General Debate 26 November 2008

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OECD rank 22 kiwi

John Key going in to bat for New Zealand:
Key fights UK’s flight tax

Good luck in trying to squeeze blood from a stone. I’m certain that the UK won’t drop these new taxes.
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November 26, 2008 8:21am
Buggerlugs

Seeing we have a bloke called Moles as the new Black Caps coach, does this mean the NZ Cricket team intends to keep on digging? I can’t wait until he brings in his management team of Toad, Rat and Badger…
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November 26, 2008 8:36am
Rakaia George

Yeah OECD, there’s nobody quite as “good” as Gordon when it comes to inventing new taxes…
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November 26, 2008 8:54am
Murray

Well OECD Brown can play ball or we’ll send back all the overstayers we’ve got who are from Britain and a few we have no further use for regardless of their immigration status.

Looking at you McChronic. Cullen, you’re on the list too.

See how Brown likes them apples.
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November 26, 2008 8:55am
Turpin

Thanks s.russell for the last general debate answer.

“As at 30 June 2008, net core Crown debt was in a small net asset position of $19 million.”
Ie. there is no debt at all! Note also that this does not include the assets of the NZ Super Fund (now about $14 billion). Not however that debt is expected to increase again after many years of decline.
I do not know about local authority debt, but the total is probably small bikkies in comparison, a few billion maybe? At most.”

My point was that we should be able to easily see what it is so we can monitor it and the report could be a canary in the mine.
But thanks for the reply.
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November 26, 2008 9:18am
side show bob

OECD, typical socialist solution to any problem, if you can’t regulate it then tax the fuckers. Pommy moron, if the idea was to inflate the coffers then this one is a real let down. I thought the idea was to encourage spending, talk about biting your nose off in spite of your face.
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November 26, 2008 9:20am
mudmum

Totally non-serious, pet grudge here. Why do the morons (cyclists, if you need to be told) think that riding their blasted two wheels through a pedestrian crossing, as the people are crossing, is OK? They want to own the road against all other forms of wheeled transport and now they’re trying takeover bids on pedestrians as well. No-one’s right except a cyclist, eh? I’ll just keep calling them morons until they get a brain to call their own!
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November 26, 2008 9:39am
Inventory2

What’s going down between Brian Rudman and Rodney Hide?

http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/2008/11/rudmans-campaign.html
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November 26, 2008 9:46am
Murray

mudmum I used to work in central Wellington where if they could fir a bike there they would ride there. You learn to put your shoulder into them and then offer to wait for the cop if they want to make an issue of a pedestrian not diving into the garden to get out of their way on a footpath.
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November 26, 2008 9:46am
Banana Llama

Mr brown can play ball or we can start looking at some new teams to play with, we are not beholden to some Muppet elect half a world away, perhaps we can start by putting punitive tariffs on Imported goods from the U.K since they also travel half the world to get here.
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November 26, 2008 9:47am
mudmum

Murray – i work in central Auckland and i have to admit, this morning i was very tempted to stop to shake an imaginary stone out of my shoe, to give the moron something to think about.
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November 26, 2008 9:49am
oranjemakker

Has anyone spotted this story? http://www.stuff.co.nz/4772341a24035.html
Excerpt:
Christchurch dungeon owner Richard Jeffrey Barker today avoided being sent to prison, but will serve nine months on home detention and pay $5000 to each of two teenage girls he scarred during bondage and discipline sessions.

Home detention? One of the girls was only 15, I thought there was no informed consent at that age so surely its a form of sexula abuse therefore? This follows on from a discussion on yesterdays debtate about sentencing (in that case it was argued sentence was too high).

The story gets worse:
Judge Phillips said the victim impact statements made distressing reading.

One of the girls now suffered shame and fear, and was on anti-psychotic medication.

The other had been scarred physically, mentally, and emotionally, and suffered depression, anxiety, paranoia and panic attacks.

That girl saw Barker as a “manipulator of young people”.

Again, in what universe does this justify home detention?
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November 26, 2008 9:57am
Rakaia George

Mudmum – take a chill-pill and realise that it’s not cyclists that you’re p*ssed with, it’s inconsiderate f-wits who happen to be riding bikes. They’re no different from car drivers who run red lights, or mums with buggies two abreast on the footpath or deathwish pedestrians that step into the road without looking.
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November 26, 2008 10:00am
oranjemakker

As a follow up question for discussion, what are the official guidelines for granting of home detention vs prison, and should the new govt. tighten these?
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November 26, 2008 10:01am
Redbaiter

From Drudge-

SHEEEEE’S BACK! COULTER DELIVERS BOOK EXPOSING ‘GUILTY’ OBAMA MEDIA

Bestselling author and controversialist Ann Coulter plans to crash Obama’s inauguration party with her new work, GUILTY.

Set for release first week of January, the book exposes and mocks, in graphic detail, the media’s love affair with all things Democrat and Obama. Coulter presents exhibits A through Z.

“GUILTY is a much-needed reality check on a Left gone wild,” declares the book’s jacket. “When it comes to bullying, no one outdoes the Left. Citing case after case, ranging from the hilariously absurd to the shockingly vicious, Coulter dissects so-called victims who are invariably the oppressors. For instance: While B. Hussein Obama piously condemned attacks on candidates’ families, his media and campaign surrogates ripped open the court-sealed divorce records of his two principal opponents in his Senate race in Illinois.”
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November 26, 2008 10:12am
OECD rank 22 kiwi

The good news just keeps on coming:
NZ to stay in recession through 2009 – OECD

Thanks Helen Clark and Michael Cullen.
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November 26, 2008 10:17am
mudmum

oranjemakker – saw the story yesterday and it is very frightening. This, from the NZ Herald this morning, is also scary:

Supermarket warns customers about threatening nine-year-old boy
New 9:49AM Wednesday Nov 26, 2008

A Christchurch supermarket is warning elderly customers to be careful, after a nine-year-old boy has been threatening customers, demanding money and stealing groceries.

The New World Supermarket in St Martins has warned customers not to give money to the boy who has been begging in the carpark, because of reports he was causing havoc in the community, reported The Press.

One local, who did not want to be named, told the paper the boy was “intimidating and threatening”.

“He has not just been in the supermarket carpark but also approaching people on the street mainly elderly, frail women, asking them for money.”

The boy had been approaching supermarket customers since being excluded from school three months ago.

An 84-year-old woman said the boy had approached her four times in the past month.

He had asked her for money and followed her home as she walked to her house from church on a Sunday morning.

Police said they were working with Child, Youth and Family in regards to the situation.

We seem to have some really big, endemic problems in society presently. Home detention for someone who is entrapping young people into a life of squalor and degradation? no idea about the guidelinnes but hello! what’s that all about?

Nine years olds excluded from school and running wild on the streets? Little Nia Glassies tortured to death? I truly fear for our society sometimes. i know that’s been the cry down through the generations, “what is the world coming to?” But, it does seem worse now than it ever did. i should like to blame the unnatural life our young people are now forced to live – excercise is playing a team sport, carried to practice and games by parents to afraid to let children walk anywhere any more because of the perceived dangers; tiny gardens where ther’s no hope of playing a decent game of anything; parents both working and putting their children in after school care etc, because they’ve no financial choice, then coming home too tired to do much more than organise a quick meal, check homework and shovel the unfortunate little ones off to bed to get some peace; nowhere to run and play just for the sheer joy of running and playing; no conception of what it is to love and care for animals and no good contact with them – etc etc. As I say, I should like to blame these things, but maybe that is too simplistic?
I don’t have answers, I wish i did, but i kind of, in a hazy way, blame a negative media and a disengaged adult population, led to believe that nothing they do can make any difference, it’s all up to the state.
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November 26, 2008 10:17am
Murray

An umbrella through the spokes is a common enough accident in Windy Wellingto mudmum.
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November 26, 2008 10:18am
Redbaiter

“What’s going down between Brian Rudman and Rodney Hide?”

Rudman is a disreputable commie who typifies the deceit of the “objective” mainstream media.
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November 26, 2008 10:34am
Inventory2

I wondered as much Redbaiter! Thanks for confirming my suspicions.
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November 26, 2008 11:01am
Redbaiter

Just my opinion Inventory. Take it or leave it.
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November 26, 2008 11:10am
Colonel Masters

Misleading headline in the Herald:

Agent plays both buyer and seller at auction
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10545070

Am I being dumb, but whereabouts in this story is the guy acting as the buyer?
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November 26, 2008 11:31am
wikiriwhis business

“I don’t have answers, I wish i did, but i kind of, in a hazy way, blame a negative media and a disengaged adult population, led to believe that nothing they do can make any difference, it’s all up to the state.”

The answer is, dilute the state and work from community level.

The state is never there for the community. they’re totally divorced from each other.

Laws to operate the country are already in place. Get away from govt level to local level.

Politicians are self obsessive and self impt. They are the scourge and drainers of society and need to be recognised as such. “Let them eat cake” is their motto.

And remember, you’re not going to be asked anything for another three years.
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November 26, 2008 12:01pm
wikiriwhis business

I’m quite peeved we can’t acess yesterdays posts.

The face page is day to day now

Not a nice trend.
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November 26, 2008 12:14pm
Viking2

“Nothing changes but change itself”

Spin doctors enroll.
Hiring underway at Parliament

Wednesday, 26, Nov, 2008 11:28AM

Hiring is underway at Parliament as political parties prepare for the new Government.

National has already picked up new media and advisory staff. Senior TV3 reporter Stephen Parker is tipped to be working for Energy Minister Gerry Brownlee, while New Zealand Herald political reporter Paula Oliver has been picked up by the Prime Minister’s office.

Former Foreign Affairs advisor Brad Tattersfield is understood to be working for Social Development Minister Paula Bennett.

Meanwhile the Green Party is after a new media coordinator, two media advisors and at least three executive assistants for their senior MPs.
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November 26, 2008 12:28pm
oranjemakker

Mudmum,
I saw that article as well, almost farcical if it was not so disturbing. Everyone (police, CYF, neighbours, etc. etc.) clearly knows that this kids family are scumbags but there is either nothing they can or will do about it.

Further disturbing stats reported in todays ODT ( http://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/33441/community-work-scheme-criticised ) that more than 1/3 of those sentenced to community work dont complete their sentence. if this is not bad enough, if i read this para correctly they can get off the hook by not completing their sentence:
The most recent Ministry of Justice figures show that of 7398 people sentenced for breaching community work in 2006, most (3763) were convicted and discharged, 2450 were given more community work and 668 were jailed.

The rest were fined or had their sentences deferred.

What?? So, let me get this straight. You get sentenced for a crime, then by not completing that sentence you eventually get off scott free? And giving someone more community work, when they obviously have no intention of showing up, is beyond idiocy. Also, why do you need to prosecute someone for breaching their sentence, surely you should jsut be able to throw them in jail? no wonder the courts are so tied up dealing with this crap. Another question one should pose to the esteemed Mr. Goff?
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November 26, 2008 12:29pm
freethinker

Re Big Ears Brown and his punitive departure tax – are the Brits smart enough not to make long haul flights ex UK and take a short haul flight to Amsterdam/Frankfurt etc and then continue from a no tax country – British Airways you could be a big loser so stick the knife into big ears and watch the stuffing fall out.
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November 26, 2008 12:38pm
virtualmark

mudmum, re the cycling through a pedestrian crossing. I do a lot of cycling, for leisure rather than for commuting. I often ride through central Wellington. And yes, I confess, I ride through the occasional pedestrian crossing. Two reasons:

1. I’m firmly clipped into the pedals, like a skier is clipped onto their skis. So it’s a pain in the #@*$ to stop. If I come to an intersection as the pedestrian crossing phase goes then I’ll coast through it without having the stop and unclip. If your foot was screwed to the accelerator pedal in your car you’d probably look for ways to avoid stopping too.
2. One of the most dangerous times for cyclists is at traffic lights just as the lights go green. You’re at slow speed, having to reclip into your pedals and meanwhile every berk in a car is trying to practice their grand prix start alongside you. If you’re going to get hit by a car there’s a good chance it’ll happen then. Personally I’d rather coast through the pedestrian crossing and stay away from the traffic mayhem.

Personally I won’t ride closer than a bikes length from any pedestrians, and only at walking pace. Obviously I didn’t see the particular cyclist you’re referring to and so I can’t say how responsibly they were riding. But yes I agree there are other cyclists who’re a lot more aggressive (particularly bike couriers in my experience).
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November 26, 2008 12:51pm
PhilBest

Well said, Virtualmark. I know the feeling……….
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November 26, 2008 2:03pm
PhilBest

How many people have discovered Peter Schiff on Youtube?

Watch the video of TV clips of this guy getting mocked 2 years ago for predicting the financial crisis EXACTLY:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8r-nDBx5Jg&feature=related

And watch what he’s saying NOW:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGHODRNJqRo

In all modesty, he is saying very similar things to what I have been saying here on Kiwiblog for the last few weeks.
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November 26, 2008 2:10pm
Turpin

oranjemakker
Thanks for this.
Community Work clearly isn’t working for the 20,000 (1/3rd)who are sentenced to it but don’t fulfill it. They aren’t paying attention to the fact that they are criminals undergoing sentencing. then the justice system has the temerity to let 50% of those off by discharging them

Why can’t they give someone 1 or 3 months imprisonment up front rather than the farce of them rorting the system.
They could choose in court community work or straight to jail and be warned that should they not complete the community work they WILL go straight to jail as well.

how hard is that?
How much do we pay these magistrates and judges?

At the very least they could give them an automatic 1-3 months jail for not completing the community work.

Where’s the new Minister of justice when you need them, because this isn’t Justice.
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November 26, 2008 2:16pm
gd

Re the departure tax by the idiots Brown and Darling As a FF to the UK I will either take a ferry to Dublin or the train to Paris and fly home. I would pay more than pay these bastards their theiving tax

Beware as predicted this is the start of the toxic combination of governments and big business using the AGW hoax to rape and pillage the taxpayers and consumers.

Its only the beginning as these arseholes realise the cash cow they can milk.

And all in the name of shit science
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November 26, 2008 2:20pm
big bruv

Meanwhile our friends in the NZ Green party will be urging their counterparts in the UK and Europe to spread the word, they see this as a golden chance to push their Trojan horse (the climate change con) and they could not give a fuck if they totally destroy the NZ economy in the process.

As GD says, expect to see more governments use the climate change con as an excuse to impose trade barriers, I hope that Key and subsequent PM’s have a long memory when it comes to things like this, one day the Poms will need us or ask for our support and I would love to be around when we tell them to get fucked.
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November 26, 2008 2:40pm
baxter

Orangemakker:…………..I also read the article with disbelief. The only conclusion I could draw was that the judge must be a deviant himself.
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November 26, 2008 3:26pm
getstaffed

Why can’t they give someone 1 or 3 months imprisonment

… and before someone screams about prison overcrowding… Mt Crawford Prison in Wellington is completely empty. Closed. Deserted.
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November 26, 2008 3:45pm
Inventory2

Getstaffed – The Mount is only closed until the underfloor heating is completed, the flat-screen TV’s have been installed, and the landscaping is finished. Until then, the Miramar Hilton only provides accomodation that is not up to the discerning crim’s expectations!
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November 26, 2008 3:56pm
getstaffed

IV2 – lol. Some of the best land in Wellington up there. 360deg views of habour, city and bays. All day sun (and yes a little wind). You could build 5 prisons in some remote corner of NZ for the land value of Mt Crawford alone.
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November 26, 2008 4:05pm
Banana Llama

PhilBest (3658) Vote: Add rating 1 Subtract rating 0 Says:
November 26th, 2008 at 2:10 pm

How many people have discovered Peter Schiff on Youtube?

Yeah it is frikin hilarious watching all those idiots eat crow now, thats where i get alot of my information from, i listen to the people who called this 1-2 years ago and take in what they have to say and very few are saying this will be a moderate recession.

Quite a few are talking about American stock markets going down to 1000 points ….
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November 26, 2008 5:15pm
WebWrat

David Bellamy on the Global Alarm Fest = GAF.

(http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24700827-7583,00.html)
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November 26, 2008 10:45pm

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