General Debate 10 November 2008

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Grant Michael McKenna

I am hopeful that a consequence of the new Holyoake years will be a constitutional settlement which resolves the need for Māori representation.

Perhaps a second house, with members serving six years, with two Pākehā and two Māori members as part of a small group [nominated at the end of an outgoing parliament by the PM and Leader of the Opposition, maybe?] of about ten or so “Senators”- give them the restriction that they cannot delay a money bill for more than one month, like the House of Lords.
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November 10, 2008 1:33pm
homepaddock

We haven’t had a Natational led government all century and Labour has left a mess for them to clean up.
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November 10, 2008 1:40pm
llew

And already the benefits are becoming apparent:

New Zealanders Living Longer. Thank you Mr Key!

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4756285a11.html
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November 10, 2008 1:44pm
16a Highbury Rd

A lot of civil servants looked pretty pissed on their way to work this morning.

They probably spent all yesterday practising their speeches “you cant fire me beacuse I have shifted the paradigm, built strawmen and engaged in a lot of blue sky thinking”

Good riddance you trough snouting toss pots.
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November 10, 2008 1:48pm
JamesHip

“Ding, dong, the wicked witch is dead”
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November 10, 2008 1:49pm
jafapete

Yeah sure homepaddock, Labour’s left a big mess. They’re responsible for the financial meltdown around the world. No wait, it’s all Obama’s fault. Rush Limbaugh told his radio audience last Thursday, “The Obama recession is in full swing, ladies and gentlemen. Stocks are dying, which is a precursor of things to come. This is an Obama recession. Might turn into a depression.” So it looks like we can’t blame Labour for that.

But sure, it’s such a terrible thing that the labour-led governments paid off so much government debt, giving the incoming government so much more wiggle room on the economy. No doubt about that.

In fact Labour was so disastrous that National had to spend the last two years or so convincing NZers (apart from interlopers at National Party functions with tape recorders) that it wouldn’t be much different, and wouldn’t change the really big things that Labour introduced. A real mess it must be.
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November 10, 2008 1:52pm
mousse

I have been trying to find the answer to a question regarding Nikki Kaye – she has been variously described as a lawyer and as a business woman – her website says she is completing her law dgree this year, so not a lawyer yet – can someone tell me exactly what business she is in?

[DPF: Nikki has never described herself as a lawyer, and in fact goes out of her way to phone journalists who do mistakenly describe her as that. The business she is a Director of is an Internet one which helps charities and volunteers network with each other]
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November 10, 2008 1:54pm
Spam

No Jafapete: It was John Key’s fault – especially Merril Lynch.
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November 10, 2008 1:59pm
adc

maybe we can sell the trains back to Toll for $1 and cut our losses…
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November 10, 2008 2:02pm
Pita

It’s time to trow some light on “the dark days of Rogernomics” it seems, over time, Roger has been saddled with all the trappings of the Boggyman without considering all of the good that he did at a time that the country faced difficult economic circumstances.
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November 10, 2008 2:10pm
Murray

Jafa you fuckwit we were in a recession 8 months before any global credit bullshit came along for you to blame. And even then michael cullen had still managed to piss away record surplusses.

You had nines years of blaming National now you want to blame everyone else. No sale.

F jafa, the country gave you and F. Now go sit down the back of the country with the pointy hat on till your told to speak.
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November 10, 2008 2:13pm
pdm

Jafapete – Labour are responsible for a very large proportion of the mess the country is in. They took over a strong economy and instead of focusing on developing a growing economy they focused on ideological issues which resulted in unproductive spending. So ultimately we had a declining economy.

They only really had one focus – to be re elected and to achieve this they were prepared to make people with incomes in excess of $100,000 per annum beneficiaries.
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November 10, 2008 2:13pm
NeillR

I’m amazed at the denial of the Left – it’s almost as bad as the dolchstosslegende that followed Germany’s defeat in WWI. The Standard is reporting the result was “as close as it gets” and Trotter somehow thinks the country was hoodwinked, but in reality he will see he was actually more correct when he said: “In every other election I can remember, the New Zealand electorate has demonstrated an acute grasp of what was necessary politically.”

Once he takes off the rose tinted goggles, he’ll perhaps realise that this election was no different from the others. This election was won as much as anything by the fact that Labour was near bankruptcy after paying back the $800k from the last election. They were desperate to stifle advertising through the EFA, because they knew they didn’t have the money to compete. This was reflected in their clumsy, ineffectual campaign for which they should be demanding their money back if they actually paid anyone for it.

Labour have a massive job on their hands – firstly they have to rebuild electoral support, which will be no easy feat given their current financial straits. Secondly they will need to be very careful with their selection of leader. Choosing Cunliffe will show that they’ve learnt nothing about the electorate shifting to the right on them, but electing Goff will probably lead to widespread dissent and fracturing from the left-wing of the party.

It’s always hard to make predictions, but as long as National maintain a steady course, they should be able to govern for a long time – i’m picking they will easily win re-election in ’11, but they will need careful navigation to repeat in ’14. As long as we haven’t suffered half a decade of deficits, they may just get back in for a third term.
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November 10, 2008 2:13pm
dad4justice

Time for the lefty lickspittles to remove the red eye patch.
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November 10, 2008 2:15pm
philu

“..The Standard is reporting the result was “as close as it gets”..”

how was it not..?

..is nzf getting 0.8% more changing the result not close enough for you..?

..are you part of acts ‘financial-team’..?

..phil(whoar.co.nz)
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November 10, 2008 2:24pm
Johnboy

I there any truth in the rumour that Trotter and Browniass have both applied for jobs as war correspondents in Afghanistan?
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November 10, 2008 2:25pm
16a Highbury Rd

Phil

Is their any truth to the rumours that they are making a movie about the Green party?

I have heard the working title is “Greens – when cousins copulate”
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November 10, 2008 2:29pm
PhilBest

Ah, philu, you continue to pop up periodically without answering THIS question that I have already asked six times:

PHILU: DID YOU MISS THIS?

# PhilBest (3299) 0 0 Says:
October 28th, 2008 at 1:20 pm

“While you’re here, philu, I’ve been looking out for you, you haven’t been so active on here lately, what’s up? Other duties pressing as the election gets closer, eh?

I want to ask you, have you seen the stuff about you in Trevor Loudon’s article on the Greens in the latest “Investigate” Magazine? I quote: “Green Party Blogger (since expelled) Philip U…….” He then quotes at length a posting you apparently made about Commies taking over the Green Party, which I found quite commendable. Did you really write that, philu, or who are you and what have you done with the guy who used to post as Philip U on whoar.co.nz?

…….Do tell…..!”

No answer…….?
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November 10, 2008 2:32pm
PhilBest

Hmmmm, 16aHighburyRd, did you know philu is a filmmaker who could probably give you some even more interesting footage than THAT………?
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November 10, 2008 2:34pm
philu

haven’t seen it..

..don’t read it..

and seeing as i have never ever been a ‘green party blogger’..

..why should i bother..?

..phil(whoar.co.nz)
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November 10, 2008 2:35pm
philu

heh..!..phil best heard i used to be a porn star..

(silly boy..!..he’s easily ‘played’..eh..?..)

..and has since been wearing himself out..

..in a futile search..looking for the footage..

.(.and how is ‘phil best’ not a porn-name..?..)

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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November 10, 2008 2:40pm
Brian Smaller

Philu – As far as NZF goes a miss is as good as a mile as they say. Wasn’t too long ago that the Christian Coalition only just missed out getting over the threshold. You need to get with the reality of the situation. You may, some time soon, have to get a job. Then you could afford a keyboard that has more letters and less punctuation marks.
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November 10, 2008 2:41pm
labrator

Atleast the Labour Party webmaster has a sense of humour! As reported on the herald site.
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November 10, 2008 2:48pm
philu

mmp needs reform..

..the threshold should be lowered to three percent..

..and the electorate-coat-tail mp’s lessened..

..having act on 3-5%..and having 5 mps’s..

..and nzf getting 4.2%..and getting none..

..is blatantly out of whack..

..and needs to change..

..those 4.2% of new zealanders have effectively been disenfranchised..

..and that sucks..

..phil(whoar.co.nz)
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November 10, 2008 2:48pm
PhilBest

Murray, Pdm, good that people might be starting to wake up to that. But I guess there is faint hope that the MSM might give people the truth on that score, the official Lefty spin is that Mikhael Kullensky was the world’s best Finance Minister, and it is only the “collapse of Yankee Capitalism” that is responsible for our plight now. FAAAKK, these people make me spew. AsI posted frequently over the last few weeks, NZ’s household debt, overseas borrowing, expansion of bank credit, and overvalued housing, put us in the category of “worst in the world”, much worse than the USA. Incidentally, MOST of Europe is also in a worse mess on these points than the USA is, so much for all their scoffing and knocking.

I presume John Key is talking the crisis down rather than up, even though there is truth to be dished on Labour and Cullen’s handling of the economy; as it would be better to just have everyone carry on as normal until the economic fundamentals come back into line, rather than panic and “run” on the banks. There is little point trying to extend too much in the way of guarantees to the finance sector, as:

1) most of it has already fallen over and one shudders to think how much mum and dad investors money has gone down the tubes without a murmur from our MSM;

and 2) the banks and bits of the finance sector that are still standing, are owned overseas anyway (and would probably have fallen over if they weren’t, so much for NZ “not having a crisis”) and we will probably benefit from USA and Aussie and Pommie taxpayers money propping up these institutions.

But good luck to John Key if that really is what he is hoping, because the economic fundamentals will take several times more time than he’s got, to “come back into line”, and meanwhile he has no “mandate” to do what is really necessary to cope with the real scale of the crisis. A full-scale crash would actually be preferable provided everybody knows the true reasons why. It would result in a good traditional “IMF” type recovery program being put into effect with the NZ voter having no choice in the matter. “Cutting government spending” when the government has just plain run out of both taxation revenue and sources of loan money and can’t even pay civil servants wages, is not a matter of CHOICE………and it would result in what some economists call a “V-shaped depression”, whereas the wishful politician who continues to “tax and spend” will give us a recession akin to death by a thousand cuts if he’s lucky; and an “L-shaped depression” if he’s not.
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November 10, 2008 2:54pm
democracymum

The Reds had a sense of humour after all.
Who knows they may have even won, if they had used this photo on their billboards
and she wouldn’t even have needed airbrushing.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz-election-2008/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501799&objectid=10542210
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November 10, 2008 2:56pm
big bruv

Phool.

“mmp needs reform..”

Only now do you think MMP needs reform, typical of the bloody left, when it does not suit them they want to change the rules.

The only way I would vote to keep MMP is if they raised the threshold to 10%
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November 10, 2008 2:57pm
beautox

Hard fucking luck Philu. People stupid enough to vote NZ First deserve it.

btw, where did you get the idea that starting all your sentences (if that’s what they are) with two dots makes you look cool? Actually it just makes you look like the prick you are.

Just hope National makes you go and get a real job. Twat.
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November 10, 2008 2:58pm
PhilBest

Why did it take you so long to issue a denial, philu?

I admit I’m not much of an investigator, but BOY, have you got Trevor Loudon interested NOW………….
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November 10, 2008 2:58pm
AndrewE

Anyone seen the labour site today?

http://www.labour08.co.nz/

At least they have a sense of humour.
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November 10, 2008 3:03pm
slightlyrighty

I have a question.

Why are the senior Labour party members lining up to NOT be the leader? To date we have had Cullen, Cunliffe and King all say they do not want the job.

Why?

Is it because they truely know the state of the nation and do not want to be the one in the firing line when it all comes to the surface?
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November 10, 2008 3:04pm
Johnboy

Omar Bin Laden must feel like the unluckiest Arab in Cairo today. Got his citizenship application in and Auntie got rolled the day before. Bugger!
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November 10, 2008 3:07pm
libertyscott

Perhaps Labour’s big challenge is a caucus of a lot of new people, expected to choose a leader from someone many will know no better than many of us.

This young and inexperienced lot, without the iron discipline of Clark, will be prone to make many gaffs, look more leftwing than Labour will want to look, but in 6 years time will present a decent challenge to National. However, it is the beginning of the end of an era – Goff will be the last Labour leader who was in the Cabinet of the fourth Labour government.

Meanwhile the Greens will have a stronger team, and will proclaim doomsday at every quarter.
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November 10, 2008 3:14pm
NeillR

“..The Standard is reporting the result was “as close as it gets”..”

how was it not..?

..is nzf getting 0.8% more changing the result not close enough for you..?

The result wouldn’t have changed. Even if NZF had got 5%, National/Act would have had 61 (half the seats). Add UF and it’s 62 and a majority – so NZF didn’t mean anything with regard to the final result.

The left lost, it was a rout. National polled higher than Labour/Green combined. Personally, i don’t care if the Left don’t wake up to what is immediately obvious – it will only extend their time in the political wilderness.
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November 10, 2008 3:20pm
Chuck Bird

Has anyone had a look at Clark’s concession speech on the Herald website?

The bonfire created by the right comment is missing unlike the video from TV1. It appears that the Herald has edited out the ungracious comment by Clark.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz-election-2008/news/video.cfm?c_id=1501799&gal_objectid=10541930&gallery_id=103343
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November 10, 2008 3:33pm
scott

Good to see social engineering is doing it’s job around here.
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November 10, 2008 3:34pm
Chuck Bird

Has anyone seen the concession video from the Herald website? The bonfire created by the right is missing unlike the video from TVNZ. Has the Herald edited out Clark’s ungracious comment?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz-election-2008/news/video.cfm?c_id=1501799&gal_objectid=10541930&gallery_id=103343
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November 10, 2008 3:41pm
Lindsay Addie

Are some on the left sounding bitter and twisted because they think they have some sort of divine right to govern?

I have no time whatsoever for Clark’s and Peters politics but at least they both took defeat on the chin on election night.
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November 10, 2008 3:43pm
llew

Are some on the left sounding bitter and twisted because they think they have some sort of divine right to govern?

You shouldn’t read stuff from Chris Trotter, you’ll get indigestion.
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November 10, 2008 3:49pm
gee90

Breaking News:

No place for ACT in John Key’s cabinet. Rodney Hide gets a “Winston” role, outside the government. Nothing for Roger Douglas.
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November 10, 2008 3:53pm
LabourMustBeLiquidated

Well, well, well. I feel that my nickname has now become somewhat irrelevant, and along with it, some of my enthusiasm for visiting Kiwiblog. And thats good!
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November 10, 2008 3:56pm
Inventory2

Trotter’s piece in today’s Dom-Post is even more bile-filled than the one he wrote for the SST yesterday

http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/2008/11/bad-losers-2.html
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November 10, 2008 3:57pm
Lindsay Addie

Trots is so full of wind he’s farting out of his mouth now!

😆
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November 10, 2008 4:00pm
Chthoniid

Sigh

Again, the goal of a political party is to get elected. The election rules set out the way.
ACT chose to concentrate on winning an electoral seat. It worked.
NZ First chose to concentrate on winning 5%, it failed.

Apologists for the left seem to be arguing that because ACT chose not to maximise the party vote with it’s electoral strategy, it should be punished for this and NZ First should be rewarded. We don’t know how ACT would have done if it had followed the same strategy as NZ First.

It is this backdoor way into Parliament that is intended to increase minor party representation. I thought this was supposed to be a good thing 😉
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November 10, 2008 4:03pm
Johnboy

They could attach a Bic Filc to either end and use him as a flamethrower when he gets to Kabul.
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November 10, 2008 4:06pm
Buggerlugs

The only thing left to see is all the Stranded pseudo-bloggers filing personal grievances against Labour when they don’t get their paycheques this week…

as for jafapete, hahahahahahaha. suck the kumara.

and interestingly, poneke is sucking up to National. has david submitted his CV to try for a press secretary’s job?
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November 10, 2008 4:20pm
Owen McShane

It did not take long. The GOvernment has let Nick Smith close of so many of its options.
National urged to keep to its climate change commitments

The Environmental Defence Society has reminded Prime Minister elect John Key of the party’s commitment to retain the Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS).

“We note that ACT denies that climate change is happening and has said it wants to cancel the scheme and pull New Zealand out of Kyoto. ACT leader Rodney Hide has put the future of the ETS on the table during the current coalition negotiations,” said EDS Chairman Gary Taylor.

“But National has been very clear that it supports an ETS albeit with some changes. At a seminar run by EDS on 30 October, Hon Dr Nick Smith reiterated that commitment in an unequivocal way.

“Clearly there will be support from other parties in the Parliament for retention of the scheme. It would be a very bad start indeed if National was to cave into ACT’s demands before it has even formed a government.

“A centre-right government does not have to pose a threat to the environment. National has made much of its new “blue-green” credentials in the run-up to the election. We are looking for it to start as it intends to finish: keeping to its promises and not being led astray on environmental policy by ACT,” Mr Taylor concluded.
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November 10, 2008 4:27pm
gd

Smart move by JK and Rodders to agree on a post outside cabinet Jk can now offer the same to Dunny and the MP and not put any noses out of joint As DPF well knows it all about finessing the roles that count.

Sir Roger will be there in the background so as not to frighten the horses and give the LEFT ammo. But his wise counsel will be sort and will be acted ( pun intended 0 on

And before the lick spittles start frothing name me just one of Sir Rogers policies that either theNats or the Socilaists have reversed in the past 20 years Come on lets be having you
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November 10, 2008 4:30pm
Owen McShane

Sorry, I must have been too slow with my editing. Half way through when it went on line: Should read:

It did not take long. The Government has let Nick Smith close off so many of its options.
Media release from Environmental Defence Society begins:

“National urged to keep to its climate change commitments

The Environmental Defence Society has reminded Prime Minister elect John Key of the party’s commitment to retain the Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS).

“We note that ACT denies that climate change is happening and has said it wants to cancel the scheme and pull New Zealand out of Kyoto. ACT leader Rodney Hide has put the future of the ETS on the table during the current coalition negotiations,” said EDS Chairman Gary Taylor.

“But National has been very clear that it supports an ETS albeit with some changes. At a seminar run by EDS on 30 October, Hon Dr Nick Smith reiterated that commitment in an unequivocal way.

“Clearly there will be support from other parties in the Parliament for retention of the scheme. It would be a very bad start indeed if National was to cave into ACT’s demands before it has even formed a government.

“A centre-right government does not have to pose a threat to the environment. National has made much of its new “blue-green” credentials in the run-up to the election. We are looking for it to start as it intends to finish: keeping to its promises and not being led astray on environmental policy by ACT,” Mr Taylor concluded.

ENDS
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November 10, 2008 4:32pm
jastowns

trotters dead right,main stream is owned by the very people that wanted key in power,we have all been manipulated to think a curtain way, all views here depend of what channel you watch
its much better getting news that is free from propaganda,not owned by large corporates with there own agenda,when you work this out then the manipulation becomes very obvious
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November 10, 2008 4:36pm
Chicken Little

Only now do you think MMP needs reform, typical of the bloody left, when it does not suit them they want to change the rules.

Indeed bruv, up until…well…..Saturday, the Left thought there was nothing wrong with MMP. It was working fine just the way it was they said.

Today, No Right Turn (snigger) and the Stranded all of a sudden have posts up about how MMP must be saved but the threshold should be lowered (I’m assuming so that their good friend Winston can get back in next time).

Now phule, who as we know, is No Master Of Politics, brings it up here.

Parrot?

I think we’ll hear that squeal repeated a lot in the coming weeks and months.

And phule (NMOP), never mind how close Winston was, weren’t you predicting the Greens on 10% pre election?

In fact, thinking on it, you still owe me beers from 2005 when you were predicting the same thing.

Quad or nothing in 2011?
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November 10, 2008 4:39pm
gd

Owen just like in 1984 with Lange All bets should be off.

Now is the time for real leadership JKs gotta cut tax cut governemnt waste dump the ETS Have binding referendums of the voting system and the Maori seats.

And then next week he can start on phase two of the reforms

I kid not There in no alternative. Every minute of every hour the economic situation is worsening and he knows it and some of us know it.

OK hes trying to keep the lid on but the fact is NZ is stuffed unless we can get the wheels rolling And trickle down dont work

its gotta be trickle up or better still a great big spurt up

Its all about the top 2 inches. Until we get some confidence back nothings going to move. Only when the citizesn have some jingle jangle in their pockets and the confidence to go out and spend will we recover

forget the economists and other experts Its because of these dumb pricks that we are in the hole Ignore them and their pyscho babble Its all bullshit.

Dont believe those who say it cant be done What they mean is they wont do it.
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November 10, 2008 4:42pm
Chicken Little

jastowns – are you randal from the Stranded?

There can’t be two so thoroughly broken people floating around the kiwi political blogs, can there?
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November 10, 2008 4:44pm
Neil

Great win to the Centre-Right and particularly to National.
I’d like to go down another track looking at this election from a FPP result which indicates the true enormity of this election. In the end, this election wasn’t even close.
Take each electorate and then look at the party vote of Labour/National in each seat. 51 of the 70 to National. Roughly 73 percent of seats went National, the other 27 went Labour.
Why was it that Maungakiekie voted list National,Waitakere voted List National,Auckland Central National,I think Wellington Central ?
Obviously many Labor voters were that cheesed off with Labour and stayed home. Maybe some were attracted by National’s high class candidates,Paula Bennett,Sam Lotu and Nikki Kaye who seemed to have more energy that Labor’s candidates.
I believe social issues played a key role in that area, blue collar workers tend to be more conservative than those in high wealth areas.
I believe that any National mp with a majority of less than 6 000 needs to start delivering service to his constituents now as as sure as night and day the tide starts to go out for National now.
Best effort for National was Nikki Kaye and Johnathon Young in New Plymouth. A great effort for Labour by Darren Hughes he should have gone down by 5 000. The big laugh- Ron Mark’s much fabled effort in Rimutaka. Didn’t even get close. Good riddance to that surly man.
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November 10, 2008 4:46pm
Banana Llama

RogerNomics would have Labour back in by the end of the term, what would be more damaging? So i really don’t care how correct the man is, i am not tolerating another nine years of a far left leaning Labour government.
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November 10, 2008 4:48pm
Nomestradamus

Jastowns:

we have all been manipulated to think a curtain way, all views here depend of what channel you watch
its much better getting news that is free from propaganda,not owned by large corporates with there own agenda,when you work this out then the manipulation becomes very obvious

This is a general debate thread – and your chance to entertain us with your conspiracy theories. But, for the benefit of others, this thread shows what type of person you are (I believe you are the Jas on this thread, as you’ve referred us to this website several times now, and it seems that you’re in good company with Clare Swinney there):

2008-10-09 10:48:22

good stuff penny ive lost all touch with whats going on in NZ after being away for almost 10 years,so i have much to school myself on [Jastowns, may I suggest you start with basic literacy?]
no surprise there, these criminals have taken over every where on the planet sometimes i think we are to late to change whats coming until some one like you turns up with the never give up attitude and to charge on mentality,well done

2008-10-09 22:19:23

So it sounds like the Prime minister for Nz has been picked, so what can we do to make his life hell?
set fire to his pile of money whats the bet he dies trying to put it out
another multimillionaire going for a job that pays fuck all HMMM

2008-10-10 11:06:07

very interesting tomsk something tells me you are more than likely right about john key this seems to be the trend with many of the power hungry,from what i understand about the vatican pure evil dose spring to mind,i wonder if we can find out if he has been there for one of there secret sermonizes under the vatican,maybe hes been there as a kid,this would remove all doubt in my mind to what he is

2008-10-10 16:37:53

dose any one know john keys ancestry,family tree,one thing seems to be prominent with these people who seek power,they are related to each other like bush is the queens 13th distant cousin and how obama is some how related to cheney, ive tried to find out with some searches but im quickly going nowhere [Jastowns, so Obama is somehow related to Cheney, but you’re not exactly sure how?]
my guess is he will be related some how [Jastowns, you’ll find a way to make the facts fit your story then?]

2008-10-17 21:21:53

the more i read about this john key the more a feel he is a plant for the new world order,his boss and two of his recruits where killed in 911 i dont know where he was,in 2003 he said NZ was missing in action in the war against iraq and said he supports the USAs right to invade iraq, 2005 he stood before the house and said the kyoto protocol was nothing more than a hoax now he is for it 100%,he wants to spend 1.5bil on new internet for NZ (this i think will be internet2)his mentors are bill clinton,tony blair(just stopped short of adolf hitler i think)for a man whos family was chased out of austria by nazis and had relatives killed by hitler he sure is forgiving [Jastowns, I can’t believe you really believe this?]

For a person who claims to know the truth, and to be self-professed expert on the New World Order (TM) you seem to be a few bread rolls short of a picnic. And an illiterate bigot.

This was a public service for other Kiwiblog readers. They can judge your comments here against your comments elsewhere.
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November 10, 2008 4:56pm
mara

Did anyone else notice how absolutely abject and lonely Peter Davis looked when HC was speachifying on election night? Now that she doesn’t need him anymore, the poor chap might be a liability if she goes for some “”wimmin’s save the World from itself”, global hugfest job. Something akin to sympathy tugged at my remaining heart-string. Briefly.
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November 10, 2008 4:56pm
dad4justice

mara; poor Peter Davis will be getting a real hard time now the witch has lost her cauldron of power. Maybe she will turn him into a bullfrog and he will just hop away in the sunset or go swimming in the pond at Hagley park?
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November 10, 2008 5:01pm
calendar girl

Before Peter Dunne is confirmed as a Minister, whether inside Cabinet or outside, is the hard word going to be put on him to pay back the money that his “party” still owes Parliamentary Services?

Unless the new Government espouses principles and high standards for itself and its governance partners, the country can expect more of the improprieties that were hallmarks of Clark’s administration.
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November 10, 2008 5:11pm
Rex Widerstrom

calendar girl: Bloody good point. This piece of political pond scum floats at the same level as Winston. He’ll be toast next time when Labour and Nationally finally see Ohariu as a winnable seat, so we have three years to get him to repay the money he stole.

Since Rodney Hide did such a good job going after Winston, I hope he sticks to his principles and goes after Dunne next… surely he won’t pull his punches just because Mr Quiff is on the same side of the aisle?
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November 10, 2008 5:30pm
mousse

DPF – thanks for your reply – being based in Australia and watching the results here on Sky News, which was a rebroadcast of TV 3 and also Sky News NZ’s coverage, both described her as a lawyer, including Don Brash – you say that she is the Director of an internet business, however a search of the Companies Office records for current and past directors of companies in NZ, does not show any Nikki Kaye or any derivative of that (perhaps Nicola) as being either a current or previous director of any NZ registered company – one would hope that if she says that she is a director (albeit they were your words) that she is in fact one as it would not bode well on the commencement of her political career that she is caught out telling porkies – the oppostion might feel inclined to send one of their flat-foots to who knows where to devil for more information!!!

[DPF: You sound like a member of the Mike Williams Batman detective agency. Nikki worked in the United Kingdom up until early 2008, and the company along with the co-directors is based there.]
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November 10, 2008 5:54pm
mousse

Can you also please update us on what she is likely to be given by way of post as a bright young thing

[DPF: The PM Designate is unlikely to be telling me the Cabinet in advance. But regardless it is a silly question, as I am sure you know]
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November 10, 2008 5:55pm
homepaddock

Calendar gile & Rex – The Dom Post reported all parties except NZ First had repaid the money they owed: http://www.stuff.co.nz/vote08/4738787a28435.html
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November 10, 2008 5:55pm
grumpyoldhori

Time to look at the voting method again now that the majority of the public know the working s of both FPP and MMP.
Even this old Labour type can see that their are advantages in SVT, yes, I know the public would need to be educated on it’s workings, but given time even you Nat types can figure it out.

Oh, one thing, when they put the lists out, make sure the buggers have a Bio.
beside their names, any pricks/prickless’s holding a so called political science degree will crossed out first.
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November 10, 2008 6:15pm
jafapete

“as for jafapete, hahahahahahaha. suck the kumara.”

Suck kumara? You kiwiblogrighties have yet to work out what happened last week.

First off, the end of the Reagan era in your ideological heartland. On “Face the Nation” this morning, David Brooks sees the US conservative movement with “no leaders,” in a “world of pain,” and “lacking a coherent belief system.” Very soon the most powerful man in the world will be a redistributing socialist. Joe the Plumber told us this.

In NZ, the right-wing bloc got 49.17% on election night. Some majority. Okay, I’ll be generous, 50.06% if you count Dunne. But that could change with specials. The left bloc got 45.34%, 4.72% less than the right bloc (still including Dunne). So, a 2.5% swing (for Murray’s sake: you take it off the right bloc and add it to the left bloc) would see a change of government.

Now, you may not have heard Richard Prebble agreeing with Mark Goshe on the radio this morning that the Labour caucus will provide serious opposition. The 43 or 44 strong caucus includes at least 13 capable new members, and Goff will be a formidable leader. 43-44 seats is a useful base — look at how well National did in 2005 with a whole lot less.

And remember, the National Party might have won, but its ideology didn’t. It spent 9 years out of power because it took so long to wake up to how deeply unpopular neoliberal ideas are in NZ, and then got into power after frantically working to convince NZers that it would only tamper a little bit — promise, hand on heart –with much of what Labour’s done over those 9 years.

Oh well, time to cook dinner, and it’s not going to be kumara tonight.
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November 10, 2008 6:20pm
labrator

mousee, I think if you hit her website you’ll find most of her career was in the UK (2003-2007).
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November 10, 2008 6:22pm
mousse

DPF – I do not think it is a silly question at all as it seems from reading the various posts etc, you obviously have the inside running and after all, to use the correct term, the Prime Minister Elect seems to portray himself as wanting to have bright young things helping running the country, which would no doubt make a difference from the usual hacks, a la Murray McCully and his ilk, who have been the cause of the malaise within the National Party for years – anyway I think that the reports in NZ Herald of what they are saying over here may portray the situation very accurately.

In answer to Labrator, I did check it, but it does not tell you much other than the fact that she worked in some type of think-tank position, which after all is no claim to fame when you consider the academics that have cluttered the NZ political scheme for years on both sides of the house, not that you can call a yellow-breasted upstart a la Hide an academic.
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November 10, 2008 6:46pm
labrator

Just suggesting that a look up in the NZ companies register was likely to hit nothing as not many under 24 year olds would have started a company before their OE. Give the UK registry a go, or give her a ring, her office hours mobile phone number is on her website.
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November 10, 2008 6:50pm
mousse

Jeepers Labarator if that is the quality of your understanding of business in NZ, then it is no wonder that NZ is in such a mess – she has been described as being a businesswoman – my question was what is the business that she is involved in, to which our moderator replied, if you look at the thread, that she was a Director of an internet business – a Director has a specific meaning and implies that she is a Director in NZ, if the moderator’s reply was correct, which I assume it was, and as such would be listed on the Companies Office records – try going to http://www.companies.govt.nz and click on the link Search Register and then click on Director search and put the surname Kaye in and see the names that pop up, no of which appear to be hers
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November 10, 2008 6:56pm
Chthoniid

And remember, the National Party might have won, but its ideology didn’t. It spent 9 years out of power because it took so long to wake up to how deeply unpopular neoliberal ideas are in NZ

What? Like tax cuts, an independent central bank, a floating exchange rate, removal of tariffs and quotas on imports, the pursuit of free trade agreements, removal of interest rate controls, removal of capital flow restrictions etc?

It seems to me that most of the neoliberal economic agenda was maintained by Labour in its 9 years. And they eventually got around to tax cuts.
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November 10, 2008 7:07pm
dime

jafa – ya lost dude. no one remembers who came second.

the left would be better off shutting the hell up and rebuilding.

did anyone see tv3 tonight? they were trying to get comments from labour mps about the next labour leader… they were all still arrogant and snarky… wonder if they realised they lost?

they then go to john key talkin to a kid and playing with a kitten HAHAHA

thats why ya lost leftists… youre unlikeable!
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November 10, 2008 7:18pm
Steve

National’s Plan.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/personal-finance/news/article.cfm?c_id=12&objectid=10542115&pnum=2
5. Call in public service chief executives, instruct them to undertake a review of all spending with a focus on finding savings. Establish “razor gang” type group to oversee review.

Mother in Law (81) had kidney removed at North Shore Hospital on Friday.
Her Sister (77) comes to visit on Saturday and passes out.
Taken down to Emergency, stabilised and shipped off to Auckland Hospital.
She stayed the night and sent home Sunday.
Shipped off to Auckland because it will cost North Shore money to keep her overnight there.

For fucks sake, these are Public Hospitals.
Three people plus patient plus Ambulance to transfer her.

The sister did not get much medication because the Hospital Pharmacy was closed, had to wait until getting to Auckland Hospital to get it.
This is how fucked up our DHB’s are.
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November 10, 2008 7:36pm
Patrick Starr

steve. Take my word for for. Your aunt (in law) was lucky she got out of North Shore Hospital. My dad went in for a bad back 5 years ago – and they killed him within 2 weeks
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November 10, 2008 7:47pm
Steve

Patrick Starr,
You missed the point.
How much money was wasted by doing the transfer?
All the time with staff making phone calls to organise this when they could be doing something more useful.
Administration is the problem.
BTW I have had Sinoplasty done at North Shore. The service is good and bedside manner impecable.
Full marks to the staff involved.
The problem is the Administration (those who are not Doctors, Nurses, Surgeons, Cleaners, Anesetists etc)
The problem is the bean counters and performance bonus’s. The pricks that drive Audis and BMW etc.
Hey, sorry about your Dad
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November 10, 2008 8:04pm
Patrick Starr

steve. I didn’t miss the point but In hindsight If I’d had the choice of a transfer out of NSH (at any price), well nuff said really
he’s the second relly I’ve lost there in the last 5 years thru their incompetence
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November 10, 2008 8:48pm
Johnboy

“Oh, one thing, when they put the lists out, make sure the buggers have a Bio.
beside their names, any pricks/prickless’s holding a so called political science degree will crossed out first.”

You can’t really mean this hori if we had had those rules back in the days of the enlightened Lange/Roger Douglas government (much beloved by all socialist wankers) your recently deceased idol Helen would not have got a job!!

Now if you are talking STV then I can agree with you.
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November 10, 2008 8:53pm
labrator

Jeepers Labarator if that is the quality of your understanding of business in NZ, then it is no wonder that NZ is in such a mess – she has been described as being a businesswoman – my question was what is the business that she is involved in

And my answer was quite simple, a UK business. As such the NZ companies register is likely to, and has proven to be, a dead end. Of course you could ring her and ask like I suggested? I’m not sure how you’ve managed to summise my business acumen by offering the suggestion that she was unlikely to start a NZ business at 23 or younger before moving to the UK. Perhaps you could expound on that.
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November 10, 2008 8:56pm
getstaffed

re Clark consession – what languages did she use (arabic?).. and more to the point why?
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November 10, 2008 9:02pm
jafapete

Fair point ChiffonId. What I said about neo-liberal ideology losing I qualified on my own blog: National “won, but its ideology lost. (Although not completely. Labour’s third-way social democracy has been a corporatist compromise with neo-liberalism rather than a repudiation of it.)”
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November 10, 2008 9:58pm
Rex Widerstrom

Getstaffed:

She used a number of languages. I recognised Maori, Samoan, Cook Islands Maori and I think Tongan. And yes, Arabic – As-Salāmu `Alaykum, which I believe means “peace be upon you”.

As to”why”, well she’s auditioning for the UN, obviously. The more languages she could squeeze in there, the more cosmopolitan she’d look to her new paymasters. She’d already made the decision to give NZ the flick, so it was all about moving on to the next job with no pause for regret, reflection or apology, and barely time for a nasty stab (“right wing bonfires”) at the people who’d beaten her.
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November 10, 2008 10:12pm
reid

Lefties really are little children aren’t they? Too immature even to recognise their own failings they lash out at others – ooh it was an evil biased media, ooh it was an awful conservative conspiracy against poor widdle Winston.

No recognition of reality.

Hey lefties, this is why you lost. You’re fucked in the head. You don’t understand life, people, societies or economics. In addition, you come across as arrogant – you appear to really imagine you alone have the heart and wisdom to realise “justice” in this fallen world.

You seem to think you deserve to win because you’re such super people with such pure humanitarian motives. That’s why you never criticised the abrogation of fair play represented by the EFA, because it was for the cause and everything is justified by the cause.

You stupid pricks haven’t even learned the elementary fact of life – that the secret to life is giving others meaningful value so that they can then transfer that value to others along the way. You teach someone how to fish and they will teach others. You give someone a fish and they will eat it and ask for another. It degrades their humanity and denies them the right to obtain meaning in their lives by giving them the ability to help others themselves, and furthermore, you treat them like an idiot so they think they are.

Lefties do this all the fucking time the world over and for a short time people appreciate the fish. Problem is the only way lefties can get the fish is by taking it off others because they’re too fucking stupid to pull it in themselves (i.e. lefties never actually grow any economy they control because they focus almost entirely on redistributing the fish rather than helping people who are good at catching it to catch even more. Lefties appear to imagine that situation would be weally weally awful because that would mean those awful tewwible people would have far too many fish and we can’t have that can we. That wouldn’t be super at all.)

Moving away from fish to just one of many examples from the real world, where is the education system after nine years of you? Fucking nowhere you stupid fuckhead losers. I bet Te Tiriti is a big part of it but where are the business courses? Nowhere. Lots of courses however on how to get along with others and how to avoid thinking you’re a fucking loser. Yeh that’ll really help people when they start learning how to compete in the real world. Oh right, that’s another maxim from lefty philosophy isn’t it. There are no losers. Hey fuckheads, what’s the point of lying to school children about the way the world works? Isn’t that really really really cruel and indeed, evil? Of course it is.

When things turn to shit as they have, lefties have no answer, simply because the only thing they know how to do is to re-distribute. If no-one else is creating the wealth, they have no fucking ideas at all. That’s why you were dumped you execrats, the country doesn’t trust you because it knows we’re heading into some serious shit where there’s not going to be too many fucking fish and the last thing we wanted was to have a bunch of lefties at the helm giving us no fresh perspectives but still more of the same. Cullen has known about this for several years, bet on it. What has he done? Nothing. Case closed. You lost not because of the media, not because of Hulun’s laughably flawed campaign strategy (snigger), it was because you just don’t get life. You’re actually the worst people in the world, you arrogant naive fuckhead moron fucks.

Kind regards,
reid
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November 10, 2008 10:21pm
Johnboy

I bet she can’t speak this language Gulpychokeyswallow.
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November 10, 2008 10:25pm
Ryan Sproull

You stupid pricks haven’t even learned the elementary fact of life – that the secret to life is giving others meaningful value so that they can then transfer that value to others along the way.

If it’s the elementary fact of life, why have you been keeping it secret?
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November 10, 2008 10:29pm
Buggerlugs

I note the Stranded are taking a leaf out of Winnie’s blog book and deleting comments they don’t like (no matter how well-tempered) out of hand.
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November 10, 2008 10:50pm
reid

No secret Ryan, didn’t you get love as a child? Didn’t that make you capable of passing that love on. Works with other things too. Elementary, my friend. No control-freakery required.
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November 10, 2008 10:55pm
Buggerlugs

nice post reid. it can essentailly be summed up as left = tax & spend, right = fuck me, see what happens when the left get hold of the cheque book!
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November 10, 2008 10:59pm
Ryan Sproull

No secret Ryan, didn’t you get love as a child? Didn’t that make you capable of passing that love on. Works with other things too. Elementary, my friend. No control-freakery required.

I was just having a chuckle about the wording. I’m all in favour of paying things forward.
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November 10, 2008 11:06pm
reid

“I note the Stranded are taking a leaf out of Winnie’s blog book and deleting comments they don’t like (no matter how well-tempered) out of hand.”

Maybe I’ll post my 10:21 at The Stranded then buggerlugs.

I think they might like it – I did wish them kind regards.
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November 11, 2008 12:12am
reid

How very odd, it hasn’t yet appeared.
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November 11, 2008 12:17am
reid

Update: my bad: had scripts turned off on my browser. Posted at 12:30AM. Will check back tom morn.

Expect they will see the funny side.
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November 11, 2008 12:29am
OECD rank 22 kiwi

Was Colin James involved in TVNZ’s election coverage effort on 8 November?
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November 11, 2008 4:24am
OECD rank 22 kiwi

Hilarious stuff here:
Distraught voters call the cops

This must be the much talked about “Transformation” economy that Labour talked about while they were in office. To turn the nation into a bunch of bludging welfare retards.

A lasting legacy for Helen Clark indeed. 😀
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November 11, 2008 6:11am
Patrick Starr

OECD – pretty funny allright
(until I read the last sentence of the article)
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November 11, 2008 6:20am
OECD rank 22 kiwi

I know what you mean Patrick. Lets just see what the Cabinet Expenditure Control Committee has to say about that last sentence.
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November 11, 2008 6:52am
reid

Update: Looks like they decided to keep it. Hooray.

Re: the calls, lets hope they taped them and it ends up on TV. Perhaps they’ll leak it to Garner who’ll do some sleuthin. Anyone see Sainsbury last night. Seven mins with the new PM and all he asks about is Key’s family. That guy is a waste of space. Shame he’s not a bureaucrat.
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November 11, 2008 6:54am
wikiriwhis business

What a beautiful sight the ninth floor will be looking like.

Micheal and Hullun emptying out their offices. Locks being changed.
(wonder when the discreet files were all deleted and shredded)

John looking out the window of his new office seeing the cbd in a new light.

Moving the NZ flag to a more prominent position.

And the colour red nowhere to be seen 🙂
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November 11, 2008 11:41am

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