter problem (Coke – BA Tobacco etc)

(something about owning the opposition lobby group)
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September 2, 2009 3:47pm
village idiot

Big Bruv said: ( of the tax cuts promised by Key, but not delivered)

“we all know that he cancelled the promised tax cuts so he could keep essential spending (Health and Education) at existing levels”

What a suck-up you are Bruv! And what a sucker to boot!

The police, we now hear from a ‘plaster-it-over-quick’ Key, are not losing their stations, only their houses! Great! That’ll make the job so much more attractive. Fewer cars, fewer police houses, radars that don’t work, a stupid fashion law to enforce along with one on talking on a phone in cars … at least they have their new tazers to twiddle with, that’ll keep them happy.. for a while. What a screw-up Collins and Key!
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September 2, 2009 3:47pm
village idiot

Patrick Starr said: “I was in a meeting earlier where Nick Smith …blah, blah..

Nobody would have been surprised to hear ‘bullshit’ coming out of your mouth.
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September 2, 2009 3:50pm
big bruv

Idiot

You are aptly named if you think that I am a suck up to Key, the man is a fucking disgrace if you ask me.

Actually you prove that you are indeed an idiot by attacking him, he is more a socialist than you are, you of all people should be congratulating the man.
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September 2, 2009 4:30pm
Paul Marsden

Supermarkets who are charging for plastic bags will be making a greater margin on the bags, than they do on some product lines. Supermarkets have already amortamised the cost of the bags into their margins. They are in effect, charging for them twice with all the profit going direct to their bottom line. I also resent them claiming that they will take 500 years years to break down. This is just an invented lie. They will break down within a month of being exposed to UV. (ie sunlight) Charity my arse..its just a rip-off. Shoppers should unite and tell them to stick their charging for bags, where the sun don’t shine. I have.
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September 2, 2009 4:54pm
Patrick Starr

idiot – you are not surprised? – and you are indeed a nobody….
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September 2, 2009 4:57pm
getstaffed

Paul- Wait until the card companies allow retailers to add the merchant service fee explicity to their charges. the MSF will already be factored into product/service pricing today, and soon they’ll be able to charge it again. Same issue as the plastic bags… only an order of magnitude more costly for the consumer
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September 2, 2009 5:10pm
starboard

Grow some balls..tell ’em at the checkout ya not payin for ’em !! Its worked in the lower NI..Foodstuffs has backed down and is now making it a ” contribution “. Sounds like another idea gone on the shitheap…much like adding 20 bucks to the price of your airticket for ” carbon “…what a crock of shit.
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September 2, 2009 6:20pm
big bruv

Should my local supermarket ever attempt to charge me for plastic bags I have already decided what my response will be.

I will pay for my groceries, turn down the offer of a paying a plastic bag tax and inform the young checkout operator with multi coloured hair a sixteen facial piercings that ” I will not be long, I am just going to have to carry this lot out to the car, seeing as I do not have any bags it might take a few trips”

If the checkout operator of indeterminable sex attempts to move my goods I will politely inform him/her that I do not want MY property touched and that due to their companies stupid policy the people waiting in line behind me will just have to wait a little longer.

I would imagine that the manager would be there in a flash with an offer of free bags.
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September 2, 2009 6:27pm
starboard

…and aint it nice today without that retard phil whore…wonder if he’s finally got a job ?
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September 2, 2009 6:43pm
big bruv

That’s a point, does anybody know where Phool is?

Perhaps he has been arrested or banned, one thing is sure, the bastard will NOT be out working.
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September 2, 2009 6:48pm
big bruv

Mind you Starboard, that other nut case D4J will make his comeback on the ninth of this month so even if Phool has left us for good we will not be short of retards.
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September 2, 2009 6:51pm
philu

http://whoar.co.nz/2009/george-f-will-time-for-the-us-to-get-out-of-afghanistan-will-is-a-rightwing-american-commentator/

“..Yesterday,” reads the e-mail from Allen, a Marine in Afghanistan, “I gave blood because a Marine, while out on patrol, stepped on a [mine’s] pressure plate and lost both legs.”

Then “another Marine with a bullet wound to the head was brought in.

Both Marines died this morning.”

“I’m sorry about the drama,” writes Allen, an enthusiastic infantryman willing to die “so that each of you may grow old.”

He says: “I put everything in God’s hands.”

And: “Semper Fi!”

Allen and others of America’s finest are also in Washington’s hands.

This city should keep faith with them by rapidly reversing the trajectory of America’s involvement in Afghanistan..

.. where, says the Dutch commander of coalition forces in a southern province..

.. walking through the region is “like walking through the Old Testament.”

U.S. strategy — protecting the population — is increasingly troop-intensive while Americans are increasingly impatient about “deteriorating” (says Adm. Mike Mullen, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff) conditions.

The war already is nearly 50 percent longer than the combined U.S. involvements in two world wars..

.. and NATO assistance is reluctant and often risible.

The U.S. strategy is “clear, hold and build.”

Clear?

Taliban forces can evaporate and then return, confident that U.S. forces will forever be too few to hold gains.

Hence nation-building would be impossible even if we knew how..

.. and even if Afghanistan were not the second-worst place to try: ..

..The Brookings Institution ranks Somalia as the only nation with a weaker state.

Military historian Max Hastings says Kabul controls only about a third of the country — “control” is an elastic concept —

– and ” ‘our’ Afghans may prove no more viable than were ‘our’ Vietnamese, the Saigon regime.”

Just 4,000 Marines are contesting control of Helmand province, which is the size of West Virginia.

The New York Times reports a Helmand official saying he has only “police officers who steal ..

.. and a small group of Afghan soldiers who say they are here for ‘vacation.’ ”

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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September 2, 2009 6:53pm
starboard

I dunno..there’s a few contenders on todays General D….bharmer springs to mind with his shreeking outbursts..oohh did I say that out loud…
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September 2, 2009 6:56pm
philu

and here is some round-up..

for the green-shooters..

http://whoar.co.nz/2009/citigroup-is-queen-of-the-zombie-dance-party/

“…Yet another Wall Street analyst has hammered Citigroup, despite a recent surge in the bank’s stock price.

Shares in Citigroup have shot up more than 60 percent in the last month.

Citi’s recent rally, however, didn’t prevent this macabre declaration today from Institutional Risk Analyst (IRA): ..

..”In Q2 2009, the queen of the zombie dance party remains Citigroup.”

Just last week, as NYT’s DealBook pointed out, David Trone of Fox-Pitt Kelton predicted that Citi would see an additional $68.6 billion in loan losses through 2010.

(Note: Citi’s shares took a big dive today.)

Calling the bank “one of the zombie girls still rocking out at the House Bernanke dance party” .. and saying Citi was “halfway” in the grave,” ..

.. IRA questions why any serious money manager – let alone a Main Street investor – would put their money into Citigroup ..

.. when so many questions remain about the bank’s toxic assets.

According to IRA’s Bank Monitor, which examines the health of individual banks, Citigroup is one of 2,256 banks to receive a grade of “F” in the second quarter of this year.

In case you needed an explanation of what an “F” signifies, IRA describes this grade as:..

.. “Stress levels at the extreme range above industry average.

At this degree of stress, one or more of the key elements of the business model has reached failure mode.

What concerns exist are probably already public.”

phil(whoar.co..nz)
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September 2, 2009 6:56pm
starboard

well.. speak of the devil…its retardwhore…
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September 2, 2009 6:57pm
Hurf Durf

Turns out Hoover’s interventionist policies turned what could have been a bad recession into a depression and that Dead Kennedy made overtures to the Soviets to block Reagan’s foreign policy and make the USSR survive just that little bit longer. You’d have thought this stuff would be all over our fair, unbiased, fourth estate media. The Huruld thinks there are things that are much more important.
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September 2, 2009 6:59pm
Hurf Durf

Military historian Max Hastings says Kabul controls only about a third of the country — “control” is an elastic concept —

– and ” ‘our’ Afghans may prove no more viable than were ‘our’ Vietnamese, the Saigon regime.”

Wait, I thought Iraq was supposed to be Vietnam. Dammit, Afghanistan, stick to the script!
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September 2, 2009 7:02pm
philu

once again hurf..

your comment dosen’t actually make any sense..

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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September 2, 2009 7:35pm
Hurf Durf

Yes it does, phool. Read it again.

I also appreciate the irony of being told by you that something I wrote doesn’t make sense.
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September 2, 2009 7:39pm
philu

not to mention the intellectual depth/analysis it represents/demonstrates..

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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September 2, 2009 7:45pm
Hurf Durf

Oh God, I’m drowning in irony. Someone throw a lifejacket.
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September 2, 2009 7:49pm
Cerium

“New study shows link between crime rates and weather – found strong links suggesting violent crime increases with temperature, as does property crime”

http://www.3news.co.nz/New-study-shows-link-between-crime-rates-and-weather/tabid/422/articleID/119316/cat/77/Default.aspx

Is global warming causing the increase in crime rates?
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September 2, 2009 8:16pm
starboard

no but the full moon causes people to commit murder…its true…Annette said so…
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September 2, 2009 8:25pm
Whafe

All these problems with the youth of this country, the crims, those that dont want to work etc etc etc etc etc is totally the fault of the do good lefties running this show, backing the majority into a corner where they dont want to have to think and take responsibility for actions… It is what the lefties wanted….. Heavens to morgatroid, how will anyone turn it round?, it is going to take someone with balls bigger than Texas

It is shocking when you really look into the state of the nation really, be scared…
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September 2, 2009 8:37pm
jcuknz

Oh the innocence of people … “I’ve never been charged for plastic bags!” … you have been paying for them, and the paper bags, when you bought the groceries. They are part of the overheads which contribute to detirmine the retailers margin. The 5c or 10c is simply a penalty for being lazy in not bringing your own bag to the shop, like we did in the old days when we had a wicker shopping basket et al. I have four green bags and a bluegrey one given to me by Rockgas when I bought some equipment. They are very useful for carrying things around quite apart from groceries, such as tools and library books.

It is well known that burglars prefer not to get wet, like the rest of us of course, so they stay at home on rainy nights for preferance. Plus of course when the weather is good people leave their windows open and many do not have adequate locks on them, usually just a latch. I wonder if this is one of these damm fool research projects that students do and are paid to do out of the public purse.

Big Brov .. I doubt if that will hgappen because just as when I only took one bag with me and bought large I was permitted to take the balance of my purchases, un bagged, out to my car on the trolley. I thought it rather nice of New World to give me five bonus flybuy points becuase I brought my own bags lasy month.
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September 2, 2009 8:44pm
Cerium

Yeah, with global warming, full moons (we are getting at least one a month these days) and lefties (parents, teachers, politicians, police, judiciary) there’s not much hope is there.

Flybuy points! Another leftie hidden tax.

Talking about damn fool research projects, there must be one that has shown that all crims are lefties. The ones that get caught, anyway.
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September 2, 2009 8:47pm
philu

gee cerium..!

…you are fitting in here quite well..

..you’re showing yourself as ‘one of them’..

what made you drop the impartiality-pretence/chimera..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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September 2, 2009 9:00pm
starboard

Oh the innocence of people … “I’ve never been charged for plastic bags!” …

yes we all know the real charge of the bag is included in the price of the groceries..duh….but I object to paying twice for said bag..and I wont…
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September 2, 2009 9:06pm
Whafe

I think big Trev needs to get out on his bike more, he is looking tatty in the crowd on Back Benches…. Still a loser
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September 2, 2009 9:14pm
Whafe

Is Chris Hipkins old enough to vote, he looks and sounds like he is 14 years old….
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September 2, 2009 9:21pm
Whafe

I truly struggle to understand how anyone can listen and digest the diatribe that flows from Russel Normans gob…. It is all a dream and a figment of his imagination…..
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September 2, 2009 9:35pm
kaya

For an excellent, well reasoned piece on the whole “anti smacking” bollocks have a read of this piece by Mike Moore.

http://tinyurl.com/pdd6bn

I don’t care who or what you support, that is a well written piece that defines the whole issue succinctly.
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September 3, 2009 8:29am

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